The Dan Le Batard Show with Stugotz - The Best of SBS: Mike Breen

Episode Date: June 5, 2025

The 2025 NBA Finals tip-off tonight with the Indiana Pacers versus the Oklahoma City Thunder, so we look back at when Mike Breen, the voice of the NBA Finals, hit South Beach Sessions with a BANG. Originally recorded on June 6, 2023, and now, broadcasting his 20th NBA Finals, he will be more than comfortable calling the games, but sitting down with Dan to talk openly about HIMSELF? That's history in itself too. Mike shares with Dan how he still feels like the shy kid who is simply a fan of the game, and the love he has for his broadcast brothers, Jeff Van Gundy & Mark Jackson, even when they won't say it back. Mike also talks about how from the devastating ashes of his family's home, deep gratitude rose. Watch the 2025 NBA Finals as the Indiana Pacers battle the Oklahoma City Thunder LIVE on ABC. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Service fees exclusions and terms apply. Instacart. Groceries that over-deliver. deliver. Welcome to another South Beach Session. I really am thrilled that we have a legend here who's gonna Peshaw being a legend because he's got to be humble about things but he really is a unicorn because one part of this is super super unique which is his peers will not have a bad word to say about him anyone who has worked with him so that's one kind of hard to achieve.

But in today's America, social media doesn't have anything bad to say about this man. Joe Buck is pretty good at his craft. Joe Buck is somehow polarizing, even though he's a craftsman just like this man is a craftsman. But I thank you for being here, Mike Breen, for a couple of different reasons. Your work has been exceptional over 18 finals for 30 years broadcasting games but i also respect you because everyone i talk to says you are a fundamentally decent person which can in this business soaked with ego be something that you don't find very much of so thank you for being the way you are first of all i don't know that people know you you probably purposely want to be off to the side of the stage in the shadows, don't want to be the story, but you have done your job exceptionally well for a long time and I've been a big admirer for a long time.

Well, I'm humbled by the words. You clearly haven't searched enough people to find people to say bad things. But I so appreciate it. And as I told you, I've been conscious of you since back in the early Nick Heat days in your writing days and have mad respect. So it's a pleasure to be on, although you didn't take my advice. And I thought your listeners and your viewers

would be better served if you just reran the Ernie Johnson interview over and over again, because that was just spectacular. As I told you before, he came out in the air. He's somebody I look up to. And to watch him talk about his life and his craft was fascinating. Look up to him because I think of you similarly cut

from similar cloth, where you're both faith-based and you both were raised by parents Who have you now? covered in gratitude about making sure to represent Them well and so I think of you as similar creatures Well, I don't I I don't think of myself similar to Ernie. He's just one of the most unique, special people in our business because of not only is he so talented at what he does, but that's just only a part of his life. And we've learned a lot about the other parts of his life, both through your interview and a lot of other interviews he's done. He's just, he's one of those

special people that you're proud to say, I'm in the same business as that man. You don't think of yourself as similarly remarkable? No. No. I like your kind words, and I'm striving to be better all the time, but it's hard for me to, I don't like to judge myself on things. I just know, I know the way I was brought up. I had a mother and father that taught me how to treat people. And that's why I've tried to live my life most of that way, whether personal life, professional life. So when you have that foundation as a kid, and that's the way you were raised, it stays with you for your entire life, at least it

has with me. What did your father and mother do? My mother stayed at home. She was the rock. I was one of six boys. And my dad had a couple of different jobs. He was a grocer for a while, but then spent most of my my childhood as a steam fitter in the union. He was in construction. And the two of them were just the way I always phrase it is every day of my life I felt like I was loved

and can you ask anything better from parents every day. What is a steam fitter? Whenever you go to he worked on the World Trade Center it It's all piping, all the pipes that are put in in a building that's going up to construction. So sometimes he's way up on the 80th floor, sometimes in the bottom. It's hard work, it's grueling work. So he did that for a long, long time. What did they teach you about work?

Because one of the things I want people to see here is I don't think necessarily that the average listener or viewer understands how meticulous a sculptor you must be about preparation to make what you do sound as easy as you make it sound. Well, you're making it sound harder than it is because when it's a labor of love, all my preparation, all the work that I do is about things that I just love the most. Basketball, I mean, I've done other sports in the past, but basketball is always the first love. So it doesn't seem like work. But you know, my father, I remember when he, you know, on Sunday nights we'd all be around

and he'd have to get up five o'clock in the morning the next day to go to work and he wasn't happy about it on Sundays. And I was a kid, I remember thinking, you know, he spends all this time at work and he doesn't really like it. Now, he liked the people he worked with, he realized he had an obligation to his family and worked hard, but he never really wanted to go to work because it was tough demanding work. And that struck a chord in me in that, all right, if when I get older I want to be at a job that I can't wait to go to the next day, and that's why sports came into that. But the fact that he just got up every day, he never missed a day of work. I can't remember. And he just, day after day after day. So the

work ethic that he had, I hope, is a big part of how I grew up. Not only for me, but for my brothers as well. All I heard at the dinner table growing up was my father complaining about work. So I was like, I cannot do something that makes me that kind of unhappy for a living. It makes an impression as a kid and you wonder why because you love the Man so much and you want to see him happy and he was happy. He was always happy But he he would have preferred maybe to do something else, but that's what he did It put food on the table raised six children. So

It's part of what it was but it makes you think like man How many hours a week is he at a place? He doesn't want to be was, but it makes you think like, man, how many hours a week is he at a place he doesn't want to be at? Oh, but you say, you did what I believe is a little bit of a, I don't know if you're a workaholic, I don't know you that way, but if you were a workaholic, that is a trick that a workaholic would use to say, it doesn't feel like work if you love it, and it's easier, Dan, than you think it is, because I love it, but it doesn't mean that the travel schedule and the amount of hours

you're putting in, that is not an easy job. It might be easy compared to a steam fitter, but the hours that you put in, people have no idea, Mike. They think you're getting to a microphone and just talking. No, that's one thing I'm gonna grant you today I work hard I'll admit I work hard. But people have no idea what that means though to explain to them what that means because that's flights you're doing a lot of games for 30 years you're in a lot of strange cities you're missing a lot of family stuff. Well the

last thing is is the hardest thing of the job has always been will always be even though my my children are all adults now all the time you spend away all the time you're on in hotel rooms on airplanes it's it's difficult and for people who don't fly on a regular basis and don't stay in hotels on a regular basis it's it can be it takes its toll especially the flying. So from that standpoint, though. No, and the work, though. Even though you love it, even though you love it, it can be something that pulls you away from your family

because it's hard to do well. Right, for example, like, there'll be an off night during the season. I don't have a game, I don't have to fly, but the team that I have coming up on my next game is on TV that night, so I have to watch, not have to but I want to watch the game to help me better prepare for that so during the course of the season it's just it's non-stop like every day you do a little something for your job whether it's reading whether it's

watching whether it's calling and talking to people but it's not this it's not hard labor it's and again it's talking and watching stuff that I love so much. But it does take up a lot of time. I'll grant you that one. How do you achieve balance? Well, I for years I did other things besides basketball. I did the NFL for a while. I would do some college, both football and basketball. But after a while, the grind of the NBA season, because it wasn't just Knicks basketball, which is where I started, then it became first on NBC, the NBA, and then ESPN. You know, for eight months, it's every day.

So I stopped everything else and would have four months off a year. And that, fortunately, is most of the summer when the kids were little, so that was it, and that's what made up for it, because the quality time you had then. You know, you hear all the same stuff, I'm sure. You know, you appreciate what you have more when you're away so much. So when I had those summers and the early falls,

you know, that's what got me recharged, because I couldn't do that 12 months a year, no, but also as you age, I would imagine you also appreciate a whole different set of things than you Appreciated when you were at your most ambitious this isn't to say you're not ambitious now But whenever it is you were most crazed about I I have to get ahead, because there's no way that you weren't at one point, you wouldn't have gotten ahead if you hadn't been crazed about getting ahead. Right.

The ambition changes as you get older, and the appreciation skyrockets. I've said this, getting older physically, I'm 62 now, getting older physically is really hard. The other day, we're in Denver last week, and I decided to play pickleball for the first time, and I tore a calf muscle. So getting older physically is brutal. But getting older emotionally is one of the great experiences of life, because you realize what's important, because you realize what truly matters.

And from that standpoint, it's just a wonderful time for me. Can you take me through some of the landmarks of places now that you've arrived at 60 where your gratitude so overwhelms you that you're more emotional about things than you've ever been before just because you're looking at life differently in your 60s than you have at been before just because you're looking at life differently in your sixties than you have at any other time. Yep. Well, my kids, and I keep calling them kids and I will until the day I die, they tease

me all the time that I get emotional at the drop of the hat now because everything, you know, for example, music, I'm crazy about music. Music is a big part of my life every day. So certain songs, certain lyrics make me think of things in my life. I get emotional listening to music. I get emotional watching movies. But the thing that is probably the common thread is all the people along the way. And you quickly realize, you you know people say I'm calling the finals it's an amazing thing and it is it's an honor it's a

privilege it's been exciting it's been thrilling but the number one thing for me the entire time and slowly I get there but I even realized it early were the relationships the lifetime relationships that you make and all the people that made a difference. When I was blessed to get the Kurt Gowdy Award, and you go up on stage, the line I used is, I wish I could bring all the people who are responsible for me being here up on the stage. The problem is, there is not a stage in the world big enough to hold that many people.

And that's the way I feel. And you really come to that realization as you get older. And it's like from little impacts to an enormous impacts. But there's every step of the way, every step of the way I've had somebody help me. I would imagine that that would be one of the lights on the pie chart that you would find wherever you find happiness is a fundamental gratitude. It's not even just appreciation, but that it's not about the ego of, I got here, I won these awards, I'm great at what I do, I'm special, I'm better than announcer X, I had a thousand breaks along the way, and I am so grateful for the love of those people. That's exactly it. Getting any individual award, for me, you're a little embarrassed

sometimes. I don't like the attention sometimes, but what it has become, it's become the great ability now. Once you get it, it gives you a chance once again to thank the people who are responsible for it and to show how many wonderful people you've had in your entire life and that that comes up time and time again and and not to belabor this story but Marcus Thompson you know Marcus Thompson just a brilliant writer with the athletic he just he bugged me for about a couple of months to do a story about the house fire my family went through back in in September. And I didn't want to do it. I didn't want to call attention to it

because we're fine. Everything is good. But he had a reason for pushing me to do it. And the reason was is what it came about. The bottom line to the whole thing was not that we lost our house and everything in it, but we found out once again an unbelievable reminder of how many just incredible people you have in your life and how people really do care. And it makes you fall in love with mankind again because, you know, I tend to take the optimistic optimistic look I think people basically are good are really good and care and it showed that that came flying flying colors came through for me and this is kind of this isn't boring to you no I read the I read

the story and I was moved by the story that Marcus wrote for a couple of different reasons I talked to the actor Michael Madsen we never even aired the interview he had just lost his house in a fire and was so emotional and crazed that he broke down several times just trying to grapple with the grief of losing a lifetime's worth of things that mattered to you, your family, that aren't replaceable. So the horror of that is one thing, but to read your appreciation for you to emerge from those ashes, not with the story of just profound woe is me, but, God, I felt so loved after that happened.

I felt so supported at what I imagine was a, you know, a pretty crushing time, even if it's just, even if people can dismiss it as saying, well, what are superficial things? Right, right. No, that's, that came clear right away. And any kind of, you know, the phrase I use, we were wobbling a bit there, but all the love and kindness, it strengthens you. It's incredible.

And to know people really care, they're not just saying, oh yeah, quick text. It's like real care and concern. And to have that, know that's out there for you and your family, man, that's overwhelming. It really is overwhelming. And you want to be able now, it's press me now, for other people who are going through, and I've always tried to be this way, but to be there for other people when they're going through difficult times because you realize the difference it can make because I certainly know what the difference it made. The NBA finals are here. DraftKings Sportsbook, an

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Earn points for paying your credit card bill in full and on time every month. Level up from bill payer to reward slayer. Terms and conditions apply. When did you know what you were going to do for a living? Not just the general feeling of I'm going to do something that I love, but that I'm going to achieve blank. Right about 15 or 16 thought about going into broadcasting. Again, when you grew up in a house, my dad was a huge sports fan and six boys. Sports is not, it's not something

you can choose. It's an obligation in the house. So we all played sports every day, all day, summers, winters, all different sports. So I loved it. And again, going back to what my father, not enjoying his job, I'm thinking I'm gonna get a job in sports. Now first, initially I thought I was gonna be a baseball player or a basketball player, but by the time I'm 14, 15, at least I realized that's not happening. That story's true of a lot of us who make their living around, not quite good enough to do it but can appreciate the excellence in the people who do do it. Right. So the the real bug

and and this is the interesting thing some of the people that have had the biggest impact on my sportscasting career nobody's heard of they're just people that came along my life there's a gentleman named Tony Manicola and we played with football every day during the summer on his block. He lived with his parents. He was in college, New York Tech, we were all in high school. And you know, it got hot during the summer so what we would do, we'd go hang out in his basement because it had air conditioning. And he built a radio station in his basement and played disc jockey, had commercials, records, you know, everything. Like it was a real radio station. It only went from one room to the next, but that was what he was into and that's what he was going to college for. And we used to hang out in the basement all the time and one day he says, hey, why don't you

come in? You want to be the DJ for a little bit and I'm like okay let me try it and I fell in love with it and I enjoyed being on the air and talking so my initial thought was I'm gonna be a disc jockey WPLJ was like the big rock station in New York back at that time and I thought I'm gonna be a DJ on WPLJ that was my first goal and then realized you what, this could also be sports on the air. And that's why I went to Fordham University for that, to see if I'd like the sports casting part. And the love of music that's in there somewhere, why and how is it reaching you? Like what

is it about music that tugs you the way sports does? I don't know if you know, for some people hear music it does nothing to For me right from the start and it again it was my dad He used to play his records all the time in the house and then that my older brothers started that so I went from listening to you know Glen Campbell and Tom Jones and Inglebert Humperdink that sexy as hell Right so those are the albums that I listened to with him. And then it became my older brother started getting into music and they were Jethro Tull and Springsteen and Emerson Lake and Palmer and stuff like that. So it's just everybody in my house

loved it. And just right away it just it grabs you and never lets go. And so you go to college to study broadcasting? You're still like where, when does sports get its hooks into you? Well, I went to Fordham because of the college radio station there. I was actually hoping to go to Emerson, but couldn't afford it. So Fordham was the second choice. And I think on a good day, it took me 12 minutes

to drive from my house in Yonkers to the Bronx. And I joined the college radio station to see if I'd like it. And there were a lot of really good announcers in the past. I know of obviously Ben Scully, the top of the list. And when I went there, I took all the sportscasting classes and see if I liked it. And I actually did DJing as well because I still thought that might have been a better path. You know, the sportscasting industry was so competitive and even my father

when I decided told him I wanted to go into sportscasting he had all his friends from other fields, construction, accounting, financial, called me and say they would offer me a job out of college because he heard all the horror stories that you can't get into this business but I told him I wanted to try I was gonna give it five years and if not then I'd you know join the steam fitters Union or call one of his buddies but oh wow so that's not exactly there could have been a lot of love but not a lot of belief necessarily that you were gonna be able to be good

enough to make it that way that didn't probably seem like a real job to him either no no and it I can understand that And it just was out of his love. He didn't want to see me, you know, be jobless and struggling in a field, because I was a fairly shy kid. So I think he's thinking, that's not the one. Like, I had a couple of older brothers that were much more outgoing than I was. And, but I don't think he thought that maybe this was going to be the one for me. And again, he just did it out of his love for me. I still feel though like I have in front of me someone who's a fairly shy kid. Like you said something about not liking attention when there's an award and I wanted to blurt

out. Don't go into television if you don't want attention. But it seems like you want wanna be so badly around the games that you will be on the edges of all of the attention and also kind of hide in the shadows because you don't ever wanna be the story. You don't ever want to, you want your, you have the confidence to know that what you're presenting

is what you want to be the story, that the way the tapestry is woven is what you want to be the story, that the way the tapestry is woven is what you want people to pay attention to, not you the shy kid. Yeah, it sounds weird to say that, you know, this is the business I got into and love it and have become obviously comfortable being on television. But it's different when I love talking about the players and the coaches and the game. I don't love talking about myself so much. But the interesting thing, so he's trying to get, my dad's trying to get me perhaps other things. So when I get out of college for the first

two and a half years it was a struggle. I wasn't making any money. I was doing more news, local news at a Poughkeepsie radio station. And after about two and a half years of being turned down for job after job, I called him up and I asked him to send me the steam fitter application because I just was tired of living by myself and up there and it wasn't going anywhere and I had a couple of jobs I thought I was going to get that I didn't. So the first wave of, all right, this is not going to work out. And he told me when I called him, he said, I thought you told me you were going to give it five years. And he goes, why don't you give it a little bit longer? So initially he talked me out of it, but now he saw how much it meant to me. So because there's a good chance if he didn't say that that day,

I'm getting a steam fitter application. I'm moving out of my apartment at Poughkeepsie and moving back home and becoming a steam fitter. Take me back there. Take me back to right before you're making the decision to quit. You're making the decision to, with sadness, I imagine, say give me the steam fitter application. You were right, Dad, I was wrong. I shouldn't have followed my heart. Right, right. I lived in this tiny little apartment in Poughkeepsie

and I think I was making $9,000 a year, something like that. So every month I had to get help for, see this comes across as a sob story and it's not. I'm asking the questions, Mike. You're not volunteering this. I'm doing it with a crowbar. I'm sticking a crowbar in the side of your mouth and extracting it from you.

Your reluctance is duly noted. Continue. Okay, don't yell at me. So it became difficult because I felt bad. I'm asking my brother, and every once in a while, my mother and father for money to pay for the rent. And again, covering Poughkeepsie town board meetings is not what I had in mind. I was doing some sports, but it just wasn't working.

And then the Villanova basketball play-by-play job came open and I put in for that. And I was told I was one of the final two candidates and I'm thinking this is it. And I get the letter was one of the final two candidates. And I'm thinking, this is it. And I get the letter that, thank you, but no, Bill Schweitzer, who was a great broadcaster, who I interned at WCBS when I was at Fordham, he got it. And that was kind of like the, this was the one I thought I was going to get. Because half the time you send out tapes and resumes, you don't even get a response. So it's very discouraging.

So at that point it was just really, really difficult thinking that I'm going to spend the next 20, 30 years in Poughkeepsie doing the radio station, doing news that I didn't want to do. So I wasn't depressed by any mean, but it was discouraging and I'm thinking I can't keep asking for money I've got a I've got to get a job that's gonna pay the bills on my own Is the not wanting to talk about yourself a combination of shyness and the job or is it one or the other? where You're sitting down for something that is meant to be

Revealing of who you are how you are what shaped you, whatever the discomforts of that are. Is it something else or you just don't like people knowing too much about you? You want to be careful about what people know about you? Or? That might be part of it. I actually think, and this is why I was, you know, half serious when I told you about, just run Ernie's interview again, because like I find Ernie fascinating and interesting. and even though I've been in this business for a long time and have been so blessed to have accomplishments Just like who'd be interested. I was asked to write a book Bob Wolfe's son Rick Wolfe who just recently passed away a

Wonderful man who was a book editor. He tried to get me to write a book for years. And my same response to him was, nobody's interested in a book that I would write. And that's kind of the way I feel. No, but that's not true. And I'll tell you why. You got to, you have to tell people what it is that you've learned because you have accrued a great many wisdoms across 30 years of doing this in this business. Yes, you've been around some seminal sports moments and yes, you have obviously things that are people are interested about if they're basketball fans. But you've learned some things about life that make you still do the job

with love. After your home burns down and all of the mementos that are in it and those people who are Loving you now Probably would enjoy hearing your gratitude in the in the pages that show love like it's You're telling me that your job is love story all of it That doing it as a labor of love that you couldn't have done it without the love of others, including your fathers, and who doesn't like to read a good love story? That's a great point, and you're right. You're absolutely right. For example, the Marcus

Thompson story. The thing I loved about that was that, first off, how important my wife was during it and my youngest son. He specifically mentioned them because I talked about them and how they were so instrumental in getting through it all. And then all the people to thank. And I wish I could have named them all by name. I threw some of them out there to him. But you were hurting, you said wobbling is the word you used.

You were hurting and you felt the love and support of others that made it hurt less, right? Like that's... Absolutely. I don't know what it's like to have your house burned down. I don't know what the pain of that is or how one recovers from that. Or I don't know the... Beyond the details I've read in the story, I don't think the audience knows the details. No, we were... My wife wife and I right before the season went to Napa Valley for a vacation with a couple a few couples that are friends of

ours and we're flying back on a Sunday morning it's an early flight from San Francisco which is about an hour drive from Napa so we had to get up about 430 and I had shut my phone off just so I could get a couple hours sleep and when I wake up there's all these texts on the phone. And they're mostly from my family members, my son, my youngest son, and my brothers. And I quickly found out from my son that the house is on fire. He was supposed to be at home,

but he was staying at our beach house. And so he didn't know the damage. So I quickly called our contractor, who had been at the house all weekend, because we were having work done. And I'll never forget this. I call him up, and I said, how bad is it? And he said, it's all gone.

And that was like, we're about to get on a six hour flight cross country, and that's, I have to tell my wife now, that it's all gone. Because we didn't know, we didn't know, is it just a fire in the garage, was a fire here? So that was, that was stunning, and the whole ride home, you know, we're just, I can't even describe the different things, all right, what do I have to do now? What's next? What's next? And you kind of take over, you want to take over as the husband and the father, that, all right, you're gonna make this right,. And then you land and you go and you see it. And that's a whole different thing, being told it's gone and then you see it and it's gone. So that was

really hard. And for me, the first few days, it just tried to be as strong as I could for my wife and kids in terms of, all right, we have to do this, this, this and this. And I called Doc Rivers, Doc Rivers' house burned burned down once and I just asked him. What are you thinking and He told me he says It's okay to let it go. He goes it's gonna hit you soon because I was trying to be the man of the house and He says but it's gonna hit you soon and Four days later. I just completely lost it. Completely lost it. But then again, you get these calls when the news got out.

I had over 500 texts the day the news got out. And it's just texts of what can I do? And it wasn't just, hey, I hope you're okay. I mean, these were people that really wanted to do something. And I had no idea what to tell them because I had never been in that position. But they, for me, and I've told them all this, it didn't matter what they said in the text. It didn't matter. It's just that they were reaching out and you knew that you, that they were there. And that's the part that strengthened you. Pete It is so incredibly stereotypically male to have your house burned down and do four days of how am I gonna fix this

in store instead of absorbing the emotions of you your family and everyone almost hiding in how am I going to fix this instead of grieving what has just happened immediately right right and and that's just the mode and that's what I got again for my father everything comes back so much to my father that's just the mode. And that's what I got again for my father. Everything comes back so much to my father. That's the way he would have handled it. Just, all right, what do I do next? How do I fix this? But everything's gone. What do you mean? There's no fix. Like, how do you... I have no idea what to do. First thing I had to do was get clothes. But here's where it

was different for me and then for many people who have to deal with this. So because of the success I've had at my job, we have a beach house. And it's like an hour and a half away from the home that burnt down. So instead of having to go into a motel and worry about insurance, we have great insurance and we have a beach house to stay.

So it's just different. And I felt, okay, we have the means to get through this. It's going to be difficult. There's a lot of things to do, but we have the means to get through this. You can be grateful for all of that and still have lost some things that can't be retrieved. Oh, there's no question. And still to this day, every once in a while, something will pop up being like, oh, okay okay, no that's gone too. And there were certain things that matter. I mean clothes doesn't matter and the things that you

don't think are important, like I saved letters. I love when people write letters. I like to try and write letters of thanks or whatever. And any kind of letter I received from somebody I saved, and those were all gone. And that was something that hurt. Certain pictures of the kids. Now, pictures are good because now they're all on the phone, but prior to that, when the children were little, those were gone. And those are the things that I missed.

So there's a lot of stuff that goes along. I remember, I remember, this is like five days in, this sounds so ridiculous. I'm looking at my nails and my nails have grown like so long and I'm, oh, I gotta, I gotta clip my nails. There's no nail clipper. Something so, so ridiculously silly as that. So everything had to be replaced. And that was just to try and wrap your head around that. And that's where my season started the next week. That's where my wife came in and she just took over. And she's-

Oh, you had to go. Yeah. The job calls. The job always calls. Right. The fire was on a Sunday. Thursday, we had our opening seminar, ESPN seminar in the city. And the following Monday or Tuesday, I had my first preseason game.

And I didn't have a single tie, suit, dress shirt, pants, shoes, nothing. And it all had to be done. So it was like... Oh, you didn't... So you spent four days worrying about fixing it without fixing shit. She fixed it all. You didn't do anything. You went and covered basketball games.

It's amazing You know I hit the lottery when when I married my wife Roseanne and she's to this day. She's the one that's handled the entire rebuild She's doing all that stuff while I you know took my drives to the airport to go call a game Well, how does that one work? What did she? Miss the most where are the places that there is no replacing whatever the emotion of that is when family history gets lost? Pictures with her as well. Certain things that her mother, her mother passed when she was young. Things that her mother handed down to her. Those were the

things. There's certain jewelry that she got from her things that her mother handed down to her, those were the things, certain jewelry that she got from her mother that meant so much to her. But she handled it really, I mean, she probably handled it better than I did in terms of, all right, let's go forward. She's incredibly strong, incredibly smart, and I just leaned on her. Were you not aware that people cared about you that way? Like what was... No, no, no, no, no, no.

I knew it, but not to this extent. And sometimes it's just a reminder. We all take things for granted. And I have so many friends that I'm so blessed with, but when they just come out of the woodwork, and it's not just a quick text or call, they're doing it over and over and over again what do you need what do you need it's it's incredible but not

working is never one of the actual options when you're built the way that you are correct right no there was no chance now both my employees at ESPN and and at Madison Square Garden Network they said come back whenever you want you know take your time just let us know when you're ready and You know it that made a difference too I did take off one preseason game because I was just a little overwhelmed with stuff, but you bum Lazy I thought I thought it was good to just off a preseason game get back to work But again, that's when you're when you're the people that you work for

in game. Get back to work. But again, that's when you're, when you're, the people that you work for, all they care about is, is that you're okay. And that was the case at the Garden and that was the case at ESPN. They just, you tell us what you need, you tell us when you want to come back. And that, that just was so comforting. What were the first big breaks after that, that came in your career that felt a little more like momentum as you came up? Well, the biggest one was, again, I'm in Poughkeepsie. I decide I'm going to give it five years. And back then, there was no sports talk radio.

All there was was the WFUV Fordham radio station had this talk show for 40 years and Art Rust Jr. had a show on WABC radio in New York. There was no WFAN, there was no Sports Talk and NBC radio decided to have a nighttime sports talk. They had Imus in the morning, Soupy Sales midday, Howard Stern in the afternoon and they're gonna have sports talks. Soupy sales in the midday, holy shit. How about that lineup? Okay, so this is the advent, if it's pre-sports radio,

we're talking about, what are we talking about here? Late 60s, early 70s, soupy sales? No, this is- Supe Sales is like a name from what? This is 85, 86. Okay, I'm sorry. But Supe Sales is from a different time. This was past his TV time,

but he was doing the radio there. And so they had a sports talk show that I heard about. I'm thinking maybe I could get in there. And I found out the producer was a young man named Chris Doyle who I went to college with but had lost contact with. I'm thinking it can't be the same Chris Doyle. So I called him and I said, listen, any job openings? He goes, no, not right now, but if something comes up, I'll let you know. So I continued the job in Poughkeepsie, which was six days a week. And he called me after a few weeks and said,

We need a producer on Saturday nights. So that was, I started working at WNBC radio in New York, the one day a week I had off from Poughkeepsie, and then it became two days, and it became three days. So that was the biggest break, and again, it's just somebody I went to college with. Every job I've ever received was through somebody that I knew, that I a relationship with and that's that was the theme throughout the whole damn thing. How soon after that were you doing actual play-by-play because you've got that requires a great deal of training, it requires a great deal of practice, sculpting to get good at, you can't just be put at a microphone and do it well. Right, well it was I I did mostly producing work,

but then I went to the program director and said, hey listen, I'd like to do reports from Shea Stadium, Yankee Stadium, Madison Square Garden, and he said, okay, we'll send you out there. So the sports talk show host was a guy named Jack Spector, and Jack would have me go out and cover it. So it became half producing, half announcing. Then it became more announcing than producing it was just a slow process and then they the big break was when they did a simulcast on the

MSG network and the producer on the simulcast was Mike McCarthy I was the producer on the radio cast so we became great friends and he got put up higher in the pecking order at the garden. And when a radio job came open for the Knicks to do the play-by-play, he went to their bosses and said, I got a young guy that we think is really good. And that changed everything. When did you realize you were good at it?

I thought I was pretty good at the radio. You know, when you grow up in New York and you listen to Marv Albert both radio and TV, something if that's what you want something stirs in you. I mean there's nobody better. No one's ever called basketball better. So you know I modeled myself after him but not like him and I thought after the first year I'm like, I'm pretty good at this. If you told me I was going to be the radio voice of the Knicks for the next 30, 40 years, I'd be the happiest person

in the world. And I would have been. The dream looked like what back then, though? Was it to be Marv Albert, something like Marv Albert? I thought I achieved the dream when I got the Nick radio job. And I remember Marv was still doing TV for the MSG network then, and he called me after I got hired, called my house. And I remember getting off the phone saying to my wife, Marv Halbert just called me to congratulate me. Welcome to the team. It's like, it doesn't, that dream doesn't get any better than that.

So again, that's what kind of, I never imagined doing full-time television. I thought radio was gonna be my gig. That's what I always did. And that would have been fine. How old were you when Marv Albert called your house to tell you you've arrived at your dreams? I'm gonna say 28. Okay, so that call on the landmarks of moving moments

that you've had where you remember the lighthouses of emotion, like, oh my God, I'm so happy that I'm here. I know that you probably feel a degree of that daily just because of the energy of being around what you get to be around, but at the beginning, what are the landmarks? When you see the person again now, it makes like, you see this person and you think, wow, back then, how they helped me, how they helped change my life. That's when I get the most emotional, when you get a chance to see. For example, Pat Riley, when I was a Nick Radio announcer,

I used to do this pregame recording with him. And you'd go into his office and he had dark lights and you'd go in you ask a few questions And then you'd leave there was no social banter But I learned so much from those interviews and saw his intensity etc So after the first year he gets I get I didn't think he knew my name But a week after the first year I get a handwritten letter from Pat Riley thanking me for the professional job I did that year and I thought that was just the greatest thing. Then he has his

four years of great success in New York and leaves to come to Miami and after the announcement I got another letter from him thanking me for four years of being part of a great journey. The letter meant so much to me that at a time when he was going through all this, he took the time to handwrite a letter to me. So I lost those letters in the fire. But my wife, and she didn't tell me right away, there were certain things when the people go in to try and salvage stuff, they found a few things. One of them was that letter. She had it sent to be restored and cleaned and stuff, and she just sent it to me the other day. And I get the letter and I look at it, and I just got so emotional

because of that letter. And I brought it to Pat before game one of the finals, and I showed it to him. And he got emotional as well well and that's when those things come up and when you see the person who made a difference because that later gave me confidence that Pat Riley thought I was good at my job. When you're an NBA play-by-play guy and Pat Riley thinks you're good, it gives a young man confidence and that's what came through and that's why I got so emotional. He appreciates both professionalism and craftsmanship. He probably saw very early on that you were made of a certain thing

that he respected and respects the fact that you take care in the work that you do. Right, and it makes a difference. It makes you, again It just it makes you feel okay. I can do this What else was found or recovered? The other thing that she didn't tell me about right away is I'm not a big memorabilia guy I've never really asked for autographs But one year the NBA had this Situation where they they let players put their nicknames on the back of their jersey It was they did it for one week. It was a cool idea

So ESPN when we were doing our games, they gave us jerseys Jeff Van Gundy had the notorious jvg Mine was the gray mamba Because of obviously my hair so I'm thinking you know what know what, I'm going to get, I'm going to get Colby to sign that. And he signed the jersey from one mama to another. And it was great. And I got to know him pretty well at the end of his career. And then even after his career, more so I did a couple of speaking engagements with him. So that one really meant something to me. And I was, that was one of the first things I thought of one about oh what did we lose and my wife found that they found that and that's being

restored as we speak. You are a fan first right? Oh crazy fan. Big Nick fan you know I always say when I was a kid my dad I thought he was the strongest man in the world and Dave DeBusha was the second strongest so I was loved De, my dad, I thought he was the strongest man in the world, and Dave DeBusha was the second strongest. So I loved DeBusha, loved Clyde Frazier, and that's another thing that just blows me away. When I was probably around 10, I bought a poster of Clyde, and I put it up in the garage where we used to have our weights for me and my brothers. And the poster is still up. My mother still lives in the same house that I grew up in. And the poster is still up. My mother still lives in the same house that I grew up in.

And the poster's still up. And now I've been working with the man for 30 years and he's become this wonderful friend. It's like you just, you can't make this stuff up. You don't understand. And you question like, why me? Why have I had all these blessings and have all these things happen?

Because that's not something you ever dream of. People I'm sure always ask you your best call or favorite call or whatever, but I'm more interested in the times that you've had to put the, or accidentally put the professionalism aside because the fan grabbed you. Because the fan, while you're doing the telecast,

while you're doing the broadcast, you're still the broadcaster who needs to nail the moment the important moments but the fan just grabs you and you're like whoa I got shifted there by the emotion of that and my professionalism got displaced. That happened a lot early because I was a Nick fan as a kid and every year they were competing for a championship the whole four years that Pat Riley was the coach. And there were some times where I thought I just, I was a little over the top, like be a little bit more. Even though it was a Nick radio cast in New York, you still have to main, you know, have

some objectivity. But I thought a few times that that it was a little too much. But that, you know, one thing Dan I'll say is I've been able to, for most of the time, maintain that. Even when I do Knick games early, big playoff games on NBC or ESPN, I think anybody listening would think, oh he's not rooting for the Knicks. He's clearly playing it down the middle the one time I thought that maybe I became too much of a fanboy was linsanity Because I've never seen anything like that

How somebody comes out of nowhere and becomes one of the most famous athletes in the world for about three weeks? And that's all it lasted It seems like it was longer and that was there was like pure joy in calling those games. And I think probably I came across as a bit of a fanboy during those. Whether it's a family member, friend or furry companion joining your summer road trip, enjoy the peace of mind that comes with Volvo's legendary safety. During Volvo Discover Days, enjoy limited time savings as you make plans to cruise through Muskoka or down Toronto's bustling streets.

From now until June 30th, lease a 2025 Volvo XC60 from 1.74% and save up to $4,000. Conditions apply. Visit your GTA Volvo retailer or go to volvocars.ca for full details. Do you get nervous before games? I still get nervous before game one of the finals every year. That's the butterflies and I didn't if I didn't have it I'd be I'd be worried but other than that you do it so often the only time I ever got nervous if I felt I wasn't prepared and oh that's never

possible is it? Every once in a while things happen where you don't feel you're as prepared as you always are. So there's a little feeling. The reason I laugh at you is because I'd like for you to explain to people what your preparation requires. I am crowbar-ing this out of you, but it's not possible for you to be as good as you are without you being over-prepared by X percent like there must be so much that doesn't get used My guess is not knowing anything but your work that you are wildly overprepared

That's exactly it and and you also have to know going in that what's in that folder right there? What is in that folder right there? This was the interviews we did today with the players That's not not 1% of that will make it into the broadcast. No, this stuff will. How much of that will? 10%. OK, that looks like the library Kevin Spacey had in seven of writing.

And it's not even going to be 10%. You're wildly overprepared for everything you're doing. That might be 10%. Dick Stockton, who I've looked up to as one of the great underrated play-by-play announcers of all time, all different sports, versatile, he gave me a great bit of advice. I was doing a game for Knicks TV, he's doing TNT next to me. I've got my ridiculous amount of notes sitting in front of me and I'm getting them all in order.

I look over at him and he has the game notes with like five just little things written and he sees me looking at it and he goes he goes I like how prepared you are and he says and I'm ready to go too he says but just remember he goes everything that you have to be worried about is on the court it's not down in your notes you don't want to have your head in the notes when something happens. And it was a great piece of advice. And you know, you put all these these hours in preparation in, but you have to let the game dictate what you use. And most of the time, if you use 15% of your notes, then that means it's probably a blowout and you had to go into the stories.

Because the game is still it. And you know when I listen and I tell young broadcasters this all the time, you can tell who's just doing the notes because they want to get all their information out. And I was like that early on, you want to impress. You want to impress your bosses, you want to impress yourself, you want to impress your colleagues, and then you realize you've got to let the game dictate what you want. But what I try and do, every game, you know, for example the NBA, they have 13 players who are eligible every game. Then they have, you know, two on the side, whatever.

If any of those 13 players have the game of their life, I want to have enough information to tell his story. So that's kind of the way I approach it. Do you look at anything that you have done in your past professionally with a regret, a call, a decision, anything? Do you look back on it and say this didn't go the way that I would have planned it now with the wisdom I have accrued now? No, I mean there are plenty of calls that I butchered and mistakes I made on the air but I think that's that's it's impossible for that not to happen. Were you gentle with yourself about it? No, not at first. I mean, the first however many years, it kills you, like just kills you, and shakes your confidence to the point where you're

thinking about it every night and if that situation comes up again, I hope I hope I can do better. I mean, it stays with you. You can't be as good as you are at it without being a perfectionist that way, right? It has to hurt. Right, and it should because you want to get better, but as long as you learn from it. But now as you get older, you realize it's live television, you're gonna make mistakes, and it's okay.

You have to just own up to the mistakes. I told this recently where last year, first game of the playoffs, Brooklyn played Boston. Jason Taita makes this great play at the end, wins the game for the Celtics. It was like one of the classic finishes. And I so butchered the call and I was really upset that night because I felt our team had one of the best telecasts we've had all year. Like everything clicked. And that's one of the real fun parts of the job when everybody from the producer, director, the camera people, the graphics people were all just kicking ass. And we did that day until I blew it at the end. So that's what

tormented me. And that took a couple of days. But then you realize, okay, you can get back into it. Last year, Mike Breen, consummate professional, was tormented for days? Maybe tormented is too strong. I didn't sleep that night. I was upset. I just, I wanted to do a game the next day so badly, just so I could get just back in and... It's a bit of a craze though. It's a bit of a, it's an insanity to... No question. Like, I mean, you've been doing this too long to have sleepless nights of torment because you haven't made a career-ending decision in the broadcast. You haven't made a career ending decision in the broadcast.

You haven't made a mistake that ends your career, but just you had a bad night. Yes. Or a bad ending to a bad night. But I guarantee you ask any play-by-play announcer and they'll tell you the same thing. Some might be better, but most that I know, I have some great friends that have done it, and we share the stories. Iain Eagle is a great friend of mine, Kevin Harlan, Brian Anderson, we talk about this all the time. And we're all the same way.

I have a friend who does this who describes that as spending the night eating his own right arm. Right. Like just consuming his right arm because of the way that you're ravaging yourself because you've been something less than perfect in front of people. Right. You let it go as you get older, you let it go. And I was better about it than I had been in the past. I'm not such an important game, but it's all part of the game.

What other advice have you gotten from broadcasters that has stayed with you? You mentioned that you, what did you say, was stocked? You said it was stocked and not Emberg, right? That obviously one of the best to do it. What are some other advices that you've gotten along the way from people that have been most helpful? You know, two were, that I love listening to and gave me advice. Vern Lundquist and Dick Enberg. Lundquist had a phrase, celebrate the game. And it's so appropriate. Because unfortunately, sometimes the game is bad. Sometimes you have to criticize players, coaches, refs.

But people are watching the game because they love basketball. They don't want to hear you just killing people all the time. It's a game they love. That's why they're watching it. So celebrate the good parts. And Vern was great at that. And he also helped in terms of telling you,

make the people feel like the guy who's sitting next to you or the woman who's sitting next to you, like your best friends, and are having just a time of your life together. And that I thought was really important. So that's something I did. The other with Dick Enberg was people want to know about the athletes that you're talking about.

So give them some personal anecdotes and let them know that these players, these young men in the NBA are human beings that have really interesting stories. So those two, you know, more than just the technique of doing play-by-play, those two things I thought were important. It must be strange to you, as fundamentally decent as you are, to see the coarsening in sports coverage when you're just trying to tell nice stories about an athlete who's human but you come from a tabloid city you've seen sports television become argument television you've seen Anthony Davis be amazing and majestic

but a source of just endless criticism it must be bothersome to you to watch what sports coverage has become. I hate it. It's journalism has become criticism and I hate that. That it's people feel that they have to be critical and to be considered a good journalist or to be a good analyst and there's so much out there that's you know it's it's difficult to put yourself in their positions. I mean we all make mistakes. I make mistakes on the air, players make mistakes on the court, and it just it's become too critical. And it's not just having to be critical, it's the words that are used in the criticism. You know, I've always felt I'll criticize somebody, but I'll only use

words that I would say to their face. For example, if you have a terrible game, you could say, oh boy, Dan, he just was awfully stunk. It was an embarrassment what he did. Or you can say, boy, Dan really struggled tonight. You're saying the same thing. It's just, it's a more humane way to say it. Why do you have to crush people while you criticize them? There's a more humane way to say it. Why do you have to crush people while you criticize them? There's a respectful way to do it, and I think a lot of people have gotten away from that, and that bothers me. Has it gotten meaner? Because you've worked in New York for a long time. The tabloids have played with this for a while. Basically, sports radio and sports

division was invented there. Sports radio has infected just about everything that is the sports coverage today. Yeah, no, it's definitely gotten meaner. Often there's a mocking tone to it. Unfortunately, that's what gets people noticed. And that's why when I find, you know, when I talk to college students who want to do this, that's something I bring up, and I use that expression I just said to you before, is like, only say something about somebody that you would say to their face if you had to.

Because if you're doing words that you'd be hesitant to say, write them face to face, I don't think you're doing it the right way. But you have watched and seen many of your peers, this doesn't happen to you a lot, just get wrecked by criticism. Darrell Bock You mean the broadcasters getting wrecked? Yeah.

Mike Hichs Yes, I'm talking about there is such a swell of all manner of emotion around sports right now and such a cruelty in the way that we absorb content with the advent, I shouldn't even say the advent of social media, but there's a lot of criticism on social media that would not be said to anybody's face and you manage a space in this ecosystem that somehow doesn't get a lot of what I'm talking about, which is that announcer stinks for all of these reasons. Right, no it's incredible., Twitter is just, it's toxic in terms of it gives people the license just to destroy people. And I guess it's the old thing, you know, people want to make themselves better by bringing

down others, excuse me, to their level. Five dollars. Don't pay any attention. It's just a fine for coughing into a microphone. It's an inside joke around here. You're gonna put the five dollars, you're gonna actually get the cash out of your pocket here and give us five dollars? You've got Van Gundy and Mark Jackson,

they're perpetually getting hammered. Those guys are perpetually getting beat up. They're more opinionated than you are. You're playing it down the middle, but they're part of the telecast is always something that's polarizing because there's a lot of people listening and they're going to get mad about something. Well, their criticism though, from what I view it at, is they have such a love for the

game so when they see a player, a coach, or a ref, or the league not doing something that's for the best for the game, that's where they criticize it because they want the best of the game that they love the most. And that's to me what makes them so good is they're not hesitant to make their feelings felt. But I also feel their love of the game comes out all the time. And I mean the criticism that they get, I have no idea. I think they're, you know for me it's a dream come true working with these two. We've been friends, all three of us, for over 30 years. And to do it this long with them sitting by my side, that's one of the reasons why I've had success. Because I'm with

two guys that I love as brothers, teach me about the game, and I'm so comfortable with them on the air. Do you tell them how you feel about them? It's so funny you say that because they don't like that kind of stuff. They're not interested. They know how I feel. They don't need me to say it. But just the other day before game one of the finals, I sent them both a text telling them how much they mean to me. But I specifically said at the end of the text, I don't want to hear anything back. You don't respond to this because it would be a mock. They would be mocking me for doing that. But they know how I feel about them. Why did you feel the need to do that right before that? Because I hadn't said it in a while. And that's kind of, you know, again, it goes back to what we were talking about before.

When you have kindness thrown your way and it makes you feel good, you like to show, you know what, I can do the same thing. Maybe I can make somebody feel good with a nice text or a nice phone call. And I just felt because I hadn't told them in a while and we've been doing it a long time and it kind of came because You know there was a press release about my 18th finals and I can't comprehend that That's not something I can process that I've been able to call the finals for 18 years. That's Beyond anything I could even possibly dream about and to do it with them

It just was a it made me feel boy how blessed I am to have these two next to me, and that's why I sent it. How do you feel about them? I mean, you've told me they're like brothers, but what does that mean? They would do anything in the world for me, and they know I'd do anything in the world for them. And that's on a personal note. On a professional note, the beauty of it is we can say anything to each other on the air

and nobody gets offended. And that's rare in the business to have that. And I think, again, because we came in the league the same time, Jeff taught me so much about the league as a coach when he was an assistant. Mark taught me so much about as a player and then as a coach. We watched our families grow up together. We just, and we spent a lot of time away from our families with each other. That it just, it's just been a special part of my life to have all this, these wonderful

things happen with them next to me and I can't imagine it being any other way. But you don't tell them that you love them. Oh no, Jeff would smack me if I told him, but they know I do. But it's not said between you. It's just funny because it's so obvious. You couldn't work together for 30 years without the level of understanding, appreciation,

respect, admiration that you have for them. These are difficult jobs. Man, these things splinter. They don't last 30. Friendships, some last 30 years, many last 30 years, but these work relationships can be fraught with all sorts of garbage. Right. But not everybody's comfortable verbalizing that stuff, and I I know that and if I think somebody's uncomfortable with that maybe I won't Say it as much. I'm like My dad was again go back to my father my father for for a marine construction worker was a very Affectionate man and was not afraid to talk about that and I got that from him So I'm very comfortable that with expressing emotions and telling people, but other people

aren't. So what did you admire most about your father? I used to watch, like we'd go to church on a Sunday as a family, and he seemed to know every single person in the church and would have a nice word for every single person. And they were all so happy to see him, John. So that, I really took that away. And plus his, and my mother as well, instilled a faith, we're Catholic, a faith in God that has guided me throughout my life. But I think with him it was that he just, he made everybody feel good around him and they were all so happy to see him. You're the same, no?

I've tried to live my life that way and you know, I've been, it's hard for me to say. I can't say that. Well, but you're your father's son, right? It doesn't have to... Like, if you've been purposeful about that, if you saw it in your patterning, if you admired it about him, if you learned it from him, it would stand to reason that you would see the importance of having grace in touch that way. Right. Yes.

So, yes, I've tried to be that way. I hope I could come even, you know, one-tenth of the way he was with people would make me feel good. How often is your faith tested? Wow, I'm getting deep on me here. It's tested a lot. You know, you question that all the time, and I think that's healthy. And I've had people who are in the Catholic Church tell me that is a good thing, you should question it.

So, yeah, no, that happens on a fairly regular basis. Pete The reason I ask the question is I'm wondering how often humanity disappoints you, because you made a point of saying, you know what, I think people are good. And I see examples again and again of people not being good. It doesn't mean they're capable, they're not capable of the former, I just see a lot of examples all the time of bad stuff happening to good people, and so I could see where even

the godliest of men would get rattled there? Oh yeah, you wonder. For example, last year there were some bumps. For example, I contacted COVID before game seven of the Eastern Conference Finals. So I missed game seven and then the first two games of the finals last year, Mark Jones filled in. And I'm like, all this time I don't get it and now I get it at the three most important games of the year. So I was upset with that, but okay, that kind of stuff happens. Then the fire happens. And okay, here's another thing to overcome.

And after that, one of my dearest friends from my early days in radio passed away from cancer. So that's the night I told you I just lost it. It's like one after another, and I'm saying to myself, what have I done here? Like why? Why is this stuff? And you quickly get past it because you just, number one, you have to, and number two, that's what my faith has taught me, that part of the road is really difficult. And in many ways, you show who you are through the difficult times. It's easy to be happy and great and gracious and wonderful, and as you keep saying, decent

to people when things are going well, can you do it when things aren't going well? I'm a little bit surprised, and perhaps I shouldn't be, because it requires a great level of care what you do, I will say it again, to make it all look that easy. But the idea that at this stage in your career, with everything you've done at work, that you wouldn't permit yourself to miss three games because you came down with a COVID virus that required you to not go to work because you can't work if you've got COVID. Like it's a bit maddening the the idea that you have to you have to be at work under all circumstances. Work is the important thing. These were important games, Dan. These were important games. When I think

you know how silly that can sound when real-life things happen. You're right on it and quite honestly two things I'll say to that. Number one, when I was stuck in my hotel room in San Francisco and I had to watch the first two games and it just looked so big and wonderful on TV, the Warriors and the Celtics, it gave me appreciation of you know what you've been so blessed to do this for so long. It showed me again how what a big deal this was to call these games, what an honor it was to call these games. That's number one. And then the other thing that you bring up off that,

because sometimes you focus so much on work, you asked me, regret, you know what my regret is sometimes, that maybe I did too many games. That maybe I should have been home. Because I missed dance recitals, baseball games, basketball games, birthdays. You know, my kids are, they're the most important thing in the world to me. And I missed a lot of stuff with them. And they're frequently at times from thinking, you know what, I was on the road too much.

Did I have to do it too much? Did I have to have that drive, that ambition to keep year after year doing so many games? And that's something that I'll always wrestle with. Have you told them that? Yep. Oh yeah, we talked about it all the time. And I used to say sometimes to them, I would say, and I'd have to talk with my wife, should I cut back?

Should I cut back on games? And she'd always tell me, no, no. And the kids, they love what you do. When you're home, you're home. You have the summers off. So that was something that I constantly kept with her. And I trust her word. And she was always good with that.

And I would always apologize to the kids. And they're like, no, dad, it's great. It's all great. There is not even a little bit correct of you anywhere in there, wherever the most fragile of broadcasting insecurities reside, that thinks to himself, man, Mark Jones could have replaced me there, could have replaced me forever. You know what I mean? Like we can be protective about our spaces, and if you leave, there aren't many jobs

like the one that you have, so if someone can step in there, you don't wanna lose it, and you also want to be someone who's giving with the space. Listen, I have confidence in my ability to do the job. I think I'm pretty good at it. But there's been a feeling all

these years up to doing the finals, all these years that somebody's going to say, wait a minute, we can get somebody better than him. And that's part of the drive of making sure you still prepare and want to be at your best. Because you think that, all right, you're easily replaceable. And if you do, and I'm very well aware of this, you take away the top announcer, yeah, people might be upset and say, oh boy, I miss him. That goes away so quickly. They're so easily replaced. There are, right now, there are so many great basketball play-by-play voices

that could do what I do easily. There's so many good ones. And I think it's important to know that you're easily easily replaced because it motivates you to just try and stay good and stay prepared and you shouldn't feel that anymore. You got it. No. You got it. You're okay. You got it. You can you can get a little a little lazier and it'll still got it. You can take half that many notes and you'll still be okay. Alright, I'm going to throw something back at you. You're not going to remember this,

but this was during LeBron's time in Miami and everybody was writing stuff about LeBron. It got to the point where what else can you say about him? And you wrote a column on him that was, I was blown away by it. It was incredible. And again, considering all the things that had been written, and I saw you the next day, and I said to you, listen, that column today, I said it just, it was perfect. I said I've never seen him put, you know, the way you described him and what he was and what he was going through, it was perfection. And my question to you was, do you know when you hit send to your editor, do you know this one? Now this one I nailed, this one was special. Do you remember me saying that

to you? I remember that you were effusive in your praise. I don't know what my answer was to that. I could answer it now, and I don't know if it would be similar to… All right, tell me your answer now. I…what real confidence is for me in writing, where I have my most confidence, is in trying to live up to the standard of my father who was a man who did not do pleasure, and I was somebody who was always trying to please him, I eventually got to the point in my writing and few other things where if it met my standard and I hit send, I knew when it was good and there was great reward in that.

I can't imagine that I would share that with a stranger though at the time who's just giving me a compliment. No, what you said was I don't hit send unless I feel it's that, which is kind of similar. But I remember first I'm like, ooh, there's no way. I mean, this article was perfection. There's no way. You got to know that it's that it's different and then I realized and it's part of the way I try and think is You you don't want I don't want to go on the air unless I'm so fully prepared and ready to go Just like you're not gonna hit that send button unless you feel that you've done everything possible to make that a perfect column But I don't write anymore.

I know. Because it's hard and you're still out here doing it. You're still out here doing it, worried that when you miss three games you're not at work. Damn it, you need to be at work. Mike Breen needs to be calling the big games in basketball. He's been doing it very well for 18 years. I promise. I'm getting better at it.

I don't believe you at all. No, no, no, no, no. That's true. I'm much better than I used to be Where you so you are totally insane person To get to where you got to at your 20s in your 20s You must have been driven beyond all reasonable measure by ambition. No No, I don't I've always felt that I have a really good balance that I know what's my family's the most important thing in my life and I've

managed to be able to do that. There's just, you know, there's just in the business that I came and nobody knew who I was and I had to work really hard to get there, to get people to take notice and then respect, you just feel you have to continue to do that because that's how you got there. So the idea of like, you know, laying off the reins a little bit, I just can't, because I still do the same amount of work every game. Well this means that you can't even imagine your retirement from here, correct? No, no, that's different. I'm going to surprise you here.

I'm not going to be somebody who's doing a crazy amount of games well into later years. I do and I owe it to my wife to be able to have more time with her because the kids now are out of the house and she's the one that has held the fort for so many years that I want to be able to have her be the one to decide what we're doing, where you want to go, all the different things that she's wanted to do. John Stockton, when he gave his, that's $10, John Stockton, when he gave his Hall of Fame speech,

I remember him saying, the key for my career was, every time I walked out the door to go to the airport, I knew everything was taken care of at home, and that's the way I felt my entire life. How would you as we get out of here, how would you articulate for us what that love is of building a family, building a home, building a life in support of your dreams, your family, and your faith? How would you articulate that to to people who don't understand what it's like to be married to a man who's on the road how many days a year? I never counted, don't ever want to count.

Again, it goes back to growing up in a house that had a chair of problems and we didn't have means, but again there was love every day and to see my mother and father and all my brothers, and it was such a wonderful, caring, loving home, that was like a dream. I thought, boy, it would be wonderful to have. And then you hit the lottery by meeting a woman of your dreams, have three children together, and have this incredible life, and she has to sacrifice so much for the first five years of married she made a lot more money than I did and then when she had kids she gave up to be home with the kids and to share that and grow

that's that's the the greatest to come the greatest accomplishment of my life is the family that that I want to say've raised, but she did more of the raising than I did because I was away. But also she was supporting you being happy chasing your dreams, right? Every step of the way. Every step of the way. She's the most incredible, selfless, smart, funny woman, crazy sports fan. It's just of all the blessings that I've had, the day that I was set up with her by a woman I work with on a blind date, and that's the number one blessing because it led to everything else. How did it go over when you came home after

botching the Tatum call? Was she supportive or was it, oh what a bag of shit you were crying? No, she knew she knew how much I'd be upset about it. So when I called her that night, she knew exactly. And she's always oh, no, it's okay It's okay, but she knows that whatever she says it's not gonna help. You're still eating your right arm Guys are crazy. You can't be as excellent as he is without caring that way Mike. Thank you so much It was good having this conversation with you. I enjoyed it. I so appreciate it I hope it wasn't too boring, but... You're a little self-conscious about boring, like what is it, you're trying to stay so

far out of the way, like what are you doing there? Mike Breen's story is interesting and his work is fantastic and I wanted to show our listeners the man behind the work, at least a little bit, because you're a bit concealed. People don't know a lot about you. This is good for you. People, you're not polarizing. You get to somehow skate through this entire cruel wilderness of sports relatively unscathed. And it's, I believe, because you carry yourself with a very decent aura that makes it hard to dislike you. So thank you for sharing your time with us today.

Thank you, Dan.