The Dan Le Batard Show with Stugotz - The Six Defining Games of NFL Week 14; Deshaun Watson Cleared to Practice & Von Miller Speaks on Parsons

Episode Date: December 5, 2025

Deshaun Watson returns to practice for the Cleveland Browns. Daniel Jones continues to battle a fractured fibula. And first place on the line in AFC North (Steelers vs. Ravens), the AFC South (Colts vs. Jaguars) and the NFC North (Bears vs. Packers). So much drama! Thankfully, we have Sports Illustrated NFL Staff Writer Matt Verderame to walk us through the Top Six NFL Games of Week 14. Then Pro Bowler and future Hall of Famer Von Miller stops by for a can't miss discussion on the state of pro football. (He has a new pod out, too. Give Free Range a listen.) Dave Dameshek and The Super Fuentes Brothers have all you need to plan your weekend right on Football America! (Photo by Kyusung Gong/AP) Timestamps: (00:27) The Best 31 in Sports + Pick Six (03:56) Von Miller (25:10) Top Six NFL Games with Matt Verderame AUDIO Football America! is available wherever you listen to podcasts. Leave us a 5-star review on Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/football-america/id1831757512 Follow us: Dave Dameshek: https://x.com/dameshek Matt Verderame: https://x.com/MattVerderame Von Miller: https://www.youtube.com/@VMStudio58 Host: Dave Dameshek Guests: Von Miller, Matt Verderame Team: Gino Fuentes, Mike Fuentes, Bradley Campbell Director: Danny Benitez Senior Producers: Gino Fuentes, Mike Fuentes Executive Producer: Bradley Campbell Arizona Cardinals, Atlanta Falcons, Baltimore Ravens, Buffalo Bills, Carolina Panthers, Chicago Bears, Cincinnati Bengals, Cleveland Browns, Dallas Cowboys, Denver Broncos, Detroit Lions, Green Bay Packers, Houston Texans, Indianapolis Colts, Jacksonville Jaguars, Kansas City Chiefs, Las Vegas Raiders, Los Angeles Chargers, Los Angeles Rams, Miami Dolphins, Minnesota Vikings, New England Patriots, New Orleans Saints, New York Giants, New York Jets, Philadelphia Eagles, Pittsburgh Steelers, San Francisco 49ers, Seattle Seahawks, Tampa Bay Buccaneers, Tennessee Titans, Washington Commanders Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

All right, my fellow football Americans, we have it a moment to waste. It's NFL week 14, rivalry week plus on Saturday championship games galore in college football. Let's jump right into it. Not in a minute, not after breakfast. Now! NFL week 14 featuring big time rivals and big time games and in college football championship weekend. Like I say, welcome to Football America. Episode number 31 were presented as ever by Draft Kings. Draft Kings, the crown is yours. And fellas, we have a lot to get to. Von Miller, like we say, Sports Illustrated's Matt Verder. I'm our old pal. But first, we have to honor the player who wore the episode number best. Like I say, episode 31. Welcome back, Gino Fuentes, from your

your journey to Columbia, where I assume you enjoyed some nice turkey while you were there. I've got among NFL guys, Camp Chancellor, Donny Shell, the Hall of Famer, Priest Holmes, Jamal Lewis, am I forgetting anyone? NFL-wise, no, Jamal Lewis would have been my first one out of the gate. But how about Dave Winfield, MLB legend? 3,000 hits, 460-some home runs, drafted in three sports. Yeah, that's right. Yeah, great piece of trivia there.

So was the guy who tried to draft him, Bud Grant up there in Minnesota long ago. Reggie Miller as well. How about you, Mike Fuentes? Greg Maddox. Greg Maddox, a very strong one from the hockey world, one of the great netminders we've ever seen, even though he had a higher goals allowed total. That's because he played on a team that really shot it out most nights in Edmonton. Grant Fier, also Mike Piazza. There you have your 31s. And before we get to Von and Verdam, it's time now for this week's pick six, presented as ever by our pals of Draft Kings. Draft Kings, the crown is yours.

Let's give everybody a holiday treat, shall we, Mike and Gino, Gino and Mike. Six guys that I like to do it now, touchdowns. You do it how you want to. Here are my picks. Derek Henry is going to find the end zone at least once. He has four touchdowns in his last three against that bummed. Steelers rush defense. This seems like a gimmy. Same goes for James Cook, who just cooked that same Steelers defense. He'll get into the end zone against the Sari Bungles defense. So will his

pal Josh Allen. Now, two touchdown throws, Joe Burrow in what figures to be a shootout up there in Western New York. Bake versus the Saints. It's been three games since my guy baked through multiple touchdowns. He gets off to Schneid. And lastly, Jordan Love versus Chicago, he has six touchdown throws in his last three games. He continues to roll against the arch rival Bears. Any changes you want to make? Have at it, fellas. I'm going to take out Derek Henry,

and I'm going to throw in Quinshawn Judkins here. Tennessee's awful. Tennessee's going into straight-up tank mode. This game is in Cleveland anyway. And when they get inside the 10-yard line, the Browns, I mean, they take the quarterback out. They just don't want any errors. So they just put Quinshawn in and have it rush it in.

Yeah, a lot of Wildcat for Jenkins. And the Browns are feeling. good, too. Deshawn's coming back. Everything's possible. Mike, how say you? There's no way Deshawn wants him plays. That's impossible. Not this seat. Yeah, I'm going to go. But enthusiasm must be, must be overflowing. Yeah, I'm going to go with Jackson Smith and Jigba, JSA. He had a terrible game, last game in the Minnesota. He's going to want to show out and continue his pace. So he's going to go over 90 and a half yards. I know he should pick touchdowns here, but I feel really strong about

the JSN pick. All right. Let's talk about one of the real hot teams right now. In fact, and contention for the number one seed with one of their greatest stars ever, Von Miller. Hi and hello, my fellow football Americans, I hope your Thanksgiving was as grand as mine was because we officially tapped into the holiday season and cracked open. Miller Light, and I don't mean just one, family, food, football, all great. The holidays aren't about stuffy get-together's dinner parties unless they're the kind that you want to go to or work parties. that you're required to be at.

They're about those unexpected side quests and spending time with your loved ones. And for me, my loved ones are named Miller Light cans. Miller Light is the original light beer trusted by beer lovers everywhere for 50 years thanks to its clean, finish, simple ingredients, an iconic golden color.

And this year there's another holiday we're celebrating. It's Miller's 50th anniversary. And with only 96 calories and 3.2 carbs per 12 ounces, it's a great choice to let loose without weighing you down like all that food will and did quite frankly last thursday but no apologies here the best holiday beers are the ones you don't expect miller light great taste 96 calories go to miller light dot com slash fb a bade to find delivery options near you this is a great option

otherwise go to the traditional path pick up some miller light pretty much anywhere they sell beer tis miller time and please always remember to celebrate responsibly miller brewing company Milwaukee, Wisconsin, 96 calories, and 3.2 carbs per 12 ounces. Hi, hello, and happy holidays, my fellow football Americans. A quick detour away from Pigskin to remind you that the NBA season is also underway, and it's really heating up. And Draft King's newest game, PICS, is the easiest way to play for your shot at big wins. NBA stars are lighting it up.

Why aren't you? Turn their highlights into your shot at cash. Here's how it works. You just pick more or less. two or more player stats, the better your picks, the bigger your payout. So, nail your picks tonight, and don't just win, stack up those payouts. And get this, new Draft King's customers, get $50 in pick six credits with just a $5 entry on your first pick set.

Now, don't just watch basketball, pick, play, cash in. Download the Draft King's Pick Six app now and use Code Damashek. That's Code Damashek, D-A-M-E-S-H-E-K. Play just $5. Get $50 in pick-6 credits. make the call ride the upside in partnership with draft king's pick six the crown is yours i once gave this guy a cello way back at the nfl honors i gave him another gift as well at another NFL honors either way in a few years he's going to be getting a gold jacket and in the meantime he's got a new or newish

podcast with odyssey it's called free range with von miller and his name just so happens to be von Miller. What's happening, man? How are you? Good to see you. Howdy guys. I'm doing good. I appreciate you guys for having me. Sure thing. And, you know, when you consider the name Von Miller in pro football terms, your brain immediately goes to the Lombardi that you won in 2015 with the Broncos. But really, the two Lombardies that you won, nine sacks in the two post seasons that ended with you hoisting that trophy up. Do you believe for a past, for a past, rush or anyone really beyond quarterback. Do you believe in the idea of clutch?

Yeah, I think after you experience it a couple of times, you start to believe it. You start to drink the Kool-Aid. Like whenever you play in big-time games and big-time moments and you have success consistently, you just start to like believe it. So yeah, I like the, I like the term, you know, playoff. You know, it's looking tough for us right now. But I like, I like, I like, I like playoff a lot. Speaking about that Super Bowl 50 team, Peyton Manning was a great name brand and remains one, but I think even he concedes that you, the defense, though fly zone and all the rest of it, kind of carried him along the way there. What do you think about people like me who kind of, I respect the analytics and all of that, but I think that they have all added up to take

away the drama of the postseason, which is those small moments or those, those singular moments that define the entire career. Do you think that it's appropriate to weigh those moments most heavily when you evaluate whether or not a guy's a Hall of Fame or? It just, it really just depends. You know, there's some quarterbacks that I feel like are Hall of Fame quarterbacks that have never won a Super Bowl. And, you know, usually you'll say, like, you got to win a Super Bowl, like to be like one of those guys or have like one of those big moments in the postseason to be like a Hall of Fame all time great but you know I played against plenty of quarterbacks there's a lot of quarterbacks that I respect that I feel like should be Hall of Fame

quarterbacks that never had those moments so it just it really just depends who well I put you on the spot who would those guys be I mean I guess well I can answer for you a little bit Lamar and Josh Allen come to mind. I think they're both, I think both they're both safely going to get gold jackets at this point, right? Yeah, I mean, those guys are going to have multiple opportunities to win Super Bowes. And my bet is that both of those guys will have at least one Super Bowl

by the time it's all sitting and done. I was thinking along like, you know, a Philip Rivers. Yeah, like, you know, a guy like Philip Rivers that I received. respect a lot, respect his game. He's a Hall of Fame quarterback, in my view. Never had that opportunity to, like, get in the postseason. He's been in the postseason, but Super Bowes and, like, to be able to hoist the Super Bowl trophy,

never had the opportunity. But in my opinion, he is a Hall of Fame quarterback. Man, Phil Rivers, that one year where LT was hurt up in Foxborough, they were the better team heading in there, but LT couldn't go and had to yank himself after the first drive. But Phil Rivers standing out there all day on the bum knee and everything else. That's borderline Hall of Fame sort of behavior by itself. Okay, so like we say, you have not one but two Lombardies.

And a spoiler alert, you are going to get a gold jacket. I hope that doesn't diminish the drama when that day arrives for you. But let's say, Vonn, you can only have one. Which would it be, the Lombardy or the gold jacket? I would rather have a Super Bowl's, man. And, like, you know, to be able to, you know, share those small moments, like, with your teammates and be connected for life, like, there's nothing like it. Like, now I just, you know, get nostalgic and, like, reminisce on, you know,

how dope it was to, like, win a Super Bowl with Peyton Manning and Matthew Stafford and Aaron Donald. And, like, I'll always be connected to those guys. Like, for that one game that we played for the rest of life, we will always be connected through those wins and you know I'd be old and crispy and still you know be able to like point to my great grandkids like

hey I won the Super Bowl like that one time so I would I would say like you know a Super Bowl Super Bowl win is a little bit doper for me I would like to have both though so Super Bowl 50 you have the spectacular

performance you're the MVP of the game and all of that from a fashion standpoint now that we're on the subject of fashion why 58 then 40 now 24 if you go to another team after this year what can we expect like two or something like that no I would like to say well I think 58 is just done 58 is I only wore 58 because I couldn't wore 40 and you know Derek Thomas wore 58 and I loved his game model my game after him I was a fan of Derek Thomas like that was like my guy and you know he wore 58 I couldn't wear 40 with the Denver Broncos at the time now you can but I couldn't war 40 at the time so I wore 58 and you know

that was my 11 years in Denver like that's over with and done 58 is done Denver only. I was 40 my whole entire life, high school, college. Tried to be 40 in Denver, like I said, it didn't happen. So when I went to the Los Angeles Rams, war number 40, when I went to the Buffalo Bills, war number 40. And, you know, I just kind of wanted to, I really like, you know, Kobe and, you know, Champ Bailey played here. I was going to ask you if it was a champ thing, yeah. Yeah, huge fan of Champ Bailey. like, and I just like the way, like, the two and four, like, looked in a Washington commander's jersey.

So, Kobe, champ, here in Washington, like, it makes you look a little bit slimmer, and, yeah, I went with 24. It's funny to say that because, generally speaking, I found that guys who are great at sports, professional level, don't necessarily, aren't as fascinated by. watching other people play the sport that they've dominated. And so it is striking that you do care about other sports. And I remember when you were coming into the league that Derek Thomas clone and this is the guy who looks up to and all of that. But really, you mentioned Kobe, who modeled his game after Michael Jordan, and really in so many ways in terms of style and the mid-career adjustment that they both made. And even in the way they comported themselves around microphones and everything. They really did. You are, I hope this comes off as a compliment,

you are really as much like Derek Thomas as anyone I've ever seen play pro football. I mean physically, if you had the same uniform and number on it, it would be hard to distinguish one from the other. That's cool, man. Yeah, like I watched all his videos on YouTube like over and over and over, watch this game film, watch his interviews, like, I've seen so much of Derek Thomas. Just anything that

anything that Derek Thomas was involved in that you could search and look up, I've seen it. I count eight guys from 2011 getting a gold jacket ultimately. Do you care about that draft class? Do you

like to brag to other guys about I was a part of what maybe goes down is the greatest of all time. Yeah, I like to, you know, I like to hold it up in the area and brag about it. That draft class was amazing, you know, from start to finish.

And even in like the second round, in the third and fourth round, like that whole entire draft had gems in it. You know, Richard Sherman was in the draft. I think he was a fifth round pick. You know, you got guys like that in that draft that have contributed to, to the sport.

What I like to, when I think about Hall of Fame players, the one rule that I like to go by that makes a guy a Hall of Fame player or not is

2,000 years from now, 4,000, 5,000 years from now. Say if you have like somebody looking up what humans did, right? How humans are it was. Oh, we're going to be gone? Our species will be erased? I mean, just think of,

if we moved on to something else like okay okay different part of the universe they're looking at like humans what do they do like oh they play football basketball and you look up like football and the history of football like um the history of the NFL like can you tell the story of the NFL with or without that player like if you can't tell the story of the NFL without saying that player then I feel like he's a Hall of Fame player. If you can tell that story to, you know, 5,000 years from now, if you're going through the history of

the National Football League and you can tell that story without that player, I feel like he's not a Hall of Fame player. And, you know, some players fit in there, it could be like one play. Like, you say, for instance, like Odell Beckham, like that catch, like that catch, whenever

people look up the history of the NFL, that catch will always be involved in telling the story of the NFL. So it's little things like that that make it interesting for me, but that's the rule that I like to tell myself. Can you tell the history of the game with or without that player? That's a good measure. Rod Woodson told me forever ago that you have to have been at least for one season the best or at worst the second best player. at your position, which is not as grand as the way you put it 4,000, 5,000 years from now after the humans have departed the planet Earth. Either way, an interesting measure there. So one more question about Cam Newton because he's been outspoken about a guy in your

division, your current division, Jalen Hertz. You have to win one game. Jalen Hertz or Cam Newton? Who does Von Miller take? So when I think about Super Bowl 50, right? You know, we played to that level. Cam Newton got that out of us. Like, if Cam Newton wasn't Cam Newton, we would not have played that great. Like, we understood that we had to be at our very best to have success that day. Like, Cam Newton at his prime, like, you can't tell the story of the NFL without, like, Cam Newton.

Like, he was a special player. he brought it out of you like play cam noon three times and he brought it out he he brought it out of me like i knew i was going against a great player i knew i was going against one of the best players and he's bigger than you too that's that that that had to be the weirdest thing for you is the quarterback's bigger than i am he's big he's fast he's strong like you know i knew that we had to be on point to have success so i would go with cam newton like he was a special player So now Akami, make a choice for me. Who's going to win the division?

The Eagles are the Cowboys. The Eagles are kind of slumped right now. But the Eagles have done that in the past. They have been up and down and made to the Super Bowl, been up and down and won the Super Bowl. So, you know, Coach Seriani, he does an incredible job. Jalen Hertz is an exceptional player. They've got exceptional weapons all over the place,

offensive line, defensive line, wide receivers, cornerbacks, safeties, linebackers, exceptional coaches. I would have to, you know, think that the Eagles will get it together and somehow get through the division. I'm inclined to agree with you because the Cowboys obviously have some more work to do. I do wonder, though, where you come down, given the high-end performance you've delivered it as a pass rusher. And by the way, on your new show, Free Range, I do like when you have

the powwows with other great pass rushers. That's fun stuff to check out from a distance. But do you think ultimately that Jerry Jones made the right decision to trade away Micah Parsons? Yeah, I think he did. And I think that just, I think it was a win-win, for one. It was a win-win. Micah got what he was deserved, and Jerry Jones got a defensive tackle that needed defensive tackle help. They've been knowing that for years that they needed big-time defensive tackle help, and he got draft picks.

So I think that decision was kind of already made. They just kind of like drug it out. I think whenever you have the highest-paid quarterback in the NFL and the second highest-paid wide receiver, in the NFL, those decisions kind of make themselves. If it were me, I just simply don't believe

in having the best quarterback, the highest paid quarterback, and the highest paid wide receiver. Like, you know, it don't, that, I would rather,

in my GM Vaughn sense, I would rather trade the Y receiver and get two Y receivers. Say if that's a $30 million Y receiver, I'd rather just get two 15 million dollar wide receivers and have the highest paid 60 million dollar quarterback like that makes

more sense you know to me if that cuby is worth that loot not just because he's reached that spot in his it's his 60 years so you have to pay him out because we use the first round pick on him in that logic is he actually the genuine article and worth that kind of bank yeah exactly if i'm if he's worth that that i don't need to have the second highest the highest paid wire receiver you know So I would always, you know, bet on defensive guys. You know, Micah and guys of that caliber can really create their own magic. They don't have anybody throwing in the ball. We saw last year when DAC was injured, like, everything just went downhill.

Like, you know, you don't have a wide receiver is dependent on, like, somebody throwing in the ball. Like, if you have a big-time defensive player or offensive line, anything, like, anything. like that, offensive line, cornerback, you know, those type of players, they are not dependent on like an extra element to be successful. So, Bo Nix, do you buy, we talk about the genuine article or a guy who was just taken in the first round, and so you build around him. Is Bo Nix capable of getting to a Super Bowl and winning it? Yeah.

The combination that you have to have, and when we think about those other Super Bowl teams, organizations, Kansas City Chiefs, Patriots. You've got to have a quarterback. You've got to have the head coach. You've got to have the defense. The Denver Broncos have that right now. And they are firing on all cylinders. And they have a really good team.

And it's special to watch from afar. Like, I'm so glad that I'm through with that game. Then I can go back to being a Denver Broncos fan. like 60 minutes 60 minutes last night like I had to like you know hate them and I wanted to win like so bad like it's still like on my back like right now I'm still like sick about it but I'm kind of glad that I'm through with it now I can go back to being a Denver Bronco fan where my heart will always be well so you're going to get to watch all that now as a fan and look in the rearview mirror at that and as you play out in in DC what's changed over the decade and a half since you got to the league. What are the most fundamental sort of differences, not for you as a professional

but league-wide? There are more cameras. There's always been cameras. On you, too. There's a camera on you right now. There's always been cameras, but now there are so many cameras and they catch everything. And that's why, like,

you see guys getting spit on now and like punches below the bill and like you see so much now and honestly all of this stuff has been going on

for the history of the NFL but now like cameras just they have a camera just about every player on the football field like everything is seen that is

that has changed that is different I think just the overall exposure it gets bigger, more reach every single year. And just the players, like, they just get bigger, faster, stronger, like, every year.

Like, you thought six foot corner was big back in my day, now that it's six four. Now you got Patrick Sartan, J.C. Horn, singly. You thought, like, you know, defensive tackles were fast and athletic, like with JJ Watt. Now you got Jalen Carter and you had guys like that. And you thought defense events were crazy,

like Michael Strayhand. you know, Elvis Dume Reveal, like Dwight Freeny. Now you got Aidan Hutchison and Miles Garrett. Like, they do get bigger, stronger, faster. It's wild, and that's just a decade and a half. I'm old. I remember watching number 58 Jack Lambert play. If you put him on an NFL field now, he would look like the size of your average

kicker. A couple more real quick for you, and then we'll call it a day. Again, back to fashion. Best you uniform Vaughn Miller's gotten to wear. You can include A&M if you want to, although that would be the wrong choice. I think going to the Rams, like it was just, it was new and it was special. Like, it was different. I had been orange and blue my whole entire life.

And now you're like this neon yellow and this neon blue. Like, I thought that was so cool. And then we had the cream, we had the off-white, like. I like those. People always get down on that. I think they look pretty cool. They call it bone, like the bone colors. Like, it was just so different.

Like, and I had been in Denver for 11 years. Like, you know, and orange and blue is cool and dope in its own right. Like, to be able to wear all orange, like, that was super cool, too. But, like, you just kind of get, like, numb and, like, use to those colors after being there for 11 years. Now, it's like, bro, I love the, I love the Denver Broncos colors. Like, I got orange and blue, like, running in my veins. Like, I love the Denver Broncos, like, seeing those uniforms, especially, like, the new ones, like, and the new variations, and doing the old-school, like, powder blue with the orange, like, man, it's so cool and so dope. But for me, the coolest uniforms that I've put on were, you know, all the uniforms that we wore in my time with the Los Angeles Rams.

Enjoy the rest of this season. Can't wait to see what you do on the other side of that. In the meantime, keep having fun. with the podcast. Free Range is its name. It's real good stuff. I was checking it out last night and today it is entertaining for a football fan, especially one who roots and has rooted for Von Miller along the way. Easy to do that. One of the more fun guys in pro football for the last decade and a half. Thanks for the time, man. Thanks, pal. I appreciate you having me. There he goes. Number 24, I think, number 40? Number 40. Let's go with that. Good luck to the

Aggies. Hope they don't catch my alma mater, the Indiana Hoosiers. It'll be be a quick postseason for them if they do. Giga. All right, good times await the next 15 or 20 minutes of your ears. He's a writer for Sports Illustrated. He's the host of the Matt Verteram show on Patreon. There's a Patreon. I still haven't learned after all these years how to pronounce it.

Either way, he's also the host of that football show on KC Sports Network. He's also a strong candidate to get the Shecky Award. for our favorite non-player guests this season, despite his affection, for the ever loathsome New Jersey Devils. It's our old pal Matt Verderom. How are you, fella? Good. If it helps any, I also load the Devils currently. So, you know, if that helps, I'm happy to toss that out there.

Well, listen, expectations are a mother. You know, I have my favorite hockey team had no expectation, so I'm enjoying the ride so far. I guess that's the distinction, and I guess the world order has kind of flipped. since we both started watching hockey. But all right, let's talk about pro football, shall we? Doing great work out on the road for Sports Illustrated and otherwise, always essential stuff for a self-identifying pro football fan is the work of Erdogam on Sports Illustrated and beyond.

And first question, before we dig into these pivotal games, and there are some real juicy ones. So many of those big games are going to be played by ancient rivals. You have the Bears and Packers. I would say maybe the best 20th century NFL rival, rivalry and then the best 21st century rivalry is Steelers, Ravens, you have Broncos Raiders from the AFL, Colts and Jags, Rams and Cards, Chiefs and Texans, which is two teams that both were called Texans at one point or another. And if you blur your eyes, the team

that replaced or moved on from Houston to go to Tennessee, they're the Oilers who used to be division rivals of the Brown. So in a way, that still is resonating there. What's your favorite of them. The game I'm most excited to see is probably Packers Bears just because the Bears are improved and also kind of on a magic carpet ride. And then the Packers, good luck figuring out the Packers. What week is it, right? And I've gotten to cover some Packers games this year in person and they've been on the opposite ends of the spectrum in both those games. I saw him crushed Washington and saw him for seven points against Philadelphia. Um, that game probably intrigues me the most. Colts Jags is interesting too from the standpoint of

like the Colts are in free fall if they lose that game. Sure. Like absolutely like may not make the playoffs free fall. So that's fascinating as well. And you have two quarterbacks in that game that like for different reasons are really interesting. So I'm interested in all of them. But those two are probably like the one o'clock and then the four o'clock games that I'll be honed in on the most. I have some questions around those games specifically as we dig into the

them, I'll get to those. Very quickly, though, the other one I left off is Dolphins Jets. Does that count Mike Fuentes as one of our Miami representatives in Football America? Are the Jets as good as it gets for the Dolphins in terms of a rivalry? Well, I mean, this is dating back. It's mostly because of New Yorkers that have moved down here. So, but I'm sure there was a moment in time way before Mike Fuentes' time where this was actually a game that mattered. But basically, you've been, you know, one, you know, it's just been bad. It's not really worth mentioning. Well, when I think about rivalries and what makes them work through the decades is when they happen to both be playing for something important at the same time. Otherwise, if it's one

team always kicking the crap out of the other for a generation, it doesn't have much juice to it. And DeVerdram's point, I think this Bears, Packers one feels real good because it feels like it hasn't been relevant very much this century. But in fact, I mean, I think about the Jay Cutler game getting replaced in the title game and were it not for the BJ Raji pick, we might be talking about Aaron Rogers never having gotten to a Super Bowl. Sure. Well, yeah, to your point though, right? Like the Packers were a dynasty in the 60s. The Bears were good in the early 60s, but then were awful. They both were terrible in the 70s. The Bears were good in the 80s, and at times great.

The Packers were terrible. And then it flipped. Since then, the Packers have been really good. And the Bears have had, like, pockets of being good, but, like, by and large, haven't been that good. I also think this is a real interesting measuring stick game. Like, the Bears have won all these games up into the Philly game, to their credit. The Philly game matters.

But all these games against, like, the Bengals and the Giants. And all these games where they're barely winning, like, beating J.J. McCarthy. And it's like, okay, yeah, you're winning. But as Ben Johnson himself said this week, it's kind of in spite of your quarterback. It's kind of in spite of your passing game. Like, he's not playing well if you watch these games. And the Philly game, they win.

And fair or not, I still think there are some people who go, yeah, sure, but Philadelphia is like, the entire city is apparently ready to fire the offensive coordinator. Like, I don't know what that means. This is a huge game in the sense. The Bears win this game. They're probably going to win the division. Like, they are in the driver's seat. Or is it the Packers win this game?

I think you'd certainly say, then they're in the drive. driver's seat to win the division. Yeah, they've got to go back in a couple weeks and play at Chicago, but you look at the Packers and say, okay, well, they'll have swept Detroit, and they'll be, you know, having the early win on Chicago, they still play in Minnesota. If you're the Packers, this is an opportunity. You've been the seventh seed the last two years. Can you win this game? You could be the one seat. You could admit them probably be the two seat, right? Like, enormous opportunity for both these teams. And, you know, I talked about it at the start of this week, and I'm a broken record about it all season long, but the number one seed is not everything,

but it's pretty close to everything. If you buy the notion that these games, that the difference between all the teams in the playoffs at this point are negligible, then playing one less game should mean everything. Of course, I think people get sideways, teams even, players get sideways about that reality. Like, let's just get into the tournament, but on the other side of it awaits the grip. In fact, that if you're playing three games, you're way less likely to wind up playing in the Super Bowl. No question. And if you're the Packers, right?

Like, I always think, too, it depends on who you are. Like, if you're the Packers, if you get the Rams at Lambo, that's a hell of a lot different than playing them in Sofi. Right. Like, if that game's in two-degree weather, that matters. If, you know, and the same is true for the Bears, to their credit. Like, if they were to somehow get the one-seat, like, that matters. It matters where that game is played, a lot. You know, now, look, if you're, if you're the Houston Texans,

maybe it doesn't matter as much based on the fact like anybody coming in there, okay, fine, it's in a dome. Although, again, the reverse is true. If you're Houston, you'd have all rather play that game at home in a dome than you would go in a Buffalo, right? So, like, I do think it matters a lot. You know, home field maybe isn't quite as pronounced as it used to be for some, for a variety of reasons.

But, yeah, team like the Packers, playing at home is a massive deal. That is a massive, massive deal if you can do it. Don't get me upset, Verda Rom. You're up there in Chicago land. I used to be up there. I was in Pittsburgh and the seating on purpose of the advantage that the football gods gave you forever or as long as you wanted to keep it was to not dome your stadium and how even the Vikings didn't learn the lesson after all those games in the 70s against the pretty boys from LA coming up to play in the old Met and they would always win the Somehow they processed all that, like, yeah, but let's put a dome on this. It'll be comfier for our fans when I don't even think a lot of fans even want that. I think fans like that shared experience of it's zero degrees for us in the stands and the guys down on the field.

Yeah, I agree. I think domes are discouraged of the air. The fact that the Browns are going to put a dome on their stadium is just so embarrassed. It's the worst. You know, they're the Browns. It's irrelevant. They might as well put a dome on their stadium. on it, not let anybody in.

That is actually how they probably get public money approval. It's if they told everybody, listen, we'll build the stadium. We're not going to allow you in to watch this. But, yeah, I agree. Like, I think some of these teams, like, I think the bills did a good job in the sense. Like, they left it open air, right? It's going to cover the fans, but it's open air. But some of these teams like Minnesota, Detroit, building a dome, it's trash.

When you watch a snow football game, it's the greatest thing you've ever seen in your life. Like, let's get rid of that. Can't have that anymore. You know what? I'm getting upset. even though it's frigid where you are. It's nice and warm outside here in L.A. by the way. But, okay, let's get into it.

And we'll start at number six with the NFL countdown, the most consequential games. Who's going to win them and buy how much? And we'll start with, we'll do a six-pack this week. You mentioned the Eagles against the Chargers. Chargers plus three in this one, 40 and a half at the time of this recording. How do you see this one playing out? This game to me is the hardest game to pick of the week. Because I like Philadelphia.

but I like him because Herbert is one hand right now, and the tackles are so bad for the... In fact, really the whole offensive line is so bad for the Chargers, but they have to back offensive tackles, obviously. I just wonder in this game, this is a Vic Fangio game, where Fangio just basically schemes up, hey, look, we can take you away. You know, we can take away what we need to take away. We can put the Gene on McConkey,

and we can create some pressure against this line. They've lost two in a row. It kind of feels like if there's ever a back-to-exam. the wall type of game here for Philadelphia. This game's it. Look, we don't know what's going to happen. Obviously, we're recording on a Thursday morning. Like, the Lions, if they lose to Dallas,

and Philadelphia loses, you're tied in the loss column with four games left. Like, it is imperative if you're Phil, you win. The other thing with this game is, you know, you do wonder with the Chargers. Like, with Herbert, I know it's his left hand. It's going to be a lot harder to get him under center. It's going to be a lot harder to run certain plays, right? he's going to have to hand off everything with his right hand. Like, you know, what about ball security?

What if he takes a sack, which with that offensive line, you'd expect that he's going to take a few of them? Can you hold on to the ball as well? Like a fumble here, a botch snap, that could be the game. So I like Philadelphia, a little healthier. And I just think a better team, but, you know, look, it's going to be a game played out of desperation. The charges have to win, too.

I mean, the Chargers, their schedule the rest of the year is brutal. It's one of the hardest schedules in football, no easy games. So it's a big one for both sides. Plus, we all know, so it's going to be a home game for Philly. And I do feel, because, as you know, I'm one of society's great empaths. My heart goes out to Jim Haribah, because the entire premise was aligned to pay off right now in his second season. And you lose both of your tackles. Obviously, it's going to diminish how far you can carry things.

I think the Eagles are the better team, given the personnel they're going to have available, although they're missing a significant tackle themselves. I'll take the Eagles by at least four in this one. At number five, it's the Colts. It's the Jags. The Jags are plus one and a half, 48 and a half at the time of this recording, Verterham. How say you? So I like Jacksonville because Indianapolis, it feels like we're kind of hitting an inflection point with the Coltson right now.

Jones is literally playing on a broken leg. And I know Jack Youngblood did it way back when. Daniel Jones is not Jack Youngblood. And I've watched every snap of the Colts over the last four, five, six weeks. Jones right now, he cannot move. I mean, he physically, understandably, cannot move. So that's a big problem. Jacksonville has some edge rushers that matter.

I would expect them to employ them in this game and deploy them in this game. sauce Gardner being out you just traded two first round picks for this guy so you can do all kinds of things on defense now you can't without him out there now you can attack their side of the field it makes Ward less valuable it makes Kenny more less valuable because you can

just go at that side you can cut the field in half and just go that way and Buckner being out is another huge deal since Buckner's been out they've not been the same team defensively and so you combine all those things look the fear you have in this game for picking Jacksonville is Trevor Lawrence he's been awful

the season. And you're just one, is he going to have one of those games that you had against the Cardinals where it's four turnovers

and he's just a disaster. But if I'm if I'm Liam Cohen, my entire game plan is, listen, we're going to run the ball to E.N. We're going to go short

with Jacoby Myers. We're going to, you know, we're going to move the ball. Brenton Strange. By the way, also, Jacksonville hasn't lost at home

to this team since 2014. I like Jacksonville on a tight game. I actually think Jacksonville's going to win the division. I don't think Jacksonville's even the best team in the division.

But I think they're going to win it based on the schedule. I was on the Colts in August. I picked them to win the division, but two weeks ago, looking through the remaining schedules, it was easy to divine that the Jags, who are not as good as the Texans, clearly, are going to win the division. Look at what they have left, especially if they handle the Colts here. They have a pretty free ride to the division title. Next up, Steelers, I have to point this one out. It's the 21st century rivalry of note, I think we can all agree, and not just for Steelers,

and Ravens fans. But before we get into it, just a quick reminder, in case you're on the fence about this rivalry in which way you should lean spiritually. Let me just tell you who these two teams are. The Steelers, you understand, are named after the mid-century heroes who forged the steel that built the tanks and the ships used to defeat the Nazi scourge. Now on the other side of things, the Ravens are named after a poem written by a Boston native who married his 13-year-old cousin, moved to Baltimore, got drunk and died. So go ahead and root for the Ravens if you want. It's a free country. Just know you're aligning yourself with Mussolini. Have a great time. Stand against freedom. Matt Verdrum, how say you in this one? You know what? Let me just tell you

what's going down here. The Ravens are giving six at the time of this recording, 42 and a half. I'll just say it. I got the Ravens 30 to 22, but how say you? I actually think the Ravens will not cover, but I think they're going to win. I got to tell you, and I hate to say it, because I know how die-hearted of Stelers fan you are. They are a brutal watch offensively. They are just, I don't know how you watch Rogers every week and not want to just turn the TV off by like the national anthem. It's just his intended air yards per attempt is tied for the lowest in football with Dylan Gabriel. He just doesn't throw the football.

You'll have to tell me when I already know. about this team. I'm sick about it. Because I told you. I told you 18 months ago how this was going to go and it's gone every beat the way I said it was going to go. Yeah, he's terrible. He's not good. Like, look, and the worst part of the Aaron Rogers experience, if you're a Steelers fan, I have to imagine, although you, of course, would know this and I'm just guessing, is he will miss a guy by 10 yards and then just start screaming and pouting. It's like, at what point does some receiver just say, you know what, man, why don't you come over here? And let's have this out right on the sideline.

Like, he'll show up every teammate he has and then play like abject crap and then go off in a press conference. You're like, you're terrible. You're not good. You haven't been good in three years. Like, what right do you have to complain about anything? Look, I think the Ravens are struggling as well. Lamar is clearly not 100%.

He can't run. You can't run. I know this is off the beaten path. I can't believe they gave Mark Andrews three years. I cannot believe they extended him for a three-year contract. Mark Andrews has like 300 yards receiving right now. It's unbelievable. It felt like he was winding it down.

Winding it down. It felt like he was laying down. Like he's 30 years old. They can't play anymore. They were like, here's 36 million or whatever it was. Look, I think they'll win, but I got to tell you, I don't believe in the Ravens either. The Ravens, to me, are just kind of tread in water. Zay Flowers is the only weapon half in the passing game.

I think they win because I just don't think Pittsburgh can score. But I'll take Baltimore at a, you know, like 24 to 20, something like that. All right, moving on. At number three, you mentioned we're talking about the AFC North. I think the Ravens are still going to get it. But the Bengals are right there all of a sudden. I think they need a split between the Ravens and Steelers to have a real shot here. They're in Buffalo in the meantime.

The bills are giving five and a half, 53 and a half is the total. it looks like T. Higgins is tracking the play. As much as that playoff game between these two teams in Buffalo, what was it, three years ago, in the snow looms, yeah, all that. I think James Cook continues his role, so I'm going to take the Bills by a touchdown 3427. How's say you? I think the Bills win, the Bengals cover. Look, I like, I agree with you.

Like, I've got my Friday preview file coming out for I saw where I previewed like the five best games. Obviously, games were going over right now. And my matchup to watching that game was Cook against their front seven. because the Bengals just can't stop anybody. I mean, that, to me, is the problem that I just can't get past with Cincinnati. They can't stop anyone from running the football. And James Cook is having the best year of anybody not named Jonathan Taylor running the football. And also, oh, by the way, Josh Allen is pretty good with his legs.

The path for Cincinnati in this game, not kidding, no snark, is anything to score like 45 points. I agree. It's just, Burroughs just goes absolutely berserk against the bills. can't stop anybody. And it just becomes one of these games where the Bengals get, you know, two stops or something. And they win 45 to 42 or some crazy game like that. The thing that does worry me a little with Buffalo is Alan turns the ball for a lot all of a sudden. Like, we've kind of gone back to Josh Allen from a couple of years ago where it's every game he gives away one or two balls.

But I think because of the Thursday night Thanksgiving night game, we're kind of overlooking the flaws. that the Bengals have. The Bengals had five turnovers given to him in that game. That's not going to typically happen. Burroughs awesome. That offense is really, really good. Dude, that defense is one of the worst defenses I've ever seen. And just going into Buffalo

feels like a game where Burrow could throw for 350 and three touchdowns and they still lose like somewhat going away. So I'll take the bills to win. You know, it's funny just to give you a quick compliment retroactively from two, three years ago. I think one of the very first times we talked was you pointed out,

the guy who is the secret sauce of the Bengals is Lou Anirumo. And for some reason, they canned him, and he lands in Indy. And as I predicted, that was the reason I picked the cults above all else, was the complementary situation available to them with Anirumo turning that defense borderline, you know, dominant is maybe a little bit too much. but the early returns were pretty good, but without sauce, I'm with you on all that. But anyway, there the Bengals are doing weird stuff, once again, showing the door to one of the brightest DCs in the league.

Okay, at number two, the Houston Texans, who maybe do have the best defense going right now against your Kansas City Chiefs who are giving three and a half in Arrowhead, 41 and a half. I get the specific concern at the line of scrimmage, the deteriorated KC O line against that pass rush and all of that. But Casey's only lost once in Arrowhead. I'm going to try and thread the needle here. 2120, the Chiefs get it. Yeah, I got to be honest.

Excuse me. I got to be honest. I don't know what to expect in this game from the standpoint that it feels like, well, it doesn't feel like the Chiefs can't get it. pass rush. I mean, they just can't do anything. They're paying Jones and Carl Offtis $55 million a year between them, and nobody gets home. I mean, Jones does occasionally. He's been better than his statute would indicate. Carlophtz has been good. Everybody else is basically you and me trying to get a pass rush. I mean, it's just unbelievable how bad everybody else is. He's got a blitz nonstop

to try to get pressure, which is you saw against Dallas doesn't always work. I would say that I would pick Kansas City for one reason. And that is the fact that Mahomes is the best quarterback statistically under pressure in the league and if there's one guy in this game who can just say look I don't care like I will just I will evade it I will run out of it I will run a throw while I'm horizontal

it doesn't matter I mean this is a spot where it feels like champions usually find a way to win these games and it feels like basically statistically if they win these next two games they'll probably make the playoffs because they have the Titans and the Raiders two of their last three games

I always said this about New England over the years I'm not going to bet against them I've just seen them win too many games like this where everybody's like oh I don't think they can win this game and that usually is when they play their best football I think they will win by a field goal I think Houston covers I think they'll win like 20 to 17 23 to 20 and we all walk away going

well thank God for them they have my homes because he's the reason they won the game well that's so we agree almost exactly this one's going under the chiefs win it and don't cover at number one it's where we started it's the bears it's the packers it's a glorious rivalry with big stakes this time around the packers laying six and a half 44 and a half is the total vertram choose i like the packers to win in a cover i don't think it's a ball up any means i think it's a touchdown um you know 27 21 27 20 something like that uh look i think the packers is just a better

team. The concern that I have, I guess I wrote about this game in the Friday preview is Caleb Williams, his splits, when he's not under pressure and when he is, they're staggering. Like, his splits are unbelievable. And they have Michael Parsons on the other side of the field. And Rashon Gary is a pretty good player too. I just, I think Parsons in this game, look, the bear's strength in their offensive lines are interior. It is not their tackles. this is not a game if you're the Bears that you want to struggle a tackle and be great inside it's just it's a problem it's a bad matchup I also wonder in a game like this

like not that the Packers have championship pedigree but they've been in a lot of big games over the last few years the Bears have not and their credit they won that game in Philly but Williams was terrible they won the game because they rushed for like 250 yards they're not going to rush for 250 yards against Green Bay this is not going to happen and so Look, I think the bears give a representative effort. I don't think it's a blowout, but I think love makes enough plays.

I love the way he played against the Lions on Thanksgiving. I thought he made some big-time throws when they needed them. I just think the Packers are a little too much for the Bears. So I'll take the pack by a touchdown. I'm with you. And Ben Johnson is a miracle worker, as we foretold before the season kicked off. The lions would go down. The bears would ascend.

The one thing I don't know that he's ever going to be able to fix is Caleb Williams, just inaccurate. He's too deep into playing football to suddenly turn into a sharpshooter. Anyway, listen, sharpshooteron. Make sure you're checking out his game picks, all his other work on Sports Illustrated. Again, the Matt Verdehom show and that football show on KC Sports Network. Keep up the great work. I know how busy are. We appreciate the time, Pally. All right, there he goes, and here we go to quickly, though, a note to make for you. If you're interested, in our championship Saturday picks. We made him with our old pal,

Ryan Shazir, his Buckeyes versus my Hoosiers, one of the big games there. It's available exclusively on YouTube, Football America. Check it out, won't you? We really appreciate it. Spread the good word. We'll be back on the other side of the football weekend

to try and make sense of it for you. Until then, for all the fellas here on Football America, thanks so much, my fellow football Americans. It's been a thin slice of heaven. Thank you.