The Dating Detectives - It's Raining Cat & Dog-fish: Part Two

Episode Date: May 29, 2023

Part two of Ashley's harrowing story involving catfish, dogfish, and everything in between!  PSA: This is episode 6 of 6 in season one of The Dating Detectives! Thank  you so much for your overwhelming support of show so far. We are taking a two week break and will be back with new episodes on 6/19! ***The following Program contains names, places and events that have been anonymized or fictionalized for the purposes of protection and safety. The following Program is provided for entertainment purposes only and any commentary from the hosts are strictly conjecture and should not be held as making any definitive statements about the truth or identity of any particular individuals or circumstances. If you or a loved one are involved in an abusive relationship, please call the National Domestic Violence Hotline at 1-800-799-7233 for support.***See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

The following program contains names, places, and events that have been anonymized or fictionalized for the purposes of protection and safety. The following program is provided for entertainment purposes only, and any commentary from the hosts are strictly conjecture and should not be held as making any definitive statements about the truth or identity of any particular individuals or circumstances. If you or a loved one are involved in an abusive relationship, please call the National Domestic Violence Hotline at 1-800-799-7-233 for support. Hey, Hannah, welcome back. Oh, my God. Welcome. Welcome. Welcome, everyone. Okay, so as you and everyone else knows, this episode was a doozy and it ended on a high point and we definitely left with the piner, which, sorry, sorry,

yeah, people, y'all, we loved, we loved this week. If you're not following us on dating detectives' podcast on Instagram, it was everybody DM does so many questions. They were so excited. Some of them, you were mad at us and we're really sorry about the cliffhanger. But it's such a long story. So like, just wait. I can't wait to tell you the rest of the story. But before we do that, just real quick, we do want to answer some of those questions. So Hannah, what were some of the questions that we got?

We got some great ones. So one clarification was whether or not Ashley met Morgan in person. And I think she did say it, but in case you weren't clear, she never did. She only texted with Morgan. She talked to him on Tinder, text, and they had a group chat. But never met him in the flesh. Which is really interesting because, well, she would have had no reason to meet him in the flesh. Well, I mean, if your friends with someone.

But I get it. Like, it didn't raise a huge red flag for her. Yeah, because she wasn't the one that he wasn't the one that she was dating. She trusted Kyle when Kyle, like, said this is my friend. And she didn't care to meet him because she's not dating him. Someone made an interesting point. We don't necessarily have an answer to this, but I don't think it's a spoiler. They were just like, maybe the story about Morgan, like being an alcoholic and getting

pregnant, like maybe that was like one of Kyle's like actual stories from his past or something. I was like, yeah, very well could be. Listen, we got some thinkers listening to this podcast. I love the little investigative minds. One other question that I don't think is in the episode is all about the ring. People really wanted to know if the ring was fake, what the ring was appraised for. So the purpose of that in the story was really just to show that he was listening to her. But because we all need to know, we're all, we're all, you know, we're girlies.

We want to know. I think she said it was actually appraised for, he said it was valued at like 9,000. I think it was appraised at like 4,000, 4, 4,500. So it was a real ring. it sounds like he may have inflated the truth a little bit. Yeah, yeah, he estimated a little high. Yeah, I don't think that was, I think that was an estimation. I feel like that was kind of, it was just a little lie. Maybe it's fine. It's funny how stuff like that becomes so minuscule in the grand scheme of things when it's someone like this, but in reality it's like. Yeah, because how did he know? Like, he had to have been listening and how. So the really great questions that you guys are sending in. So we're really excited to.

share part two with you and and I bet people are like get to it get to it right now should we get into it let's let's just do it before we get me all that back to Ashley and so right at that time he's like coming up towards me like backing me up kind of into the wall and his hands start to move towards where I know that his firearm is and so I'm like getting I have like the deerhead in my hand like just ready for a movement and if he moves I move and Right as I'm white knuckling the rack, my brother-in-law walks inside. And his demeanor immediately goes from like red to white. That to me was like the spookiest part because he knows that he can take me,

but he can't take my brother-in-law. And so immediately he was like, dissipate. I gave him his racks. He was like, I will always love you. It was this whole thing. I was like, Kyle, you got to go and don't come back. This is it. After he leaves, maybe an hour later, probably less.

Kyle starts to call me and text me and call me and text me. She's pulling up the receipts. He says, I won't be coming by to get my stuff. You can keep the ring goodbye. And I was like, you have a lot of things here. I'm not keeping all of your things. And I didn't want to keep any of it because I didn't know if it was listening to me. And he said, I won't need it.

I'm not responding anymore. Goodbye. And I was like, bye. And he said, I don't want to keep. I still like an explanation before the end of the day, thanks, which an explanation as to why we broke up, even though I already told him it was because I, what he said was mean,

which wasn't the real reason, but I wasn't going to tell him the real reason. He says, I'll always love you no matter. And I, like, the only reason I'm reading these verbatim is because, like, this itself is like a form of manipulation.

And certain forms of manipulation are definitely abusive. 100%. He said, I'll always love you no matter what happened between us, but I'm not into the feelings I have anymore or failing. I wish you the best. And I said, I want the same for you. He says, oh, don't worry. I'll get what I wanted soon. And I said, what does that mean? And he said, nothing. I've reached my point. Enough is enough of anything. Contentment will and will forever continue to escape me. I'm tired of dealing with it. I appreciate

everything you did for me. You know I did the best I could. I tried to do everything the right way while being there for you and trying to give you what I feel you deserve. And that is when I call his sister. That was kind of like a final goodbye. I know. I was going to say, did anyone, McKenzie, what was your like, sprighty sentence doing when you read that? Because I was going to off himself. I didn't know what was going on. That's exactly what I thought. That's what I thought as well. So I called his sister and I was like, you need to find Kyle. He's not doing well. I just broke up with him and I'm also in tears because I'm like, if this dude off himself, it's my fault. In hindsight, not the same as current moment, but in the moment, I was like, if he offs himself, it will forever

be on my shoulders. So I called a sister and she said, man, I really thought he was better. Like, he's done this before. Dogfish. This is someone that has a whole background that we don't know. Yes. So she said, I thought he was better. We'll find him. he calls again. I don't answer. He texts again. I wanted to see if you were okay. My sister said you were upset. I don't want you to be sad or cry. If you can let me know you're okay. Again, I don't respond. Then he texted me again. I hate I didn't get to talk to you, but this is what I'll remember for our relationship. I hope you do too. I hope you're okay and I hope you will be happy. Goodbye, babe. Goodbye, babe. I hardly slept at all that night. And then the next morning,

I get a phone call from a phone number that I don't recognize. And so, again, I don't answer it. And it's a text message. And it says, hey, this is Kyle's dad. Can you please call me? And I was like, so I call him. And he is like, hey, don't panic. Kyle's in the hospital.

He OD'd last night. We wanted to get your attention. Yes. And he knew that. That was my absolute worst fear of my of my ex that I was with for eight years. Kyle probably, yeah, he wanted your attention. He didn't want to end his life. He wanted to literally do the most dramatic, closest, serious thing in a way that would still keep you held on.

Correct. God. Yeah. God. While he's in the hospital, knowing that he cannot get to me. I kind of rest easy. And I had also boarded my daughter. I wanted to figure out what the next step would be.

So I boarded my dogs and I was packed a bag and I was going to stay at my parents' house for a few days. So I boarded my dogs and I told them that I had a new phone number. And I was like, hey, don't call that other number. Delete it out of the system. Don't do anything. If you need me, called my new number. And they were like, okay, no big deal. I didn't want anybody to even know that they were there.

I was like, don't put them on social media. don't do anything. They're like, okay, no big deal. And so I get a phone call from my dog boarding place on my Kyle phone. And I'm like, I just told them that I got a new number. Like, why are they calling me from my old phone number? I answer it, and it's, hey. And I'm like, Kyle?

He was like, yeah, and I hang up. So I immediately hang up and like my face like goes white. And I'm like, is he at the dog boarding place? Like I thought he was in the hospital. How did he do that? Yeah. So I immediately call my mom and I was like, hey, the dog boarding place just called me, but it's Kyle. It's not them.

Had that even happened? I don't know. But I'm just letting somebody know because I want people to be in the loop. because I don't want to have to remember all of this by myself. Yeah. And also if I die, we know who done it. Yeah. And if he's at the dog place, which how did he get their number?

Like, how did he get access to the phone number? He's right down the freaking road from me. Well, there's an app. You can use an app to pretend you're calling from a different number, but now I need to know. So, okay, go ahead. Sorry. Yeah, that's what happened.

I just didn't know that at the time. Kyle also used the same app to call from, the hospital phone number. And so when it called, it was like blank hospital on the caller ID. And so I answer it and I'm like, hello? And it's Kyle again. And I was like, listen, you can't call me anymore. Stop calling me and I hang up.

But it's not like you can block him because he's calling, as McKenzie would say, all willy-nilly from whatever number he's damn well pleases. Yeah, exactly. Do you guys call me all willy-nilly is a stupid. app and pretending you're something else. Straight up, so I call the hospital within like a minute of him

calling me and I ask, hey, can people call out if people are in here, can they call out? And they're like, no. And I was like, hmm. So we don't actually know if he was ever in the hospital or not? I can't confirm that because it's hospital

record and the hospital is not going to tell me one way or another. But his family told me that he was in the hospital. So then is he lying to his family or is his family lying to me and they're all in it together i am in touch with his sister it air quotes in the hospital i'm in touch with his sister trying to get all of his stuff back to him because i don't want anything of his ever and also if he is in the hospital i want him to have clean clothes and so i like do his laundry and i because i'm like i don't know how long he's going to be in there but i want him to have clean clothes and so give this bag to him in the hospital

take all this other stuff and And I, um... You are so sweet. So I meet her. Bless your heart. I can say that because I'm Southern. Go ahead. I would have burned the clothes and given the mask.

Yeah, that seems to be more reasonable. That's a more reasonable decision, I think. You're so compassionate. I bless you. Okay, carry on. Sorry. And so I, I'm, and so me and his sister meet on Friday. And I go to.

his sister's house, I pack up all of my stuff. And I had talked to them a couple of times. And I was like, listen, I'll tell you whatever you want to know about what I know. The more people that know, the more people can appropriately help him is kind of my thought. I want to be totally out of it. I want to be left alone. I want them to understand how much I want to be left alone and that there is never going to be a him and I ever again. And so I get there. I tell him about Morgan. I tell him about all of the other things that have happened. He's doing this. He's pretending to be this person, blah, blah, blah. I told them pretty much the same thing that I told y'all.

Like, the reason I didn't break up with him initially is because his dog was dying. And she was like, what dog? And I was like, AJ. And she was like, what are you talking about? He's had this dog, this dog, this dog, named off dogs that I, I recognized their names. But she was like, there was not an AJ. Oh, my God. wait wait so why did so he said he had two dogs yes and he only had the one dog and that was a pattern throughout

the entire time of course unfortunately the story is not over i wish one was over so he's in the hospital while he's still in the hospital morgan reaches out and i at this point in time i'm only facetaming him because i want to see who it is that's texting me he never answers he's like sorry i can't face time right now Eventually, Morgan texts me a video, which you guys have. Wait, and this is a video of a human that you've never seen before, but looks like the photos. But does it look like the photos that Morgan used? No, no. Interesting.

It's a third person. So you got a video message. Yeah, you have it. Yeah, I sent it over to you guys. Of a person saying, I am Morgan. That's clear, very clear. clearly reading a script. Molly?

Roll the clip. Roll the clip. Hey, this is Morgan. I'm sorry about text messages I sent you. You know, I hope you're doing okay. You know, I'll holl at you. Later, all right? Oh, my God.

Okay, so he's got somebody at gunpoint. He's forcing him to read this mail. Okay, the next. It looks like he's reading a script. He stutters through it. And it's not the same guy that was in the photos. and I'm FaceTime and he's not answering. I'm like, hey, prove to me that you're real.

And he sends me just these totally random again, Molly has all of the documents. It's like a AT&T bill. It's nothing that's really proof. Yeah. Also, I love that he's like, I don't know what else I can do. You're like, FaceTime. You can think I just a little idea. That's like freaking beyond.

This is legit 100% like life. time movie, my investigator brain is like, what in the actual crap? This guy is doing next level stalkers, like stage five-clinger, like stalker, psycho. Like, this guy is next level. Yeah. I say, we both know you aren't who you say you are. As I've said before, please do not contact me or my family for any reason by any means. Kyle's sister comes over. And I'm like, hey, I hope he's doing okay. I'm sorry that all of this happened. I wish it would have been different.

And she's like, Kyle went to go find Morgan last night to confront him about all of the fake numbers and the fake profiles. Kyle had a nice little chat with the mirror is what we're saying. Well, Kyle beat him up. So Kyle in a tree, he like, he had a couple of bruises. it looked like a mess. Fawed him, whatever. So either he beat up a tree and or punched a bunch of bricks or his sister is also lying. I don't know which is true. And then I'm like, okay, so there is a chance that Morgan is a real person. It might not be the person that I thought that it was, but it could be a real person. And when his sister was here, he was like, Kyle sent a letter to my home that was admitting

to everything, like a handwritten letter post office shipped to my mailbox. And I don't check my mail that frequently. So after they left, I went to go check the mailbox. The letter is there. It's from handwriting that I don't recognize because I know what Kyle's handwriting is like. So it's a third person that I don't know. So the letter was signed from Kyle, Kyle's name. Correct. Yeah. Yeah. And while I'm like thinking about that, me and my sister go to the mall, dropping, and she gets a text message. It's a screenshot of what Kyle's sister had gotten. And it says, tell your brother to watch his back and the bitch too. I'm coming after both of them

because Kyle beat him. So then I'm like, okay, this person has to be real because why else would he be threatening him and by default me if Kyle didn't really beat somebody up? Like what else would be the reason if he didn't actually do it? He wanted to stay relevant. He wanted to stay in your life and he had no control over you anymore. So he wanted to kind of keep that control is what it sounds like. Yes.

Now we know. But then we did not. know. And so I want to put that on record because if I fear for my life at any point, I want the cops to know that like this is on the radar. I don't know what the right thing to do is. I'm just trying to figure out how to keep myself safe because I want to be on the plan. So I call the non-emergency line and I'm like, hey, can somebody come to my house? Like when they can a patrol person come to my house? just want to show them some things. I want to get everything on record. The cop shows up. I show her the letter. I tell her like a quick version of the story. I tell her what I think. And literally,

while I am talking to the cop, I get a text message on my Kyle phone because I still have both phones. Okay. So just so we're all on the same page, you still have the phone that had, that was the way that Kyle contacted you, but you still had your new phone, but you don't want Kyle to have your new number. but by letting him kind of continue to contact you on the Kyle phone. That was kind of like your way of keeping you the enemy close. Smart. Yeah. Because that's how Kyle would text me and then he was instructed not to.

So then he didn't. So that's when Morgan came back. And that's how Morgan was texting me. I get a text message from a number I don't recognize and I open it and it's green. And it says, I wanted to let you know that and I immediately give it to the cop. I don't even finish reading it. I'm just like, ma'am, here you go. I don't know what to do with it.

So she reads it and she gives it back to me. And then she like steps away and she radios and she's like, hey, can you like do a whole search on this name? Because the text message says, I wanted to let you know that creep can't hurt you any further. I handled it after the threat was given out today. Just trust me it's done. Found out that you had been watched a bit over the past month.

Sorry for that. I should have done something sooner. If I have to wait a year just to talk to you, I will because you're still the one. The question is, will you wait for me? So is he confessing to murdering Morgan? Like he's handled it? Like he wants you to be like, oh, my hero, you killed him. Great. Yeah. Essentially he's like saying that he murdered someone. He was like, no big deal. I murdered him. Also, I love that he was just like, will you wait for me? after just saying you murdered their friend? Like, this guy. Yes.

So she calls over the radio and she's like, there's no record of that person with that birthday. Like, he's just not real. And I'm like, okay, I hear you in that he's not real. But I also know that there's a face and a claim that this person is Morgan. So if he's not Morgan, fair. If Morgan doesn't exist, fair. But who, but there is this person.

Like, that's not Kyle. He's got someone tied up in his basement, for sure, like, forcing that, like, holding them hostage to force them to say these things. What, yes, likely. Likely scenario. That was on March the 28th. And then on April the 6th, I get one single email from Kyle with an obituary. of Morgan. What? Oh my God.

That says. Morgan. Age 32, passed away suddenly. There's no pitcher. There's only an obituary. Wait, wait. Can you do that? Can you like just,

how do you get an obituary without like a death certificate? Is that a thing? Well, I mean, all you have to do is like call the paper and pay the money to do the obituary. And they're like, okay, do you want it posted? So yeah, you could totally do an obituary. What? That's wild. Yeah, it's online. He paid for the obituary. My mom and her sleuthing, bless her heart, calls the newspaper. And she's like, I need to know who sent this in. I need to know who requested this to come in. And it was his sister, who I had never heard of. My mom did all of the sleuthing and lands on her.

Facebook page. And she is posting pictures of Morgan, rest in peace, my brother overdosed and passed away suddenly, please pray for him, whatever. What is also interesting is that she got into the Facebook groups of the church that my parents go to, the grief counseling groups. in in so she was on the Facebook page she had added a couple of people that my mom personally knows that go to the church and was in the actual grief group that my parents go to what so this fella is now infiltrating your mama's churches grief counseling group yes that that's beyond yeah so to further chase a rabbit my mom reaches out to the people that she knows that do the the grief group and she's like hey who is this girl and they're like she got added to the group her brother

passed away she's from around here she went to the high school that i went to which she did not i not in the yearbooks nobody that i still talked to from high school has ever heard of her she it's not a thing And so she was in like a meeting or two and then she never came back. They tried to call her, but every time they tried to call her, her husband would answer. It was never her that they talked to. She would reply via Zoom instant message for the grief groups, but she would never use her voice because it was never a her voice. It was a him voice.

your mom needs to be a PI she is legit i'm hiring her i have the best mom in the world so this was a zoom support group but she never turned her camera on correct yeah no voice no nothing and so it's another person that kyle is pretending to be because if he can make morgan real then he can be not at fault for anything so he's basically he used morgan to make himself look good. And now he's using Morgan and catfishing pretending to be all these other people just to help his case further and so that he doesn't have to take accountability for anything. Yeah.

Okay. So just for clarification, because, oh, my God, this is wild. So just so that you guys understand, Kyle is also Morgan. So he's created this alter ego. and he's now created Morgan's sister and neither one of these people are legit. Like they're all Kyle. And they're like we haven't seen Morgan's sister

except for her engagement on Facebook and in this church group. Right. Which she never actually showed her face in. It's a Zoom. It's a Zoom group. Okay. So then we're just like, okay, interesting to note.

Her Facebook page really hasn't been used since. She hasn't done like a, oh, it's been one year. It's been two years. It was just like the one time and then it's just gone. So it's like he logged out of the Facebook page, never went back. While all of that was happening, I get granted the order protection. So you finally, like it's almost over then? He still did.

It texts me again. And so I had to go back to the courts and I was like, listen, he's breaking the order protection. And the last text message I got from him, he said, you're the love of my life, my best friend and my person. I don't care what happened over the past month. It's in the past. I put too much on you and that wasn't fair.

You did the best you could. We can wait until the order expires or try to rescind it. If you don't want to try again at any point, that's okay. Just block my number or say no. I'll send a single exclamation mark one day to see. If you don't do any of these things and still want to be with me, then I'll wait for you patiently. I just have to try. And then the next day he sends a single exclamation mark.

again, I don't respond. And then he texts me again and says, guess I'll wait. And that's the last I heard from him. I'm glad he stopped reaching out to you. I mean, good riddance by Kyle and Morgan and Morgan's sister and the hired actor and however other many people he made up to get to you. My question there is, were there any times in the relationship where you were like afraid of him? Like before all of this came out? Yeah, that's a good question.

No, there were a couple of times when he like would lose his temper. I think I should have been scared. But it was more so of me like, no, he's going through a hard time. We innately feel compassion right away. Yeah, feel nurturing instead of instant distrust. We want to show that compassion, especially when it's someone that you love and, you know, you want to be nice them. You want to show them love. You want to show them at love.

Especially given your history with your last relationship, like you're an innately nurturing, compassionate person. And I think we all, we want things to work. We want people to be okay. We want to be there for them and do everything we can. Like, especially women do this, not just women, but you know what I? I totally understand where you were kind of hoping for that to be okay.

100%. That is one of the great things about women. is that we can be loving regardless of what we receive, but it is not loving to be passive. It is not loving to let people walk all over you for you or for them. Thank you so much for this story. How are you feeling about it now? I know a lot of people we've talked to, and I'm sure, like, just in general, struggle with the shame around this kind of thing.

Where are you with that? I would say I feel a little bit more embarrassed. I don't really feel guilty though, but I go back and forth between embarrassment and also apathy. Like, my story is my story. And those are the facts of what happened. But I don't really have any attachment towards any of it because I don't know that guy. I want people to know the facts and I want people to know that stuff like this happens. But I am not emotionally attached to it because I, because that doesn't do any good.

That's great. I mean, I'm glad that you're able to, like, detach from it in a healthy way and recognize that, yeah, you're not at fault, obviously, and also able to move forward in some way. Are you? Like, how's dating now? What's the tea in your dating life after this? So a pretty boring update, I will never get on a dating app ever again. I'm like, if you're going to do it, please do it safely. I'm just pretty slow to the cuff now. I, I, have a slightly harder time, like, trusting people's intentions. Like, for instance, this one guy I was, like, a little bit into, it took me, like, two dates. And then I'm like, nip, not you. Not you. Normalize leaving after the first red flag.

Like, we want things to work. We want to believe in the good in people. I remember a camp counselor when I was younger, and I didn't understand it at the time. but she made a group of like 10 year olds all of us 10 year old girls say in unison i will never pity date and like we were like what obviously she was yeah she must have been going through something but yeah the dating app thing hopefully this story as you've said i'm glad you've been able to move forward and trust your infam tuition even more yeah i'll listen to my gut except for if it tells me that somebody is good it's true though so that's it's so interesting that you said that because it's

As soon as something is going well, why is it so hard for us to believe it's going well? And then for some reason, we can't follow our gut. It's too good to be true almost. So we kind of, we walk away from that. That breaks my heart a little. Mackenzie, you're the one of us who's got to lock down a good thing. How did you know? I'm putting you on the spot.

How did you know that you had a good person that you could trust was a good person? He was consistently there. Even when I pushed him away, he sat patient and quiet and he was consistently there. He consistently showed up. He consistently made promises and followed through with them. He was consistent. And as much as I didn't trust him, he was consistent. And to this day, that consistency has never wavered.

So it's like a building trust over time thing. You don't know initially. And you have to kind of let them show you again and again and again. Aw, happy to you. Thank you so much for telling your story, Ashley. We are, I just can't believe all of these, all of the, everything that you shared. I just can't believe it. Truly, thank you.

And also I'm obsessed with you. Thank you. You look absolutely panicked. I mean, I'm, the fact that she doesn't really know, like there are so many questions that she doesn't know the answers to at this point in her life. That's a lot for me. I'm blown away. Like, I'm speechless.

I don't know what to say. I can't wait to hear everybody else's responses. So yeah, so that's just it. Kyle's kind of still out there. And how did he hear her in her parents' house? I just, I want to know. There's just so many questions. And like, how, how did he like, okay, this guy is smart, right?

Like, he's, I'm sorry, but he's not stupid. Like, he's out here all willy-nilly in front of God and everybody just freaking doing all this stuff. And nobody's keeping track of him. Like, we don't know where he is. Like, can we, can we, oh, boy. I almost wish he, he's doing, like, so much work. Is there a job that he would be good at that we could put this skill? He's got skills.

Like, he needs to, like, be an actor because he's really good at what he does. We're a writer. Something. He's got a creative mind. For the love of Moses. Like, he created all of this, like, not real stuff. Like, who, first of all, who has the time? second of all, who thinks this up? Like, how do you come up with this? I feel like the more that she

answered things, the more questions I had. Like answers just lead to more questions. And why don't you speak to that? So you are PI, but there are limits to the cases you're on. Like, we're not police. Like, we're unfortunately left with the discomfort of not knowing everything. Well, so that's actually a good question. So when I first started as a private investigator, 16 years ago, I could not sleep at night. Like, I was like, I need resolution. And I will be honest with you, like, there is no resolution to probably 95% of my cases. Like, there's just none.

And so I had to come to terms with the fact that I just don't know. Like, I'm never going to know. It took me a couple years to, like, get the hang of that. And so now when I talk about some of IPI stories, everybody's like, so what happened? And I'm like, I don't know. You're like, you're freaking out. Imagine me. I was there.

Yeah. There's no resolution sometimes. So I'm sorry if your questions don't get the answer. I know. Still send us your questions because we want to know as much as we can too. But yeah, some of it is up to the universe. I do think it's interesting how Ashley is she remained so apathetic as opposed to like still shamed or embarrassed.

Like I'm sure she feels some of those things. But now she's just like, I mean, it's whatever. It is what it is. your life, Sam? Like, you know, I'm just, I would be wondering every single day. She's not only a great storyteller, but a really strong person. And her experience, given her relationship prior to meeting Kyle, he knew how to pray on her. And that is the problem with all of these. And so I want to shout out on Instagram, that girl, Audra commented about, like, asking us to talk about how we can avoid these red flags before it happens, like things that she learned.

talk about that. And I'm glad you asked because that is something we want to always do with these stories and not just kind of tell you a crazy story and be like, that's wild. But also, we're, you know, out in this world, whether you're dating or not, people are amazing. And then a couple people are like Kyle. And there's so much we can learn from these. And I do think, yeah, part of it is knowing your own vulnerabilities. Having a support system, I mean, check, like her support system was they dropped everything when she needed them. Like keep your people close y'all. In my job doing surveillance, like surveillance is my, that is my bread and butt. That's what I do. That's what I live. I eat, sleep, live and breathe, like surveillance. And so every day I'm out there

seeing all of this happen and that's all I see. And so you don't realize that like it's amazing what people do when they think no one is watching. And it's just incredible to me how, like it's amazing like you'll you'll be blown away I have so many stories it's crazy you've heard some of the stories they're insane actually stories freaking bonkers the only thing I do when no one's watching is just dance in my underwear to Taylor Swift and that's how I'd like it to stay that's all I need why can't we all just do that instead of creating fake obituaries I know that was wild and like who he paid money like He came out of his own pocket.

Like, it costs like a hundred-something dollars to do an obituary. Like, they don't do that for free. The part where his, he created Morgan's sister and joined her family's church group on Zoom. I know. This guy's alter ego has alter egos. Like, what in bananas is how, like, what is going on? That's insane. Oh, other question. Somebody asked, are the dogs okay? Yes. Very important question. We are dog people here at the daily detectives. The dogs are okay. Well, when we say dogs, there was really a long time, right? Well, I was talking about her dogs, but you're right. The one dog that died never existed. I think that's clear. He was not at the animal shelter. He used that funky app. Wait, do you know what app? Somebody asked about that too. Oh, how do you

make it stop if someone's using your number? We got that question too. Oh, yeah. Okay, so there's a couple of apps out there where you can, I think it's called spoofing. And when you spoof somebody, you can say, okay, I want to make this phone call. And it says, what number do you want it to show up? And you can literally put any number, the police department, your mama's number, your girlfriend's number. You can just type in whoever's number you want.

And when it calls your phone, it will show that person's number. So if you have your mom's number stored in your phone and they call saying they're your mom, it will show up as mom or however you have it listed in your phone. It will come up and that's how people get, that's how people get you to answer. So that's why at the animal boarding place, that's why she entered the phone. Like it wasn't him. He was calling as someone else. And that's actually very common. Is there any way that you can like stop people from using your number?

No. There's not. Yeah, I didn't think so because you can just type in a number. It's not like they're actually using it. I don't. So the thing is you, that's probably a chargeable offense, right? But it's a matter of proving it. And because those are undetectable and untraceable, the chances of proving it are like, so change your number.

Oh. I don't know what else. Like it sucks. Who wants to change their number? I've had my number for like 100 years. Wow. Okay. One more topic that we can just touch on is dating apps because a lot of people are reacting to the story like this is why I don't use dating apps.

Oh yeah. What do you think, Hannah? You have good experience on that. Do I? Well, I do. Yes. I guess. Well, I am on.

So somebody has, they've asked us a couple times. Actually, I was at a wedding this past weekend with someone who has listened to which I loved hearing the story. They were like telling me about a friend. who's come through something that was relevant to this. And it made my heart warm. So shout out. But they did ask me what dating app is like safe. And I'm curious what you think.

I mean, I'm only right now on Hinge, which honestly, I'm not going to lie. It's a little bleak right now just in terms of the selection. That's not the point. I don't know. Like I, my dating app mentality is that if I can't find them on social media, or find some kind of like connection to them. Red flag. I don't go.

Yeah, I need to like honestly. And I am, I'm fortunate to have a mom and a friend group who are pretty, I don't want to say well connected so much as like nosy as hell. Like they just like get in everybody's business, which is good because whenever I meet, like if I meet someone and they're like, oh, I went to Tulane. This happened recently. I met somebody went to Tulane. So I just went to all my people that I knew who went to Tulane.

and someone knew someone who knew him. So it's like, I just have to verify everything or I don't trust it. I don't know if I can say an app is good or not, but I do think you can't verify information about someone on an app. Like if you're on Tinder and you have no information about them but a picture, that to me is like not enough. What app did Ashley say she met Kyle on again? Tinder.

It was Tinder. Okay. So that's what I thought. So Tinder is actually the most common app. that I hear about with the cheating spouses, it's the tender. I think it's because a lot of people have heard about it the most, but it's also interesting that there are some cases I get where the cheating spouse is using match or like e-harmony.

Like those are apps that specifically focus on your emotional connection where tender, I think, was created to be more of like a hookup situation. But I mean, but it's interesting to me that a lot of them are from tender, which is like normal, but it's interesting that a lot of people are also on like Match and these emotional connection places. Well, I think, yeah, you're probably going to find Match and E-Harmony and those kinds of apps. Often those are the ones that you sign up where you have to pay sometimes. By the way, don't use your wife's credit card to go to Match.com.

I'll do a story. It's fine. Please. Oh, my God. Somebody, okay, so we do want to get more stories that are not just, straight men scamming women. Statistically, it is much easier to find stories of straight men, scamming women. But we want to switch it up, but I will say we were just talking about this where it's like, I think men are just the worst at it.

Like, women don't get caught as easily. Like, we're just better at scamming if we scam. And it's so funny to hear stuff like that because it's like, how, what, how dumb do you have to be to use your wife's credit card to try to cheat on her on an app. Wait until you hear this story. Oh my God. I can't even wait. I can't wait.

Maybe we should talk about when our next episode and next season is. That's a good transition. Oh, because this is the last episode for this season. So we're going to be on a two-week break. So I'm sorry, don't be mad at us. So make sure to follow us. Make sure you tell a friend. Do all the things.

Keep up with us on the Instagram, Dating Detectives Podcast. And you can email us. investigate a datingdetectivepod.com if you have stories or questions. We hope you enjoyed the episode and I can't wait to see you guys again after our break. I know I'll miss you and I'll miss you my beautiful dating detective. I know I'm going to miss you so much. Goodbye my armchair smooth.