The Dating Detectives - The Origin Story

Episode Date: November 6, 2023

Mackenzie and Hanna hear the story that started it all! Erica dated a man who may or may not be a dogfish. In this episode we hear her story, and then Mackenzie will do an investigation and bring us the answers we need to crack the case! This episode of The Dating Detectives is sponsored by BetterHelp. Visit betterhelp.com/tdd today to get 10% off your first month. This episode of The Dating Detectives is sponsored by Dipsea. For listeners of the show, Dipsea is offering an extended 30 day free trial when you go to DipseaStories.com/ TDD Join our Patreon! For only $5 a month you will get 2 extra episodes a month, monthly virtual live events, and access to our community page!  https://patreon.com/TheDatingDetectives?utm_medium=clipboard_copy&utm_source=copyLink&utm_campaign=creatorshare_creator&utm_content=join_link Instagram & Tik Tok - @DatingDetectivesPodcast Facebook - The Dating Detectives Podcast Mackenzie's Socials - @Freedom_Barbie Hanna's Socials - @HannaAndergram ***The following Program contains names, places and events that have been anonymized or fictionalized for the purposes of protection and safety. The following Program is provided for entertainment purposes only and any commentary from the hosts are strictly conjecture and should not be held as making any definitive statements about the truth or identity of any particular individuals or circumstances. If you or a loved one are involved in an abusive relationship, please call the National Domestic Violence Hotline at 1-800-799-7233 for support See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

The following program contains names, places, and events that have been anonymized or fictionalized for the purposes of protection and safety. The following program is provided for entertainment purposes only and any commentary from the hosts are strictly conjecture and should not be held as making any definitive statements about the truth or identity of any particular individuals or circumstances. If you or a loved one are involved in an abusive relationship, please call the National Domestic Violence Hotline at 1-800-799-7-233 for support. Hi, Hannah. Hi.

I'm so excited. So I just happened to be in L.A. again, and we're in a studio again recording this episode. We're coming to cozy on a couch. But it's really cool because Hannah doesn't know anything about this episode, right? Well, yeah. So this is like a different, we're doing something different. We're kind of going back to our roots. If you're an OG listener.

Yes. Our first episode was an episode that you did some investigation work on. Yeah. We kind of worked on the case. Yes. we're doing that again. Yeah. So this one is really fun. And I need you guys to know, just like full disclosure,

I want to investigate all of your cases and go nuts and just use my resources. But I have to be very careful and make sure that I'm using my license appropriately. And I want to make sure that I'm doing the right thing. And I want to make sure that I'm following all the laws. And so it's not just as easy as me all willy-nilly pulling up the Google machine and all my resources and just finding stuff out. Like I have to do it by the book, by the law, because that's just, that's just how I function. Right. But it's important for me to maintain that, the integrity of my license.

So that's why I can't just go all really nilly. And that's where we love you. But this is one of those cases where I was able to use my resources and get some information. So it's going to work. This episode, we're going to hear from the victim, the dogfish victim. Yes. And then you're going to do the investigation and then we'll come back with answers. And then we're going to come back with some answers or lack there.

of. I don't know. We'll see. Well, but this is like, so you guys, this is the case that started it all. This is the case that Molly, our producer, like, she was, it was her, this is her brainchild. And she's like, we need to do like a whole series of this. And that's how dating detectives was born was from this case, this story. So I'm so grateful that this person came on because they obviously created a movement. And that is not a good thing. We hate that this habit to them, but good things can come out of terrible dogfish stories. Yes.

So let's get into it. Let's hear the story. And then you're going to crack it. And then let's see what I can come up with. Are you ready? Oh, my God. I know I'm on the edge of my seat. I want to know everything.

Let's go. Let's do it. Let's go on. Okay. Hi. Our guest is here. Hi. This is Erica.

Fake name Erica. I'm so excited to be here. I feel like this podcast has been so great to, listen to because I went through this and then getting to hear all these women's stories and just being able to feel not so alone and this experience has been awesome. So I'm really excited to talk to you guys and give me the 4-1-1 on everything. You've been like an OG supporter. Well, thank you for sharing because I know it must be so like it's such a vulnerable thing already, right? So I'm so interested in hearing the whole story from beginning to

and directly from the source. Yes. The original dogfish. Get into it. So take it away. So tell us from the beginning. Give us the details. Yeah, I will start with kind of my state of mind in this time.

Like how, and obviously anyone can be in any state of mind for this to happen to them, right? But I think it's really important to know that I was 23. I had just ended my first ever relationship with a man who was 15 years older than. me and it was definitely like a very vulnerable time for me. And so I met Simon on Bumble, just normal way to meet somebody. Bumble is like a dating app, right? For those of us, who are? The one where you have to message first. Yeah. So the woman message first. Oh, okay. And then if you're queer, like anybody can message first. Yeah. So I messaged him because he extended his time on me so you can like only have 24 hours to message already love bombing yeah no

what does that mean he extended his time so that means like he paid money to make sure that i could like talk to him for like i could message him it would expire yeah she didn't reach out so he was like yo i really want you to reach out to oh okay okay i like it so i was like that so then i messaged it so i yeah that makes you feel good yeah exactly and i hadn't really like been dating anyone So I was like, let's just like try this out. We start Instagram DMing. And actually at first, we're texting. And it's like normal.

And I'm like, cool. There's no, you know, nothing weird here. But then it's like it goes over into Instagram DMing. And that's how we communicate. So then that's how we started our date. That's like how we started talking. And then his whole excuse for that was because. he had bad service at his house.

Wait, so that's why he wasn't texting anymore. That's why he wanted to move to Instagram. Did he have an iPhone? No. Okay. Yeah. So at what point do you move it from like the dating app over to the instant? Like is that something that just normally happens or?

Yeah. Like I think I asked for his number. He asked for my number or something. So then we did start texting. And then he was like, I have bad service. Can we Instagram DM? Okay. So that's like how.

Possibly red flag. Right. So that's just how we. started. And so we communicated on Instagram DM and then that just became how we communicated the entire relationship. Wait, like the rest of the time? Yes. Like there was no texting after that? No texting. What? That was all the only way he communicated with me. Yeah. That makes me. And he said it was because he did he said it was because he didn't have service at his house. Yes. And then it just well I get okay. So that kind of makes sense. Like once you're chatting on some like platform, why not just.

Okay. Yeah. Benefit of the doubt. Benefit of the doubt. Exactly. But also it's like him making it so that you won't text him. Like, why does, is there someone he doesn't want to see the texts coming in? We will see.

Yeah. So I just thought it was normal because I didn't like to see the green texts on my phone. That's such a thing. So I was like, it's fine. If you have an iPhone, if you have an iPhone, the messages come through blue. Whereas if you're texting someone with an Android, they come in green. And that can be really annoying. Because then you know they don't have an iPhone

until you know the message is going to do. It's just not cute. It's just a thing. If you have an Android, we still love you. Yeah. Kind of. My husband still does. I don't get it.

Okay. Well, for him. But yeah, so we go on our first day and it's, at first I'm like, okay, I don't know if I really like this guy. I'm kind of just having fun and he is not really like, he doesn't seem too interested at first. And so I was like, okay, I guess this date isn't going, like, amazing. Did you think he looked okay?

Like, were you attracted to him physically? I was attracted to him. He was very tall and, like, broad. And we first met at his house, which, looking back now, obviously, not a great idea. But what was the house like? It's so he has, like, a front house. And then there's, like, a back house. And that's where, like, his room was.

So then he, like, takes me to the, like, back house area. Wait, before you're even first date. Literally when we first met, this is when we first met. This is like our first moment together. Okay, never go to the second location and never go to the serial killer basement back house. Go ahead. No, no, I'm just kidding. Don't see what I did.

And so we go. Or the houseboat. Or the houseboat like Canada did. Oh, my God. We both live to tell the tale. Oh, yeah. Thank God we're here today. Thank God.

But we go to his back house. And it's like kind of a mess. He's like, I just moved out of my ex's place. Like we moved. Like I moved, this is my dad's house, but like, I own this house. So it's really like my house. So he owns it, but he's living in the back toy house. And his dad lives in the front.

So that's what he told me. All right. So that's like, that's my background on him. I'm like, okay, that's like, cool, whatever. We'll go get drinks. It's fine. Anyways, we're at drinks. It's like a whatever day we get back.

And then we hook up because that's what I wanted to do. Yeah, you're in. It sounds like if you're getting out of religion, when I'm dating after a breakup, I'm so much more forgiving of red flags, not because I'm forgiving of them. It's just I don't expect it to turn into anything serious. I'm like, okay, they're messy. Ignore it. Just go get your drink and make out because we like making out. That's like exactly my whole mindset because I didn't really feel like he liked me. I didn't feel like I liked him. So I was like, well, just like hook up your hot. And then I'll go and then cool, fun date. Whatever.

after that, it was like everything changed with him. He was obsessed with me. Like he would just be like, you're so beautiful. I want to have your babies. This is our first day. This is our first day. Oh, wow. Did you say how old he was?

He was only like five years older than me. Okay, but still older. Yeah, but still older. And so then like he kind of just starts telling me all this information about himself and his background when we're, this is like post hookup. when he's feeling, you know, obsessed with me. So did you think that after you guys hooked up that he, because you said at first you didn't say he didn't feel,

it didn't seem like he was that into you, but then did he seem more into you after you hooked up? Yes. Okay. And I was like, okay, good for me. Yeah, I was like, I'll take the compliment. Like, thanks. And of course, like I'm vulnerable.

It's after a breakup. I'm like loving this attention. So it's awesome. But, yeah, then he starts just telling me, like he wants to have babies with me, all this stuff. This is like in. Like are you like in bed It's like pillow talk?

Yeah, it's like pillow talk He's like what are the names of our kids? Yes, literally. So he's talking about babies And then he goes, look, I can show you like I can make like really cute babies. Oh, what? And then he shows me a picture of these like two

blonde little kids And he's like, these are my kids. And I'm like, what? You're like, that was not on your bumble. No, no. It was not on his bumble. Like during pillow talk he's bringing out, first date.

for stay and everything. Okay. So he's like, yeah, like I'm separated from their mom. And like we met in Oregon when I went to school there at Portland State. And I'm like, okay, that's cool. Like, I don't really care. I just met you. I'm just kind of trying to find my shirt.

Yeah, no, exactly. And she's like, I'm ready for this walk of shame. Yeah, no, I was, wrap this up. I was like, this is entertaining. I really was in that mindset of like, this is kind of silly. and didn't really think too much of it at the time. And I will also say this place that he was living in was kind of crazy because he also was growing weed in a huge greenhouse inside of this like

room back room. What? Inside. So hold on. So he owns this home. He says he owns it. He says he owns the home. He's living in the back alley house or whatever it is.

Like a pool house kind of thing. Yeah, kind of. There's a greenhouse inside of it. Yes, like a whole, a whole ordeal. Like, was it like a commercial amount of like weed or like? It was like a large amount. Like it was a large amount. It was a large amount.

And then he had a whole out. When I learned later, when I had when I had been over there more because, you know, not to spoil it, but like I kept seeing him. But yeah, then he had like an outdoor part too. So it was a whole production of marijuana. And he's selling this? Yeah. So that's what I learned later on too. that he was selling it. He, you know, sent me home with some. And so I was like,

a goodie bag. I got a hookup. I got free weed. I goes told I'm really beautiful. Like, I'm thinking this is just silly and it's fine. Just a Tuesday in LA. That's what we have planned for you tomorrow. But we marijuana is legal in LA, right? Can you grow it? So that's what's also weird is like, okay, well, it's legal here. Why are you illegally growing it? Oh, so you can't legally grow. Okay. Yeah. So like you would need permits. You would need land. And like, I'm sure there's way more that goes into growing weed legally than there is illegally. So he's not just smoking it. Like, he's legit doing it.

He didn't even smoke it now. Like, he was straight up just doing it for business. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. And also, I will say I, what he told me he did for work is he was like some, like, coder for Google. Something on the computer for Google. I'm sorry.

A coder for Google. And he's living in the backhouse of a house that he owns that his dad lives in. Growing weed. for going weed for funsies. Exactly. All right. Supplementing his income with. Gay.

But see, I'm putting myself in the like the position that you're in and I'd be like, oh, he's a genius coder. He's messy. I'm like... He's really smart with his business opportunity. Like, there's ways that you can go. Hindsight's 2020.

Mm-hmm. Do you ever see him coding? I saw him on the computer one time and he had like a lot of monitors and it looked like a lot of stuff on the screen that I didn't understand. So, yeah. I mean, so to pedophiles do that too. Yeah, we could download some fun video games and make them look like.

Totally. So that could be very sketchy. Like, it could be very questionable. Yeah. Also in this room, now I'm going to really fully describe this place to you because it's actually kind of insane. Oh, God. So he has like a lofted bed. And so.

Like a child? Like a bunk bed? Like a child. My son is nine. He just had. have to take a ladder to climb up there. Oh, boy. That sounds like a child's dream. Okay, go ahead. Yeah, so, so he has that situation. Next to him, like the bedside. It's like just like a

platform and then a mattress is on it. Yeah. It's not comfortable. It's not like it looks like he could have built it himself, honestly. Oh, this is his bed. This is his bed. Okay. And then next to the bed is like a holster for a gun. Like a gun is right there next to it. Right next to it. Yeah. After we do the deed, I'm like, oh, there's been a gun next to me this entire time. What kind of gun I asked this question not knowing anything about guns, but I imagine McKenzie you will help me. Like a handheld pistol thing. Okay.

Yeah. Like a pistol. So that's not. So did that, like, concerned you somehow? It definitely was, I don't like guns. I don't love that it's like so out in the open. Yes. Well, if you're, I get it for a self-defense, but wouldn't you want to put it like in a drawer?

Like in a drawer next to your bed. So, well. Right. So I think that depends on how you're. trained with the weapons. That makes sense. It's preference. But when you have someone over,

maybe like make them aware, just for safety reasons or whatever. And I like that you say like, if you're properly trained, like it depends on how you have the gun. Well, then he backs, when I ask about the gun, he backs it up with,

well, I was in the Marines. And so I like can handle a gun. I was a sniper is what he told me. Okay. And I was like, okay. The other thing about having a gun out like that when you bring, he doesn't know you either. Like, that feels unsafe to have a stranger come in and have a gun right there. Like, you don't know what anybody, I just, yeah. No, it's anybody who's

irresponsible. It's irresponsible and it as a responsible trained. As a responsible trained gun owner, I can tell you that it is normal, at least where I live, but maybe it's geographical. In LA, yeah, in LA, it's different, but. Would raise a brow. Yeah, but in where, as long as it's legal, you're properly trained, it's cared for, it's stored properly, you know, all those things. But if I'm bringing a stranger into my home, I'm not going to have guns out all willy-nilly that they can just shoot me with. Right. It's not the thing.

And at least, like, tell me that the gun is there. I feel like that would be a courtesy. Yes. Like, hey, I just want you to know there's like weapons in the house. Like this is where they are. Or something. Make sure. Yeah, you're comfortable.

Like anything. So he says he's a Marine. He says he's a Marine. Okay. Benefit of the doubt. Right. Again, I'm like, okay, you're older. And like, you probably started this when you were 18.

So it makes sense that you would have had all these lives by now. But then he also was saying he went to like three different colleges. He was wearing a UCLA sweatshirt. So I was like, and so he told me he went to UCLA and was a TA there. So you have to like go there for a while and also. Right. Okay. And he studied like computer science.

Yes. Or something. And then he met his baby mama in Oregon when he went to school, either like Portland State or University of Portland, one of those. And because I was like, oh, I'm from like Oregon. And he's like, okay. Like didn't want to like ask more about that. Oh, that's weird too. Yes.

So weird. And I remember like telling my friends this after the first date. And they're like, sounds like a weirdo. Like, because I was like, yeah, like, you're like, what a crazy story. What a crazy story. Exactly. So I leave the date being like, this is just going to be a crazy story, truly. So I get home and he calls me when I get home.

And I'm like, hi, like, stranger man. And he's like, I just want to make sure like you're home safe and everything's good. And I was like, well, that's so nice that he would ask. Yeah. Like, if I got home safe. That sounds nice and polite. Right. And so, of course, I went through a range of emotions from this first date of, like, he didn't really like me.

To, like, then he was obsessed with me. Then he had a gun. Then he had a gun. And then he was checking in on me. So I was, like, all over the place with how I felt. But I was like, honestly, if he wants to see me again, like, this could be kind of fun. And the sex was good. So I was like, let's do it.

So, yeah. And then I ended up seeing him again. And we Instagram DMed again to communicate. to Kate. Sure. And we just kept seeing each other and I kind of kept more and more as I hung out with him kept kind of buying all of the like love bombing that he was giving me. Can you give some examples? Yeah. Like the the whole just being so just thinking I'm literally the most beautiful person in the entire world like just literally just talking about my look and I have been insecure about my looks like my whole life. And so I think that just really like did it for me was being told I was just like a

model and I was so beautiful. Oh, I think so many women can relate to that. Yeah. And that just like constant validation was so I aided up. It was like addicting for me. Do you think looking back on it, do you think he knew like, do you think he knew what he was doing? Like I think so. I think that definitely like if I was the person I am now like a lot more confident in myself, I would have. caught that bullshit way quicker. Yeah. I mean, in his defense, you are gorgeous. Yeah, thank you.

It's a fine line because obviously, like, I want men to tell me I'm beautiful. Like, he's not wrong. They better compliment us, but it's like funny how it's a really hard line when it's the normal and then just a little too much. But we talked about in an earlier episode how too much love bombing can really like make it seem not real. Like, it's not real anymore. Like now it's like, okay, you're trying too hard.

So the love bombing was obviously kind of a red flag, but you liked it. I did. And that's really nice. Where I was at also was I had just finished this relationship with a guy who would text me like once a week. And like we would see each other once a week. And it was very like unemotional. And like I liked him so much. And he didn't really give me much.

And I was constantly like needing more validation. And then I meet this guy who is the complete opposite and is like, I'm obsessed with you. I want to be with you. That must have felt so good in that moment. It was awesome. And it was exactly what I was wanted. You also probably got out of that relationship not thinking you deserved that kind of thing. Yeah. Totally. If any red flag comes up, you're like maybe I'm just being insecure and this is what I deserve.

Totally. It's so hard. Yeah. My whole frame of reference, my whole context to what a relationship was supposed to be was all out of whack because of this first relationship I had. And so, yeah, I was just going into it, really just enjoying the attention and eating it up. Of course. And as we got to know each other more, I kind of realized that I didn't like him, but I also was just having a good time. And by our fourth date, he's constantly trying to get me to commit to him. But then our second and third date, he is like, why don't we just call ourselves boyfriend and girlfriend?

Why? He wants you to be his girlfriend. He wants the title. He wanted you to be like pregnant yesterday. Literally. He was like, lock this down. No, literally he was like, I like want to have babies with you and have a family with you. Like he was like ready to like take me and like make me a mom. Wow.

It's been five minutes, sir. Let's wait until at least an hour goes back. Yeah. And I'd be like, oh, you're silly. Like stop that. Like I just didn't understand that he was being serious. Yeah. Because it was so outrageous.

And so by our fourth date, he told me he had hooked up with another girl. What? Yeah. The what? Wait, so he's like, will you be my girlfriend? Also, I'm sleeping with other people. Yeah, because. That's a mind game.

I was like, I would like like us to not like see other people if we're like having this much sex. I just think safety wise. Yeah. Like it would be good. Yeah. And also you seem pretty obsessed with me. So like I don't know why you would want to see anybody else. It's weird.

So then he did tell me he hooked up with another girl. And so then I was like in my vulnerable kind of insecure state was like, well, then let's be boyfriend and girlfriend. Do you think that's probably what he wanted? A hundred percent. He wanted to make you, yeah. He wanted to make me jealous. He wanted to make me like want him to be mine by just saying like other girls wanted him to. And so you and you walked right into it.

I like, yep, that's what we're doing. Absolutely. And also this whole conversation happened after a whole beach day after just being like loved up on the beach and being cute. And then we were going to this romantic dinner. Just like pulling out all the stops for me on this day is what he was doing. This was our fourth date. I will also say again. So you became boyfriend and girlfriend. You have this romantic situation. Okay. So does that date end well? The date ends fine. I go back to his place. I stay up all night thinking about this decision. I think I knew my intuition deep down. Your fan tuition. My fent tuition. I think I knew deep down this was a mistake.

And I realized I didn't know what I was doing. Yeah. But when morning came around, he's all lovey and sweet. And literally he bought me brownies and cookies that night and delivered them to my apartment. and I'm like, oh my God, I have a boyfriend who buys me things and tells me I'm beautiful and takes me to the beach. What did I say this morning? You said, you guys said, what do you need from us?

And I'm like, just feed me and tell me I'm pretty. Exactly. Exactly. Exactly. It was so easy for me back then to like just have that any kind of attention like that. I was like, I'll take all of it. Yeah. And so.

It feels so good. It's like a drug. Like, it's hard to put it away. And, you know, my friends would bring up the red flags and I would be like, you just don't like him? Like, I would be defensive about it because I was finally getting what I had always wanted. And I kind of wasn't seeing it clearly. But my friends could see it. But also, we get defensive when we know we're doing something dumb.

Wait, that's such a real thing. I actually, somebody says whenever I'm defensive about something or whenever anyone's defensive about something, it's a good sign to like, look inward and like see why you feel the need to because if you're confident about something then you don't feel the need to defend it. When I heard that I was like, whoa, mind blown. It's true. A hundred percent. Yeah. So I, we just continue dating. He, you know, he meets my friends one night. And I more and more as he's like becoming more involved in my life, I catch more feelings for him. because I just think, like, you're spending all this time with this person, and I definitely was not fully always listening to him.

Even in the healthiest of healthiest heterosexual relationships, I think that's the game. You can ask my husband, he'll tell you I never listen. It's true. And so I definitely fully wasn't, like, getting the picture on who this man was because I was just kind of in this, like, a love-blind state of, like, just, like, giddiness and, like, love bombiness. So many women are going to relate to this. Yeah, that's why your guys' podcast, just every episode, I'm like, oh my God, there's another one. It sounds like I inspired this. It's like they thought about this. Thank God. I'm not alone. But yeah, it was,

it was intense. And it kind of, what happened was as we're talking just on DMs and my friends get a little more like curious about this man because it's getting more serious, right? And I'm in, you know, La Dada State. So I'm not doing my research on him. Of course. And they're like, I can't find him on any social media. I can't find this man anywhere. And I'm like, what do you guys mean? Like he has an Instagram. We Instagram DM. That's all we do together. Wait, real quick. What does his Instagram look like? Like, is he up to date with it? Does he have a lot of followers? Like, what's his active on it? What's the aesthetic? So his Instagram

seemed pretty normal because he was posting and everything but also his like his ad his username was not his name and his name was nowhere to be found like in his bio

or anything Wait what do you mean his Instagram was like how Freedom Barbie isn't your name but you have like McKenzie in like in my bio so he had like nothing

that said his name anywhere and so that definitely was weird and I I understood why my friends were like, this is strange. But I think it would have been different if he had something on something else, somewhere else. Yeah. But the fact that he had only Instagram, never showed his name and no other social.

Like they checked Facebook and they checked like TikTok, like all the things and they couldn't find him. And also if he's like in the Marines and it works for Google. Yeah. I would feel like there'd be some kind of documentation. Yeah. These are all the questions. You're like this. Yes.

Yeah, on top of social media, not being able to find anything, it's not like he also had any presence just online in general. At all? At all. So you know how like, like, I think if I search my name by Pinterest comes up. Yes. It's just like any kind of thing. But for him, it was like nothing from those schools that he said he went to. Graduation announcement.

No graduation. He was in the Marines. You would think there'd be something about that. Nothing like that. Yearbook stuff. Nothing about his team. Nothing about his kids anywhere. You would think like, oh, he's a dad.

He would want to maybe post his kids somewhere, like talk about his family. None of that. You couldn't find a baby mama, children, nothing. No, he showed me just those like two photos. And that was kind of it. That's all I had. Have you ever read a sexy book, like a little bit of smut, a little fantasy where you're like, ooh, I feel excited reading this? and like maybe you don't know, you know what I mean?

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recording them on Dipsy. On top of that, things were not going so swimmingly, like, in our relationship. We had been dating for approximately like a couple weeks at this point, and my parents came in town, and so I decided to go to dinner with them, like a normal child of my parents coming to town. Sounds lovely. Sounds legit. And so me and my mom. my friend are at dinner and me and my boyfriend, Simon. We. And that's his real name, you guys. Simon was a great name.

Making it so obvious. Simon. We want to make sure everybody stays anonymous and safe. That's the goal of the dating detector. Fucking Simon. Go ahead. Yeah. Fucking Simon.

So I'm at dinner with my parents. I tell Simon that we can meet up after my dinner. And I'm like, I'll probably just go to you. like we lived pretty far from each other. We lived on like complete different sides of the city. So anyways, I'm at dinner with my parents and yeah, we make this plan to meet up after. I get like a little drunk at this dinner because my parents like love wine and so they're like giving me glasses of wine. And so I like get home from this dinner. I'm like, hey, do you mind like coming to mine? And he just gets hissed at me. He's like, I can't believe like we have plans and like you just. You just

just want to change them. And I'm like, well, like, I'm drunk and I can't drive. Like, I guess I could Uber. And he's like, no, like, no, you said you were going to be here. Like, why aren't you following through? Very possessive. Very, like, he couldn't handle, like, when I would want to change the plan. Or he didn't like when I would just, like, not want to see him, honestly. He didn't like that. If I said no to hanging out, that would make him mad. And he'd be like, why? Why? I'd be like, because I need to be alone because I'm a human. Yeah. We're not supposed to be together 24-7.

And so, yeah, he got really mad at me and we ended up, like, having a little bit of an argument. So then a couple days later, I go over there and he's like, what are we even fighting about? Like, completely flips the switch. Oh, okay. And is, like, everything's fine. Like, I don't even know what we're fighting about.

Like, you're so beautiful. Again, the whole love bombing thing again and just back. to normal. So it's like a, it's just how did you respond? Were you like, all right bet, like it's fine, we're over it now or did you what did you do? I honestly, I liked the drama a little bit. Yeah. I definitely was kind of eating it up and I was like,

oh, this guy is yeah, you have your little Who do you think you are? Simon? Boyfriend. Like just my boyfriend being stupid. Yeah, exactly. That's like exactly the whole thing of how I felt. But yeah, looking back now, I'm like, okay, that was a huge road flag for him to not be okay with me saying no to him.

Yeah. The phrasing of what are we even fighting about with a fight that he started is so telling to me, which I've never thought about. But I'll also tell you that's probably something I've said to my husband, 7211 times. But there's a good reason because it works. It's almost like shifting. It's not explicitly saying like you started the fight. It's not like outright gaslighting, but it is kind of shifting the blame away from.

But this is also a relationship that we're like three weeks into, four weeks and two. Yeah. Very different. My husband married me. He knew what he was getting into. Yes. 100%. Yeah.

Like, we are, it's fresh. And I'm at dinner with my parents of all people. Like, he should be like, how are your parents? Did you have a lovely time? Yeah. Right. That would be the normal reaction. So, yeah, after this fight and then after this whole, I can't find him on

social media thing. I'm getting a little weirded out, but I'm also, again, getting more into him at the same time. But were you getting annoyed with your friends? Like, what do they know? Was there ever a point where you were like, they're being annoying? A hundred percent. I, like, I had friends in relationships at the time and I was like, well, like, who, how can you say that? Like, you're in a relationship. Like, yeah, what do you know? Yeah, you know. Yeah. It's like, it's like, this is just how it is. It's easy for you to say. Like, and also like, my relationship's different. Like, I definitely was kind of like me and him against the world. And I think that's exactly how he wanted it.

That's so common. Mm-hmm. Yeah, because he definitely would not be supportive of me, like, wanting to be with my friends. Like, he always wanted to be with me. And so I think that also didn't get through to me, but it also made me feel like, yeah, we're a team. And it's you and me. It reminds me of, like, every song. Yeah.

So many songs are like, I was like, I was thinking. I don't care what they say I'm in love with you You know that's like Exactly We got a record deal Molly We got a studio in here

We got our managers here We got it's like it's happening But it's weird We are kind of like Conditioned to be like Once you found the love of your life You do anything to fight for that love Exactly

What does that even mean? Unless they're a complete dick Yeah Yeah Then we're not So then what So then my best friend Sat me down

And she was like For your safety She was very concerned because, again, it's like, we don't know anything about this man. And he wants to take me on these vacations. Did you go on any trips with him? So luckily, no, because we didn't even get that far. We dated. Oh, what happened?

Okay. Yeah, we dated for like a month and a half, a little less than two months. And I had come to him. And I, because my best friend begged me. She said, please just ask him about his social media. I just need like you to bring up the conversation. Why isn't he online? Yeah.

She just needed answers. And I was like, La-di-da, whatever. Like, sure, like to make you happy. And she did seem really concerned. And I didn't want to stress her out anymore. Yeah. I was like, that's not fair.

So I go to him and I say, hey, like, just kind of weird. Like my friends can't find you on social media. I can't even believe like the excuses that come out of his mouth. What did he say? He's like, well, for my kind of job, you don't really need LinkedIn because, and then he named some, like, coding platform. And he's like, I have, I don't even have that because, like, they just know me. Like, he was kind of saying.

What? Yeah, he was kind of saying I'm so good that, like, I don't need anything. And he barely needs to work, too, because apparently he's with you all the time and not working. Oh, yeah. He would literally say that he would, like, take an Adderall and stay up all night. just to like have the whole day off with me the next day. Because I worked retail at the time. So I had random days off. And so just to be with me, he would, this is what he told me,

would just spend all night working just to be able to spend time with me the next day. That sounds 100% bogus. Like did you ever believe him? Yes. You probably wanted to. Yes. Of course. Wait, so you, he says he doesn't have LinkedIn.

He doesn't have the professional stuff. But did you press at all? Like you're not, you don't exist. You are off the grid. Like, why are you off the grid? Yeah. I was like, yeah. There's just like nothing there.

And he's like, so this is also kind of goes back into this background on him of like not trusting the internet. And that was also a big part of like his personality because he's a coder. So he's like, well, I just kind of took myself off the internet. I wouldn't trust the internet if I was trying to hide something too. I'd be like, no, we do not trust the internet. That's true. Wait, how do you, so PI perspective, is it easy to wipe yourself from the internet? No.

How do you do that? No. That's like, I'm a code. Can you code the internet? Listen, I'm not saying it's not possible because it's possible. Like, right? Like, if you got the right three letters behind your name or whatever, right? But it's, you don't just wipe yourself off the internet.

Like, you can't just, you can't stop other people from posting things. You don't have access. Like, you can't, that's not, that's not something that's real. You guys, don't ever believe that. Stop it. Yeah. Don't believe it. Like, unless this person's, like, deep, deep, like, CIA operative or whatever, like, something outrageous.

Also, when I was talking to him about no online presence, he was in this one YouTube video, and it was, like, a social experiment. And I don't know if you guys have ever seen, like, those kinds of videos where it's, like, these groups of people. And, like, one person is, like, the odd one out. And they're trying to, like, guess who it is. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Buzzfeed style.

Kind of, like, silly. Yeah. Yeah. like truth or drink like those kinds of videos So it's kind of like that and it went like Pretty viral this video that he was in And it was on his bumble profile also Like he wasn't shy about

Oh so he okay so he made it Yeah and it was also part of the reason why I was like Well yeah he's his Instagram doesn't have his name or anything But he's also like online like he's on this YouTube video But again my best friend was so good at putting in the work And wheelchair sleuth Yes exactly to really find this guy.

And in this video, in the description, they name every single person in the video, but him. What? He is the only person not in the description. He's the only one not credited in this video. So is his, do we not know his real name? Like, I'm wondering if there's another name on that list, or is he just not on it?

Yeah, hindsight, of course, then it became like, who is this person? To this day, do you even know if that was his real name that he gave you? I have no idea. You never saw like an ID or anything. No, nothing. And like it's not like his name is anywhere on the internet.

Yeah. Not even on that video that his whole body face is in. Did you ask about the YouTube video? Yeah. So when I was asking him about all this like social media stuff, I said to him, I said, okay, well, also on top of everything, like the video that you're in, the video that we've talked about before, like your name's not in it. And this is when he gives me the craziest excuse.

What do you say? He literally said, well, the girl that I'm flirting with in the video, because he's flirting with this girl in the video. She got... And he puts it on his bumble profile? No, right. Lame. She got a lot of hate because she...

It was about sex, the video, and she was very, like, out words about, like, how sex positive she was. And she was also young. So a lot of people were definitely going off about her in the comments. And his whole thing was, well, I, you know, supported her so much that I got into this, like, lawsuit with the YouTube company to get the video taken down. And that's why I'm not credited. What? That he, like, stood up for her and, like, wanted to end the abuse online that she was getting.

Okay. Okay is right. I was like, that's crazy. It was, like, an insane thing. Of course, he was so believable to me because he just had so many details. Yeah. And it was so outrageous that I was like, no way, this isn't true. Because it's like, this is so crazy.

And he knows you. So he's saying, I was supporting this woman who was like, you can obviously empathize and support that. Exactly. Of course. That made him look like a hero to me because I'm like, yeah, you support women, even the woman that you're flirting with. Yeah. That's crazy. This guy lives in his dad's freaking pool house.

So did you ever meet? The dad, by the way? I did. Did the dad say, don't believe my son? He's full of baloney. It was like, he didn't even introduce me to the dad. It was like the dad was like talking to a neighbor and Simon was just walking me to my car. He's like, oh yeah, this is my girlfriend.

He'd say, hey, dad, this is my lady. He didn't even do that. I was like, hi. Like, I said hi. Fucking Simon. Fucking Simon. I know. It's so rude.

It was so weird. But he also had this whole thing of like hating everyone in his. his family. I was going to say, I'm sure he had an excuse where he's like, well, my dad is like a piece of shit and I don't want you to have to go through that. You hate him so much that he's living in the main part of the house that you own while you're living in the greenhouse with the weed. Got it. Right. He lets his dad live at that house. Oh, does he? Yeah, exactly how he put it. So, yeah, exactly. Saint Simon. St. Simon. Yeah. So I don't really meet the dad. He says, like, just nothing nice about his mom who lives far away.

and like siblings and all of that. Like the whole world is kind of against him. We've talked about that's been a red flag that comes up every week. It's tricky because you don't choose your family and there are definitely times where you are like, yeah, I don't. But I, it's an easy way to isolate your relationship.

Yeah. I'm not close with my family and your friends also suck just so you know. Like that's what he was telling you. Was he defensive or was he like, oh, I can totally explain that. Like it's fine. He had like an excuse for everything. So what happened?

after the whole talk about the friends not finding him. Was he angry that they were like looking for him? He definitely was annoyed. Okay. Completely. He always seemed annoyed about my friends wanting to protect me. Well, yeah, he was annoyed that you were talking to anyone that wasn't him. Mm-hmm.

So after this whole talk, which I am eating up, by the way, like I know now in hindsight it all sounds kind of ridiculous. But I left that talk feeling like, okay, I have the answers I came here to get. But then right after that combo, he kind of goes off the grid. he tells me that his something happened with his mom and he needs so his mom he said had like mental health problems so something happened with his mom and so he needs to go be with her the one that he hates yes okay that he he hates because he's taking care of her okay he's taking care of everyone like he's always putting himself as this like he's a saint he's a saint yeah and he's just helping everyone

and so i was like okay no problem babe like i hope everything is fine and a few days later, I get an Instagram DM from him and he says hey, so my work doesn't want us to be remote anymore and I'm going to have to move

to San Francisco. And conveniently, conveniently, this is so convenient, Simon. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. I mean, so also the fact that you like didn't really talk, he made an excuse not to talk and then he's like, I'm moving.

So what happened? Did you go, like, so did you break up? Right. So I, at this point, was like so obsessed with him. I was in it. So I was so sad about this, like finding this out. Yeah.

And I believed every bit of it. I was like, I can't believe this is happening to me. And he also knew that my ex-boyfriend before him had moved away. Oh, no. And that's how we broke up was me and the older guy that I dated. So he, oh, no. So he used the same exact excuse, yeah, as my last relationship. Yeah.

Yeah. So then what happened? So then I'm like, can we talk about this? Like, I know this is really upsetting for you, but like, what about me and you? Like, what's going to happen? And so basically he comes over and he's like, yeah, I'm leaving at the end of the year. And I just think it would be easier if it ends now. and he seemed so, like, detached.

Like, he went from being, you know, obsessed to being like, well, this is just, like, how it has to be. Like, this is just what has to happen. So he, did you know at that point? Like, did it feel like he was making an excuse? Or were you still like, no, this is sad? It felt very real in the moment to me. Like, I think he had painted this, like, whole world so well. And he had just excuses for every single thing that I asked him.

So as soon as you tell him, my friends can't find you online, we don't. He knows that the jig is up. And he's like, oh, got to go. Like, I'm moving. Yeah, it was like he knew that people care about this person that I'm meeting and are looking. And are looking at me and paying attention. Okay, so then what? So then what happens with you?

Yeah. I mean, asshole. Yeah, he's moving away. Because you were on to him. I was on to him. I asked him all that stuff. Did you ask him, what's going to happen to the weed? Is Dad going to keep watering the weed?

I literally thought about that. And he was like, I'm so stressed out about my business. His weed business. Exactly. His weed business. And I'm like, well, what about me? I'm like, you were just so obsessed with me five minutes ago. And now you're like not even, yeah, you just want to get out of here.

So I was really taken aback, obviously. We broke up. And it wasn't until like four months later I get another DM. in my Instagram. Wait, so you all break up because he's moving away and that was it, like you didn't talk again after that?

No, I mean, I, we definitely talked a little bit because I was like, why are we breaking up? Like, we can still like be together until you're not that far. Yeah. So then you kind of like drifted off

a little bit. Yeah. Talking as much. And then what happened after four months? So then after four months, he diomed me again out of nowhere. And he goes like,

hey, I'm back in town. What? Careful. Don't fall off the couch. Okay. Why does he? He's trying to hook up. Yes.

Yes. He said, I'm back in town for the holidays. And may I add that it's like January 14? He's like, I'm here for Martin Luther King, Junior Day. What he had originally told me was that I'm going to move at the end of the year. So like December, January. And then like, I'm. I'm going to live there and that'll be it.

And run Google because I'm the greatest coder that's ever come through these doors. He is the next CEO. He is the Google machine. Because he can wipe himself from the internet. Yeah, he's amazing. Clearly. He's great. He's so talented.

And so, yeah, so he messages me and I'm like, well, aren't, didn't you just move? Like, how is your move? Like, what's going on? And why is you already back two weeks later? Yeah. I just am like, what is happening? And he is like. well, yeah, I actually, because we broke up, I actually ended up moving earlier.

And so I've been there for a little bit. See? Yeah. And so I'm like, okay, we start talking more. He's trying to see me. He's trying to be with me. But I'm like, no. Good.

I don't think so. Because at that point, too, I had started thinking about all of the things that happened in this relationship. And I was like, that was kind of insane. Yeah. Yeah. Once, like, I was away from him. it was like I could see clear. Yes.

I didn't have him in my head being like, you're so beautiful. I want to tip you away. Yeah, yeah, exactly. And having all these excuses for every single thing. Were your friends like, oh, you are having a breakup? We're so sorry.

Like, it's so funny when a friend leaves somebody bad and you're like, I am validating your feeling. Yes. But also they're stupid. But I'm having a party behind the scenes. Yeah, and I definitely like went back to my friends. And I was like, I'm sorry that I had put you guys through this.

Was he okay with you being like, no? So, no, because he would push it. And then while we're talking on Instagram, DM, I get all these notifications that go, this message was unsent. This message was unsent. Because Instagram started this new feature where you can unsend messages.

I start scrolling to, like, later in our messages. He is taking every single thing he's, ever said to me away. It looks like I am straight up just talking to myself for months. Like every single thing he's ever messaged me is gone. Also worth noting that you can you do that on I, oh, he has an Android, but like you can do that on Instagram. You can't do that on text. Exactly. So he just unsent everything? Everything. To which then I'm like, hey, like, why are you erasing all of our messages? And he's like, it's too painful. What did he say? He said, Well, I don't want Zuckerberg to have all my info.

I'm like, what are you talking about? It's just our conversation. Yeah, it's probably just memes. He's like, I'm doing this with everyone. This is, this is what, yeah. Also, isn't it pretty easy to, like, I guess you can't have to, maybe. He's trying to hide from someone. He's trying to hide his info from someone.

Yeah, absolutely. So what happened after that? Like, how did that conversation, like, end or whatever? So it kind of ended with like, I don't really think like we should see each other. No, definitely. No. But when I knew that he was available, that stayed in my mind a little bit. Yeah.

Because I was like, and he came back. They always come back. He came back. And he's persistent. As we know, he wanted us to be wife and a girlfriend after like three dates. So like he's a consistent, like he's not consistent, persistent. Persistent, yeah. He's a persistent man.

And so I knew this and I would, you know, message him whenever I felt like a little lonely or bored or any of that. And just kind of like so many of us can relate. Talk to him. Yeah. It's so much easier to do that than build something new with someone else. It's so much energy to build something new. And when you're in a place where like you don't want to build a serious relationship, you still want that validation. Exactly.

Yeah. Yeah. That's so normal. And I will add to like I also at this time. was trying to figure out my sexuality because I like knew I liked girls. And so that was also like on my mind. And I think that really helped me step away from him because it was like this bigger thing I had to focus on. Now you, the four month later thing, he comes back into your life. You're a little bit further on that journey. A little bit. So then what happened? Distanced. And I think also I start

thinking about all of the crazy things that he has done. And so I definitely have that in the back in my mind. I'm like, he's crazy, but like, maybe I'll talk to him a little bit. Yeah, it's still good sex. Yeah, exactly. And so, yeah, eventually, this was like months later, I am like, okay, fine, like, let's meet up. Because I was at a point where I was like, I just kind of am horny and I want to, like, hook up with him because it was great sex. So, and that's like what I remember the most about him at that point. I'm like, la-di-da, I can't remember all of the horrible things. And so I end up then, again, my femme tuition is like going off. The minute I send the text saying like, sure, I'll see you again.

You're like, I'm like, no. The Jaws theme song kind of plays. Just like a pit in my stomach. And so I tell him, actually, no, like I can't see you. The whole thing happened again, what happened like when I said no to him that time with my parents. He freaks out on me. he's like, I literally like, napped all day

to, like, have energy to see you tonight. Toddler's nap all this. St. Simon took his nap and now he's cranky. And then he's pissed because then you didn't want to see him. So then what happened? So then I was like, okay, well, this is exactly the reason why I can't see you.

And so he was like never talked to me again. And I was like, okay. All right, bet. And that was the end of the whole thing. So he said never talked to me again and you're like, all right, peace. Yeah. And then like a month ago, he follows me on Instagram. Like literally in recent time.

Can we block? Oh yeah. He's blocked now. Okay. Thank God. But I was like, I don't know what he was trying to do. I didn't follow him back. But he was trying to get back in there again.

Wait, we need to investigate this guy. Exactly. Now I want to know. Because I was in the military. Did he have kids? What was his deal with the house? What was it? I want to know all the things.

Did he ever visit his children when you were together? I wondered who the baby mama was. Like, I want to know more about this guy. I want to know all the things. Can we investigate? I think I'm going to talk to Molly. Molly's our beautiful producer, by the way, which sometimes you'll see on our stories on the Instagram.

But I think I want to get some, I think I want to get some... Some details. Yeah, let's just say we're going to investigate and we'll have you back on to go over what we find. Yeah, we're 100% we're going to investigate. Oh, my God. Especially since this is such an important story to the dating detectives, and there's still a lot.

Let's go over what we don't know. So we don't know if his jobs and colleges were verified. So he said he went to three different colleges. So we need to find out what's true and what isn't, right? So the colleges, is he a coder for Google? Honestly, I feel like we probably have listeners who work in, higher education. Dude, we can do, okay,

yes, if you are listening, we need to know if you, or if you know somebody who knows somebody who knows somebody who can verify these facts. I want to know what happens to your weed when you move. Two green houses.

What's the deal with the house? Yeah, we need to find out, so he said he owns the house. That's easy. I can find that out for sure. Yeah. Like that's, and did he,

does he have a car or anything? Like, yeah, he had a car. Oh, okay. So I'll find out the car. I'll find out the house. Like, we can find out literally. I just am curious about, his name because I have a feeling that his name is different. Yeah, I, because he's nowhere to be

found on the end. Yeah, we're, well, he's met the dating detectives. Bless his heart. Yeah. I'm so excited to find out. If anybody else has any questions based on this before we dive into the investigation. Go on our, go on our Instagram. We need to know what questions you guys have and we'll try to find the answers. And then we are going to have Erica back to find out like to kind of talk more about Simon and what we find or don't find. I'm so excited. I know, me too. It's been years in the making. Now it's not even a matter of like, oh, should she continue to see him? Now it's a matter of who the hell is this guy. Who was this person that I dated and talked to? But you're completely over him, right? Oh, yeah. So at this point, we're just curious. Oh, yeah. And it's like, yeah, it's hard to

move on when there's so much that you're like, was this a lie? Like all of the trust that it must It's been so hard to build that again. If anybody is like going through something similar where they're like, is this person a code or for go? Like, do you know what I mean? Yeah. Now that I'm 25, at that time I was 23 and had, again, my first relationship was with this older man. And so I just had no idea that I could even like have a say in a relationship, that I could even stand up for myself. And I think that is looking back now, there's so many more questions I would have asked.

Well, two years also is a really long time to learn. Especially when you're, yeah, especially when you're in your 20s. That's still a lot of learning. Yeah. Yeah. There's a lot of changes. So I can't wait to have you back and talk about like what we discover about Simon. Simon.

And also, yeah. Everybody find your people, your friends who are there for you, your family who's there for you. We always need our, we are not meant to be independent. So if anyone's trying to make you live without your community, reddest of red flags. If I didn't have my friends, like, looking out for me, I wouldn't be where I am now and it wouldn't have gone that way. Who's to say?

Well, they risked me being mad at them for my own safety. And I really think that's, like, the most amazing thing they've done for me. That's love. When it's, like, the hard truths, those are the people that you keep around, the ones who will be like, I'm doing this because I love you. That's hard. Thank you so much for sharing your story with us. guys also just keep in mind that Erica is the like reason for this podcast. This was the story

that kind of started at all. And Simon was right that you are stunning. Oh, thank you. So thank you Simon. Yeah, that's the only thing you did right. Hmm. Good taste. Thank you so much, you guys. This has been awesome. I love you. We can hug you because we're all in person. Okay, Hannah. What do you think? Me. First of all, I love Erica. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you for coming on. Yeah. Like, what is, well, what's interesting to me is, like, I feel like she knows in her bones something ain't right.

Like, if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, do you know what I mean? Oh, yeah. I mean, her, like, where she is now is, she's in such a better place. That sounds weird to say. She's not dead. But, like, she's able to look at it from the right perspective of being like, yeah, this is how he did this to me. but also I see now that, oh my God.

But also, I want to know. Like, I need to know what was, I need to know what was true. What was a lie? Like, we, sometimes we need that closure just like as humans, right? Like, we need to know, like, for me, I don't even care what the outcome is as long as I know it. Like, it can be totally devastating to me. But as long as I know, then it's like, okay, fine. Then I can find peace with it.

Yeah. Okay. So now the next step is that McKenzie is going to get some answers or try to get some answers. is we might have an episode in between before we can get it back to you. It depends on how long it takes because this one's going to be hard. Well, can I ask you whatever you can share? Like, what do you do now? Like, what are your PI steps?

Do you want to know, like, this is so profound? The very first thing that I always do is Google.com. Amen. Like, literally, that's what I feel like we should all start. And everybody thinks that their answers are going to be like right on the first page. You guys, sometimes I will scroll until page. like 327 on the Google. Oh my God.

But this guy like quote unquote wiped himself from Google because he's a coder for Google. Right. Okay, sure. Oh my God, I can't. Yeah. So the Google machine is my friend. But we'll see how it goes. We'll see what I find.

And then maybe if you still want to know like how I found some stuff, maybe depending on what I find. Okay. So keep track of your steps because we're going to ask you all the PI details that we can get. Okay. Because I know you can't tell me everything, which I respect. But I don't like. I know. It's like a magician.

I'm like, I get it, but I wish you could tell me. You don't know how hard it is sometimes because you just want to spill all your guts, but you can't. It's fine. This guy, the gun by the bed, like, just without mentioning it, if I went home with somebody and I just looked over and I was like, hmm. Like, I would be so nervous. I know it's like, depends on where you are, but it sounded like he was like, no, yeah. It's either this guy is a serial killer or he's just a avid gun collector. it's fine.

Right. How do you know the difference? Like, I would be scared. Like, I'd be like, is he trying to like tell me something that he's going to shoot? He's like, just so you know. There's. And here's my, it's like, it's passive aggressive. I'm not sure.

Anyway, so make sure you listen for that follow up episode because I'm really excited to dive in. Thank you. I have faith in you. And Hannah's not going to know until you guys do. So like we're going to, the next time I'm going to tell Hannah is going to, I'm going to find out everything I can. And then I'll share it with you.

you and because I want to get your genuine reaction when our audience gets to like. Man. Well, send us what you think about the story. You can DM us, dating detectives podcast on Instagram, TikTok, all the Facebook, all of things. Yeah, ask what questions that you have. Like what, like, be a sleuth and figure out like. Oh, yeah, you're suspicious. What do you think?

Yeah, what are your thoughts and tell us? And make sure that you share the podcast with a friend and ask them too because we need all the opinions and all, like, just, yeah, tell us all the things. And feel free to know. I'm dying to know. You guys, this is so fun because, like, I never get to, like, I don't know. I just turn my cases in and go home. Like, this is the first time I'm actually. This is the first time I actually get to, like, kind of talk about it a little bit. So this is kind of neat-chito for me. So I'm so excited. I mean, I'm glad she's out of it,

but I'm excited to. Oh, and make sure that you subscribe for the Patreon. You guys, it's only $5 a month. And you get two bonus episodes. every single month, you can connect with us, and there's like message boards and forums, and we really, really love to stay connected. And we do live events. We go live with you, and you can talk to us live on virtual live events. Yeah, the live events are always so fun because it's just kind of, and it's so informal, and we just try to have fun with it and just connect on a very personal level. There's nothing, there's no, like, schedule or outline. We just kind of talk.

Just hang. Yeah, and you can, you can come on and chat with us and share your stories with us or whatever. We absolutely love it. It's like a group of friends just kind of hanging out and it's the coolest thing ever. So I think that's one thing that I love about our podcast is that it is kind of really laid back and there's no scripts. Like we just kind of say what we want like him. Everything is just kind of hey, share it everyone. All the guests coming on telling us stories. We don't know the stories. Like we are just learning and hearing it with you and processing it with you, which is nice because everybody that listens to us. I mean, I haven't met a dating detective fan that I didn't like, an armchair sleuth I didn't like. Everybody's so cool.

And this story is special to us because of it's our origin story. Yeah, it's the origin story. So it's kind of cool. So. We're going to nail this guy. And also if you have your own stories, make sure you email us, investigate at datingdetectivepod.com. Also follow us on the socials at dating detectives podcast on Instagram and TikTok. And please share with a friend.

Oh, yeah. Oh, on Facebook too. You guys, we had a video that went viral, like over a million views. And that was so fun. Like, I love the engagement. So thank you for sharing that and watching those videos. So it's over on the Book of Faces and the Tiki Talk and the Instagram. The clock app and the Grim Cracker.

I love it. So, yeah, make sure you share and go subscribe to the Patreon. You can just go to the datingdetectivespodcast.com and do all the things there and listen to all the episodes. And trust your goddamn Fent tuition. That's the last thing on your to-do list. Everybody, please, honestly, do it. You deserve to. Tea.