The Dating Detectives - The Twin Flame Fight School

Episode Date: October 7, 2024

Lindsey and her husband were everyone's favorite couple, until the values of a cult like group seeped into their lives and turned him into a dogfish. Click here to join our Patreon! For only $5 a month you will get 2 extra episodes a month, monthly virtual live events, and access to our community page! If you've been dogfished and want to share your story on the show, email [e-mail] or contact us through our website using this link This episode of The Dating Detectives is sponsored by BetterHelp. Visit betterhelp.com/tdd today to get 10% off your first month. This episode of The Dating Detectives is sponsored by Quince. For free shipping on your order visit quince.com/TDD This episode of The Dating Detectives is sponsored by Dipsea. For listeners of the show, Dipsea is offering an extended 30 day free trial when you go to DipseaStories.com/ TDD Stop putting off those doctors appointments and go to Zocdoc.com/tdd find and instantly book a top-rated doctor today. ***The following Program contains names, places and events that have been anonymized or fictionalized for the purposes of protection and safety. The following Program is provided for entertainment purposes only and any commentary from the hosts are strictly conjecture and should not be held as making any definitive statements about the truth or identity of any particular individuals or circumstances. If you or a loved one are involved in an abusive relationship, please call the National Domestic Violence Hotline at 1-800-799-7233 for support See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

The following program contains names, places, and events that have been anonymized or fictionalized for the purposes of protection and safety. The following program is provided for entertainment purposes only and any commentary from the hosts are strictly conjecture and should not be held as making any definitive statements about the truth or identity of any particular individuals or circumstances. If you or a loved one are involved in an abusive relationship, please call the National Domestic Violence Hotline at 1-800-799-7-233 for support. Happy Monday. Hi, everybody.

Can we start saying, can we be like, happy dogfish Monday or dog. Dogfish day. Monday. We'll workshop it. Is this a Patreon or a real show? This is real. This is for the masses. Speaking of Patreon, though.

If you're not on the Patreon, you have to get on the Patreon because it's even funnier over there. The latest Patreon episode was really good. We got a bunch of email submissions that we shared. Yes. And like, you guys. It's crazy. There was a hitman involved.

Y'all. I mean, I won't spoil. But they hired a hitman and like went on the run. It was crazy. That one was wild. We talked about polyamory, which I loved some of the responses to that because it was a good conversation. It always is, though. And also, I love how everybody is so willing to talk about their experiences with different things. And like you, I really love to, I love to see how many different types of relationships there are. And like, you start to see like one size doesn't fit all. And it's really cool. It's true. And I love that. We've created a. community where people who are different, feel comfortable. I, like, want that to be a thing where

anybody can submit their story no matter what. Like, I don't want people to feel judged here. Yep. I love it. We love you. Anyway, so join Patreon. We also are starting a book club on Patreon. Listen, I'm not a reader. I'm more of like, if it's not an audiobook, forget it. But actually, like, I've been, like, kind of getting some books that I actually want to sit down and, like, read. Like, yeah. So send us, what people have sent us a lot of submission. ideas. We have one that we're scoping out to see if it's going to be our first book, but we want to do a combo. Like some months will be fiction, some will be more psychology, relationship book. Send us your ideas, though. So send us your ideas. Anything else we have to talk

about before we get into our guest. Oh, yeah. I just want to warn people. Oh, yeah, do the trigger warnings. Less fun than Patreon. We have a guest. Her name is Lindsay, and she was very, you'll love her. But yes, so just want to do a trigger warning. We talk about some pregnancy struggles and the journey of IVF and just a pregnancy journey in general. And that is really hard. And I'm glad we talk about it because we don't talk about it enough. Postpartum depression comes up and then definitely, you know, some mental health struggles, gaslighting. Just be prepared. Yeah. But I'm really excited for, so when we record the podcast, we record like the meat and potatoes, like the actual story. And then we come back and do the intro and outro because we have to

really careful how we just because of the sensitivity of the information but and so we've obviously we've already heard the story but but we're going to get into it but I just love that we can share with you actually like how we feel about it before like kind of introducing it like it's a good episode they're all good but it was it's good like you you guys are going to really like it shall we let's do it hi Lindsay nice to meet you hey Lindsay thank you so much for being here we're so glad to have you nice to meet you too it's exciting ready to talk about all this. Well, I'm ready. Let's get into it.

Wherever you want to start, the floor is yours. Yes, so I had what I like to call a starter marriage where I got married young. And that marriage crashed and burned. That was not, that wasn't a good idea. It happens. It happens to many of us. So, yeah. So needless to say, after that happened,

I was for 28 getting back on the dating scene and Facebook, I'm going to date myself. Facebook was like new and everybody was friending everybody and reconnecting with people. And I happened to reconnect with Dylan. I knew him from middle school. We were really good friends in eighth grade. We kind of separated when our own ways and had not seen him in. let's say 12 years, 13 years. Yeah. So did you still live where you went to middle school? Or had you moved away? Yeah. So after my starter marriage, I moved back. I moved back to Little Rock.

And I was living in Little Rock. And Dylan was living in another area. He wasn't local. So we started talking. I went on a couple trips to kind of meet up with him. We immediately had in incredible chemistry. Our physical chemistry was incredible. There was no question that the two of us were on the same page when it came to what we wanted from a sexual relationship, from a personal relationship. Like, we were dead on the same exact wavelength. And we realized, like, hey, this is legit. This is a real relationship. Like, we want to make this happen. He was, coming off of a marriage. I was coming off of a marriage. We both learned so much about ourselves. We were ready to actually be adults and be in a real relationship. So it was really exciting for me.

I was starting a whole new thing. I was ready to leave the career that I was in. And I decided that he was in Nashville. I was going to pack up my little dog and I was going to Move to Nashville. Okay. That's not like crazy far. No, it wasn't terrible. I wasn't terrible. But, you know, like I'm putting a lot of trust in this human being that I basically knew when he was 13 or 14.

And I've been talking to him now for like six months. And I'm like, pack it up and move to Nashville. I'm like taking my notes. Six months. Your notes. to Nashville. But I mean, when I got there, I actually got my own apartment, did not move in with him right away. I love that. And was really still trying to protect myself from the whole thing, but eventually moved in and everything was great. I got really lucky and landed in what I would say

is my dream career. I loved everything about it, was traveling. all the time, really felt listened to and needed. And I was really good at what I was doing. Like I, people respected me and I, I loved it. And he was supportive. And, you know, he didn't get mad at me for traveling as much as I did. And everything was great. I was confident. I was, you know, just taking on the world. Like, there was nobody that could stop me at that point. And then he got sick. He started, I mean, just a significant decline. And mind you, this man was in great shape.

He was, you know, did a lot of fight training, like a lot of martial arts fight training. Oh, wow. He was in amazing shape. I mean, worked out. And he's your age. You both were around 28, 29. Yeah. Yep. Exact same age.

But he got really sick. We're talking. it was not, there was no answers for it. Nobody knew what was going on. We ended up going to another state to a different doctor to try to identify what was going on. And we finally found out that he had essentially a brain tumor. And you went with him. You were in these doctor's appointments. I would be speaking at a conference because I was in sales. I would be speaking. speaking at a conference, California, let's say. And then I would fly back to the hospital, meet with the doctors.

And then when they scheduled the first surgery, I was in between, flew back, slept on the floor of the hospital. And that was just our life. And at this point, keep in mind, we basically had zero sex life. It was, we were just trying to survive. There was no intimacy. There was no. But that man was like, I needed him to be better.

I needed him to be healthy. So the first surgery happened and it didn't get, it didn't get fixed. So we had to go back about three weeks later. And exact same thing. I was still on the road working. I flew back in. everything was there and the second surgery worked supposedly so yeah but it didn't fix him he was still really sick like really sick and he got down to what i would say is probably

95 to 100 pounds was he living at home or in the hospital yeah no we were living we were living at home Oh, so you're like full-time caretaker almost. But here's a, I mean, like, I was also having to work. I mean, I was like, this company was built around my activity and what I was doing. So I was working and then had a constant worry that he wasn't okay. And so we kind of fought through it. And actually, our families both live in Little Rock. And his mom basically pulled the card and said, you're coming home to Little Rock.

We're putting you in the hospital. His dad is a physician. And we're going to figure out what's going on. So they did. And you probably had to stay in Nashville, I assume, for your job. Correct. But I was flying, driving back and forth because, again, I needed him to be okay. It was scary.

This episode is brought to you by BetterHelp. You guys, listen, I don't know if you've followed my social media, but I talk about how I used to wear makeup as a mask. Like makeup is a great hobby for me. It's something that I do for a living now. And on social media as an influencer, beauty and makeup, it's special to me, right? And I used makeup as a mask for so, so, so so long as I've been wearing makeup. So like 38, 40 now. So carry the one, whatever. I've been wearing makeup for a long time. I wore it as a mask until a couple of years ago when I decided, I don't want to wear makeup as a mask anymore. I want to unmask myself and really let myself shine. And I want to encourage you to do the same thing in your life, not necessarily with makeup,

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spicy spice, like maybe rugged cowboys or Scottish sailors or fairy royalty or the god of the underworld. Hmm. Mackenzie, if you had to choose a Scottish sailor, fairy royalty or god of the underworld, where would you go?

The Scottish sailor, because then I feel like comfortable cussing. Yeah, and then an accent. Even if it's Scottish, I'm not to say that fairies are gods of the underworld and an accent, but I think I'd go with the accent. I'm just saying, I would feel much more comfortable because I'd be like, oh, we can cuss here. It's fine. You don't think the god of the

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Dipsy's offering an extended 30 day free trial when you go to dipsystories.com slash TDD. So you kind of have no excuse because free trial. That's 30 days of full access for free. when you go to DIPS-E-A-Sories.com slash T-D-D-D. Dipsystories.com slash T-D. Have fun. And so he came to Little Rock. They figured some stuff out. And he started getting better.

And everything was, you know, he got his medications figured out. Everything was wonderful. His brother got married. and that was probably after three, four years of us battling, like, going through this. Oh, wow. Okay, so this is a time jump. Yeah, but like, but it's not even a time junk. Like the sickness, the sickness, the sickness lasted. Your whole life. Yeah.

That was three and a half years. There was no stop in that straight through three and a half years. Like straight through. It didn't stop. So you probably feel so bonded to this. and by the time they're starting to get better. Yeah, because I've seen. In a way that's like you don't usually get.

No, because I've seen him at his worse. Like, there's no seeing somebody worse than seeing your partner who was a healthy, amazingly fit person turn into a 90-pound skeletal remain. It's not fun. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Well, I obviously, I'm trying not to root.

for him in some ways because of dogfish potential, but I like the part of the story where he's getting better. So brother gets married. He's getting better. How's it going from there? We decided we were going to get married. So after the brother's wedding, we get married. Like, we are ready to go. And so we got married. It was a quick ceremony. And it was great. It was fantastic. Intimacy is back and I wind up pregnant. Hey. In a good way? You were like excited about it or were you like, oh, that was fast?

Well, let's talk about that. So I am not a maternal person. I know that about myself. I talk to kids like I talk to adults. I'm driven by logic and children are the most illogical creatures in the entire world. world. So I didn't know what to do, but he was ecstatic. I mean, that's all he wanted. Like, he wanted to, and it's funny, we never talked about it before. Like, we had never had that conversation. Like, do you want kids? Do you not want kids? We'd never had it. But when I got

pregnant, it was like, this is what we're doing. And then I had a miscarriage. I'm so sorry. So that, thank you. That actually affected me a lot. I mean a lot. I didn't realize how much it was going to affect me. But at that point, I had recognized how important it was for him to have kids. And so we started doing a ton of tests because they couldn't figure out.

And it turns out his medical condition, basically made him infertile. And so the only way for us to get pregnant was to go through either artificial insemination or in vitro. And I am at this point, you know, 30, 34. So we started with artificial insemination. That did not work.

And so we had to go down the in vitro route. And in vitro was, it's like a big deal. They make you go to like counselors and therapists and they have to make sure that you're going to be able to go through it mentally, that you're going to be strong enough to go through this whole process. Who knew? I actually, yeah, I didn't know that at all. The therapist, I should have mentioned this, like the therapist that we went to, he looked at us and said, I have never seen two more complimentary people in my entire life. He said, there is absolutely, I have no reservations that you all will be able to get through this experience.

And so. I'm so stressed about wherever this is going. Boat of confidence. And he was. He was supportive and he cared and he was always there. Are you excited about the process of having a kid for yourself now or was it still kind of more just for dill? I don't know. I wanted to do it for him because I knew he wanted it so much. I didn't even know what to do with a baby. I'd never, I'd never changed a diaper before. But it was so important to him that it became important to me because I saw how excited he was about it. I saw a change human being. Like it lit him up. Like he was excited. And so I think I got excited because it's like that's what he what he wanted and if he wanted it I wanted it and it was yeah that's what it was you guys were a team at that point and you do it together yeah not a small

thing it's not like oh you want Thai food tonight but I want Mediterranean okay we'll get Thai it's not that it's a huge thing to do it is and then you're you you also have to understand that I'm a girl who has had body dysmorphia issues my entire life and Throw the hormones of in vitro into that. And on top of the fact that I'm traveling all the time, and I have to be at doctor's appointments all the time. And my job is what has always defined me. And now I'm being told that I need to go to doctor's appointments like every three days. Oh my gosh. It became a lot. And so we did in vitro. And I ended up leaving. leaving, I'm going to probably start crying about this part. It's crazy to me. I ended up leaving

my job because I couldn't do it. And for somebody who like, that is what I did. Like that was me, but I couldn't do it. I couldn't. It feels like giving up your identity. Yeah. And so I switched careers. But I got pregnant. Yay. Woo-hoo. And it was a roller coaster. I obviously had a little more free time. He was working full-time. He's extremely smart and really good at what he does and was working. But we also decided at that point to start a martial arts school because that's what he did. And that was his passion. And we had some more time. And we started a martial arts school. And, you know, we built a great little side business.

I was still working. He was still working. And it was really good. Like I made it. I was not a great pregnant person. I mean, you know, women who are like, I loved being pregnant. I never felt more beautiful. No, I was sick for 22 weeks.

Is that? Okay. It was not fun, not fun for me. And then a month before I give birth, he meets me at the doctor's office. And he's, I walk off the elevator and I can tell something's wrong. And I'm like, what's up? And he's like, I was just fired. So a couple days before this, I had heard him talking to his boss.

And when he got off the phone, I was like, do you really think you should be talking to the CEO of your company that way? Because it doesn't sound like you should be. How do you react to that? He's like, well, he's like, he can't do anything about it. He needs me, you know, this is when I started to see this ego. Because remember, a huge part of our time together, he was sick. I mean, he was not 100%. So now that he's back healthy, I started.

seeing this very, like, inching out ego that's like, I'm better than everybody. Huh. All right. Yeah. Yeah. So he felt invincible and then got fired. Oh. Oh.

I mean, he was smarter than everybody in the room, better than everybody in the room. And I think it was probably there, but I just, I didn't see it. Like it was, but he, so he got fired a month before we give birth. just a little stressful. No big deal. Just a little extra stress. And when I got to the doctor appointment, my blood pressure was through the roof. So here we were. He was unemployed. I was not at my dream job anymore. And we were high earners. Like we were making really good money. And we went from really high earners to not making. I mean, we were fine. Like we weren't going to lose our house.

Yeah, but it's a lifestyle switch and it shakes it up. Yeah. So one day we decided I wanted my child to be around my parents. I thought it was critically important. I wanted him to be around his aunts and uncles and all of our family was in Little Rock. And so we made the decision after we give birth, we are going to move back home. So in April, 23rd, 15, I gave birth to Timmy.

Tim. And he, yeah, he's a fun little bundle. I had zero clue what to do with a newborn. I made my mom move in with us for two weeks because I was clueless. You're like, hey, can you help me keep this baby alive, maybe? Yeah. I mean, like, legit. I legitimately had no idea what to do.

I never babysat. Like, I was, they should not have just been like, here, take this kid home in the carrier. I think that's how I've never had kids, but it sounds like that's how most people feel when they take home their first baby from the hospital. They're like, seriously? Me? But I'm sure you're a great model. Yeah.

So we moved back. We buy a house. He finds a job. I find a job. We are back at home. Family, everything's good. But he really wanted to start up our martial arts school again because that was his passion. And I'm going to support that passion.

Wasn't my passion, but that's what he wanted to do. And it was like, okay, let's do it because that is, like, that's you. So we slowly started this martial arts school and it grew quick. We built a tremendous community, tremendous. Like people coming out, like having, you know, UFC fight nights at our house, like having 30, 40 people at our house. Like, it was legit. Yeah, I mean, like legit.

it. And then we met a student who started coming there. Piper and her boyfriend started coming to the fight school. When I first met Piper, it was with her boyfriend. And she was a flighty 23-year-old. I mean, really just flittering everywhere and was never stay still and was always joking around and there was not a serious bone in her body. It was like it was always a joke. Everything was funny, but not in a bad way. She was great with my son and I liked her. She was 23 years old and I didn't have a ton in common with her as far as like where she was in her life. She was a kid. She's like 20 years old, she's a kid. They started coming and we all got like, I mean, we got really close. She, I mean, she was a part of our family. Like, Piper definitely looked up to when she first came,

definitely looked up to me and like definitely looked up to me for helping her and answering questions and made comments about how my relationship with Dylan was like relationship goals for her or boyfriend and that, you know, she could only hope to one day have the connection that we did and be as supported as we were one another. And her boyfriend became an instructor. Oh, wow. So they were fully integrated. Yeah. Like this was like we were, we were a family. Like our fight school was a family. And we would have classes every day of the week. And we would have classes. every day of the week after five o'clock. So we would work our nine to five jobs. And then, yeah. And then he would come home and he would go to the fight school. And I would go every night with my son.

And mind you, my kid, yeah, my kid at this point is like six months. Yeah. Because we moved. Wow, that did blow up back. Yeah, we moved when he was two months. So by September, we had the school open. And so we were there every night. So as the school's growing, Kim comes to class. Who's Kim? Well, Kim is older. She's closer to Dylan in my age. She is kind of like this, whereas Piper is like a kid, I mean, like, very immature. more like blacked confidence, kind of like insecure. She was very, she always needed to talk about things. But she was very nice and always willing to help. And Kim was very spiritual, like yoga and crystals and all of that. And so was Piper. So they ended up bonding over that and getting really

close and Piper was very spiritual like that. So when she started coming and really getting involved, it changed the dynamic of the fight school a little bit. So essentially there was this community of fight and people wanting to learn how to fight and like self-defense fighting. And we had this other kind of offshoot where you had Piper, her boyfriend, Kim, who were, more of this spiritual. She's a yogi and not to say anything bad about a yoga. Like she's in like that's her life. Like she was behind all like crystals and and incense and and that kind of stuff.

And it was not our scene. Dylan and I had never been into yoga or spirituality or anything like that. So it was different and we made jokes about it sometimes but it was cool. But she was a part of our family. And we embraced that. And Kim comes in and has that kind of same thing. So after Kim joined and things had already become more spiritual with Piper, it just got more so after that.

And again, it wasn't Dylan and my kind of thing before this, but the community was into it. And so we just embraced it. So everything with the school was going amazing. But this is when I personally started to hit a wall. Like, I was totally overwhelmed. We had this business. We had our normal jobs.

We had a baby. We had all these things going. I'm kind of surprised it took you this long to hit the wall. On top of it, I'm still struggling with my body. I never could figure it out after IVF. I was struggling. I mean, I was struggling. And I felt like I was going through the motions of life every single day.

And it was like a hamster wheel. And there was no way for me to get off of it. But people just expected me to keep this hamster wheel going because that's what moms do. They don't fall off the hamster wheel. Because if you fall off the hamster wheel, then it stops and then everything breaks down. And so I felt like I was on a. a non-stop hamster wheel that nobody was going to stop. Nobody was going to come help me on.

And nobody was going to allow me to get off. And I was expected to stay on it. I was expected to, you know, keep the business running. I was expected to make sure that if we had the whole school over at the house, that we had everything planned and everything clean. I was expected to pick up a pickup. And if I, raised my hand once to try to say, like, I need help. It was basically like all I would get was

somebody kind of slowing the hamster wheel down a little bit, but then they just kept, they needed it to go back. And so I would say that it, I went from being independent, making my own decisions, living for myself, and knowing what I was doing on a day-to-day basis was making an legitimate impact and was seeing that impact to all I was was a hamster keeping a wheel going. I wasn't anything anymore. I was just a body. I mean, it was, there was, that was expected to do things.

And was I officially diagnosed with postpartum? No, because I think people just, they just tell you, my doctor put me on. antidepressants. I mean, that's what she did. And I got back on, you know, medication that helped my anxiety. But that doesn't help and make it go away that you still have to keep the hamster wheel going. And you feel alone. I've never felt a sense of loneliness like that in my entire life. And he was still going every night. Piper decided that she was going to get. certified to be a yoga instructor. And we hired Piper to start teaching yoga on Thursday nights, which was the only night

that we didn't have classes that he was coming home. And then he started to become super interested in yoga. Like the one night a week that he would come home to be with our family, yoga became extremely important to his mental health. Like he would come home and do yoga or like not come home? No, he would go back to the school and do it a Piper's class. Yeah. Okay.

Okay. Yeah. So that was interesting. but yeah he that he helped him like that was what he wanted I'm doing nothing at this time like other than like every like other than like raising a child and working right but I have no I have like no hobbies it's really just like me existing I get going through the world so when he started going to yoga on Thursday nights that impacted me so much because that was him making an active decision to go somewhere else to not spend time with me and his son. And so this is when I started to feel like something

wasn't right in the marriage. And again, I was feeling totally alone, but I kept it to myself because I wanted him to feel supported in this new yoga thing that he said was really helping him. So then he decided that Piper needed to get certified to teach classes. So he started doing instructor training to get them ready for the class, like the certification. Then he started doing. Is Piper still with her boyfriend? Yes. Yeah.

Yeah, they're still together. He started doing instructor training. So for Piper, Piper's boyfriend and a third person. And so he was on top of the classes. He was also adding additional time to training them to get ready for instructor training. So fast forward to instructor training. I am extremely close with the person that is like owns the national affiliation of our marshal. Because we had to be affiliated with a, I'm.

I'm extremely close with the main guy of this, like very close. And he messages me on Facebook and he's like, hey, Piper isn't going to pass. I've let Dylan know and he's freaking out. Uh-oh. And I'm like, he's freaking. I was like, he's like, I don't know, Lindsay. It's very weird, but he's threatening to quit. And I was like, because she's not passing, I'm like, people don't pass all the time.

Like, it's hard. And he's like, yeah, she's not passing and he's freaking out. So that was weird. I was like, huh, why are you so upset about that? And he always made it about being mad at somebody else. Like the head guy was a jerk. It was this guy's fault. She should have passed. She was fine. And I'm like, I don't really care. But this is our business. Like, we can't really, like, you don't want her to teach if she. Oh, yeah. When you said quit, I'm like, quit what? Your own company? Yeah. What are you talking about?

Right. Okay. So I'm just like, okay. No, we're not. You guys, I did not learn about Quince until just last year. And let me tell you, the very first thing that I got from them from Quince was a beautiful cashmere sweater. And it was stupid cheap. It was like, I don't know, 50 bucks or something. And it's gorgeous. And I'm so excited for the weather to turn cold, which I'm in Florida. So it doesn't do that often. But when it does, I'm reaching for it. And I cannot. I know. I cannot wait. How much do you love Quince? I love them. I adore Quince. Quince is genius. Yeah, I also got one of those Casimir sweaters. And then I also recently got a bracelet. I'm wearing it. My friend and I got matching bracelets from Quinson. They're very delicate. They have jewelry, shoes, clothes, like everything, suit, luggage, like all the things. Literally, go look. They have travel accessories. I've gotten gifts for people. That's like the first place I go when I need new clothes for transition or a gift. And what's cool about it is not only do they have amazing clothes, like leather jackets. It's a for. It's affordable. It's affordable. How are they able to do that? Mackenzie. So, okay, so here's what happens, right? So the Quince items are priced like 50 to 80% less than similar brand. So all of the things that we're talking about, Quince partners directly with top factories. So they cut out the cost of the middlemen, which passes the savings onto us, the consumer. And they only work with factories that you save ethical responsible manufacturing practices. And of course, premium fabrics and finish. is for that luxury feel without paying the luxury price, which I'm really happy with, especially if you, like, you can kind of do the little gift giving and it seems like, well, this probably feels a little bit more expensive than it was. It's amazing. And the quality is the

same. It's truly the same. It will last you as long as if you were to get a high end luxury price point. Like, it's so good. And I got my best friend, I got her one of the one of the blankets. It is so soft. It's beautiful. Oh, I haven't gotten any home stuff from them yet. It matches her homesthetic perfectly, and they, oh my gosh, it's so nice. And she hangs out on her whole thing. Well, well, now I've got to go search that section. You should go try it out. Get cozy in Quince's high-quality wardrobe essentials. Just go to quince.com slash T-D-D for free shipping on your order and 365-day returns. That's Q-U-I-N-C-E.com slash T-D-D to get free shipping and 365 day returns. quince.com

slash TDD and you should take a picture if you get something and you should send it to us. Yes, do it, do it. So if you listen to us, you probably know that dating is hard.

Hot take. Yeah. Hard to find someone. Well, they made the dating apps to help with that. And despite any dogfish that come across dating apps, we're pro dating apps.

I think it's really amazing to screen someone. Me, I'm not my husband. I'm not married, but my boyfriend. I want to talk about a dating app for doctors. Well, it's not a dating app. I shouldn't call it that. But it's an app for doctors. Hey, anything's a dating app if you try hard enough. So don't let me discourage you. But Zock Doc is basically an app that helps you screen and find perfect doctors for you. I have used it for such a long time. And finding a doctor and finding a partner, two areas where you don't want to leave it up to a total crapshoot. You know, it's not like an impulse by situation. Like you want to do your race. search. That dog agrees with me. I'm sorry. I love it. Yeah, finding the right doctor should be something that you do your research about. And Zoc Doc makes it so easy. And when I tell you, I have found

multiple doctors on Zock Doc in my area when I moved to Los Angeles. That's what I used. Zock Doc is free. That's very important. It's a free app and website where you can search and compare high quality in network doctors. So you can put in your insurance and it will filter out who fits and choose the right one for your needs. And you instantly book an appointment through Zoc Doc. So all of it is there. Reviews, location, filtering. You can say whether you want a certain gender, if you're, you know, if you're a gyne of a gynecologist, maybe you want somebody to, you know what I mean? Whatever, it makes you comfortable. You can filter all of those things. Therapists, like any kind of doctor is available. I didn't hear about Zoc Doc until they started

advertising on our show. And I was able to tell my mom about them. Like, it's not helpful. It's so easy to to use, too. You guys have to try Zoc Doc. If you have insurance, it'll say who takes your insurance and all that. It's amazing. And also, if you are looking for a quick appointment, Zock Doc appointments happen fast. So typically within 24 to 72 hours of booking, you can even have some same day appointments because they have everyone's schedule and booking schedule. So you can filter like, I need to see a doctor tomorrow for this. And it'll show you who's available for that. So, I'm such a fan. It's an exciting ad for us because I know how much I love it. So I use it. And you should too, truly. So stop putting off those doctor's appointments and go to Zockdo.com slash TDD to find and instantly book a top rated doctor today. That is ZOC, doc, dot com slash TDD. Zock doc doc.com slash Tddd.D. And all of that. Zock doc. It's in the show notes. Yeah.

say we should make a jingle. I like it. Zuck, doc. Faces out a little bit, but he's still going to yoga. And I started noticing he would be gone later than the normal class times. I don't like it. Nope. And he would say he was staying there, like talking to Piper and Kim because Kim was having this drama with this guy at work.

So they were spending all this time together. And we were scheduled to have the. huge seminar at our fight school with the big national guy he was coming in to teach and dylan had to go to the school to get ready and at midnight 1230 he still wasn't home and i find my iphone because you know is he dead on the side of the road and it showed that he was at the school still And so I was like, okay, you know, this is, this is fine, not a problem. And we had the seminar and everybody was great. And then we were coming home from that and I was in the back seat of our car with Timmy.

And I can see over his shoulder. he's got his phone open and I see on the screen she's in the back can't talk and then he closes No sirie he closes

Wait so you can see that over his shoulder Yeah Busted And it was like a chat app And there's no reason to have a chat app on your phone If you're an iPhone person Because you have messages And it's perfectly fine.

But it was a chat app. And that's when I realized, I didn't know who he was talking to. Okay. I had no idea who he was talking to. But it was somebody. Yeah. What did you do in that second? Yeah.

Did you just like get quiet and was like, okay, I'll go about my life right now for a minute or what? What did you do? So one thing about me is I, I immediately go into typically, I usually go into business mode. Yeah. But I was so shut down as a human being at that point. I didn't know what to do.

I was like, I need him because I'm like, what am I going to do with that? There was no, I mean, it was just what it was. Like, I didn't confront him at that time. But it can tend, like, he was always on his phone. I mean, always on his phone. And I finally said, hey, what is going on? Like, what are we doing? And he goes on to explain to me that him,

Piper and Kim are on this kind of spiritual journey of like finding themselves and who they are. and they're interconnected. And he was explaining to me that he had a spiritual calling to Piper and Kim. And that they were going on this journey together. And it wasn't a physical journey. It wasn't about anything about creating a relationship. it was it was just going through this spiritual acknowledgement of where they are in their lives

and I was like what are you talking about I was like this is not even you I'm like we made fun of people like this like what are you talking about I thought it was crazy I said I have no idea where this is coming from I looked at him and I said I this is I specifically said, this isn't you. Like, I don't know what this is. I had no idea where this is coming from. I told him I would be supportive, but I didn't understand it.

It wasn't our life. It came out of total left field. And so I said I would be supportive of his spiritual journey, but I was no longer comfortable with him having a relationship with Piper. And I said, look, you know, you can't. talk to her anymore. You can't talk to Piper anymore. I know something is going on. And, you know, he was adamant. Like, you don't know what you're talking about. We're just really close friends. And I said, no. And I left. It's weird. Like, I walked out. Wow. So he didn't admit to doing anything,

like having a relationship with them, but you knew. No, I'm just, I was just clarified. Like, he denied him. He just said that it was a spiritual. connection that you just can't understand. Yeah. And by the way, I can't. I have an older sister who I'm extremely close to. I'm very close to my family. I can't tell them that I'm afraid of this stuff because they would hate him.

And my sister's husband is extremely close to Dylan as well. He was one of our instructors. And like, I couldn't tell anybody. Like there was nobody I could tell. McKenzie and I have talked about that where we're like, as soon as we tell our moms for us, it's like, then it's over. Like you can't come. They're not coming back from that. You can't.

And so I couldn't tell them. I don't really have any friends here. I have nobody to talk to about this. And so we went to bed. We didn't, I slept on the couch. He slept. I can't remember which way it was. But we didn't sleep in the same room.

And we talked the next day and it was all about that spiritual stuff again. It was like, of course. We are like we're intertwined and it wasn't sexual and it was a spiritual connection. And it's not about me. It's about their spiritual connection. And I was like, you can't talk to her anymore. This has got to be it. And he broke down and was like, I want to save our family.

I don't want to lose our family. I won't talk to her anymore. And for a few days, he didn't, but he was talking to Kim a lot. Like, it was nonstop. So I texted her because I had a relationship with her. We were friends. Friendly.

I had been to her house. He had gone out. I had her number in my phone. We were friends. And so I texted her, I was like, hey, I'm struggling. I need to know what is going on. I've told him he's not allowed to speak with Piper, but it feels like he's basically just replaced her with you.

And I'll read you her response to me. This is the response I received. Oh, honey, I hate that you're going through this. And I hear you about. replacing Piper with me. That was a watch out for me since I'm hyper aware of how men usually think of friendships with me. But for what it's worth, I can assure you that we have a purely fraternal relationship. Regardless, I hear what you're saying, and I'm so sorry you're going through this pain. And I said to her, so your relationship is purely platonic, what about his M. Piper?

and she responds, oh goodness, no, that's not what I meant. Their relationship is never romantic or physical at all. I meant that we were not hiding anything and it's open and inclusive of you. And then it was like, oh, honey, this is so tough. I'm really sad. And I know, darling, I know you're going through hard stuff. This is what she was saying when I was telling her. All the honeies. Every honey is like a...

Girl, I cannot. Stop calling me darling. And tell me the damn truth. Yeah. Yeah. So after that exchange, I found that the only way I could communicate with Dylan where he wouldn't get mad or defensive was to text him. Like, was to basically word vomit.

Like, this is how I'm, this is how I feel. And so I, I've reached out to him. I said, hey, like, I know you're on this spiritual journey. And it includes everyone but me. And, you know, you're trying. But I can tell that you're getting further and further away. Like, I can feel that you are just creating distance. Yeah, because your problems didn't start when you found out about this triad or whatever

they want to call it. Like, yeah. We're already feeling that distance. Right. And this conversation happened. And he says, yes, I'm feeling a compulsion to help. And yes, I'm feeling a draw to people that I have those connections with. That's not to diminish what we are or what we have.

And I'm sorry if you feel like it does. I'm not closer to them. I'm just close to them in a different way. Don't give up on us. You know, you offer something that they never could as well, and it's not just our son. And then I'm going to read what I said. And this, when I found it again,

was so telling of my mental state at this time, and I can't even believe I was the person that wrote this. I said, I'm trying, but I'm sorry. so alone and lost right now that it's swallowing me. Everyone around me is getting their passion buckets filled and I'm begging for scraps. And it's crazy because I'm crying about it because it kills me that I was at this place and that I had no control over it. Like it just, it just wasn't good. No. It just wasn't good. Did he at all support you? That was it. That was it. He was like, I'll support you.

I'll do whatever I need you need me to do. And so I was like, you know what? He's committed. Like, we're going to fix this. Like, he's committed. He's promised me. You know, I have all of these people telling me that everything is fine. Like, you're making this up in your head.

Nobody is trying to like homewreck. Everybody is trying to just become better spiritually. And we want you, we want to include. you in this, but, you know, it's not your things, but it's not about sex. It's not about and like, everybody was, it's fine. Like, we're good. And so I mentioned I had, you know, basically one friend who wasn't affiliated with the school, because I still couldn't tell my sister, my mom, or anybody else. And I had dinner. This was two days after this exchange that I had with him. I went out to dinner with my best friend and was going over everything with her. And I was like,

you know, I think he's committed to making this work, but this is what's going on. And my friend just looked at me and she's like, you have a 16 month old. If he's committed to making it work, you guys, like, you're going to have to figure out how to get those distractions out of your life. And you all can fix it. Like, you guys can fix this. You can fix it. Like, if there's anybody that can fix it. So, I'm sitting at dinner with my friend and he's supposed to be teaching class at the school. And he has my son because I'm at dinner with my friend and I wanted a night off. And so I say goodbye to my friend. I tell her thank you. That really helped me. You're validating that, you know, I can get through this. Like, this is okay. I have a child. And you're validating. And you're

validating that. And I showed her a lot of these text messages and she's like, I think he'll be fine. So I go to the school because that's where he's supposed to be with my son and he is not there. Piper's boyfriend, who's still the boyfriend, is teaching the class. My child is not there. So find my iPhone. Yep. And he is at Kim's. house. Shut up. So Kim's out of town. Oh.

So I drive over there and I see his vehicle and I see her car, tiger's car. Oh. So immediately in my head, where's Timmy? Yeah. Like, where is he? And I go up to. the door and start banging on it like, again, like a crazy woman, screaming, give me my child.

Like, give me my child. Give me my damn baby, yeah. He opens the door and I see Piper running away. And the way that this house was the bedroom was like, I can see the best. bedroom and I push past him and I run it and the bedroom it the bed's just a mess and I essentially oh were they doing some yoga in the bed yeah yoga and I don't know where she went I'm I run upstairs looking for her she's not upstairs he's running acme calling me crazy telling me it's over and that like like oh I think I'm so smart nothing was happening he was coming to get the mail

screaming at me, telling me I'm crazy and that I'm making this all up and that I didn't see anything. And that's- Where's Kimmy? Well, that's why I kept yelling. Yeah. I collapsed into a ball at his feet, crying, begging him to not throw our marriage away. And he kept calling me a crazy bitch.

Oh. and telling me that I've ruined it and that it's over because I accused him of something that didn't happen. And I screamed, where's my child? Yeah. He had dropped him off at his mom's house so he could go meet Piper at Kim's house. Yeah. I drove over there because I want my child. but he's now texting me as I'm driving over there.

You better not go get him. You're crazy. You're unstable. You're thinking like you've made all these things up. I go up to my mother-in-law's house and I look at her and I said, I'm going to let you, I'm going to leave him here. And I said, I'm actually going to go check myself into a mental institute because I think I'm going crazy. and I mean, I drove myself to a mental hospital. I called my sister who had no idea of anything that was going on, obviously,

and I had to basically dump everything on her that night. I called my sister. She tells me not to go because she's an attorney, and she's like, no, that can be used against you. And I was like, I'm crazy. I was like, I'm crazy. Like, he's telling me that this didn't happen, but I'm telling you I saw it.

Like, I know. And I said that his definition of gas lighting right there. That is gas lighting. Oh, I'm. Oh, my God. Awful. And so I go to the mental hospital. And I don't know if you've ever tried to check yourself into a mental hospital.

But, like, basically they, if you go there, like, they take everything from you and you, they put it in the locker. But if you go there and say that you want to check in, like they pretty much just, they take you. You go in. So I'm sitting in the waiting room of a mental hospital because I made all this up. Like, this didn't happen. And the counselor, the intake counselor, calls me back. And I tell her everything that happened. And she looked at me and she said, I can't take you.

here. Like, what? You are, you are not crazy. You just caught your husband in whatever situation. It wasn't a it wasn't right. And she's like, I can't keep you here. She said, it will not be good for you. She asked me, do you feel like you're a physical threat to yourself? And I said, no, I would never do that to myself because of my son. And she said, I'm going to break protocol. You need to go. And you need to go somewhere safe and like you go. Wow. She sounds like a sleuthy. She's been through it and gets it.

And I had texted Dylan and told them, hey, I'm checking myself into a mental like this. And he said, do what you have to do to make yourself feel better. So I end up going. He told me not to go home. He said I wasn't allowed to go to the house. Yeah. and so I drove to a friend of mine's house, and I realized that I had Timmy's iPad in my car.

And so I open up the iPad, and it's connected to Dylan's iTunes account. Okay. And I basically now see the entire text thread. Oh. Between Dylan and Kim. What does it say? I need it.

I need it. Talking about essentially everything that went down. So she says, I need to know all the parts, like what happened. And he says, ha, ha, ha, I'm sorry. And then she says, then spill. So the road she lived on was Winter Avenue. And so this was the text thread. We went to Winterfell.

They renamed the house Winterfell, like Game of Thrones. Lame. Okay, continue. Fast forward through all the stuff you don't need to know about. We hear a buzzer. Holy shit. We wait. Then the knocking starts.

Piper hides. She starts screaming about how she's going to call the cops because I kidnapped her son. I opened the door to tell her to leave and she bursts in screaming and crying, trying to find Piper. I'm trying to get her out. I'm telling her it's over that she's gone bananas the whole bit. I then tell her I'm leaving her and leaving and going to get Timmy. she races out and heads to my mom. Apparently she goes berserk at my mom's saying she's going to check herself into a hospital,

blah, blah, blah. Ew. To which Kim responds. Oh, poor Bambino. I'm so sorry. That's a fucking nightmare. And he said, so everything I told you had come to pass except I'm not sure we're going to get out of this without there being a villain. Boy, did it go quicker than I expected. So he had basically

two days before that said he wanted to save our marriage. And he's now saying, I guess they'd had a conversation where he said our marriage was going to end at some point. And they were all kind of conspiring to like help him? I guess, yeah. I mean, I don't know. And Kim says, I'm sorry to make you go through it with me. I'm just trying to figure out my place in all of this. I still think it's as your sister and helping you through this shit, but I can't do that if you're not telling me what's going on. And hearing what Piper thinks happened isn't the same as hearing from you what happened. It all feels very gossipy to me. And then he's like, yeah, your place is exactly as a sister, correct. And I will get through it. I have powerful allies. I am no slouch

myself. And then the best part is coming up, ladies. Because Kim needs to know all the details. Yeah. And I don't like the fast forward through the stuff that you don't need to know part. And he says, I don't mean to be glib. It was truly a beautiful thing, even if you don't like talking about it with me. To which Kim responds, I believe you, it was a beautiful thing and I'm happy for you. I really truly am. And I hope y'all have lots more sex and long-lasting orgasms in your own future sacred space. Well, there it is.

Jesus. Oh my God, bus it. I don't like it. Were you like shaking, reading this? I don't like it. Yeah, I couldn't really believe this was my life. And there was multiple texts about how they had a celestial connection once they had sex together. And it was truly this beautiful thing.

No, they texted you. That was that was the Kim. That was part of the Kim. The Kim. I was going to say they sent that to you? I know, right? No, no, no. No.

It's still that. It was, I mean, they had this celestial connection. It was truly beautiful. It was a lot. And they essentially were laughing about the fact that I was going and check, trying to check myself into a mental hospital. That's insane. It's painful. Just disgusting.

I mean, when we, this was another great line, when we were together like that, it literally swallows energy and chills everything. It was perfect until right at the end. I was the end. And now it's a mess again. Yeah, and it's your fault, Lindsay. Of course. It couldn't be because he lied to you and no way that would be crazy no no yeah and this is the final this was the good night text to her I need to go to bed

I will go deal with everything tomorrow I promise thank you for being my sister and being so supportive we are celestally tied together and we can't walk away from each other now it looks like we won't need to I love you, sister.

What a culty, culty text. That's fucking weird, dude. I don't like it. I don't like it. Right. So the next morning, I texted him and his mom and I said, I'm coming to get my child. I called the non-emergency police line and I said, this is what's happening. What rights do I have?

And they said, you can get your child. And I said, if I need police here, I'm going to call. I got my son. And I moved back into our house and he moved out. And that was literally the last time he was in the house. But I still had his computer. So I could see everything on his computer still. And this is when things really got crazy.

Have you ever heard of Twin Flames? Yes. No. It's basically this idea that you have been connected with another human being throughout their entire life. And it might be necessary to ruin relationships and marriages if you reconnect with your twin flame in a different light. Hannah, there's a show on if you should watch it.

Writing it down. So I was reading in his computer. So in this email chain between Dylan, Piper, and Kim, they talked about Piper being Dylan's twin flame and how they were. were predestined to be together. And basically, I piece together the timeline. It actually all started in April of that year. And all of this actually went down end of August.

But it started in April. And that's when they had determined that they were Twin Flames. And they were trying to figure out how to get themselves together in the physical world. So Dylan and Piper were twin flames, but Dylan, Piper, and Kim were what they called a triad. They were being interconnected through a connection where Piper was his physical partner and Kim was his spiritual assistant almost.

And the three of them together balanced the energy of their lives. That without one of them, it wasn't complete. And I thought it was a joke at first. I thought it was like made up. And I had finally told my sister. And my sister, it went down the rabbit hole. She's the one that really dug into the twin flame thing. My sister was sending me screenshots of things of like what twin

Flames are. And when that was happening, like when the Twin Flame thing happened to me, it had not gotten to the point of the popular cult thing that it got to later on. This was very early on when Twin Flames, this was very early on. So there wasn't a ton about it, but the things that were about it still were in my mind bananas because the actual the actual thought process behind it was you're connected through the past and you could have been a poor person and the other person was somebody that helped you get from that and that's how you were connected as twin flames and then you reconnected in another life and if you find your twin flame in this world, it is.

it is perfectly acceptable and okay for you to blow up any relationship that you are in and go with your twin plane. And as somebody who lives their life based on logic and that was, that's how I make decisions, that made no sense to me. And that's when I realized like this is, he has gone way, over the deep end. He's not, he's not the same person that I married. He's definitely not the same person that I married. So I put that timeline together and he got an apartment down the street from our house and she moved in with him immediately. At that point, I realized like, this is not

worth fighting for. So I was driving down the road, the main road that we live on, and I saw him walking. I'm on the other side of the road. Mind you, this is like a busy, like, it's two lanes and like, but four because there's parking on the side. Like it's a city street. And I see him, and there's like a parking lot right there. I cut my car across the road and block. And block. And, lock him in and I tell him, I'm done. This is what we're going to do on our divorce. We're going to do this. We're going to do this.

We're going to do this. And I went into business mode and we got it done five days after that. It was like we're done. Oh, nice. And that was the start of now having to figure out how to co-parent. and all the stuff that I found out after, after. So are you now? Yeah.

So you know what? I'm in such an amazing place now. Oh, I'm so glad you hear that. Yeah. Yeah. And actually, we co-parent very well. Like, we actually co-parent extremely well. But I bought a house, moved in with Tim.

me like I was like brand new start new everything he actually got hyper pregnant i was going to ask oh what are they up to now yeah so they're actually still together they have a child together so Timmy has a half-siblings and we were not good at first, but then I met my now husband. And he is an incredible human being and is, yes, he's wonderful. He's wonderful. He is genuinely the best human being I've ever met in my entire life. I don't believe that I would have been able to have a relationship with him had I not gotten as strong as I did after. Wow.

But I think it's really important. And this is really one of the main reasons why I reached out is that, you know, I was a strong person when all this started. and I lost myself very slowly. It wasn't in big chunks, but I lost myself very slowly. And then once we had Timmy, postpartum is real.

Like postpartum depression is real. And, you know, it's so marginalized. And people tell you you're crazy. And you start to believe it because you don't know anything else. and they have to tell women out there. Like, you are not crazy. Like, you,

your fears and your, it gets all validated. And it's real. And don't let people tell you that you're crazy just because you feel like something is off. Because I was this incredibly strong, independent human being that ended up in a ball at some man's feet.

begging him to not leave me. And I can go on record and say, I truly believe he could take a lie detector test and pass and say he didn't cheat on me. Because he believes that narrative. Wow, that's so true. So strongly. That's a thing.

But plot twist, Piper actually apologized to me. and said, I wish this didn't happen the way that it did. Now, it was many years later. Yeah, she grew up and realized. But she did apologize. I'm glad. But he still has never acknowledged that it happened.

And looking back on it, I'm just shocked that it happened because I know who I was when it all started. And I just became a different person. And I feel terrible for when women are children. told that postpartum isn't real and that, you know. Oh, it's so real. I experienced it. It's real. I hate that. Oh, that's awful. And especially with somebody who doesn't know about being, like, I didn't, I never wanted to be a mom. And so then I got turned into a single mom who had no idea what to do with this child. But everything ends for a reason. And it brought me to my husband now. And we have an incredible life and he's incredibly supportive and he allows me to be the person that I am.

But again, that's the other thing is that, you know, once you've gone through something like this, it's so important to put yourself first and figure out who you are. And I like realize that you are more than a mom and you are more than, you know, an X, Y. Like you're more than what you think. There's room for all of it. Yeah. Yeah. That was hard. That was a hard adjustment for me at the end of the day.

It was like trying to realize like single mom life and navigating that because I had no idea what to do. So that was hard too. But it really did and the best part of my life happened. because it ended. Yes. I love that. And that's okay. That's such a good story to tell because a lot of people get so discouraged when you come to the end of a relationship or the end of, you know, a road and you think this is it. Like you went so freaking bonkers over this dude that you checked yourself into a mental hospital. Like you were like, I need freaking help. Like I'm going crazy. And I think so many people have experienced that. And I feel like you think that that is like

the end all be all. But you are a perfect example that like there is still beauty in the breakdown. there's still beauty in what you experience. Beauty and the breakdown. That's beautiful. Yeah, I love that. I know. There's beauty in the breakdown. There's beauty and the breakdown, baby.

I like the twist. Thank you so much for sharing that. I think that I love stories like yours because it really gives people hope. And I feel like, sometimes somebody commented the other day on one of our things. They were like, is this guy a dogfish or is he just a cheater? And I'm like, well, what's the difference, right? Not really, but like what's the, what cat? categorizes someone as a dogfish. And that's the thing. And like that's the like that is when

questioning like what is a dogfish like it's you know obviously it's a made up word. But this person was my person for you know eight years, nine years. He was my person. He was my person. And he made sense. And he just became more and more of one and started to. just veer off and become an entirely different person in the last, you know, six months of our marriage. And it came out of nowhere. That is such a good point. Like, people can become a dogfish. They don't have to always start off that way. They can kind of get turned into it. Yes. And ladies, postpartum is real. And you are not crazy. You are validated and you deserve. to be respected.

Feeling that extreme feeling of craziness, I'm doing air quotes, craziness, if for lack of a better term, and to the point where something like this happens and you genuinely think that you are crazy, like that's totally normal too. And the fact that it kind of gets thrown around all willy, like, oh, she's just crazy, you're not. And these are totally normal feelings.

This is like, it's archaic. It's how people used to call women hysterical when they had emotions. Like, it's just one way our femme tuition talk. And they did a really good job of convincing you that yours was wrong. And that's like correct. That really gets us angry. We don't like that at all.

Man, you're, you seem like an amazing person and an amazing mom. Thank you so much, Lindsay. It was so nice to meet you. Nice to be you too. We really appreciate you. Of course. To take Piper's phrase and you have a very good energy. Yish.

What an amazing person. I love her. I was so glad that you guys could talk and I want to ask you even more about like the motherhood aspect of all of this. She's obviously an amazing co-parent, which is I can't. I don't know if I could do it. Could you, well, my first thought was, okay, can you imagine? Okay, gaslighting first of all, let's talk about gas lighting. Gaslighting is basically whenever someone makes you feel a certain, someone might trick you into thinking that something happened that it didn't. Like you could be like, oh, you something didn't happen that did. So you could be like, you shove me down the stairs. I can be like, what? You fell. No, uh, you totally fell. Like that's, I wasn't even there. And they'll say it so much to the point where they will make you believe their lie, because I think they probably believe their lie. Yeah. But imagine having postpartum depression. So postpartum is basically like when you give birth,

like anything regarding pregnancy in general is going to create hormones in your body, right? That's how things happen. Like, you know, sex, and whatever. And so we're talking about like anxiety and we're talking it's like period hormones or I imagine what menopause is. steroids, okay? And it'll last for weeks or months at a time. And this is, you know, after you give birth, you go through these crazy hormonal changes. So imagine having postpartum depression where you're experiencing these changes in your body that you can't control. And you probably don't understand because we don't talk about it. And you probably don't understand them. That's a good point. And then also someone gaslighting you. And so now not only are you physically experiencing these

hormonal changes that you can't control, but now emotionally and mentally, you feel. like you're, it's crazy. Like, you feel crazy. I get it. Yeah. I mean, I don't get it. And I'm grateful that I don't, I can't empathize, but I sympathize. Like, I'm, I can't imagine. The physical, the physical overwhelm and the mental overwhelm and then combine them. And you have this great big amalgamation of just like overwhelm that you, I just can't even imagine. It's awful. I can't imagine. Sleep deprivation, I imagine, as a new mom, who's, he sounds like, you know, he was involved at first, then didn't want to be around because he had a lot of yoga classes to go to suddenly. But like, you're even, even just sleep deprivation is used as an abusive tactic.

We've had experiences and we've talked about where they'll like wake you up in the night to have an argument. And part of that is like because they know that you're less stable when you're not rested and healthy. And it's like, so throw that in as like a new parent. Then you throw in postpartum and whatever else you're experiencing. Then you throw in him. lying to you. And it's like, your world is not real anymore. If anything happens, like,

he could always be like, oh, you're just going through postpartum like, that didn't really happen. And then gas let you some more because of it. You're just being hysterical. Yeah, you're being crazy. I just don't like it. Crazy. Yeah. Well, it's amazing that she had that experience trying to go to the mental health hospital and the intake doctor was like, I want you to know that your reality is your reality. Like, I don't want to validate this experience where you, are thinking you're making this all up, which I can't, I mean, it's an, I'm not a, you know, psychologist by any means. So I don't know what the, or I don't know what kind of doctor, you know, you know, I'm not a medical professional. But if you couldn't guess, but that conversation must

be really interesting and hard for a medical professional to be like, I want to help you, but this isn't actually the help you need. Yeah. Like, what good for them. What a powerful thing to do for someone. I really do. I thought about that. At first I was like, wait, what? And then I was like, that's, that's great. I think so. I mean, obviously, it's not like turning away help. It's just like, you are not crazy. Like, you're not making this up. It's realistic, right? Like, it's, yeah. His non-apologies and her, in all of the, oh, the non-apology. Kim and Piper. Kim was the friend that I think really wanted to be in on this little, she wanted that trio to be a menager trio, you know what I mean?

Yeah, she sure did. Kim was getting that. But yeah, they all were just like, oh, I'm so sorry you feel this way. This must be really hard for you to be so, so crazy. Like, it's a you problem. It's like, no, girl, you're not the problem. So that gas line was not, not okay. That's manipulation.

I don't like it. Well, he, it's in, I loved how she was like talking about his journey to dogfish because he did not seem to start like one. He wasn't in this marriage to scam her. He was radicalized. Well, he allowed himself to be too, right? Yeah. You put yourself in that situation.

So I still have not seen the Twin Flames documentary, and you know I'm going to run to that. Have you guys, if you guys have watched it, let us know your thoughts. Because I want to, it's, I don't remember what it's called, but it's on Netflix. And it's, now I'm going to look at it. We'll put it in the, yeah, we should. Yeah, we'll put it in the show notes. So basically, he was like, I don't care who I hurt because I'm allowed to do that in order to get to my twin flame. That's like the general rhetoric of it. Oh, it's called escaping twin flames.

Escaping twin flames. Let's all go watch it because that is wild and so sad. So in the twin flames, they were talking about how you should pursue what you want doggedly, like go to their house in the middle of the night and be like, like, don't take no for an answer. Oh, so like if the twin flame, the twin flame isn't necessarily somebody that's like you're both in it together. Like you can pick someone else and be like, I'm going to stalk you until you love me back is what the cold tells you to do. Yeah. And they were talking about, they did talk about you like change your gender to be with your twin claim. So they would like control. Yeah. Yes. I wonder if they were like if somebody is married, you can kill the partner. Like I bet they would just let you do whatever you need to do. I'll be honest with

you. For me personally, it shows that that documentary really shows how easy. You know, it is to manipulate someone if they trust you enough. Not even if they trust you fully, but if they trust you enough, if they trust you a little bit, it just goes to show you how powerful words are. So when someone says, like, this is what you do and you're like, oh, all right, you allow it to make sense in your head or you don't, right? And if you're like, well, I trust this person enough, like, I'm going to allow this to make sense. And then that becomes your reality, it just goes to show you how powerful that stuff is. And strength and numbers, having two other people or however many other people in on it with you, you know, it's

validating. And so Dylan and Piper still together, but not as subscribed to the Twin Flame cult ideology as they had original then. But I mean, I wonder if, and I don't want to speak for her, but I wonder if having that element of him being affected by an ideology like that makes it a little bit, I don't know, like easier to separate herself from him. Or it's like, that's not the person she married. Like he fully changed. That's not the same guy. I'm sure it's not easy by any means.

But in terms of co-parenting now, she can kind of be like, you know what? He's a different person. And I don't want that person. That's not that. Yeah. Eye, aye, aye. How do you co-parent with somebody who did that to you? I don't know.

I mean, it's hard enough. Co-parenting in general. When you don't go through something like that, it's hard to co-parent in any situation. But given these particular set of circumstances, like the respect is gone. Like how do you, you know what I mean? How do you... He was so horrible to her. Yeah.

Just not even the cheating. Like, just the way he treated her in as she was having, like raising this child and just denying her any kind of trust and valid. Like she just had, she lost her fom tuition and that's not, that's a bigish crime we have. I hate it. I have a couple other little things I wrote down. What did you write down? Okay. I'm going to make my case.

which I feel very passionately about, I wrote down, hobbies are so important. And I believe this very strongly, especially as we get into adulthood. And I recognize that I am not a parent. So I know that when you are a parent, you have a lot more responsibility and it's a lot harder to find time for yourself. But I think this was so sad to me to hear how she was such a passionate person in her career. But then she had that pattern of wanting to be a supportive partner, which so many of us have, but it's a two-way street. And she slowly gave up parts of her passion. She moved for him. Then she had her career, but then when she had a kid, she couldn't do the career as much. Like, slowly the thing she was passionate about went away, went away, went away for him.

And then by the time it got to, you know, the peak of the story, there was so much of herself that she didn't have anymore. And I don't know if hobbies would necessarily solve it, but I was just thinking about how perfect and wonderful it is to have some. something that has nothing to do with your career and has nothing to do with anyone but yourself and your enjoyment and your creativity, whatever it is you like, and to hold on to that because it's like a piece of you and it's a reminder that you deserve to be happy, even if it's like at someone else, not at somebody's expense, but sometimes you'll have to cancel a social gathering or say no to a favor because you deserve to play your pickleball, damn it. Yeah.

That's my rant on hobbies. Whatever you got to do. I still don't know what pickleball is, but it's fine. It's all right. I don't do sports. You don't got to do all the hobbies. You just have to have something that makes you happy that reminds you that you are separate from being a mother or a boss or a whatever your role is.

Or wife, like you're also a pickleball star. But I don't know. What do you think about being so supportive that at times you make sacrifices? you maybe shouldn't make in a relationship. I don't know. I feel like I know that if from personal experience, I know that if my husband, for instance,

hadn't supported my makeup hobby, I wouldn't be where I am successfully. Yeah. Successly, regarding my success in like the makeup world or influence or whatever. But you let him go on his car trips and you love that for him. Yeah. I was not to say I let him go on his car trips. Like he has a car hobby.

And so he's like, babe, I want to buy like a super chart like a flux capacitor. And you're like, vroom, room, honey. And I'm like, let's go, boo, do it. Because if I support his hobby of car stuff, he can't fuss at me when he, when I have an Amazon hobby. Amen. I respect your hobbies are important. And Amazon counts. I genuinely think the give and take is so valuable.

And if ever you're like, oh, they, you know, if you're, if you ever start resenting them for doing something for themselves. You know, it's a balance, but that's a red flag. I just didn't, I didn't like how it seemed like he slowly kind of took all of her towards his passions and his hobbies. Of course. That was his way of manipulating her, right? You mean, Misiad. Yeah. And the fact that she was like so on top of her career when it all went, you know, went downhill. It's a reminder that this happens to everyone. And if it's ever happened to you, you are not stupid and you are not weak. You are intelligent and fabulous and strong and powerful. And these. guys are just really good at it. Or girls. Or people of all genders. Speaking of that, we need more

fellas to get in here and tell us their dogfish stories. Dude, girls are dogfish too and we want to hear those stories. Hey, Piper and Kim were dogfishing. I think. Yeah, that's true. They were lying. True, too. Yeah. We had a school of fish, a yoga school of fish, a martial arts school of dogfish. That was so. We had a school of fish. A martial arts. That was good. We had a school of dogfish. Yeah. I really want to hear from my fellas.

We need some of the fellas in here. Yeah, I know that there are people that seem too, you know, too embarrassed to share what happened to them. And you are not alone. And we want to highlight all voices and all types of relationships and all stories because to me, equality means that there are dogfish of all kinds. Everybody can be a little shitty. Unfortunately, that's the truth.

Oh my God, I love it. We all suck a little bit. We all suck a little bit. There's beauty in the breakdown. That's the last thing I wrote that I loved. There's beauty in the breakdown. Yes, ma'am. That was beautiful that she said. Or you said that. You said that. Well, so. Credit where credits do. But I, well, I've heard that somewhere and I don't know where, but there's beauty and the breakdown. Like, there really, truly is. There's beauty in knowing that this is ending, but there's going to be something else out there. And you know what I mean? And there's, the beauty. The beauty. Beauty is sometimes not seen until way later, but there is beauty in the breakdown. She said she doesn't think she'd have her beautiful relationship now without having gone through that, which is... Yep. And that's true. Look back at all your past relationships and what you've learned from them or whatever and be like, if that didn't happen, I would not have gone out that night to try and get under someone new. And I would know what I mean? And I would not have met my husband or whatever. So I'm just saying, you never know. Well, I love, you know, I love wrapping it up with a happy ending in its own way. And it sounds like they're all doing well. I sound like she's happy and the baby's happy. They're co-parenting, like as best as can be like expected, I guess. We loved her. She was so cute and sweet.

I really love her a lot. You guys drop your, if you have any kind words or comments for her, let us know. And we will, we will relay them to her for you. Yeah. And if you've ever experienced anything she talked about in terms of postpartum depression, miscarriage struggles, with pregnancy, I'm so sorry because like we've mentioned many times, it's like a hard conversation that is not often. I don't think people give it the care that it deserves. So we're just, we get it. And you guys should send us your stories. And the email is, you ready, investigate at the datingdetectivespodcast.com. Who said that? God. Just kidding. Molly's the voice.

of God. When Molly pops into an episode, she'll, like, appear and be like, guys, can you say that one more time? I'm like, yes, my queen. I love her. And also, in an upcoming episode, Molly's actually going to be taking my place because I'm going on vacation. And I'm excited because a lot of people are like, what about Molly? I want to hear from Molly. So this would be a great opportunity for Molly to jump in. You get to know her a little bit. Yay. I'm excited. Oh, I'm so excited to hear about your vacation. Also, I forgot, I'm traveling for a wedding. And every Everybody sent some pretty crazy wedding stories. Did you see that?

Someone whipped out their putt and peed on the dance floor. Like 5,000 people. Every single point. I didn't even post how many DMs responded. Like, oh yeah, I've been to a wedding where someone peed themselves. Oh, yeah, I've been to a wedding where someone peed on the dance floor. I was like, what is happening to this world? That is so funny.

And I was freaking out because I realized I take my shoes off on the dance floor. You know, I get down. Not anymore. Never again. Never again. Anyway, that was so funny. So if you've ever been to a wedding where there was like a crazy story, do tell us because I was entertained. But yes, follow us on socials. That's effortless transition at dating

Detectives podcast on Instagram, TikTok, find us on Facebook, all the things. Yeah, and we really appreciate when you guys share our social media stuff, like share a post or a story because a lot of times people, like, people are like, oh my gosh, my friend shared this and oh my gosh, I need to tell my story. Thank you so much. And then it becomes this great big, like, this really cool thing. And it just adds to the community that's been created here by you guys. So we really appreciate you. And thank you, everybody. We love you.

We'll see you. And go watch Twin Flames and let us know what you think. I'm like literally about to go do that. We should talk about it. Maybe, yeah, we'll post something where we can all debrief. Yeah. A second, a double dogfish debrief. Have a great week.

And as always, trust your fun, tuition. Bye.