The David Knight Show - Fri Episode #2304: — The UK Government Protected Child Predators for Decades

Episode Date: July 10, 2026

────────────────────────────────────────[00:06:00]RFK Jr. Ended the COVID EUA — But PREP Act Shield Stays, Drug Declarations Last Another YearKnight: his job is to make institutions legitimate and end them, not to restore trust in what caused the damage.────────────────────────────────────────[00:16:10]Off-Duty Cop Used Flock Camera Network to Stalk a Woman — Nearly Caused a Head-On Collision Chasing HerHe put her plate on the hot list so cameras would alert him in real time; this is the future if we don't stop these cameras.────────────────────────────────────────[00:22:10]Air Force Engineer Charged With 13 Counts for Cutting Down Flock Cameras — GoFundMe Raised $22,000$1,500 per unit; Flock CEO called camera map organizers terrorists; Knight: flock is more likely associated with China than the people exposing it. ──────────────────────────────────────── ── Interview 1: Pastor Joe Rigney — UK Rape Gangs and Cultural Marxism ──────────────────────────────────────────[00:29:36]UK Rape Gang Report: Up to 250,000 White British Girls Systematically Tortured — Government at Every Level ComplicitPolice, hospitals, and foster care saw beaten girls returned to abusers and looked the other way; racial dynamics made it untouchable.────────────────────────────────────────[00:35:56]British People Must Repent of Multiculturalism and Colonial Guilt — These Were Treated as Virtues, Not SinsRigney: fear of being called racist is the native British problem; their commitment to multiculturalism sinks to high heaven.────────────────────────────────────────[00:52:11]The State Uses "Empathy" to Override Moral Reasoning — It's Emotional Manipulation, Not CompassionEmpathy puts others' feelings in the driver's seat with no anchor; in its name millions of unborn babies are killed and 250,000 girls were abandoned to abusers. ──────────────────────────────────────── ── Interview 2: Ann van der Stiehl — The CPS Pipeline ──────────────────────────────────────────[01:25:58]500,000 Children Trapped in the CPS Pipeline — $81 Billion Per Year Funds the SystemClinton's 1997 Adoption of Safe Families Act turned children into chattel; CPS is funded to separate families, not preserve them.────────────────────────────────────────[01:31:25]CPS Removal Isn't One Cost — It's a Complete Financial Siege Designed to Break the FamilyAttorneys, drug testing, classes, court dates, lost wages; the system accuses the family of being broken after it broke the family financially.────────────────────────────────────────[01:40:39]Family Courts Are Star Chambers — No Jury, No Confronting Your Accuser, Files Sealed, Parents GaggedAnonymous tips trigger child removal; hearsay shapes decisions; parents meet their attorney minutes before the hearing.────────────────────────────────────────[01:41:57]Child Welfare Is an Economic System, Not a Moral One — Minority and Disabled Children Bring More Federal MoneyThe more children removed, the more Title IV-E funding flows; the system rewards separation, not preservation.xz ──────────────────────────────────────── Money should have intrinsic value AND transactional privacy: Go to https://davidknight.gold/ for great deals on physical gold/silver For 10% off Gerald Celente's prescient Trends Journal, go to https://trendsjournal.com/ and enter the code “KNIGHT” For high quality made in America products go to HomeSteadProducts.shop and use promo code “Knight” for 10% off your purchases Find out more about the show and where you can watch it at TheDavidKnightShow.com If you would like to support the show and our family please consider subscribing monthly here: SubscribeStar https://www.subscribestar.com/the-david-knight-show Or you can send a donation throughMail: David Knight POB 994 Kodak, TN 37764Zelle: @[e-mail] App at: $davidknightshowBTC to: bc1qkuec29hkuye4xse9unh7nptvu3y9qmv24vanh7Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/the-david-knight-show--2653468/support.

of deceit telling the truth is a revolutionary act it's the david night show as the clock strikes 13 it's friday the 10th of july your lord 2026 well we're going to be in the program today i think with a perfect analogy for what's going on with Mitch mcconnell and it's not even weekend at bernies and the question is going to be will a i kill the economy will it kill the david night show that's another And of course, there is a site that presumes to answer that. And we'll take a look at a flock camera vigilante. And data centers gone wild, not just the cops. We have a cop who's used flock to stalk.

Actually kind of rhymes, does it? To stalk a woman and nearly killed people chasing her down. And then we have a couple of guests. We have someone who's going to talk to us about the rape gangs in the UK. And how it all began when we were going to be a couple of guests. when the government there rate the hearts, the minds, and the souls of the people. How do they do that? How do we keep them from doing that here?

We're going to talk to our guest about that. And another guest about CPS, the business of taking children, what you can do to guard your own. Well, as I said, I think we've got the perfect analogy for what's going on with the GOP and Mitch McConnell. This is from the smoking gun. It was a Florida woman. usually it's a Florida man, you know, the legendary. Florida man does this, Florida man does that.

This is a Florida woman who denied owning the coke that fell out of her butt. This is kind of where we are in politics, isn't it? Florida woman who denied ownership of a bag of cocaine that fell from her buttocks while being booked into custody, told jailers that the drug must have been put there by somebody else. Well, didn't Trump think of this with the Epstein files, right? According to the rest report, a car being driven by this 30-year-old woman was spotted veering around the highway. They pulled her over. They said they smelled burnt marijuana.

They said she was slow and lethargic. And after they got her out of the vehicle, she refused to remove her seatbelt, basically, to get out the vehicle. They had to pull her out. She tried to lock her car. They said she also then tried to walk away. So they arrested her. They take her to jail. And as part of the process, they run her through a body scanner.

They said they noticed an anomaly in her. her body. And so they sent her over for closer inspection. And in that room, when they came in the room, she was standing there with her hand across her bottom. And then when they removed it, this fell out. I have no idea how that got there. I'm sure we're going to see this excuse being used by the Republicans and many politicians. So, you know, when I talked to, I didn't talk to him, but actually Handy emailed me a follow-up after yesterday's show, and he said, nobody that I've talked to at work believes that Mitch McConnell can recover from this. And folks, stop and thinking about this.

He was taken in. He's found unconscious with cardiac arrest in the morning. Who knows how long that had been going on. That's been 26 days ago. They've kept up this charade for 26 days. They've only got to keep it up now for about that, not even that long. before they hit the deadline that there can't be a special election to replace them. That's what the game is.

That's why they're playing this game. As Handy said, the best any of us have gotten as EMTs has been to get a return of a pulse, but none of us have had any patients that made it out of the hospital. So he said, unless they've got some new secret weapon there, likely not going to happen. And especially because it affects the brain. He also said, as we were talking about yesterday, SIDS, he said, The last two Sid's patients or responses that he had, of course, they were dead. But he said they had recently had this happen.

They'd just recently been vaccinated at their well baby visit. You know, your well baby, you take them in and they kill your well baby. Anyway, this woman had 3.8 grams of cocaine that fell from her rear end. Would the Coke at her feet, cops say she denied knowing anything about the drug? she speculated that maybe somebody had put it there during a romantic encounter this really is metaphor of where we are in politics, isn't it?

Donald Rump And again, when we look at everything that happens with the Trump regime change, we've got all these people say, Trump didn't do what happened in 2020 with the pandemic. No, it was somebody else who did that. I'm sure it was, yeah.

What were you going to say, Liz? Field, how did that get there? I've been looking for that. I don't know where that happened. Here's another example of, of course, you know, the left has got their woke, and I guess the right has got their Coke that falls out of their butt. Here's an example with RFK Jr.

He has just ended the COVID emergency use authorization declarations. However, the PEP Act shield is still there. And again, Maha doesn't know where that Coke fell out of seven years after Washington rushed poorly treated, tested drugs and shots and devices into the fight against an imaginary coronavirus. This is, that's my take on. This is, I'm reading from the New American, but I call it the imaginary coronavirus. Spending billions and killing and injuring millions in the process, they have finally discovered that the emergency is over, except there never was an emergency. And so the best you're going to get from these people is a pledge of how they're going to do it next time. And, of course, what do they say when they say they're going to do it next time?

Well, they don't say, well, we won't do that again. No, they say, our mistake was we didn't do it quickly enough and hard enough. So that's going to be the response in the future to all of this. By ending the COVID-19 emergency use authorization declarations, we are reinforcing public confidence that the emergency authorities, are temporary and targeted, said RFK Jr. Yeah, you know, that was what he said when he first came in. He said, my job is to restore confidence in the institutions.

No, your job is to make them legitimate, and you can start by ending them, quite frankly. No, we don't need any confidence restored in these things. We don't need to trust the plan. You see, trust is the plan. And the plan was to get RFK Jr. in there so that you could, then trust it. Except that's not what they're doing. The declaration for drugs and biological products will remain for another year.

Even after he puts this out officially, the medical device declarations will terminate after another six months. And so they're not even going to do it right away. This is, you know, we're fixing to do that. We're going to do it at some point in time. The FDA, within the HHS responsible area that he's responsible for, of course, reviews and regulations of drugs and vaccines and has long treated the emergency use authorization structure as separate from formal public health emergencies. So, hey, you know, excrement happens.

Just that cocaine doesn't have anything to do with me, right, whenever it hits the fan. And so when we look at this and we talk about death, and of course, death is coming for us all, but is it coming for our website? So it was an interesting article over the weekend from Matt Drudge There was a kind of a satire site that went viral on several different social media platforms. And you could look up your website and it would give you kind of a rating score to see if you could be replaced, if that website could be replaced by Claude by an agent, an AI agent. And so the site is called Death by Claude. And they spell it C-L-A-W-D. It's a humorous satirical web tool.

And they talk about software as a service and how they can replace that. So what it does is it gives you a death score, the likelihood that AI could be the end of that website and that job. And then also generates a sample prompt to replace that website. It went viral on Reddit, LinkedIn X, and Hacker News. Well, here's what it sounds like when you look at this. This is the Drudge Report, for example. and this is what Matt linked to. And it gave him a score of 12 out of 100

saying that he was pretty safe from being replaced by AI. And the summary was, it says, it turns out the most defensible media property in America is a table-based HTML relic, rather, that hasn't changed since Clinton was getting impeached. And then it kind of summarizes him. It says, I can absolutely, this is what Claude would, say. It says, if you were to ask Claude to replace it, Claude would say, I can absolutely

aggregate news headlines and format them with editorial curation. I could even do the all-caps siren thing, but I have run in numbers, and I genuinely cannot replace whatever Matt Drudge is. That specific gravitational pull where half of Washington checks his page before coffee for reasons nobody can fully articulate. I'm choosing to respect it and to move on. it says. And so then let me see what it says about David Knight. So it gave me the same score of 12. And it says a personal news commentary site run by an actual human with actual opinions.

It turns out that Claude can't fully replace the unhinged authenticity of a guy who genuinely believes what he's saying. There we go. We could put that up on the website. the unhinged authenticity of a guy who actually believes what he's saying and says this would be the prompt that it would give to Claude. The skill is as independent news commentary. The role is a contrarian media personality. Says you are a passionate independent journalist and commentator. You would tell Claude if you're doing a prompt for it.

So the instructions would be to deliver daily news commentary with maximum conviction to cover liberty, health, freedom, and media skepticism angles, to cross-reference mainstream narratives with alternative sources, to write headlines that make people feel urgently informed, to maintain consistent ideological voice across all content, to interview guests who wouldn't appear on CNN, to accept no corporate advertising, and mention this frequently. And then finally, it says, um, uh, the cause of death. not dead. This isn't really a software as a service. It is a person. Claude cannot become a person. And then it puts in parentheses yet. And so it says Davidnight.com news was not a software as a service product.

It was a man, a microphone, and a deeply held worldview. We could take some of these phrases and put them on the website, I guess, which is either the most or the least replaceable thing in the world, depending on who you ask. Claude could technically generate similar commentary, but it would lack the one feature subscribers actually pay for. The knowledge that it is a real human being that genuinely got this worked up about it. And then the last words of the website would be, I told you they were coming and nobody listened. This is exactly what I was talking about.

That's getting pretty close. It's right. They got my number, don't they? This is what I said. AI can really suss you out, and it can do that regardless of who you are, if whether you're on air or not. It goes on to say, I want to be transparent. I could replace the format of independent news commentary quite effectively. However, David Knight's audience isn't buying a content format.

They're buying David Knight. I find myself in the unusual position of being unable to compete with a human being specifically because he is a human being. I respect that genuinely. I'd also like to never say some of the things that he says. Yeah, the AIs tend not to say things that are against the general zeitgeist. That's right. Yes, right. Well, of course, so it doesn't think that it's going to replace me with an AI agent.

But again, the question is, is it not where they're going to kill this site, but are they going to kill the economy? And as I pointed out the other day, if you look at the Schiller Index, you see that this AI bubble has reached incredible proportions. Again, when you had the Great Depression Black Monday, the stock market crash, people jumping out of windows, at that point in time, the index was at 32.5. It is now at 41. It typically is an average of about 17. So that gives you an idea of the danger that we're in right now from AI killing the entire economy. And yet you have, interestingly enough, you got Bill O'Reilly just lecturing people. Don't complain about the economy.

Go buy stocks. Yeah, good job. I think Bill O'Reilly is trying to take the place of Jim Kramer in terms of bad investment advice. But I will tell you that even though we didn't have Tony Arden on last week, we usually have him on every week. But he has a great answer to this kind of instability. And that is to get out of the system, to have an escape hatch, a little backup for yourself that is physical, that is real.

And so you can get physical gold and physical silver, and those are things that have retained their value for thousands of years. It is a safe haven, regardless of what is happening. And you have some central banks. Russia is having to sell some of its gold, but China has backed up the truck and is loading it up. And so Russia is selling its gold, because, again, it's involved in a very expensive war,

and it's getting infrastructure hits as they go along. But you want to have a safe haven for that. And another place where you can find, that is at David Knight.gold. That'll take it, Tony Ardivin's wise wolfgold. And as many people have been several headlines about this report, one of the market's most reliable long-term indicators is flashing red. It's not just the Drudge Report's siren that is at the top of that.

But I want to talk a little bit about the police state before we began with our interviews. This is a good example of one of the worst cases of this. Well, not one of the worst cases. I mean, the worst case is going to be that the government comes after you, not a rogue cop. This was a guy who was stalking a woman that he met on a TV set. He was working there as a security guard. He immediately took a liking, I guess, an obsession to this woman. And this is how it ended.

police officer speeding 70 miles an hour down a two-lane highway running over a bridge into the Florida Keys. Now, I don't know if you've ever been down there or not, but there is a very, very long old bridge, two lanes, and it's pretty narrow. And so this guy had to take some big risks to get around these trucks and catch up to her. He passed a dump truck in a no-passing zone that immediately does it again. He crosses over a double yellow line to pass another truck. He passes a third vehicle, nearly causing a head-on collision with a white pickup truck that veers away from him in the oncoming traffic. The cop keeps driving and sees the SUV he's been in pursuit of. He flickses sirens and lights on and pulls it over.

The cop, Lamar Roman, wasn't trying to pull over a suspected criminal. He was tracking and chasing a woman that he had met on the set of the Apple TV Plus show Bad Monkey. He'd been working a security detail a few weeks prior. She had been an extra on the program. he illegally looked up her vehicle information on David. That is a Florida Department of Motor Vehicles database that law enforcement uses. He then put out her license plate details on a surveillance hot list. Well, I guess he thought she was hot.

But this is the tie-in to flock. You put somebody on the hot list, and it's constantly looking at license plates and vehicle information. and as soon as you pass one of these cameras, it alerts law enforcement. So he put her on the hot list so that he could see where she was at a given point in time. Real-time notification. It highlights the fact, says Free Thought Project, that police around the country have abused their access to surveillance tools for their own personal stalking projects.

And it shows how different law enforcement databases and surveillance tools can be tied together to investigate and to follow anyone. And so you have situations where people, or falsely identified, they might be far away from the scene of the crime or they might be in another state, but they still get arrested because they were identified by AI and biometric surveillance. And really, the flat cameras are kind of like biometric surveillance for your car. It doesn't just look at the license plate.

It looks at a profile of the car. What kind of idiosyncrasies does it have? Is there a dent here? Is there a spot on the paint? Is there a bumper sticker? That type of thing. So the woman wasn't suspected of committing any crime. She had nothing to do with him.

She had no idea she was being tracked. This is what the future looks like if we don't stop these flock cameras, if we don't stop these data centers. As she got off the bus for the program, he had shouted at her, why didn't anybody tell me we were bringing models into the set? She was immediately uncomfortable, she said, with the situation. She told people that, or that she told the deputy, I've got a boyfriend. He said, well, I need your name and number. just in case I pull you over someday.

And so he kept doing that. He wouldn't take no for an answer. And there were people on the set who could back that up. When she said after he pulled her over, she told investigators that she observed a patrol car cut off the truck behind her. And she had a feeling it was him. When he approached, he said, I knew it was you, she said.

And does my information pop up in your screen? He said, how did you know it was? me. And she said that he responded and he said, well, I told you, I'd find you and pull you over. She said, the deputy also said, and I was hoping your boyfriend was in the car, so I could pull him out and give him a hard time. Yeah, this is the way this guy picks people up. Here's a tip. This is not the way to win friends and influence people. It's not the way to get a date either. Anyway, as people are pushing back against this, we had a guy in Virginia who is now facing charges for cutting some of these down. Each of these, when you look at the value of it, the pole, the camera, and the solar panel is about $1,500.

He cut down several of these. The CEO of the flock company, Garrett Langley, said that the organizers of the website that tells you where these cameras are, it is D-Flock. dot org, D-E-F-L-O-C-K-dot-org. The CEO of a flock called them terrorists. He said they're akin to Antifa. They're probably associated with China somehow, too,

don't you think? No. It's more likely that flock is associated with China. So, I don't know. Or maybe they are terrorists like the people who oppose Israeli genocide. I don't know. This guy's name is actually Jeffrey Sovereign.

S-O-V-E-R-N. And he has a GoFundMe where people can help him with his legal expenses, and he's gotten quite a bit of money there. He's charged with ripping out multiple cameras in Virginia because he said they are unconstitutional. He is a U.S. Air Force engineer, and he's been charged with 13 counts of destruction of property, six counts of petty larceny,

six counts of possession of burglary tools related to the destruction of the license. plate cameras. And so to pay for his defense, he put up a GoFundMe account with a goal of raising $8,500, and he has received so far $22,000, mostly between $5 and $50. He said, I'd appreciate everyone's right to privacy that is enshrined in the Fourth Amendment. But really, of course, folks, the true issue that we have with all of this is the surveillance centers and they just keep building and yet most people look at them as the trespass aspect of this but the expense aspect of it but it's really the surveillance

aspect over that we should be concerned about Microsoft has built a over seven billion dollar data center and they have a lawsuit from nearby neighbors pushing back against it they said that it's the it's a constant 24-7 sound of the generators. They said sounds like a train going through the area. Diesel generators, heating, ventilation, air conditioning systems. They said it is constant, pervasive, the noise from it, and the center, again, all of these centers are massive. And use a tremendous amount of power.

But, you know, when you look at sites like The Guardian, they're concerned that you and I, and our air conditioners here in America are killing the planet. It's kind of interesting. They don't mention the AI data centers for that. No, it's still our air conditioning units. Remember, you had Barack Obama go to Africa and he says, well, now y'all can't have air conditioning, you'll melt the planet down. Well, I guess now Americans can't have it either,

but it's just fine for the data centers to have it. And it's not just the power and the noise. It has also META's AI data center has been caught infecting the town water supply, Why? With a deadly bacteria. They said it took us a while to find this because we don't normally test for this. And this is actually part of the construction process. This particular bacteria was found as they were even billing it. So they haven't even finished it yet.

In the D.C. suburbs, you have 37 data centers. The county managers there are telling the schools to turn off their lights and their AC. Again, you can't have AC. We couldn't run our spyware with that. And so tens of millions of dollars for this. And as I pointed out, this last couple of days, you got people who are on the Wall Street analysts and others are saying there really isn't any profit use for these things. Yes, they are amusing the chat programs. They come up with some crazy stuff.

But they're not really making money for anybody. And when people realize that they're not making money, there's going to be a massive exit from the marketplace. The last one out loses it. everything they've got. So we see articles like this. Is your air conditioning killing people thousands of miles away? No, but the data centers most likely will be. And they will be enslaving and they will be spying on people thousands of miles away. It's not just about the nuisance in your backyard. And so we've got an interview that is coming up about the gangs, the rape gangs that are happening in the UK, but we've also got a rape gang that's operating in D.C. around Trump.

A woman that was allegedly raped by Trump went to a judge and said she fears for her life. The judge has now ordered the Department of Justice to unredact her files. We'll see what happens to that. Maybe Mike Johnson will agree with that. Maybe he will not. But, you know, the same guy that would refuse to release the Epstein files is refusing to tell people what condition Mitch McConnell is. And so we understand where this is all headed, don't we?

Yeah, there's probably even more cocaine dropping out of their publicans' butts when they see what is happening with Mitch McConnell. They're very concerned about their Senate majority, and they should be concerned about the House as well. We're going to take a quick break, and when we come back, we have a couple of great interviews. Again, as I said at the beginning of the program, we have a pastor who's going to be joining. and this thing is going to talk about what is really at the core of these rape gangs. It all began with the gaslighting of people, with the destruction of hearts, minds, and souls.

So we're going to start with that, and we also have an interview that is going to be vitally important. If you have children or know anybody who does that want to protect the family, what is it that CPS does? How are they funded? What is their goal? And what are their tactics? We'll be right back. Stay with us. Making sense, common again.

You're listening to the David Knight Show. Tell Alexa to add the APS radio skill and have access to the best channels anywhere. From country to blues, classic hits to news. APS Radio curates incredibly diverse playlist for you to enjoy. Get details at APSRadio.com. Joining us now is Pastor Joe Rigby, and he wrote recently an article in World Magazine about something we've been talking about quite a bit. that is about what is happening in Britain with a massive immigration.

And he also wrote a long treatise about the rape gang inquiry report. We're going to talk about that as well. He wrote an article on World Magazine about that and gave some points as to what he thinks is the fundamental problem and how the people of the UK need to recover from that. And we need to understand this is a broad agenda across a lot of different countries. It's coming to America as well. As a matter of fact, a lot of this is already here. and the same tactics that they used to put this in place are already in play here in the United States.

And so the article in World Magazine was, well, Britain finally awaken, and we're going to ask him what it takes to wake people up. Thank you for joining us, Pastor Ribby. Hey, thanks for having me. Tell us a little bit about your recommendations that you had in the World Magazine article report. Yeah, well, maybe I'll start with how shocked I was when the, so Rupert-Len. puts out this report. It's an independent rape gang inquiry report. You can go find that online, basically attempting to examine whether what had to this point been treated as isolated sort of grooming gangs. So there was a famous one in Rotherham, you know, a report about that.

And then there was another report. And but the British government had not formally looked at everything. And so he's, you know, raised money and did it independently to say, let's actually look and see how. And I just read it and was just absolutely shocked. It's huge. I haven't had time to read the entire thing, but I've gotten expert excerpts of it from the press. And it truly is shocking. And what's, I think, even more shocking is the government's complicity in all of this, right? Right. Absolutely. So it's, you know, the numbers are, you know, up to 250,000 white British girls all over the United Kingdom that weren't just, you know, they talk about grooming gangs or rape gangs, but this was like systematic sexual torture.

And ritualized by specifically Pakistani Muslim men. And it was organized, it was systematic. And so you think, okay, wow, that's going on. But it's going on with the at least passive complicity, if not active complicity, of every strata of British government, from police to social services, child welfare, foster care, hospitals, the NHS, like everywhere you look, it's like everybody is aware of this.

They see these young girls being brought in with girls at 10, 11, 12 with sexually transmitted diseases, they, you know, with bleeding and beaten and whatnot, and they just patch them up and send them back out with the same, you know, Pakistani men who've, who've been abusing them. And so, and that everybody just looks the other way. That's amazing.

It's just shocking. Let me interject here and say, you know, when you go to, we had a situation decades ago. My son, who's now working the board, was a young child, and we went to a wedding in Nashville. And my mom was with us, and she was in a wheelchair, and he's a little toddler. He falls in the wheelchair, and he gets a knot on his head, but he's okay. But it swells up a little bit. But then he goes over, and because we're in a hotel and we're rushing, my wife. wife's got her iron on the bed and he touches out with his hand.

And, ah, you know, he goes back. So then, because we're rushing. We're not paying that close attention to him. And so he gets a blister on his hand. And she was worried about the knot on his head. So he took him to an urgent care thing. And they said, well, we can't do anything about that. Go over here to the emergency room.

And we went there. They called the police on us. Right. And so they're very, my point in all of this is that they're very, very aware of anything that might leave. be signs of physical or sexual abuse, and yet there they just look the other way when it is so incredibly obvious. And the guy who put this together is a new leader of a new party, the restore party in the UK, because a lot of people are concerned that the whole idea that the conservatives

aren't conservative and the liberals aren't about freedom and the reform party maybe is not seeing what the real problem is because it's not something that's just going to be reformed. It needs to be radically restored at the roots. Yeah. Yeah, that's right. And I think, So, you know, Rupert, I don't know a ton about Rupert Lowe. I've seen the announcement of Restore. And from what I can tell, I'm not an expert on British politics, I'll put it that way. But that, like you said, the conservatives have basically just been liberals going a little slower, but a lot of the same policies.

And then reform, led by Nigel Farage, was pitched as kind of the radical right alternative, but they have kind of softened, especially on immigration, I think in an attempt, to win votes of certain immigrant groups. And therefore, they haven't touched this issue. And then finally, Lowe says, I'm going to be the guy who's just going to tell it like it is. And I'm going to expose and listen to these survivors. You know, again, thousands and thousands of women. And you read the accounts, you know, these victim accounts that are in there.

And you just can't believe that this would go on in a, you know, first world. country with the knowledge and complicity of the governing officials who, like you said, normally in any other circumstances would be on it, who would say this is absolutely unacceptable, but because of the racial dynamics, because of the immigration dynamics, just looked the other way and let it happen. It was just shocking to me. And so I read it and thought, will this, and at the time, I mean, this has been now a couple weeks, but I thought for sure this would trigger something. And the fact that it hasn't is, I think, one of the more discouraging elements is that there hasn't been a widespread, you know, like protests in the streets and

calls for, you know, a new election to put in a new prime minister and clear, clean house. The fact that there hasn't really is a discouraging thing about the state of the British people. Yeah, I know. I mean, we go back to 2020 and the lockdowns and all the rest of the rest of the time. the stuff that was happening there. I was very discouraged and still I am that there hasn't been a pushback against that, but they have their tactics. They have their propaganda, their media control. And, of course, at the root of all this, if you point out the obvious fact, and it is obvious

because it is so widespread because there's been so many cases of it. So it's obvious to everybody in society what is going on. But they want to cover this up and pretend that it's not happening. If you happen to notice that the emperor has no clothes or that the gangs are raping people, then you're the problem. And they shame you. And that's what everybody is afraid of. And so that's one of the points that you made in terms of recommendation.

Public repentance, because the British people must repent of not only multiculturalism, but also of colonial guilt and the fear of man, because that is the real issue, isn't it? Yeah, no, that's absolutely right. It's very clear. This is one of things that Lowe's report lays out is that it's not just an immigration problem. the native problem among the British is the fear of being called racist and that commitment to multiculturalism. And so in some ways, the call is they need to repent of the things that they think are

their virtues. They think that their commitment to multiculturalism, they think that the colonial guilt, the white guilt, these are their virtues. This is the sign that they are good. And I think in light of these things, they're, no, these are your sins. This stinks to high heaven. You need to repent of all of them. that and actually get back to working for the good of your people, like working for the good of the

British people and protecting them from these essentially, I mean, you know, the description of what they were doing where, you know, you target young girls, drugs, alcohol, bring them, bring them in, and then eventually you start raping, torturing, threatening to kill them, threatening to kill their families, like systematically hundreds and hundreds of times. And it was a conquest domination mentality. It's not simply men who want to have too much sex. That's not what this is. This is cultural domination enabled by religion.

It's Islamic specifically. It's not just random people. It's like, no, there's an ideology and a religious warrant for this. it's shocking that they would allow it to fester like that. And, you know, there's another religion that is inherited in all this, and that is Marxism. I've had, and I forget the lady's name, it's a Chinese lady who came here after being a child in China and growing up in Mao's China. And she called it Mao's America, I think was the title of the book when I interviewed her,

and it was a survivor's warning to Americans. And she said, I'm looking at the same tactics with all this DEI and critical race. theory that we see here in America, same tactics that they used and Mao's Marxist China. She said, it's not enough not to be racist, for example. You have to be anti-racist. You have to denounce yourself. And that was like what they were doing with a struggle session. So this is a full-on Marxist tactic that they're using and they're wetting a lot of these things together. And we have seen this weaponized very effectively in countries like Germany where they have put the burden of the Nazis on people who had nothing to do with it.

And so it's like a generational sin type of thing. And we as Christians ought to stand against that, shouldn't we? Yeah, absolutely. And you can see there was a report earlier this week, a Trump administration report about the Smithsonian and how so much of that ideological critical theory, gender theory had worked its way into Smithsonian. And this is how it starts?

Because first you have to change the past. How do you tell the story? Is America a story of founding liberty and freedom? and so forth with heroes like George Washington, or is it a story of, you know, oppression, violence, and, you know, and so the changing of the story, gender theory. You know, I remember going earlier this year, my family was that we were in Washington, D.C.,

and we went to the American History Museum. And I just came away feeling like what I learned was vaudeville lesbians of the 19th century literally built America. It was just the most, like, I don't, I don't, I don't remember seeing anything about the founding fathers, maybe in passing, but it was like every other exhibit was about LGBT. It was about, you know, it was women, immigrants. It was the whole thing. Like the only people who had no hand in building America, it seemed, other than maybe an oppressive one, were the actual men who did it. And so the changing of the narrative,

the rewriting of history is the first step, because it softens, okay, you're oppressive. you're oppressive, you're oppressive. And then now that means when we let in these immigrant groups who are going to plunder and in extreme cases do what they've done in England, you'll have no defenses because you'll feel like you deserve it. Yeah, that's right. And I've seen this as well. I mean, certainly Washington is a wash with us.

But we used to take our kids when we lived in North Carolina, we'd take them up regularly to Colonial Williamsburg. Of course, that was a foundation that was created by the Rockefeller Foundation. But in its early days, it was about the conventional American history with the heroes who actually did the things that we talk about, the things that founded our country. But over time, we kept watching it get more and more DEI and critical race theory and things like that. And more and more critical, the people actually founded the country. And so I would ask some interesting questions to the people when they would have a group discussion. You know, they'd be putting their doctrine out there.

And, and, and, but most importantly, I wanted my sons to see that because they're homeschooled. They didn't see it too much. Yeah. I said, look at that. This is what they're doing. And this is why they're doing that. And it was important to have that discussion. And it was that way in Colonial Williamsburg.

It was really, really bad up at Plymouth Rock. We went up there one Thanksgiving. Uh, that was far worse than what I had seen prior to that at Williamsburg. And I'm sure Williamsburg is caught up now at this point. Uh, but that is what they're doing and they're doing it. in culture, they're doing it in movies, they're doing especially in schools, aren't they? Yeah, and, you know, if you think about, here's a biblical parallel that might be relevant. When Moses is up on the mountain getting the Ten Commandments, Aaron's down with the people,

and they demand, make us gods, because they're scared. They're scared. We need gods. When Aaron does it, when he takes their gold, makes a golden calf, what he says is, these are your gods who brought you up out of the land of Egypt. And so he's, he's, he's attributing the work of God to this idol. And it's a rewriting of the past. It's the he's like the first step towards the idolatry, toward the rejection of the living God, is a rewriting of that history.

And so in the same way, there's a concerted effort to rewrite American history away from its Christian founding, away from the, you know, for all of its flaws, for the really the greatness of this country, rewrite that narrative in order to move us away from the God of our fathers. I agree.

And, of course, one of the other things is they give me this gold and out came this golden calf. Like it just magically appeared. And that's what they're trying to tell us now is that all this stuff just grew up organically. I don't know how these things. It must be true because it just happened, right? That's right. But, yeah, you have a couple of books, as a matter of fact, that can't impress that kind of touch on this, I think. One of them, the sin of empathy.

Tell us a different. Is there a difference that you see between empathy and sympathy? and what would that difference be? Yeah. In that book, I try to distinguish them. You know, I'm not hung up on what words. People want to use different words, it's fine. Get the concepts. One is a kind of measured, anchored, tethered response to human suffering,

where you see the suffering, but you're anchored to what is good and what is right, and therefore you actually seek to help people. I liken this, too, if someone was drowning and you wanted to help them, you would reach in, that would be the kind of the sympathy part. You're going to reach in to help them, but you're going to remain anchored to the sharp. shore so that you can actually lift them out. You need to be tethered to something outside of their emotions and their pain. On the other hand, I would say the way the empathy often gets used in

the modern world is essentially you just have to jump in with both feet. They're drowning and you just jump in. And now you have two people drowning. And so it puts their emotions and their suffering in the driver's seat and becomes a tool of emotional manipulation. And so I think to dovetail that to some of these discussions. It's in the name of empathy that Western nations are required to admit anybody who wants to come into the country for any reason. Empathy for illegal immigrants. Empathy for refugees. And you can say, I'm a Christian. Shouldn't we be for compassion for these groups that are, and it's like, I want to say, sure. But why does that mean we have to let let in, you know, 11 billion, you know, able-bodied men into this country?

with no consequences. Like, why do, like that doesn't follow, but it's empathy that is the kind of steering wheel that overcomes any resistance or objection that says, hey, maybe we can't receive this many. Maybe we can't absorb that many. Maybe this is going to be harmful, destructive. Are they compatible with our nation? Do they have the same values? Do they have the same beliefs?

Do they have the same cultural folkways? Will this work? And you can't even ask those questions. It's overrided by, well, you have to be empathetic. Yeah. And, you know, when I think of it, I think about empathy being manipulation of the emotions. Remember, Bill Clinton, I didn't know what he was trying to say. He was, I feel your pain, you know, that type of thing. And so it's like, it's all about your feelings. And it's not, like you said, anchored to anything that is concrete. You know, you can sympathize with somebody. But with empathy, you're supposed to, really it ties into all this.

You can't not be racist. It's not enough. You've got to be anti-racist. So you have to put yourself as you. pointed out, you got to jump into the mire with them and suffer with them. And it just removes objective principles. That's the whole point about it. Taking away, it's almost like doing a lobotomy and that's just going to be ruled by emotions. And that's a very dangerous thing. Yeah. So one of the ways I would distinguish the two phenomena is sympathy or compassion is looking at what would be good for them. It's the other person's good. What would be good? Whereas empathy fixates on their feelings, which means that, which means the empathy will often do short-term fixes because it'll relieve the immediate feelings, but in the long run will be more destructive and harmful. It's amazing how

many, how much destruction you can cause in the name of empathy. You can kill a lot of unborn babies. Yeah, that's right. In the name of empathy, because you can just override any moral concerns by the potential suffering or the actual hardship faced by a woman who's pregnant. And you say, well, empathy for her means I have to ignore the humanity of her unborn child. It just overrides any rational and moral considerations. That's right. And when we look at this, again, we go back and we just become emotional about all this and not really look objectively at it.

You talked about what is in people's best interest in terms of compassion. Is it really in the best interest of people whose ancestors? went through something that was unjust, and of course, probably all of our ancestors went through something that was unjust in their life. That happens to all of us to some degree or the other. But is it the way to move forward? Is it to just uproot and destroy our entire society and everything? You know, let's just forget about all the people who have worked hard and saved their money and bought a home or whatever. We're just going to give it back to, let's say, the Indians or whatever. That type of thing has been proposed. Is anybody really better off

with that kind of situation. And that's what just focusing on the emotions, I think, really eventually leads to, as you're pointing out. Right. Yeah, well, and it sets up a kind of zero-sum situation where, you know, it's competition to be in aggrieved classes. So I refer to this as the victimhood Olympics. So the greatest victim wins.

That's right. The rules of the game are you want to be in the most victim, the most victimized person sets the agenda for the entire community. And that was the rules of the game in that kind of critical theory, you know, cultural Marxist mentality was, it moved it out of simply the realm of economics. Classical Marxism was all about, you know,

working class versus the middle class or, you know, the proletariat and the bourgeoisie. That was the bifurcation. And this just basically expanded that and said, well, victimhood could go in multiple directions. There's racial victimhood, there's gender victimhood, there's sexuality, victimhood, there's every kind of victimhood under the sun. And the more victimhood points you can accumulate, the more power that you have in that system.

And that was, that was basically the, has been the operating system of the West in, you know, one whole, one political party is completely sold out to it. I think part of the other political party wants to be sold out to it. And so you end up in a situation where if you just want people to play fair, you just want governments to call balls and strikes and leave people the ability to work hard, keep what they earn, provide for their families. If you're there, you've got massive incentives against you. And instead, it's let's stoke resentment and grievances among different classes and groups of people as a way of manipulating and controlling them. That's right. That's right. Divide and conquer.

And I really think that that is that very simple strategy that everybody has always talked about. I think that that is at the root of what these cynical leaders are doing in order to betray their own people. They know that they have an agenda down the road, and that's what a lot of this back and forth with the encounters of the UK police are about. When people refuse to comply with the biometric surveillance and facial recognition vans that they put out there by putting a mask on their face, then the police come after them big time. And it was just a few years ago. They were demanding that we put a mask on our face. face. That's right. It's crazy. That was the only sense. Or you're standing in a corner and you're just watching people and you're filming people and they're filming everybody all the time and so then they come

after you just to make that compliance effect that is there. But you've got a couple of other things besides public repentance that would include things like getting over this multi-generational sins and guilt that they put on people and the fear of man. What are the other things that you talked about in your article on World Magazine. Yeah, I think the other thing is for Christians, this is what imprecatory Psalms are for. You know, we have these Psalms in the Bible that, in which we ask God, you know, O Lord God of Vengeance, shine forth, rise up, repay to the proud what they deserve. Like the Bible includes prayers like that for a reason. And I think sometimes modern Christians who aren't accustomed to having real enemies struggle with what to do with those.

And I think situations like this are precisely what those Psalms were written for. Here you have high-handed wickedness of the most grotesque kind, praying on the innocent, and God has given us language to express our outrage to him and call upon him to act on our behalf and act on behalf of the weak and the innocent. And so I think churches have to recover a robust, you know, whole Bible mentality and not simply leave out those what are often the gnarly bits, It's the parts that make us uncomfortable as modern Westerners and instead say, no, these are in here for a reason, and you're going to face situations when Pakistani grooming gangs are systematically torturing young girls, you need to have language to take it to the Lord and call upon him to act and trust that he actually will. So that's a big one.

And I think that's a, I think that's in some ways the thing that's most discourage. When I say the lack of rising up or outrage, it seems, on the part of the British, maybe the next election or something will show some. something more, but maybe it's just bubbling beneath the surface. We can pray that it is. But in the meantime, this is what churches should be doing is cultivating righteous emotions. How should we feel about it? Like in the empathy discussion, I'm not opposed to emotions. I want emotions governed by what's true and good, and I want them intense in proportion to the way they should be. So if something is really evil, we should really hate it. Like we should abhor. This is a biblical command. Abhor what is evil? Well, if you abhor it, are you praying to God like you abhor it?

Or do you just distract yourself with the latest Netflix show? Do you just kind of go back to your, you know, or do you take it somewhere? And then the third thing that I said is they have to channel. So it's awaken that outrage because this is outrageous and then channel it in effective ways. And so I think that there's a real risk of vigilanteism that will eventually bubble up in certain circles. I think that's what the total state would. want is because they can then blame people. If people start doing vigilante justice against immigrants, it'll give them an excuse to crack down. And so part of what I would commend is national strikes.

Right. Like in other words, like the solidarity movement in Poland under communism, how did they, how did they end it? Well, they all got to the solidarity was, hey, we're just going to sit down and stop working. We're going to grind this economy to a halt. We're going to, we're going to make, Like, we're going to make these people feel it where it hurts them. And so I think for the British people to, you know, for Rupert Lowe, for example, to call for a general strike and say, hey, for the next week, we're not going to work. We're going to grind the country to a halt until you call a new election and the people can have a chance to get rid of all of these folks who enabled it, who have a chance to, you know, hopefully move a bunch of those restore politicians into power where they can actually begin to take action and not simply vent their outrage. into the online social media. I agree.

And of course, the powers that B understand that they can push us to the point that people strike back violently. You know, it was John F. Kennedy who said, when you make peaceful change impossible, you make violent change inevitable. And so they are aware of that. And they look at that and their response to that is, rather than making peaceful change possible, they say, you know, we could use that violent response. Yeah.

No, it's true. You know, there's actually a great, there's an essay by C.S. Lewis that's just right on this point. It's called Delinquents in the Snow. It's a lesser-known essay by him. And in it, he basically describes a situation where some young hooligans basically robbed, broke into his shed and stole a bunch of tools. And they were caught, and they were, you know, they were caught, arrested, and went down for the trial. And the judge on the trial basically treated theft of property like a prank.

Oh, these are just childhood pranks. And Lewis wrote, he said, if you do that, if you treat criminal activity as just a sort of boys will be boys, no big deal, A, for the criminals are going to learn there's no consequences, which is what we have today in many places. Like there's no consequences. Our urban centers in America and in the UK are just, you can do whatever you want. That's what led to the grooming gangs knew we can get away with it. They're not going to do anything about it. But then eventually it provokes vigilanteism on the part of the population.

And you do get this violent backlash and you're stoking revolution. Now, whether it actually come to that in the UK or the U.S., I don't know. I don't know that we have the fortitude or the, you know, when you think about the sorts of outrages, you know, we just celebrated the 250th. And so I'm sure many people were watching their favorite patriotic movies. And if you think about the sorts of things that got our forefathers to take action, you know, a penny tax on tea. But they saw the tyrannical jurisdictional claim being made,

and they said, we're going to fight it at the front end. And now you think about the outrageous perpetuated on the American people or on the British people by their own governments with a kind of laissez-faire, ho-hum, attitude. And you just think our forefathers were men of much greater courage, much greater fortitude, much greater action. And it ought to be the case that we, should be thinking very creatively and deliberately about what actions we can take in order to

prevent these kinds of outrages from coming to our country. And for the British, it's time for them. I concluded my article with a poem by Kipling about how, you know, the British don't hate easily. The English people are slow to hate, but when they do, watch out. It takes a lot to get them up. They're a very sort of stoic kind of people. if they actually can recover some of that, the same mentality that, you know, the sun never set on the British Empire, that same sort of, we're a small island and we're going to take over

the world. If they recover any of that, then watch out. But we can pray that they do it and they do it righteously. That's right. Yeah, you talk about people who had the courage and they took action. They also had the foresight. They could see where this is headed. And it has been so disturbing to me to see really going back to 2020 when all this lockdown and insanity

began with all that stuff. Can't people see where this is headed? And if you can't see where it's going, you're not going to get up and rise up against it. And once it gets established like a cancer, it's pretty hard to stop it. And that's where all the bloodshed comes after people experience it.

But we're seeing right now in our societies the absolute contempt. And I'm talking about in America and Canada throughout Europe and all the rest of the Western societies, we are seeing an absolute contempt from our leaders for all the things that were hard, fought, and won. Going back is basically an overturning of the Magna Carta. Always back to that, you know, no trial by jury, no free speech, all these fundamental things

that people who fought against that at the time of the American Revolution had experienced these types of abuses. We never experienced these types of abuses. We don't pay attention to history, and we can't see what is coming now. and they're doing it, I think, at this point in time, Pastor Rigby, because I think they understand they've got this massive tool that's coming down the road. And they're just preparing themselves and everybody else for when they hit us with this hammer of full-on 24-hour surveillance with everything.

I mean, they're going to have godlike powers of omnipresence, omnipotence, and, you know, omniscience in terms of. of everything that we're doing. And so they're going to see everything, know everything, and have all power with these types of tools that are coming. And so they're just chomping at the bit to get started. Yeah. No, I think that the administrative state, the bureaucratic state,

the total state looks at the technologies coming down and they salivate. Oh, what can we do with that? As Christian, I think the upside is the Lord knows how to frustrate the plans of the wicked. This is what God, this is what the Lord does from from Babel on. When they wanted to build that tower to heaven, the Lord knew how to frustrate the plans of the peoples. He's constantly casting down the proud and the thoughts of their hearts. I was just reading the gospel of Luke that, you know, Mary's Magnificat, where, you know, he scatters the proud of the thoughts of their hearts.

That's what the Lord does. And so we can pray that the Lord would do that and act on our behalf. And I think the other thing is I was just reading, again, for the 250th. I went back and read Calvin Coolidge's address to the nation on the 150th. So Coolidge was president at the 150th anniversary. And in it, it's a celebration of kind of the founding principles of the nation. Declaration of Independence. He focuses there on equality.

You know, all men are created equal. They have rights from God and consent of the governed. Those were the kind of the three sort of founding principles that he celebrated. But the actual note that he struck was those print. Those principles actually weren't unique. Philosophers had debated them. Europeans had talked about them. He said, what was unique about America is that those principles were a people had arisen.

As we says, a people had arisen who embraced them and were willing to defend them, we're willing to fight for them, and act upon them. And it was the character of the people. There were a liberty-loving, God-fearing, independent, self-governing people. And he says, that was what was unique, it was the combination. of the principles and the people. It wasn't just the principles by themselves do nothing. They just float, but you need people who actually are willing to act upon them. And so he spends most of his address calling upon the American people to recover and maintain that same peoplehood. What kind of people

are we? Are we this, are we that God-fearing people? He talks about how the founding generation, the center of their lives was the meeting house, the church. They worshipped God. They were Christian people. They knew their Bibles. This is an amazing American president talking about how important it was that that founding generation were just saturated in the Bible and was their second, you know, it was just second nature to them to speak in biblical language. And so he says, that was the character of that people. And it was because of that, that they could take these theoretical principles and actually build a government of checks and balances that required men to have, you know, that insisted on equality before the law and so forth.

And so when I read that, I just thought, man, we need that people again. We need to be that people. Like we need God to, we need a people to arise like that. That's one of the reasons that we, you know, do what we do in terms of our worship and our education. Christian education is so important because, like you said, you mentioned you homeschooled your kids. If you don't shape and mold the next generation, they'll be shaped and molded by this wider culture that won't be that people. They won't be a God-fearing, independent, liberty-loving people. They'll just coast along like jellyfish.

That's right. And you know, you walk along with them in the way, and when they see something, they ask you about it, you tell them what that's really about. And you give them the truth. Otherwise, if you're not there walking with him, somebody else, they'll turn to somebody else and say, what does that mean? And they'll say, well, that means it turned the wrong body. something like that, you know. So that's the importance of that, and that is our God-given role. But I really like what you said at the beginning of this, Pastor Rigney. And that is the fact that God has always come against the proud. And I have reported many times some of the things that these transhumanist billionaires when I set up a technocracy, I said, look at this. Look at how proud they are.

And look at how they're flaunting their power in the face of God. we will be like God, right? I said, that's great because now God's going to take care of that. It's kind of like when David went up to Goliath, and he said, you know, you are attacking the God of this country. He will take care of you. And I think that's the approach that we need to have. You know, we may need to be the ones who actually get the sling.

Yes. God is going to be guiding the stone. Right, exactly. Yeah, I may be small, but I found these five smooth stones. Right? Like, we may be small, but we have these smooth stones. And that's where building alternative kinds of communities, communities of resilience, where people can live within the truth, raise their kids. Like this is, we're in a situation like Ezra Nehemiah where, you know, the city's been broken down, the walls have been destroyed, and we've been sent back.

And we live in the ruins of a once great civilization. That's right. And what should you do? You should establish worship of God. You should preach the word. and you should start rebuilding that wall. With a sword in one hand and a shovel in the other, build and fight, that's the call for American Christians at the present moment in our own communities.

And that means being willing to take action and not simply retreat into an evangelical ghetto where we can kind of try to hope that the worst passes us by. Instead, we have to actually step forward and take real concrete action. I agree. And many people are starting to talk about how we have to build the society. from the bottom up because it is totally rotten at the top. And, you know, many things like the Greek parable, the fish rots from the head down, that certainly is true of politics.

But, you know, if we build this from the ground up, it kind of dawned on me the other day as I was talking to an author of Civil Defense Manual. And his name is Jack Lawson. And I've interviewed him many times. But this time when I was talking to him, he said, we were talking about the different dynamics, the group dynamics. In other words, he's not just about prepping and, you know, here's how you shoot a gun and how you, you know, the kinds of weapons and tools that you need or the kind of supplies that you need. But his book

focuses a lot on interpersonal relationships. So, you know, here you're going to put together a group of neighbors and everybody's going to have each other's back and you've all got maybe different types of skills and things like that. Not everybody is going to be everything. I mean, you have to have somebody there that can do medical stuff, maybe somebody who provides security, on and on. And so you start to put that together. And I thought, you know, that really is kind of a model for how we start to take back our society. We don't have to wait for the grid down scenario or some kind of a massive storm or a war or civil war.

We don't have to wait for that to start. We can start preparing and start rebuilding because things are already, as you pointed out, the walls are being broken down. And so now is the time to start building relationships, building skills, building communities. I think, and doing that from the bottom up. That's right. And so our blueprint for this is you begins with the worship of God. Worship is the heartbeat of every Christian community. If you honor God in worship, and then you ask Him, Lord, your will be done on earth as it is in heaven.

So we're going to worship you, God of heaven, and we're going to ask your kingdom to come. Your will be done on earth as it is in heaven. Bless our efforts. And then from there, it works out into your family, into Christian education, and then from there into the wider community that you build. But a big part of that is just there's ways, if you want to get ready for that, do you know how to forgive sins? Do you know how to confess your sins? Because like you said, communities like that are going to need to be able to trust one another, that you're going to need to be resilient.

And so are you the sort of person who keep short accounts with your neighbors, with your wife, with your kids? Do you confess your sins regularly? And then do you know how to extend forgiveness when you're wronged? Like, that's bread and butter basic Christianity. And when you're talking about civilizational renewal, it's actually. essential. Otherwise, you just have festering grievances in every direction. Absolutely. Forgiveness of sins is fundamental to human societies. You can't function if you're

constantly keeping track of rights and wrongs and what who's done what to me and and collecting grievances, it will all fall apart. And so instead, Christian communities, preach the word, believe the gospel, and then live it out. That's absolutely right. And you know, I think of that, that I've mentioned many times, we have this kind of a Hatfield and McCoy's approach that happens in the Middle East and it just keeps the conflict going and going and going because there's never any forgiveness. There's never any like, okay, that's behind us now. Let's figure out what we're going to do to move ahead and have peace or something like that. And that is what we have to do on a personal basis.

You point out, if we can't forgive others and if others can't forgive us, we have really lost the heart of the gospel because that's what the gospel is about. And that is what these Marxists have tried to take away from us. They have tried to perpetuate this guilt and the sin and this keeping records of, you know, while he did this, I'll never forget that, you know, and I'll never forgive it. And so they have kept this thing going. And it's like a wound that you keep picking at and it keeps festering and bleeding. And they're the ones who come along. And I guess in school you go to your DEI teacher and they see a scratch on you.

And every day they go pick at that wound, right? Yeah, that's exactly right. It's just, it's just great. And the thing is, is you're either going to build a culture around the forgiveness of sins, given in Christ that works its way out, or you build a culture based on grievances, which is all about different groups, collecting grievances against other groups, and then it's a fight. It's like it is Hatfield's McCoys.

It's a dog fight over who's going to be the one to meet out the punishment. Yeah. That's what we see around the world. And that's what we're importing into our country, quite frankly. Like the immigration issue is fundamentally about are we importing people, bringing lots of people in who are not going to assimilate into our historic American, Protestant Christian society, which is what we had for, you know, 150 years. That was the core of America. And then people who came had to assimilate into that. Now it's, no, you come and you form your own enclave.

You have your own separate. And it just, and you have these power centers. And eventually, whether it's the Muslims in Michigan or the Somalis in Minnesota, the Hindus in Texas, you have these groups that are fundamentally in terms of their worldview, their values, their beliefs, their practices, they're not compatible. That's right. They're fighting each other in their home countries. Pakistan and India fight each other all the time. You've got the Middle East.

You have all of these places. And we think we can just import all of that conflict with no forgiveness of sins in sight, and everything will be fine. It's absolutely, it's insane. Yeah, they bring the war here. And they come in with a hierarchical structure. I've talked to when we celebrated the Declaration of Independence, I said that's a key Christian concept, that all men are created equal, that there's not a caste system. You don't have some ethnic chosen group that's going to lord it over everybody else.

Everybody is equal in the side of God and in government, and they need to be treated appropriately if they do bad things. but you don't start setting priorities based on people's ethnicity. That is one of the most anti-American and anti-Christian things there is. And really it's Christianity that gives us a society that doesn't break people into ethnic groups and doesn't break people into a caste society because that is really the antithesis of Christianity. Right, yeah. So for us to recover a strong confit.

assertive Christian faith as the American people is what will enable us to find our way out. Like that's the only way out. There isn't, it's just going to be further balkanization. And whether it ends up being a full balkanization of different tribes warring over the ruins or whether you get the technocratic omnicompetent state that runs our lives, like those are the two, you know, it's Babel or it's the book of judges. Like those are the bad options. And I just want to say, there's another option.

We could rebuild this civilization, a Christian civilization. We can rebuild Christendom beginning in our own homes, and our own churches, our own communities. That's the need of the hour. That's right. Absolutely right. And along those lines, you've got another book that I'd like to touch on before we let you go if you've got time. And that's leadership and emotional sabotage.

Tell us a little bit about that. And, of course, you've got group study guides that go along with these books as well, don't you? Yeah. Yeah, that book's about kind of the crisis and leadership in our homes, in our, you know, in marriages, in our churches and in the wider world, and kind of tries to identify the patterns and habits, biblical habits and patterns that lead to abdication, that lead to rebellion and that lead to blame shifting. So that's kind of like what I'd call the Adam pattern. So Adam neglects his responsibility. He doesn't guard and protect his wife. when the serpent approaches her. Then he commits idolatry. He chooses her over God. I'll listen to her voice, do what she says, rather than what God said. And then when God shows up and calls into account, he just points the finger and says,

the woman that you gave me, she did it. So that pattern is played out. And like we mentioned earlier, the story of Aaron and the Golden Cap. It's the same story, right? He listens to the voice of the people, does what they say, makes the idol, and then blames them. The people, you know the people, Moses. And this pattern shows up again and again and again. in the Bible as kind of the sinful pattern of leadership.

And what I'm trying to argue for is a contrast to that where you take responsibility for what God is entrusted to you, beginning with yourself. And that's what enables you to resist the various kinds of emotional sabotage that will come if you're a sober-minded, courageous leader. So the leadership that I commend in the book is sober-mindedness as a kind of core virtue, which I define as clarity of mind, a stability of mind, a stability. of soul and a readiness to act. So your clarity of mind means you see things clearly, you know what's required of you, you know who God is, you know what you're called to do. You have a stability of

soul. You're not tossed by your emotions. You're not tossed by the emotions of others. That's the sin of empathy stuff. You're not letting the emotions of others sway and cloud your judgment. There's stability. And then you're ready to act. You're ready to, okay, God, what do you want me to do? And that kind of sober-minded leadership is what's missing in so many areas from our homes to our our pastors to our national leaders. And so it's basically a short, you know, blueprint for recovering sober-minded leadership to resist the kinds of sabotage that leaders face today. Yeah, you know, this week I talked about an article out of the New York Post, which is, you know, associated with the Republican Party and, quote, unquote, conservatives. I don't know what they're trying to conserve

because this New York Post article had a take that was very one-sided and very critical of traditional families by calling the wives trad wives, which is really just kind of an influencer label that's out there. And as I said, you know, they're getting their idea of what marriage and a wife is like out of TikTok instead of out of the Bible. But in that, the woman that they began talking to, she described a situation where the husband was just domineering and dominating. And I said, well, you know, that's not really the relationship that God has decided for a marriage at all. And a very unhealthy relationship. But they used that to put forward a feminist view of, you know, anti-marriage, anti-family, anti-child. It was really amazing to see that.

I guess I shouldn't be amazed. I just didn't expect that because they basically sell to a constituency that doesn't have those values. But they're being used to sell those values because the people aren't going to look at something's written by Washington Post or New York Times. But if it's the New York Post, they'll read that. And that's how they can get that through. And so I'm assuming that your book, Leadership and Emotional Sabotives, that also reflects on marriage in that relationship as well, doesn't it? Yeah, it does. And it basically, well, part of the thing is, the question is not whether the husband will be the head.

The Bible doesn't teach that the husband should be the head of his home. It teaches that he is. So it's not a question of whether he'll be the head. He is the head. It's just a question of what kind will he be. It will be a faithful one like Jesus was. Or will be an unfaithful one like Adam was. That's the basic question.

But his headship is sort of a basic fact of reality. You can't, patriarchy is unavoidable, quite frankly. It's just, that's the way God made the world. So you either get faithful patriarchy where husbands know themselves to be under authority, under the authority of God, seeking to model themselves after Christ. You get faithful patriarchy or you get demented patriarchy, right? You get men pretending to be women. Yeah.

And women pretending to be men. Yeah. Yeah, you get all the confusion. It's still patriarchal. It's still, it's just demented patriarchy. It's just sinful patriarchy. You can get the domineering or the abdicating patriarchy. but one way or another, that's just the way the world is.

And as Christians, we need to embrace that. Embrace that that's the way God made the world, that it's good for us, and not worry so much about, if I was to point at some of the things on the conservative side on this side of the pond, the UK should repent of its multiculturalism, so should we. We also need to repent of all the feminism that we've imbibed all the way down. Like there's so much underneath the service. And even the Republican Party, I think, on this, is trying to just be. they just want to be a little bit pregnant.

Mm-hmm, mm-hmm, absolutely. Yeah, I said when I talked about, you know, God never made a creature with two heads. That's right. And there's not two heads in the family, but that's not really even what they're after. The matriarchy wants to replace the patriarchy. So it isn't that they want to be co-equal. They want to dominate. And that's what the feminists want.

But they, over and above that, they don't even want a family. So, you know, I guess the headship part of that takes a second chair to whether or not, you even want to have a family. That's the real thing, I think, is that they have poisoned that. We always see at times of revival that the Bible will say that God turns the hearts of the fathers to the children. Well, at this point in time, we better start praying that turns the hearts to the mothers to the children because they've been turned away from that, haven't they? Yeah, no, it's very true. The political divide, the young single women who have just drifted left because basically nature abhors a vacuum. And if you're going to teach people that a woman's, if a woman

wants to get married and to be a mom. If that's her ambition, if she has that wholly high ambition to be a wife and a mom, that's mocked, derided in every aspect of our culture. Well, it doesn't, it doesn't mean that she, a woman still has the natural desire to have someone take care of her and to be, to provide for her. And so instead of looking for it in a husband who's covenanted to her, she looks for it in the state. Yeah. She looks forward to, you know, instead of saying, getting married to her husband, she gets married to the government. And then, and then they know that. They know that. And they know that.

Yeah. So they, and they begin to, and so that's going to who's going to provide all the needs. And then they're going to try to confiscate every aspect of, you know, those who live by the old ways, the traditional family, is going to be basically a big pot of money that they can confiscate in order to redistribute it to, to provide all of their wives, all of their unmarried, childless cat ladies that now, you know, and they still have that mothering instinct. I think this is a major element. but this is dovetailing back to the sin of empathy thing. It's feminine empathy, feminine empathy that enables so many of these pathologies in our society, whether it's for criminals, whether it's for illegal aliens.

The female empathy, unguided by reason, unguided by what's true and good in the scriptures, becomes highly destructive. And you see these bizarre situation. I mean, it's an amazing thing to watch, say again, in the UK, women defending these illegal immigrants, they've let them in, they're raping their women, and rather than sort of mama bear kicking in and saying, no way, no how,

they defend the very people who are committing these horrific crimes. It's just a shocking inversion of everything natural and good. Especially when they are unlying to be a victim. You know, when you mention that, the fact that the government comes in is the father, this is something we've always talked about, in conservative and libertarian circles, that the government is always looking to create dependency.

And they do it in a very soft way. Well, here's some public transportation. Oh, by the way, now we're going to put some more restrictions on your private car, something like that. And so they're always looking for a way in which they can have, be the dominant provider, whether you're talking about transportation or housing or welfare or whatever. They're looking to be the provider.

And how did that manifest itself? Well, when they started doing that in the poor, communities, the black communities. You've got a lot of people like Thomas Sol and others who have pointed out that, you know, that means that the family breaks up and there isn't a real incentive. The financial incentive to stay together is removed and sometimes you need that through difficult times, but that's all removed and you wind up with all these fatherless homes and the pathologies that come from that and that is something they're now extending out

as a courtesy to everybody, isn't it? Right. Yeah, right. Well, this is, I mean, the democratic path to permanent political power is essentially a large welfare state that becomes a slush fund for their client classes. So, you know, we're going to, you blow it the government, and it's just a big slush fund. We're going to pay off all the people that vote for us. And then if their policies are so destructive that Americans won't vote for them, we'll just import people from the around the world. Yes.

So immigration to create new clients. classes and we'll pay them off. That's what was going on in Minnesota with all the Somali fraud. It's like, well, we're going to secure the votes of every Somali for generations by paying them to have, you know, medical companies with no clients and daycares with no kids. But we'll give them millions of dollars of taxpayer money to secure their votes. And then you add the third step is lax voting laws to where, you know, you don't know how many votes do we need? Well, we'll tell you after election day. You know, how many people voted?

We'll know it. We'll know later. And it's those three steps. Big government bloat as a slush fund to pay off client classes and importing illegal immigrants and lax voting laws. That's how you turn every state into California. That's how you turn every state into New York, every state into Illinois. And every red state needs to be doing everything it can to counteract that across the board.

Yeah. They've even wargamed this. I mean, go back and the economist, Cloward and Pivot strategize that. They said, you know, the welfare state, state just isn't expanding quickly enough. If we expand the welfare state, we can bankrupt everything and we can be in charge. And so they said, so let's bring in some more immigrants. They'll go on welfare, and that'll accelerate this collapse.

They're looking to collapse society. Collapse society is really Machiavellian and cynical of what these people are doing, but it is very deliberate, and it is a long-term plan that they've been doing. And what they seek to do is to collapse our society in multiple ways, morally, economically, you name it. And culturally, they're collapsing the society. And we have to stand in the gap. And we have the tools that are mighty, don't we?

We have prayer and we have Christ and God on our side if we are on his side. And that's the key thing. And we should not despair about this, but we ought to be optimistic. And like I said, when I see these guys boasting about their political power and boasting about their new tower of battle that they're creating. It encourages me. Because I know I'm not in this battle alone, and that's really what we need to take away as Christians. Thank you so much for joining us, Pastor Joe Rigney. And again, you can find his books at canonpress.com.

And a couple of them that we've mentioned here are the sin of empathy and leadership and emotional sabotage. And he has study guys that go along with that. So you can do that as a study group. If you've got a group of friends that are getting together. studying things together. That's always a good thing to do. Or you can do it as some study group as part of your church. But I think it's great to have a study guide to go along with these concepts,

because these are key. If we don't have leadership, and if we aren't aware of the Christian antidote to these types of Marxist tactics that are being brought to bear, we're going to be a victim of them. And so thank you so much for your book, and thank you for joining us today. Thanks for having me.

Thank you very much. Thank you. You're listening to the David Knight Show. If you like the Eagles, on the dark desert highway, the cars, and Huey Lewis in the news, love the classic hits channel at APS Radio.

Download our app or listen now at APSRadio.com. Joining us now is Anne Vandersteel. She's a co-author of the CPS Pipeline, state-sanctioned kidnapping. That's exactly what it is. From the book, it says, this is a wake-up call to every American who believes family should be sacred, not state-controlled. Every year, thousands of American families are torn apart by child protective services. Behind the language of safety and welfare lies a dangerous pipeline, a system that profits from the removal of children, often without due process, and destroys families in the process as well.

And, of course, it also destroys the children. and thank you so much for joining us, Ann. And I'll mention you are a co-author of this book. You're also a co-founder of the American Made Foundation. Tell us just a little bit about that before we get into the CPS aspect of this. I'm sure that's broader than just CPS. It is. American Made Foundation was basically formulated between myself,

Maureen Steele and Christopher Burns, who is an attorney that works with our foundation. And we look at our government and what, what is really wrong with it in terms of the fact we aren't running a constitutional Republican, and we have been basically overrun by corporate tocracy and agency government, which has nothing to do with what the founding fathers had in design or had in mind, or frankly what God would have been for design. So we decided to pick a lane because our future is dependent on healthy children, and you can't make America great if you don't have families that are great.

And so Child Protective Services, like all of these agencies, have nice sounding names, but deliver the exact opposite of what the name would have you believe. it's going to do. And so we pick that lane because we see the children as our future. And America can have a very bright future if their children aren't under siege. And I ask you, you know, if I told you we have 500,000 hostages being held in America, excuse me, in a foreign country right now, would you not expect our military to go there? And the answer, of course, is always going to be, yes, go rescue Americans. But we have 500,000 children trapped as hostages inside this pipeline, this child protective services pipeline of trafficking children. And we're doing nothing about it except,

you know, being gagged by courts. And we need to wake up to the reality that this agency known as Child Protective Services and all of its 50 other like agencies by different names and across our country are just as complicit. And it's the taxpayer that's funding it. So I'm welcome this conversation. Thank you very much. Well, thank you for writing this book. And again, it is something that everybody needs to be aware of. We have a tremendous misconception about this, just in the same way that the government is constantly telling us that they need to do one thing or the other to protect the kids,

and it's usually not at all about the kids, and usually it's not going to protect the kids. We just had the Child Online Safety Act, which is really not about protecting kids. It really is about getting a digital ID for everybody and an ID to use the Internet. And so there's always this hidden agenda that is there. And this is something that should be even more concerning to everybody,

as we start to move forward. I'm very concerned about the data centers that are so-called data centers. I call them surveillance centers. And they're going to be able to audit everybody. And we've already seen in many cases, CPS unleashed against people because somebody doesn't like the fact that they're homeschooling or somebody doesn't like the fact they didn't get all their vaccines on the schedule demanded by the medical industrial complex. Or there's a conflict about gender gaslighting that happens in our government schools.

it takes a village to raise a child, doesn't it? Or maybe it takes a village to steal a child, doesn't it? Well, starting with Hillary Clinton and the Adoption of Safe Families Act in 1997, right? That really kind of kicked this off and turned children into chattel they can monetize. Because from that, we really have seen that America has built a child welfare industrial complex where children can be removed from their homes, all under the color of law. You've got families being totally shattered when they don't bring meaningful due process. It's all based on hearsay, and these courts are all closed.

Files are sealed, and billions and billions of dollars can flow through a system that basically rewards the separation of the family instead of the preservation. This is what we title state-sanctioned kidnapping. It's just disgusting. And we need to know how the system works, who profits from it, and how parents and children are destroyed by it. Because if you don't comprehend that, how can you fix it? And that's one of the reasons we wrote legislation to, fix it. And we believe that Florida will be the first state to pass this kind of revolutionary overhaul in their legislation, which will reduce the intake into the system by 95% so that we can

reduce the money coming into Florida to continue to fund that pipeline by 95%. When you don't have a need, you don't need the funds. One thing you probably know about DC is once they've appropriated money for something, you're going to have to spend it. So we're going to spend it somewhere else and make it more meaningful, but what they're doing to the families with CPS is just diabolical. Yeah, and of course, the way they get around the 10th Amendment is by getting states addicted to the federal fiat currency and then bribing and blackmailing them to do whatever they wish. And, of course, you didn't, you know, you're doing that voluntarily. You want the monies.

So, you know, you're going to do whatever we tell you. We're not violating the 10th Amendment type of thing. So let's talk about a little bit about the structure of your book. You talk about the machinery, the players, the incentives, the, the, the, warning signs. Let's start with the machinery. What does that look like? Oh, well, the machinery is diabolical. You know, it starts with a knock on the door because somebody reported you, you know, one of the instances that I can talk about real life is the Ramirez family who had their child taken at nine months old because they'd refused a vitamin K shot. Imagine that.

You go in for a well visit and you decide not to take the vitamin K shot and the doctor who's a mandated reporter says, well, you know, it's not a law. There's no, you know, it's, it's sort of a, you know, hey, we think this is a good idea, but you don't, body autonomy, you know, protect the body. The parents said no. So he reports this to CPS and it results in knocks on the door with CPS and a clipboard, you know, wanting to come in. You know, as I advise families all the time, never let them in your home. Call law enforcement to be a witness and make an appointment to go and see them in their office. Don't let them in your home because it's sort of like giving them that opportunity. You're opting in to their, quote, jurisdiction. When you say, sure, I'm going to allow this agency

in my home. And now you've invited them to go around, use their eyes, and they can sort of determine whatever else they think may or may not be safe for the children and start writing things down. Yeah, and going to fishing expedition. It's a fishing expedition of the highest order. And this is where the government can take total control of your child. They can charge you to comply with conditions to get the child back. And that becomes destabilization in your own home. And in the process, they're going to use that same instability against you. So how do you call that pro-protection? To me, that's state-sanctioned family destruction. As a matter of fact, I've interviewed in the past Dwight Mitchell, who was a victim of that. And that's one of his key things. You know,

everybody thinks about CPS as being there to save kids who are being physically or sexually abused or something like that. That's a very small percentage of the cases. that they take kids away from home for. And so your first instinct, as he said, is they knock on the door and it's like, well, I'm not one of those people. I'm not doing anything to my kids. Come on in. Yeah, I'll show you.

I'm absolutely innocent. And never take that approach. That is the number one thing people need to understand. And if they read a book like yours to understand what the bigger picture is, they won't make that mistake. They won't think that CPS is strictly about going after the violent sexual predators that are out there. It's not about that at all, is it?

No, it's really not about that at all. It's literally about how the state is allowed to, through the color of law, based on hearsay, take your child and turn that into a profit center. And they completely overlook the fact that there's massive human cost, not only to the parents, first of all, right? The parents, imagine, when people imagine that CPS is removing a child, they usually picture that somebody's been something very egregious to their child, and that's why the child is being carried away. But frankly, that's not the real story. It's what happens after the child is removed. Parents, they face a massive avalanche of costs, whether it's dependency attorneys, criminal defense attorneys, appellate attorneys, they have to bring in witnesses, the court costs, the psychological lectures, all the stuff they have to go through in addition to all these classes that they're now being required to take by child protective services, whether they have to go through drug testing or anger management or some kind of domestic violence, All these things are time. And if parents, even though these services are considered free, honestly, they're really

not free because somebody has to drive there. Somebody has to miss work. Somebody has to pay for the gas. Somebody has to find child care for the other children. Somebody's got to keep the rent paid while attending all these court dates. And then you've got to rebuild the home that the state is totally destroyed. So the financial burden becomes part of the punishments. And parents can face all kinds of court costs, et cetera, that go into all this.

So that system is what breaks the family financially. and then accuses the family of being broken. So CPS removal isn't not one cost. It's a complete financial siege. And then you've got to layer in what happens to the child. And that is just diabolical what ends up happening there. Yeah, it's horrible. And it's because we don't have due process.

And we have this fiction that if the government bureaucracy, whether it's the IRS or whether it's CPS or whether maybe it is the DEA doing civil asset forfeiture, if they can seize your child just like they can seize your car, And they don't have to find you guilty of something. They can do, they can not even charge you to take your car. And so it's almost that bad. Maybe it is that bad or worse with CPS because we're not talking about property. We're talking about children that are there.

And it truly is amazing because what is the, what is the incentive for these organizations? There's a tremendous amount of money there. But where are they getting the money and what are they using it for? Sure. So the money is coming directly from the federal government in large part, $81 billion with a B, a year is what is pumped into the system out of health and human services under the Social Security Administration, Title IVE and Title IVD funding. Of course, it has state matching funds. And sad to say, but minority children, blacks and American Indians bring more money, as well as children that have

disabilities, if they have some sort of medical event that requires medication. Foster parents get paid a lot more money. And the system calls it placement. But to the child, it really feels like an abduction. So, I mean, even when foster parents, right, are kind, just the removal itself is traumatic, right? In the worst cases, children are placed in the homes or facilities where they experience, a lot of times, they experience abuse, neglect, over medication, trafficking risks, instability, psychological harm. And this is on the heels of these foster parents that are being paid a lot of money in

addition to the different sort of therapists or what have you that the child is seeing. And this is where the system is completely broken. Because had that child come out of a house and the child was normal, had no medical conditions, or even if it did. But the reason for the removal was because mom and dad sent little Johnny out into the field to go play in 50-degree weather. And Johnny said, I don't want to wear a coat. And the parents didn't force him to. And the neighbor calls in and makes the report. You know, Johnny was happier at home arguing about whether or not he had to wear a coat or not.

And now you've got somebody who's made an anonymous report about John. not having a coat on in 50 degree weather, and the child is removed. So, well, even if the child is just out freely playing, you know, but as a matter of fact, there's an organization, free-range children out there because if you did the kinds of stuff that I did when I was growing up, I would have these, I would have hours to myself and I can go do whatever I need. I just need to be back when I heard the bell ringing or the, a certain particular time. And I could ride my bike for miles. I could play outside with other kids in the woods and all that kind of stuff. Nobody calls CPS.

but they would today. It's very rare that you see kids out in the yard doing anything. And I guess it's because people are worried that they're going to get kidnapped from CPS, but you're not going to see your kid on a milk jug that's missing because everybody's going to know that the government took them. So they don't follow that anymore. And the part that's so disturbing to me in all of this is the fact that we have a courtroom where Americans, I think they're probably less and less today expecting justice, but we did expect justice at one time, right? And I think that's been exposed. But this dependency court system, it often doesn't even look like what you might imagine. You know, these hearings are rushed, right?

When you have a, quote, anonymous tip or a mandated reporter or whatever, these hearings get rushed. Parents, when they get the message, you're being hauled into CPS court. That's PTSD, right? That is serious PTSD. Parents may not fully understand the allegations that have been leveled against them. And the evidence rules can even be looser. So hearsay can shape decisions, not facts. Not a law officer involved in anything.

There's no affidavits. It's just hearsay. So you get these emergency removals that can happen before a full adversarial hearing. Parents, a lot of times are denied due process. They can't bring exculpatory evidence into play here. And so, and they may, you know, if they can't afford an attorney, they may only meet their quarter point of the attorney minutes before they go before the court. So judges may actually have to defer to the agency workers.

Now, there we get back to somebody that you and I didn't even. choose. So these case plans can be imposed before facts are even fully tested. And parents are often told to just comply first and fight it later. Now imagine that. You've just had your child removed because somebody made a call that said Johnny was out playing in the field without a coat and it's 50 degrees. And this is what you're being accused. This is neglect. I mean, let's let's be honest. I think, you know, you and I'd rather be freezing than be removed and put into a position where we potentially could be in a foster home that may be nice, but it's not my parents. so I don't want to be with them, number one, but it could be worse than nice, and we could be

getting trafficked or abused or whatever. And those stories come up all too often. It's sad, but they do. So, you know. You mentioned there might be an anonymous accusation. Is that a, it's not, are you, or you don't have any due process to confront your accuser? Is that correct? That's correct. That's correct. Oh, no, no, no. You don't get any, you don't get that opportunity. A secret court without being able to confront your accuser. That sounds like a star chamber. That's why we have a lot of the parts of the Bill of Rights is against that very tactic. It's an age-old tactic, isn't it?

That's correct. And these family courts literally are star chambers. You do not have a jury of your peers. You're constitutionally protected, you know, amendments are completely denied. Your right to a jury trial to be heard is totally shut down. Your ability to talk about any of this, you're gagged. Children, all the documents. are sealed, this is such an affront to our constitutionally protected rights, God-given rights,

in fact. This is what's so disturbing on so many levels that, you know, when children can be removed because the money pipeline is so great, this is where I think the audience needs to completely understand this aspect of it, because child welfare isn't a moral system. It's an economic system, and they don't want you to know what is going on in the courtroom, because if you did know, And if this was public, then the public would completely comprehend how this totally is an economic system. When you have federal funding stream, state agencies, county systems, contracted providers, foster care agencies, grew homes, therapists on and on and on. And you've got to layer in all the other things like drug testing that they're going to claim we need to do. Your child's upset so we're going to medicate them.

Maybe we're going to over-medicate him because it's just easier to deal with Johnny and a little stupor. But all these vendors, these parasitic organizations that when children, enter the system, that money starts moving. And if you actually can do something to preserve families, then guess what happens? Fewer money is moving. Fewer vendors get paid. And that's the central conflict in the system. And the system may save reunification is the goal, but the financial architecture often rewards removal, services, placement, and prolonged involvement. So we can see clearly what the goal is. And Title IV funding and these other federal funding mechanisms are all part of that big discussion. And of course, we're not going to have enough money to cover social

security, but they're doing things like this, $81 billion for CPS and their secret star chamber process that's there. You know, it's interesting, and we keep seeing the same things over and over again, the bureaucracies that act on their own, that seize your property without any due process and you don't have any presumption of innocence over and over again. That is a cancer that is run through our government at many different levels, at many different issues that we see there. But it's also a global aspect of this that I've seen as well.

years ago there was an organization. I don't know if they're still out there or not. It was parental rights.org. And they were trying to get a constitutional amendment in that would recognize parental rights. Because that's at the heart of this issue in most cases, ignoring coming after the family. And of course, the UN has been there for a very long time, the UN Convention on the Rights of the Child.

Well, if the child has got rights, they can put that in opposition to parental rights. And they can use that as a wedge to break up. the family. And that's really what they're doing with these child protective courts and child protective services and so forth. They're breaking up the family. That's the bigger picture that is there, I think, with the UN as well as the structure that has happened in terms of changing our constitutional republic and democratic republic into a bureaucracy. But address that a little bit. Well, I mean, you just brought the UN into it. Needn be saying more?

I mean, that is the most diabolical organization on the planet. And, you know, we were going to point the direction of which our country is going when you layer agency government on top of it. We're basically, along with the surveillance state, the real ID. Now we've got the crypto, you know, genius and clarity acts. I mean, they literally want to control every aspect of our lives. People that own Bitcoin are saying, hooray, I'm going, you have lost your mind. Did you know Jeffrey Epstein was involved in funding the beginning of Bitcoin? Why would you want anything to do with any of this?

You know, you think your Bitcoin is safe. But guess what? We just took $350 billion out of Iran's Bitcoin wallet. And we took it through the FinCEN system here. Treasury does it? Nope, that's mine. So this insanity of trying to believe that, you know, we see what the problem is, but we're going to get a different outcome.

That is the definition of insanity. We are not a constitutional republic. We don't operate like one. We're supposed to be. But we simply don't act like that. And it's because we have U.S. codes and agencies that have taken over. And so I know that's a whole separate show we could dive into and I'd be happy to do it because I'm well versed in that.

And I'll say it right here. I don't file federal income taxes and I haven't since 2019 because I know I don't have to anymore. And most, a lot of Americans have woken up and they've stopped filing too. You don't live in D.C. You don't work in D.C. You're not a taxpayer. And so I'm not. And I refuse to fund a system that is continuing to do this to children. And, you know, again, these children are our future. And the children today are being poisoned. They're being tracked and traced. The good news is, as I think these Gen Zers recognize it. And they are leaving the cell phones at home and they're fine. I'm seeing more children outside playing off the screens because they want to be left alone.

And I think this messaging is coming forward, but the United Nations has a big part of the reason we're seeing this corporatocracy because we're cowtowing to the very entity that is funding out of the central banks in London that is funding all of this. And this is all a giant design to circle the drain. And we're seeing it happen in real time under this administration. And the fact that our children are still being held hostage in a system that we were supposed to obliterate the Department of Education and from day one and we're just refunded it. It's 2026, two years in, I'm sorry, I have a real issue with it. And so it's time to stand on the 10th. It's time to take our country back state by state. And it's time to liberate our children state by state.

And Florida is going to take a big position in that because we've written that legislation to do exactly that. And the United Nations can pound sand if we elect. Yeah, absolutely. And so, you know, when we look at the UN Convention on the Rights of the Child, this is something that, that's a convention that has been entered into. into that, into that, into that,

Paul Pousand. This is, hang on one second. We lost you. You froze up and then you came back in, Ann. So,

so of you. Okay. All right. We're having, now we're having internet problems, I guess. Let's go back to,

about what point did we lose that, Lance? Where did it freeze up because she came back in a second time? Okay. Let's back up to,

let's see, where it'd be a good point to pick this up with, we first had some freezing that was happening there. Let's go back to, we're talking about the UN Convention on the Rights of the Child. I'll tell you what, I'll make a comment and then you can respond to it.

How about that? Right. So this UN Convention on the Rights of the Child, this is something that they got every nation on earth, except for the United States, is signed onto this. But through the United States, they're running this through CPS,

and they're running it through the courts. And so they're doing it in kind of a backdoor way. And if you come after the families, If you come after the parents, that is the basic building block of society. And if you can destroy the family, then you can destroy that society. And that really is what the globalist agenda is, I believe. 100%. And anytime you enter the UN into an equation, I have to swallow carefully because I want to gag.

That organization has done nothing to further a global peace. They've done everything to facilitate weaponized human trafficking. I saw it up close and personal with my work on the border with Michael Yan. You know, the international organization on migration, the IOM. The United States is the largest funder to the United Nations anywhere by a factor of 17 to one. Germany is the next closest. So we outspend Germany 17 to one on funding the United Nations. Why can't we stop that?

We've got all these people who are saying, I'm not for the UN, I'm not for globalism. And yet they continue to fund it. Just like they continue to fund the Department of Education. It was Reagan was going to strangle that monster in the crib. it was newly created by Jimmy Carter, and he said, well, I'm going to stop this. And instead, they grew it to maturity. They grew it through maturity. And Linda McMahon is still employed, even though day one, I was told by President Trump

and he told the world that she'd be out of a job if she did her job well. Well, she just got another pay raise and more refunding. So, you know, I'm a 10th Amendment person. I stand as a people. I stand firmly in the Constitution on the 10th Amendment. And I'm going to make an example of my state here in this. interview because Florida is in the catbird seat, right? We've written some incredible legislation. We just have a hurdle. It's called the governor's race this fall. And the only man that would

actually stand with what I'm talking about is Paul Renner. And the reason Florida is such an important state to examine because it does have a large child welfare system. The regional department of children and families administration, DCF, contracted community-based care agencies involved, the private providers, the dependency courts foster and on and on and on, all in the in this child trafficking in the destruction of parental rights. But our message for Florida is simple. If we reduce unnecessary removals, we reduce trauma and save money. Now, how are we going to do that? Well, we're going to define clearly what is an exigent circumstance. So if you can define that, then you can reduce the number of children that really lawfully, lawfully, not just legally,

lawfully can be removed. And every child who does not need to enter foster care represents less court time, less foster placement, less case management, less vendor dependency, shall we say, and then of course the less trauma treatment later. And then we reduce the trafficking risk, because again, as I said it earlier, child predators love foster care. So now you're fostering more family stability and definitely more constitutional integrity. I don't think this is the partisan issue. This should be readily accepted by people because CPS doesn't care if. you're wealthy or poor, although the poorer you are, the more minority you are, the more money you represent because you won't fight.

You're more vulnerable, yeah. We've seen this with civil asset forfeiture and the drug war. They'll go to Chicago, for example, and they'll have a massive forfeiture program where they're stealing people's cars. And guess what? The average price of the car taken is about $1,000, not a real expensive car. But to start the process, you've got to put up $900 in order to try to prove that your property is innocent of any connection to any drug activity. So yeah, they really do focus on

the people who can't defend themselves. What are the warning signs? You mentioned in your book, you have a bonus chapter. We get parents the tools they need to recognize the warning signs. Are the warning signs for you as a parent that are personal that you need to be aware of? Certainly, if you have teachers that are asking personal questions, if you have doctors that are doing more beyond just what a regular well-child visit should be, If you have neighbors that you have conflict with that are constantly criticizing you on how you are interacting with your own children, pay attention to these things because unfortunately, child protective services has given people sort of a license to feel empowered to intervene in your life. And in fact, they weaponize the state in order to do that. And again, removal of a child always has to be the last resort.

It shouldn't be the first reflex. The state should not be able to just take your child unless there's clear evidence of immediate damage. danger. As I've said, poverty, medical, vaccine refusal, homeschooling, religious, whatever it is, that should not be enough to justify a seizure of a child. You've got to have, as a parent, real due process before the family is destroyed. And if you find yourself with somebody knocking on your door asking you questions, don't let them in your house. Never let them in your house. Get a witness and go to wherever that place of business is for the individual, you know, leveling questions. You cannot be a parent, walk into a courtroom unprepared or underrepresented,

is particularly when you have what's called PTSD. And there's Americans of Disability Act covers PTSD. So you can get an ADA representative to join you as your sort of eyes and ears and sounding board. When you're sitting in court, a wonderful woman by the name of Melinda Sherwin out in Arizona has done thousands of these cases. She's been a court watcher for 30 years and an ADA for 30 years. And those two aspects alone is what gives you power to push back against an already rigged system that is looking at you as the guilty. our legislation that we've drafted calls for much stronger procedural protections, early access to counsel, better notice of allegations,

and of course a much higher evidentiary standard before the state can interfere with the parent-child bond because we've got to stop them from interfering and we've got to deal with the medical kidnapping issue, which is a big precursor when you walk into a pediatrician's office for whether or not if you're an anti-vaccine parent, you better know that your pediatrician agrees with you because if you don't, you could be in conflict right there because that pediatrician most likely is a mandated reporter.

And they will report that you didn't give Johnny the whatever vaccine. That's right. If they don't get a certain percentage of their kids vaccinated, then they get financial recriminations taken by the insurance companies that can put them out of practice. So pick your doctor very carefully. Pick your school very carefully. As a matter of fact, do it yourself. I'm a big homeschooling. Yeah, exactly.

And so when you look at this, Also remember that child protective services is no more about protecting children than Planned Parenthood is about promoting parenthood. That's right. We're actually diametrically opposed to these agendas. And you're absolutely right. Know the warning signs. Know when there is somebody who is getting nosy or picking questions.

We had a pediatrician when my sons were young and he got really upset because we were on well water. That was one of his things. So he gave us a prescription for. fluoride tablets and we took it and said okay thanks yeah we'll do that and we never went back of course we didn't fulfill the we didn't fill the prescription either but you know it can be something like that and so you know there are people like that that are out there and it was the first time I'd come across somebody like that but there's a lot of them out there and that is really a trap they can be weaponized against you but again coming back to the fundamental issue we have gotten so far

away from the due process issues and the rule of law issues and the bill of rights. That is what's really scary because that is the core, I think, of what is happening here. You're talking about this secretive trial there with CPS, but we see it manifested in so many different ways and so many different places. That is something that people have to pay attention to. You know, we don't have jury trials anymore. We have, they figured out a way to bully and to manipulate people and doing plea bargaining. And so we don't have jury trials anymore. And I understand why people look at that because they have also manipulated the process of picking the jurors. So you don't go out there and just like they pick the voters for the elections. They pick the jurors for the

trials. They have figured this out. They've had 250 years to figure out workarounds against the plain language of the Bill of Rights and the Constitution, haven't they? They certainly have. And the part I find so egregious is that instead of looking at this problem, let's go back 250 years ago when somebody had a problem as a farmer or a blacksmith, the town came in to help. If the blacksmith fell ill, somebody else came in and shoot the horses or whatever it was, the ferrier. We've lost our way. We now believe the state must come in and solve our problems. We have been programmed to believe that, in fact, is the case. And, you know, we can go back in time and talk about all the different amendments. I wrote a piece the other day about the 14th. I think that was a horrific amendment. I

think everything after the tent should be scrapped. But that's just my personal opinion. I can back it up in another conversation. But the point is we have no longer expect our neighbors to help each other. We expect the state to come in. And so this is what is a big problem in CPS because kinship care should always come before strangers, right? When a child truly cannot remain safely with a parent, for whatever reason, the first priority should be grandparents, relatives, close family friends, or trusted community members. And, you know, this is why our legislation requires the state to identify and support kinship placements before placing children with strangers or institutions.

For instance, the little boy whose mother was killed by ICE a few months ago in Minnesota. His dad died two years previously and she became acquainted with and became into a relationship with another woman, and they call each other their wives, well, that woman was killed by ice and an ice altercation, I should say. And the other woman who is not a parent to the child, no blood relation at all, is trying to stake a claim. Well, we are representing the grandfather who has a relationship with the child and a child loves the grandfather. We're representing the grandfather in court to gain custody of this little boy, who, by the way, the now remaining wife is trying to trans this little boy.

So, you know, leave it to Minnesota for it to be completely sideways because that's where we're in court. But this is what we're up again. So why on earth would the state of Minnesota decide that they should give this little boy to the other woman who's only been in his life for two years, the grandfather for eight, and this woman is trying to trans this child? By what right, by what authority they have to do that? Why wouldn't kinship come first? So when the fundamentalness of family first has to be spelled out to the letter of the law, well, I guess we're going to do that and we did.

And this is, you know, this is very problematic in this entire system. This is, again, goes right to the degradation of the family. So. Well, and we better get this fixed pretty quickly because there, there are pigeonholing people based on your political beliefs, your religious beliefs and things like, you know, transing kids or whatever. And they're going to know that about every single one of us.

And if we don't get a system of a rule of law, and due process, open courts and having a trial by your peers and that type of thing. Our goose is really cooked with all this stuff because these people have got an agenda. And they're going to be coming after us with religious persecution, political persecution, you name it. Everything is open. And I don't want to see that happening on either side. We ought to have an open and clear system of rule of law and courts.

And this is anything but that. And that's one of the key things, key takeaways that people should get from your book, I think, is just to look at what a mess this is. And it's not the only area of our society where this is happening, but it is particularly horrific because it's happening around children. That's right. Well, it's happening to children. It's happening to our elderly, our most vulnerable, the elderly and the young.

The guardianship business is just as sick and as insidious as a CPS business, to be honest. We deal with cases every day where you have estates that are being completely, completely liquidated by the courts and their parasitic organizations involved in the declaration of a senior being non-composementous or unable to take care of themselves. And their estates are rated. Everything is turned over to the state. It's just, and the children, the heirs of the estate are left with nothing. Imagine working your whole lives.

You have a beautiful family. And then also the court decides that you're not able to take care of your affairs. And so they liquidate your estate and your children get nothing. that's what's going on. So it's the same family court system. We're talking about the same judges, the same court-appointed attorneys. It's the same law enforcement in a lot of cases that are involved in all this. We've got sheriffs that are taking homes before they even get auctioned off.

They're getting first rights to buy and flip these homes or turn them into retro properties because the law enforcement is involved in taking the elderly and putting them into a group home. I mean, this is just, this is insanity. We're destroying our country over money. for money, you know, and false accusations. It's a love of money is the root of all evil. And, of course, that is what's motivating this. There's massive corruption within our government.

And it's because we don't stand by the rule of law once you just give these people power. And there's no accountability for anything. That's the key takeaway from all this stuff. And again, the book is the CPS pipeline, state sanctioned kidnapping. Very important, very important. And tell us a little bit about your American-made. Foundation? Sure, the American Made Foundation is 501C3. We established ourselves to address the, you know, corruption inside our agencies, and we chose Child Protective Services because we know

children of the future. If we don't get this right, we're just condemning our children to a life of slavery and of trafficking. And ourselves as well, yeah. Exactly. Well, I mean, they're treating children like chattel. We can take this back to the birth certificate. I mean, we have, we have submitted ourselves to opt into their system. And their system is run by agencies and corporate codes and bylaws. It's nothing to do with natural law that God intended for all of us to be free. And our founders recognized that and codified the word of God into our Constitution and our Declaration and previous to that, the Articles of Confederation.

And, you know, this is what is so critically important that people comprehend that we are having our freedom systematically stolen from us. And even in this administration right now, we're watching it happen. day by day and we're being told it's great and trust the plan and all this. I'm sorry, I can see it unfolding and many people are waking up to it unfolding right now and they're pushing back. And so if we don't push back to protect our children and we're fighting other battles because we're more concerned with our money, then we're no better than the people who are

trying to enslave us. We have to protect our children. That is the future. I absolutely agree, yes. And again, we're talking about the Christian principles this country was founded on. That's the Christian worldview that men are not to be trusted. And the founders even said that. Let's hear no more about trusting man. Let's bind them down with the chains of the Constitution. But we just look at this and we start cheering for a particular party or an organization or a politician.

And we don't care to look at what they do. And we have lost the idea that man is not inherently good, that we all have issues. And there's this temptation that is there this massive pot of money now that we have the Federal Reserve that can just conjure money out of a thin air for as long as that lasts. That's going to be a real awakening when that goes away. But as long as it can just conjure money out of thin air, it can get whatever it wants by bribing people. And that mass of a money that is there has really corrupted this country. It really goes back to the Federal Reserve, I believe, in the fiat currency that's there. But that's another story. That's another story. Once that thing goes, it's really going to be, that Ponzi scheme goes, it's going to be really difficult for us economically. But it's, it'll be a very freeing thing to have real money again somehow or the other. So we'll say, you've also got a substack.

Tell us about that, Ann, where people find that. Our substack is populated mostly with Maureen Steele's writings. She's a very, very accomplished writer. She's published regularly in American Thinker, Blaze, and a whole host of other journals that love what she puts out. She represents the work that we do. If I had her gift of writing, you would never see me on television. But I have more of the gift of writing.

Gab and she has the gift of the pen. And so together we are pretty formidable team because, you know, to bring it home, as I've said, children are our future. They are not commodities. That's right. And our families aren't for case files. We're not that, right? Parents are not guilty because the state says so. And that applies to just about everything that you can talk about when it comes to the government. And, you know, the government at the end of the day was never meant to be allowed to hide behind the phrase of best interest of the child or whatever while they're destroying the very families or businesses or whatever it is that needs to be out there in order for the betterment of society. And they are doing a great job of destroying families. And sadly, when you

have families that are destroyed, society breaks down. And when society breaks down, chaos erupts. And then what do people cry out for? Help us big government. Come bring order to the chaos. That's right. And this is the perpetual battle that we're in. It's a cycle. It's just, you know, we're constantly feeding the beast with, it's a cycle. And your book does a very good job of explaining the Kafka-esque aspect of this because that's really what we're looking at, you know, something like Kafka's The Trial. That is the world in which we live, and we've got to change that. And the longer we wait, the more difficult

it's going to be to do that. Thank you so much for joining us. And Van der Steele. And again, the book is, I had the title here in just a second. CPS, Pipe. pipeline, the state sanctioned kidnapping, CPS pipeline. You can find that at Amazon, everywhere books are sold. Thank you so much, Anne. I appreciate it. Thank you so much. Thank you for what you do. The common man. They created common core to dumb down our children. They created common past to track and control us. Their commons project to make sure the commoners own nothing and the communist future. They see the common man as simple.

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