The David Knight Show - INTERVIEW: Border Sheriff — Is Border the "Wild West" or a Police State?

Episode Date: January 18, 2023

The border issue is THE issue that divides left from right according to many. But have conservatives thought through the consequences of some proposed interventions? Sheriff David Hathaway on what it's really like from his perspective not only as sheriff, but from a ranching family with roots going back to before AZ became a state. Also, the CIA's involvement in drugs and why, since he opposes big government, he's a sheriff.Find out more about the show and where you can watch it at TheDavidKnightShow.com If you would like to support the show and our family please consider subscribing monthly here:SubscribeStar https://www.subscribestar.com/the-david-knight-showOr you can send a donation through Mail: David Knight POB 994 Kodak, TN 37764Zelle: @[e-mail] App at: $davidknightshowBTC to: bc1qkuec29hkuye4xse9unh7nptvu3y9qmv24vanh7Money is only what YOU hold: Go to DavidKnight.gold for great deals on physical gold/silverBecome a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/the-david-knight-show--2653468/support.

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Search Bank of Ireland current account to find out more. Terms and conditions apply. Send via 365 online and phone. Government stamp duty applies to debit cards and checks. Bank of Ireland is regulated by the Central Bank of Ireland. All right. Joining us now is Sheriff David Hathaway. He is a sheriff in Santa Cruz County in Arizona, right on the border. And there's been a lot happening right there in his area.

We wanted to get an update from him in terms of what he sees the problems are there, solutions to what is happening. But there's a lot of things that we want to talk to Sheriff Hathaway about. The Homeland Security obsession with tracking people, as well as the sheriffs in Illinois who are standing on their authority to not enforce the gun control orders of the Democrat governor and the legislature as they just passed a massive gun control bill. So joining us now is Sheriff David Hathaway. Thank you for joining us, Sheriff. Thank you, David. Good to talk to you again.

It's always good talking to you. Now, you've been right at ground zero there. We've had the outgoing Governor Ducey, who started putting shipping containers there on the wall as they're concerned about the masses of people that are on the border as title 42, they're talking about that, uh, uh, being taken away this whole immigration situation on both sides. It is something of a mess. Tell us your perspective on this. Yeah. If I can step away from my position as a law enforcement officer for a little bit

and just talk as a private individual, what should be the correct position on, um, immigration and on borders and i actually wrote a book on this a few years ago it's called immigration individual versus uh national borders because i saw looking at the libertarian community and i consider myself uh once again not speaking as the position i'm in right now as a uh a radical uh libertarian voluntarist anarcho-capitalist whatever you want to call it i think the market can solve everything capitalism can solve anything any any problem um there are voluntary solutions to any problem so you know i kind of saw a conflict in the libertarian community where some people wanted freedom and free market solutions in every area except borders, except immigration, except borders. And I delved into that, read a lot that's been written by Murray Rothbard and Hans Hermann Hoppe on that subject of borders, nations. There's an essay called Nations by Consent.

You know, Murray Rothbard, Hans Hermann Hoppe have both written a lot on this topic. And so kind of within the Austro-libertarian community, sort of the libertarians that are part of the Austrian economics camp, some of them, not all of them, there's people that disagree with them like Bob Higgs, he's an Austrian economist, Bob Murphy, people like that. But some of them would want the state to get out of everything in our life except for border enforcement. And so I thought, well, this is kind of an odd thing because I think free markets can handle anything. And just anecdotally, I do own ranch property right near the border in two counties in Arizona, in Santa Cruz County and in Cochise County. The ranch property right near the border in two counties in arizona in santa cruz county and

in cochise county the ranch property has been in my family since the 1800s since before arizona became a state in 1912 and if i can just give you a little analogy like um you know all the correct position on borders as in anything else comes stems from private property and you can get your understanding of private property either as a christian from understanding that you know god uh gave mankind dominion over the world over their animals over the environment or you can get to that same conclusion through natural rights you can study natural rights self-ownership and say you own yourself you have the right to control all property that's within your domain, within your realm of control, as long as you acquired that property voluntarily. So if I look at my ranch property that's near the

Mexican border, as with any other property owner, I consider myself to have the absolute right to invite anybody I want onto my property or to exclude anybody I want from coming onto my property or to exclude anybody i want from coming onto my property so i should be able to rent a house to a mexican for example if it's a voluntary arrangement i should be able to hire an employee to work on my ranch that's a mexican if i want to it's a vault nobody's coercing anybody to do anything it's a voluntary arrangement i should be able to sell something to a mexican or american or anybody else now the way I look at it, as a, like I say, radical libertarian, voluntarist, that there should not be the ability for a third party to come in and put a perimeter around my property, another border, and say, you cannot invite whoever you want onto your property, or you cannot exclude

whoever you want. And that third party, we could call him Darth property, or you cannot exclude whoever you want. And that third party, we could call him Darth Vader, or we could call him the United States of America. Some third party has no ability to tell me I can't trade with somebody else, or I can't have voluntary interactions with someone else, as long as the test is whether the interaction is voluntary. Now, let's go up to where we are now. I know a lot of conservatives will disagree with this position, but there are tax-funded structures within the state. Border Patrol is one of those tax-funded structures in the state.

You have guys with guns that are blocking voluntary transactions from happening. I think that that's an interference with the free market. And this book of mine, it just represents my journey exploring this issue. Like maybe I'm missing something. So it has multiple chapters that talk about all the different things like the welfare state, what's become to be known as cultural destruction or demographic change, cultural shifts, all the different arguments they use. But one of the main arguments is the welfare argument. And I always say you should just get rid of welfare if there's a welfare magnet. I can do a little example from the era of alcohol prohibition. If you have a government program that causes a problem, you shouldn't create another government program to solve that problem.

You should get rid of the initial government intervention. So in the era of alcohol prohibition, which happened from 1920 to 1933, we had the first gun violence in the U.S., the first drive-by shootings, the first gang violence. So what was the solution? They drafted the first firearms laws. The National Firearms Act of 1934 was actually drafted in 1933, the last year of prohibition. It was passed into a law, took effect in 1934. That was a direct result of alcohol prohibition. So now we have more gun laws. Why? Because of alcohol prohibition. Or if I can flash back to my years as I was a supervisor and I transferred eight times in my career, my last five offices,

I was the office head of the drug enforcement administration, including in this county where I live right now. And one thing we noticed, I noticed this when I worked 10 years in Illinois for the DEA, that the drugs came in to coincide with when the welfare checks came in. The welfare checks came in first day of the month. So all the drugs came in at that period of time. So you know what you could do is you could say, well, this welfare state has created a problem so let's solve the problem by creating something like the dea or like a drug task force to solve to attack the secondary problem so you create another uh problem to attack the first i mean another government intervention to

attack the problems created by the first government intervention so So that's what I look at, at border enforcement, 30,000 foot view, philosophical view, speaking as a libertarian, that if there's a problem, the problem most people would have is the existence of the welfare state. And I think people should actively oppose the welfare state and go back to what we used to have. Churches would provide the needs of any, and they would verify if people really had voluntary needs. And if you got rid of of that then that would be the test to see if people are coming here from nefarious reasons and the people that come here are mainly coming here to work like a native-born american is three times as likely to go on welfare as an immigrant is immigrants are almost entirely coming here to work sometimes people conflate the fentanyl importation with the migrants that are coming here to work sometimes people conflate the fentanyl uh importation with the migrants that are coming here to work but it's two separate issues the migrants aren't coming loaded down

with fentanyl but i've talked too many words in a row there david so i'm going to turn it back to you but that's just kind of an introduction before getting into kind of my position as a law enforcement officer just philosophically i think all rights stem from private property. And if you can uphold private property, free markets, and you honor the price signals of the free market, and instead of allowing for government intervention, you allow the market to serve everybody and to solve every problem. Well, I absolutely agree. You know, I told you the one question that I flunked on the Nolan chart. They give you 10 questions about civil liberties and 10 questions about economic liberty. And the one that I disagreed with them on was the border issue.

And as I told you, it was the welfare thing. I felt like, as you pointed out, it's a magnet that draws people through. It'll pull them through the wall, any wall. It'll pull them over the wall. It'll pull them under the wall. If you've got something there that you're offering free benefits that's that's what you're going to get so I think that's the fundamental issue and the economy the difference between conservative

viewpoint on this and say a libertarian viewpoint I'm sure you've heard of Butler Schaefer he has a you know he was a libertarian constitutional scholar. He has a daughter named Brittany Schaefer. She has a podcast, and she's had a man on there two times named Todd Seavey. And he has said, it's interesting, his observation that borders and immigration have become the single issue to define if you are correct on the right or if you're correct on the left. He says you can be wrong on everything else so for example you could be uh if if you were if you believed in like a East Berlin style wall with razor wire on the top and machine gun nests every 100 meters if you thought that's that's the

correct position for enforcement on the on the southern border you could be wrong on everything else on everything else that the right holds dear, like global warming, you know, the Second Amendment, gender issues, religion, you know, Israel. You could be wrong on everything else and you would be accepted on the right. If you were good on that issue, the same goes for the left. If you had the correct issue that the left or that the Democrats hold dear on immigration and borders you could you could be wrong on every other issue he said this has become the predominant issue in politics to define if you are on the right or on the left or if you're a democrat or or republican so i'm just kind of definitely because it's very interesting it's not like a range of issues yeah this has

and i really see it i see when i take a more of a. Yeah. This has been, and I really see it. I see when I take a more of a, like a free market position on immigration and borders. At LiveScoreBet, we love Cheltenham just as much as we love football. The excitement, the roar, and the chance to reward you. That's why every day of the festival, we're giving new members money back as a free sports bet up to 10 euro

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I see the hatred from the right. I get emails and social media posts filled with profanity. I get death threats in the mail. I don't report any of it. I'm not a sissy. I don't report any of this. But telling me that they want me you know to to get killed and to go to hell and it's incredible the the level of rhetoric that comes from what I

when I grew up always thought you know conservative kind of meant like Christian kind of meant like you know you know civil person you know like the following the Prince of Peace, you know, but it really has become the single issue that, you know, I can see that in my area. Well, I think that's largely because of the 2016 campaign. Trump made it the central issue. And that really kind of defined, he kind of redefined where the, what the right held as important, and he made it all about the border.

But I've talked about this in terms of E-Verify. You talked about secondary problems when the government creates a problem, and then rather than going back and seeing what the real issue is, they add secondary, tertiary things on top of that. Things like E-Verify, for example. I pushed back very hard because I said, look, I don't want to have a system where I've got to apply to Washington for permission to have a job. And this is how this escalates. Take a look at passports. You know, it wasn't that long ago, the early 20th

century. You didn't have to have a passport to go anywhere. As a matter of fact, John Kenneth Galbraith said, look, if you have gold, you can, you know, you can go in and you can buy your clothes here. You can travel into Europe from the UK, and you can buy anything that you want. You don't have to exchange into any currency. So you're free to travel. That's all changed. You're going to have passports everywhere. Even in the Reagan era, like Ronald Reagan was against the Berlin Wall. He was against walls.

As the Soviet Union was making sort of ovations to emerge into freedom, he said, Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall. And during that time, Reagan was also against tariffs. And also, you didn't need a passport as a U.S. citizen to come back to the U.S. Like my wife and I, when we were young, you know, both of our families lived here on the border. We just go back and forth on the border. You come back. It's your country. The U.S. is your country.

And you just say U.S. citizen, declare your citizenship and come back. So, you know, you've kind of seen like 180 degree change in the Republican Party in the last like whatever it is, 33, 34 years from the time of Reagan to the time of Trump, where you had the very much the free trade, the no tariffs, you know, needs. Everybody was afraid back then about a national ID card, if you start requiring passports to return to the country, it's going to be a national ID card and that whole E-Verify thing. Yeah, you're exactly right. And just as an example of my family being in the ranching since my dad, my grandparents, my great grandparents in this area, there used to be a program called the Bracero program. It was very easy.

If you couldn't find an American that wanted to work on the ranch, you could easily hire somebody from Mexico. They give you a little I-94 card, a work visa, and then they had to turn it in within a certain number of days, 90 days, 180 days, or they'd never get another one again. So it was easy to employ people, but nowadays people are scared to death to employ anybody, because they're afraid they're gonna run afoul with the feds, because if they don't do

the E-Verify thing appropriately, you can't do like my grandfather did, and he needed people to build a couple of miles of barbed wire fence and just hire a bunch of people to go out there and cut fence posts and dig the post holes and put it up. Now you're running risk of getting in trouble with the feds. And that's on the employment side. Look at how they burdened that with reporting requirements because you got to pay the taxes

and so forth. And we're going to see that on the consumer side. We're going to see that kind of control about everything that you can buy, everything that you can do when they usher in CBDC. But in between that, we talk about E-Verify, but it's also passports. The fact that you used to not have to have passports so much as we just pointed out. First time we ever got hit with a passport issue. We took the kids in 2000. And in 2000, we went up into Canada, latter part of 2000. And they almost didn't want to bring us back in. You know, my wife and I had driver's licenses and we had done that type of thing before.

And the kids were with us, but the kids didn't have any identification. And they really hassled us, the Americans did, as we were trying to come back in from Canada. But when you look at what has happened the last couple of years, David, the, you know, the passports that started getting stronger and stronger and more numerous and, and then having requirements, like you got to have a vaccines for certain types of diseases and so forth to travel now into these countries. And then they put that on steroids last couple of years with the lockdown with COVID. And now that is the central thing.

Davos is talking about how this has been a big boon to what they want to do, getting people accustomed to having a passport to travel internally. And that's coming to us as well in America. But that is all pushing for everybody to have a digital ID. And it comes back to the border. And people can't make that connection as to what the issue is there. When you look at Novak Djokovic, they had a three-way tie for the Grand Slam champion of tennis. It was Nadal, Djokovic, and Federer, Roger Federer. And it was tied like 20-20-20. And then Djokovic couldn't come in to defend that

and to one-up the other guys in the U.S. Open because he wouldn't take the shot. I'm not going to take the COVID shot. Me and my doctors don't think it's going to be good for my health. And I even tried to help him on that. My kids are big tennis fans, and they wanted him to be able to run up, one-up Nadal, Rafael help him on that. My kids are big tennis fans and they wanted him to be able to run up one up Nadal, Rafael Nadal on that. And I just happened to know the commissioner of CBP and I said, is there anything I can do to get him under? There's what they call law enforcement, parole, law enforcement waivers to be able to get somebody in for a special purpose i did a lot of that when i was with dea we could bring informants in under what they call a silent waiver or a special you know a category of waiver to bring people in for a limited person but no they were just adamant that they were not going to let him set that example and if i could talk a little bit about the the passports and the nonsense

on that my wife karen uh you know sweet She's 5'2", she weighs 95 pounds, little innocent, you know, harmless little person. At LiveScore Bet, we love Cheltenham just as much as we love football. The excitement, the roar, and the chance to reward you. That's why every day of the festival, we're giving new members money back as a free sports bet up to 10 euro

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the CBP computers like she had her passport and everything like that one time I think when she had her picture taken for the passport she didn't have glasses so she walked through the port of entry with glasses and they always photograph you now. And it does image analysis. It takes that computer image and it does image analysis of the picture on file in the passport. And one time it did a little red flag and it said,

refer to secondary for further verification of identity. Maybe it's because she got a few years older. Maybe she had her hair different. Maybe it's because she was wearing her glasses. But poor little thing, they take her in there. They take her cell phone away. They detain her for half an hour. I'm outside all worried about it.

And finally, we make it through that. The next time we come back, this red flag is now permanently in the computer. Look again more closely at this person. And it's kind of like when you get on a no-fly list or something. It's this behemoth state. There's no human aspect to it anymore. And there I'm sitting there wearing my tag that says sheriff on it. They know I'm the sheriff.

They know our families that we grew up in this area. But now that it's in the computer, it's permanently there. There's no way to delete the red flag from my wife, Karen. grew up in this area but now this in the computer it's permanently there there's no way to delete the red flag for my wife Karen so she goes in there trembling and like gives me her cell phone before she walks through the line because they're gonna do this little digital image and the computer is gonna say look again because it's happened before so you might be a person of interest might be a problem and then it keeps referring her to secondary she goes

in there she gets detained um and then they you know they they interrogate her and then eventually they let her come in because they have to you know she's not carrying drugs or anything like that but that's i just want to tell you that little story because it bugs me to know and people don't know the problems that the border officials cause here and all this border enforcement. There's cameras everywhere. There's cameras southbound. There's cameras northbound. Now they search you as you leave the US. The US officials search you as you leave the US. They take your money under civil asset forfeiture. They take your guns, even though in Arizona, the NRA ranks Arizona number one for gun rights nothing's illegal here you know on the state side nothing's illegal um but they they take this stuff under civil affidavit for sure for sure they don't

charge you with a crime so i tell people look be careful what you ask for if you ask for walls walls don't just keep people from coming in they keep you from going out it has that east germany effect so now like 15 years ago it was a trial program where they had these southbound inspection personnel just standing in the lanes u.s officials searching you as you leave now they have permanent structures there so as they create more of a choke point at the official ports of entry it's also a choke point for americans that want to expatriate they want to take their gold coins and their money because they think they're losing their freedoms in the u.S. They want to get out of Dodge and go down to Acapulco or something like that. Now they're searching you as you leave and making it harder for you to leave. Yeah, Americans

returning into California. There's just a report I talked about last week where if they get in the wrong lane, and this has happened to me when I'm going through, you know, get trapped and I don't want to go on a toll road, but I don't see the sign. And then there's no way for me to turn around. They got into, because they were listening to their routing software on their phone, got into the wrong lane, no way to get out. And then when they get up there, they say, well, you know, you went in the wrong lane. You're not supposed to be here.

They hold them up for $5,000 to say we're going to confiscate your car. This is what's being done on the American side to American citizens. If we let the government continue to escalate this surveillance state, this police state for total control, we know where this leads. We know where they want this to lead. The only thing I would say here, David, is when we're talking about, even from the Christian standpoint, nations know, nations, tongues, and tribes. And so I understand from the conservative standpoint, their concern about that, because that's really kind of what makes us a community and separates us, you know, languages and

borders and cultures and things like that. And that is something that we see the globalists working very hard to erase all of those boundaries because they want a homogeneous population that doesn't have a sense of community to resist them because that's where the resistance is and so people focus instead of trying to build their community i think the problem is instead of trying to build their community stronger they just focus on the border and saying that's going to take our community down rather than coming up with a positive way to build a community, to set up a culture that is vibrant and interconnected. So if you have somebody that comes in from another area, as we used to see, America used to be the melting pot. But we don't have confidence in our ability to do that.

So we want the government to come in and save us from every perceived problem. Yeah, and I don't see any problem with people self-segregating, you know, like voluntary arrangements, what Hopper calls covenant communities, things like that, where you can have gated communities. And, you know, and it's nothing wrong with people choosing who they want to live around, as long as there's not force being used to force people into together or apart from each other and you know that's always been these days life is all luckily with bank of ireland's current account and visa debit card you get all your day-to-day banking covered for just six euro a month so you can tap pay and send in euro with no surprises easy search bank of ireland current account to find out more terms and conditions apply send

via 365 online and phone government stamp duty applies to debit cards and checks bank of ireland is regulated by the central bank of ireland i hate to say it but it's always been fashionable to hate the foreigner and not criticize the regime that exerts control over you you could see that during the the fauci regime you were de-platformed it was misinformation if you said anything against the regime that rules you but throughout history you've been able to hate the foreigner you know you've been able to hate in different points of history japanese or germans or Vietnamese, Koreans, Iranians, Afghanis, Syrians, Iraqis, Hitler, talk about the Polish, going to be like the big threat to the

motherland or to the fatherland. And it's like, you've always been able to do that. Your regime will allow you to complain about a foreigner. And I'm not saying that to discredit what you're saying. I totally agree with what you're saying. But you've always been allowed, as a matter of fact, let me see if I have it right here. You may not be able to see this, but this is a poster I have on my wall in the office. And it's like a mirror image of two identical countries, but it shows the language that they used to describe our blessed homeland and their desolate waste. You know, our noble adventurers and their brutish invaders, our wonderful religion and their foreign superstition.

You know, it's just kind of, but it's a mirror image. It has like two fleets, two boats, two different armadas, but the religious building and the government building and the army, they're identical on both sides of that image. And I have that on the wall just to kind of show how people describe people that are outside of their group. And this has always happened. This has been back to the Roman Empire. There was a Roman historian called Tacitus that wrote a book called Germania. It was about the German people, and he described them as brutish, as barbarians.

And the Romans would write this kind of a treatise on anybody that they wanted to invade, or they wanted to demonize. And that Tacitus, he had never even been to Germany, but that thought continues in modern literature and fiction to this era, that the ancient Germans were unintelligent and brutish and treated their women badly and ate with their hands and just threw the bones on the floor, like all these things you see in these medieval-type movies about, you know, Northern European people being brutish and whatnot. And that was all based, that imagery is all based on a book called Garmania. I wrote it, written by a Roman historian called Tacitus.

There's a good book about that called The World's Most Dangerous Book, about how that resulted, that kind of negative imagery about the German people resulted in some of the things that Hitler, you know, that motivated, that propelled Hitler into power, this idea about demonizing foreigners. But, you know, I think if you have voluntary arrangements, you're always going to have people and cultures and linguistic groups come together, kind of self-segregate. You know, you can see this in public schools, you can see it in prison populations, that people have a tendency to linguistically and culturally associate with people that they have an affinity for. So I think rather than trying to, you know, sequester people using force, you know, using government force,

I think you should let people naturally make voluntary arrangements uh but it doesn't necessarily mean you're just going to have a bunch of rich people from a certain you know ethnic or cultural group or linguistic group all living together because they may want somebody to mow their lawn you know and it may be that hiring your neighbor your rich neighbor to mow your lawn is not the best thing. So you just need to let the market work these things out like these voluntary associations of who works with who, who sells with who, who associates with who. I agree. I agree. Yeah, there's some genuine concerns there. But what we see, I think we both agree that the government creates an issue.

And then in response to the problem that they created, they have additional things that they stack on top of it. And we've seen it with the drug issue. You start out with prohibition. It gets people to make more concentrated forms of whatever it is that they're prohibiting, whether it's alcohol, the other things. You get organized crime. You get corruption in the police.

You get corruption in the courts. Things escalate, and then they start escalating into things like civil asset forfeiture, SWAT team raids, militarization of the police. It goes on and on. This is the type of thing that we're seeing, and we're seeing that being repeated at the border when you start talking about all the passports and surveillance and all the rest of this stuff. I was the head of the DEA office here, and people asked me, like, well, talk about the

fentanyl issue. And, you know, like Ron Paul always does, he says, you kind of have to, you can't just start in the moment. Like you look at alcohol prohibition, just like you said, the drink of preference of Americans before alcohol prohibition was beer and wine, both low alcohol products. And then with alcohol prohibition, the smugglers were smart. So they smuggled gin and vodka and whiskey because beer and wine are mainly water. So if you're going to run the risk of bringing something across the border from Canada or Mexico, you might as well do the most potent version and then there's less risk. The same thing happened with drug prohibition. At least they had the

decency to make a constitutional amendment for alcohol prohibition because there's no provision in the constitution for you to ban a substance. But they didn't do that with the war on drugs. But what happened? The same thing. Before you had the war on drugs, before you had the Harrison Tax Act, what was the drug of choice in the US? It was ditch weed marijuana.

And the Asian community, like in San Francisco, they like to smoke raw opium. But once you made those things illegal, now they started smuggling, instead of the low THC ditchweed marijuana, they went to hash and hash oil and sensimia. And instead of the raw opium, they imported heroin because it takes 400 kilos of raw opium to make one kilo of heroin. So it resulted in stronger versions of that but since my mind is chaotic chaotic and all over the place do you mind if i talk a little bit about a spy blimp that we had in our town yeah yeah we we had a a blimp that was launched in our town oh about six months ago and i you know ranted and raved about that to all the media that would listen to me you could find on youtube you can look at sheriff hathaway spy blimp and you'll see videos of me complaining about this is turning into a surveillance state and a police state but what they did they anchored

this blimp that was a video platform cpp put it there it was a mile and a half from the border in the middle of three residential neighborhoods in in the u.s and um it was all very secretive they didn't brief law enforcement or brief the community on it or anything and i just ranted and raved on that and lo and behold last week they took it down with no no explanation i'm wanting to think that my ranting and raving made a difference but um there were a lot of people in my community that were very concerned that, you know, what was CBP doing with this thing anchored right over the residential neighborhoods, looking down into their communities. There's, they call these things aerostat blimps. There's one in the county east of me in Cochise County, that's a radar platform for low flying aircraft,

but this one is a video surveillance platform, but you know, a little minor victory there on the police state, you know, it's minor victory there on the police state. You know, it's just kind of me complaining about it all the time. And then, I don't know, maybe CBP thought this is too much of a hassle with this sheriff. Well, it's always been about surveillance. I mean, you go back and everybody's talking, well, we need to have another church committee hearing because, like, the FBI is snooping on people and segregating people out by their political beliefs and that type of thing.

The church committee hearing was about surveillance, and that's why they had the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act was the thing that came out of it. But everybody remembers the more sensational details of the heart attack guns and the assassination plots and the rest of that stuff. But from the very inception, the CIA and the NSA were spying on Americans. That's what the government wants to do. They're obsessed with knowing everything about us. As a matter of fact, just this last week, I came across, they were talking about DARPA and their constant surveillance, and they refer to it in some of their stuff as maintaining

custody. They see this as an open-air prison, and they want to maintain custody of us. And they use these terms like lockdown and the rest of this stuff. I mean, they are trying to set up a prison and that's exactly what. It is happening with Davos and the rest of these people. It's all about digitalization so that they can have biometric IDs and surveillance and permission to do everything, including now, even what you eat and even travel within a city. They want to keep you within a 15 minute little village.

Uh, and if you want to get outside of that village and they're already doing this and, uh, in England, it, um, uh, um, it's a Canterbury and it was Oxford. Uh, they're setting these things up and they've got, uh, you can't get out of your little zone except a couple of times a month. And that's everybody in your family. You know, one person goes out, well, that's one. You know, you've got another couple for the next month. It's just amazing how they're trying to lock everybody down in prison.

And I think people don't realize how this border stuff really ushers in the greater police state. Like, I have predator drones that fly over the ranch. We have the surveillance towers that are three four miles inland that are video surveillance platforms uh ground monitors uh smaller drones that type of thing now you know if we get people accustomed to this and then you're probably familiar with the 100 mile what they call constitution free zone there's been three supreme court cases to define cbp's authority to search without probable cause so there's this this book by this guy, I can't remember his name, called Nobody is Protected. Border Patrol is the most dangerous police force in the United States.

And it's about, it chronicles the Supreme Court decisions that have given Border Patrol absolute authority within 100 miles of the international border to stop anybody for any reason and to interrogate them without even having probable cause now if you look at the us if you look at the international boundaries two-thirds of the people in the us live within a hundred miles of the international border cities like los angeles new york miami uh you know seattle even chicago is within 100 miles of an international border. So they, the federal government has given themselves the ability to pull you over, search you and interrogate you, which they do me too. They interrogate me and stop me and point guns

at me on my own ranch. And, you know, and then detain me and I'll, you know, sit there very still not start arguing the Constitution with them. But it's this uh this privilege that they've been given and i get to get into that in my book too you know the kind of the legal basis that they've given themselves for this 100 mile no probable cause zone and then within that zone you also have all these surveillance platforms blimps and drones and everything and people kind of give it a pass because it's to do with the border and think well you know we, we need that for the border. But it's really becoming, you know, a surveillance state. And, you know, I don't know why Border Patrol has kind of become like the new messiah to conservative Christians. You know, like I've lived in Missouri and Illinois

and Tennessee, and you see the church bulletin, you know, pray for Border Patrol. Okay, it's fine to pray for everybody. You know, you should Border Patrol. Okay, it's fine to pray for everybody. You know, you should pray for everybody. But it's become like Border Patrol and people will say, I know a Border Patrol agent. And he told me this and he told me that. And it's like, you know, I mean, just because you knew somebody that was in the KGB or the Stasi or the Gestapo or something like that, obviously people are going to make a pitch for what they do. They're going to lobby for what they do. And Border Patrol has a very strong union. And I

like the Border Patrol officers. I know, you know, I know good people and all that. But it has become this weird thing that Americans just think they don't care about this total police state as long as it comes in within this hundred mile to the border zone, which covers. These days, life is all... Luckily, with Bank of Ireland's current account and Visa debit card, you get all your day-to-day banking covered for just €6 a month. So you can tap, pay and send in euro with no surprises. Easy.

Search Bank of Ireland current account to find out more. Terms and conditions apply. Send via 365 online and phone. Government stamp duty applies to debit cards and checks. Bank of Ireland is regulated by the Central Bank of Ireland. You know, a lot of the U.S. Kind of reminds me of Fiddle on the Roof. That's a rabbi.

Is there a prayer for the czar? It's like, yeah, God bless and keep the czar far away from us, right? Same thing with the Border Patrol, the federal. I grew up in Florida, and I'm thinking, you know, when we think about the 100-mile border, if you were to draw that in on both sides in this narrow peninsula, you know, 100-mile border going on both sides, many places, that probably encompasses the entire interior of Florida as well on the border. So, yeah, it's a very long, skinny state like that.

And that's the thing. That's how it metastasizes if we lose track of what the bigger issue is. And I think when we talk about politics, the bigger issue is liberty. But it's also looking at people as individuals, I think that's a key thing. And people are just afraid. And they've been, that fear has been stoked by conservative media who's looking for a demographic. It's been stoked by demagoguing politicians like Donald Trump, who, you know, getting everybody focusing on the worst criminals that come across. And again, many of the worst

people that are coming across are going to be people that are brought in because of the war on drugs or they come in because of the welfare magnet that is there. I remember some of the policies, and there are some real issues as to what we do with it. I remember there was a father whose daughter was killed by MS-13 on Long Island. And he was from El Salvador. And he said, we came all this way to try to get away from them. Now, in that area, they had kids that had come in as minors. They were brought in by MS-13. They had tattoos on their face. It was literally written all over their face that they were MS-13.

And there was an argument in the school. They killed the daughter. And he goes, what do I do? How do I escape from this and so there is a a a you know when you see somebody that is obviously um you know uh part of a gang member uh you can't arrest somebody if they haven't committed a crime nevertheless there's got to be something that can be done about some of those types of things what would be the practical solutions people will talk about the gang members ms-13, Mala Salvatrucha

from, you know, from El Salvador, all the different gangs and drug dealers and pedophiles and sex offenders that come across the border. But if you made on I-70 between St. Louis and Chicago, if you just made a checkpoint where everybody on the freeway had to be stopped

and searched, had their names run on the computer, you would find tons of gang members and lots of dope and lots of pedophiles and lots of sex offenders and people with criminal history so it's kind of a little bit of a red herring to say if we force everybody to be run through a computer at the border you're going to have you're going to have you know a certain person you know of uh you know people that that are narrowly wells you know in that thing and if i can touch a little bit we're talking about the stuff at the border like uh you probably your listeners have probably heard in the news title 42 and there's there's a lot of things that i call fuzzy math that have to do with the last two years two and a half three years um title 42 is one of them um title 42 is a covid mandate nothing else

the last remaining covid protocol and it's really funny to me that the people that deny uh all the coveted stuff as do i you know there's never been a you know the coveted virus never been isolated you know much less all the omicron and Delta and all this kind of stuff. But just people take it at face value. But they don't like all the COVID mandates and protocols and restrictions that were put in place. Title 42 is the last one of those. It just says you can't do any processing under Title VIII.

Title VIII of the United States Code is the U.S. law that covers everything to do with immigration, you know, visas, work visas, tourist visas, student visas, asylum. It has health and safety provisions. But Title 42 just says you can't process people under Title VIII. You just have to turn them around and do an expedited deportation with no processing. So it's estimated that 40% of the people coming in now are repeat crossers because their situation was never dealt with. They came in with their papers, whether they come in at a port of entry, because when you're at a port of entry, you're on U.S. soil. So even if you're making any kind of a claim for a visa or asylum, you're on U.S. soil. And at that point, they have to deport you. So they deport them under Title 42 no processing the same with people that come between the parts of entry no processing what it used to be is present your documents if the answer is no it's no if the answer is yes it's yes and then you're you're in the system you may get a hit for illegal entry and then you're you're a criminal uh a repeat offender in the system if you come back again

but right now there's there now, there's no processing, so it creates all these fake statistics of duplicate crossers. Another thing started under Reagan and continued, I mean, started under Trump, continued under Biden, was they invalidated all these legal visa holders in Mexico. There was estimated to be, at 2019, 4 million legal visa holders in Mexico. These are the B1, B2 visas, tourists, day shoppers, students, things like that. So they said, if it's for non-essential travel, you can't come across. So all these legal visas were invalidated.

These people had jobs in the U.S. They had families in the U.S. They may just happen to have been in Mexico when these restrictions started. So they have their legal documents, and it puts pressure on them to cross between the ports of entry illegally, even though they had legal documents. So this created a bunch of what I call fuzzy math, these statistics that were to do with the COVID restrictions, but they add to the statistics for the last couple of years. And yet, my wife and I, we live right along the border. We walk along the border every night. It's very peaceful, very nice, calm.

Don't see anything happening out there. It's not these massive caravans, these looped videos that you see on the news that they'll just loop them and show them over and over of people sitting under a bridge or something like that. And another thing when we're on the topic of that, there's no tabulation of the people going southbound. Every day I see whole households of furniture, Hispanic people leaving the U.S., going into Mexico, have these modern computer-controlled factories in Mexico, going down there to work and live and have a better life. There's no deduction of those statistics of the people leaving

from the ones that are tabulated as coming in. So it creates this ever increasing number. And then they have this other thing where they put these hundreds of motion activated game cameras along the border. And every time they trip from anything, from a cow, a deer, a moth, the wind blowing the leaves, they count it now as what they call a gotaway statistic or a getaway statistic. And they add that to the other statistics. And I say, well, look, Border Patrol my whole life, you know, I was born in 1959. My whole life they've said, we don't get all of them. We get one out of three or one out of four. So if you're going to add a fictional number to the current statistics, then you need to go back to the 70s and the 60s and the 80s and add that number to those

statistics as well. But it's one of those things, and it's not like they talk about Democrat administrations and Republican administrations. It's always been cyclical. Like practically every year in the 80s and the 90s and the 2000s, there was over a million apprehensions at the southwest border. And that was under, you know, Democrat, Republican presidents, you know, under Clinton, under the last years of Reagan, and then under Bush. And then there was a 14 year lull that was all eight years of Obama, the last two years of Trump, Trump Jr., I mean, Bush Jr., and all four years of Trump. And so then they do all this COVID nonsense, and they have the inflated numbers. And just to show, to talk about the fuzzy math a little bit, the last year of census data,

the last complete year of census data we have is 2021. And it's the lowest year of population growth in the history of the U.S., in the over 240-year history of the U.S., 0.1 of population growth in the history of the U.S., in the over 240-year history of the U.S., 0.1% population growth from all sources, immigration, native-born Americans, and yet they want to say there's this invasion and they're taking over the U.S. It's just like I said, there's no tabulation of the people leaving. And of course, populations increase. Like if you look at 1990, US population has gone up 90 million since then. Mexican population has gone up 55 million. Border Patrol has increased five times from 4,000 agents to 23,000 agents in that same period of time from 1990. Per agent, they're actually detaining less people. But, you know, numbers go up, you're inevitably going to get a new record year. Like there was a record year under Reagan, 1.6 million. That year was tied under Clinton, 1.6 million. And then we've broken that record in recent years. But like I said, there's a lot of fuzzy math built into that. And of course, there's been a lot of fuzzy math anytime you

come around the government, whether you're talking about unemployment figures or they constantly adjust or inflation numbers or COVID cases. They play fast and furious with it. That's why I wanted to get your take on it. Living there, having your family that's been there, as you said, since before Arizona became a state and in the past when I've talked to you, you talked about how the town was just devastated when everything got locked down with the pandemic because you had people that were going back and forth on a regular basis. They were coming into the town there to shop from Mexico and vice versa.

So there was trade that was going back and forth and it all just stopped. And so I think this Title 42, a big part of that is to continue this pandemic. They keep extending the executive order for a state of emergency. You have Abbott doing that in Texas, but Biden has extended it. He's going to be extending it for the eighth time. Trump did it four times. He continued to do it after the election. They don't ever want any of this stuff to end. That's the one thing that they want. And we have to understand and we have to look at alternative ways to deal with issues that we've got, friction that we've got, without falling into the trap of demanding a police state.

That's the last thing we should be looking at. Just like with drugs. I understand, you understand, that it's a serious issue. Drug addiction is a serious issue. But we understand it's a spiritual issue. It's not a law enforcement issue. Many people have done this for many, many years. I've talked to them after they've retired, and they said, look, this is an absolute failure. It's not a law enforcement issue. Many people have done this for many, many years. I've talked to them after they've retired and they said, look, this is an absolute failure. It's

made everything worse. It hasn't stopped any addiction. The drugs have gotten stronger. So we have to understand that if we keep doing something as an approach for 50 years and it doesn't work, maybe we should try something else. Let's talk about what's going on with the sheriffs in Illinois, because you've had experience living in Illinois, and now we've got this building revolt against massive gun control, big fines and other things that are being put out by the Illinois governors, and you've got 80 percent of the sheriffs saying we're not going to enforce that. And I'll just throw this in to get you to comment on this as well. What we see happening from the ATF, and this was a Trump precedent, to do gun control by executive order.

And now they've got a massive move to force, essentially, registration over this pistol brace thing. That is a big issue there. So talk a little bit about gun control. Talk a little bit about the lesser magistrate and the role of the sheriff. Yeah, you know, the state of Illinois, before I moved there, my parents in Arizona, they heard I was getting transferred there. And they were worried because all they knew was Chicago and not Illinois. But if you look at Illinois, it's a long north-south state and a lot of rural people, a lot of hunters, a lot of fishermen, a lot of sportsmen, a lot of guns.

You know, especially the southern half of the state where I live, a lot of, you know, a lot of hunters, wildlife refuge, you know, national forest, state forest. So, you know, you got a lot of, you know, your conservative rednecks, a lot of gun owners there, but they've always had, at least the whole time I was there, I had property there for 25 years, but I actually worked there for DEA 10 years, lived there 10 years, five years supervising the DEA office in Southern Illinois, and then five years where I commuted across the river to Rush Limbaugh's hometown, Cape Girardeau, where I was the office head there. So I supervised DEA operations in 17 counties in Missouri and 20 counties in Illinois. And they have this thing called the FOID card, F-O-I-D, the firearms owner ID card. They've always been ranked very poorly by the NRA and the gun owners of America as far as gun rights, but it's been

something that people tolerate. You got to go in and get your picture taken and you have to carry this card around and that's very, very, very arduous if you're transporting a gun, ammunition separated from the gun, gun disassembled, things like that. But you know, the people tolerated that and a lot of people that value their Second Amendment rights. So, you know, I just thought this would be coming someday because I know the people of Illinois. I know, you know, 90% of Illinois, which is not Chicago and it's not East St. Louis and it's not Springfield and they, you know, a lot of gun enthusiasts there. So I really applaud those sheriffs and I'm kind of a little bit surprised that in Illinois they would react that way. But on the other hand, not, because I know sheriffs are a county position, and most of those counties have conservative values,

and they own guns, and they're proud of their Second Amendment rights. So I think the sheriffs know their local population. And I think that's something we see a lot. When you look at electoral maps and you look at an election, typically what you'll see is the state, you know, and I hate the idea of coloring conservatives red, you know, but you'll see that the rural areas will vote Republican or conservative. And you'll see that, you know, the, there'll just be small geographical areas, the concentration of the cities, they go Democrat, they go liberal. And that's something of an issue for freedom everywhere. But again, it's the same type of thing that you see the effort the electoral college is trying to counter that.

Many people said maybe we need to have an electoral college at the state level. Maybe that would be a solution. I don't know. But I think that's really what we're seeing there. Probably 80% of Illinois is rural and conservative, and it's the urban areas that want all this gun control because it's really a war on drugs issue, I think, is what we're mostly seeing. Yeah. Yeah.

And I applaud them, and I hope they succeed on that. And I don't know how we're doing on time, but if I could define a little bit my position. Yeah, go ahead. We've got time. It's just on a different topic. Just to kind of say, kind of an oxymoron of how I started out this interview, talking about being a voluntarist, libertarian, thinking the market can handle everything. So why am I, in essence, being a hypocrite and occupying a tax-funded position um because you know i do think taxes theft there is no social contract uri david we didn't sign a

social contract at some point that says you give me these services and i'm willing that you you know tax my property or whatever at this percentage rate. But the reason is it's pretty simple. I have a lot of family, we have property here. I have relatives, aunts, uncles, cousins, parents, my wife's family's here too. And if I occupy this position, I can keep a tyrant from coming in here

and occupying the position that would force everybody to wear a mask to wear masks or take shots or take their guns away from them or whatever the next boondoggle that comes down the pipeline, if they want to take people's gold and silver, take their hard assets. I just kind of wanted to get that in because people may be wondering that in the back of their mind. If I think that taxation, involuntary funding mechanisms, coercive funding is illegitimate, and I do think that, then why do I occupy this position? And it's just that if I don't occupy the position, somebody else will.

Well, that's very legitimate. I've talked many times to Matt Trujillo, who wrote a book, The Doctrine of the Lesser Magistrate. And I think that idea of interposition to protect basic fundamental rights is very important. We need more people like you standing in that position that don't believe in big government, that don't believe that government is a solution to every issue. That is the most important. That's the type of sheriff we need to have everywhere, I think. So I understand. I see that people would see that as a contradiction,

but it really is about interposition. It's about protecting the people under your jurisdiction. And I think that the sheriff's office, that is what that was designed for. And to be the power of the community, if necessary, to bring together a posse, if it's something that is big that is happening, but to organize that and to be the chief law enforcement officer there it's a very important position has a lot of power to protect innocent people from tyrants and so I certainly understand why you're there well it's been very interesting talking to you and I've had a lot of people but that asked the question about you know what was going on at the border and why you were

opposing the shipping containers. I agree with your answers there. I understand that. And I think that people need to be careful what we ask for because we just might get it in spades. Yeah. And next time I come on, David,

if we could talk about another topic, uh, the CIA smuggling drugs in Latin America, this is not just things of fantasy. I discovered this when I was doing the investigation to find the killers of Kiki Camarena, the DEA agent that was killed in Mexico in 1985. Me and a team of other agents doing Operation Leanda found out that it was the CIA that tortured Kiki Camarena to death. And there's actually recorded cassette tapes of the recording session, of the torture session. And if your viewers want

to watch something, it's free on Amazon Prime. There's a series called The Last Narc, four-part series, nothing's redacted. It has the actual people that were in the room that identified the CIA agent. And if you want to cut to the chase, go to the last episode. It's a four-part episode. Look at episode four uh very interesting it identifies the cia agent that actually did this it was to create to smuggle drugs cocaine to fund the contras in nicaragua and i actually interviewed people cia pilots that told me that's what they were doing too multiple people have verified this but of course it fell on deaf ears when it got to washington because it was one federal agency having another federal agency but i would encourage your viewers watch the last

mark on amazon prime especially the last the last episode it's not fiction there's nothing redacted has what was said in the torture session where they were asking kiki camarino about what do you know about what the cia is doing in nicaragua and then the cia smuggling drugs multiple cooperating individuals they actually have the actual individuals that were in the room with the cia agent on camera using their real names on this episode it's a real bombshell episode and it's validated something i've always known since i investigated this since the 1980s and it just pains me to go to these events to commemorate kiki camarana i've spoken to multiple groups of school kids and all about how

the cartels and you know tortured him to death and all that and okay but you know the real story is something a little bit more nuanced so anyway wow wow how did how did that wind up uh not getting destroyed you know did gina Haspel not know about that? You know what's funny is when that series just came out a few months ago, it immediately went off Amazon Prime. It just disappeared for like two months, and it's back on again, and I downloaded it. I actually downloaded all the episodes just in case it disappears again because there's no fake names. There's no fuzzed out silhouetted faces or anything it's the actual uh mexican jalisco state police officers that were in the room with the cia agent and uh you know

us in the dea that we're tracking down the killers of kiki camarena we identified people that were in the room and then we did photo lineups to show them the people that actually led the torture session recorded the torture session and it was you know and we have the name of the cia agent and the name is actually in that that video but you know very interesting and you don't want to don't want to pop anybody's bubble about you know it's just amazing that stuff that gary webb wrote yeah you know Alliance. That's not just, you know. Oh, and it was amazing how, you know, they got a hit team essentially on him with the LA Times. You know, they had a whole bunch of reporters that were brought in to discredit Gary Webb. And, you know, then eventually I believe that they killed him as well.

But I guess the thing that, the only thing that I'm surprised about that is that footage survived. Was it because it was with the Mexican police officers? Is that why that? Well, immediately the lead investigators named Hector Bedeas, lead DEA agent that ran Operation Leyenda to investigate this. And I worked a lot in Mexico too at the time of that investigation in the late 1980s and he has had death threats and he has had uh current and former cia agents come and tell him look you know you need you need to watch out you need to watch your back um and they have threatened to the federal officials have threatened it to extradite the lead dea agent to me Mexico because he uh there's a warrant out for him there because he ruffled feathers down there you know like you know exposing other people that were in the room

when this when this happened so it just kind of these guys uh you know it kind of took the air out of their out of their sails who was who was who was filming it and who had custody of the film so that it survived? Because, you know, that's a big issue when I talk to John Kiriakou, who exposed the torture. You know, Gina Haspel went in and destroyed all the evidence, especially the videotapes of what they were doing, in order to create lies about weapons of mass destruction to put us into a war. So how did they keep this away from her? Audio cassette tape. And then they actually have nowadays,

just recently filmed, the people that flipped and cooperated with the DEA that were in the room in the torture session on camera exposing this and talking about that the guy leading it was this CIA agent. Okay, okay. So they got testimony of the people that flipped talking about that, plus the audio tapes that are there.

Yeah. That's very interesting. I didn't know about that. And so it's called The Last Narc, and it's on Amazon? The Last Narc, and it's free on Amazon Prime. You don't have to pay for it. And the whole series is interesting. It's a four-part series.

It's all true. But if you want to just get to the uh the the cia the part about the cia torturing uh camaraderie you can go to episode four for the last two episodes and in but it leads up to that throughout the series um it's the whole series is interesting but you know you know that's why i think it's very important for people to get a realistic view of what is happening here. Because we've been fed so much stuff with one spy show after the other and the James Bond thing. Throughout the 60s, everything was spy this and spy that. You know, it took over from the Westerns. And they make heroes out of it.

We had J. Edgar Hoover with Efren Zimbalist Jr., the FBI. You know, that was all a PR move. And, you know, now the conservatives are concerned about the FBI because now the FBI is coming after them. But it used to be the other way around. And I worked in South America for five years, too. And I had a special team down there of Bolivian military and police officers. We targeted for a year the biggest drug trafficker in the country. Went up, and when we're going to raid the house, we saw the CIA team was going in and out, in and out, in and out,

talk to this guy. And then so we were supposed to de-conflict this with the embassy, but we knew the CIA would shut it down once we figured out that they were involved. So we hit the house, they got mad, the ambassador threatened to throw us out of country, put their spook in the prison, maximum security prison in Bolivia, and then the CIA hired a team to bring them in to break the guy out of prison, but they didn't know that the pilot they hired was a DEA informant. So we had our DEA informant pilot fly them in with all their RPGs and automatic weapons and grenades to hit the prison and arrested them when the spook team came in with all their rpgs and automatic weapons and grenades to hit the prison and what arrested them when the spook team came in to bust their other cia guy out of the prison so i mean

i've confirmed this multiple levels at the source where the cocaine is produced in south america and in the investigation in mexico it's like absolutely thing it's not innuendo it's not yeah it's not just fake stuff i i've seen it firsthand and i, and I'm getting old enough now to where it's just like, who cares? Just tell the truth about what I've seen, what I've observed. It's amazing. The levels of corruption, the fact that you have interesting fighting going on between different law enforcement organizations because of the massive corruption that is there. People just don't realize how deeply embedded the deep state is and how we have really even when we talk about things like civil asset forfeiture, it's not, they say that they have the authority to do this because it's not a law, because it's

a rule. And so you have the bureaucracies that are creating rules. And I say, you have no due process, no presumption of innocence, no protection against excessive fines and punishment, and on and on. They can take your property without even charging you with a crime. How do we get to this situation? And I think the only way that we get out of it is to get people to understand that's what's happening. It's almost impossible to get people to believe that this is really happening in America. They don't realize how deep it is.

Unfortunately, elected officials at the federal level can't stop it. You have these oligarchies, and you have this bureaucratic state that's embedded like the senior management within agencies. Like you talk about civil asset forfeiture. You probably know this, David, but in DEA and the FBI, it's all administrative. It doesn't even go through the court system. DEA has their own what they call administrative law judge that passes judgment on the court system. DEA has their own, what they call administrative law judge that makes, passes judgment on the

seizures made by DEA and by the seizures adopted from local law firm. It doesn't even go through the courts. They pass their rules. They pass their rules. They got their enforcement people. They got their courts. And, you know, hey, we got our own little fiefdom here. You're right.

And that's why I think, you know, when we talk about this, you know, why am I a sheriff if I don't think this is right? That is really the most effective way to stop this. You're not going to send Mr. Smith to Washington and have him stand up and do a filibuster and explain all this to people and have him change anything. Everybody knows that's the way that works if they're there. Yeah. That's the key. Well, thank you so much for joining us.

Very interesting, as always. Thank you for talking to us, Sheriff David Hathaway, Sheriff of Santa Cruz County in Arizona. Thank you, David. Appreciate it. Okay, and I'll give out my email, sheriffdavidhathaway at gmail.com if anyone wants to get a hold of me. If they want to read things I've written, I've written a lot for the Libertarian Institute and lewrockwell.com if they want to read some more.

Good, yes, yes. And I've read a lot of what you've written. Excellent stuff, too. Thank you very much, David. Appreciate it. All right. Bye-bye. The common man. They created common core and dumbed down our children. They created common Core to dumb down our children. They created Common Past to track and control us. Their Commons Project to make sure the commoners own nothing. And the communist future.

They see the common man as simple, unsophisticated, ordinary. But each of us has worth and dignity created in the image of God. That is what we have in common. That is what they want to take away. Their most powerful weapons are isolation, deception, intimidation. They desire to know everything about us while they hide everything from us. It's time to turn that around and expose what they want to hide. Please share the information and links you'll find at thedavidknightshow.com. Thank you for listening.

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