The David Knight Show - INTERVIEW Honest Elections: What Would It Take?

Episode Date: April 27, 2023

Joseph Fried, CPA & auditor with 40 yrs professional experience, on various types of election fraud and what it would take to have honest elections in Republican controlled states and in Democrat controlled states. Author of "Debunked?: An Auditor Reviews the 2020 election — and Lessons Learned"Find out more about the show and where you can watch it at TheDavidKnightShow.comIf you would like to support the show and our family please consider subscribing monthly here:SubscribeStar https://www.subscribestar.com/the-david-knight-showOr you can send a donation through Mail: David Knight POB 994 Kodak, TN 37764Zelle: @[e-mail] App at: $davidknightshowBTC to: bc1qkuec29hkuye4xse9unh7nptvu3y9qmv24vanh7Money is only what YOU hold: Go to DavidKnight.gold for great deals on physical gold/silverBecome a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/the-david-knight-show--2653468/support.

Every year, thousands of people go to their very first concert. Our boosted signal at large events means they can always call a taxi to get home. Mom? Yeah, yeah, yeah. It was grand. Do you think you could pick me up? Every connection counts, which is why Ireland can count on our network. Vodafone. Together we can. But there are still divine offerings up for grabs, with all NoviBet customers getting a €10 free bet for every day of Cheltenham. And on top of that, we're paying up to seven places each way on selected races throughout the festival. I declare this a most generous offering.

NoviBet. More power to you. T&C Supply 18+. Bet responsibly. GamblingCare.ie. Welcome back, and our guest is joseph freed uh he has an mba from case western reserve as well as many years as an auditor for ernst and young then uh back in 1983 formed his own firm had a 40 year career doing this he's done a lot of audits as well as he is an AI CPA authorized peer reviewer for dozens of other audit firms. In 2003, he had a book. His first book was How Social Security Picks Your Pocket. We know that certainly is the case. 2008, after that financial crisis, he wrote a book called Who Really Drove the Economy Into the Ditch. But now he wrote a book called who really drove the economy into the ditch but now he has a book that is about the election from an auditor's perspective and so we want to talk about what

went wrong but we also want to talk about some solutions so joining us now is joseph freed the book is debunked an auditor reviews a 2020 election you can find that on Amazon. And is there any other place that people can get that? Thank you for joining us, Joe. Is there any other place that people can get that book? Amazon or Barnes & Noble, either one. All right, good, good. David, thank you very much for having me on. I sure appreciate it.

Well, it's good to have you on. Before we get into everything, I mean, give us your take on what has happened with this Dominion lawsuit and the firing of Tucker. I mean, how do you see all of this stuff breaking out? Well, as you know, I wrote an article recently, and I think I wrote it maybe three or four days too soon. Because the first point I made, I sort of gave a mild defense to Fox. I said that unlike some other networks, they allowed diversity because, as you know, Tucker Carlson was very much against the Ukraine war.

Yeah. Hannity was very much for it and so forth. So I was saying, what's wrong with that? And the same thing with the Dominion, that you had Maria Bartiromo and justice uh i mean judge janine pierrot uh saying one thing i don't think they were by the way really supporting this i don't think they were telling the viewers believe sydney powell she's telling the truth but they were giving her a platform yeah on the other hand we had tucker carlson and others who were blasting her i don't see anything wrong with that and that was my point but now it looks like i i'm worried that fox has gone down the dark path of uh stifling descent

oh yeah yeah i think so and i i dropped my fox completely. I won't even watch it anymore because that really, you know what really burned me up? It wasn't just that they came to a resolution without Tucker. It's the way they did it. I mean, the way they take a guy who's been there 14 years, their biggest earner, or at least the biggest, maybe not the biggest earner, but certainly the biggest in terms of viewership. Right. And they have some staffer just, uh, tell them don't come in on Monday. That's unbelievable. Well, you know, Megan Kelly was saying, um, and Tucker has said, maybe they're doing this because they want to sell the network. And Megan Kelly said, yeah, you know, there's a lot of advertisers who didn't like Tucker because he's controversial. So maybe they figured they can get anybody in there and they can sell more commercials.

But they're not looking at the bigger picture. Even if Tucker didn't turn in the ad revenue of some other programs, his presence there was pulling in viewers. And that was driving people to these other programs where they were going to have advertisers. So that was a very narrow way to look at it, I think. And even if they wanted to have a conversation with him and say, hey, you've got to go because we're losing money, you don't have to do it in such a horrible way that you're basically trying

to humiliate the man. So I just couldn't abide. Well, I've had similar experiences with that where I used to work. I was fired the same way for many of the same reasons where I was. There was also no concern in terms of you did not have an editorial staff that was telling us what we're going to cover and the angle that we're going to cover it from. You know, Megan Kelly came and she was doing interviews with us and and and she was with NBC at the time. And they were very stressed the the people that were with her were talking about so uh tell us about your news

meetings in the mornings it's like what no we don't do any of that you know same way it is for the opinion people at at fox news and they couldn't believe it you know that was happening because typically they feed everything to these talking heads is the way they would do it at mbc and all the rest of them uh so you were able to come up with whatever you wanted to say, unless it offended the guy in charge. And if it offends the guy in charge, you get summarily dismissed without any notification whatsoever. In my case, it was a week before Christmas and I didn't have tens of millions of dollars

to fall back on like Tucker did, but I had an audience that supported me. So I really do appreciate the the people who kept this going. But let's talk a little bit about the Dominion issue. I have focused way before this happened. I was talking about Smartmatic and Dominion and ESS and Heart and all these other electronic voting machine things. And I said, it gives us a unique kind of vulnerability that is even worse than if you've got the old classic voting machines that they would typically put in the trunk and drive around. I said, they have all these different levels of vulnerability that you can see when the CIA gets hacked, when the Pentagon gets hacked.

Don't tell me that these things are not going to get hacked. Don't tell me that they can't easily be manipulated from the inside. And if you do that, it is a lot of opportunity for corruption. And then, of course, where you come in, which is the auditing aspect of it. Talk a little bit about that and the difficulties that we have just from an auditing standpoint to know if an electronic voting machine has been hacked. Well, let me just preface it by saying when I heard Sidney Powell first talking, I said to myself, this lady might be 10 or 15 years behind the times because things have changed in the last five or six years dramatically with the mail out ballots, the mail-in ballots, and with not only a lack of ID, but the six swing states I looked at, for the most part, scrapped the signature testing. So my theory is, why would somebody bother with the cyber stuff in this era?

Well, let me give an example. Nevada, three months before the election with Trump and Biden, they gutted their regulations. Harvesting has no limits in Nevada. It can be done anonymously. It can be done for money. A guy theoretically could just walk in with 500 ballots and say, sign them all, because they don't catch those signatures and there's reasons for it i articulate those in the book their their method is ridiculous and there was an informal test done by the way a very clever reporter for the las vegas um review journal conducted a test and now it's just an informal test, but eight of nine bad signatures

went through. He had his friends write their own, to keep it legal, they signed the ballot envelopes, but they traced it in his style so that they knew it was not their normal writing they all went through anyway but there were actually reports and that's in my book there were there was a mail carrier who said i'm looking at thousands of these ballots sitting here what it's going to become of these they were finding them on floors they were finding them on mail uh areas of buildings so there was a yeah so they're everywhere i guess what i'm saying is you mentioned when you say you said they had mail out uh ballot election and i've called it that i said this was a mail-out election where they mailed out so many ballots that they had no control over where people were getting multiple ballots you might be somewhere that

was close to two jurisdictions get a ballot from both jurisdictions. And that was the thing that was completely out of control. And, and the, the, uh, the electronic voting thing has been there for a while decades, we've talked about the vulnerability of that. And I had said in the 2016 election, I said, well, I think the next one's going to be a hacking fest, but it changed because of the lockdown. And that was one of the things that I've been saying all along is that because they did the lockdown, because we had a lockdown election, because of Trump claiming it was a pandemic and we all had to lock down. That was the fundamental issue right there was doing this by mail. And, of course, that ties into all the ballot harvesting and things like that.

But there's no way for people to be able to verify those things, right? Well, some of it, though, is so obviously phony. Like in Michigan is a great example. Secretary of State Jocelyn Benson mailed out 7.7 million ballot applications. It had never been done before in Michigan. There was no basis in the law to do it. But the courts backed her up. But the point I'm trying to lead to is there was it's not like people to get a ballot would go up face to face and cough in somebody's face. This was all done remotely anyway. It's not like what was the reason for

this? You either did it through the Internet or you did it through an email or you did it through a text message. She had no basis to do that. Then, you know what she did? She followed up immediately by declaring that all her staff were to presume signatures were valid. So that's telling the fraudster, oh, there's lots of ballots around here. By the way, less than half of them were actually used. So there was 3.4 million extra ballot applications floating out there. And she's telling fraudsters, by the way, if you sign them, we're going to presume that it's legitimate.

That's totally unnecessary. She used COVID as an excuse, but there was no basis, in fact, for that. And they all do that. And I've been involved with third-party politics, and we have to get signatures to get on the ballot each time. You know, they'd have some high threshold of retention, ballot retention, so that if, you know, you had to get, like, say, maybe 10% of the vote for governor or for president to stay on the ballot. Very difficult for a new third party to do. So every time that didn't happen, you'd have to start all over again and do the signatures. They go over them with a fine-tooth comb. And, of course, we have seen this as well in terms of just like the recall election of Gascon in L.A.

They went over the signatures of the fine-tooth comb and threw them out so here in this state they say we'll just assume all the signatures are valid and we won't even bother to look at all of them that's the kind of fraud that we're seeing but let me ask you this of course you know as you point out the ballots are controlled on a state-by-state basis right every year thousands of people go to their very first concert. Our boosted signal at large events means they can always call a taxi to get home. Mom? Yeah, yeah, yeah. It was grand. Do you think you could pick me up?

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And I said, everything about this is wrong, that the states are in control of the ballots. There's not any ballots being shipped in from the federal government. There's not any technology to put blockchain watermarks on all these things either. So all of that was, was incredibly, uh, off the mark. Wasn't it? Yeah. I, uh, I think I know that I forget his name. The guy you're referring to is that.

Well, there were suspicious things, but not necessarily. Um, uh, yeah, I, I know what you're saying i know in fulton county they did have some whistleblowers who said wait a minute uh we saw a lot of ballots that looked strange that they didn't look like they had ink but they looked like they were printed with toner yeah but this was in a in a single county it wasn't a national thing that's right and the ballots differ from state to state and the ballots are officially in charge on a single county it wasn't a national thing that's right and the ballots differ from state to state and the the ballots are officially in charge on a state-to-state basis yeah i just wanted to clear that up so let's talk about uh the ballot harvesting we hear so much about ballot harvesting

and we hear that trump wants to do ballot harvesting now and you've got a an op-ed piece you wrote uh should the gp really do ballot harvesting? So tell people what ballot harvesting is first. Well, ballot harvesting, the distinction between a good ground game, which is perfectly fine and legal and has been done a long time, and harvesting is you never, with a good ground game, you don't get your hands on somebody else's ballot. You keep your hands off of other people's ballots. They put it in the mailbox.

They put it in the election center or they put it in the drop box. There are, and by the way, even if you take the 10 closest states in the last election, in all cases except for one, harvesting is still illegal, which is a good sign in a way because when i say still for the most part what i mean is there are minor exceptions like in some states you can harvest three ballots in other states you can have harvest the ballots of family members in other cases you can do it for somebody disabled in your family. But there are minor exceptions. These are not like you take 500 ballots and you stuff them in a box. Right.

And let me just insert here and say when I talk about the vote-by-mail election, how that turned everything upside down, I had somebody contact me and say, look, I'm disabled. I always do this. I said, no, we're not talking about that. You know, a kind of absentee ballot that is driven by process where you request it and they send it to you and there's some handshaking and stuff like that happening. And it is a small number anyway. That's not the issue.

The issue was this lockdown election and how this became essentially, you know, the major way that everybody voted. Right. Well, here's the problem for Republicans. This is why I strongly advise them against it. I'll start with the last one first, because that's the big one. They'll be prosecuted. Republicans forgot what's happening right now in Manhattan, where we have a prosecutor who is elevating a bookkeeping mistake. Because whether you call a nondisclosure agreement non-disclosure expense

or legal expense in this particular case there was no tax implication this was not anything more than a ministerial clerical error or or maybe deliberately to conceal something embarrassing but it wasn't uh malevolent and he's he's trying to elevate that and tie it into a federal crime that he doesn't have jurisdiction over to get a republican at the same time he's taking serious crimes and de-escalating them or diminishing them that's right so yeah we don't have a justice department that's fair anymore they're going to escalate it because of political connections they're going to escalate the minor situations into major felonies and vice versa right oh can you imagine how the media would have fun catching a republican harvesting ballots they would if he did two ballots they would make

it the biggest story of the week yeah and they And Republicans seem to think, you know, this is what happened, by the way, with January 6th to a large extent. People don't talk about this. But a lot of Republicans saw that Summer of Love that had just taken place seven months earlier. There was a horrible, if you want to call it an insurrection at the white house instead of the Capitol. And a lot of, I suspect that there, and I wasn't there, but I suspect that a lot of Republicans were saying to themselves, we're going to show those Democrats.

They think they can go rioting. We can be tough too. They didn't understand the double standard that was going to come down on them. Well, I'm here in Tennessee. And so we just had this situation where, you know,

he had some legislators lead a mob. They were pushing and shoving other legislators, trying to keep them from getting into the chamber. Then when they got into the chamber, these Tennessee Three got up there and took over the whole democratic process. And then look at the way this has been portrayed. This is some kind of anti-democratic thing, and the Tennesseeennessee three have been brought into biden's white house and celebrated uh they're not being put in a jail and tortured you know like the january six people have had similar things happen as well um in kentucky you know you had the the trans activists took over their their legislature the same same week so yeah there is obviously a a tremendous double standard and you're right if the the Republicans want to go in and do some of these things that are really questionable, and I think that they're corrupt.

I think you probably agree that as well. They'll look the other way when this type of corruption is being done by them. But they're not going to look the other way when it's done by Republicans. They're going to make it look like criminal activity. And it's not that hard to make it look like criminal activity because i think basically ballot harvesting is is designed it is criminal you see that's the thing uh there's no incentive to do harvesting unless you do it on a big scale but let me tell you the other all right so i started with the that one which republicans better remember that they'll be prosecuted but here's some other reasons year, thousands of people go to their very first concert.

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Innovate, the IT solutions people. They're not going to be good at it. Because if you really look at where the harvesting takes place it's among the homeless i mean you could homeless could vote 20 times because they're they're in one parking lot and there are cases where the one or two thousand people with the same address and when they and the democrats always say well yeah but those are homeless people they have a right to vote, too, you know. Yeah.

Right. But the trouble is, a month later, they're all in a different parking lot. And somebody's going around registering them again. So but who owns the homeless? They're all in the Democratic strongholds, those homeless. They're not in the Republican areas. The Republicans aren't going to recruit those people. And there's other factors. A big element, I don't want to get my mailman mad at me, but mailmen are implicated in harvesting. And there's been, I think in that article,

I may have cited John Levine, I think it was, of New York Post, read a great, you know, he got a great story. He found an anonymous harvester, big-time harvester, working for the Democrats for 20 years. And he talked about how he had mail carriers, plural, in his work crews. And if you think about it, why not? Who can do it better? Here's a mailman. He's going on his route and he says oh i've got this apartment here and there's five bills going to the same place and i know that oh there's only one that's valid i'll take the other and i'll make ten dollars on each one i got

forty dollars just on that one newman like seinfeld right newman the mailman he's not going to determine who's going to be president uh another area are the nursing homes because you know that the the disabled demented patients are taken advantage of sometimes and nurses tend to lean they're not super liberal but they tend if you look at the voting records they do lean to the left so i'm just saying it's not even going to work well forget it instead try to expose and you can expose the democrats you know how you do it offer rewards big money cash rewards i know some people will fight it and they'll say it's intimidation. But first of all, I start with a public announcement. All you can do this six months in advance of the election.

You put out public announcements saying, don't hand your ballot to anybody. In our state, that's against the law and you don't want to be participating in it and your vote may be altered. Then you also back it up with cash rewards. If you hear of this, there's a $10,000 reward for the conviction of somebody who is harvesting ballots illegally. And it's almost always illegal, like I said, except for minor exceptions.

So that is the way I think to go to expose. Now, then you have the problem, well, who's going to prosecute it? Because the Democrats don't prosecute their cases. One of the things I put, you know, there was a great, the public information legal, I forget, it's PILF, it's P-I-L-F is the acronym. As in pilfer? It sounds like filth, it's killed and they they did a great study in florida a few years a couple years ago where they found that there were 156 referrals made for election fraud and david do you know how many of those were followed up on and prosecuted in any way let me guess zero probably right zero yeah no investigations they ignored it now thank god that we have a florida governor now

who has formed an election force that's great and they are and they're doing magnificent work by the way don't believe those left-wing summaries. Go to their report in January of this year, of 23. After just five and a half months, the Florida investigative force for elections put out a report. And I'll tell you something, they've done magnificent work. And they got a big blockbuster, I think, coming up there's uh in um orange county which is orlando there is a black democrat former candidate who is uh blowing the whistle she says on for multiple years i think that decades even there's been a scheme going around in the uh where people have been hitting uh black residents or in buying their ballots so and they're working on that case so there's some

big potential cases but in most parts of the country those cases are totally ignored you think that uh in detroit in uh bolton, in Manhattan, they care about those. They'll ignore those cases. But you need, so I guess I was leading up to that, that you need, I was saying, expose the harvesting, and then you've got to find a prosecutor who will take it seriously. If you can't find a prosecutor, one thing I've just started to get onto is the power of the sheriff. The county sheriff has tremendous power. And they did, the sheriff in Racine, Wisconsin is the one that blew the whistle on the nursing fraud. It's major nursing fraud there in the 2020 election.

But the, and I didn't know this, I'm just telling you what I've learned fairly recently, that a sheriff is, first of all, he's an elected officer. He's answerable to nobody except the people of his district. And he's usually established his position in the constitution of the state. So he's got a tremendous amount of power and so people and already democrats are trying to mobilize a counter offense here saying uh governor so and so you need to uh rein in this uh rogue sheriff here or something but i i don't think they're going to find it easy because like you say they're set in the Constitution with certain privileges. It's a very powerful position, and I've been saying, because I'm fed up with all of the establishment politics,

I've been telling everybody, pay attention to who your sheriff is. And we saw this. I've been saying that for years. We saw this very clearly during the lockdowns of the pandemic and everything. They could make it a lot worse, or they could nullify even these rules that were coming from the state governor, and it's the sheriffs that can do that. No, we're not going to enforce that.

We're actually going to protect people. I talked just earlier in this show about a church in Illinois where Pritzker was horrible about the lockdowns, but the local sheriff was protecting the church to allow them to meet, and they put their deputies there on Sundays to keep the state police from bothering was protecting the church to allow them to meet. And they put their deputies there on Sundays to keep the state police from bothering anybody. So you can do things like that. It's a lot of power at the sheriff. They can investigate, and they have the ability to have those police actions.

The other part of this that we look at, and it's been there for a long time, and when I looked at all these different aspects of fraud, and of course, North Carolina, where I used to live, they had, still do, I think, the longest voting period of anybody. They had no IDs. And I've told the story many times about a friend of my brother-in-law's who went to vote on election day. And all you have to do is give them a name and an address, and they look up and say you've already voted and so does this other person at your address he goes wait that's my mom she's been dead for years and so that's the kind of fraud that happens you need to be able to vote early and vote often with these people so there's a lot of things that have been there for a long time that are very simple and they don't want to fix them you know at the time

we had republicans in charge these are rules that were put in by the democrats long voting periods and no id and stuff like that but we had a completely republican legislature republican governor they didn't want to change any of that stuff yeah the republicans were really slow to the dance here and uh one of the biggest uh you know in retrospect someday i think people will look back and say Trump's biggest accomplishment might be that he's fighting the election. I know there's mixed opinions on this, but somebody had to sort of wake the Republicans up to the fact that shake things up, that you have to start paying attention to these processes because we were like frogs in a warm pot of water that was getting hotter and hotter, and we were falling asleep. Yeah.

I mean, you've got to wake up. Yeah, yeah. Everybody goes to sleep when there's a Republican in charge, or they think they're in charge, who is actually in charge. You don't see. But when they think that the Republicans are in charge, they go to sleep. Talk about why there weren't any convictions, in your opinion for the election fraud you know they didn't do too well in courts we had the courts throwing it out saying uh as a candidate

you don't have standing to look at all this stuff i've looked at this for the longest time and and you know i was saying when this was all happening why do they keep going to the courts i mean certainly you would expect the courts would give them a hearing. They did over the 2000 election, we had the hanging chads and all the other kinds of stuff that went all the way to the Supreme Court and they did it pretty quickly. But this was distributed over several different states. So it was different in that regard, but they just got shut down everywhere. And so I looked at four states and they had razor thin margins. And I said,

so why don't they take their case? If they've got a case that they can prove fraud, why don't they take it to the state legislatures that are Republican in those four States that Republican legislatures, razor thin margin that went to Biden. And in two of the four States, they even had Republican governors. And I thought,

why don't they take it there? Because the state legislature can send a different slate of electors. And if they had done that, then, you know, as Thomas Massey said, if they'd sent two different slate of electors, if one of them had come from the State Board of Elections and the governor and another one had come from the state legislature, we could have a discussion as to which one of those groups we want to recognize. But it had to be sent officially and nobody sent, pretended to send another slate of electors. Looking for reliable IT solutions for your business? At Innovate, we are the IT solutions people for businesses across Ireland.

From network security to cloud productivity, we handle it all. Installing, managing, supporting, and reporting on your entire IT and telecoms environment so you can focus on what really matters, growing your business. Whether it's communications or security, Innovate has you covered. Visit Innovate today. Innovate, the IT solutions people. I think you're alluding to the independent state legislature theory, but don't you you think and i know you're an attorney so i defer to your judgment no i'm not an attorney oh you're not no no i thought you were no i'm an engineer but oh okay well that's better i'm glad to hear it dave i feel better

but you know um i i think that that theory has not been tested at the Supreme Court level, but it may be soon. As you probably know, the Supreme Court is considering a case. I think it had to do more with redistricting, but it may have implications for the election of whether a state, the legislature, could take control. I don't think in the aftermath of 2020, I i mean i think there would have been pushback so fast oh yeah it would have gone i'm just saying that that might have been one way they could get it to the supreme court right if you could convince the state legislature look you know here's our proof we got some fraud here they say all right we're going to send a republican slate instead of a democrat slate and then you know if uh you know thomas massey pence and other people

look at it and say well this is one we're going to recognize and the constitution says that the state legislature will set up the terms for the uh for the electors or whatever then the the court would have had to have heard that and would have had to weigh in on that i think and and look at that they may not have looked at the evidence they may just have looked at the point of law and said well you know which you know we're going to recognize, you know, are we going to recognize the State Board of Elections? Are we going to recognize the legislature? But I thought that they had a case there. But why do you think that they didn't, you know,

why did they strike out on the courts? When I first heard the independent state legislature theory, I thought it was kind of extreme and wacko. And I've come to believe more and more in it and i actually think it's a very could be a very positive thing and here's what i mean what turned me around was seeing the pennsylvania and the wisconsin supreme courts they made decisions so unbelievably abominable that i'm thinking what they basically threw their states to Biden. And I'm thinking, and I'll back that up real quickly, Pennsylvania.

Trump finally won the right to have observers after going to the court a couple times at the lower level. He won the right to have observers within six feet of a table processing ballots and the supreme court said no no no you have to stay back 15 to 18 feet in philadelphia the rest of the red part of the state you can have close observation but you can't have close observation in philadelphia now what kind of Supreme Court does that? And then they, I think we said already, when the signatures, when the book fire, the Secretary of State wanted the signatures to not necessarily be used, the Supreme Court takes it a step further and says, oh, no, you can't use those signatures to match anything. So Pennsylvania's got no standards at all. They gutted their election. And in my opinion, by doing that, they made it an invalid certification. So when I see these Supreme Courts like that,

and the one in Wisconsin, I won't digress to talk about that, but that was just as bad. I'm thinking, well, why should seven people on a state Supreme Court be able to throw an election like that? Why not have it so that you have the legislature step forward and say, we voted. The majority of our legislature says. That's you're not following election law. The Supreme Court of Wisconsin or Pennsylvania says, yes, that is our election law the supreme court of wisconsin or pennsylvania says yes that is our election law you take it then up the road up the federal court system so you go i don't know i'm not a attorney but you would start at the lower levels and work all the way to the federal because

that's basically what happened with uh gore v uh bush right well you know you have you have a divided government you have a separation of powers and that's true at Well, you know, you have a divided government, you have a separation of powers and that's true at the state level. And so you have the governor, you have the courts, you have the legislature, and then you've got the constitution says the legislature shall make the rules. That's the only guidance that we've got about that. But if you had a disagreement between, uh, the, um, you know, the state board of elections, which is, you know, they're on the governor's, uh, side and you've got a disagreement with the legislature. That sets up an interesting checkpoint of powers that might get you into a deeper discussion of what is there.

But let's talk a little bit about, since your book is about auditing and you're an auditor, you know, debunked and auditor reviews the 2020 election let's talk a little bit about uh the the impossibility of auditing and the things that have been done to keep you from being able to do a real audit yeah well election people don't even know what an audit is they uh you know how they think it's counting we countinging is the end product. Well, we start with a risk assessment. We look at the external threats. In the case of the election, there were a lot of those. There were all those 19 bellwether counties that extra votes over the previous election. That normally means he wins. Those are external threats. It's valid to consider them. They're certainly not proof or even evidence of fraud. That's for sure.

But those are the external threats. There's internal threats we look at, too, which might be like a complicated dominion machine that nobody has a right to look at because of proprietary restrictions that would be called a an internal threat and we look at those threats and we say how significant they are and then we say well what kind of internal control system does the election center have to fight those like do they for example rigorously well first of all do they have ID no they don't have ID do they check signatures no they for the most part the six the six weeks they did not check signatures and I could go down the list I won't waste your time on it but um so their systems were terrible I mean just terrible systems You know what really riles me?

I'm sure you know John R. Lott, Jr., the PhD who works on election issues. And he put out a great study a couple of years ago comparing, well, basically what the 47 countries of Europe do. And every single one. Last year, it was all but one. Part of Britain did not have ID required. But now they even moved to it starting January 1st of this year. Every single one of the 47 have ID. And I believe it's all but one is photo ID.

And it's really crazy because they're so focused now to an extreme of having biometric identification. They want a global digital ID. They wanted vaccine ID and passports and all the rest of the stuff, but not for voting. That's not suspicious at all, is it? When you got to do it to cash a check or whatever. I mean, but they don't everything except for voting. You want to fly on a plane? You got to show me your ID, you know?

Well, you want to hear a real hoot. The Democrats always act like their people, voters can't figure out how to get ID. It's going to be too confusing for them. That's right. Yeah. In Georgia, Georgia from 2016 to 2020, their rejection rate for bad ballots dropped to one. Eighteenth, so if this is if this is it in 2016, it's one eighteenth as much in 2020.

But here's what's really significant. That's the statewide fulton county the the stronghold for democrats that's in atlanta right it's near atlanta right they uh it dropped to just 14 of the state rate so those marginalized citizens who don't know how to do anything they were seven times smarter when it came to filling out their ballots apparently seven times smarter than the rest of the state it's you know so obvious what happened there they were just letting all the ballots slip through no matter what oh yeah signed unsigned any defect didn't matter no address didn't matter you know when i was in texas i did a report there about the State Board of Elections,

and the guy that was running it had worked at the Rose Law Firm, you know, where Hillary Clinton was. And they brought him back, and he was brought back by a Republican. I think it was Rick Perry who brought him back, because they had a long list of Republican governors. But he came back under Rick Perry. under rick perry and every election uh he would tell every one of the uh counties uh don't keep a an image a facsimile image of the ballots just get rid of all those things and in the constitution it said they had to keep them but he would send it out every election and say uh don't don't retain those things so we don't even have anything to look at, let alone, you know, and that's what is happening in most cases, right?

There's not anything that you could go back and even take a look at. As you're pointing out, you've got different risk assessments, internal and external, and you would audit things like that. But I mean, even if you wanted to go back and do a recount, you know, they don't have the stuff where you can get an honest recount. Well, you know, I digress a bit. The next step after you do all that analysis is that then you'd plan some tests. You'd say, well, this, but I want to say something. In some cases, you stop right there and you never go a step further.

In other words, when you hit, I give this analogy sometimes. Imagine you have a pizza shop where they have no record system, but they have a big cardboard box in the middle of the room. And they sell some pizza. They throw $20 in the box. They need some sauce. They take some money out and buy some sauce. And all year long, that's going on.

And at the end of the year, they say, hey, Joe, we need our financial statements audited. No, it's not auditable. I don't care what you do. We don't count anything. I don't care how much money is in that box because it doesn't mean anything. That's really what you had with these six swing states that I looked at. And it's meaningless when you have unsigned, when you have no ID and you have no real signature standards. And let me say one more thing that's on my mind about signatures. Even under the best of circumstances, signatures mean nothing.

There's a test I cite in another article. It's something else I'm about to write. Where they compared how well professional signature examiners do to non-professionals, and non-professionals are what we have in our election centers. The non-professionals had a failure rate of 38%. And you know how they fail? They tend to, they said the professionals tend to focus on the differences between two sets of signatures. The non-professionals tend to focus on the similarities.

So they tend to have these level one mistakes where they overmatch. They think that everything matching when it's not matching. So signatures mean nothing. Get that out of there. So when you look at this thing and the the record system is so messed up you would as an auditor you would just say well that's it uh there's nothing that can be done that's right but if you if you did say well all right i can work with this then you'd beat the heck out of those transactions you'd be you'd be uh getting a thousand of this type of balance you'd be test retesting signatures you'd be actually and by the way the very best test the the test that i

recommend for republicans to use use canvassing of residences not of people necessarily but of residences so in other words you select like 800 houses. This will ferret out the harvesting. You select 800 houses in a systematic way so it's representative of the whole county. And you knock on doors and you have a list of all the people who supposedly voted by mail according to the county, because you can get that list. So you supposedly voted by mail according to the county because you can get that list so you say well according to the records you voted by mail in the last election is that true and you're going to get a certain i guarantee you a certain percentage of say no and but it's very important to do it right away before memories fade you want it accurate if you wait six months people will legitimately forget what the heck they did

so you got to do this like in the days following election but that's what the cyber ninjas wanted to do in maricopa county by the way remember that audit but they were blocked big time uh carolyn maloney jamie raskin merrick garland all came down on them with both feet and said, no, you will not. It's intimidating. Even though this is months after the election, it's intimidating to voters. But that's the way. To be fair, if you want to get it representative, you're going to have to go to the graveyards as well, right? Absolutely.

You're going to have to pull them as well. Let's talk, though, about what we've talked about what's wrong let's talk about what needs to be done on the theory that the republicans would be interested in doing it okay um well i've got to ask a question are we talking about republicans are in control or the democrats are in control of the state well let's say the republicans are in control of the state what needs to be done say the Republicans are in control of the state. What needs to be done? Okay. We can talk about both of them, but let's start with the Republicans. Okay. Yeah.

Obviously, you want to get the ID in there. You want to ban harvesting completely. Mail-in ballots, okay, but you got to have a reason, like you're disabled or you're traveling. So these are just reasonable things um uh you can still keep signature standards as an addition to the id requirement but that's all you know just as an addition um let's see i would have a uniform shorter voting period would you put that in there yeah i was gonna i'm just about to get to that i was going to say a uniform period for voting with a uniform cutoff as well as a start, too. And as for the machines, I would never allow a vendor to say, you can't

look at our machine. It's proprietary secrets. You know, I would make that when you bid out those, if you're going to use the machines, frankly, I don't even think some of these counties need to have machines at all because, you know, accounting isn't such a big part of the process. So all these are big adding machines. They're very expensive and complicated. Yeah. When you look at the thing, we look at the, uh, they have people who go around and look at the, um, uh, slot machines and the casinos. And, uh, I don't know how far they're able to get in there, but I imagine it's probably

not nearly as, uh, uh, sealed off a black box as it is for the voting machines. Yeah. They compare with these, these things, but yeah, I, I would look at it. I mean, my ideal solution would be just hand ballots. Everybody votes on one, maybe two days, and you've got a holiday, you know, so that you've got – because I understand that some people, if you make it on one particular day, some people can't get off of work. So you make it two days. You make it a weekend or whatever.

You give people a holiday, and everybody votes at the same time. I always talk, Joe, about the situation when the American government ran an election in Iraq. They had it on the same day. They didn't have a good way to ID people. So when you vote, you get your thumb painted purple and you couldn't wash it off, right? And that's how they kept people from voting multiple times in different places. You could do something. So they know what it takes to have an honest election. And the State Department will typically look, this is another thing, I don't know, in terms

of the exit polls, the State Department will look at the exit polls in a country's elections and what was officially reported. And if they see more than a 5% difference there, they'll say there was fraud. But you never see, you know, we have one agency that does all of the exit polls, and it's pooled for all the media. And they'll give them demographic crosstabs, and they'll say, well, you know, this many people who are white

or this many people who are black or male and female or, you know, the one-armed people they they voted for this candidate that can't but they'll never give you the total because they don't want you to compare the total to what was actually reported the exit poll total versus the official poll well you were saying if there's a discrepancy of so much in the exit poll you know that reminds me of something too remember I was talking about Georgia and how they dropped from what from the 118th of of the rejection rate of of 2016. any I you were saying what would you do to make better controls I was I put a provision and any change in rejection

that goes that big triggers an automatic audit yeah you that was 78 000 votes in georgia that election was only 11 800 the margin and you've got 78 000 changed just by rejection rates by another was the discretion of the people counting the ballots that's not an election that's just baloney i mean yeah and then in Fulton County, it was even more. You know what it dropped to? If you compare the state 2016 rate to the Fulton County, one, one hundredth and twenty-eighth. It's hard to even say, but imagine more than 128 parts. It dropped to one of them.

That's so obviously fraudulent that, you know, people don't want to hear that word. They say, that's not proof. No court's going to say that. It's proof to an auditor of something seriously wrong. That's right. Seriously wrong. But do you want me to get into what to do with the Democrats? Yeah, let's keep going with that.

Yeah. So we got that for the Republicans. And I would, you know, my preference would be to see hand-counted hand ballots and to have, as you pointed out, a close observation where people are watching it. That's the way they do it in Europe as well. I remember when they had Brexit and they were counting ballots and you had people who were, you know, standing over them watching this stuff, not standing over them, but, you know, close enough, five or six feet away from the table. They're not going to interfere with them, but they can see everything that's going on clearly. You know, that reminds me of something too. That's another

change I would make is have a bigger period between the election and the certification. Because the standards we have worked when people walked in, 90% would walk in, they signed their name in front of somebody, and it was was pretty quick it really was mostly just counting now it's more than counting because you've got all these baloney ballots coming in unsigned no id you've got to examine them i mean frankly the whole system's atrocious but it takes time how is anybody going to launch a lawsuit or an investigation in two weeks or something? Some of the states have incredibly short periods. It's very it varies a lot with the states.

Yes. But anyway. All right. The Democrats are in control. This is tough now. And there's no easy solution. But first of all, you got the fox guarding the chicken house. OK, so you have to have some very tough-skinned observers

including a lot of lawyers going to these districts because it was it was sad i felt bad for the people i mean in detroit in uh in some of those there were several areas fulton county was one detroit was another there was about four or five cities where those people needed helmets. They were being abused terribly. You should see the hundreds. One of the things Sidney Powell did right, she did a lot of things wrong, but she had like 100 affidavits. And unfortunately, all her crazy talk about certain things distracted from it.

But she had a lot of testimony under oath from people or affidavits, I should say, under oath from people citing the same thing that they throw out a Republican observer and the whole room would cheer, including the paid workers. And there were racist comments made about them. And they were really intimidated and that's got to stop yeah so but anyway that's the first thing is tough thick-skinned observers next thing is documents start requesting the vital documents with your right to know your freedom of information whatever the terminology, right away, before the election's even over, like, put in your request, we want the chain of custody documents. You know, in Arizona, 740,000 ballots were not covered with any chain of custody document. I mean, you're taking it on faith. 740,000. And that's a verifiable fact,

thanks to Verity Vote in Pennsylvania. They did a great job on that. So that would be the second thing is to documents, to get those important documents. Then the third thing, which should start right away, is the canvassing. If you can find a tough auditing firm, and I have to admit, auditors tend to be little worms. As the image says, I don't think they want, you know, if I weren't retired, I'd have a hard time writing this book because my clients would be attacked. They would be told, hey, why you this horrible uh election denier doing your books for you why are you doing that he shouldn't do your audit he's a he's a monster so they don't want to get involved even the big firms you know they just don't want to get involved but if you

can if you can't get them get some very credible retired people with a great at you know great images and integrity so that no, but because there will be attacked, but they've got to knock on those doors and ask people about that voting. That's the only way to attack the harvesting and the phony ballot through the mail votes. Well, that's the same kind of thing we saw throughout this,

this pandemic. You know, if you've got a doctor who's got a different opinion from the, the official narrative or whatever they're get, they attacked they lose their job they lose their career they lose hospital access and this is one of the really i think frightening things that's happened to our society it really is a totalitarian approach you know people understood that you in the days of silza nitson you know if you criticize the government you're going to lose your home you're going to lose your job you're going to to lose your job. You're going to lose everything.

That's what they're doing to people. And if we, each of us stand down because of those threats against us, that's when we lose. We only can get through this if we stand up one by one. And I know a lot of courageous people have done that in different places, but that's not what most people do. They will succumb to that kind of pressure. No, there's a lot of mandates and everything.

Yeah. Well, writing this book, I mean, my first, the first two months, I just tried to grab all the information I could because I saw it disappearing. I mean, because, you know, YouTube started striking everything off. Yeah. And it's terrible. I mean, a lot of of i imagine there's a lot of people who don't realize what's going on because they're not trying to get that i mean if

you want you know it's like what were they saying on twitter that after elon got it he he discovered there was all this child porn going on and stuff that that was okay but on the other hand talk about vaccines or talk about elections was was banned from twitter i mean it's a crazy world that's right oh yeah and it's okay so what else to do uh if you can do an audit now nobody's going to let you do an audit but the unless and skip back to your comment about the legislature, they might have the authority and they did, for example, in Arizona, have the authority to have Dr. Shiva Ayyaduri. I don't know if that's a name you've heard. Yeah, I've interviewed him. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. He's a brilliant man. I mean, he just proved that the Arizona audit was a fraud. I mean, he proved it because he assembled a panel of six people, three professionals,

three non-professionals to examine 499 sample signatures, compare them to the registration, and they found 12% didn't match. 12%. That is extending it out to the Maryland population of Maricopa County. That's 204,000 votes in the election decided by one 20th as much 10,000. Wow. So 20 times more. And you know what? You would.

I could almost hear it in my head what the Democrats would say. They said, yeah, but Joe, those would be cured. We cure. That's their word. The jour now is curing ballots, which is the phoniest thing. They think that you could, well, let's say you cure 90% of them. You still have 20,000 phony ballots in an election decided by 10,400. I mean, there's no way that was a solid, that should have been certified. And I never will go to the point of saying Trump won because, as I said before,

to an auditor, if something isn't certifiable, you stop there. You don't say, but I think maybe it was this, or maybe, you know, I can't really certify this, but I think they made a billion dollars. You don't do that. You just stop. And so I'm not going to say who won that election. People can make up their mind who are the ones cheating. But I'm going to say that, okay, what else can you do?

The audit, if you can. And the last thing I think I'd recommend is that reward strategy again. We're not using rewards. Some of this corruption can be ferreted out because you know something, harvesting usually is a multi-person operation and those people will rat i mean you're going around a lot of people know what's going on the reason i remember i said i told you about orange county orlando that black democrat woman and i say your race only because this was all done within the black community and she was pointing that out she because this was all done within the black community, and she was pointing that out. She said this was a black thing that they were targeting black

voters, and that's why she couldn't, didn't feel she could win in an election there. This has to be stopped, but there was a lot of people who knew about that, a lot of people, and believe me, if you dangle a $10,000 reward, some of those people would have stepped forward years ago and blown the whistle on it oh yeah i agree yeah the thing is though that reward is going to have to come from the legislature and even then they're going to get uh they're going to get sued by the justice department or something like that because if you go back and you look at what would the the amazing case of this guy who was convicted of you know trying to manipulate the election because he put a joke meme up there, you know,

Oh, by the way, don't forget to vote on Wednesday type of thing. Right. And the other side, again, as you're talking about, don't,

don't try what the Democrats do because you had Democrats who were doing the same thing. Nobody even said anything about it, but this guy puts it up and they call it election interference and convict him on that. So if you put up something there and say we're going to run a reward, that better come through the legislature or they're going to come after any individuals with that. It truly is.

We're in the final stages of an unbelievably corrupt and totalitarian government. That's the real takeaway from all this stuff. I mean, we've had so many problems with elections for such a long time. And as I've told people, the corruption in elections begins with a two-party system that determines who even gets on the ballot and who gets to have a debate.

And now we've just had both Trump and Biden say, no, we're not going to have any debates this time. So it's amazing. Before we lose time here, again, the book is debunked and auditor reviews the 2020 election and people can find your articles at western journal is that correct uh they're western journal they're at american thinker i have at least as many there and i have a substack account it's joe free dot cpa at substack or something like that okay

by john substack as well great talking to you thank you so much appreciate it thank you dave the david knight show is a critical thinking super spreader if you've been exposed to logic by listening to the david knight show please do your part this dangerous information to spread farther. People have to trust me. I mean, trust the science. Wear your mask. Take your vaccine.

Don't ask questions. Using free speech to free minds. It's the David Knight Show.