The David Pakman Show - 5/5/23: They won't stop on trans, another arrest likely

Episode Date: May 5, 2023

-- On the Show: -- Florida Republicans pass anti-trans bills related to bathrooms and gender-affirming care -- Donald Trump is likely to be charged with another crime this summer, this time over his call to Georgia election officials pressuring them to "find 11,780 votes" following the 2020 election -- Caller talks about the US lifting the COVID vaccine requirement for international travelers -- Caller argues there are only two genders -- Caller thinks Republicans are only consistent in being racist and sexist -- Caller doesn't suspect Ron DeSantis can win his fight against Disney -- Caller wonders why so many of the show's live callers are men -- Caller asks if any Democrats could beat Joe Biden in a 2024 primary -- The Friday Feedback segment -- On the Bonus Show: The Friday Bonus Show hosted by Producer Pat 🦛 Happy Hippo: Use code PAKMAN for 20% off at https://happyhippo.com/pakman 🌱 Ounce of Hope: Get 25% OFF with code PAKMAN at https://www.ounceofhope.com/ 🪒 Henson Shaving: Use code PAKMAN for FREE blades at https://hensonshaving.com/pakman -- Become a Supporter: http://www.davidpakman.com/membership -- Subscribe on YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/thedavidpakmanshow -- Subscribe to Pakman Live: https://www.youtube.com/pakmanlive -- Follow us on Twitter: http://twitter.com/davidpakmanshow -- Like us on Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/davidpakmanshow -- Leave us a message at The David Pakman Show Voicemail Line (219)-2DAVIDPApril 20, 2023

Speaker 1 In addition to some of the bills we already talked about that Florida has passed relating to trans people and don't say gay and so on and so forth. There was one that I just didn't get the opportunity to talk about on the show. In fact, I think much of the discussion around it happened when I was when I was away. The Florida legislature has ultimately passed this very extreme anti trans bathroom bill, as well as a ban on gender affirming care. And the details of the bills are all of the things that you would imagine it would penalize providers by putting criminal penalties when gender affirming care is given in certain situations. It would take licenses away from providers. It would prohibit Medicare from

covering gender affirming care for trans youth or adults. It prohibits public funds. It's sort of like the full package that they've tried and sometimes done on abortion over the last 20 years going in the direction of trans. Now, there's a particular detail about the debate that I want to look at with you. This is not new. This happened. This happened a couple of weeks ago, but it's just an extraordinary reminder of the insanity that is taking place in Florida. I'm going to play a clip for you here of a Florida Republican representative, Webster Barnaby, who said during a completely bonkers rant debating HB 1521, which is the bill that we're talking about here, criminalizing trans people for using restrooms that correspond

to their gender identity, all these different things I mentioned. He refers to trans people as mutants, demons and imps reminiscent of sci fi characters, including X-Men. If you can imagine, listen to listen to what's happening in Florida. I'm looking at society today. Yeah. And it's like I'm watching an X-Men movie. Okay. With people that, when you watch the X-Men movies for Marvel comics, it's like we have mutants living among us on planet Earth.

Ugh. And, you know, some people don't like that, but that's a fact. It's not. We have people that live among us today on planet Earth. That are happy to display themselves as if they were mutants from another planet. This is some of the most vile and disgusting language that has been used by elected officials during hearings on this issue, these issues. This is the planet Earth where God created men, male and women, female. Wow. I'm a proud Christian. Oh, I didn't read. Oh, he's he's a proud Christian. Oh, well.

Oh, so then we have to accept any completely unhinged, hateful rant from him. I'm sure conservative Republican. I'm not on the fence. There is so much darkness in our world today. So much evil in our world today. So much evil in our world today. And so many people who are afraid to address the evil, the dysphoria, the dysfunction. I'm not afraid to address the dysphoria or the dysfunction. The Lord rebuke you, Satan. Exactly what you would expect to hear during a discussion of law in a civil government that separates church and state would be for an elected official to

rebuke Satan as part of his political philosophy, completely normal stuff. And all of your demons and all of your imps who come and parade before us. That's right. I called you demons and imps who come and parade before us and pretend that you are part of this world. Right. So I'm saying my righteous indignation is stirred. I am sick and tired of this.

We are too. I'm not going to put up with it. You can test me and try to take me on, but I promise you, I'll win every time. This is the DeSantis agenda with sort of a violent Christianity laced through it. You mix it up, spit it out, and this is what you get. Now, as a matter of just, you know, noting, if you're listening, the distinguished gentleman Barnaby happens to be black. And so we have an individual from a historically marginalized group in society, marginalizing another marginalized group from society, which just really warms the heart, doesn't it? The bill ultimately did pass. And this is an example of what some Floridians have representing them. This is the ideology

that we see. Really, really tragic, sad stuff. Yet another Donald Trump arrest now appears to be almost certain this summer. Let me explain that. We've been seeing some of this news for a bit now. It now seems pretty clear. Vice News reports Trump's next criminal charge is practically on the calendar. Let me explain. Former this is from the article. Former President Donald Trump's second criminal indictment looks all but certain to go down this summer. You could even mark it on your calendar between June 11. I'm sorry, July 11 and September 1st. Why those dates? Because Fulton County District Attorney Fannie Willis,

Fannie Willis, no matter how I pronounce it, someone writes to me saying I'm saying it wrong. Fannie Willis has formally asked local officials to beef up security during that window when she plans to announce charging decisions in her long running investigation of Trump's attempt to reverse his 2020 election defeat in Georgia. She wouldn't need all that extra security if she weren't planning to go after Trump himself. Former prosecutors and legal experts say Titus Nichols, an Atlanta area defense attorney and former prosecutor, said, quote, The Fulton D.A.'s letter makes it almost certain that Trump is getting indicted. There is no reason to send something in writing, no other reason to the sheriff. So let me tell you what this is all

about. Several weeks ago, Fannie Willis's office did send a letter to the sheriff indicating requesting additional security during this next period that will contain whatever decisions are made with regard to Trump and Georgia. That period of time is July 11 to September 1. And as former prosecutors, lawyers, others are saying, and as just casual observers of this are saying, why would she make that request? Were it not because there is going to be a decision made to arrest Donald Trump and that there is going to be a similar circumstance that plays out in Georgia as what we saw in New York City? I think that that's pretty likely, you know,

that if we want to make a sort of differential diagnosis of the facts, you could say, well, in order to not show her hand early, she is requesting the extra security regardless on the idea that there might be agitated people, whether or not Trump is charged or something along those lines. Maybe like maybe she says, well, if I charge Trump, his supporters will be furious and they might show up and be violent. And if I announce I'm not charging Trump, people who want him charged will show up and be violent. The reason that's hard to believe is we've seen no evidence. There's no reason to believe or fear that people who think Trump should be charged are going to show up and be violent if

he isn't charged. We just I just don't there's no reason to think that that would happen. So I do think the most likely scenario is Trump is going to be charged in Georgia. This is not going to impact his existing supporters very much in all likelihood. The question is, is it going to impact Trump's ability to be out and campaigning? If now with another arrest, another indictment, another pending trial, if this all starts to get in the way of Trump being able to just go and campaign. It may start to make him an unappealing candidate. The counterpoint to that is there absolutely are MAGA people on the right, on the Republican, in the Republican voting rolls who will actually be energized if Trump is arrested

again. They will feel that he is being scapegoated. They will feel that he is being, you know, and remember, the key word is feel. They will feel that he is being targeted for political reasons rather than he did things. No former president has ever, ever, ever done. The Georgia case in particular is interesting because it is arguably where the most serious and most relevant charges may come from. And there are other prominent Republicans that are wrapped up and tangled in the Georgia mess, Lindsey Graham and so many others. It is not yet clear even whether or not Trump is charged. And it looks like he will be. That may not be the full list. There may be even more Republicans charged. The fake elector scheme required dozens of highly placed people.

So this could actually be a major, major takedown of a number of conservative figures speaking legally, of course. And as always, you all know I am for law and order and I actually am for law and order. If there is no evidence against someone, they should not be charged. I don't want anybody charged for political reasons, reasons of retribution, revenge or whatever the case may be. If there is no evidence, then do not charge people. What I want is for the justice system and for the investigations to happen unfettered, unconstrained by political meddling or whatever the case may be.

Look at the evidence, compare it to the laws and then make a charging decision that should apply to Trump. It should apply to Biden, Hunter Biden, Hillary Obama, people who work locally, people who dog walkers, McDonald's employees. This should be the standard that is always applied. And I am consistently for that. So the news is almost certainly Trump's getting arrested again. If and when it happens, we will have it for you. It is the Friday show in the sense that it's Friday and this is the show. We will take a very quick break and continue right after this. offering super quality lab tested kratom kratom, also known as Mitra Gina Speciosa, is an herbal leaf from Southeast Asia known for its soothing and uplifting properties. We've talked about it on the show before. Some people compare it to coffee, others to CBD,

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happy hippo dot com slash Pacman coupon code Pacman saves you 20%. The info is in the podcast notes. The David Pacman show continues to be an audience supported program. What that means is there's no major corporate funder of our show that comes with a lot of great benefits, including that I just decide what's on the show and no one can coerce me or convince me to talk or not talk about whatever the downside is. We do depend on your support to do what we do, But we have a great system for that called membership. You can sign up at join Pacman dot com. It takes mere seconds and you can use the coupon code. Twenty four starts now. If you'd like to get a discount off of the cost of your membership, sign up at join Pacman dot com. Let's get to the phones, which we do via discord on the Friday show.

David Pakman dot com slash discord. Join the discord. It's free. It's a good time. But let's hear from some people at David Pakman dot com slash discord. See what is on people's minds. Let's go first to Nelson from Bethlehem. Nelson, welcome to the David Pakman Show.

Nelson, welcome to the program. Oh, I apologize, David. I had pushed a talk on. Thank you for taking me first. I actually just had one question and I want to know if I could get your thoughts on some breaking news. Sure. Um, what is your opinion on the United States government taking out the mandates today for the, um, uh, uh, international air travel?

You don't have to be COVID vaccinated anymore. The U S took that out for incoming travelers from other countries. Yes. And federal employees and the such no longer have to be covered vaccinated. I saw that and I was really surprised. I thought it was supposed to be a permanent thing. I think the White House put out a thing on it. You can see it.

I believe that it all ends on May 11th. Yeah, let's see. I've actually got it here so we can be precise. U.S. COVID-19 travel restrictions to be lifted. May 11th will be the last day for multiple restrictions, including that international air visitors be fully vaccinated. Listen, I don't know what my medical opinion on it is. I can tell you that politically I get why it's been done, why it is being done. And I also you know, if we are to believe that at this point in time, the vaccine doesn't prevent transmission, then in a sense, I get it right.

It's sort of if you want to protect yourself from becoming seriously ill, you get yourself vaccinated. But if it doesn't reduce transmission, then why does everybody need to be required to be vaccinated? I think the risk of it is in an ideal world, Nelson, at some point we will have a covid vaccine that does prevent transmission. And at that point, no longer having the tool of requiring it could be a missed opportunity to actually reduce transmission of the virus. But that's a future looking question. Yep. Well, I completely agree, David. Well, thank you for having me on first. And shout out to my good friend, soft gentleman.

He's also listening, but he can't call in right now. So David, have a great day. Nelson from Bethlehem. Very powerful stuff. What was that? The soft something. I don't know what that is. I don't know if that's a listener of mine.

Let's go next to Will from North Carolina. Will from North Carolina. Welcome to the program. What's on your mind? Hello. I know that your focus is largely electoral politics, but I was wondering if you have any comment on some means of affecting progressive political change outside of electoralism, like maybe labor organizing or mutual aid in your community? Just any thoughts you have on that?

Sure. I think that if all we're doing is voting and then tuning out for four or two years, that is a huge missed opportunity. And this is unfortunately, you know, the right understands this will. That's the thing the right understands. We're going to raise hell at school board meetings and we're going to try to get involved in municipal requirements. And you know, this recent idea of let's ban trans people from dressing in line with their gender identity, that they're the Department of Agriculture, I guess, in Texas is trying to put that in place. The right knows how to get involved in all of this other stuff.

And I think it's critically important that the left do it as well. And whether it's, again, school board, city councils, events in communities, all of these things, dealing with police policy. Right. Get making yourself heard when there is the possibility of changing police policy within a municipality. We've got to be doing all of these things. And importantly, you know, Neil Postman wrote about this. OK, we vote and then we watch all this news about Russia and Ukraine. As interesting as it is and as as important as what's going on in Russia and Ukraine is in affecting people's lives there.

What are you or you or you going to do about the situation in Russia, Ukraine? And shouldn't we redirect some of the time that we're focused on issues that we will never impact? Shouldn't we redirect some of that time on our local communities? So I'm with you 100 percent. I will. Thank you, David. Have a great day. All right. Will from North Carolina. Great to hear from you. Let's go next to Deshaun from Atlanta, Georgia. Deshaun, welcome to the program. Deshaun, please. Speaker 4 Hey, hello. Speaker 1 Hello. Speaker 4 How are you doing today?

I'm doing well. Speaker 4 Good. Good. I had two questions for you. Sure. Speaker 4 So one, how is your feel or outlook on that kid that got sent home for having a shirt that said there's only two genders? I don't know where that happened.

Where did that happen? Speaker 4 It genders. I don't know where that happened. Where did that happen? It was it. I don't know. I saw on Instagram some some kid. He wore a shirt to school and people were saying that they felt unsafe and that he was he was being like a distraction or something. What's your opinion?

Here it is. Seventh graders sent home for wearing T-shirt that said there are only two genders. This is a 12 year old and we don't have to say the kid's name was removed from gym class and told to take off his shirt because people were complaining it was making them feel unsafe. He refused. They called his father. His father ended up having to pick him up. Listen, I don't I don't know how I feel about this. You know, on the one hand, how involved do we want to get in how kids dress at public schools with no dress code? Obviously, they can't wear things that are obscene, I guess, would be the law. The question is, is that an obscene shirt? I agree that it could be a shirt that is deeply troubling and offensive to people.

Is it obscene? I don't know. So I'm not sure about the legal base. Wait, wait, wait, wait. I have a question. What's what's what's what's what's the what's the problem with it, though? You said that you said that there was something wrong with wearing. Well, it's not that I said that there's something wrong, but like, I'll give you a scenario,

right? Imagine that you are a trans person, right? You were you're biologically male, but you are trans. You identify as female and you are starting to, you know, dress and style yourself the way women traditionally do in modern society, I could see how seeing that shirt is going to cause you stress and anxiety and potentially make you feel unsafe because it's a very like, listen, I'll give you an opinion. But I'll give you back, though.

I mean, he he got sent to he got sent home for wearing a T-shirt that says a fact. Well, hold on a second. You can't nothing wrong with that. That's just his. That's just his. You know, I'm saying. Hold on a second, Sean. But let's wait a second. Let's just wait a second. Hold on to Sean. You're switching. You're you're jumping between saying the shirt is a fact versus people's rights. Let's pick one of these things to focus on. Right. Because you're jumping all around. All right. All right. All right. So let's let's let's just let's just put this a scenario. OK. Yeah. Let's say I go to school and and I go to school and it says I wear a shirt that says there's only boy and girl. All right. What? Tell me if tell me if that's a legitimate reason for me to get sent home. Yeah, I'm I don't know that it is a legitimate reason to be sent home.

Like it doesn't feel like. Well, hold up, Deshaun. You're not even letting me talk, though. No, I'm letting you talk, bro, but I'm just I'm just trying to get, you know, I'm saying no, but every three words you're interrupting me. Here's the thing I'm struggling with. Uh, I am close to a free speech absolutist in that I really don't want to be restricting the speech of individuals unless there's like a very clear reason to do so.

And when we talk about clothes being worn in school, my tendency would be to say, let's let's not get involved in schools making those decisions. I'm thinking of let's just think about another shirt that someone could wear. Right. Like I'm a Jewish person. Imagine that I'm 12 and someone wears a shirt to school that says all non-Christians are going to hell. It's certainly not an illegal shirt. But as a Jewish person, I'm going to see that and say, wow, that's a lot of damn hostility towards me based on my identity. Does this person know my identity or not? Am I safe? Is this going to be a comfortable learning environment? So, you know,

Deshaun, if you listen to my show, you know, I'm not big on trigger warnings or any of this college being a safe space thing. But I'm struggling with what should be allowed in a middle school for sure. I don't know the answer. All right. I mean, that's that's a reasonable that's a reasonable answer. Now, can I ask you a question, Deshaun? Oh, yeah, sure. Go ahead.

I mean, I thought I was asking a question, but yeah, go ahead. Well, you know, we can both ask questions. That's the beautiful thing about independent media. Would you agree separate now from biological sex? Do you agree that people express gender on a spectrum? I'm not asking your opinion of whether it's good or bad. Do you just agree that people express their gender? I agree. I agree that if you have a certain belief of biology and your science stands on it and you have that sort of belief, then you can stand by it. You can stand by what? That's my. On biology. No, but let me ask you, can I rephrase the question? You can't because there ain't no spectrum on biology. I'm not. That wasn't my question.

Is it OK if I just restate my question a different way and then you can answer it or not? OK, but I have a second question that I didn't I didn't ask it. Let's get to that in a second. Let me just first just to make me feel good. Flatter me. Let me ask my question one more time, OK? So how do you what what you mean by that, bro? OK, yeah. OK, go ahead. Indulge is maybe what I mean. Would you agree that the rock Dwayne, the rock Johnson and the fashion designer Isaac Mizrahi are both biologically male? Would you agree with that?

I mean, the rock is a man and whoever I don't know the other person, but if they're a guy, then yeah, then they're a man. OK. Would you also agree that despite both being biological men, they express their gender very differently, where the rock expresses significantly more masculinity, while Isaac Mizrahi expresses more what we might associate with femininity. Would you agree with that?

OK, yes, yes. But but listen, no, but hold on to Sean. Does he hold on? Hold on. His identity. No, but I'm not saying anything about biology. Hold on. Whoa, whoa, whoa.

Hold on. Well, the difference between expressing and what you are. But I'm all I'm asking you is you can you can express yourself all you want. See, the rock can express itself as as a dress wearing. Yes. But Deshaun, like, all right. OK, now we're going to know. But now that you're swearing, we're going to have to bleep. So we can't just please don't. Oh, I'm sorry. I'm saying Deshaun. All I'm saying is my question was, do you agree to the PG? Do you agree that gender is expressed on a spectrum? And you agreed with the example I just gave that that's true. I'm not

pushing any other belief on you other than that. Speaker 4 Bo, what's your what's your idea on a spectrum, though? I don't understand Speaker 1 that biological men express different levels of masculinity and femininity in their expression. And so do biological women. That's all. That's all I'm saying. You agree that gender is expressed on a spectrum.

Well, people express their gender in different ways. I mean, you can say you can say you're a man, but then on the other hand, you can act like you're like you're not a man. OK, I'm saying. All right. I think I got it real quick. What was your other question to Sean? And oh, yeah, this was this was actually a very, very important question.

What do you think about. Women, trans women going into sports playing against other women. OK, I've addressed this a thousand times. I think in a lot of sports it doesn't matter. I think we do need to figure out why does it not matter? Well, there are certain sports where physical strength is not the sort of determining factor of advantage. But I agree that we need to figure out in certain sports how to handle that. I don't know the answer. I think it's a tough question and I don't have an answer. I think it does have to be figured out. Speaker 1

It that it is. It is actually because you know how there's the WNBA and there's the NBA like there's a there's a reason. Speaker 1 Yeah, but I'd agree with you, Deshaun. I agree with you on basketball. I'm agreeing with you on basketball. I would agree with you. I don't I don't know what we do. It seems we need to figure that out. Speaker 1 So is it is it now? Is it now that we have to make a transport sort of league thing? Like, is this what we're going to have to do? Like, you understand what I'm saying? I do. That's an idea that's been proposed. Women manhandling women. I'm saying that that's just

ridiculous. All right, Deshaun. Thank you so much. There's Deshaun from Atlanta. He's acting like my views on these issues are totally different from what they are like. Yeah, we got to figure that out. I mean, in some sports, I'm not sure what you do. We've talked about do you have to look at does there have to be some medical consensus about whether I don't know in some sports what we do. I'm not pretending that we've solved that. So there's no reason to, you know, put pretend like my view is something other than what it is. Let's go to David from Philadelphia. David from Philadelphia. What's going on today? All right. David, I'm sorry. I know you don't. Don't do that. Sorry.

Do you hear me? Yes, I can. OK, cool, cool, cool cool cool first off i just want to say i listened to that whole deshaun thing um i disagree with everything he's saying he's full of it he's just like live your life the way you want you know if you identify as a woman it makes no never mind to me if you identify as a man makes no never mind to me. Fair. So anyway, I keep hearing you talk about how conservatives and MAGAs, they only subscribe to their principles when it's convenient for them and drop it once it's inconvenient. Correct. Right. Well, with some with some principles. Yes. I'd say all of them when it comes to, you know, when it comes to capitalism, free market or with free speech or with limited government, like all of them.

Once it's inconvenient, they drop it. OK. Yeah. I mean, with a lot of those issues, you're absolutely right. Yeah. So if we take that to its conclusion, would you say the only principle these MAGAs are consistent with is a white supremacist patriarchy where rich old white men are on top and everybody else and everything else is exploited, exiled or eliminated while the rich old white men just consolidate and get as much power and money as possible? Listen, that's absolutely the case for some parts of the American right wing, but not for all of it. And I don't think we gain anything or advance our cause by painting the

entire modern American right wing as a white supremacist with a white supremacist brush. So I think you're correct that the vast majority of the white supremacists who want to put white Christian men at the top of a hierarchy are voting more for Republicans than Democrats. That I agree with. But saying that that's what the Republican Party, what the entire right wing is at this point, I don't think it's productive, nor is it completely accurate. OK, I I appreciate that. Also, let me apologize for sounding a little pretentious. I've been doing a thousand things at once and I'm just trying to get all of this out there. So it kind of sounds a little, I don't know, combative. Thank you. I appreciate that. I watch your show

all or listen to your show all the time. And, uh, you're one of the better, um, one of the better, uh, podcasters out there. You're very, very pragmatic. You believe in one thing, but you understand the reality of the situation. And I appreciate that. And like, not to knock the Young Turks or Barron Cousins, but they're very, you know, why isn't this the way it's supposed to be? And I appreciate that you understand why stuff isn't the way it's supposed to be, even though you wish stuff would be the way it would be that way. All right. David from Philadelphia. Very much appreciate the call. Let's take a very quick break. If you're holding on,

hold on, because we're going right back to the phones in a moment. One of our sponsors today is Ounce of Hope, giving our listeners 20 percent off. Ounce of Hope is an aquaponic cannabis company and a small business that supports the David Pakman show. If you're not familiar with aquaponics, what they do is sustainably raise fish and they use the nutrient rich water. Folks, we're talking about fish poop here to feed the cannabis plants. It's really a cool concept. It's organic. It's symbiotic. And what ounce of hope offers you is a wide range of high quality cannabis products. They have CBD. They have more recreational products made with Delta eight and Delta nine THC. Their products with THC are psychoactive, producing the type of buzz associated with

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The info is in the podcast notes. All right. Let's hear from a few more people. We take calls via discord at David Pacman dot com slash discord. Let's go to Skyler in New York. Skyler, welcome to the program. What is on your mind today? David, how's my audio? It's beautiful. Great.

So I wanted to ask you about the ongoing battle between Disney and Ron DeSantis. Yes. On one hand, I do tend to agree that Disney as a corporation is way too powerful. And the idea that they can basically self-govern can be a bit of a red flag. And generally, there are a lot of other aspects about Disney that are damaging to the free market, to labor, to the environment.

On the other, I'm really enjoying how Disney continues to humiliate DeSantis and the amount of L's that they keep handing him. Now, I don't really think the Santas is taking some sort of principled stance in this whole battle. It's obviously just cultural and over the don't say gay stuff and Disney allegedly being woke. But I'm curious, David, where do you fall in this whole battle? I think that I share your concerns with the idea that a corporation can essentially work as a self-governing entity. I don't like that. I think it's not a power that should be delegated

to corporations. And with that, I agree 100 percent. I do believe that DeSantis and this anti woke movement has overplayed its hand as it applies to Disney. And more generally, there's polling that now I've discussed a number of times that shows that the majority of the American public, it's not a huge majority, but it is a majority actually falls on the woke rather than the anti woke side on a lot of these different issues, including trans LGBT, et cetera. So I believe that it is a bad strategic decision for DeSantis in Florida to target Disney not only over issues where the majority of the country is actually with Disney, but also

because Disney is so beloved. You know, I hate theme parks, but a lot of people love them and people like the Disney characters and the movies and all that. It seems like a bad decision to pick a fight with Disney tactically as well. Yeah. And, you know, my biggest like I don't know if it's a concern or just observation is is obviously the continued escalation over what being anti woke actually means. You know, I don't know where it ends. Like at this point, we're having a whole war on like Western society and culture, whether it's education, whether it's medical science,

whether it's, you know, culture and religion. I just I don't know where the end point to this. So let me address that. If you ask people on the right, they would say the anti wokeness ends when we defeat wokeness. My view is that's never going to happen because the country has become more and more woke. I mean, when you if we think about wokeness as sort of like enlightened left wing ideas, the country keeps moving more and more in that direction. So I think anti wokeness ends as those ideas become less and less common. And when Republicans realize they're not going to win with anti-wokeness, then they'll move on to the next thing. Yeah, it's interesting how a lot of the,

you know, sort of corporate wokeness that gets derided by the right, by big corporations tends to typically only exist in the social sense and that a lot of times this corporate wokeness doesn't really trickle down to like improve progress or progressivism around labor or equitability. 100 percent. And that's because for a lot of these corporations, they're just taking the view they determined to be more socially palatable. And it's because that's what's most profitable. Exactly.

All right. Well, thank you very much for taking my call, David. All right. Thank you. Great to hear from you. There's Skyler in New York with a very interesting and important issues being being brought up. Why don't we go next to I hope I pronounce this correctly. Is it Tiku in Los Angeles, California?

Tiku. Tiku, welcome to the program, please accept the invitation to join. I'm here. Welcome. What's on your mind today? So I have been listening for quite some time since last year, and I've noticed that a lot of the callers tend to be men. And I was wondering if just like by way of data or insights from being in the industry, if you have any insight on why that may be. Yeah. Shows like mine, the Young Turks and others have significantly larger male audiences than they do female audiences. It's in all of the demographics that applies to all of our shows. Even shows like this with female co-hosts still have overwhelmingly male audiences. And that's reflected in the callers, I think. And and part of it is

what what the demographic data seem to show is that women are less likely to get political analysis from online left wing independent media shows than men are. Interesting. Yeah. OK. And then a final question just for you as a media professional, I wanted to hear kind of even though this is sort of politics adjacent, your take on the strikes that are happening. Speaker 1 The late night writers. Well, listen, we actually talked about this on the award winning and world famous bonus show earlier in the week.

The thing about the strikes is the demands are obviously they were not able to come to an agreement over salary, but it's really more complicated than that. And so much of the money being made on these programs is now coming on the back end through archives and streaming and asynchronous viewing. And writers don't typically have a provision in their contract that compensates them for that. So they are saying now that the initial audience that watches it live on TV is only a fraction

of the total audience. Since we don't get any of the back end, we need more money up front. I think that's a totally legitimate claim. It's a reality about the changing media landscape. So I think they're they're completely correct in their desire to be paid more up front. Great. Well, thanks for taking my call. I also don't watch any of those shows, so it really doesn't bother me if they're off the air. There you go. All right, Tiku. Thank you. I appreciate the call. Sure. What is that finish? Is that a Finnish name?

No, it's a name my mom made up because it's easier for Americans to say than my actual name. Oh, OK. Fair enough. All right. From Los Angeles. Crystal clear. Thank you very much.

Appreciate that. Why don't we go next to Patrick from Vancouver? Patrick, welcome to the program. What's on your mind today? Hello, David. How are you, sir? I'm coming to you with tears in my eyes enough to flush the toilet 10 to 15 times. Very good. I am wondering about today about your opinion about

investing. Well, I mean, so ESG investing for people who don't know is investing that takes into account the environmental and social impact of the companies that you are investing in. Generally speaking, there's two views on this. One view is if you focus on ESG, you're going to get an inferior return because the most profitable companies may not adhere to whatever is sort of like en vogue at the time in terms of adhering to environmental and social issues. So it's a perfectly fine way to invest, but you're just going to have a lower return. The increasing counterpoint is that over the medium to long term, the most profitable companies will be the ones that are environmentally and socially

conscious so that actually it's the best of both worlds. You're doing a good thing morally and ethically, and you're also going to get the highest return. Honestly, my view on this is not a morality view. It's informed by my by my views generally on investing, which is I don't think I'm good at picking stocks. I don't think most people are good at picking stocks. I'm going to invest in the broadest index that I can. And if I'm invested, like I was going to bring up like ESG index funds, but like the problem is like their management fees are significantly higher than high management fees. But my view on this, Patrick, is if over time the court, all companies in a country are going to move more in the direction of stricter environmental and social standards by investing in the broadest possible

index fund over time, I'll get more exposure to that ESG aspect anyway. OK. So it just it was just the market, the market like for like, you know, for something like, I don't know, an S&P 500 index, it will just adjust over time. I would go even much broader. I would go with a total stock market index. Yeah. OK.

So, like, I shouldn't feel bad about, say, investing currently right now in a in like, you know, a total stock market. That's a different question. Whether you should feel bad or not, I can't tell you. Maybe you do feel. I mean, listen, you know, Noam Chomsky was confronted a few years ago and they said, you know, you make all these criticisms about corporations and all these different things, the environment and social responsibility. But then you've got your retirement money in the same index funds everybody uses. And Chomsky's response was basically like, listen, I'm an activist for

the things that I believe are right. But at the end of the day, am I going to keep my money under my mattress? That doesn't make any sense. There are obviously more options now than just mattress or oil stocks. But, you know, that's Chomsky's view. OK, thank you very much, sir. All right, my friend, thank you very much for the call. Always, always great to hear from our friends to the north. I'll be back in Canada soon. It'll be extraordinarily exciting, I'm sure. Let's go next to Thomas from Vietnam. What time is it in Vietnam?

It must be. Is it like 2 a.m. or something like that? I don't even know what time it is there. Thomas, please unmute yourself so you can tell me what time it is. No, boy. Thomas, yourself, me. There you go. It's almost midnight here. Almost 10 to 10 to 12.

I love it. What's going on today? All right. So we've Joe Biden going to join the race for the election. Who do you think is going to be the next nominee for the. Democrat Party, I believe it will be Joe Biden. But who would challenge Joe Biden on a on a primary would be the most likely candidate, do you think, to to win or to challenge?

To challenge Joe Biden on the on the primary for the Democrats? I mean, I think it's the people that are currently running. It's Marianne Williamson and Bobby Kennedy Jr.. It doesn't seem like there's a big appetite from serious Democratic contenders to challenge Joe Biden. I don't think we're going to see that. Right, but do you think who would, you know, be postly the biggest challenge to Joe Biden at the moment? Oh, if they ran, who might really be able to challenge him in a serious way? Right. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's what I meant. You know, I have two views on this. One view is. Another center left Democrat who's just younger and more energizing,

but who isn't too far left would do best. So like that would be an argument for like Gavin Newsom. If Gavin Newsom challenged Joe Biden, it's someone who's not very far to Biden's left, but he's energized and he has an approach to dealing with Republicans that might be more appealing. But on the on the other hand, the name recognition isn't really fully there. And I don't know. The other perspective is the way to challenge Joe Biden most effectively would be balancing being truly on the left, as some define it, and being more well known. So that would point to someone like Bernie Sanders, who is even older than Joe Biden, even though people want a younger

person rather than an older person. But but Bernie would be the person who would be able to eke out the most support. My instinct is if today you say to me Newsom enters or Bernie enters, I think if Bernie announces today, he immediately picks up more support than Newsom would against Biden. That's my view right now. Not enough to win, not enough to win, but more support than Newsom would get. Right. Personally, I would love Newsom because I love his energy and. Hello is his eloquence as well, and and his he and he provides the amount of of tenacity that I think the Democrats really need to to step up to the to the competition against the. The Republicans, I love Newsom's tenacity. I love the way he says we need to be ruthless and all of those things. I don't know

that he yet has the name recognition to even have a shot in hell against an incumbent president. But in an open Democratic primary could be a different story. Right, right. OK, thank you. That's it for me. All right. Thomas from Vietnam. Very good to hear from you. So great to hear from anyone that called in and also anyone who called in but wasn't able to talk to me. We will take calls again. And I so look forward to speaking with you next time. We'll take a quick break and be right back. I've had such trouble finding a great razor where I am not cutting myself or getting those nicks on my skin, which are so common with the cheap disposable razors. You have to meet our sponsor, Henson

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We will start with William Sutherland, who suggested via a YouTube comment to my entire audience. People go watch Jimmy Dore, someone who talks truth, not this BS. And you know what? If this comment resonates with you, I am not going to try to convince you otherwise. One of the things I'm actively not going to do on the program is try to convince people about why or whether they should watch or listen to me or anybody else. If to you, if you go over to Jimmy Dore's channel and you say, you know, it looks to me like Jimmy Dore is telling the, quote, truth and David Pakman is, quote, lying.

That's great. Go watch Jimmy Dore. Leave me alone. I'm not going to be offended whatsoever. OK, I would love for you to do that. Marvin Whitler commented on YouTube, quote, To be a atheist, you have to acknowledge there is a God for you not to be live in. Therefore, you're wrong. You're not an atheist. This is painfully stupid. If I don't believe in purple unicorns. Does that mean that I there must be a purple unicorn out there somewhere for me not to believe in it? No, that doesn't make any sense whatsoever. This is the type of nonsense that ends up becoming a meme and repeated and repeated and repeated. And if you take one second to think about it, you realize it doesn't make a shred of sense

whatsoever. To be an atheist, you have to acknowledge there is a God. No, you don't. Doesn't really make any sense. I'm sorry. OK. Grimace posted to the subreddit about my book recommendation Waves of Rancor and says David mentioned this book on a show last week. I was able to hunt down a copy. Holy cow. Reading this book is eye opening. It was published in ninety nine. And the stuff they talk about, how the far right are indoctrinated is insane. They still use the same techniques today.

I highly recommend that I would buy a used copy or find a means of getting a less expensive digital copy. This is fantastic. This really you know how it's like you can you can get anything right now. You can find any random book. This book is genuinely tough to get. I ended up getting a used hardcover copy. Looks like an old school library book. I think it might have been a library book at some point. And I didn't I didn't remember the book was from ninety nine. I thought it was even older. If you want to trace how right wing media got to

where it is today and right wing indoctrination got to where it is today. You have to understand how it started. And this book, Waves of Rancor, goes back to the way in which talk radio originally ended up on AM radio, the degree to which right wing religious broadcasters sucked up a bunch of the licenses for broadcasting all the way through and into Fox News. If you really want to understand how our media got to where it is today, such an important book. And I love that Grimace was able to find a copy. Also from the subreddit, Matt

Lately says, does anybody else reflexively say truth central or Lauren Bobear? I watch too many of his meaning my videos that the wrong pronunciations are permanently stuck in my head. Yeah, the same thing happens to me sometimes when when Trump goes at a speech and he says they should really be investigating Biden and Hillary and even Obama. Obama. I will sometimes almost feel like Trump got it wrong by saying Obama instead of Obama. They are they're extraordinarily meme worthy little snippets. And I apologize if now they're in people's heads in that way. OK, also from the subreddit. This is from a user named Cool Customer. This gets me back to do people watch what I watch the videos before commenting? Do people listen to

what I say before commenting? I recently did a segment about Bobby Kennedy Jr.'s candidacy saying this guy's an anti-vax dude. He's using pro Putin talking points. No one should vote for him. And yes, I once had dinner with him and we have mutual friends. Look at the post that showed up on my subreddit. David shouldn't whitewash Bobby Kennedy Jr.. I understand there is a personal progressive connection there, but in my opinion, David shouldn't cover for his anti vaccine history. He didn't become anti vaccine during the pandemic. He's been anti vaccines 2005. In fact, he runs one of the largest vaccine disinformation campaigns, children's health

defense. He's done an inordinate amount of damage to public health. OK, so anyway, the point here is that did you even listen to what I had to say? I didn't whitewash it. In fact, what I said was, despite the fact that this is a little awkward because I've met Bobby Kennedy Jr. and we had dinner once and we have friends in common, his candidacy is a disaster. He's an unmitigated anti Vaxxer. He's going on TV. He went on Tucker before Tucker was fired and used pro Putin talking points. This is a disaster. And by the way, Steve Bannon loves

the idea of Bobby Kennedy running as a, quote, chaos agent. And it's all the nonsense. I didn't whitewash anything. In fact, I said, despite personal connections, I think that this campaign is an absolute and total disaster. So please criticize me for things I've said, not things I haven't said. The Bobby Kennedy candidacy is a disaster, without a doubt. OK, John commented on YouTube. Just remember, the same people who want to ban clothing they don't think is appropriate are almost always the same people who wanted to ban masks during a worldwide deadly pandemic. It's more about their personal feelings over those of anyone else. Yeah, this goes to this idea that Ben Shapiro talked about the idea of

banning people from wearing clothes that don't align with the traditional clothes worn by their gender. And I explained it makes absolutely no sense. And then the Department of Agriculture, I believe it was in Texas. We talked about it last week is looking to put in a policy where you have to dress in accordance with the traditional clothing of your gender. It is, you know, the same people who talk about how great freedom is and liberty and government not getting involved in people's lives are now saying we're going to decide what you wear. They are the same.

To some degree, they are the same folks that were saying no masks, ban masks, whatever, and then going to leave them asking to a personal choice, but not the clothing will decide what clothing you can wear, but leave the masking to a personal choice. These aren't serious people. That's really, at the end of the day, the most important thing to understand. These are not serious individuals who bring real thought to the table. They reflexively will say whatever they think at that particular moment is useful to achieve whatever immediate goal they have, even if it conflicts with whatever they said

a week ago. A user, Sassy Nana, asks a really great question about these ideas of sending homeless people to encampments outside cities for rehabilitation of different kinds. Sassy Nana says, how do you rehabilitate a homeless single mother who works full time at Subway but can't afford an apartment? And of course, that is an absolutely accurate critique of this idea that Trump has about we're going to get them seen by doctors and psychiatrists and we're going to get them off drugs and all these different

things. Tons of homeless people are working or very recently were working, and either way, sending them outside of a city will either make them unable to continue working or make it dramatically more difficult for them to get a job anytime soon. It's a disastrous idea. The homeless encampment idea has recent examples of how it's failed and more distant in history examples of how it's failed. It's inhumane. The conditions always become ridiculously, humiliatingly bad, dangerously bad. And the crowd cheers whenever Trump brings it up. So it is very, very scary stuff. If you have anything you want to say, feedback on the show, criticisms, praise, whatever, you can email info at David Pakman dot com or leave a comment on any of our various

social media platforms. We have a fantastic bonus show for you today. The show doesn't have to end right now. If you're not a member, there's no more show until next Monday. If you are a member, we have the bonus show coming right up. You can sign up at join Pacman dot com and make absolutely sure that, you know, the coupon code indicted is available to you. And I think it's a it's like a 50 percent discount off of the cost of membership. Join Pacman dot com. See you on the boat. If you love chilling mysteries, unsolved cases, and a touch of mom-style humor, Moms and Mysteries is the podcast you've been searching for. Hey guys, I'm Mandi. And I'm Melissa.

Join us every Tuesday for Moms and Mysteries, your gateway to gripping, well-researched true crime stories. Each week, we deep dive into a variety of mind-boggling cases as we shed light on everything from heists to whodunits. We're your go-to podcast for mysteries with a motherly touch. Subscribe now to Moms and Mysteries wherever you get your podcasts.