The David Pakman Show - 6/13/25: Trump voter in tears, Tulsi makes it all up

Episode Date: June 13, 2025

-- On the Show: — Trump’s top economic advisor admits they’ll probably extend the tariff pause again — because Trump can’t make a real deal to save his life — Tulsi Gabbard claims protesters are paid actors based on fake Craigslist ads, while actual Trump events do the same thing — A Trump-voting Florida roofer breaks down on camera after ICE detains six of his legal workers — and now he’s learning what accountability feels like — Trump prepares to unleash military force against peaceful protesters at his $45 million birthday parade — fascism doesn’t arrive with jackboots, it shows up in a suit and a smile — Trump spreads bonkers conspiracy theories about “fake” protests because he can’t accept that millions of people genuinely oppose him — We break down how Democrats keep failing with young men — and how they could actually start winning them back — A DHS official straight-up admits Trump deployed troops to California without legal authority — proving the constitutional crisis is already here -- This week's Friday Feedback -- On the Bonus Show: Senator Padilla manhandled by DHS security, Israel strikes Iran, and much more... 🪟 3 Day Blinds: Buy one get one 50% OFF at https://3dayblinds.com/pakman ⚠️ Ground News: Get 40% OFF their unlimited access Vantage plan at https://ground.news/pakman 👂 MDHearing: Use code PAKMAN to get a pair for just $297 at https://shopmdhearing.com/ 🛡️ Incogni lets you control your personal data! Get 60% off their annual plan: http://incogni.com/pakman 🔊 Babbel language learning: Get up to 60% OFF at https://babbel.com/pakman -- Become a Member: https://davidpakman.com/membership -- Subscribe to our (FREE) Substack newsletter: https://davidpakman.substack.com/ -- Get David's Books: https://davidpakman.com/echo -- TDPS Subreddit: http://www.reddit.com/r/thedavidpakmanshow -- David on Bluesky: https://davidpakman.com/bluesky -- David on Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/davidpakmanshow

Welcome to the show, everybody, as we are on the eve of the biggest protests of Donald Trump's second term, probably the biggest protests of Donald Trump's presidency. We have top Trump staffers admitting Trump's running away from his own policy. Scott Besant, the secretary of the Treasury, was answering questions this week about the tariffs. And Besant says we're probably going to see another extension past the 90 day deadline. We are now governing by Trump chickening out and running the country off of imposing and then pausing tariffs. Add infinite item as the kids like to say.

Take a listen to this. He gave an answer that was frankly all over the place and difficult to understand. We're less than a month away from Liberation Day Part 2. Very few of the trade deals have been announced yet. I think most people in Congress and around the world would like to know what's going on. Should America be preparing for Liberation Day 2.0? What do we plan for January, July 9th and July 2nd? I would say, as I have repeatedly said, that there are 18 important trading partners. We are working toward deals on those.

And it is highly likely that those countries that are negotiating or trading blocs, as in the case of the EU, who are negotiating in good faith, we will roll the date forward to continue the good faith, we will roll the date forward to continue to good faith negotiations. If someone is not negotiating, then we will not. I'm hearing that Trump does always chicken out. 90 deals in 90 days. We're still waiting on one damn deal in 130 or something days and the country is running right now off of a series of repeated pauses of tariffs.

And we still don't have any real durable deals. Now one funny moment. Congressman Gomez sort of brought up Elon Musk body checking Besant and Besant just kind of played it like, oh, some of the reporting on this hasn't been right. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Secretary, how are you doing? So far, so good.

OK, I was just curious because I know Elon Musk body checked you at the White House. I just know I know. I see Elon Musk. You know that. That's why I heard. So you believe you believe what you read on Breitbart is telling us, Congressman I didn't know it feels too sensitive for you. I won't ask that question, but Let me know I will take South Carolina over South Africa any day. Wow

Wow shots fired there by Besson and then maybe more substantively and just as terrifying Congressman Bayer asks about economic data and GDP data. And Besson doesn't seem to acknowledge reality that GDP was down in Q1 and it may be down in Q2. We don't yet know. Marcus reacted positively is when the administration is in retreat from key policy areas. I want to say given your successful past, isn't this embarrassing? Is there a question there, sir? Is it question? Isn't this embarrassing? Oh, it is an embarrassing.

Well, I'm sorry, congressman, but you, they seem not to have seen the economic data. The, we've had the GDP growth has been quite substantial. Job growth is solid. GDP growth is half what it was last year, sir. The job growth is solid. And we had Job growth is a third what it was all last year, sir. No, no, no. And private sector job growth especially. And if you'd like to talk about

inflation, would you? The inflation has been coming down. Just the inflation is good so far. We will see every economic thing I read, which is much every day, suggests the impact of the terrorists is not. Well, why don't why don't we look at the data rather than the hysteria, which is how I made my career. And of course, not acknowledging that GDP is down and it may be further down. One of the really important takeaways, I think, is I really with this economic data stuff

try to abstract myself from the politics of it. Let's think about who can give us information that we can count on CBO in terms of scoring tax bills or whatever the case may be. And let's go to the primary data and we can then ask the political questions. What policies led to this or what sort of economic ideology is wrapped up in the White House right now that could either help or hurt this? We do all that stuff, but we start with the numbers and the numbers are GDP growth was negative in Q1. And in about five weeks, we're going to know the outcome for GDP for Q2. And it just feels painfully dumb, painfully

dumb to not even start with the facts. But that's where we are right now. Tulsi Gabbard appeared on Fox News to make all of it up. And she is now diving into the conspiracy theory that will later see Trump dive into that the protesters in Los Angeles and elsewhere are getting paid. Now, I'm going to listen to her explain it to you. We're going to listen to her explain it to you. She's the director of national intelligence. But it's important to mention, number one, we still have no evidence that the protesters are getting paid. And number two, why would they need to be paid?

What's taking place is so vile and disgusting that, of course, people are protesting. People are furious. Take a listen to this. The bottom line is they don't care about the American people. They don't even care about the people that they're claiming to protest for. So many of them are paid protesters. This thing is being orchestrated, obviously, in many ways. And ultimately, President Trump is the one who took action to keep the American people

safe and try to bring peace back to the streets that these rioters are destroying. What can you do? The bottom line is they don't care. What evidence do we have of that? Well, she hasn't presented any. I'm going to tell you the type of evidence they're talking about. And she mentions it here.

Here is Tulsi saying there's an investigation into Craigslist ads. Listen to this. Can you tell us about the orchestration, the financing and is Gavin either whether he knows it or not actually siding with the cartels here? Whether he knows it or not, he is certainly again, this is something that the Department of Justice and the FBI is looking into who is funding these protesters. We've seen, you know, the ads put up on Craigslist offering people thousands of dollars a week to go out and conduct these violent and dangerous riots.

Let's talk about the Craigslist ads. I don't believe these Craigslist ads. I think they're bullshit. I'm going to show you an example. Here's one that somebody sent me. OK, this is not a Craig's list ad to get people protesting in L.A. This is a Craig's list ad to get people filling seats at Trump's parade on Saturday. It's obvious bullshit.

OK, these are provocateurs. When you look at it, there's a few signs that this is nonsense. Number one, you look at it, there's a few signs that this is nonsense. Number one, you look at the compensation. It says each seat filler at Trump's parade will be paid a thousand dollars in crypto by an LLC called Fight, Fight, Fight LLC. You know, no one would pay a thousand dollars per person if you were doing this. It's just ridiculous. Even if it was five hours, that would be two hundred dollars per hour.

Very few people make two hundred dollars per hour and they don't make it for standing around. The other thing here is that when you look at the details, it says you will be provided a red hat to wear, making it, of course. So it's a Trump MAGA hat, but we're not really saying that. And then it also says we encourage people of color and ethnic groups to sign up for maximum perception control that you would never include if you were looking to recruit black and brown people, OK, to fill seats around Trump or his parade. You wouldn't include for maximum perception control in the ad. So there are these Craigslist ads for seat fillers and protesters on both sides to make

Trump look bad and to make the protesters look bad. It all the whole ads on Craigslist thing seems to be complete and total bullshit. Now, if that changes, if Tulsi figures something out that differs from that, I will tell you. All right. Things are getting very real very quickly. I'm going to play a video here for you of a Florida roofing company owner, Vincent Scardina, who voted for Trump, supported the immigration crackdowns as he understood them. And he is now in tears on camera because ICE just detained a third of his staff.

The men are Nicaraguan, no criminal record, valid work permits, asylum claims pending. They've done everything right. But that didn't stop ICE. Why? Because Stephen Miller told ICE to go scorched earth and deport as many people as possible no matter the context. Trump said, oh, we're going to be going after the hardened criminals. But they're just doing raids across the country, home depots of just people looking for honest

work. And here is Scardina stunned that the monster he voted into power is now coming for his employees. Look at this. You've lived in Key West for how long? Forty four years. Vincent Scardina is the owner of the roofing company where they worked. He's owned it 37 years.

It's going to be really hard to replace those guys, says losing these six men is losing a third of his workers were not able in Key West to just replace people as easily as say a big city, very limited people to pull from and then you would have to train them and that takes sometimes years. But for Vincent, it's much more than that. It's financially as well as emotionally. It takes a toll. You get to know these guys. You become their friends. Just not an employer, but a friend. And you see what happens to their family. It's quite a shock. Given his support for the president, we asked what he would tell the commander in chief

if he had a chance. What happened here? This situation is just totally, just blatantly not at all what they said it was. Vincent, you voted for Donald Trump? Yes, I did. While he agrees with most of the president's policies, he thought the Trump administration was going to focus solely on deporting criminals. Yeah.

You know, something about Trump and Homan and Miller and all of them saying this will be the largest deportation program ever. Something about that didn't get through to him. It seems immigration officials, he says, are just trying to me quote us now. Buyers remorse. I don't know a little bit. How much damage does this create in your community? It's not just happening to me. I mean, it's happening across the board. I

know of one landscaper that lost nine or 10 of his the whole crew he had, and he's just totally out of business all of a sudden. He wants his workers released and yearns for normalcy in his community and for the families of the men. Many argue wrongfully. All right, you get it. But he voted for it. Right.

So listen, this is tragic, but it's very revealing. The truth is that this was always the plan. Trump didn't really hide the agenda. The cruelty was the point of it. From day one, it was about making life unbearable for immigrants, whether they're here legally or not. We've been warning people. We've been telling people over and over again that businesses will suffer.

And so when I hear Scardina say this isn't what I signed up for, the answer is it is what you signed up for. You didn't know that this is what you were signing up for. You thought the hammer was going to drop on somebody else. And this is like one of the big maga lies you believe you come to believe Trump's going to unleash chaos, but it's only going to affect other people. I'm going to stay safe, but it's now crashing through his business. It's crashing through his life, his friends as he describes them.

And this is only going to get worse. So do I have sympathy for the workers? Of course I do. They did nothing wrong. But for the boss who voted for this crap, thinking it was going to hurt other people, that's not buyer's remorse. That's accountability. And we now are realizing that the fears that this would be bad for businesses and this would be bad in so many different ways. It's all completely true. Now, I know that many of you are going to be out protesting this this weekend at the no Kings Day protests. That's phenomenal. I believe these protests are going to be absolutely massive. As Senator Brian Schatz told us yesterday, we need to self-police.

Brian Schatz told us yesterday, we need to self police. And so we all know that if there's any looting, any violence, any fights, this is what the right wing media is going to seize upon. I'm going to be at these protests tomorrow. Producer Pat said he would be, et cetera. We need to police the movement. What do we do about provocateurs from the right that show up seeking to make it seem as though the left is doing this stuff? Well, we got to police that as well. OK, so I am cautiously optimistic that these protests are going to be huge. They're going to make noise.

They're going to be seen. I hope to run into some of you out there. And then, of course, on Monday, to some of you out there. And then, of course, on Monday, we will do a full debrief and analysis. But one of the things that's critical to understand is that the fascism is here. It's in a different form than you might have expected it. But the fascism is here. And I want to really dig into that contextually and historically. After this short break, I am not exactly a wizard at building and fixing stuff this short break. I'm case, the quote is free with no obligation and their expert team will then design, measure, and install everything.

So you just sit back and relax. You don't have to do anything. I love the new window treatments that three day blinds got me for my office. It looks great. Schedule your free, no charge, no obligation consultation. You'll also get there by one, get one 50% off deal on custom blinds, shades, shutters, David Pakman, dot com slash Pacman. The link is in the podcast notes. You know, every time we call out Donald Trump's authoritarianism, the right calls it media hysteria. But I want to remind you that Trump admits he's looking for ways to defy the constitution

and maybe even pursue another term. Now, if you don't know the bias behind your news, even ability to understand and undermine constitutional norms. I've been with ground news for years now because this is what they do. They expose the hidden agendas behind reporting sources and make it easy to compare coverage and understand critical issues. Even better, if I'm reading a story on another site, the ground news browser extension will flag the sources, political bias, and give me other reports on the same story so I can verify the information. in David Pakman, com slash free membership. And for those looking to get their own, you can use the coupon code. It will end soon to save about 50 percent. We have to stop pretending and acknowledge that we are seeing fascism.

We have to just say it the way it is while making it clear. We're not saying this is Hitler in the 1930s and 1940s. That's not what we're saying. This is not concentration camps. It's not the final solution. But fascism doesn't always arrive in jackboots. Sometimes it's with a suit at a lectern with a smile and a salute. And what we're watching unfold under Donald Trump in June 20, 25 is fascism.

And it is fascism adapted for a nominally democratic environment and sanitized for cable news. But it is still fascism. Saturday, Donald Trump will be throwing himself a 45 million dollar taxpayer funded military parade for his birthday. It's going to feature troops, tanks, a fleet of attack helicopters. And Trump has made one thing very clear. If you protest it, period, not if you loot, not if you do violence. If you protest it, you will be met with very heavy force. We talked about that on Wednesday. It's a direct quote about American citizens peacefully exercising their First Amendment

rights in a constitutionally protected way. If you think he's bluffing, look at Los Angeles, because the Marines landed in a move that violated the Posse Comitatus Act, the bedrock principle of law since 1878. Trump deployed 700 Marines and thousands of National Guard troops to L.A. to crush protests against the ICE raids. No request from Mayor Karen Bass, no approval from Governor Gavin Newsom. When they complained, Trump threatened to arrest them. And of course, no legal invocation of the Insurrection Act, which would legalize what

he's doing. Marines trained for Afghanistan were dropped into an L.A. neighborhood. No clear rules of engagement and a Pentagon scrambling after the fact to draft policies about when are you even allowed to do this? When are you even allowed to use force of this kind domestically? The LAPD, you know, not not a bastion of progressive resistance. The LAPD put out a statement saying we oppose this. Even the cops didn't want it. They weren't notified it was happening.

And what we have to remember is that fascism is a process. This is how authoritarianism builds. No one is sweeping in in an instant, but it's piece by piece. The press gets chilled. ABC fires veteran reporter Terry Moran for calling Trump and Stephen Miller haters. The process becomes criminalized. Dissent is equated with treason. Governors who object or threatened with arrest or in Speaker Mike Johnson's words should be tarred and feathered. That's what Maga Mike said about Gavin Newsom. And when the protests

inevitably come because of the authoritarianism, because some Americans aren't willing to sit quietly while freedoms are bulldozed, those in power manufacture a crisis. They provoke and ask a provoke, escalate and militarize until they can justify even more state violence. And that is what Trump adviser Stephen Miller did. Order aggressive ice raids so that you bait backlash. Use the backlash to say we've got to send in the Marines to generate more protests in other cities, which will end. We don't know yet, but probably not well.

So we've been here before. This is not Nazi Germany. But also, Hitler didn't start with gas chambers. He started by demonizing minorities and saying, we've got grievances here. We're going to deploy military police to restore order. We're going to attack the legitimacy of local governments. Mussolini did parades. He did pageantry.

He used state violence to centralize control and crush dissent. Pinochet did the same thing in Chile. Erdogan did it. Putin does it. And Trump wraps it all in patriotism. He claims he's restoring law and order. What he's doing is overriding state sovereignty, a principle of the Constitution, criminalizing protest, a constitutionally protected act and unleashing military force on civilians without rules,

precedent and accountability. If we allow it to be, this will become the new normal. We've passed the point where this is policy differences. The idea of you want a flat tax. I want a 50 percent talk top tax rate. I want a 50 percent top tax rate. I want a 30 percent top. This is so beyond that. This is about naked, brazen, unaccountable power.

And if you think Trump's Trump's going to be satisfied at stopping with California, you haven't been paying attention every time there's a legal loss, a poll drop or a protest or a failed policy attempt. He escalates. Violence is now in the system. So what do we do? We don't minimize this. We don't rationalize this as politics as usual or Trump being Trump.

We call it creeping fascism. Period. We show up. Now, I saw a Reddit post. Why isn't David in the streets in L.A. like Hassan? Well, number one, I don't live in L.A. Number two, I can do much more on my show with the five million people a day that I'm reaching than I would getting into fisticuffs with police in Los Angeles.

But the point here is we show up everywhere. It's not just in Los Angeles. But the point here is we show up everywhere. It's not just in the streets. We show up in the media, in the ballot box, in state legislatures, in local media. The GOP apparatus is enabling what's happening and we have to show up and then we use whatever platform we have, however small, because fascism thrives in silence and confusion. So we've got to speak clearly. Not a drill, not a practice, not a false alarm, not theater, not satire. It's real and it's happening right now.

We can stop it, but we've got to pretend we are. We should not pretend that this is any less than what it actually is. Let me know what you think. As far as the protests go, Donald Trump is now claiming that the protests in Los Angeles against the ice raids, against Marines in the streets, against his forty five million dollar taxpayer funded birthday Milliput military parade, he says that they are paid agitators. And in his mind, I guess you would have to be paid to protest this. This is not new. It's part of a long running authoritarian playbook.

If you can't deny that there is dissent, everybody sees it on TV. You can't deny that the dissent is happening. You've got to delegitimize it. One of the most convenient tools is these are paid protesters. Here is scrumps making the claim. So we have this guy allowing this to happen. Let me tell you, when you watch these agitators break up concrete and hand it out to people as they stood on line to get it, these have to be paid troublemakers. You're here to say that the governor and the mayor paid them.

You believe that the governor and the mayor paid the. No, I don't say the governor of the mayor said somebody spang him, I think. And if they're not, they're just troublemakers. What can I tell you? But you know, the funniest part about this and the saddest part about this is how delusional Trump must be, because the obvious question is why would anyone need to be paid? Why would anyone demand payment?

Trump has, by the way, it's like a three block radius. So it's not if you're going to pay people, you would get more people. Trump has unleashed ICE raids in immigrant communities. Stephen Miller's directing agents to stake out seven elevens and home depots, deploying hundreds of active duty Marines and thousands of active of National Guard with no rules of engagement to a U.S. city when there are mostly peaceful protesters. Why would anyone demand money to protest that there are 21 million immigrants living in the U.S.?

Nearly four million people live in L.A. Actually, is that right? I want to make sure Los Angeles population. Yeah. OK, so my memory was right. About four million people live in L.A. when good people see ice dragging people out of their neighborhoods without warrants or even I.D. Of course, people are in the streets. Trump's throwing himself a military parade for his birthday. So people are angry because they're awake. The lie about these must be paid protesters as a long history. Trump used it in 2020 when Americans were protesting the murder of George Floyd.

He said these are paid thugs. He said protesters were bussed into the White House when people demonstrated outside Brett Kavanaugh's confirmation hearings. He said that this is Soros funded opposition or Republicans did anyway. When women marched after Trump's election in 2017, they must also have been paid. It's never been proven. And it doesn't seem to be true, but it's always useful because of protest is a paycheck. It doesn't count.

It's not real democracy. You're just manipulating according to the people in power. So the goal here is delegitimize it, make it seem even though you turn on your TV and you go, wow, people seem really upset. You believe that they're only there because they're getting paid. All of a sudden, they're not as legitimate. And this is the authoritarian logic. And what's dangerous is that it's the same framing that authoritarians used to justify

force. If the protests aren't real, if they're botan stage by enemies, then the state is justified in cracking down. And that's how you go from there being paid to they are foreign agitators to they are terrorists to send in the troops. Now, of course, Trump skipped a few steps in sending in the troops this week. So that's the slope we're on. We're not guessing it's happened in country after country in the 20th century, even in the 21st. And what this reveals is fear.

Trump's insistence that these protests must be fake reveals he doesn't want to acknowledge that Americans genuinely oppose him. He can't face that reality. People are willing to risk getting arrested to show that they don't like what Trump is doing. People are willing to risk getting injured or surveilled to show that they're going to stand up to him. So instead, he goes, ah, these people must be getting paid.

That's all it is. The alternative is too scary for Trump because the alternative is that people genuinely don't like him. And we know that for Trump, that's one of the scariest things. So he ends up using military force. He ends up using ice. He ends up using this increasingly fascist spectacle to control the country. And at least some people are saying no. At the same time,

let's not overstate the scope of these protests, which in Los Angeles, at least, were limited to just a few block radius, overwhelmingly, overwhelmingly peaceful, constitutionally protected. And even a reporter getting hit with a rubber bullet. CNN's Jason Carroll getting detained. Jason Carroll's security getting arrested. And this is all part of what is clearly a bigger plan, probably to deploy troops to more than just Los Angeles. My prediction is we see troops in at least some additional cities. Let me know what you think. Info at David Pakman dot com. Send me an email. troops in at least some additional cities. Thanks to I'm the is in the podcast notes. as I'm You Pakman. That's INC OGNI dot com slash Pakman for 60 percent off. The link is in the podcast notes. young men. And I think that for once it is not wrong to be panicking a little bit about

the left and winning back young men. After the twenty twenty four election, the numbers were brutal. A majority of 18 to 29 year old men voted Republican, not just white guys, black and Latino men shifted right. And now the party is trying to figure out what happened and how to fix it. And in the midst of figuring out what the plan is, we learned about this 20 million dollar campaign to study masculinity, run ads inside of video games, do focus groups, digital outreach, the classic maybe we need a left wing Rogan, maybe we need a left wing Andrew Tate sort of thing. I don't believe any of that stuff is going to work because the problem isn't that young

men are, you know, watching the wrong YouTubers. The problem is they don't believe the Democratic Party gives a damn about them. And a bunch of cringe outreach is simply not going to fix that because Democrats keep getting this wrong. Sometimes they ignore men in certain, um, uh, cert situations, I guess I would say. Sometimes they try to pander in awkward sort of corporate ways that don't work. And young men I don't see as asking for pity. And I don't even think they're asking to be the focus.

I think they're trying to figure out where they fit in. Many are broke. Many are stuck in dead end jobs, can't buy a home. They feel like nobody's talking to them except right wing grifters blaming women and immigrants. And that's garbage. We know that that's garbage, but it at least attempts to address directly how they feel. And what we often see from the left is, you know, treating young men like radioactive material, afraid to go near them, afraid to say anything real, speaking in generalities

and platitudes. And then they end up shocked when it doesn't work. So let me go through what I believe would actually work. Number one, talk to young men like they're human beings rather than a PR problem that needs to be solved. Don't guilt them. Don't tiptoe around them. Just be honest.

Hey, listen, a lot of stuff sucks right now. You're not imagining that. That part is real. The path you were promised doesn't exist. We're not going to feed you lies about masculinity and we're not going to blame immigrants. We're going to fight to give you a future that's not miserable. And we do that with economic policy and with a lot of other stuff. OK, number two, let's not treat masculinity like a disease. Not every young man who lifts weights and wants to

lead a family is a threat. There's nothing wrong with ambition. There's nothing wrong with strength. But what matters is what you do with it. Democrats should be saying if you want to build something, that's great. Let's build a world that works for everybody. If you want to use masculinity to raise people up rather than to put them down, that's awesome. Let's do that together.

The point here is there are ways not to shame young male instincts, but direct them towards a better outlet. Number three, this is critical. Frame progressive policies as power moves. Like forget the safety net language. Talk about power. You want freedom. How about not being buried by debt or having to stay in a job you hate just to keep health

care? Don't rely on your boss for health insurance sort of message. How about not wasting your life in a bullshit job just to survive? So the goal shouldn't be to outmacho the right. But you can win on the question of who's actually going to give you control over your life, which is a very masculine thing, masculine thing to have. Number four, I would cut the micro targeting. You know, young men, I believe, can smell it when you're messaging at them.

So I wouldn't slice things into identity groups and, you know, try to appeal to 16 different demographics with 16 different taglines. Talk about freedom, dignity, control, the sorts of values that people care about. Number five, there need to be some people who can be amplified as as examples. I wish that I had more examples. One is like a Scott Galloway type speaking to what young men are going through. Loneliness, lack of direction, economic failure. like a Scott Galloway type speaking to what young men are going through. Loneliness, lack of direction, economic failure, but doing it in a way that's grounded and

not preachy and pointing out that what Democrats are offering is better than what Republicans are offering. I don't think Democrats need to find the next Galloway, but there needs to be, you know, the amplification of people who are already kind of doing that thing. And then finally show up in the spaces where young men are. So, yeah, I mean, you got to be on YouTube, Discord, Twitch. Don't do it copying the right tactics, but make sure that someone is showing up in the spaces and the conversations.

Just being on MSNBC clips is not going to win anybody over. You need content that meets people where they are. It doesn't have to be super complicated. You know, young men don't need to be saved. They just want a future that's not garbage and they want a political party that understands that. So I don't believe that the answer is spending 20 million to then create a hip outreach campaign or, you know, a progressive Andrew Tate.

The answer is showing up with real policies, real values, real language that doesn't treat young men like idiots or enemies and actually showing that, you know, it's not really very masculine or alpha to put other people down. It's actually a sign of weakness as a sign of insecurity. The secure masculine macho alpha is going to bring people up, is going to work to improve his community, et cetera. So I believe young men are listening.

They're trying to listen to what they can find. If Democrats are like whispering or talking down to them, I think young men are going to keep walking away. There's a short clip that's been making the rounds showing a CNN reporter questioning DHS official Trisha McLaughlin. And it has to do with really what is one of the core legal questions around what we've seen in Los Angeles this week. And that question is, did what was the mechanism through which troops ended up in Los Angeles?

Was it issued involving the governor of California as the law requires or was it issued only by the president? Trisha McLaughlin gives an answer. Finally, again, Section 12406 says that orders for these purposes shall be issued through the governors of the states. Were these orders issued through Governor Gavin Newsom? They're issued by the president United States who saw that our ICE enforcement officers that our law enforcement were being pummeled by rocks. They were being attacked. Molotov cocktails being thrown at them. American cities, Los Angeles citizens being put at risk. That's real leadership to actually put more resources on the ground to make sure

that things don't spiral farther out of control and no lives are lost. All right, Trish. I'm a little off. But this is not exactly an answer other than it was Trump. OK, so let's I'm going to give you my my my belief here is that these orders issued entirely by Trump may well violate the law. I'm not a lawyer. This is based on the lawyers I've spoken to and what they have told me in the research I've done. Let's get to the key legal question.

When can a president send troops into a state? The answer isn't never. Sometimes they can. It's a common question, especially during crises. Can the president just order federal troops into any state? The answer is usually not. But there are exceptions. The main rule against using the military as a police force in the U.S. is the Posse Comitatus Act. This generally says Army, Air Force, Navy, Marines and Space Force can't do any civilian law enforcement within the country.

You've got to keep the military separate from policing when troops can be deployed. There are some exceptions when troops can't can be deployed, includes the Insurrection Act. This is the most significant exception. And it says the president can unilaterally deploy troops if a state asks for help, of course, or to enforce federal laws or rights. If there is major unrest or violence in a state that's preventing federal laws from being enforced or if people's constitutional rights are being violated and the state can't or won't fix it, which is not the scenario in California. In those cases, the president might act even without a state request.

Historically, it's been used to enforce civil rights, like during school desegregation, kids were going to prevent. I'm sorry. People protesters were going to prevent black kids from going to school, which the law said they are allowed to do. And so the federal troops were sent in for protecting federal property. The president can use troops to protect federal buildings and land and personnel specifically. They can't go beyond that in circumstances of natural natural disaster.

This is under the Stafford Act. They wouldn't really be acting as police is the thing, but they can provide support, delivering supplies, offering medical aid, helping with logistics that can be done simply at the request at the institution of the president. But it almost always is happening at the request at the institution of the president. But it almost always is happening at the request of a state governor. And then with the National Guard, it gets a little bit tricky. National Guard is unique because it's controlled by the state governor. Governors can deploy their state's guard for emergencies, protests and disasters.

And the Posse Comitatus Act usually does not apply in that role. However, the president can federalize National Guard units, bringing them under federal control. Once federalized, they operate like regular federal troops subject to the same rules. So those are the only exceptions. The MAGA right is arguing that a bunch of these requirements were met. They are saying ICE, which is enforcing federal law, wasn't able to do it due to the protesters. That justifies sending in the troops. Protesters were endangering endangering federal property that justifies sending in the troops. The National Guard is rightly federalized, federalized because

of the protests. And therefore we were justified in Trump doing what he did. That's their argument. I am not convinced at this point in time that that is true. Sending federal troops into a state is a big deal. Trump seemingly did it on a whim between golf holes and the point of the law. The intention of the founders was keep the military out of local law enforcement, but it makes some exceptions. I do not believe the circumstances meet those exceptions. Trump exceptions. Trump believes that it does.

I will leave it to you now, nearly a week into this thing. What do you believe about the legality of what Donald Trump did with the National Guard as well as with Marines? Let me know at info at David Pakman dot com. which life conversations, not games or gimmicks. So I'm learning exactly what I actually need to know when I land. I've even been using babble speech recognition technology to improve my pronunciation. Super helpful. Babble is designed by over 200 language experts and proven studies from places like Yale and Michigan State.

There's a study that found that using babble just 15 hours is like a full college semester of a language. in right now. Get up to 60 percent off your Babel subscription, but only for my audience at Babel dot com slash Pacman. Get up to 60 percent off at Babel dot com slash Pacman spelled B a B B e l dot com slash Pacman. Rules and restrictions may apply. The link is in the podcast notes. All right. Let's get into Friday feedback for the week on Friday. We'll go through the email comments on various platforms, reactions, direct messages, the

whole lot of it. You can always email info at David Pakman dot com. If you have a message you would like to submit, I want to start today with a bigger picture sort of issue that is facing the show right now. And I'm going to give you some example messages first and then I'll kind of tell you where my head is at. Zahan comedy on Instagram said, David, you and Bernie Sanders are the only two people who give me a hope for America.

Keep pushing the truth and hopefully people will open their eyes and ears. OK, beautiful message. Incredibly kind. I love it. Here's another one from Mary Ann, who said Dave's firing on all cylinders lately. Love David's prescient June 6th analysis of MAGA being about belonging. Also his later observation about the right's willingness to debate after not watching for a couple of weeks.

Glad to see him firing on all cylinders. Love it. Thank you so much. Another one. HH Kony, I'm building to something. Stick with me. OK. HH Kony on YouTube says thank you, David, for doing your job and showing day after day this

B.S. to the world. Another positive comment. And I like it. However, you knew it was coming. OK, Celestial Reach says the David Pakman show isn't really doing well where you're by the way, it's atrocious spelling and grammar. Let's keep to the core of the message. You're reporting yesterday's news, which is unfortunate because you're the most substantial

creator on the left. You don't focus on the drama as much like Adam and Luke. Can you consider doing a live stream once a day? Even 20 minutes of that day's news doesn't have to be as clean and edited, just an and idea to try. Keep up the work. OK, a criticism that we are publishing news and it's too late. OK, Chris on Instagram says you give only conjecture and lopsided in nature reporting.

It's sad. I hope you learn a more mature version of fact reporting and honest, unedited journalism. OK, so another criticism here. So let me big picture it. OK. The audience is as big today as it has ever been. And so the position that we find ourselves in all the time is that the bigger the audience gets, the more opinions

there will be as to what the show should be. We get emails from people all the time right now saying, David, you're not being alarmist enough about the authoritarian slide of this administration. You need to be louder and scream and be more passionate and a little. OK. The other side, David, you're being too alarmist. You're being too hyperbolic about the threat of authoritarianism. This stuff is really not that bad. You need to tone it down. Actually, we get people who write and say, David, could you do the show later in the

day? So by the time you publish it, the news is less stale and it can be more breaking news. And of course, we are not a breaking news show. And even if we record the show later, we're always going to miss something because there's twenty four hours between shows. So I've explained it. It doesn't really matter when we produce the show, because it will always be the case that something will seem stale by the time all the clips.

OK, here's the most important thing. The show has to be. The stories I feel like talking about in the way I feel like talking about them. Now, you might say, well, but David, we think you should be talking exclusively about the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. Or why not make it a foreign policy show or interview activists every day or what. If the show is anything other than just what I feel like making it. Number one, it's going to be disingenuous. It's not going to feel genuine. And number two, we just have a different problem than corporate media with seven layers of

editors and producers, which is all of a sudden I'm taking direction from other people as to what the show should be. Now, of course, when I hear from my audience, this particular story is incredibly important. And if I have something unique to say about it, I consider that. And I say, well, that that is something to consider. But fundamentally, if this show just isn't what you would like it to be, there are other shows that maybe are that some of those people say you need to do deeper analysis of bills. Well, sometimes I do. Last week I did an analysis of a bill that I didn't think was getting enough coverage.

But there are shows that just look at congressional bills. That's the show for congressional bills, not this one. Or David, I don't like that you deal with only domestic issues. I want it to be Ukraine and Gaza. Well, there are shows that do that, I assume. It's not this show. So here's the most important thing, I think, in this environment. We're trying to build an ecosystem here.

OK, no one show can be everything to everybody and no show is going to be liked by everybody. I'm aware that there are people who were pulled into the political space by me. But now that their interests are more defined as either foreign policy or activism or education, they've moved on to other shows. That's OK. What we want is to keep growing overall and keep growing the ecosystem. So my message here is we're always working to make the show as good as we can. We're always meeting the team to talk about how can we improve this?

How can we improve that if the show is not what you want it to be? Of course, let us know what it is you want. But understand that there are other shows that maybe are the show you're looking for and that's also OK. But with our community, we're going to keep doing the best to make it a genuine show that reflects what I'm paying attention to, what I'm thinking about, et cetera. And the one change we are going to be making, because we think that this is something we can do with only upside, we are looking at moving to earlier in the day what is now like

the nine p.m. YouTube video show, the full hour show that's at nine p.m. We're going to move that to earlier in the day. So it's still not a breaking news show. It's always going to be the case that some stuff is on the next show. But we think that we can move the nine p.m. show up like two to three hours. More people will be able to get it for their commute home. More people will be able to have it when they're in the gym after work. So I think that that just has upside more information about that upcoming.

All right, let's get to a couple of other messages. Brian Myers says, since when is your dumbass opposed to more spending? If Dems were in charge, they'd be spending even more and you'd be cheering at calling it a monumental investment. Sit down, Gumby. So here's the deal. I've criticized wasteful spending under both parties. The real question is, what is the money for and does it help people? Food stamps are one of the most economically stimulative government spending programs. When you give people food stamps, it gets multiplied into the economy through what we

call an economic multiplier. And it does a lot of good in addition to getting people food who need food. On the other hand, lowering the top tax rate for the richest Americans, money that is disproportionately just put in banks, which banks can loan out. The multiplier isn't zero, but it is way less economically stimulative. So for me, it's never about I'm opposed to more spending or I'm for more spending. When we're talking about programs that help people in economically stimulative ways, I'm for it.

When we're on random spending on just replacing bombs that we already have too many of that will never use and feeding the military industrial complex like a bottomless pit. Yeah, I'm against that. And as as many of you may know, My instinct is not let's solve a problem by raising taxes. My instinct is not Let's solve a problem by just spending more sometimes. That's the solution But we want to evaluate that and And so, oh, I'm for against spending. It's like, am I for against screwdrivers?

It's like, what are we trying to do? You know, if I'm trying to write a book, the screwdriver is not super useful. If I'm trying to screw in screws, then it is. All right. Job K. Flo says, ha, cough, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, do should live a little bit. You may maybe one of the most unintelligent. What do you call yourselves again? Contributors the way that you just presented that and then listening to it, we're not even close to each other.

First of all, which why don't you just say, hey, I'm going to play this video and I want you to think this. But I'm lying. So here we go. Where do you hear this? You know, job, K, flow, I'm not sure what your first language is, although I actually know it's English. It's just an atrocity.

I'm not totally sure what you're saying. I don't believe this is the right show for you. OK, that's my instinct. I don't some comments leave me speechless. This is almost poetic in its chaos. And I don't think there's anything I can say that's going to make this the right show for you. All right.

T.R. says this is good stuff. I like this. You cannot be a cold blooded capitalist and a genuine progressive. Capitalism is literally killing people the world over. You have to actively reject the profit motive and deficiency drive in many cases to best serve society's needs. I'm going to answer this as if it's addressed to me. I don't know that when they say you, I don't know if they mean one cannot or David, you

can't. I do consider myself a capitalist, but not a cold blooded capitalist. It is very fair to say that there is a tension between participating in a system and criticizing it. OK, I don't claim to have a perfect answer. What I can tell you is my viewpoint is that well regulated forms of capitalism, like what I write about in my book that exists in Denmark, Sweden and other countries. Oh, it's it's so cliche. Well, they're good examples for a reason.

What exists there right now is the most evidence based, best form of government that I have studied. Now, if someone wants to bring to me examples of a socialist organization, an anarcho capitalist organization, communism. And you say, here's evidence that it's a better that you get better outcomes. I'm willing to examine that. Sometimes when I say that, people will go, well, we don't have any good examples because all of the ones that we have were perverted or messed up, like, for example, the Soviet Union and this and that. OK, like, for example, the Soviet Union and

this and that. OK, well, but so then someone should try the experiment. But to say that in some way I am the cold blooded capitalist while claiming to be a progressive is very much untrue. The way I would like to go is from where the U.S. is now, which I believe is a too under regulated form of capitalism in the direction of something like what we see in Northern Europe. And I think that the best empirical case I can make is for that. That's where I am. And I welcome other views and dissenting opinions. All right. Remember that we will be relaunching and totally re jiggering our substack.

And I'm going to tell you about that soon. But get on my mailing list just so you're ready. You can email info at David Pakman dot com. Say, David, please put me on that newsletter or sign yourself up at David Pakman dot substack dot com. We have a phenomenal bonus show today. We have a phenomenal week of shows coming up next week. for watching.