The David Pakman Show - 7/5/23: More crimes, more boos, more interviews

Episode Date: July 5, 2023

-- On the Show: -- Dr. Ami Klin, Director of the Marcus Autism Center at Emory University School of Medicine and Children's Healthcare in Atlanta, joins David to discuss autism, including prevalence, diagnosis, causes, treatment, and much more -- Failed former President Donald Trump reportedly shared secrets on the Mar-a-Lago patio -- In yet another line of possible investigation, Donald Trump reportedly trying pressuring Doug Ducey, the then-Governor of Arizona, to overturn the results in 2020 -- 2024 Republican presidential candidate Ron DeSantis is now using David in a new campaign ad -- Luke Beasley, David Pakman Show correspondent, went to Pickens, South Carolina to interview supporters of Donald Trump at his recent rally, and it was absolutely insane -- David's critical thinking book for kids is now available, called "Think Like a Detective: A Kid's Guide to Critical Thinking" -- Donald Trump speaks in South Carolina, telling endless lies while the crowd boos Republican Senator Lindsey Graham -- A Trump rallygoer in Pickens, South Carolina suggest sending Joe Biden to a concentration camp, among other insanity -- On the Bonus Show: Judge restricts Biden officials from contact with social media firms, lawsuit says Harvard gives preferential treatment to overwhelmingly white legacy admission, Meta will launch Twitter competitor called Threads, much more... ♨️ Bon Charge Sauna Blanket: Use code PAKMAN for 15% OFF at https://boncharge.com/pakman ✅ Parcil Safety: Get 25% off with code PAKMAN at https://davidpakman.com/safety 💰 Public.com: Start getting a 5% yield on your cash at https://public.com/pakman ✉️ StartMail: Get 50% OFF a year subscription at https://startmail.com/pakman 🦛 Happy Hippo: Use code PAKMAN for 20% off at https://happyhippo.com/pakman -- Become a Supporter: http://www.davidpakman.com/membership -- Subscribe on YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/thedavidpakmanshow -- Subscribe to Pakman Live: https://www.youtube.com/pakmanlive -- Follow us on Twitter: http://twitter.com/davidpakmanshow -- Like us on Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/davidpakmanshow -- Leave us a message at The David Pakman Show Voicemail Line (219)-2DAVIDP

. Welcome back from the 4th of July holiday. Hope it was good for everybody. No matter what you did, it was for some people a weekend of crimes, crimes and more crimes. And in fact, the number of additional possible crimes that we are learning about related to the 2020 election in the time afterwards is wild. Ron DeSantis has also featured me in one of his campaign ads. We're going to talk about it. We were on the ground in Pickens, South Carolina, for the Trump rally. Luke Beasley interviewing a bunch of people. The Children's Critical Thinking book is finally out.

I've got a copy here that I'm going to show you. It is an incredible day. But to start with, I want to start with an incredible interview that one of the failed former President Donald Trump's press secretaries did where she says, you know, this new claim from Trump that he was talking about classified documents, but he didn't really have them in his hand. It was just bravado. He was just trying to impress people. It's directly contradicted by Stephanie Grisham, who says, I saw him do it on the Mar-a-Lago

patio, which further suggests that indeed the recording in which it sounds like Trump is showing people classified documents in which he says he's showing people classified documents. We don't need to look for a complicated explanation. The explanation is he was doing exactly what he said he was doing, showing people classified documents. Let's listen here to an interview on MSNBC with Trump's former press secretary, Stephanie Grisham.

Look, you know, Donald Trump, is it plausible Trump was showing classified documents to people in private meetings? The short answer is yes. I watched him show documents to people at Mar-a-Lago on the dining room patio. So he has no respect for classified information, never did. You know, listening to that exchange every time, it just makes me so angry. He talks specifically that he should have declassified it, but he didn't. So there, I think, is proof. I believe also there's a portion of that audio where he says, you know, this is off the record.

And I know Donald Trump knows the rules of reporters, and he knows if it needs to be off the record that they can't talk about it. So I think he was covering himself in that regard. And, you know, I was thinking about this earlier. I just want to say to your viewers, I don't think people understand how hard it is to get your classified permissions. I remember when I was going through it to get all of mine, I got held up because of a $13 kinder care bill that I did not know about. And so I couldn't get clearance. They go through everything about you. It's very difficult to get a security clearance. And I think people, you know, they miss that's in the weeds, obviously, but to be showing it to people who haven't gone through the extreme vetting that you go through to get it.

Listen, we understand where she's going with this. This was not something that only allegedly happened that one time where it was on audio recording and it never otherwise happened. And so it's plausible to say Trump was just talking about classified documents. He wasn't really showing them to anyone. And we've seen this so many times. We see the report from a Cassidy Hutchinson under oath during the January six committee where she said Trump lunged at a Secret Service agent. He snapped.

And then one of the defenses we get from Trump and others is this is completely out of line with how Trump normally behaves. He's never done this. He doesn't snap. He doesn't do anything. And then a month ago, we got another report from Trump's plane where Trump snapped at a reporter on his plane, grabbed his phone and tossed it because the reporter was asking Trump questions that he didn't like and didn't want to answer. And we say, oh, the one story has now become more than one story. And yet they love to insist that every single one of these stories is completely out of character for Trump.

At this point, it is extraordinarily difficult to take seriously, even for a second, that Trump was talking about classified documents, saying this is off the record, audibly shuffling papers, but that they were actually golf course plans, as he has asserted at least at one time since this audio report came out. Crimes, crimes and more crimes. And now we go from the East Coast to the southwest of the United States. And let's talk about more possible crimes in Arizona. I need 11000 votes. Give me a break. That's a quote that many of us remember that relates to Georgia. That was during a phone call that the failed, twice indicted, twice impeached former president had on the phone with Georgia officials saying, I only need 11000 votes to defeat Joe Biden. Give me a break. Let's find those votes. Trump claims he was saying

just I think I won. Let's just find the legal votes. Every other sane person in the world who heard the audio tape says, no, Trump's trying to coerce and say, find a way for me to win, even if Joe Biden actually won. It turns out that it was not only in Georgia that Trump was doing this. And this once again fits this theme. We get one report and many of his defenders say so out of character, he would never do this. We now have two independent, unrelated reports. Washington Post exclusive report from our friendly Ann Caldwell from the community radio

days, Josh Dossi and Yvonne Winget Sanchez. Trump pressured Arizona Governor Doug Ducey to overturn the 2020 election. It's it reads just like the Georgia story, but it's a different story. In a phone call in late 2020, Trump tried to pressure Republican Arizona Governor Doug Ducey to overturn the state's presidential election results, saying that if enough fraudulent votes could be found, it would overcome Trump's narrow loss in Arizona, according to three people familiar with the call. Trump also repeatedly asked Vice President Mike Pence to call Ducey and prod him to find the evidence to substantiate Trump's claims of fraud. Pence called Ducey several times to discuss the election.

They said, though, he did not follow Trump's directions to pressure the governor. The extent of Trump's efforts to cajole Ducey into helping him stay in power has not before been reported, even as Trump's other efforts have been made public. Ducey told reporters in December 2020 that he and Trump had spoken but declined to disclose the contents of the call. Although he disagreed with Trump about the outcome of the election, Ducey has sought to avoid a public battle from Trump. Notably, Ducey did not record the call, according to people familiar with the matter. So we now have yet another story. We have now heard if you look nationally from county election officials, state election officials,

state legislators, we have heard from all of these different levels about a very specific sort of plan. We know that there were elements to this attempted coup that went all the way to the White House. It included the January 6th rioters, the halls of Congress, fake electors in various states, pressure phone calls, attempts to commandeer voting machines. Remember, every one of these little details would have been a crisis if Obama had done it. That's for sure. But they are just yet another instance when it comes to Trump. There was that period right after

the elections where Trump said sequester the voting machines, get voting machines. Officials went to Trump and said, what are you talking about? We can't really do that. What do you mean? Just bring them here to the White House. It doesn't make any sense. We at this point can make a couple of conclusions. Number one, these people were not randomly acting alone. You didn't randomly have fake electors in Arizona and fake electors in Wisconsin, all trying to do the same thing just by mere coincidence. It is obvious that this was a concerted and coordinated effort. Number two, some of the same tactics and techniques were attempted in multiple states. The pressure phone calls were attempted in Georgia and the pressure phone calls were attempted in multiple states. The pressure phone calls were

attempted in Georgia and the pressure phone calls were attempted in Arizona. Now, the questions that remain and I don't pretend to have the answers at this time. We just don't know. Is special prosecutor Jack Smith looking into what we just learned about from Arizona? Is it possible that this will become part of his investigation or is this being independently investigated at the state level in Arizona, much like Fannie Willis is investigating the same in Georgia, from which we will soon know the outcome sometime between next week and early September? We don't know the answer to that. But what is abundantly clear is that this was a concerted effort. Looney Lindsey Graham seemed to have been involved in multiple places. By the way, Lindsey brutally booed at a Trump rally over the weekend. We'll talk about that in a moment. That's the latest. And it is

crimes, crimes and more crimes. Ron DeSanctimonious is now using me, David Pakman, in one of his newest campaign ads. This was published over the Fourth of July holiday. This is an ad that not only includes me, but it includes our friend Farron Cousins from Ring of Fire and many others. The point that the ad tries to make is that we on the left, we're all scared of Ron DeSantis. What we're actually saying in the clips that are used is that we think DeSantis is more dangerous than Trump to some degree because he's less incompetent. And that's true. It's actually not a terrible ad. The context is we all think DeSantis is nuts. Take a listen to this and you will see me pop up a number of times. If Trump was the

original Terminator, DeSantis is like the T-1000. Ron DeSantis is far more dangerous than Donald Trump. A more disciplined extremist. They're just like, oh, well, at least DeSantis is like the T-1000. Ron DeSantis is far more dangerous than Donald Trump. A more disciplined extremist. They're just like, oh, well, at least DeSantis isn't crazy like Trump. And I'm like, no, you should be more scared of him than Trump. He's more savvy, he's more coy, and he doesn't have the pitfalls that Donald Trump does. The real reason this man is so terrifying is because he's managed to succeed in areas where Trump has failed. If anyone out there thinks somehow he is any better than Donald Trump,

then they don't know Ron DeSantis. If you thought Donald Trump was bad, you got another thing coming. He may actually be able to do a lot of the things Trump merely wanted to do but failed to do. DeSantis actually knows the system. And I think Ron DeSantis is far more dangerous than Donald Trump. But he's also more competent, I think. Inferior than Trump because he's not so incompetent. He's more cunning.

He's not an incompetent administrator the way that Trump was. He would be more able to get things done. Ron DeSantis is far more dangerous than Donald Trump. Far more dangerous than Donald Trump. Far more likely if he becomes president to successfully implement a lot of these horrible and disastrous ideas. Now, you'll notice that when I mention horrible and disastrous ideas, they put the word awesome on the screen with a little asterisk. So, you know, I saw a comment about this ad

that it's very creepy that they're proud of this to a reasonable person. Like if you just put aside party affiliation, DeSantis seems like he's running for dictator. I read a number of comments like this in response to my tweet about this video. But these are such weird times that because the highest virtue is triggering the left and triggering the libs, they actually get mileage from so many people saying this guy is dangerous for his authoritarian ideas. I saw another comment that said this ad would be more effective if they left out the parts where we're all calling

DeSantis dangerous, like they could have gotten rid of all of those things and the ad would actually be stronger. But it's almost like a badge of honor that much of the country, including folks like me, see DeSantis as incredibly dangerous. Saw another response to this ad, which was along the lines of trying to pander to the right by bragging about how much of a fascist you want to be is a pretty bad strategy if you make it to the general election. And there's actually a lot of insight there. As I've said before, the way DeSantis is running this campaign is maybe useful in a Republican primary and maybe not because he's making no progress whatsoever against Trump still polling low 20s.

But the anti woke stuff, the I'm a wannabe dictator stuff, the left thinks I'm dangerous stuff. It might play well in a Republican primary and it might not. But I don't see any way that this is useful to DeSantis in a general election. Now, a couple of people wrote to me and said, David, you should sue him for using you in the video. I have not consulted with an intellectual property attorney on this. It seems pretty clear to me that if you are a candidate for office and there are people publicly commenting about your candidacy for office, that all of that

stuff is fair use. That that's my instinct. I have no interest in suing. I'm more interested in the fact that he's now using me in a campaign ad. Let me know your thoughts. Make sure you are subscribed to the YouTube channel as we press forward towards two million YouTube subscribers. I believe we should save the recording of today's show because it's actually a pretty good show. I hope you'll stay with me. I love a good sauna after a workout, after a stressful or long day, you get in the sauna to unwind. The blood vessels dilate. Your heart rate goes up. It can soothe muscles and more. Now you can enjoy the same effects from the comfort of your home without a bunch of strangers walking around, which I

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We were on the ground in Pickens, South Carolina, for Donald Trump's Fourth of July weekend rally. Our correspondent, Luke Beasley, was there. Now, if you've been following the show for a while, you know that Luke's done some wild interviews. I believe they all pale in comparison to what Luke saw there this weekend. And Luke's done a great job. But the level of nuttiness and cultishness that we saw there this weekend is something to behold. This is likely the best and worst one ever. Now, remember, you can find Luke's YouTube channel at David Pakman dot com slash Luke. Luke and I strategize before this

event, and I said it might be useful. It might be interesting to focus in specifically on the indictment and the audio tape of Trump admitting to crimes. I was shocked myself at how insane the answers from these folks were. Let's start with this first guy, completely confused, understands nothing, cannot think, quite frankly, shocking he can even get dressed in the morning. Listen to this. What are your thoughts on the federal indictment? Speaker 4 My thoughts. Oh, I'm not worried about not worried. Like you don't think he did what he's being accused of. Speaker 5 I'm there. What you don't think he did what he's being accused of?

I mean, what's this indictment being accused of? It's like, you know, they hand out indictments like cookies. Yeah. Well, he's only been indicted twice. I mean, like, so you have the Manhattan DA and then the federal. Oh, that Manhattan DA. What a piece of s***. I mean, a porn star. I mean, look,

every rich person had sex with a porn star. Yep. Party family values. All right. Party family values. Right. I mean, I've had sex with a porn star. Oh, God. Here we go. Really? Really? You know, I'm not going to comment on that. OK, you judge for yourselves. Whether this young man had sex with a porn star. All right. And you would be a good candidate in the party of family values. You know what? We all make mistakes. So show me a man with no convention, conviction of the past. You know, show me a man who. I mean, I have no convictions in my past. He's never said a cuss word. Show me a man

that's never, you know, had perverted thoughts. Show me a man. Perverted thoughts about their own daughter like Trump. I think that was a joke. He said that on The View. They'll defend anything, anything he'll defend. And that was on The View. And he said he would like to. He said if he was dating somebody, he would date a woman like his daughter. And the most reading recent reporting says that they're defending Trump fantasizing about his own daughter. Folks, the White House, he has been overheard fantasizing about having sex with her. How does that relate? What's going on right now? I just think it's gross.

But but you asked me, what do I think about his indictment? Well, I know you brought a porn star. So here we are. Look, I mean, look, we've all looked at porn. We've all there you go. Oh, you know, we're just really going. So what this is the first clip I saw from what Luke sent me. And I said, oh, my goodness, if this is what this is going to be like, this is going to be crazy. It actually gets even more nuts. Here is a guy. Luke explains what about ISM to this guy and the guy doesn't get it and just responds with more. What about ISM? I mean, there's an inability to be able to think here. Speaker 4 arguments. Oh, what aboutaboutism. No, what is it?

It's a logical fallacy when you try to respond to someone's argument and kind of break down someone's argument by just referencing something else separate from the conversation. You guys do that all the time. I have no, you can't talk to. That was a whataboutism right there. No, no, the point is you can't talk to a liberal. You're talking to one right now.

Don't be silly. I could wrap you around my finger in two seconds. The bottom line is careful. I don't know what that means. OK, what it means is you've been lying so long you don't know how to tell the truth. What it also means is you've stayed really quite a line that applies to Trump, right? You've been lying so long you don't know how to tell the truth. The entire insanity for so long. You still don't know how to tell the truth. So we're unraveling it. It's like a piece of thread on the sweater. So do you agree? And you guys are losing. Do you agree the Espionage Act outlines certain things you can and can't do with classified material?

Yeah. So do you agree on an audio? Don't you agree? Why aren't you doing the same thing for Biden? Because we don't even have evidence that he did the same things Trump did. Not only did he do it, he had no authority to do it as vice president. He obstructed an investigation. He classified anything he wanted as president, but this piece of dreck can't do anything as vice president. Do you understand that? Let's bring the heat down and just let me ask an honest question.

In the recording that's been released now, you can hear Trump saying this is still classified. I could have declassified as president, but I didn't know. Okay. He didn't know. No, no, he did know. He did know. It doesn't matter here. He didn't know or it doesn't matter. But why isn't Biden in prison by now? He talked to the FBI months earlier. Give us the documents. Give us a document. Help you. Not a problem. You guys are creating a mountain out of a molehill because you don't want him to run. That's how stupid you are. You're afraid that all this is going to materialize on a much bigger scale and he gets elected.

That's why you guys can't handle it. This guy is really a piece of work. And when Luke confronts the exact same guy with facts about what Trump did, the substance of the indictment, the guy says, grow up and mentions China. I'm not kidding. This is these folks vote. So we've got to make sure we're voting. And the people that are in charge are so evil, so disgusting and so fascist.

All of us are vulnerable, including you. If they don't like you, just look at what they're doing to Trump. Just realize that. But like I would never hold on to classified documents and then lie to federal authorities and then disrupting investigation and then conspire with staffers to hide the contents. Grow up, please. That's our priority. Look what's going on around the world. China, Russia. So what about about documents? Yeah. More what about ism there, as you can see, the next guy confidently says the indictment is garbage, but he hasn't read it and says the audio recording is garbage,

but he didn't listen to it. And then when he gets pinned up against the wall with facts, he says, doesn't everybody do the same thing that Trump did? What are your thoughts about the Trump indictment? It's probably garbage. Probably garbage. Yeah. Read it now. OK.

And then what about the audio recording that got released? Probably garbage. You didn't listen to it. How would you know it's garbage if you don't even look into it? Some serious things are being uh accused here like tell me what it is mishandling and uh classified documents holding on to them when he wasn't supposed to have them all right uh violating a subpoena lying to federal authorities obstructing investigations and conspiring with other staffers to move around documents to keep

federal authorities from getting them it's like it's like stealing a candy bar, guys. Come on. Sounds sounds pretty serious, but doesn't everybody do that? This would be a comedy if it wasn't so serious and so tragic and so said, doesn't everybody do all that exact same stuff? All right. Then we go and we hear from a woman who is suspicious of the audio recording of Trump admitting to crimes. She's suspicious that it even really exists. She's like, there is no audio tape. That's weird. And then another woman pops up and they both seem really confused. And you'll notice

they don't know anything. They use words whose meaning they don't understand. There's their mouths are moving. I hear noise. I recognize the words. They don't know the meaning of these words. Listen to this. Well, it's like, why do they have an audio recording? I mean, that's like going back to Superman with, you know, the also and it's the reporter

carrying a little recorder. Well, you know, they have video. They could have had him on video, but they didn't. You know, it's just it's plus he has the presidential. He has with no discretion. He has no discretion. She doesn't even know what she's saying. He can take his, you know, the records that the presidential, yeah, but he has been charged with the espionage act, right? Or Violinian. No, he, he, come to his home. They, they had the opportunity to go through everything. Right. And they told him just to put some better locks on and they came back. You know, there you go. He has the right as a president to certify and declassify.

This is Obama's fourth run. There you go. Obama's running for the fourth time right now. Obama. This is fourth presidency. He's controlling stuff. Speaker 5 Yeah, absolutely. Speaker 6 The only thing Obama hasn't checked off of his list yet is freedom of speech. He wants that gone. And he's campaigning everywhere on every platform he can get on. And that's one of the main things weaponized the FBI weaponized. So what's interesting is some of the vocabulary of the conspiracy theories has trickled down

into their brains. They just don't really understand it or know how to use it. R.S. and freedom of speech and guns, all of that. He wanted those are on his little checklist. And that's what he's doing. Yeah, it's actually it's quite fitting that this interview is being done in front of a row of about a dozen porta potties because everything coming out of the the mouths of these people really deserves to be flushed 10 to 15 times.

Then speaks to two more women who say the tape doesn't exist and it must be AI. It must be actually it's not really Trump. If there is a tape, it's AI. OK. And then one of the big things in the news right now is that tape of Trump caught on recording. No, that's that has been debunked that there it doesn't exist. Have you not heard that? That tape does not exist. I heard it. It does not fake like AI Trump voice. It must be because they tried to produce it and they couldn't produce it because it does not exist.

Even though I listen to it, it might have been AI. I don't know. But they tried to produce the actual tape. There is a, I think there's film, but there's no sound. There you go. In fact, there is no video that I'm aware of. When Trump got asked about it, he just said, no, no, no, in the recording, he didn't deny that he said all the things in the recording.

Why wouldn't he say, oh, that was fake? If it was fake, I'm not in his head. That's a good question. Even Trump's not denying the authenticity of the recording. He's just saying he wasn't really showing anybody papers. I don't know. I don't know what Trump's thinking. Fascinating stuff. Then we go to a guy. This guy is probably racist is my sense. This guy refers to Luke as boy. He said, Hey boy, Hey boy, let's listen. What man is talking? Is the only person alive on this earth that can save this Republic peacefully, peacefully, peacefully. Right now, if he's not elected, you listen to this boy. This. Folks, this is not an actor. Central casting, right? As Trump likes it, this is not an actor. As far as we know, Republic shall survive regardless of what the hell

it takes. OK, that over in your pipe. I'm smoking it. OK, the guy says to Luke, smoke that in your pipe. He says in calling Luke Boy, he says Trump's the only guy who can peacefully save us. But if he loses, then all bets are off and it's very much not going to be peaceful. And the last guy Luke spoke to this this stuff needs to be in the national archives, really. Luke speaks to a guy with no shirt on who hasn't read the indictment, hasn't heard the audio, but he has really strong feelings about both. Do you think wokeness? I hear a lot about wokeness on the right. Is that a big problem?

Uh, like being woke like these woke companies? Yeah. Yeah, for sure. How would you define a woke? Woke? Like leave the damn kids alone, that's for sure. That pisses me off. Woke is leave the kids alone? No.

Dude, I don't want to get into this too deep and stuff like that because I do got to carry on. But basically just being woke, like you're just shoving crap down our throats. Like you have to do this and you have to do that and you have to obey this and you can't say that because Sally over there is going to get offended and you can't read this book. You can't be gay, et cetera. Yeah, dude, all sorts of things. And it's annoying. I'm sick of it. I just want people to be happy. There you go. And then then they actually get to the part about the indictment here. Here's that. So with the indictment, have you read it? And have you heard the audio recording? That's been a big thing in the news not too much in depth about it so it's a little strange to me since it's like such a big thing against him and he's saying

that biden's weaponizing the government against him you know so then wouldn't it be good to know if that's happening or not no yeah i mean like it totally it totally is it's just like with trump having to go to court on multiple different occasions for like all this stuff that the Bidens are doing. You know what I mean? With Hunter and Joe and all these trades and this secret crap that's going on, you know. And then it's just like it's kind of like, hey, look over here. Look at look at Donald Trump. You know, like we're arresting him and we're doing this and that while they're doing all that crooked stuff. Some would argue. Do you agree that right now they don't have hard evidence? Otherwise, they would be broadcasting it on Fox News.

James Comer admits, we don't have the evidence right now, but we think we have the evidence against Biden, I should say. Yeah, I mean, it's totally there. So then wouldn't it be like, oh, wait, you think that is there? Yeah, I mean, I think that the stuff is there. It's one of those things that like, I feel like they got to like put it out in a certain way, like a strategic. They've got all the evidence against Biden.

They're just waiting three years to put it out. Kind of what you can't just like blast it out there because maybe stuff gets like spoiled or some sort, you know, it's just. Let me put it this way. It's like if you leave if you if you leave Mayo out too long, it's spoiled. Same thing with the evidence against Biden. You agree that I right now can't see the evidence that's being referred to. I can't listen to the recordings that are being like, yeah, no, I understand in that sense. Some people would think maybe Trump, we can read the evidence in the indictment, what they're alleging, and then hear the audio, which is one of the pieces of evidence ourselves. We can listen to it. We can't do the same with the Biden stuff.

So maybe the Biden stuff is actually Republicans trying to distract from the Trump stuff. No. Yeah. Honestly, dude, I feel like at this point, we just don't know until it actually happened. So with the indictment until what? Right. There may not be an indictment that happened. That's the whole point, because it doesn't appear as though they have any evidence against Joe Biden. Incredible work by Luke. This is what we're up against and we have to support independent media. So remember, you can go over to Luke's channel, David Pakman dot com slash Luke and subscribe. Please make sure that you're subscribed here. Last month in June, a record three and a half million people watched our videos but didn't subscribe. It's free to subscribe on YouTube. Support the work we and others are doing. It is so important. Make sure that you do that. All right.

This has been a long time coming and I'm super excited and nervous about this because I don't know how it's going to go. I've teased for a while that we've been working on a children's book on critical thinking. As so many of you know, I've identified one of the many problems we have in education in the United States is we're not teaching critical thinking to kids nearly early enough. I've written with our team a book for kids on critical thinking. I have the first proof right in front of me and I'm holding it up. This one labeled not for resale. This book is now available on Amazon. We did an email blast this morning and the copies are flying off the shelves. It is unbelievable what's going on. I don't pretend for a second that this 40 page book, including illustrations and dedication and everything, that this 40 page book is going to

solve the critical thinking crisis we have. But this is a book that six, seven, eight year olds can read with their parents. Nine, 10, 11, 12 year olds can read by themselves. It is about starting to think critically. When someone says something, how do we know that it's true? How do we know that we know anything? I can't tell you. I I've heard from people saying, David, I'm buying 25 copies. I'm going to bring them to my local libraries and give them give them away. I'm buying these as gifts for I don't have kids, but I'm buying them for my my nephews and so on and so forth. It's available in Kindle and in paperback. The Kindle is preorder. It's going to launch Tuesday. Preorder it now. Please help us with the preorders. Only a couple hundred preorders can put us at number one for the category.

This is, you know, we're used to hundreds of thousands and millions being the numbers we talk about on YouTube and podcast, etc. A few hundred orders of this book today will put us at the top of the category and then all bets are off. I want to also mention that this copy I have here is the first proof. We're going to call it like proof zero. I am going to give this proof away to someone who buys the book. I'll tell you how to take advantage of that in the future. Everybody who buys it will be eligible. So I'll be doing that. I'll give this copy away. I got two proofs. One, I'm going to save for my daughter, who, by the way, loves the book already. She can't read. She just loved the

pictures. Probably is going to rip the book up very, very soon. So I may need to get a couple more proofs. You go to David Pakman dot com slash book. That's it. David Pakman dot com slash book. Make sure to leave a review Kindle paperback. I'm going to update you on how this goes, but it is a super exciting new thing that we're doing and it is only available at David Pakman dot com slash book. We'll take a quick break and be back right after this. If you've been getting crushed in the markets lately, like many people have, you were probably happy to hear that Treasury yields have been surging right now. You can get a five percent yield on Treasury bills, which is higher than most high yield savings accounts I've

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Go to start mail dot com slash Pacman to get 50 percent off your first year. That's only about two bucks a month. That's S.T.A.R.T. Mail dot com slash Pacman for 50 percent off. The link is in the podcast notes. Today we're going to be speaking with Dr. Ami Klin, who's director of the Marcus Autism Center at Emory University School of Medicine and Children's Health Care of Atlanta. Dr. Klin, thanks for joining me. I really appreciate your time today. It's my pleasure. So we're going to

talk about autism. I think maybe a good starting point is what is our understanding today in 2023 of what autism is? Because over the decades there have been discussions, both well intentioned and sometimes not about whether autism is a, quote, mental illness or is it a neurological disease or what is it? What is our understanding today of what autism is? Autism is a developmental condition, which means that it is, um, uh, visible from a child, from the time that a child is, is born and he has genetic origins primarily, which basically means that it runs in families.

And if I have a child with autism, for example, one or two in every five younger siblings would also have autism. So it's a highly heritable, it's a strongly genetic condition. I say developmental because impacts the development of the social brain autism is a condition that impacts the child's ability to to develop relationships to acquire speech language communication to be able to navigate the demands of everyday social lives successfully. And it's something that is considered to be a genetic trait, and whether or not it becomes

a disability, it happens over time. And it's a very broad spectrum, from children who are very significantly affected to individuals who are much less so, from individuals who have intellectual affected to individuals who are much less so from individuals who have intellectual disabilities to individuals who are much brighter than you or I. So it's the most common complex neurodevelopmental condition. So when we think about genetically based and to some degree heritable. It's not like you said, it's not a guaranteed heritability, but there is this idea that it runs in families. There's this question of that when autism develops, are we to understand that based on what you're saying,

this is something that is sort of set and fixed in the womb? It is not. It is not. And that's a really important message to your listeners. Autism is strongly genetic, but it's very complex, with many hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of genes already implicated in autism, each one of them conferring a very low amount of risk. And so it's a little bit like traits that a child is born with, which means that they have an attenuated sense of others. And as a result of that, they accrue hundreds and hundreds, thousands of thousands of missed opportunities of social learning.

And so the autistic symptoms, they emerge in the second year of life as a result of the divergence in their development from that of their peers. is that were we to be able to identify the children very early on and provide them with early treatment and services and supports, their outcomes could be optimized. So it's absolutely not inevitable and most importantly it's now within our reach to be able to optimize their outcomes. And our ultimate goal really is to change the narrative of autism from one of disability to one of promise and diversity. When we talk about intervention and treatment, what are we talking about? In other words, what what are what do we say?

What do we mean when we say treatment of autism? Treatment for autism would mean different things at different stages of a person's life and depending on the level of disability of an individual child, adolescent or adult. But in regards to early treatment and services, meaning for children who are infants and toddlers, it goes back to the fact that what moves brain development forward early on is the mutually reinforcing choreography between infant and caregiver, is that dance, this back and forth that is at the basis of a child's ability to speak, to acquire language, and to communicate with others. And so all of the treatments that are available to us early in people's lives have to do with strengthening that connection between infants and caregivers and ensuring that this back and forth moves forward so that they can acquire all in the home or in every different or

in every possible setting so that they can have a role in advancing their own child's growth. Speaker 1 Let's talk about prevalence. Prevalence is cited in many different contexts, including some we'll talk about a little bit later when it comes to phenomena in society. We'll get back to that. But when we talk about prevalence, how does prevalence today compare to our understanding of the prevalence of autism at times past? Do we have a better understanding? So now we have changed the threshold for diagnosis or are there genuinely

more autistic people being born today than in times past? Help us understand that a little bit. Sure. And you're absolutely right. Right. Prevalence has been rising for for for many years. When I was in training, we used to say that there was one person of autism for every 2,500 individuals. And nowadays, according to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, that is one in 36. That's an enormous increase. We say, for example, now that in this country, 95,000 children will be born in the U.S. every year who will have autism. And if we went by the prevalence of, say, 40 years past, it would be only about 1,400. And that's not even the number in one of the 50 states. So absolutely, prevalence has been rising. And what the science

has shown is several things. Number one, we're finally getting things right, meaning that the number of individuals with autism that we find in the community depends on how we go about trying to find them. And so there was a time in which we waited in our clinics to count the individuals who walked through our doors. The CDC has changed those kinds of methodologies. And what we have seen is a much more comprehensive survey of the population. And those studies happen every two years. And what we have seen is that the prevalence has been rising every two years. And every time we got a little bit better in reaching a particular community, because in the past, minorities, low-income families and

rural families were not truly represented in the population that we survey in order to get a sense of how many individuals with autism are out there. So that's one of the factors. So one factor is we are better at serving the whole population. The second part is, do you as a top person in this field believe that there is actually a higher prevalence among the population separate from our ability to measure it? A very important factor is the one that you alluded before. Our understanding of autism has changed dramatically in the past 30 years or so. So the definition of autism or what we recognize autism is much broader than what we used to think. And of course, the moment that

you broader the definition, you will going to find more people. There is no question about that. But I have to tell you, there is a difference in terms between prevalence and incidence. And you mentioned, do you believe that there are more children being born with autism now than before? The answer is very likely no, because incidence means the truth about a condition in the community. What we have seen is that that might not be the case. And what is the case is the children or the individuals that we are able to ascertain and find and document their autism. And I'll just give you a brief example for you. A few years ago, there was a dramatic increase in the prevalence of autism. And in one community in particular, the Latina community, the prevalence has risen by over 110%. So it did not mean that all of a sudden there are more children from Latino communities being born

of autism. What he really meant is that we're finally knocking on their doors and now counting them to when it comes to some of the controversies as to autism's cause. No doubt you're aware that there is a conversation that has been going on for 15 years about vaccines. BPA lining in food cans has been discussed. Wi-Fi signals are diets, lack of exercise, the wrong exercise, video games. You know, I mean, I don't have to give you the full list. Some of these are more commonly discussed than others. Very generally, do we have any sense about causal or lifestyle factors right now as they relate to autism? I understand why when a condition is poorly understood, there are plenty of theories. But if your listeners include parents, and I hope they are listening to us,

these various different theories have been proven over and over and over to be wrong. So, for example, vaccines don't cause autism. Vaccines save lives. Other environmental factors that have been studied have not been shown to be causal of autism. So it's very important for people to understand that autism is not a disease. Autism is not like cancer. You asked me beforehand if autism was inevitable, and I was telling you, no, it's not inevitable. What does that mean? It means that it is a trait. Children are born with an attenuated sense of other people.

And because they fail to engage others in this back and forth we call social interaction, they end up developing the symptoms called autism. And there are many ways in which this dance between infants and caregivers can be disrupted. The most important one in autism is this genetic trait. We talked about this autism being highly heritable and strongly genetic. That is the most well-substantiated cause of autism. But you can also develop autism if you disrupt infant-caregiver interaction through things such as, for example, prematurity, or if a child goes through, say, repeated surgical interventions, if the child is born with congenital heart disease, 8 to 12% of very low gestational age children develop autism,

as do children with congenital heart disease. It's basically if you disrupt that, either because you have a neurological insult or because you have a genetic trait like what autism is, you can end up showing the symptoms of autism. But there is no substantiation of any environmental factor whatsoever to date. Having said that, among low-income families, the fact that there are what we call social determinants of health that basically puts families at disadvantage because there is trauma or because of poverty or because there is a very, let's say, impoverished linguistic

environment in the home. Well, those factors can aggravate autism, but they don't cause autism. I know we only have a few minutes left, but there were a couple of other things I wanted to ask about. As you said, if the term cure may not be an appropriate term, because, as you say, autism is not a disease in the way that cancer is a disease, given what we know about the likely genetic basis, do you think that as we move forward with gene therapies, that gene therapies may come in to play a role when it comes to autism in some way? Unlike other genetic disorders that are caused

by a single gene or a small number of genes, autism, the genetic basis of autism includes hundreds and probably by the time we finish discovering all of the genes that are implicated in autism, there will be over a thousand. It's very, very unlikely that a genetic therapy is going to make, let's say, a contribution to individuals with autism's quality of life. it is much more likely and much more pressing and much more imminent that we as a society are going to identify children earlier and provide treatments that are already available to us as the ones that we discussed before. And the notion here, just as you said, it's not to cure autism, it's not to eradicate that trait, is to ensure that children with that trait have the very best possible outcome they can have.

And the fact is that the majority of individuals with autism do not have intellectual disability, and they are making extraordinary contributions to society every day. What we want is that all children have an opportunity to make that contribution and to live fulfilling lives. We've been speaking with Dr. Ami Klin, who is director of the Marcus Autism Center at Emory University School of Medicine. I really appreciate your time and insights today. Thank you. It's my pleasure. Thank you. Keep your money in a Yotta bank account. You'll have a shot at winning nightly cash prizes ranging from two cents to a million dollars for every twenty five dollars in your account. You get one recurring ticket to the nightly prize drawing.

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That's with Y O T Tman dot com slash Pakman. The link is in the podcast notes. One of our sponsors is Happy Hippo, letting you try their products completely free. Happy Hippo offers the purest, highest quality kratom you'll find anywhere. Kratom is also known as Mitra Gina Speciosa, which is an herbal leaf from Southeast Asia. At low doses, Kratom is known for its sort of energizing, uplifting effect, comparable to coffee. At higher doses, Kratom can create a calm, soothing feeling, which some people take for

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They'll even ship to you for free. Go to Happy Hippo dot com slash Pacman. Click the pink button at the bottom of the page that says free Kratom. You can also get 20 percent off all of their products with code Pacman. That's happy hippo dot com slash Pacman. Click the free Kratom button to receive some product completely free with free shipping. After that, use the code Pacman for 20 percent off. The info is in the podcast notes. Earlier, we looked at clips of interviews that Luke Beasley did with Trump supporters at his rally in Pickens, South Carolina, over the holiday weekend. Let's now look

at clips of the actual rally. One of the most interesting things was that Republican South Carolina Senator Lindsey Graham was brutally, brutally booed. He had a speech himself and he was booed and ran off stage. And then when Trump talked about him, he was also booed. Here is Lindsey cutting it short after getting heckled the entire time and running off of the stage. You really you love to see it. You really do.

God bless America. A visibly frustrated Lindsey Graham, brutally booed by a supposedly friendly MAGA crowd and walks off stage when Trump mentioned Lindsey, the crowd also not convinced. Speaker 4 twice. Not you know, you can make mistakes on occasion. Even Lindsey down here, Senator Lindsey Graham, your love, Senator. We're going to act. We're going to love him. We're going to love him. I know it's half and half, but what I need some of those liberal votes. He's always there to help me get them. OK, we got some pretty liberal people, but he's good.

He's good. We know the good ones. We know the bad one. Crowd is very, very, very, very much not convinced. Trump then going into woke, going into elements of woke and says nobody knows what wokeness is for women. And, you know, the amazing thing, because of our crazy woke society and I hate the word woke, actually, because nobody even has a real accurate description. It means a lack of common sense more than anything else, but because of sorry, sir, woke means you are

aware of injustices in society and you'd like to fix them, at least if it's possible. Trump as news was breaking about his phone call to pressure Arizona's governor to overturn the 2020 election results, weighed in during his speech about his phone call to try to get Georgia officials to overturn the election results. And he continues to exist, insist rather. This was just a perfect call copy of it. It was a perfect call.

These were perfect calls. These were calls where you're questioning the validity and the safety of elections. And it's a disgrace that they're allowed to even think about it. But not one person protested until long after that call. Right. And if there was something wrong with that call, I am not a stupid person. Number one, I'm an honest person, so I wouldn't do it anyway. But when people are on the phone, Trump would know whether there was anything right or wrong,

whether there was anything wrong with the call. That's not true. Trump doesn't know anything. And Trump would never lie about the call. That's not true. Trump lies all the time. Many lawyers. Do you think many people were on that phone? Many, many people. Do you think I'm going to say what they'd like to have? But the problem is it's not borne out. I will tell you what is borne out. The call was supposedly taped in the state of Florida and in Florida. You're not allowed to do, you know, that's a two party state. In other words, you're not allowed to take phone calls.

They take the phone call to show you how nice they are. They take the phone call. All right. So Trump rambling and rambling about that. None of us believe it. And then lastly, Donald Trump directly attacking special prosecutor Jack Smith. It's hard to believe this is a good strategy for the presidential records act. Well, that's what they should be looking at, because everything I did was under the presidential records act. We have a thug prosecutor named Smith, Jack Smith. He's a thug.

He's had many losses. He's destroyed many lives and they put him in charge. In the meantime, what about Biden's records? This guy is one thousand eight hundred and fifty boxes. He has boxes stored in Chinatown in D.C. Rough place, by the way. And Trump continuing to tell the same debunked lies about Joe Biden and his documents. It's the greatest hits.

But I have to tell you, even the cult crowd seems a little bit skeptical, but not the cultists we're about to look at video of. It wasn't just Luke Beasley on the ground and pick in South Carolina for the Trump rally. We also have these incredible interviews done by right wing media, including right side broadcasting. This one is maybe the sickest we've seen. A woman at the Trump rally in South Carolina said that Biden and others should be taken to the train station. I there's no way around this, folks. She's talking about trains to concentration camps. That's what this woman is talking about and says it with no shame.

What should President Trump do on day one when he gets back in? Lock him up, right? Deep state. Take it down. Take him to train station. Take him to train station. I didn't say that. Take him to the train station. That's even almost too much for Marjorie Taylor Greene's boyfriend, Brian Glenn, who does

these interviews. This is what Nazis say. Here's a guy at the Trump rally who told Brian Glenn Trump's trying to expose the deep state. And Lindsey Graham's part of that deep state. I'm sure first you got to expose the deep state and Lindsey Graham's part of that deep state. I'm sure first you got to expose the deep state. And he's been working on that. One of the creatures is here. Lindsey Graham. There you go. Brian Glenn, also unsure whether he wants to get involved in that. Of course, one of the things cultists often say when they are constantly lied to by the cult leader is that the cult

leader is really honest. Here's what this woman had to say. Like people are becoming more involved rather than they did before. And a lot of people's eyes are opening to what is more truthful and what's not right. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Truth is a revolution right now. And that's not something that we've had in a long time. It feels good. It's refreshing to think it's refreshing that Trump is so, so, so honest, so, so, so honest. And then even interviewing an 11 year old girl who has been sadly brainwashed with the same stuff, says Trump's the only honest guy left.

Why are you excited to be here? What what made you want to come out? Because I love Trump. What is it that you like about Donald Trump? He only tells the truth. That's a big thing, right? Telling the truth. Scary cult stuff. Scary cult stuff. We've got a great bonus show for you today. Sign up at join Pacman dot com. Remember, Alex Jones hates the bonus show, the bonus show where you want to make money. Everybody else that makes money to fund themselves is bad. Howard Stern likes the bonus show, but he won't pay for it. A David Pacman membership costs six bucks a month.

Yeah. Join Pacman dot com, my friends. That's the place to sign up. We will see you on the bonus show.