The David Pakman Show - 9/28/23: 2nd GOP debate goes really poorly, Trump holds fake union event

Episode Date: September 28, 2023

-- On the Show: -- Cenk Uygur, host of The Young Turks and author of the new book "Justice Is Coming: How Progressives Are Going to Take Over the Country and America Is Going to Love It" joins David to make the case that Joe Biden cannot possibly win re-election in 2024, and more. Get the book: https://amzn.to/46uUwmK -- Despite not even attending, Donald Trump easily wins the 2nd Republican presidential debate, as the debate itself becomes a farcical reality show not useful to any of the candidates who attended -- California Governor Gavin Newsom is in the spin room after the second Republican debate and destroys everyone -- Failed former President Donald Trump gives a fake, staged speech supposedly supporting striking UAW workers at a non-union factory with non-autoworkers holding fake signs -- Republican Congressman Jason Smith does not like it when NBC reporter Ryan Nobles explains to him that the supposed wrongdoing by Joe Biden allegedly took place when Biden was neither President, nor Vice President, nor a candidate for any political office -- General Mark Milley now must take security precautions for himself and his family after Donald Trump suggests Milley should be executed -- Voicemail callers as David super specific questions about pasta and tea -- On the Bonus Show: The meaning of "abortion" is up for debate, Alabama super-prison cost climbs past $1 billion, Senate passes resolution to reinstate formal dress code after John Fetterman controversy, much more... 🔊 Babbel: Get 55% off your subscription at https://babbel.com/pakman 💻 Psono: Get the world’s best password manager for businesses at https://psono.com 🌱 Unsolicited Plant Talks: Save 15% with code PAKMAN at https://unsolicitedplanttalks.com/pakman 💪 Athletic Greens is offering FREE year-supply of Vitamin D at https://athleticgreens.com/pakman 👍 Use code PAKMAN for 10% off the Füm Journey Pack at https://tryfum.com/PAKMAN -- Become a Supporter: http://www.davidpakman.com/membership -- Subscribe on YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/thedavidpakmanshow -- Subscribe to Pakman Live: https://www.youtube.com/pakmanlive -- Follow us on Twitter: http://twitter.com/davidpakmanshow -- Like us on Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/davidpakmanshow -- Leave us a message at The David Pakman Show Voicemail Line (219)-2DAVIDPSeptember 20, 2023

. Republicans held the second Republican primary debate for the presidential nomination yesterday. It was held in California. The biggest winner is Donald Trump, even though he wasn't actually at the debate. Donald Trump skipping this debate much like he did the first one. And he really was the winner because not a single candidate did anything last night that actually puts them in a position to even have a theoretical path to this nomination. We're going to look at clips. I will ultimately give you my sort

of breakdown of how the entire night went. It started off. I mean, listen, if we if we say that this is a VP audition, that these are candidates auditioning to be Trump's vice presidential running mate, I don't think anybody actually passed the test. It became total reality show nonsense. Funny moment to start it off. Stuart Varney was one of the hosts of this event, along with Dana Perino and Univision's Ilya Calderon. And Stuart Varney struggled and glitched trying to say her name, abandoned it and just instead called her Univision in what is just an emblematic moment for how this entire night went. Look at this news channel, Dana Farina and Ilya Calderon, Univision. OK, absolutely beautiful moment of unity and understanding and everything else just completely

bailing and saying, I think I'll just call her Univision because this name is not really working for me. Then we get into the truly, you know, even if people didn't talk over each other, the format doesn't allow for real debate. You will have someone rant and rave, making eight different allegations against the different candidate. And then that other candidate is given 15 seconds to respond. Even if everybody goes by the rules, it's not a format that actually lends itself to substantive debate. But this is the sort of thing that was happening the entire

night. Listen to this. It sounds like I'm playing seven clips at once of people talking. That's that's one clip. That's the way it was live for much of this debate. Absolutely and completely ridiculous. Even when they didn't interrupt each other, there was no deep policy discussion of any kind. Here's a heated moment where Nikki Haley and Tim Scott argued over curtains, curtains. What was the deal with different curtains that Nikki Haley did or didn't have someplace? Ten cents on this gallon in South Carolina

as the U.N. ambassador, you literally bring in fifty,000 on curtains at a $15 million subsidized location. Next. You got bad information. First of all, I fought the gas tax in South Carolina multiple times against the establishment. Just go to YouTube. Against the establishment. And you want to know what that 10-some was? When they wouldn't pass the gas tax, the establishment and the companies wanted me to do it so much that I said the only way I will pass it is if you will give us three.

All you have to do is go watch Nikki Haley on YouTube. If you will give me three times the deduction and income tax, then I will look at your gas tax, which is why it didn't happen. Secondly, on the $50 million. Here is a nice part. Secondly, on the curtains, do your homework 10 because Obama bought those curtains? Did you send them back? It's in the press. Did you send them back? It's the State Department. Did you send them back? You're the one that works in Congress. Oh, my gosh. You get it. All right. Whose responsibility was it to burn in a fire the curtains that the Obama

State Department installed wherever the ambassador to the U.N. lives or works. This was the entire debate. No new path to the nomination generated for anybody. The voters of the Republican electorate don't seem to actually want anybody other than Trump. And continually they would use these talking points that make no sense given the reality on the ground. Like, for example, here's Vivek Ramaswamy, who completely bombed by the way. I think his campaign is probably over after last night's debate.

He and others kept talking about putting people back to work. Listen to the home. But here's the other thing that we can do. It's easy. Mr. Ramaswamy. And it addresses the national. By the way, Ramaswamy, Stuart Varney really struggling last night debt as well as brings down prices. Put people back to work.

We are using taxpayer money. Yeah. Unemployment hasn't been this low for this long in something like 60 years, 70 years, maybe put people back to work. We got to get the country working again. Unemployment is almost at what we would consider full employment if not there. And it doesn't matter because it doesn't really matter what they say. Nobody's really listening. It's not a format for actually engaging with ideas.

None of it. Chris Christie, who I think he and Nikki Haley did the best last night, they actually answered questions and were the most at least theoretically honest. He still continues to be irritated with Vivek Ramaswamy and here tells him to just put his hand best last night. They actually answered questions and were the most at least theoretically honest. He still continues to be irritated with Vivek Ramaswamy and here tells him to just put his hand up. I have respect for every man and woman on this stage because they've done it. Put your hand down for a second. I still got I still got time, dude. So and I have to tell you, it is true that no matter what was going on, Vivek Ramaswamy would put his hand up. It wasn't even he wasn't even always being talked about. It was just unclear. He just put his hand up.

And it seems this was the strategy for many candidates. Just keep talking because they might end up listening to you and everybody else shuts up. But it was not a productive means of having any actual policy engagement. The dumbest actual policy idea of the night, I believe, came from the failed former vice president, Mike Pence, the one MAGA wanted killed. He suggested the following when it comes to dealing with gun violence. Go to the Congress of the United States and we're going to pass a federal expedited death penalty for anyone involved in a mass shooting so that they will meet their fate in months, not years. It is a vote of the.

This is maybe the dumbest policy idea I've heard from Pence ever. Certainly the dumbest last night. The idea is we will curb gun violence. How? By making it known that if you commit a mass shooting, you already committed it. And if you don't take your own life in so doing, which many of the shooters do, or if the police don't end up shooting you dead, which is often the way that the mass shootings go down, then if you get the death penalty, you're going to get it much more quickly. You're not going to have to wait around 20 or 30 years to be executed.

It's going to be much faster. This will have zero deterrent effect in particular for multiple reasons, including that mass shooters often plan to die at the shooting. And secondly, they are not anybody in a position to commit such a heinous act of wholesale violence is not going to be dissuaded because the death penalty might come a little bit faster. Dumbest policy idea of the night. Chris Christie attempted to be tough and to send a message to Trump.

Even though I like Chris Christie the most of everybody on that stage last night, I don't know that he really seems tougher, intimidating when he does stuff like this. And I want to look at that camera right now and tell you, Donald, I know you're watching. You can't help yourself. I know you're watching. OK, and you're not here tonight, not because of polls and not because of your indictments. You're not here tonight because you're afraid of being on the stage and defending your record. You're ducking these things. And let me tell you what's going to happen. You keep doing that.

No one up here is going to call you Donald Trump anymore. We're going to call you Donald Duck. Whoa. OK, so I mean, it's a funny premeditated line. I don't know that it really does anything for anybody, but this is what the debate has been reduced to. And Chris Christie is doing his best to bring something to it. Here's a compilation of Mike Pence, who I believe was one of the worst

performers of the night, trying to be charismatic and testing out a variety of different jokes and lines. It's landing about as well as Ron DeSantis trying to appear charismatic, which is not well. Joe Biden doesn't belong on a picket line. He belongs on the unemployment line. Yeah. And that was an applause line which failed. Very little applause as a result. I'm glad Vivek pulled out of his business deal in 2018 in China. That must have been about the time you decided to start voting in presidential elections. I served in Congress for 12 years, although it seemed longer. Chris, you mentioned the president's situation. I'm my wife isn't a member of the teachers union, but I got to admit, I've been sleeping with

a teacher for 38 years. Chris Christie just nodding like, what the hell is this guy talking about? Pence is not good at this. The Sanctus is also not good at it. Just a failed, failed night for so many. Nikki Haley did again find a spot where she was able to go after Vivek Ramaswamy hard. I think maybe it landed, although again, this is all part of a format that doesn't work for anybody.

We could have and what you've got. I honestly, every time I hear you, I feel a little bit dumber for what you say, because I can't believe. All right. So, you know, the crowd likes it. I feel dumber whenever you talk Vivek. It's a funny line, but it's also representative of the total debasement and sham of this entire Republican Party that has failed on policy. And then they fail on tone and they fail on substance and they fail on optics and they

fail on conversation. And this is what you're left with. And maybe the biggest loser of the night was Fox News. At the very end of the debate, Dana Perino tried almost like a mix of survivor and jeopardy. She tried to have the candidates write down the name of the person who should be removed from the primary today on a piece of paper. She it was turning it from metaphorical reality show TV to literal reality show TV. And the candidates didn't seem to go. And welcome back to the final minutes. I could go another hour, but we only have a few minutes and candidates. It's now obvious that if you all stay in the

race, former President Donald Trump wins the nomination. None of you have indicated that you're dropping out. So which one of you on stage tonight should be voted off the island? So at this point, it seems like a joke, but it's not a joke. Use your marker to write your choice on the notepad in front of you. Fifteen seconds starting now of the people on the stage. Are you sure? I'm absolutely serious. With all due respect, I mean, we're here like we're happy to debate.

I think that that's disrespectful to my fellow competitors. Nobody wants to. Nobody wants to participate. Let's do some questions. Let's talk about the future of the country. Oh, my goodness. So the biggest loser was Fox News. The biggest winner was Donald Trump. By not being there, it was so clear there's no one there who seriously is actually making a run for this nomination. These are not serious people. Trump's also not serious, but he has the bully pulpit of former incumbency and 60 percent support.

So if I'm Trump, I'm sitting at home laughing all the way to the bank as I see these people fail. I think the two candidates that did the best were Chris Christie and Nikki Haley for two reasons. They were the most sane and they actually answered questions. Many of these other candidates just answered some other random question when it was presented to them. After the two of them, I believe Doug Burgum would be in third place. He was generally honest and marginally less extreme, followed by Tim Scott. Tim Scott was sort of like the dividing line between cuckoo for Cocoa Puffs and like trying to engage a little bit on some of the issues. And then at the bottom, tied for dead last, I would have Ron DeSantis, Mike Pence and Vivek

Ramaswamy. DeSantis and Vivek's candidacies may be over after this disastrous debate. Absolutely horrible. The guy who was at the debate that made the most sense was actually Gavin Newsom. What? Let's talk about that next. The Biden campaign deployed California Democratic Governor Gavin Newsom to the spin room of last night's second Republican debate. I have to tell you, he's pretty good at what he does. He really is. I'm going to give you a couple of examples here. Here's Gavin Newsom presented with the story of Ron DeSantis saying, I spoke to a couple who was mugged three times in California and Newsom is actually armed with facts. Listen to this.

My wife and I have met three people who have been mugged on the street. Why? I want him in this may be an opportunity. I appreciate to look up Jacksonville, Florida, and he may want to familiarize himself with Miami, Florida, and his homicide rates, which are 100% higher than San Francisco. Crime rates in his own backyard. He has a higher homicide rate statewide,

16% higher than the state of California. For whatever reason, he didn't bring up Tennessee, Arkansas, South Carolina, didn't bring up Texas, all with higher crime rates in the state of California. This is an old trope. I mean, if you're in New York, so I think people are getting a little exhausted by the fact that we're focusing on New York's crime rate and not the crime rate in these other Republican led cities.

He has the data. And of course, the reality is people get mugged in every large metropolitan city. The question is, what are the rates? And as Gavin Newsom points out, the rates are far higher in a bunch of these red state cities, including Ron DeSantis, Ron DeSantis or DeSantis, his own state of Florida. The issue of jobs came up. As I told you, the jobs numbers are good. And Gavin Newsom is very good on this issue as well.

Just prone to distraction when we got a record of a conference with Democrats. All of us are distracted and we need to be more forceful. Thirteen point five million jobs almost seven times more than the last three Republican presidents combined. Joe Biden administration, 47 million jobs created since Ronald Reagan left office in nineteen eighty nine forty seven out of forty nine million done by Democratic administrations at ninety six percent. This jobs debate is not even interesting. The only thing that's interesting is the last three Republican presidents have one thing in common recessions. I mean, we dominate on the facts, but not the narrative.

There you go. And he is absolutely right about that. And lastly, from Gavin Newsom, interviewed by Sean Hannity after the debate and shuts down the entire we used to have energy independence and Biden took it away. Some of this, by the way, but he also adopted it. He made us he made the country energy independent. By the way, 75 years, we are more energy dependent today. Look that up. It's a fact. And if you know, no, it's just factually and Joe Biden is unilaterally disarmed. Encourage the people watching. Look, it's 5.94 quads. Google 9.5. Look at all the restrictions Joe Biden has put on oil and gas companies. We are more energy

independent today under Biden. Pence doesn't know that. Your audience doesn't know that. More domestic oil production than any time in history. We're on pace this year. That's a fact. You guys keep making that up. No, we don't make it up. You're making it up. We're energy independent and now we are energy independent. We're not energy. The data as it exists today reflects the reality that Gavin Newsom is putting forward, not Sean Hannity. So I'm looking forward to this Newsom DeSantis debate on November 30th. But more importantly, Newsom continues to show that he has the delivery and the tone and the sort of constitutional makeup of the sort of Democrat that is needed. Doesn't mean we love him on policy, doesn't mean California is perfect or that his

governorship has been perfect. But this is the sort of thing we need because this guy's going head to head against these people. Pete Buttigieg does it. There are others who do it as well. Let's take a quick break. You're not going to believe the fake staged union speech that Donald Trump attempted to give yesterday. That's after the break. I run a business and I know how important it is to keep passwords safe. Our website has been hacked in the past. I've talked about it. There's videos on YouTube about it.

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That's unsolicitedplanttalks.com slash Pacman. Get 15% off using code Pacman. The info is in the podcast notes. The failed former President Donald Trump yesterday engaged in the closest thing I recall he or any American politician doing that is this close to overt Russian or North Korean style propaganda. Now, you might be saying, David, that sounds a little bit hyperbolic that that what do you what do you mean? Donald Trump, after being rejected by the actual union workers that are striking in Michigan with the United Auto Workers Union because he's against unions, why on earth would they welcome Trump?

Trump went to a nonunion factory, had people in the crowd holding signs that say union workers for Trump. They weren't actually union workers. And Trump in his speech pretended that he was talking to union workers, even though the union said, don't come here. And he was at a non union factory. This is unbelievable. The Detroit News reported that there were about four or 500 Trump supporters in the audience for Trump in Clinton Township, Michigan. It was filled with

pro Trump signs, MAGA hats, etc. It was at Drake Enterprises. Drake Enterprises has about 125 employees at this facility. So right off the bat, we know it's not even just their employees. It's a propaganda crowd. Fine. But the most important aspect to this is the catalyst for Trump going was that he wanted to get involved with the UAW strike. The UAW doesn't represent the Drake Enterprises workforce. It is not a union facility. But Trump shows up as if he's speaking to union workers. In fact, there were these union members for Trump signs, which we're putting up on the screen for you right now, all over the place, which union members, the people that work there aren't union. And it actually turns out that some of these were not even that they were just brought in to hold

signs. There was a local paper that covered this event. They found one guy holding a union members for Trump sign who wasn't in any union period, just not in any union. Another one was holding an auto workers for Trump sign wasn't an auto worker. The entire thing was fabricated. And here is Donald Trump speaking again, acting like he's speaking to the United Auto Workers, which he's not. Speaker 4 But we will stop him. Hopefully your leaders at United Auto Workers will endorse Donald Trump. Your leaders at United Auto Workers, they weren't in that room.

This was a non union factory. This is overt propaganda and misdirection. Trump then pretend again, continues to talk about this like he is speaking to auto workers. But then he also can't help himself and he starts issuing some complaints. Crooked Joe backed every single blood sucking globalist attack to our U.S. autoworkers. And you've been attacked for a long time. Those attacks all stopped for four years with us. And they were getting so strong and you were getting so strong.

And they were building plants here again. Now the plants are going back to Mexico and they're going back to China. And he's coming back. They're coming back for more. I don't know that he's going to make it to the starting gate, but let's assume he does. If it's not him, it'll be somebody else with the same ideas, because that's the ideas they have. They're very destructive for our country. But we will stop him.

Hopefully your leaders at United Auto Workers will endorse Donald Trump. Because, you know, standard history for years and decades and years and years, years, they always endorse a Democrat. It's almost like it's almost like an automatic reflex and there's no reason for it. But it's it's a habit. Yeah. Why do the unions endorse Democrats historically? Well, here's Trump pretending to speak to union workers at a plant that does not have a union representing the workers. It is ridiculous.

Trump then, of course, can't help himself. He has to go after electric stuff. In this case, he's going after electric boats. What happens if the boat has an accident? Starts thinking, do you get electrocuted if the boat sink? Guy said, you know, I've never thought of that, actually, but I think I gave him an idea, actually. Now, can you imagine the boat goes down and you're sitting on top of a battery? I don't I don't feel good about that. Right. And yeah, just constant confusion about everything electric. Trump also of note seems to announce that he's

not going to pick any of the current people that participated in last night's Republican debate as his vice president, although many see it as a vice presidential audition here. Trump seems to say none of them seem to have what it takes. Speaker 4 competing with the job candidates are all running for a job. No, they're all job candidates. They want to be in the they want to tell to anything secretary of something. They even say VP. I don't know. Does anybody see any VP in the group? I don't think so.

Does anybody see a VP in the group? I don't think so. So maybe Trump not planning to go with anybody from that group. And then lastly, here is a guy at Trump's speech who is the has been president of the auto work president for auto workers for Trump is a group, I guess, auto workers for Trump. He's retired and he says encouraging people to buy electric vehicles is bad because it'll lead to job losses, which is not true. But let's listen to what the guy has to say.

Probably electric vehicles. The Biden push. He hasn't come out and, you know, endorsed flat out mandates, but he's pushing the industry to build more electric vehicles. Yeah. He's pushing consumers through incentives to buy more electric vehicles. But electric vehicles require 30 to 40 percent fewer workers to build them because you eliminate the engine, you eliminate the powertrain, you know, the drive shaft. So the argument is electric vehicles are bad for labor because the engines are so much

more simple in EVs that you don't need as many employees. This is very much like I don't need a calculator because we've got an abacus or I don't need a smartphone because I've got a calculator or we don't need cars because we've got horse buggies. And what about the horse buggy drivers? The reality is that there will be widespread new jobs as a result of more electric vehicles. Number one, the entire world of batteries, both for home battery, home electricity, storage, charging home electricity batteries, batteries, and also for electric vehicles. The battery world is going to expand new research, new factories, tons of jobs.

The charging infrastructure is going to be an industry unto itself. We have very undersized charging infrastructure in the United States right now, other than Tesla, particularly for all of the vehicles that are being sold. That's going to be gobs of new jobs. Grid upgrades to the electrical system will be required. There will be both innovation and new blue collar type jobs for grid upgrades. Materials are finite and they are valuable. So there's going to be a push to recycling many of the elements used in electric vehicle batteries and recycling and re repurposing of those elements is going to open up tons of new jobs. We're going to raise demand by having more electric vehicles. People will say, hey, OK, now the vehicle is electric,

but my electricity still comes from coal. Let's go to clean sources. So wind power jobs are going to explode. Solar power jobs are going to explode. The electric vehicle and grid world is very software driven. So there's going to be new software jobs related to electric vehicles and vehicle charging. So this is total nonsense. And I don't know if they don't get it or they get it and they're lying because it's what they're expected to do. But a completely staged farcical event. The union workers said to Trump, we don't want you here. You're not pro union. So Trump just showed up, shows up at a nonunion shop and pretends to be talking to union workers, Russian North Korean style propaganda.

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Maybe just to pick something interesting that relates to what you discuss in the book. You seem, I think, increasingly worried that Joe Biden's reelection is going to go haywire, that he's going to lose, that he can't beat Trump if that's who the nominee is. The context, although you're not directly addressing this necessarily in the book, the context you talk about in the book relates to it. Am I accurately understanding your view on the Biden reelection? A hundred percent. Yeah. The look, nothing is in terms of probabilities of winning. Nothing is zero or 100%. Everything's on a spectrum somewhere, right? Yep.

So, and unfortunately, a lot of people think in a binary way. Well, he won last time, that means he's gonna win this time. No, it doesn't work that way. It's a percentage chance. And with Joe Biden, any rational person realizes that the percentage chance of him beating Trump is much lower than if we had a strong Democratic candidate. Now, why is he, quote unquote, not strong? Well, look at the polling. It's not my opinion. And this isn't progressive versus moderate. That has nothing to do with any of this. I don't have a progressive alternative. There's no Trojan horse that we're going to sneak in, and voila, Nina Turner's president. No. Okay. I mean, I would love that, but no.

Okay. No, I'm just, I'll take Josh Shapiro from Pennsylvania. I'll take Governor Beshear from Kentucky just to increase our percentage chances. So why are they so low, David? They're low because he's 72 percent of the country says that they don't even think he's going to make it through a second term. That's a disastrous poll. And so we could try to wish that away, but we can't. His approval rating in half the recent polls are in the 30s. If you're in the 40s as an incumbent, you're very likely to lose. If you're in the 30s, I've literally never seen it happen. And remember, when he won the electoral college by a razor thin margin, he won the popular vote by four and a half points. So he has to be up

at a bare, bare minimum four and a half points. So he has to be up at a bare, bare minimum, four and a half, but then you're playing dice with democracy. So realistically, he has to be up five points. And right now he's losing. Come on, guys, think about it. He's losing to the moron Donald Trump right now. It's inconceivable. It cannot, David, it cannot be the most important election of our lifetimes. And we are choosing to go into it with a very hobbled candidate because we'd like to be polite to him because he'd like a better legacy as a two term president. So let me present let me present a couple different perspectives. OK, and see what you think. One is. It's September, you know, end of September, early October 2023.

And Joe Biden is currently the president of the United States. So the question I'm asking is his replacement with who would actually get him get the Democratic candidate in a better position. I don't think that if he were to be replaced at this point because of the negative connotations of that, that it actually would increase the chances that the Democratic nominee becomes president. Do you agree with that? Or you think his replacement at this stage of the game ups the odds that the Democratic

candidate wins? His replacement would instantly give the Democrats a five to 10 point bump in really with who, though? OK, easy, super easy. I named two right there. Name them again. I could name you probably about 400 Democrats in the country who would do better than Joe Biden. I mean, look at that way of thinking.

The only Democrat who could win is Joe Biden. Why is the rest of the Democratic Party totally pathetic? No, no, no. My argument is less about that. And by the way, I don't know that I'm any more of a Biden fan than you are. I'm just trying to think about this as strategically as possible. The act of saying at this point that a president who has announced they are running for reelection has an OK economic record and has had some tangible advancements for labor, et cetera,

which we can talk about saying we're actually going to pull them out. We're either going to run a primary or we're just going to anoint someone. It's hard for me to imagine it helps. No, no, it's totally. Yeah. Look, that's we have a massive disagreement there. So let me explain why. Yeah, please.

And this case is almost never made. So probably nobody's even heard this case before. OK, first of all, heated primaries are a wonderful thing. The examples against heated primaries go back decade after decade. In 1972 and 1837, no guys, in 2020, the Democrats had a heated primary, they won. In 2016, the Republicans had a really heated, the most heated primary in American history, and they won. Why? Because the extra coverage, media coverage you get from a heated primary helps your side make your case to the American people.

The Democrats are not making their case at all. Whereas if we had Governor Beshear from Kentucky and Governor Shapiro from Pennsylvania against Joe Biden, they'd all be talking about how great the Democratic case is and how they would be better at executing that Democratic case. I don't believe in anointing anyone. It's absurd. I don't believe that the president is king and we must abide by his rule. I don't believe in line of succession and hence the crown princess Kamala Harris should

be anointed next. No, I believe in something very simple. Democracy. It works. Give me a primary today and I will give you a much stronger Democratic Party. Couple thoughts on that. And this is interesting. And by the way, I would love a Democratic primary and make Joe Biden win it again.

Like I get why the Democratic Party is not doing it. I understand their their thing is we've got someone in the Oval Office. Our best shot is just go with that. I would love a primary to honestly, honestly, David, I don't think that's why they're doing it. Well, they're a corporation. Hold on. Hold on. Everyone, you know, and I know everyone in our lifetimes has said the rule, an incumbent under 50 points is very likely to lose. So they keep talking about incumbent advantage, and that's actually not true. The incumbent advantage exists in Montana, where name recognition is the name of the game. But at the presidential level,

everybody's gonna know the Democratic candidate in the general election. Literally, everyone is. Name recognition is not an issue. Incumbency actually weighs you down as president. It's actually a negative thing. They get to attack you on all the different issues. So the Democrats don't want Biden just because they believe in the power of incumbency. And maybe some of them do, genuinely. But the real reason is they believe in the power of authoritarian rule. You ask the DNC, they are never going to go with an outsider. They are never going to go with someone who isn't already the incumbent because they believe in the current power infrastructure.

Us as Democratic voters need to rebel and say, I didn't sign up for authoritarian rule. That's the other side. I signed up for democracy sign up for authoritarian rule. That's the other side. I signed up for democracy and fighting for our values. So two thoughts on this hypothetical primary that we both agree won't happen, but would like to see one is, by the way, I don't agree to that. I'm trying to force that. OK. All right. Fair, fair, fair. And T.Y.T. dot com slash dropout because the most the best way to get here is that Joe Biden stops being an egomaniac and worry about.

So you you think it might happen? I don't think it will have. Fine. That's a disagreement. But here's two thoughts based on what you said. One, the Republican primary right now is a version of what you described, meaning they seem to sort of agree on the package, much like you're saying Democratic voters agree on the platform and why it's better than what Republicans are offering.

Many of those people in the Republican primary are less crazy than Trump and probably would be more likely to actually do the things that they want to do. Trump's blowing them out of the water without even going to the debate. So that's that's one thing. It's not obvious to me that when voters are presented with other people who are younger and less crazy with the same ideas on the Republican side, they're doing something very different. Republican voters are different. And you can make that case in a second. Second observation, we have some polling of Williamson, Kennedy and Biden. Now, my opinion is Kennedy and Williamson are not people like

the ones you described. But. I actually think if there were a primary right now and Biden is in it, I think Biden wins the primary. No, no. Yeah. The only way that he wins the primary is mainstream media brainwashes every one of the Democratic voters into compliance. Okay. But I don't think they're going to. And so that's a giant difference between 2016, 2020, and 2024. Why? Cuz in 2016 and 2020, MSNBC and CNN hit progressives and Bernie Sanders harder than Fox News did. Constantly battering, battering, battering, because they're in favor of corporate rule and establishment Democrats. But in this case, it's not really,

look, I wish it was Marianne versus Biden, and I'm gonna vote for Marianne if those are the choices. And I'm gonna do that easily. I think she's not only the better candidate in terms of policy, I think she has a better chance of winning. I think everyone has a better chance of winning than Biden. But okay, put that aside, put that aside. What is much more likely is a Governor Shapiro or a Governor Beshear or a Governor Whitmer against Biden. Okay, well, in that case, the mainstream media actually probably flips to being either neutral or a little against Biden. Because then they don't have to worry about a progressive, which they hate way more than they would hate Trump, right? So since you don't have to worry about that, and they all know Biden's gonna lose. I mean,

you could see the sweat on Joe Scarborough's forehead every morning. And James Carbo came out yesterday with Bill Maher and said, what are we, crazy? Finally, David Ignatius at the Washington Post, finally people are catching up to what I'm saying crazy? Finally, David Ignatius at the Washington Post, finally people are catching up to what I'm saying, which is, guys, this isn't your normal battle where you dig into your trenches. Do you really think democracy's on the line? Because my hair's on fire. Trump is promising not only imprisonment, but death for his political opponents. And people aren't getting it. They keep projecting normalness onto Trump when he is not normal.

Will he actually do those things? Yes, he will definitely imprison his political opponents. He has said it, Bannon has said it, Roger Stone has said it. They've said it 100 times. They're gonna imprison people for no goddamn reason. His former defense secretary just yesterday said yes, he considered arresting and imprisoning General McRaven and General McChrystal in the last term. And back then there was brakes in the car. So democracy is actually on the line. To go in with a wounded

antelope is madness, total madness. So I think even the Morning Joe guys know, I mean, for them, it's Newsom and Whitman, right? For me, it's Shapiro and Bashir because I think they're more likely to win. They want to swing states that want to red states and they're more personal, slightly better policies. But give me anyone, anyone but Biden. I don't want to purposely lose this election. I don't want to go quietly into that good night. So to not make the entire interview just about this, I think this is a good segue into what you argue in the book is actually the state of the country when it comes to the political spectrum, which is that you argue that this is fundamentally a progressive country. This

is an argument I've also been making when you really do issue oriented polling and the wording is fair. And particularly if you track the change over the last 30, 40, 50 years on a lot of these issues, abortion and many others, that it is it really is fundamentally at least as progressive a country on average, close to some of the northern European countries. However, you talk about in the book influence of money. We know that the way that politics is financed is a problem. We know that the Electoral College is a problem. We all these different things sort of get in the way.

What do you believe is the most direct path to getting all of the obstacles out of the way? Not so that we can skew anything, but just so that the actual current opinions of voters will be reflected in who's representing us in Washington, DC. What are the obstacles we have to get out of the way? Yeah. So there's really two. There's a bunch of things that I explained in chapter six as to why we're going to win

and how we can win. Right. But there's a couple of pillars of that victory. So one is the route that Bernie's been taking, which is go for leadership at the Democratic level and change the culture of the Democratic Party, have it represent the voters again, as opposed to corporate interest. And in chapter four, I explain how we lost the Democratic Party to corporate interest and to donors, right? So that's a perfectly good way. And we're gonna win with that, because not only do you see the polling shows that two thirds of the country is progressive on nearly every issue.

And so you just need a leader to put a spotlight on it, right? But on top of that, you also have the young voters, and the young voters are very progressive and they're coming in a tsunami in our direction. So once we have a leader, it will galvanize all those forces. But you cannot just wait for a guy on a white horse to ride in and save the day. So the real key in the long run is to take money out of politics. The only way you can do that is a constitutional amendment to go above the Supreme Court. And do you need to build a bipartisan coalition to pass an amendment? Of course, of course you do. But the thing is, the one redeeming quality Republican voters have is that they also hate

corruption. And so I know with Trump they don't mind it, but other than that, they actually did want to drain the swamp and they actually do hate corporate Republicans like Mitch McConnell. And that's a really positive development. And we need to take those guys and our guys and say, stop listening to corporate Democrats and corporate Republicans. Work together to get an amendment to end private financing of elections, because as long as they get their money from private interests, politicians will always serve private interests. And of course, the last roadblock, David, is mainstream media, corporate media overall, which is right-wing media and mainstream media combined.

And those guys are the biggest benefactor of money in politics. They get tens of billions of dollars every election cycle. And so since they get almost all the money from corruption, the media does an excellent job of convincing you that there is no corruption. No, when someone gives millions of dollars to a politician, they're just talking to them. Oh my God, they happen to agree. That's why they always vote with the way the donors want. It's just a coincidence. The New York Times tells you in absurd, ridiculous fashion. CNN tells you it's a massive gnosis. I get messages from progressives who would agree with basically everything you just said

and who write to me worried. And they say, you know, David, we have the Bernie Sanders example from 2020. Paula Jean Swearengen, Randy Bryce, Nina Turner, who I believe now works for you at TYT. I'm as progressive as the rest of them. But there's a bunch of these races at all sorts of different levels where the person that genuinely seems to be the progressive loses. Is it because maybe the country isn't as progressive as I thought? Is it because of media coverage? Is it because of money in politics? What's the explanation that ties it all together? Yeah. So, look, there's both specific cases

and the general explanation in terms of the specific cases. Every case that you mentioned, those three examples, for example, are very different. Pauline Swergin, I had a lot of love for her in the beginning, God bless her heart, but she did not run winning campaigns. And in West Virginia, the way that she ran it in the media coverage, it was not realistic, right? So on the other hand, Nina Turner did not lose the Republicans. She lost in a primary and she had a 35 point lead. Why did she lose? Because Democratic lobbyists put in packs, put in over $4 million in the last two weeks. They bought nearly every ad in Cleveland. And so that money, the corrupt dark money is what beat her in the primary. So if you go with that line of logic, what are we gonna

do? We're gonna give up as Democratic voters and say this party no longer represents us, it represents corporate interests, but we have to go with the corporate candidates because they're the ones with the most bribes. That's just a disgusting place to be, right? So I don't want that, but we can beat all of that. We can get past all of that. So the general way to win is, and this is why the last part of chapter six is so important, not just the PACs, but the media. And this is why TYT is important and David Pakman is important. And all of these shows are important. Because guys, if we just live under mainstream media, they're gonna hammer the progressive

candidate every single time. I mean, look at what they said about Bernie, that there was gonna be executions in Central Park and his followers were Nazi brown shirts, right? And that wasn't on Fox News, that was on MSNBC, right? But because of the new wave of media, people are not listening to those guys anymore. So the under 45 year olds vote for progressivesives. Even in states that Bernie lost, I show in the book, he wins under 45-year-olds, depending on the age bracket, by 20 points, 40 points, 60 points. And so we cannot snatch defeat from the jaws of victory. Our side, according to the age demographics, is about to win in a massive way.

We just have to get out of our own way and make sure we run in primaries. Do not let primaries go without running. The fact that no progressive ran against Biden is a crime. They just gave away. They just gave away all of that media coverage, all the ability to make the progressive case, even if you don't win. Cenk, last thing I want to ask you about the the Trump criminal trials, Trump skipping the Republican debates, et cetera. This is very like tactical and practical to what's going on right now. I interviewed Rachel Biddecoffer. She's not that impressed with the Republican polling. She

says, you know, a lot of voters don't start paying attention until way later. It's not that obvious that Trump is necessarily going to win the more every day that passes, that Trump's winning by 45 and DeSantis is falling and the Vakes up to eight and then down to four. And there's just just nothing happening. Prices for ads in the second Fox debate are 50 percent lower than they were for the first because no one's watching. No one's paying for this stuff. Is there anything that can get in this guy's way to prevent him from being the nominee? Yeah.

As always, the only thing that can get in Donald Trump's way is Donald Trump. So can he do something even more monstrous? I mean, look. Cassidy Hutchinson says that when they were chanting hang Mike Pence, Donald Trump was cheering them on and saying he didn't mind if his own vice president was going to be murdered by his fans. Now look, people just glaze past that because we're so used to Donald Trump being a monster and we're desensitized to it.

If Barack, if there was a story, a credible story from someone inside his own White House that said that Barack Obama didn't mind if Joe Biden was murdered. Right. It would have literally been, very literally, the story of the century. Yeah. Right? So Trump says it every second. Oh yeah, of course, he's in favor of murdering people left and right. He just said he wants to murder the Joint Chiefs of Staff. This is not normal, okay? So now, but that doesn't affect MAGA because he could shoot someone on Fifth Avenue and get away with it. But if they see Pat Cipollone and Mark Meadows testify, whether it's in Atlanta or in the federal case, on the stand and say, yes, I was in the room, I'm absolutely positive.

He said he did not mind the vice president being murdered. He thought his own vice president deserved to be murdered. If they confirm what Cassidy Hutchinson said, does that wake them up out of their hypnosis? Maybe enough of them. Maybe. I think they assume it's a lie. I think they assume the witnesses are lying if that happens. I'm sure.

I'm sure. But I'm giving you that the only things that could possibly be. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. In the documents case, you find out why did he take the remember the one in Bedminster, New Jersey, the plans to invade Iran? Why did he take that one? Why was it at the top of his desk? Well, who's Iran's number one enemy? Saudi Arabia. Who just gave his son-in-law $2 billion? Who just bought the PGA so they could turn all the golf tournaments into Trump golf properties and have them played there so that Trump could make millions of dollars? The Saudis did. Now do I know that he sold that to the Saudis? No, I don't know that at all. I don't have any evidence to that effect. But it's a hypothetical of if Jack Smith has that evidence and he lays that out in court,

would that change MAGA's mind? And maybe some percentage, some percentage will never change. If he gave it to ISIS and said, here's how you can murder as many Americans as you can, even then they wouldn't change. I know that, I know that, right? But is there enough Republicans, and my sense is about half, exactly half, that are convincible if something over the top happens? He just said Mark Milley should get death. What if one of his fans murders Mark Milley? Right. I mean, two, two, two, I hope it doesn't happen and that's terrible. I know these unbelievable scenarios still wouldn't get half of Republicans to budge. OK, but maybe it would do enough damage that he could lose a primary.

But there's no way in the world that these chumps are just going to be Trump on their own. They're not. Yeah, it would take one of those scenarios to even get us to maybe, which is a pretty, pretty insane bar. Well, listen, Jenk, the book is excellent. I encourage every progressive and non-progressive to read it for different reasons. But still, the book is called Justice is Coming.

How progressives are going to take over the country and America is going to love it. Host of The Young Turks, Jenk Uyghur. Great having you here as always. Thank you, David. And if people want, they could get a copy at T.Y.T. Dotcom slash justice. I appreciate you, brother. Many people know how hard it is to break bad habits, and sometimes you have to replace a bad habit with a better habit. And that is exactly what

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That's try f u m dot com. Then use code Pacman for 10 percent off the journey pack. The info is in the podcast notes. All right. This is great stuff. They're continuing to look for the evidence that Joe Biden committed crimes is some kind of crime boss is running an incredible crime syndicate, bribery and influence peddling and cash payments and all of these different things.

They just can't seem to find it. It's sort of like the joke of George W. Bush looking around the White House for WMDs. Remember that really tasteless joke that the Bush administration did? Well, the Republicans seem to be looking under every crevice they can to find the evidence against Joe Biden, and they don't really have it. Well, now, Congressman Jason Smith thinks he found something, some kind of text message or something along those lines. The problem is that what he thinks he has, which if it's even anything, the timing doesn't really seem to be incriminating to Joe Biden. NBC reporter confronts Jason Smith with that. And Jason Smith doesn't like the confrontation. Take a look at this. This is really, really good. And apologies for the audio on it.

I know it's not the best audio clarification about the timing of the message leading to this exchange with the Republican congressman. And then the WhatsApp message you have, I believe, is dated June 6th, 2017. Joe Biden is not vice president or even a candidate for president at that time. So where is the direct connection to some sort of criminal malfeasance within these two pieces of evidence? Well, I think the facts speak for themselves. There's over 700 pages of examples of where people should be very concerned. Can you explain the timing of the August 6th WhatsApp message?

Why is that evidence of some wrongdoing? I'm not an expert in the timeline. I would love to have President Biden and his family to tell us about all the timelines because it's really, really. Of course, it's publicly available information. When Joe Biden was vice president, president and a candidate for those offices, it's public. You don't really need him in there to explain the timeline. And we see so many meetings and so many phone calls that involved around official activity that the vice president has been participating in. And then big sums of money follows later. But if he's not the president or the vice president at that time, where where's the

wrong doing? He wasn't even a candidate for president at that time. Where where's the wrongdoing? He wasn't even a candidate for president at that time. He was a candidate in on in August six of 2017. Apparently, a parent, what source are you with? As if that here is this is setting up the character assassination with NBC. So apparently you'll never believe us. I don't think I don't believe you. I'm asking you for I'm asking. Speaker 1 It's like it's not a question of belief. It's public when Joe Biden was a public official. It's public when Joe Biden announced he was running for president. It's not a question of belief. Speaker 2

Very direct question. You presented a piece of evidence that you say came on August 6th, 2017, that demonstrates that Joe Biden was using political influence to help his son If he wasn't a political figure at that time the first what's that message you put up? Where did we talk about the brand? I'm here. I'm my Completely open-minded about this. I'm asking you specifically How does that demonstrate that there's some sort of political influence being put over him if at that time? He is not a

political, he's not an elected official. I'm definitely not going to pinpoint one item. That's clear or any item. You presented it. It was your first thing that you brought up. So apparently you don't agree with it. So it's not that I don't agree with that. I'm asking you to explain. I'll take the next question. These people don't want to be questioned. They are, you know, maybe they need 52 years of Biden in public office before finding the smoking gun against him. If evidence comes forward, I will be the first to say this is something. Based on everything we know about Joe Biden, he's not perfect.

He has many faults, but it doesn't seem that a wide reaching bribery, criminal conspiracy of influence peddling and cash and laptops and the entire thing. It doesn't seem like that is what they are going to uncover. After Donald Trump said that General Mark Milley should be executed, Mark Milley now needs to up security and take personal security precautions for himself and his family. As I've said before, Trump may very well get somebody killed. Here is a clip from a forthcoming interview on 60 Minutes, presumably will air this Sunday. General Mark Milley, who Trump recently said maybe should be executed for treason,

was asked to weigh in about what Trump said. If you ask me which person here is adhering more to what we might call patriotism, not a term that I love throwing around. I think that when it comes to the way the military is used in terms of missions, I disagree with many of them. But if you say to me, who actually cares about defending the principles the United States was founded on, Trump or Mark Milley? I think the answer is obvious.

Take a look at this. Speaker 1 President Trump recently said that your dealings with China were so egregious that in times gone by, the punishment would have been death. That's right. He said that. That's correct. He is suggesting that you be punished by death. The former commander in chief to his former top military advisor. Look, I'm a soldier. I've been faithful and loyal to the Constitution, United States, forty four and a half years. And my family and I have sacrificed greatly for this country, my mother and father before

them. And, you know, as much as these comments are directed at me, it's also directed at the institution of the military. And there's this two point one million of us, which, by the way, Republicans and Trump claim to love and support endlessly uniform. And the American people can take it to the bank that all of us, every single one of us from private to general, we're loyal to that constitution.

It will never turn it back on it, no matter what, no matter what the threats, no matter what the humiliation, no matter what, if we're willing to die for that document, if we're willing to deploy to combat, if we're willing to lose an arm, a leg, an eye to protect and support and defend that document and protect the American people, then we're willing to live for it too. So I'm not going to comment directly on those things, but I can tell you that this military, this soldier, me, will never turn our back on that constitution. But for the record, was there anything inappropriate or treasonous about the calls you made to China? Absolutely not. Zero. None.

It almost seems odd to ask this question because the former commander in chief seems to be calling for your execution. Are you worried about your safety? I've got adequate safety precautions. I wish those comments had not been made, but they were. And we'll take appropriate measures to ensure my safety and the safety of my family. Trump who loves the military Republicans, he rebuilt the military. The cupboards were bare, you know, the entire thing. He now has endangered his top general from when he was president of the United States.

Just as a reminder, Donald Trump posting to Truth Social a few days ago, quote, Mark Milley, who led perhaps the most embarrassing moment in American history with his grossly incompetent implementation of the withdrawal from Afghanistan, costing many lives, leaving behind hundreds of American citizens and handing over billions of dollars of the finest military equipment ever made, will be leaving the military next week. This will be a time for all citizens of the USA to celebrate. This guy turned out to be a woke train wreck who, if the fake news reporting is correct, was actually dealing with China to give them a heads up on the thinking of the president

of the United States. This is an act so egregious that in times gone by, the punishment would have been death. A war between China and the US could have been the result of this treasonous act to be continued. They support the troops, guys. They support the troops. Wow. All right. Real quick, a couple of voicemails to one nine to David P. A lot of food questions in the voicemail today. Listen to this. David, I'm watching the debate here and I'm wondering if you got a new camera. It looks good. And also I just made some pasta and I got this kind of thin pasta, but it wasn't angel hair. And I'm curious on your opinion about pasta thickness.

OK, so if it's like angel hair, but thicker, you probably have something known as spaghetti. That would be my guess. I'm not big on noodles. I prefer stuffed pasta like tortellini and ravioli. Secondary to that, I'm a fan of rotini and other of that type. And then last on my list would be noodle type pasta like angel hair, fettuccine spaghetti. It's just not really my thing. And I did get a new camera and I do think it looks very good. Here's one more food question that came in. Hey,

I'm just wondering, what is your favorite type of tea and how do you like it prepared? My favorite type of tea, I would say, is black tea, normal black tea with a little bit of milk and sometimes a drop of honey. All right. Keep sending in the food questions, I guess. I'll keep answering them. We are going to have such a great bonus show for you today. I'm out of time to tell you what's on it, but I've never lied before about when we have a good versus a so-so bonus show. Today is a good one. So I'll see you then. Sign up at join.