The Debaters - 1829: Belts vs. Suspenders & Move to Hamilton

Episode Date: May 16, 2024

Elvira Kurt and Graham Chittenden have no time to waist when they discuss if belts are superior to suspenders.  Then, should everyone move to Hamilton? Gavin Stephens and Ron Sparks bring the Hammer down on each other in their debate for this Ontario city.

Hi there, listeners. Steve Patterson here. You know, I get asked to emcee weddings a lot, and I'm happy to do it for close friends and family, especially when the wedding is somewhere fun, like, say, Reykjavik, Iceland. So my family and I booked an Airbnb in Reykjavik for a week, and it was awesome. There was plenty of room for all of us,

and we met lots of locals in the neighborhood. And that made me think about how much our home would be appreciated by fellow travelers as an Airbnb too since usually it just sits empty while we're away. It's in a great Toronto neighborhood full of restaurants, shops, and friendly people. It has room for a group of four to all have their own rooms and honestly we'd appreciate the house earning a bit of income to help with our next trip. Intrigued? Your home might be worth more than you think. Find out how much at airbnb.ca slash host. And speaking of hosting,

that couple I emceed the wedding for? Still married. That's how good I am. Though I guess I can't take all the credit for that. Anyway, let's get to this week's show. This is a CBC Podcast. This podcast is an extended version of The Debaters, which may contain more mature themes. To stream the radio-friendly version of this episode, download the CBC Listen app or go to cbc.ca slash The Debaters.

And thanks for listening to The CBC. Hey Canada, it's time to ham it up. From Hamilton, Ontario, it's The Debaters! The Debaters, where comedians fight with facts and funny, and this audience picks the winner. Now here's a man who has a ham-o-ton of jokes, Steve Patterson. Hey, that's Graham Clark. Hello, Canada.

Welcome back to The Debater. We're here in hearty Hamilton, Ontario, a town steeped in history. In fact, the Stony Creek community of this city is the site of the decisive battle in the War of 1812. Right? In fact, there's a memorial in Stoney Creek celebrating the battle, which is just a carving of a Canadian soldier kicking George Washington in his pantaloons. As you may know, when Canada was a colony of Great Britain, we burned down the White House. Sorry, sorry about that, America.

Which unfortunately aligns those Canadians pretty closely with present-day Trump supporters. So let's hope history doesn't repeat itself anytime soon. But now it's time to meet two debaters here to fight their own decisive battle. When this comic's pet duck needed reconstructive facial surgery, she paid for the whole bill.

It's Toronto's Elvira Kurt! Elvira Kurt! One of our absolute favorites, making her way to the left side of my stage. And this comic gets all his iron from the periodic table of elements. Let's welcome Brantford, Ontario's Graham Chittenden! Graham! From nearby Brantford, making the reasonable drive here tonight from Brantford.

Welcome, my friend. Thank you, Steve. Your topic is one that we hope will hold you up. Belts. Are they superior to suspenders? Hmm. Let's find out. For a lot of people, this is going to be a tough decision.

On one hand, belts are easy to find in shoe stores and karate dojos, while suspenders are available in finer men's clothing stores and the clown depot. Now, just because I don't personally know many people who wear suspenders and myself

have only worn them at my high school prom and in wedding parties, doesn't mean that suspenders aren't popular. Particularly in Hamilton, where the steel clasps for every pair of suspenders in the world are made. Not a lot of people know that because it is not true. Anyway, it's time now for a debate that will waste no time in getting to the laps. Waste, like W-A-I, forget it. Waste no time.

Thank you, Elvira, one for you. So, whereas they offer greater versatility, less hassle, and countless styles, be it resolved that belts are superior to suspenders. Elvira, you are arguing for this, please. You have two minutes. Starting now, Elvira Kurt. Elvira Kurt. Belts are practical and coveted. MMA fighters and boxers will beat each other to a pulp just to win one.

Can you imagine anything more tragic than Muhammad Ali holding up his World Heavyweight Championship suspenders? Well, well, I can. I can imagine something more tragic. Two words. Chastity suspenders. LAUGHTER

Is that like nonsense? Well, that's suspenders for you. What other accessory acts like a person handle? Suspenders practically inspire wedgies. Even pants understand the importance of belts. They come with built-in strips of cloth. Tiny fabric soldiers standing at attention, circling the action, waiting to be looped in.

Suspenders are gangly and hapless. Huh? Huh? They're sad little metal teeth hoping to sink into any waistband that'll have them. They're not a real accessory. They're an afterthought. Pants are made with belts in mind. Suspenders are made only for mimes. Look, the world is already so full of tension.

Do you really want more attached to your body? Suspenders are annoying and confusing. Are you wearing the pants or are they wearing you? Belts don't just hold your pants up. They hold them close. They're like a hug you wear. So snug, so secure. Every time I cinch in, notch the right hole,

I whisper, Every time I cinch in, notch the right hole, I whisper, thank you, leather mommy. Thank you. Elvira Kurtz. Yeah. Keeping it all together on behalf of Belz. It's not gonna be easy to argue against that, but I think we've got the person for the job,

because here to tell us why he believes that the suspends justify the means. It's the one and only Graham Chittenden. Thank you. Yes. For starters, of course there are no chastity suspenders. People in suspenders. People in suspenders get it when they want, where they want. And all belts are terrible.

Conveyor belts, timing belts on cars, the Bible belt. But tonight, we are focused on the unfortunate and popular piece of clothing. And whether or not it's even clothing is up for some debate. It is really more of a luggage strap. Your sole job is to keep a pair of ill-fitting pants strapped to your body by applying direct pressure to the area where your vital organs are unprotected by your ribs. This is why I have a soft spot for suspenders and the rest of you have a soft spot on your pancreas from your belt. And yes, sure, belts are everywhere,

but popularity is not quality. The turf war between VHS and Betamax only swayed in favor of VHS because of its use by the adult film industry. And I'll tell you perverts something else. Even seatbelts were only doing half the job until they

added half a suspender to the mix. Suspenders are a fashion statement. They add a touch of class to a smart outfit. Belts are an archaic binding just waiting for their opportunity to upgrade a sexual misadventure to an accidental homicide. Everything about belts are violent. Belts are dads hitting kids.

Suspenders are mom, Ferd, and sons. That's more their jam. Just the vibe they bring. Suspenders are playful. You wear one off your shoulder, and it's like, ooh, I'm fun. But an undone belt just says, I've been at this buffet way too long. We're driving home with the windows cracked a little bit. Belts are what?

They're a place to hold buckles that commemorate rodeo achievements and eating contest victories. And if you lose too much weight, what do you do? You take out your belt and you punch another hole. All this hitting and punching. Who hurt you? I'll tell you who. Your belt.

Thank you. Rael Tittenden. Whoa. I'll tell ya, on paper I didn't like your chances in this debate, but you have really come out swinging. I'm gonna give you three and three quarters points. It's very close. It's very close.

Keep in mind, these points aren't real. All right. It is time now. Keep in mind, these points aren't real. All right. It is time now for the Bare Knuckle Round. We're debating whether belts are superior to suspenders, so strap in and buckle up. You rabble trousers need to go fast and furious throughout the width and length of this midsection, and pray it doesn't leave us

with our pants down. So cut yourselves some slacks. And belt it out now. You win belt buckles for things that are not impressive. Like nobody would ever go, oh, what'd you win that belt buckle for? Science. Well, you really want to win something, don't you?

Maybe, maybe you'll win this. Maybe you'll get the golden suspenders for this today. You're just so fixated on the prize. I want to talk about your Mumford and Sons reference. It couldn't be more millennial. Do you know what I mean? Like it is your generation, Graham, that has really, like, embraced this oldie-timey trend of the suspender. Oh, it harkens back to a time that

never existed. You guys, you millennials, you put them on cargo pants and a flannel shirt, you think you're Wild West lumberjacks, when really you're just East End bull dykes, you know what I mean? And I don't even want to get into the Gen Z, okay? They're playing right now on TikTok with suspenders. They're like, ooh, check out this life hack, vertical belts. Ooh, they're bungee cords you wear on your pants. Eee, ee, ee, ee.

Yeah. Somebody put Grandma in her pajamas with the belt loops on and get her to bed. She's lost it. Okay. All right. All right. That's the bare-knuckle round. All right. It's time now for the firing line.

In my hand, I have a list of questions about belts versus suspenders brought to you by elastic waistbands. Elastic waistbands. Gain weight, lose weight. They'll adjust in a cinch. The Hold Up Suspender Company says you should avoid wearing suspenders

when what? Graham. When you're not wearing pants. What? Can't really argue with that. Graham. When you're not wearing pants. Ha! Point. Can't really argue with that. Four points. Elvira. When you want human interaction.

The actual answer is in casual settings because suspenders are most appropriate in formal settings. Suspenders aficionado Larry King was gifted a pair of suspenders by Janet Jackson that had what feature? Graham. Timberlake's fingerprints. That's a good answer. That's a good answer. Four points.

Al Virker. Janet Jackson's nipple prints? Pretty close. That had open holes around the nipples. And Larry King said he had worn them once. So that's an official point. In the 1968 film Once Upon a Time in the West, Henry Fonda says wearing both a belt and suspenders

at the same time makes a person what? Elvira? Need diapers. Can't get out of there fast enough, you know what I mean? You're just... Incorrect, but half a point. Graham? Hard to get naked.

We'll give you one full point for the passable impression. Wearing belt and suspenders at the same time makes a person not to be trusted. How could you trust a man that can't trust his own pants? Actual line from the movie. Movies have gotten way better. And that's the firing line, everybody. All right.

We are in the home stretch. And it's almost time for our fabulous Hamilton audience to vote. But first, here again to support suspenders and punch holes in the belief around belts, let's hear again from Graham Chittenden. Okay, let's end this by talking about the worst belt of all,

the reversible belt. And this isn't just one ugly belt masquerading as two ugly belts. This is a deception, a misrepresentation of wealth, the same facade of dubious value that gave us the 2008 global financial crisis and Bernie Madoff's $64 billion scheme.

And these bankers didn't go to jail, but Bernie Madoff did. And you want to know the first thing that happened when he got there? They probably took his belt. Do you know, when you go to jail, if they take your suspenders or not? No. Nobody does. Because nobody who wears suspenders has ever broken the law.

Suspenders. Secure pants. Safe society. Thank you very much. Brave Chittenden. Bringing it all around. Tying it up in a nice bow at the end for us. Nice clothes, my friend.

Now, looping back around on why belts are best, let's hear once more from Elvira Kurt. I'm not saying suspenders made me gay. But the pair I owned in 1974 were the color of a rainbow. I'd like to say that I stopped wearing them once I came out. But the truth is I stopped wearing them once I came to my senses. Also in 1974. You see, back then, suspenders were nothing but a fad.

Mine just happened to foreshadow my future as a lesbian icon. And it wasn't just me, it was all my friends. One had suspenders in measuring tape yellow, notched end-to-end like a ruler with numbers, and little black lines marking eighths of an inch. That also foreshadowed her future. Is she an architect? No, she's a sheet of plywood.

My point is, fads come and go, but belts are forever, so buckle up, baby. Thank you. Nice. Alvira Curtis. Buckle up. This is a battle of slogans now. They've nicely wrapped up their arguments, giving the audience something to chew on.

And let's see how the audience has decided. By applause, how many think a win for Graham would be a happy suspending? Graham Chittenden. A lot of support for Graham. And how many of you believe that Elvira earned her black belt with her belt barbs here tonight? Elvira Kurtz.

Very close. It's very close. But I've got to give this one just by a smidgen to Graham Chittenden. Suspenders over belts. Big hand for Graham Chittenden and Alvira Curtin, everybody. Hey, Debaters fans. For access to bonus content and details on upcoming tour dates, be sure to follow us on Instagram at

at CDC debaters. And now back to Steve Patterson. Hi there, listeners. Steve Patterson here. If you're a frequent traveler like I am, you know that traveling is great. But as a wise young girl with fancy red shoes once said, there's no place like home. That's why when I travel by myself or with my family, I often book Airbnbs for that homey touch, like the one I stayed at in Stratford, Ontario recently, where I performed a show and took in some Shakespeare. Though to be clear, I didn't perform Shakespeare. There's no perchance of that happening. I was not meant to be or not to be. Anyway, my point is I like the feeling of home when I'm on the road. And I feel like I'm not alone in this.

Especially when I'm traveling with my family. Which got me thinking, when we're on the road, our house could be a home away from home for fellow travelers too. If we host it on Airbnb. It just makes sense. Actually, it makes dollars. And those dollars could help pay for our next family trip. Your home might be worth more than you think.

Find out how much at airbnb.ca slash host. Something to prepend on and on. My name is Graham Isidore. I have a progressive eye disease called keratoconus. And being I'm losing my vision has been hard. But explaining it to other people has been harder. Lately, I've been trying to talk about it. ShortSighted is an attempt to explain what vision loss feels like

by exploring how it sounds. By sharing my story, we get into all the things you don't see about hidden disabilities. ShortSighted, from CBC's Personally, available now. Are you ready to meet your next pair of debaters? That is a yes. This comic bought some books on planting your own crops and is currently plowing through them.

It's Chatham, Ontario's Ron Sparks. Let's bring out Ron. Ron Sparks, one of our favorites. Here he is, striding out confidently, taking the podium to my right. And this comic's failed attempt to buy a mini golf course was due to him being a littleav. Welcome back, my friend. Gavin getting his place behind the podium to my left. Your topic is one that we hope hits home with this crowd. Hamilton, should everyone move here? Let's get it out in the open. I'll let the debaters duke that out, but you know what I think should move to Hamilton?

The hit musical, Hamilton. That would only make sense. Who wouldn't want some hot Hamilton in Hamilton action? It's a marketing match made in heaven. I would also love to see Chicago in Chicago, or Greece in Greece, or Les Miserables in heaven. I would also love to see Chicago in Chicago or Greece in Greece or Les Miserables in Ottawa. Although if you think about it, that kind of did already happen pretty recently. Do you hear the truckers honk? Honking the honk of angry men. If while he ever has his way,

they'll all be honking once again. He is leading in the polls. His Canada does not sound fun. Irish Trudeau would step aside and let Freeland run. All right, you guys, the musical group. So, whereas it's an affordable city that sets the Ontario standard in location, landscape, and lifestyle. Be it resolved, everyone should move to Hamilton. Gavin, you're arguing for this, please, my friend. You have two minutes. Starting now, Gavin Stevens.

Thank you, Steve. Move to Hamilton, right? We are the Hammer. That's our nickname. The Hammer. We're not Hogtown That's our nickname. The Hammer. We're not Hogtown. We're not Wheat City. We're Hammer.

We're a powerful tool that sits in the right-hand pocket of a worker who builds infrastructure and communities for families. It's also a bankrupt rapper from the 90s who has giant pants. This city is dedicated to trying to help the less fortunate in our society. It may not be perfect, but there's a genuine effort, and I'm proud of that.

I'm also proud that the city has deep-fried spaghetti and honey on pizza on the same block. And if you like pizza, this is your town. While you're here, try a square of Roma's pizza. Do you like bread? Do you like sauce? That's it. That's all that comes with it. Hamilton is also the place where they filmed Robocop

and the dystopian future series series The Handmaid's Tale. And they didn't have to change a thing in the city. Robocop, MC Hammer, I suggest you humble yourself before the kings. We are the best. Thank you, Steve. Thank you, Gavin Stevens. On behalf of the Hammer, thank you, Gavin Stevens. On behalf of the Hammer. Thank you, Gavin.

Now, here to tell us why anyone who moves to Hamtown ends up getting ham boned, let's hear from Ron Sparks. I know we are in Hamilton, and it's a sensitive subject, so I'll do my best not to lose the audience. Now, I have performed in a lot of two-horse, po-dunk garbage towns... LAUGHTER ..for some of the smelliest, stupidest,

most inbred, slack-jawed hick yokels on Earth. But none of them compare to Hamilton, Ontario. Because Hamilton is so wonderful. Far too lovely to start inviting everyone to move here. It's all right here in the resolution, Steve. It's affordable. Great location, landscape, and lifestyle. What's with the hard sell, Hamilton?

You should want other people to think that your city is crap. I'm not saying Hamilton's not great. I'm saying the opposite. This is a great city, and you should try to keep it that way by not inviting the entire world to move here. Do you know why the Vikings named Iceland, Iceland? To keep other people away. Because it's so beautiful. You know where they hated living?

Greenland. That's the one that's covered in ice. They called it green to trick other people into moving there. The only thing that's green there is your skin after you get scurvy, because they can't grow fruit. They'd kill themselves to have their own peach festival. I get there's a Hamilton-Toronto competitiveness and you guys put each other down all the time. Well, you can stop worrying about that. The only people who think Toronto's better are the people that live there. If you've ever traveled anywhere else, you know that everyone hates Toronto.

And to be clear, I am not just saying you should not invite the rest of the world's population to move here, no. I am saying you should actively keep them out. That is why I am going to build a wall. That's right. And I'm going to make Mexico pay for it. Or maybe Toronto.

So say yes to Hamilton and no to Gavin's insane plan to bring 8.1 billion people more to live in this great city. Let's send them somewhere that's got a lot more room, Steve. Greenland. Thank you. Ron Sparks, everybody. Ron Sparks with an ingenious quiz. We got ourselves a debate here, Ron Sparks and Gavin Stevens,

and it's time now for the Bare Knuckle Round. We're debating whether everyone should move to Hamilton. So first, let's iron out the details in front of these Hamilton spectators. And be the McMaster of your own domain. Prove you're debating metal and you could steal this debate right here in Arkell's kitchen. So hammer away starting now. So Gavin you want everyone in the world to move to Hamilton. That's a disaster waiting to happen. I mean, what if some of these newcomers, they come with a bunch of crazy ideas and they

start, you know, parking on the street on the right side with the car facing the correct direction. That's not how things are done here. It's the anarchy. I think we have more than enough room. We have a mountain. We have a mountain, right? So get your sherpa and get ready to drink some pee. We're all going to Lime Ridge Mall, right? I don't get where the whole inferiority complex thing comes with Hamilton and Toronto.

Because, you know, basically they're the same. They got all the same stuff. They both have a stadium, and they both have huge shopping malls, and they both have a choice location on the world's cleanest lake. And they both also lack the same things. Like, for example, neither one of those cities has a professional hockey team. We might not have a hockey team, but we are really good with vegans.

And I... We're very progressive here. I'm sorry, did you say vegans? Yes, a lot of vegans. Okay, so that's one strike against Hamilton. Okay. All right, that's the bare-knuckle round, everybody. We're debating whether everyone should move to Hamilton.

On the debaters, so far it is inconclusive, so let's keep going. It's time now for the firing line. In my hand, I have a list of questions about moving to Hamilton, brought to you by the nearby Kilman Zoo, the one place near here where the tiger cats never disappoint. What is the motto on the homepage of Tourism Hamilton's website? Ron?

Celebrating 208 years of not being Buffalo. All right. All right, that is an opening two-and-a-half-point answer. Good work. Gavin? But have you seen what Cornwall is up to? The motto on the homepage of Tourism Hamilton's website is, it's in our character.

You don't say what it is, and I appreciate that. What tops Narcity.com's list of 21 struggles of living in Hamilton? Gavin? The continuing will they won't they LRT subplot in the city. I have heard about that. Ron Sparks. Not enough Tim Hortons. Strangely, no. The list of 21 struggles of living in Hamilton is topped by the constant one-way streets. Sort of a Hamilton thing, I guess. One slow clap. According to Numio.com's cost of living comparison, it costs about 7% more

in Toronto than in Hamilton if you want to eat where? Gavin? The Costco free sample aisle? 7% less free in Toronto. I like it. Two and a half. Yeah.

Ron? Hamilton. It's 7% more in Toronto than in Hamilton if you want to eat in Hamilton? Yeah. Because of the extra driving. All right. It costs about 7% more in Toronto

if you want to eat at McDonald's. Which is a whole other debate, really. And that's the firing line, everybody. Well, it's just about that magical time when our audience votes. But first, here again to tell us why Hamilton is so awful to live in that it forced people to create Burlington. His words, not mine.

Let's hear again from Ron Sparks. I saved my most powerful argument for last. If everyone on Earth moves to Hamilton, that includes me. I rarely shower and have no plans to get rid of this beard. And I could be your neighbor. Even worse, Steve would move here. You really want him behind you in line at the grocery store, trying out his debater's puns?

Sure, it's fun for an evening, but imagine him tapping you on the shoulder for hours. Hey, that corn section's a real maze, isn't it? I'm getting six boxes of Cheerios because I'm a serial killer. I'm not milking these jokes, am I? Again, it'd be like that only for hours on end.

As you stand in line behind 30 million people at Nations Fresh, and all of them have coupons. So please say no to Gavin's evil plan and yes to keeping Hamilton clean and beautiful. Thank you. Ron Sparks says not everyone should move to Hamilton.

Now, here to tell us why he thinks of this fair city as the hamster that roared, let's hear from the mighty Gavin Stevens. Thank you, Steve. tell us why he thinks of this fair city as the hamster that roared. Let's hear it from the mighty Gavin Stevens. Thank you, Steve. All right. Hamilton gets a bad rap, but we are a great city, and the

data proves it. Like, an angry mob of people would truck, shut down Ottawa, cursing the prime minister and waving confederate flags. Hamilton also hosted the CMA Music Festival, so. Right? Vancouver loves its scenery. It's always, have you seen our mountains?

No, I haven't, Phil. I've spent most of my visits sitting in your $4,000 a month basement apartment. We also have from Halifax, Theodore the Tugboat, right? And if Halifax meets our demands, they'll get him back in one piece. Clearly, Hamilton is the best city in Canada, period.

Thanks, Steve. Thank you. Gavin Stevens, everyone. Gavin Stevens, leaving room in his argument to be filled with civic pride. Hamilton, it is up to you to vote by applause. Who felt that Gavin made a meal of moving here and was a real hamburger helper?

Gavin Stevens. All right. Nice support there. And who agreed with Ron that Hamilton should be considered an urban planning crime scene requiring just a drive-by? Ron Sparks! Well, the audience has spoken. The Hamiltonians say not everyone should move to Hamilton. The winner is Ron Sparks, everybody! Big hand for Ron Sparks and Gavin Stevens.

Well, that's all for this week. I'm Steve Patterson saying to everyone in Canada, visit Hamilton, Ontario soon. I promise you'll fall for it. I'll argue with you again soon, Canada. Good night. Good night. The Debaters is created by Richard Side.

This week's episode was produced by Nicole Callender, Chloe Edbrook, Dean Jenkinson and Graham Clark. With continuity by Graham Clark, Diana Francis and Gary Jones. Technical production by James Perella and Todd Reimer. Story editing by Gary Jones. With special thanks to Katie Ellen Humphries, David Pride and Emily Ferrier. Executive producer of CBC Radio Comedy is Lee Pitts. And thanks to everyone at the McIntyre Performing Arts Centre in Hamilton.