The Debaters - 1902: Atlantic Ocean vs. Pacific Ocean & Growing Up Poor

Episode Date: September 12, 2024

Matt Wright and Charlie Demers make waves in St. John’s, Newfoundland when they discuss if the Atlantic Ocean is superior to the Pacific Ocean. Then, Bree Parsons and Nikki Payne bring a wealth of wit when they decide if growing up poor makes you a stronger person.

Hi there, Steve Patterson here. You know, I travel a lot for work on my own, so when I can do a trip where I get to bring my wife Nancy and our daughters along, I jump at it. On a recent trip to Ottawa, we booked an Airbnb. It was a nice home in a nice neighborhood, and it even had room for our dog Ferris, which was also nice. And that made me think, hey, maybe our home in Toronto would be a nice place to stay for some nice people too, since it sits empty while we're away. And honestly, it would be great if our house started bringing in some extra cash to put towards the next trip. Because frankly, Ferris keeps screwing up in his job interviews. Your home might be worth more than you think. Find out how much at airbnb.ca slash host. This is a CBC Podcast.

This podcast is an extended version of The Debaters, which may contain more mature themes. To stream the radio-friendly version of this episode, download the CBC Listen app or go to cbc.ca slash The Debaters. And thanks for listening to The CBC. Hey Canada, this ain't your average radio show. From St. John's, Newfoundland and Labrador, it's The Debaters! The Debaters, where comedians fight with facts and money, and this audience picks the winner. Now here's our patron saint of laughs, Steve Patterson. Hey! Thanks, Graham!

Hello, Canada! Welcome back to The Debaters! It is so great to be back here in Newfoundland and Labrador, a province that takes law and order very seriously. Do you know what I'm talking about. Recently, police answered a call where they ended up being assaulted with a block of cheese.

True story. It was dangerous because it was a sharp cheddar. And the lead officer was lactose intolerant, too. Anyway, they captured the suspect, and when they got him to the station, they grilled him, and he melted under pressure. And that crafty matzo fella, he had a long rap sheet, which included several counts of baking and entering.

Time now to meet two debaters who are a fond duo of each other. This comic once repaired a doghouse while it was occupied and nearly screwed the pooch. It's Newfoundland's Matt Wright! Matty Wright! There he is, taking the stage to my right, soaking in all the love of his hometown crowd, Mad Rocks.

Thank you. And this comic never demurs. It's Vancouver's Charlie Demers. Charlie Demers. All the way across the country. I will. Gents, your topic is one that you'll be sure to like. The Atlantic versus the Pacific, which is the superior ocean?

Oh, I know. I know that out here the Atlantic Ocean reigns supreme, obviously. After all, yeah, yeah, let's hear it from the ocean. Yeah. After all, most of you can see it from your living room. And with climate change at its current pace, pretty soon you'll be able to see it in your living room. But enough about that.

Time now for a debate that we think will go swimmingly. So, whereas it reaches more continents, is featured in countless stories, and is vital to Canada's economy, be it resolved the Atlantic Ocean is superior to the Pacific Ocean. Matt, you are arguing for this, please. You have two minutes. Starting now, Matt Wright. Thank you.

Ordering seafood and finding out it's from the Pacific is like going to a show to see Barenaked Ladies and finding out it's the band. People eat seafood from the Atlantic Ocean and the taste reminds them of their grandparents' fish and chips. People eat seafood from the Pacific, and it reminds them that Oppenheimer was based on a true story. Vancouver seafood looks horrifying.

Have you seen a Pacific lobster? They don't have claws. What happened? What kind of psycho eats a lobster and is like, you know what this needs? More legs. Yeah, my favorite part is the legs. I wish my popsicles had three sticks.

Pacific cod, butt ugly. Atlantic cod, pretty sexy. I'm deniable. I said it. I said it. They are the Pete Davidson of the sea. You think this ugly with his weird posture and his sunken eyes, but every beautiful woman has been photographed kissing it. My friend Heidi got screeched in and she used tongue. Some of the world's greatest stories

take place on the Atlantic Ocean. Titanic, Jaws, Moby Dick. The Pacific only has Free Willy, a movie about a pervert whale who grooms a young boy. And Charlie, you better watch what you're saying about the Atlantic Ocean, because it can hear you.

And unlike the Pacific, it does not like being trashed. I don't want to swim in garbage. The only thing I want to swim with is my friends, my own urine, and the unknowable mysteries of the sea. Thank you very much. Matt Wright, on behalf of the Atlantic Ocean, and man, did you come out swinging. Now, here to say something specific about the Pacific, it's the terrific, prolific Charlie Demers! Thank you, thank you. Aloha.

I thought it would be fun and edifying to start my debate with a traditional greeting from the very middle of the Pacific Ocean. I find it much warmer and more inviting than the traditional mid-Atlantic greeting, Mayday, mayday, this is the RMS Titanic! Too soon! Let's get one thing clear before we go any further.

People cherish and treasure both the Pacific and the Atlantic Oceans very dearly, which is why property values are so similar in Vancouver and Conception Bay South. But if we're actually comparing the two oceans, it is, as we say on the coast of the Pacific, a wipeout. Or, as you might say here on the coast of the Atlantic, a tundering celery salami calamity, or something similarly folksy but ultimately inscrutable. Just think about our ocean's most iconic creatures for a second. When people saw our ocean's favorite

whale, they were like, that's a killer whale, dude. Meanwhile, even the most celebrated work of art about an Atlantic whale was like, this whale is a dick. The Atlantic is a smaller ocean, which has nevertheless managed to fit in infinitely more historical trauma. European imperialism unleashed so many seafaring atrocities all across the Atlantic that the

sinking of the Titanic and Caribbean piracy are the things we make movies about in order to avoid the upsetting history. Not so much a joke as just a historical fact. When James Cook was off of Newfoundland, he was like, oh look, a bay of despair. But when James Cook was off Hawaii, the Hawaiians were like, we'll show you despair, buddy. They didn't teach you about James Cook. Okay.

The Pacific. Our very name means peace. And even our garbage patch is great. Hang loose, baby. Pacific all the way. All right. Charlie DeVance, everybody. He came a long way to argue right to your face.

All right, debaters, we got ourselves a good one. Time now for the Bare Knuckle Round. We're debating whether the Atlantic drowns out the Pacific. So let me do a little light housekeeping here and suggest that you two go under toe to toe and rip-tied your opponent a new one. Go ahead and point out how full a ship they are. Consider this a heavyweight title bout

with any bad jokes causing great barrier grief. Time to take a deep dive now. First, if I could just quickly congratulate the producers on really finding nice, neutral territory for this debate. LAUGHTER CHEERING AND APPLAUSE Yeah, yeah. CHEERING AND APPLAUSE

Matt, if you had any courage, you would have held this debate with me in Winnipeg, like I asked. LAUGHTER Hey, if you want to win a cup, you would have held this debate with me in Winnipeg, like I asked. Hey, if you want to win a cup, you got to play on the road, buddy. Oh, okay. Okay. Yeah. By the way, I'm not some stranger to Atlantic Canada, incidentally.

My father has lived in Halifax for the last 20 years. So, you know Halifax. That's the city where they make Newfoundland comedy. Uh... Okay. Whoa. Okay. If you're mad about Newfoundlanders going to Halifax to work, wait until I tell you about Alberta, buddy.

Let's get back into the ocean, guys. No, listen. Okay. All right, I'll say this. You were talking about the Titanic. That was a bunch of rich people. That's... That's... I call that an early attempt

at equitable wealth redistribution, in my opinion. That's what that is. Yeah, the Titanic sank so Bernie Sanders could run. Now, let's talk about the Pacific Ocean. Let's talk about Amelia Earhart. She successfully made it over the Atlantic Ocean, flew over it, and then mysteriously drowned

in the Pacific. I will be brave enough to say it. The Pacific Ocean hates women. Wow! What a sexist body of water, just killing a feminist icon. Hi. Charlie?

I don't know whether to be offended by the point you're making or just happy that you're finally making a point that's not about seafood. I realize, yes, you enjoy the fish and chips, but there are other things you're allowed to do with an ocean, like visit points along it. And we have beautiful beaches and beautiful, and I understand if you, you know, enjoy sitting on a rock and learning where people drown. I do. All right, all right.

Then we'll call it there. That's the Bare Knuckle Round, everybody. Time now for the firing line. In my hand, I have a list of questions about the Atlantic Ocean versus the Pacific Ocean, brought to you by the news network most watched on fishing boats, C-SPAN. The Atlantic and Pacific meet

at the Drake Passage, which Britannica.com describes as one of the most treacherous voyages for ships to make. What makes the Drake Passage so feared? Matt. I actually can't answer this question because I thought the Drake Passage was when you used to be on Degrassi

and then you become a rapper somehow. I like the logic. What? One and a half points. Charlie. No, what makes the Drake Passage so feared is that it starts at the bottom, but then it goes to here. Start it at the bottom.

Well, what actually makes the Drake Passage so feared is that currents meet no resistance from any landmass and waves top 40 feet or 12 meters. According to BBC's Science Focus website, why is the surface water of the Atlantic saltier than that of the Pacific? Matt Wright. People on the West Coast are more concerned

about their sodium intake. That's a pretty good answer. That's plausible. I'm going to give you one⁄2 real points for that. Charlie Demers? No, it's because soy sauce still hasn't really caught on in this part of it. Is there sodium in that one?

My mom told me it was good for you. The surface water of the Atlantic is saltier than that of the Pacific because it evaporates faster than rainfall can replace it. That's right. That's right. Oh. Shout out to Ursula the Sea Witch.

Wow. That was the greatest. That was the greatest. That was the greatest. Marineinsight.com says, the most remote place on Earth is an area in the Pacific Ocean called Point Nemo, over 2,500 kilometers from any land. What man-made objects can you find there?

Charlie. The very last local CBC Radio news team. Oh, that one hurts. Matty Wright. A torn-up Sears catalog with a bookmark in the brassiere section." A lot of men clapping a little too loud at that one. 2 1⁄2 points.

It's actually NASA's go-to location to crash space debris in an underwater graveyard. Ooh. Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha. Okay. That's the firing line, everybody. We are cruising towards the end here of this debate at the lovely Holy Heart Theatre in sensational St. John's,

and it's almost time for the audience to vote. But first, here again to prove that he's worth his salt when it comes to promoting the Pacific, let's hear again from Charlie Demers. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. If the Beach Boys had lived on the Atlantic instead of the Pacific,

California girls would have been an unrelenting, depressing shanty about all the young women from an Andalusian fishing village who had perished at sea. Even the most primal fears to emerge from the tragedies of the Pacific have done so in culturally vital ways, like Japan's Godzilla films. If a giant radioactive monster emerged from the Atlantic, Newfoundland and Spain would just fight over who had the commercial fishing rights to it. The Pacific is deeper, but what else would you expect from the single body of water

whose shores gave us sushi, Nintendo, the potlatch, surfing, the boomerang, yo-yos, the internet, the ukulele, and the debaters. We all know how you're gonna vote. But when you feel that, when you get home, that feeling, that's the undertow, my friend. Charlie Gennett, ladies and gentlemen. Oh, wow. A great champion for the Pacific Ocean. But will it be enough?

First, we've got to hear again from the hometown kid here with the perfect storm of fact and funny. It's the Atlantic Ocean's advocate, Matt Wright. Thank you. The Pacific Ocean is known to cause frequent earthquakes. Do you know what earthquakes do? Destroy buildings. Do you know what earthquakes do? Destroy buildings. Do you know what's in buildings? Small businesses. Do you know... Do you know who owns small businesses? Female entrepreneurs. for nerves.

Wow. Once again, the misogynistic Pacific Ocean sabotaging success for women everywhere. Obviously both these oceans are wet. And this is a bit of a reach, but the Pacific Ocean is wet in the wrong way. I can't really explain that, but you know when you're like at night,

when you pour yourself a drink of water, and then you forget about it for a couple of days, and then you wake up two nights later, and you're like, ooh, I'm so thirsty. Surely I can drink this water. Water doesn't go bad, does it? And then you taste it, and you're like, whoa, I'm so thirsty. Surely I can drink this water. Water doesn't go bad, does it? And then you taste it and you're like, whoa, water does go bad.

That's what the Pacific Ocean is like to me. Does that make any sense to anyone? No? Okay, moving on. You can hear the Atlantic Ocean in the music. Great Big Sea doesn't happen if Alan Doyle grows up next to the Pacific. Here's an Alan Doyle lyric if he did.

The night that Patty Murphy died is a night I'll never forget. Some of the bi's have a gluten sensitivity and we went to bed at a reasonable hour. The Atlantic Ocean is right over there. It's right there. If I lose a debate to a man who made fun of sea shanties in front of an audience of Newfoundlanders,

I will walk into it. Matt Wright ladies and gentlemen Matt Wright says the Atlantic Ocean is better than the Pacific Charlie Demers says the opposite we have an open threat let's see

what the audience will do by applause who seconds Charlie's Pacific Ocean motion? Charlie DeMatte. All right. All right. Very polite. Polite applause. And who thought Matt floated the best Atlantic argument vote? Mattie. There it is. The winner is Matt Wright. The Atlantic Ocean's better than the Pacific. Big hand for Matt Wright and Charlie DeMass, everybody. You're listening to CBC Radio's The Debaters. Want access to bonus content and information on upcoming tour dates?

Then be sure to follow us on Instagram at at CBC Debaters. Hi there, Steve Patterson here. You know, I travel a lot for work on my own, us on Instagram at at cbcdebaters. Hi there, Steve Patterson here. You know, I travel a lot for work on my own, so when I can do a trip where I get to bring my wife Nancy and our daughters along, I jump at it. On a recent trip to Ottawa, we booked an Airbnb. It was a nice home in a nice neighborhood, and it even had room for our dog Ferris, which was also nice. And that made me think, hey, maybe our home in Toronto would be a nice place

to stay for some nice people too, since it sits empty while we're away. And honestly, it would be great if our house started bringing in some extra cash to put towards the next trip. Because frankly, Ferris keeps screwing up in his job interviews. Your home might be worth more than you think. Find out how much at airbnb.ca slash host. Hey there, I'm David Common. If you're like me, there are things you love about living in the GTA and things that drive you absolutely crazy. Every day on This Is Toronto, we connect you to what matters most about life in the GTA, the news you gotta know,

and the conversations your friends will be talking about. Whether you listen on a run through your neighbourhood or while sitting in the parking lot that is the 401, check out This Is Toronto, wherever you get your podcasts. Hey everybody, are you ready to meet your next pair of debaters? Listen to that, Canada! They're ready! This comic's comedy is as gouda as it gets. Let's welcome Newfoundland's Brie Parsons. Brie, there she comes, looking confident.

Taking her spot to my right. And this comic insists there's no pleasure without pain. It's Sackville, Nova Scotia's Nikki Payne. There she is, flexing her comedy muscle already. She takes her place to my left. Your topic is one that will raise a sensitive issue. Growing up poor, does it make a person stronger? I will say that I had a modest upbringing that could probably be defined as poor, but I'm not sure if that made me a stronger person, though it certainly did set the stage for a career in Canadian comedy.

I do have some financial tips for Canadian entertainers that I personally learned the hard way. If you want your money to earn some interest, keep your material interesting. If people throw tomatoes at you on stage, catch them and plant them. And being paid in drink tickets doesn't count as liquid assets. It's time now for a debate that we've been saving for a rainy day. So, whereas it teaches resourcefulness, discourages materialism, and ensures that nothing is taken for granted, be it resolved, growing up poor makes you a stronger person. Bree, you are arguing for this, please. You have two minutes. Starting now, Bree Parsons. I'm so thankful I grew up with nothing

Cause now I expect nothing When considering strength I think it's best to address Who you would want on your team in the apocalypse Rich kids, they played lacrosse And tickled the ivories Poor kids, they played lacrosse and tickled the ivories. Poor kids, we played war.

And spotlight. War is a fun little game where we would run into the woods and hit each other with sticks. That was the full game. And spotlight is nothing if not learning how to hide from the police. Growing up poor means knowing how to survive off the bare minimum. I know I can get by on canned food and just the threat of a knuckle sandwich. We had two bowls in my house, one for soup and one for cutting my hair. Growing up poor forces you to learn many skills. You can't afford to hire someone to fix anything for you. You change your own tires. You cut your own wood.

You drink too young because it's cheaper than therapy. So when choosing your apocalypse team, do you want someone that knows where to buy a new toaster or who can make you one out of a metal clothes hanger? Thank you, Steve. Bree Parsons. Nice job. Now, to tell us why growing up with no money

is in very poor taste to her, let's hear from Nikki Payne. To this day, I hide money. I just hide it around the house like an Easter bunny with an anxiety disorder. I had a roommate that said the only other person he knew that hid money like me was his grandmother. So growing up in a trailer park in Sackville, Nova Scotia provided the same level of complex trauma as being bombed by the Nazis in Malta.

I was one of the richer kids in the trailer park. All that did was teach me that I was dangling precariously on the frayed edges of socioeconomic uncertainty. I'm nine! I was already keenly aware that the only thing between me and the kids in the free lunch line was a father slash second income. And Donnie Payne was one debaucherous seg party away from having his maintenance man arse thrown to the curb. Yeah Brie, back in the 80s when me and your mom went to school. They didn't think to just give all the kids free lights like now.

No, they made the poor kids line up in a parade of misery for the whole school to judge. I was already a trailer park kid with a speech impediment, wooly mullet, and one boob! So I sucked back my dried-out peanut butter sandwich from home with gratitude. Yeah, yeah, we were allowed to eat peanut butter at school! Because they let the poor kids be judged and the anaphylactic kids could die for all they cared.

And you wonder why I hide money. It wasn't elementary school. It was the GD Hunger Games. Growing up poor has left me shell-shocked. Only money is called clams, so I guess I'm clam-baked. Thank you very much, Stefan. Nikki Payne is not a fan of growing up poor. It is time now, debaters, for the Bare Knuckle Round.

We're debating whether growing up poor makes you stronger. So go for broke, but remember it takes a value village. But I'm sure we'll all be richer for having heard your wealth of wit. So time to destitute your own horns starting now. I was the kind of poor that in fifth grade, we all had to make an instrument. And all the kids in my class, right, they made these really cool ukuleles out of tissue boxes. Not me. I made a set of bongos out of duct tape and two John Player

tobacco containers. I found a picture from that day, andie could have a real instrument and a nicotine patch. See, that's why I'm so cheap. I don't want to have any child of mine playing bongos. Nikki bought your 48. Yeah, but I've got a 48-year-old trailer park uterus. Okay, so... this thing's still viable. She was talking about, you know, that we got free lunch.

See, we had an envelope. Mom could put money in it if she wanted to, and she did, because she's a good woman. She put $5 in it. I would save that $5, give it to my older sister, one at a time. She'd buy me cigarettes, and I would sell it on the side give it to my older sister, one at a time. She'd buy me cigarettes, and I would sell it on the side of the school right outside that door.

Resourceful. You're getting ready for a life of crime. That's a good place to stop. The bare knuckle round. It is time now for the firing line. In my hand, I have a list of questions on growing up poor brought to you by what my dad considered the gold standard in children's nutrition,

goldfish crackers. Ate those till I was in my teens. Bustle.com's list, Nine Ways Growing Up Poor Makes You an Awesome Person, includes, You Know How to Survive with Very Little, You Know the Value of Things, and what else? Brie. You're Easy to Please, Just Wine from a Box

and Veggies from a Can. It's not what I have here, but it's a good line for a song. Two points. Nikki Payne. You're ready for a recession at a moment's notice. It's a pretty good point, too. One and a half points.

You understand other people's struggles. Way to go, bustle.com. The National Post reports that the federal government reduced child poverty by as much as 17% with the introduction of what program in 2016? Bree? Planned Parenthood.

They can't be poor if I don't have them. That is a three-point answer right there. The National Post reports the federal government reduced child poverty by as much as 17% with the introduction of the Canada Child Benefit. See how boring the real answers are? That's why we do fake ones. Finish this lyric from the classic Johnny Cash song, A Boy Named Sue. Well, my daddy left home when I was three

and he didn't leave much for Ma and me. Just what? Nikki. He's type 2 diabetes. Incorrect, but I would love if that was true. One and a half points. Just this old guitar

and an empty bottle of booze. Yeah, I got two. Movieweb.com's list, 10 movies that accurately portray the struggles of poverty includes Slumdog Millionaire, Forrest Gump, and what beloved children's classic? Nikki. Magic Mike.

Bree. The Very Hungry Caterpillar. Breathe. The very hungry caterpillar. That's a good answer. What beloved children's classic? Willy Wonka and the Chocolate Factory. That's the firing line, everybody. We are racing towards our closing arguments, and it's almost time for this Holy Heart Theatre audience to pick a winner.

But first, here again with a wealth of arguments against growing up poor, let's hear again from Nikki Payne. I'm a single lady, debt-free, and own my house. Bree here would say that I'm a single lady, debt-free, and own my house. Brie here would say that I'm a shining example of how growing up poor made me a strong, independent woman. I'd call it carer-induced independence. I cut my own hair. My clothes come from Costco.

Who am I wearing? Kirkland! I'm cheap. Yeah, I'm single because I'm afraid of penises. Because they make babies. Babies are expensive. I can't enjoy the company of a man without adding up in my mind how much this company could cost me if the labyrinth of birth control I've erected were to fail.

Do you hear me? I can't enjoy company, Bree. I rarely come to full company. Growing up poor has ruined company for me. It has made me weak. I rest my case. Thank you, Steve. Nikki Payne. Nikki Payne. Ladies and gentlemen, that was a lot of information. Thank you, Nikki.

Now, here to dish the dirt on being dirt poor, let's hear again from Bree Parsons. When you grow up poor, you are resilient, tenacious, and without shame. No one can take anything from you. I got a divorce last year, and I learned about split assets. I lost one of my two bowls. When you're poor, you're solely responsible for every aspect of surviving.

We are our own line cooks, lumberjacks, hairstylists, plaster painters, personal trainers, and cigarette rollers. We are the majority and we run in packs. There's strength in numbers. The rich people don't have numbers. They are the 1%. They may own the houses, but we build them. Thank you, Steve. Well said.

Brie Parsons. Nice job. All right. Audience, it is up to you to decide. By applause, who thought that Nikki's anti-poverty patter richly deserves to win this one? Nikki Payne. All right. Love for Nikki. deserves to win this one, Nikki Payne.

All right. Love for Nikki. And who thought Brie was right on the money about growing up minus money? Brie Parsons. My delicious. You are rich in applause. The winner is Brie Parsons. Big hand for Brie Parsons and Nikki Payne, everybody! Well, that's

all for this week. I'm Steve Patterson saying we're all richer when we share a good laugh, which makes everyone who listens to this show loaded! I'll argue with you again soon, Canada! Good night! The Debaters is created by Richard Seid. This week's episode was produced by

Nicole Callender, Chloe Edbrook, Dean Jenkinson, and Graham Clark. With continuity by Graham Clark, Diana Francis, and Gary Jones. Technical production by James Perella and Mark Strong. Story editing by Gary Jones. With special thanks to Heidi Brander, Emily Ferrier, Katie Ellen Humphries, and David Pride. Executive producer of CBC Radio Comedy is Lee Pitts. And thanks to everyone at the Holy Heart Theatre in St. John's.

For more CBC Podcasts, go to cbc.ca slash podcasts.