The Debaters - Are rings better than bracelets? And is it always great to be a trailblazer?

Episode Date: March 27, 2025

Which jewels rule: rings or bracelets? And being a trailblazer is great…right?Featuring: Graham Clark, Heidi Brander, Faris Hytiaa, and Lara Rae.

I've been covering politics for 20 years and I can't remember a time like now when everything we thought we knew has been thrown in the air. From Trudeau's resignation to Trump's tariffs to a spring election during huge shifts in the polls. There's a lot at stake and power and politics is here to guide you through it. I'm David Cochran and on CBC's only political

daily I speak to the key players in this election. From the candidates to the analysts to the journalists on the campaign trail, you can find power and politics wherever you get your podcasts, including YouTube. This is a CBC Podcast. Hey Canada, are you ready to expose yourself to comedy? From Vancouver, home of the Expo Skytrain line, it's the Debaters! The Debaters were comedians fighting with facts and funny, and this audience picks the

winner. Now here's a man who trained hard for this show, Steve Patterson. Hey! Hello again, Canada! Welcome back to The Debaters. Always great to be back in Vancouver, a city that we always have time for. And one must-see destination whenever I'm here

is the Gastown Steam Clock in Gastown. The clock is a huge hit with tourists who make thousands of posts on Instagram and even more appropriately on TikTok. So give it a visit if you're ever here in Vancouver, because it's a great place to go to blow off some steam. It's time now to meet two debaters who are ready to clean each other's clocks. This comic sometimes buys her bacon in a hurry, resulting in some rash-er decisions. It's P.E.I.'s Heidi Brander! Heidi Brander, the pride of P.E.I.'s Heidi Brander! Heidi Brander, the pride of P.E.I.

There she is, making her way across the stage. To my right. Hi, welcome back, Heidi. Thank you. And this comic was a member of a tough high school geometry gang called Hell's Angles. It's Vancouver's own Graham Clark! Graham! Graham Clark!

There he is. All right, debaters, your topic is one that will always be in fashion. Rings versus bracelets. Which shines brightest? I will remain impartial and talk about jewelry a little south of the border. A little further down the anatomy if you catch my drift.

Thank you, thank you. Talking about toe rings and ankle bracelets. These are typically more popular in women's fashion, but I'm actually wearing toe rings and an ankle bracelet right now. One for fashion, the other for legal reasons. Sure they're covered by socks and shoes, but I know they look good, as do all the guys in the locker room at my gym when I show them off. Kidding, I don't go to a gym. Time now for a gem of a debate. So, whereas they're

a classic and durable piece of jewelry that's the go-to symbol for milestones, memories, and even moods, be it resolved that rings are superior to bracelets. Graham, you're arguing for this. You have two minutes minutes starting now, Graham Clark. I'll start with, if you liked it, then you should have put a? Man, that was a 50-50 shot that you guys were going to know that. You did. You did a great job. The Bible said there's a reason that God gave you 10 fingers and only two wrists. ["Ssss"]

Bracelets are for mistresses and little girls. ["Pfft"] ["Hahaha"] You want a bracelet? Get 10 for a dollar at Claire's while you're getting your two-year-old's ears pierced. You guys know Claire's? How can I tell if a mobster is a made man

if I can't see the pinky ring? How do I know who's going to Burning Man without seeing a wooden thumb ring and matching toe ring, right? No one dreams their whole life about having that special someone on bended knee saying those magic four words, Hey, here's your anklet.

Look. Let's discuss the most important ring of all. Purity rings. A ring for virgins that symbolizes not only virginity, but one very speedy wedding night. ["Wedding Night"] Ha. Gosh.

When you win the Super Bowl in the NFL, you get a ring. I'm not sure about the CFL. You might just get, like, a coffee mug or something. ["Wedding Night"] Ha. Ha. Ha. Now, I'll give you that kissing a ring is kind of gross, but I would still prefer that to tonguing someone's bracelet. Heidi, when you're ready to take this seriously, give me a ring.

Thank you. Graham Clark, on behalf of rings over bracelets, should point out to those listening at home, if this helps, that Graham does have a lot of rings on tonight. He's showing his ring bling. And he feels the power. I like the phrase, tonguing the bracelet, just on its own. I think that was an Aerosmith album name, tongue to bracelet. Now, brace yourself, everyone, for some off-the-cuff remarks about bracelets

from the always charming Heidi Brander. Okay, okay. How is this a contest? A ring gets you into a marriage, a bracelet gets you into a beer tent, okay? S-c-k-k. Rings reek of desperation. They're like, marry me! You know, like bracelets are chill.

They're like, whoa, whoa, I just wanna be friends. You know? T-e-n-t. You can't even take a ring off without causing drama. You take your ring off, it means you're cheating. You take your bracelet off, it means you're stuffing a turkey. Okay, Saturn has rings. That is impressive.

But do you know what's bigger than Saturn? Taylor Swift. Yeah. The bracelet queen, because if you'd been dumped as much as Taylor Swift, you'd hate rings too. Ha ha, shots fired, Taylor Swift. Rings are small, okay, they're so easy to lose. Bracelets are big and easy to find.

If Lord of the Rings was called Lord of the Bracelets, maybe they would have found that ring faster and those movies would be shorter, okay? I don't know. I don't know if that's what the movies are about. I slept through all of them. Okay, I'm just gonna say it. Rings are for perverts and criminals.

I'm just saying. Think about it. Think about it. Crime rings, drug rings, sex trafficking rings. You never hear anything about a sex trafficking bracelet. The worst a bracelet's ever gotten is a slap on the wrist. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop.

Ha ha ha ha ha. Cops actually use bracelets to catch criminals. Without handcuffs, Hannibal Lecter would still be out on the street. But I guess that's what you want, Graham, to keep on gobbling down people's brains with your best friend, Hannibal Lecter. Okay.

Well, listen, I could go on about this for hours, but according to my watch, I mean my bracelet, I'm out of time. Thank you. Yeah! my watch, I mean my bracelet, I'm out of time. Thank you. Yeah. Heidi Brander on behalf of Bracelet. It's time now for the Bare Knuckle Round. We're debating rings versus bracelets. So show us why we should care at all.

By putting the pedal to the precious metal and solitary a strip off your opponent. Thank you. One cackle laugh is all I need. Let's get this audience all sapphired up. Time to bling it home now. Alright. Oh, thanks everybody. Let's go debaters. Okay, thanks, everybody. Let's go, debaters.

Okay, Graham, you heard him. This is the bear knuckle round. Get those ringies off your fingies. Ooh, I do not care for that one bit. I can do a song. I can do a rhyme. Rings, rings. They're good things, okay?

Laughter Bracelets, bracelets. Nobody's favorite. Laughter Yeah. Laughter I just want you to think about the engravers, okay? You can engrave a bracelet with anything.

There's so much room. But all you can fit on the inside of a ring is, like, a wedding date or, like, Elvish. What? I told you that in confidence, and... And... And it's Dothraki, not Elvish. Um...

Good point, man. Yeah. Thank you. Okay. Yeah. Thank you. Okay. Sorry. Oh, God. Why are we even fighting, okay? Aren't rings just finger bracelets or aren't bracelets wrist rings? Heh, heh, heh. Well, whatever she said, but the opposite.

All right. That's the Bare Knuckle Round everybody. It is too close to call right now. It's time now for the firing line. In my hand I have a list of questions on rings versus bracelets brought to you by Telephone Marriage Proposals. Telephone Marriage Proposals. I'll give you a ring later. Yep, Graham likes that one.

Graham's Jewelers says, diamond bracelets pair well with formal outfits while leather bracelets pair well with what? Heidi? A midlife crisis. Good answer. Look at that. Six points.

Graham? As it is Graham's jewelers, the question, you have to take this as law. They pair well with knowing every Aerosmith song. There you go, I knew it for a fact. You guys have heard of Aerosmith song. There you go, I knew it for a fact. You guys have heard of Aerosmith, right? Leather bracelets pair well with t-shirts and jeans. Maybe if you're in the band Creed. You know Creed? Oh man, man. Unbelievable. Oh, the Vancouver company, The Ringfinders,

has recovered more than 13,000 lost rings over the past 30 years, including the wedding ring of Two and a Half Men star John Cryer. What is The Ringfinders' slogan? Heidi? You wouldn't be here if you'd bought a bracelet. Nice. Nice. That is well within your argument. Four points. Did you guys know John Cryer?

Okay. It's... The Ring Finder's slogan is, you lost it, we'll find it. Catchy. Pfft! Right? I have no notes for that. Globe and Mail columnist Russell Smith says,

men who wear large rings run the risk of looking like what? Oh, Graham? The risk of looking like a cool and confident guy that just happens to ride the bus, right? Yeah. That's a good, yeah. Strong answer. Not what I have here, but three points.

No, Globe and Mail columnist Russell Smith says, men who wear large rings run the risk of looking like a gangster or a pope or someone who makes more money than a Globe and Mail columnist. 1403lux luxury.com says, when wearing rings and bracelets simultaneously, you should probably do what? Graham?

Be Johnny Depp. Yeah, that checks out. Two points. Heidi? Enter a Mr. T lookalike contest. Good point. I like the shout out to Mr. T look-alike contest. Good one. I like the shout-out to Mr. T. That one slightly... Current reference.

...slightly less than Johnny Depp. I'm going to give that 1.75. Okay, you, uh, wearing rings and bracelets simultaneously, you should probably wear rings on one hand and bracelets on the other. Do you want to do a swap fee? One ring, one bracelet. You want to? Yeah. Oh, OK. We got an official trade going on.

All right. Oh, one ring for a bracelet. Oh, look at the trades. Graham, don't hurt yourself. Is that fit on you? Does that? Yes, he did it. That's how it's done. You see, it could be that easy, America. I wish they could see this.

So that's the firing line, everybody. It's just about that magical time when our Centennial Theatre audience votes, but first here again to remind us that anyone who has prematurely stopped loving bracelets is suffering from a wristed development. Her words, not mine. It's Heidi Brander! This is CBC Radio. I'm not saying the audience is old, but 90% of people are listening to this because they've fallen, and they can't get up to change the station.

And when the ambulance arrives, what will save the day? Their Medic Alert Bracelets. Oh! Thank you. Yeah. Thank you, yeah. Mm-hmm.

Bracelets remind us to live strong and ask us, what would Jesus do? And I'll tell you what Jesus wouldn't do, Canada. Vote for Graham Clark and his best friend, Hannibal Lecter. Thank you so much. Heidi Brander. A very nice, distinct, closing argument on behalf of Bracelets. Now, here with another ringing endorsement regarding rings, here's our own ringleader, Graham Clark.

Hiya. There is a certain type of etiquette that comes with discussing rings, or ringette-ticket. I think we all know that was worth it. Um. Um. Um. Um. Um. Um. Um.

Um. Um. Um. Um. Um. Um. Um. Um.

Um. Um. Um. Um. Um. Um. Um. Um. Um. Um. and they didn't let him have it. Do you hate rings because of that stringy-haired guy? Because I'll have you know that that greasy troll grew up to be Galen Weston.

We could have avoided so much trouble if we just gave the ring to that slimy guy. So next time you're buying an orange for $7, remember that one ring to rule them all, and that rings rule. Yes! Graham Clark with a ringing endorsement for rings. Thank you, Graham. All right, audience, by applause,

it is up to you to determine the winner. Who thinks that Graham's three ring circus rings most true? Graham Clark. Okay. Nice love for Graham there. And who listened to Heidi's bracelet boosting and felt that they really got some bangle

for their book, Heidi Brander? Well, sorry, buddy. BC has spoken, they like the bracelets. The winner is Heidi Brander, bracelets over rings. Big hand for Heidi Brander and Graham Clark, everyone. Hey, Debaters fans in Winnipeg. We're coming for two shows on May 2nd and 3rd as part of the Winnipeg, we're coming for two shows on May 2nd and 3rd as part of the Winnipeg Comedy Festival. For ticket details, visit cbc.ca slash The Debaters.

I'm Sarah Trelevin and for over a year I've been working on one of the most complex stories I've ever covered. There was somebody out there who was faking pregnancies. I started like warning everybody. Every doula that I know. It was fake. No pregnancy. who's faking pregnancies. I started like warning everybody. Every doula that I know. It was fake. No pregnancy.

And the deeper I dig, the more questions I unearth. How long has she been doing this? What does she have to gain from this? From CBC and the BBC World Service, The Con, Caitlin's baby. It's a long story, settle in. Available now. Hey North Van, I just got one question for you.

Are you ready to meet your next pair of debaters? Listen to that, Canada! This comic's position on static electricity helped spark a debate. It's Lethbridge, Alberta's, Forrest Hitea! Come on out, Forrest! There he is! Welcome back! Good to be back, Steve. And this comic designed a horseback riding boot clip and now hopes to stir up some business.

It's Winnipeg's Lara Ray! Lara making her way across the stage now and taking the lectern to my right. Lara, I see here, and I didn't know this, the number of debates that you've lost is the same as your age, is that true? 25? Your topic is one that may be a first for us, trailblazers.

Is it great to be one? I'm looking forward to this debate, though obviously I'm a bit biased, since I'm a bit of a trailblazer myself. I was the first one in my family to quit law school despite having a full scholarship. Thank you very much. Thank you. Which my dad reacted to with language that I can't repeat here. And my older brothers then mocked me for pursuing a career in Canadian entertainment

instead of law, which I would like to defend by saying, look at me now. But I'm on national radio. So yeah. So your objections are sustained. Now time for a debate that will forge its own path. So whereas being the first person to do something can inspire others, encourage new discoveries, and lead to impactful change, be it resolved it's always great to be a trailblazer.

Faris, you're arguing for this please. You have two minutes. Starting now, Faris Hitea. Thank you, Steve. Trailblazing is an honourable pursuit. Straying off the beaten path and opening doors to discovery is a scary but ultimately crucial and rewarding decision to make.

I would know. After all, bit of a trailblazer myself. I'm the first person from Lethbridge, Alberta to appear on the CBC without committing a crime first. That's right. Don't fact check that. The beauty of trailblazing is you don't even have to be talented. You just have to be the first to try the thing. I'll give you another fun fact.

I'm the first person to ever be given birth to by my mother. I'm her favorite. She had two other children. We'll call them my sisters. One was a successful pharmacist in Sudan. We're familiar with Sudan, by the way. Do we know Sudan? Yeah? Yeah, of course. You've seen the commercials. My sister was a successful pharmacist in Sudan. She then got a second degree in international relations and then was forced to flee Sudan

due to war. When she relocated here to Canada, she had a full-time job in her field within six weeks of getting here. Sure, yeah, thank you. My other sister had her education cut short by the same war and had to complete her studies remotely while living as a refugee and is now an accredited electrical engineer furthering her education here in Canada. Please. And I...

A struggling comedian in the wasteland of Canadian because I arrived first. These stories are everywhere. Amelia Earhart, pioneer, incredible woman, terrible pilot. We still don't know where she is. No idea. And how many came after her? In the decades since, tens of women have landed planes since. And we don't know their names. Thank you.

Forrest Hetia, everybody. On behalf of Trailblazers everywhere and that line, you don't have to be talented, you just have to be first. I'm going to send that to my older brother. Eight points. Now, to remind us that we wouldn't need to follow trailblazers if we all just followed our hearts, let's hear again from the always heartfelt, Lara Rae. Is it a good idea to be a trailblazer? I know someone brilliant and beautiful. Who can answer that?

Someone who at 52 decided to change their gender. Look at me, my dear opponent. Look at me. I beg you, don't make trouble. The nail that sticks out gets hammered down. Even after you've had anything sticking out, surgically removed. Listen, in a Montreal operating room I got the last vagina of the 2016 holiday season. Very festive. Chestnuts roasting on an open fire. Played in the operating room. Oh, you're so brave, Lara.

Why? Simply because I chose to be me. Nonsense. Trailblazers aren't marching towards utopia. They're often wandering into bullets and tear gas and executive orders. Thank you. I prefer laughter, but that's just me. Don't believe this 61 year old woman? Yes, I've lost 60 debates. Once you're first, it defines you. Who's gonna

remember that wonderful Australian Olympic breakdancer, Ray Guns. Who's going to remember her other accomplishments? Jesus said, the first shall be last, and the last shall be first. Or maybe it was Dylan. They were definitely Jewish. My point is, I didn't become a 61-year-old woman to be avant-garde and a pioneer. I did it so I could be invisible to men, ignored by all, and left the hell alone alone as all women my age prefer.

Thank you. Laura Ray, getting them riled up here. Laura Ray is anti-Trailblazer and that's what we will call the movie. We got ourselves a debate. It is time now for the Bare Knuckle Round. We're debating trailblazers, so start by really Magellan with this audience. This is just the tip of the Toonberg. So don't ever rest unless that's the Hillary you're willing to die on. Time to leave us in frontiers of laughter.

So set your Simon Phasers on stun now. That was a great job, but I resent you calling Lethbridge the wasteland of Canadian entertainment because Winnipeg got there first. And I thank you for blazing the trail. For dirtbags like us. And honestly, I'm pretty surprised you're not kind of sharing my position a little more, Lara. Like, as the first trans person to first openly trans person. Yeah. Okay. I was going to ask, sorry, as the first openly trans person to lose 60 debates on CBC's The

Debaters. 61 after tonight. All right, everybody. That's the Bare Knuckle round. Time now for the firing line. In my hand, I have a list of questions on trailblazing brought to you by Liederhosen. Liederhosen. The socks of choice for German trailblazers. Liederhosen. Leader Halzenz! Time.com's list of 2024's best inventions includes a common household item powered by AI. What is it? And what does it do?

First. It's a calendar, but it only updates with the times and locations of insurance CEOs. The crowd is going wild for that. Good answer. Four points. Lara? Could you repeat the question, my dear? Time.com's list of 2024's best inventions includes a common household item powered by AI.

What is it and what does it do? It blows out candles when you're hammered. That's a good one. That's a good one. That's handy. It is a toilet seat that uses AI to monitor changes in your health. A toilet seat. Finish this quote about trailblazers from the 2011 Brad Pitt movie, Moneyball. The first guy through the wall, he always does what? Lara. Claims asylum. Yeah. Yeah.

Yep. Two and a half points. The first guy through the wall, he always gets bloody. Yeah, that was a movie about baseball. Beloved Vancouver legend Joe Fortes was a trailblazer who in the year 1900 became the first Vancouverite to do what? Lara. Default on a mortgage. Vancouverite to do what? Lara.

Default on a mortgage. Three points. Three point answer. Fire us a Tia. He became the first Vancouverite to crash an e-bike in Stanley Park. Was really ahead of his time. He really was.

He was the first Vancouverite to become a professional lifeguard. Yes! That's real. And that's the firing line, everybody. Thanks, Joe. Moving on, it's almost that magical time where our Centennial Theatre audience picks their winner. But first, as the night follows the day, here to Trash Talk Trailblazing once again, it's Lara Rae. Thank you. With our slavish need for heroes, most trailblazers are just propaganda and PR. Marconi didn't invent radio or macaroni.

Laughter Henry Ford didn't invent being a racist anti-Semite. Laughter But he modeled it to achieve! Oh, God! Oh! That one physically hurt me! Laughter Steve Jobs didn't invent taking credit for others' work, but he was a leader in abandoning his kids.

Until Elon Musk. Elon has an adult trans daughter but doesn't believe in trans children. Well that would be trailblazing, somebody my size coming out of my sis mother's birth canal. I'm not sure why I said my sis mother. I do not call my mother my cis mother. Yeah. I call her cis Marjorie.

In conclusion, trailblazing is setting fire to a path. Hate the planet much? Thank you. Laura Ray says no way to trailblazing. Now, here hoping to go out on a trailblaze of glory as he glorifies trailblazing, let's hear again from Foris Atiyah. applause Look, I'll reiterate. Trailblazing does not require grandiose achievements.

You are beloved solely for trying, not for being good at the thing. Like Terry Fox. audience groans I can't help you. I can't help you. I can't help you. Hear me out. Look, he's a hero. Absolutely, and deservedly so.

We all know the story. Very inspirational. Bone cancer led to his leg getting amputated. Terry decides that he's gonna run across Canada, right? Raise awareness and funding for cancer research. He starts his run in St. John's, Newfoundland. And his run, as we know, was unfortunately cut short. It ended, like all good things, in Thunder Bay. ["The Last Post," by The CW plays, audience laughs and applauds.]

Please don't hate me for this. He didn't even get halfway. ["The Last Post," by The CW plays, audience laughs and applauds.] And we built statues. He's on money. Because Terry was the first to try. So please, Canada, try. Thank you.

Forrest Hitea, everybody, believes in trailblazing. Lara is against, and the audience has to decide who the winner is. By applause, how many of you were full-on followers of Faris as he blazed a trail to a wonderful new world of laughs and logic? Faris Hitea! Wow! Lot of love here. Listen to that reaction.

And who stands with Lara's anti-trail blazing stance against standing out Lara Rae? It's very close. It's too close to call. I can't tell. It's inconclusive we have a tie, ladies and gentlemen. Big hand for Farah Satiyah and Lara Rae, everybody. Well, that's all for this week. Until next time, I'm Steve Patterson saying to all you trailblazers out there, good luck

and let me know when the trail is finished. I'll argue with you again soon Canada. Good night! The Debaters is created by Richard Side. This week's episode was produced by Nicole Callender, Chloe Edbrook, Dean Jenkinson and Graham Clark, with continuity by Graham Clark, Diana Francis and Gary Jones. Technical production by James Perella and Eric Penkratz. Story editing by Gary Jones, with special thanks to Katie Ellen Humphrey's Emily Ferrier and David Pride. Executive producer

of CBC Radio Comedy is Lee Pitts. And thanks to everyone at the Centennial Theatre in North Vancouver. For more CBC podcasts, go to cbc.ca slash podcasts.