The Debaters - Does Velcro beat laces? Do dress codes at work matter?

Episode Date: September 25, 2025

We have a fasten-ating debate on Velcro vs. laces, then, we get down to business when we discuss dress codes at work.Featuring: Lisa Baker, Sean Cullen, Chad Anderson, and Brittany Lyseng.

Hugh is a rock climber, a white supremacist, a Jewish neo-Nazi, a spam king, a crypto-billionaire, and then someone killed him. It is truly a mystery. It is truly a case of who done it. Dirtbag Climber, the story of the murder and the many lives of Jesse James. Available now wherever you get your podcasts. This is a CBC podcast. Hey Canada, we just dropped by to say yellow from Yellowknife in Canada's Northwest Territories.

It's the debater! The debaters where comedians fight with facts and funny in this audience picks the winner. Now here's a man known for his colorful commentaries. Steve. Yeah, thanks Graham Clark. Hello, Canada. Welcome back to the debaters,

and it is great to be back here in Yellowknife. Yellowknife, Canada, that's right. A town that offers no end of culinary delights. You can get good eats at the legendary Wildcat Cafe. Originally built in 1937 by pioneers Willie Wiley and Smokey Stout. Wiley and stout sounds like a fabulous, funky craft beer or a law firm that specializes in divorce. The Wildcat has been host to prime ministers,

including Stephen Harper, who knocked his head on the slanted ceiling when he visited. True story. Fortunately for Mr. Harper, he wasn't hurt, though, because he's so hard-headed, both in his ways and his majestic helmet of hair. Now it's time to meet. two debaters who are a couple of wildcats themselves. This comic ditched her friends, the butcher, and the candlestick maker. It's Newfoundland's Lisa Baker.

Lisa Baker. Making her way out, riling up the crowd here in Yellow Night. And this comic was happy investing in moon rocks until the stock cratered. It's Toronto's Sean Cullen. All right. There he is. Hello, good sir. Your topic debaters is one that will be fastenerating.

Velcro, is it superior to laces? Finally, finally, someone has this debate. A lot of shows said no one cares, Steve, and I said, this is what this show's about. I'm looking forward to both perspectives on this, because our house follows the bunny method of shoelace tying, which has this helpful rhyme. Over, under, around the tree, hop through the bunny hole, pull and see. I had to look that up because I'm pretty sure my dad paraphrased it quite a bit

when I was a kid. I remember it as grab a rabbit by the ears. Pull them together. I'm going to get a beer. And then my mom bought the Velcro shoes and dad just didn't even skip a beat. Stick them together, make them adhere. I'm going to go get two more beers. Time now for a debate that is a shoe-in. So, whereas it's an ingenious design that's easier to use and more suitable for all ages, be it resolved that Velcro is superior to laces. Lisa, you are arguing for this, please. You have two minutes. Starting now, Lisa Baker. Thank you. I got to say, this is my 11th appearance and the debaters, and I am quite shocked that we are diving into such a controversial topic. I would have thought by now that everyone would be on board with Velcro, especially

us. You know, you, me, Steve, most of our listeners are only a couple of years away of wanting everything with Velcro. Shoes, seatbelts, underwear. And a wasted time. On average, it takes 47 seconds to tie shoelaces. That's 8,671 minutes per year, which adds up to 18 years of your lifetime spent tying laces. 18 years! I'm a comedian, not a mathematician, but you could raise a child. You could raise a child in that amount of time. And speaking of children, have you ever tat a child to tie their shoes. It's like they don't have thumbs or fingers or common sense. You should also know that Velcro is much more convenient when you're tasked in the drunk tank.

Ever try to relase a shoe while half cut? It's like trying to teach a child how to tie their shoes. I'm also guessing, Sean, that you have never tripped over your own untied laces and a staircase, down like a wrecking ball to take out someone's sweet granny who was just trying to take advantage of the bays, going out of business sales, and send her to the hospital with a broken hip, and now her kids have to take turns staying with her, and they get a bunch of parking tickets and have to miss work to go to fight the tickets in court, and then her boss fires them, and now their houses are in threat of foreclosure? You've never done that? Wouldn't happen with Velcro. Thank you, Steve.

Lisa Baker, with her trademark research. Now, here to tell us why this isn't going to end in a tie. It's our own Lace's laureate, Sean Cullen. Velcro! It's a space-age wonder thing. Astronauts. Wow, we, whoop-de-do, yippity-de-de-de-de-da-doo. Oh, that crazy Velcro. Have you heard about it?

It's so great. I'd like Velcro to be my uncle. I'd like to tongue-kiss Velcro. Or would I? In fact, no. Velcro feels like crap on my tongue. Believe me, I've kissed it a lot. Give me laces. Sure. They require skill to use.

I know that discourages a lot of people. Sometimes they break. But when they break, you can tie them back together and keep using them. Or get new laces. Wonderful. If Velcro stop sticking, you can't buy some replacement Velcro strips for your shoes. You just throw your fancy, space-age, lazy shoes in the garbage.

In the garbage! Give me the dangling tendrils of delight. And it's more than just the aesthetic of laces with their tiny delicious tips. It's the experience of the lace. Is there anything more satisfying when, as a child, you finally manage to master the arcane,

of tying your own shoes, look, mommy, I did it. I tied my shoes. I, I did it. Mommy, why don't you look at me? Why don't you love me, Mommy? Why don't you ever care? I tie my shoes, why? Okay, that's a personal experience.

Better dealt with it therapy. But the fact for my age, the tying shoelaces, personal and satisfying experience that builds character and touches the human soul in a way that hooks and eyes never will. And they are much more forgiving

on the tongue. Thank you. Yeah. Sean Cullen, our Laces Laureate. Ladies gentlemen, and it's time now for the bare knuckle round. We're debating whether Velcro is superior to laces, so it's time to go fasten furious.

But remember to hold it together. Don't get super attached to winning. Simply hook the audience and string them along with jokes that tie in, and you'll run loops around your opponent. Now's not the time to get tongue-tied, so I let you start now. Don't you want to achieve something wonderful?

Tying your laces. It's so beautiful. It's a magical time when your fingers, you just let them do something. Beautiful that ends up making a sweet, delicious bow. Is anybody else disturbed? Yes, they are. By your lack of faith in the lace.

I feel like that's the face you see right before you hear. Put the lotion in the basket. And you know, if he used Velcro, I'd get away. It ties its own laces. I just feel... I have a referral for better help if you need it. I think the help I'm getting is happily inadequate. Okay.

Now... If you've just tuned in, we're debating Velcro versus Laces, or we were, and I'd like to continue. Here's the thing. If you are, you know, let's say, let's have a scenario here, right? Right? All right.

Let's have a scenario. We've been captured by psychopaths. Are you one of them? And now they fall in the sleep, so we have a moment to get away. But they've chained our shoes to the wall. And we have to remove our shoes to escape the sleeping homicidal psychopaths. I quickly unlace my shoes in utter silence. Tiptoe past the psychopaths, the freedom.

I would have waited for you, but you're sitting there going, and the psychopaths are, what's that not? And then I just say, pardon me, I had chili for lunch. Oh. I would come back to you to save you after they'd fallen to sleep again. I just, look, as someone who was a little crazy in my youth, I just feel like we could have used Velcro in a lot more places, like handcuffs.

Do you know what I mean? Yeah, I know what you mean. But they would be ineffective handcuffs, I think. That's my point, Sean. Well, what is, okay. I could kick the window out, but I still got to get out of the handcuffs. Elkro solves that problem. All right.

Well, that's assuming that we're on your side in that scenario. Maybe you're dangerously criminal. I don't need you on my side, Sean. You've got me anyway. Yes. This is turning into a buddy cop drama. I know, I know. If you could just...

Veltro the prisoners. Quickly, Lisa. All right. That's a good place to stop the baroncle round. It is time now for the firing line. In my hand, I have a list of questions on Velcro versus Laces, brought to you by not committing to Velcro or Laces, the classic flip-flop.

Because flip-flops are shoes that don't require Velcro or laces. U-lace.com says in Elizabeth. Three thin times, shoelaces were a status symbol with the rich having laces made of ribbon, while the poor had laces made of what? Sean? Thrift and hard work. Two points. Lisa Baker. Mr. Noodles.

Mr. Noodles is as good a guess as any. Pretty close. The actual answer was rawhide. Raw hide. What is the name of the Nike line of shoes that has both laces and Velcro? Sean? Rippin' rope.

I like rip and rope. That's two points. They're actually called Nike Easy Ons. I don't know. That's weird because I used to spray my feet with Easy Off. The inventor of Velcro, So George de Mastral came up with the idea when he noticed what while hunting in Switzerland?

Lisa. One bunny stuck to the tail end of another bunny. Good guess. Sean Cullen? The Swiss were very clingy. Ah! Incorrect. That's like...

Suit. He discovered, well, he didn't discover, he invented it. Velcro when he noticed that burrs were sticking to his clothes. Hmm. He was the first one to notice. Yep. Everyone's like, get a load of Burr boy. That's where the burberry coat was invented.

Time Magazine says the word Velcro combines the syllables, Vell, and they're right, meaning Velfit, and crow meaning what? Lisa. I believe it comes from the Latin meaning khr...

It's weird that the ancient Romans had a word for the sound Velcro makes but did not have Velcro itself. Oh, this is where you draw the line, isn't it sharp? I draw no lines. I paint pictures.

Sean Cullen? I actually know that this is untrue. Vell and Velvet Crow. It's actually, it was based on an encounter between an old German man who was curious of a blackbird. And he said, Val Crow?

That is a good answer. Three points. I like it better than the original. It's a combination between vel meaning velvet and crow, meaning crochet. Velvet crochet. That's the firing line, everybody. All right. We are speeding down the back stretch, and it's almost time for our Northern Arts

and Cultural Center audience to vote. But first, here again, to remind us that he and laces tied the knot long ago. Let's hear again from Sean Cullen. Belcro. On the surface, it is easy and convenient, but what do we sacrifice in the name of convenience? Hmm? Personal accomplishment.

An opportunity to display manual dexterity, a connection with a great and noble tradition stretching back through the generations where we share a quintessential human experience to look up into the eyes of a mother, beaming with pride at your

well, all right, in theory. But, what do we lose? As we surrender to the ease of Velcro, we lose touch with the tactile wonder. The feeling of laces

tightness. in our fingers, restraining our upper foot. Laces are the cursive writing of fasteners. Thank you. Sean Cullen.

Pretty strong. And pretty good. way to get a group of CBC listeners mobilized, as mentioned, cursive writing. Now, here to tell us why she can't stay quiet about her love of Velcro. Let's hear again from Lisa Baker. I just want to say, this is like debating Willy Wonka. I just want to get that out there.

The applications for Velcro are innumerable and honorable. almost always much more practical. Imagine if everything that currently used Velcro was suddenly replaced by laces. Like you go to the doctor and they start lacing up the blood pressure cuff. And what about slip-ons? Sean, are you one of those shoe elitists

that's coming for those two? Are zippers next? I just can't fathom a society that wants to take us back to 1867. What other archaic ideas do you have? Are you also against women getting the vote? Sean. Unbelievable that in...

Just one woman. It's unbelievable that in this day you would support laces and putting women back in the kitchen. A vote for Sean is a vote against the modern woman and this audience is better than that. Thank you, Steve. Lisa, Lisa Baker, yeah, Lisa Baker, on behalf of Velcro and women's rights and a whole bunch of stuff. That really ballooned at the end.

It took a different turn there. I thought. All right, audience, it is up to you to make sense of that and vote by applause. Who enjoyed Lisa's valcrowing about Velcro, Lisa. It's a lot of love. It's a lot of love for Lisa. All right. And who thought Sean put the lace in first place?

Sean Cullen. Very close. It is so close. It is inconclusive. It was too hard fought. It's a tie. Sean and Lisa. Big hand, Sean Cullen and Lisa Baker, everybody.

Everybody. Hey, debaters, listeners. Well, there's no debating it. We'd love it if you could hit the follow button on our podcast. That way, you won't miss an episode. And if you already follow us, thank you. When a disgraced podcaster follows a Marilyn Manchild through an IKEA wardrobe. The wardrobe is a portal?

Oh, man, I told you not to follow me. She stumbles into a once pristine magical kingdom. Now drowning in fast food and vape clouds. They are eating into my margins. Where'd you pick up that fancy business talk? He spent years living in a hollowed out stump. If these two unlikely heroes are ever going to change anything, they'll have to start with their miserable selves.

Stanland, featuring Bobby Moynihan, Reyes Seahorn, John Hamm, John Waters, and more. Subscribe now. Hey, Yellowknife. Are you ready to meet your next pair of debaters? That sounds like a yes. This comedian's favorite mom and pop store was sadly bought out by a parent company. It's Calgary's Brittany Lysing.

Brittany Lysing. Back again for more. Hello, Steve. Hi, welcome back, Brittany. Thank you for having me. And this comic watched a prize fighter retire on YouTube because he's a fan of unboxing videos. It's Winnipeg's Chad Anderson.

Chad. Good evening, Steve. Welcome back, my friend. Thank you for having me. All right, debaters. Your topic is one that, we hope, suits you. Work dress codes. Are they important?

Not to this crowd. But maybe to some others listening out there that will hear it at a future date, it might be. Those who are in the audience here can see that I'm dressed for work in a blazer, some dressy pants, button-down-collared shirt, But for those of you listening at home, I could be wearing anything. So let your imagination go wild.

You want me to be in a full suit and tie? Sure. I'm in a full suit and tie. You want me to be in a suit of armor? Bam! I'm a brave knight. With a suit of armor I got from the Black Knight bar last night. You want me in my birthday suit? I'm sorry, but I'm going to have to call HR. Now it's time for a debate that is up to call.

So, whereas it sets a company standard that can improve brand identity, first impressions, and even safety, be it resolved that dress codes at work are important. Chad, you're arguing for this, please, my friend. You have two minutes, starting now, Chad Anderson. Are dress codes in the workplace important? I don't know. Is it important for you to see your boss's hairy crack at 8am on a Monday because there's no dress code? code? Do you want Jim from accounting to be able to wear his politically charged, often line

crossing novelty t-shirts every single day? We all know he voted conservative. Why does he need so many t-shirts to prove it? Would you like it if your contractor showed up in flip-flops short shorts he has no business wearing and a muscle shirt that only accentuates his hairy beer belly? No! Every workplace needs to have some sort of dress code to prevent these types of things from happening, because if Erica from marketing sees Jim's favorite Trump shirt in the office, it's doomed. Even construction sites have a dress code. If they didn't, our already crumbling health care system would be pushed beyond its limit. Emergency rooms everywhere would be littered with monster energy drink cans from all the Kyle's and Corrie's waiting to have their toes reattached.

Even drywallers have a dress code, albeit not a great one, but they have one. It consists of a novelty beer shirt that reeks of booze, gray sweatpants that might disintegrate at any moment, D.C. skate shoes, a dart in the mouth, and a look in their eyes that lets you know, you're not safe. The workplace dress code is there to protect us. It protects us from each other, but most importantly, it protects us from ourselves. Thank you. Yeah.

Chad Anderson. Now, here to crack the code on why dress codes are the worst, as far as she's concerned. Let's hear from Brittany Lising. What is a dress code really? I think it's a mission statement from the company that says, Hey, we don't think you're smart enough to pick your own pants out. Call me crazy, but if you can't trust your employees to dress themselves, perhaps you have bigger problems. This is Jerry. He's in charge of your pensions. Also, if not enforced, he wears a who farted t-shirt.

And tight bicycle shorts with juicy written across the backside. Hey, what say maybe we don't? little jair bear take care of people's money anymore. Instead of making pleaded pants a company-wide policy. Dress codes are for the sheep of the world. You know what they say? All the best ideas always come from a group of people who think, act, and dress the same. No, wait, that was the Heaven's Gate cult that said that. And the cast from mean girls. Dress codes are playing to the lowest common denominator. They're for the what-ifers of the world. What if front desk Brenda does not wear a company-approved blouse to answer all your Corrie's cabinet and kitchen questions?

Will the customers start to see through the cracks? Not quite the tight ship after all, Corey. I'm taking my business elsewhere. How about grow up, dorks? Forgive me for holding humanity to such a high standard, but I think given the great responsibility of dressing ourselves, Maybe, just maybe, the cream will rise to the top. Thank you, Steve.

Thank you. Brittany Lising does not want work, dress codes. It's time now for the bare-knuckle round. We're debating whether dress codes are important, so hats off to you both. My advice, keep it shorts and sweet. And don't sweater the small stuff. You need to blazer a trail, because this audience won't abide. loughers, or someone who slacks off.

At least that's my overall's impression. It's time to get down to business, professionals. Starting now. Oh, wow, a white lady from Alberta calling people with decency and respect for other sheep. Big surprise. Right? Big surprise! Whoa!

Whoa! Whoa! I have more decency and respect for others. I just don't want to eliminate people with hairy cracks and beer bellies from job sites. They're my target marriage market. We can't get rid of those guys. I'll bring my dad next time. I already been there.

Oh, this. Wow. What a way to find out. Hello, son. I'm just going to go now. Listen, name one place with a dress code that has a chill vibe, you know? Nothing. Like, if you walk up to a restaurant, the doorman's like,

you need a blazer to be in here. I'm like, look, I'm not even wearing pants. I don't know. how a coat's going to help. Tim Horton's has a dress coat, and they seem very chill. They're so chill, in fact, they don't care if you didn't get your Ryan's breakfast box. Just get the hell out of the drive-thru. Look, Brittany holds humanity to a high standard, which is wrong, you guys.

We need to be held to the lowest possible standard. Your dads need to be told not to wear their female box. Investigator shirts every single day. Every day. Oh, that's what FBI stands for. That explains the divorces. That's probably a good place to stop it. We are debating the dress code.

That was the bare knuckle round. It is time now for the firing line in my hand. I have a list of questions about work dress codes brought to you by casual Thursdays. Casual Thursdays. When you're so casual, you don't even work on Fridays. According to Indeed.com, under a casual dress code, employees can wear items like jeans, shorts, sneakers, and t-shirts,

but they cannot wear what? Brittany? A diaper and a baby bonnet. Very specific, pretty. You like what you like, is that's all I'm saying. Chad? Gwyneth Paltrow's Goop Fragrances. Some people think you're making that up.

That's a real thing. People that cannot wear revealing clothing or clothes containing offensive words or images. I would also add neck pillows. You got one. Good for you. You don't have to walk around the airport with it. Driving me crazy. Newsweek reports that in 2021, employees at Hooters complained after the restaurant chain made what change to the dress code.

Brittany? Shirt or shorts, but you can't have both. Like that? One point. Chad? The kitchen staff also now have to wear the shirt and shorts. A lot of burns, Steve. A lot of burns.

words. Yeah. They actually made the shorts shorter, and then Hooters filed for bankruptcy in early 2025. So I guess the shorts were the right length in the first place. And that's the firing line, everybody. Well, it's almost time for our Northern Arts and Cultural Center audience to vote, but first, here again to tell us that she uniformly hates uniforms. It's Britney Licey. thing. Dress codes are about control. When I see a group of people all dressed the same, it makes me very, very, very nervous. I wonder what all those men in matching outfits, marching in unison, legs and arms straight

up in the air are up to. I'm sure it's nothing, carry on. As a woman, up until very recently, dress codes have always been very sexist. Boys, go ahead, pants, tie shirt, perfect. Gingals? Let's see a little leg, but not too much, you flirty little devil. Don't be fooled. Dress codes are not about brand identity or company standards.

They're about drinking the proverbial Kool-Aid baby, and it's to remind you, you work for us, and we wear pink on Wednesdays. Thank you. Wendy Lysing. Good point. Timely, too. Now, here to tell us he's always in the mode for address code. Let's hear again from Chad Anderson.

Listen, we've heard some great arguments here from me tonight. And I'm pretty sure I got this locked up. But just in case some of you are still on the fence, let me make one more argument, okay? You already have to pretend that you didn't hear the inappropriate comments Jim made about which. but now you have to be reminded that he doesn't respect you every time you look at his I Love Boobies t-shirt?

It's not even a clever t-shirt. He could have worn an I Love Hooter's shirt that had a picture of two owls on it that would have been borderline, but fine. The workplace dress coat is there for a reason. It's there, so you aren't constantly staring down the barrel of every moose knuckle and cameltoe in the office. Thank you very much.

Chad Anderson in a closing argument that will send some of our listeners streaming to their local definitions to see what that means. Thank you. All right, audience, and it's time to vote by applause

who thought that Chad was entirely right in this one, Chad Anderson. Okay, all right. Pick it up and he's laying down. And how many of you agreed with Brittany, that every day should be a casual day, Brittany Lysing. Very close.

It's close. Great support on either side. It's a tie. It's inconclusive. Where will you want to wear? Big hit for Chad Anderson and Brittany Lysing, everybody. Well, that's all for this week. I'm Steve Patterson saying no matter how you dress,

I'd like to formally thank you for listening. I'll argue with you again soon, Canada. Good night. The Debaters is created by Richard Seid. This week's episode was produced by Nicole Callender, Chloe Edbrook, Dean Jenkinson, and Graham Clark. With continuity by Graham Clark, Diana Francis, and Gary Jones. Technical production by James Porella and Corey Haberstock. Story editing by Graham Clark.

With special thanks to Katie Ellen Humphreys, David Pride, and Emily Ferrier. Executive producer of CBC Radio Comedy is Lee Pitts. And thanks to everyone at the Northern Arts and Cultural Center in Yelan. knife.