The Debaters - Is 20 Years a long time? And do names need to have meaning?

Episode Date: September 4, 2025

It’s the premiere of our 20th season! So we’re asking: Is 20 years a long time? Then, what’s in a name? We’re deciding if these signifiers need significance.Featuring: Derek Seguin, Lara Rae, Ola Dada, and Wes Borg.

It's finally summertime. I'm Nala Ayyed, host of ideas. These last several months, maybe longer, have tested our Canadian pride. So that's why this summer, we have some special programming lined up for you. We're revisiting conversations with Canadian artists and thought leaders who are moving this country forward. You'll also hear a special series I did where we traveled across the country asking people how to make Canada better. So join me for a special Canadian society. summer on ideas.

This is a CBC podcast. Hey, Canada, are you a fan of comedy? From the home of Fantan Alley in Victoria's historic Chinatown, it's the debater! The debaters where comedians fight with facts and funny. in this audience, it's the winner. Now here's a man whose comedy is always fantastic. Steve Patterson. Hey, thanks Graham Clark.

Hello, Canada. Thank you so much for joining us again. Welcome back to the debaters. It is great to be back here in Victoria, B.C. The capital city of British Columbia for our 20th season. 20 years of making people laugh wherever they are. That's not the official slogan, we're still working on it. Speaking of history, did you know that originally the capital of BC was almost New Westminster instead of Victoria?

I know, right? Back in the 1860s, politicians went back and forth between New West and Victoria to debate. which city should be the capital. For two years, that debate went on. The whole thing ended when New Westminster, MLA, William Franklin, showed up to argue his case drunk. He was so hammered, he read his speech and then read it again, without noticing.

And if the people who make Canadian heritage moments are listening, yes, I would like to play the part of William Franklin. And yes, I am a method actor. Time now to meet two debaters that are almost certainly sober and funny on purpose. This comic once stepped in front of a former prime minister in a clear case of obstruction of Justin. It's Winnipeg's Lara Ray. Lara Ray, there she is. One of our favorites taking her place behind the podium to my left.

And this comedian built a miniature Canadian embassy as the last. addition to his model UN, it's Brasser Quebec's Derek Sagan. Bonjour, my friend. Woo! All right. Welcome, debaters. This is a big one. You two have been debating a long time. You've debated each other before, right?

Well, we're just like 10 minutes ago. And you've actually been friends, good friends, for many years, right? Sure. Yes. All right. Well, I'm glad to hear that your friendship has hit so many important milestones. And speaking of important milestones, this topic is a big one for us. 20 years.

20 years. Is 20 years a long time? Which is a weird question in Victoria. The debaters does turn. 20 this year. That's 20 years of laughs and logic. You might be wondering what to get someone for their 20th anniversary. I looked it up. It's China. So let me be the first to welcome our new 1.4 billion listeners from the People's Republic. So whereas it represents a substantial portion of the average human lifespan in which many things can happen, be it resolved that 20 years

is a long time. Derek, you are arguing for this, please. You have two minutes, starting now. Derek Senga! Okay. Thank you. Thank you, Steve. Listen, 20 year ago, I had two cute little babies.

I now have three soul-sucking money-borrowing, slovenly roommate. Who I love, but, yeah, 20-year, it's a long time. How did this end up being my life? I live with people who steal from me. Speaking of people who steal from me, I was also married 20 years ago. And guess what? I am not anymore.

I know, shocker. And I had no gray hair on my beard. I didn't have this giant bed-end. My forehead didn't start on top of my head. And I could tie my shoe, without making women tennis noises. That all feel like a lifetime ago, because it literally is a lifetime ago,

and for no one more literally than Miss Lara Ray over here. Like my daughter Andy, Lara Ray did not even be born yet 20 year ago. She was living life as a man, who, like Voldemort, shall not be named. And they had a wife, and, and, listen, Lara, having been married, I could think of like seven things I would chop off

to not be married anymore. But then, there was a time I got a phone call, like 12 year ago, and Lara told me that she was actually a gay man and was coming out of the closet. And I was like, okay, can I go back to my kid's birthday party now? And then, a few years later, turned out not to be that, after all. Turns out she was actually a closeted woman. Is that a thing in the closet?

I don't know. Women like closets. I don't know why I'd come out. Anyway, so from married man to gay guy to trans woman, that's a lot. That's like four lifetime in 20 years. Seriously, from being my fishing body to all of a sudden someone who rolls their eyes when I burp.

That's it. Derek, Derek's again. Says 20 years is a long time. I don't know where I thought you were going to go with that, but it wasn't there. Now, here to tell us why she thinks that 20 years is but a blink of an eye.

Let's hear from Lara Ray. 20 years is a long time. Maybe. But I don't think any judge would give me that for taking out my opponent, Derek. Do you? Maybe in Quebec. But I get it a bit.

Derek has been playing the same-size venues for the last 20 years. It must feel interminable. But I have ADHD. I don't notice time passing. Do you know how many VHS tapes I still have? From Blockbuster? I knew I could get gender affirmation surgery at age. surgery at age 30 but I waited until I was 50 that's 20 years does that seem

long not when you smoke as much weed as I do the only time I noticed time passing is when it comes to writing new jokes I know Derek might not relate but in my case I had to I was playing a straight mail comic the biggest part of me my act was now missing. How big you ask? Bigger than Derek. Yeah. That's a weird boast.

It's like me bragging about the Lamborghini I just totaled. Or a SpaceX rocket. You see, I'm not a Luddite. I have asked Jeeves. We have one kid, but I've been doing comedy for 40 years. So I have jokes about her as a baby and as a kid and also as a teenager. And now she's 33. Does that make you think that time has passed, Lara?

No, because I just invented two more kids for her. my act. I still sleep in the waterbed. Thank you. Laura Ray. Laura Ray says 20 years is not a long

time. All right. So the table is set and it's time now for the bare knuckle round. We're debating whether 20 years is a long time. So there's no room for era. There's no room for era as

as you tell your opponent, epochs on you. This one was written for the smart people. You can walk the walk, but can you tick the talk? If not, there's 20 of fish in the sea. Listen everybody, I would like to take you down memory lane for a second. Steve, if you would join me, I remember it was less than 20 year ago that Steve and I embark on a train to Ottawa to take part in this show we'd never heard of

called the debaters. We're like, what is this thing? And we were taking the train because I lost my license. Steve was still afraid to drive in Quebec. But now, not even 20 year later, could we even imagine this show without host Steve Patterson? It was like it would be prehistoric. times. All right, I thought that would be enjoyable to go down memory lane. Steve moved to

Toronto now. That story felt like 20 years. Lara, we've got some more room for you. Yeah, well, here's what I would say. I don't completely disagree. I just think that the last 20 years don't feel like a long time. And let me explain. 20 years ago is 2005. And 25. And 25, Five years ago would be 2000. I just want to show that I'm intelligent. Those numbers check out. So 20 years ago, 2005 YouTube was incorporated, and the Facebook became Facebook.

But 2000, that was before 9-11, before any social media. But 20 years ago, okay, because there was no social... You said my thing was long and it was no social media. Are you allowed to surrender in a debate? I don't know. I don't know what's happening. I have something. Hey, remember 20 year ago you know who was president of the United States?

George W. Bush. Yeah. Remember? A time when we had super smart presidents? Ha! Ha! Ha! Things change.

I don't know if he was that smart. You know what the joke was, laugh. That's what the joke was, laugh. No wonder we never went on that second date. All right. That's the bare knuckle round, everybody. Yeah. It is time now for the firing line in my hand.

I have a list of questions. Brought to you by the number one primetime talk show on CBC television 20 years ago. George Strombolopoulos tonight. That was the number one primetime talk show on CBC television. And not just because it was the only one. But that helped. Forbes says in 20 years, the following things will probably be obsolete.

Eyeglasses, keys, and what else? Lara? Democracy. Yeah. I'll give you the point, but I hope you're wrong. Derek Sagan. I was going to say critical thinking, but that's similar to what Lara said.

So I'm going to go with voicemail? No, back to critical thinking. That was an interesting inner conflict that we all got to hear out. Forbes says in 20 years the following things will be obsolete, eyeglasses, keys, and above-ground power lines. Also, if we're honest, probably Forbes. According to experts, over 20 years, what might grow as much as 40 feet?

Oh, oh. Derek? My toenails, because I can't reach them to cut them anymore. Real gross, Derek. Thanks, buddy. Lara Ray. Donald Trump's nose. Ha!

All right. Audience is giving you two points. Donald Trump is the current president of America. I don't like to say his name, because if you say it three times, he might show up. might show up. According to experts, over 20 years, what might grow as much as 40 feet? A tree.

That was worth the walk to that answer, wasn't it? I can't believe there's experts in that. That looks like it really grew. Britannica Encyclopedia says it's widely believed it took 100,000 men, 20 years. years to do what? Derek. To figure out that when a woman says

it's fine, it's not fine. It's a good answer. Three points. Lara? Ask for directions. I'll give two and a half points for that. These fake points are really adding up. It says it was widely believed

it took 100,000 men 20 years to build the Great Pyramid of Giza. I don't know if someone out there guessed it. I just heard like a yes! Way to go, audience member. That is the firing line, everybody. It is almost time for our McPherson Playhouse audience to vote. But first, here again, to tell us why she thinks the days are long, but the years are short.

Let's hear again from Laura Ray. I think there was one period in my life where I really did do a lot of growth, age zero to 20. I think my ability to choose for myself, which came along and maybe at age five, ruined everything. But if I might be serious for a second, being sober for over 20 years does make time pass more ecologically and serenely when every day and every moment is not filled with your own crap and the drama you voiced on others. Yeah.

Now that 20 years of sobriety, of course, was 30 years ago now. No, I'm kidding. I'm still very sober. although with Derek's cruelty tonight, yeah. I really do feel my surprise it's a little precarious. But don't let that affect your voting.

I'm sure I'll be fine. Merci Bocou. All right. Lara Ray. Lara Ray. Now we're here to tell you, that he sees 20 years being a long time with his 2020 vision. Let's hear again from Derek Sagan.

Hey. Do you know that same-sex marriage was only made legal in Canada 20 year ago? Now ask any married couple, gay or otherwise, who got married in 2005, if 20 years feels like a long time. 20 year ago, Pope John Paul II died. second died. That's four popes ago. That's right, CBC audience at home. That's how long 20 years is. Four popes. Do you know how many video were on YouTube 20 year ago? One. It was me at the zoo. Not me. Not me. That's what the video was called. It was called me at the zoo.

That's literally 14.8 billion videos ago. And I have watched all of them. That's it. Derek's again. Good points there, buddy. All right, McPherson Playhouse. It's time to vote. Who thought that Lara...

Actually, hang on, sorry. I've been told by my producers that we have an important message on this very subject from the creator of the debaters himself, Richard Side! Well, hello. Hello, hello.

Hi, everyone. Richard Side, everybody. Well, thank you. No, seriously. But thank you. Well, but 20 years, that's incredible. You know, when we first put this show together, I heard things like,

It'll never last, you run out of topics. No one will listen. But I said, shut up, voices in my head. And now, 20 years later, I am so impressed with this team who puts the show together every week and the talented comedians who feed this juggernaut and keep it going.

Yeah. And you, mostly you, our audience, who come to the live shows and allow us into your homes, into your cars, into your earbuds. Thank you so much. sincerely and this man Steve Patterson

thank you for being hilarious and thank you for not abandoning us for our career in the States 20 years does feel like

ages ago but you know what it's gone by in the blink of an eye so I hope that helps out with the vote

long-lived CBC Richard Cide everybody our creator now McPherson Playhouse it's really time to vote who thought that Lara's argument

against 20 years being a long time was so fun that time really flew by Laura Ray okay okay and who thought Derek's two-decade Diat tribe did the job, Derek Sagan.

All right. The audience is spoken. It's close. It's well fought. But the winner is Derek Sagan. 20 years is a long time. Big hand for Derek Sagan and Laura Rui, everybody. Hey, debaters, listeners.

Well, there's no debating it. We'd love it if you could hit the fall. follow button on our podcast. That way you won't miss an episode. And if you already follow us, thank you. I'm Nala Ayyad, host of ideas. And I'm beyond proud to let you know that ideas will soon be turning 60 years old. Not the podcast, of course, but ideas the program and our deep roots at CBC Radio. So to celebrate a little early, we're spotlighting some of the most brilliant thinkers of our time by revisiting your favorite Massey speakers. So join me this summer on ideas and help celebrate our 60th birthday. Victoria, I just got one question for you. Are you ready

to meet your next pair of debaters? Listen to that crowd, Canada. This comedian sometimes says Ola, using his phone's Dada. It's Vancouver's Ola Dada. Ola Dada, everybody. How's it going, Steve? Hey, brother. Welcome back. Yeah, it's nice to be back. And this comic makes way for his self-driving fruit dispenser to avoid upsetting the apple cart. It's Victoria's Wes Borg.

Come on out, Wes. There he is. Wes taking his place to my left. Hello, good sir. How are you? All right, debaters, your topic is one that will have you naming names. Should every name have a meaning? I'll let our debaters try to make a name for themselves shortly.

But first, this seems like a good time to point out that my full name is Stephen. I know I've blown some of your minds with that tidbit. There's not only a meaning behind my name, but meaning can be found in how my name is said, especially when I was growing up. If everything was good, my parents called me Steve. If I was in trouble, it was Stephen. And it's spelled with a pH, which makes no sense at all. because pH doesn't make a V sound.

It's probably just a vase they were going through. Anyway. Now, it's so stupid. Now it's time for a debate that will be too funny to name. So, whereas it can impact our identity, offer a cultural or historical connection, and influence how we experience the world, be it resolved,

there should always be a meaning behind a name. Ola, you are arguing. for this please. You have two minutes starting now. Oladada! Yes. Thank you, Steve. I think that name should always have meanings because it gives us history. It tells us where we come from.

And I can tell what my parents were going through based on the names that they gave their kids. Because my full name is Olaoomi, Samuel Mubarakdada. My sister's name is Abiola Deborah Dada. And for some reason, my little brother's name is Nathan. So let's break this down for a second. The first two names, you can tell my parents, we're very eager to start parenting.

And by the third name and the third kid, they had retired from parenting. You know, the names really tell you what's going on. The meaning behind my sister's name, it means born into wealth and honor. My name is Alawi me, which means I want wealth. Funny way to find out your parents were broke

when they had you. And Nathan, it means gift from God, which is a funny way to also find out that they had no idea he was showing up. If names needed no meanings, you wouldn't have any nicknames. Because right now, every time I go back to visit my family, my mom calls me Mr. Funny Mom. Or the ha-ha conno-so. The name tells you a lot about a person before you meet the person. And it also affects your life as you go around. because I used to work at a bank as a financial advisor,

and I would send emails to all my clients, and I would never get a response. To one day I sat down and thought to myself, if I received an email from a person I wasn't expecting, right? You got an email saying, allow me, tell me more back that I at a bank that I cannot say.com. I probably didn't even open that also. I'm like, nice try you Nigerian prints, nice try.

Thank you. Alla, Dada, ladies and gentlemen. Now, to tell us that a rose by any other name would smell as sweet as a person named rose, let's hear from West Borg. Thank you. Thank you very much. I don't know much, but I do know that most of the things I think I know are completely wrong. Now, one thing I think I know is that when a baby is born,

their name should be meaningless. Burdening an innocent baby with a meaningful name is unfair. You know, there's probably a lot of stupid kids out there whose parents named them Leonardo. It just adds to the disappointment. And, you know, there's probably some, you know, mildly intelligent Steve Patterson's out there somewhere. Statistically, there should it be at least one, and, you know, we both, yeah.

So imagine the expectations forced on every boy whose last name is the third. Having a meaningful name might be fine for the max powers out there, but what about the children of parents who didn't think things through? Kids I call the tragically hilarious. If your last name is Dover, don't name your son, Ben. How can little Ivana ask the teacher to go to the bathroom when her last name is Tinkle? It's always the children who suffer. You know, if I had to live up to. the perceived meaning of my last name, Borg?

Well, I would have to be an alien half-robot and a rubber onesie with a cable coming out of the back of my head telling everybody how futile resistance is. And now, my parents, my first name, Wesley, just doubles down on the humiliation. But as embarrassing as that is, I was adopted, And before I was adopted and given the name, Wesleyborg, my name, I, is Randy Johnson.

I would have been immediately sent off to the Pornstar factory. And that sounds exhausting. In conclusion, assuming that a name has to have a meaning is biased, unfair, and cruel. And you know who agrees with me? Every single Karen. Thank you. Yeah.

West Borg getting the crowd behind him here. All right, Tobaters. It's time now for the bare knuckle round. We're debating whether names need meanings, so I'll be frank. To avoid getting the Nicole shoulder from the audience, be sure to have them Gideon with laughter. It's almost time to start airing your beefs. So, Isabella, ready to ring?

Yes, it is. Now. Ola, I noticed that you said that your name means, give me wealth. Yes. Well, stand-up's a great career for that. You also said, if names don't have meaning, then nicknames wouldn't exist. But I think actually, nicknames, well, they do exist. And they should have meaning, because then the nickname is based on what you do

rather than what your parents expected from you. So what's your nickname, Wes? I don't want to talk about it. Yeah, that's what I thought. Okay, all right. That's the bare knuckle round. It is. Time now for the firing line in my hand.

I have a list of questions on name meanings, brought to you by the biggest name in show business. Zach Supercalifragilistic Expegalophonikis. According to Thebump.com, the names Oscar, Liam, and Caden all have the meaning what? They all mean... nothing to me. Well, I can't

argue with that. It's personal. One point. Ola. Probably means it's probably a white guy's name. That's pretty good guess. It actually means warrior would also have accepted Mario Brothers character

Wario. In 2020, Elon Musk gave his newborn son the controversial name X-Ash-A-12, which means what? Wes. Please adopt me. Listen to that. Three points. X-ash-A-12 is a combination of X, the unknown variable, the elvish spelling of AI, and a high-speed aircraft.

But you knew that. British Columbia can reject a newborn's name if it uses numbers or symbols, if it combines more than two surnames together, or if it is what? Hola. Not gluten-free, free razor, non-GMO. That.

Three points. Three points. Wes. Stupid? The actual answer is if it's potentially embarrassing for the child, so yes, Wes, yes, stupid. And that is the firing line, everybody. It is almost that magical time when our fabulous McPherson Playhouse audience places their votes. But first, here again to remind us that it should be illegal to have a name with a meaning.

Let's hear again from West Borg. Ah, thank you. Requiring meaning behind a person's name is meaningless. Some names are cool, but for every Remington steel, there's going to be a hairy behind. So any future parents out there, please name your child something,

ridiculous. So your child can define their name and not the other way around. Think of Rudolf Diesel, Jules Leotard, Henry Heimlich, and the Jukuzzi brothers. They're all real and they're named after what they did and not where they came from. In the words of the great Victorian plumber and inventor of the floating ballcock, a name shouldn't define a person. A person should define a And that brilliant plumber was named Charles Crapper. Thank you. Wes Borg says don't let your name define you.

Now, here to tell us names should have a meaning, and that's the way he's leaning. Let's hear again from Oladada. Thank you. Meaning of names should always have meaning because they strike emotion. Recently, I just got canceled in Nigeria because I wasn't saying my name properly because I wasn't using the right accent, which was kind of confusing for me because I was raised in Canada. So when I say my phone name, I used to say Ola Womi.

You know, I used to say with a Canadian accent, but I was supposed to say Olau Me. Can you imagine us having a conversation right now and I go from my name is Oluwomi to know my name is Olauomi? That is not. That is very disingenuous. You know, it strikes in motion. It brings up conversation, you know, in all. the internet people started running polls for me to change my name because i wasn't say my name properly the options were buried george or clifford for good or bad names should always have

meaning because it sparks conversation and brings us all together my name is oladatta thank you so much for having me steve thank you a lot interesting debate here on whether a name should have a a meaning and it is up to the Victoria audience to decide for us. It's time to vote. By applause, who thought Ola's name game should make him a household name, Ola Dada? A lot of love for Ola. All right. And who thought Wes was right that meaningful names should be put to shame? Wes Borg. The audience has decided and they don't think that names should mean too much. The winner is West Borg, everybody. Big hand for West Borg and Oladatta.

Well, that's all for this week. I'm Steve Patterson saying, whatever your name is, you can always make a name for yourself, even Stephen. I'll argue with you again soon, Canada. Good night. The Debaters is created by Richard Side. This week's episode was produced by Nicole Callender, Chloe Edbrook, Dean Jenkinson, and Graham Clark.

With continuity by Graham Clark, Diana Francis, and Gary Jones. Technical production by James Perela and Kean Dunn. Story editing by Graham Clark. With special thanks to Katie Ellen Humphreys, David Pride, and Emily Ferrier. Executive producer of CBC Radio Comedy is Lee Pitts. And thanks to everyone at the McPherson Playhouse in Victoria. For more CBC podcasts, go to cBC.ca slash podcasts.