The Debrief - Lets Talk Therapy | The Debrief Podcast

Episode Date: May 6, 2024

Welcome back to The Debrief! In this weeks episode unfortunately we are without Katie but thankfully had Archie step in! This week are discussing all things THERAPY, the variations, the taboos and most importantly the benefits of prioritising your mental health. As always don’t forget to email [e-mail] or DM us @the.debriefpodcast with any debriefs and dilemmas. Have the most amazing week! Lots of Love,K+K x Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

welcome to the debrief hello guys hi it's gonna be a bit different today it's me but it's not just me so don't panic but we haven't got Peach. I know everyone's really upset. I know. We haven't got Peach, but we have got Art. I'm here. Hello. Hi, darling. How are you feeling? It's my second time on.

I know. I know. Your second time. It was a bit of an impromptu one this morning. Yeah, it was. It was. Well, Peach. I say poor Peach, but not really poor Peach.

But she's in Portugal. So she's absolutely fine. But we've had a bit of trouble with the studio. So it's all fine. We're positive had a bit of trouble with the studio. So it's all fine. We're positive vibes. We're finally in the studio. But because Peach is in the air, I've got Arch. I'm on air instead.

Yeah, exactly. Exactly. So you win some, you lose some. Exactly. How are you feeling, darling? Yeah, good. Good. Nice.

Nice Monday. It is Kitty and I's three year anniversary today. So this is quite a fun little thing to do. It is, isn't it? I know. Three years, guys. Three years of growing strong. Three years.

Three years. Do you know what? Actually, go us. Go us. Like. Who would have? All of the haters back when we first got together. All of the haters back in the day saying she's annoying to you.

I mean. Or saying she's going to break your heart. Yeah, guys, honestly. Look who's heart's in touch. Never did. Okay. Mine is. Heart is stronger than ever. Okay. Yeah. to you i mean she's gonna break your heart yeah guys honestly look who's heart never did okay mine is stronger than ever okay yeah so happy anniversary darling anniversary i know but guys it's may and we're gonna do a really interesting episode today at summer yeah summer's coming but that's what i was saying actually like kind of the host here don't you worry it's fine because

it's may we are doing a subject that's all to do with the month of may which is about mental health and may also focuses on counseling and therapy and we thought it was really interesting that we should touch on this today and i think it's even more interesting that we have the male perspective on the pod the debrief is all about debriefing although we are so many girly supporters we aren't just girlies and the debrief is to debrief with everyone and that means men as well so we are grateful to have you here oh exciting yeah are you nervous not as nervous as i was last time no and i'm excited it's a good topic yeah it's a really good topic. It's something I'm interested in, yeah. Okay, so should we get into it? Let's go. Tell me your mantra, bitch. My mantra for this week is, it's all going to be worth it.

Lovely. Nice. I really like that. I've got an exam. Yes, you do. In a few days. Yeah, on Wednesday. Two days time, everyone.

And most of you probably won't know is I don't actually like my uni degree. Yeah. It's not for me and i would prefer to be doing something else however we're doing it and it's all going to be worth it it's good so yeah the limited revision that i have done will hopefully help suffice yes it's all worth it are you talking about the last two years or are you talking about the revision what's all worth it bit of both okay probably not doing the degree doing good okay applying myself in a way that i am not necessarily used to yeah yeah okay fine

i'll tell mine thank you for asking actually you're getting the swing of this should we live it this will be almost yeah so my match this week is i deserve great things and i will achieve great things damn right damn bloody right arch damn fucking right i think there's been so many ups and downs these last few weeks lots of ups don't get me wrong lots of lots of ups i had a really really fun week last week where I had a big audition and it was like a full day like workshop kind of thing which I really enjoyed that's always where you feel your best you know when you fully get to be in the building and then there are also some lows and that's life and I think just reminding yourself as you're

saying you know everything's worth it everything works out I do deserve great things not just because I believe in myself but because I'm working hard no so you have to experience the lows yeah to feel the highs absolutely yes you definitely do you tell me what your song of the week is and you will have to sing it if you're you will have to sing your song i've changed my song choice my song of the week was and i'm surprised this hasn't been, you guys haven't used these guys more. Jungle, All of the Time. Oh, I love the time. Oh, love the time.

Yeah, good song. We're actually going to a Jungle concert. Love them. I think they'll be one of my favourite bands. And I knew them before they got big. I'm saying that someone at school, Tom Rock, told me about Jungle. Oh, all right, big dog. And ever since then, I've been on there.

Okay, so you're a bit of a B-not. Yeah, beat that. Yeah, beat that. What's your song? My song's fucking brilliant, actually. So, think about things. I met you. How you feel about me?

Oh, okay. Yeah, you know the one. The Eurovision one. The Eurovision one, yeah. Oh, my God. I wasn't with you at the start. I know, I know. The eyes, I was like,

oh, it's your mind-fucking podcast, you will know the song again. It's like, it's the one that goes like, I never forget. I know you, yeah. I was bound together forever. I will never let you go. And then they do the dance.

Yeah, it's such a good one. It's a really good one. I remembered it the other day. I was like on a hot girl walk and I was like, shit, remember that Eurovision song? Now, I'm going to try and say, I'm going to spell their name out. Who sang this or the band. Oh, yes. D-A-O-I is the first.

D-A-O-I. And then F-R-E-Y-R. D-A-O-I-J? Dower Freya? Freya? Freya? Freya? Freya?

Freya? Freya? Freya? All right, my love. They're from Gloucester. But whatever they are, however you pronounce their name, fabulous song.

A record. A record. A recommendation. for this week. So we've got this new cafe coming up, which is quite close to us, called Clubhouse in Putney. Every single time we walk past, I'm like, I can't wait for it to open. It's right on the river, everyone. Gorgeous.

So if you kind of like come off the Putney Bridge, cross the river, it's kind of near down there. And it's gorgeous. Great views, nice walk, nice little cre cross the river. It's kind of near down there. And it's gorgeous. Great views. Nice walk. Nice little creps next door. It's going to be dangerous. Yeah, I know.

I think it's going to get me into cycling. And I don't know how you're going to feel about me in Lycra. Yeah, I won't feel good about it, actually. Yeah, the bulging. I'm not a Lycra. Oh, yeah. Thanks. Yeah, I'm not really a Lycra woman.

So I'm not sure you should be a Lycra man because we're three years going strong and we don't want to bring Lycra into the mix. It's not a vibe. I think it could work. Maybe. Look, no hate on the Lycra people, but I'm personally, I just don't like the bulge. One day you'll see it.

Oh, it's quite hot, actually. That's quite sexy. Really? Okay, now you like it. Really, do you do you think yeah okay well we can give it a go yeah maybe let's debrief okay so this week as i said we're going to talk about all about counseling and on mental health surrounding therapy i think it's so important to talk about i think it's a subject that I'm shameful to say that we haven't really touched on. And it's been a year into the podcast. During this episode, we're going to talk about our own experiences, other people's experiences and thoughts and questions about therapy. But before we go any further, I'm going to define this as more of counselling because therapy can also be physical. But we're going to talk about counselling, which is more emotional and mental. Yes, yes, exactly. So we're going to talk about counselling

and the definition is the provision of professional assistance and guidance in resolving personal or psychological problems. I don't like the word problems, although that was the definition. I don't like that. I think maybe you could say worries or concerns or potentially I don't know what is it you don't like about problems I don't like that word problems because I think it makes it sound as a negative and I don't think having things to sort out is such a negative thing that you should a connotation I think counselling is such a great platform to help individuals that I think saying problems is almost like, oh, you've got an issue you need to do. And I'm like, yeah, I don't think that's it. It could be sometimes. And look, this is my opinion.

You know, this, the expert at the end of the day, that was a definition. So the experts could say, well, you're wrong. But in my mind, I'm like, I don't like that word. Subjective. Yeah. Yeah, it is, isn't it? Yeah. Okay. So the first thing we're going to talk about is our own experiences and our own personal thoughts on counseling okay and before we get any further i would want to see from a male point of view what do you feel about counseling in general maybe friends that you know have had it family potentially what are your thoughts about it yeah so So I've come from an upbringing where therapy has been utilised a lot, I think. I myself went to therapy in a family setting as well as individual. I think therapy is a brilliant tool.

Yeah. And it's a method. I mean, there are so many different things that work for people. It's the same thing as like the way you learn. Are you a visual learner? Are you active? Yeah. Like all of those things. So when you're coming at the issues that you can find within your mental health, there's going to be different methods that work for you. And I think therapy is probably the most common one that works for most people, but it doesn't work for everyone. So I will preface with that. But I do think in the situations that i've had i went through doing tbt so it's like cognitive behavioral therapy can you describe what that is yeah so it's people who don't know people who felt as if or as usual people

with td or with a few a bit of anxiety and all that it's behavioral methods so it's ways to access different coping mechanisms in a sense so that you can kind of offset how you're feeling and understand the roots and remember different methods that make you feel better. Oh, how interesting. However, this one, I was much younger. And I think in hindsight, I probably wasn't actually in need of that help. It was probably more of a cry for help makes it sound too deep. It wasn't a cry for help, but it was a situational thing. Okay.

But I do know it works for a lot of people. Anyway, yeah, help but it was a situational thing okay but i do know it works for a lot of people anyway yeah i think therapy is a really good thing i think it's really interesting from a male perspective i think i was i saw some statistic a couple of days ago that only 36 percent of nhs therapy referrals are male which i mean there's loads of things you can unpick with that is it that they just aren't going to see the nhs for help and they're not getting with with referred or is it seen that women do better with therapy yeah what do you think would you say i think it's a really interesting the first thing you said really struck me which you said i come from a background we talk about counseling therapy

almost a lot of people in your family have gone through it my mom's a drama therapist your mom's a drama therapist fantastic i mean's a drama therapist. Fantastic. I mean, there is a point and there is a plan we've had to bring your mum onto the podcast. She's a drama therapist. Good luck. She'll get her boobs done.

She's a drama therapist. I think that'd be really interesting insight as well. But my point was that I come from a background of I knew nothing about therapy. And quite frankly my mum and I have had lots of conversations about the fact that we have learned a lot at the age of what 21 I am now and my mum almost about to turn 60 sorry mum sorry mum young at heart um

we have both said to each other you have taught us a lot and growing up i didn't really know i don't think i knew anyone who went to counseling or therapy it wasn't really spoken about i know for a fact my parents haven't experienced it my sister and i and i believe i was actually the first one too my experience with but but to do with the female thing i think it's it's a female attribute anyway to be a more emotional not that i'm saying counseling can be an emotional exploration but in some ways it can you know because you will be vulnerable you will really open that heart and sometimes be very vulnerable in your feelings and and perhaps what you're saying about yourself i think men can are more internal look i'm not a man so i can't talk on the behalf of men you can absolutely interrupt me at any time but i think women are more likely to go to

see someone to talk about something because i think they're willing to be vulnerable yeah i yeah i think in my opinion i think uh women in general people who identify as women, have the comfort in being vulnerable. They're more comfortable in that position. They are more comfortable to be able to explore their feelings. And that might be due to societal expectations, all of that stuff. There's loads of research on this. And in the opposite with men, it's more of a fact of men are still have like we're we're human beings yeah we all have the same emotions we'll all feel things on a spectrum but it's it's more maybe that

sense of being able to feel comfortable expressing those feelings yeah to feel comfortable to address that i'm maybe i'm feeling emotional and all that like um as a male so i think that's the main thing i don't think there's much differentiation between the emotional capacity of men and females i think it's the actual societal expectation of who can come across as emotional yeah and also it can go in the other way for for women like again you can interrupt me here but i can imagine some women like i do not feel this kind of emotion like like i'm i feel very like internal with my emotions too yeah i think women are expected to be emotional yeah exactly you know

i think the the stories of women who haven't been you know that famous story of the the woman who was accused of hurting her child and in fact the child was taken by it was it was an australian story a true story this woman gave birth to a little baby and it was a tragic story and the baby was taken from the camp and a dingo one of those big dogs took the baby oh my god it was awful now she was accused of hurting the baby because she wasn't emotional they said you know women are emotional yeah and she you know it was a whole big ordeal but besides that i think women are expected to be emotional i think because of you're gonna you know but because of periods because of things like that it's like women you know women exactly and look i'm a great advocate of an emotional woman you know if anyone needs

an emotional woman come to me i'll cry any you know i love a bit of a cry i love a tantrum like all of them but you know it's don't laugh too much i'm laughing I'm like, I'm going to, all of them. But, you know, it's don't laugh too much. I'm laughing nervously. No. But I think with my, my own personal experience was very good. I think I first experienced counselling when I was about 14, I would say. Okay. Yeah. And I was the first of my close internal family.

I'm not talking about Estanaen i'm saying the four of us my sister my mom and my dad to experience it it was very interesting i was very on the back foot i think i was a bit nervous i i'd never really because my family it wasn't spoken about i think i i felt that a problem actually going back to the word at the start i was thinking okay that maybe there's something a problem when in reality i was a hormonal teenager who had lots of things going on and lots of dramas at school and my parents just wanted an outlet to help me chat to someone and not you know sugarcoat things where you have to with your parents of course you do and you have to with your friends and whereas sometimes that do. And you have to with your friends. And whereas sometimes that neutral platform

could really just make you open up. And I did. I didn't see her for long. I'd say maybe a few months. I can't really remember four or five months, maybe max. But the experience I felt, I had a woman, which I think really helped. I don't think I would have opened up to a man,

which is interesting. But I might say the same. Yeah, yeah. Like it's always interrupted. No, no, no, interrupt no no no the kind of maternal aspect that I think again what we're going back to how you feel maybe more comfortable with speaking to a female I remember my one was a female oh interesting it might have been some kind of I was on I was under the age of whatever I was I think I was young I was maybe like 11 12 and i would have probably not wanted to speak to a man because i was like oh no so it's the kind of i said maternal because it's like

that kind of a a woman similar to a mother's age um but i imagine your mom is so open about mental health and especially going to talk to people, therapy, counselling. So I thought, I bet from a young person's point of view, you categorise when you're small, don't you? You say, well, all women know what mental health is and all women are supportive of it, you know. So I'm sure in your mind you expected it. Yeah.

Okay, so the girls very kindly asked the debrief yeah on your socials for some um polls about their people's experiences with therapy and mental health and they asked how many of the people um went to therapy themselves and it's quite interesting i think um what you guys found was 95 percent of people said that they have and they really enjoyed their experiences with it. Wow. And only 5% of the people said that they didn't have a good experience with it or they did not go.

Yeah, I think that is mad, first of all. That's a lot. That's a very high number. That is huge. And look, you know, Turo and Horn's here, one day we'll have our own talk show. But we're still a growing podcast.

Yeah. And for that amount of people who are following us, know we've got a few thousand now i'd say that are following us and 95 of those people have said yeah i've gone to therapy i've experienced counseling i'm like wow personally if i had to guess i would have said 50 50 i wouldn't have said that high i'm considering the demographic you're maybe reaching might be different like I know that again going back to the gender equation you had a lot to know such higher percentage of women who are following you than men yeah that's true and maybe in the age bracket as well but it's still such a huge like good on like go therapy yeah I think that is so good especially because I know our demographic is between 18 and

26 that's our biggest platform for reaching to individuals and i know a lot of our viewers are women yeah i would love to know the percentage of men that voted on that i know a lot of the men responded i was one of the voters you were i will admit and look i'm never gonna say any names but i know that a few men responded to questions as well. A lot of men did. Yeah. Which was very interesting. But 95%.

Yeah. 95%. How comforting that. Very comforting. Especially in the world we're living in of talk to someone if you're feeling it. Yeah. And people are. Yeah.

And that's a good thing for people to feel it. Okay. Other people are doing it too. I think it's so generational though. Like I think if you pull out there to 56 year olds that would be so different like i think of my parents the first time my mum ever went to and i hope she's okay with me saying it because i fucking am now for the first time she ever went to counseling i told her to and i booked it for her. Yeah. And it was because she was going through a really difficult time with losing her own mum and navigating her identity,

you know, really, really tough stuff. And I booked her to go see someone and said, I'm doing this. And she did, you know, and I know my dad never has. And I think that's so if we put that pole up against people that age, I think it would be so different, completely different. Yeah. I think also it's a really interesting, well, something to highlight right now

that has also sometimes made me a hesitant to go is the cost. And therapy is an expensive thing. Like it comes with a certain level of privilege to be able to go to therapy and to be able to do that kind of communication and sort your mental health out or to protect self-love in that sense. It comes with privilege and that's really something that... Well, it's not an expectation.

Like it's not a... it's not universal. Exactly. expectation like it's not a it's not universal exactly i mean you can get it on the nhs but it takes like usual i mean love the nhs but it does take months to do that longer yeah it can be a harder process i i also think you know talking about this whole subject in an idle world arsh and i talk about it a lot we talk about cancelling therapy a lot because of i think your family's experience we talk about it and i say if i could if i had the money if i had all the money in the world and this is a question i'm going to ask the debrief listeners as well like wherever you are whatever you're doing right now ask this question to yourself what do you think if you had all the

money in the world and all the access to things as well would one would you get counseling or therapy and two how often would you get it and this is what arch and i always say and my answer to i'm gonna answer it first you'll have to wait my answer is i would do once a month i would do once a month and i think for me personally and I'm not going to say why yet because we've got a great answer to something we're going to touch on later that brings up my whole emotions towards this but once a month for me I'd feel is enough look we're all different we are all different you know I know some people get it weekly some people get it every other day I've no idea yeah but for me personally I think once a month would really make me feel safe, I think.

How about you? I do once a week. Yeah, okay. So I remember I did, when I went to school, we had a really great listener. She wasn't a therapist, she was a listener. And anyone at the school could access her.

You could book her in for free. It was a really good thing my school did. And you got half an hour and it was basically therapy, talking therapy. And I did that once a week and it was a really nice systematic thing of because other than your thoughts and worries that come up during the week it was also really nice to have it became like a progression it was like a you work towards thing how have you gone on with with doing this how has that gone okay should we try and think

and it was like a accountability almost and almost something like if you have an issue during the week it's like okay well i know i've got this on tuesday at this time so i've got that guaranteed it's not like i've got it in three weeks i feel like i'm having a meltdown i don't know what i need to do yeah okay and it was just nice to have that soundboard you know it's a lot of what therapists learn isn't it i think so then why do you feel what would a therapist give you that your relationship can't i think all your friends or me or your parents what what did they give you because what you were saying there i thought i do yeah not to beef i'm just saying i'm sure other people feel and i've got we've got a dilemma that actually i've got two dilemmas today i know you've

got one as well but both men wrote the men, which is interesting. So that's why it's such, everything works out and why it's interesting to have you on here. But one of them does touch on this. What does a therapist give that a relationship can't? I'm not saying,

I think I'm just asking, what do you, what's your personal opinion on that? In my personal opinion, it's very similar. It depends on the healthiness of a relation like our relation was very healthy and that probably does merge the the two in that sense we're also very blessed and privileged that we feel like our mental health is at good pace yeah we both feel very strong we have that so i believe that if one of our mental health was to to deteriorate deteriorate in some

sense or an issue to pop up that could then add a strain on the relationship which you wouldn't want to to to to ruin a relationship whereas if you went to therapist as a neutral non-biased all of those kind of things where you can discuss how you're feeling without it then making i think i know i can understand people thinking i've got bad mental health but i don't want to go to my partner because i don't want that to become their worry and i don't want it to be become an issue within our relationship and maybe for them to feel it's a reflection upon them exactly and then also for uh this is going way back but i've also had situations where a partner an ex-partner has had mental health issues and that can sometimes feel like a pressure on the external person who isn't

feeling those emotions so that kind of separation i'd say is justified yeah and it is it's probably healthy so every relationship is different i'm very very happy and blessed to be able to be with Kit and to have that relationship that we have where we can basically be each other's impartial therapist. But I can't fully understand people wanting external. Completely. And that's what therapists are for. Yeah.

And before we go on, I just wanted to touch on that, you know, the question I put out there was a question. It's not a statement. I think it's very healthy to have look there are things that i would discuss with an external person that i wouldn't want to admit to my boyfriend you know maybe own insecurities or i don't know social pressures you know that unfortunately as much as i love you a man wouldn't understand i'm thinking you don't have i don't know periods or breasts you know you don't have, I don't know, periods or breasts. You know, you can support. Of course you can. And you always do.

But can you understand? You can try. But you can't, you know. So I think going to an external person is so beneficial. It really is. Okay, we're going to go on to the things. We obviously asked the debriefers about their opinions on it. And 95% said that they did go.

And they've given us some reasons why it helped them, which is really, really interesting. So the person who wrote this in actually said that they were fine to have their gender put in. So they are male, sorry. And he said, my counsellor helped me to forgive my younger self for my own mistakes I made.

I'm now much kinder to that younger me oh brilliant i know i will i was like oh it's so emotional i think that's such i think that's like such a great thing oh gosh to learn about yourself you know to be able to talk to someone and oh sorry i thought that was just such a lovely thing to say you know i think we all have like guilt about things that maybe happened when we were younger or things we said but i think for someone to really help you forgive that i mean it's i've heard so many people say it actually including your sister she's said it to me including kendall jenner you know she was like love the debrief girls you're doing so well it's like thanks kj she said it on the kardashians that she said one of the her counsellors things that

coping mechanisms was take a photo of your younger self and look at it can you say those nasty things you're saying to yourself right now to that younger self to that photo can you yeah I doubt it you know and Kendall says that apparently she puts that photo up on her bathroom mirror so every time she goes in there and she sees herself now she also sees the little one you know and I think that's beautiful i think what a positive thing to get out of this and also you have to move on you have to you can remember but you have to forgive yourself you can't always drag yourself down you're never gonna be able to move on if you do so so i think that was lovely one uh do you have any for things that's uh good things so someone has said that it allows time to talk to yourself

which is a nice thing to think about because we all have our internal monologue don't we are a dialogue in our head and i imagine therapy as an adult must feel almost just like a an external dialogue of stream of consciousness isn't it it's like just relieving all of those thoughts and here having someone say that's a natural feeling that's a natural thought you're not thinking obscure things and if you are potentially thinking those obscurities then it would be like okay well then this is the way we can clarify it yeah so that's a nice thing yeah that's lovely and it's really interesting that yeah i've got another one my mum suggested i see someone after i was having frequent panic attacks i really didn't want to go and i was so against it now i'm now i see my counselor every single week i haven't had a single panic attack for three years and i have found ways to manage my anxiety

brilliant i mean can you imagine you know frequently having anxiety attacks and for three years you haven't had one yeah yeah that must that that shows how much you can really benefit from talking to someone and actually the basics of it the basics of opening up is something that's age old you know it's something that should have been done years and years and years ago but all you are doing and all that is happening is someone help you process it but great you've got another one i do i have one more saying it helped me feel empowered and validated in my emotions oh no interesting yeah similar to kind of the conversation we're having earlier about emotional and how you kind of respond to your own emotions and being empowered by that and being validated by that is a really

validated such great work especially empowered as well but validated being like what you are feeling is okay and it's me yeah yeah i think that can sometimes be the scariest thing being like oh i don't really want to admit that to people because if i admit it will they say that's weird or you know someone said my counselor helped me to see i was in a toxic relationship i felt i couldn't leave him after five years but she gave me the strength to realize what i want out of relationship now i'm happily single great brilliant yeah and that just shows that counseling therapy is all about different things you know it's not it's not just about one thing it can be whatever is happening to you and for you and in your life. And everyone goes for different reasons.

Completely. It is not just a one, like the reason for you going to counselling does not define the reason for anyone else going. And if you hear someone says, I'm going to counselling because of this, and you're like, oh, I want to go, but I don't think I've got what they've got, or I don't think I've got the feelings they're having, like, fuck that, go. Like, that's you. I've got what they've got or I don't think I've got the feelings they're having like that like fuck that go like that's you like you go for what you want to do I also think you need to be careful

not you I mean general you need to you need to be careful the reasons well you should never anyway but don't what's the word assume. Don't assume reasons why people are going because people are going through all different things. Cool. So we also have, well, you guys have received some reasons why people haven't been to therapy. Yes. And the people who've answered

and they've never been to a counsellor or they've never explored it. We've got some reasons for that. Yeah. The first one I've got here is the fear of being judged. Oh, yeah. Which I fully get. Yeah, I do that. Not because there is any judgment, it we've got some reasons for that yeah the first one i've got here is the fear of being judged oh yeah which i fully get yeah like not because there is any judgment but i've never felt judgment of oh it's always the feeling of what other people's gonna think what which it always sounds

so silly and like nonsense when you say it out loud and you really think about it but it is just like a it's a guttural feeling yeah yeah it's tough and so that's hard yeah it is really hard and one that i think a lot of people feel you know and i think a lot of reasons why the generation above us and the generation above that didn't go because they were like oh also admitting defeat i think people saw it as i'm going to put put this in the bunny marks, a weakness. I think it is anything but. I think it is strength. I think someone who can stand up and admit they need help is the biggest strength that you can possibly do.

So in no way do I think it's a weakness. But I think that generation saw it as one, which is a shame. But also it wasn't spoken about. So they would feel judged. They would feel nervous about approaching it. Yeah. It's like going to the gym, but for your head. Of course it is. Yeah, it absolutely is. Be that gym lad. Yeah, do it. Do it. Everyone would be going every day then. Well, maybe not every day. Someone said, I'm worried I won't like the person who I talk to. It takes me a long time to trust someone.

So talking to a complete stranger seems very hard to me. That's fair. Yeah, it does seem fair. I was just like, I think it's difficult because I think the best thing with counselling and therapy is you can choose who you want. But I'm sure in order to trust someone, you need to give them a chance.

But that's hard. You can't say to someone, you need to give them a chance. But that's hard. You can't say to someone, trust them. It's like, you know. I think also have the confidence that these are trained professionals. Yes. So they have to have a qualification. They have to have gone through a system of institution where they will be learning.

They will be taking exams. They will be doing dissertations. They will be learning they will be taking exams they will be doing dissertations they will be researching stuff like this so they have to have a level of ability and credibility to their name with this so i fully understand the feeling of wanting to get to know someone but don't ever feel like oh i can't like they are trained to be open and nice and that will be a a part most therapists probably go in because they want to help yes and do remember that it is their legal obligation to stay confidential so that is the something that you can trust you know they cut they cannot be discussing this in any sort yeah they will not they cannot i think it's only if they think it's

a harm to your life completely and that will be at a certain risk level anyway. And look, with everyone listening to this, we want to remind you that we are not therapists ourselves. You know, we cannot give prescriptions. We can't do anything like that. We are not doctors. We haven't studied this. We haven't done the exams.

But we can empathise. And we hope that if you are really struggling and if there's something that you really want to this is your chance to then go talk to someone you know there are loads professionals loads of things out there the the next one was i'd like to see someone but i don't want to commit as in if i see them every week i'd worry i wouldn't know what to say and just make things up do you know what's so interesting this is the one i was going to talk to you about saying this is why i'd see someone every month i've never related more to a comment i was just like i

completely get you this is why i could only do once a month i i could not see someone every week because i'd be like i'd worry i'm wasting someone's time i'd be like okay like what should i say you know oh do you know i had a fight oh about and i'm like you know like so that comment i completely got like i'm i really worried make things up and i the person who wrote this in i responded saying i feel exactly the same so interesting yes yeah i want to reassure that person that that's not weird to feel like that well i feel it might be weird but we both feel it together so that's fine yeah but yeah that's why i'd go once a month so completely get that but my advice to you would be again we're not trained professionals but my advice to you is well don't commit to every

week don't even commit to every second week be up front with that counselor and say look i feel this way i don't want to do every week or second week i kind of want to do it when i feel like it maybe yeah maybe you're in control completely at that point you're a paying customer you are so it's your you're on your but yeah i can i mean i can understand that feeling but i also think that i know a lot of counseling will like the first few weeks will be like unpicking lots of things historically it will be them getting to know you so i wouldn't stress about that too early on but if that is your feeling then yes you're in control this is about you reclaiming your mental health it's not about them claiming your mental health no so you do you and i get you i get you boo so it's fine you know we're in the boat together making things up oh gosh okay so quickly before we're

going on to dilemmas yeah of course we're going to mention where to find counsellors and therapists. It's so important because as we said, we're not. So for you to do so, we're going to talk about a few options. As Archie touched on earlier, there are three options. So if you ask your GP, you will get a referral to a counsellor or to a counsellor on the NHS. I think that's a great option. It's free.

You know, that's very available. Make sure to tap into that. That's very important. Also, you can get therapy apps such as BetterHelp, Talkspace, Sanvello. I haven't heard of that one, but apparently it's very good. And there's a wide range of therapists

to choose from and online easy services. Online services, fantastic, which means you come back from home, just open Zoom. Fantastic. You don't have to to travel you don't have to worry about what you wear or anything like that some even have a camera off which is fantastic if you don't want to be seen better is it better to help better help have a texting service fantastic so you can text your counsellor through the app so it's confidential and all that stuff. But like that's phenomenal. It is phenomenal. Yeah, it's very, very good.

And I think the best thing about these apps is you can choose someone to talk to. So that person who said, oh, I don't know if I trust them. Great. You've got loads of options. You choose who you want to trust. And the last one, if you prefer someone in person as opposed to online, I know I personally would, so this would be an option for me. You can go onto Psychology Today on Google and they will help you find a counsellor in your local area face-to-face.

So there are a few options. There are loads more options. And I know... Quickly jump into speech-talking therapy is not the only option as well on therapy. So I'll rep my mum here. Yeah, go on, Arch. mom here yeah now qualified drama therapist so it's therapy through drama which for some people might think of oh my god that's the worst thing you've ever thought of it's not like us we love it yeah we jump but no it is kind of therapy through dramatic yeah so drama therapy is like therapy through

different um dramatic techniques i think a lot of puppetry, a lot of stuff like that, which you might think, oh gosh, but no, if you get into it, it's good. But on that kind of topic, there's art therapy, there's music therapy, there is dance therapy, movement, like the whole range of things. And also there is also the ability to do different things. I think for both me and you are in a sense therapy is exercises gym is running don't be disheartened thinking oh i only do that that is still claiming that's helping your mental health okay have one part of your life where you give back to yourself okay and if that is

doing therapy or a run or something like that yeah that is for you and because of you so completely do that yeah fantastic thank you archie important. It is really important because I think before I met you, met your mum, I'd never heard of any other therapy other than verbal. So your mum introducing us to different forms of therapy, and she really has talked us through the process because I said, so what do you actually do? You know, what do you do during a session? Of course, she's never disclosed what she says or her client says but the premise of the situation and it's great so this week we've had the debriefers write in a lot about

their own counsellors and therapy experiences so hey girls male listener here really need your support and advice as i need to debrief with you my ex-boyfriend actually got me into the podcast fantastic fantastic sorry he's your, but he had good taste. He had good taste. Okay. First, please, can you not judge as I'm worried people will think badly of me? Of course not. Of course, not a chance.

So I started seeing a counsellor about a year and a half ago. At the start, I was very hesitant, but now I wouldn't know what I'd do without him. Yes, dot, dot, dot, him. For context, when I first met him, my toxic brain was glad he wasn't my usual type and therefore I won't fall in love with him. But as time's gone on, I feel like I'm treating him almost as my boyfriend,

solving my problems, listening to me, defends me and is always supportive. Girls, I am in love. I can't stop thinking about him and the more emotionally vulnerable I get, the more I want to rip his clothes off. We live in the same borough in London, so I see him a lot, local pubs, cafes, and even at the gym. Whenever he sees me, he always comes over and talks and I do feel it's flirty, maybe I'm delusional. He holds eye contact just a little too long and has even said to me if things were different,

then stopped himself. So basically what I'm asking is what should I do? I think I'm in love with him and if I go for it and he wants it too, then I'd be so happy. But if I do go for it and he isn't into it, then it risks me losing such a good relationship I've built with my therapist. What should I do?

Please help and please don't judge. Thanks. He's talking about he fancies his therapist. Yes. Oh. i've built with my therapist what should i do please help and please don't judge thanks he's talking about his fancies his therapist yes oh yeah i don't know yeah if you think you're getting vibes you're getting vibes i think so and i also think a therapist if they weren't interested they wouldn't come up to you in public no no no i couldn't i completely agree and i'm kind of on the side of, if you feel there's a vibe, there's a vibe, and you can get another therapist,

but you might not get another whatever his name is, Jeremy. And if Jeremy's kind of into it as well, I get it's hard because it's like, if then I make the move and you're just like, oh, whoa, whoa, whoa, no, then you've lost a good therapist. Get that, completely get that. But you can't carry on with him being your therapist anyway if you're in love with him because yeah because that's not good therapy yeah

you you're just you're you're making a god in your life yes you're idolizing him and you can't idolize him if he's your therapist oh then either way get get rid of him as a therapist and go for the love and get another therapist completely that's what i'm saying yeah 100 i think don't feel guilty about that i can understand it's why we spoke on it earlier i can understand why you'd feel boyfriend vibes because he listens to you he defends you you know he's there he's present get that completely got that but you can't have him as a therapist anyway if you're in love with him you just can't you categorically can't you can't be in love with the therapist and i hate to be a bit of devil's advocate here yeah he is also paid to give you the advice yes yes so don't get misunderstood

there that's his his job to support you and to give you the advice and to defend you yes which isn't me saying that he might be into you because he probably is you sound amazing but it could be also his job yes ignore actually yeah no no it's good to get the male perspective it is it is but i'm saying get it now finish the therapy stop that now straight away find your new therapist and get your thing going with him yeah good luck okay Okay. Therapy role play. Yeah. Yeah. I love it. Anniversary's in it. Yeah, we can give it a go.

Sorry, Eileen. Sorry, my mum. Okay, right. We're going to go on to X. Okay. So you are going to start. I'm going to ping pong you. You ready?

Lovely. My first ick is when people say, oh, I'm so depressed. Oh, I have really bad anxiety disorder. There is differences in my opinion. You can feel anxious, but having anxiety as an anxiety disorder is very different. It's almost like a chronic illness. It's something that people really suffer with. But having anxiety as an anxiety disorder is very different. It's almost like a chronic illness. It's something that people really suffer with.

Everyone, I think, feels anxious. It's a mixture of nerves. It's a mixture of physical responses. I think everyone feels anxious about things, but having anxiety is a very different thing. And that sometimes grates on me, especially I'm really depressed or I've actually got three aches. I'm going to add into this. And when people say, kill me now,

I don't like that. I hate when people say that. I understand it's colloquial. I understand all of that, but I really think in the world that we're living in, just do not say it. Be careful. Be really careful what you say. That could be so triggering to someone. Oh, that was crap.

No, you can't. No no it's received it's received it's received it's my podcast okay mine was when oh that therapy counseling whatever you call it is a taboo subject oh have you heard have you heard suzy gets therapy oh oh really what's it why are you why are you doing that why are you it's like saying bloody Jemima's just gone to the gym. It's like saying Terry's gone to a boxing class. What's the issue? It really pisses me off because also like it's a secret. It's a big piece of gossip on the newspaper.

I'm like, who gives a shit? I really couldn't care less. Why is it any of my business if Terry goes to counselling? Who cares? Good on him. Could you transfer me so I could? Do you know what I mean? Like, good on him.

I'm not bothered in the slightest. Oh, she's got to join in. Questions? Your serious question. I'm serious. So hit me with the serious. My serious is, do you think therapy works for everyone? Hmm.

Very good question. Look, I'm not the Oracle at Delphi. Educate yourself, darling. Educate yourself and you'll know. I am not the oracle, so I can't say, but on my fun, loving, cheeky podcast, I am. So I'm going to say, does therapy work for everyone? I think it's good for finding solutions yeah i think it's it's a general assumption to make that every therapist is good for you i don't think so because i think some therapists as we touched on earlier work in different ways yeah so some could be dance some could be music some are verbal all of that kind of stuff and some definitely would not work for me i know for a fact i think there's no way i'd want to do that you know so i think i think therapy is very beneficial of course it is oh if i have to say an answer does it work for everyone i'm gonna say no yeah i don't think it works for everyone no i can't i don't think i can

yeah say that do you agree yeah it works for a lot yeah but it won't work for everyone nothing works for everyone like no no no no not even gluten guys there are things out there for everyone yeah do you see not even gluten gluten

can't even work for me you know except sourdough except sourdough pizzas yeah okay so my silly question is

would silly silly thank you Archie keeping me accountable would you rather have dance therapy every week yeah now i can't i can't define what dance therapy is but in this little four walls podcast studio dance therapy i'm gonna tell you it's full on like jamming out okay we're not doing creative movement like in drama school arch we're doing like slut drops, like getting the booty out.

Or, and it's just one-on-one. So just you with them. Oh. Yeah. Or singing therapy. Now, I don't even know if this is a thing, but you have to, you can speak, but you have to sing your words like, I just feel this week when like this, but you can't just be like, yeah.

And it was like, you have to be oh like you have to go for it you have to proper sing all your words and it's one-to-one one both one-to-one is a music for the dance yeah okay dance why why because wait oh actually but am i going for therapy yeah you're still doing your therapy and so in in the dance therapy, I'm just dancing? Yeah. Nah, okay, I'll do singing. Because I feel like I do sometimes sing speak with you. Yeah.

Hey! Maybe it was your last girlfriend, because I can't remember that. It was with you, and you know. I think the singing, well, I hate singing in that kind of situation. You've got a lovely voice, Archbold. Thank you, my love. It's okay. But...

Support. The dance. Oh, this is tough. I'm going to go singing because I think I will probably benefit more from actually discussing words for me in my own way than for dancing. Yeah, cool.

Doing slug jobs. Fine. Although I do love doing the worm. You do. So you could, yeah, get some real clarity through that yeah yeah i'm going with sing speak cool yeah yeah what about you i'm exactly the same yeah i'd be so embarrassed but like doing it i would i'd love the attention

not in the slightest it's not making songs guys thank you so much we've got to the end we have got to the end of the podcast arch thank you so much for coming on it's been great having the male perspective and happy monday everyone have a great monday go into the week feeling really clear-headed and make sure if you want to see a therapist go for it this is your sign this is your sign to do it thank you so much darling great to have you on thank you you. Thank you for having me. Happy anniversary. Happy anniversary. See you later, bud. See you later, guys.

Bye. See you next year, probably. Yeah. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. I've got a rebel soul I've got a rebel soul