The Decibel - What’s going on with the detentions at the Canada-U.S. border?

Episode Date: May 6, 2025

The U.S. government is ramping up its efforts to deport immigrants. On Monday, the Trump administration announced a new policy offering anyone illegally in the U.S. $1,000 and a flight to leave the country. And on Sunday, President Donald Trump didn’t commit to upholding the right to due process for citizens and non-citizens alike.Sara Mojtehedzadeh is an investigative reporter with The Globe, and she’s been covering Trump’s crackdown on immigration. She’ll explain the rise in detentions along the Canada–U.S. border, the impact of the Trump administration’s policies on asylum claims, and what it could mean for immigration into Canada.Questions? Comments? Ideas? Email us at [e-mail]

So, in early March, an undocumented mom living in Detroit who was originally from Guatemala was making a Saturday trip to Costco. She was with her two kids, aged one and five, who are U.S. citizens. She plugged Costco into her GPS but didn't realize that it was taking her to her nearest outlet, which was actually in Windsor, Ontario. — That's Sarah Moshdahedzadeh. She's an investigative reporter with The Globe. — So basically by the time she realized the mistake, she was on a one-way toll route to the Canadian border

along the Ambassador Bridge and was unable to turn around. — Because this woman took a wrong turn, she had to re-enter the United States. And this essentially led to the detention of her and her family. And that kind of kicked off the saga of being detained by U.S. border protection after being turned around at the Canadian border

and being held in custody for almost a week. The US government is ramping up its efforts to deport immigrants. On Monday, the Trump administration announced a new policy. It would offer $1,000 and a flight home to anyone who's in the country illegally and chooses to quote, self-deport, end quote. President Trump also recently raised questions

about due process. It means everyone in the United States has access to the legal system. It's protected by the constitution. But on NBC's Meet the Press on Sunday, President Trump was asked if everyone should have due process. He didn't answer directly.

Your secretary of state says everyone who's here, citizens and non-citizens, deserve due process. Do you agree, Mr. President? I don't know. I'm not a lawyer. I don't know. Well, the Fifth Amendment says so much. I don't know.

It seems it might say that, but if you're talking about that then we'd have to have a million or two million or three million trials. We have thousands of people. So today, Sara is on the show to explain the rise in detentions along the Canada-U.S. border, the impact on asylum claims, and what it could mean for immigration into Canada. I'm Maynika Ramen-Wilms and this is The Decibel from the Globe and Mail. Sarah, thank you so much for being here today. Thanks for having me. So we just heard the story of this undocumented mother from Guatemala and her two children who

were detained at the border. What happened to them? So they were held in CBP detention. So this is detention administered by US Customs and Border Protection. They were taken to a office-like building and held in a windowless room according to the mom's lawyer. There was no bathroom on site. They had to ask permission to use the bathroom and be taken to another location. On the first day, they were given one cup of instant noodles for food and some chips

for the kids. There were no diapers on site. And overall, just conditions that their lawyers say was totally inappropriate for anyone, but in particular, children and a family. Yeah, that sounds like really difficult conditions there. Yeah. And so one other wrinkle here was

that her kids are US citizens. The mom was undocumented, but the kids did have citizenship. But she essentially had to choose between being separated from her kids or keeping them with her, but being in detention. So initially, you know, the kids are one years old and five years old. So she decided to keep them with her. Five days into her detention in this sort of office-like building, the kids developed fever and a cough and there was no medication provided. So at that point she did decide to release them

to a family friend on the outside. And the subsequent day she was released, but she now faces deportation. She has a removal hearing in June. Wow. I mean, this is a really intense situation that you just described there for, you know, a wrong turn on the highway to end up in this situation with your two kids.

What did U.S. Customs and Border Protection, so CBP, what did they say about this case? Yeah, so in terms of the length of detention, which was almost one week, which in the past sort of been very atypical for CBP detention. It's typically only supposed to be for 72 hours or less. It's meant to be short-term custody. They said because the mom decided to keep her kids with her rather than separate, that prolonged the period of detention that, you know, typically in the case where there are US citizen children, they would seek a suitable guardian. But the dispute over, I guess, what to do with the kids or not wanting to separate from the kids prolonged the mom's detention.

But overall, what we know is that the policy under the Trump administration is to move towards detention and deportation. And so families, including mixed status families, where, for example, one parent is undocumented and the kids are US citizens, are increasingly finding themselves in a situation where, yes, a wrong turn could land you in prolonged detention and possible deportation from the country. OK, so it sounds like this is part of kind of new policies

that are coming into practice since Trump has come into office. Let's talk about this specific detention center in Detroit and what's happening there. What do we know about this facility and who's being held there? Yeah, give us some details. Yeah, so I first started hearing about this kind

of strange detention facility at the Detroit Windsor Crossing when I started reporting on the implications of Trump's executive orders on immigration for people who are arriving at the Canadian border from the US and returned by Canadian border officials. So for example, an asylum seeker who is trying to make a refugee claim in Canada and has turned around under the terms of this refugee treaty that we have with the US. So these are people in America kind of driving north to the Canadian border.

They're not being allowed into Canada. And so then they'll be in the custody of the US border control. That's exactly it. Yeah. And so what I learned from that talking to lawyers and advocates was that they were seeing people sort of disappear into CBP custody, were unable to contact them, and that the detention facilities didn't seem equipped to deal with, you know, even short-term detention to say nothing of, you know, a week or two weeks, which is what we're seeing now.

So those concerns were also raised with Congresswoman Rashida Tlaib, who then requested a site visit and said that she was taken to facilities at the Port of Detroit that included an office building that has been set up to, you know, to detain people who have been apprehended at the northern border. And that she was told by field officers that over 200 people have been held in these facilities and a lot of concerns around not just the conditions but again the ability to access legal support from within these facilities you know lawyers couldn't even say where their clients were being held and so really just concern about the ability to

access legal support when you're being detained in these conditions. Yeah. And I just want to really understand then, I guess, the shift that has happened since in the last few months since Trump has taken office under the previous administration, under the Biden administration. What would happen if someone, you know, accidentally got to the border like this versus what's happening now?

Yeah. So in January, President Trump issued an executive order that essentially upended a lot of the policies that were in place under the previous administration, under Biden's administration. And one of the most significant changes was ending the policy of essentially releasing people on a discretionary basis to await formal immigration hearings.

So for example, if you were an asylum seeker, typically in the past you would be released to wait for your asylum hearing. That is no longer the case. The policy is to detain. So for example, we know that in October last year, 4,300 people were released on parole from ICE detention. That number plummeted to 25 people across the entire country in March. So the emphasis now is very much on apprehending, detaining, and keeping people in detention.

Wow. And I also wanna just talk about, I guess, the situation of these individuals who do find themselves at the border, because this example off the top, this was an accidental coming up to the border, right? So tell us about those situations where people are actually coming to the Canadian border here. Yeah.

So this is ensnaring lots of different types of people. So you know, typically if you make an accidental turn into Canada, you know, if you're a full US citizen, it's going to be annoying. You're going to have to reenter the country and it's going to take you a few hours and it'll be a pain. But if you are someone with precarious immigration status, this has now taken on a whole new hue really. So this could impact obviously someone who's undocumented. You know, President Trump has placed a big emphasis on removing undocumented people from

the country, but it's also impacting asylum claimants. So I spoke to advocates who have been supporting two men from Benin who have active asylum claims in the US. They're awaiting asylum decisions. They were on their way to work one day and again got ensnared in this tricky exit off the highway in Detroit and ended up on the Ambassador Bridge. They were detained and they were told that they would not be released until their asylum hearing. So that could be a year from now. The system is really backlogged. So people are sort of facing the prospect of extended periods of

detention even if they you know if they're not undocumented they're just waiting to receive an asylum decision. This can also impact people who have temporary protected status so this was a program to provide temporary protection for people from certain countries like Haiti and Venezuela but the Trump administration is trying to essentially get rid of that program. And so again, these are people with precarious immigration status who, again, if you make a wrong turn

or decide that you're going to try and seek asylum in Canada instead and are turned around, you're likely going to find yourself in detention and possibly face deportation. This idea of taking a wrong turn, this is this is kind of a new thought for a lot of people. This accidental situation. Is this common for people to accidentally find themselves at the border? Yeah, this particular accident in Detroit is kind of infamous.

So it's a major highway in Detroit and essentially you can verge left and that will take you into southwest Detroit, which is an area where lots of immigrant communities live and work. Or you can verge right, and that will take you onto this one way toll route into Canada. And so at the Port of Detroit, when Congresswoman Tlaib made her site visit, she was told by field officers

that 90% of the 200 plus people who have been detained there in recent months were accidental crossers. 90% are accidental. Yeah. So most of these detentions are a result of accidents. We suspect that the remaining 10% are likely asylum seekers, but this is just one port of entry, right? The Detroit port of entry.

And we really don't know what is happening Along the other northern ports of entry. Yeah Okay, so after people are detained at this Detroit facility What happens next? We heard the example of the mother and kids off the top is is that kind of typical? well again, it's it's tough to know because lawyers and advocates are really struggling to Contact people and CBP detention It's tough to know because lawyers and advocates are really struggling to contact people in CBP detention.

They're referring to it as sort of secret detention or being disappeared into CBP detention. But we are getting some anecdotal reports from people who their lawyers have been able to connect with them. For example, we've heard about a man who was detained by CBP at the Port of Detroit. He is Venezuelan. He is allegedly a member of a Venezuelan-based gang. He attempted to commit suicide while in CBP custody. He was transferred to hospital and monitored there and then cleared to be released to an

ICE-contracted facility. So he's in immigration detention. What CBP has told me is that of the 200 people at the Port of Detroit detention facilities, around half have been released and half have been sent to immigration detention. But again, we don't know what happens to them from there on in.

But there are certainly concerns that people are being removed from the country without due process. We'll be back in a moment. So Zahra, we've been talking about this one detention facility at Detroit mainly. But how do these detentions fit into the Trump administration's larger crackdown on immigration in the country? Yeah. So in January, the Trump administration issued executive orders essentially mandating

this sweeping crackdown. And this looks like obviously more people being detained. And also the expanded use of something called expedited removal, which is essentially where a low level immigration officer can issue a deportation order. And there are a lot of concerns about the use of this tool because essentially someone is ordered to be deported without ever seeing an immigration judge. Often they will not have access to a lawyer or the opportunity to gather evidence to make a case to legally remain in the country,

for example, to access the asylum system. He also invoked a very old piece of legislation that is essentially a piece of wartime legislation in an effort to remove people who are alleged to be members of Central American or Latin American gangs. Now recently the courts have said you can't do that and they have declared that to be unlawful but it's unclear how the Trump administration will respond to that court ruling. So really just a really expanded emphasis on the use of detention and rapid deportation,

which is raising concerns that people will be removed in error from the country. We've already heard in the media reports of people being accidentally deported to El Salvador to this prison camp. And so, yeah, really concerns about how this is going to play out in practice for people who don't have an opportunity to speak to a lawyer or to even, you know, be heard in front of an immigration judge. And of course, this is all relevant to Canada because we share a border, we share an agreement as well with the US when it comes to asylum seekers. This is called the Safe Third Country Agreement. Can you just give us a reminder here? What exactly is this agreement? So, the Safe Third Country Agreement essentially is a treaty to share responsibility for the

protection of refugees. It came into force in 2004 and it's premised on both countries, both US and Canada, being safe countries for refugee claimants. And so in practice what it means is that if you are an asylum seeker, you can't transit through the US and claim asylum in Canada and vice versa. Now there are some exceptions to that. So for example, if you have family members in Canada, you can claim asylum here. If you're an unaccompanied minor, you can also claim protection here. The idea really is though you're supposed to claim protection in the first country essentially

that you're in. That's right. Yeah. So refugee advocates have taken issue with this agreement for many years, but the concerns under Donald Trump are now considerably heightened because of what we're hearing around due process for people who may be asylum seekers. And so refugee advocates have called for the suspension of this agreement or at the very least an expansion of the existing exceptions to that agreement that would essentially extend

protection to more people who are seeking asylum in Canada. I think a basic question some people might have after, you know, hearing about what's happening at facilities like this Detroit Detention Center, does what's happening now violate the safe third country agreements at all? Well, I think that's the big question, and certainly the concern for refugee advocates, because under Canada's legal obligations to refugees, we as a country cannot knowingly turn someone around who we have reasonable grounds to believe

will be returned to somewhere where they might be tortured. So if there are fears that people who are genuine refugee claimants or face a very serious possibility of persecution in their home country, um, you know, if they are being removed from the U.S. without due process to somewhere where they could face torture, you know, that is gonna raise serious questions about the Safe Third Country Agreement. And you did mention that sometimes there are exemptions to this agreement so you you could still claim asylum in Canada if you have family here or if you're a

minor as you mentioned. Is that process still working like some individuals are still being allowed to claim asylum in Canada? So CBSA officials have regularly in fact let in people under these exemptions. CBSA that's the Canada Border Services Agency. But there are concerns about this process, because you need to obviously be able to document that you have a family member here or that you meet one of the exception criteria.

And refugee advocates are concerned that people are sometimes being issued negative decisions by Canadian border officials when, in fact, they should be granted access to our asylum system. So for example, I spoke to a lawyer who represented a family who tried to claim asylum in Canada at the Buffalo Port of Entry. They had family in Canada, but they were issued a negative decision by CBSA. The mom and kids were held in CBP detention for two weeks. They were eventually released, but the dad was sent to ICE detention and is expected

to face deportation from the country. So again, the risk of detention, deportation, and family separation has really increased under the Trump administration. And the issue around not being able to access legal support when you are in CBP custody, again, here is really relevant because if you want to challenge the decision of a CBSA officer, you really need legal support to do that because essentially you're asking them to do a judicial review of your decision. But in the current reality, you might not be able to find a lawyer to help you do that, and you might be deported by the time the courts in Canada

make a decision on your case. So it's a really fraught place to be for someone who is seeking one of those exceptions under the Refugee Treaty. Yeah, it seems like there's not necessarily a guarantee these days that this system is going to work the way it's supposed to, to give you those opportunities. I mean, given all that, then, Zara, like, is the US still accepting asylum seekers and refugees?

Is that process still working? Well, again, I think there's a lot of concerns about the asylum system in the US. The first thing is that the asylum system in the US is extremely backlogged, even more so than our system here. But there's also a lot of concerns around whether people are being given legitimate opportunities to claim asylum. So under the first Trump administration, there were concerns and sort of documented cases where people were not being given the opportunity to file asylum claims. They were being pressured

by immigration officers not to make those claims, or they would say, I want to file an asylum claim and the request was ignored. Under this administration, the threshold that people are being expected to meet in order to access the asylum system is manifest fear. So what I've had lawyers tell me is that they're essentially advising clients to just scream at anyone who they encounter in the sort of immigration border enforcement system that they are terrified to return to their home country. So this idea of manifest fear to show that you're scared.

Yeah, to physically show that you're scared. So I think the concern is that it's going to be a much more restrictive approach to asylum, whether or not it crosses into territory where the US is in breach of its legal obligations. I think that's what needs to be unpacked. The Canadian government has said at this time they feel that the US is in compliance with its obligations. They have not said whether

developments in the US have prompted a review of the safe country designation, but we'll have to see how things play out. Okay, so Canada still considers the US a safe third country at this moment in time, it sounds like. Has Ottawa said anything else, though, about the detentions near the Canadian border, or that situation more generally? So they've told me that they're monitoring. They are actually legally required

to continually review the US's human rights record and its refugee protections as part of the agreement. That is one of the requirements. Again, they've said at this time they think the US is in compliance and that they'll continue to monitor. They've continued to issue warnings that crossing the border illegally is very risky and warning against doing that. But essentially, that's all they've said on

the matter. Just very lastly here Zara, like I guess everything that we've talked about here, how might these changes around detention and deportation in the US, how might that impact Canada and how we handle our immigration and our refugee claims? I mean I think it's a difficult one because first of all, there's going to be the question around the Safe Third Country Agreement and is the US still a safe place for refugee claimants? Again, refugee advocates, that's a big question for them and there have been longstanding concerns about that. But I think that is going to be in tension with the political imperatives in Ottawa.

We know that border security has been a feature of Canadian government's discussions with Trump, negotiations with Trump. So they're going to have to balance Canada's legal obligations to refugees with, you know, their own political imperatives in terms of negotiating with Trump. Our own refugee system has a massive backlog of claims. And so there's concerns around, you know, making sure that our system is also operating efficiently and processing those claims and is able to sort of work through that big backlog. And, you know, we've also seen some rising anti-immigrant sentiment

here in Canada as well. So again, I think for policymakers and politicians, it's going to be about balancing those legal obligations and also where the political will is at in terms of dealing with this issue. And I think that's going to be some tricky terrain to navigate. Sarah, thank you so much for taking the time to be here. Thank you. That's Sarah Mojdeh-Hedzadeh, an investigative reporter with The Globe. That's it for today.

I'm Maynika Ramon-Wilms. Our intern is Kelsey Howlett. Our associate producer is Aja Souter. Our producers are Madeleine White, Michal Stein, and Allie Graham. David Crosby edits the show. Adrian Chung is our senior producer, and Matt Frainer is our managing editor. Thanks so much for listening, and I'll talk to you tomorrow.