The Deck - Oakey "Al" Kite (9 of Hearts, Colorado) Part 2

Episode Date: February 1, 2023

In the 18 years since Oakey “Al” Kite was found brutally murdered in his home, investigators have tried to track down a mystery man who they believed was responsible. But they were left stumped at... every turn. Now with new technology available, investigators are hopeful they might finally find this cold-blooded killer.If you know any information about the murder if Oakey “Al” Kite please contact Detective McDonald at the Aurora Police Department at 303-739-6013. Metro Denver Crime Stoppers is also offering a reward of up to $2,000 for tips, and you can call them at 720-913-7867or go online to Metro Denver Crime Stoppers to leave an anonymous tip. To learn more about The Deck, visit www.thedeckpodcast.com. To apply for the Cold Case Playing Cards grant through Season of Justice, visit www.seasonofjustice.org Follow The Deck on social media and join Ashley’s community by texting (317) 733-7485 to stay up to date on what's new!

Transcript
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Starting point is 00:00:00 Our card this week is Oki Al-Kite, the 9 of hearts from Colorado. This is part 2. If you haven't listened to part 1, pause here and go back so you can follow along. In part 1, we unpacked the beginning of the investigation into the murder of Oki Al-Kite in Aurora, Colorado. Al was tortured and murdered in 2004, shaking that quiet community to its core. But early on, detectives had a suspect, Robert Cooper, a man who had rented out Al's basement and then disappeared, leaving a trail of phone numbers, addresses, and other identifying
Starting point is 00:00:38 markers behind. Except, they were all fake. When we left off, agent Tom Sobiaski with the Aurora Police Department was digging through Robert's phone records and tracking down all of the people he had called. And he was about to make a discovery that left investigators scratching their heads. I'm Ashley Flowers. And this is the deck. As agents Sobiaski started working his way down the list of people Robert had contacted before Alzheimer's, he noticed a pattern.
Starting point is 00:01:40 A bunch of them had ties to the University of Colorado Hospital. Some of the renters only had placed ads like in the library at the University of Colorado Hospital at that time. It was at ninth in Colorado or nearby businesses or in printed like directories for people that were renting to students at the teaching hospital. Some people only had their ads in those so that Killer had to be down there at the hospital, had to be going in the library, had to be going in nearby businesses to get the phone numbers to call the numbers he called.
Starting point is 00:02:16 Out of everyone he called, Agent Sobi Eski discovered that Robert only met three other people in person. Two of them weren't really interested in talking with investigators or didn't have anything helpful to add. But the last one, a professor at the University of Denver who was renting out part of her home, described the unnerving feeling she got when she was giving this Robert guy a tour.
Starting point is 00:02:40 She said as soon as he walked in the door, the hair on the back of her next to it up, and she thought something horrible is going to happen to her. He made comments about how he'd seen her add for this town home in an ice cream restaurant called Lix, and he made some comment about sexual comment about it being Lix. And he never really answered, ask any questions. It'll be appropriate for if you're going to rent some place.
Starting point is 00:03:09 So she felt that she was lucky that she survived. After the visit, she said that Robert left and never contacted her again. She didn't see if he'd left in a car or anything identifiable like that. She was just happy to be alive. It was an eerie story for sure, and it confirmed for investigators that Al's murder wasn't committed by someone he knew. This was probably completely random, and Robert could have
Starting point is 00:03:36 just as easily picked someone else. There were older women that would have been easier to subdue older men, better locations, high field to murder someone, for some reason he picked Alkaid. We're not really sure why. Now the woman was able to give Agent Sobiesky a description of Robert, and much of it they had heard before, but she also said that he had a distinct voice. She noticed an accent as she's talking to him and she teaches English to be done it for years and she noticed a Romanian accent that he had
Starting point is 00:04:11 and he confirmed to her that he was Romanian. So here's the thing, no one else had mentioned any accent, much less something as specific as Romanian. But most of the other testimonies had come from people who didn't get a chance to talk to this guy, and this woman was actually an English professor. She spent her life studying language, so of course she picked up on it right away. From her description and some of the other testimonies, Agents Sobiaschi was able to get enough for a composite sketch. But since the description of Robert's age varied so much,
Starting point is 00:04:45 he actually had two composites made. Agent Sobiaski thought that this guy was most likely changing his appearance between each meeting on purpose so that no one would really be able to get an accurate description of him. Sometimes he acted and dressed like he was in his 30s, other times his 50s. So when making these sketches, he wanted to cover all
Starting point is 00:05:05 of the bases, just in case someone recognized him as one version versus the other. Now here's something you might already be thinking about that just keeps sticking out in my mind. Some of these conflicting descriptions actually come from times when Robert was going to visit Al. So wouldn't Al have noticed? Like, oh this guy looks different every time he comes over. Well, we can't know what Al thought at the time, Agent Sobi Eski told our reporter that his theory is the description of Robert we get from the neighbor, which is the one who says that he looks older and had a cane. That one might not be as accurate as some of the others. But it was early in the investigation, and they were desperate to find this guy, so they wanted to include it just to cover all of their bases. They didn't get any hits from the composites right away, but that was okay, because they
Starting point is 00:05:56 still had plenty of other leads. I mean, they weren't even done with the phone records yet. As Agent Sobyeski was speaking to the woman, other investigators tracked down the serial number and the model of the phone to a company called Kiosera in Florida. When Agent Sobiesky called that company to inquire about it, they were able to tell him where Robert bought the phone. It was purchased at a 7-11, about 23 minutes from Al's place. And when officers went to the convenience store, they were immediately hopeful that they would get something on this guy because there were security cameras.
Starting point is 00:06:30 But as you all know, it is never that easy. 7-11 at that time, maintained surveillance video for 30 days and he waited 31 days to activate the phone. Whether he knew that or was this lucky, I don't know. So there was no surveillance of him buying the phone. There was no record. They also couldn't track Robert's financial trail because the store's record showed that he paid cash for the phone. So they honed back in on the data from the phone, specifically the location data. And that proved that he traveled as much as possible to leave a harder trail to follow. But investigators were still able to tell that he had spent a lot of time near the hospital, which stuck out in Agent Sobiuski's mind, thinking maybe this guy has
Starting point is 00:07:16 some connection to the hospital. He knew about cell sites, like I said. He traveled from Golden to, you know, Far East Aurora in North to South to make calls. So he had that kind of knowledge back in 2004 that the police would use the cell site location to try to pinpoint where he lived or where he was calling from. That's something a lot of people didn't know back then. No. It seemed Robert was outsmarting investigators at every turn. He thought of everything, including thinking ahead of his time.
Starting point is 00:07:55 But there was something the records told them that probably wasn't fake. And it gave them a clue as to what Robert's daily life may have looked like. You see, he didn't make any calls between 8 and 5 Monday through Friday. He had a lot of calls on weekends, it was evenings, so our theory is that he had some kind of a job where he was around people and couldn't make calls on that phone and discuss, you know, anything about renting. He didn't want any witnesses to that. There were also two to three weeks where no calls were made at all,
Starting point is 00:08:29 which just brought police back to their hospital theory. If he were a student or faculty member at the teaching hospital and maybe they had a spring break or a vacation or something, he might not have been in the area. But there could have been another reason for the break in calls. Maybe he was incarcerated.
Starting point is 00:08:47 So they decided to pour over records from all the jails in the area, but no one they came across fit. Now to me, the timing of this gap is really important. And we know that it took place right in the middle of the phone records, but investigators couldn't tell our reporter when that was or even the exact number of days
Starting point is 00:09:08 that the break lasted. Anyways, just as they were closing the door on the phone records, an investigative window opened. It took them 10 days to fully process Al's town home, but the results were finally coming in and proving to be helpful. Luminol testing revealed blood residue in the shower confirming that Robert cleaned off after the murder.
Starting point is 00:09:29 But most importantly, they determined that the blood that they had found on this step in Al's basement wasn't Al's. So it had to be the killers, right? Well, maybe not. The main thing that the investigation had proven to Agent Sobiaski and his team was that the killer was smart. He'd outmaneuvered them far before he'd even committed the crime in the first place. And so to think that he'd be so sloppy as to leave his own blood at the crime scene, it seemed almost too easy.
Starting point is 00:10:07 And so a new concerning theory started to develop. We thought this guy is this smart to go through all this to plan this homicide and he had some association with the hospital. Once a say he doesn't bring somebody else's blood and smeared on me. What the step going out of the basement. So that was a thought that we had, but we know that didn't happen. The thought that someone would bring another person's blood to the scene, specifically to throw investigators off was chilling to say the least. But just as quickly as that they repopped up, they put it to bed
Starting point is 00:10:44 because the mystery person's blood wasn't just found on the step. They also had other samples from the bedroom that weren't owls, samples that not only matched the blood on the step, but that were too mixed in with the rest of the blood to have been planted. There was so much blood evidence, and at the time the Colorado Bureau of Investigations would only, they told us they were only in test 10 areas. And with a whole room full of blood and walls and ceilings we wanted to make sure one of those 10 was a suspect.
Starting point is 00:11:11 So we had CBI actually come out. We removed the whole carpeting from the basement. We laid it out. And in evidence bay, and we went through it. And it was fairly quickly. We had a profile, and then we ran it through Kodus. And we didn't get any matches and Kodus.
Starting point is 00:11:28 How had they gotten here? One of the most brutal crimes that these season detectives had ever seen was committed by what? A ghost? Because that's what it's feeling like, right? Like he was invisible. How had no one seen or heard a thing when a crime scene was this vicious? That's what kept bothering Agent Sobiesky. He'd been stuck on the fact that none of Al's neighbors said they heard any disturbances despite the hours of torture that they knew Al endured. And sure, he could have been gagged, but investigators didn't find any evidence that he was.
Starting point is 00:12:03 So they decided to try and recreate the attack and see what they could hear. Agent Sobi Eski went out and stood in the yard and on the sidewalk while other detectives stood in the basement and screamed, and he didn't hear a thing. He even went into the home that shared a wall with owls and tried the test again. I had an detective standing where he was killed and screaming top his lungs and hit the walls tried the test again. Now it's a little hard to go in order because so many things were happening all at the same time in this investigation. But earlier, like in the first week of the investigation, Agent Sobiaski had a fraud
Starting point is 00:12:43 detective looking into Alice financials since his wallet was missing from the investigation. Agent Sobiaski had a fraud detective looking into Al's financial since his wallet was missing from the scene. And now, that was finally paying off. The detective had got a hit from Saturday night. Al's credit card was used at an ATM at the Wells Fargo bank, which just so happens to be the same Wells Fargo bank, where if you remember from episode one, Robert had told Al he worked
Starting point is 00:13:05 at, like that was his whole reason for coming to town and needing the new place. Investigators rushed to the location and asked them if their ATM had a security camera. And it did. And yes, it was working that night. Investigators had finally caught a break. And when they got their hands on the steel images from the ATM, they were over the moon because they finally had an image of Robert Cooper. Kind of. He was wearing gloves and a ski mask that only showed the bridge of his nose and his eyes,
Starting point is 00:13:39 so really it just confirmed that he was a white guy with they think dark eyes, but this is better than what they had before, which was basically nothing. You can actually take a look at that photo on our blog post for this episode. That's at thedeckpodcast.com. The video showed that Robert pulled up to the ATM at 9.59 p.m. in Alstruck and used his car to withdraw $1,000 from his account before pulling away. It was interesting because he went to the Wells Fargo at 999 NSL Sable where he used the victim's credit cards.
Starting point is 00:14:09 And one of the transactions he did was Okie Kite would direct deposit his paycheck. And if you're a Wells Fargo customer, you can get a loan advance on your paycheck being deposited prior to the paycheck being deposited. The suspect knew that transaction and got money from El's account, even though it wasn't there based on the fact that he was heading up coming to Pazzo's paycheck. So that was some knowledge of the Wells Fargo system there as well. Pieces of the puzzle were falling in place. Slowly, they were learning more about Robert Cooper while also finally narrowing in on their timeline.
Starting point is 00:14:50 They thought the attack on Al took place between 6 and 10 pm on Saturday night, and this includes everything like the attack and cleanup. Then they believe Robert went straight to the ATM and then came back to ditch the car. But what really stood out to Agent Sobiaski from the ATM and then came back to ditch the car. But what really stood out to Agent Sobiaski from the ATM visit was the amount of money Robert took. Any armchair slews out there want to check your notes? This guy could have borrowed against Al's full direct deposit, but he didn't.
Starting point is 00:15:18 He took just $1,000. The exact amount that he paid out for the rental agreement. He basically had his money back, but Robby wasn't the motive. You know, going to the ATM machine, driving the victim's truck, knowing that we'd seen was I think it was all part of his planned out murder. The further he went in the investigation, the more we, I don't want to say we were amazed by his, what he had done, and the thought that had went into it, but it kind of made us all step back and think, you know, how long ago did this guy start planning this, this
Starting point is 00:15:58 crime? To come up with the phone, you know, how he's going to pick a victim to go and meet in people and pick in the victim and then plan it as crime and then doing the crime and then the ATM and then, you know, on and on and on. It was a well-occurrestrated homicide. I mean, there were a lot of thought went into it. Throughout the rest of 2004, they did everything in their power to follow every clue they could.
Starting point is 00:16:25 They worked with Wells Fargo's security from Aurora all the way to the East Coast, trying to determine if Robert really could be an employee, but they never identified a potential match. They also looked into students and teachers, basically anyone involved with the hospital. And there were a few leads that looked promising, specifically doctors from Romania who were visiting around the times of the murders, or even foreign exchange students. But eventually, all of them were ruled out by DNA. I thought maybe you came in and went to school for a few months and then did this murder
Starting point is 00:16:57 wise here for school. But we looked at people who delivered coffee, everything we can think of, you know, the hospital. coffee, everything we can think of, you know, the hospital, we security guards, we, the police department there, they were great help, saw the instructors, professors got the composite drawings, we just didn't have any luck. Based on how spread out all the call sites were, agents of the Eski Thought Robert had to have had a method of transportation. But in all their witness sightings,
Starting point is 00:17:27 no one had ever seen him with his own vehicle. We thought maybe he came there in a bus. We contacted our TDE, all the bus drivers. We hit them all up with composites. We did a lot of work on this case. I mean, anybody we thought we checked every dumpster within miles of, you know, the bank up there thinking that he may have dumped some clothing or whatever
Starting point is 00:17:52 but we never found any evidence but we this spent a lot of work on this case. Eventually the leads they had all dried up, and the case went cold. But Agent Sobiaski and the other detectives never forgot about it. In 2006, they consulted with the FBI who put together a case bulletin that was uploaded to ViCap. ViCap is a nationwide database of evidence and other relevant resources from violent crimes
Starting point is 00:18:19 overseen by the FBI. It has a lot of information stored up, but Agent Sobiaski didn't get any positive hits with his case, meaning that Robert's DNA didn't match up with DNA samples from any other cases stored in the system. That same year, though, the FBI sent profilers from the behavioral analysis unit to try and give investigators a little more insight into who this Robert guy could be. I kind of agree with the FBI that this guy is a normal guy during the daytime and he has a job from eight to five
Starting point is 00:18:52 Monday through Friday, which the phone records kind of show. And that you would not know he's a killer. And that he was looking for somebody to kill and he planned this perfect murder. And he had some knowledge he'd be really interested in like crime shows that he possibly was a police officer or maybe was fired from a police department or security guard who couldn't get hired as a police officer who wants to challenge the police to catch him.
Starting point is 00:19:21 He had some kind of, maybe a minor criminal history and that he's definitely worked his way up to this because you don't start a crime like this. This would not be a beginner's luck murder. This was very well planned out and months of planning and very patient. In 2008, Agent Sobiuski was contacted by some officers in Omaha, Nebraska, who had a
Starting point is 00:19:46 possible lead. They had been dealing with a string of murders that had some striking similarities to Al's case. Two people had been murdered that year in their homes, and investigators thought that they might be connected because both victims were related to doctors and teachers at the local university, and they were stabbed excessively, one more than 15 times. None of the four people in Omaha had been tortured,
Starting point is 00:20:10 but even though the MO wasn't exactly the same, Agent Sobi Eski looked into the possible connection because it would fit in with his theory that Robert was connected to the hospital in some way. And maybe Robert had been transferred there or was continuing his studies at that university. I'm not sure about all the details regarding that investigation, but what I do know is that ultimately that lead turned into yet another dead end.
Starting point is 00:20:33 They made an arrest in there, so it wasn't that... The motive was different. The suspect in their case had been terminated by these people, and his career was ruined, he felt, so that's why he was the motive for their killings. It would turn out that that wasn't the end of strange coincidences. Because in 2009, there was another suspicious murder. This time, it was out in California where a man was found in his home with his hands bound and multiple stab wounds. But what really grabbed Agent Sobiaski's attention was that this man had a connection to Al.
Starting point is 00:21:19 The man's name was Lee Scott Hall, and he had worked in the same building as Al Backman Al lived in California prior to 2000. Now they didn't work for the same company, but still it was a weird coincidence. Weird enough for Agent Sobi Eski to look into it. We talked to all Mr. Hall's co-workers were interviewed. He never mentioned Oki Kite. We interviewed all of Oki's family, friends. He never mentioned any Mr. Hall or that he was the fact that he was murdered or that he knew him or anything. Officers at the Livermore Police Department then told Agent Sobiaski that they had confirmed
Starting point is 00:21:56 sightings of a suspect and a motive which actually didn't match in Al's case. Mr. Scott was a whistleblower on a government project where possibly billions of dollars had been wasted. And they thought he was murdered because he was a whistleblower, that type of thing. That case has never been solved. The suspect in that case, they don't have DNA, but the suspect in that case, seen in the driveway
Starting point is 00:22:21 of the victim, Mr. Hall's residence that day was a black male, which eliminated him from our crime. The years dragged on with fewer and fewer leads. And by the 10-year anniversary, this case was ice cold. Agent Sobiaski still did his due diligence, though. He updated ViCap every year and followed every new lead that came his way. The case was featured countless times in local media and got spots on TV shows like America's Most Wanted and Sensing Murder.
Starting point is 00:22:52 Over the years it gained some notoriety and everyone who heard about it developed their own theories, one of the most popular being that maybe Al was a victim of the serial killer Israel Keys. Israel, who we actually didn't episode on for crime junkie back in 2019, was a notorious serial killer who murdered at least three people across the US, although the true number of his victims isn't really known because he never left any substantial evidence behind, just like Al's killer. He was arrested in 2012 and died by suicide that December while
Starting point is 00:23:25 in custody before he was ever tried. Despite similarities though, Israel's DNA wasn't a match to Roberts. Another theory from a lot of the online chatter was that Al's killer was connected to the murder of a man named Mike Emmert. Mike was a real estate agent killed in the home that he was hired to sell in Washington in 2001. And this one has eerie similarities. Mike was stabbed multiple times, and while it doesn't seem like he was bound in any way, his wallet and his car were stolen. But that's not the eerie part.
Starting point is 00:24:02 Officers' main person of interest was an unknown man who had met Mike's family a few times and walked with a cane that they believed was fake and part of a ruse. But once again, they would hit a brick wall. Because investigators had a DNA sample from Mike's crime scene to compare with Roberts, and it didn't match. Agent Sobiaschi still kept pressing on, and as DNA technology continued to advance, he finally got something solid.
Starting point is 00:24:31 In 2017, the CBI was able to use new methods called phenotyping and genetic genealogy to build a better profile of Robert. So Parabond nanolabs can take a DNA profile, put it in their database, and they can tell you with quite a high degree of certainty what color skin your suspect will have, what color's eyes will be, what color's hair will be.
Starting point is 00:24:56 If you'll have freckles, they can tell you what part of the world it came from, and they can put all that information into a computer and they can give you a composite of them. The results said that Robert was most likely Romanian, with brown hair and brown or hazel eyes. They created and released a new digital composite of Robert and even made an age-progressed version to show what he would have looked like at the time they were made in 2017. But the new composites didn't bring any new leads, and they couldn't find any trace of any one in Robert's family using genealogy. We're talking not even distant relatives,
Starting point is 00:25:35 which for Agent Sobiesky confirmed that Robert and his family most likely lived outside of the US. So even though this didn't pan out and point directly to their killer, maybe their theory that he was a foreign exchange student or a visiting doctor did have some weight after all. Agent Sobiaski worked with Interpool and Homeland Security to get the DNA uploaded into some of their international systems, hoping that they'd get some sort of hit there.
Starting point is 00:26:02 But they still ended up with nothing. Which means you guys, this man's DNA hasn't shown up in any other crime scenes anywhere else in the world, or at least it hasn't been uploaded to any systems. It seems unreal, right? Was this some perfectly planned out crime, just one and done, or did he get better and leave even less behind? If he was smart enough to know about cell phone pains and the window of surveillance footage and burner phones, maybe he was smart enough to completely change his MO all together. You understand now why this case gnaws at me, right?
Starting point is 00:26:39 Because you can see Robert Cooper in any unsolved case if you really want to. If he really is that clever. In 2019, with not a whole lot to lose, investigators allowed Al's case to be featured on the Oxygen Network show, the DNA of Murder with Paul Holes. Their production team traveled to Aurora, and it was actually a member of their team that stumbled upon an interesting piece of information. member of their team that stumbled upon an interesting piece of information. They learned about a group called the Turkish Hezbollah, which is a mostly disbanded terrorist group in Turkey. But while they were active, they had some gruesome torture techniques.
Starting point is 00:27:16 That came up as part of the Falaka, is what the tournament is for the beating in the bottom of the feet. It's certainly a theory that I haven't ruled out. They use that type of torture and it's from that area of the world, so I certainly haven't ruled it out. The idea that Robert could have been affiliated with this group in some way, or at least taken inspiration from them, was definitely interesting. But unfortunately, the theory didn't help push the case forward. It ended up becoming
Starting point is 00:27:48 another bit of information to add to the 17-3 Ring Binder's Agent Sobiaski had filled out over the course of his investigation. And that's really all he has. Bits of information that have never quite fit together to form a full picture of Al's killer. The case remained frozen as Agent Sobiaski retired in 2021, after more than three decades with the department, almost half of which he spent on Al's case. But that wasn't the end of the road for the investigation. In January 2022, Detective Jason McDonald became a cold case detective for the Aurora police, and he was assigned
Starting point is 00:28:25 Al's case. He had the ground running trying to dig up new leads, and it wasn't long before an interesting one found its way to him. In the spring of 2022, he was contacted by the FBI about a 2009 murder that took place in Lincolnshire, England, and that, matched Al's. The victim's name was Alan Wood and he was in his 50s when he was found murdered in his home. He'd been stabbed, tortured, even had a knife wound to his head, just like Al Kite. His cause of death was also a cut to his throat, and not only did they find some of his killer's DNA, but the man had even been photographed around the region wearing a mask and using Alan's credit card at ATMs. We have a picture in the blog post for this episode of all that
Starting point is 00:29:10 as well. Now that crime was still unsolved, and Detective Mcdonald was over the moon when he learned that they had Alan's killer's DNA on file, so they went ahead and compared that sample with Roberts. The test took a few weeks, and Detective Mc Detective McDonald was shocked to learn that it wasn't a match. But he was just getting started. Since then, he's been able to once again utilize updated technology to inch the investigation ever so slightly closer to the finish line. He's connected with a local organization called United Data Connect, and they've been retesting Roberts DNA and digging deeper into his genealogy.
Starting point is 00:29:50 So when you upload your DNA to like FamilyTreeDNA.com and you opt in for it being accessible to law enforcement and say we have a suspect DNA profile that we're trying to find in that database and we get something that has a relative match to it. It'll give a value like on a scale of 1 to 100 for example. 100 would be a very high number as an example. Using this process, United Data Connect was able to find what Detective McDonald says is a high-value match to Robert's DNA. About 41%. There is some relation to our killer's DNA, but it's not super high. So we're looking in the third to fourth cousin range, which would mean our killer and this
Starting point is 00:30:42 person who's uploaded their DNA into FamilyTree DNA.com have about the probably have the same great great grandparents. So it's going to be a pretty big family treat of map out, but there is a relation and I've been working on contacting them to try to map out their family tree and get more people, more males in their family. to try to map out their family tree and get more people, more males in their family, tested it with DNA kits to narrow down this killer profile. There is some hesitancy and I think it's understandable when you get a cold call from a person saying they're a detective in another state who has seen your profile and wants to dig more about your family history to find a killer in your family I think that cold call can be quite intimidating and cost some hesitancy and some people and that's the kind of
Starting point is 00:31:34 road black eye face with with this part of the job Ultimately detective McDonald says that he will most likely have to travel to this family and get additional samples himself in order to complete their family tree and bring them one step closer to Al's killer. But it's just about finding the time in his schedule. I mean, Al is only one of dozens of cold cases on his plate. The DNA is the key to unlocking the mystery of Robert's identity.
Starting point is 00:32:04 And that's beyond important, because not only did this guy end Al's life in such a horrific way, but investigators believe he's done something similar before. And the longer he is able to be free out in the world, the more likely he is to do it again. Well, I've been an officer for 35 years here with the RRPD and this is the biggest case I've ever had here. And I think about this case quite often. I could honestly say that this case comes to mind, given that I'm retired for a year, probably once a week. Al was such a nice guy and he was targeted for no reason and murdered, you know, he had a family and I met his, Al's sister and I mean the family's just crushed beyond. If you can imagine your brother being found like this,
Starting point is 00:32:55 we all feel kind of guilty that we can't solve it because that's was our job and Al is such a nice guy. If you have any information about Alice case, or Robert's real identity and whereabouts, don't hesitate to reach out. If you were in or around Aurora in 2004, you may have seen the sky, even if you didn't realize it before. He was white, with brown hair and brown eyes likely, and while he didn't have any tattoos or markings that would make him stand out,
Starting point is 00:33:25 he did have that recognizable Romanian accent. And he may have frequented Wells Fargo locations or the University Hospital. If this information jogs your memory even a little bit, you can call Detective McDonald at the Aurora Police Department at 303-739-6013. Metro Denver Crime Stoppers is also offering a reward of up to $2,000 for tips, and you can call them at 720-913-7867. The Deck is an audio chuck production with theme music by Ryan Lewis. To learn more about the Deck and our advocacy work, visit thedeckpodcast.com. So what do you think, Chuck?
Starting point is 00:34:17 Do you approve? Aaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh Bye!

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