The Deep 3 Podcast - Every NBA Team's Most Disappointing Player | Ep. 118

Episode Date: December 6, 2024

Today we pick the most disappointing player on every NBA team! #nba Check out the TD3 merch: https://the-deep-3-shop.fourthwall.com/ Listen on Spotify!: https://open.spotify.com/show/3elbbqVumwqz8wl...IdknsLW Listen on Apple Podcasts!: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-deep-3-podcast/id1657940794 Follow us on TikTok!: https://www.tiktok.com/@thedeepthree Follow us on Instagram!: https://www.instagram.com/thedeep3podcast/ Isaac's twitter: https://twitter.com/byisaacg Muhamed's twitter: https://twitter.com/Mojo99_ Donnavan's twitter: https://twitter.com/Dsmoot3D 0:00- Intro 1:53- Lakers 19:55- Hawks 25:15- Jazz 27:55- Trailblazers 33:10- Warriors 38:55- Raptors 41:20- Kings 43:33- Pelicans/Magic 47:50- Nuggets 52:05- Rockets 57:20- Grizzlies 1:00:04- Pistons 1:05:24- Wizards/Heat 1:13:08- Hornets/Bulls/Spurs/Cavs/Celtics/Nets 1:16:27- Thunder 1:19:35- Knicks 1:22:30- Bucks 1:24:40- 76ers 1:29:45- Clippers 1:33:33- Pacers/TWolves 1:37:58- Suns/Mavs 1:41:25- Tiktok time Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Transcript
Discussion (0)
Starting point is 00:00:00 You know, every year we come in the season, we have agendas. Everyone likes to pretend they're not biased. We are very biased and we don't run away from it. Everybody has them. And you know, there's players that we're really high on, players are really low on. And as soon as somebody comes out and meets our expectations and it's great when we say they are, we're always the fastest to run a victory lap and say, I told you Franz Wagner was going to be a star. I told you so-and-so was going to do great.
Starting point is 00:00:22 Today, though, today we're going to talk about players who have been incredibly disappointing, players that we expected a lot from and have done the opposite this year. just players that aren't having a great season incredibly disappointed not just mildly disappointed not just like it's been a few bad games they've just been stinking it up that level of bad
Starting point is 00:00:41 yep okay and you know the title of the episode is every NBA team's most disappointing players this season so some of them will be that some of them will be incredibly disappointing some will be just a little bit with some context and so on but we're going through every single team and if you're watching this and you're a fan of one specific team
Starting point is 00:00:57 we're going to tell you who we think you're selling you who's ruining your team season and we'll see if you guys agree all right let's get to him well what's on you what's on you what's on you're at what's going on um you see where i'm at right now this is what happens yeah when you're on the road and you're trying to get it out the mud and you're trying to do as much as possible to make these crown you're satisfied with content this is what it looks like right now yeah you're important from some grandma's basement wherever you are we'll figure it out later
Starting point is 00:01:30 if you guys are here drop a like for Mo to get him back to his home see if we can get him back across the country he's stranded right now and yeah man let's get into the episode
Starting point is 00:01:39 The cranium is crazy oh my god I mean I don't know what to say Pray on eaters rejoice We're going to start with probably the guy that I probably put in the thumbnail, probably the guy
Starting point is 00:02:00 that has been the biggest talking point over the past week in her disappointment. We're going to start with the most disappointing player on the Las Angeles Lakers. This feels weird. I am leading the most disappointing players of season conversation off with LeBron James. It's over for you, O'May.
Starting point is 00:02:18 It's over. I've been waiting on this for 10 years since he was 30. The fucker, you can't go on any longer. What's his name on Twitter? He said it when he was 28. 10 years later, father time has come to have a little bit of victory. He hasn't fully won yet. LeBron's not cooked like some people are saying on Twitter. But I think this season, I'm going to pick LeBron as the most disappointing player in the Lakers.
Starting point is 00:02:40 And not because it's like his fault, right? We're not saying that he's like a huge disappointment because he's done less than expected of him or whatever. He's just old and finally looking like it. We expected this three years ago. And we're finally getting the season where I think is definitive that he's not a top 10 player right now. Wow Okay Yeah
Starting point is 00:02:57 I think we're there I think we're there We might be pushing Top 15 narratives By the time Christmas comes around I don't I don't know If LeBron's top 15 right now
Starting point is 00:03:05 Okay Okay What makes you guys Go ahead and say that shit Oh man What do I begin Can't just I guess they talk about
Starting point is 00:03:16 My goddamn king And not back it up With any real statements Or facts Okay so let's talk About the Lakers In general then Right
Starting point is 00:03:23 Because I think with the Obviously the Lakers have been disappointing as of late. They started off as like the goddamn three seed, we came up here and did our power rankings. And as a Lakers fan, I said, I'm not ranking them as a top five team or anything like that despite that placement.
Starting point is 00:03:35 They're clearly fake demons. They had a very even 0.2 net rating despite being 10 and 4 because they were barely beating teams by the slowness of margins even though the teams were bad. So I think we saw the riding on the wall that seems not very good, right?
Starting point is 00:03:47 You guys agree? Yes. Yeah. Yeah, we saw it. Yeah. For sure. For sure. And now the fakeness is just gone or the demons are gone.
Starting point is 00:03:54 and there's trash. They're just bad. And the biggest part of that, as we've talked about all season, is their defense is atrocious. Their bottom five in defense that have been all season. And a big part of that is LeBron James right now. I think it's clear that his offball defense is really bad. And this isn't a team that has a defensive personnel to hide him. You know, in some years past, like maybe 2018 or whatever year was,
Starting point is 00:04:16 he was coached by Tai Liu and had some good defenders around him. He could kind of meld in at times and then turn it up when necessary. This roster does not allow. that when you're starting next to god damn de angelo russell dalton connect and ruri hachemora three bad defenders so lebron's bad defense has really shown the team's defense is six and a half points worse with him on the court right now and that matches the eye test i think i've never it's it's really really weird like i think yes that the defense is bad we've seen this for about like six years now like i would say starting in like 2017 2018 around
Starting point is 00:04:54 that range you you started to really see lebron like conserve his energy on on defense and really like pick his spots and he was never you never trash but you can see like i'm he's not going to go out there and be d p oi guard your best player right do all that stuff but he can still turn it up in spurts obviously yeah like like you said the fact that the fact that nobody is a good defender on that team outside of anthony davis and the fact that like in the fact that like you say is all the the time. AD's, one of his biggest false defensively is that he doesn't get back. And so you have a lot of guys who just don't play defense overall than somebody who gets beat in transition defense. And that leads to them getting destroyed by 40 points on, you know, like that.
Starting point is 00:05:42 Pitiful. By the fucking Miami heat, he doesn't stink. Those performances come to like when you have this. JJ Reddick looks like he wants to quit already. He looks like he just can't take it anymore just because of how bad they are. I mentioned defense to start. Defense isn't even the biggest issue. I just want to get that out there first. Their defense sucks. They are running a very switch-heavy scheme that is doing a lot of instant switching off-ball whenever there's anything close to a screen to not let teams even get into the flow of the action, right? They say if you want to run a off-ball screen, if you want to run a backdoor cut, whatever it is, we're going to switch it to not even allow you to create an advantage. That's something a lot of teams have done over the
Starting point is 00:06:18 years but it only works when you have good defenders who have the high enough IQ to make that happen they have not not that we'll say that but that's fine call the point of this team coming to this season was that they're going to be an offensive heavy team right they started the season off with a third offensive rating they're down to seventh and again this is the first time it's ever happened in lebron james's career not even as a rookie this happened the team's offense is significantly worse than him on the court they are currently 13.6 points per 100% session's worse at LeBron James on the court. Now, that is ridiculous. Trader. Dude, at his peak, that's, like, the stars have like an offensive rating like 10 points better.
Starting point is 00:06:58 To be minus 13 is one of the worst in the entire league. Granted, there's probably some noise there, but he just has not been consistently good. A few games ago, there's a stretch where he missed 24 straight three-pointers. And we all know at this point of his career, he is extremely reliant on his outside jump shot. Obviously, he's not finishing the rim like he used to. He misses a lot of bunny layups. He almost never dunks. He really, relies on bully ball in the half court and finding shots of the ribbon transition so if his jump shot isn't falling he looks old as hell man it's it's so funny because i like over the over the past a couple days i've been seeing a lot of people like put massive massive money on like lebron
Starting point is 00:07:38 10 points at at least in like in the like parlayer or whatever and it's like it's like a thing now We're going forward, like, it's not, it's not as much of a guarantee as you think that LeBron is going to show up and get 10 points, especially the way that he's shooting. It's crazy. I look at this situation and I'm just like, yes, like LeBron looks like he slowed down a tad bit, but I'm not going to go as far just yet to say he's the top 15 NBA player because the fact that matter is like if you put him around shit, he's going to look like shit. That's what the Lakers are at this point in time. So it's amplifying and making things way worse. You're making a good point. He won 24 straight missed threes.
Starting point is 00:08:20 That's not going to happen forever, right? He's going to have, that's an aberration. He'll get back to his normal shooting from three, which will make him look better like he has the past couple of years where he really relies on that. But the margin for error is so small. If his three-point shot is not falling, if he has a cold streak like this,
Starting point is 00:08:34 life is incredibly difficult for him. We talked early in the season about this new JJ Redick offense, the running off of these screens, this high amount of actions. It's so different than what we've seen in past years. The past five games or so when they've been on this skid, that hits completely fallen off of the cliff. And people are going on Twitter and they're quick to blame JJ Reddick. They're saying, you know, rookie head coach, yada, yada, yada, part of it is probably that he's not motivating the team right now.
Starting point is 00:08:57 They're not listening for whatever reason. But part of it is when Anthony Davis, LeBron James, and dealer get the ball, they're stopping the offense. The team is simply not executing the game plan. They're falling out into a rhythm and getting back to old Darwin-Ham looking habits where they just have a slow isolation-based offense. don't work out. And that's making LeBron and Anthony Davis's life harder. There's a reason they've played so bad for the last seven games and a big part of that it's just not putting the effort to execute and make
Starting point is 00:09:22 those easy buckets happen for him. Look at Darvindham having a lasting impact on grown men's lives. Darlingham out here leader of men. You know what I'm saying? Like it doesn't matter if he's in the bitter or not. They're still following him. And that for him, I love that for him. Yeah. So I saw something
Starting point is 00:09:38 on Twitter the other day. I think it was after, maybe it was after last night after the loss of them, to the Miami he or the loss before that some Lakers big Lakers page I don't remember the name was like it's time to have a conversation and then below that was a picture of JJ Wright looking miserable as ever and as usual you like his fans are trying to find someone to skate to skate go and at that point in time what's that what we know the truth who you put in the label we know the truth we it's rough i mean it's rob lincoln the roster that's been correct the same exact
Starting point is 00:10:19 mid roster that's been around for the last two years you know i think at the at some point in time there's a famous quote by alan i i said allan i said albert einstein such an insane like mishap said some like expecting change with no change is insanity and that's exactly what's happening We're doing the truth of that. You're right. Yeah, I'm not the quote. That's not the quote. It's not the quote right now.
Starting point is 00:10:46 It's doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result is the definition of insanity. No. When you said, that's how Alan Iverson would have said it. That's not the Albionstein version. That's a different. But to your point, to your point, despite the butchers, you are on the right track, though. You were 100% right. Yeah.
Starting point is 00:11:08 Listen, Darwin Ham lost the locker room. lost the locker room, he had to get fired, right? It wasn't, it wasn't surprising. We don't need to look back and say he shouldn't have fired, but the same errors are still here, because Rui Hachimora still can't set screens, he still can't switch screens, D'Anger Russell is still the terrible defender offball, Jared Vanderbilt still doesn't play basketball games, they still don't have a backup center, they have all the same issues, and coaching can only fix so much of that. So you're 100% right. While they had to make a change, JJ Redick is not a fucking miracle worker. We see now that maybe some of us got excited, and we thought
Starting point is 00:11:39 that there could be some marginal changes that make them better they're just the same team that's why I picked them to be seven seat again like last year because I think they're the exact same team and Rob Polinka is just the worst is the takeaway we've talked we've talked
Starting point is 00:11:53 a lot about how your perception of the Lakers has changed and I'm looking at them right now and I'm thinking to myself are they going to be in the top ten because I think that's a bit dramatic but I know what you mean
Starting point is 00:12:09 That's not crazy. Because just because the rest of the Western Conference is super, super competitive. And obviously, like, I'm not going to sit here and say, like, they are definitively not going to be in the top 10. But the best case scenario for the Lakers was always we have LeBron and AD. If we are, if we're now looking at them and LeBron is teetering between that top 10, top 15 range. And then you have AD and no defenders around them. It's clear that, and whether if it's his fault or not, it looks like there's a disconnect between what JJ's trying to preach and trying to get everybody to do, not even from a supreme
Starting point is 00:12:50 execution. We're going to outthink these guys, whatever, from an effort standpoint. The fact that that's not happening, how long does this slide last? And something that like we've seen from LeBron, at least for the last two years. the playoffs is that he can dial it up from time to time and still be a quarter and still be like lebron he could do it for a quarter he could do it for a half but something that i saw this year and i saw last year was especially like in in series against the nuggets if he gives you a good first half second half is going to be bad he had he had a game this this year where lebron went
Starting point is 00:13:27 crazy i think it was he had like a 30 point triple double and i was like yep next next game he's going under that that point total and he came out and had like 12 because the It's just so hard to do it consistently. And so if that's the case, I don't know what the ceiling is for the- Yeah, you just said a lot of things that all need to be addressed one by one because you're on the money. I think first thing you said was if he's not going to be a top 10 or 15 player that changes things, you don't have that.
Starting point is 00:13:50 You can't fall back on having two top 10 players. That's why I picked him as the most disappointing player. I could have picked Gabe Vincent, who offensively is playing like shit from a butt. He hasn't made a shot and I don't know how long. He shoots like 12% from three for his legist's career, obviously disappointing. but LeBron his let's call it a semi falloff or just aging
Starting point is 00:14:10 if he can't if they can't have that fallback they have no no ceiling whatsoever they have no floor so even though it's yeah it's gonna cave it even though it's not his fault it's disappointing because the window is over
Starting point is 00:14:22 if he's not a top 10 player they just don't have a shot and that is literally the difference between maybe this team could do something and make a conference finals if they get hot the right time like over years ago versus it's being dead in the water because you just have to have two elite players.
Starting point is 00:14:36 Exactly. Listen, as much as I love LeBron James and I want the most success for him in his career, I'm looking at my chops right now as we speak because I remember, we have you guys pick. And by we, I mean, the Atlanta Hawks. And if you guys somehow, some way, if you guys are, you guys are like our Anthony Davis ankle injury or ankle roll away from being in the lottery next year. And I'm looking at my top. I guess. You can say about anybody.
Starting point is 00:15:04 going to be a you're not going to get a top 10 pick calm down relax you're not getting shit when it happens flipping this and then i'm adding you yeah sure if anthony davis breaks his knee in half or maybe they're too good for that but uh don't another thing you mentioned was um j j reddick they're not listening to him and he's talking about that in conferences and he sounds so frustrated yes and it's crazy because his schemes are good the ideas are good but the roster just does not fit it at all. You guys got to listen to him, man. God, he knows
Starting point is 00:15:37 what he's not even that, but if you're, he's the coach is right guys. You have to play hard. But no, but I think a big difference in a rookie coach and the established veterans
Starting point is 00:15:50 like a Tailu is you have to have some ability to bend your style to your talent. You cannot ask Rue Hachamora and Delo to switch everything off ball. These guys do not have that
Starting point is 00:16:00 in their bag. They are not equipped to execute it. It seems like they're not listening to him. I think they just can't do it. I think they are not equipped to execute this and they're they gave up on him right like that Milwaukee Miami game they clearly gave up in the second half. LeBron and AD gave the fuck up and the role player is followed and I think it's just frustration because they simply cannot do it and it's frustrating when you you're starting to get off you're trying but you're not equipped to play this style it leads to that it's a fucking
Starting point is 00:16:27 snowballs and now it looks like he loses locker room for a game but they're just ejected. Yeah and I I think for the Lakers another thing they need Rob Polinkin needs to be on the phone instantly right not not not only well yes that too but not only just because you have to
Starting point is 00:16:45 you have to make a change in the roster you know everybody's trade stock is going down if you watch the if you watch the Lakers over the last two two three weeks and you're watching you're watching Dilo one get called out multiple times over effort you see the entire team
Starting point is 00:17:01 quit like that what other team is looking at that saying, yeah, we're a DeAngelo Russell away from getting better. If you look at at Rui, outside of the crazy three-point shooting street that he had two years ago, you look at everything that he's been doing. What team is saying to themselves, yeah, Rue would be a really nice addition to what we're doing here. Like, I don't, I think at this point right now, if you are trading for any of these guys, you are trading for the opportunity to get what they were two years ago at their best but they're not putting that on film right now and if I was an opposing GM I would be very worried and I wouldn't make that call for them like
Starting point is 00:17:40 mad picks would have to be attached to to the deal do you guys remember that episode we did last year I don't remember which one it was but I think there was at some point where I said I'm ready for this error to end that I'm kind of kind of okay if they move on from LeBron and AD at some point yeah I don't remember why I said that but I still feel that way And the rebuild is on the way. Maybe it's retooling around Anthony Davis. LeBron's probably retire for next year. They're not going to do this for many reasons that practical in real life has to do with business, the team.
Starting point is 00:18:14 LeBron's desires, how perception works for the NBA, how you treat your stars and so on. If she has a fan even further, I would not be disappointed as a Lakers fan if the shit got blown up by the trade deadline. What does the blow look like to you? It looks like Anthony Davis. and the Hawks, give us that goddamn pickback LeBron James, let's go home to the Cavs, let's get you a fucking title, let's dominate the East,
Starting point is 00:18:37 let's go back to rebuilding. Hey, Anthony is what we need and he will fix all of our problems. I will be more than glad to go ahead and have that conversation with you at a later time. Whatever it looks like, I don't know. It's probably not that extreme, but I won't be upset if they decide
Starting point is 00:18:54 to give the team a chance and trade the picks to like make this team salvageable. I won't be upset if they do that and they get a Cam Johnson or whoever may be with those two first-time picks but I also will not be upset if they just throw the towel in and move on to the next area. Yeah, because it's clear as they, this is just, it's been a crooked product for two and a half,
Starting point is 00:19:11 three years or whatever you want to, whatever it may be. There's no way out other than unloading the talent you have, which is AD and lighting with Bronner right through the sunset or trying to unload the clip and get a Cam Johnson or Dorian, Smooth, Smith, or Zach Levine or whatever. it might be the sad reality is they're probably not going to do either and they're probably going to be mid for the next two years before lebron attires and just be a 45 win team which is the
Starting point is 00:19:36 worst ever seeing lebron go out this way like the wizard's mj is just disgusting but that's where we're at that's sick well well that's that's all you can say just well sucks to suck yeah well here we are perpetual playing team as always i'm not surprised i'm just disappointed Listen, I'm taking exactly what you said, and I would like to talk about another disappointment on a perpetual playing team. Let's talk about the Atlanta Hawks. Let's talk about five win streak Atlanta Hawks, the hottest team in the NBA, Atlanta Hawks. We do not care. Let's talk about Trey-O.
Starting point is 00:20:18 And let's talk about how Trey Young, specifically his shooting, is failing the Atlanta Hawks this year. because you can you can you can talk a lot about about the role players and it's kind of similar to to lebron in in the sense that like yes there's other people who aren't playing as well however none of this works if trey young is not trey young and we've seen tray have up and down shooting seasons before we've seen him go go back and forth he's showing 30% from from three right now right i I understand that he's averaging 12 assists. The whole idea, though, behind this is you are going to be offensive engine. We are going to have long, light skins who can defend around you.
Starting point is 00:21:05 And then we'll have whatever big we can find. And that's kind of going to be the thing. And if Trey is not shooting the way that he needs to, Trey's not scoring the way that he needs to, then you are not five-game win streak or whatever. You're not going to get to the places that you want to go. And so that's why for me right now, Trey Young is very disappointing while I watch the Hawks.
Starting point is 00:21:28 Yeah, I can agree to that to a certain degree. Like, all this doesn't work in the long term if Trey's not being Trey. But in terms of overall Hawk basketball, this is the best that it's been in years, considering, like, the style of basketball that you're playing. You see Trey's usually dropping. And meanwhile, while you see that. Yeah.
Starting point is 00:21:51 Yeah, this is, in terms of like, conducive basketball. No, listen, in terms of like actual winning basketball, like there's a real vision that a lot can be bought and we're more of like a modern team than ever since we've had Tray Young in terms of like. I believe you. I believe. Yeah, exactly. It's just sad. It's just pitiful. It's the best has been in years.
Starting point is 00:22:10 Listen, man, if I wish I had lineage to be, to let me be a Lakers fan or a Warriors fan or a Celtics fan. I'm dealt with these cards. And I'm appreciating them. And for right now, what I am appreciating is the Dyson, Daniels, the Risha says, DeAndre Hunter, literally being the front winner of the sixth man of the year race right now. I'm appreciating all this, but long term, you are correct. I think Trey's... This year.
Starting point is 00:22:38 He's facing two things. There's, like, his Achilles is genuinely bothering him. And then on top of that, too, he's giving up the ball way more than he's used to. and I think he's slightly struggling. Binmore has been picking up his dribble a lot more. Floater isn't in. Obviously, nothing is really going in for him on the offensive end. And he's just like learning how to capitalize in this new role
Starting point is 00:23:04 while doing a little bit less. And that's why, and that's why for me, that's why it's kind of disappointing because of, because of the way that everybody else is playing. And for so long, for so long, like, Trey has been labeled as like an empty stats guy. Like, he's, you know, he's not a quote unquote like winning player and now that the hawks have some pieces to where
Starting point is 00:23:24 you can play winning basketball now that jalen johnson is picking it up and he's starting to do the things that we thought that he could in terms of like handling the ball playing defense being extremely versatile on offense it is kind of disappointing that tray can't either isn't or can't immediately fit into to this role where if if he if he was like on it they would they would be much better especially in this situation right now. Okay, so it's disappointing clearly. Like you want to see him make his shots because like how good could they be?
Starting point is 00:23:54 Five game, one streak could be even greater if he's scoring well. But is it worrying. Like he's shooting 29% from three on 6.4 pull-up three is a game. That is not Trey Young. Like he's had cold streaks before, but this is the least efficient year
Starting point is 00:24:06 even worse than his terrible rookie season. There's going to be positive regression at some point, whether it's because the Achilles you Donmo mentioned or whatever. He's going to get healthy and play better. Are you worried long term or just disappointed on what we've seen so far because that's a big difference there yeah i don't i don't think i'm i'm worried but i am
Starting point is 00:24:24 disappointed yeah that makes sense yeah yeah that's fair to say i think the only slight things that tell me like nah no worry about it is that it's not like he's been not shooting the ball he's been trying to get his shit off just last night against the milwaukee bucks he took nine threes none of them all's went in he put up an absolute fat zero if he wasn't getting those three's up then I'll be like oh my god like what's happening he lost his aggressiveness that made him such like a potent offensive force along with his passing ability but because he's getting those stuff off I think that at this point in time there's none to really worry about is just an insane really a disgusting shooting slump that you've seen from him and throughout his entire career
Starting point is 00:25:07 so I'm not worried about it makes sense again disappointing what we've seen so far but I think we all think the hawks will generally be fine things are trending upward so it's not too doom and gloom yeah exactly you know what is what is kind of like doom and gloom right now i don't know i bet you're going to tell me all right the utah jazz we don't have to spend necessarily too much time on this but keontay george has been one of the most disappointing players second year players that the NBA has to offer us right now i think it's clear his day that he's been forced into a role that simply just doesn't fit him being the lead guard he's never been that throughout his entire playing career, not only in the NBA or college or high school.
Starting point is 00:25:49 And I think Will Hardy's been forcing him upon that role, thus making him like one of the most inefficient lead guards in the entire association right now, especially starting. He's probably the worst. To start off the year, I think he shot like 32% from the field for his first seven or 11 games. And overall, his efficiency is just disgusting. his ability to bring up the ball comfortably, up court, even with the slightest of pressure on to him, is a battle.
Starting point is 00:26:19 And for that to be your lead NBA guard at times, it's very concerning. The turnovers are absolutely disgusting. I believe, fun fact, the Utah Jazz, they lead the NBA and transition points to giving up, I believe, which is like at 31 points per game, and that's the most that we've seen. in like 20-something years.
Starting point is 00:26:40 It's ridiculous. And a lot fall on his shoulders. Now, I will say, over the last seven, nine games, he's been a bit better shooting like 43% from the field. But it's clear that he's super disappointing. He's not the lead guard that for that organization. He could be an off guard to an Isaiah Collier. He looks a lot better and more comfortable with that responsibility off of his shoulders.
Starting point is 00:27:01 But as a now, he's definitely slightly disappointing because he's not a lead guard. he's more so like a con sex and type of player yeah Dylan Harper you're ready to speak Utah jazz I know your dad doesn't want you to go there but they need you get ready it's gonna happen his dad was just tweeting about how he doesn't want to see him in Utah he made a joke about requesting a trade they need a Dylan Harper in the draft it's clear they're tanking so you kind of want to empower some young guards to try to make those playmaking leaps while you're trying to tank because you know it helps both ways they might get better at it and you might lose some games So overall, it's a win.
Starting point is 00:27:36 But yeah, you want to see him get better at that. And I'm not out on him yet, but I definitely see what you're seeing. Can't be too excited. Yeah. Do defensively, with him on the court, the Utah Jazz have a defensive rating of 127. And with him off the court, they have a defensive rating of 109. Yeah. Let's talk about another similar situation.
Starting point is 00:27:57 Let's talk about another guard who was drafted to be the league guard of his team. And the rebuild kind of hinged on his. shoulders no and none of it has gone well no the most disappointing player for the Portland Trailblazers is none other than Scoot Henderson no yeah yeah yeah so last year no I don't want to talk about it he was bad he was bad and everybody rushed to call him a bus and make fun of them and we came up here we preach not caution what's the word patience we said young guards have rough seasons often no it's best to not overreact yet let's see how it looks in year two let's see how the skills begin to develop
Starting point is 00:28:34 as the time goes on, give him a second before we make too harsh of a judgment. I still feel that way in principle, but I think we've seen enough through the summer 25% of the way through the season and all of last year. I think it's safe to say Scoot Henderson is not a star by any means. That's clear. I am beginning to be worried if he's ever going to be a starter. Like, there's a world where he goes a good player still. He's not, nobody's done after 100 games.
Starting point is 00:29:00 But the idea of building around him is done, I believe. oh man that's not not going to be a starter is such such he can be a starter he can be a starter i mean that's dramatic but it's not a guarantee he has to develop still it's not a guarantee at all and it's just such a such a heel turn and it's it's very unfortunate because it's he's in a situation that is like i know that they have guards in in portland but it's also tailor made for him you were the third pick in draft and we i think i think a lot of people got fooled by or relied to about how athletic he was he's strong right like he he he looks big but he's not like as fast as powerful as some of the other guys that people were comparing him to
Starting point is 00:29:46 and so and so because of that like there probably were some expectations on it but also just outside of that like regular point guard duties just haven't been his thing and it's it's kind it's kind of not kind of the regular guard duties aren't your thing it's regular disappointment which is also wild and this is what i never understand about like just the league in general you have chaunty billips as your coach like it's very it's very weird it's very weird that these like older guards can't foster younger guards in that in that situation especially with chaunty because he bounced around so much as a as a young player so you can you can understand and be in that mindset of a young player trying to figure out his way
Starting point is 00:30:32 and he can't help and it's that whole situation is very weird to me what makes it what makes it even worse is like the Portland Trailblazers have been a lot better than any of us as expected to have like eight wins so far into this 2022 game season that we've entered and it has absolutely nothing to do with scoot Henderson this team is tanking they're they're a lot better than they even want to be themselves and it has nothing to do with with you. In order to make Toronto's fans happy, which is to, for them to get the highest pick possible, they probably need to pick Scoot Henderson or play Scoot Henderson a lot more. That is incredibly sad to say and to think of, bro.
Starting point is 00:31:13 It's alarming and I'm starting to sound the fire bills too. Are we selling stock? Are we selling? Like, how much of you stock are you selling? I've been sold. I just didn't tell you about it. I did it behind closed doors because I didn't want you to. I'm still in on it. I'm still in on it. Yeah. I wanted you to hold the bag so I can get out before the whole. whole market crash. And maybe the market
Starting point is 00:31:29 ass crash and you're just caught holding it. Now I'm holding. Yeah, yeah, you're fucking cooked. He does not shoot well from three. We know that, 32%. Not, I mean, it could be worse, I guess, but not good. 28% from mid-range doesn't really have touch there. Doesn't have a first step to beat people consistently and get to an open shot.
Starting point is 00:31:44 So it shows it doesn't really generate any open looks from either level. And only 54% at the rim, which is not particularly good, especially if you're not a good shooter. There's no scoring strength to hold his hat on. The processing speed is a passer. Clearly is an issue. end of the day if you don't have the athletic system
Starting point is 00:31:59 to get open you don't have high level passing to create advantage even without getting super open as a score you're not a strong defender you're not big
Starting point is 00:32:07 and can serve some defensive versatility with rebounding there's we've literally not seen a strength yet which tough even better
Starting point is 00:32:15 like that's that's tough it's looking like an old school bus story now that we haven't seen in a while that's true we haven't seen
Starting point is 00:32:21 we haven't seen we haven't seen we haven't seen a bus yeah just like someone who's just like straight out for me complete miss yeah completely miss i wasn't going to say that but a complete miss we've been let us straight for sure he's listen he's gonna he's gonna be great in the euro league it's gonna be awesome he might he might win he might win MVP it's gonna be awesome yeah and again
Starting point is 00:32:42 there's a world where he finds a career like markelle fultz did where you find like a bench roll and you know develop those skills over time but he's a lot of time a lot of reps and a lot of patience and a lot of recalibration of expectations man no this is so cooked you just brought up Mark Hill Fultz in the big year of 2024. It's going to be 2025. And that man plays for what team? I know, but he had a couple years where he found a role for himself. All right.
Starting point is 00:33:07 What's the next team? It's on me. Let's talk about the Golden State Warriors. And let's talk about how Brandon Pajemski is stinking it up. They don't want to hear this. because we've heard so much and to the Warriors credit they are right they have a lot of depth and that is something that has propelled them in years past and something that's that's propelled them this year brandon projemsky is not a part of that he he is missing threes left and right
Starting point is 00:33:43 he is not scoring at all they have now that the anthony melton is out you have an opening for brandy progensky to come in and be that guard and be that that, you know, be that, be that guard in that role. And he's just not taking it. And you, like, you, you expect him, you expect him after a really good rookie season to take, even if Warriors fans were like crazy and they thought that, oh yeah, like we got, we got another star on our hands, probably was never going to be that. But to be a very productive role player, he's the antithesis of that right now. And he has by far been the most disappointing player on that team. Yeah. So obviously he's not making his threes, which is like the most important thing to do for a player in his current role playing next to Steph Curry as like an off guard. You have to hit your three. It's like baseline, obviously, to stay on the court. 22% is, I can't even say not going to cut it. It's abysmal. I'm also disappointed with his defense. I didn't think he was an amazing defender, but I thought he was cool. He was a solid enough team defender. And there's been some games since the Anthony Melton got hurt. And pods has kind of been forced to really have a big.
Starting point is 00:34:54 defensive presence, where this team is constantly in rotation. And in this game against Nuggets, when Dremont wasn't there to just hide and save everybody, he is a walking blowby. Specifically, like on ball, I'm sure he's okay enough, but specifically when he's closing out on a shooter, he's so easy to blow by on a closeout that it leads to so many issues with their defense having to rotate behind him. And this whole Denver game, they were just constantly in rotation, constantly creating open looks with Aaron Gordon cutting off of Yokish post-ups.
Starting point is 00:35:24 he's not playing good on either end right now. Pods, man, looking back at it, I'm sure. Dude, we need to start having a real conversation about how badly the words have missed for years now when it comes to these NBA draft picks. They haven't had a singular. I mean, if he plays like this, it's looking very mislike.
Starting point is 00:35:45 Sure, he's a 19th pick in the draft. He had a good year, now he's struggling. I'm not preferred to call him a miss in the draft. Right outside of the lottery. Listen, it's miss adjacent. Dude, it's a close stretch. I'm not going to write off Brandon Pajemski. I'm running him off.
Starting point is 00:35:58 I'm over. I'm over it. I'm selling myself. Oh, my God. I like pods. I like pods. I think when it comes to like most disappointing player talk, that's completely fine.
Starting point is 00:36:08 Me personally, I think I would lean towards Jonathan Camino because expectations are higher. I feel more about him strongly than some like pods. I'm not, whenever I think about like the warriors and their roles and downfalls or the warriors and their successes, I'm not thinking about. Pajemski. He is Pots. He's there to do the simple things and be like an accessory cord whenever needed. The passing, a little bit of defense, spreading the floor and beating players off the dribble once in a while. I look at Jonathan Kaminga and I'm just like continuously
Starting point is 00:36:40 disappointed in him and how Steve Curry's handled that situation since he's been drafted. Moses Moody, great player doing what he's supposed to do. PODs, he's doing what he's supposed to do, but Kaminga hasn't been able to like find ways. not doing what he has to do. I agree with you. I agree with you. Because the two that I was deciding over were between Kaminga and Pots. And the one stat that stood out to me where I was like, oh, yeah, now.
Starting point is 00:37:06 Like this guy, he's thinking it up. Pods. Pods has had three games this season with two or more threes out of 19. That's insane. Three, three games. This is coming from a player who shot 38% from three last. year he has three games this season with two or more and mo you mentioned that that your expectations are lower and i get that why you say that but this team's expectations were not lower
Starting point is 00:37:34 for brandon pajemsky it was reported that the jazz desire to have him is why they didn't get loud of marketing because they refused to trade brandon pejemsky because they viewed him as a neck young cornerstone they didn't view him as this ancillary guy like oh go do everything pause we'll handle everything you just do you no they viewed him as an important piece that can be the off-card of the future next to Steph Curry that can be an important part of their defense and their offense. And he is doing either three nor a D right now. So
Starting point is 00:38:00 I think his disappointment, especially with the Anthony Melton injured, is immensely important. Exactly. Exactly. That is one. Because right now they can play buddy healed and have good offense but no defense or they can play Gary Payton
Starting point is 00:38:15 to second and have good defense or no offense. They're back in that position where they're picking if they're going to go either side. And the Anthony Melton was the key to having a two-way backcourt. Pods needs to be that now, and he can't be. I thought Pods will turn it around now. He should turn it around. Yeah, yeah.
Starting point is 00:38:30 I'm not out of him, but he's playing like fucking garbage. We know he can be better. That's why we're calling him out, but yeah. He needs to get better fast because they're on a five-game win streak with losing streak. No end in sight. Oh, yeah, losing streak. And they need some fucking lifeline into a better run of the season.
Starting point is 00:38:47 I agree. They need different looks. They need different looks. What's your next? all right next up i guess we can go ahead and breeze over a team like the toronto raptors i think plenty of people has felt this on twitter specifically people are talking about how this is one of the most ethical tanks that they've seen in quite a while you know if you're a tonal ropers fan you should be super happy with what you have in front of you scottie barnes is back
Starting point is 00:39:16 starting to ramp things up a little bit i've had a great had a great game last night or two nights ago Grady Dick has slowed in, slowed down as of late, but still has, like, maintained a level of aggressiveness, which is what you love to see. And then R.J. Barr has completely changed the trajectory of his career. He looks like a real foundational piece. Now, when you think about disappointing, disappointment for this Raptors organization, it's hard to pinpoint one specific, someone specific player, but other than they're, like, guard rotation. Ochoibaji, can't say anything about him. He's doing his job averaging, like, their team. points, efficient as hell.
Starting point is 00:39:51 Cool. I'm looking at Emmanuel quickly. I guess you could say he might be a little bit disappointing, but he only played like three games. So at that point, I really can't really call him that. After that, my attention goes to someone like Davion Mitchell, who was
Starting point is 00:40:05 a lottery picture just a couple of years ago. They got him for practically nothing from the Sacramento Kings, and this is the most amount of opportunity that he's ever had in his entire NBA career. And to see him still not to be as efficient as a shooter when it comes to what this team needs around their star players and Scotty barns and
Starting point is 00:40:25 god damn i can't believe i'm saying about r j barrett that's slightly disappointing is the world ending and crashing burning no it's not the end of the world whatsoever but if you're going to place disappointment on a player it's got to be him yeah you said a lot of words to say there's not a big disappointment on the raptors i think it's you got out of davy on Mitchell on your list the answer is they don't have a big disappointment things are going great they're not even going to be tanking anymore Scotty Barnes has come back starting a point guard and been amazing playing like a star again so things are going well for the Raptors
Starting point is 00:40:55 Raptors fans are always commenting you as when talk about us yada yada today's the day we're not going to say a single more word about you because things are going good so you shouldn't want us I try to go ahead and give them their love and give them like you know a brief hierarchy of how their scenes is going right now and you just try to shut them up I try to find things are going very well right now we don't got to pretend they're doing quite well all the young players look good
Starting point is 00:41:17 we can move on except for Davion yeah sure whatever it's not high on a priority list let's talk about a player that you love to shit on mo for no reason over the years whoa and not shit on but you like to say that fans have too high expectations for him that you never saw the vision well your anti agenda is currently aging amazing because the most disappointing player on the sacramento kings is kegan murray okay yes yes yes let's talk okay and for him it's real simple it's he is not making threes. And this is a team we talked about last time we did our power rankings that does not
Starting point is 00:41:52 win the three point volume battle at all. They are currently 24th and three point volume and 25th in efficiency while giving up a lot of threes because they don't have any shots at the rim to try to hide them on to Sabonis. So this team is built around Dearen Fox, Sabonis, and DeRosen, non-three-point shooters besides Fox, who's a good three-point shooter, but not great. But, you know, not a lot of volume there. And the Kings desperately need Keegan Murray to provide some shooting. They desperately We need Kevin Hurd to provide some shooting, Malik Monk, etc. And Keegan Murray is by far in a way their best shooter. He's supposed to be the guy that provides a three and the D
Starting point is 00:42:25 and he is completely lost to three right now. 29% from three, 30% on catch and shoot threes, 11% on pull-up threes. And 96% of his threes are open, and he's still shooting this terribly. That's the most damn end stat about it. That's crazy. Every shot that you take is open and you can't make one.
Starting point is 00:42:45 And you shoot 28% on the, open threes it's probably just a cold stretch he's had a career of shooting well so he'll probably get back to it but they're the goddamn 13 or 12 seed right now i don't know where they're standing because it changes every day and this is a big swing factor of what is going to be the thing that can maybe save them yeah you better make some shots my guy yeah we can keep this quick but i've always not a fan of teams overly relying on role players who are just simply role players and are good at being good they're not great but they're good at being good and so such to see but hopefully they think it's better yeah again this isn't one I'm terribly
Starting point is 00:43:21 worried about long term but it's a big problem oh for sure with how they're built but tomorrow's in there I'd be terribly worried yeah they have a ridiculous amount of heavy weight on his shoulders yeah I agree I agree all right I'm I'm doubling up I'm going to because there's one that we don't really have to spend too much time on and that's okay easily the New Orleans pelicans just because this is a loss season for everybody's everybody's dead the only thing is that that one of the people that is hurt is Zion, and you just never want to see that from him
Starting point is 00:43:51 because it always gives you some more, like, concern about can we build around him? Can we do, you know, can we ask? Those home recesses are out the door. That's what I'm saying. Like, we've been having that so many times, but like this season, again, it's like he was just, it looked like he was having the breakout year last year,
Starting point is 00:44:06 and then now we have to go through another year of, like, injury stuff. So that stuff is not, it's not great to hear. Yeah, we've talked a lot about Zion being the big disappointment. We don't got to beat a dead horse. Exactly. It's looking tough for his future.
Starting point is 00:44:17 Obviously, we don't got to say too much about them. What's your second team for this? The second team that we're going to talk about is the Orlando Magic. Listen, you may think that everything is good, right? Because they, listen, Franz Wagner has turned into a start. They've maintained while Palo's out. However, the one kind of weak spot that you can still point to is KCP and his shooting. Because he's, no, I'm going to give him a little bit of credit over the last week.
Starting point is 00:44:40 He's had a couple of good games, right? It's starting to look like he turned around. However, right after that good week went back to being. you know, the struggling KCP that we've seen for a majority of the year. He's already had seven games this year without hitting a single three. He said seven overs this year. And the big, the big big thing, obviously, why everybody was excited with when the magic signed KCP is because last year, they needed shooting.
Starting point is 00:45:08 KCP is known for being a shooter. And if he's not there, being a shooter, then it's a problem. Right. So that's the thing that if you're looking at the magic, it's kind of disappointing because especially when Palo comes back, if Palo can come back and be at the level that he was, if Franz can continue to play at this level and then you get KCP and his shooting can get there, the magic are they might be the second best team in the Easton Conference. Yeah. There's a big theme here going on. In the age of the three-point shooting era and the volume of three is needed from every team, a big running theme of most disappointing. players is going to simply be people who are there having an extremely cold shooting season.
Starting point is 00:45:48 And KCP is a poster boy that his edition was talked about like it was damn near a star edition because his shooting was that desperately needed on a team like this. So the high-end role player adjustment that they could add to that offense by adding in KCP shooting could have a star type of leap for their offense. And they just have been robbed of that. Exactly. And it's like we kind of hinted or people were kind of pushing back on the idea that, you know, KCP is going to come in and completely change the magic because he did have a bad,
Starting point is 00:46:19 a bad playoffs. He wasn't a knockdown, knockdown shooter for, you know, his, the second half of his career in Denver. But there's certain guys that just like on defense, you already have the reputation of being a good defender, you can have that as a shooter. There's certain guys that are labeled as shooters and you have to give them respect as such. And KCP is kind of one of them. But he's not knocking him down.
Starting point is 00:46:46 So Orlando, they're going to need some shots out of him. Yeah. Yeah. He hate to see it. You just hate to see it. Actually, in my opinion, too, if you're going to talk about, like, most disappointing players for the Orlando Magic, KCP, salute, he's one of them. But I also think, like, someone, like, Cole Anthony is easily one of the most disappointing
Starting point is 00:47:03 players, too. His role has just continuously, like, dwindled over the last few years. And people have always complained and talked about how they need lead guard, crates and shooting, and all sorts of stuff. Meanwhile, you drafted the guy who's supposed to fix all those issues and wells just a few years ago. And he's average career lows across the board.
Starting point is 00:47:22 So it's like, I get that. He had an opportunity to kind of lock that up. And he, when he was getting major minutes, the team was getting better. And they still said, yeah, we're still going to need an upgrade. So I don't, I don't feel as bad because I do feel like, oh, Anthony has had opportunities to show exactly how good he can be
Starting point is 00:47:43 and how much he can lead an offense and lead a team. So it's like, it is what it is, but they're, they're just going to keep taking shots. Yeah. All right. What's your next team, Mo? That's fair.
Starting point is 00:47:53 All right. So my next team is going to be the Denver Nuggets. Sad to say, this is not really shocking whatsoever, but Jamal Murray has easily been consistently one of the most disappointing players in the league, one of the most disappointing players that the NBA has to offer because he has a chance to do something special with one of the greatest, people keep on saying it might be one of the greatest offensive players at all time. No, like Nicole Yolich is one of the greatest offensive players of all time. He's in all types of conversations. Don't care what names you put up. He can look them in
Starting point is 00:48:22 the eye when it comes to what he is offensively. And you have Jamal Murray, someone who you had the opportunity to trade away back when he was injury riddles, towards ACL and all that. But you decided to keep him. Stay 10 toes down. Great. I love to hear that. Love to see it. And you won an NBA championship. You did that once. I was a couple of years ago. and Nicola Nokia since the NBA championship had done nothing but just like loved up his game even more than what it once was. And so you have this generational player who's just stomping every defense that tries anything up against him. Meanwhile, your sidekick, whose job is to really just be, empty the clip, hit tough shots, hit clutch shots and be ultra aggressive on that end, has looked like a shadow, a cast of himself. on a consistent basis this season.
Starting point is 00:49:15 And so with him being this level of disappointing, if I'm a team like Denver Nuggets, I'm looking to trade him immediately so you don't continue to waste any more time and give yourself an opportunity to maximize on Yokic's peak and prime. He's been so disappointing. So, that's interesting.
Starting point is 00:49:32 I didn't think that you would go there with him. Because obviously, like, I'm with you. I do think that he is the most disappointing. And it's clear, I guess, like, from the outside looking in, it's clear that he's not 100% healthy. Is it? I think so. I think that he has moved very, very weird since the cap injury.
Starting point is 00:49:54 And it's been kind of clear now. Whether or not you think that he's healthy and that stuff is gone, that's a different conversation. And if you think that, then I am with Mo. You have to move on, like, immediately. Because obviously, like, everything that you do is around Yokic and you need the pieces. Yeah. I think it seems, again, listen to Nuggets fans, seeing the reporting, there surely is lingering issues.
Starting point is 00:50:17 There always is with this type of stuff. So I don't want to say that you're completely wrong, that he's not fully healthy. I'm not going to claim he's fully healthy. I don't know that. Yeah. But at a certain point, if there seems linger forever, you have to start to wonder if maybe these are injuries that just have a permanent impact on your athleticism and this is just going to be who you are. And if that's the case you guys are right, that I don't know what means I think you're rid of them, just because I don't know if the value is going to be anything that can make them better. But I think it's safe to say that if he can't reach the playoff levels we saw a couple of years ago where he was playing at a top 10 point guard level, we were saying he's the best non-all-star in the league pretty clearly.
Starting point is 00:50:51 Like we were saying he's essentially another all-star. The talking point is always Yokis never has an all-star teammate, but we know Jamal Murray can rise to that when needed. If he can't do that, then you simply don't have a title ceiling. And we can talk a lot about KCP going, the bench sucking, yada, yada, if Jamal Murray is not the Jamal Murray of old, the title window does not exist. Yeah. depth you can have all the depth that you want everything in the NBA still does come down to can your top two players be like elite elite in the playoffs and then everybody has to fall in line from there but that is a very big foundation that you need to have and Jamal just isn't he's just
Starting point is 00:51:27 not showing him right now yeah and I don't know what they can do to retool around that if that's the reality if he's not going to give back the level which he might we could be wrong he could make a see crow you never know but if he can't you don't have a ton of young assets to be frank the pick situation it obviously gets better over a year as they replenish but they've made trades their second apron team
Starting point is 00:51:46 there's limited flexibility to go out and get a true second star unless a miraculous deal happens and a team just really wants Jamal Murray I don't have a ton of hope
Starting point is 00:51:55 for this problem changing anytime soon I agree the only hope is Jamal Murray getting it together and being the demar Murray of the old
Starting point is 00:52:02 yeah all right so is my turn now yes it is once again let's talk about a guy who is no we've done a lot of team a lot of disappointing players on here who just like aren't we've mentioned a lot of players who are just having cold shooting stretches right that that's disappointing they're playing below their obvious previous expectations
Starting point is 00:52:24 I want to talk about a guy who's playing exactly at his previous levels and has not gotten better in any meaningful way offensively that is jalen green jason green is a disappointment for the rockets because it coming after the end of last year when he had his annual insane March and April, we were like, listen, man, I don't think this is going to be the case. I don't think he's $6.5.5.000 of Mitchell now, but I think there may be a world
Starting point is 00:52:47 where he's somewhere in between that some of these skills that are developing can carry over to next year, and maybe he can be the second star that they're paying him to be in some capacity. He has done none of that same stuff. That stretch where he averaged damn near 30 for that month
Starting point is 00:53:02 is because his three-point shot was absolutely insane, and because of that, people had to respect them, and he'd be able to get to the room really well coming off of that. And the whole offensive package really started to click because he could not goddamn miss from three. He is back to shooting the exact same averages he shot last year, the year before that and the year before that at 34% from three. And that's really what he needs to be a star. He should do a little bit better at the rim, which is cool. His
Starting point is 00:53:25 athleticism is helping there. And he's defending better. So he's made some strides and he's a part of why they're so good. He's not selling them. But there's games where he gets hot and he goes with 30 because his three-point shot is falling. And in those games, you see a brief little glimpse of what this Rockies team could be with an elite off the dribble shooting threat next to Alper in Sangoon. And you're like, oh my God, if they had March Jalen Green for a whole year, they would be ridiculous because that skill set is exactly what this team needs. And his inability to do that consistently on a night and night out basis has to be the biggest disappointment for a team that otherwise is going really, really well.
Starting point is 00:54:02 We should have made this episode a year ago. because that's that's that's what I did the same shit that's that's what I consolidated all of my disappointment for Jalen Green because it's the same like you said it's the same thing year in and year out of what you want to see from Jalen rather than what you are getting from him on a consistent basis and so for me I'm not that disappointed I am more vindicated you are who I thought you and and that's that's it I think for them I think I would be more disappointed at Reed Shepard because he was the contingency plan in case Jalen Green did the same thing that he does over and over and Reed Shepard is not looking good.
Starting point is 00:54:44 Reed Shepard is not showing you flashes and that's for me. That's the more worrying thing if I'm the Rockets because this like damn like I had two chances to get a guard and right now it looks like that's still going to be a whole moving forward. But yeah, I'm just I'm never going to pick a rookie on this type of list but I know what you're saying like yeah we all have high hopes of read so it'd be nice to see. him come up on a hotter rate but yeah it's a rookie guard shit it's the same thing sometimes it becomes sometimes it becomes trey young you never know but it's hard to it's hard to like trust in the rookie guard like reed shepherd who's naturally like you said schooer trey young or whatever rookie guards just get
Starting point is 00:55:20 off to a tough time in general it's hard to want to give him that opportunity to get over those bumps on the road when you have preferably i'm in thompson tarry easton and all these guys playing the best team basketball for the Houston Rockets that they've seen since the James Sardner. It's so hard to want to give Re-Separd that opportunity and be like, okay, it's okay, like play through it. There's no such thing that's play through it. Why? Because they're winning right now. Yeah. So the Rockets most used lineup by far over 600 minutes is their starting lineup. That is Fred Van Vellee, Jalen Green, Dylan Brooks, Jabari Smith, and Alperin-Sengun. That lineup has a 114 offensive rating and 103 defensive rating. So plus nine. Very good, right? We know
Starting point is 00:56:01 It's because of that defensive rating is ridiculous The offense is like a little bit below average Their second most used lineup It's the same five starters Except you swap out Jalen Green for amend Thompson That lineup has played a little bit over 100 minutes So not the biggest sample size in the world But it's their second most used lineup
Starting point is 00:56:17 Wow man that team is plus 36 They have a 128 offensive rating And a 91 defensive rating By doing nothing 991 is ridiculous 128 is even stupider That's it. 128 offensive rating is ridiculous, unsustainably good, obviously.
Starting point is 00:56:34 But listen, you swap out Jalen Green for your best bench player and you become the best defense in the NBA, bar none, and your offense looks better. Again, it won't be, it won't sustain to that level. It won't be plus 36 all season that's out as asinine. But it matches what we've seen so far. You know that it looks like the writing's on the wall. Ryan might be on the wall right there. God damn right it does.
Starting point is 00:56:58 Amend Thompson is coming, man. just might have found a clue for me right there. Okay, bar. Yeah, man. We'll see. Jalen Green has made developments. He's better at the rim, and the defense has been noticeably better. So I'm not here to say, ha, ha, Jalen Green, you stink.
Starting point is 00:57:14 It's, ha, your three-point shot kind of stink. And I need that to be the saving grace of this offense. Okay. Okay. That's tough. That's tough. You know who also stinks? Who?
Starting point is 00:57:25 Market Smart for the Memphis Grizzlies. Okay. They hate that man. They hate that man. The other day, they were in the end-season tournament. Now they're limited, of course. I don't want to say thanks to Marcus Smart because there was a few other things. Yeah, NBA Cup.
Starting point is 00:57:41 There you go. My bad. Get it right. The Ambrates, the NBA Cup. Show some fucking respect. Show some respect to our corporate overlords. Exactly. All right, you're right.
Starting point is 00:57:50 Respect oil money. Point is, Marcus Smart. threw away. It felt like he threw away the game in multiple occasions, and it's not only this specific game that I'm over here bringing his name upon. It's basically throughout the entirety of the season, the entirety of the season for the Memphis. He's been nothing but disappointing. Going back to what you're similar to what you said about Janeline Green and his inconsistency from the three-point line, Marcus Smart has been nothing but that throughout his entire NBA career outside of maybe one or two years where he was just like, okay.
Starting point is 00:58:28 He's not giving you much on that end. Defensively, like, he is a playmaker, and when being a defensive playmaker, that comes with, like, being risky and making boneheaded plays, when you're trying to be witty and all that other stuff, hasn't worked out on that end as well. He's been pretty much an absolute zero for this team,
Starting point is 00:58:46 and I haven't looked at the stats yet, but I'm sure the minutes that he's playing are absolutely disgusting, and it looks like all Memphis Grizzies fans out there want him out of the town immediately. he's by far the most disappointing player yeah when he's on the court they currently have a 117 offense and 110 defense so they're one in those minutes by nature of the memphis grisies being fucking fantastic but his on-off numbers they are two points worse than him on the court checks out so you know he's just surrounded by great players on a great team so he's not going to
Starting point is 00:59:19 be this like disgusting catapulting black hole that ruins him but he's not making him better like they hoped right the idea was to have this ability to have a lockdown defender next to John Morant and also be a backup point guard. And part of its injuries, but part of it is just the three-point shooting that he saw in 2019 has consistently gone worse every year. He's not getting any more athletic. He's getting old. He's getting old.
Starting point is 00:59:42 Yeah. You just said his three-point shot from 2019. That was five years ago. That's a prime, right? That's a good amount of time. That being said, to stream to the Lakers. We need a defensive guard. It's safe Marcus Sports.
Starting point is 01:00:00 Did everybody? Donovan, he got next. Let's go to Detroit. And let's go to a guy who... We didn't forget you guys this time. Last time we needed underrated players, we forgot about you. We got you this time. I know I was in Detroit because I would have forgot him again.
Starting point is 01:00:17 Yeah, you probably would. I should have you to trade me. But every time I watch the Pistons, I'm always left saying, man, Jalen Dern is getting on my nerves. because Jalen Dern has not expanded his offensive game. Jalen Duren has not improved his defensive game. And it has led him getting, you know, less minutes. Shout out to J.B. Biggestap for seeing him play,
Starting point is 01:00:43 seeing him not improve on the things that they need him to improve and saying, I'm not going to do what Moni Williams did. I'm not going to keep you out on the floor for as long as it is. You can still be out here because you can do some things, but you're not taking the steps. forward. You are not progressing the way that we need to. And for the Pistons who are obviously in a rebuild, just want to see young players. Jalen Duren should be a guy who every year you see something. And it's just not, it's just not there. It's not clicking. And so he is the most
Starting point is 01:01:13 disappointing player on the Pistons. People like him because he has like, or attacks for him because he's like swole as hell and dunk for hard. So people assume he's like really good. You know, he got Dwight comparisons early last year. And you mentioned hasn't expanded his offensive game. I don't even fucking care about the offensive game. He can just be running Duck Mountain his whole career. The defensive effort and IQ and ability to make
Starting point is 01:01:33 smart pick and roll coverage reads has just not developed at all. And Isaiah Stewart oddly enough has been fantastic defensively after being dog ass last year when he's playing power forward. He's moved back to center and he's been a saving grace to them. He has been exceptional defensively. Yeah. I agree. I agree. When it comes
Starting point is 01:01:49 to Dylan Duren, like okay, you have Oracle, you can get away and steal NBA minutes. But if you're going to have ORA and you're not going to play defense, you might want to work on your offensive game, okay? You're not going to do that. You're not going to have a little shot. Your passing is a little interesting, but bro, you're jailing during. No one's ever going to prioritize that.
Starting point is 01:02:08 Let's be real. What is the point of you starting on my team? If I want you starting on my team, that means that I want the number one overall pick. The pistons are past that rebuilding phase right now. They're trying to get things together and build some self-respect for each other. they've done a for their organization and they've done a fantastic job this entire season they aren't they aren't embarrassing they aren't the washington wizards they're not the utahs that's so actually a team that you got to be like oh shit like they're kind of irritating to play against
Starting point is 01:02:36 and jane d's he's he's the anchor on this team holding them down in the worst ways possible bro yeah i mean okay i'm not i'm not you guys been real extreme with your hate today what do we I think Jalen Duren is still I think Jalen Duren shouldn't be He shouldn't be given up on Because I think he has the potential And athleticism that if you can let him develop And hopefully get him average defensively
Starting point is 01:03:01 You just think he's sexy No, it's the tools Oh my God Hey man, he's hot What can I say? If he can be Confident defensively Literally a same
Starting point is 01:03:11 There's a reason they're still playing Jalen Green Because if you can get them competent At their weaknesses The strengths can be huge And if they can make him a decent defender That man can dunk a basketball It'd be nice if they could play them enough. No, these guys go to practice.
Starting point is 01:03:25 They start biting their lips and the coach is like, all right, you got it. Like, I'm not, I'm, no, I don't, I don't have, the same way that I don't have much hope for Jalen Greeter. I don't think that I am super optimistic is the word that Jail Lerner will end up being, you know, the, the idealized version of what, of what he can be. And so seeing that and just like, said they're not they're not in phase one of the rebuild they're in phase two where you actually want to start being respectful winning games you need people to start taking those steps forward and now it's more of just like oh let's see you know what you can do and then we can build around it no we kind of have a vision and you need to fit into it and you need to start doing some things and he's not so that's why
Starting point is 01:04:09 yeah yeah you're you guys are right i'm just like they should probably see it through a little more and like see if he can develop because the potential's there but i don't I'm going to believe you for not being optimistic. It's not going well. Yeah. I can never be a gym. So you got, you got one and a half years. And I'm calling people up. What can I get more? I see what they want to see out of him. But yeah, you guys are right. It hasn't been pretty so far. I will see you, Jalen Green. Will I see it through? No, but I will see you on that bench.
Starting point is 01:04:42 Absolutely. I wonder how it feels to be somebody like Jalen Dern and like somebody sent you this clip and these guys are like, yeah, your defense is not good right now. I'm worried, but they're also like, you're kind of hot. But you're also sexy. I mean, you know, when is a win, you know what I'm saying? I mean, I can only do what I can, you feel me? You think I'm hot?
Starting point is 01:05:10 Oh, my God. Rushing the way. You know the playbook. You know the movie. okay what am i going to do next let me see i'll knock out two at once all right okay first one i'm gonna say yeah i'm gonna get over with real fast and how much to say about him kail kuzma you're playing like piss and i like kai kai kuzma a lot i like kow kuzma a lot but god damn has he been detrimental to the wizards it's okay because they're tanking so detriment is welcomed around that
Starting point is 01:05:42 town but he missed a first few games and man that ball was moving ball cool a ball you look great jordan pool looked great kisper was doing his thing everybody was looking at and fantastic. He comes back. He shoots 27% from three since he came back, is dominating the ball, getting his touches because he wants to be Kyle Kuzzo and put up his numbers,
Starting point is 01:05:59 be a score. That's what he'd get paid to do. So I understand he wants to assert that. The shot's not going in. He went from having 4.2 assists per game last year to 1.9 this year. He's not passing well. He's not scoring well.
Starting point is 01:06:12 He's not defending well. He's not rebounding well. He's not doing Jack's shit well right now. But he also has 2.4 turnovers. More turnovers than assists. That is the sign of a bad basketball player. Cal Coulouse was not that. He'll be better. But right now, for these first 20 games, he has been a bad basketball player. And I'm sure he'd be the first one to admit that. Kyle Cousman, I think you've been playing fantastic basketball. I like what you're doing. I told you what the goal is. The goal is to get Cooper Flagg and you've been trying so hard to go ahead and do so far. Isaac, you are wrong. Isaac, your analysis is Dogwater, dog shit.
Starting point is 01:06:40 Those match are skewed. They're not real. They're fake. I swear to God they are. Kyle Cusman, keep on. And it annoys me because he's a guy that I want to put into trade talks to put on a good team because he's a big wing that can do some. things with the ball. But if he's not going to be shooting the three well and he's going to be a black hole offensively, why the fuck would you trade for him right now? So maybe he wants to stay in Washington like when you could have gone to Dallas last year. Maybe he's tanking a stock on purpose. I think he's just trying to, I think if you're a team, this could easily be a trade that you just simply have to see through and buy in that yeah, like everything just sucks over there. They're starting two rookies and Alex Sahar and also Bubb who's like having
Starting point is 01:07:19 they're both having okay rookie season shout out to them I'm at the seat if I'm a team if I'm a contender who needs some type of gap filled in or some type of sixth man or whatever I'm 110% like getting off like as low as as as as as least as possible
Starting point is 01:07:33 for some of Macawkusen. Okay yeah we'll keep the Okieucus in one brief he just needs to play better that's clear day all right let's talk about another one that is serious that this is something we actually have to think about serious players standing in the league
Starting point is 01:07:48 Oh, wow. What is wrong with Bam out of bio this year? Oh, my gosh. Tell me that, because he is, the Miami Heat are full of disappointments. Jimmy Butler looks like he's taking a step back, but I won't give him the title because he's getting old.
Starting point is 01:07:59 It's fine. That happens. Bam out of bio looks awful. And this is a player that we have all been high on. We've put him high in the center rankings. We've said after those three superstars, he might be the next guy up. He's number four, five at worst.
Starting point is 01:08:14 He has played nothing like a top ten center right now, at least offensively. I don't have a strong feel for the defense. Maybe that's still being DPO Y levels. Miami Heat fans, you tell me. So great. Offensively, what the fuck is he cooking offensively? It makes no sense.
Starting point is 01:08:27 Two and a half years ago when he had his best offensive scoring year in 2022, 50% of his shots came from the rim, 37% came from Florida range and 12% on long-made range jumpers. No threes, right? We know this year he's really added some threes. That's kind of been a two-year transition. Fast forward a few years later this year, 18% of his shots come from three, up from zero.
Starting point is 01:08:45 So that's a pretty, you know, that makes sense. we'd like to see him stretch the floor a little bit, right? Tell me those nasty sets. I know you got him. But where the fuck did those shots come from? You would think he's turning long mid-range jumpers into threes doing the smart, efficient thing that every big man has done
Starting point is 01:08:58 in the modern NBA? Tell me about his touch. Please tell me now. Why would he? Why would he do that? Instead, he's shooting 38% of his shots at the rim now. He's down over 12%. He's not getting to the rim.
Starting point is 01:09:09 He's taking almost all of his shots from Florida range and long mid-range jumpers and a little bit of threes. And he is shooting piss from those spots. He's shooting his career work. First, 58% of the rim, down from 70. He's shooting 35% on floater range, despite that being where majority of his shots come from.
Starting point is 01:09:24 Every time he gets the ball down low, he doesn't want to use assertive athleticism to dunk on people to get into dunker spot range as anything. He wants to hit his flutter game, and he wants to be modern-day David West, modern-day Lamarcus Aldridge, do this little mid-range game where you get these tough shots off
Starting point is 01:09:37 because I'm assuming he thinks that'll help him have longevity as a score. He can do that for a long time and not be reliant on his athleticism. Make sense in theory, but if you're going to suck at those shots, I suggest you get down low and dunk that fucking ball
Starting point is 01:09:49 because that is what you're really athletic and really good at and it is not going well with this soft-ass jump shot approach. Yeah, tell him to be big and get in the paint. Let's please. I love that.
Starting point is 01:10:01 I love that. Put your shoulder in somebody's chest, god damn it. Use that wingspan. If I don't see a drop step a night, please. Please. Now, yeah, I don't, I don't know.
Starting point is 01:10:14 It's very weird because like I we've talked this whole episode about guys who have had bad shooting seasons but it's been from three I can't remember off the top of my head guys who have like bad shooting seasons from the rim and they just like lose their they like you lose your touch and then all of a sudden it comes back so that loki is kind of worrying to me that that bam isn't shooting well at at the rim and like I don't yeah I don't I don't have a great grasp of as to, like, what, like, the pinpoint thing it is that's causing him to miss all these layouts. I just know that every time I watch the end, he's missing these bunnies. Something I'll say is that the Miami's offense in general is absolutely disgusting. Like, they are one of the, they try to feast when it comes to the mid-range game.
Starting point is 01:11:07 Three-pointers, they've been trying as a late, and it's just not been working out for them obviously over the last few years, might I say. And so this team overall just sucks their game plan, sucks. They're all in the mud. Eric Spoltsch is still in my mind. He's worldly renowned as one of the better coaches, head coaches in the NBA so far this year. It hasn't been a great display of that. And when he isn't on his piece and cues and the shot diet is just not adding up in the big year, 2024. And then on top of that, too, your best player in Bam out of bio, someone who's supposed to, you know, take the reins from Jimmy Butler isn't performing as well. It's a quick product.
Starting point is 01:11:43 And that's what... I think I have an idea what it is. What is it? I think. I don't know who trainer is, but I bet he has one. And I bet it's on some Drew Handling shit. And I bet he spent all summer working on, pull up jumpers, doing those hangpools. And I bet he came into the season with that as a large part of his priority to get better as a jump shooter.
Starting point is 01:12:04 Like I said, to prolong that longevity and build that out of his game. And when you spend all summer working on something, you want to pull that shit out in the game. and it's been just too much he hasn't found that balance it's okay to prioritize becoming a better shooter and working on that but not at the detriment of your strengths
Starting point is 01:12:20 and that's been the biggest problem as well as the Miami Heat as well as the Miami Heat just having nobody to set up open rim shots for him so he has to get it out of the mud and create the shots by himself and he just doesn't have that type of skill set
Starting point is 01:12:30 he needs to be finishing pick and roll lobs and stuff like that to get to the rim if he's creating face-up opportunities he's gonna be taking jumpers because it's not blown by people you're setting us up right now Because Drew Hanlon been on these internet streets fighting for his life the entire time. Oh, he saved Janus.
Starting point is 01:12:45 Shouted Drew Hanlon. He made Janus a goon this year. Yonis is a mid-range demon because Drew Hanlon was in his back. And Alpsom positivity. I love it. Drew Hanlon, we're not coming for you. In fact, I would like to get in the lab with you soon. Yeah, let's get him all right.
Starting point is 01:12:59 Maybe he should get in the lab at Bam. Apparently, Bam needs saving his mid-range jumper right now. So Drew Hanlon, hit him up, please. Yeah. Please. I agree. I agree. All right.
Starting point is 01:13:08 Dude, okay, so I have a few teams here that are kind of irrelevant in terms of who's the most disappointing player. Few of them. I'll go ahead and just write them off. The Charlotte Hornets, how can I say anybody is really disappointing? The Mellow Ball is currently out within dreams having the season of his goddamn life right now. If you want to say Brandon Miller is disappointing, disappointing, eh, cool. I think you start off a little bit slow, but really, signs are there. They're just a team that has a lot of gray areas.
Starting point is 01:13:34 He might be it, though. Okay, next team, the Chicago Bulls. The Chicago Bulls are the Chicago Bulls. No one has any real expectations for these players. Nikola Wutchevich playing good basketball. Zach Levine doing the same thing. Josh Gitties being productive. Who is disappointed on this team?
Starting point is 01:13:51 If you want to say Patrick Williams, cool. He's shooting like sub 40% from the field as a power forward. That is absolutely disgusting. No one cares. Okay. Yeah. Okay.
Starting point is 01:14:03 So let the segment be the ones, the teams who don't have a clear disappointment. and let's let's speed run through these I have the spurs who I think also don't really have a disappointing player Jeremy someone got hurt that sucks
Starting point is 01:14:14 that's kind of disappointing Wemby has been fantastic of the last 15 games especially he's shooting over 40% and 3 on ridiculous volume not a disappointment Chris Paul has been great for his standards
Starting point is 01:14:24 at this point of his career not a disappointment Harrison Barnes has been shooting the three wall not disappointment Vesel came back he's been shooting the shit out of the ball not a disappointment like things are going well
Starting point is 01:14:34 maybe there's some bench players that fans are pissed off at I don't know how they feel about Malachi Brandom right now, whatever, but overall, I don't have anything to pinpoint for the Spurs. Okay. Nice. I think for me, the, the Cavs, I don't see, I don't see anybody as being like a massive disappointment for the Cavs.
Starting point is 01:14:51 Like, I know, I know DeMitt hasn't been like, you know, best shooting guard in the league, you know, like it hasn't looked the same. But I watched, I watched them and I watched the way that they performed. I watched the way that he's playing. And it doesn't seem like a massive disappointment. So that's why I'm not going to give them anybody. And then for the Celtics, I put down Jalen Brown, but I don't really feel like it's kind of the same thing.
Starting point is 01:15:15 I don't feel like Jalen Brown has been a massive disappointment. He isn't shooting the ball particularly well, but he's also doing some things better. Like Jalen Brown's getting to the free throw line like seven times a game, which is huge. Yeah, it's a huge. It's a massive upgrade. So you can, you can either say Jalen Brown on that. Sam Houser, you got your whiteboard chain sats by Peyton Pritcher. Like he's the guy now.
Starting point is 01:15:36 like maybe if you want to go there but but yeah for the captain the Celtics there's really nobody on those rosters so i'm like yeah you guys just thinking it up okay okay and that's a little speed run i got another one one more the brooklyn nets no one cares brooklyn netts no one cares brooklyn netts yeah everybody everything's going well for these teams either well or two expectations so it's not that we don't care about your team many those things are good many of those teams are interesting it's just in terms of disappointing nothing to say yeah yeah exactly nothing's really disappointing okay which again if you're ever going to get written off on an episode this is the one this is the one where it's okay exactly don't be upset
Starting point is 01:16:15 your team is either like met expectation or like no one's really has like or exceeded you know you can't you could put the playing game on nobody that's cool so how many how many i've i've i've have three teams left i have a few more left i have a few more left and a player that i want to talk about next okay belongs on the oklahoma city thunder again it's hard to point to anyone being disappointing but if there is one he sticks out on like a sore thumb
Starting point is 01:16:40 on one end specifically and it's obviously Alex Caruso his shooting has like been evaporated I don't know what has happened I don't know what juice I don't know what like
Starting point is 01:16:51 black magic juice is out he can't score anymore he can't score for anything his offensive chops has like completely evaporated or it's like pass his head boy got sucked up now he's awful
Starting point is 01:17:04 I don't know what happened to you They had sucked Alex Cruz My boy got trained, man They don't slurped his powers Isaac, I know you got the numbers for me Do you have Alex Cruz those offices stats? No, but they're bad, I'm sure. I'll pull them up.
Starting point is 01:17:30 I'm sure they're disgusting. Last time I took you shoot like 20-some percent from the three-point line and over the last few games, I'm sure that they did not improve whatsoever. Oh, 21% from 3, 15% from the non-corner 3s, 30% from mid-range, 62% at the rim, which is down a little bit, but not terrible. 41% overall effective field goal percentage. This is a non-threat as a score.
Starting point is 01:17:50 That's what that is. That is a guy who is doing absolutely nothing for you offensively. At least it's a score. We know he's a good passer and keeps the ball moving well. He's the guy that the box score never tells the full story of Alex Caruso, which maybe is a little bit of nerd cope. but he needs to shoot at least a decent
Starting point is 01:18:05 at least average or at least a little bit below average not non-existent threat now tell me real quick while Moe's talking Isaac can you tell me
Starting point is 01:18:13 or can you look up what Josh Giddy was shooting last season dog ass as well but better than that better than that he saw actually well quote unquote well
Starting point is 01:18:22 but those stats are so fake he had 52% effective football percentage 34% from 3 and 60% at the rim so below average from 3 opposed to nothing at all Granted his defense is piss
Starting point is 01:18:35 And Alex Caruso is still an elite defender So I'd still rather have Caruso But yeah This team We thought they were gonna push Fucking 70 games Win 65 because they had Iheart and Chet in the back
Starting point is 01:18:48 And Caruso As this lockdown guard adding to this team Their white ball rotation was dangerous It was the deepest as week And sadly those white boys have been broken All those white boys have been sucked Chet has his fucking pelvic is broken that's crazy
Starting point is 01:19:04 Alice Caruso's hurt now it wasn't performing well this team is still at one seed but we're kind of be wrong but breaking white more is the O KC man break Collison your only saving grace please fix it what has happened
Starting point is 01:19:17 it's a little bit disappointing it's a little bit disappointing that we've been robbed to this insane season but with that being said they will be fucking fine Caruso will shoot better the bigs will get healthy at some point it doesn't matter but what could have been could have been historic
Starting point is 01:19:31 yeah exactly I agree. Okay, what's my next one? Next one I'll do. McHale Bridges for the New York Knicks has not been worth six first round picks. When this trade was happened, Donovan was hype.
Starting point is 01:19:48 He was, oh, let's go. New York Knicks basketball Knicks tape. And I was like, I like it. I won't rent on your parade. But I think I told you they gave up a lot. I was like, this is a lot of picks that value-wise, it does not make sense even a little bit.
Starting point is 01:20:01 It's outrageous. for a role player. But I understand it because they're so close that you have to overpay to get over that to hit that next little nudge to get to the championship level. It makes sense to overpay when you know that overpay will make you them.
Starting point is 01:20:15 And it has been. They're the top offensive league for the last two weeks. They're running it up offensively. They're good. Number one offensive league. Now that we know they did the cat trade though, it makes this trade look a lot less essential. Because we thought, okay, you overpay
Starting point is 01:20:29 because you need a little bit of talent injection. You got it. Then you got it again with Kat. So it makes it seem like you maybe didn't need to give up all this picture, Mikhail Bridges, who the whole selling point was that we can get his defense back to the levels it was with the Phoenix Suns when he was not just good, not just great, not just very great. He was third and defensive player of the year voting. You know how outrageous it is to be a wing defender and be third in DPOI voting? That shit does not happen ever.
Starting point is 01:20:56 He was amazing defensively. We commonly came up on the show and called him the best role player in the goddamn league. Then he went to the Brooklyn Nets Got a little big for his britches He started taking a lot of shots Being the one option Abandoned defensive intensity altogether And we thought maybe he would come back
Starting point is 01:21:09 This year with a smaller role in the Knicks We'd see some kind of hybrid Where the offensive skill set he gained Would make him better than that end But the defense would return a little bit And kind of have him be even Has not happened Their defense is not particularly good
Starting point is 01:21:21 When he was expected to be the guy to make it great So that's a little bit disappointing No man I hate the Nets I hate the Nets I hate the Nets They sucked up McKale's D now he can't stop anybody it's ridiculous why did they suck of his d
Starting point is 01:21:39 i hate the nets man he's shooting 46% on corner three if he's in the corner and he's standing like this and he shoots it's a bucket but if he shoots a non-corner three it's a brick every time unless it's a fade away he's killing the fair ones there you go he's not getting to the rim at all either which might be by design of the offense a career low 50s percent of his shots so he's been great for mid-range like he always is that's been nice that
Starting point is 01:22:05 part has carried over from the you know the development he had with the brooklyn nets but he you have to have the wing duo of ogy and macaille be great defensively for this team to win a championship the fact that's never going to happen again i think we can write off mcale bridge's defense it's never going to come back so this is a very good team that's hard to imagine them hanging with the boston celtics yeah i just don't want i just don't want to talk about it All right, we can move on. However, I'm going to stay in my sadness a little bit because I want to talk about another guy who is near and near to my heart.
Starting point is 01:22:36 We're going to talk about how Bobby Portis is one of the most disappointing players on the Milwaukee Bucks. And listen, over the off season, I put him kind of high in our power forward rankings. And I was only off of vibes. And I was out of lawyers because I love Bobby Portis. And as somebody who is one of who's on the leadership committee of the Bobby Portis fan club i have to do this to me i have to let him know you're not you're not playing well uh but listen damn it bobby i mean the defense is just awful it's just it's just nothing you know like he just can't guard anybody and there's so many times where shit the offense isn't there either
Starting point is 01:23:15 listen nothing's there nothing's there and if the if the bucks weren't a second apron team who had limited resources to go out and get everybody and didn't have to go and find brand new know, point of attack defenders and somebody who can cover up for Dane, they probably would have spent one of those assets on getting a Bobby Porter's replacement. But they are stuck with Bobby Portis and they have to keep playing him. But if this was a serious, serious team, he's unplayable. He's not like that. Yeah, I, Bucks fans hate him with all their heart. It's like comical because he used to be like a fan darling. And there's some games where he gets like cheered from the crowd at the game because they so love him. But people on Twitter are like,
Starting point is 01:23:57 the fuck are you idiots watching he's playing so bad why are you cheering like yeah he got like so much yeah he got cheered last night and that's honestly the best part about the bobby for this experience because he got into some like scuffle i forgot with i think it was with with uh risha shay um it was one of them light skins tangled up bobby and you know they went they weren't they were falling into the stands and then the whole crowd was like bobby yeah like he was about to fight That's the best part about the Bobby Portis experience at this point, is that he might win the fight, and that's it. But as for basketball, it's not looking good.
Starting point is 01:24:36 You know what else is, oh, go ahead. No, I don't got shit to say. No, okay, cool. You know what else I don't got you to say about? The Philadelphia is 76ers. They got nobodies. When he comes to talking about disappointment, bro, you could say MB is not there, not playing.
Starting point is 01:24:53 What else is there to say? I'm going to say MB. Let's talk about that. No, it's not write that off. We haven't really, we referenced it. Let's talk about the- I'm gonna say PG-G-G-G-G-Bin-pick. Sure.
Starting point is 01:25:06 Yeah, PG's spot-bine-pick. Yeah. I think Joellen, we might have reached the end of the Joelan B. Prime. I think that hasn't been confirmed, but it feels like we're getting to that point where the injuries are stacking up, and he's, you know,
Starting point is 01:25:23 just think about the timeline of what's happened. We referenced it in the past few episodes, how disappointed it is. He's out again. He came back, wasn't that good, went out again immediately. We haven't really unpacked the big picture thing here. He played in the Olympics, and immediately after it was reported that he's dealing with an injury. Made it seem like he probably shouldn't have been playing in the goddamn Olympics, especially coming off of a playoff arm where he wasn't healthy to begin with. As soon as that was reported, it was real, real quiet kept about how severe this injury is. And out of nowhere, before the season started, we were like, oh, he's
Starting point is 01:25:53 actually going to miss the entire beginning of the season, and we don't know for how long. He comes back, obviously, after not having a training camp at all and being injured all summer, looks garbage. How could he not? He's coming back from so much rust, and he is a rhythm-based player. Then immediately gets hurt again, like three games after, you know, when these players like this have these injury issues, they fight through for their whole career, think about Brandon Roy, think about Greg Oden, think about Yao Ming, Tracy McGrady, all these guys. I think Tracy McGrady is a good example, where there's a few big injuries, it happens, they get robbed, they come back, and they come back, and, and they come back. you know, to kind of rinse and repeat and get to themselves, once they reach the end of this cycle,
Starting point is 01:26:30 their body breaking down, they quickly get to the point where they're injured every five seconds and can't stay on the court. Same thing happened with Derek Rose. He had two major ones, came back, and then like the third year after that, every five seconds were injured. I fear that we maybe reached that point with Joel and Bede
Starting point is 01:26:45 and it sucks because he was so underappreciated in his prime for all the reasons we've talked about on the show for years. I fear the era domination might be over. Okay. that was a lot to say that was a lot to say i'm not going to go to that extent when it comes to i'm scared i'm scared like you're scared when he comes to his prime being officially over but i can i wholeheartedly understand for all your for all your reasons good points but i need to see him ill i need to see him on the court in order and i need to see the effects of those injuries
Starting point is 01:27:19 genuinely slowing him down for an extended period of time and sadly like that's a problem you're not going to see him on the court that's the issue that's the issue but eventually whenever it does happen maybe in february when he's on the court on a consistent basis and if he has like a 15 game stretch of just not looking then that not looking like that guy i'm ringing the bells of horror because at that point like it might actually be over and if it's over at that point then like you have to look at oh shit we just gave this guy paul george who's like 35 years old a fucking insane bag and now the main hub of our offense and defense isn't even like that guy anymore, it's over.
Starting point is 01:27:55 You're cooked. Now, they still do have Jeremy McCain. Amazing. Love the vibes. Love the energy. Still do have Tyre's Maxie. Love the vibes. Love the energy again. Both, again, are bundles of joys. But the storm that Joel Embed
Starting point is 01:28:11 is, no matter how happy Tyre's Albert and Jeremy Kane may make you, like they cannot like overshine outshine what Joel and Billet is at all. Yeah. Again, and I'm not saying I seen him be cooked. I'm saying I fear he is cooked and I sense the pattern arising that happens a lot
Starting point is 01:28:31 with players at this stage. He's 30. And I know we've seen a lot of guys have crazy longevity. We have not seen a lot of guys that have his size and his style of play and his injury issues have longevity. Honestly, him making it a 30, he's had a good run. And we're hitting that point now, he has. That's such a lot of same as any.
Starting point is 01:28:51 no i mean like literally like the way he overcame those early injury issues and got like six amazing years that's not that's not a given like if it's reached that point it makes sense like we've had a long sample size that we probably took for granted as a fan base that spent those entire six years fucking slandering him for being unlucky but i don't know if we're going to see another 35 point per game stretch anytime soon if you hear the words he's had a good run culminated together. Oh shit, it's fucking over, bro. There's no more turning back at all. It's over. It's so over. I hope you're wrong. Yeah, I might be being dramatic. Well, maybe, maybe it's not as serious, but you said the, the Rockets thing, you said, what does that sound like? The writing
Starting point is 01:29:35 on the goddamn wall. I've seen some more riding over here in Philadelphia and I don't like the way it looks. Fear. Fear, fear, fear, fear, fear. Donovan's hate an ass, been quiet. I know. I'm just, I'm just letting y'all. Let me give you a little bit more to hate a about to my next team and i think this is my last team or the los angeles clippers same exact things going on over there of course they're a little bit they're a much better of a team led by their defense but there's no real conversation to be had other than like how like good vibes kind of going on over there because they're overcoming the obvious in kawai lander not being there and the same exact vibes happening philly in terms of mbeats happening over there
Starting point is 01:30:15 with kawai lander and the clippers so it's just like the right might be able to on the wall. Yeah, I mean, first all, I think it's been, exactly. It's been more on the wall for Kauai than it has been for Embed. And I feel I feel bad for Clippers fans more
Starting point is 01:30:36 so than Sixers fans just because they, yes, because they saw the run happen. Like they saw it about to happen. 2021 Kauai Leonard is an extremely special. player. It is, he, at that, at that moment, Kauai Leonard was one of, like, I feel like he had to send it to another level, you know, above, above 2019. And the way that he was playing in that series against
Starting point is 01:31:03 the Mavericks, like that was extremely special. Also, that team got to the conference finals without him, right? They were so solid around him. If there was ever going to be a team that made a run, it was going to be that one. And so to see them have that level of team success and then have koalander be hurt there that that kind of sucks and so that's that's why i feel bad for for them whereas like for the sixers you never really had it like you never really had the dominant joel series the dominant joel run like that so i do feel bad for for clippers fans in that sense but you know it's funny it's kind of it's kind of it's kind of it's what's funny for the clippers last stream we're talking about the clippers and i said i feel bad for their fans because i feel like
Starting point is 01:31:50 I feel bad for the team because the team has gotten it out the mud so hard when they were in such a bad situation after Kauai got hurt and they just pulled their bootstraps up and just fought their way to the six seat right now have been well about 500. I said I feel like I feel bad for them
Starting point is 01:32:03 because these players are owed an opportunity to contend with a healthy Kauai Leonard. I talk about how annoyed that makes me for their fans and how bad I feel for the players and the team and everything. And Donovan was like, I don't feel bad for those bitches. They deserve it.
Starting point is 01:32:17 I know you woke up feeling better today because now you're talking about you feel bad for the fans. fans last time you were like fuck clippers fuck the fans fuck the staff i say this i said that i feel bad for them more so than the than philly fan on a relative scale yes i feel bad if we're talking about absolutes i don't care about them right i don't right i don't i don't it is it is what it is but get because at the end at the end of the day they are both they're both hanging on to a thread right that's that's all that's all that they that's all that they have no this is
Starting point is 01:32:56 i feel back to the clippers they deserve a shot they are so good right now and i respect them yeah i did too shout out to ty lu he's one of the best coaches in the NBA i don't know i don't know if any coach out the jimbo hardin but he said the first name person can go ahead and do this shit bro oh you said james who harded i love that prediction that i made earlier this year It's aging like wine There's not a lot of my predictions In terms of James Hardin looking Like similar-ish
Starting point is 01:33:25 And having being like 50% of prime James Hardin Ah Yeah, he's definitely having a good year For what he can give you people right now Yeah, exactly I have two teams left One is the Pacers I don't know if I feel the need to say it
Starting point is 01:33:40 We know is Tyre's Halliburton We've had many talks about his play this year How I am done predicting him To become a top five point guard again that ship has sailed. He does some good games as of late, some get right games. But then they're always immediately followed with another three for 15 from the field game after. So there's some ups now.
Starting point is 01:33:58 It's not just down, but it's very much still up and down. It's the beds, man. You know what it is. You said it earlier before, too, like a couple weeks ago. It's the beds, bro. The hotels that they'd be having him sleep at. He got a bad back. Too hard in his back, man.
Starting point is 01:34:12 Yeah, well, we know Tyre's Halliburton has been a disappointment for the pastures this year. We talked about that at length. last thing I have though is a Minnesota Timberwolves and for them I have Jaden McDaniels Tell us why Jaddeny McDaniels was paid big A couple of a couple summers ago
Starting point is 01:34:28 We all thought you deserved it It was like oh good deal You lock down your young 3&D wing Who's looking like he's developing Into one of the best role players in the league He was looking like a little 2021 McHill Bridges-ish Didn't have quite the scoring impact
Starting point is 01:34:42 But we saw the skill start to develop And we kind of said I think he has the opportunity to take a big leap and get more on ball chob start to do more with that frame do more with that defensive baseline really develop since then he has developed
Starting point is 01:34:55 absolutely zero the defense is I'm sure still good he's not quite like a Herb Jones type locked on defender he's a little skinnier a little easier to push around by a Luca type so he's not like the one-on-one lockdown but he is still a very good defender could make an all defense team any year
Starting point is 01:35:09 whatever that hasn't gone anywhere but offensively there's no real no real development he currently has his lowest rim-focal percentage since his rookie year he's not finishing well he's 40% on mid-range the lowest of his career 30% from three the lowest of his career simply put we have to stop predicting that every promising 3 in d wing that has a long wing span and is below 20 years old we have to stop predicting they're going to become stars because some of these guys can't really dribble and if you're like jimmy daniels and your handle isn't the strongest you're not going to become a high-level offensive player the development is going to stall out because you need to have a base line good enough handle to create advantages doesn't seem like it's ever going to happen for him it'll be great he'll be a good defender but the next level i don't think it's coming yeah it's very it's very disappointing especially now now that like cat is not out of there and you bring julius randall in you you knew that you were going to play a different style of basketball and you were like okay
Starting point is 01:36:05 we're getting rid of cat we're getting rid of our spacing five even though that julius randu can't hit the three he's not a shooter like that but we have dante and you were hoping We have Jada McDaniels, and you can have enough three-point creation. And on top of that, when you add the fact that Anthony Edwards is going to take over 10 threes a game, yeah, we can live with that. But when Dante is shooting bad and when Jaden is shooting bad, it leaves your offense in a place of just like meh. And you don't really have any direction from beyond the three-point line. So I definitely, I definitely get that of why he's the most disappointing for them. yeah yeah he's jem mcdaniels and if you recalibrate your expectations that he's just going to be
Starting point is 01:36:48 a role player and like be a guy for your team that's part of your core but not like somebody you're looking to to raise all tides i'm sure he's okay obviously he's to shoot better from 30% from three that'll come around but i had a lot of stock in him really making a leap and i'm just over that yeah i feel like when it comes to these specific role players in the same archetype as jada McDaniels, I could always look at another situation adjacent and be like, yeah, this is the exact same thing going on just in different cities. Keegan Murray, some people just simply buy too much stock into what this offensive player could be, whatever peak version of that, and they surpass what he is right now because of like the tantalizing opportunity and potential that they might have. So because of the youth and the signs and flashes they're able to show once in a while. You know, so we just, we need to start looking at these young players, specifically wings,
Starting point is 01:37:43 as what they are versus what they could be a lot more often. Yeah, and I mean, I don't really forgot about it. Could have been right. It wasn't. Sometimes it's a Michael Bridges, and he does develop into offensive player. Sometimes they don't, you know, is what it is. Fair. All right.
Starting point is 01:37:59 I got two teams left. I have two teams left. One of the Phoenix Suns. We are going to talk, not for a long time, but use of Nirkage. Hey man Usen Nargid to be pissing me off too I was like You watch you watch him
Starting point is 01:38:16 And there are just nights where he just does not have it He does not have it as a finisher He does not have it as a defender You can see it on the floor Kevin Durapy get mad at him sometimes Right? Making KD act out of character And he's done some things to try and be
Starting point is 01:38:31 You know more effective He's stressed out his His offensive game He takes more three but at the same time he's seven feet tall he shoots like 50 something from the ring it's not it's not great and there's just him being there at the five limits them to a certain extent and if they had somebody else there who can maximize either one of the skills either be an actual like plus offensive player or a plus defensive player the sons would go to the move but that's
Starting point is 01:39:04 you know that's kind of they had zubotch they would be on they they could be in the finals if they had too much they'd be they yeah they'd be legitimately they'd be as good as the thunder if they had zubatch uh i wouldn't go that far but they'd be close they'd be as good i will i will i will say that if they had it somebody who can actually defend the room yes they would they would be that good with this with this with this court with this court and the way that budalha has them playing and if everybody's healthy granted that's that's a big ass because katie once again is hurt however power rankings I would I would I would like that
Starting point is 01:39:37 But yeah but you said He's been cooked for a while and it's it's kind of clear And he has flashes he has some games where you know It looks okay Most of most of the time he's not doing Things the way that you want him to And then my last team the Dallas Mavericks I'm going
Starting point is 01:39:53 Listen he doesn't play a lot a lot But I'm more magically but just because The just because the mavericks are once again In talks and trying to find like a backup four and another backup you know big and you like they've been trying to fill this hole for so long and you've had this guy like trying to play in that role and he's just not living up to what they needed so now you have to go and make another deal and give up more access to go and find this piece so for me i would go there i thought about clay he's fine it's like it's not as great
Starting point is 01:40:28 as you want but it's not the hate so bad no no it's it's just like not he's not as bad in a cold stretch is what it is yeah and like and some of the stuff that he does like he's still his gravity still means some some stuff to that to that offense so even if he's not knocking down shots or if he looks a little bit hesitant that's something that i've seen a lot of mass fans talk about you know like his unwillingness to shoot the ball sometimes he's still creating good looks for other people so it's not he's not a disappointing player yeah i think the mavs is by the nature of how glaring that hole as you mentioned cleba has to be it p j washington is like their most important player right now besides Luca
Starting point is 01:41:05 when he's healthy they're dominant when he's not that hole is exasperated and they just desperately miss that athleticism at the four on both ends you got to get somebody behind him because at any point he can turn an ankle and your playoff run could be over because you can't win without him yeah
Starting point is 01:41:20 p.J. Washington's defense feels so good been great with steel man and I think I think that's every team and I think that means that we are heading into TikTok time The first TikTok time in December, here we go, bro. Let's do this shit.
Starting point is 01:41:37 I'm ready. Oh, I just realized you're wearing the hat because it's the first week of December. I didn't even like that. Oh, yeah, that never clicked. You guys don't have to know a goddamn holiday spirit, bro. It's crazy, bro. I ain't in front of this country. What?
Starting point is 01:41:50 I'm big Christmas. No, not really. I was expecting the Christmas tree or at least some lights for you, Isaac. Ain't nothing. I'm not even from this country. I don't even celebrate this holiday. And I got this hat on my head, bro. I do this for the real years out here.
Starting point is 01:42:03 Happy Hanukau, whatever. You're from Atlanta. Happy, happy Kwanza. Hey. Happy Kwanza. Let's go to TikTok time. Welcome to TikTok time. We're going to start with the draft.
Starting point is 01:42:19 Okay. This time, we're going to do a draft of NBA players who never made the finals. I think in the past we've done who didn't win a finals, but now there's people who haven't even made one. Never got there? Never got there. It eliminates some of the popular. picks like you know James Harder and Chris Paul Barclay they at least made it once or twice these guys are all right even close I got the first pick you do the draft order is Donovan
Starting point is 01:42:45 mojo 99 me oh see this is this is interesting this is very interesting because I don't know where I want to go it is a tough one of the first pick on because there's no like there's a lot of good players yeah a lot a lot of good players now you're on the spot you got to do it where we're going with the first pick of the no finals appearances his draft. Listen, man, you know me. Give me Victor Wenimama. First pick.
Starting point is 01:43:10 At my center. At my center. Oh, my God. All right. Okay. All right. Go for it. I am put in the worst position in this draft.
Starting point is 01:43:21 Easily. I don't know why I'm set up to be this way, but I guess the basketball gods never want to favor me or the draft gods never want to favor me. Okay. So you got Wemby. Fine. Whatever. It's just Isaac.
Starting point is 01:43:33 This is the draft gods He's just Isaac Okay So Considering the lack of talent From this field From this position right now I need to get Joelle and Bede
Starting point is 01:43:48 Immediately Fuck I was hoping you didn't pick him No I need him on my team so bad Malin A Zonovan How the what the fuck? Why did you not pick Joel and Bede? I don't want him on my team
Starting point is 01:44:00 What do you mean? I have a I have a culture that I want to build Joel and B does not fit into that. You're disgusting. Get the head out of your heart. Whatever. Now, I am in a weird spot. I really thought I was going to Joel Mb.
Starting point is 01:44:12 Moe. Can you answer this question? Why hasn't Joel M.B. been to the finals? Because he hasn't even... How can you get to the finals when you haven't even made the conference finals? Thank you. All right.
Starting point is 01:44:24 As I continue with your pig? No, I think he has, actually. But I lied. Give me Steve Nash at point guard. Makes sense. Who? Give me Steve Nash. Okay.
Starting point is 01:44:34 Steven Nash. Okay. I assume his name is Stephen. I actually don't know that for sure. And then I can go a lot of places with this. I can probably get them next time. I'm in a weird spot, man. Clock, clock, clock, shot, clock, shot, clock.
Starting point is 01:44:51 I'm gonna go double guard. Give me Shay at shooting. That was a great pick. I was hoping to see if I'm in my lap. I feel like Shay and Nash is a good fit. Yeah, very different. Yeah, very different places. Canadiates?
Starting point is 01:45:05 Oh, double, double maple. Let's go. I'm going to win. Oh, shout out to the youths out there, Farn. Shout out to the youth. Smoke that food. Okay. Find out you got bread?
Starting point is 01:45:19 You love your mom? You let your mom's in the food? Ah, you make me sick to my stomach, farm. It's a girl, shut up. Shut up. You're a little boy. At my point card, I want Dame Dala on my team. A Dame and Joel and B-B-B-L should, in theory, be great.
Starting point is 01:45:42 Theory, Tony, take you so far. All right. At my... Ooh, I'm trying to figure out. I'm trying to figure out what to do. I guess I kind of messed up because I picked one and be at my center. At my... You know what?
Starting point is 01:45:58 Let's just do it. We're going double big. at my power forward give me yow ming oh my god I thought he was in a fall to me this stupid ass 7 5 and 7 6 yeah
Starting point is 01:46:13 both of them can hit 18 footers oh yeah space now at my 3 give me Carmelo Anthony Nasty Loser pink Yeah loser your team is disgusting
Starting point is 01:46:29 Team makes no sense but it's huge so I'm sure it could be fun. It's some nonsense, though. Yeah, no. I would love to play with this team in 2K. It's amazing. I would hate to watch his team in real life. Everybody's on the block.
Starting point is 01:46:48 Okay. At my three, give me Paul George. I like his defense alongside Dame. That's a good pick. I was probably going to pick him. oh well damn i can't believe you took all the centers fuck what am i going to do yeah he got all the centers i love that you don't have been lost he's like you know
Starting point is 01:47:10 if i can't win what are you going to lose nobody first of all i didn't i didn't even lose i haven't lost you did no i did it okay give me blake griffin and don't want where do i want to go with this one next I can be George Gervin.
Starting point is 01:47:33 Blake and George Gervin. Okay. He got me. You got me. Blake and George Gervin. You got me. I have nothing if not bucket getters. Okay.
Starting point is 01:47:44 Speaking of bucket getters, at the two, hmm. Yeah, at the two, go ahead and give me Dominique Welk. No! One of the greatest, co-cah, what does Shaq say? Uh-huh. Whatever. Oh, no, I have to go back to the drawing board
Starting point is 01:48:01 Because I actually don't know what I'm going to do Because that's kind of everybody that I had No I thought I was going to get one of them This is very, very tough right now See J. McCollum is looking you in your eyes, brother He's right there He really, he really is
Starting point is 01:48:16 You don't want the president of the NBA Players Association Right there Well add to your team if you ask me All right, here's what I do For my point guard I'll take Derek Rose Okay Yes I would like that
Starting point is 01:48:32 I would like an MVP At my point guard And at my two guard Once again Here we go Got it Give me Give me Vince Carter
Starting point is 01:48:44 Nice Vince Carter Okay Nice Okay that's cool That's cool All right So my point
Starting point is 01:48:52 Listen I'm GM of the year I had to come off the dome with that You have zero playmakers on your feet. Who's eating in buckets? Everybody. So I got Dame, Dominique, PG, and I need a four on my team. Doesn't necessarily have to be a fantastic defender, but I'd like them to be playable. Someone who could stretch the floor, give me Lari Markman.
Starting point is 01:49:20 That man hasn't even made the playoffs. He's been at least for eight years, and he has to be able to eight years, and he has to be played. hasn't sniffed the playoffs bro it's kind of sad all right well you guys have the biggest teams in the goddamn world i need a strong defender give me rudy gobert rudy rudy rudy he's getting killed by wendy he can't hang with wemby all right man he's getting he's getting he's getting he got bent for wendy in the olympics don't let don't make me turn this into fever rules Rudy Kang. Oh my gosh.
Starting point is 01:49:55 No, Rudy is a demon in people rules. He's a demon in people rules. He was a demon in people, he was 17 years old. What do you mean, cooking? They're on the same team. He saw one video of Wembe playing one-on-one basketball. And the workouts? Cooking him.
Starting point is 01:50:11 You saw it. You saw it. All right, so I don't even know who won this. Like, maybe, maybe, Mo. Yeah, his team makes sense. So, I'll go ahead and say it out first. I won this crowd eaters. This was for you.
Starting point is 01:50:22 audio listeners shout out to you point guard i had damien little shooting guard dominie wilkins at the three paul george four lara marking at the five i had joel and bead perfectly balanced i have stephen ash shay george gervyn blake griffin and ruddy gober i have derrick rose vince carter carmelo anthony yow ming victor women y'all i'm killing y'all i got it i got it let's go spot by spot who is the best point guard i got it uh probably me No Are you out of your fucking mind But also like
Starting point is 01:50:56 He's probably Shut up It's prime Steve Nash What are you talking about? Yeah it's Nash Who is the best shooting guard Probably It's probably me
Starting point is 01:51:04 Either either either Neek or Shay It's me It's me It's Dominique Wilkins All right He's the most accomplished He's just because his career's over
Starting point is 01:51:14 But It was Dominic's best year Better than Shee's best year Come on brother This is let's not Let's not drag this Let's not drag this Who is in a small Ford?
Starting point is 01:51:22 Me. Is Mello better than George Gervin? Yeah. Yeah, I'm gonna take it. I'm taking that for me. No, he's not. I'm taking that for me. I'm taking that for me.
Starting point is 01:51:35 I'm making that. When it's all set and done it's even going to be better than Paul George? Shut up. Shut up. The George Gervyn, I can accept. PG, shut your fucking mouth. Power forward. I mean, really, Lissy, Wembe's your power forward.
Starting point is 01:51:51 So I guess Wemby's better than Lowry and Blake. Actually, no, it's prime Blake still better. Well, actually, no, let's keep it here because I'll take Yow over Lowry and Blake and I'll take Wemby over and B to Rudy. Wembe is not better than NB. Get the fuck out of my face. I'm taking that. I'm taking that for me.
Starting point is 01:52:09 All right, man. That's right in the draft. I got the best team fit. Let's go. Is that what we're jacking for? Who fits the best? I have bucket getters. This is team basketball.
Starting point is 01:52:21 Does my team fit well or terrible? I can't decide. It's the George Gervon pick. I'd pick the best player, but that might mess up to fit a little bit. It works. It works. I mean, I think it probably does work. I don't know.
Starting point is 01:52:33 Blake's got to kind of be a stretch forward, which he's not going to like. But if you can knock some three, it'll work. You got it. Next thing we're going to do, we're going to do our cheer list for this week. And for this week, we're going to start our yearly cycle of putting every position into a tier list. today we're going to do 15 of the 30 starting point guards of 2024 2025 okay we've done this for two years in a row we give it a couple months or about 20 games into the season and then we rank the standings of the most relevant guards and you know really most relevant players every position
Starting point is 01:53:06 okay okay let's go ahead and do this here yeah let's start with the point guards where let's start at the top where are we putting luca dantsich yes he hasn't been like healthy lucid a donchist as he's seen but it's he's eating up now yeah he's hitting him now i think luca's one of those players that you have to account for how you have to count for him getting healthy earlier in the season it's a plane in shape and him getting it in shape yeah he starts over year but we know he's still a top three player in the world got to run off all that hookah that for his lungs all that patron exactly that nicotine it'll be that'll be fine that October you remember that one video i think it was at the when they won the western conference finals and
Starting point is 01:53:51 oh yeah he had a beer in his hand and then i think mark cubit or someone like took it away and he was like ewes michael finley oh g michael finley it's hilarious okay let's go with another big dog where we're going with step curry also s tier i'm not i'm i'm i'm never stop it stop it i'm never dropping step curry below s tier until the day until he starts looking like lebron then i won't drop him below ST. What? Look at you. Come on now.
Starting point is 01:54:21 What do you think Steph Curry's averages are right now, mister? I know what I watch and I still see greatness. He don't even You're watching,
Starting point is 01:54:27 I'm missing missed layups. What are you talking about right now? I miss it. I'm watching Steph Curry look like he's really struggling to carry the ridiculous low they're asking of him, which isn't fair.
Starting point is 01:54:37 Oh, my bad. My bad. I forgot. Who's he playing with? Oh yeah. Pajamski, Kaminga. Buddy Heald had to get hot
Starting point is 01:54:46 for a couple games. Thank you. Thank you to Andrew Wiggins for coming to save Steph Curry. Put that man in S and give him his respect. Please. 22 points per game.
Starting point is 01:54:55 I don't care what the numbers say. I see him and I say, they're looking like LeBron. They both look and they take a step back. That boy nice. Put him in S tier. Stop it. Mo, what do you think?
Starting point is 01:55:07 What do you think, Mo? Steph clearly is not on Lucas lover right now. I don't want to say pretty clearly. I just catch up to him or whatever, but he's done. not he's not at that tier he's probably going to be an a maybe b depending on who we want to no b's ridiculous b's ridiculous let's put him in a cut you my no he's still amazing he's just
Starting point is 01:55:28 being asked to be this number one option like 2022 where he carries all the offensive load and you said until he looks like lebron he looks kind of like lebron he can't handle that offensive load either they're both looking old and need more help than they have he'd never missed 24 straight layups 24 straight three whatever the best he might miss a little layups no the problem is he just can't take as many shots as before he just can't quite get there just in some fourth quarters this year where his legs look cooked he looks like he's struggling to get through that high usage a is fair yeah I hate it no we're not telling the truth I don't want you guys listen at next week step Curry fan club meeting I don't want I don't
Starting point is 01:56:07 want to see you guys there security looking out my key card what security me all right I thought I'm gonna get in there trust We're going to the Mello ball. He's in A tier. I don't know about that. What? Get out of here. He's great.
Starting point is 01:56:24 I mean, he's averaging 30. The volume is crazy, but I don't think he's better than Seth Curry or on the same level. Even though Seth Curry can handle the usage, we know the awful impact. We know the playmaking he brings. We know all the other stuff. Lamello is still the worst defender than Curry, too. I think we should separate them. I'm sorry.
Starting point is 01:56:43 I have to go A. I have to go A. Yeah. I think, yeah, if the hornies didn't have... Look at it, he's dope. A's here it is, I guess. If the hornets didn't have Lamello, they wouldn't be anything. They already aren't great, but Lamello's, he's at least doing something.
Starting point is 01:56:57 I guess. They're right to 10 seat when you got hurt for sure. This guy does not respect buckets. 19. You were just fucking crying a new one for Steph Curry not being S tier, but now I can't say that there's a difference to Lavello and Curry. I feel like that's a bigger gap than Lamello than a currying Luca. I don't know. I think the aggressiveness.
Starting point is 01:57:14 that the rest of this that we've seen Lamello take in this year and with how many buckets he's been getting he's keeping them brothers aflo over there in Charlotte
Starting point is 01:57:24 I think he deserves 18 we can move in we can be flexible with our no we won't we won't do that we won't do that
Starting point is 01:57:32 we won't do that okay so Lamello's A where does Tri Young go that's why I'm saying we gotta be flexible with it right now that's probably we got to be flexible with it
Starting point is 01:57:41 Lamello's been better this season I mean, yeah, he has been, but has you been... Yeah, okay, whatever, we can do, we can do that. Trey Young and B makes sense. He's on a cold-ass shooting stretch right now that'll probably get better
Starting point is 01:57:52 by the time you're watching this in a few months, but right now he's playing out of B-tier. I can agree with that. You know what's funny? I think when we did this last year, he was also really low because he started terribly, but he came up.
Starting point is 01:58:01 I think when we did this last year, he was like C-tier, but he ended up recovering, so I'm sensing a pattern. Hopefully, listen, hopefully Trey Young can get back to what Trey Young does, but right now, yeah,
Starting point is 01:58:13 he's not playing as well. as the other three. Yeah, that's fair. Deerrin Fox. Hmm. She's playing. He's not. See, this is hard.
Starting point is 01:58:25 I guess he's on, I guess he's on the same tier as, as Trey. Trey might be at the bottom of that tier. Deerr or maybe, well, I don't know. Dear,
Starting point is 01:58:33 Deer and Fox is back. The focus is messing up again. Yeah. DeR Fox is back with his superpowers in terms of like finishing ultra well at the rim, not shooting as efficiently with the three-point shot this year, but it's hard to say. I wish there was a space in between A and B and put him right there because he's been better than Trey on the season objectively.
Starting point is 01:58:54 And I think we're giving Trey a lot of grace right now. So we can put him in-B. But we'll know, like, Deiaron is at the top of B. Trey's at the bottom. I don't think there's a big gap between Lamello and Dierre. Why aren't they in the same tier? I mean, one has, like, I'm giving Lamello a little bit of credit for the carry. job that he has to do every single light.
Starting point is 01:59:15 Dearon Fox might actually have to be in the same tier. You say that. He's not carrying them to a three seat. Why are we giving them carry credit? They're where they should be. They're mid. Deeran Fox is special. He might need to be,
Starting point is 01:59:28 ooh, this is so nasty, bro. Carrying the Charlotte one, it's two mid is hard. No, it's not. Their roster isn't the worst in the league. They're where they should be. I mean, if you want to keep the mellow in A, that's fine. I feel like Deeran should be right next to him. So you want to drop Lamello into B?
Starting point is 01:59:46 It's either we drop Lamello or lift up Lamello. Yeah, you pick whichever one you want, but I think they should be together. Fine. Lift up, lift up D'A. I'm cool with that. Deeran, welcome to A tier. Yeah, okay. Okay.
Starting point is 02:00:00 James Hardin. See, he's wildly inefficient. Don't care. He is unloading the clip and carrying that offense, though. Yeah. Which is hard. Don't. I do not care about.
Starting point is 02:00:13 James Hardin's efficiency right now because it's not like, it's not like in the gutter. So anything, yeah, so anything above that is, is fine considering the offensive talent around him. I'd give James Hardin like a B. If we're grading off of expectations, I'd put him in A. Okay. A is too much for show, but I'm sure in terms of expectations. So B is fair because in terms of inefficiencies, he's having the same exact inefficiencies
Starting point is 02:00:39 as Trey Young, a little bit worse to start off the year. I'm fine with putting in B because he's carrying that team with all the playmaking duties and shit. He's fairly beat. Yeah, and they're actually a really good team. So I think they actually deserve carry credit for keeping that offensive float and lend the defense win games.
Starting point is 02:00:54 So for sure. Yeah. Where do you want to go with Jamal Murray? D. 2024, Jamal Murray. D. D. This is...
Starting point is 02:01:02 That's a good sound effect. But yeah, I mean, we've seen Jamal Murray be as high as like B or A in a playoff series, but it hasn't been. consistent. It hasn't even been infrequent. We just really haven't seen a high level this year. That was years ago. I don't
Starting point is 02:01:18 think we will ever see Jamal Murray get back to that level. He is indeed tier. When Jamal Murray Jason goes right now. When the Denver Nuggets won a playoff past. It's over. He's cooked. When the Denver Nuggets won an NBA championship, folks were telling me,
Starting point is 02:01:34 Jamal Murray is better than Trent Young. Jamal Mary is better than Darry's Garland and also the He was. He was not. He wasn't lit. He was just having a a moment. It was just a moment. Okay, now you're hating. Play after Mom, where it was real. We don't got to pretend that didn't happen just because it's not happening anymore.
Starting point is 02:01:50 He's not at all sorry. He was supposed to be one, though. Put him in D. It was next. For now. We'll see. Maybe we'll come back. We'll see. Where do you want to go with Darius Garland? See. A sweet prince. Very comfortable. There he is. He is not see. Are you out of your mind? He's definitely
Starting point is 02:02:05 he's been at this level right now. Darius Garland has been probably better than Tray. You know what? Just for that, drop Tray Young into C. Get out of you. Get out of here. Get out of here. You ruin his rep. Now,
Starting point is 02:02:16 but Darius Garland's been on the same level as Tray Young. I agree with that. I think Darius should be B. Trey's a better passer, but Darius has been the far better score, especially off ball. Okay, fair. Fair.
Starting point is 02:02:31 Listen, he kind of locking up, too. Better than Trey Young is. You saw him, you saw him guard Jason Tame just one time in the post. Listen, man. Hey, he did a job. He did a job. He did a job. Okay, where do you guys want to go with Cade Cunningham?
Starting point is 02:02:46 I think he's... I'm pretty good efficiency. The turnovers are a problem, though. I think he clearly hasn't... He's not in the same... He's not the same caliber player as Day or Strait or James Harden as to be at two carriers with the ball. And you can't be a high-level point guard
Starting point is 02:03:01 and not an elite passer, but still careless with the ball. Those three things... He's been nine-assisted game. His passing is legit, but the turnovers are a bit much. And the efficiency has to be a little bit better to make up for it. So I'm cool at C for now, but he's on the up and up. Yeah. I will be shocked at by the end of the year.
Starting point is 02:03:18 That stuff normalizes and he's looking like B. I hope so. That'll be great for him. Yeah. All right. Fred Van Vleet. He's been solid. He started off horrible start the year.
Starting point is 02:03:29 He was chucking shots. He was looking like Drake hooping out there, actually shooting like Drake. But he's come back around. But he's okay now. And he's, he's very serviceable. He's doing Fred Van Vleet things. I don't think I think I would still go D though
Starting point is 02:03:43 I don't think he's been as good as Kate Especially considering his Slow shooting start I'll go D Yeah He's not the same level of the player at all Yeah and D makes it sound bad But these are all good players
Starting point is 02:03:56 So even like D is still like above average I didn't include any terrible This is all top 15 Ish Exactly These are good people Okay John Morant
Starting point is 02:04:06 Oh see I like the way Josh's been so I've been playing I like he's changed his game a little bit he's not as aggressive of a score anymore I mean I said he doesn't want to dunk anymore
Starting point is 02:04:18 yeah he said he didn't want to fall in soldier RIP to highlight real oh my god but he's passing out of his mind the passing is the best has ever been he's at nine assists per game he's even though the scoring isn't as high
Starting point is 02:04:29 it's because he's not just not taking as many shots he's a better player though still a yeah bro a lot of people play don't know a lot of people don't know this but he's going back to his old college play playing days in terms of his playing style super talented as a pastor and he went away from that
Starting point is 02:04:44 because he saw that he could like the advantages in the NBA are insane but the tradeoff isn't worth it considering the injuries that he's like accumulated over the last few years he's 18 now he starts to dunk again he wanted to draw charges and hurt him it was ridiculous if he starts to dunk again estier he doesn't want to dunk though it's not coming back they don't want them they don't want him to start jumping Mike Conley F F F F damn no other words just put him I'm sorry don't say anything alright don't say anything just put him in F Isaac please okay
Starting point is 02:05:15 respect our others thank you the lips are sealed Jalen Suggs who this is fun best defender on the list that's for sure can we put him
Starting point is 02:05:28 can we put him in B or is that too much no no you can put him in D or maybe C if you might be generous but the shot making really fell off after Palo got hurt it was a crazy start but the lack of that extra attention is getting them a little bit. So probably still D, but the defense is outrageous. Yeah, D is fantastic for him, though.
Starting point is 02:05:46 D is fantastic. Jalen sucks, top 15th, poor guard, and NBA, sign me up. That's all they need. You could put them next to Cade if you want, if you want to go see. Best defender on this list by far. And you want to put them in D. All right, let's go, let's go, Jalens. I mean, look, D is good players, though.
Starting point is 02:06:03 Like, Fredman Elite's good. Yeah. I can go see, though. I'm fine. I'm fine recognizing Jalen Sugg's defense. and the offense has made strides I'm okay with it but it looks crazy next to Ked Cunningham
Starting point is 02:06:15 because everybody has biased towards lead offensive players and people have such a bias towards that because the guys that dribble a lot and while offensive value is important so is defensive so I'll accept Jalen Suggs and see we might need to revisit that
Starting point is 02:06:29 you might need to no no we don't where we go with Chris Paul D maybe he's at a good year good year for his old man standards so yeah if he was playing like a regular old man he'd be with mike connolly and f but again he's better than that so we'll put him in d yeah is he better than mike he definitely is mike he's shooting like shit from the field yeah he is he has he out
Starting point is 02:06:55 a rough shooting year but i mean is chris paul as good as brother i'm bleeding he had to say that about mike i thought we were respected our elders shit god damn it's you're right my bad Chris Paul is almost Chris Paul is at 10 points eight assists Running the offense smooth double double Or above expectations We can go we can go D Yeah positive you are Yeah if you are 39 years old
Starting point is 02:07:18 And you are under 6 3 If you have 8 assists I'm rounding that up to 10 I'm giving you that credit He's averaging a double double this year Yes And last but not least Shea Gildes Alexander Mr.
Starting point is 02:07:34 Stier. Ain't nothing else as you said. Simple as that. Luca's better. So Luca might be like the top of S here for sure but Shea's better
Starting point is 02:07:41 than the guys there in A we got to give it to him. Yeah, I agree. I agree. S tier is for MVP candidates. The guys like could win an MVP any year and Shays in that.
Starting point is 02:07:50 You can win at any moment. I agree. I agree. So let's go through this list to see what we got to revisit. The comments are yelling at us right now like they always are. Luca and Shea and S tier,
Starting point is 02:08:00 that's fair. We don't got to change that. Steph, Lamello, Deerran, and Jah in A tier. I'm with that. I guess that makes sense. Deering, Steph's number three.
Starting point is 02:08:09 Steph's the third best point guard. John Moran's the fourth best point guard. And if you want to say this year, Lamello and Deerner are like fifth and six, that makes sense to me. I like that. I don't think eight tier needs to be changed at all. I think it's perfect.
Starting point is 02:08:22 B tier we got Hardin, Trey Young, and Darius Garland. So that's 8, 9, 10, or 6, 7, 8. That makes sense to me. Sure. Yeah, okay. Yeah. Trey Young, 6, Dary's Garland.
Starting point is 02:08:33 seven, Jimbo's eight. Okay. And granted, we don't have every point guard in the league on here, so there's probably some other people that would be top 10 we're forgetting about. Yeah. Kate,
Starting point is 02:08:43 I think this deal is fine. I think we don't got to change anything. We don't. Once again, another perfect tier list by TD3. People are going to look at Jaylen Sugs and Cade like so crazy, but completely different players,
Starting point is 02:08:56 but they're both special in their own right, but they're not stars, like B. I would not apologize for loving Jalen Sugs. I don't care. his defense is amazing and I won't feel bad about it So go lock up Go go try to get a bucket on Jayland Suggs
Starting point is 02:09:08 And you come back to me and tell me how your experience was And then we can start talking I'm not going to have a good time I was wrong That's into that tearless Next thing we're going to do We obviously do a lot of guessing games I put you guys through the ringer
Starting point is 02:09:27 Having you try to guess teams Guessing players You've done all these different variations And last week we did a matchup of all the guests of players, but we combined a bunch of faces. It was crazy. Today we're going to do a mashup
Starting point is 02:09:37 of all the formats we've done from guessing a team. So I'm going to show you a, you know, the team graphic we always show you. And before we've done colleges, 2K overalls, heights, flags, all that shit, you're going to get a hodgepodge
Starting point is 02:09:50 mix of all of them. Okay. Okay. Shit, let's try this shit, man. It's not even a category. So, can you guess this NBA team? So creative. I know, look at that.
Starting point is 02:10:00 First off, which team is this? okay a is a bastard uh the point guards a bastard he's mad at so no reason calm down holy shit i feel his energy through the screen right now yes all right but the four man the four man went to kentucky so we have to start talking we have to start thinking about the the bigs who have come out of kentucky okay so there's julius no yeah julius turned who went to kentucky um who else when came from there. Oh, we'll look at everything else. I'm to focus on Kentucky.
Starting point is 02:10:34 Talk to everything else. No, we have to, we have to lock in on Big Blue. You have to lock it. Yeah, that's the easiest. 7-9 overall. And who's like, who's, who's, who's mad at that foot guard?
Starting point is 02:10:44 Who's aggressive? Who's angry? I'm just sick of shit. I mean, Chris Paul, Chris Paul is always, always yelling. I know Fred Van Bleet just got, you know, he just got fine for yelling at people. But it's not, though.
Starting point is 02:10:57 It's not. Because, because the center is American. Yeah, you're right. Javari Smith is a war eagle. Yeah, he went to Auburn. He went to Auburn. So I'm trying to think of these, these colleges. Normally I feel like we're pretty good.
Starting point is 02:11:13 I honestly, I feel like you're pretty good. Who are there 79 overall wings? Who is this mid? Please. This is so weird. I think we're in hell right now, but is this the New Orleans Pelicans? You know it's not because Zion with the Duke. but he's not even starting though he's not playing we've seen exactly one game is on probably
Starting point is 02:11:35 are you guys cooked are you always done no no no no we're we're not cooked we are not cooked you beg it get that last guessing we're not we're not cooked 79 overall three who the hell is this bro we have to we have to think if you think about teams like like the clippers the lakers the suns the this just west of conference it's not the blazers please please help me Help me. Yeah, I think this is fried for me. Oh, wait. Is it the Dallas Mavericks?
Starting point is 02:12:06 What a buzzer beater. This is the Dallas Mavericks. That's Lucas complaining ass at Point Guard. PJ Washington at Power Forward. I sold this so hard when it comes to Kentucky, bro. I sold this so hard. I was about to make you throw in the towel and you got it last second. Look at that.
Starting point is 02:12:21 They stick out like a sword thumb. Fuck. I forgot. Okay. Thank you. One of one. One of one. So, Walmart.
Starting point is 02:12:27 Brown. You got more to come. You guys can bounce back from this terrible show. next up which team is this dang kentucky dudes man another kentucky guy and you got the 12th who are these kentucky wings 88 overall center
Starting point is 02:12:40 and then we got a brick wall noticing brick wall you got an 88 overall center this is one of the best centers in the entire NBA and what i have 88 overall screams that but okay yeah he's one of the better centers it's hard to be
Starting point is 02:13:01 I know who this is oh huh man 88 overall center that screams to me that you're okay 12th pick
Starting point is 02:13:10 you're an okay player brick wall I don't know what that means but this is the Miami Heat nobody's not oh my god it's not remotely close to Miami Heat I don't even know what you're getting at
Starting point is 02:13:24 I'm gonna buy 8 overall and that is not and didn't didn't Tyler here will play for Kentucky too but under but understand there's mad there's mad mad mad mad oh i got you this is the sacramento kings there we go no it's not there we go is this the oklahoma city thunder this is the oklahoma city thunder and that is kason wallis who's currently the starting shooting guard okay that's it threw it out okay the brick wall is lewd dorts sturdy ass yep doork chamber so bonus so makes sense at 88 and i assumed that oh man that cooked me okay y'all we got mowing a blender next one which team is
Starting point is 02:14:06 this this is all sleepy oh it's the Utah jazz because we don't like them we don't watch them nobody cares this is not the Utah Jazz but you were close this is specifically tailored to Donovan the Clippers I don't care about them yeah don't care about them hate promulence again Taxes Donovan Hayden the Clippers We can't avoid them If you see Zoubatch is very impressive to me That's good Next one
Starting point is 02:14:38 Which team is this The goat What is that It's just a brown circle It's a color of someone's skin Browns Now you're a wild boy You're a wild boy
Starting point is 02:14:54 wow okay that could either mean like yo that's your last name or wow boy I'm throwing off I'm sorry I'm rattled okay this is crazy all right so we have an American the 14th pick in the draft as the as the three oh I got this in the heartbeat you have to realize
Starting point is 02:15:24 Spit a few heartbeats. Who made this graphic? Isaac. Mm-hmm. What is, what is Isaac known for out of the three of us? Glazing. Blazing. Who particularly?
Starting point is 02:15:38 Who's his goat? Nicole Yokic. Noticing, 14th overall pick just a year ago. Michael Porter Jr. Christian, what's his last name? Not Brown, but Braun. Ooh, this is the Denver Nuggets. This is the Denver Nuggets.
Starting point is 02:15:53 That is Christian Brown is a shooting. the white brown great pick yeah it's pronounced brown not brown finally finally because i had the first oh shit there we go now we're even now we're even there you go death has to show respect to the one and only and me just blitzering words there we go this is the Denver nuggets that that was easy next up which team is this okay a u s u s in a heart beat. There's not that many USC guys in the entire NBA. One of them is Bronny James, but I
Starting point is 02:16:30 fear Bonnie James does not play the power forward position. I know who does, though. No, you don't. I know who does. I know who's the fifth pick overall for this team, too. In those long arms, I know length. I see link from anywhere. Lengths come from all sides
Starting point is 02:16:46 and angles. A length spur. Yes. Who is this? This scurance to me that this is the Cleveland Cavaliers This is the Cleveland Cavaliers Donovan Mitchell on his length There we go That man got length for days
Starting point is 02:17:02 Not gonna say it Not gonna say it Don't say it Don't say it No We out meeting Shay Oh my God We just did
Starting point is 02:17:14 It's fine We can admit it We can admit it All right man Last one Which team is this Is that maple syrup I feel so old squinting at this screen right now
Starting point is 02:17:28 Come on, Unk, you got this. Help me out, Unk. Some people, sir, what is that? Okay. I got this in Harvard, too. That flag is a dead giveaway too. What flag is that, Mo? What's the flag is that?
Starting point is 02:17:46 I know, I see this flag and I know this player. I don't know why. Name the country. Tell me the country. I can name the player, bro. Name the player. This is Yakopoldo, and this is the Toronto Raptors. Correct.
Starting point is 02:17:59 This is the Austria flag. Boom. And Yaquipotel's team, the Toronto Raptors. There we go. Yeah. I don't know. I don't know if you see Austria. I just see the flag.
Starting point is 02:18:10 I'm like, oh, Yacopoldo, this is how I think about it. And I carry out all my day. That's crazy. That's crazy. My mind. And there you go. You guys got through them. Only one loss.
Starting point is 02:18:19 Okay. Actually, no, Donovan clutch up at the end. So no losses. Yeah. There are you. there we go undefeated never lost Big ball of bread Next thing we're gonna do
Starting point is 02:18:29 We're gonna do a blind ranking I haven't done one of these in a while I kind of forgot about them for a bit But I'm gonna have you guys Blind rank some NBA championship teams Okay So you guys know how it works Blind ranking 1 through 5
Starting point is 02:18:42 Yeah yeah yeah Rank them blindly and the chips fall Where they may Yeah yeah yeah Alright let's do it Who's the first team First of the five teams We had last year's Boston Celtics
Starting point is 02:18:51 See I'm good people putting them at three honestly three yes three because i understand i understand what the number say i understand what the stats say but i also know what my eyes watched and i know that there are other championship teams that are better my eyes watching dominance you're you sir are a glazing that's why you feel that way i'm okay putting them at i'm a solstice glazing you know what iziger you wrote it down been out voted apparently put them in three no you can disagree i'll leave him at three if donovan screws this up it's because of that placing right there okay next up the 2020 lakers the 2020 lakers are not better than that self-esteem like oh hold on hold on hold on hold on
Starting point is 02:19:40 let me not let me not hold on hold on that's what i'm saying that's a good that's a good debate let's have a conversation here let's have a conversation we're here for discourse right the fact that you had still a prime lebron james you had anthie davis as mobile and as much of a a real-life uter the fact that you had those two guys alice caruso Kyle kuzman was out here whooping playoff playoff rondo you had a lot of guys on that team they were the best team from start to finish their defense was amazing I think that in that situation I think I would take the 2020 lakers over the 2024 boston Celtics but was would their defense be amazing enough
Starting point is 02:20:21 to stop all those threes raining in? I do not know. I think their defense would be amazing enough, though, to do something to Jayson Tatum and, like, prevent Jam Brown from having the series that he did. So I think I'm okay with that because their two best players can't fuck with the Celtics two best players. So we could put the Lakers at number two.
Starting point is 02:20:40 I like that. Okay, 2020 Lakers are at number two. Liskers? I can't spell it all. I'm trying to do this while looking at the screen. Yeah, put the 2020 Lakers at two. Okay Number three
Starting point is 02:20:51 We got the 2007 Spurs See they could have Went ahead The 24th six But this This wasn't the It's not the beautiful
Starting point is 02:21:00 game San Antonio Spurs So we would put them At 4 But we respect Tim Duncan on this podcast though And this is when
Starting point is 02:21:08 Tony Parker Was a bucket too Yes Hmm Y'all don't respect Tony Parker Me personally I put him
Starting point is 02:21:14 Never mind We should respect Tony Burke Go ahead That's one at 4 Never mind For it's fair I can see them
Starting point is 02:21:23 versus something going either way Next up The 2006 Miami Heat We can put them at 5 That is one of the most Not not the most But
Starting point is 02:21:34 There's a lot of context That goes into that championship And we are putting them at 5 So you're telling me Dirk is a choker I mean yeah He was He was
Starting point is 02:21:48 Yeah man I mean, listen, shout out Dwayne Wade. Amazing, amazing young player in that year. Obviously the worst team here. Easy. Okay. Now, Donovan, you can make or break my entire list, depending who has a number one. Drum roll, please.
Starting point is 02:22:04 The 1985 Lakers are number one. Yep, we're good. We are good. Has a perfect tier list been created? I think so. Has a perfect blind ranking been created? Well, yeah, as a blind ranking, I think we did the best that we could. If you want to put the 24 Celtics at two, fine.
Starting point is 02:22:23 I, I, I, I disagree right now, but I do think it is a debate. But after one, four and five, that's fine. Yeah, I'm happy. I'm happy. We did it. I think this may be one of the first, you know, we used their ass at this. That's true. Yeah.
Starting point is 02:22:38 We did you do. We don't know pretty bad. We're normally pretty bad. There you go. Comeback season. It's fine. But we never left. To be expected.
Starting point is 02:22:47 But we never left. The next thing we're going to do, I'm going to have you guys guess who has all of these NBA all-time records. It's a little trivia game. I'm going to say a record. You should tell me the player that currently holds it. Shout out nerds. Let's get into it.
Starting point is 02:23:04 Chat out, let's do it. First off, who has the most personal fouls in NBA history? This has to be either LeBron or Kareem. It has to be somebody who's played a long time. I'm going to go with them. And I'll pick one I will go Kareem Okay
Starting point is 02:23:22 Okay I'm going Kareem too I guess Fuck it It is Kareem Abdul Jabbar Makes a hell of sense Lebron doesn't foul that much A big man is always going to foul It's because LeBron don't fucking try sometimes
Starting point is 02:23:33 That's why Senators they're in the mix They got a foul Yeah yeah Smart big Okay listen I threw you a layup to start That's fine
Starting point is 02:23:41 You gotta get the ball rolling Next one Who is the most field goals made In NBA history Again Is this either LeBron or Kareem? I think it has to be Kareem because LeBron had threes to make up the space
Starting point is 02:23:57 Between them for scoring So we're mathing right now I'm gonna go Kareem Okay Mr. Algebra Yep, it is Kareem okay I thought That I'd make you overthink it but it is Kareem again Now you pass basic algebra You know what I'm about basic algebra
Starting point is 02:24:14 Number three Who is the highest three point percentage in history? Uh, I got this, I think. Go ahead. Well, I got my bid. Is this Seth Curry? Hmm.
Starting point is 02:24:28 You know what? It's tricky. Okay, so I, so I have a couple names. I feel like Steve Curry's name is up here. It definitely is. It's top three. Yeah. I feel like Steve Kerr's name.
Starting point is 02:24:38 Seth Curry wouldn't, wouldn't shock me. Um, if Kyle Corver was on this list, it wouldn't shock me. He's up there. I'm going to put. going to put my faith in you and i'm going to trust you as my partner and we're going to go with set curry oh that was dumb as hell never trust mo it is steve currie i know set currie's top five though shit probably our next one who is the most playoff steals ever all right so honestly if we go playoff anything kind of have to go lebron
Starting point is 02:25:17 though. Can't go steals. Why? But if you're but like if you're if you're if you're talking about somebody who's been to the playoffs consistently like it has to be somebody who either was a steals demon or just has the sheer volume. And so like LeBron's going to be up there might be like John Stockton. I think he's a good answer to this too. You think for a hell long long. He led the league multiple times. He's up there all time at seal. So I think John Stockton might be the Yeah. I think he might be the answer for this. We'll go. We'll once again lose because we listen to Mo.
Starting point is 02:25:54 It is LeBron James. Do it's LeBron? What the fuck, bro? Sorry, go. He went to the finals 10 years in a row. He's playing like 20-something playoff games every single year. He's averaging at least to steal a game or like 0.9, whatever. This is the only time that you ever seem to believe in John Stockton.
Starting point is 02:26:13 Never again. There you go. He sold you for one last time. Who has the most points in Celtics history? I'm going to shut up, Donovan. You cook. I mean, I don't know the Celtics like that. I guess the easy thing to say would be Larry,
Starting point is 02:26:31 but Larry only played like 11 years. Bill Russell wasn't a score like that. No, he wasn't a score like that at all. We could say like Sam Jones. I always confused Sam and Casey Jones. I always forget that. but we will take the easy wait but paul pierce played played for them for a long time that is true is it paul pierce i don't know i don't know i'm not i'm not i'm not i'm not sure
Starting point is 02:27:01 i'm gonna take a guess i guess yeah i'll go paul pierce oh three ls in a row it is john havelacek figured yeah that makes sense i skipped an old look at you had to be one of them Figures Typical Who has the most Sportsmanship Awards I think I got this in the bag I don't know why
Starting point is 02:27:27 But this got to be Good old unc over here in Minnesota This is Mike Conley This is a new award too Why do you know that I don't know Why the fuck do you know What this is this a new award
Starting point is 02:27:36 I don't know Is this a new award When did they start handing this out? I don't even know Sometime in the last like Seven years or so Mike Kong Is listed on the official NBA
Starting point is 02:27:46 your website which is hilarious yeah adam service NBA sportsmanship okay there you go who has the highest field goal percentage in NBA his has to be something stupid like DeAndre Jordan yeah yeah yeah yeah shout to Chris ball man holy shit oh he was a merchant Did he make first team all NBA too? Yeah He did. Shout out Lobster. In the dead era.
Starting point is 02:28:21 In the dead era of centers. And we were in a recession in the NBA back then. He looked. He looks like Dwight Howard trying to be Deonti Jordan in this picture. Like he's Dwight Howard. Yeah. Playing Dejantre Jordan in a TV show. Professional hair and makeup.
Starting point is 02:28:38 He's on the FX show of the Clippers. Yeah. Effects. Effects got the movie. what nice you never heard that intro before I do I know you're talking about yeah next one most playoff blocks in NBA history LeBron James anything playoffs it's either I guess for blocks it's either LeBron James or Tim Duncan and I'm gonna go Tim Duncan yeah I'd go LeBron but I'll let you rock with Tim Duncan Timmy D oh you played for a long time too got to be
Starting point is 02:29:11 Tim Duncan yeah yeah Yeah. Hey, Mo, anytime you have an instinct, go against it. Yeah. No, I just kicked in like, oh, shit. Yeah, he was an old man in the NBA, too. Old ass man. He played for hell long.
Starting point is 02:29:24 Last but not least, who has the most steals in NBA, in Lakers history? Okay, so obviously, Kobe played there for 20. I'm going to go. We can go Kobe. Simple as a day. Let's go Kobe. You could. Yeah.
Starting point is 02:29:40 Mo, you agree? Got to be Kobe. It is. is Kobe. Yeah. Yeah. There we go. Shear ball. It's common sense. Yeah. I thought maybe you'd overthink it by the end. Nope. It is Kobe Bryant. Okay. You guys should have done better, but you didn't do horrendous. What you mean? We only missed like two. I sold us. I sold us like twice. And that's because I was listening to him. If it was just me, I would have done better. Listen, man, listen, man. I will never try to see you wrong. I just happen to see you wrong.
Starting point is 02:30:08 We got one more segment to do before I get out of here. You know, a few weeks ago, we did a a game where I asked you to I named two NBA teams I wanted you to combine their players and see if they could beat the Boston Celtics that was this year you know we talked about current teams
Starting point is 02:30:22 we're going to do it again but you guys are going to combine NBA teams and see if they can beat the 2001 Lakers okay Kobe Shack at their
Starting point is 02:30:32 at their peaks combining how do we upend the best duo of all time okay let's do it so first teams the Cleveland Cavaliers
Starting point is 02:30:41 and the Denver Nuggets Okay, so we would have Darius Garland Donovan Mitchell Okay Right, it's current right Current to be all the time Okay so we have Darius Garland Donovan Mitchell
Starting point is 02:30:55 At the three We need some defense So Just get Lebron Just we have to get the No no we're going current We're going current What the fuck are you talking
Starting point is 02:31:06 Oh current cabs Current Nuggets Okay So, Garland, D. Mitch, who are we putting at the three? Michael Porter, Jr., I guess. Are we given, I took a quarrel the call? Or are we giving Michael, Gordon, he's been, hey, he's been shooting one from three-point line. That's what I'm saying.
Starting point is 02:31:28 We are giving Michael Porter-June. Are we putting Dean Wade? Are we giving Dean Wade the call? And now we're talking. Now we're talking. Now we're talking. Anybody, Max Trues, Max Trues, Sam Meryl, Sam Meryl, anybody about MPJ. Is George's Nien getting the call?
Starting point is 02:31:43 Let me know. Oh, my God. Let me know. So MPJ and his tinfoil hat, go to the three. Obviously, Yokach is the five. We know the Aaron Gordon connection at the four. Do we want to go there or do we want to go Mowgli? Mowgli.
Starting point is 02:31:53 I love his defense. I love his defense. I don't know, though, because... Aaron Gordon fits so good. If we had... Because, like, imagine if you had Aaron Gordon, you could put Aaron Gordon on, on Kobe in some scenarios. Like, if they start running some...
Starting point is 02:32:10 Like, I would not feel... Yeah, but he's getting burned. We saw... By who? By who? By who? By who? By who?
Starting point is 02:32:17 No, but you have two guys. So, like, it's going to be Yokic and then it's going to be... You're going to have Yokic who's guarding Shaq, and then you're going to have DeMitch or Aaron Gordon who can guard Kobe. Every Mobley, if he tries to play Shaq, he's getting put in the blender. Obviously... It doesn't matter. He's not being the Lakers.
Starting point is 02:32:35 I need as many hands in the room. I need as many hands in the room. That's it. But, like, but, okay, but like, Aaron Gordion. is getting put in the blender as well but he how do you do you want to get cooked by 20 or 30 you choose right now we can get cooked by 15 either way
Starting point is 02:32:48 they're not being the Lakers it doesn't matter I believe in you I'm in Evan Mowgli I believe in you we'll take Mowgli we'll lose by 30 all right whatever I'm on the way around okay next team
Starting point is 02:33:05 the Warriors and the Celtics all right Steph Curry cool at the two Derek White Not Jalen Brown Oh we have a lot of options
Starting point is 02:33:16 But the three Okay So you want to go Steph Curry Jalen Brown Tatum Dremond KP Ooh
Starting point is 02:33:24 Hey last year South Xelix plus Steph Curry That might be That might beat the Laker Listen We may have done it
Starting point is 02:33:32 We may have done it They You think we've done it Until Chris Topps, Brazil is had the weirdest injury that you've seen in your entire life and then our goal defense is gone out the window. Some shit you've never heard of.
Starting point is 02:33:44 Yeah. But I would love to see Shaq, Shaq step above the free throw line and do something to KP. Because if KP gets too wide open in a row, it's a wrap. Yeah, and Shaq has to come out in defense, F. Curry and KP from three, it's a lot.
Starting point is 02:33:58 And if that's our starting lineup, as long as we have five guys on the bench who are ready to use all six of their fouls against Shaq, I'm okay with that. We'll bring Luke Cornett with this as a six-man Fowlchack Cornet and TjD will be on the bench and they can use their fouls.
Starting point is 02:34:16 There you go. Okay, next one. The Bucks and the Thunder. Bucks and the Thunder. We're definitely going to Shay. We're going to say at the one. I like that. I would like to make J.W. to play's natural position
Starting point is 02:34:30 and put them with the two or three. Don't make a play power forward. Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, so don't. We don't want to put, like, Dame at the one. and then Shea at the two? No. I don't think you need both. I feel like you have to pick one,
Starting point is 02:34:43 especially because you know, you know we're getting Yannis, so you're not going to have this like math, this like crazy perimeter guy at like four or five. He's not going to provide you that level of spacing. So I'd go Yonis at the four. So we're obviously going to go Chet and Yonis to have that crazy fit.
Starting point is 02:35:01 We're going to put Shea in there. JDA but the three or Jada bet the two? We can put Jada by the three. Then who do you want to? put next to these guys you guys alice caruso you guys are doing dame so dirty i just go yeah i just don't think at this point in time want to dame in there you want to go dame shay jadab yannis chet dame jade of yonis and chet is the best lineup to me i don't think listen that's a lot of all handlers it's i feel like i just want to shoot it he
Starting point is 02:35:33 clearly does he clearly minded it so much he listen he's he's he's Tell him to shut up because they're trying to win right now. All right. It doesn't matter. We got Shea and MVP caliber player and we got Yonis. It doesn't matter. Clearly, he doesn't vibe with the already MVP candidate that's on his team. Do you think that adding another one would make him be like, yeah, I'll stay in to the corner?
Starting point is 02:35:53 So you want to put Alex Crusoe in place him? By that logic, give me Isaiah Joe. Give me Aaron Wiggins. If we just want somebody to be in the corner. Does this team beat the Lakers? It doesn't matter. We're missing the point here. Probably losing.
Starting point is 02:36:04 I can't say that. I can't say that. well it depends on we put in dame at two because if we put dame at two then we're losing we put Isaiah Joe there we might win say a Joe shot out Isaiah Joe okay anyway let's say they lose we're getting caught up on these niche arguments that are not the point who's guarding Rick Fox I need to know the 2020 Lakers plus that 2020 Miami heat oh so what's her not using anybody but like jimmy and bam that's it yeah jimmy and bam onto the 2020 lakers so she got bam ad lebron jimmy kCP i had because bronze playing point uh all right yeah
Starting point is 02:36:51 i'm with that that meets the 2001 lakers yes 2020 jimmy butler yeah 22 jimmy butler yes 2020 jim buggler was looking like kobe himself It was crazy Yeah But that Added on to LeBron And the shooting AD
Starting point is 02:37:08 Yes Oh yeah I need that And AD and BAM's defense Oh yeah I need that Apparently
Starting point is 02:37:15 It's easier than I thought Apparently We'll give a tune Just because Mone knees that shit You don't understand I was just It's elevating
Starting point is 02:37:31 bro We're imagining That Say, oh, if that brother had a couple more inches, oh, don't get methanizing and salivating. Have you never seen that Stephen A clip? No. Never. I forgot who he was talking about.
Starting point is 02:37:48 I hope it's real. If you're still here, this is the end of the episode, comment. No, it's real. Oh, I need that shit. True. Need that. Hashtag need that. Yeah.
Starting point is 02:37:58 I will see y'all next week.

There aren't comments yet for this episode. Click on any sentence in the transcript to leave a comment.