The Deep 3 Podcast - The Knicks Steal Game 1, Jokic Is Unstoppable, and More! | TD3 Live
Episode Date: May 7, 2025Breaking down this crazy week of NBA playoff hoops #nba Support the stream: https://streamlabs.com/thedeep3pod Today we react to all the latest NBA news! Check out the TD3 merch: https://the-deep-...3-shop.fourthwall.com/ Join the TD3 discord!: https://discord.gg/RUkjpMPp7E Listen on Spotify!: https://open.spotify.com/show/3elbbqVumwqz8wlIdknsLW Listen on Apple Podcasts!: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-deep-3-podcast/id1657940794 Follow us on TikTok!: https://www.tiktok.com/@thedeepthree Follow us on Instagram!: https://www.instagram.com/thedeep3podcast/ Isaac's twitter: https://twitter.com/byisaacg Muhamed's twitter: https://twitter.com/Mojo99_ Donnavan's twitter: https://twitter.com/Dsmoot3D Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
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The worst thing about today is Donovan gets to be happy.
Once again.
Two weeks in a row.
We're Liddy.
Two shows in a row.
Last week's full episode, this stream, we come in here, and we got to let Donovan be happy.
We got to let Donovan have his moments because the New York Knicks that we all love to doubt, we all love to laugh at for incompetency, for little brother's syndrome amongst the big market teams.
For being...
Sorry, brother. He can stop.
You're going to bring your sweat.
For being just inadequate compared to the hype they get as the staple New York team in the biggest market.
Today's that you get to be happy because you guys actually did something good.
Dude, I have so many.
Everybody doubted.
Shut up.
Because everybody doubt it.
I have so much.
What I just say?
Shut up.
Don't say another word.
Don't say another word.
Because the whole world disrespected us.
Did I give up?
Yes, I did.
Did I jump back in five minutes later?
Yes, I did.
But we did it.
We got game one three to go.
You know what I'm saying?
It's up.
We got it.
Shout out to Walking 37 for tipping $2.50 right off the top of the show.
We appreciate you guys coming through.
We've got 400 of you guys in here already.
Appreciate everybody coming through right when the stream starts.
Got lots to talk about.
Like you got to see by the title.
We're talking about the start of the second round of the playoffs.
We didn't really get a chance to give you guys like second round prediction just because of every goddamn series went to seven games.
So it kind of fell between episodes.
But we're here to recap the first game in which we saw three upsets in three games,
including the next winning the first.
match against the Boston Celtics like we talked about, we'll talk about that, we'll talk about
the OKC Thunder game, we'll talk about the Cavs game, we'll preview the Warriors versus Timberwolves
game that comes on tonight. Yeah, man. Fun, a little round of a series you have to talk about.
No, last night was amazing. I feel like, and everyone's been saying it, but like last night was
peak playoff hoops, right? Because not only do you get the way that the game's ended, but you got
him, you got them with actual, like, good teams, right? Like, if stuff happened in the first time,
I was like, oh, dang, that's crazy.
This 1-8 is still going to get stopped, right?
And so now it feels like things have actual consequence
for what's going to happen in the playoffs.
And for a Knicks team that was down by 20,
for a Knicks team that hadn't beat all the top teams
and you know the stats, they're over 10 and all that,
to be able to stay in that game, do what needed to be done,
miss the opportunity to win it in regulation,
and then go win it in overtime.
That was hands down the best win
that the Knicks have had all year.
So I guess we're starting with the Knicks game.
Oh, no, 100%.
I guess that's been decided for us.
100%.
For them to do that, even when Josh Hart got into early foul trouble,
cat got into foul trouble,
Brunson didn't play amazing in the first half,
and you still saw their ability to kind of turn up.
Shut up.
I also said this last year, and it's the same thing again.
OG and Ninobe is the most important African man in my life.
I love him because he his offensive
explosion good
no more rights to the airport if you can listen
fuck you if you can drop 29 and go six of 11 from three
and play amazing defense over the course of two and a half three weeks
and continue it going fine you can have that title but oh gee's doing that and you're not
i got four points for you
that's it yeah so i yeah everything that the nix did last night
aside from Karathy touted in his performance.
Everything else was like, you know what?
You did what you needed to do and shout out to y'all.
Let me read a text that Donovan sent in our group chat during that game in the second quarter.
No, that was why.
In the second quarter, whenever the team.
So we're barely the lead here.
They lost it.
They won this game.
The New York Knicks.
They beat the Boston Celtics.
And they did this by making a hilarious comeback because this was the game chart.
This is what the lead changes look like.
All that green right there, that's all the time.
and the boss of Celtics led.
You see this little chunk done here,
this little bit of green?
That's a big amount of green.
They were up by a lot of points
and they blew a 20-point lead
to lose this game.
At home.
At home in game one.
So first things first,
unsurious performance by the Celtics.
They missed over 43s.
Tatum, in the last half of the game,
I think scored zero shots at the rim,
lots of step-back threes,
fell into old Tatum habits
and that annoyed people
in the end of the game when he tried
to hit a game-winning shot overbunds
by taking a step-back three.
It was a typical,
what you'd expect from one of those weird games in a series
or the self-expined a way to blow it
because of all their bad habits,
that happened.
The funniest part is.
Midway through the second quarter,
Donovan texted, and he said,
he tagged our friend,
he said, as a CBA expert,
tell me what I have to do
to get Carlton Town's off the books
and amnesty his contract.
That was Don't's reaction
to Carlton's early performance in the game.
No, it was despicable.
Because you talk about all the bad habits
that Tatum was having.
Carr Anthony Town's,
his bad habits were,
100% on display.
The shot selection, the fouling, the being out of position.
The Celtics did a very, very good job early on in that they knew, they knew we can get
Car Anthony Towns into these actions and we can attack him every single time.
And they were able to do that.
They were able to get him into foul trouble.
And he just, he can't move laterally with Jason Tatum or with Jalen Brown.
If they get by him and he's trying to make a play at the rim.
His hands are going to be in the wrong spot.
He's going to get a foul.
And so Mitch Robinson had to come into this game a lot earlier than what you thought.
We saw Pressure Sanchua minutes in game one because of the Carithetown's foul stuff
and because Mitch can't make free throws and the subject started to do, you know, the hack of whoever's strategy.
But that was one of the reasons when way back in August and September and you are having like,
that's a raving moment where you're psychic and you're looking forward.
and you're like I can I can already see what it looks like in the second round of the playoffs
when cat is in these situations and the Celtics did a good job and then at half time
they're like what if we just didn't do that again right what if what if we what if we just
didn't exploit that to to the same way that we did in the first half and then that kind of set
a whole bunch of things into into motion for them to lose that game hey mo what's up
can tell you something what's up Celtics and five we're fucking right who who cares
I don't, for the first time ever,
like, I am so perplexed when it comes to the outcome of this game.
Of course, it's fuck the next 24-7 all day ever.
But even bigger than that, it's the Boston Telsic Celtics.
Fuck them, too.
We witnessed them miss a historic amount of threes.
Over, what was the number, 46, 45, 3s?
Disgusting.
That is a hilarious choke job that we witnessed.
It would have been 46, but Jaylon Brown didn't even get a shot off.
Tragic.
We're never,
we're probably never going to see this happen again.
I don't want to say an NBA history,
but for at least a very fucking long time.
Yeah.
And to see.
For another three days.
They're going to put up 703s in game two.
This is how they operate.
Yeah.
Again, this is how they operate is the best way to phrase it.
Yeah.
This happens.
Sometimes the Celtics are known to troll.
That's why in early in last playoffs when they were,
you know,
we knew they were this dominant team that had their best season by far after adding
K.P. and Drew,
everyone still kind of had in their head that there's going to be games where they troll
because you live by the three and die by the three,
you know, naturally sometimes you're going to die a lot by those threes and this type of stuff
happens. That is to be expected at some degree, right? That's the reason they're probably not going
to sweep a lot of teams. We win a lot of series in five. That's cool. We all still expect
to Celtics to win the series, right? We're not going to overreact. But I will say, Jalen
Brown has been dealing with a lagging knee injury. He has his moments where you still look
like Jaylon Brown, but it's not quite as consistent. I think we can attribute that to the health.
And the last episode we talked about Chris Hosperus and how quite as it's been kept,
unless you're a Celtics fan,
Celtics fans are the first to tell you,
he kind of sucks right now,
and he's kind of sucked for a while
for KP standards.
A lot of the stuff he was brought in to do,
the spacing he's expected to provide,
the defensive anchor he was supposed to be.
He hasn't been doing too swell at those things.
So while we do still think
the Celtics will come back and win this series,
props to the Knicks,
but we're not going to change our prediction.
There's some issues with the Celtics
and they've got to figure out
over the course of the series
before they get to these later rounds.
The KP thing, on top of that,
on top of him being inconsistent in his play,
he's inconsistent in his availability.
Yeah.
And it's been like that all year.
And the weirdest part about game one is that he left.
And it was like, it wasn't even that he got hurt.
He was ill, right?
He got sick.
And so it's like, you know, are you actually going to be here?
And so I think like going forward in game two, the Jalen Brown aspect and the, and the
Porzingis, uh, I don't know, situation, I guess.
Lacking illness slash, yeah, whatever.
Yeah.
Because he missed, because they obviously missed time before the playoffs started with an illness.
Doctors didn't even know what he had, which was.
It was really, really weird that the last two things that, or two of the more major things
that we've heard from Christops over the last six to eight months, doctors are like,
this is super rare.
I've never seen this, right?
With his foot injury and with the illness.
But it leaves a door.
It leaves a door open for the Knicks to go get this series because, no, because.
It's not a motherfucker fucking serious.
No, I'm dead.
I'm dead serious.
If Chrisops, if Christops is not there, if Jane and Brown is a little bit compromised.
Sam Houser also turned his ankle there.
Yes.
We're talking about a team that is extremely top heavy.
And do I think that the combination of Jason Tatum, Drew Holiday, Derek White can elevate
the Al Horford Wright, can elevate them?
Of course.
Also Drew Holiday coming off the hamstring, but whatever.
So you have a top heavy team who's missing a lot of its, missing a lot of its heavy
hitters are at 100%.
There's a window open.
And so you can, I think I'm, I'm obviously.
not going to pick against the Knicks but like you know if you're just an objective
is a possibility yeah if you're an objective person and I don't think that it's just a mathematical
possibility I think that it actually is a real possibility that the Knicks win the same
damn I got bad news for you it just feels like everything had to go their way bro you
you escaped a cat disaster class how I thought it wasn't possible but hey because it's the guy's
name, aka Jalen Brunson, he made a
fucking possible. So why don't you flip that? I've seen
a lot of this though, but why can't
everyone's like, oh, the Celtics missed it. They miss
X amount of threes. Tatum was doing
this, Tadam was doing that. These are things that we've seen
from the Celtics before.
And have we, have we?
We've seen the once every six games and then they dominate
the other five of those six games. Okay.
So we've seen that before. We've
also seen Carinthe Towns. In the series
prior, she almost 50% from
three. So you do have that. You have
we've seen stretches of the
we've seen stretches of the year where
Mikhail Bridges has looked better
offensively than what he did last night.
You can say,
hey, that can also get back to a positive
to a positive measure.
So while you're trying to play out
this balancing act, are the Celtics the favor?
Of course they are, right?
Are they on paper the better team?
Yes.
But line up, but put,
get on the line, boy, boy, and see what happens.
See what happened.
I thought we were coming up here
we were enjoying this next win
we were saying awesome
I was trying to
but then y'all out here
and be like
and then we got insanity over here
we got Hopium going too far
you're setting yourself up for disappointment
listen man if they win
shout out gentlemen Brunson
he will be propelled
as one of the greatest Knicks
of all time
to win this series
easily he already is
this you shouldn't overreact
any game one
you definitely shouldn't overreact
when the best shooting team
we've seen in the last 10 years
shoots this poorly
shooting variance decides a lot of things
this was so close of a game
despite the self-explaying
so far below their levels
sure McKill can play better sure so and so can go well for the next two the chasm of the difference between their average performance versus what the Celtics did is a lot smaller the Celtics were so far below their line I think there's always a balancing act with these game ones from a team at top C that beat their first round series early they had a lot of time off there's always a balance between is it going to be rust or rest when you miss 45 threes clearly you had to deal with some rust a little shake that off that okay that would be I would agree with you more in that statement if
If the game was close throughout the entire way,
if you, you pulled up the graphic.
The Celtics were up for a massive part of this game.
They were up 20 up until the mid third quarter.
Nobody was saying, oh, like the rest, the rest.
Yes, they were.
Everyone was saying, damn, they're fine way to win,
despite their jumper being this bad.
But being, being up 20, right?
That is a little relevance to how the jumpers look.
Had they had they won, even if they shot the way that they shot,
had they won yesterday, everybody would have said,
that the Celtics are just that much talented.
The Knicks suck.
They can't, they can't, they can't, they can't, they can't, they can't, and you know,
no, no argument of Russ would have been, would have been brought up.
But now because they lost, now it's, oh yeah, the, now it's, now it's, now it's, oh, yeah,
the, the Russ, the Russ kicked in.
They fell into bad habits, which is the one thing that they have, that, the one thing
that we've been talking about for the Celtics for two years, maybe even three years.
It happened last night.
This is what they do.
The bad habit was missing open shots.
That happens.
Either way, if you miss 45 shots, you're rusty.
Why are you missing shots, though?
Because they're rusty.
Either way, they'd be rusty.
They either would have won despite the rust.
I will say, I will say, you did it.
They took bad shots.
Towards the end of the game, towards the end of the game,
there were very bad shots taken by guys like kings.
I agree with you on that.
But in general, somebody take a turn.
Somebody take a turn.
You guys, I actually are pissed me off.
No, you're right.
They did take bad shots.
There are so many bad possessions by guys.
guys like Jalen Brown and especially Jason Tatum
to his own standard, bro.
He was doing, he was spammy step back threes
for whatever fucking reason.
Those got, when you talk about
specific mannerisms and just habits
that they fall back into,
that's 100% on Tatum for that.
Yeah.
I love shaking my hair now.
You can't, you could do that, but you can't do that.
Well, anyways, regardless of back to the point.
Don't let me blow this out.
I went to Turkey, man.
But I, overall, like, Isaac is overall, right?
like yeah like yeah
the late game execution was bad
there wouldn't have been a late game execution needed
if they hit an average amount of their shots
which they will most games all I'm saying
I'm not saying they sell this way perfect
they obviously it was a close game
they didn't execute in the fourth quarter
it wouldn't have been a close game
eight out of ten times if they ran this back
because most times the Celtics proven
they're gonna win the math equation
more times they're nine they're gonna make
at least a below average amount of their shots
not the worst shooting performance of their season
like I'm listen you can have some hope
the Knicks are not to be
they're not an easy
like ever the offense is that good brunton is that good but i won't give myself i won't if i was a nix
fan i wouldn't give myself too much hope that they're going to win the series because of the worst
shooting performance you could possibly imagine from the celtics i just wouldn't let that be the reason
where you're like yeah we can make him do this again this is definitely going to happen again i would
look for i would look for other reasons to be happy i'm going to the back in the head who's
winning the series in what games gun gun a legitimate gun to the back of your head the celtics
I didn't know like I'm not I'm not disputing that the Celtics should be the favorite in this series but I'm saying like the way that you guys are approaching this and because at the end of the day now there it's a best of seven the Knicks have have one game like you just have you have to get four they have one I'm saying that for that for that there's a couple things that happen in the Knicks favor I think going into game two which is one you come off of this crazy physical football series with the Pistons.
And I do think that you saw in the, at least in the first quarter or in the in the first half at the whole, it took them time to adjust.
They, they were like, what do you mean I can't just run over these people?
What do you mean?
I can't hit him on his hand.
And so when Hart and Kat and Brunson even get into foul trouble, it takes, it takes a little while.
And so I think you have, you have that aspect of it.
And we'll figure out, right, what happens from from the.
the Mitchell Robinson development, because I actually do think that it's very interesting that
the Celtics went to the Hackamitch pretty early and didn't go back to it.
Like I thought that in the second half, that was also something from them that was like,
it clearly worked.
You clearly got the Knicks out of any type of offensive rhythm that they had in the first half,
and you allow them to play with it, to play with that lineup in the second half and use their
defense to get back into it whenever Kat was still in major foul trouble.
Like, they could have pressed the issue so much more.
And there was a scenario where we could have seen Huck 40 minutes last night
because all of the bigs were either unplayable or infallurable.
And the Celtics, I don't think press that button enough.
Yeah, what's interesting is the Knicks, they ran their most switches this game by far on the season.
Before this game, the most switches they ever ran in the regular season was 24 in one game.
They had 33 in this game.
And that was a part of the reason why they came back to besides the Celtics going cold.
They went cold and it made a big difference because in that second half,
they were having a hard time beating those switches one-on-one.
So the Knicks did find something there that the Celtics have to adjust to.
So, I mean, the Celtics probably will, but they definitely have to figure that out.
That part's TBD.
The Knicks, at the very least, they showed them something that they don't normally do
and that caught them up guard in their game planning, I'm imagining.
Because I assume they did not expect the big to be switched out quite as much.
The Nitz Celtics are probably planning for a heavier drop coverage game.
So shout-out tips, pulling that out of nowhere.
I guess maybe they're hiding that for the playoffs.
Maybe that was like an actual thing of that sort.
but I really hope you're right.
I hope you're right.
I would love nothing more.
No, stay on that side.
Keep it okay.
Keep in mind.
I like trolling you.
I would like to see the Celtics downfall more.
So let this make that much clear.
I'm not hoping to be right about the Celtics.
No, it's okay.
I would love to see the Celtics downfall so much more.
If it meant you're happy about your team, I would accept it.
I 100% agree with you.
So I'm on the same thing.
It's way bigger than you, but we're talking about history.
I'm always going to troll you if we can.
But we would also love to see the Celtics downfall.
Also, let's not get that confused.
Yeah, exactly.
It's always fucking Celtics.
This is a troll either way type of debacle in this series.
Either way, we're going to laugh.
Yeah, there's, bro, this is one of the, we're in one of the best seats to be in as NBA fans, because whatever happens.
We don't give a fuck.
We don't give a damn.
We don't get to laugh at him or laugh at the Celtics.
As a passive viewer, this is the best case in area.
A win is a fucking win.
No.
No, shout out to the Knicks.
It was a great comeback.
More importantly than anything.
Shout out Jalen Brunson for once again being just an outrageous closer.
Like we had this conversation last year when we realized that he is like transcending everything
you thought his archetype of his size could be.
He just keeps doubling down on this.
We had the series winner against Asar Thompson.
We had him closing on this game strong.
He's just the most likable star player in the league, I think.
I don't know besides people that hate his foul bidding, which I guess is fair to use their own.
Man, he should have pulled that out yesterday.
I was called for it.
That's so interesting that you said that because usually typically throughout this
entire Celtics Knicks series
about the entire year.
Something that I noticed that the Celtics tried to do a good job of is not
get runs into the line because obviously it just creates an avalanche of
advantages for the offense and also helps get him going as well.
And this game, they didn't do the great.
He got to the line, I think seven times or eight times.
And that's, yeah, of course, like that's not usually,
I think that's right around his average.
Sightly both.
They did an okay job with that.
So I'm curious to see how they're able to tighten down on like,
even more because if you look at the
previous games that they faced off
against each other,
Brunton has not been in general
been able to get to the line as often
and as comfortably as he usually is
because of how they decide and fend him
and give him a little bit more space and use that link
to go ahead and disrupt him.
So I'm keeping an eye on that heavy.
And on that,
I'm very curious in Game 2.
Like the number one thing that I'm watching
or that I'm looking for going into Game 2
is 100%
the KP situation.
Yeah.
Because if KP's not there and you have to roll out
Al Horford, you saw at the end
of the game, the Celtics were giving
that switch, the Knicks were taking it. And they said,
if you are going to allow us to have
Jaylen Brunson or have Al Horford
on Jalen Brunson, cool, we'll
live with that. And as great
of a defender as Al Horford is,
you do trust Jalen Brunson in those
moments in ISOs where the
Celtics are also going to be like, we trust
Al Horford. It's one-on-one. It's one-on-one.
you know what Jalen Brunson can do
and so I like that's going to be an area
where the Knicks are going to be able to
hopefully find some more success
if KP doesn't play or if Alhorfer has to play extended minutes
yeah I'm glad this
the Knicks are going to at least make this a fun series
because like even you were not excited to see
how you're a scarehouse is going to go
at least they gave us something that we can like
not all three these series
thank God they're going to be close because it's felt like on paper
it was going to be a lot of blowouts
or at least not blowouts because they're all good teams
but it was going to be a lot of series
that we didn't have a lot of
there wasn't a lot of questions
on who was going to win it on paper, you know?
Yeah.
So let's move on to another one
that now we have a lot of questions about.
OKC Thunder
where it's Denver Nuggets.
This was the funniest meltdown
I could imagine
and probably the most frustrating
for Thunder fans
because we saw the OKC Thunder
pretty much dominate for three quarters,
really three and a half quarters.
43 minutes,
the defensive activity was insane.
Alice Caruso played out of his mind.
Yokich 8, but outside of that,
they had a double-digit lead
for most of the game,
and then Yokic just went God mode.
Yokic scored like 10 straight points in a fourth quarter run
and then Mark Dagnall,
Mark fucking Dagnol decided to do the most hilariously unethical series
of fouling of three that bit them in the ass,
gave them carmic debt.
They lost the game strictly because of Mark Dagnall's decision
to foul up three too many times.
And then Chet fucking Holmgren looked like George Hill at the line.
It was a hilariously comical meltdown.
I never seen that man so much paler in my life.
He was scared shitless.
It was such a jarring meltdown to go from such a, for again, for 40 minutes,
we were like, okay, Thunder came out strong.
The rest, they look spry.
Alex Russo looks like.
The low management worked.
He looks amazing.
He's playing full minutes now and flying around.
Shout out of him.
He was going down to.
And then the flip fucking switched.
And then Yokic, the level, like, so much to be made about the Mark Dagnolk mistakes,
fouling up three in the chat misses.
Even before that, for the five minutes before that,
Yokic dominated so unbelievably hard.
That looked like the Bronto shit with how much they just like locked in.
He defended pretty well.
And I think it was like four-shaped possessions.
He just smashed the paint, scored every time and just slowly wooded away that lead.
It was real best player in the world shit.
I was thinking the same exact thing.
And in turn in that too, like, Shay did his thing.
And he tried his best to hoist, like, hoist,
up all the other guys around him but of course she wasn't able to or i mean my bad not she
chet he had a so-and-so game not the greatest game in fact one of the worst games that he's played this
postseason and then jadev as well like we've had questions dating since last year about how
consistent and how reliable of a go-to store score can he be yeah he was the complete opposite of that
last night 20% from the field five for 20 and i think he was the biggest one that it looked like
Rust, I think. Now, we know J-Duff can have some fucking poor shooting games, so that could
happen as well. But in round one, he did such a good job of asserting his like physicality
against smaller defenders and the Grizzlies. And in this game, I guess part of it is the
Nuggets played a pretty big lineup for most of the game with Aaron Gordon and Nicole Yokich
out there for most of the minutes. But he was just so weird and like dependent on the on his like
off-balance floaters and not really creating contact and finishing in the lane that it looked like
rust to me and the shot's not falling. But you can never be sure because it's two years in a
where we're seeing a lot of bad J-Up games,
it's always going to be a concern.
Didn't start well in that regard.
That's what it looked like last year, right?
Yeah.
I think the Mavs also, like,
did a really good job of exposing his handle
and, like, game planning to make him look bad.
This game, I think he just, like,
played horribly on his own accord.
Just look back.
Either way, this is two years now.
Yeah.
Where we're in the second round,
and you're not playing the cupcake in the first round.
And so you have actual,
and listen, for the nuggets,
like, shout out to,
to them because and i i think you guys have probably seen the clip too of yoke's like in the time
out you know yelling and stuff he's looking like player coach right now and he's looking locked in
but this is this is now for jadob the i think we all talked about him as one of the the biggest
x factors for the thunder because you knew it was going to come come down to this and so
it does it does suck because everything that everybody said about the thunder all year in
terms of inexperience in terms of are they are they really like that is jadab is jadev really like
that offensively all of that came into fruition in one game and so it it's the same thing as with all
of these series the door is open now and if you give the best player in the world a little bit of
daylight to where now they only have to win three of these games you can see like you can see
Yokin's taking over against Chet and against Hartinstein for the rest of the series and him
dominated. We just saw it last series about how much he can dominate and how much he can impact
the game. So I'm, I'm not moving off of OKC, but I'm like, okay. You guys, you guys actually
have to go out and win it. It's not, it's not like, I don't know about it open in terms of
like I'm not changing my opinion. Because before we didn't get to do our predictions, I was going to
say OKC in six because the Yokic factor, he's just so good. And they have such the purpose.
perfect player to take advantage of all the Thunder's weaknesses and the fact that you can beat them up on the boards with Nicole Yokish specifically and create a lot of offensive rebounds with Nicole Yoker specifically. So I was thinking OKC and 6. I think this just makes it so we have to really, really see what the Thunder are about mentally now because we have no concerns about them on paper. And if their offense is good enough, their defense is good enough, if their best player is good enough, et cetera. We know that if basketball is playing on a spreadsheet, they would be everybody by far. The question is the mental side of it. That's kind of what people mean when they say.
experience right like can you stay poised under pressure in those moments you've never been there
before clearly check got a little shook on that free throw line from that this will be the best test
of that i think to really throw them in the fire from having no pushback in round one to now
you had a little leeway you were favored in the series you could afford to lose a game or two
and still be fine to lose that game right away you can't lose the second one now it's it's not do
or die per se but for the position you're in as a younger team that is favored but you know
you have the questions you have a little bit of a chip on your shoulder for you
your inexperienced and you hear that you got to come out and show that you have that
championship mental so so we can believe that the the net rating matters so we can believe
that the defensive rating matters because you have the requisite wherewithal to make it matter
against a team like the Nuggets who I am so unbelievably moved by them right now and so just
like I don't need I'm not proud because I'm not a Nuggets fan but I'm like respecting them so much
the level of lock in they have the way they're pulling up their shorts and defending in these
big moments it is just like it's peak whatever the it feels like 23 because it like whatever like
championship material means whatever it factor means it feels like I'm watching it every night they
have that to the highest degree yeah I feel like in 2023 like there were so many moments where
down like that five-man line that that that they had you would get to the fourth quarter and if the if the game
was tied or if the Nuggets had a small lead it's like all right they got it because they were just going
out-execute you offensively and the fact that they can do it on on both ends right
obviously offensively they're always going to do it because yokech is there and the right play is
going to be made but now that it's a it's a two-way kind of lock-in that is a very interesting
development yeah and it's a it's a high high level of a dog that they have I'll I'll
overreact right now and I'll say if the nuggets go up to O they got it well yeah yeah I
would be very scared they went up to O I agree that would
wouldn't be overreaction that would be oh fuck losing both games in the home court that is not a good
place to start from yeah exactly for me going forward for game two a thing that i'll be definitely
keying into and hoping that this isn't the outcome because again like you guys know and as you
start off the year i'm like yeah i got the Denver nuggets coming up this top of the year uh coming
towards the end of the season but i switch sides and i'm like yeah i think okay c's actually
going to be title favorites maybe like midway 30 games in the season or whatever
Seeing how they got beat the fuck up on the boards was so, like, it's deflating.
They got abused on the boards, and I think I saw so much.
In general, they're a bigger team, obviously, but I felt the Isaiah Hardinstein impact,
but it feels like they just need much more else everywhere in terms of, like, effort and hustle and all that other shit across the board.
I think that's going to be here to stay no matter what, even when the games they win.
They won the boards because you have to throw two bodies on Nicole Yokic.
And when you do that, you help off of Russell Westbrook and you help off Aaron Gordon and Christian Brown and all these so-so shooters.
And those guys are so unbelievably good at cutting and crashing to get the board when Yokish tries to shoot over the double team.
That's going to be a strength of theirs regardless.
So, like, part of it is by design because the Nuggets, the Thunder know that and they're okay with that because they know they have to throw two bodies at Yokich.
So I think that comes to the territory.
The thing that concerns me is the Nuggets, they play defense.
last night, they looked to me like the Golden State Warriors defense with how they were able
to completely shrink the floor and use their positional size to cut off all the driving lanes
and make it so if Shea wants to drive, he's going to double it at the nail every time, they're
going to have to swing it out to a shooter and they're going to close out really hard and make
that shooter make a quick decision. They did such an unbelievably good job at that that
Mark Dagonal needs to have a better fix for that in the game too. They need to go in the lab
and figure something out because Shea did not look comfortable at all times. He had a good game
overall. But in that late game scenario where the Nuggets scored like eight straight
points with Yokic and really whittled down that lead, the other side of that is they
locked the thunder the fuck up in the half court because their ability to cut off the driving
lanes was so good. And part of it is also that fact that in the playoffs right now we're
seeing them allowed the most physicality ever. So they're allowed to really knock
shay off of his driving lanes. If you can be really physical with him, you can double him
well, you can recover well to those shooters. They got to figure out some spacing situations
going on because that's going to be tricky, tricky, tricky every single late game situation.
Shout out to Russell Westbrook, man.
He was a demon effort-wise that game.
He always is, so, you know, that's his M.O.
But he was really important.
Him and obviously Aaron Gordon,
we're ignoring the fact that this man hit a fucking game winner.
We haven't even mentioned it.
Ice in his goddamn veins.
I mean, shout to you, you know what I'm saying?
He's not a real game winner of the playoffs.
Ice in his fucking veins.
He's such a likable role player.
Yeah.
No, it was great.
To your, to your shape point, this is, this is 100% where,
where Mark Dagnall has to get into his bag
because they won and they blew the Grizzlies out
because the Grizzlies suck.
But Shea hasn't looked comfortable all playoffs.
Yeah.
Like he's had, he's had, you know, his first, like, games under 25 points in forever.
He's gotten certain numbers, but it hasn't looked as crisp.
And all the, like, MVP moments that we saw throughout the year,
he hasn't had one of those signature moments in the first five.
five games where on the other side like yoke's just doing that basically every other game and so
finding a way to get your star player um comfortable that's a like that's going to be on him especially
when you're going up against an interim coach and you think that you'd have a coaching advantage in
last night that just you know at least toward the end of the game wasn't was in the case and the
shade thing um it's not so the reasons he's struggling i think aren't surprising in that teams are just
doubling the fuck out of him.
With extreme consistency, which happens in the regular season, he's not exactly new to it.
But obviously, the intensity in a playoff series is different.
The level of game plan, people always talk about when you play a team for seven straight games,
you're going to have a more precise game plan, right, and they're going to know the perfect
spots to double him, the ways he's most uncomfortable attacking against double teams.
They're doing that more.
That's natural.
You have to learn to be able to work through that as number one option.
Every star gets that.
Tatum famously struggled with that for a couple of years.
Now he's pretty damn great at passing out of the.
that and then the it hasn't been talked about too much the level of physicality being allowed is like
noticeably extremely different right now compared to most playoffs runs we've talked about it yeah it hurts
him especially people talk about it in so far as that like you're not going to get those free throws
in the playoffs that hasn't been the issue the issue is his driving ability is so predicated on
angles and his ability to like slither around people that if they're able to hand check him it really
throws him off his rhythm and that's what he has to adapt to i think so it's like a mixture of two
things that come with the territory of being a superstar that I think we all think he will
adapt to it or at least can TBD he has to figure it out this is what comes to the territory you
have to be able to adjust the new coverages in the playoffs and they just flip the switch like
there's a there's a middle level of like normal playoff intensity that they just a hundred
percent you know skipped and now it's like you're playing game six game seven in the NBA
finals every single night and so yeah that's going to be crazy especially in this game which
once again, they haven't played anybody because the grizzly suck.
And so you haven't had to really, really get deep in your bag because before you look up,
you guys are by 25.
Yeah.
Right?
He has had to really go and use, you know, his fifth best move and take a counter off
for that move to go get to go get a bucket.
Like, it's definitely an adjustment.
So we will see.
Yeah.
If you want to get credit for being an MVP, being a top three player in the world,
you get them in that very good season.
these are the moment you've got to prove that it transit to the playoffs right like it's the exact time that
he kind of like solidifies himself as that and this is this is obviously a great test because the nuggets are doing
an extremely good job with that and it works both ways too because yokech is getting hounded they're
following the shit at fm every play they're also doing the same thing okay sees an incredibly physical
defense and he's done know what he's done he's done a fantastic job at foul baiting so then nuggets fans
have screamed for him to do to be more unethical he was so unethical in the second quarter getting chet
and Isaiah Hardenstein
to foul trouble on purpose,
he did such a good job
at that because he's a season
veteran that has learned
to cope with that
physicality.
Yeah.
You got to see the other side.
You got to see Shay also
learn how to figure out
ways to get around that.
Game to who you got.
I would hope,
OK, C.
I'm about pray,
okay,
so he finds a way to win.
I'll go with the thunder.
They also,
they did the things
that they also like normally do
in terms of,
like they turn,
they turn,
they turn them over so much.
they I think like they they doubled them up on turnovers they were able to yeah you're right they had like 18
turnovers right they were able to get points off of those turnovers and so I think like that's something
where even as great as as yokic was last night and all the all the you know lock in slap in the floor
that Denver did the the defensive pressure and the strength for okay C this season has always been
their defense it's always been the fact that they have elite perimeter defenders and they can go and say
caruso you come out we'll put somebody else in and they just have this factory of guys
that they can that they can roll out that that's not something that i feel discouraged about
in the least and so going into game two i still expect them to put a lot of pressure on on the
perimeter for denver and they're going to be able to get turnovers they're going to be able to
get out and get points off of that so it really is you know even if shade doesn't have an
amazing game which if shade even if like if jada has a bad game and
And if Chet is just so-so, you can have their regular defensive pressure.
And let's say Shea goes up 5%.
I feel good about them winning it.
I mean, I feel good about them winning it as long as Mark Dagnol doesn't do the stupidest coached decision of all time.
So, like, in the day, like, I'm not unconfident in the thunder now.
They have, again, they have to lock in and show us their championship material mentally and win game two.
So the pressure's on and they have to answer it.
That's TBD, right?
That's not a guarantee.
But if you're confident beforehand of this series, I don't think you should be less confident now.
I think you should be noticing
that it's harder now
and they have no budget for error
but again they were winning
for most of the game
and then I can't
I can't over exaggerate
how fucking stupid
what Mark Dagnol did was
They had 11 seconds left on the clock
and he started fouling up two
What's to be gained
if you foul them every single time
the ball comes in with no time off the clock
At that point you're just like
taking turns shooting fritos
in perpetuity forever
until somebody misses
You're not running any time off the clock
All you're doing is injecting an opportunity
for randomness
with three is smart but also you have to combine that with losing time on the clock if there's
two seconds left always foul up three if there's 11 seconds left play some goddamn defense it doesn't
make sense to do it at that point that early it was i compared on twitter to the jr smith game one shot
uh fuck up from 2018 where he did another clock it felt like that level of mind slip to me where
that just didn't make sense at all and he just completely like froze don't do that and you win
the game and it's a very different conversation right now and add on top of that yokez was out the
game.
Yeah, that part too.
Yolkich was out the game.
The Nuggets didn't have any timeouts.
They weren't going to be able to get Yokich back into the game unless the thunder
stop the, stop the game.
And they said, we will do that and give you as much time as you need.
So silly.
You want them in?
You want them in for how long?
We got you.
So, like, that's the, that was, yeah, that was the major blunder.
And the day, J-dub sucked.
Shea was good, but not quite as amazing as he was in the regular season.
Still good.
He had damn near a triple double.
We were kind of framing like he had a bad game.
It's just not to his MVP standards, but he was still good.
Chet blew two free throws look like a deer in headlights.
None of that would goddamn matter if Mark Dagnall just had regular baseline clock
management and did it completely soil his pants.
Like it was that level of meltdown that like everything else that came because of that
can be traced back to the fact that he pretty much lost in the game.
Yeah, I can agree with that.
Their AI led offense failed him last night for sure.
And I feel pretty good about them coming back and bouncing back in game too because like
you said, nothing was wildly uncharacteristic.
like a force like shake fit is facing just a different level of defense and there's some
uncomfortabilities in his game but still within that like you said the and he put up like a
30 point triple double a damn near so yeah his game is still what is what is what is going to do
alice crusoe gave them like 20 fucking points out insane a 20 point for game 20 point game last
night and also had like fucking five assist two or whatever he had five threes as well played
ridiculous check i mean jad up just needs to hit his shots and chet just needs to overall show
it more, a little bit more offensively
to help, like, release a lot of pressure
from the J-Duds and Shays of the world.
I think we're not going to see much better of Chet
for a few reasons.
I've talked about it all year.
He's not a good score as a power forward.
They're kind of, so in this series,
they have to play in power forward
because it's goddamn Yokic.
You got to play the double big lineup
and pray you cannot get destroyed
in the interior.
So you have to do that
and deal with the downsides.
Che is good as a score
when he's against five
because he can stretch him out
and has a little bit of a quickness
advantage against most fives.
Like he would against Yokchch
who'd create some good jumpers.
when he's playing the four
he is not strong enough
to exploit smaller guys
so you're not going to see
big scoring games
with him in this series
and also
when he missed all the time
with that broken hip
his key came back
his lower body
is so trash right now
he is so weak
as you'd expect
because he missed
six months
with a broken hip
you can't do a lot of squats
I imagine
remember those two dunks
that he missed in this game
yeah
weak-ass lower body
he could not jump high enough
he missed a putback
he missed a wide open dunk
there was
the late game free throws
I bet his legs
were fucking tired
and not contributed as much as anything,
you're going to,
Che is going to have a struggle
in this series as a score
no matter what I think.
Unless he just,
you know,
threes fall,
it changes things.
That's the main thing for me personally.
Like,
when it comes to him and his mobility
and, like,
gliding to the room like he casually doesn't,
not necessarily can't hold you
to those expectations,
but bare minimum just like hitting your shots,
your set shots specifically is needed
and there's no excuse for that.
I think defensively he looks so pretty good in this game.
Obviously, Yokish went fucking beast mode.
He'd,
got them both in foul trouble, beat up both those bigs.
He had, especially against everybody else that's not Yokic,
Chet played a good defensive game.
So there's at least that, but yeah, man,
I think they're going to have to win in spite of his offense in this game in the series.
J-dub has to be the guy to beat that second star
because you're not getting it from Chet
when he has to use all of his energy to defend fucking Nikola Yokic.
Broken hip is so crazy.
Yeah, it really is an insane.
To break your hip and to come back and not just be like,
you know, like older person, like if you're 30 and you're,
break your hip and you're like man i'm just trying to learn how to walk again you're playing professional
basketball on the best team in the league being asked to be one of the best defenders in the league
after you broke your hip like it's it's crazy at the ripe age like 21 22 yeah and you had to defend
a colin yokic with twig legs because you couldn't work out for five months like bro i'm going home
and he's already he was already at a disadvantage too because his legs are his legs ain't
nothing do to do about it yeah missed six months of a bolt because he like he can't
You can't put on any size of peak.
Like these ages, right, is the peak time where you are, like, putting on size,
adjusting to NBA physicality.
And to have somebody who already missed an entire season, have one year and one off season,
and then basically miss a majority of this year as well.
And by the time you get back into your rhythm, boom, here comes hard and it's time.
Now you have to figure out how to work with this.
I feel like next, and obviously, then the number one seed,
they could still go on and win a championship.
Everything could be fine.
Next year, it's going to be a similar situation,
probably to what we saw with Darius Garland this year,
where, oh, yeah, you actually get a full offseason to rehab this crazy injury.
Now you're just going to be better from start to finish.
Because from the jump, those first nine games,
Ted was looking different.
He was looking crazy.
And then he broke his hip.
So I'm very curious to see after the offseason what he looks like next year.
You know, it comes to the territory.
everybody gets hurt and has to deal with the downsides we've been critical of everybody in there
everybody breaks their hit yeah it is a bad injury but so it's i would say it's on the team now
it's on mark dagonal to realize that chet's still going to be a good defender offensively there's
given tank you're going to have to play into hardinstein as a finisher play more to jdub you know not
ask too much of chet like this is what he's paid for this is why he won coach the year last year
this is why he's heralded as an elite coach time to show it mark because this is a series that
requires very good coaching because even though you have a just immense talent advantage
up and down the roster, Nicole Okish makes up for a lot of that.
Yeah.
You know what's the dumbest conversation that I saw last night on Twitter after this game?
People were saying, oh, man, the Wemby conversations are over, bro.
Chet and Wemby conversations, I can't believe you had those talks.
The most dumbest shit I've seen in a very, I can't say in a very long time.
But some of those dumbest commentary and takes that I've seen from this game is.
Who had Chet and Wemby talks?
like compare people comparing the two
yeah but like and like anybody really think
TD and like Dirknowitzky type
I mean I guess
Thunder fans probably said
Chats's probably better than Wemby
but did anybody with like
did anybody really believe
Chet would be better than Wemby
is that a real conversation
I think they were in the
not necessarily in the same
tier but in like a similar class
of players
I mean it's like
defensively yeah
yeah for sure
defense for sure
it's playing the way that he played for nine games
cool right where he was averaging 24
getting four blocks right there was
that 10 game stretch we were saying
the d p o why is chet's
however again we haven't seen that in
in a whole year and wemby
wild chet was out like it
this the season really has been a disadvantage for chet
because while chet was out
wemby was out here ascending
and taking massive massive steps
offensively he was looking great defensively as well
and now that his team is better
you're going to start hearing
that stuff like people are are going to realize how good wemby is and obviously yeah we're not
turning this into wendy glaze right now we got to talk about cleveland versus the pacer some news
just broke that the game's going to start saying we'll tell you about it but first let's read some
donations shout out to i've avocado for different $15 shout out to jt 2501 for $3 paradox for $3
$7 something's in $5 for $5 I'm throwing that $5 back
Carlos for $3 appreciate you shout to dark lobster for $20
Appreciate you a lot.
Shout out to Elsa OZT for $3.
Dark Lobster for another $5.
Appreciate all y'all, man.
So we talked about two straight upsets in game ones
in which teams that we thought
would walk through their conferences
got beat at home.
Turns out there's a third team
that we also thought
would walk to the conference finals.
Here go a little more for you.
They also lost.
The Cleveland Cavaliers lost
to the Indiana Pacers in game one.
The Pacers being a team that we all respect.
We don't expect them to beat the Cavs.
but we all say you better be on your goddamn toes
because the patients are not to be fucked with
they are going to make you execute and play your game well
turns out Darius Garland wasn't there game one
so that made things muddy
and then the Pacer just out played them in game one
game two is about to happen
we have news that's Evan Mobley
Darius Garland and DeAndra Hunter
are all out for game two due to injuries
Holy fuck
It's getting scary
Those three players from the rotation bro
That sucks
Pivotal players
That sucks
So these guys were all up in the air
I'm guessing what they decided to do
was let's cross our goddamn fingers for game two
let's get them healthy for game three
let's try to if we had to punt it we have to punt it
they need to be 100% before they come back
and I guess that's what they opted for
this kind of sucks because the calves are having
the best season they've ever had outside of LeBron
to see it potentially
to be irrelevant by injuries how annoying
just all you can say is how annoying
it's just no analysis really
if they win the series are not due to injuries
we'll see but how fucking
annoying for when the premier teams to be eliminated by something
like this if that goes that far
scored down a little bit
to that first reply they can't keep getting away with this
the pace is year in and year out at least for the last two years
are now here in the second round and have key injuries going in their favor now
shout out to them though because all you can do is play who's in front of you
and at least to their credit they're up one oh right now like they did go into cleveland
in game one and get that game and they had three stars there so so it wasn't an easy game
they won a game against a team that yes was very in
good position to win still yes and so listen we've talked a lot about tyrese and his his development
and his ascension and i guess regression to to the mean or whatever yeah right up and down nature
of his style of yes so we we talked about tyrese game one yo andrew nemhard is disgust
he's a homie ludden them hard we go hard every day for nem hard he's he's disgusting the the his impact
on on this game whether it be shot making in kisa
in key situations and not like the obvious like oh i'm going to hit a shot at the end of the
quarter but like cleveland's making a run and nemhart hits a hits a three to kind of keep
them at bay where nemhart goes and makes makes a nice pass gets it still here like he he has been
so key all year long and there's a reason why whenever you look at the top lineups for indiana
nemhart's always always on there and it's like him and tirese and pascal like that that that big big three
whatever like that trio it's elite and he played so well in game one nim hard is such a weird
ass player because coming into his career everyone saw him and knew he was going to be a very good
like role player for this team he has been that since day one up until now obviously but in the
he seems like one of the new one of the NBA's like latest playoff risers traditionally he's a
he's a he's been a good three-point shooter you shot like i think 35 percent for his first year
85%
for his second year
and this past season
he shot 29%
from the three point line
he's never been like
a player
who's gonna kill you
with his scoring
more so he's like
he provides solid
secondary tertiary
playmaking
and he's a very good
consistent role player
might I say like
at times
he can feel Derek White
esk
definitely
that's a good comparison
like there's only
so many players
in the league
that can be
your main point
of attack defender
hit a three
and create
like as a point guard
a little bit
Derek White
Andrew NMhard
Jalen Suggs I guess Dyson Daniels if you want to give him that with the creation jump
Outside of that can you name anybody else that fits that mold like it's so unique and so valuable
It's rare it's rare to have all those all those things and also be able to like still be the one of the best defenders
The best permanent defender on the court at all times
Yeah, and so seeing him just like rise and shoot 40 fucking 45% from three point line
The pieces just have so many weapons they have so many weapons that can easily glide into 16 17 points a night
and Tyrese Halliburton's job is to eat it's not easy of course but for him he makes it look easy
because he's the one conducting all this shit and their offense is full so effortlessly yeah
yeah we've talked about a lot as of late the paces are just so disciplined and just so consistent in
their approach we we talked a lot early in the year about when Tyrese Halliburton were struggling
and they went to these like more lower usage of him I guess you can say egalitarian spread out the
ball offense and when Tyrese Hallibor was playing poorly and it seems
to adversely affect him, we were like, what are they doing?
That feels, if Tyrese can't play this way, then that's going to, you know, your ceilings
is lower.
He adapted so long ago.
He's back to being really good in finding his flow within this.
Now you're seeing it paid dividends.
You see why Rick Carlisle elected to make him play this way.
They're not dependent on one star player.
They're not even dependent on two star players.
They're dependent on five guys that all create and all have a role.
It gives you such a high floor that here you are.
You get, I guess, quote unquote, lucky with injuries.
you're going to take advantage every time
you're going to win the game
if the other team's under man
because you are going to simply play your game
and if the other team isn't in tip-top shape
ready to play their game
at the highest level,
you're probably going to beat them
five times out of six.
Yeah, and obviously
you don't want to see the injuries
on Cleveland side
and it does put,
it does give Indiana
a great opportunity to go up to-0.
I still think Cleveland,
so I'll say this.
I'm picking Indiana tonight.
I picked them before,
before this game
and before all these.
the other guys got hurt.
But D. Mitch, and you saw it in game one,
D. Mitch and his playoff rising and his ability to just say,
I'm just going to take over the game right now.
It was on display in game one.
And you are going to see that tonight.
Like you're going to see him put up a lot of shots,
carry the offense, put the team on his back,
and there were so many stretches,
specifically this one, where the Cavs eventually took the lead,
where D. Midge, going to the rim, putting pressure on the rim,
knocking down shots, right?
when his off the dribble 3, like a lot of stars,
but when his off the dribble 3 is working with his speed
and his ability to put pressure on the rim,
you just got to put your hands up and be like,
all right, you got it.
So, like the D-Mids game might happen tonight
and we might look up and it's going to be 1-1.
And, you know, Mowgli's back for game 3,
Garland's back for game 3, and everything's fine.
Yeah, I wish we had more to say about this,
but it's really just like, we'll fucking see what the castes can do
before the stars come back.
Like, it's just unfortunate.
Not much to be said about a team
that's going to be playing with half of their star
players we've been handicapped with these conversations tied your own legacy game today yeah you know
if they win it'll be a teamish legacy game probably he's had a lot of good playoff moments if he does
it again you know he has those spry legs they kind of manage his minutes start the year you're looking
seeing him play better because of that hey you mentioned if you're ever as you have a 50 point game
in you tonight would be a good night to give it they need it bad and fourth series of the second
round the one that we obviously haven't seen yet that starts tonight golden state warriors
versus Timberwolves.
I guess we'll just start here
because this is one we can actually
finally give a prediction to
because that hasn't started yet.
Who's winning the series?
Who?
Man.
I'm going, I don't want to say it.
But I'm going with the Timberwolves.
I agree.
I agree.
It's a sweep.
No, no.
No, I'm saying like here.
Oh, yeah, yeah.
Yeah.
And at the most basic level,
Houston was a tough matchup
for a Golden State
because not only did they have
an elite defense,
but they didn't have anybody.
could score, who could score.
Minnesota has a good defense, and they have somebody who can score.
And so, like, on that very basic level, if you, the games that, that the Rockets won,
it was because Jalen Green stepped up and got 38.
Fred Van Bleach stepped up, and his three was falling.
And so whenever you had a perimeter player, I actually have a really good game, then
Houston was able to capitalize on a lot of the weaknesses that Golden State had.
If you turn Jalen Green and is like, let me.
go from Jalen Green to Anthony Edwards, that jump in itself and having, and having that ability,
you look at the series and it's like, hey, like the wolves are at a very, very high advantage here.
It's so hard to have this conversation right now because these are two completely different teams
who face each other multiple times, but they face each other when they're in different, like,
phases of their integrations.
We saw, I think the Golden State Warriors this season have like a three and one record against
the T. Wolves. That was before, of course,
the Jimmy Buller trade, and that was obviously before,
too, Donja Dimitigio
was out plenty of those games.
Rudy Gobert, of course, missed some time as well.
And on top of that, too, like, they didn't have
their newfound identity just set
and things weren't flowing for this team, and they weren't
obviously healthy, too. So, it's
hard for me to, like,
find ways
with their newfound identity for each of these teams,
specifically the Golden State Warriors, though, in this case
scenario, it's hard for me to find ways
to see how they
can legitimately like give the Minnesota Timberlose issues like of course small ball is
always going to be a thing for them yeah I think it's a big thing but I'm not sure how much
of it is going to be able to really throw the Minnesota off the game I think y'all are more confident
I am I feel like the wolves have the warriors have a chance I'm gonna go Timberwolves but I
I don't feel amazing about it just because there was spurts in that Lakers series where
the small ball did work and was able to bog him down
The Timberwolves didn't have an amazing half-core offensive rating for that season for the series.
The difference was the Lakers just had no juice at the rim and eventually it wore them down.
They couldn't execute that through the final minutes.
The Warriors have to Ramon Green.
It makes a big difference.
They had Jimmy Butler.
It makes a huge difference.
They have guys like Moses Moody.
They have some size there on the wings that they can do a way better and more consistent version of that small ball defense while also going big.
Well, big.
We'll see what Looney and Post give them.
Post looked horrible in that last series.
He probably won't look at here either
But if Loney can hang with Rudy Gaubert
And they can do that small ball in spurts
And not have to die by it like the Lakers did
I think that could be there could be a world
Where that gives a Timberwell enough trouble
Whenever they're not seeing it for 48 straight minutes
Like they did against LA
That that could bog them down
And to me it comes down to what Jimmy Butler
Looks like offensively
Post injury
He didn't have that playoff Jimmy juice
Or even like earlier in the series
In the series season post trade juice
He looks like he's hobbled a little bit
We'll see how that heals over time.
If that's going to be an issue, they probably won't win the series.
But if Jimmy has an extra level to get to and can provide more offensive value than he did in those last three games,
that could give them enough to be able to really make that Wolf's defense struggle.
The Will's defense is really good.
It's not immune.
It's not like, it's like the Thunder defense where we can count them in as being the best in the league no matter who they go against.
Yeah.
They don't have the perimeter offenders that Houston obviously at R.K.C. has, obviously.
So I do think the Timberwolves are going to win, but if we see some of those things go the other way
and we see them struggle against that Draymond Green center defense,
and we see Jimmy have a good series
where he exerts himself physically against some of the small defenders
in the same way Luke did last year on the Mavericks,
whenever he was really able to get into Jada McDaniel's chest,
Mike Conley obviously, Don't Stevensonzo, not the biggest guys.
If Jimmy's able to get some of his bully ball game stuff off,
that could make it interesting
because that could really limit the Timber Wolves' death
and how much they can deploy certain lineups without size,
I think it'll go six or seven.
I think depending on what version of the Warriors we get health-wise,
that will determine if it does go full seven,
but I'd be shocked if it's like five games or anything crazy.
I don't know if I would be shocked if it was five games just because at this point
we've seen we've seen Ant also elevate to a level where it's not only his scoring but
it's his playmaking.
It's his decision making that even if the warriors are doing certain things defensively,
he's making easier and simpler reach just to allow the offense to keep flowing.
And that is a major step for him.
And so if he's going out, he's scoring 20.
and you know still keeping the ball moving that's massive win for for minnesota one thing that
kind of scares me and it's not going to it's not going to scare me until it presents itself
but in that in this rocket series you saw how physical it was draymond green was madman right
normal draymond green stuff however he picked up two two flagrant points once you get to four
it's a one-game suspension.
And it's, I'm halfway joking, but I'm also halfway not.
You have Rudy Gaubert on the opposite side.
And so like, I'm saying, that's what I'm saying.
And so I don't know, like we've seen Dremont.
He slapped Fred Van Bleet in the face for no reason the other day.
And so I was like, can he stay, you know,
composed and controlled enough to where him and his flagrant points
doesn't become an issue because I can 100% see.
a situation where we get to game five and it's been four games and it's super physical and
all this and draymond is out here flailing and doing all this stuff and now draymond suspended for game
five and it's tied to two and now you have a situation so like again i'm half i'm halfway joking about
i'm kind of not no i know what you're saying no you make a good point i guess let me rephrase that
if the timber wolves win i could see them definitely winning like with these now that you're
mentioned that especially because the fact that the series is happening 48 hours after game seven
of the Warriors playing against the Rockets
and before the playoffs even started,
we said whoever comes out
at this Rockets versus Warrior series
that we all think is going to go seven
to immediately go from seven game of war
with these physical teams
to whoever plays the second round
is probably going to have a little more rest
that's going to make a big difference
and the Timberwolves are probably feeling spry
their legs probably feel fine.
They did not have to physically exert themselves
that hard against the Lakers team.
So that could definitely be a big deal
if it turns out that Timberwolves
are able to just physically overwhelm the Warriors
that they have too many small guys
that they can poke at.
Julius Randall has a great series again.
J. McDaniels continues his stretch of being the biggest guy on the court, as he says, and
exerting himself there.
You're right.
I can see a world where that just overwhelms the Warriors and the damn breaks and they just get flooded.
If the Warriors win, it's going to be a long series.
There's no way they flood the Timberwolves.
Yeah, I don't think, I don't know if they're capable, especially at this point in the playoffs.
I don't know if they're capable of winning a series of five.
Yeah.
If they are, it has to be something cataclysmic has happened for the Minnesota's
and rules, and they've exploited the first.
living fuck out of Rigo Bear.
And also on top of that, too, I do think
we're going to have a much better naturally, Steph Curry
series. He felt he faced a
halacious defense as a couple nights ago.
He talked about how he's never felt
face a defense so physical
compared to
when it comes to the Houston Rockets. And now that
of course, like the Minnesota
Timberl has an elite defense, but they're
not top five or six. I think
they land around like top seven or nine
for the regular season.
And so it's a different type of defense. It's a more
interior face defense compared to the use of rogons where they get beat your ass from
fucking anywhere yeah and so i think they're gonna find they're definitely gonna find ways to
exploit that and i do i i feel like the series is probably going to go to six
potentially seven i won't be surprised at all and that's gonna and there's gonna be so much
blood on step kursaing because of that so much blood on his hands good lord he's gonna be a murderer
yeah this one's just this one's hard to gauge because like it's so extreme in his
outcomes that like the timber rules could dominate the warriors that's not out of the realm
possibility or the warriors could do their veteran stuff they could it could be draymond versus
rudy go bear of old where we see the small ball give a little trouble so you know makes him
one on the margins and the series goes long like lots of outcomes here it's you can't really feel
confident either way but i do think you could probably feel confident that timbrewell's winning either
way so that's why i'm going to them but i agree we don't know which version of the series we're
yeah for sure two biggest x factors in my rest my case my case is rested i do feel like jermar green
and his ability to hold his temperatech or whatever is a fucking major x factor and also so is jimmy
butler's health because they're not going to be able to get away with jimmy butler putting up like
11 points like the timbrewolds have way too many options offensively to let that happen you can you need
you need to make up space and cover from somewhere and so jimmy bowler has to
to be not like super saying Jimmy Butler
but can you give me like 17 on a
consistent basis because you can't afford
anything less than that.
No, yeah, you're right.
Jimmy Butler's health is probably the biggest swing factor
here because I 100% agree.
You need elite second option Jimmy Butler.
It can't be going with the motion whatsoever.
Yeah.
But on the topic of the Golden State Warriors
before we end the stream,
we have one more Golden State Warriors-related thing to do.
I ask you guys to give us
your best NBA hot takes
relating to the Golden State Warriors
and we are going to rate them from 1 to 10.
Chat, I hope y'all cooked because last week, you did not.
Yep, you gave us a lot of playoff hot takes a couple weeks ago.
They were all related to Kauai Leonard, and I did not as well.
I'll say that.
You guys had a lot of hot things about Kauai being better than star X, Y, and Z.
Tough.
So we'll see what you guys did.
We got a variety of takes here about Warriors currently, Warriors in the past, Steph's legacy,
Katie's legacy, Clay's legacy, et cetera.
We're going to let you guys know how we feel with utmost honesty.
And chat, I want you guys to also rate these and let us know what you think about your fellow chat members,
hot takes.
do it.
Number one, we got Kyrie Legion, who said,
Draymond Green, the right of his peak years,
has had more impact on winning than a lot of top 15 players in the league at that
point.
So I say this to say, is Draymond like a top 10 player in the league for you at his peak?
That's the hot take, essentially.
It sounds weird, but I'm going to say, yeah.
Like, he had, as much as Steph, like, transcended the game with his offense
and what he's been able to do with a three-point shot,
Jamon Green deserves 100 or 10% to be up there as a defensive player in himself
And making like small ball didn't start with him
But he like perfected that shit
Yeah he is the one who he enabled the rest of the Lee
To begin to start doing a lot of the shit that he does
Yeah any given year it's tough because let's say the number he said 15
Any given year it's tough what we have to actually look to see who the top 15 players were in 2018 or whatever
But to the spirit of the question I do not disagree I think it's a W take I'll give it a 9 out of 10
And you guys know who I feel.
I think Drummond Green is the best defensive player of a generation.
He's one of the best defensive players of all time.
The whole idea of people talking now that double bigs is back, small ball's gone.
Small ball was never here in any type of serious fashion of winning championships.
Unless you had Draymond Green on your team, all the other modern champions played big.
The Lakers ran double bigs.
The Bucks ran double bigs.
The Celtics have KP and Al Horford.
The only team that has really won with small ball in any serious fashion is Draymond Green led team.
so and they still had they still had kd you still outside yeah yeah you still had had katie who's
seven two yeah probably iggy had a crazy wingspan before that you were playing with boge it
so like they've always had a big i'm gonna give this for a hot take i'm gonna give it 10 out 10 i don't
agree with it though just because the the NBA Twitter word of the week is amplifier and you
you see you know you've seen a lot of people i saw that yeah you've seen a lot of people been using
that that word shout out zack low but and so like i think when you fit into that you fit into
that category like obviously you are you are great but just from a team building like we're
winning games draymond's impact is allowed to happen because he's playing on the floor with
step and so like obviously he can go other places and he would still be a really good defender
but he's able to be maximized and amplify everything because of that situation so i'm not
going to give him that necessarily but listen shot shot too it's pretty bold though yeah i view
Draymond the same way when I hype up
Chad Holgren and why I'd rather have him over
certain guys who are first options on their
team, they're the bucket geter, they're the playmaker,
they're the playmaker, whatever.
Amplifiers are a good word if we're going to use
that. I would a lot of times
rather have the guy who's going to be my defensive anchor
best defensive player in the league any given year
and make everybody better offensively
with their role player skills that serve
to amplify people and make them better with the floor spacing
with the passing, etc. Dremont Green
is probably the most extreme version of that in NBA history.
He is the amplifier. He defines that.
He is the definition of an amplifier.
Yeah, and I value that greatly.
I would rather have that than a guy who can masquerade
as a first option that will get you exactly nowhere.
I'd rather have that over a Bradley Biel
or whoever may be that can go out and get you 30,
but it will amount to jack shit.
Give me the goddamn amplifier.
Bradley Biel just in Cancun, killing.
There's Pena Collada, bro.
So, yeah, tap to you in the chat said mid-onball options.
Exactly.
Give me the amplifier over the mid-on-ball options every time.
Next up, winning one more ring
will put him, that being stuff,
above Magic Johnson as the goat point guard.
Do you think with one more ring
You're gonna put Steph in top five all time convos
Putting him above magic
Those conversations are very very hot
And when we say one more ring
Let's say it's this ring this year
I was just about to say if it was this ring this year
That would shock the entire NBA world
NBA world because they were not the favorites
Not the first second or fucking third bro
So if they were to do this shit
Steph went on a god tier run
And he would this ring would feel
Exactly like that 2020 ring
Which we all know is like one of the weaker champion
teams, not to say this Warriors team is better than that team.
This slanted.
But in general, he says that every time we bring up this 2022.
Dude, it's a bitch-made team.
I'm sorry.
I'm not doing no original revisionist history.
Andrew Wiggins that year was fucking fire.
No, I agree.
Yeah, compared to the rest or not that.
And this team right here isn't one of the best teams.
They started out like 21 and like two.
Like they were, they were fantastic.
Just compared to the other, compared to the standard of what a championship team is.
I think they're better.
Just because you don't understand teamwork at its place.
I love it.
Nothing here or there.
I think I respect them a little bit more than you do,
but I understand your sentiment, so it's not crazy.
Point to say is like he would surpass Magic Johnson.
Yeah, five rings is a lot.
If Steph Curry has five rings while being the most influential player of his generation,
potentially the best point guard score of all time,
potentially the best, how do I phrase this?
Most elevating non-passer, I don't know,
the most impactful score to making people better in how he was shooting Benz the Court.
If he has all these accolades and all these arguments for Benz the court,
best offensive peak ever, best so-and-so-ever,
there's the best player on the best team ever,
all these things.
If you put a fifth ring on his finger,
it's pretty goddamn hard to deny his place on Mount Rushmore.
Quick question.
04 pistons and 22 Warriors.
Shit, bro.
This is a nasty as hell.
I'm mean, worries, of course,
naturally because I got the best player
by far on the court.
But it's a break fast.
It's not a...
I don't think that teams as bad as you think.
I think when you revisit this whole Warriors' conversation.
He just hates that.
I don't hate him.
I just look at them.
016 or 22 Warriors.
Over the last.
over the last seven years
they are the worst championship
I think they might beat the 21 bucks
they beat the 21 bucks
I don't know
but then again
we're also
but the 21 bucks are like
bottom tiered team too as well
we're also doing the same thing now
where we're revisionizing the bucks
a little bit everyone's mislaring them
as of late because the bucks
were not sad so many years
that was a great team so let me not
let me not fall into it
yeah they're a good team
look I think you would agree
if Steph wins the ring
he can be the go point guard
he can't he can be
it's a yeah it's a discussion
yeah so a team
Yeah, it would be neck and neck.
It would be a point where you can have a preference because they're accolades match
and there's so much that can go either way that I think you could feasibly say it's a tie.
You can't be mad either side.
10 out of 10.
What's next?
We have since 2014, never has Kevin Durant been more impactful for a team than Steph and Curry has,
especially when they were playing together.
Curry was the best player on all the championship teams by a long shot.
This was his comment.
I am laying on my stomach.
I'm kicking my feet up.
I'm so happy reading this.
Steph was better.
has always been better
don't ever get a twist
it has like Steph better
it was always his team
me and Donovan were saying
this shit in 2018
freshman year of college
we were getting yelled at
until three o'clock in the morning
we were in the group chat
saying Steph better
we've been on this hill
for as long as we know
each other
Steph is better
I do understand
I don't think it's like
egregious maybe I'm a little bit
less on this hills
than I was back then
back then I was like
what do you mean you like
Katie Moore
are you insane
I do I've come to be a Katie
appreciator
I do think it's neck and neck
talent-wise, but if we do a lot of impact stuff, we do a lot of who makes players around
them better stuff and we save those convos for other players.
We don't do it with Steph in the macro sense.
I think if you're ever going to do impact versus talent, this is the argument for it.
Understand we got, we just got a buddy heel legacy game because of Steph Curry.
Like he was out here getting double team and they, I saw somebody tweeted this out,
they were double teaming Steph and leaving the guy who had 22 points in the first half wide open.
That's because of Steph at 37, picture, and I don't have to go get the screenshots,
but picture what they were doing with a prime Steph Curry, 28-year-old Steph Curry,
leaving Kevin Durant and Clay Thompson wide open on the wings.
They are flooding and they are doubling to Steph Curry because his shooting ability,
especially at his peak, is greater than anybody's, you know, singular skill ever.
Yeah, ever.
Yeah.
And so I do think that just because of that, like,
in that in that moment he was
but this is like the ultimate like close debate
like this is like two 99
overall players like yeah it's so
unbelievably close that you've got a nitpick
and I feel like I feel like the people
who think Katie's better are so visceral in it
where they're like what are you talking about you think that
little motherfucker who can't play defense is better
than the seven foot demon are you an idiot
the hang as he pulls all the knee as hell
they're so extreme with it that they can't even fathom
thick and curry's better and
I don't know man it's close
I'm the other head thing I do agree with you guys
I've been on the on the on the Steph Curry been better like since day one but on the other hand like to try to be the antagonize to try to like devil's advocate of this conversation like yeah I understand it because on the simple face of things like the buckets that KD did get were special generation of course but I pay my attention I'm me personally I would talk about more so his defensive impact and what he was able to do on those warriors seems I think that's like really like the difference after I was to be one.
The question for you, though, how did he have so much energy to play defense?
Oh, yeah, it's because offense was so easy because Steph Curtis is making it an easy job for everybody.
Like, again, I do, I do understand it, but you're also, you are-Taddy was in defense.
I understand.
I don't condone it, though.
Yeah.
Next one, we got, if Draymond didn't punch Jordan Poole, they'd still be a title contender right now.
So the question is, do you, so they think they're kind of contenders now, so maybe it's a bad framing?
But do you think they'd be title favorites if this team still had Jordan Poole and
didn't trade him for Chris Paul's salary that they let walk and got absolutely no value for.
You could low-key just inject Jordan Poole into this team one-for-one with the path that they went on.
You wouldn't make, you wouldn't lose anything.
Like, you could still get Jimmy Butler.
So imagine they had Jimmy Butler and Jordan Poole.
Would that be the difference?
That would help a lot.
Jimmy, Jimmy, Boer would eat so much.
Jordan Poole eats so much for Jimmy Buller.
I don't know right now if, man, this is tough.
So his question is, would they be, would you feasibly be able to say they could
beat the Thunder in the playoff series if they had Jordan Poole?
I would say yes.
I would say yes.
Because I think the confidence that Jordan Poole was already playing with in like 21 and
in 22 was insane now.
Were there, there were really, really bad moments in the finals where he wasn't really
He looked small out there.
Yeah, he was small.
He wasn't playing great defense.
I do think that that would be something.
But also they're playing like, like they've been.
played buddy healed in this you know like they've leaned on on him they've leaned on on pretty
bad defenders and especially now that they are post clay how just having somebody who can dribble
the ball and kind of create for themselves would alleviate so much pressure off of step off of
jimmy butler having three of those guys would be would be very very key i okay i'll do it i'll
give that like a nine out of ten yeah i'll give a seven out of ten i don't think they'd be able to beat
the thunder but they'd be serious and you guys know how i feel about the way they handled that
chris ball salary i hate every bit of it i'd hate the trade in the mom
moment, W take, we'll give it to you.
I give it to you.
Next up, 2022 was the best warrior's championship.
Do you got to define best?
So, okay, so I guess what he probably means is, he's not going to say it's the best team.
Is it the most impressive championship they had?
All things considered, is it, if you're ranking a championship on like legacy points,
which combines how good they are, who they be, how impressive it is, et cetera,
is this their highest rate of championship?
It's hard to make this bowl statement when 2015 exists for me.
Good point.
Because that's, in my mind.
that has the real argument to be the best
because they initially came onto the scene.
Of course, we were all put on to aware
of being like the strength and numbers thing.
I don't know.
You're shaking your head for it.
2015 is great and it's awesome.
Yeah.
I think the conversation,
it has to go between 22 and 17
because of how dominant 17 was.
Because you showed up into the gym
and we showed up in that season and knew
that nobody's beating this team
and they ran through
through the playoffs they lost one game i think it was in the finals like they were
some you know you're playing you're playing lebron lebrons he's going to get a game
but you go 16 and one in the playoffs you dominate everybody like it it was so easy for them to do
it yes it was easier yes they stacked the deck or whatever all that i probably agree macro
wise end of the day there's a reasonable argument that's the greatest team of all time if you
say you have the greatest team to ever exist in the history of the association and it's 78 years
whatever it's been probably got to give that to them is their best championship
Okay. When I think about like best championship, my mind, I'm also thinking about like, okay, like what's the most like impressive too.
But I guess different words. For Curry's legacy, 2020 is the best one. For the Warriors franchise legacy, 2017 is probably the best one. Yeah, okay.
But for Curry specifically, 2022 is certainly the best one. Okay. Gotcha.
If developed correctly, pods can easily be a top 10 shooting guard in the league.
L, one out of 10, zero out of 10.
Oh my God. I don't know. I'll say, calm down. The shooting guard list is not. Every year when we do ranking
season the shooting guard list is always the one where we get to like eight nine and ten it's
like they in this position kind of stuff we've all had some bad takes over time not to put this one
on blast but you did rank jalen green number eight and that was that was reason that was a i was fake that's
big as a bitch i'm not here i'm not here i'm not here footage it is not me i don't want to really
to get your jalen green take but i will say that you felt comfortable putting jalen green
in those talks you might feel comfortable putting pods in those talks one day this the pool is
not deep desmond bane is like six or seven doesn't bean is a very good potential fringe all-star
i agree if you tell me pods gets
within striking distance of Desmond Bain
in the best case scenario, if developed
correctly, I guess it's not impossible.
Pods getting striking distance of Desmond,
that's so much good she's going to have to have to happen
for Podsville.
I just think the bar for number 10
shooting going to league is probably lower than we're thinking
right now. It's probably not very high at all.
Man. I don't know who I put at 10,
but I'm looking, oh my God.
It might be Janet sucks. Right now.
So 6 through 10, you're 6 through 10.
This is last summer.
Yeah, last summer.
6 Levine 7 Caruso 8 Beal 9 McCollum 10 Devon Vassel for you
Oh Paz could definitely be as good as Devon Fusel
For you for you six Levine seven Anthony Simons
Eight Dante Divencinozzio
Nine Jalen Green 10 Alice Caruso
Hey this is a double you take this man can certainly be as good as Devon Vassel one day
I'd listen it's it's it's lofty I don't know if I'm predicting it
But if you don't tell me in the best case scenario if you get the best version of pause development
he can be the 10th best shooting guard in the league and be as good as
Devin Vassell? I believe you.
Yeah. Mine, just for
the record, six Caruso,
seven Reeves, eight Malik Monk,
nine McCullum, 10, Zach Levine.
This man can be as good as Malik Monk,
I promise you. Oh my God. Herb Jones,
I need you to come a fucking live next year,
bro. Dyson Daniels, please prove it to him
once again. Holy fuck. Save me.
Ranking season is really the Wild West, man.
I know. It's a summer. Everything changed so fast.
J.P. Talks 101 says
if Curry had been traded before he became a super
the Warriors still would have won
at least two championships. I'm not going to lie, brother.
One of the stupidest takes I've ever heard.
I hate this.
Dummy.
We've had too many good ones.
I'm sorry, JP.
We've had a lot of W takes up here.
You had to be the sacrificial lamb.
This is the first L take of the episode.
Big L.
I know what you're getting at.
Maybe if they got Kevin Durant,
and it was Drayman, Kevin Durant,
Clay Thompson, Andre Gooddow.
They could still win one.
They probably never get close to signing Kevin Durant.
If they don't have Step Curry there to attract him,
L take.
Yeah, he's going to Boston.
If Steph is not there,
he's not going there.
Nope.
Sorry, JP.
Corey Green says,
Steph is one of the most skilled
and complete players ever easily.
And then a bunch of other stuff
he gets more specific.
But do you think Steph has an argument
for the most skilled player of all time
is the hot take?
The most skilled player of all time.
Typically when you hear this conversation,
people just immediately think about
like bag work.
They line Kyrie's name into
they line Alan Ivers' name into
Alan Ivers's name in two.
But Steph probably like
deserves to be at the very top of that conversation.
conversation simply because just hit joke think about being so insanely good at one thing people
think about all your other skills as like secondary and even at it you look at every category of
player that matters defense passing dunking finishing scoring shooting whatever they all have a
variety of mixture of athleticism and skill shooting is the one I think that is entirely skill
there's like hardly any element of athleticism in traditional sense and he's the best ever at this thing
by far that is entirely skill based
That alone gets you there.
Then you get into the off-all movement
and how that's the skill,
the cardio, the playmaking is still good.
He still do on-ball reps.
He's a very good finisher,
has the vintage high off the backward.
He's a good finisher.
He has defensive traits that are good.
He's not just a cone.
He's far from the worst defensive guard
of his generation.
A lot of other skills,
very well-rounded player.
It's not ridiculous.
When people think about this,
they think of the guy
who has the best combination
of mid-range jump shooting
and ball handling.
That's typically what comes to
from most people.
I think Seth has his given argument
mean as any of those guys.
I agree.
All right, we can, we can go, yeah, we can go skilled.
I'm stopping at complete.
Yeah, I didn't, I didn't say that for me.
He's not one of the most complete players of all time.
But skills, I think to be complete, you got to have a ton of athleticism to be one of the
most complete players.
Yeah.
Yeah, you, you can't, you can't be a, and it wasn't all like his fault, but he was
the weak point on the, on the, on the defense.
Like, you can't, you can't have that for like half a decade.
You almost have to be really tall
To be one of the most complete players of all time
Yeah, it's forced
I mean it's no
I mean it's no shock
Why like all the greatest players of all time
Are literally bulletproof
And there's nothing that you do about it
Because they're naturally fucking bigger
So yeah
It's natural
And being complete being large as part of it
Exactly yeah
Yeah, I'm in this sport
Steph Curry easily peaks higher
Than Kobe Bryant in their best years
Ah fuck
Now easily is easily is disrespectful
But as you guys know how I feel
We had this argument last year
in our great debates episode.
I'm of the opinion
that I'm taking
2016
Sef Curry
or rainy version of Kobe
personally
is it easily to you guys
I think easily
might be dramatic
but you know where I stand
I say this
I'm gonna throw this whole
take in the trash
simply because
they used the wrong there
and so I'm not gonna
and so I'm not gonna address this
I'm getting out of this one
T-E-R-E
Tapcio Trevito
you were not hooked on phonics
I just spelled that wrong
while looking at this thing
He's actually in the chat
Tap Teptio you were not hooked
on phonics as a kid
you use the wrong there and therefore your take is
disregarded. Oh my god
Tatillo, what is going on right now?
Are you good?
Grammar. Shit, man.
Spell. Yeah, I'm off this.
But this is a good debate though. I can't, you can't be mad
to somebody picking Kobe, but I'm with the opinion that stuff.
I'd rather have his best version. So, I'm
going to go 9 out of 10. It's a good take. I'm not
going to go 10 because you said easily and that's a bit extreme,
but I'll go 9. I'm going to say 7 out of 10.
Yeah, that's fair.
Neasily is much, much too much for me.
Yeah, the chasm is a huge there.
Yeah.
73 and 9 Warriors would lose to the 2024 Celtics if fully healthy.
So would the best team with the best regular season team of all time be able to beat last year's Celtics team?
This is how I know you're a child.
No, they're getting destroyed.
The reason for the take that we just read was because 2016 Steph is one of the best players of all time.
and had they had draymond green not flicked his hand they beat lebron james in five games they beat lebron james
and kair irving in five games right like they are they are absolutely insane and you talk you talk
about drew hollett you're getting prime draymond green Andre igo dala clay thompson pre-surgery like
the defenders that they had as crazy yeah it's also insane yeah i've respected 24 Celtics very much
actually and I think they'd be able to beat a lot of teams that you want that you
probably think are better than them because of their clout essentially not this one
this is where it does the line man the 22 warriors beat the 23 said like I've yeah but
the 24 you know KP and drew made a big difference like I don't care okay like like I think
the 24 Celtics would probably beat the 22 warriors maybe they would
I'm on most side with this one but I think they decisively beat that team but 73
I mean he hates the team exactly I don't hate him but I'm just like but I'm letting
rip off to me a little bit in this conversation
I might do a little hate to myself.
But no, 73-9 is a different tier.
But I respect the Celtics enough to not give you a terrible grade.
I'll go 4 to 10.
Now, I'm going 22 over everybody.
Okay, fuck it.
There's the goats.
There's the goats.
Dremont Green is the best defender of his generation.
One out of 10 because it's not a hot take.
Like, this is just...
Facts?
It's kind of just facts.
Okay.
Bad hot take, but good take.
It's either him or Rudy Gaubert or Quay Leonard.
Tremon Green has the longevity, the impact of success, over all of them.
Yeah, he's one.
He's won.
Because on top of, like, on top of the peak, his versatility is what separates him from Kauai and from, and from Gobert.
And the fact that he's able to do what both of those guys do at a high, high level.
Yeah, he got it.
Yeah.
Being able to masquerade as your lead center defender while also like manning down the perimeter as well is a rare skill that he is the only one to master being elite at both.
We've seen other rim protectors as good as Rudy Gobert.
we've seen other perimeter defenders as good as kauai i don't think there's ever been a
defensive player as versatile as him i feel like he's probably the number one most defensive
the versatile player of all time yeah it's either like him or rodman and even then like he's probably
a little bit more versatile yeah yeah i don't know if robin is also paid top number two so i don't
want to say anything disrespectful but he's doing in the modern NBA where mobility requires a lot more
versatility because you have to be on the perimeter a lot more than he did back then robin can
probably do it as well like like young rodman could definitely do all the things that
that Draymond does, he just doesn't have the luxury being in this, today's NBA.
So, like, that has had to show a lot more versatility, so he has a luxury of being
able to say he had to do more.
Yeah.
Robin today would be interesting.
He'd probably be Jared Vanderbilt on offense, but it would be fantastic defensively.
He'd be Draymond.
He'd be the closest thing.
I mean, yeah, if you took like 87, but if you, if you told him, like, here's five years
in A and then go do you, like he can be.
I think he'd be a lot better rim finisher than Vanderbilt, I imagine.
He'd probably have you'd do some type of pick and roll.
We did that one.
Draymond Green was a third best player
on the 2018 Warriors by a mile.
So this is basically saying
Draymond Green versus Clay.
W take 10 out of 10.
I've been on this wagon forever.
People market the splash bros as a duo
so everybody assumes that Clay is the best
non-KD teammate of
Steph Curry.
Draymon's always in the most important player there to me.
Yeah, that makes sense.
I will say that simply because of
how many aspects of the court
that draymond touches at at the most elite level possible like when it comes to clay and his
responsibilities on this team and on this court simply just be the best be the best three point
shooter second best two point shoot on the court alongside stuff and do what you do defensively his job
i don't want to say it's easy of course but with the value that they look like a completely
different team without draymond compared to like without clay a lot of what he does seems they
can fill in the gaps with like a few role players well draymond he is uh without him
on the court, he's up.
They're a difference.
To make the argument for Clay,
you have to use a lot
of hypotheticals.
You have to say like, oh, well, if they allowed him
to do this or if this was the situation.
So it's like, even on that, on that level,
I'm sorry.
I'm not going to do the hypothetical
conversation with you in that sense.
Dremont Green had a role,
had an entire side of the floor
that he operated and was able to master it.
And there are results,
the championships based on what he did.
and based on his impact
so I will
it's a 10 out of 10
We did too much
Ramon Glazer right now
man this is too much
but it was all facts
Steve Curry
is a mid-coach
carried by talent
No
he's not
I want to say
incorrect
like carried by talent
every league coach
is fucking carried by talent
there has to be talent
on there
it's a prerequisite
you can't
you can't be the league coach
without having
necessary players in place
not going to give him
attacks
for playing with Steph Curry
he got the most
side of him. What he did offensively is revolutionary. His ability to manage
personalities is the best ever. Not best ever, but best of a generation. That's like
defining trait of his. And one thing we've noticed as of late. Wait, how is that a
defining trait of his? He just lets Jemond be Jermon be crazy without saying anything. A lot of
coaches would not be able to manage Draymond. A lot of coaches would not be able to manage
Draymond. They'd be terrified. No one would be. Every put put you in a room with
Dremont Green, you're going to let him do his thing, bro. He might throw a cookboard over your
Like, you say it as a joke, that is an immense, immense notch on his resume to keep
Dremont Green in line and get the best out of him.
To reel him in from where he was last year, do, Steph Curry was crying on the court
because Dremont couldn't control him.
Post Jordan Poole, he was crashing out hard.
It looked like he was bad.
It looked like it was like, we've seen Crash House before.
It was like the end.
Yeah, like end careers.
Dramont, I mean, probably also Dremont thing for him navigating that and getting out of that
mental gym he was in.
So shout out that.
somebody in the chat said his inability
to develop young talent
needs to be talked about.
Sure, that's not a strength.
They also fucking suck at drafting young talent.
Have you noticed that?
Have you noticed that young players
and you guys are mad he doesn't develop
aren't that good usually?
And we've seen a lot of track record
that if Steve Kerr doesn't want to play you
and thinks you don't have the juice,
you probably don't have the juice.
He's probably right most of the time.
How many players have left the Warriors
got a chance and made something out of it?
Not a lot of people.
I'm also giving him credit.
Most people who leave the Warriors
immediately fall off.
Yeah, out of the league in a year and a half.
Yeah.
He developed his players 12 years ago.
They got, he got, he got, he got with Steph.
They won, they won 16, 17 more games.
Yeah.
He got, he got with Draymond, made him some random second round pig and said,
you're going to be in the started lineup.
You get to play.
Clay Thompson, same thing.
So he's been eating off of his own development for the last 12, 13 years.
And it's fine, right?
It's not, listen, it's not my fault.
Yeah, can't, can't step into the role.
Yeah, if you, if you, I'm, whatever, whatever, whatever.
Last one, the 2016, 27.
17 Warriors would get smoked by the 96 Bulls.
I think you're smoking.
That is the only smoke that's going on.
You're correct.
Yeah, in any context, smoked is kind of wild.
Yeah, I mean, in case you can tell,
we are a very pro-prime Warriors podcast.
We are big warriors or specters,
so you're not going to get a good response out of us
for this take.
I'm going to give you an L.
But a shout out of you and your 90s nostalgia.
I swear to you out,
with the way I'm going to be talking about this team
when I'm like 50 years old,
My kids don't think
like the real life devil
came with something
and played on the goddamn basketball.
Hey man,
they ruined my life
when I was 16, 17 years old,
bro.
I have nothing to look forward to.
No friends.
I just had my straight homework,
bro,
and I'm watching LeBron James play basketball.
And he can't even do that
at a fair level, too.
This guy was a loser.
Definition of a loser,
bro.
It was LeBron or nothing.
That was it.
This guy was a fucking dork.
Fuck, right?
They didn't do shit.
No parties.
My dad didn't let me join a wrestling team.
Fuck, bro.
No prom date
Fuck, bro
I was on my ass
No maidens
I had no haircuts
Fuck bro
No line up
No date
No clout
No fit
No money
No car
I had no license either
I was on my ass
Oh yeah
Bad take
L take zero out of 10
2017 Warriors
I think would win
I don't know
You could say for their era
You could debate it
If you're debating a
Who would win one on one
We've had this conversation
Many times
have 20 plus years of X's and those developments, it would be insane to think that doesn't
matter. So give me the 17 Warriors as a Goat Team. I agree.
And with that being said, that's the end of the stream. They did a lot better with these hot
takes this time around. Last time they're on some. I feel like we were mad agreeable in this
one, though. I feel like we agree with a lot of them. That's why he likes it. Everyone's everyone was
pantering the way he thinks already. Yeah, man. Appreciate all coming through. Good stream.
Let's go watch this Warriors game. See how it goes. Who's up right now? Pace is up right now.
Yep. Let's see if the next.
Knicks can make something
to happen in the series
and we will
I hope so
but I also will
love to laugh at you
if they don't
amen
we'll see you all
on Friday
for the next week's episode