The Deep 3 Podcast - The Media Is WRONG About These NBA Players | Ep. 192

Episode Date: March 2, 2026

NBA players the media doesnt understand! #nba Check out the TD3 merch: https://the-deep-3-shop.fourthwall.com/ Listen on Spotify!: https://open.spotify.com/show/3elbbqVumwqz8wlIdknsLW Listen on Apple Podcasts!: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-deep-3-podcast/id1657940794 Follow us on TikTok!: https://www.tiktok.com/@thedeepthree Follow us on Instagram!: https://www.instagram.com/thedeep3podcast/ Isaac's twitter: https://twitter.com/byisaacg Mo's twitter: https://twitter.com/Mojo99_ Donnavan's twitter: https://twitter.com/Dsmoot3D Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Donovan, what is one thing that bothers you that people say about your favorite NBA player? I mean, you know, they'd be disparaging his name. Who was he? My captain, you know what I'm saying? They say he's a foul baiter. He's a gripper. I'm waiting for you to say something. That's not true.

He's efficient with his movies. That's it. He understands how to take space and angles. That's it. Grifter. See, let's stop. As you guys see for the title, we are here today to discuss everything that you guys feel is misrepresented about your favorite player or really about any player that you guys

decided to submit by the media, by fans of other teams, by fans of your teams potentially. We're going to go up and down your guys' submissions for everything the media gets wrong about your favorite player. Okay, let's do it. Mo, are you expecting to see Trayong on here? For what? He hasn't played in like two years. Everybody understands.

Is he still your favorite player? Yeah. I'll say so. I haven't seen him play in a minute. So until he plays like in a wizard's jersey, then it's like, ah, can't do any more. That's how much like a bad wizard jersey could do to you. But you know that's coming, so you're not getting ahead of it. He dumped him.

Yeah, he dumped him. He's not in that line. He's not anymore. I'll see him next year when I see him play. I'm like, all right. Then I'll be like a fisherman. I'm not going to lie. AD was on my favorite players for a long time.

He's a Laker. As soon as he joined the Mavericks, stop thinking about him. Really? You're stuck with Camingo, buddy. You're a Lakers fan. So you guys just pump and dump all the time. Me can't do that. Yeah, you don't know anything.

Nothing good happens in your basketball life. Yeah. Damn. Tough. Pumping dump is outrageous. That's what y'all do. With that being said, cue the intro music. Let's talk about players

than media is wrong about. We're throwing it back. Whoa. That's crazy. He was bragging. I don't need it. The cranium is crazy. Oh my God.

Crowd eaters rejoice. All right. Who were we pumping and dumping first? D. Souls hit us with the first one. First one is SGA. All right. Okay.

So. Eternally. SGA. Eternally. The best score of a generation. A guy about to be only the fourth player ever to win back-to-back MVP's in championships. And yet he gets labeled as nothing more than a foul bigger.

With some even saying he's not top three in the world. Yeah. I guess that probably is. So this isn't necessarily a media issue. This is a fan issue. Because I think the media understands you see go on ESPN, you go on the ring or any other like, you know, discourse setting type of outlet.

You'll see he's the MVP favorite. You'll see he's one of the best players in the world where we get to ESPN top 100 times. There might be a situation where they rank him number one over Shea. I'm over Yokic. You go to an Instagram comment section. You go to a TikTok comment section. You go to Twitter replies talking about any other team that's not the Thunders fan base. They will say this guy is the worst and they hate him.

It's so, I don't know. We've talked about it for so long because people have hated on them. from like the moment that they started winning, people have hated on shade. They've hated on the Thunder. And it's just so interesting because I always, the shade conversation for me, always comes back to the fact of the number one problems

like that people talk about with the league is everybody plays the same. Everybody just chucks threes. And it's like, what if you have somebody who plays the same way that your favorite players throughout history have played? They don't take a lot of threes or it's not like the basis of their game in that way. And they're winning. they're cool like they have they have all the like off-course stuff of like I'm dressing well

like all this all this stuff you have every single piece yeah yes you have every single piece and now you are the most hated man in the world like it's it's crazy it's weird you know what i've like to see but not like to see but what i've seen a lot and agree with on twitter people are starting to realize that yokic has also become a grifter himself he's bad he's gone really bad or last year and a half and i shouldn't even say bad because like i don't care at all about this at all with anybody i joke with you i bruns in the beginning i don't really give a full of fuck about foul gifting at all. I understand some people it does get egregious and like I'll recognize like oh that was a bad flop. I think it's one of those things like many things in discourse that

while it is this much of a problem, it's talked about so disproportionately that I'd rather just ignore it because it's like it's worse to over fix it on something than to like you know, you can acknowledge it's a small problem but it's treat like a big problem. I'd rather ignore it. So I don't really care that yoku is doing it now too. But he's doing it more egregiously than Shea, I think. man you know why because also I feel like Shays heard it

and Shade doesn't I feel like Shays kind of slowed down on the foul baiting quite as much this year I feel like he hears it and he's like I'm beat you with jumpers wait to April yeah maybe maybe maybe yeah wait wait to April

for people to say like going back to this take to not have them like top three is ass and nine but I haven't heard that just yet maybe like going back to what you said it is just like the media and the power of the people and how they talk about him in the comments on Twitter and also their stuff

but yeah going yeah going back to what you said to what you said, like, overall, like, he is a top three player in the world. People definitely have been talking about. I think one of the, like, the storylines that ESPN has been carrying over the last few weeks is talking about how he's on the verge of breaking Wilts' record of the most, like, 20-point games, consecutive 20-point games in NBA history. And that's something that guys, like Michael Jordan hasn't done. The current leader of points of all time, and LeBron hasn't done. Katie's telling this league, he can't do it.

Kobe's been in this league. He ain't do it. SGA is here. And I think how a lot of people view him. Overall, I think we do, like, the mainstream media does a decent job when it comes to, like, all the other guys, the common jails in the street and how they have, like, power and say someone comes to how they talk about shit on Twitter. That's where it's, like, always been the real issue. Yeah, you can't violate likeability. The media can't make people like a guy and they've decided they don't like Shay. I still don't quite, I understand it because I've heard their reasons and I understand the words they're saying. It's perplexing to me still because of everything you said and how he checks all the boxes you would think, but some people would just come off as corny, I

guess. Also, I think for me, like the saying that he's like not top three in the world, that's where I kind of like draw my line. Yeah. I really, if you want to hate, go ahead and hate. Right. I do. There's, there's a space for everybody to be hated. And like, I also think that even like just because you're a great player doesn't mean that everybody has to just like, you know, worship the ground that that you walk on. Like, I think that there are certain things that people can do to where you could be like, I didn't like that. I don't like you as a player anymore. Like, Like for me, even with Embed, like, I can recognize the talent and the offensive talent. I will forever hold on to the shenanigans that he had in the playoffs season against the Nix.

And like, it's going to be something that, like, I look forward into the future and be like, no, like, I don't. I'm not a huge Joe and Embed fan because of it. I can see a lot of people because also because OKC is so dominant and because they're beating your favorite player and your favorite team. And so you have one or two plays out of this playoff run where Shea did probably foul base. Because I'm not going to say that he doesn't do it at all. Of course, he definitely does. Yeah, everybody doesn't. So your team is getting beat, your favorite player lost in the playoffs,

and then you have one specific memory of Shea baiting for a foul. And now you're going to say, I hope he loses every single game from now on. He's a foul baiter, all this other stuff. As long as you can recognize, as long as you can say that and also say, but he still is top three, then I'm cool. That's important. So you mentioned he definitely does it. And I agree with everything you said.

There's never been a second where I watch Shay and I like, I thought. Obviously, I know people would say he's a foulbator. I see him do a foul bait. Oh, people can be mad at that. I've never once sat down and watched it and been like he's the worst fallbator in the league. That was crazy me. Like, I've watched, I thought that watching Brunson before. I obviously thought that watching Hardin before.

And B.C. And Brunson is a little different because his head is bigger, so it's over exaggerated. He actually has a tip back forward and all that. It might have been in the Indiana series. One of the playoffs series over these last two years, the, okay, the Piston series in the first round, there were games in that series where it was egregious. And the only reason why I can't be mad is because literally he, he's playing for my team. If it was anybody else, I would have been up here and been like, yo, like, you need to relax.

But for, yeah, for him in that series, like everybody does do it. And like, Yokic, I think part of it is also, like, one, it's egregious, but also he's so big that he gets hit a lot anyways. And that's why he's like, oh yeah, I don't really wear the arm sleeves. Like I want him to see the scar, see how bad I'm getting hit. Massacist. Yeah. I like it. But he does like endure a lot of, a lot of contact as well.

So I can understand why him at this point, it's like, no. Like I'm, if you're going to do that, I'm going to get my, my game off too. Yeah, that's 100% what it is. The arm sleeve thing. Like he wants the rest to see like the. Yeah. Yeah. He likes to be.

You dancing for it, man. I like the way it hurts. All right, who's next? All right. Next up. Bronny James. Bronny James. He is actually okay for the 55th pick of the draft.

It's not his fault that he is the son of LeBron James. No, it is his fault. He chose to be LeBron. You're right. Speester. Did you just say that quotes get Bayla's head? What do you say? I think I heard it.

Don't feel on the fire allowing him to get his shit off. I got a mention it was hilarious. Prop. Game recognition. nice game skip Bayless. I didn't watch a clip but I saw the quote. I've always thought that Brony has a bigger clutch gene than LeBron James.

I don't know what he's talking about. I think it must have been after Bronny's Big Julie game a few days ago. I've always thought that Brony had a bigger clutch gene than LeBron James. He's always thought that. He's always thought it, actually. He was there at Sierra Canyon. Yeah, he's always said. I've been said actually.

Old man, Babel. All right. There is something about seeing somebody standing in their principles with like bro i hate you but you know i got to respect that uh yeah but this is obviously correct right if you look at every single 55th pick we need to do that we need to write down every single 55th pick in the draft write down their average PR their average plus minus their average next movie we'll be cheer listing every 50th overall pick in NBA history not even 10 out of 10 i need a statistical breakdown of every single 55 overall pick in the last

15 years to see blindly where brawny ranks amongst them because i bet he is completely middle hold it back. Bangor TikTok, bang or hook. Every 55th pick. You need to say it exactly how you just said it by now. Everyone's eyes glaze over.

Oh, brother. But clearly it's true. And it's to be expected. I guess the off-season's here. Yep. How can you, he's LeBron James, Jr. How could he not be over-scrutonized by the media?

How could he not be over-scrutonized by fans? It comes to the territory. The 55th pick from this year, his name was Lachlin Obrich. Puppie Lachland. Yeah, and he plays for the Chicago. He pays for the Chicago Bulls.

He was drafted by the Lakers, though. Before that, obviously, it was Brani. And then before that, in 2023, the 55th overall draft pick was Isaiah Wong. Okay, no one knows who we is either. Isaiah Wong had some moments. I remember people were comparing him,

being like Isaiah Wong is way more decorated college prospect, deserves it way more than Brani. And that was like a talking point for him. Granted, the last year and a half, hasn't done much an NBA, but he would definitely point to him as somebody who was more

proven than Brani. Now in 2022, Guy Santos, he just got a contract extension. There you go. Good player. And if you tell me Brony ends up as good as Guy Santos, I would not be surprised. I think that's super, super possible. 2021, Aaron Wiggins. Very valid pig. Salute. We're kind of going crazy when it comes to 55

overall pick. And then in the year after that, 2020, that's, we're going to get real nasty. There's Jay Scrub. And then after that in 2019. Who is Jay Scrub? His name is Jay Scrub. Yeah, he was on the Clippers. He got like, not, he He had a couple moments, but he wasn't really like that. I'm unfamiliar for Jay Scrup.

Yeah, and then 55 in 2019 was Kyle Guy. Okay. That's the name right there. I bet Ronnie ends up as good as Kyle Guy. Yeah. I bet he does. Pacing well for 55 of a world. Who Tyler Hero is, I always thought that was going to be Kyle Guy.

The only similarity is white. Kyle Guy's a coach now. That shit crazy. Really? Yeah, he's like some type of college coach or something like that. That was quick? I think he might be like influencer girl with college coach. Can you get hurt or something?

No, I don't think he didn't get hurt. No. I just feel you don't typically see guys like pivot away from being a player that fast after four years. I mean, if you're the 50 fifth pick in the draft, like your, your leash and your NBA so it's probably not long to begin with. Okay. If he was the fifth pick in the draft, he's like, he's a coach. It's like Josh Jackson was a coach in 2020, 2020.

But at least Josh Jackson was like a decade ago. This is 2020. Yeah. He dabbled. Calca, I was playing with Camiga. And now he's like, he's playing internationally now too. Okay, that makes sense. A little overware.

Okay. Okay. But yeah, obviously, Brian is going to be in this list, deservedly so. He's always going to be a guy that whether it's deserved or not will be scrutinized just because he's Brony. Yeah. Indeed.

All right. Next up, we have Zion Williamson. Zion just being some big dude that loves food and doesn't care about basketball. This year, when he's healthy, he's been averaging 22, 6 and 4. I'm glad you brought this up. I didn't, you picked him all this time. I didn't see him. I had no idea who we're talking about.

I would love to talk about Zon-Wilm's there now. He's having a perplexing year. He's the most healthy. He's been in years. The whole shit early this summer by him getting skinny and taking care of his body. He got hurt early on. We were like, ha-ha, that I got nowhere.

It's been true. He's healthy now. He has the lowest use rate of his crew by far. They just do not play through him at all, which is probably to help mitigate the injuries to realize what we talked about before the season that you can't trust in him so we got to put more usage

in other people's hands to not put all our eggs in the aisle in baskets. So if he gets hurt, our entire style of play doesn't go out the window. Man, they rarely don't play through him, though. It is so weird that he's answered the health issues seemingly, but is at his worst production-wise because of all these factors that were probably because of the health issues leading up to this year. I think he actually did just get injured, though. But he was on like a 35-game playing streak, which is the longest of this career.

He just got hurt like a couple days ago? Yeah, so that's tough. He did. He did. I miss that. It's, yeah, it's tough, but it's like, I think the health stuff, it does have to be applauded,

but also at the same time, if that comes at the detriment of like, if you have to essentially load manage your career, right? So that you can't be the number one option, the face of your franchise, this crazy phenom that we thought was going to turn into like the next great, you know, American player,

all this other stuff. If you can't do that because you can't stay healthy, then a lot of that goes out the way then like even if you're doing this at a lower usage rate to the masses, that's not going to mean anything. Yeah. Like we, every time that people have been familiar with Zion it has been in the context of he is the one.

Like he's the chosen one. He's the most athletic. He's the most polarizing, the most like unique body type, whatever. And now he's just falling into a line of, I guess really like a new age of top NBA players of the league is so different. get hurt a lot.

We're not, we're not hitting on these draft picks. And honestly, like, you've had bust throughout, you know, NBA history, but this specific version

of people not living up to their potential because they're getting hurt a lot and more consistently, that feels like Zion is kind of the face of that. You know who's also to face that? It's working in the positive way because the team is good.

Lamello ball. They're not asking to be less, what we said before the season is that we wanted to be less of a score, could be an actual point guard because clearly this 30 point per game type of usage he was going through, wasn't conducive to winning,

was getting him hurt a lot. Dave shared the ball more. Ask him to do a little bit less as a score, focus on playmaking. He's staying healthier now. He's winning games now because he's not taking as many ill-advised shots. It's the same thing as Zion, except Zion's on the worst team ever, so it doesn't matter. And even then, like there were moments where Zion, like they were playing through Zion, through point Zion, and it was working.

Like, we've seen 10, 15 game stretches here and there where Zion as lead man, there is something there. And I think that there's more behind Zion lead man than Lamello lead man. Definitely. you know what do we do that though so all these factors we know that he can be amazing we know that he hasn't progressed skill wise so he's kind of reliant on the physical side of it which might lead to him getting hurt more by over-exerting himself because his body can't keep up and we see now that he can stay healthy he's proven that he's proven that he's proven that and we're he's obviously not going to be the face their franchise that's fucking clear but also in the year in which he's not going to be the face their franchise that's fucking clear I would assume that's not he's only healthy because he's not going to be the face their franchise that's fucking clear I would assume that's not is on the move the summer or soon after. What do you do with that for another team? If you say, we know who can stay healthy or we know who can be amazing.

I don't know if we can do both at once. Dude, you have to be, again, like a team that is damn near right in the middle or slightly below that and don't have many other options. They have many other options to go ahead and swing for the fences. And I'm not saying like, he should be on the horns or anything like that. But a team in that level of state works where they just have much. Exactly. They don't have much going on for themselves.

You know exactly. that is too, by the way. Who's that? You know, a team that's always in the middle or right there below doesn't have a lot of options. Listen, we got, we got Kaminga at home. Signing trade, Kaminga for Zion? We got, win, win, win. I was thinking the Bulls.

Oh, no. I was thinking the Bulls, I guess, yeah, he's called his regards. But it's like, I think a team should trade for him still. Like, it's probably worth a gamble at some point. I just don't know, like, you can't say it be Aaron Gordon because he doesn't rebound particularly well for his size. He doesn't. play help defense particularly well for his size

doesn't space the floor particularly well like he doesn't do the small stuff that we can point to him and be like go put him next to yoke it she'll cook it's kind of like no we need to see point in Zion if you want to get something out of him because he's best on ball by a wide margin I think some team out there should take a gamble on that but whatever

team does do it I'm also not going to get up here and be like let's go amazing move like it truly will be a gamble yeah it also depends on the package for what they give up for for Zion I can see I think the bulls like need. Yeah, I actually think that they need Zion.

I think there's a couple other teams that it would just be interesting to kick around the idea like Sacramento. We were talked about Sacramento as like a job destination. They could go get Zion, right? They have this whole conundrum with point guards. What if you just don't run traditional point guards? You say, oh, we have points out.

And you do that. I think, yeah, I think Sacramento could be fine, Chicago. I think the only like interesting contending team that I can think of that is like, Okay, I could see you making a swing for you guys have kind of been in the mud over the last few years Trying to look for big names. Try to trade for a big name this past trade deadline. What about the Warriors? Could they be a Zion team? I mean, it's not a disgusting idea. I don't even know how to talk about the Warriors at this point with everything looming over their head. And that's why they might be perfect. You have to try it. Yeah. You have to try it. I don't know if you have to try it. I think you do. Jimmy Butler. Jimmy Butler's ACO is torn. Porszingis isn't going to play like.

You know, you know exactly what that was before. Well, Prisings is going to walk this summer and Jimmy Bullitt should presumably be healthy next year. Yeah, but what is a healthy? Like 36 year old Jimmy Bowles. Well, here's the thing. The reality is here, then you put this team out to pasture and put it down. That's the reality here is that we need to put it down like a decadion dog. I don't know if attached yourself to the Zion sweepstakes helps you anyway.

Okay. When you say that, are you including trading steps somewhere else? If all things were equal and everyone believes in a rational world in which emotions didn't matter, absolutely. Clearly, that would be the answer. But when I'm in that world, obviously, he's the goat. You're not going to do that to him. but like in a perfect world, yes. You would get something for security.

So is there a way to put them out to pasture with stuff still being on the team? Yes, you just accept that Steph Curry will waste his time in the NBA until he retires. Waste him with stuff with Zion and just do nothing. That's kind of the reality. It was what they've been doing. So they've been signaling for two years now. That's why we stopped talking about it. They've signaled.

They will not get rid of future picks. They're going to waste stuff Curry's motherfucking time, put up cute teams around him, let him buy his time when he retires. They're going to rebuild all their picks. See, but I don't even think these are like cute teams. These teams are bad. Like right now, I, I agree.

Like, I think a lot of the way I would operate with the Warriors would be, Steph is going to be here. We're not going to win a championship. That's okay, right? We're just going to wait it out until he's gone. However, in the meantime, we don't have to go out sad. We can still try to be somewhat fun. Like, if we can get to 42 and 40, right, 44 and 30, like,

that would be the range that I'm trying to be in as opposed to, yeah, we're going to trade for Zion. And it's going to be like the super, you know, massive swing and convince ourselves that we can be a contender. That's not going to happen, but can we see some deep threes? Can we see some fun lives? That's all I want for the next year and a half. I think that's what they are doing, though, with Jimmy, right?

Like, Jimmy's going to be back. So, like, I don't think they need to get, I don't think getting Zion gets into 42 wins. I think they're already there. But he's coming off of, he's old and he's going to off. Sure. I don't feel comfortable moving off of Jimmy. I'd feel like mad going to be doing that because it's just like,

it's kind of stay old. It's tough. Yeah. Okay. Yeah, we understand the Zion conundrum. It's going to be here forever. I don't know if the media is wrong about him, but the media certainly isn't talking about him enough for how strange of a situation he's having right now. I think that's the thing.

They're not wrong. They're just kind of put him outside of their minds. Yeah. You have certain. There's just certain teams where if you don't start out 22 and 9 or something like that. You're enough? Ignore. I'll see you at the lottery.

That's it. The Kings this year, bro. The Kings are the most. I can't remember a team in recent years that has been so irrelevant as a 2025, 2026 Sacramento Kings. Zero young players that are interesting. I mean, shout out right now. Shout out the, like, cute, fringe role players that are, like,

they got somebody. But no, like, real young players that are going to be the future in any, like, tangible way that you're going to build around. Most bad teams have that. No stars that are around kicking it. Sabon doesn't playing all year.

No intrigue on the trade market. Really? They are just a team. Everybody else getting surgery and shut down from the air. They're all tankers, apparently. The only ethical tankers in the league. Just pure ass.

Exactly. They tried to be good. What's next? Next up, we have the media says Tatum has no aura, but with a fresh cut, he's top five. Rudy Gobert. So many casual fans think that he sucks generally and is barely even a good defender. And that's mostly because of the guys like Shaq constantly shitting on anything he does. Oh, Craig.

Bro, I think was it after the, I think it was half time of the goddamn Minnesota Timberwood Nuggets game. Shaq was still throwing shots at Rudy Gobert, but big 20, someone needs to tell him this is not necessary anymore oh yeah because they had a clip of a demon chintel saying like man I'm shooting I'm shooting frito's like shack and he had gotten a little bit upset and he's like

you know what actually I like him though I'm gonna take this out on go bear Is that what he said? Oh you just what it felt like he was doing listen I just I just saw saw the clip so I may have like read it wrong or whatever but he is he will take every opportunity that would be very funny though if he actually said

that like straight up and he's like I'm mad I'm not going to say it to Adante. I'm averting it to go bear. That would be very funny if you say I've said that. Should we talk about Tatum's aura? Or should we move on? Yeah, let's do it. Okay.

We can talk about my guy. Come on, man. Let's come back. Give me the case, B, souls. For his aura? Give me the case for him having top five aura with the fresh cut. I mean, literally when you were describing SGA earlier, all I heard was my guy Tatum.

So if S.J.S. Top 5 ORA. Okay. By the transitive property, JT should also have. top five or what is or the transitive property define or no no define the transitive property for you real quick is it like x equals x or some shit some shit like that i don't know x equals y priore out of your moment that's why when i looked this out it's going to be one of those things oh i was right again no you you use it in the right context it's not x equals

that doesn't make sense but you didn't use in the right context let's go have more, is the media wrong about Tatum's aura? No, because I, because I do think that a certain part of, or personality is, you either have it or you don't, like people, people either like you or they don't like you. And I, I don't know, like, obviously, like, we've talked about the specific things that Tatum has done that could lead somebody into a path and be like, I don't know, this guy's, this guy's corny. He's not for me.

Like, I don't think he's really like that. But some people are just not the most. marketable, the most likable, and Tatum seems to be, you know, one of the guys who falls into into the other category. Like, we, we have this conversation so many times because I, I like, I enjoy some of Big Sean's music. Okay. Are you saying, Tatum's Big Sean? I will say there, there are times where, and like Drake also, legendaryly bad lines. There are things. There are things. that Big Sean says that I'm like if Drake said that it would be like it would it would come off as like oh that's a good line and then there's some things that he says where it's like if Big Sean said that he would get clowned immediately and so there there is a certain part of it's like it could be the same exact thing two people can do the exact same thing. Shea and Tatum or Shay Tatum and Anthony Edwards could all post the exact same picture on Instagram with the exact same caption and people will look at all three different yeah because of who they are.

It's the harassment versus flirting meme. you're describing. Yeah. It's all about delivery and it's all about aura. It's all about how well you say things. Can you imagine if Tatum, after every other game went on Instagram and wrote up poems and shit like that and posted on Instagram, people would drag him through the mud.

Tatum writing poems. We'll be the epidemic online. He's double standards, man. It's okay. My guy's coming back this Friday. Is it this Friday? Are you thinking? That's what everyone was saying. That's what I was saying. It was supposed to be this Sunday, but the maps. Versus the maps. Okay, that's a good, get right game.

Go beat the shit of it. I also saw that. He's, he's obviously, like, tapped into that whole world. But I saw the Friday timeline being pushed by Bill Simmons. Ah. Yeah. Okay. So possibly table with a greener salt.

We'll see, though. All right. Shout out to him's top five at war with the fresh cut. Is that implying he needs the fresh cut to be top five in order? You know, he's a got one, though. Is he a fresh cut merchant? He does always got one. You're right.

Can't remember last time I saw him scruffy. Yeah, you can't really blame anybody. It's like, oh, he needs it. I always got it. I will say going back to the Rudy Gobert Shack thing I looked up Rudy Go Bear Shack on Twitter Oh my God the amount of tweets from like the last five years of Shack you Shitting on Rudy Go Bear

I was trying to look for last nights I saw shit from 2021 What do you say? What are you saying? I don't know trash ass Rudy Gober I don't know whatever you think he said he probably said it Correct He left no stone unheard All right next up

Yokic not liking basketball. He loves the game. Cool. He loves this game. Does the media, so I guess to tie this back to the main topic and not just have it be glaze. Do you think the media over indexes on the whole talking point of Yokic being too nonchalant and not liking basketball, caring about horses?

People probably use that to say like, maybe we'll retire early. He doesn't like the game enough. Do you think too much is made to that? I think they used to. Not anymore, though. I think I think it's cool, yeah. He's broken the horse allegations? Yes. You know what happened also when when Mike Malone got fired and and Adelman came in, that entire playoff run, I feel like there were more shots and more clips of Yokic being somewhat animated on the sidelines than we had ever seen before. So I do think in that moment, people were like, oh, he actually really does care about basketball. Like this is, this is kind of cool. Where before he was just, he was just being Yokish and he wasn't really caring or outwardly showing.

his passion in that way. So this begs a wider question. Do we care too much about the animatedness of our stars and the like upfront vocal leadership they display to the cameras or when the cameras are on? Do we talk too much about that? We're not enough. He's good now.

Oh yeah, he's animated as fuck. Look at this. So are Lou Dor Dutia, man. Do we care too much? No, I think we should tell the line sometimes. There are plenty of stars who are just like aren't the most animated at all. or in there just like stale face through anything that happens good or bad on the basketball court like Hawaii or D. Rose could hit. He said it's like so many, he's done so many crazy things.

It's just like right afterwards, you know, you can't tell what's what's happening. So I think it's fine and more so it's just like one of those funny talking points that we have about Yokic right now. Yeah. So part of it I did kind of want to believe because I do think it would have been funny if Yokuch was just this amazing basketball player, a guy who has top 10 all time potential. you know two two three years ago and as he's ascending he's like bro i actually don't want to do this anymore i just like i've made i've made hundreds of millions of dollars i want a couple of mvps i just want to go you know hang with the horses if that was if you if that's what you wanted out of your life cool i'm i'm with it i think it would have been funny i think at this point i think it's clear

that he's not going to retire early because he wants to go back in and hang with with the horses yeah so but also but to the vocal leadership stuff, I don't, I do think that stuff is important. And it's, even historically, I feel like it's very rare where you don't have your best player or best player in the world not be so like super, super vocal leader and your team respond or even like perform at a very all time level. Is that rare? Is Tim Duncan a vocal leader for that team? I think he's the rare one. I feel like everybody else is, was somewhat vocal. I think, probably see this more rare ones than you would think

if you think about it. Because I feel like we're probably colored by Mama mentality, Michael Jordan, like all that stuff that we think about like the prototype for being like the franchise player, best player, like leader type guy. There's probably a lot of those though of guys that well let me preface by saying all this. We probably don't fucking really know the dynamic. Maybe Tim Duncan is vocal as hell in the locker room.

We just don't really know. But from our perspective, Steph has Draymond. That is some element. He's not terribly a vocal, but you know. Yeah, Draymond is like on a different level. So it's like he he can go out and do that. But Steph is, and at least, at least off the court,

like, Steph has never shied away or never, like, not talked even at, at the podium. On the floor, obviously Draymond's going to be the one

like yelling and doing all this other stuff. But Steph is like that, LeBron, Kobe. Like, yeah, if we just, we just go,

even like, Kareem, I think maybe, like, too half. What do I know? I know. But,

like, from where I've seen him, right, it wasn't that he was, like, terribly just like kawai silent yeah yeah there's kai there's kevin durand there's a lot of superstar players over the years that aren't like rah mama mentality so we probably talk a little too much about it as this like necessary thing but it does matter to some regard yeah you can't be

it i do feel like it's hard to be the the top player be somewhat like aloof yeah it's it's rare you got to have like a very specialized team and then you also have to be like that for it to be like damn they're okay to be a lose you know yeah you definitely need a good you need your draymond in that scenario you need to have a good environment that enables that type of leadership mpj was speaking for the team and they shipped him out of here next up next we have damian lillard damian lillard it feels like he's not talked about nearly as much as he should be as one of the top five point guards since 2010 maybe even top three in the 2010s uh the way he was just able to keep that team barely in the playoffs is way more impressive than anything Kyrie has done.

He just wanted to hit it off on. He wanted to hate Guyi. All this is true, but I think I think Liligis is just due. Maybe this is a Treblitzers fan, just always got to go back for their guy. Especially the topic being the media gets wrong. I think the media fully appreciates Day Millard. Yeah. Like, I remember specifically in the mid-2010, 2016, 2015, or whatever, mentioned not that

longer. Remember when he like snub from the All-Star game and then the very next year, he played in every single all-star competition that was available. Performative. Dunk contest, three-point contest, a whole nine. Skills competition. Everyone appreciates him. It's just like no one ever obviously looks at him as like the top guy because he ain't

go to no finals. He ain't won no MVPs. He wasn't sniffing no first team all-N-BAs because he got Russ. You got Steph. Even then, I think he's like the most respected non-aculacquoise guy I can remember. Yeah. At least the last 20 years. Like, no, I will say he was the face of like the beard grown thing.

Like no accolades is a beard. Yeah, that's Twitter slender. That's different. That's always going to be a thing. But even outside of that, if you ask those people to, like, really sit down and talk about it, like, of all the guys who have no first team all NBAs,

no MVPs, no conference championship wins, no finals appearances. No assist titles. Keep going, right? Yeah. Yeah.

Got fucking Molly wops. Yeah. No defining teams. Never let a great team. No 60 win teams. Of all my God. guys, he's probably the most appreciated. I feel like Dame is always either underrated or over it.

He's never in the middle. I feel so, I feel complete opposite. I feel like he's just Dave and everyone knows it. Like he's just like, like I said, one of the most respected, non-accomplished players.

Like, just we know how great he is, never had the circumstances to do a lot of team accolades and stuff, but we know that he's the second tier, best of the second tier. Yeah. So mid,

mid-2010s, because he said that he's top three, would you put him in that top three? Because it's like Steph, step CP Russ and then dame so you want to say four the 2010s yeah I think he's he's four I can't put him top three now

yeah I guess Chris Paul deserves it it's tough because 2021 he got his final appearance let's loop that area together though and like you know let's say 2010 through 2024 whenever they're all at their peak before Chris Paul fell off and Dave started getting hurt yeah Chris Paul probably deserves to be number three and Dame four okay and he said top five

debatable top three that's debatable I guess you can try to debate him into top three but you're probably going to lose some of the backer for that era. He was better than Chris Paul for a lot of that. So it's not crazy. If you want to tell me you think Damon Lurd is better than Chris Paul for that 12 year period, I'm not like pissed at it. Yeah, that's fine. Damien Lillard, during the, Damien Lurter's list of accolades after All-Star weekend

26, nine-time All-Star, All-Star MVP, NBA, All-Star MVP, NBA, Rookie of the Year, NBA Top 75, Rookie of the Year, bubble MVP, NBA Cup champ. This is a lot of champs that, a lot of accolades that nobody talks about. Two-time Skills Champ, NBA Teammate of the Year, three-time three-point contest champion bubble MVP and I just want you to know

I was being very brave the text is still small I was locking in though I was nothing you can do about it it's just I don't have this right screen on right now it's not reflect

this I'm looking at the big one but just know I was locking in there you go all he's next who is next next up we have the pod

V. Fahs, the common opinion, that he's bad when he's actually a lot worse. Brandon Padimski. This is hilarious. Why did Brandon Pajemski become the face of ass? He's such a regular dude. I know Warriors fans hate him. Probably because Warriors fans big him up all last summer

about being like untouchable and this promising up-and-coming future top-ten shooting guard because Warriors fans are clinically insane. Because they are truly the most ridiculous fan base in the NBA over the last decade. So I guess they've kind of built him up to tear him down. As a passive observer, I can't imagine having a strong opinion about Brandon Pajemski. That's like me having a strong opinion about Torian Prince. He's just fine.

No, no, no, no. The difference is that someone like Brandon Pajmsky bakes himself up. There's so many times where he's been like, yeah, like, once Steph, Draymond and all these guys leave, I'm going to be the faces of the scene. That's like, you're setting yourself up to be slayed and drag. A lot of people do that? I personally just like don't think about that very much. But I understand it. Do a lot of people do that really?

I don't think so. A lot of players exude confidence. He just has a mic because he's a warrior And people just listen to it and talk about it That's what makes it He's just a warrior so it's more amplified Like he's delusional A lot of these guys are

I bet if I go to I'm going to pick a random player That I've never heard talk Tyos Jones and ask him five years ago What he thinks he'd probably be like Yeah I'm up next or whatever Like he's just not steps teammates So we don't give him a mic and ask him things

But imagine you said that And then you started the season And truly one of the most horrific Shooting stretches that we've ever seen When he had when he had that crazy, crazy slump to start the year. Like, those are the things we can't live with that.

I know. That can't happen. I'm not defending Brandon Projamski saying he's like great or anything. I just feel like he's too regular to deserve to be the face of vitriol when we can reserve the people that are actually garbage.

I just think he's the biggest indicator that the Warriors Dynasty is finally over. That's what it is. On every graphic, especially when Curry's injured, they put B pods on there. And I know it pisses off Worters' things. They're really what they are.

They're taking the aggression out on him for a failed dynasty coming to an end. They're like, he's a problem. We need to have some punching back. Lokey, that comment might be right, though. He might be worse than we think. I'm thinking about it now because the infrastructure with the wars and knowing just like how good stuff is,

how much Draymond carries on the defensive side of the ball, right? Like they lift everybody up. When they're gone, B-Pots might just like in a vacuum outside the wars, like he might be worse than you think without stuff in Draybond. This might be real. Be-Paz's. first option hoops. Oh, my God.

Self creation. Score as goes. But hey. Next up. Next up, we have Damar de Rosen. DeMar is an underrated scorer. He's on the top 20 list and still nobody mentions him, even though players like Carmelo Anthony get glazed when they literally accomplish the same things.

They just want to get it off on another player. That's what I've noticed. Everyone has a target. Like, Kyrie got a stray. Now Carmelo is getting astray Hey Ooh David Montgomery just got traded to the Texans What?

Convo for tomorrow on house call Yeah that just happened as we're talking That's nice That's nice Joe Mixin's cooked For Mello So Mello and the Nix They did get beat by

By LeBron By Prime LeBron That did happen So did the Raptors and Demar However Never in Carmelo's life Has his team been beat and then now

the city belongs to somebody else. Like you got beat and then it became Lebronto. Yeah. That didn't happen. The dynasty literally started because they left, they got Damara out,

out the paint and they brought in Kauai. And so there are, there are moments. Also, like, Melo has a, like, Melo's higher on the all-time scoring, scoring list. He has a scoring title.

Like, he, there's been more tangible things of Melo being on a, different level of scoring than DeMar de Rosen. Shout to him, though, like for his longevity and being able to play in the league this long and at least get opportunities because even the fact that we have

moved into a three-point centered era and DeMard de Rosen is not some crazy three-point shooter. It hasn't really evolved his game. Crazy, crazy like that. And is still able to get opportunities knowing that he's not an amazing defender. He's not going to shoot three- three-pointers like his archetype is is one that the game passed up years ago yeah and he's still

out here getting checks like that's commendable i like the distinction between getting opportunity opposed to making things happen or like doing being successful he said shout on him existing in a three-point era he didn't say thriving he's in sacramento like it's very much to thrive in Sacramento anywhere, but they, like, we're seeing right now with small guards. And, like, if you, if you are at 6-2 and all you do is score the ball, you can't, you can't play for us. We've seen archetypes in the past, your mid-post power forwards, right? Your Z-bows, guys like that, they, your, your role players, Brandon Basses, all those, you have none of those in the league anymore. I do think that DeMarre de Rosen is specifically from the mid-range and being this, like,

super, super high volume mid-range player, we're not really going to see that from a, from a guy that's not like top 10 in the, in the league. Do you want to say he's an All-of-Famer to the tweet? No, but like, what I, probably not,

but he will be because the basketball, of fame is the best ball of fame. Yeah. But I'd probably say, but what does he have outside of, like, what is top 20 points all time? It's definitely a total argument.

Yeah. Like his total is out of there. Yeah. You don't think he's going to make the All-of-Fame? And he's been like a pro and all-time. Well, yeah, I don't know. Because even though it's the basketball Hall of Fame, other people have accomplishments in college or like world in like international play. He might be the only top 20 score as not in the whole fame.

That might be the hard part. Sometimes you got to break the rules. Also, he'll get kicked out of the top 20 scoring. So eventually. So he has a very small window to make it, I think. If he lasts like five to 10 years afterwards, he's cooked forever because eventually like Luke doesn't kick him out soon. You know, Shea obviously. Like he's going to get kicked out relatively fast, I think.

Yeah, I don't think tomorrow The Roeson's a Hall of Fame. Tough. Not take, neither do I. That's not great. Next up. Our guy, Paolo Bancaro. Paulo, he's switching from just getting his own numbers up

to trying to play real winning basketball. His passing IQ, rebounding, and shot diet have all improved with, of course, his efficiency being the concern. With a more offensive-minded coach, I think there's still potential for him to be great. Arnold Buck, great. He had me up until the last word. great. I think it can be good

still, but through everything, he's right. Like, Jamal Mosey is holding his team back, but Paula Bancaro is just not holding him to his end, hasn't been doing it pretty much his entire career. And of course, it's been like one of the bigger talking points throughout the entirety of the year.

People realize that, oh shit, like this guy really isn't that guy. Now they land of magic fucking in trouble. Let's see. Shot diets. Shot diet. Last year, 43% of his shots are mid-range jumpers. This year, 42% of his shots on mid-range jumpers. Last year, 25% were from three.

This year it's 19% or from three. He said, playmaking is better. Last year, his assist percentage was 26%. This year is 22%. What else did it say? Defense? Fuck out of my face. Rebounding?

Passing IQ? Sure, I bet he's rebounding well. I haven't looked. Let's see. Defense rebound percentage, 18.6 last year. 19.9 this year. He's rebounding 1% more of his team's misses. Good for him.

you went on live and said you had a better shot chart you don't have a better shot you went on live say he's a better passing he can't pass the ball he's a he's a good passer i'll give him that it's not any different he's been a good passer i think maybe we are overreacting too much to his worst moments because he's having his worst shooting season by far and it's reasonable to believe it's a slump and like he's not magically a worst shooter after three years. But that's just hoping for him getting back to the standard he put last year. And that's not a good standard. He needs to improve, not get back to neutral. So while I understand your sentiment, he's probably being, he's probably being doing too much

for his performance right now. That's not going to be indicative of who he is forever. But the problem is you're mistaking it for people caring about what he's done relative to last year when really the problem is he hasn't improved relative to last year. And that's just true, I think. That's a hell of a slump. Nine months? Nine months. People have bad years. Listen, right now is 48% effective focal percentage. Last year was 50. He can get back to 50.

That was still 16th percentile, but he can get back to 50. Also, nine months. Yeah, nine months is crazy. That's a whole last. Yeah, I think like, also the idea of a coach unlocking somebody.

I kind of buy into it. I kind of don't of yeah some some other coaches is going to come in here and now they're going to be a completely different player and you're going to go from being outside like the top 35 into being now now you're in the conversation for top 10 which would which is what the potential of like palo bank hero number one overall pick that kind of gets to I think I think I think he can be better I think again the idea of being unlocked is probably a weird term I think that term only like should belong to players who are clearly being like abused not being played or like not like simply put the ball in hand me just stick your eyes in a corner and just go go do your business

to be back in and practice every day which player you think is being abused I just need examples right I don't know I'll talk about head I can't think of a perfect case scenario where someone's being abused but there were times where bro I'm a hawks fan bro I see Nate McMillan fucking play Timothy Luwabu Karabot over Jaylon Johnson, bro, when our whole roster died. We had like six active players. Players like that get abuse. Yeah, you describe Jalen Johnson's first two seasons as abuse? Yes, 110%.

100%. 100%, bro. Not neglect, not disrespect, abuse. Abuse, yes. He's in a generational trauma from this experience. Yeah, I agree. I mean, we should expect Pala to improve, but I think it's also. fair of me as a non-magic fan, non-Palo FC member, passive observer who is not

rooting against him but is also not rooting for him, it's fair for me to no longer expect the top 10 player to come at any point. It's fair for me to no longer have quite as much of a ceiling on my hopes. But he can back to me against top 25 player. That's obviously possible and probably likely. Sure. All right. Next up, we have Paulo West, Sangoon.

He's shooting so bad that it's literally impossible that this is just him. It's a slump and it'll pass. He's currently shooting like he's the worst center in the league. Media needs to chill. It'll pass. Hopefully. Once again, I ask you if this is higher than your effective focal percentage from last year, is this a slump or is this who you've been to your entire career?

This is two straight years now where he's been this bad efficiently. I don't think it's a slump. I think it's fair to say that he will get better because he is clearly a streaky shooter. There will be ups. There will be downs. You will see better points, probably in the playoffs, probably two weeks from now. There will be games where he shoots well. But I think we have too big of a sample size to say it's just a

slump. Two year slump. That's what we're doing now. Two year's slump. That's ridiculous. The second his usage went up and his efficiency went down. You get prescribed something for that. Ricky year, 51% effective fiscal percentage.

Year 2, 57, year 3, 555, year 4.50, year 551. That's, he is who he is. He's not an efficient. score and that's going to be part of his game forever there will be times where he obviously gets hot from three and he has good matchups and you can abuse them down low in the post like that big game he just had against the kings who have no bigs there will be times where he scored as well and everything is unlocked and he looks amazing but i think we have to just accept that he is a very talented player that's a good playmaker draws double teams well facilitates offense extremely well for the five being

that hub passer but he'll never be like a hyper efficient score i feel that that that's made abundantly clear right yeah at least not as like a one option because i do think that part of the reason. Part of the way that he can get better is just getting, it's getting easier, easier looks. As the Rockets come back, like whenever Frey comes back next year, if we're not tasking Schengen with so much, like, on-ball creation for yourself and for everybody, and now you could be a little bit more, more tactical with where you're able to, to attack defenses with. Maybe you get a small efficiency boost from there, you know, as opposed to, actually, we're going to, we're going to

bound the ball to a man, you're going to get the ball at the midpost with 17 seconds left. Go make something happen. You're right. So that's why two years ago he was a little more efficient, right? He shot 54. Actually, this is a frequency, my bad. He shot 66% at the rim. That's never changed, actually.

So the difference in efficiency is really just like his mid-range creation buckets were more efficient two years ago. And in his second year, when he was the most efficient, he shot 36% from three in that season, which he's never replicated a single time the rest of his career. So, yeah, everybody gets less efficient if they're spoon-fed more buckets, right? That's like, goes across everybody. The hard-power at Shangoon is he's not a great defender, obviously, doesn't space the floor, and his biggest efficiency issue is his layup touch comes and goes for some reason.

That doesn't scream a player that gets better or more valuable with the ball in his hands less. Yeah, that doesn't also scream someone who should be, like, view it as the first option, really the second option. At this one in time, like, we need to be talking about him as, like, a third option because it's clear as day, like, he's shown us who he is. Whoa, these numbers are nasty. everything is like in the like top 50 whatever and it's like it's pretty decent and then you get to field goal percentage 125th 3.50th 3.40th 3.106. 320th on free throw percentage. See that's the part that be pissing me off right like what do you you mean to tell me you've been like a 69 and this 3.4 percentage or field goal percentage or free throw percentage have been basically the same thing

throughout the entire career you don't get a smidge better at all from that all that's annoying. That is tough player man. Tough player. Because, like, obviously, again, the playmaking is real. He is a legit, talented creator of buckets for his teammates. But you need to have something else to go along with that. Otherwise, shit gets spooky. Like, we said at the beginning of the year. When the three-point shot was falling and it looked like he made the leap to being in a,

at least average three-point shooter, that chain reaction unlocked so much. That's why we started talking about him as a top 20 player. We did our Christmas episode. We all ranked him around 20. I think y'all had him, like, 16 or something. I had him, like, 19. We did that shit again. Oh, God.

15 spots lower? Because now the three-point shot's gone. like more than that? Yeah. Does he make the top 40? Yeah, he'll probably make top 40 because we give him credit for that early season stretch.

And he'll be back into 40 for sure. Yeah, he'll be back to Rappalo in the 30s. Damn. Yeah, it's been tough for these non-defenders, man. Especially this year, I feel like if you're not consistent offensively and you're not playing defense, conversations get scared about your race real quick.

You got no barge for error. You got to be on fire as an offensive player. Yeah, so that's tough. All right. Next up, we have Evan Mowley. Evan Mowley. He, yes, he's not taking the leap. He should have this year.

But if his insane leap last year wouldn't have happened, he would be an all-star this year. He's still a phenomenal defender and great contributor to the Cavs. And I believe that he will bounce back, quote-on-quote, if he will. Yeah, probably right. We've talked about it last week that we had disagreement here. I'm just done expecting him to make a top 10 leap. I think he showed that he probably doesn't have the on-ball scoring for me to have that expectation realistically. So I'm just taking him for what he is.

And I think that's closer to a top 20 player who's going to be a DPO-wide level defender, good not amazing play finisher solid not great on ball creator and just kind of be a uber valuable defensive player that has enough offensive impact to be like a rich man's Ogen Anobi which crosses you into all-star territory

yeah you got to start you in Bucke's man maybe he doesn't maybe it's just who he is and that's just disappointing that's fair that's it is it is disappointing because obviously 25, 27 points.

I don't need that. And if anybody like gets to, if anybody starts averaging 27, 28 points a game, I'm legitimately like, oh wow, like you're here. You've arrived, right? Like that's something that is still very hard, regardless of what the era looks like. Averaging close to 30 points is something to be like,

wow, that's crazy. Getting to a spot where I can, you know, I can ask just a little bit more of you, I do think is like, okay, I want us to get there. What was your expectation for him as a score as he capped out? Like before the season, what would you? I think absolute best case scenario, like everything hit. Yeah, everything hit.

We got quote unquote the lead trademark 24 points. That's a lot. You had it. Best case scenario. Sure. Yeah, that's not insane. He has to be a full-time center if that ever happened. Wow, man.

And which maybe isn't better for him defensively. Maybe isn't better for his team. but for him to prioritize scoring, he needs to be a center. Yeah, man. If he gets to, and if that's true, cool. If we get to the offseason, the cabs go outside. Oh, we got to make a move. I'm sorry, Jared Allen, you have to go somewhere else.

And he gets moved on and then we start next season. Every mobile leads to five. And we're still in the same scenario. Then that disappointment will turn into rage. Yeah. Well, if they go out sad, sure. I don't want them to do that, really, anymore. I don't want them to prioritize it.

Evan Moble as a score as like their MO for how to best prioritize assets on our team. Prioritize winning. And I think them having him next to a big, like they do it for a reason. Obviously, it's really good defensively. It's putting a lot of responsibility on him moving to center. Like now you better be averaging 24 and 12 because you're going to be holding the down there. So I'm okay if they never do that. And we just never get amazing Evan Mobley scoring years.

Yeah. I think what helps or what doesn't help this conversation is that I don't know if it was for some reason Dan Gilbert or Donovan Mitchell himself, probably Donovan Mitchell. He said something along the lines in the interview. talking about how like this organization will go as far as someone like Evan Moby will take us and that there was like a vast expectation through the leap that he did take last year oh shit like he's like literally ascending in front of our eyes and so I agree with you now like I will in the past I was so so comfortable like moving off with

some like Jared Allen but now I have you someone like him like as a luxury and additive but if that's that oh my bad that opens a bigger question how long do we hold on to expectations with these guys this probably happens a lot we have to we at a certain point we have to just recalibrate and say I was too high on a guy when he was 22. I expected him to get better forever. Not everybody does. You got to eventually lose that.

Are we even, like, beholden to what we thought about a guy a year and a half ago? No. I think a year and a half years. I think, honestly, like, everyone's kind of getting around that time where the opinions start getting solidified.

And I think there might be, like, one and a half more years of, okay, let's see if you can actually keep starting to, people don't take year 10 leaps, like that to really like or and even if they do it doesn't happen often yeah it's it's more rare most guys you are who you are in you 24 yeah roughly and so i think for for mobly and that's why i do think like the ever mowbly stuff i mean the jared allen stuff is a little bit more on the table for me because if i know that like at least on the team is in terms of talent age every everybody where

they are right now. Every Mobley is either the first or second most talented player on that team, depending on how you feel about, about DeMitch. I think giving him all the opportunity to then fully explore all of his talent, I think that is on the board. I think that doing that also prioritizes winning because if they go, if they go outside and you say, oh, I don't really want to break them up, like clearly it works and we can prioritize winning, does it, right? Like, if we just keep running the same thing back with DeMitch, Mobley, and Jared Allen, I don't know how much of actually prioritizing winning is. And then we can have another conversation of maybe it is good to put a little bit more pressure or put a little bit more on Evan Moby's plate.

See if he can step up. And worst case scenario, it doesn't work. And what happens? Oh, no, we won 49 games and go out in the second round. We're doing that already. You know, if they go out and the town of playoffs, I can 100% agree. We time, literally the only thing we do say is time will tell with that. If it's proven come playout time that this model with these two big just won't work.

there's not enough offensive firepower, then yeah, I'll be told you with you that it'll make sense to trade Jared Allen and bring in a four that's like a quasi small four to play next to Evan Mobley and have a more of an offensive slanted team.

Yeah, I just, especially with like top five picks, I do want to give them a lot of opportunity to be, to be the player that we think that they can be. And so whether that, whether that be, you know,

who's coaching the team or certain team constructions. But like I'm not, I'm shut and, Shout out to Jared Island, especially because he's been playing very well, especially with James Hardin. I'm not going to let the idea of Jared Allen stop me from pushing forward everymobie's potential. Yeah. If I see it that way.

The thing is, like, specifically for the Cleveland Cavaliers, they're not the type of team to want to go ahead and give their young players the world and continually build, building them as like the one guy. We've just seen it with someone like, there is Garland. He was fresh off of making like, what, an all-star team? And you go ahead and bring in someone like Donovan. Of course, like, you're in your kind of have to. That might be a problem. But I don't think it was a problem because Darius Gone was only going to lead you so far. You know, that trade, I'm not going to say save them necessarily, but it definitely put them in a better position compared to what they would have been with Darius gone and rocking out of Evan Mobley.

Yeah. Well, D.Mitch is the second best player to ever play in a cab jersey. So that's a little different. It's a little hard to have a conversation about that being a problem when he literally is the second best player you've ever had in your franchise. So yeah, you do that every time. But to your point, yeah, they're not going to they're not going to let a talented young player stop them from making a big upgrade, is what you're saying?

Yeah. If that's at Mowbly's development, they're not going to let them stop them from Google and whatever best for the team. It's so crazy. Donovan Mitch is like the second best player ever to put on this jersey. Yeah, I'm like, the Cavs. Yeah, respect to Larry Nance. Respect to 2016 Kyrie.

DeMitch probably clearly is number two. They've been very respectful in these last like 10, 15 years now. But before that, Mark, probably. There's a reason LeBron saved him. Yeah. Who's next? All right.

Luca Donchich. It's not that he doesn't have his faults, but the media would have you believe that he's punching babies in the crowd. When he plays basketball. Punching babies in the crowd. This is obviously true. There's been so much conversation

in the past two weeks of Luca Donchich because the team is bad that he's been one drawn in the most heat. When, well, really everyone's drawn heat. He is the real thing. There's just heat to go around. Everybody's catching a fist in the nose. Yeah.

He has gotten the opposite. of what people expected in terms of the Lakers PR. He is not getting the glaze that would lead to MVP conversations because he's a Laker. He is getting so fucking scrutinized for things that are not super different. Like people the talking point now is obviously not getting to the rim as much. People are seemingly treating it like he used to be Shakeda to Slexander. Like he used to be the best slashing in the league. He's getting at the rim less, but it's not this like insane difference.

People are just really, really harping out now because he's a Laker and has all this attention. You're watching every game. The way he's getting every single part of him picked up. part and treat like their new weaknesses is hilarious. He's been this guy in most of these ways.

I saw some stat that said like, yeah, bro, within the first few years at Luca Dunge's career, he averaged like maybe 20 dunks a year. Now he might get one or two

in an entire season. Did he average 20 dunks a year? Someone was going into it. Is that even true? That's a lot. I don't even know if it was true. I find that hard to believe. But they like made,

made it made sure to emphasize like how little off he gets the ground. Get out of the ground now. It's hilarious. He's having, so 2024 was his most efficient year because he was a god outside of that at 56% true shooting right now it is his third highest of his career efficiency-wise

he's still an amazing score he's still leading the league in scoring he's not quite efficient to Shea and we talked about it at the beginning of the year the real issue for this I think is because Shea lapped him so fucking hard because she became this guy who was seen as a little brother completely different tier of player as Luca when they entered the league and now he's ascended so fast so hard that it makes Luke as a lack of ascension relative to where he was four years ago look pedestrian, that's a little bit of boils down to me, I think, is his peers have just done so much

and changed so much about them that people want him to do the same when he's more or less the same player he's been for five years, which is still a first-team-all-MBA, incredible player. Not everybody gets better every single year and reaches this upper echelon of, like, all-time great winning MVP and finals MVP. I mean, it's not unfair because he is that good, but it's not some sign of a precipitous fall off that he hasn't done that yet uh okay fall off no i do i yeah and that that's that's that's how people are talking about right sometimes yeah i i do think also the the same way that we're talking about with like hallo and shingoon of uh and and be so like if you're not playing you're not

playing defense like you really got got to be on and obviously his offense is amazing but when you are a laker obviously everything is is magnified much more And your defense here, it's going to be looked at more than what it was whenever you were in Dallas, especially because of the team construction. And it was already a big story prior. But when you are complaining after every call, after every call, non-call, people are going to look at you and say, you're a whiner who doesn't play defense. And it's also, it's also hard because the last two. Three superstars that have played for the Lakers have been two-way guys. Like, AD was an amazing defender, and he had the run in the bubble where his scoring went, you know, top-notes, got the chip.

LeBron, obviously, two-way guy for his career. Kobe, two-way guy. And so this is kind of one of the first stars that L.A. has had that hasn't necessarily been, not even a great defender, just a regular average, you know, he's out there. And so you also aren't kind of falling in line with these other expectations of the guys who have been here prior. And the Lakers are probably not going to win a title. They're probably not going to make a deep, deep playoff run. And you, like the lasting image for this season is probably going to be Luca with his hands up complaining about something. I think all those are good points.

I think it's fair to criticize Luca and to feel like there's faults in his game, maybe you could say he'll never win, whatever your takeaway is around those faults. totally fair to point them out it's just not different than it was previous years you know like all these faults were the same in 2024 yeah he's the same guy like the defense has been bad the roster isn't quite as insulated for his defense as it was with the Mavericks so

I think the framing of it as he's not on the same levels the top three guys maybe top four soon depending on when he's offense develops next year is fair but the framing that he's so much worse now because he had all this wear and tear on the body and he fell off at 26 is doing a little bit much I can only understand that take when it comes to seeing Luke at his worst compared to all the other guys in the top three or four or whatever.

His worst looks so much worse because, of course, he's like, he was a defender of the group. And whatever his shot is not falling and he's like dancing on people and all this stuff. It just is a really bad product. Like guys like Yolkich, guys like Yonis when he's healthy, guys like Shay when he's healthy or Shay as well. They're always going to give you like a productive game no matter what. And Yokic's downs are really, really. level because of how like ball little his scoring can be but when he's hot like i mean he's fucking yeah my bad luca when he's hot argue he's like the best player in the goddamn league compared

to everyone too because of his like dual threat when he comes to passing and inside scoring and the step back three and all that that's the shit that no one else at that level has as well so it's like goes both ways yeah there's all right last one my boy kevin aran is a great ball player and isn't a snake and no this isn't a burn yeah we caught you buddy Trent come on Trent

sure thing Trent okay buddy yeah does the media make too much of Kevin Durant being a snake and having burners

no I would say the media has not made enough of it because everybody tips it around it because no reporters want to treat it as fact everyone says I don't know what happens I don't know maybe it's fake I

Why, yeah. The Kevin Orent is on Twitter all the time. And we said it whenever he, whenever we first talked about it. And all he does is tweet. And then they ask him about Twitter. And he's like, I don't want,

I'm not here to get into Twitter nonsense. You love Twitter nonsense. That's part of the, of your ethos of legitimately your story and how you interact with fans is being directly involved with Twitter nonsense. I think Twitter nonsense gives your life meaning. I think you need Twitter.

Nonsense for a day-to-day satisfaction. Yeah. And there is, obviously, step fans like myself and just like warriors people are going to point to it and be like, you haven't won anything outside of your time with the Warriors. And before, before Golden State, you can say, you know, that's more of like a, I would say, like, it felt more on the court reason, right? Like you and the rest and the way that that team was constructed and obviously you were up three one. you didn't really play well in the last couple games of that series and then you end up going to Golden State. But since then, every place that you have gone to has, when you have left there, it's gone up in flames.

Like Brooklyn went up in flames. Phoenix seemed like one of the more unhappy places that we've seen in a long time. And then now not even eight months into the Houston Rockets experience, now we have the burn a situation. And this is probably going to end in a similar fashion of everybody being like, ah, this isn't really what I expected we were getting with the Kevin Durant, you know, experiment. So I think that's true. Fair enough. And that is our main topic for today.

Time to move on to the second part of this show. It's time to talk about all the news stories that have happened since we last recorded on Thursday. Beasoles, what do we have first? What is headlining the news of this weekend? Yes. The biggest headline of this weekend, the Atlanta Hawks, collabing with Magic City. Cause a lot of uproar on the timeline.

Mo, what's your first reaction when you see your favorite team doing a citywide activation to touch on the culture of the city they're from give something the fans might want, give you a reason to go into the stadium and purchase a piece of merch which is something that most NBA teams

don't often give their fans and then you look up, you see, oh, what could that be? And you see it's a strip club. The strip club. The strip club. Why are we honoring Magic City like they've like saved this community?

Sorry, you're saying Magic City hasn't helped the lives of many around the city. We've talked about Magic City so much in these last like three weeks. Like I just feel like they've been It's been mentioned a lot. We might need to blow up Atlanta. Like that's the only chief keef style. Yes, dude. Like chief keep dropping universe.

When I saw them, I thought it was like an actual joke. But seeing this Like come on man. You know some? There's other like productive things that we could. I would very much like to have that hoodie. I know you. I would love that. Like you're actually serious. That'd be hilarious.

I would love to wear that hoodie on the show. Can somebody procure me a Magic City Atlanta Hawk City? I would love to own that. That's so funny. You get on me for liking things ironically. Yeah, this is exactly that. Of course, literally, that's what I'm saying. But you're like, I'll put that shit on, like, you're serious. I would.

I would love to wear the other show. I would. Magic City. Come on, man. Sounds like a right off to me. There you go. What the fuck I'm supposed to say to my little brother when he's, He's like, oh, what's Magic City? I want it.

How much just to like describe it to what Magic City is? You tell him it's the most consistent source of jobs in the Atlanta area that's changed the lives of many workers and has put money into the pockets of Atlanta citizens. And then what now? After his 13-year-old sells, it goes on the internet and like types in Magic City. That is not your problem. All you can do is something. It is, though.

You're birthing a freak. All you can do is identify the economic impacts. Like, what do you think is going to happen? From there, it's not a thing. your hands have more issues on my hands now what's the next door you got to get to you got to move him out of Atlanta if you say it I can tell you what it is you have to change schools do your own research next up then Metabio is sick of the playing let's actually play this video you're really pushing to got this plane kiss on the end

yeah I don't want to be more we're better than being in the plan every for the last four years. Seven of the next eight at home, home court visit to capitalize. This upcoming is so bad. So next time it's short. Protect home court. You know, we already've been struggling on the road,

so we go home. Went some games, you know, being our atmosphere, being in our habitat where our fans are cheering for us and see if we can string some. You culture everyone. Good Lord. He said, I feel like we're better than being the playing game last four seasons.

Cap. He's so dreadful right now. You're exactly as good as being the playing game. Time is told. I saw Duane Wade said he called him. He let the voice memo and said, show me, prove it. Numbers don't lie. You guys are exactly a playing caliber team.

You can't be saying shit like that. He said the last four years, you're playing about 80 games a season. That's over 300 games of a single size. He said, oh, we're better than this. 300 games slump. I'm sorry, man. You guys are playing team. You said earlier they get prescriptions for things like that for two years.

They don't even get prescriptions for four-year slumps. They put you in a building that you don't come out of. Come with us. You stay a new place after a four-year slum. Come on, man. You got a new home. You start getting phone calls every week. You got to check in with someone.

Hello, we're a water bottle. Yeah. Oh, my God. I'm waiting for pay him down. I am ready to get that. See, and this is good hate. This is good hate. We just wait.

I like that. But yeah, they suck and they're like, they're also post a war of mediocrity. He fans always tell us in the comment section, this is a heat hate podcast. And every time we say something about the heat, it's always negative. They're like, the hate podcast at it again. You're right. I have no reason not to hate this team. They are just as a passive observer that wants to enjoy every team they watch, this team has

a blight on my enjoyment. They have not been enjoyable in several years. Yeah. And they just added a Celtics man, so no explanation to you. Hate the heat. No more good things said about the heat until they do something good. Yes. Next up, I want to show you guys that updated

MVP ladder because it's a cost some commotion. So we have SGA at 1, Nicole I chatt 2, KD at 3, Wembe at 4, Luca 5, Jalen Brown 6, Donovan Mitchell 7, Jalen Brunson, Anthony Edwards and Kowai Lund. Looks exactly right to me.

Interesting. I like seeing Wembe at four. Can we be at three? Should he be at three? You could talk me into that. It depends how. So I can also be talked into it. I think the top five is right.

If I'm getting, if I'm getting nasty, I'm going very narrative. I'm switching Jalen and Luca. But that's, that's it. that's that's often just personal bias obviously. Yeah but doesn't the top four are the only ones that are really in their EP combo. Luca and Jalen Brown are both equally not in the convoy that

I don't really care about that conversation. Like obviously Luca's much, much better. And like thankfully the Jalen Brown shit is dying down. People are realizing how stupid it is. So that's not really, he's not going to win it. If he gets fifth place in the voting at the end over Luca, that's fine. Who cares about fifth place? The top four is really what the conversation is to me.

Those are the guys that have a realistic chance. If Luca, I mean, if Yokic and Shay don't make the games played, I feel pretty good about it. being between Kate and Vic. If, yes. And honestly,

at this point, it's so, it's so close and everybody has, like, has their, their points for, for why they should be MVP.

I'm gonna close my eyes. You tell me which team has a better record. I'm gonna go with that. Because the team success is crazy for the Pistons to, to do this in the east and then have,

you know, have the amount of, of comfortability out east. That's, that's very, you know, noble. And then obviously we talked for years

about them not having the offensive prowess of some of the other teams. And then for Wembe, if they do catch OKC and even them just being close in this in this moment with them at the top of the conference, that's also noble. If the season ends today, are you giving Jalen Brown first team all NBA over Luca? Hell no. People are going to want to do that. And I think the history of books will spite us for life if that happens. And Luca loses a first team all NBA to Jailen Brown because of opposite people.

are in either direction. Is what I was saying last part. I swear, especially if SGA and Yolkich don't qualify, y'all are going to be pissed with them MVP votes because Jalen Brown will be up there with Mbby and Q. Well, he would be a dissing third, I think, but he would be third. I'm telling you you you're going to get pissed. This is what I'm telling you.

You're right. He shouldn't be, but you're maybe pissed. Because those two guys have like flawed cases. Like the Wemby scoring hasn't come around yet, decayed efficiency and turnovers, whatever. Like, so maybe those guys are enough flawed that when, that Jalen Brown would get like, if what 25% of votes well one of those guys gets 40 the other gets 50 whatever the numbers come out to you that he won't be a distant third I do feel confident he would get third though I've just had the sense that specifically this year the media is very pro jalen around maybe it's just my timeline there's a lot of me there's definitely a lot of people that are pro jeline right my my all my all NBA teams and like I've really the last like week and a half I've really really started to like hone in and like okay who like who is going to be on on on these teams and like I'm really my all my all mba teams and like I'm really like who is going to be on on these teams and And shout out to Jalen Brown.

I'm having the hardest time. And I think that there's even a very real scenario where like he's, if I'm just going ranking, he's on like the back half of my second team as opposed to just like an automatic lock. Because some of the other guys below him in terms of like D Mitch, I think it is getting discounted in in a lot of these conversations. I think what he's doing this year is super super noble. Like, honestly, if you tell me that aunt is at six above Jalen Brown, above D. Mitch,

I wouldn't look at you crazy. And can be five. And I really respect where Anthony Edwards has been doing it. I do think that because the wolves are the wolves and they're not, you know, they're not blowing anybody out the water, which for MVP, I understand why Aunt is a little bit lower. We're talking to all NBA and just like more individual performance. I think it has as good of an argument as anybody to knock Luca off a first team and potentially get in there. Sure.

Sure. Yeah, right now the Timberwolves are a game and a half above the Lakers. They're close enough. People are treating the Lakers in these conversations like they're the fucking 15 seat right now. That's the hard part is the Luca thing is so smeared right now by the lack of success in recent weeks that it feels like the Lakers should be in the play in. They're currently six.

They're not going to fall to seven. I don't think unless they really fall apart. They're half a game out of five, one and a half game out of three. So they're close enough that if they are still in that mix and even finish at like four. How close are they to seven?

To seven, they are two games. But it's Phoenix, who is not really trending up right now with Devin Bookerhurt. So, you know, it's possible they fall to seven. They're not going to fall to eight. That's Golden State.

They're five games below that. They're probably going to stay somewhere between, well, they really can go to three six is going to be the outcome. If they're in that mix, Lucas should still be first team all NBA. If they fall to playing game and you want to keep mad of that

because Celtics are a higher seed by a large margin. Like you just said, Anthony Edwards, carries his team to the three. See, whatever it may be. I'm fine with that.

As long as the Lakers are in that mix still, I think it would be kind of crazy to leave Luke off a first team. That's fair. Yeah. Yeah, I understand that.

I just, you look up and it's like, oh, wow, he's averaging 30. Like this, it's crazy. Yeah. So,

yeah, I just respect what he's doing this year. For sure. All right, next up, let's have these conversations about Lou Dort. I would play the clip,

but apparently someone tried to upload it and got a copyright strike or whatever from Lood Dorts. Six man YT uploaded a video that I'm sure the topic was about Lou Dord's dirtiness potentially.

It was a clip of him fighting over a screen in which he grabbed Derek Live these junk whole handful. He got a technical file obviously in that game. YouTube dinged it as inappropriate content. Nudity and sexual content. Nudity and sexual content.

There was a follow up to this tweet in which he said YouTube made him do a whole questionnaire and like training course that he had to answer questions about like what behavior you can and can't do like he's a sicko because Lou Dord decided to do that again. I'm surprised like the league didn't send him a memo or like a personal message or send him an actual course to be like, yo, you got to cool it man. Maybe they have.

Everyone's watching. Maybe they have. Yeah, they probably have. So this is obviously on the topic because in the recent game, he purposely hip-checked Nicole Yokish wearing up the court. Nicole Yokish did not like it, got in his face. Big General Williams got in his face back They had this whole little kerfuffle

That resulted in Ludo being ejected from the game For getting a flagrant two And a whole new way of a discourse About Lou Dord being a dirty player Yeah and it wasn't a hiptock He tripped him Oh it was like an ankle track Yeah he like yeah he like leaned back

While Nicole Yok was walking behind him He leaned back to bump him And then we complain What do you mean? What? What? You're gonna call that shit Fowl, foul

Come on, right The most clear, obvious intentional act. The ejection's fine, right? No one, like, I don't think anything Thunderfans would be like, that's a soft ejection. You got caught. Tough. Now get out of here.

And a lot of the time, too, with Lou Doort, he gets away with being, like, a dirty player most of the time because he doesn't necessarily, like, gravitate or get a lot of attention from the rest because he's not like your traditional dirty player. Traditional dirty players, guys like Patrick Mevery or Drummond Green. They're going to jaw and talk a lot. They're going to let you know that, hey, bro,

you can't either you can't fuck with me or i'm gonna make your life fucking hell tonight leudort don't do that he just be in the corner taking his weird threes and that he just like does stuff here and there he's a respectable dirty player he doesn't talk he just he just does dirty shit no i just he doesn't talk ludorre does have a history of doing a lot of wild stuff yeah he's he's he's clearly him like trying to like he was trying to hipchek him and he ended tripping him like that was clearly overt there's no defensive that there's a reason he ejected and it was a good call he routinely is just like too violent He doesn't get control over it and the leads to hurting people.

I mean, that's just who he is, right? He plays defense on the edge, plays aggressively. And when you don't have good control over that, because you're playing so aggressively, you often do shit like that where now you look fucking crazy. Yeah, there was a play that I see earlier this season live. He, I think Lou Doer was trying to close out and defer a shot. Yeah, he was trying to close out. And I think they were playing against Toronto Raptors.

And he ended up, like, riding on top of the shoulder of, I think he's named Mollour I move the stretch four shooter. He was literally on top of his shoulder in between grown ass, man. He's like fucking 2.30, 240 or whatever. It's right on your shoulder straight up like that. And Chet and someone else had to grab him off on top of him. It was ridiculous. He does a lot.

He is in this tweet from Royce Young where he's trying to say that Dort isn't some longstanding, well-known dirty player. It's a myth. I think honestly, if you are defending Ludoort, you're going to look at the numbers. If you are going against Ludoort, you're going. just going to say watch the game. Also, Royce Young works for the Thunder. This is his job to be a PR person essentially.

So take a green assault. You can have, we can, right now on, on Twitter, that wouldn't be banned, but you can find a five-minute clip of, of Lou Dort doing all types of dirty stuff. And I think for, for Dremont, obviously, goat in terms of just, in terms of just doing wild stuff on the court.

But for Lou Dort, he, the Thunder have only been relevant and good for a couple years. And even in this time, as you get that reputation of, I'm just a very good physical defender, you do get away with a lot more than what you probably are called with. And not being a Dylan Brooks or Patrick Beverly and talking all the time, you can go under the radar for a lot of stuff.

And people will not be like watching you every single time. But now when you trip literally the best player in the world, and cause him to lose his mind again, now it's a problem. Yep. And even if, 90% of the game, not even if,

I think the reality is, probably 90% of the game, he's playing aggressively, and it's like, it's annoying, but it's within the limits. He's pushing the line but not doing anything crazy,

but there's always that 10% where he has one or two plays where he goes over the top and trips you for no reason because he can't fucking keep his shit under control, and now we're going to color, that's a color perception

for every single play you do. Now people won't care if you're blowing up a screen and shoulder, putting your shoulder in front of somebody in a way that's legal and like good defense doesn't matter because they're going to remember you fucking tripping somebody running up the court for no reason he does play like a football player oh yeah like yeah like he plays like a linebacker he plays like like a college football player that's going to to the wreck and just and just picking up

and it's like oh this basketball yeah it's like yeah it's tough all right sticking with the thunder my god chat home girl made this video get him off my screen let me hear this why is he so close to I didn't know he said And if you have He definitely didn't do it as good as I did And a leopard Are you breathing in my ear like this With some thames on

You're trying to take me off He definitely didn't do it as good as I did My God He's trying to show off his fits And that's crazy I took up the whole door A real chef can cook with all flavors This is me dressing it up

And I've been going crazy With the animal prints That's the python Zip up sweater With the slack and the loafers. This looks clean. And the loafers.

That's me dressing it up. This is me dressing it down. This is one of my sweatsuits that I designed and make myself. Nothing really fits me how I want, so I got to do my own thing. This is super clean too, though. Here's another look. This is a camo on camel look. This is super clean.

I'm wearing my KD 18Ps. These actually come out in mid-March. Make sure we go get homegrown and big ass tetrapi. Sometimes I forget, bro. These players just really, big ass kids. Like they're just like, want to see my fits?

Yeah, exactly. No, you said, you put TikTok, got the little mic in front of his mouth, got real sensual and said, check it. Like a little kid. Does it doesn't spin? Yeah, exactly.

I'd be forgetting like, where you're just like 21, 22, 22 years old or something like that. You're not that far. They gave you a hundred million dollars. Exactly. What they expect you to do, but not say check it.

Look at this Belisioca. Was this Spitz fire though? Yeah. I mean, Some of them, I like the, I like the, I like the one with the slacks, like the, the pleads slacks and the, the cardigan one. The, the, the, the cheater prints. That was cool. I like that.

So do you approve of this video? Of the video, no. Of the, of the sentiment behind the video, yes. Okay. But this is, uh, this is an entry into a larger societal study that will be had. Social study of what? Chad Hungry's mind? No, of, I'm just players of chat hungriens ilk.

And what else is that? NBA players, you know, people who get, you know, a lot of money early on and now we see, you know, just how much the NBA has impacted them from a cultural perspective. Yeah. The culture has impacted Chad Holmgren. Because it is, it is different from like, I would say traditional Midwestern culture. Yeah. I don't think they're doing it like him. So we have to, we have to figure out where does.

that culture and influence come from, why are you the way that you are. This is why AAU basketball is important. Exactly. Exactly. Yeah, the cultural crossover of AAU basketball. To young Minnesota white kids. All right. Next up we have Moe's Guy, Jonathan Kamenga, last three games.

27, 7, 4, 17 and 9, 20 and 7. Undefeated as an Atlanta hog. Never lost. man now we did beat the wizards the wizards the wizards again and the Portland trade blairs just without denio d or two but I saw young hansom minutes on that court a win is a win still we did what we're supposed to do we we blew the fucking bladgers back out we put up like 43 points

in the fucking first quarter bro what we do that in a minute come bucket giving back shots in Portland that's exactly what you want to see after a trade like that yeah so are you in are you are you okay obviously you're not in because it's three games you're gonna be like oh sample signs we played bad teams I understand that. Are you hopeful? Yeah, I think he's like fulfilling things on the roster. Ladies and gentlemen, we got him.

I feel like compared to what compared to what we got him for we got him for we got him for, which is Porzingis, I feel good no matter what. Because Perzingis is doing absolutely nothing over there and goes to. He's played like maybe one game and he's been out for the rest of the year so far again. Like, yeah, I'm happy no matter what we get out of him. You know, it's tough. There's nothing that John the community could do. for the rest this season to repair his reputation

and make us believe in him. He could go crazy. March basketball. I've seen this before. Do it again. Do on a team that wants to win. He could be garbage. People already have to decide

who he is what he is. People probably won't even notice. Like, you really do kind of have to just wait until next year. And that's the hard part because obviously pending free agent. What do you have to say? Okay, they're going to decide

do they want to pay him. They don't want to sign and trade him so high. They don't try to keep him around. Let's say he does this for the rest of the season. not 27 every night, but plays well. Average is 21 on solid efficiency. Defense hasn't come around, but you're seeing the version of him that you would have hoped you could see when he's freed from a coach who hates him, plays with confidence, and scores the ball well like he said he always could.

21 points your game next to Jalen Johnson. What would you want to do with that in the summer? So we have been expiring in C.J. McCollum and Jonathan Kamika has a team option for $24 million. Yes. It's not crippling. It's not bad. It's not terrible at all. But we do have a little bit of money, like, committed elsewhere.

But we don't have any, like, terrible contracts on this team. Very movable, movable stuff. And 24 mil is just for a single year. So I'll be, if he's going to, like, do what he did over the last three games, just play, like, very good respectable defense, not be a black hole in offense, while also, like, being a very stop rebounder, which for this team specifically has been, like, a real weakness for us, being another, like, actual, like, elite level athlete alongside Jill and Johnson, because you've been dire when it comes,

that in general, like, yeah, I'll go ahead and pay him that money. Why not? We have nothing to lose. Well, what you want him for like, he doesn't want just the opt-in. His camp will say, if you're going to keep us, give me a three-year extension or trade me to somebody who will. That's the reality you're going to be faced with. See, if he has, if his camp is on that type timing, then that's on them. Well, anybody will. It's an inspiring contract, right? They're going to want to be with a team that can pay them. Like, either he's going to walk next summer because you didn't pay him or let's make this happen because we like it here. I would be willing to maybe do like a two year extension maybe but it's not surpassing like 30 million he's going to be

on like one of those weird jailing green well 30 mil is plenty that you don't you don't got to go higher than 30 I promise you 30 30 will you want to give him two years 30 sure I'll be I'll be willing to that because you can easily you can move off of that okay like attach to pick it's not crippling at all he's so interesting because on the surface if you didn't know anything about john the coming go and how the past couple years of went from like the expectation standpoint it's not terribly shocking at this athletic guy who is drafted because he has these traits and shud flashes of being a good score goes to a new team that has plenty of usage to go around has a new coach like I said who does not hate him dude this is the happiest he's ever been I never

seen him smile so much plays with confidence now it's not terribly shocking can play better I just think we've all kind of we've seen the ups and downs of jonathan good that we don't really feel inclined to like get too high on the highs but I suppose it's not impossible that it just works out in Atlanta it's not but I think I think for that reason also like everybody's view of Kamiga is so jaded. Yeah. He, he has to go on a legendary PR tour

this, this off season. And number one, listen, hit my line because I can, I can help you, right? I'm playing in every

offseason league possible. I need to see him at the Drew League. I need to see him at any Seattle pro am. There should be a clip every two weeks with a Kaminga highlight tape saying, Camiga dropped 60 in the Drew. Kaminga drop, 90 at the Seattle program.

I don't feel like those things are bad for a player SPR. No, no, no. Because everybody has like, because he's like labeled himself as this like score and people are like, well, the words need scoring. You haven't scored. You need to show in as many options as possible. And in as many forms as possible that I am talented and I was being done wrong by Steve current.

I need to solidify that in every single aspect. So go ahead, score 20 for the rest of the year. And you put up 60, 50, 50. 40 in every single in every single pro am across the summer you get your bag and you and you come out here in the start of the season and then you finally blossom into the player that you think that you that you can be because like you said there's going to be opportunity right you're going to have a chance to score as much as possible and so if you can be a decent player it's not like the hawks trying to try to compete for a championship you're just trying to be respectable if you and jalen

Johnson are now just two, just to what, six, six, eight, six, ten for James Johnson. I just these, these tall guys just averaging 20. That's, that's fire. That's cool. That's a nice recipe to get a 41 and 41. What's the next story? 100%. I saw a tweet today and said that the Hawks are 31 and 31.

And then the points for, like their point differential for the years plus one. Nice. You're correct. And we're plus one. I'm taking that. Next up, viral video of Steph Curry. Just want to see y'all's reaction and thoughts. All right, what do we have here?

Steph Curry. Can I have Dremont. What is he tweaking about? This got to be so tiring. He's just looking at him. He has a mood. He showed us a slump. He hasn't moved one inch at all.

He froze. What is Dremont freaking out about? What's the context of you? I don't even remember. What does it matter? D-pods, probably. You hate him. Damn.

Step has been. there done that he knows how this goes is Jermont yelling at him is he just frustrated what is he's talking to a coach I'm guessing I bet he's probably complaining about a rough or some shit he's calling that man yeah man

Curry knows what's up what do you all think of the Steph Draymond relationship like because people have been having that is it like maybe this is a weird paris social conversation is it like one sided yeah like no or he's just dealing with Dremont all this time

yeah it's been so long he knows Dremon's got to be Draymond. You deal with the annoying parts to get the good parts when I'm healthy. It's fine. Nobody understands a man better than Steph Curry understands Raymond, I'm guessing. That's also facts.

Yeah, so it's just, it's tiring. I feel you see, you see just the despair in step's eyes, the lifelessness in his body of life. But when is he coming back? Every time I want to go see the Warriors play, I'm like, yo, Stefan on the plane,

I ain't watching him. Next year? Next year. You finish it out. I might as well. Yeah, it's not, it's not good. It's not a good time. But thank you, Dr. Monroe, for once again submitting a video into meme,

Hall of Fame, and to just continue to add to your catalog. Exactly. He knows who he is. Yeah. Outstanding resume. All right. Next up. Nicole Yolkich since returning from injury, 27, 14, 9, 49% from the field, 32% from 3.

However, the nuggets now fall to 5 and 8 in that time span. are starting to get This is trade his ass They're better without him Take him out of all the fame They're strict I'm telling y'all They're strict about these non-defenders this year man

Oh 4932 We gotta have conversations His defense has been bad though Like his defense actually It's part of why they're losing No Aaron Gordon there to help that either His defense has been an issue There's been these averages

Are held up by strong games There's been some bad games along with it Hey man they're mid The Nuggets right now they've been telling us they've made for about two months now. We have to just hope for a magical bill of health to come to get at the right time and from them to have enough time to get their feet under them

and get on a good, just like defensive hot streak, I guess, essentially, of like effort and buying and understanding and getting all together on the same page after missing all this time. I don't think we're getting that, like, amazing year we hope for. It's not, they have to hope that, honestly, in the first round that they play the Lakers.

Because if they play, they play Minnesota in the first round, you're getting walked. Well, right now, the lower seat in that Minnesota match up. Right now, they're five, Minnesota's four, so they would play them. If you play them and game seven is not in your building, and obviously that it doesn't feel the same as like, oh, no, like we have to go on the road in the playoffs. But still, it would be better if game seven was in your building.

If you have to do that, then that's very tough. I think the Lakers or the Rockets, obviously, are the two most flawed teams in that, like, upper six. If they can play either one of those two, that would be the idea. ideal matchup. I agree. And hopefully for them, they can get those matchups at home where you at least have like the altitude advantage for the last game.

But this is not where you want to be at at all. So I'm, I am a little bit worried about them and them going toe to toe with. Forget, forget OKC. Because that's going to, that might happen later depending on the stuff. Can you beat San Antonio right now in a series? Are you ready to match up with them? Dude, the stadium. The state of yoke's defense is so disgusting.

yesterday earlier than day when I was watching the game like it was a simple straight blowbys anytime any player got a paint touch and yoke was like trying to recover and turn him hips them hips could not move at all and i think i've seen a move before you know like i think it's just straight up effort and people going back to what you said it's been like a bigger conversation about that as of late and that's just so like glaring now a g does help cover all those up but what ag can't cover up is fucking cam johnson dude yesterday guess how many points you put up None. Zero points in like 23 minutes of play.

He was a zero factor. If it wasn't for like Payne Watson's ascension, which is like still impending, he's not like a solidified star in anything of this yet. If it wasn't for him like being like ascending, I'll be so much lower on the nuggets than I am, I am already, and I already don't feel good.

I saw a tweet for someone said, Cam Johnson shows, I don't want my athletes to be to, all this self-aware gimmick, all this self-aware, smart intellectual guy, give me the overzealous, overconfident athlete that can take down the world. Yes, bro.

So yeah, we talked about it last week. Kim Johnson's not having a good year for what we expected from him after the Brooklyn year and for the value ad we thought he would bring to this team being exchanged for Michael Porter Jr. People are also doing a lot

from Michael Porter Jr. PR for what he was doing for this Nuggette team because, you know, naturally that conversation is leading to everybody saying terrible trade, they shouldn't ship off MPJ. They ended the dynasty because they shipped off MPJ. Any title hopes are gone because of that? He did the dirty work.

he was the rebounder. Unheralded guy who they needed. People were doing a lot. That's guys name. Did the dirty work? That's Aaron Gordon, if anything. It's 100% Aaron Gordon. Dude, there was games where he couldn't close because of defense.

Michael Borgier was not a good defender. Played through injuries. Shout out to him. Didn't play well. There's a reason they didn't move on from him because they weren't sure he's going to be healthy. Doing the dirty work and acting like he's this salt to the earth work hard guy all the time. People were doing a lot about this trade. Yeah, because there was a time like you mentioned where they were talking about

like, MPJ, like, wasn't ready to, to play. And he was talking about, like, just how much,

like, like how he wasn't locked in. And he makes a lot of money. He makes a ton of money. Yeah. And so I do. I, yeah,

that's a, that's a bit too far. Mm-hmm. They are right, though. Like, ultimately, they might be in a position

where the quote-unquote dynasty ended because you did take such a step back because you moved on, on from MPJ. I don't think they're right. I think that's a, to narrow it down to Cam Johnson's,

MPJ as being a step back is a vast oversimplication. It's because Aaron Gordon's gone. Because everyone else has heard. What I'm saying is like, we'll see if Aaron Gordon is, I'm obviously big assumption because of the injury stuff. If we get to the playoffs, Aaron Gordon's healthy. And the majority of the stuff, obviously I'll always move apart, yada, yada. But you had MPJ last year and if you have Yokic, Gordon, and Murray.

And now that specific spot, which we saw was able to still. be very formidable even after KCP left and now it's really like that big four that's carrying everything. If Cam Johnson is in that big four and he's not producing, then that's, that's extremely tough. Like even, even that tweet that you were talking about, they had quote tweeted a clip from the Nuggets, uh, Laker series where it's a, it's a scrambled bang bang play. It's like a minute left. And Aaron Gordon gets the ball, throws it back out to MPJ. And MPJ, no hesitation from three while the nuggets are down three. No hesitation pulls it, right? It pulls it. It pulls cash it, tie game, changes everything. Right now, if you're in, if you're in that situation and

you have those many, those bang, bang plays, I have no faith in Cam Johnson to even take a shot like that. And that's, that's where I'm saying for a team that already is, is kind of behind the, the, numbers in terms of, like, depth and everybody stepping up. I'm going to need more from Cam Johnson. I know what you're saying. You're describing, I think you're describing scenario where they could lose because of Cam Johnson. That's obviously possible. I think to preemptively say when they lose it'll be because of this move is doing a lot of over simplification

when we've had but there's just plenty of reason. But it's been all season of of of Cam Johnson finding his way not not shooting well and the thing and the things that he is not bringing are things that they

directly miss from that MPJ trade. For sure it just that role of between those two is not impactful enough for it to in my opinion to be the deciding factor the cam johnson stuff would not be terribly important if aaron gordon was healthy or if somebody was healthy obviously Peyton watson's hurt too everybody's been hurting out the line up all year yeah there's a lot of light being shine on it because everybody else around him keeps crumbling but that's the bigger issue is everybody around him because crumbling if that all was normal or gets normal towards the playoffs i just don't think that role as the fourth fifth option on the never nuggets offense has enough impact to be like the deciding factor in a series yeah yeah i can agree the reality is like both of these two things that you're saying if you guys saying are true. It's just like the whole Cam Johnson thing, this is really a sour taste in our mouth

because we had like not absurd expectations from him, but we all suddenly said like, oh yeah, like MPJ may put up like better numbers in terms of like, quick technical issue, OBS crash, we had to restart. If you were enjoying that conversation about Michael Porter Jr., it is now over. On to the next new story. Peaceful is what we got. Next up we have Doc Rivers on Pat Riley's comments about wishing coaches still wore suits and ties.

It's a tough one because quarter zips are so comfortable. real. Real. Come on. That's real. Rare Doc W. I can't even had to him choosing comfort. This is exactly what I was talking about, man.

Go put that suit on, bro. He's like that Joe Mazzao comment. Whenever the Southwix reporters got new chairs in a media room and he asked him about him, he's like, anything for y'all to be comfortable. What? He said that. Oh, my gosh. Anything for y'all to be more comfortable.

And here he is not wearing a suit because he's picking up, because he's picking He's choosing comfort. he's being his own worst enemy. He's choosing the easy way out and that's not like Joe Mazuda. That's not the Joe I know. It's certainly not the one I know.

So I think Joe needs to step it up. Doc, if you want to wear cordage, just go play golf, man. Listen, Janus is not going to be here. You can leave. He might as well leave. He don't do anything for this team right now. Are they allowed to wear suits

or do they all have to wear athletic leisure now? I think everybody has to wear the same thing. So if Doc wants to wear a suit, NBA won't let him? I think, that's kind of crazy. He might. He can't put it on. He might be able to, but I think like the, the coaches, like, everybody has to be in unison.

Like, he can't just be in a suit and then the coaches be in court as if. Yeah. Interesting. Makes sense. Does it? Maybe you should let the feet of want to put it on, put it on, let them stand out and see if they can shift the narrative to make everybody else want to do it. Then you kind of throw off like the, I think he also is moving one. We have NBA players on the side wearing these fucking Gucci sweaters.

There's no cohesiveness of the look anyways. If they're not playing, then yeah, but these coaches are always like doing their job. You can't do his job in a suit. That's what I'm saying. But also, the players are getting, it means that I promise you, the like assistant assistant defensive coordinator is that. They are not pulling out a stylist to sell the best like that. Yeah. So you're going to get L-L-ABC pants?

Is it W-Doc or L-Doc? W-Doc, we're a W-Duty for me. This a loss. Put the suit on. Put a suit on. Get out the lead, bro. All right. Next up we have Kevin Love

on the Gary V podcast saying, we were a super team. We were expected to go to the finals. This is from 2015 to 2017. Facts. Yeah. They were expected to go to the finals. He's right.

They had three all stars. It was to be expected in that Eastern conference. Were they a super team? I think that's the real conversation. I don't think super team is. Looking back at it, they probably weren't like legitimately won.

when it comes to like NBA history or whatever, but when it comes to how they made that move, trading with the number and overall pick and Andrew Wiggins in that summer for Kevin Love. Yeah. We've morphed the view of what a super team is over the years. Yeah. In this era, in 2014,

if you trade for a third all-star after you just signed one and put together three all-stars, that was a definition of a super team at the time. Now we've had so many these attempts swing and miss that I think now you had to be a good attempt to be considered a super team. But in 2015, yeah, that was absolutely, like, I'm sure the day that traded for Kevin Love, ESPN, was running new super team formed in Cleveland.

And they were. Yeah. This is changed now because now we have three all sorts together all the time. They don't work out. Shit don't change real fast. But at that time, all you needed was three. Yeah. I think especially also, I mean, he's right.

Every 2018 is the only year where anybody could possibly fathom like that the cab's not making the finals. And that's because, you know, Kyrie was gone. But all the other three years, it had to be them. It had to be the Warriors. Or 16 and 17. It's so crazy, Kyrie left. Every time I think about it. What a moment.

What a way to go. And then went on first take. Yeah, it was on first take and having... In that fucking suit? Looking like he said a debate. You know how in disbelief I was when we got Kyrie? He's one of those players were like... Where were you when that happened?

In college? Specific. Not even in college. The moment. Oh, the moment. You must have been in high school, right? Were you? Yeah.

Yeah, you must have, was it, was it a junior year or senior year? Senior year. 2018 happened. Was it the summer of 2018? Summer of 2018, I was a graduating senior in high school. Okay, I thought just after our freshman year of college. Yeah. I see, I see.

It feels like it was a high school memory. But yeah, I guess it was after freshman year. So the 2017 finals was our freshman year of college? No. 2017 finals is the finals going into college. So, no, he got traded 17 summer then. Yes. Oh yeah, yeah, he did. Because what happened? Because he played 17, 18.

Yes. That was the first year. Yeah. And because there was some versions of, because he was a 2K cover athlete. And there was some versions where he was on the Caval. Oh, yeah. Yeah. That's crazy. 2K 18.

What a time. Don't remind me. That's so garbage. That's how I met CJ. I met him in the Jetta elevator because he had just got 2K. Didn't know anything about CJ. He just walked in the elevator. He was like, you got the new 2K if you're trying to pull through it.

I was like, okay. Y'all played 2K18. Yes. Who's the newest one? All right. Next up. Kendrick Perkins says Kate Cunningham replaced Luca Donchish in the top five

in NBA because he plays defense. Oh, brother. What are we talking about right now? I'm running with this until the playoffs. Do you know what I'm running with this? I'm going to say it's true. This is the part where everyone's been talking about where it's just like, okay.

Maybe the Kate hate has an art, the Luca hate has gone to a point. Bater, Cade being better than Luca, slow the hell down. That's too much for me, man. And overall, like, the Cade MVP talks have been a little bit too much for me because I'm like, I need to see him.

The MVP talks aren't too much for me. It's only if Shay and Yokic miss it for games played, you know? Then he enters a conversation, which is like fine. If it's him versus Wemby and Jalen Brown, it's fine. It's better than Luca thing. Like, y'all were setting Kate up for amid slander. They lose to the Knicks or lose to the cats. And suppose that top five better look at player K. Cunningham.

She's a couple tour dates. We're setting him up for slander. Okay. A couple times. One, you can't be scared of slander. You just can't. Like, you just have to. But it's unfair.

It's not, it's not unfair. It's not, but expectations are unfair. He's not a top five player. That's what I'm saying. He's just not. Yeah. The expectations for that is not fair. We're getting too hard over those range.

He needs several efficiency leaps at his score to be a top five player, I think. Maybe. Maybe. I also think it's very funny. Seeing the way people use defense as like this tiebreaker and like like like like people, people say, oh, he plays defense. And so it's like, he, he doesn't. He doesn't. That's fine.

And it's a very yes or no check box. And then on offense, that's kind of where you get all the other discussion of like, well, he does this better. He does that better. And then on the other side, it's like, yeah, he guards. Because there's box scores for the offense or stuff. People don't have to think about it. harder. Yeah. And it's, it's

funny like that. But I do think again, for right now, I'm, I'm a, I'm a locking with this. Okay. I'm gonna say it. W. Kendrick Perkins. You're crazy. Speaking of Kendrick Perkins,

is he got another one. All right. What does this say? You got another one for Kendrick Perkins. He says, Jalen Brown reminds me the season of NBA young boy because he's an independent artist and he's now with the industry. He's a Celtic.

All right, what's the next one? That's Gucci Man in 2006, man. Immediately after Dougie Kendrick. This is one of the most wild metaphors I've ever heard. Okay. Nice. I don't even like begin to understand what the fuck he's talking about with that one. Okay.

He's an independent artist. What does that mean? Oh, because he's not with Nike. Is that? He does have the label push, I guess. What he means? He's not with the industry. He's a Celtic.

He has an extreme label push with Boston Celtics media. He is not an independent artist. Yeah. That's because the people are with them and not, not, you know, you are dropping everything. Just get it together, buddy. Yeah, right. That's the first thing I got dropped. Come on, man.

You hit you, you hit your water bottle. I have a water bottle on the table. I'm going to drop it. I'm going to count that as a drop. But yeah, Perkins, just added to the roof. Listen, 50% there. Donovan co-sons the first take, not the second take. You shot 50% from the field today.

Yeah. That's all you need on ESPN. All right. Last one. Russell Westbrook says he's the most athletic player ever. Don't even question that. Better check the numbers. What numbers tell you this?

Like his combine measurements? He was talking about like his dunks. Well, he can actually listen to it. His dunks? Oh yeah, let's do it. Yeah.

Let's see what was like this. What are his number? I wish. Yeah. We mean wish. I wish you're athletic. Most athletic all time. Ever.

Ever. No, you know, question that. Just check W8 most dunks. Never mind. I'm a stop. Yeah. I'm gonna stop for us

I know he was doing most dunks okay that's not how land is for him to say he's clearly one of most like point guards of all time like in the conversation I don't know if he's one like I'm gonna say he's one I'm gonna say he's the most athletic

or trying to think of older point guards that are very athletic he's yeah he's he's the most athletic point guard because one like he has the high end athleticism of just like I'm just jumping super high and we've seen him get downhill with and without the ball very fast, he's the best combination of all the different type of like athletic.

That's fair. And if you could be the most athletic at a position, then at that point we're at, to die, the beholder, what type of athleticism from what type of size human being is more impressive. So you're certainly in the conversation. Yeah. Yeah. That's not crazy to say at all. The speed, the strength, like underrated quickness because everyone's always so focused

on how high he's jumping, how strong is finishing at the room at his peak. Very afraid to say. Okay. If you're still here watching this episode, comment, do you think Russell Westbrook is the athletic player of all time. Or minimum top five athletic all time. That's a fair. It's hard to argue with five top five.

That's fair. There's some guys that feel like seven foot. Maybe it's more impressive to some people to do certain things. But pound for pound, he's definitely top five, I think. Yeah. I'm thinking like Bronn, Jordan, Jordan. I think Russ is just athletic as Jordan, isn't he? Do you think LeBron?

No, Russ. He's probably the same caliber of athletes as Michael Jordan. I don't know. I think Jordan, there's like a level of flexibility that I think Russ didn't have. Well, now we're getting into skill versus athleticism. I don't know where that line is. But I think Russ at his peak, I do think is as athletic as maybe.

Yeah, I would think that'd probably similar caliber. Like Jordan's obviously like the more flexible finisher and has more agility and stuff, these things that like make his athleticism more functional. But in terms of height, weight, speed, combine stuff, they're probably same caliber. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Like they're just as fast. Just as high, just as strong.

he might. Maybe he's just a mad guy, but his power on dunks is legit. Well, I would say if MJ play with the modern era, he might be a little crazy dunk guy too. So it would be different. He'd be slamming on people.

All right, let us know. Who do you think is the most athletic point guard of all time is Russ number one. And we'll see y'all on Thursday for the next episode. Peace. Jim McCabeem.