The Deep 3 Podcast - The New York Knicks Are NBA Champions | Ep. 222

Episode Date: June 14, 2026

The New York Knicks just won the NBA FInals! #nba   Check out the TD3 merch: https://the-deep-3-shop.fourthwall.com/   Listen on Spotify!: https://open.spotify.com/show/3elbbqVumwqz8wlIdknsLW   Listen on Apple Podcasts!: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-deep-3-podcast/id1657940794   Follow us on TikTok!: https://www.tiktok.com/@thedeepthree   Follow us on Instagram!: https://www.instagram.com/thedeep3podcast/   Isaac's twitter: https://twitter.com/byisaacg   Mo's twitter: https://twitter.com/Mojo99_   Donnavan's twitter: https://twitter.com/Dsmoot3D Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Wembe. Oh, oh, oh. Throwing it back. Whoa. That's crazy. He was bragging. I don't know. The cranium is crazy.

Oh my God. All right, Donovan, take it away. The New York Knicks are officially champions. It is 10.50 p.m. Saturday, June 13th. How you feel? Man, I can't believe this is life, man. I have these sunglasses on because I've been crying for the last night. Since the game in now, I've been crying.

I can't let you see my eyes that red. Don't do it. No. We can't do it. But, man, man, this whole thing is crazy. It really is, like, insane because, like, to take, like, the long, long view of it is, like, I never really thought that I, like, there was a long time where I never really thought that they were going to ever win a title.

And so then for them to actually do it and to come back 15 down. basically in every single game off the heels of the greatest comeback in NBA history, like this entire season, this entire thing, it's, I'm going to go to sleep, I'm going to wake up and it's still going to feel like a dream. And like long, long, so I'm, I'm, okay, indulge me for a second. Take a time. So like, and so anytime I meet somebody, like, and you know, like we started talking about basketball, they're like, oh, like, who are you a fan of us?

I'm a Knicks fan. And they're like, oh, okay, like, are you from New York? I'm like, no, I'm not from New York, but like, I'm from Houston. And I explained, like, oh, yeah, my dad's from there. And, like, that's kind of, like, the short answer. And, like, but, like, the long answer is, like, yeah, my dad's from New York. But ironically, he's not a Knicks fan and I'm from Houston. I'm not a Rockets fan.

But we grew up, like, going to New York a lot. And, like, I fell in love with, like, the city and, like, all of my dad's family, everybody else, they're all Nick fans. And so it's like, I was around them all the time, fell in love with New York. And keep hearing all of these stories about, like, like, the old garden. Like, oh, my God, like, the Garden was rocking. I'm in love with it. And so, like, that's why, like, they're my team.

And so you have all of that and you hear all of these, like, folk tell stories of all of that. And you just, like, build, build, build. And then whenever I, like, and I think I've told the story around here before where one of my uncles, like, swore me in as a Knicks fan and was, like, you know, from here on out, you're, like, this is your fandom. I don't think you told us that. What is that?

When I was in either, like, early high school or, like, late middle school, once I'm, like, done bandwagoning, I was like, I was always a Knicks fan. But I was serious about my next fandom. And so one of my uncles like brought a jersey in and was like, put your hand on this jersey and like put your right hand up. And he made me like repeat after him. I like swore in to be in the Knicks fan like I was like the president or something. You got jumped in. Yeah.

And so it's like from that moment on, you can argue that that was one of like the worst decisions that anybody could ever make. Because they like they lost. They had multiple seasons where they are losing 17 games or where they're winning 17 games. multiple seasons where, you know, they're missing the playoffs. They're the embarrassment of the league. You have multiple years where, like, for the longest time, and really since, you know, since the last title, like for the last 35 years, the Knicks have,

the Knicks and Madison Square Garden have been a place for everybody else to get their game off. Like, they've purely been the stepping stone for everybody. Like, you have the 90s bulls, you have Hakeem getting his first ring, like Kobe scores the garden record hardin has like a 60 point triple double lebron has 52 there currie's coming out parties there her sets the three point record in msg when we had a 40 and 20 game on christmas and like that's his coming out party like every step of the way for a long time it's been

about somebody else at the garden and today it's not about anybody else and it's about the nix and like i'm trying not to cry again because like this is so insane that you have this entire thing in this like curse of 53 years and you know curse or drop whatever you want to call it and it's just over now because of some big-headed 6-2 guy who is the clutches player that you've ever seen

in your life and every single game in the series he got better and better and better and the series culminates with him dropping 45 on the road, down 15 to win the title. And this team is so special. Like, like, we obviously, like, we went back and forth all year long about, like, you know, the Knicks Tier 1 contender. Are they Tier 2?

You know, they have the embarrassing loss on MLK Day and all this other stuff. And you go in, it's like, yeah, they're good, whatever. For a majority of people to even say, yeah, like, I think the Knicks have a chance to win the finals. They had to play the greatest month of basketball. ever seen. Yep. And just to have a chance. And they ran them.

They ran them. And they beat them in five. And what did you say they'd do? I said they ran them. I said they run them. Yeah. And they ran them. And so now,

Jaylon Brunson's a champion. Josh Hart's the champion. Carl Anthony Towns is a champion. And not just as Carlton Town is a champion. No. Carl Anthony Town is the champion for the next jersey. Carl Anthony Town is the champion for the team you root for it. The epitome of everything you did not like in basketball four years ago,

it was your savior. Was the missing piece to bring you the championship that you just spent 20 minutes talking about why you never thought you'd get it? Cat was the missing piece. Big Cat. Big, never, ever. He will never be the little one. He will never be the little one from here on now.

Doesn't even know how. And I remember, I said it, I think a couple weeks ago. Like, I went back and watched the emergency episode when Kat got traded. It was like, I can't believe it. Like, I can already see the two. for 16, game six, whatever. Luckily, we didn't have to get to a game six because we beat everybody in five or four

and that's it. And all I said was, all right, man, lock in because it's time to win a championship. And Kat, from the moment he became a Nick locked in to a different level than what he was before and changed his style of play. And not just in the moment he became a Nick.

Last year, he was Kat. He was good offensively. In the playoffs, he was bad defensively. He had terrible moments in that series against the Pacers. He had his fair share of Carlton Town's moments. He locked in this year. He got better. And I think that's such an important thing to point out

that you got the full degree. You got the full experience of Chrononton Towns. He fouled out today. Filed out today. He still has his up and downs. But he gave you enough ups for the perfect amount of time, secure your championship. Him getting you the best version of him.

You mentioned earlier, a 6-2 dude brought you the championship. That's generous as hell. A 5-11 dude with a nice measurement brought you the championship. That's not supposed to have. happen. Look up and down the roster. Kat was a player that we've given up on, thought we'd never see the world in which he could be the best or second best player in championship team because

of Flossie has, right? Still a very good player, but we know our serious doubts with him being a nucleus player. Jalen Brunson, second round pick, six man, signs to your team. No one expects him become a superstar. Here he is. Josh Hart, the most imperfect role player imaginable. McHale Bridges, all we talk about. You gave up way too many picks to get him. He's not worth anywhere close to the package. He's played largely fine for the whole time he's been in He's at his up and downs, obviously, lots of lows. Even when he's up, all we talk about is you gave up too much. Mike Brown was fired by the goddamn Sacramento Kings.

To be tossed aside by the worst organization in sports, and then to be hired by a team to immediately take them to the championship, and you can get into the bench players, people like Jordan Clarkson written off, Miles McBride never should have been here, all this stuff. Every single person that has to do with the championship is doing it in a likable way, a way that you can root for. And we've talked about that a lot, right?

That this Knicks team feels like a team that even if you're not a Knicks fan, there's so much to be happy for them up and down the roster. And the Knicks themselves, when Leon Rose took over, failed rebuild. The prize of that three-year period where you were winning 17 games a year. Yeah. R.J. Barrett. And they flipped all those bad pieces into all the underdogs I just talked about. There's nothing about this team that's not enjoyable to see them thrive.

Yeah, we can even go back to the summer of 2019 when everyone thought y'all were going to get Kyrie, K.D., Zion. Y'all end up with Randall and Brunson and everyone's laughing at it. at y'all i was everyone i'm not going to lie so was i so was he he was laughed at himself yeah that's what i'm saying they were also feeling the despair feeling the doubt of all the guys i mentioned they hated on mcale bridges not being worth the picks they hated on cat for having terrible performances they didn't truly believe in brunson when they signed him that's why i feel so good to them i'm sure because they shared the feeling of not belief until there was a reason to believe and every like every every moment of the of the journey and even in in this um in this series like

there's always, it always felt like there was, like the other shoe was about to drop just because that's how it's gone for the Knicks for so long that even after game three and the, the only loss that they've had, you know, since game three of the, the Hawks series, you had a lot of people, oh my God, Brunson ball, oh my gosh, what, what are, what are we going to do? And instantly, as soon as, as, as that game happened before everybody's eyes, it's like, I saw a tweet the day after that was like, man, that 80 million Brunson contract. is going to go, is going to look insane in two years. Like if they don't win it and like the fear and the falloff and the doubting,

it never, it never truly went away until the final zero's hit. And like, oh, gee, Mr. Frito to put them up four instead of, instead of three. And it always just, the door is just always open just enough to where in the back of your mind, you're like, is this going to go sideways? And it never, it never did. Yeah. And so right now, again, thank you to C.J. McCollum. You have played, like, you should get a ring.

You played as, as integral of a part in this championship run as anybody else to scare the Knicks into whatever. Had Josh shook. Yeah. To the max more than shook. And from that moment on, the teamwork, the fight, the hustle. the never say die attitude about this team that you saw whether they were going into a game up through real, ready to close people out by 30 or tonight and do what they did the entire series, which is, oh, it's okay, yeah, we're going to start the, we're going to start the first,

the first quarter, you know, two of 13. We're going to, we're going to spot you 15 points and to just keep coming back and back and out execute and make timely shots and do it all when Duce McBride was hitting absolutely everything in the first couple rounds was not on anything this series. Landry Shammit, kind of the same thing, right? Had good games early on, but as the series progressed, you weren't getting the same Landryshammer that you were getting earlier in the playoffs. McHale Bridges was shooting 70% from the field for the first three rounds, was not,

obviously had good games, but wasn't that level. And then even Kat after the first two games and everyone's like, is he finals MVP? then you had Kat multiple games where the foul trouble is right there on front street. And through all of that, the Knicks persevered. And they are, they're champions now. Yeah, I just find it crazy that Jalen Brunson specifically led this team. Not even because of the whole Becky Hammond conversation that we've all been having. But I think specifically this year, there was a lot of conversations about small guards that don't play defense,

that offenses are built around. are those guys, you know, players that you should build around. And for Jalen Brunson to do what he did specifically this year, bro, y'all can, honestly, Becky Hammond could still be right. You are wrong about Jailen Brunson, though. Sure, sure. You are for sure wrong about Gilman. And, yeah.

And like the thing with the Becky Hammond thing, like, okay, so one, yes, it is like, it is a rallying cry for Knicks fans because you have somebody who was like very public about the disbelief in Jalen Brunson. her specifically and her comments specifically is only big literally only because she's a woman like because everybody else every other man in NBA media says the exact same thing of yeah oh you can't have a small guard you can't have a small guard but they decide to pick on on Becky Hammond that's the only reason why like her comments have stayed around but just to the point of the entire conversation of small guards the one caveat that we always say

is like yeah you just have to have a superpower you just have to be like that yeah when your team needs it and and jaylon brunson is yeah that obviously part of it is that he's just succeeded in spite of the clear limitations that style of play but also speaking so much about that just centers jelan brunson on this like he just backpacked this team and this isn't what this moment is at all to me yeah that sure it is like you said becky ms said i don't think they'll win a championship they did so her comment was factually incorrect right but the spirit of it we all know what she meant we all we all agree with what she meant to some to some degree right whether the line of jaylon Brunson are not who is good enough or not good enough to be a small guard-le-le-le-a-te-te team,

neither here nor there. This Nick's championship really, to me, shows that they were at their best when they weren't so Jalen Brunson focused. Last season, they lived and died by Jalen Brunson-Iso ball. They lived a lot of times. For the past two years, we've loved Jailen-Brunsen for being such an incredible Licking performer that's so reliable, such an engine of an offense. There was times in which it didn't pittered out because it's just a very difficult style

of play. They're here because before the last two games in which Old Cat came back to play, a little bit with the foul trouble and being a lot of stupid decisions. Big time. Before he relapsed on the offensive fouls, he was arguably their most important player. They played through him as the hub.

That's how they got these last two sweeps before the finals. They were destroying teams by him being a bigger part of the game. Brunson all year focusing on off ball. Mike Brown doing a very good job of getting him off the ball more in turn, empowering Kat, empowering OG to provide offensive value that makes him an all-star conversations now, which we'd never say that before. Mikhail had a good run in the playoffs too.

Everybody touched the ball more, and they played without being so focused on Brunson. So to even go back to that convo so much, I get the fans are going to do it. How are they not going to have their moment to shed on all the Jalen Brunson haters? But this is really about how you can make a team that's led by one star, be led by the whole team.

Have it be a starting five, be a moment that in real time for the last two sweeps when we started to realize, oh my God, they can make this run. We knew in the moment that we're witnessing one of those runs where a full team locks in and plays their best basketball and has a historic run that we don't go to talk about Dynasties, but I'm going to talk about this and this and that. For this month, they are playing perfect basketball as a team.

And that's so much more important to me than whatever the hell we've got to take away about Jalen Brunson. Facts. And let it not be lost. We are the first team in NBA history to complete the double. We are the first team in NBA history to win two championships in one year. The way he's ever done that before. What's other championship? The in-season tournament, the NBA Cup.

Hold on. Both of you need to show some respect to the Emirates NBA Cup. Cuff. You are, you are correct. The Emirates, the Emirates NBA Cup won that, won the Lerio O'Brien. Listen, man. You think people will take that tournament more seriously now? Yes, 100% honestly. It just definitely helps somewhat. I don't know if it's going to be like overnight. We care all of a sudden. Yeah. But this is the type of thing you need to see for that, that accomplishment to begin to matter. Because it's going to just take time and history for those type of things to really have an imprint in our brains. When there's only two championships and neither one of them led to anything, like in terms of those teams having long runs after, of course, we're just going to forget it even happen.

But as time it goes on, history comes, and we see more and more teams do both. The Thunder home was at both last year. They lost in the finals. Now we finally see it happen. I hope we see the tournament start to matter more. Because I think it's good to have more opportunities for accolades and more opportunities for moments in history.

Yeah. And I do think honestly that the tournament low-key, because we saw the spurs and the Knicks both in the tournament final. And so that was one of the first times that people were really like, okay the spurs are are for real right because they had they had those games against the against okay C where they where they handed out belt and they proved that they could that they could hang with them and so in terms of like a a measuring stick or a point in the in the NBA season where you can finally have like a legitimate litmus test I do think that the cup might be something for that

but like the Knicks you know doing everything that they've done this year is fantastic and like the way that this team has changed from then to now, you know, from December to now, from April to now, their evolution is one of the most interesting and fulfilling evolutions of a team within one season that we've seen, you know, especially for a team that at the beginning of the year, we thought was going to be in this position, was going to be in the finals. and, you know, we took rollercoaster roundabout way of getting here, but at the end of day they are, you know, they're at the top, man. Yeah.

Yo, the Knicks of champions, man. The Knicks of champions. Fulfilling is an interesting way to phrase it. That's definitely like you felt the full range of emotion in this season. And I can't remember last time that happened that the team was expected to be in the finals, but like we mentioned in the recent weeks, that's largely because the Celtics were seemingly. going to be in the gap year. They were eliminated from it.

We know Janus was on the side because the Dame didn't work out. He's gone off the team. Like, a lot of people, I picked the Cavs, you picked the Knicks. That was the conversation coming into the season. The Convo was one of those teams would be in the finals, but we think the Thunder and going back to back. Or we think this, oh, actually, no, we weren't seeing the Spurs yet.

Whoever you had outside the Thunder in the West, it was like most of the conversations. Pre-season the Nuggets. Yeah, the Nuggets. Yeah, they were the other team the second. The rural convoy was like who I think in the West is going to win the finals. So they were seen as a favorite, but it was a very, like, someone's got to do it, type thing. So to go from that to mid-tier playoff team

because we're starting to lose faith in this core because they're having these up and down performances, to we're insane in the playoffs, to we're in the finals. Like every single step of contender, you check those boxes this year. You felt every single moment of underdog favorites in between. Like, there was no stone left unturned

when it comes to expectations for this next team. Man, they did it, man. I'm still just like, in shock, you know? And because every, again, every, every single person on, on the team just stepped up and, like, OG for him to have the performance that he had throughout this, this entire finals. We're coming into tonight, there were a lot of people that's like, hey, OG N and OB is my finals MVP.

And to, to have him perform on that level, everything that they've done is completely, you know, justified. It's, it's, it's paid off, you know, you talked about Josh Hart being the imperfect. role player. I've said it before. I said again, I want him to have a lifetime contract. Like just the way, the way that Josh Hart plays is, he need one of those. Yeah. You need, you need somebody on your team that is, that, you know, hustle, hustle driven, that selfless in terms of his play style and does everything else. Mitch Robinson had a broken pinky this entire series and still was able to give,

uh, Wembe, a little bit of trouble here and there. We saw Huck Porty tonight. We saw Sohan, like Jose Alvarado, getting him at the deadline. They legitimately went 15 deep in this game and in this entire playoff run. And everybody, actually, they went 14 deep. There's one guy who didn't really get, you know, run it's okay. Who you talking about? Sohan? No, Daddy.

Oh. But outside of him, everybody else got minutes in a meaningful spot and they stepped up. Like Hugporti, he played 30 seconds. to start the game tonight gets pulled. And we were saying, yeah, he looks too frantic. He does not look ready. Immediately they put him back in the game. He comes back, gets a big block on Luke Cornyette.

Everybody on this team did their job, did their part, contributed as much as they needed to contribute. And you get a championship out of that. And so now this team stands in history and the NBA era of parity and not having, you know, back-to-back champions. us being in this time in NBA history and the Knicks building their team the way that they did, there's about three to four teams in the league now that are looking at really everybody's looking, but teams that are like close enough.

There's about three to five teams that are going to look at what the Knicks did and say, why not us? You know, we can go for it. They are going to change, especially with the second apron, they are going to change how you construct teams. And so when we get a year or two down the line, you know, Oh, I wonder if Mow's been talking about it a lot. I wonder if

AJ Mitchell can be our next Brunton. I wonder if Austin Reeves can be our next Brunton, right? Trying to figure out who can you find that's up and coming to now come in and lead your team and can we build a good culture around that and win a title. And you have this data

point now that tells you you can. You have this data point that now to now tell you it's not impossible to build from the middle without drafting at the top or without having some massive, massive, you know, A-list free agent come to your city. There's a few things there, I think, to unpack that all that's correct, right, that this team has some unique circumstances that can be probably replicated,

but in some ways probably not. The first conversation of things you named is the Brunson thing. Can we find the next Brunson? That's the one to me that's probably a little bit harder. I think Brunson might just be a once-in-a-generation hidden star that needed his opportunity. But we talk a lot about the league being the most talented it's ever been. It would not be shocking to me if you told me. an awesome Reeves fan that hopefully puts on a little more weight if we're going to use him

as a specific option. But like that type of guy goes to a team and like becomes a superstar, that's possible. I'm sure there's other opportunities like that for players around the league. That might just be a product of the league being more talented, like we said, or he's a once-in-generation guy who can't replicate that. There's a few things you can super replicate though. Trading for a lot of good players, finding wins on the margins, blowing up a team and using the rebuild assets we have to go trade for good players right away. OG was gotten for no picks for the prize of your previous rebuild and a cool late first round pick we found in quickly that being rjabird and quickly right making trades like that and just finding good players every single

deadline super replicable being a middle tier contender and making a run because you stay healthy and play the best version of yourself that's the part that's mega replicable in the second apron year if you tell me next year that's the timber wolves and they win despite being the fourth seed 100% believe you if you tell me that's who out east could that be that's uh the listen The Cavs have thought that they could be that team. Obviously, you go out and you get DeMitch and you have a highly drafted player. But in terms of somebody that is the four seed and is like, you know what, we can still do it. It's either them.

Orlando is going to continue to tell themselves over and over, right. Try to see if you can have your big draft capital trade in Desmond Bain. You got a little bit of value with Franz. You have your top pick in Palo. Can we put these things together? may be and they're going to go in with their new coach with Sean Sweeney and say why not us exactly and the part of that between cabs and Orlando you just mentioned and why they could be a good example to replicate this sticking it throughout the years losing getting further and further and further and then finally getting the final notch on your belt making the finals that's something you can see replicable throughout of teams everybody's always the instinct just to blow it up because a lot of times there's a team I need to blow it up because they're not going to make it that far sometimes you see a team like this that goes one more year and this is the year and this is the year they get it done, that's super applicable in a time where not only is your second apron thing, making it hard to go back to them back.

Injuries are at all time high. Every finals this year feels like it's dictated on which teams make it that far based on who stays healthy. Literally, why not you? Literally all things that happen is you are the team that plays their best and doesn't get hurt. Stick it through for one more year. Now, for the cast example, that would be nice to say before the trade Aries Garland. So now I don't know if I have hoping that James Hardin area, but that type of thing.

For sure, don't have hoping the James already. After today. If it was a garland era still, I'd like, literally why not you? You want 64 games. You went outside. You made the conference finals the next year. One more year you can make it that far. That's super replicable.

Yeah. This is, yeah, this is special. And because you talk about, like, you know, people having, you know, injuries every single year. And even, even this year, we talked, the Celtics were the favorites coming in. They got into a situation where they were in a game seven. And then all of a sudden, Tatum is out again for game seven. obviously very, very different circumstances because he's coming off the Achilles. If it was just a regular year, he probably would have played, we'll see.

But also, I'm not sure just because of how Tyrese, you know, went out last year. But so rarely, so rarely. And this is why, like, this specific season is so magical. And it means so much is because very rarely do have a team that has the opportunity right there front of them and they capitalize fully on the opportunity right like people the oh there's only one champion every single every single year and things happen all the time and how many times have we seen you know somebody be up to one and you have an opportunity to go up you know three one and really take control the series and then boom now it's two two and the whole series changes or you you

you miss you miss one shot you you forget two you make two mistakes on back-to-back plays and then all of a sudden you have this six-point swing in the third quarter of a playoff game and how the whole series is different, right? All that stuff changes constantly. And the Knicks were faced that and looked at straight in the eye being down to one to the Hawks.

And they completely said, you know what? We have to make sure that we don't waste the potential that we have. And they did it. And not a lot of teams actually accomplish that. Let's talk about, we're doing it.

We're capturing. this moment perfectly, right? Let's do a little bit of the legacy stuff and the history talk. Because this is such a significant team. Let's put our Bill Simmons hat on. We've seen random, quote-unquote, championships before, right,

that we didn't see coming before the playoffs started. I think people, well, obviously mentioned 2011 as a team that was a good team, but they weren't talked about as being in the inner circle contender. We expect them to win their conference, let alone be the super team heat, right? Yeah.

Same thing with the Knicks, that they're in the mix, they're a top three seed. We expect them to be able to make the final. that's in the air, we don't think they can beat the quote-unquote super team thunder or by the time we got the playoffs, super team spurs, right? That's a good comparison, I think. A lot of other people might mention the first Hakeem title with the Rockets.

That's the year they were the eight seed and won the championship, right? Sixth seed, I believe. 60 was the second year, I think. What was the year they were the eight seed? The eight seed? They were in the eight seed. Oh, 60. I'm thinking of 60.

Whatever. 60 when they were a lower seed and won, people might think about those type of teams. Those teams had Dirk, had Hakeem, had a all-time, great top 30 player of all time leading them. To not have that makes it feel so special. And I feel like that's why I feel so unique is that it's like like I mentioned earlier, not about Brunson only, though he is the finals MVP does get, we'll talk about his legacy and all this and stuff. The fact that we have this type of run without it being led by one superstar like that, the only thing I can think about is the 04 Pistons, that's a defensive team. So of course,

it feels different in his ethos. Yeah. To get that in this type of well-rounded two-way team that has star players, but not like one all-time great. I can't think of another version of that. There's always an all-time great that leads these Cinderella runs. I feel like it'd be like the 07 spurs of like no one ever believed in them or no one believed in them as much. Yeah, exactly. Like Duncan, you know?

Yeah, it's in Duncan. I mean, the answer to your question is they have an all-time great. Okay. Is that a combo? I think now like it's Isaiah Thomas and Steph Curry and is Jalen Brunson in terms of small guards that have led their teams to a, to a championship and have been the drive. driving force of what their team has done. I think, I mean, Jalen Brunson has been an all-MBA guy for, for, you know, his time in New York.

He's been, you know, all-star at the same time. Coming into the playoffs, there was, you know, you could have at this point, eight-minute cut-ups of clutch playoff Jalen Brunson scoring moments. and for him to have, for him to have the clutch going that he does for him to now have the title and the finals MVP to have four years in terms of a body of work. We can assume, let's just say,

hey, this goes on for another two years and we have a six-year window and a six-year prime of Jalen Brunson where you get a title, you get six all NBA selections, whether it be first, second or 13, whatever. All of that, that starts to move you up pretty high. on the list because not a lot of people have all of those accomplishments.

And so if the Knicks make it back to the finals next year or if they continue to have deep playoff runs, we'll see what happens. But this is, this is now, like they've done the hardest thing. You've gone out and you've gotten, you have the trophy. You have it. And so as we start building resumes, Jaylen Brunson's resume has a very, very strong foundation to start pushing your way up. Am I going to say top 30?

No, but we can start at, you know, 55, 50, right? And we can start pushing our way forward and really see how much we could push the envelope. Yeah, fourth straight year in a row averaging 27 plus points per game in the playoffs. His career averages in the regular season as a Nick, 26.3 points, 6.8 assists. That's funny, those are the averages. Whenever he was signing with the Knicks in that off season, that's pretty similar. I think it was 24 in the sample month to describe. that's pretty similar to the sample size we had

and he played games without Luca his last year of the Mavericks and we said if he can do this as a New York Nick is worth the money for them that was like 24 and 7 so what I'm saying is he's been precisely what you could have hoped for in the best case scenario

and even greater of the playoff performer like you mentioned 26 point per game playoff series left and right that's one of the greatest second round picks of all time that's the greatest bench player turned star I can remember I'm sure there's other deeper in history

that I'm not thinking of but literally the wilder wildest dreams you could have had for Jalen Brunson's career, we're seeing that. Yeah. And Kat, Kat's entire narrative changed today. The way that people are going to talk about Kat for the rest of his career is different now. Yep. And so that's done.

Mike Brown, a guy who was coaching, was coaching Braun, coach Kobe, got fired from both of those spots. You mentioned earlier, gets fired from Sacramento and continues to just build and build and build and get better and better and better as a coach. and now he has a title. OG, he wasn't there in 19 because he was hurt. But as he starts to ascend

and his game starts to grow even more, you have his standing in the league that's up there. And then now, Josh Hart also be, Josh Hart now gets into those like, you know, he's in the conversation now. When you start naming the best role players and stuff like that,

Josh Hart is going to be right there. And Mikhail Bridges, All of that is, you know, he plays every single game, the five first-on picks. Everybody's legacy is completely stamped tonight. And I can't feel happier for any of them. Also, two things. One, you know the rules. Jaylen Brunton finals MVP.

That's best player in the world. At least for the summer, right? When we do our next rankings, we'll see what it is. But for the summer, Jaylen Brunson is the best player in the world. At least for the next two weeks. Yep. And that means I don't want to hear a damn thing. Who's the best guard in the east?

Is it this guy? You know exactly who it is. It's Jaylon Brunson. It's talking to you, Pistons fans. I don't want to hear a damn thing about the Pistons fans. I don't hear all year. All year. Oh, my God.

Kate Cunningham is doing this. It's doing that. Yo, it's literally, it's levels to this. It's levels to this. And I don't want to hear anything. thing. You have to, you have to do this. And Jalen Brunson just did it. So he is solidified, obviously, as a top 10 NBA player. He is solidified as the best guard in, in the East. Listen, you want to have some conversation? He might be the best player in the East.

So there's, there's all of, all of that that we can talk about. But for tonight, and especially after this, we might have to go, we have to go, you know, pop some bottles tonight. Because I'm with how long we've been doing this? 35 minutes. 35 minutes. I'm getting antsy. So we might have to go out tonight.

All right. I'm going to name an NBA player. It's all me. I'm going to name an NBA player in the Eastern Conference. You tell me why Jaylen Brunson is better than them. Okay. Kate Cunningham. He's a much, he's a much better score and clutch score.

He does not turn the ball over as as much. You're saying a lot of words. And he's more steady. Just say he has a ring. That's fair. Yeah. Jason Tatum He has a ring too

He has the newer ring He has the updated ring So he's on the top right now Yeah So until Jason Tatum gets a ring newer Than 2026 championship Brunton's on top Yes

Also Brunson beat him In the playoffs last year Chain snatched What are you talking about You could have stopped At the first point man Yeah Just keep rubbing it in

Don't forget about that Donald Mitchell They were in combos for a long time Your chain has been snatched They were in convos for a long time We were just talking to a war at that point Yeah, Brunson's been past it.

A year ago, we were saying Brunson's better. Brunson was frying him when he was in Dallas. As a backup. As a backup. Ben, been frying him. Been frying him. Not even conversation. Not, no.

It's not close. Joel and Bede. Come on, man. Join him be, have fun at the World Cup, buddy. Palo MacCarras. We're still playing playoff games right now. And you're at the World Cup. There's levels to it.

There's levels to this. Palo Maciero. Come on, man. You are not there. Let me see you score 25 back-to-back games. Janus. Can you get back to the playoffs? Brunson's there.

Bruns is deep in the playoffs. He's completed the playoffs. He's never hyper-exemptive. There's literally no more games to play. One too many. One too many. La. Listen, steak too buttery.

Steak too juicy lobster too buttery. Let's go to the West. Who? Victor Wobinyama. We just, you just had your opportunity. trying to play dirty, try to throw elbows, put your foot under my foot, try to take me out the game.

Why don't you hit a free throw in the last two minutes, buddy? Why don't you learn not to turn the ball over in the last two minutes? Why don't you do that? Roll the ball out. That's all happened. That's what I'm saying. The ball was rolled up.

Why don't you stay grounded this summer? You're trying to or for him all the time. I'm in your head, boy. I'm in your head. He's going to be thinking about the Knicks all summer long. Brunton's in your head, dog. It's over. Kevin Durrett.

You bro. Just go argue with somebody. You go argue with people on Twitter, not with me. Not with me. Okay. Luca Donchage. As soon as I left, I came out, I got the ring. Right?

If I'm Jaylen Brunson, I won the chip in five. You lost the chip in five. You know? Hardware. You know what I'm saying? Hardware. I do have the ring. And again, I do have.

I have two rings. Two. Because I've, I got the double. I got the double. The Embers NBA Cup. Look, doesn't have any of those.

Nothing. Lucas never touched the NBA Cup finals. No MVP's. I got finals MVP. Damn. Laft. Yeah, out of here. Laft.

Listen, Jane of Brunson has been focused on winning championships. Luca Donchitz has been focused on winning PR battles in men's health. I'm taking Jaylon Brunson. look guys I'm fit now you sound like me what's you talking about

oh man where are we going to rank brunson we already viewed him as a top 10 player he's probably top five no you forgot a name no let's continue the activity oh yeah oh yeah SGA

oh SGA I was waiting for you in the finals dog what were you it was supposed to be you versus me I was a if I'm Brunson I'm looking at him I thought I was going to play Jordan

Now I have to play the role of Jordan this time Because you don't want to show up Because I'll do you a solid I'll be Jordan If you insist I guess But listen If I got to you

You better not skip it next year Don't skip it next year I'll be waiting for you Nicole Yokic I will squawing you every day And we roll the ball I don't care if you're 7 feet 8 feet tall You can't guard anybody

I'll fry you right now He's personifying I am He's stepping into the shoe He's just method. Because he's not He's not, he's,

because Jaylen Brunson is not going to talk like that. You have to do it for him. It's okay. You don't want to go talk about that? I don't know, I got a long summary. He does have a long summary.

He just getting feisty in those finals games. Might be a batter in his back. He might have some shit to say. Everyone's humble till they don't have to be, man. That's all I'm going to say, I tried to, I did try to tell y'all. D'A.

Fogg's, try to stare into into Jalen Brunson's eyes. I told you, you were looking into the eyes of a killer. And when I look back on the other side, when he look back on the other side, I can know you are not the one. You are not a killer.

You was bricking. Loudly. 40 minutes on the Knicks, we'll probably do 40 more after. Let's talk about the spurs. Man, before the season started, playing team on everybody's radar, right? I'm sure there are some people out there that had the foresight to know when people would become best in a world caliber and get them to a high seed. The masses pick them to be a playing-ish team, right?

Right? They come out, they show they are far better than that. They show they are the greatest threat, the Spurs, I mean the Thunder have seen in the run as a top team. They come out, they beat them, right? They make it this far in their first playoff run with the Victor Roman Yama leading the team. And Dylan Harper's first year as an NBA player in the first year, the Aaron Fox is on this team. Everything coalesces. They make the finals take down the big, bad future Dynasty 2B in the Thunder.

good year overall you can't take any big complaints with that right you overachieved nevertheless you make it this far expectations realign you were the favorites to beat the Knicks

heavy favorites I think we view them as a slight favorite obviously you withstanding being a Knicks fan me and Mo Beaswell I'm pretty sure you agree viewed them as a slight favorite we picked them in seven games or so damn sure didn't expect you to lose in five damn sure didn't expect

the Victor Woman Yama to have multiple terrible fourth quarter performances pretty much every game except the one they won was pretty bad in the fourth quarter whether he's missing big free throws not being able to be an assertive

downfield player not being able to create with a ball in his hands when he really needed to because they take away the pick and roll just generally not being the best player on the court

at all times, late games pretty much every time when we got to the fourth quarter we felt Jalen Brunson and the Knicks and the Knicks getting extremely comfortable being extremely confident, and the spurs are going the other way. Part of which, because Victor Womniama,

got the experience everybody said you would. First time at this big stage, you have a thing or two to learn, buddy. Welcome to your 07 Braun series. You're going to get beat down. Maybe he wasn't quite as bad as 07 Braun for his standards. He wasn't great. He wasn't playing up to the version of Wembu we saw in the last playoff round. That happened.

The Aaron Fox. You are going to have the worst summer of your life. That's true. I would worry for your safety for O'Fell. I'm not going on. Yeah, he was, he was three of 15 tonight. Everything the hit is said true. Legend of winning is the most validated man on the planet right now.

For tweeting in October, Deeran Fox is genuinely not needed. Whatever, there's a big game that Dylan Harper had before Deeran Fox came back from injury. He tweeted that, got harassed for months because Deer & Fox went on to be an All-Star, and they were just so good that the point was like, well, they can just have a bunch of good point guards, and it's fine, right? Here we are. He gets hurt in the last round, twist his ankle, plays through it, utter garbage in the finals.

And to say he was garbage in the finals might make you think maybe there's a chance he just played bad, right? Maybe there's a chance he just wasn't making shots and things happen. Sometimes we use words like ass, garbage, whatever, to just be a run-at-the-mill bad series. He makes $60 million a year

and he was not one-third the player of the rookie point guard. He makes $60 million a year. He was an active detriment for most of the minutes he spent on the court. He makes $60 million a year. He is 27 years old. He is supposed to be the smart, keep the ball in control, get the ball moving type of guy that while you have the young talented guards, you need to doll in the room.

He was at least matured on the court. He made the most mistakes. The most one-headed turnovers. Never mind, Stephon Castle was on this team, so I can't say that part. I retract that last sentence. He made the most decisions outside of Stefan Castle that were bad. He was the most inconsistent score that continued to have opportunities to score and did not make the buckets. Ms. Johnson continued to say you're going to have those opportunities.

Bad decision. I understand. you got here so far with him, you're not going to change things up now at the biggest stage. There's a reason you are where you're at. This sheer unwillingness to make any type of adjustment

when it comes to the Air and Fox's usage, that's why you lost the finals. There's plenty of things you point to. You lost because your $60 million point guard played absolutely poorly. Not any type of qualifiers there for a star player or anything. He was a negative player.

Yeah, once again, we're looking at the minutes tonight, Deer & Fox, 36.8 minutes, Dylan Harper, 31 minutes. on today, today's Saturday, on Thursday. Oh, these are a season average. Oh, series. Series.

That's even worse. What do you see? That's even worse because then that shows consistently over, over, over these five games that you time and time again went with Deer and Fox, which after, after game one, you should have known that Dillon Harper had to play as many, if not more minutes than Deer and Fox. And even tonight, right, Wemby starts out, has a couple, you know, good, good moments. The only person on the Spurs that's on go for real is Dillaharper, right?

Denver Vassell, Hooper, he played, he's, you know, role player, whatever, he's doing his job. But in terms of the guys that you are reliably looking to score, Dillard Harper was ready to play. Defon Castle was one for 10 tonight. DeAren Fox was 3 of 15. Wembe was 7 of 19. we've been it's probably about an hour you know post game i hope everybody shower because they all pissed down their leg time it it reeked and stinky smells crazy in san antonia somebody smell yeah yeah for real and i just i think if you're if you're miss johnson

this is he's he's part of it he's part of this young core of hey you have to go through it to to learn and to get better and so like i don't think mitch jonson this is he's he's part of it he's part of this young core of hey you have to go through it to to learn and to get better. And so, like, I don't think Mitch Johnson, like, there's going to be some people that overreact and be like, oh, is Mitch Johnson the guy? Like, he should be fired or whatever. Like, that's not, I'm not going to go that far. But for this team, and as they move forward, this is definitely a series where they will

all look back on it and they will all look and see things that they can do better, things that probably should have happened and areas that they can execute. I mean, Wembe, who is a really, really good, good frito shooter, missed two fritos you know, clutch, missed two Fritos down the stretch in game four, missed Fritos again tonight, Deer and Fox. Every time he put up a shot, I was scared just because I was nervous about the game, but anybody else watching that game is,

as soon as he puts the shot up, you're like, oh, that's off, right? And it's really, really tough when you get into one of these moments and the rest of your bench isn't going. They had, they had like 20-something bench points. Dillon Harper was basically, Dylan Harper was 90% of the bench points. Everybody else got maybe a layup here or there. But it's really Dillon Harper and that's it.

So when nobody else is helping to contribute, then I don't know like where they were supposed to go. And even then, even then, they were still up 15. And once again, poor execution down the stretch of the game, bad decisions, Dylan Harper going to the room super fast, 26 seconds left after a miss shot. It's a two point game. D.R. Fox fouls.

There's no need to foul. that in that situation. I genuinely don't understand why he did that. I still don't know. Normally when things that happen, I can explain to you what he was thinking, why they would plan on doing that, why I disagree. I have no fucking clue why they intended to do that. I guess it's because if they ran the full 24 out,

there would only be three seconds left and they want to have more time than that, you know? But you didn't even try to press. Yeah. Anything like that. It was such a quick foul. And so from your guards, you have, you have something very, very serious this off season where the guard rotation has to be figured out in terms of who's playing

and that's a Mitch Johnson thing. And then on the player side, Stefan Castle has to get better, right? D.M. Fox has to, whatever, whatever was wrong, he has to get better. Dylan Harper, even as good as he played in this series, the next time that we go into next, season and you do have the keys, yes, the slashing is amazing. But if you are the full-time point guard, you're going to have to playmate. you are going to have to shoot a little bit better. You are going to have to add some stuff to your game.

So there's across the board things that everybody can work on and the series exposed that for a lot of them. And I know you were hating on the Spurs because you felt like they were speed running through their art. Yeah. You can't speed run through a lot of these things. Yeah. There's only one team that's done it.

And that was basically right after the merger. Yeah. It doesn't happen. You're talking about the Trailblazers? Yeah. And even the Thunder. last year who were the youngest champion post trailblazers. They got whacked the series

the season before by the Mavericks in which while it counts, the Thunder should have won that series. But Jada wasn't ready for the moment. Chet wasn't ready for the moments. They lost the series. Here we are. And it's rare that it happens in the finals, especially when you beat the Thunder. It's such a strange thing to talk about now because on one hand, some people look at the series how it plays out.

They were up by 15 tonight. They're up by 29 in the game prior. And the other two losses, I don't know the exact number was their biggest lead. They got like 14 point leads, 13 point leads. Something like that. Every single game, in the second half, I think, for all these games, they had double-digit leads, blew them all. And every single one felt the same.

Every single fourth quarter, Jalen Brunson got to being his most comfortable, when it mattered most, was his most agile, his most difficult to stay in front of, his most composed, making these crazy layups, drawing these fouls, all these things, while the spurs completely started sputtering. they looked like they had to force every single bucket. Nothing came easy. It was so hard to get to a consistent wimpy shot because you got to set him up

and they were selling out and stopping him at the rim. The shooters weren't shooting well enough. The guards didn't have the in-between game. Whatever it is, right? Whatever we just ascribe to be the main reason for their fourth quarter meltdowns, those same reasons you ascribe happened every single time. So you can look at that and say,

Young team versus Clutch team that's been here before kind of makes sense, right? they beat the defending champs. They beat the Timberwolves. They got here and we weren't talking about them being a young team. In fact, we were talking about them being a team that clearly we don't got to talk about the youth anymore because they've proven that they can walk into OKC, one of the best home court advantages in the league,

one of the best home court advantages in sports even, and beat them handedly in a game seven and not really be struggling like that. So we don't need to talk about it. So the question is, do we just cut them this general explanation that they're a young team and it makes sense this happened? Or do they not deserve that bail out? Because they've shown they're above that and we need to just say you play terribly.

So going into game four, I would say, yeah, you might be able to cut them that bail because when we had the quote after, it was either after game one or game two where he was like, I think I didn't do a good job of responding to the high after the conference finals. And a lot was made of their celebration post-conference finals

and, you know, people were like, yo you know there's another series to play and you guys are are crying on the court and showing all of this emotion like don't don't get too caught up in this specific moment because you still have the Knicks on the other side who are playing as well as anybody can play and I think in the first two games you you did see that and so I would I you can have use there game game three you go out you execute towards the towards the end of of the game and that game kind of followed like the same script they were actually down seven at half time and came back you won the game cool game four is that's the one where everything flips and now you

look at this entire team and you look at the series and the way that they lose all of these games and you say yeah you guys are young and you are also at the same time dumb and so you can be young and dumb and this is just a combination and maybe you get smart whenever you get a little bit of this experience, but it's all, it all blends together a little bit. So I think if you're making this a mutually exclusive thing, that's a wrong thing to do. Yeah. Um, but we definitely, we definitely see the, the holes and things for every single one of those players, even Wembe, the number one thing everybody is is going to talk about is you have to get stronger. You have to work on your conditioning, right? Um, so there's, everybody has their checklist. Everybody has their marching orders now.

And going into next year, it's going to be super interesting because OKC is not going to be, hopefully, OKC might not be down to ball handlers in the playoffs. And you never know. You know, like, I don't, I don't know. Never heard a lot when it matters. But just, but just barring injury, the other team that you are probably going to have to go, that you're going to have to go through, at least in a longer series, you might have to face something that you still haven't seen. You just haven't seen a fully healthy OKC. I think the OKC thing is we're talking about for a couple of reasons. To the point of like, do they deserve to bail from a young team?

Do they deserve to say, you show you beat OKC? Maybe one takeaway is OKC just without J. J.M. A.J. Mitchell, a lot worse than we thought. And maybe that just wasn't quite the stamp to disprove all doubts that it was treated as, which is going to be true like that at the moment. They made the finals. How are you not going to be like, bet you proved it? maybe we look back and say that team was just a lot weaker than we thought

and the next team are just a notch above them and at a certain point the youth shows up when the quality of the opponent is that great, right? On the other hand, we thought there's no chance. That's the wrong verbiage. We were very confident that Thunder were going to have a long run where they make the finals consistently, right? Injuries came in and said,

nah, this is the modern NBA, pace and spaces up. Everybody gets hurt. You are no different. It's just hard to make three straight, deep playoff runs and not have soft tissue injuries derail you. Is the conversation around the spurs being they'll obviously make it back? How do we treat them in that reality where the injuries are clearly proven that even young nucleus is? It's hard to make deep runs every single time and hope everybody stays healthy.

I think we kind of have to redefine what being back means in this era. Exactly, yeah. The ability to, or the expectations to go back to back years in the finals is lofty in this era. But if they come back in maybe even three years, I feel like that's the course of just teams now. Like that should be the expectation of regular contenders in this area. Exactly. It's not make the finals every year.

That's not the new version of a dynasty, I think, that we're hoping the Spurs can be and the Thunder can be is more like what the Spurs were in the 2000s and 2010s where you just have a huge chunk of years. We can't even call it the same way as them because they're also a one-off how long it was. Call it eight years of being a contender-level team. Hopefully you can make the finals half of those.

years, but they will be in and out. And that's the pathway now is that I would like to say I'm up here and say, oh yeah, the Spurs are for sure going to be back. Dylan Harper year two, Castle Year 3, there's only up from here, which is true. The expectation to me isn't like be back and win it next year. So I'm saying all to say,

end of the day, we can give you all the slack for being a young team and understand how you got here still blew a huge fucking opportunity and that stinks. We haven't talked enough about that. As a Spurs fan, all these caveats aside, you were in the finals against a team you were favored to beat against the team you were better than in the regular season in pretty much every way.

You're a 62 win team facing a team that we, the Spurs, the Knicks still have these flaws that we're not going to talk about because they made history, made it happen. A big part of that is the spurs, like the teams before them leading this run, weren't capable of exposing the flaws to Knicks in any meaningful way. Actually, never mind, they were until the fourth quarter came and then they weren't. You were up double digits every single game. You should feel horrible for blowing this opportunity. You should feel horrible.

feel fucking horrendous. Well, that's what I'm saying. I can't even give them the young excuse simply because, one, 29 point lead. Exactly. That's not a young, oh, we're just a young team. That's why we blew a 30 point lead in the second half. I can't give you that. You're class A chokers.

Yeah, that's what I'm saying. And the next game, and y'all were hearing me throughout the whole game while we were watching, bro, no way they're doing it again. No way they're doing it again. And they did it again. Like, there's certain things that are like, you get traumatized so much. Just not going to let it. happen to you again.

And you let it happen to you again. You know what it is? It's that those memes about Donald Trump when they're like, surely old Donnie will not wiggle his way out of this controversy again. Surely they got him this time. That's the Knicks.

Surely they won't find a win erase this lead again. They always do. And the Spurs fans had to deal with that for five straight game. Y'all don't understand. We got the craziest plot armor in the game. That's what it is.

We've had an insane plot armor. But also, I can't give them the young excuse when Deeran Fox is such a big, reason that's to why they've been losing and he's like 28 years old. Okay. So yes. So yes. And we, trust me, we are going to get all the Deerran Fox Slander off. But also like coming into the playoffs, it's seven games of postseason, you know, experience. Yeah. He's also for basically new to this as well. He's never been to the finals. he's never been to the conference finals.

And even those seven games, right, it might have went different had he not broken his finger. But Sacramento had a game seven in their building and Seth Curry walked him down, not even walking down, Seth Curry just did what he does. And he had 50 on the road. And they weren't able to compete in that thing.

And so for Spurs fans, like the missed opportunity, that's the worst part about it. Because now that you don't win, you look at your team and you take a step back and you're like, dang, we really have a lot of stuff. up to work on. Yeah. Like, we really have to upgrade the bench.

Shout out Luke Cornett for everything that he did in the regular season. Could not play in the, in the finals and in the postseason. You need somebody else who, who, you need somebody else in that spot in your, in your big man role. You are looking at your coach and like, dang, the coach needs to step up as, as well. Like, they have, they have a lot more holes than, than you would have thought for a team that, you know, in their words, was dictating the outcome of every game. game. So I think for Spurs fans and for them trying to take a step back and take stock of

what you actually have is going to be super important because as we, we're talking about San Antonio in the context of them versus OKC for the next five years. OKC just got bounced and we've talked about their roster construction and the way that their role players, you know, lean more defensively to offensively. They, I promise you, Sam Presti is looking at, he has three whiteboards and is looking at every single player that's available and everybody that's, you know, potentially available, all of that. Everybody else is going to try to level up and it is on you now to do the exact same thing.

Yeah. And try and I, we're talking about what, what does getting back mean? I do think that probably getting back means conference finals and playing for the opportunity to get to the finals. Yeah. I think that's kind of what it means in, in the modern era. Yeah. Because you can't, you know, you can't guarantee a finals appearance, but if you can just

give yourself a chance, and that's probably it. I think, I think that's what makes this next run so special, in my opinion, is because, like, over the last couple of years, there have been a couple of teams that kind of throw in this parody era of like, yo, this is going to be the team that's going to be a dynasty, that being the Thunder, that being the Spurs. Got to win one. I'm not going to lie. I know it's kind of laughable now, but the Celtics,

when y'all got McHale and Carl Anthony Towns and all of them, the conversation was, yo, this is going to be the team that's built to beat the Celtics. No, it's not awful at all. Yeah. And y'all did. They got old, but you're right. Yeah.

And y'all did. And I think that's one of the most more impressive parts of this is, like, in this era that there were teams that could have been super teams and dynasties. Y'all got one through. Y'all weren't scary throughout this whole process. The Knicks are dynasty killers. they killed dinosaurs before they begins I like that

because I have no expectations that Nick's being a dynasty I like that which is not an insult that's not to say anything about this Nick's championship being not impressive at all but I enjoy not having to think about

is just going to be a five-year run like it's cool that we don't have to have that conversation for real and we can just talk about the fact of what you just said that these are the motherfuckers that stopped that from happening that is a cool arc to have in history

yeah like y'all y'all weren't scary at all it's kind of like when in 2017 18, when the Rockets got Chris Paul, even though the Warriors were these juggernauts, hey, we have a guy, we are contenders year and year out. Let's try to win a championship, even though the Warriors still exist. Like, that's kind of what this championship is feeling is like.

Even though the Spurs, the Celtics, and the Thunder exist, we got an opportunity, we got a core, we got a nucleus, we got an error right now. Let's try to maximize it. Fuck all the noise. You're trying to, like, riz him up right now because you just told him that Jalen Brunson did exactly what James Harden tried to do and failed. Oh, wow. You're whispering in his ears, sweet lovings.

Hey, man. But to stay on the topic of the Spurs, while we're still finishing out their section, obviously the biggest question now will be what to do with the Deerrin Fox situation. What the fuck do they do? I don't even know. We'll say the same thing I said last week.

If they could trade Deeran Fox today for another high quality player of similar stature that rebalances a roster and allows you to start Harper while maybe getting a power forward-sized body next to Wemby, that would be ideal. If Jaron Jackson was known on the Grizzlies and they want for some reason,

which doesn't make sense because Joe, whatever. But if there was a Jaron Jackson type available and you could just swap him out one for one with Deeran Fox, beautiful. Our problems are all solved. I don't know that it's that easy. I do think teams probably won't overreact too much to his performance in this playoff series

because the ankle probably is a real thing that we're not going to give him that slack because it's the finals and life is life. You're going to get slandered. He didn't look the same as he did in the regular season. So I don't think he's going to be like worthless because teams know he was dealing with injury and was playing in a,

offense that kind of deprioritize his counting stats, you know. So I don't think he's worthless. I do think that his contract is fucking gigantic. And in the second apron age, we've seen better players or as good of players have a hard time finding a market because it's just tough to pay people with that size contracts if they're not going to be reliably the guy. And the Spurs are in position to give him that contract because it wouldn't be so cheap for now and their other players are so cheap for now.

So it makes sense for them to pay Deer and Fox, assuming he is regular season, Deerrin Fox caliber. I don't know that any team is going to give you a Jaron Jackson type of asset right now if you do put Deer & Fox in the market. The only teams I can think of that have the space and they have a need for a Deerrin Fox type

and that would somewhat make sense would be like a Brooklyn who is just trying to trying to get themselves going. Because if you're a contender and you're paying somebody $60 million, dollars, yo, you need them to be the guy. Real quick.

What's up? I feel a tremor. I feel an earthquake coming. I feel heavy footsteps that is distracting me from our conversation by the air and Fox. I feel forehead. Hey! We're champions.

Hey. Hey, listen. Us and C.J. McCollum. We're a champion. You know, I like the way he worded that. Listen, I said earlier, C.J. McCollum's getting a ring. Because y'all took the most games off of the champions more than anybody else. We did.

So the Hawks, the Hawks had the best playoffs showing against the Knicks this entire time. What chapter you on right now? We're covered pretty much everything. We're on the end. We're trading the air fox. Wait, to where? Why? I said, I said to Brooklyn. Okay, wait.

I hope you guys didn't do too much on it because you. you have to remember, he did come from Sacramento. So I was going to say that the only teams honestly are Brooklyn and Sacramento. Yeah. Set him back. So we spent about 40 minutes talking about the Knicks and how special the moment is. You missed the soliloquies about their moment.

You're a funny guy, man. We're talking about the screen. Because we're an hour in, bro. I wanted to make an appearance when I had to. I had responsibility. We're talking about the spurs now and the takeaways and how the runway might not be as audits. and Maddoch to get back and it was still

a little bit of opportunity despite their youth. So that got to the conversation of what do they actually do about Darren Fox? You've sent one message in the past hour in the group chat since like you said you were busy and it was a derogatory message about Darren Fox that which I will not repeat. What do you think they should do?

What did he say? I forgot. Lock him in the room, summer. Put him in a classroom with like the most rudimentary basketball teacher you can think of. I don't know. Someone like, B ball breakdown or something like that He'll break down things like real

simple way put him in like Don't put him in AAU Nah fuck that maybe a little bit too advanced Put him in like I don't know we need to get fundamentals down also too Plus give him so he needs surgery Some type of surgery with his angles or whatever Fuck too

Oh fundamentals awful coaching All that I remember that hell no Put him in the room with the worst person you know And make him suffer Man, it's just so storybook. It's just so storybook how the season ended for him, bro. And also how Dylan Harper performed this last game.

Yeah, so I've repeated the same thing we talked about last time that in an ideal world, you'd just trade him one for one for a power forward of a lower level all-star caliber. If that's not going to be available, I guess you could consider breaking up his contract and trying to get role players back. I hear PJ Washington's available. I hear Daniel Gafford's available. Maybe Deere Fox or the Mav is for their role players. Like it could make sense to give a point.

guard next to Cooper flag. Maybe they want to pick a wing in the draft instead of one of the second tier guards they can have. Maybe something like that is possible, whether it's the maverish or somewhere else. I'm sure there's a team that would like Darren Fox for our middle tier players, right?

That's possible. You might just have to roll with him for one more year and not sell low. And I guess Bench him for Dylan Harper and your two or just make Dylan Harper Monu and hope he's okay with that. It's a weird conundrum they're in.

Gap year spurs, here we go. That's disgusting. So the good news is they can still get really good and still get back here with the Aaron Fox. Yeah, yeah, yeah. We're talking about all this, how to make the best case scenario to get off of him. The reality is they can keep him on the team and still get better. They're not an expensive team yet. They're still all making rookie contracts.

They can go out there and make moves in free agency, make trades happen, keep the Aaron Fox and hopefully get rid of him years late. Like the next summer or the summer after that, they don't have to offload him, which is at least a decent caveat. Do you all think the Aaron Fox is willing to take a smaller role next year? Who is the fuck? Yeah. At this point Who gives me a fuck What Deer Fox thinks

At this point Yeah it doesn't matter I mean like I do think near Fox It'd be better So I'm not Like Who gives a fuck

I think it'll be better And I do think he's not We're judging him At least point All regular season he was good The series took away His free will I do think he's back

To being a good player Sims character I think if he's at the point where he's contending to play poorly Which I don't necessarily think he will I think he would back To be regular season near Fox NBA not just, we won't be talking about him as an asset.

We'll be saying that's a good player. I'm not selling stocking Deering Deer and Fox. But if Dylan Harper, it continues to rise and is playing, like the future All Star we think he can be next year, I do not care about the preferences of Deer and Fox with that being the opposite turns momentum. The reason why I ask is, I feel like a lot of the players that we slander, typically it's purely because they're underperforming for their role.

But if we switch up his role, if he truly does accept Six-Man Deeran Fox, Let Dylan Harper and Stefan Castle be the starting guards And he's the six-man Can you have a six-man making $60 million? No, you can't And that's the problem For one year maybe, I don't know

Yeah, for one year, I guess, it doesn't matter That's the problem is that And for one year, I mean, fine You also have a new case trade value though if you do that Yeah, we'll test it out I mean, listen, I don't know how low either of these guys is I don't know, listen, I have not ran anything Fox and a pick for Katie

No that's that's Fox and a pick for Katie That's super possible for sure That's not bad I think I would actually consider that You know because like From the Rockets I'm telling you to kick fucking bricks Obviously

However Everybody on the Rockets hates Kevin Norek And so this is assuming That you need a point guard Yeah this is assuming that That their situation is untenable And that nobody on the team Rocks with him

He has to get out of here And if you're the if you're the Spurs you go, you get a wing who can, who can score. He doesn't have to be, you know, a defender in the way that he needs to be because you have Wembe so you can cover him up just a little bit. And you're not, you're not so reliant, obviously, on D.R. Fox's offense or on Stefan Castle, you know,

and his offense growing. Because I do think that going into next year, as we talk about them, you know, we always talk about year two, year two leave, year three leave, whatever. It is a lot to ask for everybody to just go up three overall points and everybody's offense gets better and everybody becomes a great shooter. Like we're probably going to get to a point next year where that's one of them is going to be the same.

I'm glad you mentioned that. Yeah. That's a good point. Katie might be available. Katie or not, that is a good point that we cannot assume linear progression for all these young players, right? So I'm saying this to say, I will not, I don't think we'll see what happens for both these teams and free agency.

If the rosters are the same today, which is a bad assumption, but it's just, humor that. If the roster stay exactly the same for both these teams, I don't think I'll go into next year picking them to make the finals over the thunder. Okay. Just inherently off of progression and players getting better in the next year, right? I think I will default to a healthy thunder. I'm still thinking as a better team. Don't hold me to that, but for now I'm feeling that way. And the only thing, which is why I want to pivot this question to is how does Wembe factor into that? And what do we take away about Wemby from the series? Because we touched on his late game performances. Is he best point in the world? I think he's,

we had that feeling end the last round. Shea had a bad performance. Wembe had a bad performance. Yoke Che a bad performance. All these players, Luca didn't, wasn't healthy enough to make a run so we don't know about him. Yannis has always hurt. All these guys have their flaws in caveat, so there's no person holding the crown. Do we feel like what I just said about the Thunder potentially being the better team

and linear progression not being relied upon? Is that just shut up by Wembe becoming the clear-cut best player? We're going into year four, Wembe, who made. made the finals in his third year, which is absolutely crazy. And the simple, like, linear progressions that they all could have needed really is, like, Wembe having nailed down certain things within his offensive game and being able to control the pace and the tempo and all that. Now, I know and I understand it's hard for bigger guys to do that.

The only guys offensive you do that in NBA history are guys like Yolkits and shit like that. But honestly, like, the linear growth and what we expect when it comes to what's missing for this team, Wembe just simply straight up should be the answer at all costs. Now, besides that, would that be enough considering what a healthy O KC look like depending on what they do when it comes to the exterior things and how they decide to upgrade their roster of shooters and what a new chat look like? And I don't know, that's TBDS too much for me.

But Wembe, if he's on that level and the goat trajectory, then he should be like the easiest simple answer. Yeah. Well, we talked about earlier. He's out of the goat conversation. he has a final ball. That's over with. You'll never be Mike.

I'm sorry. I can't do it. But honestly, I think a shortcut on, like, not I'm thinking about, I wouldn't even if Katie's there, sure, why not try to go go that route? But me personally, you have all your picks. On top of that, you have Atlanta Hawks, 2027 pick if I remember correctly. Unload the clip and get Janus. Why the fuck not?

Speed run through this bitch. De Nair Fox makes all the money in the world. Yon is just too, obviously. Make yourself unbeatable. Be this. Aero's like complete villain. Do it. What's stopping you?

The fact that you probably got to give up you to Castle or Harper. Nah, can't do that. Then you're not getting honest. No, Fox and Fox and like a lot of picks up should be enough. I guess if you give like every single pick you can possibly offer. Exactly. Don't Carter, Bryant. Maybe that'll be making it.

I'm excited for what? I need this person to stay away from my bombshell, man. Yeah, I'd rather see myself. But yeah, so I think to your point, when we'll be becoming the player that we hope he can be next year that can end the combo when we becoming the clear-cut legend that we know he's going to be that could be that could be what the Spurs need right

that everything else is extra right now is he the best player in the world if we do if we did a best if we did a top 30 player in the world ranking a week from today would you rank him one after what you saw and the flaws in his game no I don't I don't think I would because I think I

the late game stuff is is I think I'm not going to ding him specifically for the late game stuff, but I am going to ding him because I think the late game stuff happened because of flaws in his game that I, that I think other people don't necessarily have. So you think the floor raising he brings as a defender and everything that that does doesn't outweigh the offense of a Yoko-Tur-Shay? Right, right now, maybe, maybe not. So certainly it's certainly fair. It's hard. I feel like truthfully, all of them are probably tied.

And if there was like a legitimate belt in like one spot, then the belt would just be in purgatory right now. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Like that's how it would be. I don't think anybody has it right now. But especially with, with Shea and the way that She was able to perform in game seven,

I feel like that was a good bounce back to make sure that he's, you know, obviously still tied with it. Yolkech's horrendous series in the first round going out sad like that, but we still know what what Yokic can bring offensive to a team. So it's, it's different. And I don't know if one is, is, obviously, if you put him one, fine, whatever, I don't care. Does all this just like Pemdos into Yokich don't mean the best player in the world? I mean, potentially, I wouldn't think, I won't call you crazy for that.

But like, going back to what you said, all these guys are real weaknesses. And there's only certain amount of things, there's a certain amount of things that they literally cannot do on the, on either side of the floor. When it comes to Yokic, can't defend for his life, when it comes to shake, he can't guard, Rwimby, he can't grab every single rebound. He can't get every single seal. He's a guard right at the end of the day. He does a lot, but there's only so much it can do. When it comes to Wemby as well, he can't close games every single time because he doesn't have the ball in his hands every single time.

He's not dictating players or making decisions or calling guys to set out. He's not doing that. There's only so much he can do. But if you want to give the crown to him, I'm not going to be mad because I go into the conversation next year projecting. And that's how, like, steerhead the Wimby the best player in the world because he has, of course, experience now. He has the greatest defensive floor fucking all time and all that.

You can call Wembeah and that and that's fine. You won't, I think it'll be probably hardest to make an argument for some like shape potentially. If it was, if this was wrestling and I was scripting it, you'd have those three fighting for it. Yeah. All of a sudden, it's like, what is that? And then Ant just comes flying down.

We get a leap from it. And then now he's in the combo as well. Like, I think those, those four. And then obviously, like, Yonis, if he could, you know, stay healthy or just be in a regular basketball situation, we'll see what. happens. Fuck Luca. Yeah, he's good.

Damn. He has an opportunity. It's been, it sucks because he did get hurt right before the playoffs and like. And he was heating up, man. We were thought, I thought we were bringing a run. He's just like, he's literally in, not in every single way this generation's hardened, but in terms of like NBA hierarchy, no one's ever going to look at choose the best band NBA.

What? All right. Now they're here. No one does that. We're not being used to this. No one's doing that. This is a Webby conversation. You know what?

Let's be honest. But you know what? Listen, again, we can have this conversation later in the summer because right now Jalen Brunson is the best player in the world. All right. Yeah. He has the title. Whatever.

I think we all agree. And it's only fitting, actually, that we're at the height of the parody era. Nobody repeats. I guess we're at the parody era for best player in the NBA too. That is wide open and to each their own, which I don't think it's a coincidence. I think part of it is just Wembe's at this point of his career and trajectory that he's not ready yet when he's. He's clearly the next guy.

But I think it's not a coincidence that we're at a point that the parity error is partially more talented teams, injuries. Defensive schematic right now are as good as have ever been. We've really seen defenses catch up and being able to game plan for these superstars and make their lives hell. We don't see Steph Curry walking to drop coverage every play now. We don't see LeBron being able to get an easy switch every time and attack a mismatch. Teams are incredibly smart at taking away what your best player does and making you beat them as a team. That's why being deep matters more than ever now. Kind of makes sense that all of our best players

are seemingly getting the chinks in their armor ripped apart and pinpointing all the weaknesses. And now we feel like all these guys are flawed. They're probably not that much more flawed than goat players of the past. We're just in that air now where these things that are really, really focused on. Maybe that's just a league now.

Maybe. But you also, I mean, for Wembe, you had four games. The Spurs as a whole, four games of losing the exact same way every single time. And you had bad performances. And, yeah, you had bad, moments every single one of those losses. And so for for wemby, I think it is really important. And this is what whenever we did our offensive player rankings, as great as wimby is

defensively, we know that he's won and nobody's really close. We all had him, you know, 12, 15. There still is a big jump for him to make to get into the top 10 of offensive players in the in the world. And so that's something that, that he has to figure out this off season and this summer and really, really find where on the floor he wants to go. And I, the one thing that I will say, that's not just like being dumb,

but is like kind of the young part of Wembe, talk about all the time. He loves to Oro Farm. Yep. And there's so many times where, where you can see Wembe want to go for the kill. you can see when we want to have this very grandiose moment. And sometimes that's not necessarily the shot or the thing that you need to do.

And so I think as we progress in his career and you start to get a sense of how to not only understand the moment, but, you know, but really control it and control your emotions. Yeah, dictate it. Yeah. And dictate those things. That would be an improvement that I am really, really certain that we will see from when we're going into next year. He was with the monks during the summer last year. He got to go back. I don't know.

Is there like a level above the monks? I think I need to go the other way. I'm going to get with the bloods. Get with the bloods and the cramps. I don't think he needs that honestly. He doesn't. He doesn't. He doesn't.

He does. He does. So we did our whole thing about the Nicks, whole thing about the Spurs. This is the last day of the season. Wow. Season's over. Tough. What do you guys feel like?

What should take away from this season? What to find this season? Now that it's a rap's, team back. Nick's obviously being part of it, Spurs being part of it, the Thunders, failure to go back to back being part of it, whatever it is to you, how do we define this season? That's an hour over.

I think, I think, I think it's a turn of a new era for me personally. Because like, you see someone who, we've been, for the last few years, who's the best player in the world? Who's the face of the NBA? Like, the guys are here

and also we're in a new era where there's going to be like, not, in my opinion, not a singular face of NBA like a LeBron or like Jordan. There's going to be like a multitude of dudes who are running this shit because of depth and how going back to what you said, these teams are literally like tactfully designed to pick apart your star players like never, ever before. Turned new era when it comes to that. Whole small guard talk.

I'm sure you're all talked about it already. There's like so many holes now that can be poked into that argument. Also on top of that too, youth really, it matters. of course, we've seen it, but youth and the experience isn't the end-all be-all when it comes to why a team should fail. So I think this is like a complete turn, turn of a corner when it comes to so many things like that that we want to believe in entering this NBA season. So much just like disproven.

Yeah. I think, yeah, I think for, for, maybe not for like going on into next season, but for this season specifically, like, imperfection doesn't mean bad. You know, I feel like there were a lot of teams that we looked at all seasons. long and we were harping on specific flaws that they had and it's like you know they have this one problem they have this one problem and sometimes i could at least for me feel like i can get caught up in like the the specific flaws of a team and you forget oh but they also do like x y and z well and they they still do have a chance i think for for the nicks especially when you're talking about

you know oh you can't you can't win a championship when when you have a guard and in a center that are this bad defensively. It's like, one, obviously, like, can't play better, but you can have other pieces around them to insulate and to insulate them and play better. Like, there are, it's okay to be, to be flawed. No team is ever going to be fully perfect, but you do have to still make sure

that you have superpowers to overcome those things. Super, super duper powers, because Brunza is just one of them ones. Yeah. I'm sure you all already had the conversation too. And, like, I think a lot of NBA players too. I said he was top 15 all time. I don't care what you said

You got it honestly Like when you do shit like that It's like you can say literally anything I'll believe you could tell me like You can tell me he was in the Bible I believe it right what? Like after the shit he pulled Yeah

In Bretton and basketball Might as well dude He can do anything Yeah I think Yeah I think the main takeaways I just talked about A couple minutes ago About the parody era quote on quote

And what that really means And how it pertains to The Best Point in the World Convo and the cat just did some crazy shit and the flaws of stars being poked at I think that's the main takeaway from basketball this year and from this whole playoff run

is that teams are so smart now and I just think we're past the point at least I'll say this until when we change these things potentially in the coming years I think we're past the point of the best player in the world completely dictating the league in the way that LeBron making all these finals in a row Jordan winning all these championships in a row

I just think we're this season really personifies the fact that those days are gone and that even if Wembe is as good as LeBron James one day, which is obviously we're far from that conversation. Even if he does that, I just don't think we're going to see the ability for one player to completely strangle the league like that and be the guy that's in the finals every single year.

Whether it's injuries, whether it's schematic becoming so high level, every single coach being such a genius, there are so many coaches from back in the day that are just vibes guys and rely on their staff and they are just there because they're leaders of men, like head coaches in football to have the coordinators, that is seemingly going extinct. You have to be a very, very well-coached team X's nose

to make these deep runs. Mike Brown did genius stuff. Mitch Johnson for all the criticism he got. Did a great job maximized this roster this year. We know what Mark Dagnall has done. Joe Mozilla has done. Teams are very, very smart now in all regards. Front offices are 20 times as smart as it used to be.

The amount of stupid trades and stupid jams is dwindling. Only the Pelicans got one these days, seemingly. the bulls got rid of theirs. Everything is getting higher level. And I think the new thing is just all the pieces matter. Not just the biggest piece. That being the superstar. It's not a go-stack stars league anymore.

We know big threes don't work. It's not that big threes don't work. It's just that stars aren't everything anymore. Man, all I heard was LeBron James Legacy is 100% preserved forever. Put that bitch in a time capsule, man. All the pieces matter now. We're in a pieces over the queen chess piece type of league. Now we're not on that anymore.

Also, I'll say this, basketball's in a great place, y'all. Basketball's in a great place. I think that's my takeaway from this season. It's been a lot of conversation over the last couple of years. Oh, is the NBA dying? All these ratings conversations. The face of the league conversation is a part of that conversation. We're good.

100%. And what that means is all the fans out there on Twitter specifically, don't let the Republican Twitter rage bait you into thinking basketball is a dying sport because it's the Black League and they have to hit on. it and do all these things about the league being woke and all this shit basketball is in a great spot the tv ratings are high which you shouldn't have cared about to begin with but those are doing good the quality of basketball is good the judgments they've made to the league are good the quality of players and teams everything about it is in a good spot yeah man and the nix of champions

and the nix and champions and the nix and champions and that doesn't contribute to the health of the league we have teams that are likable we had a little drought because we were just like in between eras, everything's up right now as far as future stars rising, big markets winning, Knicks fans being there happy, it's a good year. Think about the quality of this season

compared to 2023 when the Nuggets beat the heat in that war-gast final. Oh my God, that was so nasty. And we were talking about the three points, the pace is all too bad, nobody's playing defense. Past two years, they've been letting defend...

They've been letting the fuck out that cat daddy right now, man. They've been letting defenders beat the fuck out of each other for the past two years, and that's been good for playoff basketball. You got to let him fight? Adam Silver,

you have this moment until we have the next draft lottery comes and we start to hate everything you do again for now you put together good product this man also listen you got lucky that the next one today because then you didn't have to go back and hand where to be a retroactive player you got lucky you didn't have to make that that decision because he was for show supposed to get suspended so adamson was like thank god what a season man that's our last part of the season any closing remarks on of it i said at the sorry of the year that the Knicks were going to win the title. Did you?

I do. I had Knicks over Nuggets. And they went out and they did it. So what that means is sometimes you just got to pick your team. Yeah. And just roll with it. Just be a fan. Wasn't that graphic of everyone post like Kenny said?

So sometimes you guys stop trying to be an analyst and be a fan. Yeah. Pick your team every year. Eventually it'll work. You might have to wait for three years. But it'll work. Eventually you'll have a moment. Yeah.

When you were on a podcast and you were wiping tears because your team won a championship. I'm having my oxygen tank ready, bro. Just ripping my last words. We both did a video of Donovan reacting to the championship. Top comments. Everybody on T3 has gotten to see their championship team win. Good for them, except for Mo. Literally.

Yeah, bro. Like, my next? I hope so. Fuck. I hope so. Once you get jailing around, you'll be it. I can't even say it. I can't even say what a straight thing.

This motherfucker's dead. This motherfucker's dead. We'll see y'all next week. We'll see. TBD, man. I'm getting a championship rate too. Oh, my Rebecca? Yeah.

I'm getting one. That's hilarious. I'm getting a ring pop.