The Deep 3 Podcast - We Put Every 2025 NBA Rookie In A Tier List | Ep. 138

Episode Date: April 25, 2025

Today we rank every NBA rookie from this season! #nba Check out the TD3 merch: https://the-deep-3-shop.fourthwall.com/ Listen on Spotify!: https://open.spotify.com/show/3elbbqVumwqz8wlIdknsLW Listen on Apple Podcasts!: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-deep-3-podcast/id1657940794 Follow us on TikTok!: https://www.tiktok.com/@thedeepthree Follow us on Instagram!: https://www.instagram.com/thedeep3podcast/ Isaac's twitter: https://twitter.com/byisaacg Mo's twitter: https://twitter.com/Mojo99_ Donnavan's twitter: https://twitter.com/Dsmoot3D 0:00- Intro 3:35- warriors vs rockets 18:20- lakers vs twolves 31:28- bucks vs pacers 40:14- other playoff yap 43:30- rookie tier list 2:00:55- tiktok time Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Are y'all ready to talk about the youth, to talk about the next generation? Them young boys? Them young boys? As you guys see about our title, as you guys see my title, today we're talking about the youngest people in this league we cover. Today we're going to do a tier list of every single rookie in this NBA season. I meant to do this a couple weeks ago, but I think now is a good time to do it. We've all had a full 82 games to digest what we think about these young players.

So today we're going to put them in a tier list based on, I think, how our evaluation. of them long-term has changed in this rookie year. So not how good they are today, but from what we learned this year, how good we think they'll be going forward in their career. Yeah. I think going back to the summer, a lot of people clearly gave this draft class a lot of shit.

One of the most famous headlines people used to say was, wow, this is the worst, weakest draft class since 2000. Oh, man. Do you guys remember how bad the 2000 draft class was? Some people say it up all time. That's such a drag. It's not as bad as the 2000 draft class. and I think we're all happy to see that.

Yeah, I feel real good about the draft class compared to what we came in thinking, but lots of talk about there we'll get into. We'll talk about all the guys at the top, like 1 through 18 we're going to do. Then we're not going to do every single person, but we're going to do all the ones who had notable rookie years that we felt like we learned from. But you guys know, before we get to that, the NBA playoffs are going on right now.

So we got to talk about all the biggest series right now. We're doing it. We're like splitting up the coverage. If you guys watch our stream on Tuesday, we covered the Lakers series, the Denver Nugget series, the Nick series extensively. Since then, there's a few games that have happened in some of these series. So we'll cover the ones that have changed. But if you don't hear us talk about your favorite team series right now, that's because we covered it extensively on Tuesday. And they

haven't played another game yet. So go back and watch that VOD. Combine that with today's discussion, you should get all of our up-to-date thoughts on every single NBA playoffs. You need to be tapping into TD3 Tuesdays. You shouldn't have to be reminding them every single podcast episode. But here we are doing it. You're not doing your job. We are. Your job. Watch our videos now. But yeah, man. Let's talk about the NBA playoffs.

Let's talk about these young boys. Let's get right into it. The cranium is crazy. Oh, my God. I mean, I don't know what to say. Pray on eaters rejoice. Before we get started, before we talk to talk about the playoffs, I almost forgot. Mo, I have a gift for you.

if I give it to you right now, do you promise you'll go off camera and you'll put it on right now? No. You don't promise you that. Let's do it. You will. Potentially, let's do it. No, you got to promise me or you can't have it.

I break promises all the time, bro. You got to make one. I'm a liar. Are you going to make the promise or not? Yes, and no. Yes. Okay, I'll be right back. To the crown eaters, yes.

And for the crown eaters were to, I'm not breaking shit. This is what I do. Did you know about this? I didn't know about this. I had no idea. what's going on but he has a piece of fabric and I'm very curious to see what it is I found a t-shirt I saw this online

I immediately thought of Mo and I had to give it to him before I had to buy it in the moment because I know I would have forgot about it and it's too perfect for Mo I'm going to let you guys see it right before I do I have no idea what to expect I sent you this this is fire oh I didn't even see you said me this perfect sin a

oh my god I have to wear this All right, you guys carry the episode, sorry. Yeah, yeah, go change, go change. You got it. I usually don't let none mess up the swag, but this is the swag. Yeah, man. He's stupid. While he goes and gets a little wardrobe change going on, what playoff series you want to start with?

All right, so we talked about, I already forgot what we talked about on Tuesday. All right, okay, so we're going to start with, I don't even know why I asked you. This has to be the most pressing story you talk about. Game two last night between cold and stuff. State Warriors and Houston Rockets coming into the series. I chose to forget. Yeah, well, it wasn't a great outcome for longevity of the series as a neutral fan because the headline of this game, Jimmy Butler is injured.

He fell so unbelievably hard on his ass. The second it happened, I said, oh, my God, I know his tailbroon might be broken. Yeah. I was horrified of the outcome. As of now, we know he had a contusion and didn't return to game two. We'll see if he misses more time or not. But I have to assume I'll miss at least one more game. That shit looked horrible.

probably and like if he's gone it's so like the series the series is done it's i there's there's golden say might not win another game if jimmy butler doesn't play for the rest of the series and it's just because it's just so clear like if jimmy butler's not there then the warriors are the version of themselves where we're like man these guys suck yeah step curry is is out here overtax last night jimmy butler got hurt brandon pajemke was fighting through food poisoning right you had so much going on. And then on top of it, you have to go back and forth. This is a nerd. Can I give you a hug on the box? Please, can I give you a line?

Ah, man. Sina Braun has entered the building. He were in the medium. This is a fantastic fine. Yeah, but you're right. Without Jimmy, it looks how early season warriors did, where Steph gets so much attention thrown at him that we say, oh, wow, this doesn't look at the same guy anymore. because while Steph is still amazing and can still give you games like game one where she just has ridiculous shot making that gets him to 30 points despite playing against an elite defense

that does a good job, he can't necessarily go night and night out with no help like he looked without Jimmy Bulley yesterday and just fight through all these double teams and get to his own buckets. The speed isn't what it once was. He needs a certain level of infrastructure to get his game off, which is fine.

He's 37. It's not a slight. Without Jimmy, it's just hard to imagine that that goes particularly well. Yeah, and he can't do that against the most athletic team in the league like Houston is just able to throw body after body after body and especially in games like game two where we are currently in the Jalen Green experience.

Yeah. Terrible game one. We're like, oh man, this is, this is bad. This is deep. This is rock bottom. And then he goes out in game to me and he has 38 points and he's hitting every I'm glad you say that. Every pull up three, he's attacking the room super aggressively. And the one knot that we keep saying about Houston is who's going to create offense in the half court. with Jalen Green did that yesterday and when they do that they are able to control the game throughout you know all 48 minutes they're able to to blow the warriors out and it's going to be easy if he's playing like this yeah so we talked you know last week we did one question that every NBA team needs to answer to win their first round series if you guys saw that episode uh our prevailing

opinion up here was that we're picking the warriors in seven games I think Donovan's at six me and Mo were seven but we were like I think I can see both of us yeah we don't feel good about that shit at all. We were like, we guess we'll go warriors. Like it's conventional wisdom that you go with the old team that has a half court superstars. They'll win a close series. But I was like, it's damn near too close to call. I don't feel good about this opinion. I got to pick a side. So I guess I'll say they'll barely win, but it truly could go either way. And the question I had, they're one of my teams was which version of Jalen Green you're going to get? Because there's some nights. I always say he looks like six five Donners and Mitchell. That was last

night. He hit like fucking 10 threes. It looked ridiculous. Everything comes together when he's hitting his step back three. The outside in approach works so much better. He gives them the half-core shot making they need. But then you got games like game one where he looks lost. The game plan was attack Curry one-on-one, and Curry was kind of just locking him down, which is crazy.

So, Jaylon Green giveth and Jaylen Green taketh away. This team, we always talk about their one superstar away from being good. That's everybody wants to get Devon Booker, wants him to get Kevin to ramp. Knights like this where Jaylon Green straight a performance like that superstar, you're going to find this team to be incredibly hard to beat. Jailene Green is so crazy because he's single-handedly outside of Kauai Leonard, he is the biggest X factor in the NBA playoffs.

And that's just so brainbreaking to even say because if he is doing what he did last night or somewhere around that realm, who is stopping the Houston Rockets outside of the Oklahoma City? Nobody. I don't know nobody you can do that in the West of Congress. Yeah. Much of a force defensively and offensively as well. like we didn't even mention i don't know i don't know if you guys mentioned alfredson gune yet but holy fuck he is a problem as well he's been the most consistent player outside of no he's been the

most consistent player so far this series throwing through game one and game two i think game two he gave him like 17 points and 16 rebounds and one on it five this is monster game you know and i know the turks are coming after you guys like you better watch your back and i understand it now as well in terms of his overall offensive skill in game, not necessarily being the best at one certain thing, but really damn good across the board. So valuable, bro. No, yeah, he's great.

They did a really good job in game two at, you know, after game one, they lost game one because their offense was abysmal. They actually did a pretty good job against the Warriors in game one defensively. No Warriors fans were on Twitter gloating like, y'all told me this defense is the craziest thing you've ever seen. We just beat them. They scored less than 100 points. The Rocket's defense held up just fine.

The Rockets' offense was just disgusting. It was beyond approach. It was absolutely horrendous in game one. They scored like 85 points. Didn't look good. They did so much better of a job in game two, utilizing Sangoon as a driver and not just running these lineups where he thought to him in the post. They did a good job of having him be an isolation guy from the top of the key with much better spacing.

And he did a really good job attacking these small warriors defenders. Anytime he didn't get Dremont Green on him, he was attacking the one-on-one, getting downhill, making the right. decision that's like the most imperative thing in this series is how they can put sangoon in the right spot to attack non-dremong green defenders because outside of him they don't have anybody on this roster that can check sangun this roster is full of draymond loony post or big guys a bunch of small dudes after that i don't even feel like great by jimmy on him one-on-one because he's just too small i don't feel i don't feel good about anybody outside of drayma like post post good you're big

doesn't matter like singoon is looking at that and he's saying food luni is not quick enough to stay with Sangu whenever he gets into his back like that. And so I think that combination of Sanguon dominating down low and then Jalen Green dominated from the perimeter, like Mo said, that's what's making Houston as dangerous as anybody in the Western Conference. And it makes it so that, specifically on Jalen Green, it makes it so that you are not relying on these like Fred Van Bleet 20 shot a night,

you know, step back threes, tough shot type of performance. performances. And even though that Jalen Green does take some tough shots, you do feel better about him taking those rather than Fred Van Fleet. And so the ceiling is just much higher when he's doing that. And they did a good job last night, too, of mixing up their lineups better. They had, you know, obviously Jimmy Butler went out really fucking early. So after that, it was Steph Curry versus the world. They had some good stretches whenever, you know, the lineups called for it when they had to get some good off the court where they put Jabari spent that center, a minute power forward, and then have their three perimeter players whoever they chose.

that line of did such a good job defending in a really switch-heavy scheme against Steph when they knew he didn't have any help to really punish him on the switches. They weren't going to get slips from Buddy healed being them on the short roll. Then we're going to get Jimmy Butler attacking their smallest offender.

They can full-on switch one-through-five against Steph and really neutralize him. And that's really what blew the lead open in the second quarter, I think. And that's like their biggest strength is they can go double bigs. They can go single big with Sangoon attacking this biggest guy.

They can go small like that and really stifle you with mobility. And obviously, this all works a lot better with no Jimmy Butler, but I think we saw a much closer version of who the Rockets are than game one when their offense was just like worst case scenario. Yeah, this is so, it's very funny because every game is a race to 80 points. Whoever can get to 80 points first is going to win. And because nobody, nobody, nobody in this series is super, one, the way that it's being called and the way that it's being played, this is one of the most physical series. Oh, it's prison ball. I love

seen in in a long long time and so with that physicality with the warriors and now that jimmy butler is hurt and he's out with their lack of offense with the rockets inherent lack of offense it really is like can you can you build like a 10 point lead and can you kind of sustain that for for a while and on the on the warrior side because we're talking about like houston doing everything i came out of last night extremely extremely frustrated with jonathan Kaminga because I was actually What'd you expect? He hasn't played in a fucking a week

I was I was probably as furious as I've been watching watching Kaminga what the fuck Because on one hand And I do want to give him grace To go from I'm the third leading scorer on this team You bench me at the end of the season

You take me out of the rotation I can understand how that can take somebody Out of that mindset Yeah on the other hand We're here now you know and so like jimmy jimmy's out pod isn't playing you have an opportunity to even if you don't think that you have value on the warriors to at least showcase your talents for other people because you know people get paid off the playoffs all the time yeah and i i thought that in a spot where the

warriors could have just used some more athleticism you didn't really see that out of comminga yesterday and i thought that he was pretty passive a little bit and i think that like it was it was frustrating because I thought that Golden State, there was a moment where they were like, you know, they were pushing to come back. It was 10 or 11 points. And throughout that whole time, you were getting more out of like Pat Spencer and quitting post rather than Kaminga. And so I think that like, one, he's going to have to play because Jimmy is going to be out. And so in game three, I do like, they're going to need Kaminga to step up and be more aggressive and try to be more of an offensive factor. Because outside of, really, not even outside of anybody else, matching athleticism for

athleticism, Cominga is one of the only threats to pose athleticism on Houston. You're right. But for the Golda State Warriors, more so specifically, Steve Kerr, he's never really trusted comminga at all when it comes to trying to build an offense, not around him, but more so trying to, like, cater towards some, okay, Camigua, we're going to give you a certain level responsibility and give you certain opportunities, draw up X, Y, Z plays, or whatever. Like, no, it's like Steph Ball, even if Steph Curry is not on the court, we're playing a specific way, this is our identity. And it's your job to figure out ways to make yourself

valuable, whether it be like last year when they tried the CP3 thing and tried to make them into DeAndre Jordan, just use him as a role man or this year when they tried to give him more responsibility. This is the best season he's had, of course. But still, you don't feel really good about him. For someone like Jonathan Caminga, was a young player lottery pick we all we all know the egos high as hell um it's hard to it's just so hard to not to be on the bench and not getting any burned right after you just had your best year like you said and then all of a sudden be called up in the playoffs and be given a ridiculous not a ridiculous little but give be given this amount of opportunity that you haven't seen

before all in just like a split second you know yeah so i don't really blame him for being for what did he do last night i think he put up like 11 points on 13 shots which is disgusting but it's what you get yeah i mean it's a tough situation but you know that's the type of situation you got to you got to persevere through if you want to make a roll for yourself in the league it's not going to be easy i got a question it's definitely hard now with this jimmy bowler injury being apparent i don't know if there has been any type of update just yet in terms of how much time is going to lose but whether he's back or not clearly like the warriors are not the same how do you feel about the warrior's chances coming on top of the season so i said this when you were changing

if jimmy's not here they lose they lose the yeah clearly i mean how can you if you thought we thought it was a tight series when he goes it goes seven that was under the impression jimmy fucking butler would be there one of the best playoff risers who's done great work in the first game and first eight minutes of this game i guess it's such a huge gigantic part of what makes this team good post-deadline their defense their offense everything is completely revitalized because of him and him alone like he is the single difference between them being the 11 seed and then being a team that we say might be the second or third best team out west without him i just don't know how you could have even a little bit of face and they will let you know that on the broadcast every two

minutes i like every two minutes they're showing the graphic of like what the warriors were before jimmy belair and afterwards like it's a constant reminder and it's and it's true though like it's something that like we've gotten kind of used to but it is very very wild how this team was out of of the playoffs looking like they might be out of the play in, and then you get Jim and Butler and they rise, you know, all the way up here. So it's a massive loss. And the fact that they don't have anybody else who can not only create their own shot, but the one advantage that we all knew that Golden State had over Houston was,

yes, you guys are more athletic. We're just smarter than you guys. We have more experience. And so the fact that you don't have another smart, like super smart guy out there in Jimmy Butler to have that, like, that mind meld between him, Draymond and Steph to outthink, you know, quote unquote, the Rockets, that's the biggest loss out of all of this, is that you can't, you know, out-skine this very young team

that hasn't been here before and do all the little things that happened in a playoff series. That's one of the biggest losses outside of just having somebody else who can just go get you 25 and 5 in a game. Yeah, we'll see. Yeah, obviously the series all comes down to Jimmy Bowler's availability. That'll be the big deciding factor. But in the end, I think we saw that after game one,

people might have wanted to overreact and say the rockets stood no chance. Even those first eight minutes, obviously it was only eight minutes. They were looking good. They came out strong, made good adjustments. So I think at the day, you're seeing that the rockets aren't frauds by any means, you know, the way that that might have been floating in there after game one. They're going to have ups and downs. And I think we saw both versions of them in these first two games.

Now, we had another series to talk about, when you want to talk about seeing both versions of a team in two games. trying to tell you. We got to talk about the Los Angeles Lakers versus Minnesota Timberwolves series this is one that

we had varying we all picked the Lakers we had varying degrees of certainty Donovan was very certain the Lakers would be the Timberwolves I think Moe

was somewhere in the middle probably closer to Donovan I was kind of scared I said I pick Lakers in six I feel like it low key might be more

like seven I'm fucking Lakers I'm gonna pick the Lakers someone in the series don't understand who you're hearing it from but I'm kind of worried

because the Timber Wills pose a lot of advantages right I feel like it's going to be a long series and it'll come down to who executes their version of their advantage is better. In game one, we talked about it on stream last week. They beat the shit out of the Lakers.

Every swing factor that could have went to the Timberwolves went to the Timberwolves. Every single thing that could go either way went the wrong way of the Lakers. It was a nightmare scenario. There's always a debate between what's better when you have certain days off not being in playing. Do you get rust or do you get rest?

The Lakers had goddamn rust. then game two came around and the script was completely flipped what did you guys see in game two when the Lakers came out and beat the Timberwolves obviously the first thing and maybe it is the most important

maybe it's not but the thing that jumped off the screen the most was oh LeBron locked in tonight LeBron is locked in he is sliding defensively he is trying hard he is sprinting everything

did you not see that he showed up to the arena 10 hours before the game started showed up to shoot around like three four hours before it started crazy. He was absurdly locked.

And that's what he does. And so that was very apparent. And so just the, just the overall energy of, of the Lakers, that, that jumped off the screen immediately. Secondly, the, yes, like the, the Timberwolves had a great shooting night in game one. But we talked about how that was a product of the way that the makers were guarding the Timberwolves. That, that didn't happen in game in game two.

They were, they were much better defending the, the, the three-point shot. And so as a result, Nazreed, who got into some wild foul trouble on, some stupid fouls. All the role players did. They were all being dumb as hell. But he was one for three from downtown. And Jada McDaniels, who went crazy, he was 0 for three. And so you had those two guys combined for like 40-something points in game one. They combined for 17 in game two.

Instant swing right there. That's crazy. And that's their biggest strength in my mind. They're definitely one of the deeper teams that the Western Conference has to have and also another big thing that like jumped out more than ever to me this last game was rigo bear he plays he played as much shit as the internet tries to give him and how they like portray him as just like fake demon fake dpoi or whatever it is played off the court in the playoffs just big one of the easily one of like the top three biggest lies that we've had over the last

like 10 years um top three yeah that most definitely it's probably top one And honestly, in terms of how much people say it. Yeah, most definitely. Oh, it's besides Shay being a free throw merchant. With Rudy O'Bare, I was so wildly disappointed in his rebounding ability. Like, to be that big and to be that limited on the offensive end, which he already is, we already accepted, but he makes up more so far with the defensive end. Like, the lack of rebounding is what kills this team. And in my mind, kills any hope of any, like, actual.

consistency in the playoffs. That's a huge flaw. Yeah. And I think, yes, that to me is more about the Lakers in this game in a good way. So obviously on that stream, I was quite worried. I was like, they need to show me in game two that I should feel good about the Lakers in the series because game one was quite concerning. But, you know, a big part of game one where they lost was they just simply didn't execute well. They just played bad in the day. They didn't defend well. They didn't hit their shots. They didn't get into their sets fast enough. Clearly, the words Jake Reddick used was they weren't ready physically for the playoffs that showed so that was part of it right but also to the

point um around naus reed jada mcdaniels everybody else getting all those threes in game one they helped way too aggressively and way too lazily on these drives they were just doubling the shit out of every single anthony edwards touch in ways that were way too predictable he gets the ball and they just throw this just vanilla ass double team on him and said you're not going to beat this as a passer, it's quite easy to beat you as a passer when your health defense is that mediocre and that's simple. So, so, and beat them as a passer in game one. And that's why all these threes happen, especially in transition where the Lakers did not get on run. Game two, I asked in that stream that they play, Anthony Edwards, a lot more one-on-one and allow him to make him, make him

beat you as a score, not only a playmaker. They did that. And of course, he had a better stat line and Julius Randall had a better stat line because they played them a little bit more head-on, said we have good big defenders. You're going to have to beat them. And they did do you know they scored well but it leads to less shooting opportunities for these people we're talking about that was a game plan and they also did really smart zones every time anthony edwards got a isolation on the wing when they had time they threw a two three zone in him or just different variations of zone coverage to confuse him that worked really well so double less and double smarter is what we asked for and they did that and then to your point about the greedy gober rebounds

when the series came out i said i don't really give a shit about gobert and randle being too big for them the lakers are really fucking good at being you being up on the boards and just swarming you with all these power forward-sized bodies and not letting you just kill them on the glass aside know that dunk was crazy that hand just had on jackson hayes but the lakers are just really good at that so like they were i always thought they were going to make gobert's struggle there and really get into his lower body with dFS rui hachimora and like gang rebound so that's a return to the laker strengths i think how did you feel about rudy gober's defense because it was good they attacked the shed it was it was it was good i like for him to be on an island and for them

to attack like that was clearly the game plan they said we're we are going to try and get this switch we're gonna we're gonna attack gobert in isolation and in one-on-one situations and i know like obviously the lakers scored on some of them he held up for sure as well as you could ask part of that also was that lucca was lucca demon time he's a bully man lucca like it legitimately felt like he was more worried about making gobert fall rather than scoring there were there was so many times where he felt so much yeah where he had gobert on him and it's like oh you could have you could have went right there but you kept playing with your food and so like obviously that that helps out gobert but even without that he did as well you know guarding it in spaces you can ask for him so

i was fine with how he played people misunderstand why they why they attack gobert they don't attack gobert because he's food and he's the easiest matchup in the league for a big man he can't stay in front of guards. He's quite decent at it, quite good at it, actually, for most traditional protection protectors. He's one of the better guys when it comes to elite bigs of that, you know, drop cover style. He's very good at staying in front of you. They do that because you're way better off attacking him on the perimeter than you are attacking a perimeter guy and having him help on the back end. In game one, he shut down the paint, dominated. So they did this because they said, we're going to pull him out. And even if it's not going to be as good

efficiency as attacking Nas Reid, it's a lot better to attack Rudy Gober so he can't help in the paint. And that was a really smart adjustment. I think overall, J.J. Redick had a lot of good adjustments and that was one of them. Yeah, I agree. They tried to nullify his superpower, which is like being in the back end and just being a big tree branch and affecting everything in the pain. And in the pain that the other team tries to have going on. Even when I saw a stat last night,

even when Austin Reeves and LeBron tried to get their shit off on him, they only shot like a combined three of 12 against. I texted Donovan this. Are you in the group chat too? I said LeBron needs to realize Rudy Gobert is not a mismatch for him. anymore. He needs to stop isolating him on the top. He does these slow dribbles and kind of like stands there and these big crossovers and just like fake going and doesn't go.

He thought he was food too. He sees Luca and Austin Reeves being quick, giving him trouble and he's like, ah, my turn. And it never goes well. He's like, we're all eating. He needs to cut that shit out of his game. I know old instincts die hard. That is not his game anymore.

It's also, it's also so clear that he can't do that anymore. Because Austin Reed be throwing these lobs like 10 years in the air. He, like, he had to. that clip a couple weeks ago where he was like oh yeah like my bad i threw it to you know i threw it too high yeah and then lebron was like yeah you know that took three days off of off of my rest and he keeps doing it yeah he keeps throwing these lives where he'd be thinking this is his moment i could go if i'll him out i'd do this same exact thing bro i'm thinking like oh my god this is my d-way to lebron moment in milwaukee the highest possible as well but now this is a good game this this showed you uh

i think he showed you a lot about the lakers team because i said in this past stream that the lakers offense is incredibly overrated. I've been saying this. They win with the defense. In this game, the Minnesota Timberl scored 85 points and the Lakers scored 94. They got those 94 points in the first half. They went crazy, built a big lead-up. Second half, they went cold. And in that first half, they went crazy because Luca Donchich went vintage Luca shot making against all these Rudy Gobert isolations. He was going insane. Second half, you saw that start to slow down. Right now, Rui, LeBron, and Reeves aren't shooting well in the squad of threes. You started to see that without the crazy shot making of Luka.

The offense starts to get a little, little iffy, but they still won because they won with defense doing the swarming small ball, but really kind of big because everyone's 6'8, the type of defense on the interior. This is how their games are going to look. You're going to get the stretches where Luka takes over and makes the offense hum. When that doesn't

happen, the solo LeBron minutes aren't good offensively anymore because the isolation game isn't quite there for me anymore, but they're going to have a strong defensive infrastructure that keeps them, you know, in striking range for Luka to have these offensive runs. Yeah, but I think that because I still feel very confident about the Lakers winning the series because you haven't had an amazing awesome Reeves game. You have it. Like

LeBron was locked in. He, he wasn't awesome in terms of his shot, his shot making. There's another level for both of them to go to. And when the wolves were making their push to come back and everybody's missing these shots, like LeBron, even the shots that he was missing, they were still good shots and he was still getting to his spots. And so I don't feel, I mean, I haven't felt like this in a decade but I don't feel like anybody can like slow lebron down or like get him to not go to his spots so there's that aspect of it and so going into game three like i think the lakers get game three i think you you've seen luka ramp up you've seen them make a couple of adjustments and i it's it's very hard for me to keep thinking about minnesota and while they are talented

if if the lakers can defend like this and you're forcing you know nazreid and you're forcing you know nazreid and Jada McDaniels to really, really beat you, I don't really trust them. And it also seems like by the end of this series, like Jackson Hayes is probably going to start, play two minutes, and then, you know, hit the bench, and you're just going to roll with. Dude, he's getting just ran off the court immediately.

I talk about that too on the stream that I hope, they need to get some good minutes out of Jackson Hayes in this playoff run. Clearly this will not be that series. Because he plays six minutes, gets three fouls, And JJ Redick is like bench the rest of the game. Get ready to play small well for 42 minutes because you cannot touch the court again. And that can work in the series, I think, because I think they have the type of, in Bruega-Barr's sense, I can say this, unskilled big men that they're not going to make you pay in that way.

You can deal with the physicality. In certain other series, you're going to need Jackson Hayes to be able to give you some minutes. And I hope he can, you know, carry some momentum into the second round. Man, rest up, get ready for Houston. It's okay. I hope. But I also don't think the Lakers are out of the woods yet. Like, this is still going to be a tough series that we've seen both teams, their first strike. You know, game two always tells us a lot about how the teams are going to adjust to each other.

And I'm fine being confident. The Lakers will win in six or seven, like I said before. But listen, Chris Finch can still have an adjustment. There's still plenty of ways that the Timberwolves can play better too. So still a close series. I'm not ready to say it's for sure the Lakers are going to stomp. But decent. I feel decent about the Lakers and sixth prediction.

Also, shout out to Randolph who's played well through two games. Like, that was somebody who we've talked about having a lot of pressure. People have been, you know, talking about how Randall's a playoff droper and this and that. This is one of the, the first playoff series, maybe the only playoff series that he's actually been, like, really, really healthy for. And he's played well through two games. And so I think, like, you know, shout out to him. Another shout out. I said it or I alluded to it.

Isaac said it. You know, Anthony Edwards is steady evolving and taking, like, an actual other leap in terms of his stardom in the NBA. he still hasn't had a bad playoff game bro so far in this series and although obviously the timbrews didn't end up with the win his game specifically not forcing it trying his best to look for outlets to for his other shooters and whatnot although they're taken superb and he just like he's steady climbing his rankings yeah steady climbing all right one more big series i got to talk about paces versus bucks you know game one came and the pacer's for lack of a better word, beat the shit out of the Milwaukee books. Damien Lillard wasn't there. They were

completely outclassed. It looked like it was going to be the cleanest of sweeps. And then, miraculously, Damien Lillard returned from his blood clot issues three weeks after it was initially reported. One of the craziest recoveries we've seen from something like this in the NBA. And, you know, we expect that there would be some rust. He'd missed all that time. He's an older point guard. We've seen what Damien Lur looks like when he's not in tip-top shape. So I don't think any of us expected him to come out and change a series and make it so the fuck suddenly had the top two players in the series and blitz the Pacers and suddenly they're the team to beat but we expected there'd be some differences right did you see a difference in game

too in which the Pacers won and went up to a no no no there were arms length no but that but but they were in arms length not even because of dame because he again he looked like he hadn't played basketball in three weeks but he played in like 40 minutes I believe which is which is criminal it's wild He had one, I think going into like the fourth quarter, going into like the last five minutes, he had like one, one made three on the night. It wasn't, it wasn't good. And for this series alone, I don't really care about, in terms of like what it says about

Dame or whatever. I don't really care about Dame's performance. He's coming off of blood clots in three weeks and they're like, oh, this is miraculous. Like, it's medical history. Nobody's ever been able to play this quickly. So you knew that that aspect was going to happen. They also got 28 points out of Bobby Porters And that's that's something that you're not going to be able to rely on

We were on stream as the game started Kyle Kuzma started the game We were on zero watch for the first like seven minutes He's shit yo first of all the announcers messy as hell He had a shot he had a layup and it was like his third basket at the game And the announcers was like Kyle Kuzman with his third shot of the game Oh my God They are they are messy because they were on zero

watch too but i don't think that i still don't have a lot of faith especially going into to game three maybe just because they're going back home but the stuff that um the stuff that the buck's role players are doing seems very non-helpful and you just you just look at the stat line and you're like oh my honest 34 18 and 7 and you lose again they're going to lose this series they're probably going to lose it in five and that's it's just going to be that That's embarrassing in the worst way possible, bro Yeah, DeVosia is just a better team We talked about why on stream after game one

They're better in every way Their size is more effective Because Brooke Lopez just can't play in the series He's too slow The three point rate difference between when Brooke is on the court and off the court Is gigantic because he is having the hardest time of his life Rotating to this five out spacing

And not allowing constant open threes Teams turn into 2017 Warriors, bro Every time he touches the court Every single time Their big presence isn't good their lineups with Bobby Portis is probably what they should start which is like a gross solution

because that's defensively worse but at this point they had to make something happen their wing play isn't good enough their back of guard play outside of Damien Lurit isn't good enough to contend with having Nemhart and Tyrese Halliburton and Tij McConnell on the court at all times they're bigger, faster, stronger, shoot better

outside of Yonis it just feels like a no contest in terms of top to bottom talent Oh man I just this is coaching my practice also in my mind when it comes to single Doc Rivers, the adjustments that he made between game one and game two. The only adjustment that he made was like, okay, Dane back, cool. You get minutes, you play, cool. That was it.

That was the game plan. I don't understand how you can start as atrociously as they did to earlier in the season. I think they started like two and eight. And you go ahead, try to find some magic, and you play the dairy birds of the world. And then you also give someone like Andre Jackson Jr. minutes. and he helps turn around the entire ship. He hasn't, as time has gone on throughout the year, he's gone like little, little, little of a role,

and he doesn't play anymore. If I'm someone like Doc Rivers, I look at that dude and I'm like, okay, fuck, we're small, we have no defenders, our offense's ass. It's obvious, clear as day, Andre Jackson Jr. doesn't do shit on offense other than like slash and shit, but it's much better than what Tori and Prince is giving you currently.

I understand. Tyrese Hallibor and Dunkin on them. But yeah, exactly. You need some type of point of attack defender or someone who's going to hound these guys. Like, do you guys remember what Andre Jackson Jr. did in the in-season tournament? This is pitiful.

Like, this is crazy. Why is Janus Brooke the pick and roll defenders? And look at Brooke's slow ass. You got Tyrese Hallibur and yamming on you. When's the last time you've seen him dunk? I mean, he does occasionally, but once a quarter. Yeah. Quarter of the year, the calendar of the kind of like Q1.

Q1. Series adjustments needs to be made in the most obvious. obvious one is right there and we're just continuously seeing this team get pummeled. Yes. And I know I understand that they got within two. It was kind of close and then, you know, Indiana pulled away again. But you look at the boss score and the bucks shot 50% from the field, 40% from three. And for a majority of this game are not close to it. And so when you are, when you have that like, that's, that's, that's good splits for. for a team when that when that's happening and you're still not close offensively i don't know what's supposed to happen and i think that yonis is playing as well as he possibly can he's having his superman moment and this core around him is one of one of the most disappointing cores

that we've seen around like a thriving thriving superstar in a long time and they're just going to get blasted bro they need some fucking dog in them and nander jackson jr is a part of the not a part of the answer to me. They were literally... I want to make fun of you because you keep saying like Andre Jackson Jr. He's not the answer.

No, I want to make fun of you, but I can't because that's one of the only options. I don't make fun of you and not necessarily you, both of you, because why are we acting like there's an adjustment Doc Rivers can make? This team sucks and the Pacers are really good

and they have no chance. We don't need to say anything. You can suck, but how bad can you? They stand no chance. It'll be... No, it's very clear. The Pacers have a better chance of beating the calves than the Bucs do a beating the Pacers. They're just clearly outmatched.

It doesn't matter. I think if Dame never got the blood clout issue and he won 100%, we might not be seeing that different of an outcome either way. I feel like the Pacers are just clearly the better team and they're displaying that. No matter what lineup combination is out there, the Bucs do not have enough good players. Okay, I disagree with that. But, I mean, even if Dame was healthy, do I think that the Pacers could still win the same? series, obviously, yes. It would be closer, but I still think the pictures would win.

Yeah, but I mean, down, down 2-0, this series is done. Yeah. There's nothing. There's no way outside of everybody on the Pacers dying that the Bucs are going to win four out of five games. It's not going to happen. You know, we're saying this, obviously, anything is possible. So if this does happen and the Bucks do win this series, one or two things will have

happened. Either Tyreys Halliburton had a nightmare series, and it's the biggest choke job we've seen. from a good team or Janus is literally God and we need to put him in our top 10 of all time because he can make fucking water into wine because he's gonna find a way to win this series that's unwinnable he's averaging like 33 and 17 he's gonna have to average like 50 and 20 so if we're wrong and we're speaking confidently and you're a bucks fan you see this and you end up winning the series don't direct your hate to me direct your love to Janus because that is your lord and savior because he would have done something ridiculous and don't act like you don't feel the same way right now we know what we're

watching but shout out the patience man I can't wait to to see them versus the Cavs. Obviously, the Cavs is a better team all year and should be favored to win, but we'll find out real fast if the bucks are just like that down bad or if the Pacers are just insanely dangerous and can beat anybody in the conference. We'll see. I'm going to lean towards the Cavs in that series, but it will be a war. Most definitely.

Damn, I need a 40 piece, please. We need a 40 piece from game and the 50s from yon. That's the only way. This man is on multiple medications. I can be 40 points in game three. Multiple medications. It's hallucinating on the court. I don't blame him.

It's going out right now. He's not you've seen four rims. Oh, this is so bad. We can speed run through the other series I've played games since the stream. OKC continues to beat the shit out of the Grizzlies. Not much to say there. You see the jaw layup?

Oh, my God. The job layup? Which one? There was a clip of Jod doing a reverse layup and like he just threw it up, and just ran back like no care nothing at all everyone's like y'all are you even trying just tossing shit uh shay hasn't played well through two games for his standards doesn't matter it hasn't mattered because like they're just like he doesn't need to go his performance has little bearing

because it's such a top to bottom mismatch we want to see she have a good rest of series though because in series two they'll probably have to play the clippers or yokitch and you can see a war where they come in rusty because they took the week off because they beat the shit out of this team and then maybe they lose a game one because the other team is hot off of a game seven in rhythm so that's worth monitoring uh cleveland versus miami uh shout out donovan mitchell scoring 30 in both front games our biggest question was we know he's taking a step back to let others eat in the regular season can he elevate a game when needed he's doing that same certainly he's doing it normal donovan mitch of stuff and shout out the heat for making them work

and having a fake comeback then the fourth quarter making them lock in a little bit good for you guys. Boston versus the magic. Also uninteresting. But Jason Tatum's hurt. Missed game two. Probably precautionary. I'm sure for the finals he would have played.

It was cool, though, because the last time we saw Jason Tatum missed time in the playoffs, it was kind of a fucking nightmare playing through Jalen Brown, 2023. Now we have Drew Holiday. Now we have Porzingis. It was good to see what would that look like when Jalen has to take a little more on his shoulders. Look great.

He got his game off. Had the requisite help that couldn't just trap him nonstop. Very encouraging there for somebody who's coming to the series hurt. Poor Zingis also had to get five stitches because Gogo busted in his head. Bro, he snatched off his unicorns. Gass! Crazy. Ripped that shit off.

Just gas is for him. Yeah. But after that, I mean, you know, it's the same thing we talked about before to the series after game one. It's good to see Palo going so crazy. He's looking encouraging. I think his playmaking is really doing well. The team has no chance. Franz still can't shoot.

It's still a huge issue against a team this good. Your spacing is so limited. Your second star being part of that bad spacing is a problem. A lot of questions they have to answer this summer and I'm not feeling good about it. Same old, same old. They need to take the Detroit Pistons route and just sign players, veteran players, who can shoot the fucking ball. They tried to.

They signed one. That's all they had in their bag. Yeah. I think they need. You thought you had a better form. I think they need to get a stretch five clearly because they're not going to get spacing from the three with Franz. I want to see them in a stretch five and I want to see them with Anthony Simon

type guard next to Suggs, bring KCP up the bench or trade him, whatever is fucking necessary. I want to see that. If that doesn't work, there's going to be questions long term about can Franz Wagner be the second start of Palo Grang Carroll? Because at this point, it's feeling like both need the ball on their hands. It's very reductive, but that's where we're at right now. Obviously, Franz can get better off ball and we can see development happen.

They're both incredibly young. You don't got to rush into anything, but it's going to be something to monitor next year. Most definitely. They're on the hot seat. Their gym is on the hot seat. their coach's low key everybody's in the hot seat yeah that is sure everyone is pretty much at this point

the organization is a suspect man that's NBA playoff talk let's get into the main part of this episode let's go let's put every relevant 24 NBA rookie into a tier list and I say relevant I'm not being reductive to people who aren't on this list

it's not to say you're never going to be good but we did the top 17 in this class and then after that the ones later deeper in the draft that you know had a role in year one because obviously we come up here and do 60 players there would be 30 of them that didn't have an opportunity in year one because they're waiting their turn and we would say we don't know so if you don't see your favorite rookie on here it's not because we hate them it's not because you think he's trash we might but it's not necessarily the case it's just that in year one we didn't learn a whole lot

I think yeah I agree um and I think the some guys like the reed shepherds of the world or Well, he's on here. Yeah. He should be on here because number three overall pick. And we saw him in a very, very, very limited role. But when it comes to gauging guys like that, overall world didn't make this list. It's, it's talking there.

Reed shouldn't have been on here, but he's dropping so highly we got to talk about him. But he's in the same boat that he was given so little run that we don't know anything realistically long term. But put him on here because how could you not put everybody in the top five? As you see in the tiers, we have All-Star, for the players that we think, he can be all-stars elite role player starter solid bench guy a lot to prove and not looking good

bro not looking good bro that's a spectrum we're working with here if you're in the bottom tier it's we don't have a lot of faith in you we kind of think it might be cooked and if you're at the top we think you might be the diamond in a rough of what was thought to be a bad draft class every draft class has at least one all-star usually even 2013 they got yannis at the end of the lottery there's always sleepers in there that you don't necessarily see coming i kind of think we do have a couple of those in this draft class so that'd be worth talking about yeah alright let's see I do where are we starting at let's start the top let's start number one overall

let's go with Zachary Risha Shea obviously he was talked about is the least oppressive number one overall pick in a long time everybody had something mean to say about him when the pick was taken we all thought Alex Arrigo won but then he said I don't want to be on the Hawks but he didn't really say that but he made it very fucking clear so they didn't pick him Mo how are you feeling about Risha Shee on this tier list

I felt like he had a fantastic rookie year and he showed his ability throughout the entire year. Of course, at the start of the year, things are rough. But if you look at his efficiency as each and every month went by, he got scored more. He got more efficient. Tone overs went down. He just grew as each and every single month went by. And I feel very strongly about him in his role as a hawk. And not only that, just his role as a player and how he's valued and viewed in this league. Someone like him is what every single team in the league craves at the three slash four position or whatever you do a mass and i think in this tier list specifically unless his things like if he was able to

consistently create for himself and be some type of like a real penetrator or initiator i would say he has all-star potential he's shown like a good amount of flashes of that so i but flashes aren't just enough for me to call him an all-star so for that i think i belong i think he belonged in the elite role player tier. Yeah, I think, I think, like, we, we came out and we called him, you know, Harrison Barnes. This is the French Falcon, you know what I'm saying? He is in your favorite category, borderline potential fringe all-star. And I think that elite role player fits that, fits that mold perfectly.

Last 25 games of the year, when you talked about hit a much stronger finish of the year. 61% true shooting. He shot 38% from three, 62% on twos. He just really filled all the spots you want as a complimentary score playing off of Tray Young. It was just like quintessential whenever you saw the draft pick and heard him be described as this do-it-all wing who will do everything pretty well and elevates you and make your team better, but not, you know, blow your mind with any crazy ceiling individual skill. That's precisely what we saw. Like it was exactly what you should have expected. And the swing factor is obviously, you look on this before and after, first 50 games, 33% from three, last 25, 38%.

it really came down to is his three falling everything built off of that which is what you'd expect for the young player right you have to be able to shoot outside because your body isn't fully developed to dominate on the inside surprise surprise when he shot well he looked fully worth the pick yeah i agree i think the next steps for his development what could like breach him into the all-star tier is seeing how well he can like consistently hit on close-outs and what he can do when he's not just simply spotting up and catching the ball from tray young or jeline johnson or whoever it is dishing out to him i I think that's like the next step of development. But before that, obviously he needs to continuously, like, solidify himself as one of the best shooters that the NBA has to offer. You can do that. We are having other conversations about him. But at him as a now, I feel very comfortable with him as. Yeah, I feel very confident that whatever your evaluation was of him before the season

started or pre-draft, it should be exactly the same. He has checked every box and been completely utterly too standard. Exactly what we expected from this number one pick would be an elite role player. he is still that which honestly is really good like obviously you you went into the last year's draft and people didn't think much about the about the ceilings of and like the potential of all the players but when you're rebuilding just getting good players in the building is also super super important and so for a team light like dogs not even trying to you know go go down that path but their future is unknown they just fired the gym you don't really know what's going on

with Tray Young, when you're in that transitional phase, just having good players on the roster can help you and make that transition a little bit easier. So it is nice that they found one of the players with the highest floors in the draft. Yeah. Yeah. And I think there's a couple guys that I feel like we have a higher ceiling. So we can still debate if it was the right choice. But you definitely feel good about it if you're a hox fan, I think.

I agree. Let's go chronologically. Number two, what do you want to go with Alexar? I think Alexar is a good testament. to, when you look at a rookie, are you going to view them based on what they do right now or the flashes and how much you think that can be, you know, developed upon as the years go on? Because he was one of the most inefficient players in the NBA. He was not a good rebounder. He did very little of the big man things well. Shot a lot of jump shots. Didn't make a lot of

jump shots. Really bad rim finisher. Not what you want to see from a starting center as of today as a 19 year old. But, but, but, but, man, the flashes are incredible. That man can move. He can run the way he can fluidly handle the ball at that size. You think the shooting touch is going to develop because it always does with players this age, usually. So I kind of love him because I think once he builds his body out,

once the jump shot comes more consistent, once the team has a better infrastructure around him to help him get more easy shots set up for him and not have to be as much for a creator. Once he continues to develop that handle and make that moment, ability, huge strength, a la Jaron Jackson, Jr. I kind of think he has an all-star ceiling still, despite the crazy weaknesses right now. Yeah, I think right now the weaknesses are too crazy to see, but I agree with you overall. Like his strengths are just unfathomable, and that's the shit that you just can't scheme

around, and that's like a super power in which will catapult him to one of the best power forwards that the league can all. He easily has like top 10 power forward written all over him. You could be that by like year three or four of his career and everything pansed out smoothly. I am kind of, I'm okay with putting him in an all-starts here just because of those strengths are so invaluable and so rare at some of his size. And the effect that he can have a defensively to defensive, defense player that we're here. Now, we are being generous. We are being very generous.

Yeah. I'm okay with you. Yeah. I'm not in love with it, though. I'm, I think I'm probably the lows, but I don't hate Alex. are, I don't think I'm, for sure not as high as you, but the flashes are crazy. Like, defensively, it is good. His ability to operate in transition, which will get better as he, like, understands

the game, that's going to be good. And even if he's not some, like, wild, wild efficient three-point shooter, I haven't having a seven-footer who can, who can guard the paint and then get his own rebound and go coast to coast and operate in transition and get easy buckets and has, you know, like some passing chops to where he can play make a little bit. That in itself, he can get to a point where he's averaging like 20, like 21 and 8 and being a very, very impactful defender. The Wizards feel like they're on a decent trajectory right now, which is crazy to say,

but like you have them being like a succeed and then him being that good. All-Star is in the possibility for him. Yeah, I don't feel crazy saying that. Like I think that's, I'm not single-wee a perennial all-star. all-N-B-A type of guy, but I think he could make an all-star one day. And it'll have to be the type of scenario where you look at him now and he's getting up all these shots being hilariously inefficient. He shot 39% from the field, 45% on twos, which is ridiculous for his seven-foot player.

It's hilarious to say it out loud. He clearly needs to be on a team that gets lucky in the lottery this year and drafts either Cooper flag or Dylan Harper, and he can be the second star. That's his role. Go try to develop into being Jonathan Iseng on D. defense, which is a high bar, but I think it's not a wrong possibility. And a good complimentary player on offense that can play

off of a star, stretch the floor, do secondary creation, lead bench units, running transition, be able to outrun all these other bigs. They're trying to guard you. Feels to me like the Jaron Jackson's ceiling isn't like insane. We're doing a lot. We're doing a lot of hoping that he gets better at things is a horrible at,

but I don't feel like it's crazy. But he's shown he's shown the flashes and I think that even there's a, it's a weird line between like between you're chucking and you are not a good shooter

and like I know you're not a good shooter but you are getting these in-game reps and so that is also very very valuable because we used to say that with Vincent's like at least try and shoot three in game and the fact that he's in a situation where you can get those live reps

that that means something when we say All-Star at least for me I'm thinking at least like minimum two-time All-Star because anybody can like make one also or so team like if you have like a good year and I'm and I'm not even saying there has to be like back to back or whatever but just you have a stretch where you are you know kind of all star level yeah like you know varying in between like 24 and 30 when we rank players we compare you to all stars even if you don't necessarily make the game because there's only so many spots you're in conversations of comparison to other guys who are there yeah exactly I agree and for someone like Alexar what's super encouraging is like he understands but will make him elite in this league and what sets him apart from every single player. And for, like, as a Hawks fan,

it hurts obviously to put someone else above Zach or Ritch today because Zach had clear in day the better rookie year. For Zach, his game just feels too limited to where he doesn't have, just yet at this moment as you speak, he doesn't have the ancillary skills

as Alex are to put him on top. Yeah. Yeah. And again, if it goes the other way and these skills don't develop, it won't be shocking, right? I can see a world where he doesn't doesn't hit this ceiling too but all we can do right now after the work of year is project and i feel okay being be nice to alex are because the skillsets are there from such an early age i don't feel terrible

about it yeah all right number three overall what do you guys want to do or read shepherd listen man you got a lot to prove you you have a lot to prove it's not your fault necessarily that you have a lot to prove because we didn't see a lot of you but okay yeah but how do you want to treat this tier because technically we haven't seen much of him so i guess he has everything to prove because we just don't know, but I don't think when you put other players there, it'll be because you think they're not very good and have to show you they're good. Whereas he

didn't do anything. He literally didn't do any bad. He didn't do like much good. I still, whatever I felt before the draft, I still feel like he'll be a starter. Obviously he didn't have consistent minutes. His stats are really bad in those limited minutes he got in garbage time. But there's a few games where he got to start and put up over 20 points

in those roles when he had a consistent role. He did really well in the G League. We got thought about him beforehand, I still feel like I would expect him to at least be a starter. And the three games in the G league that he played, he put up 30 and eight assists a game on 45% shooting from the field and 40% from the 3. He was just gutting. It was hilarious. I don't know if you saw any that.

He was just out there clearly told, go get in a rhythm, go shoot every gem shot you can. Yeah, exactly. Which is fine. I will say. If he was asking the G league, then I'd be like, you got a lot to prove. Like, that's legitimately scary. But he wasn't. he is on a team

and so coming into the year we were like Jalen Green watch out like Reecher was going to come in and take your spot all this stuff Jalen Green had enough of a solid season to where you can see like if it's not Jalen Green it's going to be Devin Booker or it's going to be somebody

of that ilk so I'm not sure necessarily where Reecherper is fitting in especially because the way that EMA is running the team is very much like if you're if you're not guarding and you're not consistently giving given like 25 points a game you're just not going to play and because he's not even getting the opportunity to get there I'm not sure how to how to parse out his future especially like with the rockets so I'm inclined right now to go solid bench guy because eventually they're going to have to move on

from some of the young players they're going to have to start retooling I would say solid bench guy But see, you look and read Shepard still, and so beforehand, we thought he would be at least the elite role player. And from what you saw in his rookie year, now you think he's worse and will be the solid bench guy? Because that's the exercise here. The exercise is how you feel about him long term now. So same type of mindset as if it was a pre-draft projection, but it's after a year where you have the sample size.

You know, and you can't, you don't have to get to do away with what you thought before this season. You know, do you supplemented now? You really think his ceiling or what he will be is a solid bench guy? Maybe. I mean, because also, like, you know, you go through the whole draft process and you like start looking at guys. And there's some guys who you just fall in love with. And so you may be higher on them than what they actually are. And so my pre-draft notion of what Reed Shepard is or what somebody else is may not have been correct at the time. I'm not going to say it was right or wrong. But I'm saying the way he won't do it. I'm selling zero stock. I'm standing on it. I'm standing on all of it. He started against the OKC Thunder. On March 3rd, he played 31 minutes, 25 points, five assists. 70% on twos, 42% on threes.

He looked extremely good in that game. I saw that one. I didn't see this one, but he played against the Clippers. He started on April 9th, 7 for 14 from the field, 20 points, 4 assists. He shot 60% for 3, and then his third start is that late game year against the Lakers, where he played badly, 5 for 14 from the field, 14 points. Three starts, you know, it's a tag example. side of this house is absolutely nothing but

I don't know he's done nothing bro to like he's shown stretches he's at games where he doesn't look like he can't play you know no he looks like he belongs in those few games but it's such a hilariously small amount of games and all the the minutes he got

outside of that were so low leverage that I take almost nothing from it and even if guards who play full time roles as a rookie we know guard production as a rookie is so fake point guard struggles so much all the time. We know what happened to Trey Young.

We know what happened to Scoot. We see it all the time. Now those are two different ranges of outcomes there, what that could be after that season. But it's not crazy. Thorman in that conversation as well. Oh, Dary is Garland. He's very much in that, like,

he's very much that type of player as well. I still feel like I have no reason to sell my stock. Like he didn't, I wasn't shown, somebody else in this list will get to, that pick was pick number 10 overall. I have a lot of reason to sell my stock. We were shown a lot of poor play that I should feel worse now. I don't feel like I was shown any reason to feel worse

about him so I don't feel any reason to move him down. I'm not saying All-Star, but I feel like elite role player is still fair. You were saying All-Star pre-draft. And now I'm saying elite role players like, I said there's a ceiling of that, but I... You saw one stop. No, I'm just like... I guess... I don't know

about elite role player. I think he needs to earn that and so far he hasn't even been given the ability to earn that. I feel comfortable putting him in a starter. But did he lose that? Because you thought that beforehand, too. Did he lose that for you? He didn't lose it. It was just like, you have to have the, you have to have the opportunity to show it to me.

We have to keep part of it as our pre-draft notion and what we thought beforehand. Like, we don't have to make that irrelevant and go off of just this year. Like, we can use context. You're right. I agree. It's not, what content is. That's what I'm saying. Like the college and your other evaluation of who they'll be. You know, you don't, nothing exists in a vacuum.

You know, we don't only have to look at just this year in which say, you shot poorly now. I can't think you're going to be better. Like, there's a reason we thought he'd be good before that. Yeah, I, I agree. But like, there's going to be. players on this list who showed me physically more than some like reach separate and i don't feel comfortable putting them above him just yet so because of the timing of things i feel very fair in putting him in starter until he like the second that he plays like 10 straight games of like more

than 25 minutes a game then i'd be like okay there you go just to confirm everything i don't want to jump the gun too much just yet i need to see it starter it is i feel like you don't i feel like we'll look back in a year and we'll be like oh yeah that's an elite role player i feel very sure of that. I feel, I feel like decent of that as well. I just need to see it. Okay, and that's fair. If you just don't feel as confident in that, that's completely fine. If you do feel confident in that and you just don't want to do it because of sample size, I'd have

an issue with it. But if you just need it to be proven to you still, that's completely fine. We can go starter. Yeah. Okay. That's fair. Number four, Stefan Castle, the complete opposite of Rich Ebert. Given all the opportunity in the goddamn world. Maybe too much. Yeah, well, too much as far

as like his efficiency suffer because of it because he was just insane usage man after Victor Woman Yama got hurt and especially after Darren Fox went down with the surgery, all the touches in the world won rookie of the year because he had all the touches in the world and produced, right? You apply the rookie tax

you assume he's going to be a little bit inefficient because he's a goddamn rookie. He did well with that usage, I think, overall, right? You feel confident what you saw that he can handle that and that he's going to improve because of that usage and that it wasn't just a strictly you had a lot of touches. He did enough with that you feel good that he can handle it.

Where does that put you? Do you see an all-star ceiling? I think a lot of people would say yes, but there's still the big shooting concerns. He's a very good high floor player. Do you feel like the ceiling will be there? That's tough. No, I'm putting my hands up real quick.

I don't know if I see All-Star. I think as high as you can go on the elite role player tier, he will be at the top end of that. That's fair. Yeah, that's fair. That's what I see. I think he's Derek White and not Drew Holiday. Yeah.

Yeah. Like, and again, it's rookie year. one of my personal biases is just and as he gets stronger it'll get better but guys who are like big and taller who aren't great at the rim it is it is something where I'm like eh I think he will be good at the rim

most rookies aren't I think yeah most rookies aren't I think we see the flashes we see the ball handling we never feels good we see the good change of pace I think obviously you can't just with rookies you can't only look at like rim field goal percentage of course he will be good at the rim I believe I think he has the strength he has the desal

he has that style of play that you know everyone always said coming into the draft he looks like a she regent in that way i do believe he'll be a very good rim finisher he has the vertical oomph there that you think that he's not going to have athletic disabilities there that make him not be good enough he's going to be vertical and finish above people and through people with the finesse i think he projects it be a very good rim finisher it all comes down to the shooting to me do you project he'll be a good enough shooter because if he's not going to be an above average shooter i find a hard to believe he'll hit all-star but i do think elite role players like the floor i don't see any one world in which he's not a very very good role player yeah bare minimum that's where he belongs in my mind as well when it comes to all-star talk i think there's definitely a real world and where the spurs are elite one day they grab like 65 damn near 70 wins and yo they just they just belong they just 70 all-stars damn in the future i'm talking like fucking i mean he he for him deeran and wemby obviously like wemby's a hit but like you're asking for basically for them three to be like, you know, we're going to have three, those are the Wemby conversation.

We're going to have three guys on second year, all NBA or high. Wembe should be good enough that he had, at some point he'll win in 65 games at least. I know what you're saying. Yeah, exactly. And if that happens in turn, Stefan Castle has to play a big role in that I'd assume. Yeah. So I can definitely see a world in which he like just swoops into one max like two, three all-star games in his career.

As a rookie. Also, you think you think also because we're going to, because I'm looking at all-sign as like two or three. You think he can get to like three all-star games? He showed just as many flashes as Saar did, I think, just as many. Do you feel those flashes are quite as transcendent? Like, when we look at SAR, we say, okay, wow, if you hit the ceiling and you're a mobile shot blocker who can shoot threes and handle the ball and then somehow you get good at finishing

at the rim and shooting consistently, you'll be a star. Did he show you enough that you say, if we give him the same benefit of the doubt, if you're shooting develops and that becomes really good, that these other strengths that are obviously going to be elite, he's obviously going to be a very good defense. defender very good slasher good off ball as a cutter especially if you see the shooting get to be at least average do you feel like those things will carry him to all-star the one thing yes and no the only reason why is just because you already know we have when we here we have de air and so just overall like offensively like your usage and your in your ability to to really like I guess

showcase all of your skills in that way so situational yeah I don't think you should do that though I don't think we should do, like, would you make an All-Star with the specific team? I feel like it has to be more about the level of the player. I mean, he's a, he's a rookie in a young situation where they have one of the best young players. I think it's like this core, this core, at least him and Wembe, like, this core is going to be together for life. Yeah, but I don't really care about, like, you know, we talk about, I don't care if they actually make the All-Star. It's like, are you that level of player. So I don't want to give him tax against him.

We're talking about how good these players are. And we're like, yeah, but you got to play with Dierran. And, like, that's not really an evaluation of a skill. Yeah. I lie in between both of those things I'm like... But opportunity does matter So I get what you're saying

It's not like it's insane Yeah yeah exactly I lie in between both of those things I probably feel more comfortable Putting him in the elite role player tier As of now But I can definitely envision a world Where he just like

Average of 17 points When you're 16 points What plays like stellar defense Is the wing stopper for the Spurs Or whatever it is And it slipped into an all-star game But That's like a perfect world

Seeing Saar there And knowing how much bail we cut him and then Steph who also has these traits that show he shot 63% of the rim which isn't horrible for a rookie with that usage now the 33% from midrange is horrible the 29% of 3 is horrible so that is quite maybe we need to put star down because if someone the average person was to look at the system like pro what are these guys

they're not we're just fuck them we're just trying to project on what we think will happen we're trying to make this age well so we're trying to think about it five years from now when you look back at this what do you think it'll be and he can go either way it feels disrespectful in the moment but trying to divorce yourself from that like does he deserve the same benefit of the doubt

no so me because I don't think those skills stand out and aren't I think the word is used transcendent enough compared to Saar he probably wants to remain in that tier all right he also almost got hugged down by by racist like I don't know

obviously putting a lot on somebody's plate too early can be it's not always beneficial and so after Wembe and Fox go down and he's like all right Savon like run the show like that's not you know instantly going to be successful but I don't know

and maybe that just speaks more to how good research was playing more than a knock on castle. Yeah I feel like we might I don't know we can go with the role player clearly you two both want to do it there so I want to argue it too much but I kind of feel like he could be given the benefit for the doubt for All Star but it's so

fringe we can go elite role player Ron Holland To me this is between Starter or Solid Bench Guy From what we saw at Ricky Year right Similar situation Because he can't shoot even a little bit But man his energy is so good

The way he runs the transition A limited dog I think he We'll see if he can develop To be a good defender That's TBD It's not a other own possibility I think solid bench guy

I'm going solid bench guy The should be a starter But the shooting is a problem The shooting is wild It's wild And, like, yes, you can, if you play like Ron Holland and you have that much, that much energy, you can be on my team. He's a floater, man. His floater is nice.

He shot 52% from Florida range. I saw yesterday. He hasn't, he has a package attacking the rim, but he can do a little bit despite his limitations. And the body will develop. He'll get better as a slasher, I assume. Offense. If we're just talking offensively, though, because. What do you think he shot from the corner?

15%. I saw it. It was terrible. 19. Yeah. Damn. If we're just talking about his offensive game, I would put him in a lot to prove. But I think that his athleticism, his motor, all of that raises his, raises him up to solid bench guy.

If the offense comes around 40%, 50%, he's easily a starter. But that, it's a lot of questions offensively. So I think solid bench guy is a nice medium for him. Yeah, we're giving him a lot of benefits to doubt for we. think he just like looks like a player who's good and will be good like you see the it's all intangible as an eye test that that means something you know is development is weird but i think the shooting from him isn't just a bad shooter it's it looks atrocious like it's not going to ever be a threat so like someone like stepan castle i think we can give him someone like saar especially we can give

him benefit of the doubt he will develop as a shooter i don't feel like we can give that benefit for the doubt yeah no yeah tjohn's salon number six overall oh man this is not looking good bro yeah it's not looking good at all bro this is rough i don't know where to start when he comes to t john salon um i do uh we everybody was right i'll start there the world was right this pick happened we reacted to it on our live stream of the draft and we said whew it's kind of high all right i get wanting a wing between your star point guard and brandon miller who kind of like a shooting guard a little more finesse than he is playing big for his size.

You want a big wing there to fit with him long term. Okay, that makes sense. Modus Bezellos is right there. Tijon Salon was expected to go like 15 or 16, maybe. You could have traded back or picked a good player. What are you doing, bro?

But you picked the project way higher than you had to. Huh, that doesn't make a lot of sense. And who would have thought it's played out exactly that way? This would have been very palatable if he was a 19th pick and you'd say, okay,

he's the youngest guy in the draft, I've got to give him time. He was always going to be a project. He was never supposed to contribute day one. It's a little bit different when we know who you passed up on. We know the process to get there was you just picked your guy despite the strategy that could go into it. And I won't pretend that I watched a ton of him in the second half of the season.

Obviously, when the Mello went down and the playoff runs coming up, there's certain teams you kind of tune out to. Maybe he had some flash in the second half that I would not privy to. The Hornet's fans, there was a 10-game stretch where he was averaging like seven points. six rebounds he was shooting like 50 40s like his splits were pretty decent there's a 10 game stretch that a lot of hornet fans are going to point to and be like see like he is he's he's growing he's doing this and for him at least for being somebody who is who was unplayable in and out the g league to oh you actually look like a viable rookie that's cool but it's it's beyond a lot to

prove it like no matter no matter how good you have everything to prove Yeah, no matter how good of a stretch, he could average 30 in that 10-game stretch. And I would still come out here and say, it's not looking good because the entire season was just, it just looked too much for him. It just looked like he's just not in a, one, not in a great situation, but also he didn't do a lot to prove that he has enough of the skills to transcend whatever to be a solid NBA player. So I am not, I'm not super high. Yeah, again, I made sure to purposely this, the bottom tier doesn't say bust, doesn't say, doesn't say you're out the league. We're so far early into this. You really can only learn so much from a rookie year. So even the most disastrous of rookies, like I guess you can say it's him this

year, it's not looking good, but it's not over. You are the youngest player in the league. You do still have a chance to prove everybody wrong. By the end of year two, I'm willing to say somebody is cooked. By the end of year one, it's just not looking good. But we'll give you time. We'll see if those 10 game stretches start to pile up and you can prove people wrong. Hornets fans, I know you don't feel good about it. I'm not saying you should, but I will not say, he's done until the end of year two at the latest not just yet not just yet there's so much disarray in that organization and chaos and it sucks for someone like him to be thrown into that situation someone who needs a creator and all that to be set up needs some type of backline defense

to help his glaring flaws and whatnot he just set up to fail also in that situation yeah yeah we'll see man donovan clinging number seven overall i feel really really good about him i see him as a player i know his weaknesses and strengths. I see players who've had massive success in the league with his exact archetype and there's certain holes in his game that are clear as day, like, offensively. But regardless of the fact,

he belongs in bare minimum, the starter tier, but could very well be a elite role player. Yes. He is going to be one of the best room protectors in the NBA. That I feel good about. So the best defenders in the NBA is like a go bear, Anthony Davis,

this, Wembe, those guys kind of transcend being just a rim protector because they're so generational, have switchability, have all the defensive instincts that make them some of the best defenders of all time. Not saying that, but if you look below that, the traditional drop big rim protectors of Bisa Zubach this year, Klingan will be that good defensively. I feel almost certain about it. I'm going elite role player for me. But, but, but, but he sucks ass offensively right now. He's a non-factors. He is an incredibly bad rim finisher for his size. He's just as useless as on offense as this table you can't expect anything there's some really go bear hand stuff going on but he is young not the youngest rookies at all he had a couple years in college i don't know so defensively i think

he will be zu botch offensively i'm almost certain he won't be now he'll get better he's he is still a rookie like there's a pretty big difference between like what zach ed did as a rookie offensively and what clinging did his offensive skill set is nowhere near as polished wasn't expected to be that's the difference in their as prospects you saw that in the rookie year so Maybe he can be a lop threat, can do enough on the margins, it can work. You are confident in the defense, not in the offense. What do you do with that? I don't know.

So I'm looking at him. I think, like, for me, the point that I'm trying to, that I would love for him to get to is like a young Jared Allen. Like, I would want him to get to that point where, like you said, I'm not even thinking that he's going to turn into a player that's going to average 15, 60s. 16 points per game. It's really, can you be a consistent, like, play finisher? And while I do hate seven-footers who are not good at the rim, his defense is really,

really good, man. And I think that even just that alone, having, we talk about it so much in that having a big who can protect the rim, who can anchor your defense, it provides such a solid foundation for your team moving forward. And so even if that is just, is just who. who he is, I think that in itself can make him an elite role player because of the value and because of what he does at his position defensively. So I'm going to go down with you.

Let's do it. Because I think there's a world in which he gets to near DPOI level interior defenders. Yeah. Another interesting caveat in his game, too, that's really going to be able to raise his ceiling is seeing his willingness to try to step outside every other leg game. So far, or this first season for him, he took about 50. and made 14 of them. It's about 20%.

Now, of course, that's not good whatsoever. But for a rookie big who had zero expectations to be able to do that, seeing him have the awareness and also be put in the position to step out and just at least attempt them, very, very, very valuable. And it could raise the ceiling and overall value in the league tremendously. So I feel good about a league role. It was taking, bam, years to start, you know, stretching out and or stepping out and doing that. And he's a great rebounder too, which is another 7-2 big rebounder,

should be an elite shot blocker, good drop coverage big. I don't think his feet are complete summit. I think he has good enough mobility that he can be a true elite defender one day. Yeah, elite role player is fine. If we think you're going to be one of the best interior defenders in the league, that gives you a high floor, he's going to get better offensively. He's not going to have stone hands forever. He's going to get at least to be a good dump-off dunker at the minimum.

That's going to get developed. The lead role player is cool. Yeah, I agree. the second that he's able to step outside and be more comfortable hips-wise and feet-wise guarding smaller players, hey man, he could slip into an All-Star game one day. Yeah. Okay. Number eight, Rob Dillingham.

Where do you go with Mr. Shifty? Mr. Shifty, bag man. He didn't have a big role. Fans were clamoring for him to have more of a role. I think he showed some decent flashes, but mostly because the team needed, there's a time in the season where they desperately needed some ball handling juice, and he provided that. So the idea of Rob Dillingham was really, really. really appealing Timberwolves fans for a lot of this season but you know he's a tiny rookie so

none of the like performance based metrics were like amazing how could they be he is tiny and obviously he's time to develop I kind of feel like solid bench guy is still if he thought he was going to be new age Jamal Crawford new age Lou Williams beforehand you could probably still think that I 100% still yeah why not every time I see his highlights I'm like yo this is an instant offense professional score type of type of player and it's just it's just fun it's it's fun watching watching him play obviously because of his size you're never going to look to him to be like a lockdown guard until you're not going to you're not going to ever ask that of him a lockdown guard we put the bar a lot lower listen I'm done I like him but he's like there's going to have to

be a lot of stuff in place for him to be a consistent starter on teams that are making deep, deep runs into the playoffs. And he's going to have to be, you know, providing so much offense for it to be worth it to have them out there. So solid bench guy is fine for me. Yeah, yeah. The evaluation is still what it was. He's very similar to Reed Shepard in that you didn't see a time.

Like, so evaluation should probably be what it was before. Now, he got a little bit more of an opportunity than Reed did, but just a little bit. Not that much. It was very inconsistent throughout the season. I feel safe, assuming he's exactly who we thought he'd be. Yeah, I feel perfectly fine with him. as a solid bench player.

Something that did surprise me coming into the season seeing how more developed he was as an actual point guard. I think he had more outside. Obviously, like the scoring juice and the perimeter stuff is fantastic and fancy, but one of my biggest questions to him is like, okay, you're a small guard, no defense. You can shoot, nice handle. But what else, how can you fight the game

in other ways without necessarily putting the ball in the basket or getting who will kill him highlights? He's been passing the ball. He was passing the ball more well than I initially thought he would be. And if he continues to build on that and if the opportunity presents itself, he could easily be a starter. Yeah, he still has the juice that you want to keep following him over the coming years and see what it becomes. Yeah. Number nine, Zachary Eadie, a man who was subject of much slander during the NBA playing tournament when they played the Golden State Warriors.

and in his first ever NBA playoff game as a Ricky big man who is huge has extreme highs, extreme lows he was asked to go out there and perform against Draymond Green the greatest defender of his generation top five defender of all time Jackie had to go out there and contend with him

and my God did Draymond embarrass him people were saying acting like Zachity he's never made a lay-up a day in his life because Draymond was terrorizing him under the room getting into his handle disrupting him he could not finish anything and people were slandering him like he was just Bobon right

acting like he was useless but in that same game he had a lot of rebounds defended the rim well deterred shots well I'll say this his rookie year went precisely

as you could have predicted it he is really immobile gets in foul trouble a lot because if you blow by him he's going to foul you because he's big and lumbering that's a problem but remember I liked him a lot

for the draft I said he was going to step into the league and be one of the best offensive rebounders in the NBA that happened He's a 95th percentile offense rebounder, 98th percentile defensive rebounder. I think he's a pretty good rep protector for a drop big with that size. Does a lot of, second half of the year, or last 12 games of the year, after Taylor Jenkins was fired, did it a lot more screen setting with him.

And I think he looked pretty good as a roller. They do a good job of establishing him, his size down low and feeding him and making him a constant threat you have to respect. To me, he's exactly who, up highs and lows, exactly who we could have thought he'd be. I'm going to start with him. I agree. for those for those reasons i look at him and it's like all right he's just he's like stephen adams but like you know a little a little bit not a little bit but just taller right like he is i i really like to his screen setting his offensive rebound and obviously is is one

of the the the things that you look at his game and are very excited about if you can do just those two things that's that's awesome like you can start on a whole bunch of teams i don't think that his offensive game is ever going to grow to be like one of the best out of bigs in the league. And I do think that his, his offense is going to be dependent a lot on who's playing point guard with him. Yeah. Like, because he's going to be asked to, to set a lot of screens. If that connection is, is good. And that's why I'm, like, when I talk about him, I'm thinking about Stephen Adams, because you think about, like, that connection between, like, Russ and Stephen Adams and how hard those screens were and all these dump off passes. And if you can get that

between him and Jai, then maybe there's a possibility of him going to like elite role player if you really get some synergy there. Yeah. But I think for just in a vacuum around the league, he is a starter. Bro.

The biggest issue people have with him coming off of this playing tournament and into the postseason is his rim finishing. It's the number one question you have about fucking Zach Eady long term is can he finish at the rim? Yes, he will get better at that.

He will not face his Raymond Green every game who's a perfect defender disrupt that. If that's your biggest concern, he will be just fine. Now, it does get ugly When he has to rotate out the perimeter And defend isolations He fouls so much

That needs to get better To be expected He's a 7-4 Ricky Big Man That was always gonna be rough to start His ceiling will be defined On how he can develop And deal with those weaknesses

Learn the right angles Learn the right way To use his type of athleticism To make up for the lack of speed With length That is where we decide If we'll be in the role player or not But starters to me

I think he's already He's a good starter now So I feel like that's 22 He should be a lot better now the ceiling will be defined by those things I agree I think start is a good place for him and it's one of the more obvious placements on the list

for me yeah number 10 Cody Williams take the floor this is your guy he had a great app session with him about non-basketball related things it was great talking with the combine came on our show we talked about future I think

what else we laugh he was real funny guy we laughed a lot I'm just gonna go ahead and slide him right there yeah next player Okay, number 11, we got modest Wuzellis of the Chicago Bulls. This is an all-star. I was going to say, if you beat me to it, I was going to take the floor.

I feel my, I don't know if this is a hot take. I feel like it's, I can't say a guarantee because nothing's a guarantee with rookies. I'll say it. I feel 75% sure. As sure as you can beat without it being a guarantee with a rookie player, he will be an all-star. I feel like it is so clear. It didn't get talked about a lot. I can talk about a little bit.

Didn't get talked about on the national stage because nobody cares about the Bulls. And it was a second half of the year development. a lot of March basketball development, he was straight up extremely good in the second half of the year and shows every single sign you want to see from somebody that can be an all-star from a wing.

Yeah, I agree. Once the doors got wide open for him in terms of opportunity and the Zach Levine's are out of the way, they were somewhat leaning on him and depending on him and because of the skills that he showcased on the court,

which is the three level ability, the ability for him to be like a special and like very creative driver while having pretty much an all-around game and not necessarily like showing an ability to just not have a ounce of being a good defender one day

or not having an ounce of being a good shooter. Like he has an all-around package and driving to me specifically and creativity around the rim is what sets him apart from everybody in this draft and I think he has the highest ceiling out of everyone too. Like similar to, I'm not going to say he's like

going to be Janus or an all-time really. player but when it comes to like being surefire like he should be all-star i feel the most confident in yeah he's a steel draft in a similar way that i feel very confident we'll look up in five years and say this is clearly the best player from this draft i've been sitting on it i tweet about a few times i was like oh i kind of think you know there's not very many people i'll take above him then i was like i probably would only take sar above him now i feel like i'm clearly taking him number one in his class i had to start some some scratch from one round one guy from the start of march to the end of the year, 13.6 points, five rebounds a game, shooting 39% from three, 80% from the line,

which is always good to see. You like for the free throw percentage to kind of match up with the shooting split, so it's not like, oh, this guy, you know, it's just getting hot. You see that. And whenever, like, and you talked about it with his driving, there's times where he has the ball with his confidence is just, you can, you can see it. And he, like, he has the ball and you can feeling you can you can feel his aggressiveness going going to the basket doing all these different things being put in in i guess better positions as the year went on to showcase his athleticism yes but when you are when you're that athletic when your shot is coming around when you are aggressive driving to the basket yo the ceiling is super super high he's a 96 percentile shot blocker

for wings as a rookie and block percentage so the percentage of opponent field goal is you block yeah 96 percentile as a rookie and i did the same thing where i look at the stats in the second half of the year. I filtered it since January 1st. So I looked at an even bigger sample size. 65% of the rim, plenty good for a rookie, 46% from mid-range. That's good as hell, like for anybody. 37% from 3% and 40% from the corner.

Three-level scoring in the second half of the year in a complimentary role, filling the lanes, runs really well in transition. And, you know, like, before the draft, before the year at the G-League Ignite, coming into that season, he was viewed as a number one prospect. People thought he would be the number one pick. like the way everyone like penciled in cooper flag

it wasn't as much of a pencil because cooper flag is fucking generational but zaki modest bezelis kind of occupied that mental spot before the season started that he would be the number one guy then it fell off because the g-league ignite was a nightmare and most importantly it fell off because he couldn't shoot well from three in that time playing on a team with no point guards they had literally had zero point guards no structure

it was a complete bullshit of organization simply put if they knew he would shoot 40% from the three for an extended period of time as a rookie he probably would have been the number one of real pick yeah I agree his athletic ability and how he's able to set him

it's like he maximizes every single ounce of the 610 or 611 sometimes feel like he's 7 foot ability in him and along with his like with his way he like contorts his body towards the rim and just puts himself in some very specific situations yeah especially

he's he's special he's special and he has a level of special in his game that just sets him depart from everybody else. That feels so concrete. I mean, you say special, what I think you're describing is also it was handle. That's a big difference in young players and wings in general. A big difference between a wing who can be 3 and D and then a lot of times you see a guy like that and you say, oh, if this develops and keeps doing this, like a Deandre Hunter as a rookie,

he was drafted and said, three and D guy, maybe he can develop and has some chops to do this and that. The limiting factors usually their handle doesn't develop and they just can't get by guys with any source of consistency, even if they're fast-faring transition and would test well in a 40 yard dash it's not applicable because they don't have necessarily ball handling skills

to make the most of that burst this motherfucker has all the ball handling needed all the burst he has all of the one oh you know when we talked about the combine he was talking about how much he loves bag work and how much he like looks at mellow

and our preconceived notion of him wasn't that when you look at him play in the G league and then he came up here and he was like I want to do hezzy tween pulls I want to get in the post and be a five level threat he's like people what he say he was like people think there's three levels of scoring there's really five yeah and he was like

describing all this post acumen that he wants to have I am fully certain that he will have the craftiness necessary as a ball handler to be a self-created type of score in his prime and I think the difference with that is or if you really want to get into it to his decisiveness as an offensive player and how he's able to just like see defenders and have a move for each and every move the defender tries to counteracted as well exactly and so that also just things that I don't want to say you can't get developed because most definitely you can but it's one of the more it's one of the hardest skills

and traits to develop as an offensive player in this league and he has it day one yeah instincts it's hard it's hard to teach instincts you get rare situations where people improve their basketball IQ a lot while being in the league but a lot of times you're kind of just born with it or not let's put him ahead of

Alexar yeah I feel like there should be another to you that he can go to me just bad that you both think they'll be all start obviously he's a more sure thing mostly because I don't want to have to change the visual that's been on the screen the whole time I have to reframe the whole thing

I'm not doing that but okay that's clear we all feel very good this is a pro modest Vuzellas podcast always has been damn I feel like it's so like stark between like my

comfortability and saying like Alexar is going to be an all star versus like modest blues I almost feel like Alexar should be like demoted that has nothing to do with him just because you feel like modest there's nothing to do with him

it has nothing to do with him I'm just talking about like the skills are so surferfired with a modest that like I don't know if I'm like so Yeah like like like you You guys just want another tier And we're not gonna do that

Because I have to change a lot of editing stuff Like do you feel like they're in the same Just pretend I just want to kick down AlexR That's literally I don't want a new tier No You don't agree I do feel much more confident

about modas but also i don't think that we can like say because it's not like we're putting them in like a bc tier it's like yeah yeah it's just like do cross this threshold to get into this tier and so i do think that's the all-star tier could go on forever it can go up until lebron james tier so like you can look at you know what this is how we do this bam oh wait uh there we go he's the top of the tier all right it's hilarious i'm with that and let's put castle above risa shay to be in the top of this tier hey no that's fine oh whoa whoa And then this is cool. Way too much movement.

Way too much movement. I do not agree with this. And then, yeah, now the tiers are perfectly ordered. We'll order all the tiers. Perfect order. Keep that to yourself, sir. I actually feel better about reed than clinging, but so whatever.

Yeah, we'll look at it as like a pseudo order. Look at it going across all the way down. That's like the order. And that feels fair now. Who's next? Bob Carrington. We're going to skip a couple of players. Topich didn't play.

Devin Carter had a mixed role. Didn't play the start of the season. Huge injury as well. I don't have a good read on how good Devin Carter is from his rookie year. Bub Carrington. This is another one that is, you look at the Wizards, and you see the got these three rookies that perform pretty well. As a rookie, you know, they're building a good infrastructure there.

We feel good about the program they're building and how these players will play off of each other. Bub is all flashed in the same way Sar is. Not actually, like, efficient production. He's a rookie point guard. You're not expecting them to. But man, the man can handle the ball. I see a little bit Kobe White in there,

maybe not quite as quick, but the like shittiness knifing through the paint i i feel like the u killum i the eye test signs are pretty good above garrington they they are he's a he's a solid mid-range shooter he doesn't really turn the ball over which obviously which for any point guard is always nice to see that that in itself like not just solid 48% for mid-range that's like really fucking good that's not just that's good outright for any player that's that's peak that's peak that boy nice the only worry for me about his game right now obviously again he's a rookie so there's this is the worst that he's ever going to be seeing how he doesn't want to get into the paint as much yeah is like a major red

flag because considering it's like doing that opens up a ton of a myriad of abilities of you and your game and your team offensively but the bare bare bone what he is now like in my mind he could just be a regular starter i'm thinking solid bench guy for now because he's not a good rim finisher not a good three point shooter he's all handle and mid-ranged ability right now he's a great floater game and a great handle that i feel like he's like a bigger rub building him yeah again i think obviously you know there's a range of outcomes everything could develop but i feel like solid bench guy is like a flawed player that shows signed that sounds like ron holland to me yeah he so his his his three-point shot

was coming around towards the end of the year i don't know if that feels like ron holland though Because his skills feel more refined. These couple of skills feel more refined, but there's a lot of them that aren't. Like, I mean, yeah, his on-ball skill set is more refined. That's what he does.

But inversely, his defense is less refined than probably Ron Hollins is. His three-point shot is if he, not refined. The rim finishing is incredibly unrefined. Like, the passing doesn't, I mean, I don't,

maybe he was better pass on I thought. But there's a lot of question marks still that aren't. If you guys don't go starter, I won't argue it to death, but I feel like putting him next to Ron Holland and Dillingham feels fair, especially Dillingham. I'll say starter just because you said that that man, Ron Holland was doing 19% from

the quarter. Right? That like I, there's, there's stuff in his offensive game that is not only unrefined, it's kind of non-existent. And so you really have to go up like two levels for Ron Holland to get to a point where you're like, oh, if this can be a consistent part of your game, then we're good. where as I feel like for for bub we're kind of at that point already where it's we're looking for that consistency and then we can get there so that's why I'm more inclined to put him in starter than

yeah you want to say that we feel good about his passing chops continue to develop and the three point shot was 34% it's not I'm not bad I didn't mean to say it's horrible I just meant that I don't think he'll be a great rim finisher so I'd want to see more signs that he'll be a really good shooter and I don't think he'll be a non shooter so maybe I made it sound like I think he's like Ron Holland I don't I just think that it's not yeah I don't I just think that it's not yeah It didn't project to me like, oh, this is going to be a lethal off the dribble three-point shooter that makes up for the lack of rem aggression. Yeah. So that just sounds like a very flawed point guard that think about that archetype.

How many of them are starters? Yeah. I can agree with that. I can agree with that. Just a starting point guard. And I don't have a good feel for his defense. Maybe Wizards fans think will be a good defender. That's never come across to me, but I don't have a strong opinion on that.

I haven't gotten there. But let's just put them at starter. Let's put them in. I think Fuck it No No but I think I think to be

To be one To be a point guard And to not turn the ball over A lot Personally that that means a lot to me I think the fact that you Already do have One offensive skill that is

Towards the top of the league That also means a lot Yes you have to work on your three point shot Yes you have to work out On your finishing at the room But You already have something that you can go to And get off

and operate at a high level those two things working together that's why i think starter yeah i'm not i'm not like down on bucarington or anything i just feel like it really just comes back to read every time i see him there that i'm like if that's the quintessential you love who i project i yeah i think they're different going to be a different class of player and even like ed if i'm more certain about being who he's going to be but i'm not mad at it it can go either way so yeah i think i'm more sold on his three-point shooting which helps me believe that he has a place in this league he's shot 81% from free throw

line as old which is like a strong Yeah, solid bench guys have a place in this league too that's exactly the verbage I would use

he has a place in this league for sure and has a place in this league is to me a solid bench guy yeah for sure I agree

but I was going to say he had a place in his league as a starter somewhere along the lines as well yeah okay that's fair

I guess honestly the delineation between starter and solid bench guy is often how good your team is yeah so it's really

starter on a good team is what that means because solid bench guys can be a starter on a bad team yeah So it's really like, do we envision you being a starter in a contender, basically?

And sure, sure, why not? Next up, what pick was he? He was 14, 15, we have Khalil where. I still don't know if it's Kalil or Kelel. I think it's Kalil. No, I think it's the... It's Kelel, like Superman? Yeah.

I feel like I've seen people say both on broadcast, so I have no clue. Where? What do you guys want to do with where? The, honestly, very, if we want to talk about traits and you want to talk about, flashes. I'm a motherfucker like AD sometimes That's that

That man had That man was in the Running through the air He was in the running For rookie of the air Off like four good games Because he looked magical He can run like a gazelle

He's one of the fastest Centers in the league Probably will be a good Lop threat And projects to be a good shooter from the position Already gets them up Obviously the efficiency

Will get better As he gets older You would hope So Don't see him being a good Passer Probably not a lot of Self-creation

going on there From that frame But Listen man a rim rolling lob threat who can block shots and shoot threes he has a place in this league the ceiling is crazy you can play on my team the ceiling is outrageous any team in them exactly

I kind of feel like we're looking at elite role player here I'm cool with that I yeah I think everything you said is true to have to have somebody yeah those those trade to those flashes they got me they got me I'm a fan yeah I mean again it's it's very tantalizing you could very well see it not developing and you're like Oh, we got shocked by the who everyone thinks are getting the next Wembe and so forth.

It can not work out. It really comes down to how disciplined of a defender he is because we know he has the size and the physical traits to be a good shot blocker. It all comes down to how he develops. And I don't think he's a bad defender now. I don't think he's starting from a low point. So if he can be an above average good rim protector that can play effective drop and keep his feet moving and be able to give you a little bit of defensive versatility with that speed he has,

I feel like it'll be hard for him not to be really good. I agree. Like he'd have to be, he'd have to like, he's going to be able to shoot. he's able to dunk he would have to be like the biggest idiot in the world offensively and I don't think that

he looks like he's a very good IQ player that doesn't strike me as a weakness at all to be that archetype and not be good you gotta have nothing going on between the eyes

and that is not how I would describe him all right the only role player it is yep okay the next up Jared McCain number 16

we've talked about him a lot we obviously feel like he would have won Ricky the year if he didn't get hurt we feel like he has at a very high ceiling already an elite shooter Elite offball mover

Talking about a lot going on between the eyes He's a high IQ player Small so probably not going to be the best defender I think he has a little bit of passing chops I don't think he's a black hole there Definitely Small sample size So we only saw the good

That maybe that could have came down But the high high of individual skill As an off ball shooter That's at least an elite role player I think Bare minimum you're right I agree he can't go no lower than elite role player Obviously there's like literal limitations In terms of how he's able to get

his shit off due to size and whatnot and how impactful he is all around on the game or on the court. But bare minimum, he's an elite role player. If you guys want to, if you guys think that he has a puncher's chance of making an all-star game, which I think so, I'll be okay with spending him there. But Barry Minow, I feel so good about every team. He's just going to get limitless like NBA contracts for the rest of his life. Yeah. Because that ability to shoot as well he does on or off the ball. You open first in this tier, about Castle? Yes. Okay. Yeah, that's fair i think punch your chance is a good way to say if you told me he developed into an all-star not impossible he would just have to be like actually win the best shooters in the league

because he's never going to be this like dynamite at the rim just with the physical limitations he's not big and he's not that fast not to say he's slow you knows how to use his angles really well and he's quicker than he is fast that but he's not a burner he's not going to be a downhill elite slasher like step on castle is with that size and vertical so to be an all-star he has to be one of the best shooters in the league play on a really good team because he's probably going to have to be your like second or third all-star a lot of questions and not quite as high of an all-sword level floor but elite role player to me I would be baffled if he's not that I agree I always say

he already is that so yeah I think he's going to be Des and Bain is I think the outcome okay I'm cool with that yeah yeah and doesn't basically slip into an all-star game sometime in his career we all agree like he is an all-star caliber talent right below right below slip in he can slip in the same way that Goron Drojic slipped in as an alternate So he's like right below You deserve to be an All-Star Yeah, I'm going to Elite role player

That feels right I think a little bit better Than Goran Drager's I'll say like Mike Conno Hey man Mike Colleen was special I wouldn't go that full Mike Colley was good He's turning into Unk

Yeah Mike Connolly was an elite defender People don't remember He was a good defender He didn't remember They remember that guy getting attacked By Luke Donchish I don't remember Green Grind

He was athletic Oh man First 30 million dollar contract in the NBA. Oh man, you're right. He was like the richest player in the NBA for like for summer. Yeah. Okay.

Dolphin Connect number 17. Tell me about your, about your pasty prints. I don't know, solid bench guy, I guess. I don't think he has a ceiling of read. I don't think,

I mean, I guess he's, no, he's because he's so old. He doesn't have, you can give Bub Carrington more. You think he has a lot to prove or no? No,

no, no, he is a solid bench guy. He had a in-and-out role because the team is contending. If he was on the Charlotte Hornets If that trade went through He would have put up fucking numbers He would have been going crazy

He would have been going crazy He was set up the ball Like 17 Bronx 41% from the field I think he's an old rookie That showed enough flashes With his roles consistent He is a really Really terrible defender

Off ball defense He has nothing going on up there right now He has a lot to learn But he can shoot He can cut His biggest issues Are that he has to figure out

A lot of the mental side of the game And he was thrusted into a team That's contending And you want him to be a little further along that because he's so old but I think he'll improve there so I think he has a low ceiling and a high floor solid bench guy feels completely fine

all right okay I feel good about that yeah he's similar to a lot of these guys especially the older guys like Edie they are who we thought they were yeah he went 17 for reason that's where you draft a solid bench guy next up on our list 21 we got east missy

okay so interesting player flawed but has some good strengths Yeah, we've seen players, like, in time and time through and through, like, over the last few years of the NBA, last 10, 15 years of NBA. I think when I view him, any team would like to have him a part of the roster, big, athletic, great athlete in terms of his ability to run up and down the floor and very flexible and all that. I think he, bare minimum, is probably going to be a good starter in the league, but he has the ceiling of a new, I don't feel good about Elliott, player just yet but started i would leave role players had the equation for me i think he's either i think he's either a starter or a solid bench guy yes he's very athletic good vertical room contester for sure he can

jump for sure not a good drop defender yet he's currently a defender in the same way that like young yannis was where it's not super disciplined technically but is a really good weak side shot blocker because his length and speed and ability to just be athletic there he has that instinct in him i think would be a good shot blocker has a lot to work on to be an anchor defensively and the instinct is to be like Oh, Javelle McGee Insert X athletic big that can run up and down the court and catch lobs

Pretty fucking bad rim finisher right now And he's kind of slight for that build I'm sure he'll build a body out And he'll get better there But I'm not encouraged offensively I'll say that I think he could be a good defender But he has to build up the fundamentals around

His traits which is always the case for guys like this He could do that If you told me he's a really good backup big that wouldn't shock me. I agree with you. But I think on motor alone, he's going to be a starter. Okay, we go starter. Yeah, he, he goes on.

I feel good enough of other traits that. And, you know, that's like a really easy role to hit your ceiling in compared to other roles. Like, if you play with the right guard that can set you up and use your strengths and mitigate your weaknesses, it's pretty easy to get to your ceiling compared to, like I said, compared to other archetypes. So I'm cool giving him benefit of the doubt.

I agree. Yeah, he got it. Okay, who's next on this list? I'll pull it back up. Kishon George, the third Washington wizard here. I love Kishon, George. I love Kishon, George. Shout out to, shout out to the Wizards.

I think they have another, at least starter and at least starter for you. I feel better about Kishon George than I do about Carrington. And that's fair. That's fair. That's what I'm saying. At least minimum starter. And if they go ahead and, you know, if the lottery odds bless them and they end up getting flagged, and you have a defense moving forward with George, Sarr, and Flag, that's nasty.

George's a good defender, man. He puts guys in shackles. And, like, he's going to be a 3-D guy, especially as they build out the roster and they have more gifted players that come in, like a hopefully Cooper Flag or whoever may be. He has a little bit in his bag. Like, he has some good in-between game. He's really good at throwing his shoulders, throwing those elbows, knocking guys off, getting to those little driving lanes where you can create separation with your elbows

and deselling for your little floater mid-range game, he has some of that in there. He's a really good shot blocker. Like, he's good at one-on-one defense. Oh, he's a stock's merchant. Like, he gets wherever the ball is, he's going to be around the ball. Yeah, fantastic, a rotating rim defender for a three,

which is an incredibly valuable archetype that is overlooked a lot. It's part of like why OG and Inobes is such a good defender. It's more about the interior than it is one-on-one. I'm going to put my arms out and stop you from driving. The interior defense is going to be a big strength of his. I think he'll do some secondary ball handling, attacking closeouts you see the signs of being a good three-point shooter good one-on-one defender quintessential three and d guy i don't know what team wouldn't love to have him on their

team bro he seems like a he should have went in my mind like top seven probably in this draft looking back we're i think ease are going to look back about how we did a redraft yeah easily for sure for me personally interesting so those top two tiers you put him like between clinging and where actually because reed still there i think seven might be harder than you think but seven might be a little i don't know because i mean you stand on it stand on it you got modest you got saar you got read you got jared mcane you got castle you got risa shay that's six the bed is on castle in my mind oh you're out you're out of your mind you're out of your mind it might be on castle it might be on castle hell no i like i like

i like chashon droid a lot not that much hell not yeah all right brother you got it it's not ridiculous these are all young players in a close draft they that could you could be Right. I can definitely I get 100% imagine a world where people pull this clip up in two years and I'm like fuck no

and they're like look at Kishon George she just dropped 30 he had a game winner and I'm like I got it next up Terrence Shannon Jr. The slashing

extraordinary for the Minnesota Timberwolves had some flashes had a famously really good game against the Lakers sooner after Luke could trade in which they beat them

I think they were shorthanded that game he got a lot of minutes man that guy is a bullet attacking the rim yeah yeah he's every single out he uses every ounce of the six seven six eight frame and i was the biggest fan

of his coming out of college i see i've watched him play over here at illinois over the last like two three years or whatever and seeing the three level scoring and the defense and the length that he just he just makes himself feel known and apparent on the court he's always like people know he's playing people feel him on the court me personally i feel okay with putting him at solid bench guy but deep down in my heart I feel like he's bare minimum of a starter solid bench guy's fair he's a he's a slashing specialist he's an older guy so solid bench guy's very fair

yeah we'll see okay yeah I think there's definitely a pathway for him to be a starter but there's there's a few more things in his game that need to be yeah I think I mean he could be a starter but I think it it really would just depend on like what the team construction is is like and how his defense develops over time yeah

okay uh Ryan done you know preseason can around he shot like 42% from three in the preseason everybody lost their minds we were like oh my gosh is this going to be one of the single biggest offseason developments we've ever seen from a prospect in the history of modern NBA draft discourse and then you know the season it returned to normal he went back to shooting 31% from three but he will be a very good defender that team was a shit show he was one of the only athletes that had some juice on the team I think he will be a very good elite defender offensively

I have absolutely no clue to take away from the season And that's why I'm I kind of want to put him in In a lot to prove Because what Oh no he's gonna be a great defender I don't know

No that's different A lot to prove It means like you have nothing Just like hang your hat on in my mind A lot to prove is like damn You're not looking good bro Like yeah Then why have the tear

I don't know I didn't just should have got this way I don't know Maybe you want to put Tijon salon there I mean no we're just We're just gonna go through this whole thing And it's not gonna be anybody You're right, but I don't fall obligated

Put him there just because he's the worst guy I'm not putting him there because of obligation I just think Listen 40% on free throws He does not profile as a good shooter So I think solid bench bench guy minimum is

He does have a lot to prove offensively I mean you have to be a good enough shooter I guess so But his defensive floor is very high He's going to be a very good defender But I guess it's hard to be a defensive specialist If you have no offensive juice to you Like you look around the league

Those guys don't last very long. You look at Jerry Vanderbilt. It's kind of tough to keep you on the court sometimes if you don't have any semblance of a jumper. Okay, maybe I do like a lot to prove the more that he's talking about it. For the specific archetype, it's like imperative that you can get to serviceable level

and he has a lot to prove to get there. So I guess we'll let you know. All right. They call them a madman. I guess we'll put Ryan and then a lot to prove. Fair enough. Isaiah Collier. Similar situation.

he can't shoot even a fucking little bit it is just nothing as a three-point shooter but he has, I loved him for the draft he has remembered one of my guys I hoped he can shoot better than he has but the idea I had of him was being a downhill

fast point guard that can create paint touches and use that to be a very good passer and he's an even better passer than I thought some of his per 36 minutes passing stats are ridiculous like per minute he's the best passing rookie by far he was actually like a top 10 passing point guard in terms of assist for the second half of these year that is going to be real strength he's going to be a dimer that can create a pain touch

i don't know how much faith we should have in the three-point shot to come around yeah nothing's impossible he's not a loss cause he shoots him he's not ben simmons the biggest ex-actor for ex-actor for me is his gauge on my gauge on him on defense which i have like little to none and if he doesn't end up pan panning out to be like a solid defender he's going to be a starter in this league and i think the playmaking might be just so good that you have to figure out a way to build around that yeah it screams to me i mean a guy who's a really good passer but the scoring has to come along it sounds like a solid bitch guy to me sounds like t j mcconnell coming up like those guys exist all the time yeah uh that that sucks

because uh i really do want him to be to be hired he can't he can't for sure like it's not impossible i think there's a there's definitely a world in which i have to move he's messy down no no no no i want i want him to be hired but i'm with you i don't i don't i'm with you i There just has to be a little bit more of... I just need to see it a little bit more to actually believe in it in terms of his full offensive game. When it comes to, the shooting is bad. The difference in him in East Missy is that, like I said,

is the reallessness of hitting that floor from their archetype. It's very easy to become a starter as an athletic room running big. It's not very easy to become a starter as a point guard that can't shoot at all. That's very hard to do. Like, you have to be fucking transcendent to be a black hole as a point guard shooter these days. Yeah. I don't think it'll be Black Hole forever. I don't think so at all.

I think he'll probably get the competency, but it's not a given. I would be being biased if I said, we can assume he'll be a good shooter. Okay. Okay, it's okay. Jalen Wells, potential rookie of the year, probably going to finish second or third.

Very good on-ball defender. On a good team as a rookie, having an important role. Already a starter. Already a starter. Sounds like an elite role player to me. I don't know if I've, how much more of a ceiling do we think he has

than what he is now? I mean, he can, he can obviously be a more consistent shooter because that kind of went away like he hit the rookie wall but so if he is hitting he's 21 by the way

okay 21 that's fine if he's hitting the if he's hitting the threes at the clip that he was earlier in the year you you add what like 5% growth on that a little bit yeah you add you add just a little bit I take that back I think he's probably gonna be a starter usually role player for a rookie yes

yeah three D guys guys go to a starter everybody we have another role player has like some juice to him like we think these bigs can be you only there's any juice who else not really for any like on ball stuff do you like almost defense that's no no no no like

offensive oh no I don't know okay yeah I think he's very good and we'll be very good but I don't know that could prove us wrong maybe this is a lazy take maybe Grizzies fans will point to certain things as well and we're just have a blind spot to him but he had such a refined role this year that he did so well that I'm assuming he didn't just do that forever and he didn't maybe it maybe was lack of opportunity but he doesn't have like crazy physical traits that I'm like giving the opportunity he's going to get into more of his rim scoring bag yeah no he's just he's a small guy

he's not a crazy shooter doesn't have crazy handle feels like he's going to be good 3d player forever all right cool last player on this list the other second round pick we have quentin post just a solid bench guy and I think that this has a lot to do with if you are a big who can shoot threes there's a place for you in this league and he can really shoot three he can really shoot he broke off or he earned a spot on this list

in the second half of the year by you know the Warriors one of the biggest question marks around Jonathan Kaminga was the fit because the only way to get to five hours pacing on that team and enable his slashing was by having

Draymond Greenplay Center who didn't want to do that full time then the same situation applies when Jimmy Butler comes over turns out they have they had a fucking five out spacer right there who's also seven feet tall can also do a little bit of rebounding and drop coverage big defending that makes the jimmy butler transition so much smoother having him play instead of trace change this team and enable them to be how good they are and even if

he never becomes like an elite elite rebounder or defender you're seven feet tall and you can shoot threes yes you can you can you can play and you will have a role on certain teams to play in limited minutes and every team you are at minimum a solid bench guy I agree now if you can you can you If he improves on those things, now we're talking elite role player, right? If he can, if he can, if he can, if he can, if he can, if he can, I lose the words. If he can improve on defense. Yeah, if you can improve on defense or have another, like, layer of offense to him when it comes to, ironically, of like, have a post game to him, then, yeah, like, he's going to be easily a starter in this league, pushing like a league role player. But also asking, asking a seven-footer to be like, hey, we want you to shoot 40% from.

and then improved to be a great defender and a good rebounder like yeah just be just be just be Chris Osprezingis and like he'll be fine yeah shouldn't move terence shannon and you're done to a lot to prove probably why what what is he done to deserve like a lot to prove what is he done to deserve being higher I guess I don't know like it's just been it's all been flashes and he's an older guy so we don't cut him quite as much bail as you do like a Ron Holland I feel like he deserves deserves to be a solid bench guy. Well, I think for the most part, it's just tough

because the Timberwolves are a literal contending team. Like, it's hard to, it's hard to, yeah, it's hard to place, like, I don't know. Yeah, I don't care that much. It's fine. And this is our tier list. Here we are. Damn, hold on real quick.

I just realized we did forget, like, two rookies that are semi-important. AJ Johnson on the Washington Wizards as well. I think you should have been on this list. I think he deserves some type of who. You know, I didn't forget him. We talked about this, this motherfucker. Tristan de Silva also probably should have been in this on my opinion as well. Okay.

Yeah. Cool. Solid bench guy, Tristan de Silva. Salute to y'all. So we don't respect AJ Johnson. I just realized that. Congrats. I don't know.

I don't have to be. He had those great games after he went to the Wizards. He has some shows and flashes. Absolutely nothing before that. I have very little to take away from that small sample size of AJ Johnson. What rookie do you feel most comfortable with in your placement? And what rookie do you feel like least comfortable with? Modest, be zealous.

What do you mean? Guaranteed All-Star. You heard me? Lease comfortable? Yeah. Everybody in elite role players should be fine. I guess Klingen is a world and wish we're too high on him. He doesn't develop.

That's possible. Oh, I feel worse, in my opinion, on Reed Shepard, because we happen too low. What do you think, Donovan? Let's see. I'm super comfortable with modest as well. And also Zachary, I should say. So I feel the best about modest. I think I might feel the worst about Ron because I love Ron Holland.

However, I don't know if I'm getting tricked by go hog. Yeah, by dog. Okay. We'll see. You're the type to get tricked by dog. Exactly. And he plays on a team where they, they, like, they highlight the amount of dog that you have. And that's been, like, the fun thing about the pistons this year.

So, um, yes. I don't want to get drink And that's our tearless And that's this portion of the episode It's time Donovan pull out the cranes Wifle me up I got the green one I guess

Oh these are piggy banks Yeah Welcome to TikTok time Crowns are ready We're here to yap Let's have some fun We move Welcome

To TikTok time Wow Today Cinebron, welcome to TikTok time. Today we were drawn by Cinebron on Moe's chest. But after that, after we take a good long look at Cinebron, we're going to start with something

else Moe related. We're going to start with hair swaps. And today, we're going to put every single Jimmy Butler hairstyle on Moe. And I want you guys to rate it from 1 to 10. I'm just going to be a mute during this podcast. During this section. This is lit. I wanted to read it from 1 to 10. I got this idea from a YouTube

comment on our last stream. I forgot to check your name. Shout out you who gave me this idea. I replied do it. We appreciate you. Yeah, man. Ready from 1 to 10. Tell me how well this hairstyle fits Mr. Modra 99. I'm laughing a lot. I know I'm next. Well, we've done plenty of stuff with you and TikToks with your lookalikes.

Yeah, man. Let me know how I'll fit you. We'll start off. The first one. We got the 2015 Jimmy Butler haircut. This had to be you in high school. This had to be you. This is fits. This is wrong. Yeah. It works. But that one I will. It was me. We got to give it 10. It fits normally. It looks the

part you could wear this today if you wanted to it wouldn't look crazy. Yeah, this is 10 out 10. Well, it'll be a little bit crazy I guess because it's an old Duke back in the day. It's a little like come on, 2025, but it wouldn't be crazy. Yeah, but it's a little bit been spiky. It's a little bit more like Dr. Umar than you know.

Dr. Umar. That's exactly what it looks like. But okay, we're starting nice and tame. I like it. Snow buddies never. You know what I'm saying? Next up. What about this one?

We got the 2020 bubble, Mo. Oh, now I look like Michael B. Jordan. What the fuck is going on? You don't like it? No. No, he's struggling. This is Childish Gambino right here.

That is not me. My whole, bro, you got this whole photo sheet. It's hilarious, bro. That's really what is. This is Childness Gambino in, like, in the This is America video. All you're going to do is take your shirt off. Yeah, your headline is jacked up here.

Oh, man. It's not the worst. look though i mean it's a scruffy vibe it's not horrible get a seven my dad would not allow me back in house like this bro i'll say that i'll go seven this really isn't that bad no it's not you could take a little taper with this but it it's passable yeah yeah it's the scrappy for the time it's a vibe it's like you're trying to be like this like brooklyn hipster guy you're like living loose you have like a lot of rings on very rugged yeah like it's it looks intentional it goes well with the fit yeah listen you you have this on you spend your day you know

you drink some matcha you go get away you get away you hit up a record store like i've seen dudes like this in new york you're right next up we got the braids oh yeah now my dad will kill me if i had this bro i would not i would literally be homeless and my last name would be stripped for my name bro you kind of like i'm davis here who Oh, for me and P. Okay, I didn't hear what you said. I look like Davis. Okay.

Yeah, this is a zero out of the time. Grow your hair out. This is a zero out of time. Well, you know, like this, honestly, this is one of the best ones. What's wrong with this? Not really. You anti-braids? I'm not anti-braids.

Rades are cool. I'm not on yourself, on yourself, obviously. Yeah. You don't think you can rock? He said, I'm not against the cause. I'm not against the problem. Braves are cool. If I looked at the braids.

Have you ever tried to grow your hair out? When I was in high school, yeah. But post high school, no. I know my player. I know my game. And I know my limitations. Okay. These are all not too bad yet.

Oh my God. That's Burn a boy. You know, the West African in me is screaming right now. We got the 2023 dread weave. That's Burner Boy. That's Leon Thomas. Oh, yeah. That is, that's Andrew from me.

Victoria. Oh, shit. And you got to keep in mind, it is a weave. This would not be your real dreads at the time. Yeah. I need you to pull this off. I'm thinking about it. This actual is quality.

And I feel like a new character with this, right? So, hold on. I'm inspired. Like, the Atlanta in me as well mixed with the West African in me, too. Like, bro, I kind of want to. This is like, what a fuck of flame-esque to me, bro. It is. You got a takeoff.

Yeah. I'm going to have to do this. R.P. This is a 10 A 10 I don't make the rules This is my slide 10

You like this one Okay Okay This one's Yeah it's not the worst It's not terrible I know what's coming though No you don't

I do know what's coming We got the orange braids Oh my God What This is the worst pose ever I didn't even know This photo exists Orange

Orange Dreds With the Mew Oh my goodness 10 out of 10 10 10 combo With the pinky ring this is you look like a basketball player from a hulu show

you look at you got cast as lebron james yeah that's full facts oh man i'm going 10 out of 10 i love it this is crazy as hell the hair the headband works no that's crazy as hell man you need to start wearing it actually does work it looks better than the previous braids you should start wearing a headband

just recreationally Like Nelly He's casually going to headband when I'm in the grocery store What's good with homie, bro? Next up We got the pigtails Jimmy Butler wore this Jimmy what is going on here, man

Jimmy Butler with the puffs He was in between Hairbrain days I looked like a rejected Barbie doll You look like mini mouse I look like I was a rejected male cheatleader

look like a what was the from the doll from the rugrats Angelica's doll with a hair shaking of the side I know like who you're talking about Yeah I can't I can't remember the name Angelica's doll from the rugrats But it is accurate However I never want to see this hairstyle

Ever I'm going zero out of ten Luckily for you I'm not capable Last but not least You got Emo Mo No way Yo him you and kills me this is such an evil picture Demented picture

Stranger Things type picture Cut my life in two pieces I just imagine myself head banging right now I should have completely blacked out my eyes Maybe a little like a demon How are you feeling man We know you used to dabble With the hot topic vibes back in the day

I did not Your headphones has some pair more in there Has some chop suey Don't disrespect my skull candies. There's not regular headphones. The fuck is going on. You got some all-time low in there. A little bit of fallout boy.

Man. I like this. 10 out of 10. 10 out of 10. Would you let your daughter date someone who look like this? Are they a nice person? Tell me, would you let their daughter date something like this? Are they a nice person?

Okay. Imagine this person walks up to your doorstep. Hey, sir. I'm here to take out your daughter 8 o'clock. What are you going to say to that? Listen, man. I see you at 10. Wow, that's crazy

Price of your family I think I saw about the lip rings You see that in your bag And I never even tried that bro That's fucking crazy Never even tried that As if I was assuming If you had tried that

The double nose ring Have you tried the nose ring? I've experimented with it Never actually stuck that bitch through my nose But I experimented with it Sticking through my nose is crazy as hell again I am West African bro So my parents would kill me in this own

me. What about the eyebrow piercing? Again, my parents would kill me and disown me. You don't understand how serious they play. What about the eyeliner? The allegations would be outrageous. That would be the one that makes your dad the most mad. He would say some out of this world things, bro. Straightening of the hair?

Oh, man. Might break your neck? Yeah, no, bro. He would decapitate me. Just snap it. Ten. Again, ten. So, bro, if I came into the podcast one day like this, you guys would seriously

but this is not a recording day for us anymore. We're sending him to therapy. You're fired. All right, man, that's end of that. That's good. Good way to start to set the tone. Next thing we're going to do, let's talk about Kauai Lennar's legacy. Let's pivot.

Okay, completely different. I'm going to name a series of NBA players, one of which is Kaui Linder, one of which is somebody else. You let me know who had a better peak. You know, we talk a lot about what Kaui Linder would have been if he didn't get injured. I don't want to do that. I want to say, at his best, whatever version you think that is,

2017, 2019, 2021, maybe. Let's call it that whole range of 2017, 2021, that four-year peak. Compare that to other all-time legend peaks, which was better. Okay, let's do it. So not body of work strictly how good they are at their best, fully healthy.

We'll give them that benefit of the doubt. It's crazy conversations. It's going to be had and don't be surprised. Yeah, so level one. Kauai Leonard or Tracy McGregney. It's Kaui Leonard and it's not close. Even just defensively. Like, Kaua Linder was never best version defensively and offensively.

Even 2019 Kauai was a much better defender. Yeah. Like, I love T-Mack level with you did it for the game, but the peaks are just incomparable. Kauai today is a better defender than, you like everywhere. Yeah. It just accomplishment's sake. You have to go, Kauai. It's Kauai.

Easy. Level two. Kauai or Scotty Pippen. Shout out to Scotty, and I'm glad that he has his little, you know, his fairy tale of year. He's not Kauai Leonard. that's not that's not that's not him it's not it's different there was a point in like 2016 where you were like oh kawai could have been scottie if he played next to jordan and then he got closer to jordan than he is scottie at his best he kind of transcends this if jordan had scotty

they would have won 82 games yeah i mean if jordan had kawai they would have won 82 games every year he just scottie pimpins is simply outclass out tiered pound for pound yeah just mostly because of the on ball creation the scoring level is just different yeah you can give scotty passing great I guess defensively maybe because they're close you can say they're either but the scoring back is night and day

yeah but it's not so as far as like all-time rankings is close because Scotty has a better body of work did it for longer has you know the trophy shelf is much bigger but peak for peak it's not a contest I agree and this is a pro Scotty Scottie Pippin podcast

you don't even take it as being done with the 90s level three Joelle and Bede oh yeah it's This was tough. I should don't, I should. In the regular season, it's tough. For playoffs, though, we just saw Kauai perform at a higher level. In the, in the regular season, I'm still inclined to go with Kauai.

Oh, you must forgot. Those MVP years, Joel was different in the regular season. If Joel did that in the playoffs, he would be one of the 15 greatest players in all time. Like, he did not. The impact of Kauai defensively as a perimeter player to do what he did and to be able to shut things down the way that he was, Joel was doing the same as well. Joel was a better defender at his peak. Kauai, 2017, 2021, Kauai was not, like, 2015 level defense.

I'm going, I'm going, I'm going Kauai Leonard at their feet. I'm going to lean Kauai Leonard as well. The playoff rising doesn't it? Because he even had his peak defensively. He won like two defensive player at the year awards, right? Early in his career, yes. Yeah. But that wasn't at his peak, though.

You know, they didn't quite overlap with the offensive peak. That is true. But, you know, one of them all-time productive legend in the regular season, one all-time productive legend in the NBA finals. So I feel safe going. on Kawhi. Actually, I think we had one DPI. I don't think it was two. Really? I thought it was two. Or is it two? I think it might have been one. I don't know you. I'm looking it up right now. I remember when it was. Yeah, so Kauai won his DPRY in back-to-back years in 2015 and 2016. Okay. Yeah. I knew 2015. I couldn't remember 16 or not. There you go. So yeah, it's Kauai. Yeah. But again, that wasn't quite the same. It's more of a conversation though. It's more of a conversation than it was from the last. Regular season would be a huge conversation. but one guy is the best playoff riser to get shit done one guy famously hasn't had so much luck

that decides it i think is kawai level four kawai or kevin garnett see this is this is tough as well only at their peak only at the kg ranks higher but only at their peak again kg kg is like also dpoi MVP all that carrying sam kis all these all these guys to west to conference finals. Kauai's had MVP caliber years. 2017, he was third. But to actually win it is a different thing, to actually still be that level of defender that KG was.

But we'll see that level of player is more so the question to me. Yeah. This is why it's level four. Level four is always tough. I can go either way. This is close. This is the conversation Kauai's in. I feel inclined to go Kevin Garnett

because we saw him at his peak defensively and offensively at the same time. If Kauai had 2015 defense and 2019 offense, then you could make the argument. But because you didn't see that, I'm inclined to go Kevin Garnett. He also has the ring, you know, obviously the circumstances are different. But peak for peak, I think Kevin Garnett might have one of the best two-way peaks of all time. This is so tough. It's definitely one of the best. But Kauai is a much better score.

But I'm leaning towards Kauai. I'm leaning towards Kaui. Kaui is a better score, so it's not crazy. And he's a good defender himself. I'm going KG here. I, yeah, I'm going with KG I think the fact that you saw the peaks at the same time Yep, that moves, it moves me

And there you go Kauai made the level fourth I didn't make it all the way through the gondlet Level 5 would have been Kevin Durant Which shout out Kauai, Kevin Durant Let us be, come on I see people trying to have these conversations Honestly, doing too much

I would have to slip Oh, you think KG is better than Durant I think KG's peak is I think even us who are there are forgetting Because we see so much Post Achilles Durant pre-Achilees Durant

2017 Durant Okay, that's the one 2017 Durant That's top six peaks Top seven peak Like that's Yeah Dude that's a perfect player

Yeah On both ends as well Obviously he's not to the feet To Kauai Or KG more so But Like we've seen so many years Of older man

Durant and the longevity Like making us Almost forget the younger version That like Yeah It's like We're almost like Taking it for granted

Because we still It's such a great version No I feel that But I still think that like that that 2016 2015 to 2017 right like those two two and a half years or whatever of kawai's peak where he is getting to 25 26 points a game he is rising in in the playoffs doing all this stuff he is dp oi in those i think that that's more analogous and a better conversation to have in terms of kawai versus kd rather than kai than kg and i think that

If you tell me that the very best of Kauai Leonard is better than the very best of Kevin Durant, I won't look at you and say that you're crazy. I mean, you can't say it's crazy because we've seen Kauai rise, but I think it's clearly wrong to me. I think we don't have to talk about the reasons Kevin Durant's a better player. We all know it. And, I mean, I saw someone sound Twitter. This is a bit dishonest, but it is true.

Kauai Leonard's legacy is built off of Kevin Durant's injuries when he would have won and beat him, but he got hurt. let's not let's not let's not let's not let's not talk about whose legacies are built off of who yeah right let's not let's not do that it's intellectually dishonest but it is true let's not let's not do that all kawai all kevin right to do is not get hurt and then we wouldn't be having these conversations let's just celebrate the game facts okay next thing we're going to do let's talk about NBA championship teams we've done a lot of ranking of modern NBA champions things of that sort.

What I want to do today is, you know, they're all great, but let's talk about their perception amongst fans. I want to name some NBA champions, and you tell me if they're overrated, underrated, or perfectly rated. So this is really about how you feel people perceive these champions years after the fact. Because, you know, winning a championship in the moment,

we're always going to be like, oh, they're on top of the world. How could they not stay there? Surely there'll be a dynasty and so forth. You get a few years removed. You see the realities of team building. Things change over time. The game changes.

We see teams differently. let's talk about how teams are perceived. Let's talk about it. Let's do it. First off, quintessential debate, 2020 Lakers. This is a hard one because the bubble makes people either write it off

and say, oh, it's fake basketball or you want to defend it because that's nonsense. I look you feel like they're underrated in my mind, simply because of talking a conversation about the bubble. But if you look at the actual team

and how they were constructed being defensive-oriented and having wings on guard-playing, wings on wings, If you forget, Rondo was out here shooting like 373, 373 point line, doing what he does on defense, being playoff Rondo. Then there's the Alice Caruso of the world.

KCP was there. Yeah. There's another, Danny Gruen was there. It's deep, bro. People didn't realize at the time that Alice Caruso was one of the best guard defenders of the modern NBA. And now we know that, and he was just there coming off the bench. This team was deep.

It was physical. It was big. Oh, he doesn't get talked about a lot. LeBron was still prime LeBron. This is still just as good as 2018, LeBron. I'm going to say underrated. they were before the bubble they were at the top of the west right and the the like couple days before the bubble hit they beat the bucks who were at the top of the east then the very next game

went and they played the clippers and everyone was like oh my god the clippers are here they're going to win the title beat the clippers at the same time they were at the top of the west and i think that for a lot of teams that are more defense oriented rather than offense you look at them and you think that they are not as good as what they were when at their at their peaks like having great defense having an all time great defense is special and it's very very hard and so I think because of that they are underrated exactly they caught that window where they had the supporting cast they had prime lebron james who hadn't fallen off age wise compared to like you know still great but you know the age caught up to him a little bit and you had pre all the injury issues of anthony davis who was moving like a gazelle you had jump shooter anthony davis yeah and even if you want to say that part is because of the bubble even before you Before they earned in the season, he was still dominant, still fantastic. To me, surprise, surprise, I think the first championship team I saw in my life as a series fan is underrated. Is that the Nossus? Not the Nautis. Is that Alex? Coastus.

Costis. Damn, that's God forget him. He was there because they wanted to recruit Janus and free agency, so they kept him on the roster. And then as soon as LeBron, as soon as Yon assigned his extension, Coestis was gone. Next up, the 2023 Nuggets. This is an interesting one because at the time, we thought they were amazing. How could you not? Now we look back.

That year, the NBA was kind of in flux. One of the weaker playoff brackets. Yeah. They faced the Miami Heat in this finals too, which is... Yeah. They ran through a West that wasn't nearly as good as it is today. I'm still inclined to say underrated, though. Because I think, I think one, depending on who people play in the finals,

that kind of taints people's... Perception. Yeah. View of, like, the entire team and the entire run. But also, they're using... I've seen people say, like, that the Nuggets have never, like, beat. like a 51 team in the playoffs and stuff like that when if that five-man unit of of Jamal KCP Michael Porter Jr. Aaron Gordon Yokic that is that is amazing and elite and especially

when you still have like MVP caliber coming into peak of his powers Yokic and they had a bench they had a bench still it's great yeah yeah the Bruce Browns of the world was so important valuable yeah This is a great team. There is credence to the fact that the path there was easier than some other years. And the reality is they took advantage of the perfect year where their window was, I completely optimized because there's so many teams that were in flux, like I said, and they just got it done, which shout to them. It's not easy to get it done, even if that's the case.

But perfectly rated probably, I think. This is one of the few probably perfectly rated. Yeah, I'm going to try not to use that, that crutch, apparently. perfectly rated, but this might be the one. I'm, it's nuanced. I'm still going underrated. Okay, that's very. It's not crazy.

The 2015 Warriors, to me, this is quintessential underrated. Because they get overshadowed so much by the better versions of them that came and dominated the rest of the decade that people kind of view this team as like, oh, they're a baby version of the 2016. They must be an easy look. It's team won over 60 games. This team was dominant. This team won with teamwork with spread out attack.

Yeah. This is a amazing team. This is true strength of my numbers right here. This team defines that entire mantra that they have. Yeah. And people have the crutch of like, oh, if Kyrie didn't get hurt, Kevin Lov didn't get hurt, they would have lost. Maybe. Or maybe they would have won so because they were fucking fantastic.

They don't appreciate the Landryo Barboses of the world or the most spates of the world, bro. Mob buckets? Abundance of them. Yeah. So this team, to me, this team is undeniably underrated just because they're overshadowed by their sustained excellence after this. Yes. Which is rare because, like, you know, it's understandable they're underrated because it's, You almost like never see this in history where a team is this good and then gets that much better to where the previous version looks like unimpressive.

And, you know, and also because it was Steph's first MVP and the second MVP, like you said, was so much better in everything that they did afterwards was better than what they did. Yeah. And the psychological effect of playing LeBron James and like Steph was still coming into form of how we were going to perceive him as a legend. A lot of narrative stuff working against them in their place in history. The 2012 Miami Heat. Thanks a lot of underrated. champions man I don't know how you can say this one's underrated no I well I'm just saying out of the last three yeah because I've been I've been going underrated I don't

feel like the heater underrated by at all I don't I don't know if I want to say overrated but I lean overrated over under well that was a crazy sentence I think overrated is an easier argument than I do underrated yeah I'm not gonna go overrated with them this is going to be the first one that I use perfectly rated on okay this is the year they beat the okay c thunder their first championship yeah because this this is also a weird year because this was the lockout year yeah true and so it's it's kind of different but actually no i am going to go underrated because i am okay because if you go back and you look there's a lot of revisionist history if you go back and you look at um at what people were saying

going into the series a lot of people thought that the thunder were going to win the series like It wasn't a crazy unpopular opinion. That was probably about 2011 stink, though, wasn't it? That was probably about people to want to trust LeBron. It may be that, but it also might be the fact that, like, Katie is, you know, rising. Katie was averaging, like, 30 in every playoff game. Russell Westbrook was coming in. They still had James Hardin on the team.

So I think that now it probably is a little bit underrated. And seeing some stuff about people talking about Chris Bosch wasn't. a rich ball was it was all that yeah that's nasty if i understood his point but yeah not that you know there that was that was nasty i'm gonna pull out again this is gonna be the last time i pull up my perfectly rated card right here yeah i don't think that they're overrated i do think that like for the level that that lebron was at d wade it at least in 2012 his knees weren't completely in 2012 and so you still had a very very elite dwayd you still have chris bosh who is you know,

forming into all these like different roles that they, that they're asking him to play. I just, I think that like you, you look at this team and you look at the fact that they lost in 2011 and that, that this four year run was bookended by losses, but it doesn't, it doesn't negate the fact that like at their peak they were.

I miss this era, man. I miss this era so much. Look at this picture for so nostalgic. It's amazing. I've had that T-shirt. It was awesome. Okay.

Sounds like they're perfectly rated. 2021 bucks I'm this might be my first overrated why is it overrated do you feel like people respect the shit out of them

that is too much yeah like I look back on this team and it's like I think the team within itself might be a little bit overrated

I don't think how it's looked at from behind is overrated you know I think Janice's performance isn't overrated but maybe the team is like they won

because he went Superman and he had enough help but it's not like if you stack this up against other champs that came right before right after it's not one it's not one of the stronger ones yeah like the only team over the last few years the only team i can say like clear cut is better that the the milwaukee bucks are better than is that 2022 go to say warriors team outside of that like this feels like a pretty weak roster um in terms of championship roster

of course like drew holiday of course he played a very important pivotal part to this team and their success, especially their defense, but seeing how you can easily take the jury out of this whole thing and their defense and not like piss poor. Yeah, well, okay, so I don't want to do that because then it's just like, oh, yeah, like, we have something built off of great players. Let's just take the great player away. And then it's not as good. But I am with you.

How legitimate is their defense? I, I mean, you still have. Great. Yannis is amazing. You still have Yannis. You still have Brooke Lopez. I just think that Yannis had to do. they were down 2-0 in this in this series and i think that 20 people talk about the 2020

like that bubble and that championship having the ashtick i don't think that any championship has an asterisk if you're going to argue one does 21 would have more of an asterisk than the bubble 21 is the year where they started early where everybody was hurt was super weird people going in and out of games and in and out of lineups with with covid and stuff like that 21 is one of the weirdest chips. The Brooklyn Nets of it all. The insanely unlucky stretch that made them not win the championship.

I'm not doing that. They should have won the championship so easily. And part of that, I'm sure, the injury thing is like a difficult thing to parse because how much of it has been short and off season, how much of it is bad luck. Everybody got hurt that year, including the team that was clear cut,

favorite to win the championship. And including the team out west, that was a defending champ in the Lakers who didn't make it there because they got hurt. So a lot of stuff in the air. And, you know, you can't really fault them for that. then you win who's in front of you

So this isn't to discredit anything But if you have to parse I guess you could say that It was a relatively weird year With some variance So I'll go overrated for them Okay To 2001 Lakers

Perfectly rated Yeah their heralded Is a top three team of all time You feel like that's very appropriate Yes I think I think where you can get to To them being underrated

Is when you start saying like Oh they'd get like crushed by 2016 2017 team by the warriors in that era. But, like, one, you may, you may be right, but that's also just a product of, like, where the game is. And obviously, like, this team is built for 2001 and not built for 2016. And so you can get a little bit weird, but we always talk about greatest duo of all

time. Shack and Kobe, it's that, is that, like, is that video? They're the bookmark, yeah. They're probably the most glazed team of all time and is completely deserved. Yeah. He's completely deserved. Like, they're considered the Goat team, even though they didn't win. in like 72 games or something like that

like some of the other ones, it's completely deserved. They'd be completely unguarable in pretty much any era. 2008 Celtics. Two different answers. From us, from them, from their perspective, I wouldn't say they're overrated.

They overrate themselves. Definitely. I think the world underrates them because we're mad at them over there. That's the best way to put it. That's the best way to say. Every time they touch a mic, they're the most annoying people in the world about their championship. But, you know, a certain point you've got to not let that cloud your judgment they are an all time great defense they are an all time talented big three they were fantastic for their era they beat good

teams it's a legitimate it's a team you need to respect despite how annoying you think kentry perkins is yeah i agree they encapsulate underrated in my mind based off of these conversations outside of basketball with that being said everyone overrated paul pierce i don't want to hear it anymore shout out leon poe man 1994 rockets i put this one here because a lot of people say they would have beat the Bulls if Jordan never retired. It's me. I'm a lot of people. Is that doing a lot?

Is that overrating them? No. They would have beat the Bulls and six. Damn. The Bulls had never seen anything. The Bulls had never seen anybody like Hakeem Olajuwon who could actually shift the floor and shift the defense the way that Chicago would have needed to.

What was he going to hit him with? Lateral movement. There you go. They can't handle it Okay Fair enough Maybe it's one of the most underrated teams Of all time

The 1996 Bulls Considered the goat team Perfectly rated Yeah that's another perfectly rated thing I said I wasn't gonna pull out it again I have to pull it out again Okay It's fair

You know you don't think anybody's Any uh Any myth of what's the word here Mythologizing You don't think anything's all deserved You won over 70 games It's a lot of games And you won the championship

And you got the deal done Yes, you got it. And you have one of the, you know, one of the two best players to ever play. And the fact that a book ended a three-peat and the fact that that three-pe, I mean, it started another three-peat after book-ending one before, like, you know, there's sustained excellence there. It's not a one-off. You can't help but say it's deserved. And you beat a team who won like 69 games too. Yeah.

This team is unmatched. Except for 2017. Yeah. The 2014 Spurs. You know, the beautiful game we commonly refer to them as one of the most unstoppable offenses of all time. Do we let the beauty of it cloud our judgment and put them in places? Maybe we shouldn't. They were super deep.

Or is the beauty of it underrated? I'm actually going to say, it could go so many ways. Yeah, I don't know. I don't know how people perceive this. I'm going to say overrated. Okay. Just because y'all weren't loving the spurs like that back then. People were watching this team play basketball and were like,

ho, home, it's the spurs. And now that we're actually removed from it. And now that they beat LeBron, everyone's like, this team was so good. Oh, my goodness. Yeah. y'all were not loving this team in the moment they were amazing they were unique they were fantastic fully deserving winning championship i wonder how much of this has to do with the manmy heat roster breaking down if they played 2013 heat would they have won well i yes like they

they should have you know like they they they should have they should have won okay so maybe maybe what i just said as a mute point they clearly were good enough yeah we're going to have to win two years in a row so that's not a good point i was scared at this team in the finals after the spurs won in the western conference finals tim duncan was like we have four more we're going to get it done this time. That was the first time I had ever heard Tim Duncan be like, yeah, we're going to do it. And like, talk trash. I was like, oh, thank you. Does the whole hummus the fact that people didn't like in the moment make them underrated then? Maybe they're better than people think because they're boring. I feel like a lot of people right now, right now people

are talking about how, like how much they love the team. I'm saying you're overrating how much you like. So you basically, you're not even saying the team's overrated. You're saying you guys are fucking liars. Yes, but I didn't want to use my perfectly rated card. Okay, okay. Yeah, the team's probably perfectly rated then. Fair enough. And that's the last one. Does any other team you want to throw out there before we're done here that you say it's overrated? Any championship team that comes to mind?

2022 Warriors? Stop it. No, I feel like everybody hates on them and it's like, yeah, shout out Steph because like that team sucks. Yeah. Yeah, that's true. I don't know. They got it done, but it was a Steph masterclass.

No, a team doesn't suck. No championship team sucks, but you know, compared to some other ones. Maybe, well, actually, now, we give the, we give the 04 pistons, their flowers. I was going to say they maybe get a little bit too much flowers. People make it sound like they invented defense. Well, that run though The run that they had was crazy It was a great run

But people make it sound like Some people that like Sometimes you would say then Versus like a modern team And you'd be like Yeah, the modern team's gonna win It's a modern basketball They're like

They couldn't contend with the bad boys They punch them in the chest Ben Wallace would kill Draymond Green And I'm like you have to relax What's another Yeah I guess All the other championship teams I feel pretty good about

There's one team I do feel like Is underrated through we talked about this a little bit earlier and one of the last in the Kauai slide I do feel like the 2019 Raptors team is genuinely one of it's one of my personal favorite teams

of all time because of how deep and well-rounded they were I understand that I can't I can't give you underrated because that's that's one where it's like it was two asteris that happened in the moment where like

Katie pops his Achilles and then Clay Thompson tear his ACL2 and so it's like what are we supposed to do? Yeah, well, they're playing the greatest team of all time, so. There's, yes, who lost their two. Barriers.

No, I just mean, I understand. It's not like the, it's not like the 20, 23 Miami Heat lost their two best players, and it was a given. Like, they still would have been good enough to be most teams. The only reason they weren't good enough then before the injuries, because that bar is ridiculously high to clear. Like, most teams are good enough there. You put 2019 Raptors on, like, every year after that, they probably could have been in the finals. That's, I think, yeah, I think that's my leading point. They're better than the 2021 bucks.

They're better than 2021 bucks. They're better. Are they better than the 2020 Lakers? It's tough. That'd be a crazy series. That'll be a crazy-assie-assie-assie-A-Series. That would be amazing. Defense would be great.

They might be better. They might be better. Next thing we're going to do, keep four cut four, NBA shooting guard edition. You guys know how this works. I'm going to name eight players. You got to pick four to keep, four to cut. First name, Manu Genoobli. We're keeping him.

He's an all-time, great, his own right. Okay. Let's keep him okay. I thought you were going to disrespect. Yeah. We're keeping them on him. You don't want to think about it?

Nope. Okay. Derek White. We can cut Derek White. Why? You said he's better than Kyrie. You said Derek White's better than Kyrie. It's Kyrie is better than Kyrie Irving.

Maybe. He might be. Then we're going to cut him too. I don't know. It's blind. Damn, you want to cut Derek White. Okay. He's blind.

You agree, Mo? All right. I'm a, I'm a, voted i don't have a vote he it's just my he's on that shit go ahead yeah

he's so confident his two votes devon booker yeah we gotta keep him we have to naturally okay superstar

or all star at least okay fair enough let's not throw that word can tavia is called well pope oh he's getting cut the fuck up

damn yeah diced up okay manslaughter ray Allen can go either way But it's looking like We should keep him properly

Yeah we have to keep Ray Allen Yeah Multiple time champion One of the best shooters of all time He has to be on the list He has to be on this Okay Donovan Mitchell

Oh yeah Only one spot in keep left Two and cut You sprinted through these names See D Mitch is It's kind of interesting Because on one hand The talent is awesome

On the other hand It's like He has no it's like you got rookie of the year and beard grown yeah so i'm trying to parse this with the all-timeness of this list for the sake of the all-timus of this list i think it's fair with your lodges to cut him because he has nothing to hang his hat on outside of that rookie of the year outside of like bangor bubble performances that he had with demal mary no one remembers none of that bro hard to look at booker and keep and put demich and cut but you've laid your bed it's blind

ranking you've already fucked yourself a little bit booker went to the finals bro I guess He didn't go helps His name is in history We're cutting in DeMitch I think you probably should have Kept Dimich over Ray Allen But she's their own

I didn't know that was the choice Yeah Like we had the list Austin Reeves Oh he's gonna cut that There's one spot in each of life You don't want to think about it I don't care

Yeah Austin you just can't be kidding What if I say Markle Fultz Then we Marko Faults Then we keep Markle Fultz Fine You guys

You laid your bed Now it's time for you to sleep in it The last name on here, Alan Iverson. Exactly. This is like the perfect list. I feel right. I mean, you did as you could. D. Mitch should be on the left side, I think.

I probably would have kept him over Manu. Better all time than Manu. Over who? I'll leave that to you to decide. Leave it to the comments on the side. Who should they have cut for Donovan Mitchell? He said, over who? I'll tell you, Donald Mitchell is not one of the four worst players on this list.

Yeah. I'll leave it there. We did good, though. We did good. For a blind ranking? Yeah, okay. You guys didn't do a bad job. You guys have certainly known worse in the past.

Today, next thing we're going to do, well, I believe you have some shoes to show us, some sneaker talk. Yeah, every year we usually review some new signature shoes that's dropped, and this is that time, bro. So we have, I think, six, seven, six, seven signature shoes. I did that completely by accident. We got some signature shoes, and I want you guys to grade them. I'm a, B, C, B, C, F, whatever it is.

Thank you for telling me the letters. I needed that. I need a refresher. Let's go ahead and grade these shoes. Number one, we got the Lamello Fores. Yeah, these are not for me. I'm outside the target audience. This looks like Splatoon.

There's a lot of colors. It's a lot going on. Avatar the Way of Water shoes. You remember those gangster SpongeBob shoes or gangsters going to about T-shirts? Yes, yeah. If there was a gangster Squidward T-shirt, for you can be rocking these shoes. I'm sure they're not bad though.

I mean, I'm sure for the generation that likes all these colors and this type of vibe, it's probably cool. I'll give it a B. It's not a bad design. No,

the color way's doing a little too much for me, but the design isn't bad. I'll go B. And because of the colors, I'm going C minus. Fair enough. Okay. You don't like the text on the bottom,

not from here? No. It looks like Lamello's tattoos. That is true as a fire tattoo? C. It's not a couple of men. It's not great. Okay.

I think it's solid I think if I saw a color That was a little more tame I'd probably like them a good amount But I don't I said like None of the colors are tame brother You're right You're right

It's the Mellow shoes The only ones because I've had The only ones that I've gotten They had to be the all white pair I can't I can't deal with all these guys Yeah these are all white So the shoe itself is actually good You just don't like the color

Well I've had a pair before I've never had the Mello four I think I had the shoes So you gotta update your game Keep mind people We're only going off the looks Not performance People always comment

The grip is so good on the mellows though And I'm like bro Do you think we've tried out all of these shoes. They think we kick genius. What's going on here? I'm just running up and down footlock to stop him.

He's doing suicides. He's ain't good enough. The whole TikTok will be clearly talking about straight looks and they're like, they haven't even played in those. I'm like, are you an idiot? Like, are you why?

You know what you're watching? That's hilarious. All right. Next up, we got the KD18. These look like baby shoes. Baby shoes. I'm not, I am not with these. These are robocop shoes.

Yes. I kind of like them though I kind of like the green on them I like the silhouette a lot I can take or leave the shiny metallic looking metal on there yeah but I like it overall I like more than I don't like

yeah I like the damnia ribcage like look on the side it's kind of fired to me I would give this to be the predator little alien look that's crazy I actually don't like the upper I like the back heel the shape and the design of the back heel that's cool the back hill looks like it's for an old man

it's fitting for KD getting up there i'll give it a b plus i again similar thing i don't love the silver but everything around that if i take myself out of the the the island of the silver b plus i'll go b okay okay okay high ratings for katy's new suit katy's shoes are always pretty good though i can't remember the last like terrible kd miss you know they're releasing his kd6s i saw that the peanut butter and jelly ones they will be on my feet no nostalgia eighth grade or ninth grade what was that we'll be here with my nike elite socks to match with it yeah cargo shorts absolutely those are the days man Does yell the, like, peanut butter look on them?

I remember seeing so many outfits built around that. Yeah. People I've never wear like color of their day in their lives. All of a sudden, they're wearing purple. Next up, we got the Jalen Brown 7-4-1. This is his own specific brand. Hey, man, listen, shout out to you for having your own business. Yeah.

Shout out to. Shout out independent business ownership. Mm-hmm. Shout out L-C. There we go. Entrepreneurship. That's what we're pushing. Shout out to you.

Exactly. Now, how do you feel about the shoe itself? Again, shout out to your entrepreneurial spirit. And I can definitely see that spirit come across in these shoes. Shout out saying a good example for all the kids from your neighborhood.

These shoes look like they growl at me, bro. The second year old feet smelled bad, they're going to like tear off your whole leg. You went against the green and against Nike and you challenged the machine and I respect you for that. Hey. We applaud the effort.

Hey. A is. Next up, we got LeBron 22. They look similar to one of his last shoes I think that's what I can see I can see the vision However you have a lot of text on there It's the mellow ball time It's getting a little bit too little mellow it

You are 40 years old But I like the way that the leather Has the check mark I built into it in the middle of the shoe That is nice That's cool And what's the back? The back looks like it might be like a signature or something Yeah, I think it's a signature That's fucking dope

I need that tatted on my chest Okay I don't overall C plus B minus something of that sort If the writing is on all of the shoes Then I'm not with all of it But if that's just for the specific color way

Then I like the shoe I guarantee you every shoot does not have graffiti on it Yeah no LeBron would take this company Yeah I saw it be minus This is a cool shoe Not one of it was best, not one of it was worst Sounds like the run of the middle When you have 22 shoes

Sometimes you're gonna get some average ones And this is one of those Yeah I think this is a very mad color way But, hey, me personally, I would have this in my closet if I had an opportunity. Yeah, I feel like you always pick Met Colorways where I'm always like, I feel like I'd like this if I saw a regular one. They're always fucking ludicrous. Next up, we got Luca Force.

I like that a lot. Is that like a fabric? It's like a, it's like a canvas on it. I don't think I'm a fan of this shoe for something. I like the lines. I like the circular nature. I like the canvas texture on it. I like the low top.

I like the midsole. Nico Harrison saw this coming and he was like, yeah, bro, you got to get out of here. We can signature from I swore I would never like a Jordan brand shoe Because they all are famously bad But this one works for me I think I think these fall in line With the tradition

That Jordan brand Yes this reminds me of the CP3s And the mellows It's a very Jordan brand shoe And that's not a good thing I'm giving these a D Man I like it It's kind of like a running shoe

It has like modern vibe to it I love the canvassy nature of it I like it It's not bad But it's not one of them I didn't give it to see. We alt that. Yeah.

Haters, man. Next up, we got the Curry Fox ones. This fox is first sitting at your shoe. Again, another bad color way, because the white and purple ones are much better. I mean, we talked about before. I love the fox on the strap. The fox on the strap is really good. Great touch.

That's doing a lot of carrying. Outside of that, it looks like a curry shoe. Looks fine, I guess. But the strap has a lot of aura points to it. Come on, man. Come on, come on. We got to, we have to step up. Really?

It's time. We're in a new era. We need to be better in our designs. I'm not rocking with this. Darren Fox literally posted the other day on IG. He wished he played in these, bro. He wore them on the sideline. I'm sure if I had my own signature shoe.

Yeah, this colored way. If I have my own signature shoe, I would love to play in them too. I too. If you had a black and white fit to hoop in, you wouldn't wear these? No. What? No. that's yeah the colorway is not good damn yeah maybe maybe i have to see another color

the gray and purple ones are nice i like the gray and purple ones a lot no i agree those are i like i like i like all white hookishers next up we got the kawai force a i love these these look like new balances they did a good job of putting the new balance vibe into a basketball shoe this is fire i would wear these these are granny panty shoes that's the whole new balance is that's the vibe that's that's what's cool that's what makes some new balance work. If it's Kauai's aesthetic, this is by far the best color way. I've seen some other ones that just look like.

This is how you get the brand of New Balance, a streetwear brand that has a certain aesthetic and transport to Kauai's world. I fuck with this. If you are talking about creating a cohesive feel amongst all of your business ventures, A plus, if you are asking me if I'm going to wear these out, I'm giving it an F. I'm not putting these on my feet. Nobody's wearing these out. There's fucking 2025 basketball shoes.

Are you hitting the club in Corruptors? You might be able to actually. No, they didn't look like a casual shoe. I would wear this in the court. This looks like some fucking... I would not wear these on the court. I would not wear these other than. You would get clowned if you pulled up to the court with these.

In Co-Ivoid. The only reason... I would get clown. I'm not 14. No one's going to clown me. We are going to go out. Yeah. We're telling you very direct me right now. I dare you.

Bring it to the court tomorrow and you'll see what happens. You're solid. I like them. As a fan of new bouncers who owns many pairs, these work they're not bad though i'm hating overly this is a bee i like the dirty soul look i'm hating i'm hating this yeah you guys are haters these are good who next up we got the joker ones he made these last year when he left i believe nike and he teamed with this chinese company called 361 design or something like that this man not only showed me goofy shoes he

showed me the goofy shoes imaginable why is sponge bob on my screen from your goat this was a personal choice he was involved in these conversations he has a personal connection with SpongeBob you literally have goof personified hanging on the keychain brother it's Yolkits he loves horses and Spongebob the goofy's character I could possibly imagine if it comes across and guess what? Yes it's

goofy on but he rolls up in your hood and gives you 60, 20 and 50s. Did he do that because he's built like SpongeBob? No he's not I know he actually enjoys Spongebre it's like yeah this is a personal connection

I'll go B plus on this why this looks like the most generic basketball shoe I've ever seen in my life. This is like Chad GPT spun out basketball shoe and they made it goofy. My seven-year-old nephew would have a fielded with these. I swear, man.

These are 2K generic made yellow. What the fuck are we talking about? You need to be more whimsical and enjoy these shoes. Exactly. I like the cut of the shoe. It just looks like basketball shoe. Like the default.

Yeah, it does. It's a D. It does. It's just trash. There's a regular ass shoe. And then you have the little Spongeball keychain hanging on the side too. That's a nice collectible.

It is hard as hell. I love a man who sticks with his inner child, bro. This is fine. The silhouettes is trash. It's just mediocre. Oh, man. I need a pair of them. And he gave you 60 in them.

Exactly. Was he wearing those in you have 60? I don't know. He dropped 40 with them, I think. For sure, for sure. That's hilarious. What do we have left? Next thing we're going to do, let me pull up my document with all the planned videos.

Here we go. Oh, okay. The last thing we're going to do, actually, before we get out of here, long episode. I'm going to name you several skill sets in the NBA, and I want you to tell me who the best player in the league at each of those skill sets is. Okay. So, like, all the core skills,

I want to get a lay-at-a-land of who right now is the best of each of those skills. Okay. First off, we got shooting. Steph Curry. Goes without being said. Let's say without Steph Curry. He's obviously the goat. Without Steph Curry, who's the best shooter in the league right now?

Anthony Edwards. Percentage-wise from three. But this mid-range shooting is too bad. Definitely get to have three-point and mid-range shooting for this. Sounds like him and right? He did shoot, like, 43% from the three-point line this year, so I'm crazy. It's probably fair. Shea's the best mid-range shooter, but the three-point isn't there.

I'm not having Yol-Kitch in these conversations. Listen, 43% or 43%? But the mid-range, he doesn't shoot mid-range buckets. Yeah, I'm not. All right. So are we going Kimmer-D-D? Fair enough. I'm fine with KD.

It's pure everywhere. Okay. It's always pure. Rebounding. Who's best rebound in a league right now? Zubach. Probably. Probably Zubach.

I think he averages like 13 or 14 a game. Or Yokic. Yokic is pretty fantastic on the offensive boards. Yeah. I'll go. I'll go Yokic on the school. Yeah, you could put Yokic in there. Turns off of the board.

Yeah. Speaking of Yolk. Tray Young, the leader of assists. All right, shut up. We're going to call Yokish. Trey Young's up there. Treyang is a fantastic playmaker. Yokh is better.

Bullshit, man. Better pass to seal. Better angles. The size makes him see more. The passing vision is really different. Better, better. Man, show me how many times Nicole Yolkish has nutmeg someone and thrown a lob at the same time. Zero.

He don't have a highlight like that. What's the next category? You think it's hard? Hard as fuck. You win the game? What? I talk about how it's over here. I mean, that's an either-or proposition.

Yeah. Nicole Yokic probably has the best combination of all time of vision and passing accuracy. It's like him and Magic Johnson. Yeah. Yeah. Perimeter defense Who's the best Like guard or wing defender right now?

Like obviously Dyson Daniels jumps out Could throw out Lou Dort's name Big sturdy ass To Monty Camaro is a very underrated name He might be the name But I lean towards

But he's more versatility Like on the inside too He's not just best perimeter guy Dyson Dyson I'm gonna say Dyson Dyson Daniels Perminder defender

Perimeter I might go Lou Dort Because Lou Dord's big Oh wait a minute Let us not forget about the guy who's hurt, but it still has the crown. This is Herb Jones Award. Eh, nah.

I'm talking about this year. I'm going to let Herb Jones reclaim his award next year. Right now, I'm going to give it to Ludoort. Okay. Can't be mad at that. Yes, you can. Lou Dort, come on. The best?

He's so fucking big and physical. He's good. The best? I would lean towards Dyson Daniels personally, but I can't be mad at the leader. Alex Caruso is a better primitive defender than Ludo. I don't know. It's different types of defense. right there.

I think Alex Caruso is more skillful of a defender and knows how to like pivot better and shit pivot

it wasn't like move his hips I would rather go Dyson Daniels and Ludo just because Ludo is not the best guy on his own team

Dax and Jans and it is there you I'd rather let you have that and go Dudo over Caruso interior defender still Rudy Gaubert's title could be Rudy Gau Bear's title I don't want to

You just don't want to I don't want to He is he is who can know I mean If you're not going to go Rudy Gobert I guess The only reason you wouldn't do that Is because if you want to go

Wemby or Chet Yeah Okay But Wemby Wembe's hurt But he played He played Who cares

We're not doing today It's in the Yeah All right You want to say Wemby already passed up Rudy Gober As the best interior defender

Yes I'm gonna say Rue For now You say Rudy You need to get Into the future My brother It's Wemby

Rudy still deserves respect People have kind of like glossed over him in their head That's why He's number two, he's the second best But like it's Wemby Wemby is a better shot blocker Obviously now his length is ridiculous

I think Rudy's probably So the better consistent drop defender But if you listen Wembe's one of the best defensive Playmakers of all time If you want to say it's him already I'm not mad at it Okay

Wembe it is I'm going Rudy You suck We'll go Wemby Damn Ha And that's the end of this episode If you were so here

What should they comment Cinebron is in the building Let's go Cut that up TikTok shop You can probably Ticktoch shop Wait a lot

Really? I've seen bad videos For the Cinebron Really? I haven't seen one What the fuck is wrong With TikTok, man Comment, Cinderbron

Go check it on TikTok shop I guess Not an ad And we'll see you all later I'm gonna make an account Right now I'm gonna make bands