The Deep 3 Podcast - We Ranked Every Shooting Guard In The NBA | Ep. 150

Episode Date: July 18, 2025

Today we rank the top 30 shooting guards in the NBA! #nba Check out Ep 3 of House Call!: https://youtu.be/RdDSFvezQrk?si=MUpKZv42NYfrCpuh Check out the TD3 merch: https://the-deep-3-shop.fourthwall.com/ Listen on Spotify!: https://open.spotify.com/show/3elbbqVumwqz8wlIdknsLW Listen on Apple Podcasts!: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-deep-3-podcast/id1657940794 Follow us on TikTok!: https://www.tiktok.com/@thedeepthree Follow us on Instagram!: https://www.instagram.com/thedeep3podcast/ Isaac's twitter: https://twitter.com/byisaacg Mo's twitter: https://twitter.com/Mojo99_ Donnavan's twitter: https://twitter.com/Dsmoot3D 0:00- Intro 3:02- 30-26 25:50- 25-21 37:10- 20-16 53:28- 15-11 1:07:12- 10-6 1:25:25- top 5 1:30:19- tiktok time Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

You know, you look across the media landscape, Hollywood, entertainment, TV, movies, etc. Everyone these days is obsessed with sequels. Assessed with running back the same thing over again. And it's never quite as good the second time. I hope that's not true for us because today we're doing week two of ranking season. We are here to rank the top 30 shooting guards in the NBA after we did the point guards last week. How are y'all feeling?

It's honestly not even like it's a trilogy. This is year three of ranking season. Yes. Yeah. And guess what? We're going to be like Fast and Furious next year, the year after that, the year after that. This is a staple. I promise you. It's going nowhere. It'll change up a little bit every year, but it's not leaving. Yeah, man. Shooting guards today. Not the most interesting one. I think we talked about it off camera a little bit. Twos and fours have become like tweeners across the league these one. I think we talked about it off camera a little bit. Twos and fours have become like tweeners across the league these days.

Pretty much every star is like a one, three or a five. And then there's some guys in between that are slightly unique to become twos and fours, but the positions are kind of dying. And because of that, this is a confusing list for me. I had a hard time deciding what I value from this position. It was, this is my least confident list I've had in a long time.

Yeah, cause it's so situational, right? Like if you're one in three play a certain way Then you need a two to fit that or if you have a specific kind of big then you need a four to complement them So it's like yeah, you know Like if you're big doesn't shoot your four has to shoot right if your five does shoot you're okay Not having a four who can shoot yeah the shooting our position over the last few years many have talked about it as being a The shooting our position over the last few years, many have talked about it as being a dying position,

meaning like, yeah, there's a lot of twos who should be ones, but don't pass certain qualifications. That's needed to be a thriving one, starting one, someone getting 30 minutes a game. So interesting list regardless. Best example is in another era, this was 15 years ago, Shae Goldis Alexander would be in the mix to be one of the best shooting guards

of all time. That would be the discourse, but he's a point guard these days. And I think that says a lot about this current state position So because of that, I think we're gonna see I assume a lot of variants in these lists today Most of the time we have a general range where y'all agree guys go in I think we might totally disagree about what is valuable in this list 100% 100% So that being said we're gonna go into it We're gonna rank top 30 as we always do but before we get to that

I gotta tell you guys, about episode three of House Call, it is out now by the time you guys are hearing this. We decided to put every single NFL team's wide receiver one into a tier list. Hopefully you guys have seen the first two episodes of House Call. In episode two, we did our quarterback tier list,

which you guys know NFL fans are gonna defend the quarterback to their fucking grave of their favorite team. So lots of disagreements there, as you'd expect. I guarantee you will have just as many disagreements with our wide receiver list. It will also cause you to be upset because we don't say your wide receiver one is the best in the league, but nevertheless go check it out. Subscribe to a new NFL show house call. Like I said, if you haven't seen it, it's been a fun time.

We move to multi-sport crayons. With that being said, let's cue the intro music and let's rank some shooting guards. Once again, you guys know how this works. Top 30 shooting guards in the league. We're going to reveal brick by brick, piece by piece, five groups at a time or one group of five players at a time until we reveal the full top 30 list. We're going to start with 30 through 26. First up, we have my list.

Let's get into it, man. Number 30, I have Jared McCain. At 29, I have the biggest follower of this season. Kentavious Caldwell Pope, number 28, Nikhil Alexander Walker, 27, Brandon Pajemski, 26, Devon Vassell, another pretty big faller this season, I think. Okay. Okay.

And big faller, I think, because I think we have Vassell in the teens last year, coasting off of potential. And this year, I think a lot of that potential took a seismic halt because he dealt with some injuries and had his worst season since like his rookie year I think. There's no more potential. It's not there, but it's dormant. It's dormant potential.

But like the high-end potential of what you thought he could be... That's not there. Yeah, I'm not necessarily going to project a star leap anymore at any point. Not that I ever said Vasell was going to be a star, but it was always like, hey, the NBA nerds are paying attention. Don't sleep on Devin Vasell. Now I'm like, hey, then be a nerds are paying attention. Don't sleep on Devon. So now I'm like, sorry. Yeah, I think because of the trajectory that the Spurs are on and how bad they

were over the last few years, he was empowered in places where he probably shouldn't be when it comes to what he's best at in the league. And over, I guess, next season, hopefully, like he, his role and his demands will be diminished and he can fit into that 3D role that he once, like, was drafted so highly for. He's not that anymore. He dealt with like so many lower foot injuries this year. Every two weeks, it felt like he had a new ankle injury

and I think that really showed in his play. He got 62% of the rim this year, down from 71 the year prior and that was what really encouraged me because of that his overall efficiency is down below league average and nothing about his game really developed positively I think to make up for that it was just less dynamic through level scoring and while the defense isn't great either the passing isn't great either the three-point shooting is still good not

top of the league overall just again less reason to project with him and I think he's falling amongst names that are other good solid role players I'm not gonna lie it's super shocking to see that KCP made this list. That's very, very, very no, he's like honorable mentioned, but I don't think he belongs to be on this list at all for this past year. Not saying like it's preposterous. I think he's more so like 35, 36 or something like that. I do think at this point in time, he's going to have a bounce back year.

Obviously I'm not selling him off. But last year specifically with what he did and what he was asked to do, his job was super simple. He just wasn't able to meet the role, which is just to hit threes. And I think when I look at guys like Nah, Pods, Vasell, and even Jared McCain who have shockingly, I have a lot higher for what he did last year. I think he had a marvelous, marvelous rookie year. He did a lot of things that surprised me that I didn't necessarily have in his bag. And I think he's levels ahead of KCP, NARPAWS, and Vasell easily by far without a doubt.

Yeah, I didn't put McCain higher because it was 23 games and he didn't have the chance to hit the rookie wall that every rookie hits. So I didn't want to overreact, but I do respect that. I do think he's really good and he will be that level I just I tried to control myself in my hype around him But it was 23 games five stars not a lot but for the KCP thing I try not to overreact one year whenever I think the falloff is Something we can project to improve somewhat. I did put him 29 still opposed to Mike last year

I think he was like fucking 15 or something. I do think he is worse now. I think his abilities with the ball in his hands were disgusting last year. He couldn't the way he was attacking closeouts, making reads. He was bad offensively, truly terrible. But I do think he will go back to shooting 39, 40 percent from three. Like he does every single year of his career besides this one. I don't think he forgot how to shoot overnight. So I do think that'll normalize in a situation playing off a drama rant where

he's going to be fed higher, you know, higher percentage shots again off of a creator. That's one of the best in the league of generating corner threes. I'm not going to overreact too much there. And I do think he had a good defensive season still. He's still a good fighting over screens. He's still a plus defender. And for this list, a common theme, I care about defense so much for this list. That carries you far.

And offensively, he was not top 30 last year at all. He was fucking not top 50 at the position offensively last year, but defensively still of average. And I think we talked about the way the shooting guard position is changing, especially in this range. None of these guys I want to be a focal point offensively. This has to be Jeremy Kane who again, is a game play. All these guys in the bottom 10 of this list, I don't really want to run the game through them whatsoever.

So I want guys that can play off ball be good defenders hit open threes do Minimum some of the ball in their hands I do still think his defense is worth this is how you know like the league is like these two positions that we've done So far so distinctly different last last episode. I talked about this bottom 30 tier is They're like specialists in the league and they're very, very good at specific things. These guys aren't specialists at all. The opposite. Yeah.

The killer is under Walker. I think is the complete opposite of a specialist. He is a solid offensive player, solid defensive player, not really exceptional at anything, but doesn't have really any bad weaknesses as an offball to guard. Like you can fight over screens, you can do some team defense, you can attack a close out, you can shoot three, none of which at the highest level in the league, but all of which solid. And I feel similarly with pods after he had his terrible first half of the season, I think

second half he normalized and I feel like him and the killer, the walker pretty similar. Yeah, that's fair. Um, so I'm, I guess I'm different than both of you guys. So I didn't, yeah, I didn't put McKay on my list just because he was a rookie and it was so, so little. So I was like, OK, let me just let me just wait. So I did. I didn't do that. I think I'm with you, though, in terms of like where I put Casey P, because the defense is the only reason why he's still here.

You know, they had to attach an asset to get rid of him. And I am I still want to give him some respect I am a little bit nervous about the bounce back because I think it can happen however, it's very rare that you see that happen with guards like a lot of times like when it goes it goes and is he a Lebron yokich merchant like is just easier to play which it probably is as a Catch-and-s shoot player if you're playing with LeBron who makes all the perfect reads and Jokic who makes all the perfect

reads and the reads that you don't even know you were able to have. You know, so being in the correct spot, we could just be at a point in his career where offensively if he's not playing with one of those types of creators and we'll see, you know, like what Memphis looks like offensively next year if John Moran is able to To create some stuff it Maybe he can get back to something like that. But I think that yeah, he's he's on the border So I think 29 is fine. I actually have like I like pods and not a lot more than than you do Yeah, I I do think that they're a little bit low here

Yeah, I can I I struggled a lot with this list and some of the guys above, I don't like more. I wouldn't rather have, but I'm trying to respect their skill set even though I don't think it's what I would want in a position. So again, the bottom 10 I struggle with, the bottom 15 really I struggle with immensely. So I don't even disagree with you really.

I would rather have Pods than the Killers Underwalkers than a lot of these guys. If I had to win a championship this year I'm damn sure picking pods Nikhil Alexander Walker and probably KCP over the cell easily easily I'm also like trying to balance like my preferences versus their skills and like what we think we'll get from them next year trying to Do the whole? Impartial you're including next year into this ranking as well. I thought I was solely like what they did last season I'm trying to have a whole view of who the player is, which is like both to me.

Oh, shooting Gargarts, you and Helm, that's crazy. The Vasell stuff is super interesting. He just injured, what I'm trying to say is I think he dealt with injuries that slowed him down, and I don't think that'll be the case next year, so I'm not gonna write him off. This year was a bad Vasell year. I think next year will be a better one.

So I'm not trying to gauge, reflect entirely what this last season was, like just one to one. I'm trying to gauge how I view them as a player right now. So that means to me what I just saw versus what I will think like both of those put together. OK, so that's the only reason I don't think the killer is under Walker has the I think he is who he is. Whereas no, because I'm not projecting it. I'm not saying that way, but I think he's in hell right now. I get it. I get it.

That's the nature of this. We're like Like you can talk yourself into one of these guys and then two minutes later be like, I really want that. Yeah. I'm trying to think of the right way to frame it. Like I'm not projecting Vasell will get better. I'm just predicting that he is better than what we saw in this season, which he was tampered by injuries. And it's fair to say as a talent, obviously Vasell is more talented.

He is like when it comes to this list of players, I saw to McCain,, I guess fucking demon when it comes to hitting contested threes, bro. He's ridiculous. And obviously, like he has grown that tendency is kind of like growing a little Kobe Kobe mode here and there. And fans spurs fans feel so divisive about it because when it comes to who would you rather have the ball in your hands and the late game situation, obviously outside of the Fox and Wemby, it's a vessel. 100% He does so many.

He does a lot of off the dribble things that a lot of guys just can't do and haven't grown to develop that skill set. And Vasell has. Is it great? Not necessarily. And that's why I don't like that. I don't I don't like that for that. I think that like for for Vasell, a lot of it is the Spurs have been so bad over these past couple of years.

Like you were the guy a couple of years ago that had a little bit of potential and we've latched onto you. We've, we've seen some stuff that was actually tangible in terms of like, you can build upon this and be a, a very good score. But as they've, as they've like progressed and reshaped the team and now that you have DMR Fox is like, are we going to close with D with Devin Vasell on the, on the floor when we get likeR Fox, it's like, are we going to close with Devin Vassell on the floor when we get like our best five? Maybe. I was looking at this and it was, honestly, it's so hard to look at Spurs on off numbers because if any of the lineups have Wemby in it, you throw it out, right? Because like the difference between a Spurs lineup with Wemby and

without is massive. And so I'm trying to look at all of these lineups and try and look at, okay, do you fit here? Do you fit here? And it's like, if he's not out there, you also, like, you know, it's so hard to look at them and actually get a real. You also sell is like a minus five on defense because he played a lot of bench units without Wemby and those defensive units got torched with that Wemby.

So I agree. That's also part of why I'm not overreacting to Vasell thing and giving him a nod over guys I think just won't be as good next year just because of how archaic and insane their team was last year. But again, if this was off of this past season and the guys I want on my team, Vasell would not be in the top 30.

So if it's my first of references, he's not there. I'm just trying to, I can be very like rigid with the guys I want on my team. So I'm trying to be impartial, but just know if it's last year, he's not top 35 for me. Okay, let's go to this next one for you guys. All right, next I got at 30 have Quinton Grimes, 29 cam Thomas, 28 Shaden Sharp, 27 Jaden Ivy and 26 I got a case on Wallace. So in this range specifically you have young players, 28, Shaden Sharp, 27, Jaden Ivy, and 26, I got Kason Wallace.

So in this range specifically, you have young players, but they haven't necessarily put things together. The most accomplished young player obviously is Kason Wallace, who just came off of winning an NBA championship and played a very important role for OKC this year. But he was very much a part of a lot of the issues that they have within the team. But also, he defines what they are as a team when it comes to their strengths and also their weaknesses. He is not the most talented offensive scorer just yet

and creator and all that. But defensively, he's one of the, I don't know, 10 best perimeter defenders from a guard position. Yeah, bare minimum. And so I want to put him higher, but the glaring holes in his game are just so strong. And I feel like all the talent around him just mass so much. But I wanted to put him higher so much. Another name that I was shockingly, I had like so much discourse in my head and they are damn near in the same boat is Jaden Ivy and Shaden Sharp, two hyper-athletic guards who like, when you think about a lot demons when it comes to getting at the rim. Three point shooting can be if he didn't have he did shoot 40%

last year before he went down with that injury. Shaden Sharp hasn't been prioritized. Obviously, Jayden Sharp, Jayden Ivy last year. He went through hell with or two years ago. He went through hell with Monty Williams and he wasn't even starting games. He was killing Hayes was getting minutes above him. So they both had like super up and down careers and within that too, they still have like

glaring holes in their game that could prevent them from being like real productive stars in the league and guys like this who kind of need the ball in their hands that kind of hinders their Potential so I have them here and then there's cam thomas and Quinn Grimes who? Thumbs up. Yeah, Ivy I forgot about. Maybe he'd be on my list, but he's been, he did. It's hard to think about. Yeah. I need more sample size from him just to even get like a legitimate thought about what he

is or what he can be. So he wasn't on my list. Sharp, I chose not to rank. I just think I'm just a little disappointed in that. And the difference in him and the guys in the bottom tier is, like I said earlier For the two guard position if you're not gonna be a lead offensive player on a playthrough I want you to be a good defender I want you to be three indeed but a play next to the stars and I just feel a lot better about pods Let's say for sharp for that. That's so that's a little situation for me cam Thomas. I struggle with we talked about it off camera

He is slightly higher than what I've currently revealed. Yeah spoiler. He's 25 He's similar to Vasell where I'm like, if I'm building a team, I don't really want you on my team right now, period. That's not how I wanna play. But he has insane weaknesses that make it hard to build around him and probably make him less valuable

than I think some fans might want him to be because of his bucket-getting skills. A treacherous defender doesn't pass at all. Like, very rigid skill set. Doesn't really get to the rim at all anymore, either. Even though he is efficient there, doesn't do it enough. But a fantastic jump shooter. He is a bucket.

He is strong. He has a deep bag at generating mid-range jumpers. Can make contested shots. The amount of elevation on all these contested shots that he gets are ridiculous. And I'm like, that is a good skill. And like, I do think there's something in my mind that says, if harnessed by a

Smart coach I can get the best of him not to say that he doesn't play for smart coach He does but like in a right scenario when the team's ready to win I do think there's a role for him in the NBA that if they use that the six man capacity Maybe or whatever it looks like in a starting lineup that makes the most sense. There's a little bit of value there So I went 25, but it's tough to build around right now Yeah like if you ask me if I'm building a championship team or just like a team from scratch, I probably would rather have Kason Walls. Obviously, I think when it comes to one for one talent,

Camp Thomas is probably more talented, however you view that word. But when it comes to just like, obviously, too, these are night and day situations that they're in. So that kind of clouds everything about their career as well. But looking at what they've done, pen paper, I like case was a lot more so because the three points I have shown growth and development and the defies. He has a true superpower that when I even look at com cam Thomas, like you have a superpower, but there's at least like 15 other guys in the league that I rather have and who I think are better.

I so scores than you. I'm not going to lie. I should look at Thomas on the list. 15 other guys in the league that I rather have and who I think are better ISO scores than you. I'm not gonna lie. I should love camp Thomas off the list. I put him higher out of like obligation to the talent. I mean, 25 is kind of why I'm not too high. Yeah, he's probably different than 29. I mean, he's barely I just I looked at him in the cell and I was like, I'm playing with

cell here. I got to put camp Thomas here. It's like the same type of situation. Yeah, camp Thomas shot 57% at the rim, 23rd percentile for a wing, guess what he's listed as? But he's more of a combo guard, so I don't know why he's listed there. 35% from three, below league average.

Coasting off the fact that he shoots a ridiculous 52% from long mid-range, he is a mid-range bucket. And like, he is legitimately, like he leads good offense. Like his on-off numbers, the team's offensive rate was nine points better than him on the court. Probably has to do with the dreadful Nets roster outside of him But I even the advanced stats all the RAPM's LeBron Raptor all of the stuff that shoot that Attempts to gauge your impact to your team

Adjusting for the town around you adjusting for town you're playing against it all views him as a positive offensive player Which is a negative defensive player. So he's like a positive point one very neutral all around I think this that is also very neutral I think positive for neutral at times So I gave camp Thomas slight credit because I do think there's a world in which he could be utilized better But I'm not mad at putting him out you can put him at 40 not understand Just because I get it But yeah

Yeah and it's so hard to work around those weaknesses to like with the weaknesses of I would say pods and Case on walls like they have skill sets that you can fix physically around with a good roster because pots has abilities to he has playmaking tops he's obviously a positive defender good rebounder and he can like he's almost a do it all type of player and then case and walls the defense again is just fucking crazy so I understand that yeah he's definitely the hardest player to guard I mean to not to guard to rank I think he thinks

He's very hard to rank because like he he has one more year to coast off of the tantalizing talent and skill like we Depending on how it looks this year if it's deployed in a more positive way He can't have another year where he's one of the worst defensive guards in the NBA. Yeah Let's spot fire's. You have. Yeah. Cause that at 30, I have cam Thomas at 29, I have Devin Vassell at 28 KCP, 27 Clay Thompson, 26 Jordan pool. Wow.

Cam Thomas, Devin Vassell for everything that you're saying. The time is up. The time is ticking. Right? Like I, I just don't know. Yeah. We've just talked about all of them. I've talked about KCP.

Clay shout out to you. Like he's still shooting, you know 39 40% whatever It's also kind of hit or miss at this point like in terms of what he's gonna give you on a nightly basis He's not as consistent as I would like for a player Like if all you're gonna do is shoot threes, I would rather you be a little bit more consistent Like I will say specifically for the Mavericks last year There was like Obviously the Luka Dodgers thing happened and I think as soon as we could dogs got traded off of that team It like nuked a lot of play tons of production. There was so many times so many possessions

I'm always saying this was last last night was doing hella research and I saw a slew of clips where they were just not simply Feeding clay on a lot of the easy Looks all the easy looks, all the easy kick outs that he's used to getting. So I think that's a part of the reason. He got left out to die on a team that he started to play to catch Luka Dantzsch's passes. Now he's catching Max Christie passes. Najee Marceau passes. I understand that. I understand that. But also, how many, even in like, if you're talking about,

okay, we're going to move you around the league, how many situations around the league are you going to have situations where you're playing with a OK, we're going to move you around the league. How many situations around the league are you going to have situations where you're playing with a passer like Luca? Right. Very little. It's so if I'm putting you other places and this is the one thing that you are providing, obviously, like your spacing, your shooting to the day Clay Thompson retires, you are going to treat him like he's one of the best shooters and as you should, because he's shooting wise, it's still like that.

But if you don't have one of the most talented playmakers around him, I do struggle to see like, how much are we going to play you? How much are we going to value you? I can understand. Yeah, and so, and at least in like, in like a third of the games, he's shooting under 30%. Right, so again, it is very either Clay's on or

Clay's having Clay's going over 10 and then in a closeout game. And so it's like, it feels bad there, but he's also, he's also aging. So that's why he's kind of towards the bottom of my list. And then for pool shout out to, to pull like, he really did resurrect a lot of what people thought about him and the way he was playing two years ago, money laundering, like it was it was bad, but he was actually a very respectable NBA player. I do just think that like he's still not an amazing defender to, you know, to put in like that. And then offensively, in terms of like rim scoring, shooting in the three, it's getting back to like Golden State, you know, days where it was kind of solid. The floater game isn't as great as it was back then. So I don't think that

his offensive package is as good as it once was. And then clearly he's not going to be the guy that's driving offense on a top, top team. So at this point in his career, what does it look like when you are not leading the team in field goal attempts? I'm a little not that I don't think that he can do it But I I am a little bit nervous about like if we did put you back in a winning situation Are you able to scale down and I'm not a hundred percent sure but he is good and he is talented Yeah, I like Jordan pull that I ranked him higher. Obviously not on this list yet. He's on my list So he's higher. I have a lot of confidence in him to. Obviously he's not on this list yet. He's on my list. So he's higher.

I have a lot of confidence in him to do like what awesome reads is doing right now where he's a higher option playing off of a LeBron and or even a Luca now combined playing off. He's a third star, but he's an offensive oriented star. I think Jordan pull can do a lot of the similar archetype of player where he is a focal point of your offense, but he's not the focal point. So his defense matters. He can't be a zero, but he doesn't have to be like a lockdown defender because his offense is like heavily impactful. I think if he played off of Palo Bencaro and Franz Wagner, he would eat.

Like he needs to be in that type of role playing off of a big forward or a big man. I like him a lot. I like his rare ability to be an off the dribble shooter and slasher. I know the mid-range jumper in the floating game you mentioned was down a little bit this year. I just I love watching him use his shooting gravity to become a slasher I know the mid-range jumper in the floating game you mentioned was down a little bit this year. I Just I love watching him use his shooting gravity to become a slasher and use those long strides to get to the rim I want to see him in a better situation really bad Yeah, if you and if you believe that cool, I have no problem with you moving up. That's just a major question for me so that's why he's he's down, but I

Really really do respect the way that he came back this year and was actually able to perform and be like, no, you're you still have all the talent that we thought when he saved his NBA career last year. Yeah. Or at least like when it comes to legitimacy of how serious you are. 100%. I really wish I would have put camp Thomas up a sell low too. I read that's the reason what I had. But like just like okay, this is a camp. Thomas has to be When you start ranking like I would never put him on I would never employ him If I was a dinner fucking BGM But like when you start talking about like who's just having the most fun Camp Thomas has to be at the top of the list because it's either like it's like the 15th best player in the league

We're like you're getting max money and like your team is decent whatever You get to live in Brooklyn You get to make this money you get to take 18 to 20 shots a night like you're having a good time Yeah, he would never play for my team We're gonna take a quick break from the show to tell you guys about our presenting sponsor for this episode us House call is a sponsor this episode, us. House Call is the sponsor of this episode, our new second podcast, our NFL show. You guys probably saw it at the top of this episode.

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23 Dyson Dane am I a Dyson Daniels glazer or are you a hater you might be the biggest range difference I've ever seen from something I rank and you rank I have him unbelievably higher than 23 23 why is Dyson day 23 Overdiving Shinzo and no now. This is the worst ranking man. I may be hating I may be hating you probably are okay Okay, I said awareness. I love it I think defense is massively important to me because these are all off-ball guards besides the top five I'm gonna play through you and this is one of the best defenders on the list and that is and listen I

do understand that I I will say I'm a little jaded because I Have seen the the two guys ahead of him Be competent in playoff scenarios. Again, not all the time, but I have seen that from them and I just haven't seen that from Dyson and it did kind of get overlooked. And I will say I am inconsistent because once we get to the top of the list. Once we get to the top of the list and hire, I will be using that logic.

Oh my gosh. That I just like. But yeah, I don't know. I just, I do like the other two guys. When it comes to inconsistent, Davenson's though, is like the, was the definition of that for the Minnesota term rules. I was, when the trade initially happened, you guys remember like I, a majority of the reason why I like the trades because I saw DaVinci and Joe's a fucking flame thrower. You know what the best because of what he did with the New York Knicks taking like eight, nine bombs a game and smacking like 41% of them two years ago. Coming to the season,

he was super inconsistent throughout the first, I don't know, 30 or 20 games. And then he got hurt. He was just like, genuinely a shit show. Miss Mississauga games came back and he regressed to the meeting was so much better and in the playoffs, like again, it was wildly inconsistent. I love Divincento still, but he doesn't feel like he's warranted to specifically be above someone like Dyson Daniels. I'll say that's where I'm like, all right, we may be doing a little bit too much. Yeah, Dyson Daniels is just one of the best

defensive guards in the NBA. That's fair. To me, especially for the value of this position, this is like putting one of the best offensive guards in the NBA super low to me. I'm like, Dyson is clear cut several tiers higher. Yeah. Sometimes it happens.

Sometimes you lose a guy in the course of ranking and then you're like, what the course of ranking and it is Okay, so at 25 got Christian Braun 24 pods 23 Jaylen Green, I listen 22 Dante Dimitri so so I like to replace them and 21 Laverte I did not consider cares over on my list. Yeah, here's Levert did not have mental space in my brain Did not consider carousel for my list. Yeah, carousel over did not have mental space in my brain Damn, what the fuck? So long since I've thought about carousel over I'm sure I'm sure it's fine I mean these guys are all role players. So to use the wrong I didn't consider him

So I don't even have a thought to you whether or not is it deserved that put zero mental effort to think about carousel We're in these past two days. So when this rains right here outside of everyone except for someone like Jalen Green These are guys who have an idealized role and like damn near perfectly carved out what they are and should be in the league. So yeah, it's a sailing green carousel. He's six, seven, six, eight. Great ball handler. He can. He's a I so bad guy and can ball handler. I so bad guy. And I hate you.

He can. That was not what I was gonna. Okay And he can oh I see And yeah he's just like you can play pseudo point guard role and of course like we saw the team like the cleaver Cavaliers move off of Him because they didn't fucking need him anymore cuz our tigar on was fucking going crazy Dante different tensile also a form of a specialist and podses in Braun as well are in the similar category of just like you got an All-time break around you and you know how to play your role really fucking hard Yeah, I think I have Jen agreeing this thing to is a river line. We can talk about him. All right 25 of camp Thomas

24 24 I have clay Thompson 23 I have Malik Beasley 22 case and Wallace 21 Josh Hart I will say I did not put Malik Beasley apart on my list because they're impending allegations Well, so now we don't support degeneracy now we're against it not me So case in at 22 Yeah, I think he's one of the best defenders in the list I think he's a guy that I think if you put him on another team where he was able to play full starter minutes He would easily prove to be a top-end role player. I think obviously the offensive inconsistencies

I don't know if I should say offensive inconsistencies because he's just not a not prioritizing He's not a important offensive player like obviously there's points in the playoffs for his three-point shot, especially in the finals He had a disastrous few games there sucks not can judge him as lowest overall in the regular season. He's fine there He's an ancillary piece. He's good at running transition can drive a little bit small player always will be a corner sitter for the most part offensively Defensively, he's just a menace fantastic point of attack defender ridiculous defensive playmaker. His hands are insane top line steal rate Everything we talked about before I've been glazing him forever, I would easily rather have him than some of the guys below that just have better offensive games but don't have a strength anywhere close to his ability as an on-ball defender. Josh Hart, I put him lower, I'm just sick of watching

him miss threes and B, I saw someone call him the first no three no D player. No three no D? Sometimes when he's on his bad games, it feels that way. He has a dramatic difference between his ups and downs. When he's facing a defensive infrastructure that allows him to use his passing, push and transition, be a short role playmaker at times, do a small stuff, there's, and when the three's falling, there's flashes of brilliance. You're like, damn, Josh Hart is like, give me all star value tonight. His transition push is insane.

This is ridiculously impactful to this team. Then you get to some playoff environments where it's like, damn, none of that's happening and he's being no three, no D right now. No three, no D. Is the D part like is aspirated? Is that real or are they just joking? No, he's not a great defender. He's kind of a tweener. He's not.

He doesn't. He's not great fighting over screens. He's not big enough to provide any type of like impactful rotations down low. He's fine. He's not a terrible defender't, he's not great fighting over screens. He's not big enough to provide any type of like impactful rotations down low. He's fine. He's not a terrible defender, but it's not a strength to make up for the lack of offensive skills at some times. He gets, he gets caught ball watching a lot. Yeah. Mr. Backdoor cut. A lot. So he's very high highs, very low lows. So I think it's about the range for an inconsistent player that like, honestly, I'd rather have Kacen Wallis than him, I think.

But I gave Josh Hart the nod just because he with the highs are high enough that sometimes we see him really like help them win games in a very substantial factor and I do think case and wals can do that we just haven't seen him do it yet so I'm trying not to glaze too much yeah that's fair but two years in a row of sub 34 from three I'm kind of sick of it yeah I'm sure you're sick of it. I mean, sometimes, sometimes I won't lie. OK, but Milly Beasley, I think I have actually, I know I have Beasley just a little bit higher just because I do think like the shooting last year was crazy. It was. Yeah, it was. It was crazy. Now, are we going to see that next year for multiple reasons?

I have no idea. But if he is able to be on a basketball court and and actually knock down some some shots What he was able to provide for Detroit last year was so monumental and giving giving them like legitimate shooting I had I had him a little bit higher again Pending a lot but like about contract year. This is the the contract year for many reasons So you got the best of reallyuleek Beasley for sure. Don't know if it'll happen again.

So yeah, but I'm not mad at that. I just, some of the guys above him have more defensive impact, but his offensive impact was very important. So I'm not mad at it. I'm starting to see this shift in your list when it comes to the defensive value. That's just unexplainable. I like how you coupled up Clay and also Muleek Beasley.

They belong like- Two shooters? Yeah, exactly. They all belong together. I would have generally put Beasley, I don't know actually. I don't know. Yeah, I didn't put too much thought where Beasley should go. It just felt right. Like there I didn't I didn't quite put as much thought to him as everybody else. So you could sell me on him being deserving based on last season. He deserves a little bit higher, but I think I just use a little like multi-year sample size of other guys where I'm like, I know who you are a little more than I know who Mali Beasley is, who has obviously been rather inconsistent

and smaller roles over the course of his career. And I think that's the reason why I think he deserves to be a little bit higher-year sample size with other guys where I'm like I know who you are a little more than I know who Malik Beasley is who has obviously been Rather inconsistent and smaller roles over the course of his career until last year where he really exploited in Exocade So maybe I just hold held that against him that I'm like, what's the flash on the pan? Yeah All right. Can I I want to glaze real quick? Shout out to Queen Grimes. I I like Queen Grimes a lot. Oh my god Shout out to Quinton Grimes. I like Quinton Grimes a lot. Oh my god I'm glad you put him at 25. His slashing numbers are crazy I am so happy because the first like the first couple years and especially when he was leaving New York

Timbs was just not playing him He just was not getting the opportunity and so you saw like that there was like an 18 month stretch with like his three wasn't falling and then he went to Detroit and played like the very limited amount of games which you in like 19% it was ugly and and play like the very limited amount of games with human like 19% it was ugly and Obviously he's not gonna be in a situation again where you're saying like can you take 18 shots and I can you score 30? Whatever but the fact that he was able to be in a situation like that Sure everybody I can still shoot and I can still score at a ad in like an above average NBA level I do think that he's shown with his talent that whenever

a competent team is around him, he can be a legitimate like rotational player and he can scale back down. You've seen him do you seen him be like a plus defender as well. So whether he's shifting back and forth between our we need you to score like, I don't know, 10 or 12 points and just be like a good role player or be a good defender. I'm actually very, very, um, in, in trance in the idea that he can do that. So I like Quinton Grimes a lot. The defensive end is why I'm a little cautious. I don't feel like he's a great defender. I know he's had a label at times. And I think a lot of times we give guys the label of like, Oh, we saw it on defense because they're not doing a lot on offense

because he was not an opportunity like you said with under Tibbs I didn't feel like in the past couple years that he was a great defender and that that's kind of holding me back is that one is like what are we gonna get offensively like is he gonna have the opportunity to do it back half a lash like you said I don't know and I don't feel great about the defensive potential necessarily I don't I definitely don't feel great by him defensive potential necessarily. I don't, I definitely don't feel great about him doing both at once. That's my kind of concern is like, are we going to see him channel both sides of the ball? I don't know. Cause I think the second

half of last year when he really put his name on the scene was like the polar opposite. I, he was just bucket getting cause nobody was there cause the whole team was injured. So listen, sometimes you just got to pop out and let them know, right? You just, you just gotta pop out and let him know. Right. You just you just got to do that. And so I do think that for him Knowing that you're on a team that is going absolutely nowhere The best way to get your name like recognize and remind people that you can still do this You just have to go out there and drop 40 and he and he did it And so I again if you get him in another winning situation now, that could happen this year. I have no idea. Right.

Because the six and actually I do have an idea. The sixes are not going to be that. So maybe he does come out and the defense is still bad, but he's out here scoring 16, 17. But the the talent is clearly still there. So somebody wants to go make a move and he gets traded again and gets to another team Maybe you might be able to see that and I feel decent about that. Okay, let's move on to the top 20 The bottom 10 of this shooting guards list was quite dreadful. Let's get to the more interesting parts top 20 mo

Who do you have in twenty to sixteen? So at 20 I have Devin Vassel 19 clay Thompson 18 Jared McCain 17 Malik Monk and 16 Clay Thompson, 18, Jared McCain, 17, Malik Monk, and 16, Cedric McCollum. Every list you do this, where you shit on me for putting a guy too high, then you have them higher than me. You have them substantially higher than me. And you're like, I'm a guy context content. So when it comes to Devin Vassel, something that I was like holding out a part of that conversation too was he did look like a different player alongside De'Aaron Fox. We haven't mentioned him just yet. And I think the second that De'Aaron Fox was there, he was deployed much differently. He shot like 40% from the three point line

for the rest of, obviously a little bit skewed because De'Aaron Fox wasn't there for the rest of the year, but he did shoot much more efficiently. And the role was like there now that he wasn't asked to be the more dominant or one of the main ball handlers. That was a what's his name? That was a I just whose number is that? Donovan. Exactly what it was. I was going to say and expose you, but I won't. He just harassed me. But I will say that, yeah, Basel just feels the second that he's put in the right situation and he has his job, his label, he's able to thrive. And I saw that towards the end of the year, which helped me be like, okay, like he's good. The Virgin and former him coming out of FSU is still there.

And I think you can match that potential. Okay. You generally came very high. I get it. You're just, you're taking those 23 games as gospel, putting them high. I think I struggle with C. J. McCollum. At first, my instinct was to do something similar to you, but then I had to remember,

remind myself the Pelicans were fucking tire fire. The Pelicans were a disaster. C. J. McCollum is still good. He is a legitimately impactful offensive player that can play next to other people who play next to stars. He's not a dreadful defender. He's a better defender than Leek Monk. So I mean, you have him higher than Leek Monk. So I'm not necessarily making not a dreadful defender. He's a better defender than Leek Monk. So I mean, you have him higher than Leek Monk.

So I'm not necessarily making that comparison, but I think he's substantially better defender than Leek Monk. Not to say he's great, but I think Leek Monk is like a negative there. And I think CJ McCollum really can thrive next to star ball handlers. We're going to see him this year in the opposite fucking environment because it could be in the Wizards. So it's going to be a weird year, but I had to stop myself from

holding the situation and lack of motion against CJ. Everybody is also hating on CJ because everybody hates the CBA now. For good reason. It's like, he can still play. He's still good. He's still like a very good, as far as role players go, he's a very good offensive player that like, I think if you put him in Chris Middleton shoes for those title runs, like he could still do something similar like that where he's a like, he's a role player whose role

is getting buckets off of stars who need that deficiency and he can do it at a high level. And this range right here is 18 onward. I guess you could say 19 in some situations too, where it's like you have the high end offensive role players and guys who will get like at times start like looks and opportunities. And I very much think obviously I'm high as fuck on Jared on Jared McCain,

that the type of buckets he can get won't like transcend an offense, but it'll make so much people's lives easier considering all the offball stuff that he does. How like shockingly in my mind creative he was a ball handler too. And I would get to a spot and attack the paint. It moves me. And I'm just so high on him. I genuinely think he's going to be like one of the two guards going into next year. Yeah, I agree. The only reason I didn't the main thing with the 23 games not being enough thing is I don't

know how good of a defender he is yet. I just like Jenny don't have a feel for it. He is a smaller guard as a rookie. I didn't get a good feel for it in those 23 games anymore sample size. So that's the main thing making me like, I don't want to. I want to hesitate before I'm like, he's going to be this great or this great. But I'm with you offensively. I moved. Yeah, exactly. Even if he is like a defender, I still think because of what he can do

offensively on the ball and also like off the ball to. Yeah, Malik Monk is a comparison. He could be Malik Monk pretty easily. I see that. At 20, I have Bradley Beal, 19, have Josh Hart 18. I have case of Wallace 17 Uh Malik Beasley and at 16. Jalen Green Bradley Beal is the hardest player to rank ever right now I had so so I went back and I was looking at the list from last year And I had Bradley Beal at 17. I think I was the lowest out of all of us and

I don't feel better about Bradley Beal this year. I feel worse for sure. And it's like he just okay. So like the buyout happened. He signed it with the Clippers two years, two years, 11 million. Good for good for them. Like you replaced Norman Powell for Bradley Beal.

Awesome. Does it move me a lot? Like I still think that like I'm glad you said that I'll remind real quick You keep talking about it. Go ahead. Oh, you know fuck. It's the next tier. Okay spoiler I have Norman Powell and Bradleyville right next to each other and start the next year I think they're exactly the same so to your point doesn't move me either. Yeah, it doesn't move. I just okay, so when when I made the list the contract stuff was still there and so I was like I just don't want to deal with Bradley Beal anymore.

I'm just over it. And and so it was like it really was moving him down a little bit because of that. But also he doesn't play a lot either. Yeah, he used to have have injury concerns, which is apparently all the Clippers want. At this point, it's just like, can you give us 50 games instead of 82? And like, we'll pay you for 84 games. That's crazy.. It's weird. So yeah, that's why I have them there. Okay. Yeah, Bradley Beale last year was a fucking disaster So he deserves number 20. I have him I'll just say it I have my 15 just because I think he'll be better for the Clippers and I do think I

Also did I we made this list before the news broke this morning? So I just assumed he wouldn't be on the Suns anymore. So I'm like, he's gonna be better outside of Phoenix. He is a dreadful defender these days. And I think a big part of it is him doing a fit because the team is, the chemistry was non-existent last year, obviously they didn't want him. He probably didn't want to be there. I can only hope and assume that Ty Lue will get

somewhat better defensive effort out of him. So that I think will be a big difference. And I don't think he's physically washed. He does get hurt a lot, so that's holding him back to some degree, but he's not that old. I don't think he's like lost all of his step and can't do what he used to do anymore. That Phoenix situation was just like unfathomably bad

for him and everybody else, but also him. I do still think he can be a good slasher. His rim volume went down like 9% this year, which I don't love. I'm keeping my eye on that, but I think that's a big part of the team environment there and not necessarily having the same opportunity. Cause two years ago, he was shot,

I think I'll pull it up right now, but substantially better at the rim. And I do still think he has some talent as a slasher. He shot well from three both the last two years. I think he'll be a pretty good fit with James Harden. So like I anticipate we'll see not star Bradley Bill again. Like he's never making another all-starting name. I'm not gonna put him top ten ever again

But I do think that like you have Jalen Green at 16 I do think he'll be better than Jalen Green next year or around as good I'm just over it. I just know that if if Beal's all if Bill is on my team I don't think I'm making it a deep playoff run. Oh, yeah, I agree. Yeah, I agree. Yeah I don't I don't think so. I think unless you unless you put him on like the Oklahoma City Thunder Yeah, we're like everybody else is like one of the like the best defenders in in the league You just have one of the great the greatest defenses of all time It's not it's not gonna happen. He shot 39% from 3 43% the year before

49% on mid-range shots and 74% at the rim. He's still wildly efficient. He is a good three level scorer still. In ease of your harness better. And I think James Harden is a perfect offensive partner for him. It's just, he has to defend better. And that is a huge question mark. His effort level was truly, truly dreadful this last year.

I wouldn't want him on my team at all right now based off of like who he is as a person and like the inner team dynamics there. But his abilities are still harnessable and I do believe in Tai Lugui with most of him I think he could be very similar to Norman Powell with just a little bit more juice and that's fine like he can go and be efficient at all three levels and then go yell at his AAU team like you gotta guard me like they can't they can't guard you okay everybody else in the league is

gonna be just fine Like no, but you're not at this point. You are not striking fear into a lot of people's hearts I don't want them what disagree on that in the right in the wrong right environment, you know Which is like can you aren't anybody else? Are you gonna be striking? No, I mean, I think often James Harden that'll be a good offensive duo Like again striking fear is very different when you're making nine mil versus 50 mil the way we're gonna talk about you is very different Yeah, he could he'll be a value scoring ad as an offensive player. I think like for that price. He is well worth the dollar 20 No, no, no, no, I'm asking like 20 game. Oh

Well, I'm not Quiz or not if I miss his time he will get that but if kawaii yeah So assume assume kawaii plays 50 games whatever he'll probably average 18 and a half or 19 something close to that because there'll be games with Kawhi reach third option I don't know exactly basically whatever normal pal hit I think he'll be able to do the same thing yeah I think he's very similar I think it's a little more juice but yeah defensively we will see this year I have Donson even chenso 20 Jalen green 19 I had to fight a lot of biases

to put him this high but I did it I gave him some credit I did not want to because I do not want him this high, but I did it. I gave him some credit I did not want to because I do not want him on my team either. Honestly half the says I don't fucking want my team Jordan pool 18 Christian Brown 17 and Malik Monk 16. Okay Shout out Christian Brown. I think Christian Brown is very good. He's not an amazing defender, but he has some Some very high-level offensive defensive skills Yeah, I think he's a good point of attack defender defending drives. I think we saw that in the playoffs against Shea He's a strong body and is very good at the point of attack of not aligned penetration Not the best at fighting over screens, but as an isolation defender, I think he has legit skill legit athleticism that gives him skills there

Fantastic running transition one of the best transition threats in the NBA demon and had a good shooting good shooting year. And is he a Jokic merchant? Absolutely. But he is still playing with Nicole Jokic and will be for a long time. He's gonna be giving credits. Everybody's a Jokic merchant. Exactly. And he does a good job at it. So I applaud him for being in a role that fits him. I think he's a very good player. Malik Monk, I'm giving him a pass for last year because the Kings were a tire fire. I think he is very talented offensive player. He's higher than Jordan pool and Jaylen green because I think he's a legitimately above average passer.

No, definitely. That's very impactful to me. He shouldn't be the fucking starting point guard of the team. They shouldn't do that. Him and Zach Levine. That's a, it's an insane team construction. Nothing makes sense about the Kings right now, but I do think he's better offensively than those guys. It's just defensively. You can't put him much higher cause he's, he's not particularly good there. Yeah. And Jaylen greens at 19 at 19. Pretty much because we saw him buy into being a part of a good defensive team which requires you to defend like putting the effort and he did do that so I'm

not going to hold that against him. Like he not I shouldn't say hold against him. I'm going to give him credit there. He was a solid defender last year. It was his best defensive season I think and he had stretches where the offense clicks. It's just obviously the most inconsistent offensive player in the league, has made very little developments there. And the disappointing part to me is the first half of the season, he made big strides as a slasher. He was shooting like 74% of the rim for most of the year.

Second half of the year, it was dreadful. He went down to where he was for the rest of his career as a rim finisher this year. That's not great. And obviously he's just an insanely streaky shooter. But I do think it's encouraging that as a score and inconsistent score at best, you can buy into being a member of a good defense and trying there that I gave him a little bit of a nod, but it

was obligation. Yeah, I understand that. I don't know if I can put him. I don't know if I could put Christian Braun above him. Oh, I can easily put Christian Brown above him. I don't know if I could put Christian Braun above him Oh, I can easily put Christian Brown above him I don't even lose anything like it they're so wildly different because the roles and who they were playing with and all that I think damage rings probably like more talented But I don't know what jobs hire means if in the playoffs like you get immediately iced out no matter what but like okay, I I Agree with you and I do think that for a lot of these shooting guards

I don't have wrong on my team though, too there for a lot of these a lot of the two guards like They are kind of the definition of it where like yeah you go out and you get buckets and that's awesome If like if I put Jalen Green and Christian Brown in a gym and just roll out of all obviously like Jalen Green is gonna win He's also miscast. He should not be the number one offensive option on your team and it's what should he be? Maybe maybe that but clearly he should not be that and so I do want to give him like like you said I do want to give him credit for a binding because that at least shows me like you can be a part of a of a winning situation. I don't know where we have to put you or what the rest of the team has to look like, but you can

do that. And I did want to give him credit because he did, you know, score pretty, you know, pretty well. I kind of 16 feels feels fine because it's like, you know what? You're right there in the middle. and that's okay for me Yeah, again, I am putting him higher than I truly believe because I'm trying to be impartial But I I just I don't know what his right role is you mentioned you shouldn't be the number one option I don't know what he should be. He damn sure shouldn't be the Backboard duo with Devin Booker. So like he's not entering a better situation He's also entering a weird one that doesn't make sense

Like he's gonna have have to be the third option. Like, like, I don't if he's your your second guy and you're still giving him that much leeway and that much power, then obviously you're going to get the streakiness and it's going to kill you. But if if your third guy is all the NBA and like see how well he would fit as a third guy, I don't even like that scenario at all either at all I don't know what I like on a Yeah, so I'm saying like think of them all the top teams last year the Minnesota Turnbulls

You don't fucking like that the Warriors you don't like that the Nuggets you still don't like that You know like there's but it comes to this like disagree. I actually disagree about Minnesota I think. Nah, I think not as like a like third, third option for being being on that on that team. And because I do think like they they could abuse somebody like him. I wouldn't have had a day. I'm just thinking about like third option on a team. That's the that's the parameters for this conversation. He doesn't fit on any team imaginable

that you can think of with a perimeter role. Honestly, I put him way too high. He's an average at best defender. He is a below average efficiency score. He is a below average passer or average at best passer for position. There is no identifiable strength here. Never has been.

Every single year of his career, below average from three. Every single year of his career, below average from mid-range. Every single year of his career below average from three every single year of his career below average from mid-range Every single year of his career average at best from the rim 52nd percentile at the rim this year perfectly average see that there is no strength here I don't know why I put him in 19 now. I'm thinking about it. I'm pissed at myself I'm I'm actively mad at myself. I'm a look in the mirror and I'm a scream Dude, oh my god, there's no mirror right now. Go find me a mirror and I'm a scream.

Oh my God. There's no mirror. Right now, right now. Go find me a mirror. I don't know the right team for Jalen Green. I don't know the right situation for Jalen Green. He's given me nothing to work with. Even other flawed guys like Jordan Pool. I'm like, OK, you're a skilled off the dribble shooter

and you can build off of that using that and slashing off of the attention your jump shot brings. You can fit with a forward that can be a passing hub or a big man that can be passing hub like a sub bonus or whatever. I can imagine a role for you. I've seen a role for you on a great team before. Jaylen Green, I can't tell you with where are the advantages. That's why you can't tell that at all.

Like any any given time on the basketball court and your list specifically, you can see for a monk, Braun, Poole and Dante DiVincenzo, you know what they're going to be one of the best on the basketball court. You know, like, yo, like Dante, monk, Braun or monk, Poole, you guys have fucking burners in any given night. You could be the best shooter on the basketball court. You're not saying that about someone like Jalen Green at all.

You're not walking into confidence, at least saying that. I'm looking to clean the glass and I can't find above average strength. I finally found one stat that's in red meaning it's an upper percentile the league upset his defensive foul percentage is very low he does not foul a lot only on 1.8 percent of plays he fouls that is his highest percentile stat on clean the glass 96 percentile and not committing fouls because he doesn't play that much I'll just say for a player who is not known like you're one of the best defenders in the league. That's like

easily the most useless that ever easily. That's so funny. He's free to write solid this year. So he gets the line a little bit. That's really holding him up because that makes his league average his efficiency closer to league average because from the field he's dreadful. So there's that. But I'm just I haven't seen any strength to really go off of. Yes. Put him way too high. I built put him down 26 my bad y'all Failed you it was inconsistent. Okay next here 15. I have Norman Powell 14 Bradley Beal 13 Lou Gantz Dort

12 Andrew Nemhard 11 CJ McCollum Okay, you're a lot higher on see Jim I like that. I respect that Pelicans tax I think he is still good He's, the Pelicans were, it's hard to, people have kind of tuned out the Pelicans last year when Zion was gone for so long. That team was bullshit last year and it is probably still bullshit, especially when Jonathan Murray comes back and makes this like weird guard muddled up situation they have. I think he'll, he's one of the wizards. So I don't know how the public is going to gauge him,

but I do think he'll be a more effective player this year Whatever that means because it'll be like empty stats because the team sucks or whatever But I do still think cj mccallum is about as good as he ever was. Yeah I can't I can't hate I can't hate because I was I was honestly surprised when I like going back and looking at the numbers and I was like TJ mccallum is a lot more efficient than what what I remember this season being and I've never had like the biggest questions about CJ have always been like when he was younger with Dame like him both of you guys step up and play at this like crazy level, you know all-time level to

get you guys to the finals and You know like that's that wasn't necessarily the role that they should they should have had another guy I should have been on both of them. But the way that he's been able to be really whatever New Orleans needed him to be. Yeah. Offensively, he played point guard for them at times. Yeah. Yeah. He's not a point guard at all. Yeah. So I do really respect that. And so I'm with you. Like the Pelicans taxes. It's real.

Yeah. The versatility is the thing. He can be the lead guard if he needs to. He can play offball really well. At some point, the Wizards are going to flip him this year because they need to tank. They need to have a top pick that's protected or else it goes to the Knicks. So he will be traded. Hopefully a trade to somewhere good that can use him because he can still contribute to winning pretty well. I will say I the reason why I had him, I think I put him at 60. You spilled water on yourself? How'd you know that yourself Cuz I looked over I just saw droplets and I did The reason why I had CJ McCall a tear lower I had him at 16

It's like Disg disgusting taste in my mouth from seeing. Anyways from seeing what he did in the past last year, like ranking him, I put in this year and last year because of course this year was, yeah. And he was set up to die fucking bad. He was saying to die. I understand that guys went out in mid series. I remember like Brandon Ingram. And I'm going out and sound and play. Yeah. And Zara didn't play, but I'm like, bro, like you're supposed to be the vet. I'm over here fine for my life. If I'm like someone like Jose Alvarado,

I'm relying on you to get buckets. I'm glad you said this. I'm glad you brought this up. You saying this is not like unfair. It's not. No, no, no, no, no. I think it's unfair, but it's not unsurprising and it's not unreasonable. Yeah, perfectly reasonable That's exactly why I ranked them high cuz everybody's holding on to stuff like that Blaming him for not being able to win with Jose Alvarado and Jonas Valanchunis against the one seed in the West Of course, he got clamped. Yes You're right, but he's misrepresented by the disaster. He's been in joining the Pelicans. And I will say when it comes to. The upper echelon on my list, if I have to

specifically craft a team around and you have to be alongside all these defenders, that's why I didn't put him alongside these guys, because Dort, Nemhard, those two guys, specifically that you have on your tier, I would rather have those guys on my team because it's like, you know, I don't have to have, it'll matter. I don't have to have any type of offensive infrastructure because you're going to play and I'm going to leave the game feeling good about you regardless. When McCallum, if he's not hitting, what else are we talking about when it comes to this game or the impact? You know? Sure. I don't think he's like a, I don't think

he's a disaster defensively though, to where like a lot of players, if your shots not falling, what are you doing? Like I think he's fine enough defensively that he's not like a complete sinker swim guy yeah that's your point I probably would switch him and dork and I'm thinking about it it's not that it's not that yeah because I'm again this is specifically off of what I've seen over the last few years and he as a role player has been in the one of the worst positions so this is gauging off for last year next year I think he very well could be an 11 or hell maybe even 10 who knows trade him for Anthony Simon's game on the Celtics I think you put him next to Derek white in that backboard off of Jalen Brown and Tatum. I think he would look fantastic That's good work Connor. Now. That's what's gonna happen Brad Steven sees the vision. He's gonna get C.J. McCollum probably not He's getting kind of old but even though like any team that needs a level of shooting like if the Orlando Magic didn't make that Gargantuan trade for Desmond Bain, then I would want them to have someone like CJ McCollum coming off the bench I think he's very similar to Desmond Bain as a player. Desmond Bain is a little better defender

He's like slightly above average whereas McCollum I think is average to maybe slightly below at times depending on the ecosystem But yeah, that's a good comparison. I think he can do a lot of what Desmond Bain can do. Yeah exactly So I'm okay with you putting him at 11. That's the only reason why I was a little bit low on him. And Nemhart, I'm definitely giving the boost for what he's done to playoffs and what I know he'll do next year with Tyrese Haliburton gone and him walking into more usage.

He's going to eat, and I'm just getting ahead of it. I don't know. Is he really going to? I'm sure. I think he is. For usage, just because of usage. But yeah. He's going to have to.

Like, somebody has to dribble the ball, and it's going to be him, his stats will be better. And also like he's just had a weird shooting experience the last couple years where every time the playoffs come around he just locks the fuck in, becomes a 40% shooter. But for long stretches of every regular season he tanks his percentages by being a complete brick.

Weird, weird behavior. Lowers the expectations. Exactly. And then overperforms. But it's's kind of nasty lower your expectations to the point Where you're not even soon 30% from it's strange. You're very 9% from 3.1. It's crazy. That is the Jamal Murray playbook He's also here because he's a great on-ball defender Yeah Yeah

And I mean he's just a rare archetype of great on-ball defender who can also be your backup point guard and starting shooting guard like that Secondary playmaker guy who can play Off-ball on-ball and defend the best player Obviously if he's defended best player like he did in the finals against Shay He's gonna be too gassed to give you quite as much on-ball Which we saw at times but the versatility he brings like I would rather have him than Beal Powell is other guys and even that That was one of like the way that they were guarding Shay and the way that they told him to guard Shay That's some of the most all-out effort that you like face garden deny defense for 48 minutes or however long he played

Whatever but like that is that in itself is like we like Rick Carlos telling you before the game I don't care what you do on all Every ounce of energy that you have to guard Shay and so if you're doing that then yeah But if we're talking about just regular defense on like on a regular night in in January or something like that Yeah, his defense is awesome. It's fine. Yeah, shout out Lou Dort man like Just the ultimate strengths and weaknesses player like dramatic differences, but the strengths are outrageous He's a 40% three-point shooter for most of the season and an all defensive player on ball. Like it's just a ridiculous three and D guy with absolutely nothing else to show for it.

No on ball abilities to be seen. Not going to be a rebounder at all. Not going to be a passer at all. But my God, is he the ultimate three and D player? Like literally every single game that you walk out of after watching the door perform Spoiler I had him at 13 to you're gonna be walking away be like damn, bro Who door is you're gonna say really good things about him or you're the opposing you're like, yo This guy's a goddamn blah blah blah because of all the great things that he does and you're gonna Game you can be like little darts making three. Yes, but he did it all year. He just makes three Yeah, he just if I'm respecting defense across the list, I have to put Lou door top 15.

So at 15, I got normal pile 14. I got Josh Hart 13 Lou door 12. I got Nikhil Alexander Walker and 11 Alex Crusoe. I will say Hawks. Um, before we carry on, I did completely forget about someone like Bradley Beal I don't know why but every single time I think of the Bradley Beal thing I just want to get out of my brain in my head immediately it's it's so disgusting to the point to where I don't know what's wrong with me, I just go ahead and any notification or Information I see about Bradley Beal on my feed not interested do not show All but which is that everything so I forgot about, and he very well would have probably been like 15,

maybe 16 on this list. I respect your hyping up of your new Atlanta Hawk and kill Alexander Walker. Caw-caw! I think he is nowhere near this level, but shout out your newest Atlanta Hawk. He is a very solid player. Yeah. I mean, this tier right here is like a bunch of, well, I don't want to say defensive-minded players, but it feels like that for the most part,

excluding someone like Josh Hart. He's nowhere close to the level of defense of Caruso and Le Dord to say defensive, minor players, but it feels like that for the most part, excluding someone like Josh Hart. He's not a close level of defense of Caruso and Ludor. Yeah, that's like all defense. Yeah. Genuinely the five best permitted defenders in the league right there. But he is a positive defender. He's a positive offensive player, too.

He's not going to give you insane playmaking, but he's not a complete black hole either. So he's going to be doing a lot of great things and he almost feels like a small Small forward, you know, he's that's how he belongs on this Yeah, yeah exactly like you don't put too much expectations But when you see him play he's just gonna do his job once in a while hit like four random threes in the game play But when you see him play, he's just going to do his job. Once in a while, he had like four random threes in the game play. Yeah, brother.

And like be consistent. When he's rolling, I try to be tame because that no three no D it did get to me when he's jumping over five people to get a rebound, taking it coast to coast and real quick, he's like my killer's under Walker. I thought you thought about no, I'm not talking about Tom. I think we're talking about it. What is this new version of Nikhil Alexander unlock?

I'm tweaking. But again, I agree with the same thing. I saw it in your eyes. I was like, oh, look at you, Happy. Yeah, you should've let him continue. But I do agree with you overall. You was going crazy. Yeah, man, I checked out.

I did that. You were tweaking. How do you. What tweet can't you do? How do you think I'll talk about Josh Sparrow? Yeah, man. He said, he said, Smaller Small Forward and I was like, Hell yeah, that's Josh Sparrow! Cause I never think, I never think

of Nikhil Alexander Walker as like, small whatever. I'm like, yeah, he has like DC size. That's why I was like, sure thing, but I don't know what you're talking about. Yeah, Nikhil has had a walker's never years level to me, but shout out to Hawks. Oh man, that's funny. Thought I was losing 50. I was like, what?

At 15 I have Malik Monk, 14 I have Christian Brown, 13 I have Levine, 12 I have Norman Powell, 11 I have Cedric Colum. He has Josh Hart top 10. No, I already put Josh Hart. Oh, okay, thank God. My bad, my bad, my bad. You have C.J. McCullum. He has Josh Hart top 10. No, I already put Josh Hart. Okay, thank God. My bad, my bad, my bad. You got to love... What's crazy is Levine 13 for me, man. I struggle with it. I understand. He's such a hard player to rank. I didn't go this low. I gave him benefit of the doubt.

But tell me why you didn't. I understand, though. It's... He had a great bounce back season. And finally, we were like, listen, this is like the Lev living that we were talking about. But also the man plays no defense. Also, when like when you get to Sacramento, the usage drops a little bit. And it's like, this is good. And I never know how to feel about people when the best version of use, whenever we scare you down, it's like, damn, like, what does that say about you?

And so I do think that, think that he's also another guy where if you are in a very, I need you in a very, very specific situation. 100%. I don't even know if that's the case for O. It does. Playing through him, for the Bulls, he put up good numbers this year

and was really efficient before he got traded. Great, good for him. Playing through him is a horrible experience at times. His offensive approach is hard to be conducive to high level offense. Yeah, and I agree with that. But you harness him in the right spot. I put him top 10. What's the right spot? We haven't been in the right spot in the last six years. I think it's anything decent because you've never seen him in the right spot before in his career.

We saw 23, however many games of the number one seed bull you know, number one, see Bulls, we had it. And then that was four years ago. That's four or five years ago. So we saw all of that. And it's been so, so long. And Sacramento is just torturing everybody by trying to create, you know, Bulls West. And then you pair them up with tomorrow. And at this point, I don't really know where it would be like we've we've all talked about

him going to Detroit and playing with somebody else like like a like a Cater playing with another you know, like legit ball handler so that he's not running the offense I'm not gonna lie if De'arra Fox is still over there in San Antonio or not San Antonio in Sacramento They would we would talk about they would still they wouldn't know they know they would not with Levine With Levine as a back back or do that's like easily the best player that Levine it would play and they would they would Be they they would be better. They still would not be good. You're right, but to the point he would look good, though I think I think he's a good fit with Sabonis I think he's a terrible fit with Sabonis Monk and Demar de Rosen

Yeah, the four players is horrible But you asked what the right role for Levine is playing off of a passing hub for sure like he's a good off all players Yeah, you can run transition relocate to the corners, run off a handoffs, run pick and roll. He, him and Sabonis, I like the idea of them a ton. They just need to shoot Demar somewhere else. They need to shoot him to the East coast, the South, the North, wherever it may be.

Send him in a cannon, send him to anywhere else. And it's not because Demar is a fine player. I get him away from Zach Levine, free Zach Levine from the shackles of playing with players that do not make sense with him at all Yeah, that's been the last five years. He does not have a top five shooting guard in the league ceiling But I do think that like give him a decent system like put next to another high-level defensive guard Like you saw Alonzo ball and Caruso put him next to bigs that he can play off of like what should be sub bonus I do so think he'd be a competent player

I don't know like what makes him wildly different from guys like a Austin Reeves or maybe even like this shooting a little bit Higher to tiger. Oh, they're not wildly different. I will I will say before we move on to the or you go ahead Let's do it. Yeah, that's a good point. I Put him Dominic say his first I put him directly next awesome Reeves cuz I was like you can do exactly what awesome He's does exactly what I'm saying So and it's just that that Carson from NerdSess tweeted. He said, here's every guard to ever average 23 points per game on at least 63% true shooting percentage in the season.

Reggie Miller, Steph Curry, Damien Lerard, Shay Gables Alexander, and Zach Levine. They all did it multiple times except for Reggie and Damien Lerard. And Zach Levine did it twice. He's such a special offensive player and he's genuinely one of the best shooters in any situation or scenario. Can't shoot off the dribble. It doesn't matter. He's getting buckets regardless and he's genuinely a flamethrower. It's just hard to see and feel his level of impact because of how steep of a decline he has when it comes to playmaking. He's not as good as Austin Rees or Tyler Hero. And also defense is what it is too. So that's why

I'm like, he is that level of player. He just isn't in constantly the worst situation imaginable. I think he's extremely flawed and not amazing. The same way you do. I'm just like, you could be solid if you're given a good situation. He's simultaneously not as good as we want him to be, but also in absolute bullshit situations that like both are true And that's what for me That's what 11 through 13 is where it's like like we said the same thing about CJ where do you give him?

You give him some some grace because he's played in in New Orleans But I do think that like if both CJ and and Levine if you if you put them in the same like whatever Like competent situation, I think CJ would would be better. Right. I think I think Levine's highs are higher though. And that's the level of shooting. That's fine. The lows. I think that I think the lows when it's not going well for Levine are lower than the McCone. So that's why I'll I'll go with CJ above him. Yeah, I think Powell is a good comparison. I think he's a lot better than Powell. But I think the way Powell was used on the Clippers is how Levine needs to be used.

He needs to be someone that you don't play through him. You cannot play through Zach Levine. He cannot be the feature player that defines your play style. You will go nowhere fast. But harness him as a scorer next to better players who are better playmakers, better defensive players that can really allow him to be tunnel vision version,

like Norm Powell was this year when he almost made the All-Star team. I think we can get a lot of good out of Zach Levine there. Yeah, that sounds like a very above average shooting guard and it's the I don't know. My top 10 is like is especially the the second half of it. A lot of it was defined of me thinking like can I win with you? And I still do have questions about if Levine

is a major part of my team, do I think that I can win high level basketball games? I don't know. And I actually lean more towards no than yes. Okay, I understand. It's so easy to say that because of what you've what we've seen over the course of his career. Best ball handler she's been playing with is rookie Rubio back in Minnesota, then it's a little bit of Lonzo ball And then we're talking about Kobe white and now we're over here Put him in like next to the monster Sabonis, so it's super easy to say that and I feel you and I genuinely understand I just think it's straight up wrong though. I mean by the time you get him in

Into like an actual situation. It's gonna be time for him to play in the big three. Like his win is gonna pass him just because of where he's at right now. And so that may be docking him a little bit too much, but the perfect situation, I don't know if that's ever gonna happen. Okay, let's just reveal all of our top tens or back half of the top 10

so we can talk about Zach Levine a little more. At number 10, I have Dyson Daniels, gigantic gap between where you had him. At nine, I have Alex Caruso. Eight, I have Austin Reeves. Seven, Zach Levine. Six, Desmond Bain. Okay, so at number 10, I have Andrew Nemhardt.

Nine, I got Dyson Daniels. Eight, Zach Levine. Seven, Reeves. And six, Hero. And at 10, I have Lou Dore. At nine, I have Ben Hart. At eight, I have Caruso. Seven, Tyler Hero. And at six, Austin Reeves. Wow. at a I have crucial seven Tyler hero and at six awesome reefs Wow

Apparently, I'm the biggest Tyler hero fan here, which I did not expect to be development. I respect the all-star season I also reason Levine is tough I maybe I was just fighting Lakers bias where I might might be a fucking Lakers laser if I put him above Zach Levine Apparently not y'all both did it. I don't think it's crazy. The passing is a big difference No, fuck. Yeah, let's slip them awesome. Reads is better. The Zach Levin. Let's go. He is. He is because the passing it did. You can never sit down and tell me like Zach Levin is going to come into

have a stretch of the NBA year where he's going to put up like seven, six, seven, eight assists for a continuous stretch. I don't think I'll see that compared to the awesome Reads. Yeah. I think Zach Levin can seven is the high end. I'm moving down to eight. I don't think I'll see that compared to the awesome reviews. Yeah I think I think exactly we can

Sevens the high-end I'm moving under eight but you could convince me to put Caruso and Gannis above him just because they're such gifted defenders But I know I'm just yeah I'm just giving him so much cop just like I'm just giving him so much of a pass for the bad situations Maybe it's too much. I think Donovan like you probably convinced me I should probably put my ten seven. Seven's a bit too high, but I do think he's extremely talented. And then you put him, like, if he was in Jamal Murray's role playing off of Jokic, I think we'd talk about him

entirely differently. Then again, that's a pretty fucking easy role. It's one of the easiest roles in NBA history. So that's not exactly the same much, but I think there are countless teams that he would make substantially better. Yeah. Yeah, so also you had Jamal Murray at like 16.

So if he did play with the Yocca, you would look at him and be like, he's a Yocca's merch. I'm not giving him that passage. He might be, like you said, anywhere from like 10 to 13. Keep in mind, Jamal Murray would also be like seven on his list. His list is substantially worse than the point-by-list. Yeah. But yeah, so I think I would take, I would take Reeves

over here. The playoff stuff, I would take Reeves over Hero. The playoff stuff obviously, it was a bad series, it wasn't amazing. I'm still really, really high on awesome Reeves. And I think that playmaking run that he had really, really moved me. And so that's why I do think that you can get a bounce back from him. And I've also seen him perform well in a playoff scenario. And so for the Lakers, everything, everybody gets a pass for last year

and how the playoffs went just because the roster was flawed because you traded for Luka in February. And the one move that you thought that you had to make, you weren't able to make it because the trade got rescinded. And so it's like, is JJ's first year, is Lucas first year being in LA? You're giving Austin Reeves this new, no, not new role, but like more expanded role.

And so going into next year, now we have an opportunity to kind of solidify everything. And I do think that he'll thrive. So that's why I have him at six. Okay. Do you think he, like Tyler Herring wouldn't be able to do the same thing? He would absolutely do the same thing. He's better. He's a way better shooter. That's a I have him at six. OK, do you think he like Tyler Hero wouldn't be able to do the same thing? He would absolutely do the same thing. He's better. He's a way better shooter. That's a difference here.

That's fair. He's a much better off ballplayer. That's the big difference. I think defensively, they're probably probably pretty even. They're probably both not your premier defenders on your team, but they're not terrible. Neither of them are. Yeah, I just I saw I just ranked them together because I'm going to give the respect to Hero because he is genuinely one of the 10 best shooters in the league and also he made it all start team. So you all put Bain above hero. Now I will say I hate that I put Bain above him because that's genuinely you called me.

I never wrote for Tyler here. I told you I hate for Tyler Taylor for the next 10, 30, 20 years. Still doing it bro. Ain't unchanged. But I'm being honest. Doesn't mean it's not better than Tiger. He's not and he should have been upward. He should have been number five on my list. I am still the way Miami went and like, and granted, like Jimmy was in and out and he did get traded like later. And so like Tyler was doing this pretty much the whole year. But I look at that team and I'm just like, man, if you put a lot of other guys, like if you put Reeves

in that situation, could Reeves go and make an All-Star team in the East? Yeah. Like, I do think that him and Bam could be a good, in quotes, you know, combo. And he could do that. I think that it's part of that circumstance. I think the only case where I could see

Reeves being better than Austin Hero is probably the playmaking stuff. I do think if he was alone, he could average like seven, eight assists a game easily. I don't know how well that efficiency would hold up, but I do feel good about him being like this all around guard who's a three level scorer, even a better three of a score than Austin Reeves in my opinion, or the entire hero in my opinion, while also combining that with the playmaking stuff across the field. So I can understand.

I would trade Austin Reeves and Tyler Herro in an instant. You would do it in an instant? Instantly. I love Austin Reeves, but yeah. Tyler Herro was a much better shooter, much more consistent and a high difficulty three point shooter, very good passing himself He had a great playmaking year really developed in similar ways to Austin Reeves

Probably we'll call it a draw as a passing talents there 54% on short mid-range shots this year 46% on long range shots 52% overall Previous year from which area 49% so it's always been good. Yeah, 78th percentile, this year is 94th percentile. Legitimate in-between game that Austin Reeves has that too. Austin Reeves is better than him at getting into line. He's a really, really good grifter. But overall, Tyler Hero is a better three-level scorer, just as good of a passer, defense

as a wash, and I think his ability to play off-ball as a shooter, way more untapped potential. I don't know if he's that much different of a playmaker. I think I give it to Austin Reese because I don't know. I do feel the in between game and the file baiting too as another level like unpredictability to his game, which is why I think he gets a playmaking a lot more of a boost. Tell you a decent pick and roll ball handling passing talent like he can really really feed big men on picking roles. Yeah, can he can he developed that school over the last years Yeah, like I think I think hero not that I want to give it to him, but you got to give it to him He had a fantastic year. He was deserving of that all-star team. Yeah, he is better. He is better for sure

It's nothing but I can't believe you have I like that Lou Dorda's a number 10 But it is a bad placement though for sure. I don't like I don't okay this range of guys you can Ask Russo is gonna give you Whatever on defense obviously, we know the best defender here in our game. We want to let's for sure Yeah, but I will say there's certain at times. He doesn't have the best handle, but he has a better handle to do Dord He isn't the best two-point. I don't know when it comes to That's damn your talk. I just feel like Loo dorks will impact the game a little bit more than Loo dork is

An all all defensive kind of guy and shoots 40% from three and like it's not crazy though If that's if that's all you ask him you can put Loo dork anywhere On on any team and it would it would make sense and like the spacing wouldn't wouldn't go, you know, it wouldn't be bad. And last year, like if you looked at it at him last year, you maybe could have said, OK, this is it's the best year of his career. Let me see it again. He did it again. Right. He shot 39 percent last year. He shot 41 percent from this year.

And so if you're getting that and in the playoffs, the fact that Lou Dort is that big and has the reputation of being this like strong physical guy, that's plus five defensive attributes in the playoffs because they let him foul. So like his defense is able to go to another level because of the way that like playoff roughing is and his and his reputation. So you're going to get a version. If you can figure out, get some type of sports psychologist and figure out, can we get him to be 45% actually not 45%, 65% of himself on the road instead of at home? Yeah. This is one of the best role players in the league.

He still is that even with his inconsistencies. I agree with you. Just for me personally, when I think of the best role players in the league. He still is that even with his inconsistency. I agree with you. Just for me personally, when I think of like the top 10 shooting guards list, you need to D you need to have like more layers to your game than just simply being a three and D guy. Now he is an arguably like the best at that. But I don't know, I think in order to warrant top 10, you to have like more medals to your game than just simply like I disagree. But he's not that different. I don't have him top 10.

Oh, you don't. Oh, you've Daniels. That's not that different. No. OK, that's so he can drive. No, he was drafted as a point guard. He's been a poor guard. He is genuinely like he can match great as a point guard. That's the thing. That's the level layer of his game. That's like to get you know, level layer of his game. That's like

Great but like to be a second he's a legit secondary ball hammer. He can Simple pick and roll. He's a secondary driver. He's a better driver, but a worse shooter I think that nets out quite similarly. I got I put him a little bit higher too So I do think that he knows better offensively. It's not some leaps and bounds thing what 40% shooting for Ludo is valuable No, it is like Dyson Daniels ability to be a driver with the size is valuable But if they're both flawed office players neither one of them are spectacular passers. I guess like that's okay That's I think that's crazy to say that you think I'll be someone calling Dyson down just spectacular pastor But I'm saying the main reason why I'm not the main reason why that I'm I say that Ludo It doesn't belong to be top 10 for me Is that he doesn't have as many layers to his game as someone like a Dyson Daniels or even an Andrew Nemhard

They're not the same guys, but they're of the same like category of players and this is but this is also why like This okay, so you'd be better with Andrew Nemhard on their team instead of Lou Dort no, no, no, no, you don't think so. No, I don't. I think I think that's no, I think I think door being able to to be that size and being able to be that big and that good of a defender and still be able to knock down threes at the clip that he does, especially when nobody else on the team is is a great shooter outside of a really like like Dort I think I think that he is insanely valuable for for what they wouldn't be worse those guys I wasn't trying to say that but yeah they those guys wouldn't change

okay sees lives I know what you're getting at because they're better secondary creators and okay see needs that to some extent but then they'd be a smaller team Lou Dort his defensive versatility at that size and go to guard wings plus be the main guy fighting over screens like Nothing to get any better. Yeah, I guess I this is just again personal preference that I'm pushing hard What is your ideal role for Dyson Daniels? Like do you see cuz cuz door is what like the we'll say fourth fourth option whatever But like if he's if door is just like catch and shoot fourth option and and he plays, you know all all NBA D level defense What is your what is your ideal thing for Dyson daniels in terms of like where he would fit on a championship level team?

He'd be like the third third option if you have a really stacked team, obviously is going to be fourth Uh, what makes him different is that his ability to? Of course defensively chalk. We're not talking about that at all his ability to force defensively chalk. We're not talking about that at all. I think the layers to his offensive game, how he likes to force the floater. And he's like he's more he's not as refined as an offensive player because there's so much more to his game that he can get to. But hasn't necessarily perfected.

But I did see genuine improvements, especially over the last, like, 30 games of the year, where he assumed like 38 percent of the three point line. Now, the volume isn't insane it's like three or four game or whatever but still like that level of efficiency while also or improving on the level of efficiency and Also being able to dish out like five assists per game if he was like the main guy there At moves you could say that but there's no scenario in which you want him to get that many sister game because you don't want To play through him because the scoring bag is so limited. Like, yeah, he could get five if he was the main playmaker, but if he's the main playmaker, your

offense is fucking dog shit. So like that doesn't mean much to me, but I do think the slashing is bad. That's why I put him higher. But I do think there's also some team environments where you'd rather have the quick trigger shooting of the door who's going to stand still and be refined there. Yeah, so like they're closer to chalk offensively. I think Dyson generals is a slightly better defensive player. That's why I did this. But there is many circumstances, probably like the Thunder specifically, that I think you'd rather have the guy that can't dribble but will shoot quickly versus Dyson who

shoots better from three. He shot well from the corners specifically this year. But it's a very stagnant shooting, not quick trigger, has to be wide open, left wide open commonly. Different level of spacer. Yeah, definitely. I can agree to that. Dort's game is super simple and it's he's one of the best at that,

which is OK for me if you put him at 10 item 13. So it's not a crazy discrepancy. I just like for me in my mind, if you are top 10, you have to have a certain level of like handle skills. Yeah. And that's that's why that's where we're the only defender. And that's that's where I I disagree because I do think like, Lou Dort's game is not some crazy like, you know, like artistic masterpiece.

It is hammered nail. I'm going to bang this nail. I'm going to do one thing. And like, that's it. And if you're knocking in threes at a 40% clip, by all means, you stand there. You go where I tell you to stand and you catch and shoot. And that is all I need from you. And because I do think like, if you are that good, it allows everybody else to be just a little bit more flawed because

and it's kind of, it's kind of, it's kind of, it's kind of, it's kind of wild to, it's kind of wild to think about it, but like they, able to like J-Dub and his shooting is able to be in inconsistent chat and his offensive game is able to be inconsistent. The whole rest of the team like Kason Wallace can shoot threes like by all means you can you can be there. He can't He didn't and so you were relying on Lou Dort and he came through time and time Throughout this playoff run and he's done it over the last two years to where you know it's actually consistent. So I, for him to be that solidified in that skill, whereas I, I think that for what you're saying for, for Dyson, yet, yes,

yes, it's like it's improvement. So much time for Dyson Dennis versus like it's improvement. This is what the off season about. If you don't like it, get the fuck out of here. It's like it's improvement. This is what the off season about. If you don't like it, get the fuck out of here. Thanks. Next next year, if you told me that that Dyson is like a whole tier above Luthor because because the improvements keep going, I'm cool with that. But I do think like right now they are very comfortable and I will take Luthor.

That's fair. That's perfectly fine because he is the one of the best at his archetype. Dyson Daniels is still like as good as he is right now. He's not a finished product, obviously, and there's legitimate holes in his game that impede him from reaching a different caliber player. So I can agree with you on that. And I am not as bullish when it comes to thinking of him as a top 10 shooting guard. That's fine. when it comes to thinking of him as a top 10 shooting guard. That's fine.

Time for top five. Our top five is reveal them all. I have Tyler here at five, Jalen Brown at four, Devin Booker at three, Donovan Mitchell at two, Anthony Edwards at one. I have Desmond Baynard at five, Jalen Brown at four, Devin Booker at three, Donovan Mitchell at two, Anthony Edwards at one. So I got Devin Baynard at five, Jalen Brown at four, Donovan Mitchell at three, Devin Booker at two, and Anthony Edwards at one so I got doesn't being at five gentlemen around for Donovan Misha at three Devin Booker at two and Anthony Edwards at one and as as we look at this I

Are list differ just between Bane and hero I wish I would have put hero at or either hero or or Reeves at five and drop being down. Yeah The shooting was like awesome from from Bane however Yeah The shooting was like awesome from from being however the listen that that playoffs series was Stinky it was disgusting and it does like I think him being the quote-unquote third option in Orlando That's perfect for him. Yeah, but I don't I I was so discouraged by what I saw him in the in the playoffs for him So I probably should have dropped him down for everything else. Obviously. Yeah, I mean either way

It's five and six. They're the same guy pretty much They're both three level score that can do some secondary playmaking and be fine enough defensively I think people kind of assume doesn't Baines a great defender because he's swole a shit I don't really feel that way So that's like not enough for me to put him over here who I think is slightly more talented the ball in his hands Yeah, honestly, they're pretty fucking some with the ball in his hand So I don't feel strongly about that all putting bait over him is not a big issue to me Yeah, I just would have dropped him over the over the the platform, but that's that's whatever Mitchell versus Booker

I want to continue to be on the Booker is better hill, but but This has been so so many years of disarray. It's not his fault that he's in a terrible situation But I just don't have a good argument for it. We haven't seen the best version of him for two straight years Yeah in my mind when I think about that conversation They're so interchangeable and I gave Booker a little bit more leeway and I give him okay I'll give you number two because I don't know I don't even know if it's fair to say that he did produce better than Donovan Mitchell because he did have a down year when it comes to shooting the ball I think he only shot like 33 or 34% from three point line,

which was a significant drop off. But, um, I have no real, they're, they're in the same group. They're so interchangeable, interchangeable for me. I just feel like when everything is going and hasn't going right for Devin Booker and also Donovan Mitchell, I've just seen things work out more in Devin Booker's favor. And that's not, that's not crazy. This is the last year.

This is the last year where you can say and have a majority of the argument be, oh, it's not Booker's fault, because I do have I do have to see something. Right. I do have to see you not start off super slow and I start wondering like oh are you are you watching this and that obvious like the the expectations are obviously different you just have to meet your expectations at this point like the sons are not going to make the the playoffs and I and like when I if the sons miss the playoffs we're not going to be like oh Devin Booker didn't lead his team we know it's a trash situation it really is as an individual player Can you maximize whatever you're doing and if you see that and if you feel good fine? You can you can do that or if we get you to a better situation maybe but D Mitch has been I

Think D Mitch like last year was was better and this year You can say You can say like he scaled down for the betterment of the team. It didn't go like as great as in terms of like efficiency wise, but that is something that you can say is there for him. So I still would like to put damage above Booker because I like you said, I just have to see a little bit more from book. Okay.

Yeah. Yeah. I think if I'm magic, everybody in their best case scenario, I maybe still think Booker has a higher ceiling, but yeah. Proof is in the pudding of Mitchell. I just gave him credit. Didn't put your mustang to it. I just feel like that debates been kind of subtle for a couple of years, but I hope we see Devin Booker

for these one more year, get a prime year where he gets to be in a team that makes sense. They're asking him to be a point guard, bro. Again, that's so sad and it's so hard to. Just let him be a two. So hard to let him be a two. And I'm not'm much the same as top five top five is pretty simple outside of that we know answer number one two and three is a debate Brown is clearly four and five can be hero or Bane yeah um that felt pretty simple that's a really

simple when it comes to top fives and there we go that's our shooting guard ranking was a mess with really weird position right now with a lot of players with very different skill sets and very different Values, but here we are feel like this is the most different our list has been Yeah my worst placement for sure is The Desmond Bane thing and then there's and then also I think I fucked up as well I'm not putting Bradley Beal where I should have put him or had putting a part of this list

I didn't do that. But outside of that, I feel really good about my placements Yeah, I I take back my Dyson Daniels placement And the cute wait, we really Honda kill. I know I had him at 21 Okay, I had him item over Dyson, which is why I'm taking the oh, yeah I just think back but you were the highest on the Cali than the Walker. Yeah. Oh, yeah, of course And with that being said it's time for tick tock time March March March, March, March, March, March, March, March. Welcome to TikTok time. Today, we are once again going to begin with the draft.

And today we are once again, you begin with a build a player draft. Something we haven't done in a few weeks. We're going to build NBA players with only players who played for the Houston Rockets at some point in their career. Okay. All time Rockets got to build the perfect superstars. The draft order is me first most second Donovan third You already get whooped. Let's go. Let's do it First things first and the first pick the Rockets only draft. Give me Hakeem Elijah wants defense Damn easy pick. That's fair. You got it dude. No, it's gonna happen

Yeah, how could I not exactly give me the best defender anybody's ever. You got it. Newt, new is going to happen. Yeah. How could I not? Exactly. Give me the best defender anybody's ever got damn seen. OK. For shooting. Give me James Harden. OK, it's just one of the greatest three point shooters ever. Weird to say, but it is true.

Don't call it volume. You're wrong. I'm so surprised that you took shooting and not. Yeah, I didn't know where you're going to go with Harden. There's so many things you can do with him. I know. But it is a good place to start having one of the best difficult shot makers.

All right, well, let me get Yao's body. David, I was hoping that would fall back to me. You're not getting Yao's body and Hukim defense. That'd be crazy. And then for, see, now I don't know where to go because like for finishing or are we getting like athleticism with finishing or just like you played whatever for listen because I've tried to make some pieces. I thought it was the body is yeah so yeah yeah that's your body all right well then in that case

for shooting give me T Mac Okay, Dan is cat pulling a claws out my leg. Do you know her nails? I know god damn, okay? So she's a shooting T Mac. Okay. Yeah, okay, so for Passing give me Chris Paul mmm Woody uh I like that Can I do this can I pick Kevin Durant shooting no he hasn't played he hasn't played Brady could pick a big witty. I like that. Can I do this? Can I pick Kevin Durant shooting? No, he hasn't played. Yeah, he would have been picked up.

He has to be out where you play for them. Yeah. Yeah. Well, damn. He would have been picked up for sure. Shit. Daily Green body right there. You know what? He moves different. Let me pay homage to a Rockets somewhat legend. Give me Ryan Anderson shooting. Okay, I'm not gonna. This is throw back as hell. He's so special. Give me Ryan

Anderson. Larmark. It would be nothing without Ryan Anderson and they give me Dwight Howard's body. Okay, you say I'm getting a big. That's a great body. It's Dwight Howard's body. Okay. He said I'm getting a big. That's a great body. Whether it's Dwight or the store if I'm getting somebody. I'm leaving here with someone large. Okay. So I got finishing body that I need to work on for real. Wait, you put a T passing for T Mac for me. I got CP3. Oh, I didn't put that on there. Yeah.

Okay. How like, what the fuck? T passing for T Mac from I got CP3. Oh, I didn't put that on there. Yeah. OK. That's a bad thing. I was like, what the fuck? I don't know if me, but it's OK. All right. So I could focus on defense, finishing or body. What's probably most pressing is finishing. You know, for finishing, give me someone who's going to catch all lobs, someone who's just like a demon when it comes to attacking the rim. Give me Russell Westbrook for finishing.

Yeah. Those two years that we was in Houston, catching lobs off of James Harden. One of the last finishing prime years of Westbrook for sure. Give me finishing. That's OK. All right. So for defense, give me a men Thompson and then for passing. OK. See, now they've had they've had a couple guards, but my body is yeah And so I need a big man passing give me st. Goons passing. What is a man? You should have gave me a man man. You're just being greedy. What does a man's divas even look like a body? It's like just strange twitchy. It doesn't it's not his body though. I don't know. It's weird. Big body with a men defense.

Yeah, I feel like that doesn't do much for you. It honestly does. At least I get defensive instincts. You have his hands? Okay. I'm 7'6 and I have instincts in hand. This is what I'm saying. You guys try to downplay it. It's not, I just want- You don't want a shot blocker that size? I just want- I'm 7'6. You're want a shot blocker that's I just want I'm 7'6". You're inherently if you made a man Thompson 7'6", he'd figure out how to play. He'd be okay. He'd be extraordinary. Actually, that's funny. All right. So for defense, give me someone else who's menacing as hell. One of the most annoying person in the NBA, Dylan Brooks. Welcome to my team. I'm trying to. Are you? Easily. I'm getting you teed up before you have an opportunity

to find me. For passing, give me Kenny Smith. OK. And then? Entry passes all day. Fundamental. Bounce passes. Did Josh Smith play for the Rockets?

Yes. Give me Josh Smith for finishing. That's OK. Give me a flyer. Oh, yeah, that's great. Little bit. But it's OK. All good

Where you going? Okay, so buddy I'm thinking about my player build right now. Obviously. I'm more guard wing centered. I got hard I'm excited all guards. I Got hard shooting Brooks state defense finish like Russ Russ, passed like CP3. He's going to sell. Don't you wish you had a men body right now? I definitely did. I should have took a men. I should have took a men. I froze. So for body, give me the most Houston rocket, the most athletic Houston rocket that comes to mind

immediately. Jaylen Green? No, absolutely not. Not Jaylen Green. His last name is Green, though. Give me J.L. Green. Oh, you said J.L. Green. Let's go. Fuck, Gero, my bad. Gero Green. Good job. Fuck.

That's a good body. Yeah, stupid athlete. You're going to bounce. I mean, listen, you only have nine fingers. But who needs a? Oh, does that hurt the step back three? Hell no, it does not hurt the step back. I think you might.

Maybe. Because it's hard in taking that step back three. So it's cool. Maybe cool maybe harder with one less finger wouldn't be the same for fishing see this is this is really tough but we're gonna go very very old school give me Moses Malone finishing oh okay shout out Moses Malone does this thing you're just strong okay we always overlook him in drafts you forget he exists this is big body occasionally an old person sees our comments as he's our videos ands. You forget he exists. Just Moses Malone. Just big body.

Occasionally an old person sees our comments, sees our videos and says, why do y'all forget about Moses Malone? I'm not forgetting. I'm not forgetting. Here we are. I should have picked this finish. That's a good pick. I didn't even, I forget about him completely.

One of the strongest players in NBA history. So for body, I got, what's his name again? Garry Green, shooting James Hard Harden finishing Russell Westbrook defense Dylan Brooks and passing CP three. And then for body I have Yao shooting. I have T Mac finishing I have Moses Malone defensiveman Thompson passing Sangoon and for my demigod I have Dwight Howard's body Ryan Anderson shooting Joe Smith finishing a Kim Elijah one defense and Kenny Smith passing. Yeah, I think I got it. Do you? I think you just made a fundamental mistake with a men

defense in your body. I just, I don't, I don't understand your tweener. Most of them alone finishing. What do you mean? I'm seven six. Yeah. But you picked the perimeter guy in the spirit of it. Like, I mean, you can always be like good defenders are good defenders, but you pick the skill sets of a small and a men tomson is the one where you're going to draw on that line of like yeah he couldn't be a big like we never do that i don't know i mean it is weird it's starkly different skill sets i like again if we play the logic of you put that smart player in a big body he'll figure it out sure but you know yeah i hate him yeah yeah i hate him because i won well first of all i won first. First of all, I have a chemilateral defense

in Dwight's body with Ryan Anderson shooting. Yeah, I'm sorry buddy. But Dwight Howard at that time had back problems. I did not forget about that. At the first year he was there, he was fine. Not really, man. He was on the decline. The decline.

The decline. He was on the decline. Hey, I didn't see you there. We're taking a break from the product to let you guys know about the newest TD3 production House Call. As you can see, it's the same nonsense, the same hate, the same great takes, but just in the NFL. By the time you guys see this, episodes have already started to drop.

So tap into the new channel, to the new show. Again, it's everything that you love about the D3, but just for football. The link is going to be in the description. It's going to be pinned in the top comment and make sure you guys go tap in and bring your crayons. All right. Next thing we're going to do bleach report recently put out a very, very, very controversial list. And I still haven't seen it. They haven't. You haven't seen yet. Bleach report ranked the top 100 players of all time in NBA history. Today, what we're going to do is I'm going to have you guys guess where these players

ranked on their list. Okay. And I put pretty much all the players currently playing today. So you're going to guess where they rank amongst the top 100. Interesting. First off, we got Luka Doncic. All right. Let's see.

No MVP's, no finals, no championships, no championships. Hello. All NBA first teams. Yes. But I don't think he's not a top 20 guy. I don't think they will put him there. I do think like top 20 top 25 is going to be people who either have one or the other. Let me go 32. I'm gonna say 35. Interesting. Okay. Yeah, I got 32 for 57 for Luka. Don't shit. 57 for Luka. Don't shit. Obviously one of the great talents of all time, but you know, he hasn't accomplished anything yet so I guess they dinged him for that. We are a little bit player hating right now. But I listen at this point, it's like hey, beard grown. So

in terms of like a trophy case, so alright. Beard grown. Yeah, and for comparison of who ranked around him Tracey McGrady is at 59. No this reads at 58. So that's who Lucas right ahead of no and right in front of him Is Dolph Shays Bill Walton, you know another legend who had a small sample size Reggie Miller's at 54 This is yeah, I think it's just different caliber sound for Luca. This is so wrong Reggie Miller 54 interesting different calibers now for Luca this is so wrong Reggie Miller 54 interesting 54 for Reggie okay that's fine whatever yeah Luca's so clearly ahead of these guys by at least bare minimum like 10 spots Dwight Howard's at 52 oh you see that's just actually no I mean listen do I have mad dp or why so like I guess you can point to that and be like uh yeah I guess so that's that's a

little low 152 feels ridiculous that's a little low. $252 feels ridiculous. That's a little low for me, though. Yeah, I like that. Jason Tatum. Jason Tatum. OK, so Lucas at 57, I think Jason Tatum has to be 49. Yeah, they're going to say he's definitely better than because he has the accomplishment that any any NBA player would want. No, MVP is no NBA, all NBA. No MVP, no finals MVP, tons of team success. How much do you think they gauge that compared to Luka? I think they put him at 40.

I'll go 49. Yeah, I got some bad news for you. He's number 93. Now this is crazy. This is really disrespectful. I thought I hated Tate. But this is a new level of hate right here. Come on.

Chauncey Billups is 91. Yeah, go. Lenny Wilkins, 92. Right behind Jason Tatum at 95, you got Dave DeBuscher. Shout out Dave. Bill Sharman, 94. Shout out Bill. Clay Thompson is 98.

Bernard King, 97. Shout out Bernard. He's higher. He's higher. I can't understand why Jason Tatum would be this low. So many first team all NBAs. He has a ring. Best player on a championship team. One of the defining players of his era. 93 is ridiculous. That far behind. All right man. It's not like he's a year three player. He's eight years into his career. He's plenty of sample size. That's a, that's a good prime. You got me bleacher report. You got me. I'm

upset now. Good job. You made your list good. Congratulations. Rage has been baited. I would understand 93 if he never made it to the NBA finals. It was just like a conference finals bound guy. But since he did the thing, yeah. Yeah, even if he lost in the finals last year, I sort of understand it. But he does have the hardware that people kind of expect. It's a prerequisite to get in the top 50 a lot of times for some people. He's been to two finals already. He has been and a lot of conference finals. All right. Well, keep pushing. Shea Giltis Alexander. I think he's easily, he had like the most complete season from a guard that we've seen

only like two other times. All time great MVP season, won a championship, won a finals MVP in the same year. 44. Three straight first team all-in-BAs. I think he's going to be in the mid thirties. I'll say for I've been really I've been much higher on these players than Bleacher Report is. So I would agree with you, but I think they're probably going to dock him just because it's been like a small, small window where it's happened. So I'll go 45 Oh, he's not ranked. What? Clay Thompson is 98 Shagal dis Alexander is unranked you could look rank Luca, but you can't rank Shea who has an MVP

All these all NBA's as well. Maybe not first team, but he got those three first team all NBAs. Come on now, bro. This is it's not a one year wonder. Like he's been an elite top five player for three straight years and now he's a championship. You put Chanty Billups on the list and you didn't put Shea on the list. All right, bro. You got it tough. You got it. All right, bro. You got it tough. You got it. You got it. All right. Bleach report staff. I can't say anything crazy because these are my fellow employees. That makes me have even more ability to say something

crazy. What are y'all doing? I'm in the in the building. I'm building up to the office. In two weeks, we will be in the office. I'm my peers. I can, if anybody could say it, it's me. What is wrong with you? I wish you were consulted for this. That'd be fun. No thanks. Paul George. If Paul George is on this list and Shaggy is Alexander is not on this list, I'm going to pull George's on this list. He is number 78. I had a title. It just keeps on getting worse and worse and worse. I love Paul George. He's meant so much to the game,

but he literally has no hardware, bruh. You guys know I'm the biggest Paul George glazer too. I be over here spinning MVPG back in 2018. Move mountains, the best version of him. Jimmy Butler is 83. Grant Hill is 79, one behind Paul George. That much above Tatum is outrageous, bro. At this point,, I why would Jimmy Butler be on here, but not Tatum. Why is he be bullet ten spots above Tatum? There's no consistent

Those asking these janitors over there Security, bro, I know the guy who said he was not for a B.R. They have the cafeteria ladies, bro. You are not B.R. They're S'n Sam and Drew. They are not B.R., bro. Kyrie Irving. Okay, now they're fucking glazing. 99.

No, they got to glaze. And I think so. I think so. But how often they be posting Kyrie to think about it. Well, what is lazy? Where's Kyrie go? I think glaze would have to be like, yes, 71. He's 69. And a lot of Kyrie fans are saying it's too low that there's not 68 more talented players

in him across history league. Keep in mind Jason Tate of 93 Shays unranked. This feels like you're not hating on Kyrie putting him at 69. That is a very fair ranking if you're giving him. It's on the high end even. To be honest, OK, yeah, this is actually one that I can get with. Yeah, it's a fair ranking.

I'm still reeling from a lot of the other ones. Yeah. From the Paul George of it all. Tatum at 93 and Paul George at 78. Jimmy Butler over Tatum right now is still just like, what are we? Chauncey Billups over Tatum at 93 and Paul George at 78 Jimmy Butler over Tatum right now is still just like What are we? Chauncey Billups over Tatum? You're too confused about it about it all At this point like I'm mad. I ain't gonna lie

I can't help but to respect it because you knew what you would you knew what you set out to do and you accomplished A goal. I just watch the 71 Out of every single list that we've ever either made ourselves, Brian, blind rankings include included are all time or offseason rankings. This is easy. The worst list. So we've we've read Monty Janobly is 75.

Who? Monty Janobly. There's a common theme on here of really, really pushing role players for great teams high on this list over stars like Shea Gittles, Alexander, Jason Tatum. So Monty is 75. I think James Worthy was like 67. Which like, all right, I'm sure. for great teams high on this list over stars like shego, the Alexander Jason Tatum. So Monu 75. I think James Worthy was like 67, which like, all right, man. Sure. Shout out

big game. James. Come on. Green is 87. I'm like, all right, man. You know what? It's not all right. 87 dream. I don't like the next Next up we got Joel Embiid. 99 probably. Yeah, it has to be at 90. No, I actually know he has an MVP. So I don't know how to parse it because like, Luca, apparently if you have no accomplishments, that's better than having some. So Joel's probably going to be at like 45 or something. 66, just above Kyrie Irving, within sniffing distance of Kyrie Irving what are we doing has an MVP wouldn't want to in a row if he didn't get hurt but he did get hurt and he gets hurt a lot that's probably why he's a little bit lower it's just so hard to talk about jillian bitt's career because of all the weird thing that's been happening so i don't even know

how to gauge 66 right now at all i don't i don't like it because at least like for Paul George like I guess Pudgers has been to a conference finals right Chauncey billups has been to multiple Finals he's done the thing Jimmy Butler has led teams to multiple NBA finals. I Guess like even if you're going by like just straight rings culture There's no way you can have those guys there and then Embiid be here at 66. It's quite strange, quite strange. Damien Lillard. 40.

They gonna put him at 40. 82. Wait, where was Kyrie at? 69. 69. Dame has no chips, no MVPs, nothing. I'm trying to, I'm going 82. You're trying to guess what they would do, not what you would do.

I think they're putting them at 65 right above Carrie Yeah, 64. There you go. The first almost good guess of this list. I Don't like it, but I think it should be known generally in NBA discourse that Damien Lord is better than Kyrie all-time Yeah, him being a couple spots above him is totally fair to me. I like this. I think this is fine. Yeah, okay This is the first one I agree with James Harden. So, if Joel is at 66. Joel was 66. Damon Lillard was 64. James is at 60? You think he's in the same same area? Yeah, probably. He has an MVP like James Harden.

He has an MVP like Joel Embiid, but he actually took his team on deep playoff runs making conference finals I have no it's yet. Well, okay So it's he ahead of Luca is the thing cuz Lucas that no, they're probably not gonna put him ahead of Luca for they should They absolutely should I go 53 I'm gonna go wait. I can't remember cuz I'm 66 cuz 54 was Reggie Miller 52 was Luca okay 52 was Luca I'll go 48 then 34 okay gave James harder respect this is not bad this is not bad perfectly fine ranking that's that's

kind of disrespectful I think we did all time ranking I put him in like 31 so 34 is perfectly fine well I mean they've been trolling the whole time so it's yeah exactly I've been trolling too back that's why I'm like okay yeah that's not bad Chris Paul 40 has longevity which apparently they respect has a finals appearance which I think they respect has conference finals appearances I think they respect put him at 27 you know he might be 32 right above Harden yeah they might put him right above hard and 30 okay right above Harden they said you made the finals you've done it for a long time I suppose the logic is there. Yeah. Okay. Okay. We're getting more.

James Harden peak better, but I can't tell what they value. It's a bit inconsistent. Exactly. Why is Lucas so high? I don't know. A bit inconsistent. It's absolutely just a tad. They made these Dwight Howard. I think he's 52. Yeah. Okay. Russell Westbrook. Oh, shit. All right. So obviously quite the can of worms. Is this finally somebody that we get in like 45? I think he should be. I think it's probably going to be like 48 47. So just above Luca. Yeah. The tail end of it has been so bad though. Yeah. But the highs were there. They were there. Forty five. I'll go. Forty eight. Okay. I think that was I said 4748. It's kind of

fair. Putting in like 10 spots behind Harden and the Chris Paul range. That feels fine to me. Yeah. MVP. Okay. Yeah. Multiple conference. Anthony Davis. Oh, this is very interesting. For some reason, everyone I feel like everyone just feels like he is an under retrieer. He is to be fair. I mean, but he did well, actually, he is as a one option, but he does have a championship where he was one a one b best player for that finals run. Yeah. What are we doing? 38.

Like below below CP below Hardin. I think they're going to put him 29. I'll go 38. Forty five. Just above just above Dwight Howard. I think they're gonna put him 29. I'll go 38 45 Just above just above Dwight Howard Okay, and a little bit above now do I has way more way more Jewelry as a number one option with the DPO eyes taking team to finals. Yeah, but he does have a ring Playing with LeBron James. That's fair. That's fine. I

Don't know how to feel about that one. That was kind of a hard hard conversation. I don't like it, but it's not the worst. Once again, I feel like, well, this was the argument for the NBA 75 where people were like, you put AD on there, but not Dwight Howard. Like it's kind of the same thing. So I guess NBA discourse is just, yeah, like 80 is just that much better than Dwight Howard. I think they're pretty similar peak wise, but I don't know. Dwight did it as a first-best player which always gets a certain level of respect which is not undeserving but maybe I think there could be more nuance there at times with that. It was such a unique like team build. Yeah. Yeah, 80 never had that opportunity. His best squad was Etwan Moore, Drew

Rand, Drew Holliday, Rondo. That one're they upset the blazers he's a significantly better offensive player than Dwight I don't know if everybody thinks that or not because Dwight was the best player in the finals team people were like surely you can play through him but I do think AD peak better offensively then they had two post moves but his defense was better than 80s Janice now we're talking 19 now we're talking about the legends is he is he top 20 do you think they'll put him top 20? I think they will. I think they're going to put him at 22 16. I said on 19 24. I should have said that. Lord, you guys think a bit surprising. I certainly rank him in the teens already. Yeah, I think they're clearly wrong, but this is not like the worst placement. I don't know if it's well, okay. I have to see who else is above, but I don't know if 24 is like clearly wrong just because like if you asked me after 21 and even after 22, I would have been like, okay, like he's clearly on that path. But the last couple of years where he hasn't even

been able to play in the playoffs. So we've had two of those years taken away. Maybe you can, you can you can argue that. Dwayne Wade is one spot above him at 23. Who? Dwayne Wade is one spot above him at 23. Charles Barkley is 25 so he's one spot above Barkley. That makes more sense than Wade being one spot ahead of him. You think Wade should be significantly higher than him? No I think I think Wade would probably be at 26, I guess. Oh, just behind them because of knowing if he's yeah, no, no, me, please. I obviously the three chips, but like, yeah, the individual stuff is is different.

So I guess it's understandable at the least. OK, I'll put all those guys a little bit. I mean, I think Charles Barkley, 25 is fine. I put Wade and Janice a little bit higher, but it's understandable. Nicole Jokic clearly better than he is, at least I think so. Charles Barkley 25 is fine. I put Wade in Janice a little bit higher, but it's understandable Nicole Yocich Clearly better than you release. I think so We all think about them pretty similarly as the two defining big men of the generations defining MVP's of the generations May has what three MVP's to his name he does

Three three and four years a championship I'll go 19. They go put him at 11 17 Wow, okay. okay yeah I don't know if you should be seven spots higher than the honest I thought this be pretty close together but I'm not mad at 17 I don't know now that you oh well Yannis has two MVP's yeah and a DPOA yeah Yannis doesn't exactly have a bad resume himself okay but this is where Yoko should be so I'm definitely not this is probably the best placement we've seen so far Steph Curry Now I think he is 10 is Steph top 10 all time. I think for BR for BR

You know what they might make him seven I'll Ridiculous, I will agree with you. I'll go seven for Steph Curry. Oh, no, he's number 10 Damn, I should have stayed at 10 and Kobe is number 11, which has caused great debate on Twitter between these two players. Don't let me be in this debate. Please don't. He said, y'all not going to like what I got to say.

Shit, man. I think it's perfectly reasonable. I think it's also reasonable to pick Kobe over him. They're pretty interchangeable. But I'm sure this is far from the worst placement on this list. Yeah. Yeah, we did this yeah, we we did this this debate before Yeah, and I lean curry slightly, but I understand both sides. Yeah curry above and I think we had like a

2-on-2 debate thing. Yeah up here. Yeah, I remember that and that's the last one. Okay Oh, they're the round of the rest of top 10. They have what Chamberlain at 9 stupid Larry Bird at 8 Kind of low Tim Duncan at 7 low Shack at six okay too high Bill Russell at five okay Magic at four okay Kareem at three yeah two LeBron one Jordan okay I guess like the top ten is fine yeah standard top five yeah standard top ten in general it's fine okay obviously how we value the olds is obviously up in the air for teach their own. But just listen, man, just get well out of there.

Put Steph and Kobe in the top 10. Perfect. Work here is done. Cinema. Okay, next thing we're gonna do. Carmelo Anthony was announced as a 2K cover athlete this week. So we are gonna do a Carmelo Anthony five levels game.

We're gonna talk about how good he'd be in the modern NBA. I got five players, a variety of skillsets. You guys pick who you'd rather have in five levels game. We're gonna talk about how good he'd be in the modern NBA. I got five players, a variety of skill sets. You guys pick who you'd rather have in today's game. Carmelo or his player. Future Hall of, actually Hall of Famer now, right? He got into the Hall of Fame as well. That's why they picked him for the 2K Athlete. Shout out Melo.

Donovan, it's your time to glaze. Level one, Carmelo Anthony or Paolo Bencaro? Paolo wishes he could be Carmelo Anthony. He looks in the mirror and he sees Carmelo Anthony. Yes. Listen, man, he's not feeling the shoes. He's in the mirror and he sees Carmelo Anthony. Yes. Listen, man, he's not feeling the shoes. He's not doing it right now. I'm taking Mello.

Not yet. Not yet. Paolo obviously has a higher ceiling than Mello because of the passing abilities and really is that. I don't know if he obviously has a higher ceiling than Carmelo Anthony. Simply because of the passing, I think he has a higher ceiling. Now, of course, the scoring thing is he needs to put it

together more consistently. But if he does that alongside, keep his passing at the level it's at been that has been at bare minimum, I think he's going to be better now. It's a mellow. This is this is the one time I'm I'm going to use all of the arguments against Palo against him. I don't think I don't know if I think Palo is me better than mellow ceiling wise, but you know this level one for a reason. Yeah. Level two, Evan Mobley. No, I'm taking mellow. I think maybe in like a year, like a year or two,

especially as like Mobley's offensive game really starts to develop. And again, he's taking leaps. But right now, and I'm going to give deference to mellow because I do think that you could put him on the team and still run like competent playoff offense through him. And Evan Mobley is like rising up there. He's getting close, but he's not there yet. Okay. I'm fine. I'm fine with going Mello. I agree.

This guy. We can get going. Level three, Devin Booker. Ooh, honestly, at this stage, at this stage, I would have flipped him. I would have flipped Booker and Moe because I actually think that that's tougher. I think that yes, what Booker provides as like an off-ball player and being able to play point guard, that's fair. Whenever he does it and especially the situation that he's in, it's not a great situation. Give me Mello and give me Mello scoring because

Would Mello be better as a lone star in Phoenix right now? Nobody would be good. Yeah, I can say Phoenix is not the bar. Nobody can say Phoenix. Like I think the best version of Devin Booker and listen, shout out to them because like they got it done. They got to the finals, But you put Devin Booker next to another elite point guard who can handle it and you just tell Devin Booker, hey, go get buckets.

That's kind of the best version of Mello where you put him with a Taunty Billups, with an Allen Iverson and you say, go get buckets. Now they lose to Kobe in the conference finals, but that's kind of the situation. I'm still gonna take Mello over Booker. Okay. Pretty tough.

Level four, Jason Tatum. Ooh, shit. Better rebounder. Why don't I actually? You lose me. I think I might rather have Jason Tatum in the modern NBA. Everything we know about the modern NBA, the importance of your best player is going to be playmakers.

The importance of your best player is going to be playmakers the importance of your best players being able to defend the just The versatility Jason Tatum brings to the way you can play on both sides of the ball I think I'd rather play through that. Yeah, if I had an opportunity to draft a 20 year old Tatum versus a 20 year old Mellow, I'm definitely taking Tatum because there's it doesn't matter what type of way I lean my I construct my offense or defense team is gonna be good regardless and rice whatever opportunity of the occasion it is so I think I'm taking and just be able to play with more other stars or different types of play styles I feel good about I can't say nothing I can't say nothing you got to respect Tatum and slander Mello oh tough day for you tough day'm not slander tough day for you. I'm not slander.

You're picking against him. I'm not saying anything to not love. He's not saying to not love is to hate. I'm not saying anything. And that speaks volumes. I'm not saying that speaks volumes. Coward. Your silence is deafening.

Who's the next one? Because Carmelo wins. Now what? Now what? Who's level five? Tatum has been eliminated. I mean, come on. He's been eliminated. Level five would have been she which is not much of a conversation anymore.

Easy out hell. He got it. She got it. I dare you to say some next thing we're gonna do. He can't guard him in the post. They can't guard each other in the post. Next thing we're gonna do, I'm to name you a series of NBA statements slash takes slash questions that are just general ways of thinking. You tell me if you agree or disagree. All right. Okay.

So these are common debates and things people think across the internet. You let me know where you fall on these statements. Okay, let's do it. Kobe's legacy gets disrespected too much over the last few weeks. I would say or less. I disagree. Specifically. I don't weeks. I would say or less. I disagree. Specifically. I don't know.

I see. I see. Wait, wait. It's disrespecting too much. I agree. I do. I do agree. I think there was a brief moment in the two years after he died

where it probably went too far back. And now everyone's trying to course correct. And so now everyone's like, yeah, Kobe wasn't this. Kobe wasn't that. So I think in this moment, he is getting, his legacy is getting disrespected. I think, so when people say disrespected, it's because somebody says he's like the 10th or 11th best

player in the world of all time, not number three, you know? And I think people always thought that. People are just more inclined to react negatively now, because they're assuming it's like disrespect post-death. Like, you never would have said this if he was alive. A lot of people say at the time, too. I think people just react more harshly now. Yeah, I feel like I might agree with this because

actually, I don't know. It's so chalk because I'm on I'm in all sides of the Internet. Literally, it's so chalk right now. Like we tend to do a lot of revisionist history when it comes to specifically the conversation and talking about has been about Kobe's defense and how a lot of people feel like those all NBA defensive teams were completely undeserved and they're like an overall own talking point when it comes to building up his legacy and how great of a overall player he was. So I'm gonna agree. It's probably it's probably a little bit too much over the last few years. Obviously, I think like

the defense teams are for Gaze. We knew that before he died. But some people would do the whole like, was he ever the best player in the world thing? He, I think he probably was best player in the world at some point. It certainly was a debate between him and Tim Duncan. So people probably, people probably, uh, because the stars today, cause like LeBron, we see a lot of guys are best scores and best passers at the same time. People kind of assume Kobe's style of play couldn't have been at the same level of dominance because he wasn't that passer.

But a lot of that, and his inefficiency, was because of the era. So I think people probably discount just how high his peak was, though I think a lot of the... What's the word here? The arguments against him in all time debates against other top five players, a lot of them I I think, are fair.

But again, the peak is discredited. Plus, I I do think that pre death and post death, the the level to which people think that he was like a second fiddle or like getting carried by Shaq. Yeah, I think that's that's always been very disrespectful because obviously, obviously Shaq is one of the best players of all time and he was dominant at the same time Kobe was dominant or getting there. That's why they won three in a row. But like, if you go back and you look at those runs, Kobe's numbers are still great and there are great Kobe performances in every single series.

And so I do think that he gets disrespected too much. I agree. This is one of 10 keep moving. Next up we got Shay is a top two player in the world right now Agree or disagree. I agree if you Coming off the year that he just had you have no choice But the minimum give him the summer to be the second best player in the world Maybe whenever the season starts and y'all this goes crazy Maybe you could say like you have that but the fact that he is as efficient as he is is averaging 30 is a good enough Playmaker is is a good, you know, good defender

There's there's really no holes in his game Yeah, I mean the hardest task in the league in my mind is being asked to play a certain level of defense Which he does while also getting the most ridiculously tough shots in every area of the court. If you want to give it to him, that's fine. But me personally, I see all time. I know all time. Shea is all time, but I don't think he's all time to the level of Giannis right now, considering

how he just like, he breaks your literal offense and knowing the demon that he has been defensively if he was like I'm I can let people like I can be let people rock with this sentiment for the summer But the second the honest defense like starts to creep up around that's where I'm like, yeah, we're not talking about none right now It's certainly not ridiculous to say she's better just because one Yonis still the better defender You know as more important position bigger player, but his defense isn't like DPOI level anymore. So I don't think it's such a res just gigantic difference that you have to just say that's book open and closed shut. Yon's is better because of defense. It's not quite that deciding factor anymore. So I think it's understandable to say she is clearly the most impactful guard

score in the NBA right now. And we think his ability to lead high level offenses, be a good enough shooter to play off ball a little better, like especially cuz Yannis doesn't really buy into the big man stuff playing Off the guards like we saw with Dame like it's certainly not crazy Yeah, it's super easy to agree with this especially in the state of the bucks. Yeah, I'll let you have it Zion's career is the biggest disappointment of the 2020s agree or disagree agree Actually, oh, wait. Who else career comes up? Actually, I disagree.

Oh, I disagree. I'm surprised you disagree as the biggest Zion criticizer up here. I think. I see this. It's very tough. I go. I honestly do do go back. And I'm really like, I'm not even trying to be funny or anything.

It's between Zion and Embiid right now. Really? I was going to say I was going to say Zion and Kevin Durant for me personally. Yeah, just constant like disgusting situations Never make it made it to conference finals. Yeah, he's old as hell. But it's just like it's just disappointing to me. I think I I can he could be top five. I just think like for Embiid and maybe Zion gets him because Embiid did win an MVP.

So he does have that moment. But obviously, you want him to get to a conference finals. And the Sixers are in a place right now where you don't even know what the team is going to be like because he's always hurt. But Zion was supposed to be the next great star, and it never happened. This is Zion, it's not fucking close.

The NBA put all their eggs in the Zion basket marketing-wise. He was supposed to be the face of Team USA, top five player in the world, the newest American star that goes toe to toe with these European big men that are just dominating win MVPs. He is so far from that.

And yet, Embiid is disappointing in that he couldn't, you know, hit the highest level he wanted to hit because of injuries, but he is so much closer to his peak than Zon got to. Facts, and like with Zon, you've seen just enough to where you can think it could be there, to where it reels you in, like you have the 40 point play in game where it's like, oh, it's great,

and then boom, hamstring injury. You know what you got? You got a taste and you're ready for the whole load. You've been waiting on that. We never got the list. We never got it. We've been revving it up. We're still waiting.

OK. I'm sick again of the taste. I can agree to this for sure. LeBron is still a top 10 player in the NBA. Agree or disagree? If we're being real, I disagree. This is the first year for you, the first summer that it's like definitive

You can't really have the conversation. Yeah, you can't have the conversation at all I think last year you could have done some mental gymnastics and be like in a playoff series by all the chips are down who I Want making decisions at the highest level in a playoff setting where you're gonna attack mismatches yada yada yada I think the ship is kind of say I think yeah last year Listen when I saw when I saw him not be able to blow by Rudy go there Listen, when I saw when I saw him not be able to blow by Rudy go there, I said, Oh, it's over. I said, it's, it's, it's rap. It's rap skin. He had, he had those moments. He had moments where you know that he's leaning on the three point shot. That's not really falling. And you always expected him to turn up in the playoffs and you weren't able to get that and even whenever he did like that game for

where he gave everything he had and they stood and they lost you knew oh he's cooked for the rest of the series it's just too much energy to ask him to explain yeah it's tough I bounce back on this every single day I directly think he is number 10 but there's plenty of times where I'm like yeah he might be 11 or 12. Jokic will finish as a top 10 player of all time. Agree or disagree if he wins another championship, which I think with this new iteration of the Denver Nuggets, he probably is going to be in those conversations. Yes. So I'm assuming with another ship. Absolutely. Yes, I agree. I can't say absolutely because it's it's fucking hard to be a top 10 player of all time

But if someone tells me they think he will I'm not gonna say that's crazy It's hard to push them out of those conversations when you look at the gaudy num numbers you look at Three MVPs already is and he's like not even 31 years old or whatever So he very much could have another like random if we dropped off before he leaves too So now you're looking at four MVPs How many players of all time have those? numbers on their plate If everything goes right, I'm not thinking about him as a talent I think he's a top 10 town of all time

How many players in NBA history have been definitively the best player in the world for five straight seasons? He's probably gonna get to that. I feel like everybody that has tech and say that probably ended up a top 10 player. It's LeBron and Jordan loosely. Kareem Kareem. And then whatever you think about, Walter, Bill Russell, one of them, whatever that maybe neither one of them, maybe they go back and forth. I don't even know. But very few players had a stretch a decade that they dominated. Like Jokic has dominated the twenty twenties. If he gets.

He gets another ring, I think if he gets another ring, I think he gets it. Yeah, I think he gets He gets another ring. I think He's another ring. I think he gets it. Yeah, I think yeah I guess there cuz right now right now he's probably on the outside at like 15 ish You know, it's tough this day this era of basketball It's way harder in multiple rings and we're gonna see so many legends does not have the hardware of past legends because the league was Just different but just one. Yeah. Well, I think he can't one more. I think it's gonna happen a lot. I think you get one more for sure. Like the top 10 ever player ever conversation has nothing to do.

Obviously the skill, no one can say anything about that. It's just about what his team can accomplish that way we can like finally get from the crown like, yeah, you are that guy. And I think his team is good enough to help him get to that point. Okay. Next, I agree. Luca should sign with the Lakers long term. Agree or disagree? I agree. I agree. I think being on it, being on the Lakers gives you an instant boost in terms of like having, having people want to go play for you. And listen, man, they just got bought. They are not broke. They have money. They're going to have money to to spend and there's a lot of people can say they don't have a championship core around him

We don't know how they're gonna get a championship core around him in the coming years They're gonna waste Lucas prime years that would be reasonable History has shown if you just wait a few years stars will come to Lakers They will get blessed some way somehow if I was Luca I'd be willing to bet with history that I will get blessed with another star at some point. Yeah, why not? If Luke, if the Lakers didn't have any picks or any redeeming like young players and you talk about town on that too, but yeah, but you gotta get the fuck out of here. They sent you out there to die, but they're loading up. They're saving all their assets right now. They're not listening to LeBron. They're

willing to sour the relationship with one of the greatest players of all time. You stay there. Yo, I'll live Rapelinka, Luca. The Knicks have the most annoying fan base in the NBA. Agree or disagree? Absolutely agree. Without a doubt, bro. They want everything. They think just because they're in New York

that they're like one of the most important franchises in the history of the league. They're not. They think they're the Celtics. They think they're the Lakers. And they're just not. Exactly. They don't do anything outstanding.

They have lackluster talent historically, bro. They don't do anything outstanding. They have lackluster talent. Historically, bro, they don't have a top 10 player of all time. They never had in the 2000s. They never had any outstanding run, bro. I said, I guess over the last few years, congratulations you made to the West to the Eastern Conference Finals. Outside of that, I'll ask another living, breathing fans of senior championship. If they carry themselves, if they've been off of three straight dynasties.

Yep. Exactly. Right. Yep, exactly. Do you see the way they treat their legends as well? Disrespectful. It's just one. Just one legend that that all the other ones, all of them are front row at every single playoff game, which is actually very fun. I mean, I can I can see the argument.

I disagree. I feel like I know all y'all do was yell, bro. Any single playoff game that they have, I know, and yet everybody, if y'all had the passion that Nick's fans do, everybody else would be super excited. Obviously, I think it's your people. I think I think the Lakers and the Warriors. I was going to say, I'm kidding. It's a Warriors fan. Yeah, it think the Lakers and the Warriors. I was going to say, I'm kidding. It's the Warriors fans, pretty easily. It's the Lakers and the Warriors for me.

I think the Warriors just because they are, Steph Curry has them entitled. And like, it's so entitled. And it's ridiculous. They're a cult. They're honestly a cult. Then they're insane, too. Like, the way they turn on their own people,

the way they hate Steve Kerr, they're lunatics. They're not sane. The man has won four championships with you, and you want himr, they're lunatics. They're not they're not saying Four championships with you and you want him fired their lunatics the cult of Steph Curry breeds insanity Yes, Lakers probably looking at one of the biggest fan bases a lot of dumbasses and Lakers fan base because it's a big fan base so a Lot of stupid people out there just because it's such a big fan base But I think pound for pound person for person proportionally per capita the Warriors fans are most annoying Yeah, the Lakers Lakers fans are annoying right now

because half of them aren't even Lakers fans. They're LeBron fans masquerading. And so it's like, you're not even a real fan. You can win a championship with Trey Young as your team's best player. Agree or disagree? Wow, it's tough. Listen, I just saw a run where Tyrese Halliburton

was the best player on the team. But then one game winning the chip One game away and he ruptured his Achilles two minutes into the game. I Guess anything's possible at this point. I don't know the thing is with Tyrese Halliburton He played the best defense of his career and he used every ounce of his length Disrupting plays he blocked a couple shots in the NBA finals. I think precisely like two shots and that's nothing that's ever that Trae Young is ever going to be able to do.

Listen, two blocks in six games? It means some, bro. He blocked two shots, great. It means some, bro. A block every other game? Hey, man. It's a four point swing. Exactly, bro. That 0.6 bucks per game means something to me. It does. I'm going to agree for obvious reasons.

I think if we see Tyrese Halburn able to go and drag this team, I think if I saw Allen Iverson fucking 25, 26 years ago, go ahead and track that team to the NBA. I'm going to go ahead and say, yes, we have a chance. We can win. Yeah. We're still naming people that didn't win a champion, but I think that the percentage of it, I don't think it's, I don't think it's a non-zero chance. So because of that, I will agree. I will say if we win a championship with Trey Young, he's not going to be the best on our team.

He'll probably be the second. That means the answer is no. Exactly. Next up, NBA basketball is better today than it was 20 years ago. Agree or disagree? In 2005, agree. Absolutely.

Agree. They had to, anytime you have to change the rules because the game is getting too ugly. Boring. Yeah, man. It's better today. Yep. You don't think the game's too soft today?

You don't think they don't want it? They're entitled? Pay too much money? Well, Adam made the call, and he put in that memo to the refs, and he was like, hey, listen, let them play. The finals and the playoffs this year With some of the best basketball that we've seen in a long time like physicality is back Yeah, if you don't like watching threes, I suppose I understand

I like watching high level basketball and nba offenses. They are the highest level we've ever goddamn seen It easy. Yes to me. Yeah agreed NBA jerseys are worse today than they were 20 years ago. Agree or disagree? I don't know. They definitely did bring out some bullshit. But this and today's days, they're experimenting a little bit more. And there's a lot more. I think there's more misses than there are hits. Well, there's way more volume. There's every team that's in New Jersey every goddamn

year. The amount of jerseys we've seen in the last seven years dwarfs what we saw in the previous 25 years. Exactly. Yeah, I agree with this because all of the good jerseys right now are spin-offs of the stuff from 20 years ago. We're like oh yeah that was cool let's bring it back so like yeah you guys are trying to copy what you're doing 20 years ago. Yeah naturally they will be worse because the input is ridiculous. And jerseys is one of those things we look at with rose tinted glasses. There's always nostalgia involved. But then again, I think the young NBA fans absolutely adore

the jerseys of today. Like people like our demographic and older are like, what is Nike doing? We're losing recipes. Why don't they wear their whites on home anymore? All this stuff. Young NBA fans are like, oh, bright colors. These are sick. So generational divide. Man, go read a book, man.

And that's the end of that. Next thing we're going to do, we're going to play 20 questions. Normally we do this with players, but today we're going to do 20 questions with teams. I'm going to name, I'm going to think of an NBA team, either current day or past. You got to think which team I'm thinking of. Okay. Okay. So it can be from any year in NBA history.

Okay. Got 20 questions figured out be from any year in NBA history Okay, got 20 questions figured out. I feel like this time you might actually need the 20 questions We might actually get to the end. All right, so you less so Which team am I thinking of? Is this team from this decade? No, damn that would have made so much easier, right? Okay, so by this decade you mean the 2020s. Yeah, 20 No, is this team from this? uh from this from this Millennium century? I guess they both start in 2000. Post 2000. Yes, this team is post 2000.

Okay. Okay. We got 20 years. 25 years in the Western Conference. You said not 2020. Yeah. What did you say? Is this team in the Western Conference? They are not. Eastern Conference. Did this team make the conference finals? They did. Okay. And we're going like one specific year, right? Yeah one specific year one specific franchise. Okay, okay What's next? So there's like did the team win a championship? They did not win a championship. Nope Did this team make the finals? They did make the finals Finals losers over the last 20 years. There we go. It's love. Okay. Now. I'm not gonna go through all of them Let's let's keep asking questions, though.

All right. Is this team's primary? It's their primary jersey. I'm not the white one, but like red is red, a popular color in their color scheme. Kind of. OK, so think about the Eastern

Conference teams. You got the maybe take it as a yes, but kind of wrapped. I don't want to get. I don't want to get there's a reason why it's iffy, but kind of I'll say that Raptors Sixers. You could kind of say hogs bucks. The Hawks never you can kind of say the breaks. They never made it into the finals. The Hawks never. Oh, no, no, but the Raptors, when they made it to the finals, they won. So it can't be. But yeah. Okay.

You're right. Oh, we don't need, I don't think we need to ask another question for real. You know, can we can list them off right now? Okay. Hold on. Okay. I'll ask one question to make your job easier. Is this team from the 2010s?

They are not from the 2010s in the 2000s. Just made my job harder. Okay. He said, I thought I knew, but nevermind. All right. So losers in the 2010s in the 2000s. Just made my job harder. OK, shit. He said, I thought I knew, but never mind. All right. So losers in the 2010s. Yes. Is this the 2002 New Jersey Nets? It was not the 2002 New Jersey Nets. OK, who else lost?

It can't be the Orlando Magic, can't be the Celtics. Who else lost? The Pistons lost. Is this the Pistons? Dude, no, it's not the Pistons lost is this is the Pistons dude. No, it's not the Pistons fuck Who lost that has read in their jerseys isn't the 2001 sixes. It is not the 2001 sixes How many questions are we? I don't know Listen finals losers out the East it's in 2000

Okay, I'm I'm blinking this is that you guys, you guys have so much going for you. The fact that you haven't you've got you danced all around it. Okay, so it's not the Hawks, not the Oh, is it the 2014 Miami Heat? No, no, it's that's it's in the 2000. You asked me if his 2010s already. I did say that. I did. Fuck, I did say that okay. Oh two thousand seven caps. Thank you. There we go. You're

running great shame upon me, but not getting it sooner, but you pass the two thousand seven hog. Thank you. I'm a two thousand seven camp. I can't believe I missed that. Yeah, right there fuck and that was probably our twenty second question. The most one of the most overlooked losers. Yeah, thought I'd get you that one I'm a name. I'm gonna name every single position in the league point guard through center Who is currently the most over hated player someone that gets criticized too much? Okay for every position. Okay, cool. Let's do it We're gonna start with we go point guard point guard first shake

People hate him just because they just don't like his vibe. He's on he's on top of the world and they hate him right now. Pretty boy. Keep going. What do you say? What does he say before he says a soft, pretty boy, soft, a bitch? I don't know who they were talking about. Oh, Christian Linear, right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. They hate Shay just because he's good.

Honestly, that's what it boils down to. Fritos this, Fritos that. Shut up. Yeah, yeah, yeah, whatever. Shooting guard. See, we just went through all the shooting guards and all the best ones. I don't know if anybody.

All the ones that are hated are for good reason. Like Bradley Beals super hated, and this is like, is he over hated? No. No, he's giving good Like a little bit of correct. Maybe it's like Jalen Brown and the only reason I could say that is just because he didn't make team USA last year because he was like that's kind of it. Yeah, nobody nobody hates aunt Nobody hates D Mitch Booker

Nobody ever expects out of him. Yeah. Yeah, this one's tough cuz like Jalen Green's most hated shooting guard, but like It's kind of worse Is anybody hating on Tyler hero like that? Yeah, maybe Tyler hero. Yeah it is I do me I hate her too much. I didn't put him on my top five. You didn't either Tyler here. I guess dad's hero All-star he's been maximizing his potential, bro. Oh, no, no People hate Lou Dore. Oh, yeah This is gonna be okay Anytime we do it's on the court. It's like it's not basketball. He's a linebacker

Yeah, he's bad for the league. Okay, okay small board He did too much. You got to lose handle. Oh wait, time out. Can we slide, can we slide Lou Dort to the three and put Jeremy Kane at two? Cause they be hating on McCain. Nah. That type of haters not working. I know what you're getting at though. Yeah, they don't hate them for basketball reasons. Small Ford. It was Jason Tatum until he won the ring. It's still my PJs and Tatum. I think it up. It might perpetually be Jason Tatum. It definitely is Jason. Even post Achilles. Yeah, there wasn't quite the tear shed like there was for Tyrese Halliburton. I don't

know if the average NBA fan was like, fuck, this sucks. We're putting him at a, at, as a three and not a four. Sure. All right. Cool. Thank you. Okay. Yeah. Anybody else that could be on there that we're missing out on that deserves a spot better? The threes in the league threes in the league, not a lot of small fours under under a lot of heat. He's like, I mean, Michael Ford junior gets hated on deserve Yeah, I think I think Tatum still remains for sure, I will go take him at three power forward There's there's some power for as I guess I'm hate but like Zion deserves it

You deserve Criticism for sure. Are we hitting on John's getting heat right now? I can't tell now I don't think y'all is gonna take I think everyone sees Who's one of the KPJ and Gary Trent jr. Just being his wing options, right? I don't think it's a like that. I think so All right. Well then I'm if we think about like the biggest Like the biggest brands out there like how much of people hating on like Rui Hachimura? That's wicked bruh. Who spends time hating on Rui Hachimura? I mean Lakers fans but like. Is Chet Holgren the most overhater? That might be the cop out to be honest because people see his content like yo this amount much money from 28 percent from three She might be checked

Unless we will save him for how it was a weird position. I can't even say dream on Yeah, you can't say dream on we could put a small for their power force like a light position in general That doesn't get a lot of attention these days KD Is Kevin Durant the most people criticize the shit out of Kevin Durant off the court for like silly ass reasons that don't matter I'm just saying if we might be Katie sir We're just talking about people who are employed by an NBA team who received the most hate That's like not a hundred percent like just okay. He's probably the most hate for shit. That is irrelevant Yeah, you could you would think that like it's like warranted. It's fair criticism of his personality who gives a fuck every day on Twitter

He'd be lend a come through and slide by his crib every single day. It might be KD. He feels like he opens the door to be insulted. Center. Now there's a big man they get hated on. Rudy Gobert, easy, bruh. It's easily Rudy Gobert. Rudy Gobert's probably the most overhated center of all time.

Yeah. Now the whole COVID stuff kind of warranted a little bit. Should have taken it more seriously. But over the last few years specifically, it's really are we giving to him over joellen bead? He's perpetually just treated like he's dog shit. Oh, that is a good one. I hate both of these guys. I can't say anything after reading that article. I might go joellen bead. I will let y'all decide now. It's really good. People treat him like his DPO wise are all undeserved.

He's one of the greatest defenders, you know, and people treat him like he's a bum. I think that's okay because he doesn't back him up here and said he could be really go bare one on one. It is really go bare. And you know what? NBA players. This is exactly that's a little tips it over for me. I never see an NBA player disrespect openly.

Joe Allen be at all. It is absolutely ridiculous. Okay, last thing we're going to do before we get out of here. Last week, we did a ranking where we predicted who would be the 10 best players in the NBA in five years. So you can do a similar type of theoretical ranking. But this time, we are going to rank the top 10 players in the NBA if everybody was in their prime Okay So if every single player playing today was the best version of themselves and we're gonna take turns picking the players one by one I'll go number one mode number two Donovan you number three until we build a group list

first things first The best peak in NBA history LeBron James will be number one. Okay, okay That is quite simple with you. Now the conversation is wide the fuck open. Is it? There's I think there's two names that are up for wild debate. And for me personally I'm gonna lean towards this way because I love the consistency throughout the postseason that he's been able to provide. Oh he's gonna do it? I'm going to Nicole Jokic. Over over Steph Curry yeah I'm going to call you this guy I don't know if I agree with that but it's not crazy okay she does

have an all-time great peak they're just like when I think about peak when it's most important to fucking peak there's been so many times where the worst playoff run that we've seen from you could just happen like four weeks ago against okay see damn starting off with the dead well who's number three done it's not a real dead it's's not a it's up for debate Thank you for setting me up and allowing me to Grace my life skin go with this stuff. Karan 3. Yeah stuff crazy. It's easily number three It's not crazy to go yokage, but I would pretty easily pick hurry over him. So you forget 2016 I don't forget 2016 you clearly did

You clearly so hard to take your kids out of a game offensively It's damn and he doesn't have it's hard when you six by the step out of a by the nature of you know We did that in the fourth quarter after he done wrecked the game for the first three great And what do you do two games part of that? I? Don't know what the hell is that? Are you are you referencing a specific game? No, I said in 2016 The only the only way to take step out of out of the game is be the only reason why you would do it is because they Were already up by so much and he wasn't playing in fourth quarters. Okay. Yeah, I think

Curry is better piece me just because he's so good as an offball player He can play with any star and elevate them and so can you okay to some degree but Curry's just as brilliant with the ball in his hands as he is without Whereas yokich is maybe the best on ball player ever besides LeBron and Jordan you can say that it's not crazy but the way curry can influence those around him about the ball like there's almost an argument to put him in goddamn. He's like in the conversation to like it's a close two to one like 2016 Curry is that amazing. Come on, man. Okay, I'm not upset.

No, you should feel great shame. Not a mention at all. Number four, Kevin Dur go Kevin Durant. Another player who was always in the conversation for best player in the world, just happened to be playing behind LeBron James and playing with Steph Curry. Okay, that's good. But damn near the perfect basketball player, can play great on both sides of the ball with a lot of different players. Quite the easy pick for me.

At number five, I had a little bit of a tough time deciding who should go at this spot, but throughout a complete sample size, I think I'm going Janis Athenecumpo. That's very winning MVP and defensive player of the year is something that's so fucking rare in the NBA. It's only been done one other time with Michael Jordan. And so doing that, putting up 50 in a closeout game, hidden what? Like 15 straight free throws or whatever it was, as well. When we all know Damo, that's an insane weakness of his too. I'm going Giannis. Yeah, I would be honest pretty easily too. In the same way Kevin Durant is clearly four,

I think Giannis is clearly five. He is just behind him. And honestly, if you tell me that you think Championship Giannis playing two-way level of that type of crazy defense to close out a series closing you out offensively at 51 points and close out game. If you want to tell me on his best day, you would take that neck and neck or a little bit better than Kevin Durant. I'm not going to call you stupid. I won't agree, but it's certainly there within striking distance of each other. Okay.

Go. Who was number six? Shea Gill just Alexander. Oh, I did not expect that. Jesus Christ. I think I think she for everything that he did, we are smack dab in the middle of his prime, right? Whether you think it started already or this was the first year, whatever. But I think that she especially with what he's done over the last three years, the scoring,

acumen, the efficiency, all of that, the defensive stuff and the fact that everybody else, like he has circumvented whatever process that you thought where normally people like make the playoffs and you lose for like three to four years. They got, they were the one seed lost in the second round and she said, all right, I understand it now. One of the champ won the championship, had one of the best, not even like one of the best, but one of the best, not even like one of the best, but one of the most, once again, consistent runs ever. What she does on a night to night basis is insane.

I'm going to show you at six. Hard to disagree when you know a lot of the other guards will compare them to aren't as good defensively. I am stuck here. Do I want to go big hard and a little hard? It's tough. That's where Adam next. But I think.

Are we doing this off of one game or like how are we how are we gauging this? I think through a totality and my mom I'm not doing a game. I'm thinking of a total season. Where are these guys rank if you plop them like in the NBA today at their absolute peak? I'm saying I'm thinking like whatever you think their best is if you get like a three-year sample size of that and try to like a number seven we're going James Harden I really want to go dwell in bead because a two-way play his scoring is just as great at his highest level but the injuries that you just never put it together and I can't ignore that okay very small difference

though I think at his best on his best day, he's probably better Okay, we just didn't often see two best days in a row we are we're following my list pretty well, I like this. Yeah This player doesn't have the consistency throughout a year to year basis But when he's at his peak at his peak, he's undeniably like very much in the conversation of the top five I'm going kawaii at number eight. Oh, okay. Fair enough. You got it. You got it done I certainly think that joelleniid peaked higher than him But if you want to give credit to the guy who won and actually stayed healthy for a couple years in a row Yeah, and was able to do it in the playoffs as well, which is like the highest highest peaks if you ask me I'm going him easily. Okay, I think it's crazy. We haven't picked the MVP yet in Joel Embiid, but yeah, it's tough

Donovan who's number nine? There's a lot of options that I have here. Put Luka Dantzis at nine. Oh, whoa. Put Luka at nine. I think whatever you think about the first four years, if that's prime or pre-prime, you've seen Luka be first team all NBA multiple times you've seen him lead a team to the conference finals and to the finals before and I

Listen when Luca is on he is controlling everything. He's averaging 30. He's playoff proof. He's clutch He's 34 10 and I all that stuff You can make all the arguments for him being like he's been a top three MVP finalist multiple times over Obviously if you want to go and beat over him because he actually got it done a hundred percent cool with that But I think that Lucas has been Lucas at his best is one of the best players fuck you're making me choose between Chris Paul and Joel and be for the last spots Two players. I want to defend almost all the time I'm gonna go dwell and beat.

I know he never got done, never made a finals, never made a conference finals. But if I'm ranking the best players alive in any given year, I'm going to rank Joel and be in the top five. The year after he won the MVP when he was averaging 36 before he got hurt, that is one of the most dominant players I've ever goddamn seen. His scoring was comparable to comparable in bro. It was the greatest scoring start to a season you've ever seen points for a minute He was averaging more points than minutes. Yeah, that is

Points in like 35 minutes Wow, it was ridiculous while still being a top-end defender that I have seen very few peaks better than that I I felt like I was watching the new best player in the world for a couple weeks before it all ended to injury. But I was like, how do you win an MVP? And we all say, ah, you shouldn't won. We're going into the season thinking you got an MVP you didn't deserve. That means your PR is on all time low. We're already thinking, this guy's not on my good side.

And then your unanimous MVP halfway through the season and the haters are all shut up, that is so hard to do, but he was that amazing that year. If you were to have a number 11 who would it be Chris Paul where were you Chris Paul I think I would have probably a D and then Chris Paul I'm picking Chris Paul pretty easily yeah I don't think I'm thinking about that yeah I'm thinking Chris Paul those now finally you know after that well because if you pick okay, so if you pick at 10 You're going 11 you're going ad right I guess I will go crisp off

But let's just say because we have voted you you go Cp at 11 12 80 when be I guess at that point it would be either Westbrook or Tatum after that. I'm taking AD over Tatum. Thoroughly, for sure. Thoroughly, for sure. I don't know, because I don't, yeah, I don't know if I would do that. It's a weird conversation.

It's hard to remember AD. At some point we gotta put Regal Bear in the conversation. All right, now the episode's over. It's ruined my fucking vibe. We gotta put a legal bear in the conversation. All right now that episode's over. You're on my fucking vibe. If you're still here, comment Rudy go bear deserves love. Comment house call. We hear check out house call episode 3 check out our wide receiver tier list was a fun episode.

Let us know what you think.