The Deep 3 Podcast - We Ranked The Best Players In The NBA | Ep. 68

Episode Date: December 22, 2023

Today we rank the NBA's best 30 players! #nba Check out the TD3 merch: https://the-deep-3-shop.fourthwall.com/ J oin the TD3 discord!: https://discord.gg/RUkjpMPp7E Listen on Spotify!: https://open.spotify.com/show/3elbbqVumwqz8wlIdknsLW Listen on Apple Podcasts!: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-deep-3-podcast/id1657940794 Follow us on TikTok!: https://www.tiktok.com/@thedeepthree Follow us on Instagram!: https://www.instagram.com/thedeep3podcast/ Isaac's twitter: https://twitter.com/byisaacg Muhamed's twitter: https://twitter.com/Mojo99_ Donnavan's twitter: https://twitter.com/Dsmoot3D Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Isn't this weird that I can, like, reach over and just, like, touch you? Like, ew. Are we rolling? We're rolling. God. This is why we don't do a person. Could you? Yeah, this is.

You start wilding. I'm just going to start touching people. It's the word way to put it. Can't see it so. Can't see it so, please. The cream is crazy. Oh, my God. Merry Christmas family.

Happy holiday from the Philadelphia 7-7. Crayon Eaters rejoice! What is up, everybody? As you can see, we're in person for the TD3 Christmas show. It's going to be a great show for y'all. You see by the title, we're ranking every player in the NBA, specifically the top 30. We did this last year around January.

And I think I can speak for all of us that this year, this is one of the hardest years in recent years to rank the players because so many young players took a leap this year. They're like, it's impossible to, not impossible, but it's very hard to compare them to like the previous generation. that's already been established. This is where agendas get pushed, right? Like, there's going to be some nasty combos on this one.

And honestly, it's not even going to be nasty because everybody's good. You know what I'm saying? Like this is, like you said, this was extremely hard. And even like from 22 to 21, we're sitting here just like, what am I going to do? Like, who am I going to put here? Bro. Me and Isaac made our list last week or a week and a half ago. And we found ourselves almost every single day.

twisting it and turning it and there were just constant adjustments so from top five one to five one to ten fifteen to twenty there's just going to be no consistency between the few of us but that's all at the same time

there's going to be some consistency as well so yeah we're in for a long we'll see man if you're watching do us a favor if you're on audio platforms leave us five stars leave a review you found YouTube drop a like subscribe all that help his video get seen more people

you know it's not often we're in person it's the second time you've ever done it make sure everybody sees it from the audience listen man i ain't in the hood today i feel so good i'm in a safe neighborhood i wait to some dog someone someone waved to me back i feel good right now so please leave a like got his assing the burbs he's not going back but before we get to the rankings in the main part of the show we have a little festivities to do for t through christmas i'm gonna go grab some stuff y'all y'all talk to you some time okay what do you think he's getting us uh i have no idea i don't know to be honest with you if he's gonna i hope you don't give

us no bullshit. Some I need for real. Some rat poisoning. Sometimes. Oh. Listen, I've known Isaac. I've known Isaac is one of the top three most unsurious people I've ever met. And this is going to be some foolery right here. He's putting on the Santa hat. Look at this. He put in the Santa hat over the dad hat. Oh, yeah. He's not. Who does it like this? This is unsurious. Who does this? Like this? This isn't real. Let's let Donovan go first. Donovan. We got some gifts for you in there. in the bag first. The bag? Yeah. Merry to you through Christmas, y'all. Let's see what we got for everybody. I don't like this. Show the camera. Oh my God. Show the camera. Show your ISO cam.

You got me a Carl Anthony Towns book. His favorite player in the league. Read the title for the audio listeners. Carl Anthony Towns. The inspiring story of one of basketball star centers. One of the best in the league. Incredible. Shout in the click. Shout out to Clayton man that's the Arthur look look at the inside of this is a doctor sooth looking book that's can't read I had to keep it simple can't read okay that's crazy let me just toss that let me go let me go let's go let's go one by one go your turns move in the back first open a bag his story is quite inspiring though I can't hate on that well now you can learn all about it

there you go maybe it'll give you a new light on him no I know what the fuck is in here you better read that fucking book what is in here feels like some snacks? Not for you. Oh, hell. This is exactly what I needed. This is for the effective control of rats in mice. I could give you a hug right now, man. We can't get you on the hood for good, but we can help your battle against the rats in the hood. We can do a little damage. It's going to be put to use as soon as I touched down to NYC. Actually, you open two in a row because Donovan has two in the next one to open. Which one you think I should have? This one, or geez? That one. Open the box.

Let's go with that one. Two Mo from Isaac. Why, you really put your heart into this. I ain't put... Don't speak so soon. All right. It's still opening it. What's going on?

Here we go. We got a box. Does he need scissors? Don't show the address. You need a knife? Oh, you're good. You can... You can creative.

Oh, look at the inside. Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. Whoa. Whoa! Whoa! 8 p.m. Mondays, if you know, you know, this says skims on here. There ain't no way. Ain't no way I got a pair of skims.

Show people. Oh, that's hard. Oh, hell. Oh, hell not. July so game. No, what the fuck is this? That's hard. That's hard.

What is this? Who's been awareness? Who's been aware of this? Oh. I got Shay on my cheeks. God. Shay SGA Listen, every live stream we do

You talk about wanting to do A Skims Hall I hear you I see you And I listen So we got to The greatest hall We could imagine

The spokesperson Mr. Orah man Shea Gildes Alexander On the cheeks He got some SGA Tidy Whitties For Christmas And they are tidy

motherfucking witties Look at those things Look at that fit I don't know They look kind of big though Even for Mo They look big as hell

What you're trying to say About me man Damn X-Exel I'm planning for you To have these for decades I know you're never going to want to get rid of them once you put them on they're going to be cozy what does that mean what does that mean listen when he hits 60 he's not going to look the way he looks now that's all

I'm saying none of us are he said you're getting in thick eventually I see it okay how do you feel I feel bamboozled I feel let astray I feel distraught this is a monstrosity this is cataclysmic you just rule my hopes and dreams you literally got a skim's box you're sick in the head you know that how do you get this things we do order for old skims and you just like kept it to yourself he bought skims for himself that's what happened mother I cannot confirm or deny. All I can say is the things we do over here at TD3, we do them big. He got the skim's on right now.

Maybe. You do. Damn, man. All right, Donovan, you go next. All right. This is my last gift. Apparently, this is two gifts and one. Yeah, open a right next to come.

Give them the gift to ASMR. Exactly. Listen, I'm not going to show this. I'm not going to show this. I'm not going to show this. Show the ice okay. I'm right now where we got you. One by one.

Ooh, a Clippers viny. Listen, first of all, I live in, I live in Texas. I'm never wearing this. This will be donated. Listen, I know you're fragile. Sometimes your ears get cold. You got the old beanie on. Make sure you're comfortable.

No. What else do we have? You got your favorite jersey. Oh, the Paul George is kind of hard. No, that's kind of hills. Paul George Clips. Listen, this is going to go platinum in a goodwill in Texas. This is going crazy.

Some kid, dead stock. clipper city jerky edition come get your merch right now is there anything else in here nope there's those two all right listen i had to make sure you rep your favorite players and your favorite teams everywhere you go i got you listen i'm i'm happy that you were thinking about me but at the same time you were thinking about the community because again all this is getting donated the books right kids are going to learn how to read right kids are going to have stuff to put on their heads they're going to have shirts christmas for kids

this is a fantastic for the kids and that's what we're doing This will never touch my body. I promise you that. I promise you. Your bones just must make on a week just after holding that. But I got my last one. This is big. This feels like a frame.

I got to be careful with this. Fantastic. I hold the mic. Yeah, hold his mic for him. Let's do this as a team effort. Oh, God. It feels so weird. Oh, my God.

Oh, my God. Oh. The cranium is insane. The cranium is crazy. crazy. What the fuck? This is actually a good gift. Now this is hard. That's actually hard. This is hard as hell.

Listen, if you know anything about us, we have some iconic moments. Most of them come when Mo says something hilarious. You hear the intro song, you hear, the cranium is crazy. This is the origin of that photo. Many of y'all may have heard that before and not know what it comes from. This is it. Oh my God. The dome of all domes.

You're not holding your mic, by the. way he was talking the dome of all domes yeah facts this is perfect when someone walks into my crib they're going to be like a yo why you got this on your wall mind your business and I'm going to send him a link straight up

but this is fantastic this is the greatest fucking gift ever I got the best gift for sure no you 100% did yeah he likes you more it's the Shay undies he likes you more okay now the Shay undies was crazy but printing Shay on the on the Nutsack is crazy dog

who is fin of too that. But wait, we're not done. I'm done with your guys' gifts. Nikiel. We have producing Nikol in the corner. Come sit in my chair. Woo! Come. He was not prepared for me. We ain't forget him. I'll tell you that. Come sit in my chair. And you're going to take my mic. And we're going to get your live reaction to something else. You sit there. A lot of festivities. I'll interview you. Give me the mic. Have people seen what Nikil looks like?

This is the kill. Face reveal. What's up, y'all? Go ahead and open that for us. I'll point the mic back at you. We'll get you your live reaction. He gets a small gift. Yeah, yeah, give him your mic. There you go. We had to get him involved.

It's going to be some dumb shit, bro. Nothing about this has been dumb shit. We have him a T-shirt. Daddy. Woo! Coming soon. If you saw the last episode, Nikiel was pulling up videos for us to watch

and he had an ad that said calling all daddies. I don't know what it was going on in the ad. It was some weird shit. But we had you guys comment, Daddy Nikiel. And you did. All of you said Nikil is my dad. and now he has a shirt to rep it.

Shout up to the fathers. Shout out to him. That's a great. Do this for y'all, man. Thank you. And not only is a t-shirt, it's a crop top. It's a crop top. To accentuate your form.

Okay. I'll be wearing this tomorrow. I think you should put on right now. Yeah, maybe, uh, if they... He's not about it. It's mine to paywall. I have a paywall. I got a much of my chair.

Uh, man. But wait. Just one second. Oh. I actually have a gift of my own. So y'all yapped for a little bit while I go pull it out. I love yapping. No got to tell me twice.

So Donovan, are you going on $200 dates? $200 of course. It's $200. Yeah. We got a big old bag. Show on, show out. Big bag for you, my sir. For me?

Yeah. All right. Can you hold this? Listen, you said I liked him more. Listen, he had to compensate and he got you something as well. So Merry TV through Christmas for everybody. Ooh. Wait, what is this?

Go ahead. Open it up. What do you see? Oh, this is so funny. So I got you a pillow that says hater on it. Donovan. You and your hating is masterful. Me, Isaac, Nikiel, the crowd ears watching this.

Every single time you sleep, I need you sleeping with hate on your mind. So you wake up and you give us the greatest content of all time. We need that. Pro audio listener It's a pillow that has a Nick's jersey on it And the name instead of a name is his hater Look at this I gotta take it down

So y'all can see my smile This is This is fantastic I love this And that's everything we got for you Merry TD3 Christmas The TD3 holiday special Let's get to the rankings

Oh, never mind I said we're going to the main pod I forgot one thing For a while now we've told y'all We're going to do a PS5 giveaway When we hit 10,000 followers on Twitter that was the plan things changed

crazily enough Activision decided to bless us with three PS5s to give to you guys so we're not waiting anymore for that we're just doing the

giveaway now because we have three of these just available to give to you guys so I think we give them to them now just give them to them early you know I kind of didn't want to give it to them

because they did not follow us at all and to be honest with you I had about 50 burners ready to go ahead and win that PS5 turn, that PSI give away, bro. But they deserve it. Y'all have been showing love. Y'all been liking the videos, commenting,

showing it up on our live streams and all that. And I'm happy to give this to y'all. Yeah, listen, they got us to 6K followers from zero. That's solid. And listen, it's a TD3 Christmas special. If we're giving to all of us, we've got to give back to y'all, our crayon eaters. All right.

So the package hadn't got there yet when I recorded this yesterday, but we finally got them. All three of them. And that's kind of hard. Shout out to Activision. they send us these. We've got the special call of duty edition, PS5s, the new ones. Give it away to three of y'all. So tap in. So what we're going to do is once this pot is live, you're going to see on our Twitter account,

there's a post that's going to say reply to this for the PS5 giveaway. So now go to our Twitter and you'll see it. Just reply to the tweet and we'll pick the giveaway winner from there. Calling all the eaters! Where are you at? If you're on YouTube or Spotify, you don't have a Twitter, just make a burner. I don't care. Make a burner and reply to that and we'll pick from there. I still got a chance to snag one. Good luck. Three of y'all are going to have a Merry Christmas from TD3 with a brand new PS5. And guys, now we can go to the main pod.

Woo! So now that we're back to the main part of the show, what we're going to do is a top 30 rankings like we've always done. And how we always do it is we reveal section by section of five. So we're going to start from 25 to 30, then 15 to 20, etc. That I said all the wrong numbers. But you know what it goes. We're going to block by block and take turns. Who do we got first in this lab, Nicol?

Oh, okay. Well, there you go. We have a whole bottom five on the screen right now. I'll go first and say mine for the audio listeners. Keep in mind, like I said earlier. This is the hardest top 30 we've ever had to do. The names we had to consider that had variance in play from last year to this year, incredibly difficult. At 26, I have Jalen Brown, 27 Zion Williamson, 28 Rudy Gaubert, 29 Carl Anthony Towns, and 30 Pascal Seacum. Damn. Okay. Okay. Yo, Gobert is much lower than what I thought you were going to put. him. You have them a lot higher? Yeah, I do. Wow. I'll say that off rip. That's, that's probably the most shocking. Everything else is kind of like, it's, I'm going to say the obvious. It's so sad to see Zion at number 27. Yeah. That's so sad. He does, he has no business being that low, being in Jalen Brown and Pascal Seacom Ridge, range. That's crazy as hell. He's not supposed to be there. Last year, I would have had him like 12. Yeah, bro. Yeah, bro. It's just sad. And that's the thing. I want to put him a lot higher, obviously. I'm one of the

biggest island fans you'll find yeah he just hasn't been good this year he has many flashes being great he dropped 36 a couple nights ago the next game he dropped 12 it's just his much has been made about him being huge now and I didn't drop him because he's huge but that plays a factor in his game to game motor and he just doesn't have the same consistency he had last year when last year he was a legitimate MVP candidate every night we're just not seeing that guy this year so I honestly he hasn't been a top 30 player this year I give him better for the doubt that he'll continue to get better and still, I didn't

forget what happened last year, so I gave him some credit. Yeah, and you're going to see some of that on my list as well. Who's the hardest person to put on, on this bottom five for you? Zion, for that reason. Also, Gobert, I'm, again, I'm probably hilarious I had in the lowest. I'm probably the biggest Gobert fan here. A hundred percent. I had to balance,

so I sell this hat on, I do. I had to balance the, I like him a lot. I've come to defend him for years. I try to balance that with how great he's been this year. and listen I put him above cat I think he's firmly the Timberwell's second best player I ended up going with guys above him

that are also good defenders on here that I gave credit for that I just didn't think he had the offensive production to be above somebody like a Jalen Brown like that was my hardest debate because I know we had to talk about that like a year ago where it was Jalen Brown versus Gobert and I was firmly team Gobert

change their mind a little bit so you can sway me to put him higher so go ahead if you have a better argument to put him higher I mean there could definitely be arguments being made because I've never seen Jalen Brown have the same effect

in a complete total game on both sides like Rudy Gober does like Jalen Brown's a fine offensive player of course but he's never going to be the main reason why you're a top five offense in the entire NBA. Not to like disrespect his game or anything like that, but the sales

just have a built-in system with so many complimentary pieces that just magically not magically moves them there but they're just there you know so and I love that you put Carr Anthony Towns there as well he deserves so much love and admiration for how he's sort of evolved his game he's being more comfortable he's been a better defensive player moving his feet a lot better and all that and he's playing with a little bit less emotion he's less yappy on the court and while he

he directed that energy to actually just being like more locked in and focus on that end too so yeah listen if cat didn't go on the podcast run that he had this summer he honestly would have been higher on a lot of people's list because I think right now just the perception of cat for the last couple years has been you know a little shaky and you know people like me don't necessarily love him but I do have to give him credit and so like that's why he's on my top 30 because he has been uber efficient in the in the mid range right he's obviously one of the best shooting bigs in the league 50 40 90 right like it's it's it's crazy and so for a team that we thought was going to have to be blown up after one year,

Kat's resurgence has put the Timberwolves in a position where, like, they can legitimately make the finals. And so... It's nuts to think about from last year. That's crazy. That's actually crazy. So, yeah, so I had Kat 30. I guess we'll take this out, transition into My 5. At 30, I have Kat, 29, Jamal Murray, 28, Tyrese Maxi, 27,

Lowry Markening, and then 26, J. Limbaugh. Interesting. You have two of my hardest cuts where Larry Markening and Tyrese Maxi. I think I probably should put Maxi on here. Definitely. I ended up going Siakum over Larry. So interesting you have him like, I was thinking about Larry for 30. Why is he so high at 27? I think that Lowry one is, Lowry can fit on a whole bunch of different teams because of because of his skill set and because of his shooting. And when we talk about like, like for Maxi, Maxi has taken the leap this year, right? And I think all of us firmly believe. Like, that, like, this is who he's going to be.

Lowry took the leave last year. And while it came really out of nowhere, it is basically who, who, like, he is now. And so I think that for now, for a year and a half, which is kind of like an extended period of time in today's NBA, Lari Marketingan has shown to be a very efficient, very versatile score. Yeah. And I think that he can fit on a lot of, on a lot of teams and can contribute to winning basketball in a lot of situations.

And just because he's in Utah and they're not in the business of winning basketball games right now, I don't think that I, I don't think that we should keep him out of the top 30. Yeah, that's super fair. Lari, his individual production has not like moved or shifted at all. He's been the same great offensive player, great offense player that he's been. He's a fantastic, one of the best catch and shoot players in the entire NBA. Like you said, like he's probably the hottest commodity in the trade market. And so to see him at 27, like, I, I. I'm happy that you put him there.

And honestly, I wish that I made more room for him. But I just felt like there was too many, too many other good players ahead of him who just have gone more sunlight and sunshine, you know? Yeah, yeah. My biggest thing, though, is 29 Jamal Murray. I think it's interesting that you put him there. I love that you put him there. I didn't want to put him there because I'm just like, I'm looking at the top of year that he's had.

And he's averaging like cool 18 points efficient and all that. I missed a couple games. But I don't think he's had like an outstanding year so far. And that's fair. When we get to later in the list, I think all of us feel this way. When we talk about Jimmy Butler, Jimmy Butler gets some points because of how much he rises in the playoffs. And there's conversations that he ends up just nudging his way into because of what he does

in the playoffs. Jamal Murray is the exact same way, right? And so I'm not talking about Jamal Murray as a top 15 guy, but top 30. Yeah. Like, he is one of the best playoff risers in the league today. in history in history right the stuff that he's done in the postseason is crazy so i want to give him credit for that and so that's why he's in my top 30s i yeah i kind of wish i to put max on here maybe i would have slid him over siacum i could see maxi over cat larry they're like i want to put him on

here because i agree he's like i think he's legitimate like low-level all-star i don't really know the argument of him above cat with the way cats been playing this year that's the donovan text yeah okay that's fair you're fair enough talk us to your first five mo because there's some names here. Yeah, so at number 30, I have Tyrese Maxi, 29, Regal Bear, 28, Palo Bancaro. I had to put him on there with the successful year that he's had so far with the Orlando Magic. He's definitely going to be a first time all-star, but I digress, 27, Jalen Brown, and 26, I have Kyrie Irving. That's low for Kyrie Irving. Interesting. We all clearly, both of us, do you have him hired Dunman? He's that on your list? Okay, we'll talk because it's an audio

level yeah yeah no he's he's not on on my list and i think i think part of it is once we get to like this back half it gets it's very very tough to to start making cuts and it's like you really think larry markan's better than carrie ripping a basketball generally i don't blame you because it's just like i blame me overall like the last year two years he's done larry markin and has like made more noise in the NBA than Kyrie. That is such a subjective thing, though. Like, has he made more noise? What does that mean?

Like, Kyrie averaged 27 last year, on one of the most efficient years. Just now he's playing backseat to Lucas, who is the highest usage player in the NBA. So naturally, his counting stats are going to be lower. That ain't make him worse at basketball. That ain't make him worse at basketball, but at the same time,

we literally last three watched, like, again, I don't want to say it's attacks or anything like that, but we watched him get traded to the Dallas Maverston. They just, like, get worse. Yeah, well, it wasn't because Kyrie. The numbers they had last year when Kyrie and Luke were on the court were always positive. The team was just fucking ass around them because they traded their only good perimeter defender and had nothing on the back end to make up for a defensively deficient front court.

For Kyrie, I think a lot of what we've seen from Kyrie over the last several years. And what we might see later on in this list is you have affected teams and you have the stuff that you've done away from basketball, all of that. stuff matters. And so for Kyrie, give me one year of solid basketball. I get it. And then I will gladly put you over Larry marketing. But I need to see it for nine straight months. And I haven't seen it. So we're in the process of that. He can get back to that. But I need consistency. He has absolutely everything else. Just not actual consistent. I understand that. There's the off-the-court intangible stuff. I personally try to look past that as best as I can because I feel like a lot of

times like not to say it doesn't mean nothing like it's important it matters but I feel like a lot of like not just us but people in general to know do analysis and have opinions use it as a crutch to just be like this guy falls apart in the playoffs he's automatically worse without any more critical thinking or like Kyrie ruins teams whatever it may be so I try to bounce that a little bit and like account for the fact he's still just fucking incredible basketball like would you really rather had Jamal Murray than Kyrie Irving no one in their right mind would do that in my opinion. Maybe. Maybe. I think at this point

right now it's a conversation. Well, okay, let me not act like Jamal Murray can't stand toe to toe alongside Carrie. He definitely can. He can stand total to toe with literally anyone in the league what's June, April Hart hits. Yeah. I mean, there's a lot more games to play than just those. So I try to

maybe I should put Jamal Murray for that because listen, we put Jimmy Butler high because we know when the playoffs come around and becomes God. Exactly. I guess you can say the same thing about Jamal Murray. I guess really I'm probably just biased at the fact that he's been hurt this year and hasn't quite had like a chance to be consistent and like get really rolling like we thought he would. We all thought that he would be an all-star this year.

Easy without a question. And right now he's not in that conversation at all. Yeah. I mean, listen, I put Pascal Seyakuan here. Y'all didn't. I did the same thing with him that I did with Kyrie where like this situation he's in this year isn't conducive to him putting up numbers. But last year he was an all-star, averaged like four more points.

He's only worse this year because he takes three less shots per game because they new coach prioritized Scottie Barnes. I don't think that made Pascal Seacom any worse. He's a walking brick from three, also, but I can't ignore that. Yeah, I still think he's great, but like, if you want to put those guys we're talking about above him, sure. No.

Yeah. I, I can be mad at that. I can't be mad at that. Me personally, I left out Car Anthony Towns. He was an honorable mention. My honorable mentions were guys like Desmond Bain, Cat, of course, and then also Pascal Seacum. I wanted to put cat here so bad, but I just felt like I could not put him over Tyrese, Paolo.

Oh, you can put a cat. Yeah, no. I want him to. I want it to, but he's not the reason why, like, this team is number one in defense and the best team in the NBA statistically speaking right now. Yeah. Okay. Yeah, I think this is good.

I like this bottom five. It's a little variance. I appreciate the Palo Ben Carroll pick. Yeah, absolutely. All first time, All-Star, we need to. Hopefully. That'd be cool. It's going to happen.

Let's move on to the next four. From 21 through 25, I have Bam out of bio at 21, Scotty Barnes, Trey Young, Jalen Brunson, and Kyrie Irving. Wow. Sorry, I just had to get that out. What was that for? Trey Young is about Jalen Brunson, that's all. Don't get too confident.

That was extremely difficult. I thought about this for at least 30 minutes. And the fact that Trey Young has fallen from like the third best point guard in the league to me having Jalen Brunson conversations, it's crazy. One, let's let's not disrespect Jalen Brunson by saying Jailen Brunson conversations. Let's say that. Two. Fair. Just because he says it's right.

Don't mean that it's actually true. Okay. Trey Young is not And I'll give it up right now Trey Young is not better than Jalen Brunson Right now It's tough I don't blame you That's not that's not the case

Okay Being serious though for a second One thing that I'll say That caught me by surprise Is putting Scotty Barnes At 22 He did not make my list whatsoever He was definitely an honorable mention

I'm not saying that as if like I fucking still hate to do to whatever He generally like has made that leap after having what you call a Tyreek Evans-ish sophomore slump, which is super natural. We've seen plenty of players in the past, have this decent Tateau, for example. He made leaps to his game.

Me personally, I would not say that he's better than J.L. Brunton at all. I wouldn't consider him better than Trey Young. But to see that you have this type of admiration from at 22 is interesting, and you got to talk. Donovan, is he on your list? I think that you are munching for Scotty Bronson. He's not on my list. Y'all need to watch more Raptors games.

I'm sorry. People handle us a lot because we make fun of the Raptors and Raptors fans get pissed about it. This is the time. If you didn't put him in your top 30, you legitimately need to watch him Raptors. Tell me why he's better

than Jalen Brunson. Defense. He is a legitimately incredible defender. He's not going to get all defense buzz or anything like that because that's not the way people view him and the Raptors' defense isn't good enough. Typically, you've got to have

like a top tier defense to get in those type of conversations. He's incredible defensively. And offensively this year, it's similar to Pascoeacham, where I put him a little bit lower because the team sucks.

But we know that if they're in a better context where they didn't have all these duplicative skill sets, this team would be cooking. He has added a legitimately good three-point shot to an already versatile offensive game that's making him a legit three-level score. And if he's only averaging just over 20, it's simply because the team caliber around him,

they have no spacing. He's a slasher with no spacing around him. It's like what we used to say about RJ Barrett and why his development was kind of like iffy. Except Scottie Barnes is actually good at basketball and has displayed elite skill sets that he's going to be an all-star this year. So y'all are going for real silly when an all-star isn't near top 24 players because he's going to get that recognition from the actual league that decides it.

And it's just so clear to see that he's a two-way star now that if he had the right team around him, he'd be averaging 25 with ease. That's fair. If you want to, if you want to go ahead and say that Scotty Barnes should be in the top 30, that's cool. And that's a different conversation. The conversation that we're having right now is specifically Barnes over Brunson. Yeah. And I don't think that that is correct. I think that you talked about while we were harping on RJ, right, and all this other stuff.

Jalen Brunson plays with R.J. Barrett. It is dominated. I should have gave him the RJ tax and put him at top 10. Jalen Brunson last year, like, and honestly, you were ahead of the curve for a lot of people and saying Jailen Brunson is going to come into New York and he's going to be exceptional and he's going to be very good. He's going to have one of the best contracts in the NBA. and he exceeded expectations like anything that everybody thought to Jay LaBurton could be he passed that up last year.

This year he's taking it to another level. He's more, he's more efficient. He's shooting like 46% from three. He's fantastic. And for him to have an offense that also isn't like a crazy juggernaut offense around him. And he is the driving force. He is the driving force of a team that is going to be in the top four of the East. right hoping hope and pray right projecting but

Brunson's ability to impact the Knicks and to lift them up especially when their second star is inconsistent at times he's been good for a while but yeah yeah but you know yeah yeah yeah brunson i i just don't agree that brunson should be lower than than Barnes in this case yeah well the thing is you said nothing about defense and that's half the game and that's a lot of my debates ended up going to the guy who listen jaylon brunson's a better score He's also averages more because he's a higher volume score Can take more shots because his team allows him to do that Scotty Barnes is a slasher with no spacing

And he shoots 70% at the rim right now 38% from 3 Still average 20 points your game On I think like six less shots per game Probably than Jaylon Brunson Keep in mind I pull that number out of my ass I'm guessing it's something like that Also is an elite rebounder over nine rebounds per game

5.8 assists per game People sleep on his passing ability For a long time Raptors fans We're like oh he can be a point guard He's an elite passer and so-and-so Dramatic But he's a legitimately really good passer I just named like every aspect of the game

that he's legitimately really good at the only thing that keeps him out of these conversations for people is points per game and that's simply because he plays with Pascal Seacom, O.G. Ninobe, and Dennis Schroeder. Where is the spacing in that lineup? Yacopolde. And he still shoots 70% at the rim. What is he bad at right now?

Jalim, I'm not saying. Fuck Jalynne Brunson. No, no, no, no, no, because that's the only argument. I'm not, I will admit to you that he should be in the top 30, right? I will give you that. You don't have to sell me on Scotty Barnes You have to sell me why he's better

I just told you do Do you think defense matters I do One's an elite defender one is at Best average a slightly below average For being real he's a small guy It's not his fault One gives legitimately really good impact there One gives you nothing

I think I think that like And while defense matters If you are talking about Getting Buck into being able to drive an offense right Even teams who have the best defense In the league right You probably wouldn't believe in them as much as you would a team that has the best offense in the league, right? Because it's so hard to just watch a team.

Incorrect. All the, so many of the past championship teams were. No, no, no, no, no. Not, not, I'm not talking about champions because when we get into like the final four, all those teams are complete. And they're superstars sure. All that. I'm saying like when you're talking about a 42 and 40 team, right, if the Knicks from 2020 who are all defense, no offense, rather than the Kings from last year

who were all offense, no defense, you would probably lean towards that King's team that is that great offensively. Yeah, that's just a little bit irrelevant, I think, when we're talking about individual players, because we're talking about individual players, not the teams around them. I'm saying, the Knicks aren't atop your offense team

and the rabbits aren't top of your defense. I'm saying you are leaning towards, you are leaning towards saying, like, defense is the, is the tiebreaker for you or the thing that's skewing you. and I'm saying Jalen Brunson's out here and has the ability to give you he has the upside to give you 50 points in a game

he has the ability to give you 41 in a playoff game and be one of the reasons I don't think Scotty Barnes has that ability agreed by soon there's more that matters than points per game it just depends on what you value I think overall holistically like Scotty Barnes genuinely gives you all that that is his potential coming out of college

folks were called what's calling him the next Jemong Green folks blown out of proportion a lot of like the things that he was supposed to be elite at like his passing i think he's still like a great pass for his size not a point forward not the next he's a point forward well when i think of point four i think of a little bit different way but regardless of the fact we all we all agree he is like a great passer for his size point blank period yeah yeah i just need to see more elite level scottie barns rather than just like the first 25 30ish games of it you know what i'm saying so this is so this is so this is so far i can't be mad at it but to say that he's better than someone like jalen brunson and

trey young who's like these these two are just offense i don't want to say jillen bruns is like an offensive system himself but he is a fucking bucket and we've seen him get through the mud yeah ends and out similar to similar ways that scotty barnes has had like he has like you said he's playing alongside r j barrett and six nine r j barrett sometimes and julius randle so he's he doesn't have much help along his side either and so for these two players I think they're just a tier ahead. Scotty Barnes can get there. But I just don't think he's there just yet.

I think you're jumping the gun like you do usual with him. I'm not. You are. You did last year. I'm just right though. He's going to be an all-star. He's a thousand percent going to be an all-star. I would bet $100 something right now.

I think he's an all-star. He's going to be an all-star. He's going to be an all-star. Well, I mean, it's Toronto, so I can't get, I can't, like, go against you from that. Okay, vote the fan vote. Yeah, exactly. So it's like, what do you want me to say, bro.

Again, I think, just think about team context. We all think the Raptors are a ridiculous team that should blow it up with just the same players from two through four. Say what you want about the next roster. It's not the best thing in the world, but nothing about it holds back Jalen Brunton from his game. His game, they need him to take all these shots and do these things. They're perfectly built for him to be this guy

that can get the best of Jalen Brunson, I think. I can't think of a team context that suits him better. They have no other ball handlers. Before he's playing behind Luka and that held back him statistically, now that's not an issue. for a guy like him that's an on-ball score to be the number one option is the best thing you could hope for

there's no other guards that have duplicative skill sets it's the complete opposite for Scottie Barnes and he's still averaging 29 and 6 so just think about if he had a stretch 5 if there's no Siakum

and there was an actual hierarchy well you said 29 and 6 20 slash 9 slash 6 okay cool you said that way yeah yeah I understand I talk too fast audio listeners we got it

yeah just imagine him on a team that made sense with what he's showing now literally the only thing holding him back is how many shots for game he takes that's it all his efficiency everything else

give Brunson for being in that so if Scottie was in a good situation and doing all those things he would you would give him that credit but Brunson is in is in that situation doing amazing things that you don't want to give him the credit over Barton he's the 24th best player in the league what the fuck do you want for me again I'm saying that if Scottie could be in the best situation his offensive output would be at least somewhat close still less of the offensive player than Jaylon Brunson and then the defensive golf is way bigger than anything Jaylon Brunson is better than Scottie go ahead and much for Scotty you just don't like defense it's fun. You don't like defense. I just don't, I like Scotty Barnes as a talent. You know me against

the Toronto Raptors fans. Like it's, it's pretty much smoke or whatever. But regardless of the fact, I like Scotty Barnes as a talent, he has made that jump. He's made that leap. And I can't deny it, but I need to see a little bit more before I just jump the gun. Like if we were, if this was like throughout the entire season he was playing like this, I'm so on board and Masai Jiri, he is continuing to derail this man's career. But regardless of the fact, I need you to explain a little bit why you have Trey Young at 23. I think that's a little bit too low. I honestly, you could have been lower for how he played the start this season.

I gave him, I had him below Jay Lambrunton at first. I give him credit because the last, I think, 13 games, and he pulled it up. He's been great. He's been averaging like 30, shooting like 42% from the 3. He's snapping right now. He's back. I think I had those sap pull up, I went away. He's averaging like, oh, I have it right here.

he's in the past 13 games averaging 32.2 points, 10.6 assists. Eating. As shooting 43% from 3 and 47% from the field. He is eating. He's so back. Exactly. We've been praying to have that for Tray Young and for the past year and a half

just hasn't done it consistently enough. And I'm starting to think that when he's playing like this, he's 100% the Tray Young. We've always hoped he could be what we thought he was two and a half years ago. We thought he'd be a top three point guard. When he's not being this efficient,

which listen, it's been a year and a half of most of the time he hasn't been like that. so at this point it's a pattern. I think he's a mold of player that it's not necessarily worth giving him the high usage he demands because unless you're gonna be like a Luca Donchich,

like a Prime James Hardin, you have to be like hitting on all cylinders for that type of heliocentric play style to make sense for a team and just simply put when he's not hitting his shots he's not giving you enough defensively to warrant him being the end-all

be all of your offense. Yeah. But I put him up higher because he's been great lately so I hope he can continue that trend and move up higher on the list. With that being set through the inconsistencies,

even with that, I still think he's been better inconsistent try young in my opinion has been I think it warns him to be above someone like scotty barns I'm not going to argue about like above bam because bam is like yeah he should be 20 he belongs there he he's made that leap across the stones especially when he comes to scoring when it comes to scotty barns I see they both have had inconsistency

scotty went through it last year for a multitude of reasons um so I see what you're saying I disagree but I'm not going to kill you like how Donovan wants to get him on you over fucking gentlemen I'll argue this to death. I think we're all going to come around and Scotty Barnes pretty soon once his team tries to make more sense.

And listen, everything is easier once they have that All-Star label. So once February comes around and everybody starts to view him as an All-Star, the same way we do, a Lowry Marketing in,

a Deeran Fox, whoever, that makes it so much easier for people to rationalize these things. So give me until February. Listen, I need a year or a couple more months before I make that assumption. Fair no.

You put Tyree's Max in your top 30. It's been 25 games. Tyreys Maxi never had to beat the fraud allegations. Just just watching because there's different expectations and that's for scotty barns like you have to for someone who i view i viewed him highly as well i thought he was going to be uh his rookie year i thought he's going to be so impressive defensively he was incredibly overwhelming or

underwhelming my bad second year same shit follows and applies and this year he's finally reaching that expectation yeah it's how it works with young players they develop it is it didn't happen as fast as we hoped that should happen now and i don't feel the reason to like wait on it because nothing about it's unsustainable yeah what that being said though i think yeah 23, that's, you should be ashamed of yourself. You should be a shame to yourself right here. 25, you're gross. Go ahead and listen.

Yeah, so here's my 5. So I have Trey Young at 25. Okay. I have Rudy Gober at 24. I have Zion at 23. Dearen Fox at 22. And then I have Bam at 21. The only one looking back at this right now that I would move a change would be Zion at 23.

This is a lot of projecting. Listen, we obviously, we get a bunch of jokes off. I think I tried to overcorrect. myself in terms of saying we joke on him too much. Let me try to give him a little bit too much praise. So I can take that one, that one back. Everything else I feel fairly, fairly decent about. Hey, Mo.

The one thing I will say, we're on the same page. Let's say it at the same time. Deer Fox is too low. You are a bastard for that, bud. 22, you go to jail, go to hell. You have that, you deserve calling your stocky for Christmas. Boo, shame on you. Shame on you.

Shame. Shame, shame, shame. Shame, shame. Oh my God, bro. why it's hard what happened listen these are hard

I got like seven spots higher that's crazy Deeran Fox at like 15 is wild in my opinion okay it's average 30 yeah

it's kind of wild I don't have that it's close but keep going right anyways so we want to we want to talk about

Deerne or who do who do we want to talk about from this bam is chalk you just explains on go bear makes sense he's DPOI

I probably should have him higher. Trey Young, I talked about it. You probably agree with me. Why is Deering Fox at 22? I just like the other point guards more. And so we can talk about it more when we get to the rest of my list. Okay, well, no, let's save it then until we can pull them up and then we'll talk about

why we have them higher. Yeah. We should have the full frame of reference. Yes. All right, cool. So go to Moe's next five. All right. So for my next, my next five, I got Jimmy Butler, always have to put him there.

He could be literally like anywhere on this list. He could be up as high as like top 12, 11. And that's just the natural range that we have. Real quick. Donovan You had Jimmy Butler too low Shame Shame shame shame shame shame

This is worse Hold on Why is it worse Has he been snapping Has he been snapping so far This regular? Every year You just

It's like you everybody Every year people forget That June happens every year And Jimmy Buller Becomes Michael Jordan How do you forget Is it June yet As far as I know

He got a sat in Santa Sanic suit on this December right now Excuse me So 25 Jimmy Bowler 24 is Zion, 23, Lamello ball, 22, PG, and 21, I got Jalen Brunton.

I respect that. I didn't put Lamello. I forgot about Lamello. He got hurt 15 games in the season, but regardless of the fact, when he was, when he was healthy, you love Lamello. As soon as he started getting to the line, that just transformed his game. And for any true, high elite level score, you need to get to the line, and he finally

matched that. That's been a weakness for his entire career, and for him to finally get over that, scared of contacting, and just force himself, he realized he's six, seven, and he has some quickness to his game. I think once he comes back, I don't want to say like the corner is going to be in plain contention, but they're not going to be a complete wash or a shit show like the Washington Wizards or anything like that.

I mean, listen, nobody's going to be as worse as bad as the Washington Woods. Maybe the Detroit Pistons. Maybe them. But yeah, that's fair. But okay. Is there, are there any real discrepancies at all other than Melo? I have Paul George a little higher, but it's not crazy. I respect the Jaylon love.

I honestly wanted to put Jaylon higher. I just, the theme for mine is I've rewarded defense in every debate that was too close offensively. So I didn't go that high, but I respect it. His offense has been incredible. I don't know if it will continue to be the best two-point shooting in the league by far. But even if he doesn't, he's still great. Yeah, it's just Jimmy's too low. That's the only the issue.

I love Jimmy Butler so much. And I, like, right now, right now, I just didn't want to put him that high simple because it's like, that's Jimmy Butler in the regular season, man. Like, this is not his time where he's perfectly comfortable. being put in this range for me personally, because I know what he's going to do in the playoffs. Right now, this is not the playoffs. And so far this season, he's just been like super steady and ready. He's just kind of maintained his game and he hasn't done anything too crazy so far this season.

We all know what he is. Yeah, exactly. And I just feel like knowing what he is, he's got to be a top 15 player, at least top 20, I think. I couldn't. Yeah. He has to be top 20. I mean, coming into the year, like all of us, none of us actually believed in the heat to be good, but we put them high in our rankings because like they're Miami and part of the reason is

Jimmy Butler and Spole they just figure out ways to win and they're still doing that right now like I thought that they were going to be in the mud and they are a very good they're a very good team and it's in part because Jimmy Butler is fantastic obviously Bam and and uh... Hamahakis and all that stuff but I 25 and putting him near like the Rosalzabotum like come on okay that's fair this is like the land of like second option like elite second options right low low tier. That's what Zahn is playing

like right now right but Jimmy at 25 yeah he's in the regular season that's what he wants to be he hasn't been better than BAM so far this regular season. Right now this is BAM's team as we speak but we're not talking about just this regular season you know it's a holistically contextually we know that playoffs matter and he's going to be him like he's an

outlier in that way that I'm with you normally I'm like we have to consider that's why don't put Jamal Murray this high but it's like the What Jimmy's done just has to get respect. You know, he's going to do it again. Like, it's just who he is. That's fair to say. That's fair to say. I, y'all know that I understand Jimmy Buller is that talent.

And once he's in the playoffs, top 10? Top 10? Top 15? Fuck that. He's top five. Yeah, he's literally top five. We all know this. So 25 is just a comfortable range. And I'm just showing my respects because no one is really like paying attention to him in the playoff in the regular season. Are you sure of respect at 25? Yeah, I am. He's on the list.

You hate Jimmy Bowler? No, I love him. I'm kidding. I'm kidding. I get it. Okay. We can move on to the top 20. Let's get, okay, we got Donovan going first. All right.

At 20, I have Paul George, 19 D Mitch, 18, Kauai, 17, Damien Lillard, and then 16, Jalen Brunson. Much, just much. Okay. Absolutely. Okay. Go ahead. You think Jalen Brunson has been better than Donovan Mitchell this season, Damian Lillard, and Deerran Fox. Here's the thing.

He has been. He has been. Because he's making 46% of his threes. He's been incredible. If we're serious, is he a better player? Would you want them more long term than Damien? Lillard, no. Damien Lurid has the downside of playing next to Yonis and getting lower usage, having to figure it all out while Jalen Brunson has the continuity to just do his thing

to start of the season. So I get the bias there, but be serious. What's up? You know in any context of building a team, you would rather have Damien Lillard than Jalen Brunson. De Aaron Fawson is a rogue right for me, man. Yeah, go. He's the bigger. He was averaging 30 right now. What right now, like what in your mind tells you, nah, Jalen got that into it? He's a Nick. That's what's in his mind. I can give you, I can, I can give you dear. I think, I think with Dame and the, okay, I'll argue Dame a little bit more. And obviously the, the second star role for Dame, and I'm okay with that. Like that, that's honestly not really what's bothering me.

I think Dame has taken a while to adjust and it is starting to be inconsistent. I think that Dame over the last two to three years has been very injury prone. Yeah. And it hasn't been as, as reliable. I think that I think that right now Dame is aging into this part of his career

where he is the he is the second option and is he not is he not is he aging into it no he happened to get traded the team that had Yanis he had his best year

of his career last year he looks he's not aging in anything he just happened to be traded how did he though sure but that hasn't had any effective his play he's 303 it's a big assumption

all I'm saying is last year was the best year of his career you know this He's, he's 33. Statistically, you could probably find, like, better years. You can't, though. Statistically, you can't. That's what I said statistically. Oh, my bad, my though.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. But, like, I think that there's, I think that Brunson has taken this leap and in this elevation that if anybody else, and this is, this is where I'm going to push back on the bias from y'all, because if anybody else came out here and we're shooting 46% from three, you got to be like, let, let's, let Scotty Barnes come out here and shoot 46% from three. Isaac is like, oh my God, he's him, he's doing all this.

Let, let, let, let, let Tray Young finally become a great three-point shooter like that and start shooting over 40% from three. He's the third best point guard in the league. It's him, it's him and how, is that 40? No, okay, thank you. All I'm saying is that Jaylen Brunson, Jaylen Brunson has taken a leap last year. He has taken a leap this year. And I want to give him that credit on the offensive end, that, that a lot of,

lot of other stars have taken those leaps or have had amazing stretches and we give them credit but we don't want to give brunton the credit because he's six foot and he plays isolation basketball yeah that's why give me a second real quick how fucking dare you doubt my statistic literacy you think there's a world where i wouldn't call somebody shooting 46 for seven three unsustainable be fucking for real nobody's going to be the greatest three of all time by far that's just unsustainable no matter who you are i'm saying he is obviously that's great because, like, Steph's not doing it. I would doubt that no matter who it is.

Yeah. But for him to be able to come out here and clearly show there's a different level of efficiency that he's reached. Everybody else is making those leaps and is becoming better. And I don't think that Brunson, in the grand scheme of point guard conversations, has gotten that kind of love. And so that's why that's why I think that for him, who also isn't in a situation where, like, in Sacramento, where you have shooters everywhere. I push back on that The shooters in Sacramento are much better than the shooters

Yeah, I don't think it matters for Jaylon Brunson His game, he's not a driving kick guy His game, shooters has very little do with what he does The Knicks have confidence spacing They don't have bad space in the show I don't think to you

Would you say that? No, no, not not. He's not a guy Not bad, not bad Yeah, but for Deeran I'm like, it does help When like you are going downhill Yeah, yeah

And you can play five out all the time Because nobody is within five feet of you But his game, okay So that helps Deeran specifically, because he's a slasher. Yes. Jane is not a slasher. That has, it matters, it'll help anybody. So I'm not going to say, like, it would be nice if he had, Harrison Barnes, Kevin

Herder and Keegan Murray, sure. His game has an ISO score, getting to the mid-range. The Knicks are as good of a spot as anybody for him. I think what matters to him more is simply usage. Like you said, he's an ISO-based player. The spacing matters less for the way he plays, I think. I'd like, I said to say, I don't think his team situation holds him back at all. I think that for that for Brunton there I actually think that there's another level that he could go to if he had more spacing and I think that in a in a playmaking sense okay it probably it probably could get there because at least in the in the Scotty argument the like if we're just looking at straight assist the the numbers for Jalen aren't like outstanding right and I think that if he is dealing with somebody in in you know in the corner like

Like, like, Kevin, like, Godly, can't say his name, like Herder or like Malik Monk and two guys. Keegan Murray, sniper. Exactly. Two guys who are moving around, this constant motion, it makes it a little bit easier to get, to get those assistance to be seen in that light as a playmaker. And for Brunson, because he is this, like, ISO score and does all this, there's a floor that your offense can have. And I think if you are talking about the other guys and you're talking about a ceiling

razor okay yeah we and then we can have a real conversation about what matters more floor raising or ceiling yeah yeah but for brunson there is a floor that the nick's offense does have because he's there and i think that's appropriately the 24th best player in the league i feel like we gave him we gave him a high he's 24 he's not 50 like yeah to say he's 26 and to even put him i'm not gonna like get on this tangent for what to put him above call why landers is like ah you're toe in the line you know what i understand he doesn't play he's he's playing this season he's playing this And he's been amazing over the last 10, 15 games. He's been surreal, you know?

And that's the type of thing I'm talking about. Like, it's so easy to be like, oh, it doesn't play. He's playing this year, and we know injuries suck. It's unfortunate. He hasn't missed a game this year. Yeah, exactly. And to... I mean, I just, just to add to the much allegations,

there's 90 headshots on the screen. You specifically requested a specific one for Jaylen Brunson. Oh, yeah, yes, yes, because the other... Because, go to leave. Yes, I requested a specific... headshot because the other headshots are from him in Dallas and everybody else. Dane just got traded this summer and he

has a Bucks headshot while Brunson has been on the Knicks for two years and we're still using... But did you ask for a headshot or did you ask for a celebration? I want to ask to the headshot. You asked for the celebration. Because that's my guy. That's my guy. That's my guy. There we go. There's what you do. He deserves

to have that headshot like of his current team. Yeah, I... Fair enough. I can... Let's review the next five so we can... Okay, so go ahead. I have Trey Young at 20, 19, bam.

18, I have Anthony Edwards. Maybe it's a little too low, but I think the guys above them have had better seasons overall. 17, Donovan Mitchell, and 16, I have Donovan. Okay, let's move with my next five so we can see all three of my ones. Let's go, just go the next one.

I have at 20 Paul George, 19 Jimmy Butler, 18, Donovan Mitchell, 17 Kauai, 16 John Morant. Okay. Okay. Okay. So, okay, so clearly you have a start with yours. Anthony Edwards is the lowest year. Yeah. Why is he below a Damien Lillard or Donovan Mitchell? So so far this season are going into the season. We all know pretty much everyone was counting him as to be the next one, the guy, the king.

I don't know what I'm saying. He was supposed to make that superstar leap. And so far this season, his numbers look basically identical outside of his playmaking. I'll say he's made that leap. But so far the season's scoring has looked the same. Efficiency looks the same. He's shooting a little bit better from three, which kudos him. He's generally a better shooter compared to last year.

So those numbers, you know, apply to the actual context. But this season, he hasn't made, like, the leap to lock him down as, like, the potential best shooting guard in the NBA, depending on how you view Devin Booker on all that stuff. And I would say someone like Donovan Mitchell has had a vastly underrated season through all the turmoil that the Cavaliers have went through. They're still above 500. And it's literally only because of him. He's averaging 27, 5, and 5 on pretty good officials. you know and when i compare the two right now i think donovan has had like the better season and i don't think there's any real argument against that compared to aunt now i think there is could i see

like surpassing him as the season goes on sure it's very possible but as far as what i've seen right now i'm going to get i'm going to tell my hat towards donovan i think this gets back to several other arguments you had defense anthonyard has been not just part of a team at the top third defense, not just like there for the ride, like say Donovan Mitchell was, whenever the jazz were doing it, Rudy Gaubert was just the god there. Anthony Edwards has been like a big part of it. He's been, you say he didn't make any type of a leap. He made a good leap defensively.

The past two years, I was the first one to tell you that people overrate Anthony Edwards. A lot of that was because people were like, oh, he can be an elite defender. He just wasn't. He just wasn't for the first three years of his career. He's been a legitimately great defensive playmaker this year. Not like he's like locked on every play, but he knows when to gear it. up and went to be a playmaker, similar to like a shake-goe to Alexander who's been in the league and assists.

Anthony Edwards isn't on that level of playmaker, but he's legit there and has actual impact there. He's grown. Well, no one's going to say that about Donovan Mitchell. I mean, he's not like a cone, but it's not good. And Donovan Mitchell, like you said, after 27, 5 and 5, great. Two more points for game than Anthony Edwards. He takes more shots.

He's not playing necessarily chronology towns. He has better spacing. For everything that is good about the Timberwolves, they're not at elite offense because they sacrifice spacing for defense. If Aunt had some of that, you know, he'd hire more points per game, take more shots. They still feed Cat plenty of shots. Like, there's a lot to go around there. While the timbre, while the calves have had all these injuries, like you said, Donald Mitchell has been the rock steady force.

It's a lot of me to get his numbers more. Those two points per game are, I think, mostly because of that. Yeah, exactly. And he's risen to the occasion and showed up every single night to keep them afloat. But there's been plenty of times throughout the season where I'm like, okay, this is just another ant stinker in November, which we know why. He's had plenty of those. He's absolutely. can't see and I can't look at those and be like, nah, like he has to be better than

Donovan is sure because he's locking down on defense. Now, with that being said, Timberwell's regards of the stinkers, there's still the number from Anthony Edwards and thinkers. There's still the number one team in the NBA as in the making of this podcast. So that's just why like I just could not, I can't get past the inconsistencies offensive. I get that. I get that. Though the defense has genuinely improved and that's one thing that I did neglect, and he does, he does deserve that shine. That's something that not of all people are going to talk about when it comes to his game of course people talk about the jumping ability

and the shooting and all the other stuff about him but the defense has might be the reason why most people should probably put him over donovan mitchell but i'm just holding him accountable towards what a lot of people expected out of him and that's that leap offensive no i get that and i think he has had like several stinkers the past month you're right that's why i put him down a little bit too just because i'm like is it going to be a pattern which I think is the same thing you did. You just accounted for it more. The reason I didn't put him down a ton

is because for the season, he's still shooting 71% at the rim. He's made a leap there as rim finisher, despite having not a lot of spacing. The nice he's had these cold nights recently, I was looking into it. It's mostly poor jump shooting. He just has mid-range shot

and his 3.6 percentage have fallen down to a little bit lower in the world last year because he's had those terrible games where the shots is not falling. I tend to think that's just bad luck and that like, you know, he's not like a worse shooter now,

not an inconsistent shooter. So I didn't ding him too much for that because that happens to everybody. And, like, you know, Yokic had several terrible games. He said, like, some of the worst games was career in the past month, too. I didn't remove him from one, spoiler alert. So, like, I didn't put him down too much, but I understand. Yeah, that's different.

Yeah, that's different. It's just, like, expectations leading into the season. And although I don't want to say he's, like, disappointed by any means. But it's just like, you could use it early. Before this podcast started throughout the day, I was like, should I put him at 15, 16. Earlier, he was high as, like, maybe 14. But I decided to ding him at their 18 Because I just seen

With Donovan Mitchell and more So it's about him And he's like He's the orbit around this conversation That I didn't want to That I didn't want end up to being lost I get that Yeah that makes sense

Everything else in your list makes total sense to me I have dame a little lower I should know Have I had dame in my list yet? I forget No I haven't Okay I think he's next So you all have jaw higher

I have Jod's 16 Is he your top 15 Yeah he is Okay fair enough I ended up going with a couple guys just because like some people have made the leap this year like I have Anthony Edwards above him

clearly Deeran Fox just because they've been so great this year and made a leap I think in a very winning situation when Jod gets back and has more time to remind us who he is he'll probably get back higher

to closer to pushing the 10 I haven't for now where I try to give him some bend in for the doubt but still reward guys who have just been available to do it because they're not knuckleheads but we all know Jaws

is going to be like in the top 15 for sure other than that we all have Kauai here you'd Kauai lower right Moe? I have Kauai little bit higher. Okay, so you haven't seen Kauai yet. Yeah, I have Jimmy Butler higher. Yeah, we talk, we talk about all these guys. Paul George 20th. That's a, that's, we're ready to see the next five. All right. We got Donovan's next five. This is where it gets intense. Yeah, okay. Here we go. So, we got Tyrese at 15. Anthony Edwards at 14. Jimmy Butler at 13, Jai at 12 and Anthony Davis at 11.

Oh, John at 12. Okay. Yeah. I respect that. We had them in that range last year before all the fuckery went down. So, yeah, I think, I get it. Yeah, I think for John. And also, this is, we are recording this the day after John makes his debut and he scores 30 and gets the game winner and literally like doesn't miss a beat on anything. Yeah, he's great. And the fact that like

Jock can step onto the floor and immediately change the entire math, the entire dynamic of the Grizzlies offense and make them competent, they are I think I take this morning they're like seven and a half games out of the play in. After seeing last night, I'm like they might

make a run at 10 and they might have a chance. A game winner got you. They, no, but like if you look above them, Utah is above them. I do not believe that Utah will be better for the rest of the season than Memphis will. Fair. You have Houston who is currently in the playing right now. They cannot win games on the road and they are 11 and 1 at home. And for a young team, I don't know how sustainable 11 and 1 at home is. So I expect them to lose a couple more games and that's all Memphis is going to need to creep into the 10th spot. And then they're probably going to have to fight with Golden State and Phoenix for the last spot,

which is going to be tough. But I think that they have a chance to make it at least interesting. And, yeah, like you said, Jal was in this range before he did what he did last season. He's back. I think everything is going to be fine. And he's amazing. So that's why he's at 12. Fair enough.

I respect it. Yeah. You give a lot of respect to Jimmy. I understand it. I kind of, I'm in between. Clearly, you gave him the respect for being playoff Jimmy. Mo dropped him for being regular season, Jimmy. I did a little bit in between.

I think I had my 17 or something like that. I understand that, though. One thing that I just have a slight question about, it's not like it's a huge grievance, but Tyrese Halliburton is 15. Yes. You want to explain that? Listen.

Specifically over-ant. The floor raising, right, for Tyrese is fantastic. There's nights where the defense is actually atrocious. He's terrible, you're right. It's actually, like, it's not even bad. There's nights where it's embarrassing, how bad he is on defense. And so I was like, I just can't do it.

I get it. I just can't do it. He just, he's insane offensively, bro. I get it. But I think it makes me even more mad that you are like six, seven. You have the physical tools to not be a cone. And he is a cone. He is not impactful positively in any way on defense.

And there's nights where you just look at it and you just question, like, what are you doing? You know who else is an impactful offensive in any ways on defense? What's up? John Morant. John Moran is not a cone, but he's also in a better, a big problem. Tyreys Hallibir is not moving the needle at all. Yeah. He's also in an ecosystem defensively that doesn't warrant that at all.

So like, your team environment matters a ton for defensive effort. Put him with the grit and grind Taylor Jenkins system, he'd probably try a lot harder, put more of an effort on it. We'll see. He does not do that. And even as bad as Jai is, it's not embarrassing the way that it can sometimes give the time. Again, he also has no backland help.

The whole patient system is built around not helping at the rim, can I give up threes? Yeah. So when you beat your man, you beat your man. Exactly. So when he gets blown by, it's fucking clear as day because he's not getting help in the corners. Every other point guard doesn't have that.

That's like just asking to expose your guards and make them look worse than they really are. Like, Donovan Mitchell is probably similar, but he has two trees behind them that their whole thing is they'll help when you shoot corner threes. Contextually, they're probably not that different, but system-wise makes him look worse.

And you think, though, if you know that you're getting targeted at every play. I'm going to need you to make one stop, right? You have all the attempts to where it's not even, I'm not even looking at the percentage. I'm looking at can you get one stop. You're right. Can you get one stop out of 30 or however many possessions? And it's just, it's crazy sometimes. So I want to put him higher. I love Tyrese. I think he's

fantastic. If you want to put him up at 12 over Jod, we can have that conversation. And I can ride with you. Yeah. It's just, there's some nice words bad. No, I get it. Yeah. I think part of it is a team ecosystem that's like, I keep, this is a hard one. You show my next five and my next. Okay, show both of ours. Because I have Tyrese Halliburton at 12. Makes sense.

Okay. And I struggle because the whole time I've been saying I lean defense a lot of times. I also have been saying I lean team context and thinking about how the teams impact these guys. It's not just like their skills are on paper. Nothing else matters. Who's the five around you? Who's your coach? How are they deciding to play matters?

Same reason I put Scotty Barnes higher. So that's kind of hard for me because he does suck on defense, but he also looks worse than other guards because of that the way they play. I'd lean towards the fact that he's just been such a supernova on offense and there is the element of that's how they play that makes them look worse but I get it

like I've had to be consistent you could put them above him but like you see I have 11 out Devon Booker 12 I have Tyreus Halliburton 13 Damian Lillard 14 Anthony Edwards and 15

Deeran Fox the guys below him just don't bring the playmaking punch that he does That's fair I think that his playmaking is meaningfully enough better than everybody on the

this list that I'll over sell I'll look past some of the defense that's fair okay and I'm yeah I'm not I'm not gonna say anything anything about it Tyrese is fantastic yeah so moving on at 11 I have Devin Booker 12 John Morant 13 Tyrese

14 Deeran Fox and 15 you finally see Kawhi Leonard yeah you have any grievances at all so cool okay so let's talk about Deer and Fox now because we both time in top 15 Donovan's ass had him at 25 which I don't know how you did that No, no, not 25.

What was it? He was 22. Oh, good. That's so crazy. Thank the heavens. Okay, let's go. Yeah, it was 20. Yeah, 22.

Great. I have him 15. Mo has him 14. He's averaging 30 is the driving force of a really good team for two years now. And I've been the one that's been saying he's already. I'm surprised that you're saying that. Because you were saying that subonance was better last year. Well, no.

I hate Subonis. Was I saying that? You were. There's no fucking way I was saying that. Maybe, maybe. Maybe at some point, but after the playoffs last year, I would never. regardless of the fact what what really has helped i don't believe i take this leap is his three-point shooting he's become a serious threat he's shooting like 38% from there on eight attempts per game

so with seeing that volume and being able to maintain that level of efficiency that efficiency to which i remind you guys he came into the league as a non-shooter and throughout his entire career basically up until these last two years where he really showed that bag he started really clicking on all cylinders offensively and that just opens up the game so much more for him and everybody else to the point to where he's just as efficient

and he's pretty much like one of those point guards where you just look at his game and he just like yeah I don't know how to stop this guy because he can burst right past by you and if you sag a little bit too much he's pulling and it's going in 38% of the time he shoots 50% from the midrange 39% from 3. Legitimately great shooter like you said

on high volume you know what's crazy He's averaging 30 right now. Last season, he shot 77% at the rim. Insane. The highest from any point guard in the league, because their spacing was so crazy, you know, they're running and gunning and things were clicking full cylinder.

He was hurt for a little bit this year, and right now he's only shooting 63% at the rim, his lowest since the second year in the league. That's going to get higher. Maybe it's not 77 again. It's going to push his way back to the high 60s, maybe low back into low 70s at least, once, you know, he gets to feed under him,

the team, everything goes back to normal. What's going to happen when he's still shooting great from three, he's still in the high volume and his rim scoring comes back to normal. 32 points for game? I don't know. But like we're not even seeing

the peak version of the Aaron right now and he's averaging 30. Yeah, it's scary. It's scary. Looking at this list, I finally feel bad. I should have had ant's higher. I was genuinely a bastard.

But regardless of the fact, the only other discrepancy I see is like you have AD at 11. We clearly have in my top 10. Why is AD at 11 not in top 10? it's close I get it but listen

unless he's like 10 when I tell you that the hardest decision on this entire list for me came at 9 10 and 11 yep it's hard I I couldn't I couldn't pick

and this legitimately for me is a three way tie somebody had to be at 11 yeah and in actuality all these guys are at 9 but I don't like the lakers so I'm gonna put him at 11 and so we'll do that

but it is it is a three way tie and he's as good as the people that I have at 9 and 10. Yeah, I know the debate you're talking about. I had the same fucking issue. It was hard. Like everything else, I lean defense. And I went with AD at 9 over those other two guys, but I get it. Those two guys are more flashy offensively.

They're younger. They're arguably the one option. Well, one we'll talk about. Devin Booker is the one that's arguable, I guess, because K's KD still KD. But they're a driving force or offense while AD's second fiddle to LeBron. So I can see why you'd hold that against him. but I think the defense is like insanity so I lean that way

but I get it bro it's a tie like I guess it's not you had to pick somebody that's funny man and I told you it's the Lakers tax like that's what it is what else they're talking about here

we all went Kauai up high he wasn't that good to start the year but it's coming back he's starting to rant back up the clippers are looking great now all the pieces of fit together Terminator man he's fully back and seeing

Kauai's resurgence along with you're gross for that man Man, seeing Kauai's resurgence along with like the Clippers as a whole, just being a hell of a lot better of a team and just surpassing the early season expectations that we had of them. It's special. And Kauai Leonard is leading, he's not the leading force of that, but he's one of the

leading forces of that. And to see P. Kauai shades of 2019 Kauil Linder just right back at it, who's already like a top five player in the league when he's playing like this, it's crazy, man. He could be higher easily, but we just need to see it a little bit more. I think we're all being generous. I don't know if he could be higher because that inconsistency is still there. But I think we all appropriately ranked them

for what we know we can be. For now, yeah, for sure, for now. But if he keeps on playing like this, there's no need to be, we're not be, we cannot be generous anymore. He's going to force his way into those conversations that we cannot allow, we cannot ignore that anymore.

Yeah, he can very easily be better than Tyreys Halliburton when you take the defense in account if he hits peak for him. Listen, man, Tyrese is 27 on 62% true shooting. He's 24 now. 24, oops, thank. Oh, no, 24 points per game. Yeah.

While being the best passing NBA this season. He's just, he's like, he's an offensive juggernaut. Like, the only offensive player that's been clearly better than this year is Luca Donchich and Jokicil Yochich. Yeah, it's like, those are the only guys who are like, engarvered from that stance. That all-around type of creator is rare. And everybody else who is in that mold of him putting up those numbers

is considered a top-five player. Yeah. He's knocking on those doors once a defense becomes passable. Yeah, I agree. Are you ready for the top ten? Let's go. The medium potatoes. Woo!

See, y'all were talking about y'all had a hard time. This was the easiest top 10 that I ever had in my life. Number six. Woo! Number six, we got Shay Gilgis Alexander. That was crazy. Seven, LeBron, eight, Tatum, nine, KD, and 10, Anthony A. Davis. One, that was insane.

I can't be you just did that. Two, I don't, I'm fucking frazzled by this. I don't even know what. All I'm thinking about is shade on your face. I don't know what I'm looking at right now. She just sat on your face. Okay, oh, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. No. Okay. So let me say this real quick. Someone who I dropped dramatically and obviously raised as Shay and Tatum. I've seen Tatum over the last few years consistently hover around the top six, five range. And we all agree clearly like this dude is better than LeBron James. And so far this season, I think we can all agree. Tatum better than LeBron James last year. We all agreed that. We all agreed to that. But so far this season, we've seen that he has.

hasn't made the leap that we're all hoping that he would make to have, that he would be able to make in order to declare himself as a like solidified top five player in the NBA. There's nothing in his game that just screams unbeatable, unfuckwithable on all levels. He hasn't made, he has, like, they're just, and it's really like what he's going against, not like Tatum has gone worse or anything like that. He just hasn't ascended, like LeBron, of course, LeBron's LeBron. I don't need to talk about it.

He's averaging 25 points per game, shooting 39, 40% from the three-point line. She is Shea. He has ascended on a whole new level, playing term at insane defense while also giving you 30 efficiently across the board, shooting 90% from the free throw line and probably leading to Lee and steals. Like, there's, he is what I hoped Tatum could ascend to in terms of just like, in terms of just like stardom in the NBA. Spicy. Okay. Okay. Listen, I had Tatum in the same spot as you.

I didn't have SGA above him I had a LeBron James at number six Kevin Durant at 7 Tatum at 8 9 Anthony Davis 10 Shake Guild of Alexander Why are we hating on Tatum Listen what did you see Tatum do last night Well let me explain because I

I understand why you say that Because we had Tatum at 6 last year Why did we put him down? Nothing really changed It's more about we lowered LeBron and KD last year more than we rose up Tatum I think I think Tadon's been a steady force who's been a high driving

part of a elite team for like several years now so we know we're getting for him he's great he didn't get worse this year but he didn't get better in a way that he should have because they have the best base

in the league now with KP at the 5 they're insane the rim is always open his ass refuses to drive to the rim this motherfucker loves step back threes I saw that earlier

that there's like five players in league that shoot more than five stepback 3s a game they all do it because they shoot over 35% on that so it's an elite shot you're like you know like a Luca don'tcha

shoot 38% there he shoots 30% on them he fucking loves them he won't stop the rim is wide open and a team like that that's built on five out spacing when you get a KP

only works because you can just be an elite force at the rim and teams can't stop you there because you can't help off anybody he doesn't care he still wants to step back

and shoot every time and it hurts him and stops him from being truly elite form is immaculate yeah like it's ridiculous like he wasn't all these stepbacks

it's fucking obnoxious and it's just he hasn't taken that jump but it's more about LeBron and KD have like really like found the fountain of youth this year as scores and been incredible than where I think they just earned their spots above

Tatum back because LeBron we talk about at length he's back like he's last year you slowed down a little bit because the start of the year Russ was there hurting the spacing second half of the year he's doing the foot injury in the playoffs he's fully healthy and he's been incredible playing off ball shooting 40% from three for the whole year I think it's 39.3% now

because he's a slow couple games but a great off ball score a little unstoppable in transition been everything we'd want to see from an older version of LeBron and KD has put that team on his motherfucking back with Devin Booker and Bradley Bielhardt all the time

he's been unstoppable he's averaging 30 he's been playmaking really well defending really well they're just very close to peak form in a way that like we had to give them credit I think so let me ask you this why can't you put Shay over Taitan just because like you just need to see more of it

am I jumping the gun because I could see that argument being made against it do you need to see it in the playoffs similar to what Taitam has done on a consistent basis because he's not like a complete flopping the playoff at all he's generally still a great player in my opinion but in terms of just like the expectation being laid out for him and everyone wanting him to take charge and steer the offense and be a potent just have that potent effect on the game he doesn't have that just yet and all that comes down to is your decision making and your ability to steer the entire ship

in terms of just like aligning the offense and Shay obviously he has that he's not a natural point guard he was a combo guard coming out of college and high school and all that but to see him just still like maybe maybe it's a CP3 effect maybe that really helped him

paste the game and understand and be able to choose his spots and read the four and a whole other level because that's what's missing from Tatum as we speak and that's the leap that I saw from Shay over the last few years and that's why I officially put him over Tatum. I'm just tired of not tired of seeing Tatum just maintaining

this is well maybe this is what he is and that's completely fine exactly that's what i think i think that's what is what he is and it happens to be an elite score in a six nine frame who's a fantastic defender keeps the ball moving doesn't hurt your offense at all and consistently these winning teams he's just like he's rock steady like he is who he is and he's incredibly valuable always available the eighth best player in the league is fantastic he could be the sixth best player in the league if the two fours above him look washed a little bit like they did last year in the playoffs right now they look fantastic so i give him the credit but tatum is just he's just he's just say them. Okay. I say seven, but okay. Let's see dog. Let's just go to the next one. So we'll see them all.

All right. So I have, so I have Booker at 10, Shea at 9, KD at 8, Embed at 7, and then LeBron at 6. You're a bastard. And beat at 7. You're a bastard. Wow, man. I love it. I love it. So I think, yeah, the unbeat at 7 thing is the most, it's the biggest outlier, clearly. Yeah. Why do you think he's better than LeBron right now, though? Why do I what? Oh, my bad. do you think he's worse than lebron right now i think that lebron has found a way to be extremely efficient and to for for lebron to to mold his to mold his game in this year and to do it like from from the three point line to be able to pick his spots and still be elite right be able to turn it on and and get downhill and really like control the game in a different way than we've really ever seen LeBron control the game.

Yeah. And like even in the last two years when LeBron was like averaging 30, you watch him and he looks better this year than he has in the last two years. I think that for Embed and obviously we are going to have this this conversation, if If I told you, right, that you are going to go on this road trip for three hours and you can drive a Lamborghini there for three hours. But in the second hour, the tire is going to fall off. Would you still take the Lamborghini? Nah, man, put me in a minivan.

Exactly. And that's, and that's, and that is, and when I look at Joelle and B, that is what I see. I see a Lamborghini with a loose wheel because until he shows me that all. of these guys, from top 10 up, all of these guys, we are splitting hairs, we are picking guys who are leading their teams to compete for championships. And

Joelle Embed has refused and has failed year after year to show up in the playoffs to provide number one MVP level play. And until he shows me any type of semblance of that, you are not getting into the top box.

You are, you simply are not doing it. I know what is going to happen because it happens every year and until you show me that until you show me that that's not going to happen you're not getting into the top five i can't do it and beat tax is crazy i can't i had the same thing on the stream the other day apm monday tune in anyways i had the same thing i said like yo i got new york california type taxes when it comes to joiling beat and you have the same thing but i was able to take a step back from the hate and look at what he's done so far this season fresh start like anything that he's done in the past

haven't paid too much mind to it of course you don't want to forget but at the same time i'm just going to look at what he's done with this new coach which is like specific and to see him play this new style new style of basketball of course he does like the same mb stuff he's going to file bait that's just built into his game and he should keep it into his game because he's one of the best at his side specifically so i don't want to say i'm expecting a different outcome but to say that like he hasn't gotten better and to say like yeah lebron's more dumb minute. It's like, I don't know. Real quick, because I, because I want to ask both this specifically. You said that Tatum is at 8 because he's just Jason Tatum. Like, he hasn't necessarily taken the

leap and you are not seeing from him, which you would like. And so that's why he's not higher. Joelle Embed has not shown me what I need to see. He has shown you, though. When? You've probably not been looking. When? When has he shown me? This season so far. I'm not talking about like playoff or anything like that. No, that's what I'm looking for. That's what I'm looking for. When April comes, we can, for me, we can revisit this. I'm not going to just ignore.

I get you. Coming into this season, would you have called me an Embedd fan? No. Would you call me an Embeddead hater? No. What would you call me an impede hither? Okay. What would you call me a hater?

Yeah, you started the big heart of shit. You would have been correct. I called that man Big James Hardin so many times for the past six months. He won me over. I'm all in on James. I'm Big Embed. this, on Big Harden this year, all in general and Bede. It's simple, I get it.

You can just be like, got to show me in April. I understand. He does. He hasn't done it. I'm going to choose to believe this is going to be the year where he plays normal barring injury, which is always a big thing to bar with him because he gets hurt every year in the playoffs. He is a materially different player than he was last year. I saw a tweet earlier that I quoted. He had a quote in the media, I don't know where he's being interviewed, where he said something along the lines of isolation basketball doesn't win games.

I know that now. You can't play that and expect the win in the playoffs. He said that, I think, yesterday or today. And he's right. Because this year, under Nick Nurse, they gave him the book thinking basketball, said, read the first five chapters. He did that bitch, and he's a whole new player. He's fantastic now. He passes better than he ever has before, averaging his career high to assist, scores better than

never has before. He's been on a fucking road tour the past two weeks against every bad team in the NBA. He's decimating them. He's fucking Godzilla in all these cities, destroying them. And he does it in a way that isn't just like, don't meet the ball, mid-range. It's been so much more diversified playing the flow of an offense Feeding Tyrese max has been great this year right

You guys had me in top 30 He can do that because Joel Embed has been playing his offensive hub using his scoring gravity to feed Tyrese maxi on these dribble handoffs And he's completely bought into the system That Nick Nurse has deployed there And Nick Nurse has completely transformed him as a player The ways that he failed in the playoffs in previous years

are because they just threw the ball in the post and told him to be a surgeon dissecting these defenses He was not up to the task He's not going to have to do that anymore Because they don't play like that I don't see any reason to believe he's going to fall apart because I'm not saying that There's reason to believe because he has every year

So I understand what you'd feel that way I see optimism to why he won't anymore Because he's materially different And plays materially different ways that are just more conducive To playoff success When you called him Big Hardin That might have been the most damning thing ever said on this part Not even damn

The most correct thing Because he's tricked you again He got you again I get it Because once again, we're going to go through this whole year and he might get back-to-back MVPs and we're going to get to April and what is he going to... He literally is one of the biggest playoff failures

we've ever seen. I get it. I get it. But at the same time... He's a different now. Everybody else... Show me that they're different. We can revisit in April. Everybody else above him has had much more success than him.

He's shown us for 25 games things are different. All we can do is look at the sample size he's given us. I can't predict. future and I'm not in the business of being like nothing matters until you do it in April like otherwise what are we watching the games for the whole point is to show what these teams are this year and he's done everything you'd want to do every

checkpoint we'd have to say fix these things so you can be a good playoff player he's done them so far I don't know how he can't respond to that materially new information we have and not adjust our view of him at least somewhat I'm not saying put him at one this year he's going to be the MVP he's been the best player in the league this far yeah he's good just this season he'd be number

one I'm not putting him at one because I know he still has those things that like I'm going to trust yokech in a playoff setting more if he was this guy in the playoffs he would be the best player in the NBA and it wouldn't be a hard decision but we know it's like me the case so I didn't put him at one know what I'm saying like there's a balance there but you have to adjust to the new information at least a little bit now something that I got to do a damn thing I don't have to do anything something that I will say that's one is that so far this season we have seen the Philadelphia 76ers hat face up against one of they've had like

one of the five easiest schedules in the entire NBA. And I want to see what he looks like against one of the more smarter, more dominant defensive teams on a consistent basis. And although, like, yeah, I agree with you, Isaac, the system just allows you to play better basketball, more efficient basketball, which is the most important thing for Joelle and B's playoff career and just NBA career whatsoever, you know? And so with that being said, I kind of side with Isaac just a bit, but I'm not going to fully buy into the Joel and Bies talk until I see

because I'm going to be broke as hell and he can just prove you wrong in so many ways but just like he has just like he has like a myriad of ways to be more efficient and effective at basketball he might be able to figure out a way to just flop because that's just how he will there's always that chance there's always that chance

with Joelle and Bede so I get it are we ready to go to top five let's go top five who's first Don Moe you're first so a five naturally Joel and Bid four Luca Donchich three Steph Curry two Janice and one I got Yolkich okay this is chalk I think this is this is what I had yesterday

I changed mine up but this is this is I think the consensus right this is a very fair top five obviously Donovan is gonna like put him lower because he doesn't believe in Embed but I think this is like safe I would agree yeah for sure the only thing that could be shifted in my mind is seeing Luca surpass Steph because he's been unreal on a consistent basis and step Curry. It's hard to look unreal when your team is just so bad. Yeah. But regardless, I think Steph has been the safest pick over the last few years. I'm gonna continue to ride that wave because I have no reason not to. Okay. I was with you. Like I said, yesterday, this was my top five. I did some tinkering. I am going to go on a limb now. I'm fully buying in to Embeded

FC. And I'm just going to go all in. I might lose my house. I might lose the podcast. I might be on the street after this summer comes around because he might fail me again. I'm all in. I had this five. I put him beat to number three. You said that 9, 10, 11 was the hardest choice of your whole list. You can reveal it. This is my hardest choice, 3, 4, 5.

I was agonizing over Joel and B versus Steph Curry versus Luca Donchich. I wanted to be with you and put Steph Curry at three because he deserves it. He's proven time and time again. He's one of the greatest players of all time. Really hasn't slowed down. I'm just taking the bet that what we're

seen from Joelle and Bede is an evolution that's going to propel him to be in the conversation for best player in the world. So I'm putting him in three just because I'm showing respect to what he's done this year because when I watch this team and I watch what they do schematically and the improvements he made, I see no reason it's not sustainable. And if it is sustainable, more MVP's more successes in his future. And I'm not holding Steph back for the team being bad. It's not his fault. We all know he still as great as he is. But the only reason to put Steph above both Embedd and Luca vibes. I think he can win.

I've seen him win before. I know his style of play is conducive to winning. Every other category you think about and try to be objective, those two players stomp them out so far this year. But I put Curry above Luca still because they're both guards

and both, we know that Curry's style of play makes people better more than Lucas does and I gave him credit despite Luca's insane statistics. The difference with Dwell and Bede, defense. He's offensively very similar to Luka in that they're just going to get numbers to be insane.

Jueling Bs been legitimately D.P.O.I. level defense this year. going to say that, then you have to be consistent with your argument and put him at number one. I think that's the only thing around like, I think you do. The two guys above him are the two of the greatest players all time in the peaks. Or at least at two. No, the difference above that is that

the two guys above him, number two, is also an elite defender and number one is the best offensive player we've seen in years. These two guys above are just Teflon because they're insanity. And I did do some of the playoff stuff where I agree we can't fully bind him offensively in the playoffs. So it's like, it's a sliding scale, you know? I can

buying enough to put them over a Luca, enough to maybe put him over a curry, I can't buy into that enough to put them above the two best guys in the world who are clearly in a realm of their own, because I know for a fact, any year they're going to be dominant, regular season, and postseason. So it's a sliding scale. So when you know right now, when you lose, you live in the

sunny hills, not in the hills, but you live in the sunny state of city of L.A. Beautiful, man. Yeah. It's not cheap. Yep. I got an extra bed for you. You are sleeping with the rats. Yeah, you're going to the hood. Yeah, you're going to the hood.

you're sleeping with the rats you're sleeping by the sewers and I'll be there to help get you back on your feet we'll get them donos up on live stream Monday 8 p.m. tune in please and you'll be okay but I respect it.

You're going out on the limb here for him. You know what the worst part is? I won't be shocked if you're right. I won't be shocked at all if Joel Embed just fails me once again and if he fails me again never buying in on this motherfucker again. The next season will have to be a better season

that's funny. No, I want again if he fails me again listen James Hardin is my guy I'm never believing in his ass again. Joel and Beat has one more time to fail me never believing him again until he wins a championship. I'm doing it this year just because he's been so great

and I don't want to be the guy that just holds on to old narratives and doesn't respond to new stimuli so I'm going to be the guy that gives me credit and it's going to be a back-to-back MVP and not be a back-to-back MVP and not be top three player in the league. I think he deserves that respect. I'm glad you have a friend like Moe

who's going to help you, right? Get up off the ground because I will be there pointing at you telling you I told you so. I'm not helping you. you out whenever Embed, you know, eventually crashes. And it is, it is very hard to be back-to-back MVP's. It is also very hard to be that good.

And then to be that bad year after year after year. And so in terms of like the narrative, I'm not questioning Joelle and Bede's talent at all. The quote unquote narrative is you are not good in the playoffs, right? It's like until we get there and until you defeat that, then we can, then we can talk that i've never said anything about joel and b being a bad regular season players i've never said that he cannot be the the leader of your team that you can't run an offense through him that he is not d p oi level defender never said any of that i said that when it comes down to it he's going to fail and he's going to choke and he needs to prove that to me i think three is i i think three is why i don't

yeah i wouldn't put him yeah personally i get it i get all that being said i'm still like you just have rocks all you you're saying yonis and yoke just are teflon yeah step deserves to be in that same as that conversation because he's done nothing to prove against that other than his team itself having shortcomings yeah and in terms of luca's a different conversation but we all know what he is and nothing needs to be said you know we see what he does on a consistent basis whether it be in the playoffs or the regular season he is luca donchish no i get it so i got like i said yesterday i agreed i put him at five for those reasons because i put luca above him at first because we know that Luke was a playoff riser, he's never going to be an issue in the playoffs.

The difference to him in Embed, defense. Embed is legitimately been an incredible defender this year. Like, he should be all defense. I don't know. It's not a lot of spots. Maybe he won't make it, but he's been that level defensively.

And all the whole list I've been telling you, I think defense matters incredibly so. And if you can be the best score in the NBA and an elite defender, and you've been a good passer, and you're playing the system that lets others thrive next to you, birth a new All-Star. He checks every single box. I'm just going to go on a limb and hope that this is the year

that it translates. If not all looks stupid, but I'll want to be the one to hit that bet. All right. We'll be in lockstep if we see him be able to consistently be the best score in the NBA, or at least one of the best scores once a playoff starts. I get, I get it. Yeah, okay. Let's get to my five.

So I have Yonich at one, Yonis at two, step at three, Luke at four, and then Tatum at five. Yuck! Damn, 10, 10, about five. I get it. I mean, listen, you put him over with old men. I understand. I think. It's my bag.

Go ahead. I think Tatum over in Bede is sacrilegious, but I get it. I know I do explained already. You don't got to explain it again. No, but it's insane. I think it's, I like, I like Jason Tatum a lot. And I think that a lot of the hate around Jason Tatum is that like, there's two things. One, you got to get, you got to win a chip, right?

You've been in the playoffs long enough to where like that is the goal and that is kind of the expectation. But also in the regular season, it's just like, like, you're boring. Like, you're just, right? He's just a 27 point per game score, a very good defender, right? Yeah. The leader of a team that gets to the conference finals every year. He's, their team is fantastic offensively. And Jason Tatum is just at the center of all of it.

But, yeah, it's just kind of boring. Like, obviously, the late game shot selection stuff is crazy. And I need him to like, listen, lock in, right? Go to the basket. See if you can get a couple free throws. You have the, like you said, you have the spacing. You have the tools to do all that. I want to see that more

but I think that we should reward Tate him for years of consistency as this two-way player and having a lot of playoff success. I think we are putting him in the top 10. Yeah. Yeah, you're right. I will reward him for the years of consistently not being able to elevate

your late game decision making because number five he can elevate his late game consistency listen. And he has this year. While you're not absolutely wrong i'm going to agree with you to a certain degree but with when it comes to jason tatum he is just not an unstoppable force like we see 50 points in a game seven is it unstoppable of course

that is great but there's other elements of the game that help make you be to help you be that unstoppable there's a reason why he scored that 50 of course he was hot and all that but it's just being able to read the game and be the leader of that boat and that's just not in his bag and so what that being said, I just don't think he warrants to be top five. Yeah, and it's just like he's a worst playmaker than the three guys above him in Embed, Curry, and Luca. Because you want to argue he's just as good of a playmaker as Embed, go ahead, but I think he does a little more gravity this year.

Worst scored in those three guys. Defensively, he's better than a Luca and a Curry. I think other two things make up for it. And Embed's a better defender night and day. Like, I just think when you, he's very, he's up to, he's a top ten player because he's incredibly balanced and makes you better in a lot of ways. He doesn't really have a weakness, per se.

But I think, if you want to say scoring is that top-tier skill set, cool. But I think these other guys have higher-level elite strengths that just have tons of impact. Obviously, Curry's a system in himself, the off-ball movement, the shooting. You don't got to explain that. Lucas, maybe the best pick and roll ball in highly we've ever seen. It's certainly the best in the league right now. He's absolutely insanity with his level of three-level scoring and passing. And in Beds, you know, the most dominant score in the league right now.

And to encapsulate what you just said, what is Tatum going to do to break the game? we know what yokech is gonna do yonis is a demi god curry curry luka luka what does tatum have in his game that go ahead i'll the advantage that tatum has over and i'll i'll specifically argue and be because i think the other four are kind of like we're in locks up there the advantage that tatum has over and beat is he can look down the bench and say al horfer get in the game right and he can tell alhorfer to lock him up and do and do all that that's that's the that's the advantage but like I think that I just think that like consistently we've seen them we've seen both of them match up in in the playoffs several times and for Tatum to come out victorious several times

in those situations for Tatum to to be as as like I said as consistent and just like it listen it's two ways it's a it's a consistent two way player you're right but something that gets lost in that is just so much nuance in between that not once where they face a off against each other where I would argue that like no yeah Philly definitely genuinely has a better team and the heat they should wipe before there's never been there's never been an instance with that they've always consistently had a better coach a better starting lineup from head to tow a better system in place so everything leans Tatum's way you know and it's not easy it's not it's not it's not hard to beat down someone like Embed and I don't like that I don't like that entire team

argument that's where it gets lost I'm talking about you as a play you're singularly because if we're talking about team then Luca he's not in this I'm not giving him the positive I'll whore for tax I'm gonna give him that I'm gonna give him that great yeah man I mean

who else we now talk about we can talk a lot about AD versus Shay and Booker I just wanted the defense I think AD has been a dominant rim score this year the defense I think has been absolutely incredible he's game breaking on defense

the way those guys are offensively but I have no issue with Shay above him I cool I might even agree if you ask me tomorrow and you guys don't have an issue some the only thing that I would say is like damn, did I really put Shea over LeBron? Maybe I'll switch that, but really I just wanted to show how much higher that I had

Shea over Tatum. That'll just the hate that I had get into my heart right there. So I don't really believe he's better than LeBron, but I generally believe he is a better player than Tatum now. Wholeheartedly. That's hard. I mean, I get it. It's tough.

Again, a big part of the Tatum buys, too, is that he plays on a team that just added two great players more, so he takes less shots now and, like, has to spread the ball a little bit. Jalen Brown's also averaging less points because of that. So there's also that. Like, he's not going to be as impressive statistically just because there's more players to get more shots now. So I got to keep that in mind, too. Yeah.

But with that being said, too, I mean, they did add one of the 15, arguably really 10 best centers in the NBA at Homegram. J. Dub took a step and he's taking a lot more shots. So it's not like Shade didn't have to go through a similar thing of not like sharing the love. And he's only dropped down to 30 points a game. Big Shockware. That's not really the big thing. that's not that's not the big thing it's just seeing the game management aspect to me is what's so impressive maybe yeah the defense suit like the defense let alone could help me with this

conversation but i'm talking about how he closes games on a consistent basis on a consistent basis and knows when to ping off of other players while also being the connector and if he can't be the connector then at times he can be the floor general obviously that's not like the main strength of his game it's probably like the fourth or fifth best thing that he'd get at on on the court. But I just value him and what he does a lot on the court. Yeah. The defense is why I went him over Booker and why I'd be okay with going him over AD. AD's just like, you know, naturally as a big man being as versatile as he is way more impactful. But for a guard defender, Shay's like almost as impactful as it could be. Like he's not like play to play like a prime

choir or something like that. But in terms of defensive playmakers, you know, he's leading the league and steals by over a whole steel. Yeah. He's by far number one. And steals aren't everything. Like, you know, Alan Iverson with Leaking Stills on one point. He wasn't a particularly great defender. Shea has the size, play-to-play, he puts in the effort, playing within a team scheme that he doesn't ruin at all. He's legitimately a big part of it. He's like similar to what I said with Anthony Edwards, where he has that play-making ability defensively, and he's good enough play-to-play with his rotations and on-ball defense that he's as good as you could hope for from a guard.

So could you guys see Shea surpassing Tatum at the end of the season or throughout the season? I guess. I mean, it's just a point-for-game bias, I think. Everything that he does, Tatum does too. Tatum's also a great defender. I think it's beyond the point of game bias, but we'll see when those conversations start to fire. Honestly, it's also a winning bias because if we see Shea make each Western Conference Finals runs year after year, we'd probably have the same type of winning bias who gives a datum.

So pick your bias poison, I guess. He's sexier. I'm taking shake. That's why I gave him those undies. I knew he'd say some shit like that. It's in his blood. Waving that is crazy. Like a flag?

Yeah. You're insane. Yeah, man. Y'all smell that? No. All I smell is TikTok time. Woo! Let's go.

Cron Eaters, it's time to Christmas rejoice. Let's do it. As always, we're going to start with the draft. This time, it's going to be very different than any draft we've ever done. It's not a player draft. It's not a lineup draft. We are drafting the best NBA memes. Oh, you know.

I'm getting this. You're confident? Fairly. Fairly confident. The draft order is Mo Donovan Me. So you got a second pick. You know, you'll get your, probably your favorite memes. Yeah, I never get to, you know, I don't get to stake, but it's okay.

I'm fine. Let's draft the best NBA memes. Mo, where are we going? Let's do it. Number one overall pick, give me LeBron James lying, bro. He never tells the truth. He said that he predicted Kobe's score him 81 points. What? Capper.

That's a good pick. All right. Well, my number one pick, also want to go LeBron. Me too. Don't pick it. Don't pick mine. You know I will give me LeBron yelling at J.R.

SIR. Fuck, I'll look at that. Damn. That's off the bore for you. It's so versatile. We've never seen LeBron that mad. It is hilarious. Oh, man.

Your bracket is busted. Damn, he ruined me. Got him. I'm going to stick with LeBron. First pick, give me the LeBron James kid. Oh, okay. That's a throwback.

Give me that kid. I wonder what that kid is doing now. Is this a LeBron memes draft? He's a funny guy. second pick give me shack sleeping one of the most versatile useful means anything trash you just the shack meme always helps that's clutch that's good that's good I love that meme I give me I want to go kind of classic here give me Nick young missing the three yeah another versatile one and thinking thinking it went in turning around before the shot even went in I'm taking that one that's great that's hard

that's hard I like that one next up, go ahead and give me MJ's meme in the documentary saying, you never won anything. That is a Hall of Fame. You're a loser meme right there. You're going to zoom out so it's centered. The things about to go off the screen.

This is great. All right, where we're going next mo? Next up, go ahead and give me the meme. A Kobe Bryant leaving the Lakers game with his daughters. That is shameful right there. That is class. He was embarrassed.

to be at Staples Center. You know how bad you got to be to make somebody to leave courtside Lakers games tickets? You got to be ass. Disgraceful. It's Kobe, man. He'll do anything to go ahead and get rid of that atrocity that he witnessed.

He was so ashamed of those Lakers teams. All right. A new one, a new addition to the NBA meme list. Give me the Paul George. Where's Paul Do? This 100% is going to come back to bite Paul George and the Clippers in the playoffs.

And I can't wait for, I can't wait for that to happen. I'm going to use it every single game. I need it. Next one, we're going with a deep cut. Give me the time Mello was staring at Rihanna, ready to risk it all. Woo! That man saw a target and he was ready to pounce. Oh, man.

Can't blame him. And then, you know, next one, I'm going to go with a modern classic. Give me. I almost didn't hear you Next up I'm going with a modern classic Give me the bleach report graphic Of Jared Allen saying the lights were too bright

Oh, that's so shameful Oh no That's shameful To turn off the lights Turn off the lights Turn off the lights It's great All right

I'm going with another quote meme Give me Adam Silver saying get ready to learn and insert wherever place you are right now the piston sucks so get ready to learn Detroit buddy is fantastic you know what go ahead and give me the classic KD my next chapter me bro that is classic anytime someone wins a championship stamp katies stamp katies meme up there he's moving that's great and then for my last pick this is classic two pop meme, bro. That is a straight up offensive and I need some of that

to smear alongside my memes. That's bullying for sure. Yeah. Listen, normally when we talk normally when we talk about things like in the 60s, we just say respect. So I'm going with a very old school meme here. Give me the O KC mom made pizza roll memes

where everybody's just yelling. I love that one. Old school meme. My childhood. Facebook type meme. That's what we need on my team. You know what? While we're on the topic of old classics, how did we not pick the crying Jordan face? Oh, wow. That's the steal of the draft. What happened? That's the

society. The greatest NBA meme of all time, pound for pound. You're right. Damn. I feel like I didn't come hard enough. Oh, whoa, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. No, no, no, I'm in love when it comes to my means. Next topic. I don't have old school movies by you guys. I came hard. Damn.

Okay. All right, next tip time. Next tip time. It's going to be hilarious. All right, let's say our team, what memes do we have? I have the LeBron James kid, Shaq sleep meme, mellow, lusting after Rihanna, Jared Allen's and the lights are too bright, and the crying Jordan face. Okay, I have LeBron yelling at J.R. Smith in the NBA finals.

I have Nick Young prematurely celebrating a three going in. I have Paul George's, where's Paul, though? Adam Silver's, get ready to learn Detroit, buddy. and the original OkC, Mom-made Pizza Row memes. Great meme. That's why. Number one, I had the LeBron James Blind meme. Number two, MJ, you never want anything, meme.

Kobe leaving the Lakers game, mid-game with his daughters, Katie's classic, my next chapter meme back in 2016, and the Trey Young Lollipop at number five. Trey on Wollipop is so good. That's great. Next thing we're going to do, should you be serious or should we stay with some funny shit? Let's sit serious for two seconds.

No, let's say it with some funny shit. I just thought about it. I'm so happy you said no. We're going to do something we did a while ago. We're going to react to NBA players photoshopped bald. This iconic picture that we have printed for Mo's Christmas present

is from this. We're going to look at more crazy craniums. Cranium is crazy. So you know how it works. You're going to rate from 1 to 10 how this NBA player looks if they were bald. Okay. Let's get it.

Here we go. First up, Zion Williamson. Yo, why is this shack? Damn. Why is this Shaq? This is Shaq. Oh my goodness.

This is diesel. This is diesel. This is 10 out of 10. This is a real player. But look at that face. He looks like a villain. He looks evil. He's a truck driver.

He just saw a pack of sodas. This man has a CDL. Yo. This man looks evil as much. This looks like an unfair strip club bouncer if I ain't seen one before. That's what he is. getting everyone up and down and he's nobody through.

I'm not going to lie, this makes his aura 10 times better. He looks like a menace. I'm giving this at 9. This man is 20, if this was 1970, he would be 22 years old.

I'm giving this a 10 out of 10. This is an 8. This is a realistic person. Oh, you hate you. This is a good photo shot. Yeah, this is insane for Oswald. You see the grains in the back too. This is Walt Frasier.

Next up. J.J. Reddick. Oh my God. Lappable head If I and seen one He looks like One of D's a thumb Good God

Yep Yep Alien He is not beating The Pinky Allegations Yeah Yeah he looks He looks like

One of the villains From Spy Kids The Walking Thumbs Yeah That's where he is Oh man He looks like a genius Too much of a genius

There's too much He has a basketball Thores in his head Locked in bro I've seen this guy Working on my local gas station Goodness a 3 out of 10

Okay I'll say three out of 10, too. Yeah. If he started to look like this in real life, he's taking that flight to Turkey. He's getting the transplant. JJ, don't do it. Next up. James Hardin.

Oh, this is just Rick Ross, man. He's Rick Ross? I'm being honest, man. Yeah, this is just Rick Ross. This is Freddie Gibbs. Oh, God. Freddie Gibbs and Rick Ross. Yeah, the Loris is gone completely.

yeah this brick ross for real brick ross for real i'm scottie beeman yeah i know i just know this man is in miami all the time hella yachts and just hella iregeos all that's what i get from his got to type

yeah no this man for sure lives in miami uh is this making it look better or worse uh at this point honestly a little bit better because listen he still has braids starting to start in the middle of his head though barely

might need to come home james Right. 10. 10. Make this move, James Hardin. 10. Next up. Donovan Mitchell.

Ooh, this is a smooth head. Ooh. That looks real rubble. Yeah, it does. Like a genie. That's a knee. That's a knee. Oh my goodness.

This looks like if Kevin on stage play basketball. It looks like he's in major pain. He's one of the kids that made him shave his head. Solid. Listen, random ball guy in Cleveland, five out of ten. Yeah, he looks like he's those. He knows what he's doing, bro. He doesn't look too bad ball at all.

This is Frozone. Y'all are tripping. This is a four. He looks way worse. Athletic-ass prozone. Damn, he might be the greatest zero of all time. All right, next up. Lamello ball.

He can't go bald. This is an engineer. This is a car mechanic, Jiffy Loub. Not in the NBA. Jiffy Lou. I'm surprised there's not a cigarette in his mouth right now. he's a scammer he's scamming old ladies he's one of them dudes on the phone right now saying oh yeah credit card fraud he's one of them right there he's joining the third street saints

look at no good he lost all those or this is a zero yeah yeah i'll go two out of ten i go two out of ten this is not good it's a latin king yeah it's a bad look he looks like a rejected gang member in this right here this is bad bunny in 2017 Paul Wall. This man's from Puerto Rico. This is crazy. Next up. Blake Griffin.

Oh, man. Why is the picture deep fried, though? This is a different variation of R.J. Jefferson, bro. This is a McDonald's chicken nugget. Oh. I don't know. The whole color is just throwing me off. He's never been this dark in his life.

I don't like it. I don't like it either One out of ten I don't like it one bit It makes me uncomfortable I might give it a five out of ten Because he looks like Howie Mendo

He looks like a handy man Look like to come repair my roof or something I like it What's name like guys And all the roast The comedian Jeff Ross Bob Ross

No not Bob Ross What's his name I think it's Jeff Yeah it's Jeff Ross This is Jeff Ross This is Jeff Ross You give him a little bit Nellon and this is Jeff Ross

Just sprinkle a little bit in All right, next one. Jamal Murray. Oh, no, this is really bad. Look at his eyes. Looks crazy. The neck beard combo with the bald head. Yeah.

The back of the, listen, the back part of his head is just wide. Scoopable. Yep. That's what it is. Scoopable. Kind of looks like a potato on the top. If he goes bald, he's going to have to cut the beard and just rock the goatee. Potato, he's a tater tot right here.

It looks like something's like cut off the circulation in the back of his head and he got crazy eyes because of it Yeah, I'll go four out of ten Yeah, he looks mean as hell, bro I'm gonna give this three Yeah, I'll go, I'll go three at best I don't like it

Next up Carl Anthony Downs This is just a bad picture I feel bad I feel bad I'm about saying anything about this He just looks like my dad To be honest

He just looks like A 6-11 version of my dad Like he just looks like pro yeah man this is just a tired old man he just wants to come home from work man he's exasperated his kids are stressing him out he just wants to watch monday night football he's gonna get home hang that beard up on the coat wrap he's gonna drink up a bruise this is definitely a two though yeah i'll go too i don't like it all right two milk done next up lanzo ball is actually not bad someone right now he looks like

one of the old light skin retired rappers. Who he looked like? Paul Wall. Oh. I think there could be better. Yeah, I think it would be better at all. Every light skin ball person is not Paul Wall. No, this is Jason Kid.

It is Jason Kid. It is Jason Kid for sure. No, he doesn't look bad. Honestly, this is one of the better, like, ball players. He looks like he came from the Joe Button family tree. He's going to be potting. I'll say eight. Get ready to learn podcast, Lonzo.

10 out of 10. Yeah, this is a 10. Next up That's the end of them These are hilarious I love doing this I'm gonna do this Until we run out of

Once we react to So if you're watching this The people at Playmaker Who make these Please keep making them We need these You're fueling our content I'm gonna keep your watermark

In there Please keep making these Honorable man Alright next up You know It's Christmas time This is the T through Christmas episode We got presents

We got all these decorations Light stockings It's only right We talk about something related to NBA Christmas, so we're going to grade NBA Christmas jerseys. Oh, yes. They need to come back. We've been saying it for years. This is our moment. That's just for us.

There was a whole lot of trash, too. Let's tell us. This time to be honest. Nostalgia's going to kick somebody's ass, not me. So let's grade these NBA Christmas jerseys. First off, the Lakers all white. These are hard. This is 10. This is Christine. This is crisp. This is heavenly. I don't know what else to say, but whatever positive adjective verb you want to use for it, this is it. This is a 10. if I hadn't seen him before.

That was intense, but I agree. This is the 10 out of 10. The best Christmas jersey ever, I think. I'll say it. I'm also a Lakers fan. I don't know. I don't know if it's the best, but it is 10 out of 10.

Maybe it's my Lakers by showing, but I'm taking this over all the ones on this list. Next up. The Cavaliers, white text on red. Now, I think that these are the greatest Christmas jerseys to ever grace Christmas Day. I would certainly wear this more

than I wear the last one, so I get it. Yes. These are beautiful. These are 10. 10 out of 10. It works with every team. I love these. You can get a fit off with this. That text looks like it would fit regular fashion, not just encore. Listen, these came in in 2016. You put this with a hoodie underneath.

Little Bryson Tiller dad hat. Oh, my God. It's a cargo source. You know, you wore that to real life. You're lying. Of course I did. Of course I wore it. You had the camo cargo shorts on, the elite socks. He had that shit on back then. You know what I'm about.

I'm going 10 out of 10. You know my game. This is very nice. I'm going to 10 too. ORA. Next up. The New York Knicks neon orange I love this I can't cap I can't cap these hurt my eyes

They're so bright They're so bright bro They're so bright they're all right Six I don't know They're fine The streets of New York are very dangerous You rock one of these You are a walking

Safety cone right here That's true that's true You can put this to run at night And you would be okay No car will hit you Nobody nobody would look at you These are for safety purposes 9 out of 10

right listen you're riding a bike down manhattan this is the jersey for you exactly you ain't a target bro exactly exactly well listen also like safety rise you look at this you're a robber trying to look at somebody you see this flashbang you're not robin nobody you're leaving you're going the other way yeah so for safety purposes nine out of ten yeah fashion purposes four but we'll go six and a half to make it even yeah i'll go seven i'll go seven next up the boston celtics jersey If you put Christmas jerseys with cursive writing, it's going to be a 10 out of tone. It's so hard to mess this up. Yeah. These are beautiful.

Yeah, another 10. The silhouettes unbeatable. Yeah, I'm going to give this a 10. I'm going to give this a 10. Why isn't we a redhead band though? Oh, Christmas colors. Never mind. Yeah, it is special.

This guy. All right, next up. The Warriors blue on white. This could be better. I don't like that blue because I don't think that's the correct blue. Okay. They fucked up right there. That is true.

That is true. But once again, we see the cursive. But do you see cursive. You got to put 10 out of 10. Do we have a new rule? If we see cursive on a jersey, it's a 10? No. No, I don't think we can make that a rule.

My bad. My bad. Never mind. This is solid, though. Too much dip on the chip. All right. This is solid seven. Yeah, I'd say that.

Next one. The bulls sleeve jerseys. Sleeve jerseys should have been outlawed. They should have never been introduced into the NBA. These are a zero out of 10. So waste of materials, what I call it. I know so many people who could use that extra coverage. That is not it right there.

Was Adam Silver Commissioner when this came into the league? He tried to push it. Yes. He needs to be incriminated for war crimes. Send this man to the... Send him to fashion school. That's what you need to be sent. Send this man to Guantanamo.

Fuck that. This is awful. Zero out of ten. Yeah, this is a zero. There's just straight up a gray bull on top of that. shirt. Why is it gray? Like, ugh.

Exactly. That looks like an undercover referee jersey, bro. That's honestly, what's the difference? Guys working on foot locker. Facts.

This foot action jersey. All right, next up. That's the last one. Man, that's good. Then you bring back Christmas Day jerseys. Not this one. Yeah. This is trash.

All right. Next thing we're going to do, you know, NBA Tracey's heating up. We're getting close to those times where there's a report every day, many of which are bullshit, it, many of which have merits because there are certain players we know we're going to be

on the trade market, or at least the teams are going to explore the options. So we're going to talk about all those players today and talk about what teams you want to see these players be traded to. Who made this one? This was back in like 2019. I loved it. Before the true holiday trade when he signed that extension. Everyone thought he was down there.

This is when all those failures happened back to back to back to back for Janus. When the heat were taking his lunch every year. Yeah. In Toronto too. All right. So let me know what year you want. Let me know what team you want to see this player traded to. Okay.

First up, Zach Levine. Get him out of this next jersey. I don't want to see him as a big of thing. Why? I don't want to see that. For what? You guys have Quentin Grimes and R.J. Barrett.

What other wing options do you have? Why would I go all in for Zach Levine? Why wouldn't you? What do you have better to do? Sir. Listen, we already have Julius Randall. Why am I stacking mid on mid by bringing Zach Levine to my franchise? Listen, you see that man right there?

Automatic bucket. Why not? Listen, stacking mid on mid? That's how you become the Atlanta Hawks. I don't want to do that. I don't want to do that. Where do you want to see him go, though? I don't know.

Trade him to Detroit. They need help. Send the National Guard. Say anybody who can play basketball. Anybody play basketball. If you can make two threes in a row, you can have a 10-day contract in Detroit. Send him there. Send him to Detroit.

No. Real note, send him to either Orlando or Sacramento. Don't trade Higgen-Murie. Go ahead and give him two picks for him in a whatever filler, and you'll be. and you'll be set. Detroit. Detroit.

Make it happen. Don't ruin it. All right. Next up. Lowry Markinen. We, listen, we talked about this last time. I want to see Lowry Markening as an Oklahoma City Thunder. I think he would fit perfectly with everything that they do.

And I think that he would make them a legitimate NBA founders. I'll go one step further. I don't just want to see it. I demand to see it. Demand. I'll go one step further. If we do not see him in an OKC Jersey Bay in this year, assuming is available, Sam Pressy needs to be investigated for being investigated for being.

a war criminal. Investigation. This is the most obvious trait I've ever seen. Throw all the picks. He makes them a complete team that will honestly be arguably the best in the West.

Delo in a first? Okay. Listen, him next to Lebrot and A.D. You might be cooking. Hey, Laker's Champion. We can't let them keep getting away with this. Stop it.

No, okay, see, has to happen. Yeah, it's a must. The league needs it. Next up. Donovan Mitchell. Are all of these just nicks? Listen, D. Mitch is from New York. It's been rumored for a long time.

He is, but send him to Orlando. No. If you send, if you send Donovan Mitchell with the defense that they have, and they have been trying to find a lead guard for years, send him there. D. Mitch and Jalen Brunson is just like, East Coast version of D. Mitch and Garland. I need to see him in Orlando. He would have so much fun at Disney World.

No, send him to Brooklyn, man They need a new star And he will fit perfectly in one side Macau Cam Johnson Nick Claxton at all them They're not keeping all those guys Somebody's got to go back to Cleveland Cam Johnson, yeah

Or Camp Thomas send his ass back Don't need him You get buckets in the calves Give me that Oh limitless But so you keep the Newark connection I like him on the nest That's cool

Yeah All right next up Demar de Rosen I do not know the answer to this Because he does not fit with most teams Where would he go where would he go? Nehow.

Kind of man. Am I wrong? I don't know. It's weird because he's still really good. He's just so hard to fit with a team. Set him to Charlotte. I don't know what they're doing over there. A team with no structure, bro.

Just go ahead and send him to Detroit. Could they get any worse? Genuinely speaking? That's true. It's impossible. If not, I think he'll be, I don't want to send him to Portland. Never mind.

That'll fuck up everything they'll have going on over there. This is tough. like who six man for the lakers all right once again once again yeah I honestly don't know he will stay in Chicago keep his ass in Chicago

put him so you are in purgatory forever next up Alex Caruso put him on any team in the league and they might go ahead and win a playoff series of him

I don't know they have no access to do it I would love to see him on the bucks next to Damien Lillard oh that would be a perfect fit I love that Marjean Boat champ Chicago listen it would

be a perfect fit but this is not too k we're not doing trade overrides you are not going to milwaukee right that's not happening Alex where should he go though loki lakers oh my god next one he's pissing me off put him in sacramento though and all we're all seriousness he will be hard as i am intrigued by that yeah i am intrigued by that yeah that would be a good fit yeah all right next up pascal siacum This is next one of the shops are hilarious. Can I end? Atlanta?

Hell no. I got Jalen Johnson. I don't want him on my team. It's too late. It's too late Toronto. First of all, as an Atlanta Hawksman, you are not above any All-Sart coming to your team.

You don't know the help you can get. You don't understand. You don't got Jalen Johnson on your team, so you're excluded from this conversation, sir. I don't have to Jant-Marry either, thank God. Realistically speaking, though, put this man,

if he was in Dallas, he will be cooking. I was just thinking of that. I was thinking Dallas also, once again, a team that has nothing going for it, Charlotte, pick up the phone.

Let's make something to happen. That would be actually great fit. Oh, Charlotte, Lamello and Siakum, kind of makes sense. They will be cooking. But Brandon Miller in the middle? Come on.

I kind of fuck with that. PJ and Washington isn't there for long. Miles Bridges should be in jail. Give you Siakum in Charlotte. Let's make it happen. If not Charlotte, give him another 6-7 point guard, light-skinned dude,

put him in Indiana. Ooh, Tom, and your spot is not safe. Yeah. Defense, shooting's there still. I love that for him. I like that too. All right. Next up. O.G. Ananovi.

Hmm. Listen, you put this man on any team in the league and he'd help them. Every fan base in the fucking world wants him. Listen, put him on the Hawks, the Kings, the Utah Jazz, the Lakers, Warriors. Literally every association would love him. I've heard so much buzz about an O.J. Ananoby trade. I want him to stay in Toronto. Nobody gets O'Don. Nobody gets him. Listen, a Messiah wants seven person on picks for his ass like last year. He's definitely staying in Canada.

not happening. No, if OKC can't make a Lowry marketing trade happen, they better make an OG on an OB trade happen. They better make something

happen. Something. They need wings and they have all the picks in the world. True. Send Josh Giddy to Canada.

Put this ass over the board here. Next up. That's the last one. All right. I love that. Trace season's coming and we're going to be

milking it all the way. Next thing we're going to do, what do we want to do? Let's keep on the topic of players. we're going to grade some NBA draft picks. Okay. You know, a lot of times we do stuff like NBA redrafts.

We want to talk about a class. At this time, we're going to go to the 2021 class. And I picked out six or so players, and we're going to grade how the pick is aged. So, you know, just looking back, grade this NBA draft pick. Let's do it. First off, Cade Cunningham. Listen, they are losing so much

that people on Twitter thought they were losing games to Wingstop. Okay? It has not gone well I'm giving this a D A D It has not gone well Not because of Cade Because of every fucking thing else

It hasn't gone up his numbers You want to pick Jalen Green? It has not gone well In Detroit They suck The whole era is bad I'm giving this an A They couldn't

Picking Jalen Green wasn't the answer I can see picking Evan Mowbly But I still think long term Kate can probably become the better player Everybody's gonna get fired after this I'll probably be right pick This is an A Yeah

It hasn't worked out. Maybe he's not quite the top 10 player we hoped, but he's still going to be the best pick there. Exactly. He hasn't done nothing wrong to plumb his stock. It's not his fault. He's playing with terrorists. He didn't ask for this.

Monty Williams to say his name. Monty Williams is terrorizing him. All right, next up, Jalen Green. This is a D if I ain't seen one before. You're being kind. This is an F. They should have picked Evan Mobley. In the moment we knew it,

looking back while Jalen Green continues to be second year Jalen Green with no improvements. and Evan Mobley is an elite Defender It's honestly deplorable That I didn't pick Evan Mobley But he jumped high

Oh thank God This is a dunk man Like listen James Hardett James Harden had What's James Harding on? Yeah he was Yeah he was A lot of people were comparing this man

And saying he could be better Than Anthony Edwards Those are the type of conversations That he was in to see how far Down he's regressed down He bro they don't even Prioritize him On the Houston Rockets anymore

Name me one skill Jalen Green's above average at Vertical hair Jumping hair Yeah he has nice hair Yeah his product game is on point He knows exactly what they're putting that hair Thanks Props to you

Jonathan Kaminga This has been a D This has been a D They listen They have been trying to make Kaminga Into the star And it just hasn't worked And he's been like better I guess

But like I think this is a solid C He hasn't done anything outright to all for all of us to call him trash he's not Wiseman That's fair But Kerr hated playing him

That's his fucking false Steve Kerr refuses to play As young guys Kaminga has more potential Than he's actually been over a show He's not great They should have picked Franz Wagner We all know this

But I think a C Like it's not his fault He doesn't get minutes Yeah exactly But he don't get minutes But we don't know he's trash That's why he's a C I mean

Yeah He's not an A or B because he could be Jalen Greeneer But he's not Jalen Green He could be Jalen Green But we don't Not no.

That's true. All right, next up, Franz Wagner, the guy the one you should have paid was. A plus. This guy is going to be an all-star. Orlando has a foundational piece at Forward to pair with Palo. This is fantastic. Top two player in your draft? I mean.

Top three at worst? Top three for sure. Top three for sure. We might have to go two. You get me on the ride, but you might convince me he's number one. Okay. I'm there. I'm with you.

Damn. A plus plus. This guy is incredible. No weakness to his game. He is that guy. Yep. Next up. Al Perrin Sangoon. This is another A plus if we ain't seen one before. Steal the draft, right? Like, picked in the teens. Like, probably the fourth best player in this draft.

Yeah, easily. He could be an all-star in the next few years and no one really saw that coming. They found the face of their franchise in the middle of the draft. Face? Who is the face? Jabari Smith? I'm just saying, face to the franchise feels very big. extreme for where he's at right now they need to cling on something they have to call someone that right now and he is that guy you know who they have

as the face of the franchise Dylan Brooks oh god the luscious lock he's dominating ew let's be real nah a plus it is a plus though the last one next up Jalen Suggs

this is a solid B could be a to be honest I mean I'll say listen he's starting to come around so so that's good they're starting to see exactly you like what they want from him he plays very hard oh c plus he's not what you want from a top five pick

from a team that needs a lead guard but like he's still a very good player he's proven to be a good role player I can have a role on a team at least yeah c plus exactly they picked a good player maybe too early yeah for regards of the fact he is not a let down at all I think he's a solid because he's a productive player

that any team will have to have and I would say I would say it's to be because he fits into their culture and what they're trying to build so I'll give him a little bit of a plus for that He is a part of the culture. Yeah, good player. All right, next up. That's the last one.

I keep saying next up one is the last one. I never know. Next thing we're going to do. Let's play a game of, we do this a lot, and sometimes they hit or miss. We're going to do guest the NBA player in one minute,

but this time in person. So we can have one minute to look at the clock, looking to show his eyes, and see how it plays out in person. This is going to be intense. So let's, yeah, let's pull up a stop watch.

Who wants to do it? Last time I, I just go multiple games. Last of my day, I got that bitch in 23 seconds. Let me let me let me find Let me pull somebody up I got somebody in my mind right now Okay

Oh okay Oh I'll say I do two We'll do three We'll do all we'll do one Okay Okay So you got one minute To guess the NBA player

I'm thinking of Is he an MVP? No Is he an all-star No Is he a starter? No Does he play in the

Wesson Conference? Yes Is he playing now? Yes Malik Monk No Was he was he drafted After 2015?

No California team Uh yes Is you over 30 Yes Over 30 in California team Is it backup Nick Petum.

No, he's on the sexes. Is he a back court player? Uh, no. Back court player is the front court player? He's on the Lakers. No. He's on the Clippers. Yeah.

It's on the Clippers. Backboard. No. Oh, this is Norman Powell? No. Kauai. No. He's a bench player.

Oh, bench player. We got 26 seconds, man. Let's chill. No, no, no, no. It's not Terrence, man. Russell Westbrook. No. He said not an MVP.

Is it Daniel's Heath? No. Point guard. No. Shooting guard. No. Small forward. Power Ford

Is this Tyloo? No, no I said every position I know I was trolling Just about Ford You dick you're just What I'm spoiled it

Marcus Morris No he's not on there anymore It was PJ Tucker You You're trolled Five seconds left Come on How many players were there left

You ran out of players You ruined If you said yes to power four I 100% would have got it I don't know man You It's a rap It's a rap

It's a rap I just go out You've cheated You fumbled You fumbled You lied With five seconds left You not

Get P. Day Tucker You lied You lied You ran through Every single You lied Go to hell

You're a terrorist You lied You guys just Hold that L You lied PJ Tucker was the easiest Go to

You lied Are you guys sore What Go fuck yourself What? Go fuck yourself I don't I don't want to play this game

anymore I don't either I don't either No get your revenge Get your revenge Get your revenge I have an NBA player. You have one minute to guess who it is.

Mo has to do it by himself. I'm sitting out. Let's be for real. All right. Does he play in the West? No. He plays in the East. Duh. Okay. So does he play for the Celtics? Yes. Oh, is this out Horford? No. Is this pain pictured? No.

Is this a big? I don't know. He's been a line out. I'm gonna go ahead and go with it. This is Oh, what's that dude's name again? Oh, fuck. I don't know. You better start thinking. No, I got his name. I got his name.

No, we don't. Big Samhouser. No. Damn. Does this Tatum? No. J.B.? No.

K.P. No. So, O'Say, Reset. No. He makes fire TikToks. He does be fire TikToks. I can't say it's him. I got 50 second left.

This could be Drew Holiday. Nope. D. White. Nope. Who else is on their roster? I don't even figure it out. You got five seconds.

You don't know? Three. No, this is cooked. This is the Lano Blanton. Oh, dang. Oh, no one nods. That's crazy. That's worse than PJ Tucker because he's not even around with it.

That's worse. Good job. That is worse. No one knows. The ball nowhere right here. That is worse. Mr. Banton. That is worse.

When's last time we got PT? A couple nights ago. Recently, yeah. Did he's had him playing? Yeah, that's worse. I think he started a couple weeks ago. No way. Yeah, he was starting a few games.

They need a choice of somebody. I got this guys. I got these guys stats up. You guys ready? Yep. All right. Do you have one minute to get this NBA player I'm thinking of? Does he play in the West?

No. Is he currently playing? Yes. He's in the East. Okay. Is he on a Pacific Division team? No. Has he been an All-Star?

Yes. Wait. You can't, Google. I know, I know. I know my bad, my bad, my bad. Okay. Are we good? No.

Oh, do you know, no. Does he play for the Knicks? Yes. Ooh, he plays for the Knicks. Was the All-Star. Josh Hart? No. Emmanuel quickly.

No. Is it John Runson? Yes. Damn. That was too easy. Yeah, that's funny. I had a reference for my guy. He's had a lot of slander today.

I was like, wow, okay. I was going to pick some, I was going to pick Todd Gibson to be on. Didn't he just resign there? God. Yeah. That's hilarious. All right, next thing we're going to do,

let's get back some funny shit. Let's restore the feeling. We're going to guess some NBA players based on their haircuts. Let's do it. Another iconic thing we've done before. Guessing some players, like their head shots cropped in. All you're going to see is their upper forehead. And you got to guess who this is.

Okay. So you see it. First up, that picture is crazy as fuck keep going first player this guy that is draymond green I know those wrinkles in the low haircut anywhere this is a fighter I see this picture I see fisticus this is draymond green yeah I feel threatened just looking at this picture yeah right next up who is this man oh this could be I know exactly who this is this man is stressed he looks way older than he actually is this is grason allen this is ted cruz himself he looks exactly like ted cruz so what oh yeah we're getting these we are rolling through

oh don't be too confident all right next up who is this man i know this too go ahead he has a weird shaped head last name is interesting this is tyris halberton correct y'all are flying through these we're here next up Who is this man? I got this. This is the sharpshooter in Phoenix. This is Yuta Watanabe. Ooh, correct.

Yeah, I knew this too. Damn, everything in two seconds, y'all are flying through these. Let's see if it continues. I told you. Next up, who is this man? This could be a lot of players. He does have a clean edge up, light skin. Clearly a light skin player.

This can go two ways. This is either, he's either Steph Curry or it's Jamal Murray. But I think by the outline. I think this is going to be Steph Curry That's a great guess But you're fucking wrong Damn, is this Zach Levine? Damn, yes, this is Zach Levine

Okay, there we go I thought I got you Damn Oh yeah I thought yeah, I wasn't leaning Steph But I saw the head shape And the hair I was like yeah, this could be

Kind of looks like Dante X-in I was thinking you're gonna say him That would that would have been a great thing That's nice All right next up Deep pole Who is this man? Ooh, we can lean

So many ways with this I think we're at the point I think we're at the point in the program where Isaac is going to try and get a deep cut. Is this Marvin Bagley the third? You're right, the deep cut. No, this is not Marvin Bagley.

Oh, I was about to say, man, you're cursing if you put Marvin Bagley in these. This is not Mike Conley. He has short-haired. This is not Mike only. Could this be Duel and Bede? No. It could be.

It's not. It's Colin Sexton. Oh, it's Colin Sexton. It's Colin Sexton. Damn, it's not Colin Sexton. Oh, you played that off too, so moved. Now, that hurt. I'm not gonna lie that hurt

I get fucked Um Is he a back court player He looks like a guard It's not a guard Damn You need hints you're cook This is Carl Anthony Towns

Oh The lighting is trash That's what it is garbage That's what threw us off We got got Get fucked I think that's the last one Damn

You almost had a clean streak You almost flew through him Somehow I thought this would be the easiest one Tough Do you know how many people Had that haircut Yeah and the lighting was terrible too

We were naming all dark skin players. We got one more video left, I think, before we get out of here. I stand with my people. Next thing we're going to do, we're going to go through some NBA teams and picked their greatest center of all time. Lit. So we all love some all-time talk.

It's a staple to us. So I'm going to name six teams. You guys get, not guess, you guys pick who the greatest center of all time is. These pictures Nikil put on here are insane. I've got a Plumley? No, those are the Zellers. Oh, Zellar, my man.

Zeller. You're confused? Yeah. That's hilarious. All right. First up, the Orlando Magic. It has to be, it has to be Dwight Howard. Has to be?

Has to be Dwight Howard. It doesn't have to be anybody. It can be Shaq. It's, it's debatable. It can't be Shaq. He wasn't there for. Yeah, four years and a long time. The impact is way too important.

It is definitely Dwight Howard. Yeah. And they both have a finals appearance. I'm going to give, I'm going to give Dwight the nod for longevity. Listen, if he could have left after four years or those rules, he might have left too. I don't know. It's not Shaq's fault. He had the pre-CBA. Yeah, this is. Oh, yeah. You're right. Damn. It is a conversation, though. For a second.

For a second. You got to think about Shaq. For a second, yeah. You just have to say his name and then you're like, okay, it's Dwight. I respect it. That's how we're doing. All right. Next up. The Philadelphia 76ers. Who was in the conversation other than Embed? It would be, you would have Moses Malone there. The correct answer. And then I guess Chamberlain is for the Warriors franchise Yeah So Moses Malone

No love for Will I mean no love for Embed I think he deserves to be in the conversation He can be we're talking about it right now But is Moses Malone No I'm playing I just want to see it today It's easily Moses Malone Moses Malone is probably the most underweighted player

In the history of the league Yeah man He's a monster He's incredible bro If you played today Jesus Christ 27 17 Good grief Next up

The Los Angeles Lakers Now this is weird So many good centers. The hardest one by far. Is it the hardest one by far? Yes, the three greatest centers of all time. I'll play for this franchise. But we clearly know, everybody who knows who the number one is.

It's Kareem. I thought you were going to say Shaq. We have Kareem like third. I agree. But last time we did the talented, you were fucking crucified me for not picking Shaq. He's more talented than Kareem. Kareem just knows how to get it done. I don't know if he's more talented than Kareem, but I agree.

Kareem is easily a third best player of all time. The longevity is insane. the championship's insane I don't know why he wouldn't pick cream yeah it's it's a debate for a second and when you really look into things and how he was able to get things done at such a level

the scoring the defense the whole nine is just impeccable yeah there's really no flaws in his resume or his game yeah he's the one it's Korean sorry Shack you lost twice damn next up the Miami Heat wow damn Shack he's on

I can't wait for that play for half the league yeah Jack you lose again Alonzo morning to be honest huh me yeah

could you be okay yeah he played there for like a year and a half like a little Bam out of bio

live give him five more years that's too much dip on that it's too much dip on the chip for Bam out of bio no we're going

Alonzo morning sorry Shaq yeah but Shaq is a chip there so does Alonzo was he on that team yeah oh I just have total brain fart

but he wasn't I think I think he was on that team total brain fire I didn't even realize that but he wasn't also that guy on the team listen for two years Chris Bosch played center so see that's the real name that I want Oh low key but

he's more reverend as a four Let's go Chris Bosch Let's go He's probably best team of all time Let's go we're going Chris Bosch Shout out we don't often get Chris Bosch love Shout out for talent at that point in time I think he definitely deserves to be in this conversation.

Chris Bosch, it is. No conversation needed. We miss you, Chris. Next up, the Atlanta Hawks. So there's the Cambay Matumbo. Shout out Tree Rollins. You're the man. And there's Al Horford.

Al Horford. Y'all see how down bad this franchise is? Realism speaking, I'm going to lean towards Al Horford. Over Matumbo? What has Mutumbo done for us? we went to we saw some of the greatest basketball we saw some of the greatest basketball Hawk history without Horford on a consistent basis

The greatest first round exit in Hawks history Is it still the greatest? I'm in Atlanta basketball We have to cling on to something Al Horford congratulations the greatest first time Why don't you have good basketball Tell me when you find out Your life sucks

Next up the Sacramento Kings does Blotty Blotty DeVock Give it a No The market's Give it a buggy For what

He had like three first team All NBA's because the league Was in shambles At the center position He was great though Those weren't like fraudulent at all Maybe not first team But still he was

How many does he actually have Before I say that Because it sounds like hilarious And B score 51 tonight By the way That's insane Just everyone's looking at you Go ahead

Look at him Anything to say about that? No, good for him. Okay, DeMargson says two all-N-Ba teams. Granted, he was winning them over D'Andre Jordan has his biggest competition in that time, but he has two. Those are Mickey Mouse selections.

Nah. But you know what, but his time seemed much more fun. Just even throughout the dysfunction, I'm going to give it to Boogie. I can't in all seriousness pick Vladay DeVocating conversation all time. Give me boogie. Yeah, for sure. The score and the passing bro,

he was legit a bully It's getting ridiculous It's getting ridiculous Let's get ridiculous Let's go The Minnesota Timberwolves Now this is interesting This is crazy

This is a great poll Is Rudy This franchise sucks Is it so bad Is it Rudy versus Cat Is it Rudy versus Niccolo Petrovich I think it's It has to be cat

Damn. Yeah, it definitely is. It has to be kept. Look at the numbers. Just sheer alone. Just look at the numbers. You know, I'm just going to change reality

and I'm just going to tell myself Kevin Garnett was a center so I can pick him over, Kat. The hate is unreal. I'm cool with that. I'm cool with that. Kevin Garnett, you are now a center and you're the greatest one of all time.

Cat, I do not support that statement. And that's all of them. Ladies and gentlemen, I think that's episode 68. That concludes the T-D through Christmas. Oh, wait. I lied. Nikil just informed me.

I forgot. We have a tier list to do, ladies and gentlemen. getting away from our bread and butter. I almost fucking destroyed the fans and just robbed him. Wow. Damn. All right, man.

We're going to do a small forwards tier list. We've been going position by position over the past couple months. And today, we have 10 small forwards view that we're going to put into this tier list. Nice and simple. First off, LeBron James. Estier.

He's the standard. Is he still the best in the league? Easy. No. But the best small for? I mean, according to the ranking, that we just did for me, no. It's tough, it's tough.

But he's S-tier. Okay, so how about the guys also running for that, Jason Tatum? Also S-tier as well. Also S-tier. You can debate which one you'd rather have today, but these are definitely the best two. Yes.

Along with this guy, Kevin Durant. Also S-tier? Easy media. Yeah. Yeah. Let's get all the S-tier's, let's set the standard, and then let's move forward. How about Brandon Ingram?

He's a solid, like, B or C. No, we can't be C. He's too talented for that. I think B's fair. He definitely can't be A, though. No, he's not A. He's not A at all. I think two levels below, below Tatum is fine. Yeah, yeah, B's cool.

Okay. Yeah. Mekyll Bridges. Probably see. I think he should be in B. After proving himself this year that he can still be the number one option on a team while playing great defense still, I think that lands in B. He's in the same tier.

Yeah, I don't know why you put Brandon in a tier above Bridges. I just think they're better. So, like, I can. I'm sure, you rank, which is hard. You change your mind? Yeah, a little bit. This man's not 10 toes. A little bit.

I'm going Bridges and B. M.O., I'll vote to you. Kick rocks. Next up. It's really just because everybody says I look like him. I'm trying to distance ourselves. Jimmy Butler. He's A.

Easy A. Yeah, he's an easy A. Fits nicely between these two calibers of players. Yeah, exactly. You already know. But playoff Jimmy, top of the S tier. He's easy. Of course.

He's just Michael Jordan. Next up Dylan Brooks He's having a good year Let's be honest with ourselves here He is He's a good player Y'all hate on him too much

C tier That's fair That's also fair Thank God He's not he's not a B player He's not a B tier Definitely Oh hell not

D tier was last year for sure With all those antics And he wasn't just He wasn't efficient at all Yeah we're talking likeability We can go F But one of the best Primitive Defenders in the league

Like ability I think he's an S now Relax People are starting They're starting They're like Dylan He's seen in Houston culture man See here

Next up Kauai Leonard He's an A Yeah let's just give him the respect He can get in Kagan Des? No Not yet No

Not yet Why not? Is he past his prime S is for top 10 Okay All the rest of those Three small forwards Are top 10

Kauai is not there Mm Kauai could be there though Easily By the end of the season He could be I mean maybe But we all had Kauai

outside of our top 15 too. He's not STU. Uncertainty for A is perfect. Just to say with all the what he's been through over the last year and a half, two years, still to be A is remarkable. Injuries. And he's a clipper.

Being a clipper in and of itself is turmoil. Yeah. It's not good. It's hard. He's been through terrible vibes. What a victim. Next up, O.G. and a Novi. He should be either B or C.

You, my friend, are Masai Ujuri in a country. costume. That man is C-tier as fuck. We need to stop pretending he's a star. Yes. You don't value the defense like that? Not enough over McHale Bridges, who's also extremely good offensively. This guy's C-tier. He's mid. He's a high C-tier, though.

Maasai has tricked you by demanding five-first-on picks for him. He is C-tier. He's a great player, man. He's very good. Not an all-star. He's just, listen. I think he's low-tier B. No, he's Dylan Brooks across the border. Oh, God. That's crazy. I'm good than that.

I don't see him being in... If you put him on his own team, he would not be an all-star. Oh, absolutely no. You put him on his own team as one option. You see Detroit Pistons v2. Detroit Pissons v2. Last up, Andrew Wiggins. Hey, listen.

This year, F. This year it's an F. Normally, he should be a D though. Let's go D. That man lost all his powers last year. I don't know what happened to him. He forgot how to have a love for the game or what's something because he goes out there and just runs around.

Checks were not hitting. How to pass, shoot, dribble, rebound, steal the. ball communicate everything he did well in 2022 make him bad at that and that's a new player you got not great yeah that's a tear list a real quick one i think this is good this is a fantastic place to end the episode wonderful merry christmas to everybody if you're still here comments nickle is still daddy and you know you guys thought we're giving away through ps fives go to the Twitter, leave a reply, follow us. I want to give you a PS5. Let me help you and give you this console. You can play with us. It's literally now or never. You might be the biggest back

bumbler of all time if you don't do this. Listen, tap in, all right? Crowneaters, rejoice on Twitter. And we'll see y'all later.