The Delta Flyers - Invasive Procedures

Episode Date: May 21, 2024

The Delta Flyers is hosted by Garrett Wang, Robert Duncan McNeill, Terry Farrell & Armin Shimerman. In each podcast release, they will recap and discuss an episode of Star Trek: Deep Space Nine. This week’s episode, Invasive Procedures, is hosted by Garrett Wang, Robert Duncan McNeill, Terry Farrell, and Armin Shimerman. Invasive Procedures: A seemingly timid Trill arrives on the station and takes the crew hostage, demanding to be joined to the Dax symbiont.We want to thank everyone who makes this podcast possible, starting with our Production Managers Megan Elise & Rebecca McNeill.Additionally, we could not make this podcast available without our Executive Producers:Stephanie Baker, Jason M Okun, Marie Burgoyne, Kris Hansen, Chris Knapp, Janet K Harlow, Heidi Mclellan, Rich Gross, Mary Jac Greer, Mike Gu, Tara Polen, Tom Paynter, AJC, Nicholaus Russell, Lisa Robinson, Alex Mednis, Holly Schmitt, James H. Morrow, Nicole Anne Toma, Roxane Ray, Andrew Duncan, David Buck, Ian Ramsey, Feroza Mehta, Jonathan Brooks, Gemma Laidler, Rob Traverse, Matt Norris, Stephanie Lee, Izzy Jaffer, Jan Hanford, Sam Mikelic, & Thomas IrvinOur Co-Executive Producers:Liz Scott, Sab Ewell, Sarah A Gubbins, Luz R., Dannielle Kaminski, Utopia Science Fiction Magazine, Courtney Lucas, Elaine Ferguson, Captain Jeremiah Brown, E & John, Deike Hoffmann, Anna Post, Shannyn Bourke, Jenna Appleton, Lee Lisle, Sarah Thompson, Holly Smith, Amy Tudor, Mark G Hamilton, KMB, Dominic Burgess, Mary Burch, Sandra Stengel, Normandy Madden, Joseph Michael Kuhlman, Darryl Cheng, Elizabeth Stanton, Kayla Knilans, Tim Beach, Victor Ling, Shambhavi Kadam, Tae Phoenix, Donna Runyon, Nicholas Albano, Daniel O’Brien, Danie Crofoot, Steven Lugo, Penny Liu, David Smith, Lisa Hill, Stacy Davis, Lena Pfitzmeier, & Timothy McMichensAnd our Producers:Philipp Havrilla, James Amey, Patrick Carlin, Eve England, Ann Harding,Trip Lives, Samantha Weddle, Chloe E, Paul Johnston, Carole Patterson, Warren Stine, Carol Murphy, Jocelyn Pina, Mike Fillmon, Chad Awkerman, Mike Schaible, AJ Provance, Captain Nancy Stout, Claire Deans, Maxine Soloway, Barbara Beck, Brianna Kloss, Dat Cao, Stephen Riegner, Debra Defelice, Vikki Williams, Cindy Ring, Alicia Kulp, Kelly Brown, Jason Wang, Gabriel Dominic Girgis, Rob Johnson, Maria Rosell, Heather Choe, Michael Bucklin, Lisa Klink, Dominique Weidle, Justin Weir, Jesse Bailey, Mike Chow, Kevin Hooker, Matt Edmonds, Miki T, John Richardson, Heather Selig, Rachel Shapiro, Clark Ochikubo, Stephanie Aves, Seth Carlson, Amy Rambacher, Jessica B, E.G. Galano, Tim Neumark, Will Forg, Jeremy Gaskin, Ryan Tomei-Sigurðarson, Charlie Faulkner, Estelle Keller, Carmen Puente-Garza, James Lyszczek, Russell Nemhauser, Lawrence Green, Greg Kenzo Wickstrom, Lisa Gunn, Lauren Rivers, Jennifer B, Dean Chew, Linda Daireaux, Mars DeVore, Jennifer Vaughn, Walkerius Logos, PJ Pick, Preston Meyer, Rebecca Leary, Ryan Mahieu, Andrew Cook-Feltz, Karen Galleski, Constance, Loretta Reyes, Francesca Garibaldi, Willow Whitcomb, Jadzia Mehari, & MoThank you for your support!“Our creations are protected by copyright, trademark, and trade secret laws. Some examples of our creations are the text we use, artwork we create, audio, and video we produce and post. You may not use, reproduce, or distribute our creations unless we give you permission. If you have any questions, you can email us at [e-mail] Sponsors:* Check out Mint Mobile: https://mintmobile.com/TDFSupport this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/the-delta-flyers/donationsAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brandsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

Welcome to the Delta Flyers Journey Through the Wormhole with Quark, Dax, and their good friends, Tom and Harry. Join us as we journey through the episodes of Star Trek Deep Space Nine. Your hosts along this journey are Terry Farrell, our enchanting science officers, so say the boy. Amman Shimmerman, our beloved entrepreneur, and local bad boy, Garrett Wong, our forever, and, of course, your favorite helmsman, Robert Duncan McNeil. And today we have both myself, Terry Farrell, I do know my name, and Armand Shimmerman. I know my name also. Yay.

Right on. Welcome, everybody. Thanks, Terry. Great to be here with both of you. What a special treat. Yes. This is really. It's a good episode.

It's a special episode. Thank you for being here with me, Armand. My pleasure. And I feel like I owe you a phone call because I got your email. You know, Terry, I wouldn't worry about it because I don't remember this. Oh, good. Yay. I love that you don't remember things, Armand, because I have the worst memory of anyone I know.

Yeah, well, you're not as old as I am. I'm losing a lot more gray cells than you are. so. Are you guys taking Prevagen? No. No, should be? Are we going to do an ad right now? Is this an ad? Seriously. Well, if you're having memory problems. Well, I do have many lifetimes to remember. So, I recommend, I am taking Previgin, and I've been taking it for a few months now. I don't think it means that I don't forget things, but I feel, I do feel a little less scattered. And, you know, for me, you can, you guys know me for me that's huge you also do yoga though don't you you do like yoga and meditation and things yeah but i'm not a yogi i mean i do yoga that's got to be good for your like

calm mind do you find that that helps or yeah and i have a technical question miss feral how many weeks ahead of time before you felt the results i think it was about a month i don't know that i i think it was sort of um i felt less brain fog i felt clear great because I've often thought that I should take that before I do a play so I don't forget the lines yeah I have thought that myself yeah and honestly even reading that I didn't have a hiccup in it like I would normally have a little more I think some anxiety around it and I think that might be the brain fog and when you feel clear-headed you don't feel as much anxiety I think at least for me thank you I will I will take you up there yeah yeah I like all right

Right. And just so everybody out there knows, that was not an ad for privages. It's not. It would be great if they gave us money for the show. If it was an ad, we would have had to put the disclaimer as side effects include constipation, diarrhea, and they just like go through the whole thing. All right. Now it's time to say happy birthday to everyone that happens to have a birthday around this time. So first of all, I want to say happy birthday to Rob Traverse, May 23rd. Happy birthday, Rob. Happy birthday, Rob. Happy birthday, Rob. Happy birthday, Rob. Also, we've got E.G. Galano on May 23rd, same day as Rob. So, E.G., happy, happy birthday.

Happy birthday, E.G. Happy birthday. You're not getting any younger. Happy birthday. And rounding it all up, happy birthday, Sarah Thompson, May 25th. Happy birthday, Sarah. Happy birthday, Sarah. Happy birthday, Sarah. She may be getting younger.

Sarah may be getting younger. You never know. Okay. I know I'm not. In a mirror universe. I think you might be, Armid. I might be kidding. I'm forgetting a lot more, but I'm not getting any younger.

Okay, so we've watched the episode. We've all seen it. Before we get into it, we're going to start with our poetry synopsis because this is a creative podcast. We like to stay creative. So my limerick for this episode goes something like this. When the station is taken over, it's a shock. Jad Zia's life with her symbiont is interlocked. Hork plays his injury all the way, which lets Odo save the day.

And that cling on sure looks a lot like Tuvok. Is that why he looked familiar? That was too much. Seriously, I was like, I'd feel like I know that stuff. I did not. I did not. I'm not like, he looks so familiar. He makes a great cling on. He was good, right? He really was. He was a badass. Yeah. And so different than two. Very different. Very different. Very different. And way different than him. Yes. Yes. She's way different. Polar opposite.

And a different pronunciation of Terry's character's name, Robbie, a little bit different emphasis. Jedzia? I don't know. You said it different than that when you were reading it. It came off. Zia. It's part of the limerick. Life is you were trying to keep it in the rhythm. Yeah, the limerick has a music. It's a media. It's a media.

You have to respect the meter. Thank you. You do. Meter respect. Okay. Win and Rome. Yes. Here's my haiku for invasive procedures.

Symbient heist on. Klingon, Tim, so fun to watch. Cisco talks some sense. Nice. Thank you very much. I'm glad we both. We both got. Tim Russ in the we did we squeezed Tim and you both really hit high notes and I'm super

praising you because I'm trying to make up for the fact that I didn't do it because I was poetry is hard and Terry you have hit home runs so many have thank you thank you I really have my uh Betty is my excuse okay okay okay Betty you is your new dog yes mm-hmm you want to see a picture what greed is your new dog we didn't tell talk about this in our little this is important chat before we got going. Well, where is her cute? While you're looking for the picture,

I will do my little. Yes, Armand, you need to do some etymology. Oh, there's the picture. Oh, my gosh. Isn't she cute? Look at those gray eyes. Betty has beautiful, like blue-gray eyes and.

Oh, they're like ice blue. Ice blue. In person, it looks like she could shoot like lasers out of her eyes. Is she part Husky? Is that where the eyes are coming from? I don't know. I'm going to get one of those DNA tests because I think that would be fun.

Like a dog, 23 and me kind of a thing? Exactly. Exactly. Her mom is a pit mix. Oh. She looked like a, her body looked more like a Rhodesian Ridgeback. Okay. Without the ridge.

Okay. Copper, thin. And she wasn't like big pity looking. She was very narrow pity. looking okay where did you find her but she looks nothing like all of her puppies didn't look oh how about this i'm doing yard work right in the backyard i'm digging out this root ball to i it's going to take me to the next century but i go in to get some oil for my chainsaw i have a little lady one a little wait wait wait wait Terry feral with a chainsaw that's a picture i know i'm sorry it's blue it's only that big

and it's blue. Okay. It's really like, yeah. Go ahead. No, no. I want you to take a picture of that so that I. Yes, we all want to see a picture of Terry Farrell with the chancel. I'll show you in action.

I'm terrifying. Didn't you love Armin the Ease with which she said, well, I went back in to get some oil for my chainsaw? As if that's what she does all the time. Okay. I want to hear Terry story. I had a really big chainsaw for my first house, but this is my last. house and this is an itty-bitty one and it's electric so I'm not worried but it does need oil anyway the point is there's like it's within this little mini mall in my

neighborhood let I mean tiny mini mall hardware store yeah yeah there's a hardware store there's a grocery store there's of course it's a place called blazed where you buy or you could if you wanted to buy THC if you if it's so like inspired you and And I hurt dogs as I'm buying this chainsaw oil. And I have been stopping at little puppy pop-ups, dog and puppy pop-ups. And none of them, like, it just, you know, they were like, me about me. And I'm like, I'm not getting a dog that's me about me.

Right. So I see her. She's all by herself. She's the only puppy. And she's curled in a little ball. And so I can't see what she looks like. But I'm thinking, oh, she looks so sweet. and I asked to get in the cage.

I got in the cage. I sat down. And then she just lifted her head up and opened her eyes. And I went, oh, my God, look at those eyes. And then she, like, lit up. And she jumped up and licked my face. And like I was a five-year-old. She was so happy to see me.

And then I got all choked up. And I'm like, this woman is saying to me, I know, right, in tandem, there's someone who really wants her that wants to take her to Colorado tonight. I said, oh, no, I'm having her. she's mine she's mine her name is betty she said well actually her name is jan and i'm like she's not a jan no she's not and i have a chainsaw and if you want to keep arguing with me i have oil she's actually kind of a veronica but betty is way easier to yell out betty betty that is great too long wow congratulations yes thank you and lucky betty

to my very long story. Lucky Betty. Send me that picture. I want that picture. I will. That's a great picture. I will. Armin, give us some etymology on this episode.

Okay. Yes. Going from the lovely to the pedantic. So there are two words here of interest. This one, of course, is invasive. Invasive from the French invasive or invadere. It means of or pertaining to or the nature of. invasion or attack offensive first used the word was first used in 1520 it also has a definition of

tending to intrude upon the domain or to infringe on the rights of another really appropriate for this episode very appropriate personal autonomy right exactly body yeah and the second word is procedure from the french uh procedur or also pronounced procedure from the French procedure or procedure, the fact or manner of proceeding with any action or in any circumstance or situation. A system of proceeding. Conduct behavior. Those are the two definitions for today's episode. That's a, it's interesting how with both words there are French derivatives. Yeah, yeah. Multiple definitions within that that actually apply to the entire story. So this episode was written.

The story is by John Welpley, and the teleplay is by John Welkley again, and Robert Hewitt Wolf. I love Robert Hewitt Wolf. I haven't met John, but great job, both of them. Yes, yes. We also have the director, a director that we all love, Les Landau. So I'm really excited. My director crush. Yeah.

Such a cutie, he was. He was great. And if I was of that affiliate, you know, if I was oriented that way, I would have a crush on him too, I'm sure. Yeah, why not? He was still in style. You can, you can. Well, he's the only director that I called Uncle Les, that I threw Uncle on top of. He was family to you.

Yeah, he was. Oh, that's nice. Uncle, Uncle Rick for Rick Colby. It was just Rick. And then you guys go. The Baron. The Baron. The Baron. Oh, that's why.

Yeah. Barron. I liked Rick Colby. guest stars let's landau i had a crush on he well that's cute he was cute freaking cute and he dressed great and yeah that's why it's very cool he had a sense of cool yes he was a cool he was cool and he was happy to be there he was very happy to be yeah yeah you could feel that it was palpable all right it wasn't just a check no guest stars the very talented john glover Megan Gallagher

Tim Russ and Steve Rankin All friends of mine All close, not close friends but good friends in me Oh John Glover's a fantastic theater actor Good but not close Because I haven't seen them necessarily for a long time

But when I do see them We are very close So like you are a good friend of mine Terry Because I see you on a regular basis But for instance I haven't seen John Glover for a number of years and we used to be uh we used to come contact quite a bit right this episode but i haven't seen him so he's no longer a close friend he's an acquaintance he's a good

wow yeah he's a talented oh ed and give you a definition of what both of those i think of you as a good close friend arman as you should as i and i've always felt that way even if i don't talk to you for a while i think of you as a symbient terry i get under your skin it's how close we are good. That's very good. Thank you. I definitely am trying to work on Garrett here. Yes. Who else? Okay. Junklover, Gallagher, fabulous theater actors. Tim Russ comes out of the theater. I mean, it was a really strong theatrical. And Steve Rankin is the danger of the theater world. What? Is he really? Steve Rankin is one of the number one combat directors in the theater. It's done lots of other shows.

My goodness. He is extraordinary. He's a very good actor, but he is famous for being the fight choir. Well, there were some good fights in this episode, by the way. What character did he play? The other clangon. The other cling on. The other thing. You attacked? When you attacked. Yes. Yetto. No, no, that's Tim Russ. No, I got on the back of Tim

Russ. Yetto. So the other Klingon that was in Sick Bay the entire time. A lot of The one that I sort of fooled into getting, yes, yes. That's who I meant. Yeah. Oh, I think Arment, it does need some of that crepegen. Thank you, Terry. Exterior space shot of DS9 in the middle of a plasma storm.

We never see that. That's very rare. And there was a blue hue to it that I loved. I love the view who that pew that they put around the station. Usually it's black, very black, and like what you see behind me. But this had this blue hue to it that I just thought, oh, that's really good. Yes. Is it like what was behind, what's behind Garrett?

Kind of, that kind of blue. You got that blue too, Terry, up in the corner of yours, a little bit of blue. Yeah, I like the blue too. I like pink. I've got pink behind me. You do have pink. You look good in pink. Thank you.

Cisco gives a station log talking about how DS9 has been evacuated because of the plasma disruption, and they only have like a skeleton crew just to keep it running. Question about that log. Yeah, I have a question. You guys did a three. part, very expensive three-parter. And when I heard the station log, I immediately thought, oh, they are saving money after the three-parter. Do you remember any of that?

It could be. I mean, first of all. It looked like it to me, too. And I watched them in tandem, like the last couple of days. I watched all four episodes, like right away. So back-to-back, and that's exactly what it looked like. It is because they had such heavy hitters. They had Franklin Jellas Lachman. Where's that coming from? Franklin Jella. Louise Fletcher. I got to take two previgin today.

You need two Previgin, is what I'm going to say. Yes. Yeah, Louise Fletcher, who's you're going to say? Louise Fletcher, Philip Englm. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. A lot.

Lots of extras. Richard Bamer. Richard Bamer. Richard Bemer, who I did paper dolls with my very first job. Oh. Tons of extras. extras in that three-parter, location filming, big, big money. And I heard this, I heard this station log, and I was like, oh, they're going to get rid

of extras, they're going to get rid of, they're going to stay in the, it's a bottle show. It's more than a bottle show. It's like a bottle show with just the regulars and a couple of guests are. And not all the regulars. And not even all the regulars. Because Sir Rock's not there. No. So they saved a lot of money on this one, for sure.

Yeah, we didn't go into Quarks. Yep. You know, first time we see you, you're in the, in the... Right, right. We don't go into quotes, yeah. Well, it's also, it's also interesting because they... Yeah, I'm in the airlock, in the airlock. Yeah, yeah.

What's also interesting is that they saved money on visual effects because they only show Odo going in but not coming out later of that little out of container. We go to ops first, and my first thought was, how many hairdos does Kira have? As many as Janeway? Because I feel like this season... You think that's a... new hair episode i feel like it's a little different color it's a little the colors yeah the color i mean it's not as dramatic as cape mulgru's changes but did she change her hair to cure change her hair

through the series in subtle ways yeah yes yes of course yeah yeah it seemed it seemed to me like she had a lot of so did i for that matter i changed my hair all the time and you change her hair for the podcast as well which i appreciate it anyway uh cisco's checking with kieran dacks they're locking down the station because of that big storm outside. So that's basically what we find out here. I want to talk about that big storm. Excuse me. Sure. Yeah, please. So they evacuate the station. They get rid of everybody because of this plasma storm. Plasma storm. Can I ask you, how did the plasma storm affect the station during the course of this episode? I don't think we'd come back to it. No. But it evacuated everybody. It was really dangerous. That's why everybody had to leave.

And you know what's really weird watching them all back to back? It really felt like we were still in the last conflict. It didn't feel like Plasma Storm went in and out of my head and what it really felt like when we come to you in a second. It's like they talk about your brother. It's too close to the heels of the last. Of the same plot points. Yes.

It was evacuating, Robbie. So I was confused. I was like, oh, I don't remember this. I guess we're still worried about the Kardashians. I just thought, I thought we figured that out. And I'm sorry, I didn't watch this episode more than once. But I agree with you. I had the same thought.

It felt a little familiar, like some of the beats. You know, we're evacuating the ship. We just did that in the three-parter. It's really dangerous. You know, Corks left behind because he didn't want to give up his platinum. Right. He did that in the previous episode. So it was confusing.

Yeah. I know that Cisco calls Miles to see how things are going. says he sealed all these airlocks he's going to check the outer bulk heads maybe armin they had to seal everything because if this plasma came in in any way it could destroy the systems or it could i don't know that's what i thought it almost felt like yeah i don't i'm afraid that doesn't hold up but okay i'll accept it for now now i'm with you i'm just trying to find any reason it's outer space you can't let anything in any time. That's true. You can't let it in any way. Okay. Yeah. And they should have had like, you know, rocking and rolling. Rocking and rolling in the middle of that. Throughout the

storm is tossing the thing. Throughout the entire episode. Although the very first line from Kira in the very first scene in ops when Siska asked Kira how things are holding up, she says, boy, the Kardashians really built this station to last. So that line sort of is the cheat. It's sort of like, hey, it's so sturdy, even the plasma storm is doing nothing to it in a way. And why did we have to evacuate? I know, you're right. Hundreds of people. Because they had to pay Frank Langella. So

Miles and Odo are working on these bulkheads, and they head down a corridor when Odo hears something behind a bulkhead, and the door opens, and there's Quark, meditating or praying or something. Do you remember

that, Armin? I do. I do indeed. It's the first time I ever did this. so you did that show you created that prayer position yeah for me it was a prayer yeah and and in future episodes when on the rare occasions when quark does pray usually when his life's in danger um it's always this that's great well done well done and it that feels different than anything i've seen other species do or that felt unique it felt yeah thank you that was great and then this was taken by kira by nana in a prior episode so he couldn't yeah she was meditating with the hands up like something religion is a part of the of our show religion is there and so

we have to accept it and we have to deal with it as an actor i felt responsible to do something for the flamakey it looked good it looked great it really did well otto finds him in that position otto basically gives quirk a bunch of crap about not wanting to evacuate with the others uh because he wouldn't leave his latinum which we talked about kind of was what happened in the in the in the three-parter. Quark says that he's very upset about it, that his brother left, and Odo just doesn't buy it. And neither is O'Brien. It's a great arc for Cullum because he doesn't buy it, and at the end of the scene, he does buy it. He doesn't necessarily buy that, but he buys my explanation. Well, I think he got touched by you making him think about his brother. That doesn't

mean that he thinks that you feel that way about rom okay terry you're absolutely right but but he's open i i felt what i felt what i felt i i felt what i'm that he's open to wait maybe maybe it's possible yes i mean the ethos of of a ferengi society is you can love your brother but you can also take advantage of him that's perfectly okay in in ferengi uh ethos isn't it a rule of acquisition as well something think about probably yeah that sounds like most families i know you can love them yeah if you're taking advantage of them so it sounds very american actually yeah it does capitalism as quark leaves and they all leave the camera pans over we see some kind of device hidden inside the door so it looked like a bomb to me yeah me too that's what i thought was

it looked like one of the pads i used for to have people pay me at the bars would looked like to me oh did it really yeah all it looked like really what it looked like you did something bad i did something bad is going to happen because of you yes exactly and i'm not proud of it yeah devious he's not even sneaky uh we go back to another space shot of of the station and the storm armand's favorite color uh the blue storm and uh we're back in ops the storm's getting stronger Dax is very excited to study it. Kira's not very excited, which I thought was a great exchange.

Bashir arrives. He's excited, too. The science officers are excited. The science officers. Yeah, yeah. Kira's like, oh, great. It's like a total eclipse. Yeah.

Yes. Yes. It's like Tim Ross with the total eclipse that just happened recently. Tim flew across the country to go see this thing. He did? Yeah, he's so into. Oh, he takes his camera everywhere, not his camera, his telescope, so that he can see the stars, yeah.

Oh, they should come to my house. Oh, yeah, they should. And New Mexico was a great spot. Oh, my gosh, yeah. Well, Bashir arrives. He's excited about the view from the promenade, and he's got it all to himself because there's no extras on this episode. Dax gets a distress call that there's a cargo ship caught in the same. storm. Cisco says, tractor them in, calls O'Brien, and says, you know, prepare for the shuttle

to be tractored in or the ship to be tractored in. So Miles says he's going to release the emergency seal to let them dock. That's where I was kind of putting together quark. Whatever he did is connected to this conveniently needing to dock ship. Yeah. I think that's what everybody wants you to think. Yes. Yes. Well, it worked. It worked. Do you remember when Les Landau, how did you enjoy working with Les? I was thinking about these ops scenes like this one that we just did. I enjoyed it very much. visually, he was fun to look at. I liked. I just, we're learning a lot. I'm telling you, I had a crush on him. I loved it when he came. It was like he just, I liked, he just, I liked how he directed, too.

It's not quite as flip as Franks would be, but also just really straightforward, and we can all do this together, and we're a team, and nothing's that hard, nothing's worth getting that upset about. Everything was very easy about working with him. Yeah.

Do you know about Les Landau's father? Yes. I'm glad you said that. Armand, tell us about. No, no, no, you tell. I don't know if I'm going to get it right, so correct me. Yes.

But his father was a very famous, and successful producer and director. Yes. Who did a lot of theater to television and theater to film transitions. So he took these very highbrow plays and things that were big hits in New York and turned them into TV movies or specials.

Yeah. Wow. They are, thank God that he did that. He saved some performances that you will never see because they were theater and they disappeared. There's no camera. Right. So he didn't.

necessarily shoot the production. That's not what he did. It isn't kind of restaged it or something. He restaged it. He made it into a film. It looks like a film, but it is the performances that those actors gave on stage. Or if they didn't give it on stage, we had very major actors performing major roles from the theater. And just an extraordinary collection of theater, film as theater or theater as film. So that explains some of his calm as he's been around in his whole life. Exactly. Exactly. There's no, I'm trying to get somewhere. No, he was very comfortable in that environment. He's comfortable with Star Trek actors who tend to be a lot of theater actors as well. I think he was very comfortable in that form. I'm one of the very few who didn't have that experience, right? I mean, most of the cast has theater background. A lot of your cast, I think, had, yeah, absolutely. And yours too, right? I think so, yeah. Yeah, our cast had a lot of theater. Star Trek traditionally, I think, has always had a strong. Yeah.

Not so much that, that, but also a larger than life. So there's a larger than life quality that a lot of the actors have, and you get that in the theater. Yeah. Yeah. Although Ethan Phillips came up to me, I think, season four, and he says, Oh, I love him too. He goes, you should try theater one of these days.

And I was kind of offended. I was like, I did theater. You just were doing a play when we started our pilot. Are you serious? Oh, no. Yeah, I was just like, oh. Oh, no. But he apologized.

He was like, oh, I'm sorry. I didn't realize that. I was like, yes, I have a lot of theater in my background. Ethan and Kitty and I did Hamlet together. Oh, wow. Where did you do it? How's Ethan? Oh, we could talk later.

We did it in Los Angeles. Oh, nice. He was Polonius. I was Claudius. Kitty was Gertrude. Nice. And let me ask you about that production, Armin. My guess with Ethan is that he, once the show is up and running,

he tends to play a bit trying to crack people up or play little jokes. Do you remember any of that? Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Oh, my word. In the last performance, Bologius dies, and the audience, Pallonius dies, and the audience can't see him.

he's behind a rug and heiress and uh but the actors can we can see it yeah so he flashed us the last performance he just dropped his crown and just flashed us while oh great yes yeah exactly he did a lot he did i would think so to bring it back into this episode speaking of making people laugh that is something that less also had a talent with like he could he could really put you at ease and come up with a joke or a funny comment and truly he was probably one of the most real laxed directors I've ever worked with. I never saw him. Confident.

He never got anxious. He never, you never saw anything. And he doesn't, I don't even think he has an anxious bone in his body. He's completely like, okay, no problem. Very intelligent man too. Yeah, yeah, well educated. And good to look at. And really good to look at.

And visually appealing, yes. Visually appealing. Did I say visually appealing? I don't know. You said visually something, but yeah, I may have added that. Oh, this is going to be the runner for this whole podcast. We need to get Les Landau on this podcast with Terry as well, where she says, Les, you are visually appealing.

Oh, stop. Yeah, I was trying to sound a little too. All right, back to our story. So the airlock, so the ship lands, the airlock opens, and out comes Tim Russ. I did not look at the cast before. So I recognize his voice immediately. I was so surprised and blown away. Anyway, Tim comes out as a Klingon.

Miles Noto are sort of captured by two Klingons, a trill, and a female alien. What was the species of the female alien? Do you know? I had no idea. I couldn't place it either. But it is interesting, and I thought that was good directing and good writing. It appears that Tim is in charge. Yes, it does in the beginning when he comes out because he's so aggressive.

He really is. He even kind of, sorry, he barked orders at Varad, too, in the beginning, right? Well, yeah. And, oh, that's okay. And Collin says, you're a trill. But we never find, I was waiting for them to say, and you're a blah, blah, blah. Yeah. Because I'm like, who is she?

Who is she? She's the one alien. I had no idea. Well, I'll just all we know is. Generic alien number three or something. Or cinnamon bun hair alien, is what I would say. It was a good hairdo. on her. Well, she's a beautiful woman.

Absolutely. So they come out. They basically capture O'Brien and Odo. And then I think O'Brien reminds them that there's an alliance, reminds Tim Russ, that there's an alliance with the Klingons. And Takar thinks Tim Russ, who's playing Takar, thinks that they're fools to align with Starfleet. So clearly he's not, doesn't want to be a part of that. In Deep Space Nine, he doesn't want to be a part of that. In Voyager, he has a different opinion. Exactly.

Exactly. Flip floppy. Anyway, they force Odo to transform into the goo and go inside this holding box, which we see that whole transformation, like a waterfall. That was kind of cool. I do like Tim's line when he's leaving.

When they go out of frame, he says, let's go, ally, because earlier he says, that was funny. Yeah, I like that too. Yeah, and then we go in the infirmary next. the bad guys are bringing in the hostages into the infirmary and they run into Bashir, and they force Bashir to put Odo's box into a stasis chamber, which I didn't know there were stasis chambers in that medical bay.

Well, had they used those before? Isn't that like just the morgue thing? It might be that episode was the first time. That's the first time I remember. It looks more like a morgue. That's what I said. Like a little morgue thing.

Oh, I'm sorry. It didn't hear you. That's okay. now if you look at that box and you look at the stasis chamber there were no holes in the box any so are we to assume that shapeshifters do not breathe or was there some electronic thing within the box i didn't see any holes it may maybe electronic thing but i didn't see any holes you know like it was an air conditioner or something inside the little box yeah it's possible thank you you're right You're right. If he needed air to breathe, there would have to be some kind of ventilation

path. And if there was a ventilation path, maybe that could have been an escape path for sure. But in order to not have the escape path, they cut off the ventilation path. So I went, so does that mean shape shifters don't breathe? Don't breathe air? Because there was no air coming into it. Unless there was some mechanism that, and Terry's right, that I just wasn't aware of. yeah but if there was a mechanism they should have informed you they should have informed you they should have informed me and you should know about this because you knew how to we'll get there later but yes we'll get he's totally enclosed in that little box so why even put him in a stasis chamber it's not really needed but then in a prior episode when the the three-parter when we see the

pejoran army that shows up the assault force one of the things that odo does is he just he just comes out of a bulkhead. It's like he passed through solid metal. So I'm wondering, like, why didn't he just pass right through the box in a way? Clearly, there's some... I'm going to play Terry Farrell here. So it's possible that the bulkhead was Odoom. Oh, thank you. Okay, thank you. Thank you, Terry. He clustered himself up against the structure of the ball head. Yeah, yes. Yeah, true. That makes sense. Okay.

That doesn't make sense. All right. I withdraw my comment. and I was still my comment withdrawn comment withdrawn I will just remain ridiculous that's what I'm going to do I'm going to be ridiculous we will not withdraw the comment that Les Landau is visually appealing visually appealing we will not withdraw that comment clearly make sure Rebecca but what's even better beyond him being cute is that he's smart and funny yeah smart funny kind he's a good dresser he had it all he had it all he had it all he had style he had a nice car it was not it was great yeah i don't know what he drove anything else you want to say about les land don't he was the only he's the only director that was allowed to park like next to the set i didn't see anyone in their car next he drove right up to the it was like right by the side i was like wow that's nice it was in his father's contract yes yes exactly i got to do that on becker and then until everybody else said i want to do what terry's doing because i had next to Ted, and then everybody, so then it was like, nobody but Ted gets to now.

And I'm like, why'd y'all start complaining? I know. Took away your rights. Exactly. It was a long walk. Did you have to park in the tank, Terry? Yeah. That's a long walk for you to backer.

It was. But I was in really great shape then, so really no sweat. All right. So now we go back to ops, and they can't find Miles and Odo. They can't find their combat signals. The bad guys come in led by Tim Russ. Guns are drawn. They tell the whole crew in ops, move into the center of the room.

I think Tim fires his weapon. He does. At the ceiling or something. He does. Which lets the plasma storm in, by the way. Yes, it would. It should. That would have been exciting.

Wouldn't it have? That's your missing scene. Beautiful blue, swirly plasma stuff coming in. They all step into the center of the room, our heroes. The bad guys go to controls. O'Brien blames himself. and he blames quark suspicious of quark

in the scene I'm like we're curious Armin no no Armin would never do any of those things Armin wouldn't and I'm not happy that Quark did this I'm not quite sure why he did it I'll talk about that later

the story doesn't require this except to turn off the security there's no reason why quark should have done that I mean there's no one on the station what what security what what turn off the security protocols yeah oh you probably make the made plan before the storm got there uh see here she is again there she is well she learned it all from less lando um armin yeah why couldn't i i could see quark making this deal and maybe the original deal was you'll come get this stuff i'll let you doc and then you'll take right off if if they had tricked quark

somehow and they did i got the feeling that they did yeah i got the feeling they did a little bit but yeah it was it didn't reflect well on quark how how much um you know how risky the deal he made was if he had made a very small risky deal but then it backfired you know and why turn off the security protocols quark why could have quark turn off even if they made the deal before here yeah obviously there's no one on the station anymore, except for Odo and the crew, but as far as security goes, only just Odom. So Quark must know that. So why go through that? Why do that? There's nobody there to turn these controls off except to help the plot line. It just, I went,

it just doesn't make sense. And furthermore, I'm not happy that my character. agreed to that. So not that I, God knows there's a lot of things that my character did that I'm happy about. But, but this just, this was, as, as Kira

says later in the episode, you've gone too far. And I thought, yeah, you're right. He's going too far. But then I think your character moves to redeem himself, really, truly. Yeah. Well, they take over the controls.

O'Brien blames himself. He blames Quirk. This pisses Kira off. She basically says she's going to F up Cork when this is all over. She's mad. And I thought, oh, boy, because she already threw him across the bar. Yeah, exactly.

And she wasn't even this mad. She's going to really. She scared me. She scared me in this scene for Quark's sake. There's so much love going to Quark in this show. So much love. Then Dax recognizes maybe at the end of this, recognizes the trill. There's like a moment where she's looking.

Do you remember this moment at all, Terry? Trying to place him or... And I would disagree with you, Robbie. I don't think she does recognize him. She says she doesn't know. I don't recognize him. I think I'm trying to recognize him. Yes, you're trying to.

I'm searching my memory. Okay. That's what was going on. Do I know him? I don't... Because Cisco actually asks me. Yes. And...

You know him. Yeah, she says that. But it must be fascinating that, first of all, he's a... How often do we see trills on the show? Like, never. So... Yeah. Well, it's...

It's also like when you meet somebody and you tell them you're from, you know, you're from Los Angeles and they go, oh, do you know Bob, blah, blah, blah from L.A. And you're like, uh, no. I mean, so for him to ask you, do you know this trill from, you know, all the trills that are in existence from your planet? You must know him. I mean, yeah, it was kind of. Or they say that about California and you're like, do you know how big California is? Seriously. Like almost the whole West Coast. Exactly. Hey, Garrett, have you been traveling this summer? Oh my gosh, so much already. I don't always travel, but this summer's been insane. Trip after trip. You've been doing your impersonation of me. Yes.

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Yes. Steve Rankin comes in, enters Quarks. And clearly he had a deal with Quark to help him this deal that we were talking about. Quark has this liquid data chain case. But Quark says, I don't see any latinum. And then the Klingon grabs Quark and points the gun right in his face. I loved you. Look at the gun, the button of the scene. I thought, you were very funny in this whole episode, as usual, Armin.

But I laughed out loud a number of times. This was one of them. Oh, thank you. Thank you. Yeah. It's great. Steve called you stupid a lot in this scene. He called Cork stupid.

Stupid, Frankie. You're so stupid. Ferengi look alike. He thought I was wrong. That's what it was. Oh, no, you're better looking than ROM. So that you know it's too well. But most people, when they encountered Frankie, they all look alike.

Okay. But Armand, how was it working with Steve, your buddy? I mean, you've known. Yeah. Yeah, this was, I used to play tennis with Steve. Yeah. So, yeah, it was great. All these people were friends of mine.

So this was good. Actually, not Megan. Megan became a friend more afterwards. Okay. Okay. So next we go to ops, quark is brought into ops. He pretends to be innocent, doesn't know what's going on or what they're talking about. Cisco wants to know what these guys want.

They still haven't told them what they want. And the Klingon says, Tim Russ says, well, ask my employer, points over to the trill. Right. And that's a surprise. Yes, it was. Yes. Yeah. Because I thought, well, if it isn't Tim Rust, then it is Megan.

out her she must be in charge it certainly can't be that retiring trill it can't be him well he was very shy john glover played a great offer just like we're going to get out of here soon he yeah the way john glover played it which is perfect he played like a lackey he was not the main guy but that was perfect to the story so talented talented talented talented yeah yeah brilliant actor yeah brilliant Yeah. Brilliant actor. He, but he says, Varad says he wants Dax. Actually, he wants the symbiont that's inside her. And Dax knows this. And I go, ah, not me. I'm out of here. Yeah, she says in the end of the scene, she goes, the symbiont, Benjamin, he's come to steal my symbiant. When did you know that he's, how did you know that? Do you remember? What else do you want from me? Dax is the worm. That's how I would know.

He didn't come for Jedziah, because that's who I am. Great, that's right, that's right, that's great. It's part of my species. So you realize it in this scene. Yeah. They are very careful in the script. I was very taken with it. They're very careful about when they're dealing with Jadzea and when they're dealing

with Dax. It isn't interchangeable. It's very specific. Yeah. Robert Hewitt-Wolf, I think, does a really great job of explaining it. I mean, I know it was in his original story, but he has to, talked about how they had a different version of what they wanted from me. And so it does, he's just, I'm a big fan of his, and him and his writing. I definitely benefited from his

writing. Yeah. Yeah. He's written some great stuff. He's imagining we could get on. I would love to get him on because I don't know him. Wouldn't know him at all. And he too is, I don't really know him well either. I do. I do. I do. Yeah. And I must also say that he too is is visually exciting as well. Oh. He's a much taller man. When Terry said, when Terry said, sorry.

But you find him exciting to look at, huh? Yes, absolutely. Yeah. Terry, you had a pregnant pause when you said, well, he's someone that, like, before you said that we could get on, I thought you were saying, well, he's someone that is also visually appealing. Yes. But Armand said, he is appealing.

He is a very good looking man. But it just, the point is, he is somebody that. we should ask to be on the show. Yes, I would love that. Because I've seen on his, I've liked things that he's done on Instagram and things like that. We'll track him down. And Armin,

you said you're in touch with him. So that would be awesome. I can't, yeah. Because he's written some big episodes so far. Some talented writer. Because everybody got one up me on this one. Well,

this act ends with DAC saying he's come to steal my symbion. Bum, bum, bum. There's a little break. We come right back to Oz. And forgive me, Terry, put your hands over your ears, although you already have something over yours. Terry's a performance in this scene and all of the scenes, really, in this show, it's extraordinarily good.

She is terrific. She is so, it's a wrong word, but saint-like, when she realizes, for the good of the station, for the good of her friends, she will make the sacrifice. And you can see that in her eyes. And it is such a sympathetic, understanding performance is really quite powerful. You didn't hear any of that from me, Terry, but I hope everybody else heard.

I agree with you. I agree with you. And there's some scenes coming up that I'll specifically mention how moved I was by the subtlety and the nuance and the detail of your performance was so good. And I also want to say, and I'll get into this more later too, I wish there were more of it, Terry, because this is a Dax story, but Terry Farrell didn't get to do enough in this episode. And I love John Glover, wonderful actor. But I wanted to see the Terry Farrell side of this story more and less of the John Glover side, as talented as he is. And it felt like a Dax

story, but yet it was another actor doing a lot of the, of the, carrying a lot of the load there. And that frustrated me anyway that's my that's my thank you i feel like i didn't need to know about his so much of his past it would have been nice i mentioned my sister and my mom and dad so why am i not if i'm going to die why am i not having a little share with even Cisco about it or well even in this scene tell my mom and dad or tell my sister or i don't know yeah even in this scene you say goodbye to Benjamin Sisko and all you say was it's been fun. What the fuck?

And then when, exactly, and then when John Glover says goodbye to his friend, Benjamin Sisko, it's this long goodbye. I'm like, wait a minute. When you, what, flip it. Like, let Terry have the long goodbye. Anyway. Or have Terry

and have, have, have Dax, what Dax, have Jadzia and Varad have a discussion about life on the tree. How she succeeded, how he didn't succeed. You know, why was he envious of her? Yes.

You have one line about, well, so few people get accepted. That could have been a whole scene. And I like Avery's work more and more as I watch revisit Deep Space Nine. This is a very special episode for him. He's very good in this episode. But he could have done a little bit less and you could have done a little bit more. I agree. I agree.

Well, this scene in a option. There's a lot of characters, very complex. Les Landau, not only is visually appealing, but he can handle a big scene with lots of people on ops. I thought he did a great job. I sort of got left out of a lot of shots, but that's okay. It's okay. There are some scenes where I was like, wait,

Les, you forgot to cover the other people there. I did notice that. But in this scene, I felt like he was pretty even-handed. But there are a lot of scenes on ops where you guys are all in the background, and you don't even say anything. Yeah. And I wonder, why haven't I escaped? by now you know yeah because they're not watching me

Varad says that Dax is the best match for him she tries to talk him out of it I try to reason with them right yeah you try to reason with him it's Bashir who says he will have no part in this in removing the symbion and he says nope I'm not going to do it and Varad

was like okay and he shoots O'Brien in the arm and he's like now I'm showing you I'm serious I'm not going to I'm not going to back down and Dax does beg this is what you were talking about Armin she really begs Bashir to cooperate she wants to sacrifice herself for the dax part of herself yeah um you know nobody else gets hurt yeah that nobody else gets hurt actually she's not sacrificing the dax part of her she's

sacrificing the jadzea part of her the dachs part of her will live on that's true yeah yeah exactly make that clear yeah very intense scene where things turn and we go in the infirmary and there's dax and varad lying on these operating beds and you had the makeup all the way down here and so did he. I thought that was cool. It goes down our sides and all the way down onto our feet.

And did Wes Moore autograph that one too? He always autographed. Lucky Michael. So that was probably at the top of my breath. Did you guys notice how it took a while for Bashir to heal O'Brien's wound? And he was like, well, we'll keep working on it. Whereas on Voyager, it's almost immediate.

Once they put the thing on you, you're done. But it seems like, yeah. I think it depends on the wound. It's interesting because some things, it looks like zip and it's gone and you're like, wow, like your ear when you had got branded and he stood there and when he walked away, you looked fine. Back to normal. That phaser cut on O'Brien looked much deeper.

It did look like just a flesh wound. It looked like it cut through the muscle. Okay. Yeah, and it's a credit to Cullum that he played the pain. Usually they just sit there and they go, okay, fine, it's over with. Yeah. But he played the pain, and I went, oh, good. So it isn't miraculous.

It isn't just like that. And Kira got tasked with continuing every, what did he say, 20 minutes? Yeah. Make sure you do this every 20 minutes or half an hour, whatever the. That's right. Yeah. Apply this cream every 20 minutes and then it will. And you'll be just good as new.

Okay, Robbie, now continue where you're. Now we're in the infirmary with the dots, the polka dots that go all the way down to the feet. But I thought it was great that make up. And did they do something on your stomach as well? Yes, that's my question. Vains, veins or something, right? And it looks like a kangaroo pouch.

Yeah. Yes. So they applied that to you while you were doing that. Do you remember? Mm-hmm. Was that like a, you know, sometimes I've done these medical shows, operating shows, where they have a special table where the actor is below.

And then there's like another prosthetic. stomach that they can act so it's like a magic that's amazing so it looks like the doctor is actually cutting the actor open for the surgery when it's really just their body is down under is that is that what you did for this or was it on that would have cost too much money this was really my stomach and he pretended to pull it out right there yeah yeah and he cut the the umbilical cord oh wasn't that kind of like oh i know i know and And all I could think of was resets for the prop department. It was like, oh, take two.

They got to glue it back together. And this in one people. We only have two. Yeah, it's that kind of, yeah, I'm pretty sure it was. We cut it with like a, it looked like a cigar cutter. It looked like a cigar. It just reminded me, like Bob Picardo was a big cigar smoker when we were on Voyager. And I just remember him cutting all those cigars.

And I was like, hey, the symbiants. Oh, my God. He was a big cigar smoker. And Levar Burton would always smoke cigars out. So was Ethan. Ethan is a cigar smoker as well. Well, what about on DS9? Did anyone smoke cigars at all there?

No. In the 90s, cigars were sort of hip for a minute. They were kind of back in fashion. I smoked cigarettes then. And I remember LeVar giving me a bad time. And I'm like, don't fool yourself with that cigar. Exactly. Nicotine, nicotine.

Yeah. And he'd be like, I'm not inhaling. I'm like, it doesn't matter. Ever hear of mouth cancer? Yeah, exactly. And then years later, he said to me, Terry, you're right. See? And that's sweet.

Yeah. As he lit a cigar. As he lit a cigar. You're right, Terry. Well, in this scene for the surgery, Varad does refuse the antiseptic. He doesn't, or anesthetic. He doesn't, the anesthesia. He doesn't want to go to sleep.

He wants to watch on a monitor. And maybe he offers even to help Bashir with a procedure, which seemed crazy to me. Yeah. Um, but Bashir puts Dax under. He feels horrible. Um, this was a great moment between Dax and Bashir, Terry, you and Sid, I played this beautifully. Thank you.

He says, he's so sorry. She's like, don't, don't blame yourself. Don't blame. He's also hard to watch, isn't he? He's so unattractive, poor said. Poor thing. Poor guy. Um, yeah.

So there's the, there's a scene. He puts her under. it's very sweet Bashir says forgive me at the end of the scene yeah and then there's

a wonderfully beautiful shot like the Mona Lisa of Terry gradually fading away to sleep if you thought

he was visually arresting he thought you were as well in that shot he just it was a gorgeous shot

yeah thank you gorgeous it was visually appealing that shot Marvin Rush lit the ladies well. He definitely, his leading ladies, he took extra time. Yeah, he did.

Of course, I was 29, so it was not as difficult as it might be today. But he took it, whatever the age, he was very good with the leading ladies. So now we go back to ops. I love this opening shot, less tilting off the guns, racking off these guns in the foreground. like down by their knees the lens was it was very cool um our team our heroes are talking um to car tim russ yells out no talking and then he kicks o'brien and there's a big fight and my question is how does kira get beaten so easily in this fight right i agree by megan galliger who doesn't you know it suggests that megan is a better fighter than one would

take her for yeah because kira is a major fighter find her as a combat person. And it just suggests that Megan's character is equally combative. Yeah, and she went real fast. There were no hesitation how she was just wham, bam, wham on Kara.

I mean, we don't know where she's from. We don't know what type of alien. Maybe the planet she's from is like Sparta. You know, the ancient Greeks where they were raised as fighters, who knows. But she talks about working in kind of a brothel, right? She talks about working in a house. It did sound like a broad.

them yeah yeah and whereas kira's an you know trained soldier i would have thought that one that one i don't know i didn't i didn't buy it okay i just didn't it should have been more of a superman quality like there's a little extra superhuman power in her body or something yeah maybe it's her alien that alien species is just extra strong or something or they should have made kira slip on a banana peel or something where she was compromised yeah an accident or something happened where she Or someone helped Megan Gallagher's, you know, in the fight that I like the banana peel. The nanopoe is funny. Cisco fights.

It's visually appealing. Oh, my God. Cisco fights really good. To me. Tim Russ over the console. He was so, to me, it looked like Avery was taking out all of his, of his angst out on Tim Russ. He was like, I'm going to knock you down really good. It was, it was ferocious.

His fighting was crazy. I thought. Yeah, it was. The whole fight. sequence was choreographed beautifully, I thought. He needed to save me. Yes, he did. He was very emotionally invested.

Very gallant. Well, because he thinks you're visually appealing as well. So he did not want to lose that. Way better looking than Curzon. When Muriel, which is Megan Gallagher's character, Muriel puts a gun up to Cisco's throat and says that she'll kill him if he doesn't stand down and he relents there. This is one moment for Les Landau.

I wish the shot had been tighter. Yes. Something else because it was like a waist shot and the two of them and Megan standing there. And after watching Cisco fight the way he did, I was like, he would just disarm her in a second. Yeah. Moves.

Yeah. But if it had been a real tight shot, it would have hidden some of that exposure. And the physicality, how much smaller she was than him. And you know what? I bet you he'd watch you back and think the same thing. sure yeah yeah but cisco does give up at the end of the scene and uh we go to the infirmary next bashears removing dax from jadzi is kangaroo pouch and he cuts the cord here um is there no blood in the there's no blood like this the pouch when he opens it would yeah i think that they

there was probably a little pg moment there of like that's just too much we don't need to do that It makes me feel like there would have been a conversation about it on the set. And there was an episode, there's an episode on the Enterprise where there's a trill transplant, a symbiont transplant. And there's no blood in that one either. No. Okay. Okay.

I did feel like when the symbiont got put into, into, what's his name? Verraud. It was like a climactic physical sensation, which... Well, you're having, suddenly he's having... lifetimes and knowledge being shoved in his brain, like if you could, like when you see a movie where you're seeing it actually happened, all that information kind of impacting the brain and in a more kind of a montage visual way, if we could have spent the money on that. But then again, you are right, Robbie, in terms of your description of climactic, because this

is the climax of his life. He's been trying to have this done forever. And now it's excellent. I have a question. Not every. trill gets a symbion why is that like was there a time where everybody should have gotten a symbion no no no i explained in ops before that you know you're chosen he's explaining it too he had to study for it there's a psych evaluation there's knowledge there's all kinds of um yeah he says like one and ten get get a trill i think doesn't jed zia talk about that yeah they both do an ox Before the operation, they talk about it. And the most important thing, I think, is the psych eval.

So if they're worried about how you're going to handle the information and make sure that it's not for you, but for the greater good, if it's not and you can't handle it, you're not going to get the symbion. Yeah. All right. There's a fixed number of symbiants, right. Yes, that's not babies. That's right. So let's say there's a hundred symbiants. Okay.

A million years ago, where there are a hundred trills, like they were matched, but then as the trills, more trills are populated, now less trills are able to get them? Like, the math of it in terms of generationally to me was more my question. Do you know what I mean? Are you trying to say there's a, are you asking if there's a finite number of symbionts to begin with? That's kind of what I'm saying. Can symbionts duplicate? I have to say, I don't remember. Okay. And I'm drawing upon what I saw on discovery.

there is a pool where the symbiants live and there's an episode where we go to the pool right oh there is so i don't know i don't know if there's a finite number of symbiants or whether they do propagate whether they can i don't know how they would do that but um you know i'm just a farangi would have yeah because it seems like the symbiates sort of moves stays alive and moves from host to host but doesn't seem to have babies. I don't know how that would happen. But some species live longer than others. So this may be one of those species that lives thousands of years.

It just, yeah, to me, the whole idea, I started going, wait a minute. Yeah, if you look over the thousands of years, has this always been one out of 10 get us in? Well, that can't be because they've populated. But there is, as Terry said, there's a group. There's an official group that decides which trill gets a symbion and which doesn't. All right. Like a trill board of advisors. Exactly.

Like an HOA, sort of. An HOA. Like a liver transplant. You have cirrhosis and you're an alcoholic. They're probably not going to pick you. Between you and the 30-year-old who is a very fit person who, yeah, it's like, who are you going to pick? You're going to pick the most viable person. No.

The most visually appealing. All right. We go to ops next. That means less Lent now has a symbion in him. That's what it means to me. It could be. Did you check him? Did you check for a pouch?

I did not. I never touched his body. I probably hugged him, but I did not search for a symbion. I think I might have gotten in trouble if I did that. That's an HR problem. You may have thought about it, but you didn't touch it. Definitely. No.

Okay. All right. So we go to ops next. Quark is freaking out. They're all going to die. Kira's really mad, blaming Quark for Jad Zia's death as she should. As she should. As she should.

And notice that she grabs me as well. We talked about this, about Avery grabbing Quark. She grabs me well, but she doesn't grab me around the throat. I know. Thank goodness. Holy cow. But she grabs me by the little pails. She grabs you by the.

collar she's really mad and this isn't the first time she's grabbed me by the lapels either so i mean she does that no because remember when she hurled you across the bar bar that's oh you weren't we did that podcast and you weren't there with us that's right my recollection were you standing on like an apple box and then jump back do you think i don't remember i don't it's just that you went oh but i thought there's i just physically as an actor the only way i could think of doing that is it to have had the box, and you're actually doing more of the work than she is to throw yourself back.

Oh, I'm sure I did more work than she did. That's always the case. Or Dennis Madelman. No, no, I mean, that's what always. Yeah, right. Right. The other person who does. Robbie, it could have been that rig where you attach it

to the actor. It could have been the wire rig. It could have been the wire rig. I don't know. They didn't spend the money on that very often. Maddie you again. Matt at you again here. She says, you know, when this is over your third.

through here. Yeah, that says to you. That's what she says in the third act, but she doesn't say anything like that in the fifth act. That's true. At this point, she thinks you're through here. Then she walks over to join the others, and Marielle checks in with them. And she reveals that she met Varad on Kefka IV and that he would come to the house

that she worked at and help him relax. Yes, for comfort. and that he helped her escape this life. And so she owes him everything. And Cisco tries to convince him that Varad won't be the same after symbiosis, but she vows to stand by him no matter what. And then we reveal Varad there. He looks very ominous and very powerful, totally different performance.

It's that camera angle. It's so beautiful they shot from below and shot up. He suddenly looked taller too, didn't he? It's because they're shooting up. He really did. Yeah. Yes. That was smart of less to do it that way. And they put it like six foot three.

It was like, wow. And they put gel in his hair. They put gel in his hair too. Yeah, they had a cooler hairdo. He had a bowl cut before and now it's all up. But John Glover also is a brilliant enough actor to become a different person when he wants to be. And he was. And all that command, which John Glover usually has is the command.

That's what he usually plays. Right. was there for everyone to appreciate. Yeah, great transformation. Really good transformation. We go back to the infirmary, Bashir's sealing up, Jad Zia's incision. The scene was phenomenal. I mean, I don't even know where to begin.

Bashir tells, first starts with the Klingon, tells the Klingon to help him. The Klingon is very rude. Bashir gets really mad at the Klingon. And now the Klingon is impressed. and he helps. But this is the best part is when he goes over to Jadzia, who wakes up, and it's just the dialogue there is very sweet. And again, extreme close-ups, both on Terry and on Sid.

Just beautiful, beautiful pictures, just gorgeous pictures of the humanity coming from both. Yeah, yeah, it's really beautifully shot. And the way that you delivered the first line when you wake up, you say the symbion it's gone and the way that you said the word gone

I don't even want to try to imitate it because it was so beautiful yeah it was just really wonderful great scene well I am so grateful

that Sid and I had that together yeah yeah he's very he's a very sensitive person period yeah but

it was just a dream moment two of us working together like that yeah it was great it was beautiful and uh yeah basically dac says she never felt so empty she feels really different and empty and uh lost a bit in this in this moment gutted and we feel that as in the audience because of doing's acting good job very thank you thank you i also like how yeto slash steve rankin called bashear little human that was kind of funny to me. And this is one of those scenes, Terry, where I felt like I want to see more of this side of

the story. That's what I was talking about before. I want to see more of this side and less. I love John Glover. I'm a big fan. Yeah, this has nothing to do with him. This has to do with us getting to know our core people. Yeah.

And especially if we're going to be the skeleton crew and it is the core people, then we should know more about the core people. Exactly. I get you. And you hit. I appreciate you saying that. Home run. Every time you were on screen, you just weren't on enough.

Yeah. That you as the actor playing Dax were not on screen enough. There should have been a lot more. Thank you. We go to Ops next. Solid effort by Cisco. Try and work Varad and the friendship. But, you know, he's saying we're friends.

And Cisco's really working for Rod and that that Dax friendship. Isn't he great, though? I love when they cut to Kira and she is like, what the hell are you doing? Look on her face. And it's like, oh my God, Avery's great in it. Yeah. Yeah, the way that they're laughing.

I'm going to differ with that a little. Yeah. Avery is a very powerful actor and I'm, as I said, I've been growing more and more appreciative than watching these episodes. But I just thought he did that very well. And then he did it again in another scene. very well and they did the same thing again in another scene very well and i thought either this

is writing or the acting but i'm not sure which but can we get another note besides that approach that avery took because he kept doing it and and you know megan was not letting him overcome her but but it was always the same note the same strategy okay i would just like to say though in this scene in particular with him and john he it feels like he's trying to to befriend him, which is different than him trying to manipulate somebody into understanding what's really happening. But even as he was doing that, Terry, even as he was trying to befriend him, you could still see the anger in his eyes.

Oh, could you? I didn't get that until the second half of that particular scene. In the beginning of it, I mean, we know what he's doing. Right. But I thought the delivery at the get-go wasn't so transparent as what you're saying. I think the anger seeped in and then it was like, bam, he knew he wasn't, he wasn't getting anywhere. So with that final line. And that made him enraged.

Yeah, that final line, then you're not the Dax that I know. Our friendship's over. Like, he lays down the hammer there. That's where all the anger comes out. So before that, it was a big turn. He's trying to. It seemed to me to reveal that it was all, even though it felt real, it was all. fake. When he was able to make it turn so quickly, it was like, oh, you're just manipulating

him. You weren't really bonding over this friendship. You weren't really enjoying reliving these memories with him. It was all about manipulating. Yeah, because he does try to manipulate him to get Varad to give Dax, put Dax the symbiont back in Jadzia, but he refuses. And this is a scene, Armin, where I felt like all of you guys that were on the, On ops, you didn't have many reaction shots. This was very different than the earlier scene where I felt like it was covered well. This one was all about Cisco and Varaa to me.

I didn't even see... But I understand what you're saying, though, Armand, about it seeming, playing the same thing over and over again. And I'm not sure if it's writing or acting, and perhaps a little of both, but we just kept seeing the same scenario with just different words, that's all. I agree.

I agree a bit. Yeah, it felt like... he just kept going back to the same idea. It didn't need to be longer. That scene didn't need to be longer. It could have been a much shorter interaction. And then there would have been time for more Jetsia Zia decks. Yes.

And as far as reactions from the other members of the cast, I think we all would have had the same reaction. So it only would have been redundant. We all would have gone, what is he doing? But I did want to see you guys. I did want to see people reacting. And I didn't see much of it in this scene. That's my point.

even if it was not a, you know, a surprising reaction. It would have been nice to see this scene playing out in front of other people rather than, you know, looks to each other or things like that would have been nice. I like what's about to happen. Well, we take our little break when Cisco says our friendship's over. We come back to ops. Varad is sitting in the commander's office at this point. Cisco tries to convince Muriel now that Varad is different.

not the guy you knew he's going to turn against you she gets so mad eventually he keeps pushing and pushing she draws a phaser on him and then varad enters ask what what's wrong she says oh nothing so you can see a little bit of a like Cisco has put a little bit of separation between because she's not being honest and they're just not as connected as they were and barad is different is very different very different yeah i think it's pretty clear to anybody out i just thought i think i say in my clip she needs therapy yes she does she's definitely attracted and and and with the wrong kind of guy yes um he does say to her do you remember when varad says well i really wouldn't want anything to happen to you

yes i thought that was terrifying i agree it felt so suspicious like a threat like a threat in a way Yes, a veiled threat. ominous, yes, very suspicious. And then we see Quark roll a quarter or something. It looked like a quarter to me. I don't know if you do you carry change? Does Quirk carry change? If it's money, I carry it.

Yes, that's what I're going to say. Good answer. Well, he's got change. He rolls a quarter over to Tim Russ's feet. When Takar reaches down, Quark jumps on his back, an amazing. How great was that shot? Armand, you looked like a flying squirrel going across.

And I remember, it wasn't George. It wasn't my standing. It was me. I remember definitely being on Tim's back, yeah. Wow. That had to be you. Because we saw your performance and your, and ultimately. You're awesome in this scene.

So good. So good. And then to car slams. Action figure doll. Yes. You get slammed against the rail. Sorry. You get slammed against the rail, you get flipped over, and then you cry out in pain.

My ear, which I love. He's injured his ear. But, like, suddenly you're like six years old. Yeah. So good. And he's dragged off to the infirmary because he's so injured from this. Just great. Great screaming.

We come back. We come into the infirmary with you. Still screaming. hilarious I really like the tone of his scream the tone that you chose Armand because clearly

you had to figure out how is my screen going to come out is it going to be more a lower base or is it going to have a little higher you know

and it was the octave was higher but it worked for this episode and for the scene I actually remember thinking this is terrible to say

but I actually remember what is this comparable to and I went oh it's like being kicked in the balls that's right I'm like

I can't really relate, but I think that's a good analogy. I think it's important to make a powerful choice. Yes, yes, yes. And you make good powerful choices. Thank you, ma'am. Thank you. Very good choice. Well, he's still screaming in the infirmary, and then we realize that he's faking it.

And he gives Bashir a look as he's screaming, Bashir gets it. Which was great. It's hilarious. Bashir scans him, and it says, oh, the damage appears to be fairly superficial. And then that's where the cork is like. Oh, no. No. Yeah.

And then Bissier turns. Yes, I, but the Ferengi ears are very sensitive. Then he has all this, unfortunately for Sid, he has all this technobabble that he has to. Yeah. Yeah, he does. He does. Very funny. We go back to Ops.

Varad's almost finished with his plan. They're ready to leave. He tells Muriel that he couldn't have done this without her. He's going to leave first, I guess, in their plan. And then she and the Klingons will follow and they'll meet at the rendezvous point. And there's an awkward hug and then an awkward kiss at the end of this. He pulls away and then he goes back in a second time. And he goes back in and she pulls away.

And it's just awkward. And Cisco clocks all of this. So he sees what's going on. And then we go back to Quark and the infirmary. Bashir is treating a still screaming and crying quark. He gets a yellow, the other Klingon, to hold his tricorder while he gets a hypos. spray. And while he's getting this hypospray, he sneaks up behind Yetto and knocks him out, basically. Well, he's not behind him. He's actually next to him. So he makes a move like he's going to do something

to Quark and then quickly changes the direction of the hypospray into his neck. Jabs it into Yeto. Who falls right on. Quark made that happen. Quark made that happen. I know. That's why I think you redeemed yourself with a bad decision. that's the reason all of that is there is is to redeem that you know writers always had a problem how far can we take this character right where he doesn't become really totally obnoxious right and otherwise it makes it makes starfleet look weak if they can't they can't do something about someone who's who's obviously breaking the law and doing it under right under their noses and they're not doing anything about it but on the other hand he's a series regular so we can't get

rid of him. So he's got to redeem himself every time he makes him, you know, bad decision. Well, yeah, and that makes you love him. And it also explains why your relationship with Odo works so well. You know, just the episode before you were like, you did a moment of gratitude. And it was like you did this really nice thing. And then suddenly this episode, it's like, what the hell? Wasn't he just like on the right track for a minute? And now he's gone bad again. but then he's going to have your i don't think of quark as being particularly brave but when you when you did that with the quarter and you jumped on um tim the cling on it was like that is not in character for quark to put himself in danger so that was huge that he did that and it is a tribute

thank you thank it is a tribute to the writers that they've always had the audience asking the same questions you did terry can he do this will he do this we expect him not to do it but then he does do it or we expect him to do it and he doesn't do it they kept people guessing all the time about what side of morality was quark on and i i'm very appreciative of that very appreciate oh yeah the only thing that was absolutely consistent that you were greedy yeah and there's nothing well and even in this scene so they knock out the cling on they jump up and they go to free oh and they pull out the box, and there's a great sequence of Quark

being a safe cracker. So he's listening. Yeah, that was great too. I love that. Yeah, it was great. Really well done, Armin. Thank you. Thank you.

Oh, absolutely. Thank you. Yeah. That's what I noticed. There were no holes in the box. That's when I went. Oh, of course. There's no holes in the box.

But then you found the secret thing. You find that secret thing on the side. You're like telling Sid to give you the scalp. which was so great too. There, here we are in the firm. Scalpel. You're so serious. It's a great scene and it ends with Quark saying,

it's a gift. It's a gift. Made me laugh. I honestly like the Cork-Bershear team up here. I do too, actually. You never see them together like that. You know, when Terry was saying before that it was a special moment between her and Sid,

I sat there and listened to that and agreed with her. with her. And then I thought, did I have any moments with Sid? Real moments? And I went, no, I don't think so. No. They didn't put you guys together. They never teamed us together in that sort of way. Right. I understand why they wouldn't do it with me. I get that. But I thought, wow, seven years and I don't remember any moment like that with Sid. I had several with Terry, which I'm very grateful for. Me too. I even had a couple with Kira, none with Cisco, certainly some with Jake.

And really nothing with O'Brien either. They really segregated my character away. And I understand why. But looking back on it, I regret that I didn't have that moment. That just you had Terry. Not the same scene, but that happened with another actor that was a friend of yours. Yes. Well, like in the siege, which I didn't get to.

talk about, but I will just share that Nana and I having that sequence together of being in the battle, that was it. To me, it was so great and we did it so well. I'm surprised we never did it again. And it was shocking to me. We had little like Dax's being gossipy asking about or dating. I used to just make me crazy. Why don't we have more scenes in battle together rather than talking about dating dresses and it was just crazy it's interesting with you guys now that we're into season two a few episodes in like i think you're right there are some combinations of series regular characters and the chemistry that you had as actors that would have been great to see more yeah and for some reason on your show they don't do that a lot like our show we were constantly

trading places and you know teaming up with different combos i feel like i had great episodes with everybody you guys were lost in space right yeah and we're in a space station and that's why they had to keep have you commingling because you're in we had a ginormous set of people coming in it out all the time and a huge cast of series regulars but i wish they had made like Like Armin said, I wish they had made it a priority to give you all some episodes. Like, I would love to see more of Quark and Bashir. I'd love to see it. Just one special episode, and it sounds like there's not one.

And I will say later on in the show, there will be a number of scenes with Dax and Quark, for which I was enormously grateful because then I got a chance to work with Terry, which I hadn't really before them. Me too. I got to come to your house. Oh, you did the rehearsals. Yeah. Yeah.

Actually, Armin, Kitty, and I worked out with the same trainer. I, luckily enough, because I asked them. And so it's kind of fun that we connected that way, too, outside of work. That's awesome. Exactly. Terry, it wasn't just that scene in the Bajoran Raider in the battle that you had with Nana. it was also that awesome scene where you're dressed like a Bajoran Vedic. Remember that?

And then you say like, what do you think of the nose? And then she's like, oh, it's flattering. And you're like, I'm thinking of keeping it. So it started this little nice little comedic, yes, banter that I'm very sad to hear that you guys don't get any more of that after this. It's like, ah. Not a whole lot. No. I mean, there are things that happen for sure.

I mean, like when I get married and she's there. but it's not married not in the oh sorry robbie it's not the kind of camaraderie um less land out they gets married to less land out go ahead terry sorry go ahead they had this opportunity because we really were the two first star trek women to be seriously strong engaged women that also had a very healthy sex life, and we were sexy, and we were strong. So they have a missed opportunity. They had a missed opportunity to have us really, you know, kind of swashbuckle together instead of like dumbing it down to girls' shit.

Right. Mm-hmm. I hear you. That's all. Well said. Yeah. Thank you. Okay.

We go to ops next. Varad cannot reach Yetto, who Bashir has knocked out. He figures out that Odo's probably been free. in the scene. He decides to head to the escape ship. Mariel says, bring a hostage with you. And Cisco offers himself, but Varad does not trust him. So Kira goes as the hostage. And then Varad says goodbye. This is where I was like, it's a longer goodbye than the Terry goodbye. Terry's like, well, it's been fun. This was like to Cisco, you mean? To Cisco. Yeah, to Cisco with John Glover. But at the end of the scene, Cisco says, I will see you again, Verra. So,

You feel like Cisco is not giving up on this. To give the writers some excuse, and that's all it is some excuse, the truth of the matter is Cisco has known Dax much longer than he's known Jadzia. Yeah. Yeah, that's true. So the goodbye with Terry was only a goodbye to Jad Zia, who he doesn't know so well. Dax was going to move into this other body, but still be there. Yeah.

So maybe it's more from a Curzon perspective to say it's been fun. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Also, I do know he'll do everything in his power. And I do know that I'm not going to die instantly. Yes. Yeah.

There's some time. And Julian will do, I know he used to be in love with me. So he will do everything in his power to keep me alive. That's true. And he does a very good job. Yes. Because Julian finds Dax visually appealing. That's fine.

Who doesn't? And Gillian is also visually appealing. He is, he is. I did not mind kissing him. He's a handsome bloke. Armand, I think Quark is visually appealing, just so you know. I really do. I like Quark's ears.

Thank you. Be careful. When you flew through the air, Armand, and landed on Tim Russ's back, you were very visually appealing to me. I was like, look at that. Look at that. Look at that. Like a spider monkey.

He can do that. Okay. All right. So we're still in ops. I should go a while later. Cisco's fishing with Muriel for information. Wants to know where she's going to meet Varad. And in this scene, she knows,

Mariel admits that she knows that Varad lied to her for the first time ever. And Cisco, again, says the symbion is changing him, but it's not too late to change him back and to save Dax. And finally, because she's clocked this lie. that he lied to her for the first time. She says, okay, hands Sisko a phaser. But she does say, if you hurt him, I'll kill you. So there's a threat there.

Maybe that comes back when Megan Gallagher comes back. Is she coming back to, is that what happens, Armin? No. No. Wait, let's go back to. Yes. I think what trips it for her is her having to admit he's not going to meet her at the rendezvous point. Yeah.

That is it. And that's where she knows this is the end. Yes. It has led up to that, and that is the coup de grace. When he changes the plants, she goes, and she's been, of course, being influenced by Cisco. So, yes, she realizes Cisco may or may not be right, but certainly it's not going to be what it was before. Tara is absolutely right. Well, we go to the airlock.

We see Varad running into this airlock. There's a cart there, like a tool. cart or something, but he runs past the cart to the other door. It's a cart that has the box on it. Oh, yes, that's right. It's got the box. It has the auto box on it. You know what that looked like to me? That looked just like our prop

master's little cart that probably was. Save a little coin. Who was the prop master on DS9? Pat and Bud. Pat and Bud. Pat and Bud. And Bud was the quieter one of the two.

Yeah. we had Alan and we had Johnny Nestowitz We had John Nestowitz And then Rousseau would help a little bit too Yeah So yeah Wow props on track

Good times Back to the airlock I broke a lot of props By the way Robbie was a prop breaker I was the prop breaker You were I was

I was play around with them And toss them And do silly things And yeah What the heck I know Yeah It was my character

He was a cowboy I know we're a little worried About time And I Let's go to tell this story. That's what I'm saying, back to the airlock. Yeah. So when Viacom bought Paramount, Pat, our prop master, came to me with a huge grin on his face and he said, I got to show you something. So he took me into his back room there. And he showed me a letter from the Viacom

lawyers who had just taken over Paramount. And it was a letter to all Propmaster, well, to Pat anyway about the proper handling of phasers with the actors and it says it requires pat as a prop master to show the actors exactly how the phaser works and that that the actor is not allowed to handle the phaser and it says phaser is not to handle the phaser until the moment of shooting And then once the shot is over, the prop master must immediately take the phaser back from the actor and put it in a safe place. Now, if it wasn't for what had happened on Rust, it would be even more laughable. But the only way for anyone who doesn't understand who doesn't know this, the only way anyone can get hurt by a laser is someone throws it at you because it's a block of wood. That's all it is.

Yeah, the phaser, the prop phasers that we used were a block of wood with paint. Yeah. That was it. That's hilarious. That's hilarious. And so Pat showed me, and we were in hysterics, how stupid are these lawyers? Look at these guys. Oh, my word.

They're trying to cover every contingency. And there you go. Now it's just... And have you ever heard of a weapon called the phaser outside of Star Trek? Exactly. Okay. So funny. All right.

So back at the airlock, the trolley is. there. Varad goes to get on the ship, but the ship's gone. He turns around and starts to leave. The tool cart turns into Odo. Odo comes out of that tool cart box or something. He appears. And Kira takes on to Carr. Terry has said it earlier. You're absolutely right. He appears. We don't see him morph. No. It just kind of rises up into frame. Yeah. They already spent it all. They spent it all in that first shot. That's right. On the tool car, perhaps. He spent a lot of money on the tool car. They spent it on the three-parter.

Yeah, they did. That's right. Tim Russ and Kira get into a little bit of a scuffle there, and then Varad runs around a corner, heads off, Odo. Odo and Kira have to team up to take Tim Russ out. That's how strong Tim Russ is as a Klingon in the scene. Both Odo and Kira have to take him on. But they do win, and down goes Tim.

Poor Tim. we go to another airlock and Cisco is waiting inside this one as Varad comes in and there's a standoff you know Varad is not going to give up

Varad makes the mistake of calling Cisco Benjamin he says you won't shoot me Benjamin and starts to leave and Cisco is triggered by this don't call me Benjamin and he shoots him so yeah is that how it said it Robbie did he say it kind of gusto something like that that's how it sounded

in my head okay good and I and I understood that's what had to happen that has to be what happened but by shooting I mean we were told this in the you know in the script they say that if you shoot this you could hurt the symbion so if you shoot him and it looked like it shot him in the chest that's what seemed to be aiming um then then this whole episode about saving jadzia uh the sim if the symbion is earned injured and can't go back into jad zia which we already know is a fragile situation exactly then you lose them both i i went couldn't he have done something else except shoot him um because it it can harm the symbion if it harms the symbion it harms the Symbian, it harms Jetsia as well.

It just seemed more out of vengeance than out of thought. Yes. Wouldn't even better to punch him and knock him out? Yeah. Or to have an emotional, like get to him emotionally and have him. No, we've already tried that at nauseam. I guess we have tried that. How about a, but how about a Vulcan things?

Yeah. Maybe we set to stun. But a Vulcan neck pitch? Yeah. Well, he did aim hot. Leonard was alive. We needed Leonard to come and be on the show. Cisco did aim higher.

Leonard's on your show? No. I said we needed him to come on the show. He did the Vulcan grab. Yes. But Armin, he did shoot higher than where the symbionion is located. So it's not a story. Yeah, it was up high.

I thought it was like his shoulder, but maybe that was wishful. I thought it was solar. I still agree with you. Armin, if they say in the episode, literally say the words, any, because I think they said even if the phaser set to stun it could kill, didn't they? Yeah, they could kill the symbion.

He should have punched him, cold cocked him. He should have punched him or kicked him in the balls. Wow. Yeah, and then he could have screamed like Quark did and it would have been a whole, you know. Right. I'll call that. Now that we're here, I just want to address this as well.

Dax says about the simbians and the trills matching, she says a bad match could prove serious damage to both the symbion and the host those are the words from the episode yep okay

do we ever see it being a bad match for John Glover for Barad no no so what so so it wasn't that maybe he was right maybe he should have gotten you know we never see that

I thought he was going to be more diabolical as soon as he switched like or you think ooh he's scary now but he had uh altruistic reasons to wanting to be he wanted to go to the gamma quadrant and help people and that didn't seem to change did it no so i kept thinking why have you told us that this might happen and then i'm grateful that jadzia survived the operation um but then the simeon is going back and forth that that's got to be problematic. It's got to be problematic. Oh, yeah. I thought where you were going with your pitch there, Armin, was bad things could happen if it's a bad match. Right. What if it was a bad match

with John Glover? And literally, like, the symbion wants to go back to Jad Zia. And there's like a story about our series regular that's stronger emotionally than Cisco shooting him in the shoulder and forcing a, you know, if the symbiont chooses, if the symbion. Yes. Yes. is helping to stop to stop John Glover from leaving. You know, if all of a sudden he grabs his stomach or something, it's more physically ill because it wants to go back. It wants to go back. You see Glover's stomach kind of extend a little bit

because the simian's trying to push out of there. He's like, I got to go. It's like a true north. It's like a from the movie. But certainly that Simbia could cause a barrage to go unconscious. Like alien? Yes. Yes.

Yes. These are all better pitches than Cisco getting mad about being called Benjamin. Right. Yeah. That was, yeah. Don't call me Benjamin. You know, thank God I never called him Benjamin. Last scene, we're back in the, we're back in the infirmary.

Verad wakes up to see Muriel. He's very sad. He says he feels empty. And Muriel says, you'll never be alone. She is just not giving up on him. No. She will not give up. And then Jad Zia wakes up.

She says she remembers all of it. and says, you know, has all his memories, all of Varad's memories. Another wonderful moment from Terry. Agreed. So good. Thank you. Thank you. Yeah. She says, I remember it all, everything that he thought, everything he did, and it's so sad. The way you delivered that line was beautiful.

It was just great. I believed it 100%. Yeah. You guys are making me feel so good. At the time, I was like, oh. You did such a great job. Here's my one criticism of this last scene, and it's a Les Landau criticism, because I felt like John Glover, and the very last shot is John Glover turning over into the foreground with everybody else behind him. And I thought, this is not a John Glover episode.

This is a Terry Farrell episode. Right. And her, your close up was like a big wide close up. John Glover's was in here. And I feel like the story, if Les had been toned or. instructed about where the focus of this story needs to land in the end it should have been on jad zia dax and not on john glover decks so flip-flop well i would have had this on tarry it's written and it's like a john glover episode and it or it of barad episode and it should have been

a jadzea dax episode agreed and why why couldn't you know hindsight is 2020 why couldn't have of Jatsia and Dax now, go over to Barad and put a hand on his shoulder. Right. You know? Yeah. Yeah. I understand your sadness. I feel for you.

Yeah. And maybe it's the next day because you have to remember, too, that Dr. Bashir was explaining how it can't, the symbiont also can't be popping back and forth. That's a lot of stress. Yeah. Be like if you took your gallbladder out. No, whoops. It's good. Let's put it back in.

Exactly. Yeah. You can't go run a marathon right after that, let alone walk across the room. There you go. There you go. Time for lessons, your lesson from this episode. Themes, lessons, morals, yes. Robbie, you want to start us off?

Yes, my theme, my moral, my lesson is accept yourself for who you truly are and don't try to be someone else. That's the lesson I took. All right. Terry, do you have one? I agree with Robbie. Mine's extremely similar. Yeah. Okay.

You do you. Armin. Yes. This one is a quote from some dictionary, but forgive me. To be deceived, this is from old English aphorism. To be deceived in one's own designs and expectations, the English say is to be cousined as the dog who thought that he was going to breakfast. and went to a hanging. You're so interesting, Armand.

Thank you, Terry. This is what I do for a living, though. Acting, that's just a horrible. But to deceive yourself. But deceive yourself into thinking that you have one thing when the reality is something else. To think that you are capable of being a trill host, to being a symbion host,

when in fact you aren't. that's that's that's that's a lesson for me i also had uh be very careful of what you dream your life will be um and uh and then one last lesson which was a quote from um mariel she said to cisco you never give up do you and i thought that was a theme of the show never give up never surrender yeah so my lesson i agree with all three of you i think all of you hit the nail on the head but my funny theme or moral or lesson would be never answer a distress call from outsiders during a plasma storm true that's all absolutely when you've got your own emergency going on you don't need to help other people involved in that

Mm-hmm. That's all. Thank you, Anson, Kim. Keep the door shut. Yeah. If there's a tornado, do you open the door? Hell no. No.

Let them fly away. You don't. Who's our Patreon winner? The winner of our Patreon poll for the theme moral of the episode is submitted by James Morrow. Someone's feelings of persecution do not justify hurting others. Hmm. Jimmy Morrow. That's good.

Yeah. That's very good. Yeah. I like that. James is a smart guy. All right. Excellent. Well, thank you, everyone, for tuning in to this episode of the Delta Flyers as we journey

through the wormhole. It was a special episode because we got to have both Armin and Terry join us. And what a joy that was. It was so much fun, so much fun. So join us next time as we review and recap and discuss the episode, Cardassians. you next time. Bye. Bye. And Patreon patrons, stay tuned for your bonus material.