The Delta Flyers - Past Prologue

Episode Date: December 11, 2023

The Delta Flyers is a weekly podcast hosted by Garrett Wang, Robert Duncan McNeill, Terry Farrell & Armin Shimerman. In each podcast release they will recap and discuss an episode of Star Trek: Deep Space Nine. This week’s episode is Past Prologue.Past Prologue: A member of the Bajoran underground seeks asylum on DS9, attracting the attention of Cardassians and Klingons, and testing Kira's loyalties.We want to thank everyone who makes this podcast possible, starting with our Production Managers Megan Elise & Rebecca McNeillAdditionally we could not make this podcast available without our Executive ProducersStephanie Baker, Jason M Okun, Marie Burgoyne, Kris Hansen, Janet K Harlow, Brian Barrow, Heidi Mclellan, Rich Gross, Mike Gu, Tara Polen, Vikki Williams, AJC, Nicholaus Russell, Lisa Robinson, Alex Mednis, James H. Morrow, Roxane Ray, Andrew Duncan, David Buck, Feroza Mehta, Jonathan Brooks, Gemma Laidler, Matt Norris, & Izzy JafferOur amazing Co-Executive Producers:Liz Scott, Eve England, Sab Ewell, Sarah A Gubbins, Luz R., Chris Knapp, Dannielle Kaminski, Utopia Science Fiction Magazine, Matthew Gravens, Captain Jeremiah Brown, Mary Jac Greer, E & John, Deike Hoffmann, Anna Post, Shannyn Bourke, Tom Paynter, Jenna Appleton, Lee Lisle, Sarah Thompson, Holly Smith, Amy Tudor, Mark G Hamilton, KMB, Dominic Burgess, Mary Burch, Sandra Stengel, Normandy Madden, Joseph Michael Kuhlman, Darryl Cheng, Elizabeth Stanton, Kayla Knilans, Tim Beach, Victor Ling, Shambhavi Kadam, Holly Schmitt, Christopher Arzeberger, Tae Phoenix, Donna Runyon, Nicholas Albano, Daniel O’Brien, Danie Crofoot, Ian Ramsey, Steven Lugo, Rob Traverse, Penny Liu, Mars DeVore, Stephanie Lee, & David SmithAnd our amazing Producers:Philipp Havrilla, James Amey, Patrick Carlin, Richard Banaski, Ann Harding, Meredith Hudes-Lowder, Trip Lives, Ann Marie Segal, Samantha Weddle, Chloe E, Paul Johnston, Carole Patterson, Warren Stine, Carl Murphy, Jocelyn Pina, Mike Fillmon, Chad Awkerman, Mike Schaible, AJ Provance, Captain Nancy Stout, Claire Deans, Maxine Soloway, Barbara Beck, Species 2571, Dat Cao, Stephen Riegner, Debra Defelice, Cindy Ring, Alicia Kulp, Kelly Brown, Jason Wang, Gabriel Dominic Girgis, Samantha Hunter, Jamason Isenburg, Ashley Stokey, Rob Johnson, Maria Rosell, Heather Choe, Michael Bucklin, Lisa Klink, Dominique Weidle, Jennifer Jelf, Louise Storer, Justin Weir, Mike Chow, Kevin Hooker, Marc McCallum, Ryan Benoit, Rachel Shapiro, Clark Ochikubo, David J Manske, Amy Rambacher, Jessica B, E.G. Galano, Tim Neumark, Will Forg, Ryan Tomei-Siguroarson, Charlie Faulkner, Estelle Keller, James Lyszczek, Russell Nemhauser, Lawrence Green, Greg Kenzo Wickstrom, Lisa Gunn, Lauren Rivers, Shane Pike, Jennifer B, Dean Chew, Akash Patel, Linda Daireaux, Jennifer Vaughn, Cameron Wilkins, Ken McCleskey, Walkerius Logos, PJ Pick, Preston Meyer, Lisa Hill, Benjamin Bulfer, Stacy Davis, Ryan Mahieu, Andrew Cook-Feltz, Karen Galleski, Pamela Miller, & Rik MoranThank you for your support!“Our creations are protected by copyright, trademark and trade secret laws. Some examples of our creations are the text we use, artwork we create, audio, and video we produce and post. You may not use, reproduce, distribute our creations unless we give you permission. If you have any questions, you can email us at [e-mail].”Our Sponsors:* Check out Mint Mobile: https://mintmobile.com/TDFSupport this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/the-delta-flyers/donationsAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brandsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

Welcome to the Delta Flyers Journey Through the Wormhole with Quark, Dax, and their good friends, Tom and Harry. Join us as we journey through episodes of Star Trek Deep Space Nine. Your hosts along this journey are Terry Farrell, your favorite science officer. Garrett Wong, our Forever Ensign, and myself, your favorite helmsman. Robert Duncan McNeil. Welcome, Terry. Welcome back to our, to our podcast. I'm so happy you're with us. Yes. This is so exciting. It is. Yeah. It is. Oh, my goodness. We're off and running after last week's incredible marathon of a pilot. I feel like Garrett and I were really anxious and nervous about talking about your show because we're not as familiar with it. I'm not as familiar.

So I want to do it right. I want to be perfect. I want to make you proud. Oh my gosh. Oh my gosh. You already make me proud. Please. For me, it's a new experience too because it's been so many years.

Yeah. I watched a few episodes back to back. And then I had to rewatch what we were doing today this morning because it gets so overwhelming to have all of these. I think one of the things that the writer, did really, really well was really flush out the characters. So there's things I know that I forget that I'm not supposed to know yet. Yeah.

I think that's why this one intimidates me more than our show, aside from the fact that I, you know, Garrett and I were on it, Voyager. What intimidates me about this is your show is really things are tied together. Stories and character and journeys are tied together. We just had to watch, you know, the story of the week. nothing was tied to cut there on our show. So it sort of made it simpler. This one is a little more intimidating, but it's exciting.

Okay, so we are doing birthdays now on this podcast for our Patreon subscribers. And we've got a few birthdays to read out. Mike Filman on December 11th. Happy birthday. Four from mine. Happy birthday. Yeah. We also have Carol Patterson, December 13th.

Happy birthday. Happy birthday. Estelle Keller. Thanks for being one of our Patreon subscribers. Happy birthday on December 13th to Estelle. We also have Justin Weir on December 14th. Happy birthday to Justin and all of our Delta Flyer Patreon subscribers. Thank you.

And that is the birthday of Megan, the 14th. So we have no, yes, Megan is December 14th. So that's our last Patreon birthday wish was the 14th. So no one on my birthday, correct? No one on the 15th. No, just so far. We'll see next week. No, Rob, it's crazy.

In all my life, I've met two people with that birthday, my birthday. It's so rare to find someone with the 15th. You're a December for birthday? December 15th. Yeah. My niece Brittany's birthday is on December 21st. Right. And my favorite guy in the whole world, Max Baker, my son, is on December 24th.

Oh, wow. Christmas. Eve, baby. Yeah. I didn't know that. We had a choice of the day before or the day after Christmas because he just didn't want to leave. Yep.

You want to stay in that comfortable womb. Who does? Who wants to leave? But 11. Oh, my gosh, 10 pounds, 12 ounces. It had to go. Wow. Excuse me?

It was me or him. Did you say, wait a minute. You just said 10 pounds, 12 ounces. That's a toddler. Robby, how much did you wait when you popped out? I was six pounds something. There's no way you were 10 pounds, Robbie. I'm going to say.

I think I was about five something. I was small-lish, I think. Oh, well, you got over it. Oh, did I? Okay, I also want to welcome our new profits. Thank you for signing up. David Buck is a prophet on Patreon. And Izzy Jaffer is a prophet.

Welcome to our new profits ever. Okay, welcome back, everybody. So we have all watched this episode, past prologue. I'm so excited to talk about it. We traditionally have our poetry synopsis. So I'll start with my Limerick. Do it. Here we go with my Limerick for Past Prologue.

Kira's old friend shows up at the station. He's looking for political salvation. Garrick asked Julian to come by. Is he a tailor or a spy? blowing up the wormhole was Tana's real motivation. Oh, I like it. What do you think?

I like it. I wanted to do good. Terry, tell me, were you happy? You did so good. I'm so happy. Here's my haiku for past prologue. Lose wants asylum. Tough decisions for Kira.

Bashir bought a suit. Oh, my God. I'm glad you got a suit. I tried to get sued. I know you wanted to get sued. suit in there. I was like, he didn't get suit in there. What? Well, that was a great haiku, Garrett. I really loved it. I'm jealous that you got the word suit. And you tried to get suit. But you tried to get suit in my limerick, but it didn't. It didn't fit. Quite

right. Quite a right. So, past prologue, written by Catherine Powers, directed by our good friend Rick Colby, who directed a pilot. Good old Rick. Yes. Yes. A great guest cast, Jeff Nordling, Andy Robinson, Gwyneth Walsh, Barbara March, Susan Bay, and Vaughn Armstrong. Good old Vaughn. My gosh, she's in everything. Unbelievable.

Yeah. This episode, Pass Prolog, aired on January 11th, 1993. So it's been a while. It's been a while since this one came out. Yep. In a hot minute. Yes, it has. Well, let's dive into it.

So we start off. We're in the Replomat. What the hell's a replemat, first of all? It's like an, automat, right? Isn't that where they got the name? Yeah, like think Jetsons. Oh, okay. It's to go and get food, right? Food and drink. It's like a little cafe. Well, like an old automat was the machines like in the 50s, you go put your quarter in and it's like a vending machine. It's a vending machine. Thank you. But it's a replicator machine. I get it. Okay. Now I know. So you say, I want a tuna sandwich.

It replicates a tuna sandwich. I wonder if it has the same nutritional value. That would be my question. We have discussed that I think. No, don't go there. You're going to go there? You're going to go there now. God dang it. We've discussed the replicators, where do they get their organic materials from the base of it? It's got to come from the poops.

I'm just saying it's got, we have to recycle poops. He's saying everything. Okay. On with the show. I told you, Robbie. I told you don't go there. Okay. Anyway, Bashir's.

eating in the replica map by himself. Garrick approaches. He introduces himself. Garrick is super friendly in this scene. Bashir thinks he's a spy, though, so he's terrified. And, you know, Garrick introduces himself, says, come by. I love in this scene, so many things. First of all, Bashir, I never realized Sid was so funny. Whenever I met him, he was so, he seemed so sophisticated and refined to me. I didn't realize he's such a comic relief. his first line he's both he's he stutters he's both he's so good but then physical comedy too right with that thing that that little piece of leaf in his face right he's just oh god he's adorable yeah the replomat i have a question terry about this um when you had like like a full house like when that place

was full because you in the replemate you saw down the corridor and everything right so you had to have your set had to be filled with extras background performers a lot right almost all the time i mean yeah i mean even if you when you pay attention to ops there's extras crossing in and out yeah yeah they were really good about having that so that we felt like we were really in a you know in an experience where people are living there yeah yeah that was my first impression in this scene i immediately went, oh, this is really different than our show because we didn't have, we had some regular crew, but we were lost in the Delta Quadrant with a limited crew. So we never had big, unless we were in the mess hall, maybe, but we never had big extra scenes like you guys. That

must have been a big undertaking. Yeah. Well, yeah, it was like being, well, that specific section of the promenade felt like being at a mall. Yeah. It just did. What stage was that on the, the that part of the promenade we were four no four was where ops was okay seven and whatever the turn set was what do they call that i forgot this the swing set yeah swing set thank you um and then right next to us did he say it was seven i don't remember because i lived in front of four so four was sort of my that was your orientation yeah so in the replimat Bashir is very very nervous Garrick is super, super friendly. He says, I've got a clothing shop.

If you need any clothes, any apparel, please come visit him at your disposal. Bashir calls him Mr. Garrick, and Garrick corrects him. He goes, no, no, no, Garrick, plain, simple Garrick, which reminded me of my very first, one of my first lines on Voyager where I said, tomato soup, plain, hot, tomato soup. It was the same sort of cadence. Yeah, there's some parallels here between our show and, is nine for sure. I also love at the end of the scene where they speak in unison, Bashir, when he's, when Garrick says, oh, it's just Garrick, plain, simple,

Garrick. When he says Garrick, Bashir simultaneously in unison, says it, Garrick, with his stutter. It's very funny. God, I love Bashir. You're team Bashir. Right now, I am team Bashir. Yeah. I got to say. Goodness. That won't, that won't change. I don't think it will. When you see him, What do you say to him now? Because you know how he went from Siddig and Elfadil? It's a nickname. He calls me TAL.

That's short for Terry. Love it. And I call him Diggs. It's short for Siddig. Yeah. Instead of Sid, so we both had nicknames for each other. That's so cool.

Yeah. But I think of him as Sadeg El Fidel. I don't think of him as Alexander Sadegh. That feels like, who's that. Yeah. Who's that human being? But most people called him Sid, right? Yeah.

My favorite. character so far, Bashir, exits, exits the lift onto Ops, the floor of Ops. He is telling everyone how excited he is that Garrick, the spy, wants to get to know him and maybe he can, you know, see some spy action. He asked for like a monitor so he can spy on Garrick and give them information. And basically everybody in Ops thinks it's adorable, but they don't take it too seriously. And then there's an alert that sounds. And And a Cardassian ship is spotted chasing this Bajoran ship firing at it. And they've entered, they've crossed into the wrong territory.

They're in Bajoran space. Yeah, they're in Bajoran space. And the Bajoran aboard, we'll learn his name is Tana Lose later on. But he requests an emergency beam out. And he beams right there into ops, which I have to say again, I love that you have a transporter pad on your bridge. it's incredible it's incredible but he sees kira and they know each other and he asked for asylum and that's our teaser that's how we end the teaser so kira sees an old friend who's being

chased by kardassian what's going on we will see i like the beeman how he's in that huddled position a lot of times we don't do that on voyager we just beam in standing up but he was like when he beamed in so well he had to be right because his ship was it was uh about to explode. Yeah, but we've been people in from ships on Voyager that are about to explode and they still beam in standing up. They don't beam in sitting down. They don't.

I don't know why. They should have, but they, yeah, it's weird. I think that would be, correct me if I'm wrong, Robbie, but I would think that would be the director making sure that you look like you're coming from whatever the stressful situation you came from if you looked like you forgot it, which to me, if he were standing, it would look like, did you not remember that you were just coming from a show? ship that's about to explode, you should, you should be huddled because that's exactly the position you would have been in.

I love when there's a beam in and as the beam, the beam in finishes, the person falls or, you know, as if they got, like they pass out. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Molecularly.

Yeah. Me too. I think that's cool. You like that word, huh? I do. Molecularly. You didn't know I could say it. Molecularly.

Five syllable word. You get bonus. points for that. I'm almost doing a haiku. Shut up. Okay, so we see, we see Kara's new haircut in this scene. Love. Better. Better. There's Kira. Like, hello, now she's here. Yeah. She's not like your hair going to the prom. Oh, she must have been so happy. When we first see her, it's ridiculous. Then later in the pilot, it does change. It does change a little bit.

The style change, but it was still a wig. It was still the haircut. No, no, no, it's her hair. Oh, that was her hair? Yeah. Oh, I thought it was a wig. I assume it's a wig because everybody on our show wore wigs. Yeah, that's-Roxan wore wigs, Kate wore wig. Everybody wore wigs. I had a three-quarter fall. Did you? I was going to ask you. So you had a bit of a addition. Did you go through multiple hair tests? Did you go through different styles? Like, was there until they finally came upon the final one with a single ponytail? Yeah. Yeah. They put a bun in the beginning on you, trying that out? Like, or was it just straight to the ponytail? I don't remember all the style.

I don't because I think that was probably one of the easiest things to solve. Yeah. For you guys. Okay. Yeah. I mean, for me, they went through so much drama with my makeup. I think once they settled on that look, then it was more a matter of how high should my hair go. You know, that weird.

It looked a little high in this episode, higher than I remember. Just that I, it'll kind of. There's a huge there. Yeah, you got some height. Like my spot sometimes are like, whoa. And other times it's just like. Right on the edge. I like it when it's a little.

So there's a little ebb and flow of your spots at times. Yeah, because they're hand-painted. I know. Yeah. I know. Well, Armin stole my thunder there. He wasn't realizing it. It was like, no, let me talk about my makeup.

I'm going to talk about your makeup. Armin. I know. I still love Armin. Like, love Armin. Who doesn't love Armin? I didn't get the hearts that time. You got to hold it longer.

You got to hold it longer. Three, two, one. See, I love Armin. Even though I hold it wrong, it doesn't do it. Look at that. Robbie, I'm heartless. I know. You are heartless.

Do you need an upgrade? Is that what's happening? Are you not an apple guy? I have apple. What are you talking about? You're a bad apple. Okay. I have to say something here.

When this guest actor beamed in, I looked at him and I was like, God, he looks so familiar. And it wasn't until halfway through this episode that I realized it was Jeff Nordling. who I know, who I've worked with a bunch, who Jeff Nordling, who plays Tana, actually the very first thing I ever wrote, a short play, Jeff read, did the staged reading of that play that I wrote in West L.A. at a little theater. Wow. I've known Jeff for a long, long time. But I didn't even recognize him because he was so young. Oh, that's what it was. It was like, and he had a little makeup on, but I was like, I know that guy. I know that guy. It wasn't until three or four scenes. in that I was like, it's Jeff Nordling.

Yeah. Next we go to Ops. After our opening credits, medics are wheeling Tanna, Jeff Nordling away. And the Cardassian commander, Galdinar, Vaughn Armstrong hails them.

They basically want Tana turned back over. He's a criminal. Cisco tells Galdonar that he's asked for asylum, but that Galdonar can dock and come aboard to discuss. and after he ends the call, I love when Cisco goes over to O'Brien and says,

make up some docking regulations to stall. Like, don't let him come on board too quickly. We need to go, me and Kira are going to go see Tana. So I love that. And I thought that was great. I love the fact that he was talking about delay people docking. Is that something that you guys could do? Was that like a runner that like, because it's a docking station.

So we didn't have that same kind of setup. But is that something when you were dealing with bad guys, like don't let them dock or things like that. Was that a common thing? Yeah, I think so because also you think of our TSA. This is pre-TSA heavy duty security, right? But for Deep Space Nine, obviously Voyager 2, we're so far in the future that that would be a normal. Yeah. It's a basically it's like a little country, a teeny weaning little country and people are coming in and out of it. I want to say about the docking. When creatures, creatures, aliens, humanoids, what do we call beings come on the station with with guns and whatnot i would i question how they

even get past that and get them on to the promenade yeah how is that possible yeah so that's a question that's going to come up later absolutely the cling on and i i had also had notes there because you said that i thought it was important to say yeah because that's interesting but that that would make sense i mean you could pull somebody aside when you go through customs right and go to the customs official and then they make you go through all your stuff. I've done that before. I've gotten stuck and then, especially going back and forth

to Canada so much. I've gotten stuck sometimes where I've got to go. Secondary inspection. Wait. Yes. Yes. I got stuck once because I had this little, there was this, I have a tan color, but it used to be this rice powder from Japan and it was white, right?

Yeah. And you do it just to like get the little greasy spots when you model. Take the shine away. Way back. I was probably like, I don't know, early 20s, 21, 22. And I was coming home from England. A boyfriend of mine was doing a movie over there. And we were coming back through customs after six months. They thought it was cocaine.

And oh, my God, I was just like, it's not. But like, I don't know why, even when you know you're right, how that can be such a terrifying situation. Like, please don't take them into a room all by myself. And my boyfriend turned to me. And he goes, if you start crying. right now, I'm going to slap you. What?

And it was like, it was like he slapped me just by saying that. And I was like, okay, right, don't get caught up. And you're not in trouble. You didn't do anything wrong. You've got makeup. Yeah. And it was like the, it was actually really smart of him to, you know, get me back into the real moment.

Right. Because if you get emotional. Yeah, it was really scary. Yeah, you're implementing yourself in a way. If you get emotional. I didn't do anything. I know. But it, but it did what I thought, oh.

No wonder they think that it kind of does look exactly like that. Sure. But basically it's chalk. It's funny that you bring up pre-TSA or pre-911 that DS9 was all made before 9-11 happened. And back in those days, planes, you know, going to airports was easy. I mean, there was a metal detector and that was about it. Like they didn't check much of anything. Customs was the biggest thing that we went through.

Yeah. If you went out of the country, that's why I compared it to going to another country as it keeps me because that was the only time that that happened. Well, Cisco basically said pull a full TSA on this guy. Yes. And don't let him come on board. So, yes, full, yeah, secondary inspection. Disco is delaying him. And then Kira and Cisco get on the turbo lift.

They start to ride. They have a very tense conversation about terrorists, these pejoran terrorists, Kohn Ma, which is the first time. Yeah, Kahn. First time I've heard about them. Those are the bad guys. Can I just stop for one quick second? That turbo lift, the one in ops, you know how it resembles the, we had a turbo, we had sort

of a similar elevator in engineering where it would go from one level to another. But the one that you guys have in DS9, it's open when it gets up into ops, when it drops below, it becomes a regular turbo lift. You know what I'm saying? It doesn't, does that make sense, Robbie? It's open to the, there's no barriers. Yeah, it's like, on ops. yeah it's almost like a cargo elevator up top you know like no yeah it shuts it does it shuts and then

you go down yeah doesn't it i never i thought it was going down you see you going down there is nothing down there yes we know that but i think okay yeah but but i'm saying the it's typically we had two types of turp we had the turbo lift where the doors open you go in it closes and it goes door shut, solid doors. But then in our engineering, we had an open sort of like lift that had a railing that looks exactly like yours, similar to yours, in Ops. And it would just go from level one to two, two to one in engineering. It didn't go anywhere else. But I thought from what I was watching, Robbie, that the one in Ops turns into a regular over. I don't, no, I think it's open at the bottom. But to Terry's point, when they were on the Ops set. Yes. And someone got on that

lift and it started to go down it didn't go really to another set that's on another stage right yes yes so they just go that down to nothing and to cut into the next now we're going inside the turbo lift yeah yeah yeah but you know what I'm saying Robbie it has no walls and then all sudden it's completely enclosed is what it is it once it leaves I don't think it's enclosed I think when I'm going to pay better attention Kira and Cisco go down open yeah it leave ops and when we see them on the promenade, it's finishing coming down and they're still open. I think it's open on both. Okay. So Ops is directly above the promenade then is what it is. And it just goes right into the promenade. It's still open right there. Okay. It must. So it's, and it's really not a turbo

did you ever think of that, Terry? Uh, no, I didn't put that much thought into it. I remember I thought that the ring was the promenade, that it just, we see this one part with corks, but that it literally goes all the way around. Right. Oh, yeah, it could. It probably does. second you see the windows so but i didn't i thought ops was in the center i think that elevator seems to go straight down in our story into the promenade so then it would go straight oh gosh oh my brain hurts the only set of the promenade you had was the one with quirks over there yes yeah but it but it wrapped around it implied that there was more yes it implied that it was thank you i think it's It's mislabeled. It shouldn't be called a turbo lift then. A turbo lift moves at a fast speed. That's just a regular lift. Just a lift only. Let's move on to the promenade. Kira and Cisco get down. They're arguing. The argument escalates. Cisco even grabs her arm at one point. It gets really heated very quickly. He grabs her. He says he will not tolerate terrorists on this station. And Kira, instead of going, yes, sir, she kind of tops him. She says, I want to, you know, I always have wanted a. I always have wanted a.

strong pejoran society and integrating splinter groups like this even terrorists may be necessary so she goes toe to toe with him i thought that was that was really a great scene i love that scene being able to open up to kira right away first of all bravo to nana visitor excellent episode for her all the way around. But I love watching her negotiate this new way of being for herself because you think of her being in Kohn Ma. So that's pretty heavy duty. That's like, what? I can't even imagine having that headset to be a terrorist and then to come and turn your life around to be a part of the integration. And that's, yeah, part of the solution.

So this is a very big episode watching her live out this experience and find a new way of accepting where she's at and how she can protect the Bajoran people. And I love that she stood up to him. Yeah, I did too. I thought it was great. And I will say, like, this is the right episode to have after the pilot because it's, we need to know what the politics of this place are it's exactly the right kind of episode for the series and like you said a great episode for nana i thought it was great yeah here goes into the infirmary next

and bachir is treating tana he's got very bad wounds from multiple recent battles and kira reassures him that he that she is still fighting for bayjor in her own way and cisco arrives he ask her to leave and decides to conduct this interview alone. He can see that Kira is biased, I guess, to say the least. To say the least, not only that, but she also seemed like maybe she had some kind of a thing with him, the way she was very intimate, how she leaned in with him and all of that. It felt like they had a romantic.

Yeah. Yes, it did. Something. Yeah. And why not? I mean, he's a great looking guy. Oh, yeah. Jeff Nordling is super.

handsome. Super handsome man. He was so handsome, I didn't recognize him immediately. Yeah. So Tana tells Cisco that he has been commuted for all of his crimes. And he was punished for crimes committed against Cardassians, you know, over half a century ago. But he's had enough of killing. He basically declares his innocence here. And as Cisco leaves, Tana's head sort of turned. towards the camera and he looked evil and I was like I don't believe anything you just said but Cisco bought it so yeah yeah what is up with the bumps that were on his forehead and then they disappear at the end of the scene is that a is that a Bajoran not extra nostril is he breathing through that what's what's going on I did not know what they seemed to they seemed to change they were

completely they were prominent and then they went flat It's like, it was like, it was like, well, those bladders in your, in your, when you were in, you know, your lizard costume, Robbie. It was like a bladder in there, you know, or something. There used to be a piece, there was the nose and there was a little piece that little like flangey. Like a tea up here above the eyebrows. Yes. Because it looked terrible. But they took that off of, off of, but they didn't take it off of him.

He still had it is what I'm saying, you know. All the Bajorans seem a little different. Like when I look at the background, Bajoran. Yeah. They're finding their way. with makeup, just like we are with the storytelling. Sure, sure. Yeah.

But I'm just wondering, what was that flange supposed to be? I don't even understand the purpose of it. Breathing. That's why it's not there. I have to ask, when he's shirtless, Jeff Nordling is shirtless, hairy chest, and Bashir is talking about all these horrible scars. And it looked like pink spray paint on his chest. Yeah.

I was like, that's horrible torture? No. They should have shaved the chest and then added scars. But it looks so much better when I'm able. just has his chest hair. Oh, he looked great. It just didn't work with the pink spray paint. No, it didn't work.

We go to Kira's quarters next. There's Kira talking to Admiral Rulman. And she's basically tattletailing. She's telling the Admiral that Cisco doesn't understand the issues. He's not handling this right. And the Admiral thanks, Kira. So it seems like Kira's kind of started to stir up some trouble for Siss. Yeah, that's a poor choice to go around your, you know,

superior officer to try to yeah no above above yeah around underneath above i mean to susan nemoi no doubt yes yes that makes it worse i think the next scene is in op Cisco comes in uh and o'brien tells him that the cardassians have docked but dax is delaying them so she's the brains of the operation up there She's taken care of the TSA, full TSA on the Cardassians. And he also tells Cisco that you wouldn't want to turn anybody over to the Cardassians. Very ominous kind of, you know, you may not know the Cardassians and what they do, but take it from me. You don't, even my worst enemy, I wouldn't turn over to them. And then he gets a call from Admiral Roman, so he heads to his office.

But that's important that Miles O'Brien shares this. you wouldn't want to turn anybody over. That's going to come back to be part of his strategy later. Yeah. And we learn a little bit about Cardassians, you know? I mean, for us, Robbie and I, we're like, oh, they're vicious. And they're, you know, they do all kinds of really hardcore things that you don't want to have done to you. So now we know.

Because it's only the third episode. Yeah. Yeah. Cisco goes into his office. The admiral basically tells Cisco, she's kind of upset that Kira rudely interrupted a staff meeting to complain about him. And the admiral basically says, I think you've got a problem, commander, with this Kira, this Kira lady, this Bajoran troublemaker. So Sisko just sits on that. He's got the information.

He sits on it. We go to the infirmary next. Kira's there. She comes in and kind of startles Tana awake. He must have PTSD from being a terrorist for so long because he jumps up, very scared. And he does say something. He wonders if she's lost her old fire. working with Starfleet.

So he's fishing a little bit here. He asks if she's going to let Cisco turn him over to the Cardassians. Do you think your commander's going to do this? And she says, nope, over my dead body and leave. So that's some reassurance for him that she's still on team terrorist, he thinks. Team Tannen.

Yes. Team Tana. Tana. Tana. Tana. Tana. Tana. Yeah.

The one thing I noticed in this when he asks about, Cisco he says to Kira you know what about your commander you and Cisco do you get along and she says like oil and water which I thought was an interesting you know admission from her that she's telling him that she does not like Cisco yet does that continue Terry like does that kind of combative with Cisco and Kira is that kind of a running theme you have to stay tuned That's a good answer. Tell me, I have so many questions from this episode. We can talk about this episode, but I think we'll shoot ourselves in the foot if we start jumping ahead.

Yeah, that's good because most people already have seen the whole series, right? I'm dying to know, though. I'm dying to know so many things. Good. You'll say too. Andy Robinson, is he really a spy? Is he a good guy or bad guy? I can't tell right now.

I don't know, but let's save that. Let's save that. Let's keep going. We go to the commander's office, Golden R is there talking to Cisco. he's very angry about all these unnecessary docking delays. Thank you, Dax. He wants this prisoner turned over immediately. Cisco basically says, nope, for now he's going to grant him asylum.

I love this scene. Again, Rick Colby directing. I love his low angles. The way he stages scenes is so elegant and beautiful, especially when Cisco gets up from the desk and he's basically kicking Gouldonar out. And it's this long shot that sort of tracks him around slowly. as he's being, you know, super cool and elegant as he walks to the door and hits the door button, cool as a cucumber.

I thought it was great. I think what makes this scene go is Von Armstrong's performance. I think he was absolutely dead on. He knocked this out of the park. I think this guest star role was better than the guest star roles he did on Voyager. I'm going to say right now, he really, really did so well in this. I was so impressed. Yeah.

I love Vaughn. Yeah, that's great. How many episodes did Vaughn do of your show? Do you know? I mean, you don't have to know the exact number. Oh, I have no idea. It was a lot, probably, right? I have no idea.

I really don't. Yeah. Well, it'll be interesting to see. Think about it 30 years ago. Right. Yeah. I'm where you guys were at watching episode three of your show. I'm like, I don't remember that with him.

You sound like Robbie. Robbie's like, I don't remember that. Well, it's funny. Like, we had an actress, Martha Hackett, who played Cessco in our show. And if you had asked me before this. podcast how many episodes Martha's great yeah you had said to me how many episodes did martha do a Voyager I would have said oh 20 30 maybe she did like six or seven I can't remember but you see I was shocked seeing Andy in this episode because I thought I didn't remember

him being there right at the beginning but of course he was because I said I to him but I mean yeah I don't know you just don't think about it after time goes by right yeah and we were all shocked seeing JG on the pilot too right right that was so great It's so bizarre to see him as a Vulcan. Wow. Yeah. Super weird. I didn't even know about Susan either.

I was like, that was kind of wild. I didn't know what Susan was. We were. Back then, you didn't. Filming it. No. All right. So Von Armstrong gets kicked out of Cisco's office and we go to Tana's quarters.

Kira opens a door showing Tana his new quarters. He loves his civilized quarters. But he doesn't like the Federation being here. And they talk about how much he wants Bajoran independence, doesn't want this interference from the Federation or anybody else. Kira does bring up, she says, you know, now that the wormhole's been discovered, things are a little different commerce opportunities for us, you know. But she does promise him that she's going to work on his behalf.

If he's truly done with the conma, if he's done being a terrorist, then she will help him. And he assures her that he is done with that. And he even offers, he says, maybe I can get a couple more Khan Ma to join me to come to your side, Kira. So he's offering up some more ammunition, I guess, or more temptations for her to trust him. And this is the scene where I realized it was Jeff Nordling, by the way. I was like, I had to stop and go, oh, my God, that's Jeff Nordling. I finally recognize him. He didn't have pink paint.

He didn't have. He had his clothes on. He had his clothes on. Yeah, I don't know him with his clothes off. this was a great scene another creepy look at the end by the way he's so he's so passionate is he the king of creepy looks he is in this episode i think rick colby did a lot of like tag looks in lots of scenes oh my god that's the way done voyager as well so yeah lots of like turn back to the camera for a nice

you know close up don't tell too much but just give us a little huh yeah yeah there was always a little extra at the end of most of these scenes we go to the promenade next there's two cling on females there being detained by a deputy they've refused to surrender their weapons and otto comes and gives them a choice to surrender their weapons or leave the station and they reluctantly comply i will say at the top of the scene the guards are holding the cling on women with their their weapons and the guards have weapons and i was like finally somebody's got a weapon on this ship because that really confused me that there were no weapons i'm so used to seeing phasers and you know well um but like we said in the pilot in that altercation that happened on the promenade cisco did have his phaser and he shot

to the side of yeah the criminals obviously didn't shoot someone right yeah but in this case then i would say to you we're going back to you went through the uh federation tsa how did you get on the promenade with your playing on weapons. On those actresses were excellent, by the way. That is like one of those scenes where you're like, it's a tiny little bite of something.

And they were like a meal. That was a meal. They were completely in it. Yeah, these characters have been used in the feature films as well. So I don't know. Yeah. So I don't know if this. Those two actresses?

Yes. They were in one of the, they're super popular because they did such a good job on one of the Star Trek feature films. I'm wondering if this episode took place after their feature film appearance or this was their intro to Trek and then they were used later for feature. Yeah, I'm not sure. Yeah, but they are.

Yeah, but it was excellent. Yeah, people love those too. So the sisters, the Dura sisters. I can see why. I love them. They're amazing. Yeah, they're good. I had another question.

So I love your question. How did they get through the TSA with the rifles? The Klinger rifles. And it seems like somebody would have stopped in there. And they look scary. It's not like, oh, mom's coming through with a machine gun. It's like, whoa. No, it's Klingons.

Yeah. The other thing is like, why is there a crowd five feet away from this armed standoff? No one's ducking for cover. Deputies with weapons drawn. They're all like, they're really close. It's like this Odo has to come through the crowd who's like two feet away from this arm standoff. That's so true.

Yeah, a little ridiculous. Yeah, go for cover. How about some of you guys go break for lunch? Exactly. Exactly. Oh, my word. Oda does take the weapons from them and welcomes them to DS9, which I thought was very cute. We go to the commander's office and then Odo shows up and he tells Cisco that these two

Klingon sisters have arrived and he checked on the database. They are listed as Klingon Renegades. So they're not, you know, they're runaways. They're wanted, you know, these two. They're bad girls. Yes. Well, they try to start a revolution, right? They try to grab control of the Klingon High Council.

Yeah, the Klingon High Council. This is a huge deal. They started a small civil war. Yes. Yeah. That's what these two do. Oh, my gosh. And then they just waltzed right into DS9 with their weapons drawn and nobody stopped them.

Yeah. They're not the Dera sisters to me. They're the chaos sisters to me. Exactly. So that's a little bit of a, huh. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, that seems like security should beef up their, I mean, laws and rules don't mean anything if you don't enforce them. Enforce it. Agreed. Hey, Garrett, have you been traveling this summer? Oh my gosh, so much already. I don't always travel, but this summer's been insane. Trip after trip. You've been doing your impersonation of me. Yes. You know what doesn't belong in everyone's epic summer plans, though? What? Getting burned by your old. wireless bill. So while you're planning your beach trips and your barbecues and your three-day weekends, your wireless bill should be the last thing holding you back. Well, that is why I made the switch to Mint Mobile. The coverage and speed are the same as I'm used to, but the savings. That is the difference. The savings are incredible. And now I'm saving all kinds of money for when my

stepdaughter wants to go back to school shopping. She's currently at the mall right now as we speak. Well, all the Mint Mobile plans come with high-speed data, unlimited talking tax, and they deliver the nation's largest 5G network. So this year, skip breaking a sweat and breaking the bank. Get this new customer offer and your three-month unlimited wireless plan for just 15 bucks a month at mintmobile.com slash TDF. That's mintmobile.com slash TDF. Up front payment of $45 required, equivalent to $15 a month. Limited time new customer offer for first three months only. Speeds may slow above 35 gigabytes on unlimited plan. Taxes and fees extra. See Mint Mobile for details. Well, Odo is not happy about these two women that have showed up. He wants to lock

him up. He wants to call the Klingons, turn him over. And Cisco says, no. I love he says at the end, he says, you know, under Cardassian rule, things may have been oppressive, but at least it was simple. It's like Odo longs for some of the Cardassian tough on crime or whatever, I guess. It made me think of the Wild West. Like, Odo was the sheriff and his His rules were way more important than the actual laws. Yeah. Okay. So now we're at Quarks and the Klingon sisters are sitting upstairs and Bashir approaches Garrick.

Garrick says, you know, as the clothier, he likes to watch what people are wearing around the promenade. And he's very interested in the Klingon sisters clothes, he says. And then he notices Tana arrive and the sisters jump up to join him. And Odo, who's come into the, to the, I guess. this is yeah this is quarks so they're all kind of mingling otos come in and sees tana and the sisters uh you know meeting up in in that scene so everybody's suspicious of we're starting to see the tana that tana knows these klingon sisters and that's probably why they're here they've got something going on um i love this wide shot over the sisters from the balcony

again i'm just so impressed with the background performers the size and scale of your show. It's huge. The set was huge. A lot of places to shoot from, which is awesome. Yeah. Beautiful. Yeah.

Beautiful. Not without its challenges. Of course. We had Rick on, you know, or even Jonathan. Jonathan West. Yes. Thank you. I was like, Frakes came to my mind and I'm like, no.

That's not who you're thinking of. I like, though, that you could see that they were far enough away that the Klingons and Tana Lowe. Tonalos. Monolos. Oh, my word. See? Can you imagine trying to shoot me with a three-page monologue? And anyway, I like that it felt like we were sort of spying on them.

They didn't see us seeing them. So that was important too, I thought, that it added to this sort of conspiracy that's happening, this thing that's evolving. Yeah. The multiple levels of that set are such a great part of creating this community, this village that of people, you know, there's lots of places to hide and be private or look down on someone else. I can imagine that that set is going to be the perfect environment for stories coming up because it was great for this scene. Beautiful set. Yeah. So they connect and we cut into a cargo bay or a storage area and the doors open. The Clingon women come in, Tana's with them. They're

going to someplace private. And as they come through the door and walk off camera, camera, this rat runs by the foreground. And I was like, ew, it was creepy rats. You had rats on your space station? Oh, you can't, no, it turns out to be Odo. Yes. But still, if he's going to, if he's going to take on. Did he stop watching that?

I know, he's at the end. No, but I'm saying. Yes, we have Cardassian rats. We do. There's an episode coming up where I'm part of, I'm part of the crew trying to get rid of the rats. I can't remember what they're calling. Okay.

Can you call them Cardassar rats? Cardassian rats. That was, but that was my point is like, when I first saw a rat, I was like, ooh. And then my next thought was, wait, they're out in space. They wouldn't have any rats out here. But there are. They do have card. Okay.

So he was taking the cover of a Cardassian rat. Got it. Got it. Okay. Anyway, the rat runs across. The Klingon sisters meet Ton in the corner. They want their gold from him. He says it's on this way, that they're going to have it tomorrow.

They kind of threaten him and say, you know, you better have it. And then they leave. And then the rat that we thought was just background of the top scene turns into Odo. And it was a great shot because it started on the rat down on the ground. It started to kind of morph. And then it tilted up through some foreground or something.

And the morph continued up to turn into Odo. It was really well done, really elegant. I thought it was great. I thought it was too. It was cool. Robbie and Terry, here is my question. If Odo can shape shift into a rat, an identical version of a Cardassian rat, why, when we see him walking around, can't he make his face look perfectly human or perfectly Cardassian or perfectly Bajoran? Why does he have that look of sort of like a hockey mask looking?

It makes no sense to me. It's like, why do you look like you have a weird face, right? How does he say it's hard to look human and then he can look hair for hair? Exactly. Like a rat or a chair or whatever he does. You know, he changes into anything identically. But yet in his normal, you know, bi-pedo or look. Why couldn't we have this Renee O'Bersionwall with his own face?

Hi. Yeah, where he wouldn't have to go through makeup. And maybe if he got tired, it started to look like that. That would be one thing. Oh, yes. Like he was running out of energy. He has to regenerate that it starts to kind of look like, yes. He's got to go in the mask look.

We just improved on the show. We just improved on it. We just made the show better. Right? And if Renee were alive, he would love this idea. If he were alive, he would be like, oh, my gosh, get the shit off of my face. We could AI him right now. So, you know, you know.

Mm-hmm. Yeah. Well, great scene. So we see that Odo has heard all of this. And it was a great use of the budget to spend it on that particular moment. Yes. Right? I think so.

Yeah. We go up to ops. Cisco comes into ops, and Kira is just super energetic here. She's getting the ministers council on board for amnesty, for Tana. And she even says that Tana told her that two more Kahnma terrorists are coming to join him if Cisco promises to keep them safe. And Cisco agrees. She thanks Cisco.

A really sweet moment here where she's like, you know, I really want to thank you for helping me. And I couldn't have done any of this without. you and so you feel this oil and water sort of melting a little bit and then he says well remember that the next time that you talk to the admiral if you go over my head again it will not be pretty basically so it will be on a platter that could be pretty i don't know yes well the gnaz pretty but i think she'd like to keep her head on her shoulders yes yes great turns really great energy in the scene It was just, I was, you know, moment to moment was so authentic and great. I love the staging with Rick Colby had Cisco kind of moving through the ops section, and they ended up on some stairs.

So it went from this sort of equal height to all of a sudden, Avery is standing two, three feet above her, looking down when he threatens her. And I loved the little subtle, you know, status of high and low and using those angles. Bravo, Rick. I thought that was great. Yeah, Bravo to Rick and all the directors that, like, really, and he's one of them, it's a visual medium. Yeah. So, you know, we're using, we're using the words, and all of us are using the words at the base, but the actors are doing underlines. You're doing what you're feeling, right? What's in between the lines. And Rick Colby's doing a great job of visually helping us tell the story, too. And I think that that's one of the reasons I really like this episode, too.

There's so many layers of authentic reality of what Odo and Cisco and Kira are all going through. Our heroes are going through in trying to balance the Federation and the Bajoran conflict that's happening. Yeah, Rick had such a light touch as a director, my memory. I always felt like he had a very light touch in terms of pushing you as an actor one way or the other, but he knew how to get you into the right kind of staging or the right position or the right emotional levels that would just amplify the story's subtexts and message. So he was so good. I loved him.

He's a very Zen thing about him if I remember, right? Yeah. Yeah. Until he lost his cool. And then that temper came out now and that. Yeah. But usually he was very. You didn't want to upset him.

But most of the time. No. Yeah. We go to the commander's office, Cisco comes in. Odo is there waiting for him. Odo tells him that Tana and the sisters have some kind of secret business arrangement. And Cisco thinks that maybe the other two Bajorans that Kira just mentioned might be bringing, you know, bringing the gold that Odo overheard. Cisco doesn't want Kira to know yet, though.

So he just takes this information, listens to it. The one thing I noticed in this scene was the close talk. talking. Me too. Did you notice that? What? They were like this. No.

What was that? That was so uncomfortable. Garrett and I've talked about this on our show a lot. It happens on Voyager a lot. They would force us to get so close, unnaturally close to each other to try to hold that shot. And you were always like, really? Always for the camera. It's always for the camera.

Especially those two. I would never think those two would, that energy. It's like, talk. It was like toxic masculinity having the two of them be an inch away from each other. The close talking was the only thing in the scene that bumped me. Otherwise, I thought it was great. I like the lack of coverage. There was very little coverage.

It played in kind of one long staging. Again, Rick Colby was so good at that, you know, creating kind of movement and not jumping into close-ups right away. I thought it was great. But, yeah, Cisco doesn't want to tell Kira about what's, what they know. We go to Garek's shop next. The Klingon sisters have arrived. Garrick offers to make some silk lingerie for them or something.

They get very offended. They get very offended about that. But he offers to make them some clothes. And they don't want clothes. They want to make a deal to turn over Tana. So they ask what Tana is worth. And Garrick writes out a number on his pad. shows them a number. They're very insulted. They start to leave. And he says, wait, wait a minute. Maybe we can

negotiate. There's always room to negotiate. This is where I was like, is, is Garrick a good guy or a bad guy? I can't tell whose side he's on. And maybe that's the running theme here for his character. Good scene, though. I like it. Yeah. I like that we are questioning him. There's a lot of things we're questioning about Garrick in my mind, though. A lot of things. I don't know if he's on the Cardassian side. I don't know if he really likes Bashir, if he's trying to use him in some way.

I don't get that. There's nothing about him seems genuine to me. No, no. Except for that he makes clothes. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Yeah.

I did like the moment from Andy Robinson when the Cardassian women are insulted about the lingerie and they go to like, like grab him or something. And it felt like Andy's reaction, the way he jumped, felt real. The Klingon women. Yes, from the Klingon women. You called them Kardashians. It's okay.

Oh. The Alpha Quadrant species aren't big in the Delta quadrant. But I did marry a Klingon. You should know that, man. She should really. Klingon? Yeah. I did not know that about her.

Yeah. A lot of Taurus. Love Roxanne. So I know about Klingons. And I get why Andy Robinson jumped. Yeah. I was smart of him, actually. He offers some a price, offers to negotiate.

He even says at the very end of the scene, I am no more than what I seem to be, a merchant trying to make the best transaction. And I wrote down, oh, no, he's a lot more than that. He's claiming to be a simple guy, but I think he's much more complicated than that. We go to Tana's quarters next. Kira arrives, tells Tana that he is going to get amnesty. He's very surprised. and admits that he didn't expect that she could do it before he came. And this is where she's starting to realize that he lied

and that he's had another plan this whole time. And he admits, yes, I did have another plan, but it's a nonviolent plan, he promises. And it'll get everything that Badra ever wanted. He just needs her help. He needs a ship capable of warp speed. And she asks, well, what is the plan? And he says, I'm not going to tell you that.

you have to decide whether you're loyal to Bejure or we'll know where your loyalties are depending on what you decide. So she's put in a tough position here. Yeah. He doesn't believe in compromise in the situation. He's not feeling safe until she makes a decision to live her old life, basically. This is a really tough episode for her because, yeah, she's also, she trusts. He trusted him and assumed that he was sort of making the same choices she was making, which is to work together with the Federation.

But her assumptions were not crazy. He led her to believe this, too. Right. We go back to the replemate. Garrick joins Bashir at a table. Garrick says, you know, there's a real concern that two conma terrorists are talking with Tana and he wants to know why. says together, maybe they can find out. He tells Bashir to come buy a new suit in his shop at precisely 20, 55 hours, precisely.

So that's basically Garrick. Garrick is now, again, I was confused. I'm like, wait, I thought he was kind of helping the Kardashians with those Klingons. He was going to make a deal. But now it doesn't seem that way. I don't know what he's doing. I did like in the scene how when he first arrives, Bashir says, ah, plain simple Garrick, how are you today?

It's like the running line. He just wants to be know, everybody to know him is plain simple Garrick. It's kind of protesting a little too much, I think. But that's my thoughts on that. I just now I'm really confused, even more confused about Garrick. Yeah. We go to ops. Next, Kira is looking at the Kohn-Maw files.

She's very worried. Cisco appears, and he says, He wants to meet the new conma that arrived and asks Kira if she trusts these new arrivals as much as she trusts Tana. And she says, absolutely. And then she leaves. But you can tell and he can tell because there's a look when she leaves and she's getting on that lift. There's a lingering look between them. And you know that she said she trusts them, but Cisco knows that that's not true.

And how could she? She hasn't met them. Yeah, exactly. I mean, if she hasn't met them, she doesn't know. And she's even kind of questioning, why don't we have a hard time with his name? Tana. Tana.

Tana Lose. It's kind of like Balana. Okay, so after this lingering look between Cisco and Kira, where he knows that she's starting to have her doubts, too, Bashir arrives and tells Cisco that Garek insists that he buy a new suit at precisely 20, 55, and something. It's something, has something to do with the Kohn Ma that have arrived. And Bashir doesn't know what to do.

Should I buy a suit? Should I not buy a suit? And Cisco basically says, you know what? I think you could use a new suit. I love that moment. Yeah. And Cisco says, go buy the suit because he thinks maybe this is, you know, some way of communicating without direct communication, that maybe these people are a common enemy of ours.

That's why Garrick is saying, you know, is seeming kind of shady here in his dealings because they have a common enemy. Cisco can see through all of the smoke and mirrors. Maybe we have a common enemy, and maybe this is their way of communicating that and go buy a new suit. We go to the security office next. Kira comes to find Odo, asks if everything is ready for the minister's court arrival. She's being kind of coy. And he picks it up. on that. He knows that she's got something else she's concerned about. She admits, she says to him,

do you know everything about me? And he says, more than you think, probably more than you think. She admits that she did some bad things in her past, but at least she always knew who the bad guys were. And now she's basically struggling with the decision. She's in a pickle here because she's going to have to betray someone, either her old friends or Starfleet and Cisco. And I love love his advice. He says the important thing is not to portray yourself. Yeah, I like that line. I really wrote that down. Odo, the only important thing is not to betray yourself, which is a great, great lesson. Yeah. 100%. I really, my heart really, oh, kind of broke for her with compassion in the scene, knowing what it's like when you're in a turning point in your life, when you have to let go of what doesn't work anymore.

and let go of people that don't work anymore in your life. And that can be a hard thing even though you know it's necessary. Yeah. Yeah, it was a very relatable situation that Kira was in. Yeah, it's 100%. I like that. I like when Star Trek does that, kind of can get to the heart of something that we all have experienced on some level

and put it into these sci-fi stories. Before you go on, Robbie, there's one thing I've noticed in the Starfleet uniforms, and I'm sure you've seen this too, Robbie, in the opening the V part all the DS9 players it's flared out it's ironed out and on Voyager ours are pressed down so yeah I've noticed that too

you know what I'm saying Terry like the V you know the V of your of your Starfleet uniform right right here the V it's turned out an iron to stick out which we did not do on Voyager it was pushed down you'll notice now that we brought it up it's probably so common place for you that you don't see

the difference but it's clearly the fabric has turned and ironed and spray starched so it sticks straight out forward. It's really weird. You mean the colored part? Yeah, yeah. It's like right here on my sweatshirt.

The opening of your neck. As opposed to being, ours was tight down like that. Yours kind of flared out a little bit. It flares out. Right on. Okay, I'll pay attention. Yeah. I think is it different in,

is Avery wearing a different uniform than us? Or is that? No. this was my least favorite of our uniforms was this one but later i think later ds9 the starfle uniforms now they end up looking more voyagerie they're we change uniforms yeah you do change uniforms yeah you change again and you go gray you go gray at some point right so that changes again where there's some gray actions like dress outfits oh maybe okay right because we have dress uniforms where the color is in a difference yeah yeah and my other note that i have my other note

for both of you is that when looking at monitors, anybody looking at a monitor, all the text, Robbie, do you notice? It's the old late 80s, early 90s, Apple SE print text. Oh, I called it DOS. I thought it was DOS. I actually have a video reaction about it. It looks like old, like Microsoft like DOS. That's so funny. I see old Apple, original Apple computers. But if you look at the print of it, to me, it is exactly, because I had an Apple 2 SE in 1987, 88. So I know that print, exactly, and that's duplicated. So I feel like they use Apple computers.

It's definitely old school. Yeah, old, old school. Okay, I'm just going to say to all of you out there watching us, these are the two cutest nerdy guys ever. Thanks, Terry. You're welcome. I don't know what it reminded me of. Okay.

It just looks vintage. It looks like old sci-fi. It feels older than your show. Your show is 90s. That's my point. Yeah. It looks older than the show. But the tech felt like 80s today, for sure.

It's for sure. Okay. Now we go to Garrick's shop. Bashir arrives at 255 or whatever the time. Actually, he's late. He arrives at 2057. That's right. He's a little bit late.

Garrick hides him in a changing room, hands him a, he says, here, try this suit on, try it on as many times as you want. But all he hands him is a jacket. He doesn't give him pants. I was like, and then Bashir looks in the mirror and he looks at the jacket and he makes this sour face, which again makes me laugh. Team Bashir all the way.

I thought it was funny. But he hears the Klingon women come in. We cut outside to this conversation. The Klingon women admit that Tana, they're going to sell Tana, bellitrium, I think it's called. Belletrium, this chemical that will make the bomb. and they say if the Cardassians want him, they can capture him at the rendezvous point.

They tell him where that's going to be. They leave. Bashir comes out, asks, what is belliterium? Garrick says it's a rare crystal used with an antimatter converter. It's a huge bomb. And he's got an antimatter converter. So that is why the Kardashians were chasing him. Again, any scene with Bashir in it at this point, I'm all in.

I just, I love him. right makes me laugh i love him too i know he's so charming yeah he just he makes he makes a smile he's entertaining let's say he's entertaining yes handsome he's talented and he's a kind person he really is really a gem of a human being yeah he's got a british accent okay that's just like that is the cherry on the sunday right right like he'd be amazing for americans it is yes americans are enamored they're in love with all things english are you not american i am american i am american i'm just saying in general like americans like like yeah it's because we came from you know we're a matchup of all the things yeah we're american yeah okay we go to ops the team is now gathered it feels like to me we're at the

point in our classic star trek story where there's going to be some action the plan's going to have to come together. So the team has gathered. They don't know what the best option is. Kira says she should go keep her plans with Tana so he's not suspicious and they can find out the whole scheme. That's the only way to truly stop them. Cisco agrees. And he and O'Brien decide that they're going to hide undetected behind this moon at the rendezvous point as backup and Kira's going to go. So that's their plan. Kira's going to risk it. She's choosing team federation here. But she's got to go undercover one last time to see what the whole plan is um there was a cool shot pushing into kira at one point when she's she's uh kind of making this decision to to risk herself i thought again rick colby i love him he's

one of my favorite trek directors we ever had great stuff okay next we go to the security office and otto's watching on monitors as cisco and o'brien are about to depart uh up at i Ops, Dax is scanning from Ops to see what's going on. Cisco says they get in position, the runabout Ganges with Cisco and O'Brien. They get in position and he says, shut down all main power systems. And O'Brien says, dead quiet. So they're sitting in their backup position behind the moon, hiding behind the moon. It's so cool that all the runabouts are named after rivers on Earth, right?

So the Ganges, most Chinese don't even call it the Yangs is how you would say it. We don't even say that. They say cheng zhang zhang is river. In Chinese, chung is long. They just call that river the long river because it's the longest river, right? Oh, wow. If you want to say, K-I-A-N-G on deep-space line is river, but it's not pronounced kiang, it's jang, so it's a j-sound. So the way you would say it, soft-e, not yang, but yang, so yang-z-z-jong is how you say that shuttle. Yang's-z-jong. Wait, how do we say it again? Yang-z-z-jong. So shuttle yang-z-z-jong, is how you say it.

Wait, you're saying it so fast, I can't even get saying it right. Yang, Yang, zhi. Yeah, so you're both yang ziyang. Zhang is straight across. The tone is one, tone number one. So it's yang ziz zhang, yang, so it kind of, your voice goes down and up high. Yang zichung is how you say it. And I would not be a good Chinese American if I did not stop and explain to everyone that that is the correct way to pronounce it.

Well, I'm glad you did. And we're on your side. And I can't go back and do it. I'm so sorry. It's funny because when I'm watching this episode earlier, we have our, we have our, we always have our captions on just because sometimes you can read alien names better, right? So someone said Yatsi, someone said Yatzi, yeah, yeah, well, that's the thing. I just spoiled my own joke.

So someone said Yangzi Kian and then on, it shows the caption and Megan's in the kitchen and she's not directly in front of the TV. So from an angle, she goes, Yatsi King is what she said. Like the king of Yatsi, who are, you know, I started laughing so hard. I go, no, honey, they're mispronouncing the river in China, and they're saying Yangtikang, you know, and you're saying Yatsi King, which is completely off, you know, they wouldn't know it. Well, it's funny. I wonder, like, on some of the newer direct shows, like on Discovery or Strang New Worlds or something, if they were to write a runabout Yangtikang, I don't know how to. Yangzi Jiang, yeah.

Yeah, Young Zichung, if they were to write that into an episode, I wonder if they would have any kind of cultural advisors that they would make sure. Like, I think nowadays, what you're pointing out, people have an awareness that, you know, we've sort of, we'll go to a native speaker and say, hey, how do you pronounce this? How do you pronounce it? And they'll have the actors pronounces the right way. But we didn't back then. Yeah.

No, but we should have because you were Star Trek. It just seems like we should have been more elevated in our awareness and how to say things. Exactly. That's why I was shocked. I was like, wait a minute. There's no way that being Trek, some of these writers and some of these other people didn't say, hey, let's call someone up who's Chinese and say, hey, Garrett, you know, with Chikote, our indigenous character on our show. We had a fake, but we had a fake advisor. And they didn't even care that much. Like, no. So I think maybe that's what happened to you. I think our generation, DS9 and Voyager, we were in this sort of middle ground of there was an awareness that we should be doing culturally conscious things,

but they weren't doing it 100%. They were just sort of naming a runabout after a Chinese river and they thought, that's enough. We didn't even have to say it right. There's a little nod to the Chinese. There's a nod, but we're not really going to follow through. But we don't complete that by pronouncing it correctly. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Thank you for, for, you know, allowing me to explain Thank you for, yeah, thank you for educating us too. So just so you know, Yang Zi Jiang, Yang Z. So the Z that we have, you know, it's written as Yangxi, it's not an E, it's Yangz. It's almost like a you stop, right?

You go TZ and then end. Yang Zeng, Yang Zeng, don't go E. Just go Yang Zuzhang. Yeah, Yang Zed Zhang is how you would say it. Garrett, you know, I can't speak any other languages. You can. I've tried. It's just I'm not smart enough to do it.

But I'll try. I will try. As long as you don't go Yangxi-Ki-Ki-Kang, I'm happy. Just go to Geng, yeah, thanks. On the runabout with the Chinese river that I can't pronounce. Thank you. Yang-Zi-jong. Yeah.

That one. Kira is piloting this runabout. Tana's there plugging in the antimatter converter. And Kira asked, what is he doing? And he said, you'll know soon. And then a Klingon bird of prey appears on the O'Brien and Cisco. runabout. How do you pronounce that one, Garrett? Oh, that's, that's not even Chinese. So I have no idea how the, I don't know, but I don't speak any foreign language. So I don't know. So I'm sure it's

pronounced differently in Hindi. Actually, I do. I've been to Risha Keshe Gunga. Gunga. They pronounce it the Gunga. Yeah. So on the runabout Gunga, can you tell Terry quickly while you were there in India? Just tell her. I went with my daughter who was 17 for her senior graduation gift. There was a strike going on, a writer's strike at the time. So I wasn't working. And she was invited on this three week trip to India for yoga. And it was. Oh, we had a little. Yeah. It was an amazing trip. Oh, India, though. How great. Terry's way into yoga. So I wanted him to explain that to you. Yeah. Because I just did a four-week teacher training in Sri Lanka last summer. There you go. Or this summer, this past summer.

So, Robbie, say it again, Gunga. I'm impressed. Yeah, the Gunga River. Yeah, so I was in Risha Keshe, which is on the Gunga River. Anyway, O'Brien and Cisco are in the runabout Gunga. And they see the Klingons have powered up transporters. We go back on the, on Kira's runabout. And the Klingon sisters, beam in, I have to say, I love Klingon beam ins.

It's like this red gong. glitter. Did you notice? Why can't we have red glitter on Starfleet beam? Red glitter. They're sparkly. They're sparkly. It's very sparkly. It's the only thing about them that sparkles though. Yeah. That's it. They beam in with their gold, their red glitter sparkles and they get their gold and they hand him some kind of like tube, a vial liquid. Yeah. Well, they don't hand it to it. They throw it in mid air. Like, yeah. Oh, my God. Gosh, that's the bird, did it say it's burlyum, yeah. Litrium.

Not Borrelium. That was in another franchise. Okay. Yes, so they beam out and then we go back to Cisco and O'Brien. The bird of prey is moving off and cloaking. And Cisco says set an intercept course for the runabout. So they're going to head over and help care out. We go to ops and Dax notify Cisco.

The Kardashians are headed their way about to intercept. They're both runabouts. So Cardassians are on their way. Klingons just left. Kira's all by herself. This is bad news. We go back to Cisco's shuttle, and he heads out to help Kira. But on Kira's shuttle, all of a sudden, alarms go off, alerting Tana, our bad guy, that there's

another shuttle coming. He figures out it was waiting for them, and he tells, Kira tells him that a Kardassian warship is close to. So Tana says, go to warp, set a course for D. 9, she realizes that he's been lying about a lot of things. And she goes to get a phaser, but then he punches her. Like, full on, matalone, punch to the jaw. It was rough.

It was awkward, because how does he know she's even going for that? Like, he doesn't even know the runabout technology and the specs of that place. You know what I'm saying? Those phasers were kind of tucked off to the side. It's like, how does he? She could have been just getting up to help do something. And he just punches her. I was a little he's a bad guy

he's a bad guy and bad tonnealose and he knows her though so just like when you know anybody if they're doing something you might not know yeah okay he knew she she'd taken a turn right yeah okay that makes sense thank you

thank you thank you her hesitation right he punches her he grabs the phaser holds it at her and tells her to go to warp or he's going to blow up the thing here and destroy eight Bajoran colonies that are close by. God, he's a horrible, horrible. I thought he was all about the Bajorans and now he's going to blow up eight colonies.

And you know what? The chest hair is not making up for that now. No, no. It did for a while, didn't it? It did for a minute, yeah. But, you know, that's those are superficial things that you really shouldn't, you know, make important choices on. Did you guys also notice when the Duras sisters first beam on the runabout, they're not even once facing forward one's facing backwards i was like what why don't you guys okay that that was also

kind of startling to me too once i don't know all right we go back to o'brien uh he says they've gone to warp uh cisco says follow them and calls uh for kira but tana tana answers and he tells them that there's armed belligerium explosives on the ship and warns them if you fire on us that you will detonate that bomb. And back with Cisco, they realized that he's headed straight for DS9, straight for the station. And then Goldenar appears on Cisco's shuttle and says, I basically says, I told you so. And Cisco ends this transmission. Yeah, he doesn't go, yeah, you did. Yeah, Cisco's like, I don't have time for the, you know, the blame game here. Yeah, exactly. It's the transmission. He hangs up on they're getting near DS9 so this is bad this is Tana's plan and then he reveals that he's

actually not trying to blow up the station or anything he's heading for the wormhole he wants to blow up the worm yeah yes if he can blow up the entrance to the wormhole he'll collapse it and no more Starfleet or cardassians or anybody else yeah and Kira at the last minute makes a sharp turn as they get near the mouth of the wormhole makes the sharp turn that sort of throws them off balance. And as they go through this wormhole and the shuttle's getting sucked through the wormhole, they've got this long protracted fight. It was just crazy to me.

It was both of them going at it. It was great. It was very exciting. And just as they go in the wormhole, Cisco and O'Brien are chasing them right on their heels. So they're following them. They go through the wormhole. They fight. They wrestle.

They come out on the other side. And just as they come out the other side, the bomb is released and explodes. harmlessly out in space. Robbie, remember when O'Brien says, we may have to shoot them down, Commander? And Cisco says, ready photons, chief. We never abbreviate photon torpedoes. We always say photon torpedoes. But here in DS9, they just say, ready photons.

Because photons could be a hologram, right? Remember, photons be free, the doctor's program. So it was a little interesting to see how there's an abbreviation on DS9 here. Which sounds like when you say things like that to make the comparison, it almost seems like your show is on before our show. Yeah. Because we spell it all out, like that photon torpedoes.

And then you guys are just like, hey, photons. Yeah. It does seem that way. Interesting. Good observation. In timeline, are we all happening at the same time? Should be, yeah. We're close.

Yeah. Okay. So we know each other. Yes. Yeah. Our show starts on DS9. Do you know that? Oh, that's right.

Yeah. Our ship is docked to DS9. No, that makes so much sense. And then we live. Because you guys were with Quark. Yes. Yes. My scene, yeah, the intro scene that I had was with Quark and Robbie.

It's interesting they didn't do more crossover because if we're really happening when NCHGEM was happening and were happening when you're happening, why didn't they do more crossover? Well, we couldn't do it between DS9 and Voyager because we were thrown to the other side of the galaxy. So there was no communication. Yeah, but they could have gone to the Gamma Quad. Like there could have been some attempt from the Alpha Quadrant. to use DS9. Even when we're in the mirrored universe.

I mean, it doesn't have to be completely linear time. Correct, correct. I don't know anything about this mirrored universe, by the way. Right. I have no idea what you're talking about. Well, you will find out. You will. I will.

And thank God, Kira turned that shuttle, knocked, what's his name, Tom. Olose. Over. It's catching. Yes. Thank God. she did that and didn't blow up the wormhole because she saves the wormhole.

Cisco shows up, ask if she's all right. Tana has the still has this phaser on her and said, no, she's not all right. If you want her alive, do as I say. He's still trying to threaten Cisco. And this is when Cisco says, he uses that information that he got from O'Brien way back when. He says, you can surrender to me now or you can just wait for the Cardassian worship. and I can let them deal with you. And you see his look and Tana gives up.

He hands the phaser to Kira, surrenders. We cut to an airlock. Kira brings Tana out. Odo arrests him. And Kira's last line to him is, you know, the old ways don't work anymore. Everything is different now. So still early in your series,

she's learning this lesson herself. She's kind of speaking what she's realized for herself. they're really cementing home like who does she want to be this this episode made her have to really dig deep yeah i love the last shot as uh cisco and kira are walking away like off into the sunset down the down the hallway it was a great way great image to end on because they had had so much conflict during this episode to see them walking you know shoulder to shoulder they were together was great. Yeah, they built trust.

Great, great episode. Yeah. I liked it. I liked it too. I liked it a lot. What's your lesson from this episode, Robbie McNeil? My lesson, my theme is kind of, I take it off that last line of, of, of Kira's, that if you want to build something new, you're going to have to try new way. that's the lesson like she was stuck in sort of this her old thinking about bejorans and about

her old you know the people that she trusted and worked with and believed in she had to let go of that and trust something new so if you want to build something new you got to trust trying something new that would be my thing right my my lesson is otto's line in the series the only important thing is not to betray yourself i'd love that I think that's the lesson for me from this episode. It's a great line. Great lesson. Terry, do you have a lesson or a moral?

Yeah, I think it stems from Odo's line. And I think that would be, you know, the classic to thine own self be true. But maybe even more importantly, if it costs you your integrity, it costs too much. I like that angle. Okay. Nice. Great. Well, thank you, everybody, for joining us.

Thanks, Terry Farrell, for joining us. us this week. And please, listeners out there, join us for next week's episode, is A Man Alone. Very excited to watch that one. With Terry joining us again. Yeah, with Terry joining us for that one. A Man Alone. And for our Patreon patrons, please stay tuned for your bonus material. If you're not a patron on Patreon, check us out. There's lots of great cool extra stuff there if you become a patron and everybody will see you next week for a man alone. You know, but

Thank you.