The Delta Flyers - Prophet Motive

Episode Date: March 4, 2025

The Delta Flyers is hosted by Garrett Wang, Robert Duncan McNeill, Terry Farrell & Armin Shimerman. In each podcast release, they will recap and discuss an episode of Star Trek: Deep Space Nine.This week’s episode, Prophet Motive, is hosted by Garrett Wang, Robert Duncan McNeill, Armin Shimerman.Prophet Motive: Zek, the Ferengi Grand Nagus, pays a visit to Deep Space Nine and moves into Quark’s quarters, where he takes on an important project.We want to thank everyone who makes this podcast possible, starting with our Production Managers Megan Elise & Rebecca McNeill.Additionally, we could not make this podcast available without our Executive Producers:Stephanie Baker, Jason M Okun, Luz R., Marie Burgoyne, Kris Hansen, Chris Knapp, Janet K Harlow, Rich Gross, Mary Jac Greer, Mike Gu, Tara Polen, Carrie Roberts, Tom Paynter, Sandra Stengel, AJC, Nicholaus Russell, Lisa Robinson, Alex Mednis, Holly Schmitt, James H. Morrow, Roxane Ray, Andrew Duncan, David Buck, Tim Neumark, Randy Hawke, Ian Ramsey, Feroza Mehta, Jonathan Brooks, Matt Norris, Izzy Jaffer, Francesca Garibaldi, Thomas Irvin, Jonathan Capps, & Sean T.Our Co-Executive Producers:Liz Scott, Sab Ewell, Sarah A Gubbins, Utopia Science Fiction Magazine, Elaine Ferguson, Captain Jeremiah Brown, E & John, Deike Hoffmann, Anna Post, Shannyn Bourke, Lee Lisle, Sarah Thompson, Holly Smith, Amy Tudor, Mark G Hamilton, KMB, Dominic Burgess, Mary Burch, Normandy Madden, Joseph Michael Kuhlman, Darryl Cheng, Elizabeth Stanton, Tim Beach, Victor Ling, Shambhavi Kadam, Tae Phoenix, Donna Runyon, Nicholas Albano, Rob Traverse, Penny Liu, Stephanie Lee, David Smith, Stacy Davis, Heath K., Andrew Cano, Kevin Harlow, Hailey L., Megan Doyle, Chris Garis, Cindy Woodford, & Mariette KarrAnd our Producers:Philipp Havrilla, James Amey, Jake Barrett, Ann Harding, Trip Lives, Samantha Weddle, Paul Johnston, Carole Patterson, Warren Stine, Carl Murphy, Jocelyn Pina, Mike Fillmon, Chad Awkerman, AJ Provance, Claire Deans, Maxine Soloway, Barbara Beck, Heidi McLellan, Brianna Kloss, Dat Cao, Stephen Riegner, Debra Defelice, Alexander Ray, Vikki Williams, Cindy Ring, Alicia Kulp, Kelly Brown, Jason Wang, Gabriel Dominic Girgis, Shanyn Behn, Renee Wiley, Maria Rosell, Michael Bucklin, Lisa Klink, Dominique Weidle, Jesse Bailey, Mike Chow, Matt Edmonds, Miki T, Heather Selig, Rachel Shapiro, Stephanie Aves, Seth Carlson, Amy Rambacher, Jessica B, E.G. Galano, Annie Davey, Jeremy Gaskin, Charlie Faulkner, Estelle Keller, Carmen Puente-Garza, Eddie Dawson, Klee Wiggins, Greg Kenzo Wickstrom, Lauren Rivers, Jennifer B, Dean Chew, Robert Allen Stiffler, PJ Pick, Preston M, Rebecca Leary, Ryan Mahieu, Karen Galleski, Jeremy Conoley-Mayes, Jan Hanford, Loretta Reyes, Katelynn Burmark, Timothy McMichens, Helen Brownrigg, Nancy Janda, Dawn Colleen Smith, Cassandra Girard, Robby Hill, Andrea Wilson, Willow Whitcomb, Mo, Leslie Ford, Daniel Chu, Scott Bowling, Ed Jarot, James Vanhaerent, Nick Cook-West, Oscar Fernandez, Shawn Battershall, & Natalie SwainThank you for your support!This Podcast is recorded under a SAG-AFTRA agreement.“Our creations are protected by copyright, trademark, and trade secret laws. Some examples of our creations are the text we use, artwork we create, audio, and video we produce and post. You may not use, reproduce, or distribute our creations unless we give you permission. If you have any questions, you can email us at [e-mail] Sponsors:* Check out Mint Mobile: https://mintmobile.com/TDFSupport this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/the-delta-flyers/donationsAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brandsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

Greetings, everyone. Welcome to the Delta Flyers Journey Through the Wormhole with Quark, Dax, and their good friends, Tom and Harry. Join us as we make our way through episodes of Star Trek Deep Space Nine. Your hosts for today are my fellow Trek actors, Armin, Shimmerman, Robert, Duncan McNeil, and myself, Garrett Wong. For the complete and exciting version of this podcast, checkout patreon.com forward slash the Delta Flyers and sign up to become a patron today and get all that bonus material. Welcome, everybody. Welcome, everyone. And everyone, sign up now. Do it now.

Don't wait. Do it now. Put this on pause. Go check out patreon.com. It's an amazing spot for lots of extra stuff. Yeah. Armin is giving all of you homework right now. Sign up. Okay. Do you have Armand any like directing techniques when you're directing theater like processes that you go through with the actors? Yeah, I give them lots of freedom for the first two weeks. Do whatever you want. Come up with some ideas. What I also do is in the first couple of days, I set the blocking and then I saved them after the blocking set. That's just temporary. If you want to do something different, you can't, but you have something to start off with. For the first two weeks, I let them do whatever they want, find their own epiphanies, their own ideas. And then after the second, after the beginning

of the third week, I start to say, now we need to start cementing things. There can still be room for improvement. But, but let's just call this, the cement is laid. It hasn't solidified yet, but there's the cement. Great. Do you expect your actors to be all off book on the first, in the first rehearsal then? Usually no, but in this rehearsal, yes. Wow. Wow. Great. Because they're older. And I know what that's like. And two, it's really not fun for actors when one actor is trying to be in the moment and the other actors stumbling for words.

It's just, it's not fair for the actor who's having to wait. And it's not fair really for the actor who's stumbling as well. That makes sense. The way you describe your technique of kind of giving the actor. some blocking to start with. That's how I approach when I'm doing TV directing is I always have a, I come to set in that rehearsal

with some blocking ideas and I kind of do a mixture of what you're talking about. You know, we'll read it through first on set and then I'll say, all right, well, I was thinking what if you came in this door and what if you headed to this side of the room and I'll start to, you know, give them some fundamental that would fit the plan that I have ahead of time.

But I'm always adaptable to if the actor says, yeah, I could come in that door, but what if I say the first line from the other room? And then I come in and I'm doing this. And all of a sudden that starts, you know, then I start spinning, oh, that's interesting. If you're doing that, then you might head here. So, yeah, we sort of start collaborating,

but I always want to have something for them to start with. And your operative word there is absolutely right. collaboration yeah that's what it's about it's an ensemble working together yeah it should not be it should not be directed dictatorial it should be an ensemble working together did you feel that way on deep space nine did you feel like when you rehearse scenes or did it depend on the director certainly the director would say just what you said you know you come in from this door you go there and we would rehearse it and then after we felt slightly comfortable with that they would put down the marks and those were the marks that we would use

because if we start moving around and not hitting our marks, then the camera people don't know where to focus the camera. The focus puller doesn't know where the focus is. So, again, an ensemble. It's not just the actors, it's the entire crew. And you want to make sure that everybody's happy. It is actually, it's one of the things I want to talk about a little bit later, actually.

Thank you for posing this. Yeah. One of the tragedies of doing TV, is that usually you get the script the actors anyway get the script for Deep Space 9 we were lucky if we got the script 48 hours before we started shooting

same with us and there isn't enough time to really delve into what's happening in the script I spent most of my time trying to memorize the lines and thinking about okay, what would I do?

When you have more time, you can sort of forget about the trees and look at the forest. And in this episode, there's a couple of times when I went, oh, I didn't really think that through enough. That's because I only had 48 hours. I think both of you are very smart

in your directing processes, processes, to be collaborative and to be open. Because as an actor, I feel that, that the directors that I have not been so fond of were the ones that had a very rigid game plan going in. And when I bring up a suggestion,

they're immediately like, nope, no, no, let's stick with what I just came up with or my way. And to me, I just feel like, well, you didn't even listen to me. You're on a, you're stuck on your plan. Exactly. And the fact that both of you, Armin in theater and Robbie and television, take this collaborative outlook to begin with

is, I think, the right way, at least for the actor to feel like to be able to something. Like, yeah, you're getting the best ideas from everybody instead of just your one narrow, which is, you know, often a director can have great ideas. They've spent a lot of time, more time than the actors often, a lot more time. That's right, that's right.

With the script and looking at all of the variables that the actors aren't even aware of, you know, in terms of whatever the concept you know the tone meetings you have or the production limitations that they're not even aware of so the director will have a lot of time but if you don't take advantage of the actors creativity they've spent time looking at it from a different perspective and they've known the characters certainly the series regulars and the recurring characters know their characters better than the director does yeah absolutely but I must say this is why I insisted with my ensemble, my smaller ensemble, to meet on weekends so that we could have these

discussions because it wasn't going to happen on the set, things moved too fast. So we would get together to try to suss these things out, the very collaborative things that we've been talking about. I remember once it was on Voyager, there was a scene, I think it was early on in Sandrine's bar, that holodeck program. And I had a lot of lines in there, and I was supposed to be playing pool. And for me, I couldn't, I was having trouble learning the lines over the weekend. And so I started moving around. I set up a set for myself. And I literally came up with blocking to help me, oh, if I move over here, it's connected to this line. If I move over here, it helped me memorize. And I remember going on set and thinking, oh, I hope the director doesn't mess up what I planned,

because I was having trouble remembering and this is helping me. If I, if I could just do what I planned. And luckily, he or she did. And I was able to do what I had rehearsed at home, which helped me remember the lines in sequence. But I'm sure I did that more than once. But trying to connect the physicality to the words helped me sometimes because I was not a good memorizer. I think that's awesome. Armin, this is the first time I've ever heard him talk about his process on that particular scene. And I do remember when we were blocking that, when we were rehearsing that,

Robbie had he had everything He walked over to one side of the pool table And then he would say something and he would You know he would take the cue stick and and do the chalk thing like that He'd say a lot Then he would move over and then he would go to shoot He'd look up at me and he'd say another line and I said wow It almost seems like he's already pre-blocked this and you did

You did it at home So now I know the secret Okay that's funny Well when we would get together the Ferengi would get together In my house we would do all that And then Max would say at the very end of the session, always, he would say, and now, how is the director going to fuck us up on this? Exactly. Exactly. Exactly. Oh, very funny. We have a birthday. So,

first of all, I just like to say, Stacey Davis, March 7th is your birthday. So happy, happy birthday to Stacey. Happy birthday, Stacey. Happy birthday, Stacey. Happy birthday, Stacey. some poetry. How about a little bit of a limerick from Robbie would be great. A little limerick. A little limerick. Okay, here we go. From the wee lad, McNeil. The Grand Nagas arrives with a new book.

It has a whole new Ferengi outlook. Bashir might win a prize. His true feelings are disguised. Rom filled his pockets with some charity he took. That's clever. Very good. And you got in the B storyline as well.

And that's usually what I cannot do in the haiku. Not enough room, yeah. No. My haiku for profit motive. Grand Nagas is back. He's revised the book of rules. Quark meets with prophets. That's it.

Nice. Yeah, not much room for the B story. But you've got the A story covered. You got a lot of the A story. All the A's covered. Very nice. That's good. All right.

Well, Armin, what about your etymology? Yes. Etymology. So both words, prophet and motive. So, prophet comes from the Middle English and also from the French, the French prophet. And it means one who speaks for God or any deity as the inspired revealer or interpreter of his or her will. It's originally used in English was in 1175. that's for the word profit

motive comes from the French motif something moved or brought forward emotion its original use was in 1362 okay let's talk about this episode written by Ira Stephen Bear and Robert Hewitt

Wolf and directed of course by Renee Obijunois his very first directing effort on D-Space 9 guest stars we have once again Max Credenchik has Ram. We have Juliana Donald as Emmy. Now, this actress actually did an episode of TNG where she was credited as Julie Donald. She didn't add the Anna until D-Space 9, but she did do one episode of TNG beforehand. And of course, Tiny Ron as May Hardoo. And we also

have co-star Bennett Guillory as the medical Big Shot. Belich Guillory was also nominated for an award for his role on August Wilson's play the piano lesson. Oh, wow. And you forgot the Big Shot guest start. The Big Shot. Oh, Wally Sean. Oh, of course. Okay.

And Wallace, yes. The Big Shot. The Big Shot, Big Shot, Big Shot. Guestar, exactly. Yeah, we have the medical Big Shot and the actual Big Shot Frankie Big Shot. Perfect. And Wallachon, excuse me. Yes.

I don't know if you guys know that maybe your viewers don't know. But Wally was one of the great American playwrights. Yeah. He has written some astounding plays that were done on Broadway that became very famous. And he's just, his father was the head of the writing, the editorial department. I think I've got that right, of the New Yorker magazine. And Wally told me when he was growing up, the most famous of famous writers used to come to dinner. And they would all eat together.

and he would hear stories and literary anecdotes from some America's greatest writers. It's amazing. Wow. Is it my dinner with Andre? Is that? Yes, yeah. That's a play that he acted in.

He didn't write, but that's a play that he acted in. Yeah. Which they rehearsed for two years. They rehearsed it forever. I remember they performed it in, at the time, it was the New Amsterdam Theater before it was renovated. They performed it in this enormous, it was where the Ziegfield Follies happened.

And this theater on 42nd Street had fallen into disrepair. It was basically kind of condemned at that point. And they decided to do my dinner with Andre, this two-person, two-character play in this theater that was just decrepit and just falling apart. And it was a ticket everybody. I didn't get a chance to see it there because... I didn't see it either.

I heard about it, but I never saw it. I wish I had. It was an event. It was the play, the content, the performers, and also the space that they were performing in all of it yeah yeah he's a very from a different time he it's a generation that uh and and a kind of culture that i think doesn't exist anymore but he comes from that very interesting exactly and he told me growing up he didn't want to be a writer didn't want to be a writer at all because his father had been a writer and everybody around him

had been a writer he didn't want to follow in those footsteps and so he went into the peace court oh wow and when he came out of the piece score he was looking for work he couldn't find any work and he was starving he was a starving actor and um he saw a competition where if you wrote something and you won first prize you would get a you know pocket full of money and um so he said you know maybe i should go for that maybe i could get some money that way he didn't win but unfortunately or fortunately for him because it started the muscle of writing he began to write more and more. And as we all of us have said, it's just a great writer and a great storyteller and a phenomenal person, very kind, very funny. And if I haven't told the story, I won't tell much

more, but the only person I ever was really jealous of, really jealous of was Wally Sean. It lasted for about five minutes. It might have been during this episode. But I was, this green-eyed envy welled up in me and I was Because of his talent? Yes, talent, ability, charm, character, humor, everything about him just pissed me off. And that lasted for about four or five minutes and I went, oh, this is why some actors get angry.

Yeah. Interesting. And then it disappeared and I never had it together. Interesting. So what made it disappear? Just being in his presence? Just sensible. Just sent.

I just went, what they? What the hell are you thinking, Armin? What the hell? It's not his fault. He's so good. Right. And it was enough to teach me a major life lesson, which was, yes, you can be envious of people, but don't let it get ugly. Don't just realize everybody's entitled to what they have.

Yeah. Yeah. The origins of the teleplay for this episode are to be found in Ira Stephen Bear's early career. When he was trying to make it in Hollywood, he wrote a spec script. for the TV show Taxi, entitled Uncle Sylvester, to try to demonstrate his writing abilities. So the plot revolved around Sylvester, uncle to the main character, Louis.

Sylvester had built up a reputation for being a shameless womanizer and an altogether unpleasant individual, and he was Louis's hero. So Louis was dying to meet him to impress him with his own womanizing abilities, but when Sylvester arrives, he no longer enjoys womanizing,

and now he just wants to get back with his wife. Louis is heartbroken and it becomes convinced that Sylvester has undergone some kind of deep psychological trauma. So this is the origins of that. Interesting. Yeah. So he wrote that taxi script.

It never got made. No, because it, well, he sent it in. It was a sample. It was never purchased by the producers of taxi. So he got it done anyway. Yeah, in DS9, basically. The idea. So, yeah.

It's a good idea, though. Very cool. I should also point out, this became clear to me as more actors became directors on our show. Almost invariably, the first episode that each of the actor directors got to do was always a Ferengi episode. Interesting. Wow. The origins of the plot line involving Bashir's nomination for the Carrington Award are to be found in real life. With this plot actually being something of an inside joke during its seventh year, Star Trek The Next Generation, was nominated for Best Dramatic Series at the Emmy's Awards.

Nobody gave it the slightest chance to win because generally speaking, science fiction shows didn't win awards like that. We all know about that. Everyone expected NYPD Blue to win. However, despite the unlikely event of a victory, some members of the TNG team became convinced that they were actually going to win.

As it turned out, they didn't, but neither did NYPD Blue. Instead, the award went to the unexpected picket fences. Picket fences. Yeah, if you look at this episode, it's also the unexpected winner that they have to deal with as well. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, right. Now, Kitty tells the story a week after I was cast on Deep Space Nine, according to Kitty, I really don't remember. I was cast as a series regular on picket fences.

What? And she says, I've said to picket fences, I've already got a show of thank you very much. I wonder what role. Oh, I know exactly which role. Which role? The coroner. There was a coroner on picket fences. And we often discuss she and I over dinner.

What would our lives have been like if that offered come in first? Oh, my gosh. Interesting. You would not be co-hosting the Delta Flyers with us. I would not be going to conventions. You would not, no. Yeah, I knew some actors on picket fences, and that show was a big hit. But it doesn't look.

live on now. I mean, I bet if you ask the average person, they wouldn't even know the title. I have one final thing before you jump into the first scene, Robbie. So this episode introduces the dartboard used by Bashir and O'Brien, which soon became a permanent fixture in quarks. Originally, the producers wanted to use a pool table. And this goes to Robbie's story that he told us at the beginning about Sandrine's and his preparation for shooting pool. But they were told that Star Trek Voyager had the same plan. So that's what they beard away from the pool table. Because of Sandrine's at your holodeck program, Robbie. But then they said, they suggested that they have the D-Space line characters play cards.

But that had already been done on Next Generation. So Darts was the final thing that they settled upon because of. Oh, interesting. Yes, yes, yes. And I'm going to ask, Robbie, I've always been told, I don't know, but I've always been told that shooting around the table is rather difficult. So shooting around the pool table must be equally as difficult. It's even more difficult because of the continuity of the balls and where they're sitting from one shot to the next. They have to always be matching and you have, you know, you're hoping that actors can play pool a little bit.

Pool is not a smart story device. No. Darts is much safer because, you know, you throw the dart off camera and then you cut to make that an insert on another day where the darts are hitting the board. You don't even have to shoot it on the same day. All right. Well, let's dive into it. The plot begins in Quarks. We see Quark in a close-up getting an ear massage.

It's like Umox or something. Yeah, it's Um-Ox. Um-X. Yeah, he's getting this lobe massage, and we meet a woman named Emmy, who's doing it, and she's trying to make a deal for some self-sealing stem bolts that could triple her family's business output. She really wants these stem bolts, wants to sign a contract, but her family won't be back for a week.

And Quark says, you know, there's no. to sign this deal, just keep rubbing those lobes. Doorbell rings. Quark thinks it's the Sorian brandy he ordered, but it's Rom. Rom says, get this female out of here, and suddenly the Nagas appears. He's hooded, though. Actually, he does it.

Mayhard do appears with a cloaked figure. With a cloaked figure, exactly. Yeah. And I saw Emmy in the background in this shot, by the way. Yeah. I'm going to use the word overacting. I was suspicious because of the way she was looking and I don't I immediately I thought oh oh she's part of some plan which turns out is not but I think

her big reaction to me was very distracting it was like what's going on she's part of something that's dangerous yeah what I saw in that was that she realized oh my god this is the head of the Ferengi home world and and I have I'm in the presence of royalty which didn't make any sense to me at all because there would be no way that she would know who's Zek was. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

It was, so you noticed that reaction, too, because she's deep in the background, but it was, to me, it drew focus from the moment and felt like a plot point, something that was going to pay off later.

Yeah, you're right. But the main thing that draws your focus, Robbie, is that she's doing a lot of this. She's like shifting around. She's leaning. Like, hey,

it's almost like, whoa, bring it in just a little bit. You know, you don't have to do all that. So I think that's what distracted. And maybe it was a misdirect. Maybe Renee, as director, thought, oh, well, this kind of storyline is so peripheral, but I can make it feel like something, I don't know, something else, something more.

Speaking of something more or deep background, I ask myself, why do we need a pornographic scene at the top of this episode? Yeah, yeah, I agree. What does it do for the episode? Nothing. Why do we start the show with, in Ferengi terms, a pornographic scene? Yeah. It doesn't advance the plot. It doesn't go anywhere.

It only sort of says, don't take this episode seriously. Yeah, yeah. It feels comedic in a sense because of the way that it opens. And if you think twice about it or, you know, it's, it's ugly. exactly it is but this armand let me just again be the flip side of the point here what if what if Renee decided to direct it so that you as quark are basically bamboozling her to rub your ears like she doesn't know that this is sexual you see what I'm saying like if you're if you're like you're oh you know I have I seem to have a pain and can you please you know massage the pain

It would have shown his, yes, his cleverness. His manipulation. Yes, to show your ultimate manipulation. But it did come off very sexual and that she knew that it was sexual. So I agree with you. I agree with you a thousand percent. But I think it could have been filmed differently. And also, yes, there could have been some things that could have made it much better, I feel.

It bothered me watching it and I'm going, why do we need this? Of all the ways to start an episode, why start it this way? Yeah, yeah. Before we move on, self-sealing stem bolts is something that the late Aaron Eisenberg would always talk about at conventions in that having the frangy teeth in, it was very difficult for him to say that. Now, was that the case for you as well to say that? I would imagine so. Yeah, I would think so. We're in the infirmary. Bashir is working hard. He's reading some pad or doing something. And Cisco makes a call, ask him to come to his quarters. And Bashir says, is surprised and says, okay, on my way. And then we cut inside the ward room and Bashir walks in. And this is where I saw Renee's credit, by the way, over the scene. As the crowd applauded, I think, there was, there was Renee's credit. I was like, did he time it this way? So his name, I know he didn't.

Wait, as they're applauding, his name pops up? I think so. I think of it. It was right around that moment. I was like, did he want his first director credit to have some big applause? anyway. That's very funny. I wouldn't put it beneath Renee.

I wouldn't put it in it. I don't think he did, but I wouldn't put it back. Right. Well, the way, the timing of the credits, the directors have no. That's all the post-producer rolling that out according to contracts and all kinds of things. So it's just coincidence, but it's very funny that Armid says, like, I wouldn't put it beneath them now. Exactly. Yeah.

So everybody cheers, Bashir walking in. And we learned that Julian's been nominated. for the Carrington Medical Award, which is like the Oscars, I guess. You know, it's a big award. But he seems very confused and in shock, basically. He wants to go back to work. And the whole group is very confused.

And Dax follows him out to a turbo lift. She says he should be excited. Yeah. You know, this is a big honor. It's the Federation's most prestigious medical award. And, but she's kind of dismissing it, blowing it off. continue to walk. Bashir tells Dax, she's far too, he's far too young to get this award. It's intended to be the crowning achievement near the end of a doctor's career. He doesn't want to

talk about it or give any more thought. And Dax ends the scene being very impressed with his maturity that he seems, seems very disconnected, very dispassionate about it. That's Bashir's point of view on this award. There's a shot in this, in this scene where the force series regulars are shoulder to shoulder with each other that I rather liked. I also like the fact they didn't have to put in all the background people who were who were as regular on the show as I was and I went it's very nice that Renee not only included series regulars but also the stand-ins and the background people that we were very used to seeing every day so you know kudos to Renee or the second ID whose ever idea it was but included the other people as well

familiar faces to you guys familiar faces to you guys that's great yeah this whole storyline by the way and so now this storyline is set up I will say it felt a little thin I feel like there's a lot more

explaining to do that there was an opportunity that was not you know taken advantage of in this storyline yeah they they I'll get to this all later but yeah this whole episode to me is thing really oh we're going to have to agree to disagree because i i really enjoyed this episode a lot

but my one my my biggest complaint would be in this bashear storyline it doesn't feel fully fleshed out but is ravi is it thin is it still thin for you as a bee storyline isn't it an adequate beast it is yes okay i would disagree with that too nothing happens literally nothing happens yeah nothing Nothing happens, and it could happen. There could be a character journey here that echoes the themes of this episode in a way and could have been explored, but they didn't flesh it out. So we'll get there when we get there. We go to Rom's quarters next.

We learn that Rom's in a mess. We learn that he's a hoarder and his place is a wreck. But Quark is staying here with his brother while the Nagus uses Cork's room. and Quark calls for Rom who's brushing his lobes with an electric lobe brush I guess like an electric toothbrush but it's an electric toothbrush

I'm not sure that he's brushing them but he's cleaning out his loaves cleaning them yes I guess brushing is possible yes yeah it looks like an electric toothbrush to me or maybe the whisker that you put in like frothers to froth milk it's an electric cue tip is what it is yes exactly and let's let's Let's not gloss over the very beginning of this scene, Robbie.

When we see Quark ordering a glass of millipede juice, hold the shells. I mean, I mean, what? Sounds delicious. Insect juice. Who would have known? No, no, no, no. No, no. No, no, no.

Of course. We've already established that. We've seen it when. I didn't know you could juice the insects. I didn't know you could juice the insects, but clearly you can. You can juice anything. You juice anything. Exactly.

All the shells. I love it. Quark calls ROM, though. Rom comes out. cleaning the lobes Quark wants the place cleaned up this place is a mess and Rom basically says

well Nog usually does that but he's off visiting family right now and Cork Cork notices all these things from the bar he starts listing off oh you took this from the bar took that from the bar

they basically get into a fight because Ron's like you may be the boss of the bar but I'm the boss here and I'll do it how I want so we see a bit of conflict yeah and again And we've seen a bit of conflict in the last Ferengi encounter as well, at least that I was involved with, which is Rahma's beginning to stand up to Quark.

He's beginning to say no, no. Yeah. And good for Rom. Yeah. Well, yeah, you're right. It echoes kind of Nog's journey of wanting to better himself, which is a big theme in this episode that, you know, Quark is going to articulate to the prophets later on. but like, yes, this idea of profit or bettering yourself or improving your life, having a goal being driven by goals and improvement. That's a that's a Ferengi value that's very relatable.

Exactly. The scenes with you and Max are some of the best I've seen so far in this episode. I agree. Fabulous. And just to be able to see Max or the character of Rom opening up like a flower in a way. You know what I'm saying? He's been so closed off. But all of a sudden,

he's he's everywhere and that and we will be coming up to a scene where i'll talk about it where i thought it was just superior it was so great so well done i will agree with you um maxim my relationship is golden it's and it got better and better as the years went by as we became more and more trustful of each other and knew what we did each of us did well again um have a problem with the fact that um is it necessary for us to to squabble this much squabbling is good it's like a spice i think there's just a little too much salt in this particular stew okay okay yeah that's fair but on the other hand this sort of behavior max is brilliant at oh yeah brilliant at and and i learned years later that the writers knew this too that he was very good at this so this is an opportunity as you said

for max to shine and although i have a problem with it i don't think max would and and to give max his due let him shine let him show what he's really good at and that's a good thing and that's a yeah so on the level of quibbles of being mr quibbles and bits this is a minor quibble then correct yes it's a minor quibble thank you leave them as common characters that's who they are they're Abbott and Costello. Yeah, it did feel a bit Abbott and Costello, but Abbott and Costello is classic. And I mean, they, you had, you had that and, I think, depth of both your individual characters explored in this episode in a great way. Yes, we did.

I think that's what's so satisfying for me is that you were, you're incredibly watchable and entertaining, just on a comic, you know, watchability level. But also these characters, I learned something about both of them individually. as in their relationship in this episode that I never saw before. And I really enjoyed it. Thank you. And go ahead. Yeah, Armand, you are most certainly entitled to your critiques and your opinions. But I just want to say, please don't be so hard on yourself.

I know. It's really good. I can't peel my eyes away from the screen when you guys are acting. It's like, you know, other scenes, I can walk and go get a drink. But I'm not going to go get the drink. I would say the same thing. I've seen episodes of your show where there's other actors. And I'm like, oh, gosh, I know where this is going, and I get what you're doing.

It's not as watchable. You are moment to moment. You and Max together and Wally and this whole storyline, Tiny Ron, everybody is playing their part in a beautiful tapestry of this world and these characters that I loved. I really did. Thank you, thank you. You talk about excessive spice at times, but there are also some very, very, very, very, very. nuanced layers going on where I had to rewind. I go, wait, wait, wait, let me just catch that quick little reaction that Ron gave to Cork.

I missed that. So I had to do some rewind to get everything because it was such a full palette happening. I agree. It was the comedy, the pathos, all of it was there. I thought it was great. Thank you. And that, all of this is why all of us would get together on the weekend. Well, it's smart.

You guys knocked it out of the park. You really did. I mean, if we could, in hindsight, if I had a time machine, I'd go back and I'd say, Robbie, we got to rehearse these. You know, we had to rehearse our scenes right now before we even show up, which we never did. We never did that. You can feel the work and the chemistry that that work has built in the performances in a way that you don't feel that with the other characters.

Heck yeah. For sure. Thank you. Okay. It shows. Quark decides to go and he's going to get his room back from the Nagas. he steps out of a door realize that their rooms are

three feet apart I had no idea they're right there it seems like he's storming off to go you know to another level but he storms out and it's right there

Armin has it been established before this that you guys are I don't think so we don't know that you're I love that I love the staging of it yeah by the way Renee did a lot of

I don't know if it's his work as an actor in sitcoms and comedy but he framed this episode in a way that that platformed the comedy beautifully in a way that not all Star Trek directors were helpful with the comedy side of things and he did a really nice job

at a number of places like that shot of just seeing you walk across the hall and that sort of flat shot is very funny and if it had been filmed any other way it would not have funny no it would have just been somebody walking to another place Well, Renee was famous outside of Star Trek, as well as Star Trek, but outside as a comic actor. Yeah. Just brilliant, a brilliant comic stage actor who did some extraordinary work on the stage as comic characters. Yeah.

Well, he gets it. He knows what it looks like, when it's funny, where to sit and watch from to see, to make it funny. And he put the camera there. And did you know he was a teacher, professor at Juilliard? And that's what he taught. He taught clowning. I did not know that. Wow.

I did not know that. He wasn't, I was there at Juilliard in the 80s. He wasn't there when I was there, but. I think he was there because he and Housman were very close. Housman made René's career. Yeah. Housman made race, Housman was the founder of Juilliard.

Of Julia. Okay. And at least of the acting program. And he may have been one of the original teachers. But he taught clown and mask work. Maskwork Del Arta One of my favorite

Committee of Del Arte Robbie loved it I love mask work We had a great teacher When I was there Named Pierre Lefev Was his name

It's wonderful mask work So do you know when Renee was at Juilliard doing this too? If he was a Hausman Protegé or actor then it was

before my time because Michael Langham ran the school when I was there Okay Housman was not doing it when you No,

Housman had left years before. So pre you probably pre my days Renee grew up next door to Hausman. Wow. And Hausman recognized in Renee his comic ability and promoted Renee

when he was a young man. And that's how Renée's career got started. A lot of people might know John Hausman from the paper chase. Right. The movie and TV series. That's right. No, both. Both. Both. And he was very well known

from that TV show. that were it but he was so he had such a deep career in the theater he was the producer one of the producers of the mercury theater that orson wells uh was part of uh many things many many many many wonderful yeah iconic things yeah arman you talk about rene having some amazing theater performances as a comic in comic performances what like what plays are you talking about like well he's famous For having done Tartooth, I understand, everybody who ever saw that production, including my wife, just said, beyond, beyond. It was extraordinary performance. In Lear, he played full.

I understand he was super and great as that. He was a longtime leading man character, comic actor at A.T. in San Francisco. That's right. Where he developed his chops, where he did Tartouf, long before he got into film. And, in fact, got discovered while he was. was working at ACT in San Francisco when he got his first film role, which was MASH, and he played Father Mokahey.

ACT in San Francisco back in the 60s and into the 70s was the premier classical theater company and school. In fact, I wanted to go to ACT. That was the school I wanted to go to. It was such a highly respected school. And the year I got into ACT and Juilliard, I decided to stay in New York because I had already been living there.

It was more out of convenience than anything, but ACT was my dream. That was, yeah, great. Wait, so ACT was your preference over Juilliard? You would have, if all things were equal, you would have taken ACT over Juilliard. Giuliar gave you a great education. ACT gave you work. Yeah. Yeah, you were part of a company there.

Denzel Washington went to ACT training program and a lot of amazing actors. It was very high. Salomey Jens was out of Asia. Yeah. Great, great company. Wow. Great. Good. Good. A little more history. This is a history episode of the podcast. We've crossed the hallway. Quark knocks on the door or rings the door. And, but then Quark, you think Quark's going to talk to the Nagus. But instead, he tells Rom, you're going to talk to the Nagus and tell him to leave. And Quark hides behind, kind of behind the door. And Zek comes out. A very friendly, Zach, he's excited to have company. He invites him in. And knows Rom's name. Right. Come in, my boy, Rom.

Come in. Right. But the setup. It's Rom's name. Yes. Because the setup is Quark, right before they answer the door, before Zach answer the door, you say, you say, like, it's got to be, he knows me too well. It's got to be you.

He barely even knows you exist is what you say. And then when he goes, Rob, my dear boy. Very funny. It's so comedic already. Yeah. Well, we're inside Quark's quarters. The place is empty. Which, by the way, this, this reminds.

reminded me this shot of when we would be on stage wandering around between, you know, setups, some of our other sets and our swing set. That would have nothing in there. They would have nothing in them. This shot just, I had like a sensory flashback to walking around, you know, away from where we were filming to these empty generic rooms that they would redress and things. Like Janeway's quarters or two box quarters. It's completely empty.

Completely empty. But yeah, Zach's empty. the quarters. He says the furniture was getting in the way of his work. And he finally shares that he's revised the rules of acquisition book. And he hands the book to them. Cork and Rom are thrilled. They're excited. They open it up. They begin to read. The first thing they read is, if they want their money back, give it to them. What? But that's not the funny. The funny is when they go on May Hardoo. He's crying. And he's crying in the corner.

There we go. A new Rules of Acquisition book. We have a little commercial break. Hey, Garrett, have you been traveling this summer? Oh, my gosh, so much already. I don't always travel, but this summer's been insane. Trip after a trip. You've been doing your impersonation of me.

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Taxes and fees extra. See MintMobile for details. We come back. They're reading the book. My thought here is we see them turning the pages. It's only printed on one side like a Xerox copy here would do. And I thought, the rules of act wouldn't it be like a book why didn't the props department just print both

sides like a real book i don't know but i can't tell you i don't know how they came up with it but it is printed in farangy yes i did notice that yeah okay yeah yeah i did notice the printing that was great i just wish they printed both sides of the page because i'm sure they did it on a you know a printer right i wish they had flipped over the paper and printed the other side so it looked like a book as opposed to Well, that would be a human book. This was a Ferengi. There you go.

That's true. Ferengis don't print both. Okay. No, they only print one side. I did like this scene where I like the framing. This is very a wide shot with the window perfectly symmetrical in the frame. And you see a lot of the scenes playing the two shot. This is an example of what I was saying.

Renee knows how to frame comedy. It's not some weird lens or lens. long lens shot or something, it's, it's just simple. It lets the actors play the scene for the comedy that's there. You guys did a great job. Quick question. Is the smelling and licking of it? Is that in the script? Or was that? I don't know. When I watched it this time, I went, was that me or was that the script? Yeah. Well, you're, you're wondering if it's in the script. And my first thought was, how many germs are on that book that you did they clean it? I've got a mouthful of prosthetics. I'm not worried about germs.

Okay, fine. So it does say Quark takes the book after looking at it and smelling it. Quark's trying to figure out what the, what the riddle is,

what the Negas meant with this book. So it says, Quark examines the binding, the ink, the fabric of the paper, he smells it,

taps on it, listens to it, and licks it, but still can't find an answer. But the way that you did all of those things, I mean, yeah, sure,

they suggest you're doing, these unexpected examinations, but your execution of that stage direction was great. Thank you. Thank you. In watching it now, how did you feel about that, Armand? Were you happy with what you did?

It's too much. It's too much. It's too much spice, is what you're telling us. Okay, so this is how you say from now on. TMS, too much spice. I understand. I understand the appreciation of it. I get it. I get it. But you have to, I'm still in that same agenda place I was 30 years ago.

Okay. I'm still trying to give gravitas to the species that I so screwed up on next generation. I hear you. Okay. Well, you do that as well as entertain. Yes, yes, yes. I think you can do both things. And you know what?

If you guys get pleasure, if everybody else gets pleasure out of watching my performance, that's all that counts. Okay. That's all that counts. So what I'm gathering from what you're saying, if you had kind of condensed it a little bit where you didn't lick the entire, you know, binding, but just maybe it tasted a little piece of it, that would have been enough is what you've said. Probably. Less is always more.

Yeah. Less is more. Right. But if it's funny and you guys like it, I didn't say a word. We loved it. We loved it. And we love to be entertained by that scene. So we're okay with that.

Yeah. Thank you. Well, Ram thinks the negus has gone insane, and Quirk insists, no, no, no, no, he's a genius. He's a genius. We're just going to put this book down. We're going to wait for him to tell us what the riddle is here, basically. So Quark's committed to, there's just some evil genius behind us. He says that Zek is his role model, is his idol, and that he's tried to model his life after Zek.

Yeah, yeah. Don't gloss over when Rom reads rule number 285. A good deed is its own reward. And that's when Cork starts basically almost having a heart attack. He can't even stand it. He's got to faint. Well, we go to Cork's bar next. Cork is trying to solve this puzzle.

Zek enters into the bar. He wants to buy the whole bar drinks, which is very unexpected for a frangy. And it's a full bar. It's a very full bar. There is where Zach mentions he met some girl that was looking for quark. She said her family has arrived with all the latinum. But the negus decided to tell her where to buy these stem bolts, these self-sealing stem bolts, for wholesale. Instead of from quark, Quark is in shock.

What's he going to do with these stem bolts? He kind of walks off in shock. A hundred gross? Is it 100 gross? A hundred gross. What am I going to do with 100 gross of self-sealienable? stem bolts. I still can't say it. Yeah. Yeah. Let gnaug sell up for you, right?

He's in shock. And then Nagas talks to Rom and says he can't allow Quark to take advantage of this poor girl. Rom is very confused. And so Naga says, well, let me explain. Come take a walk with me. They head off for Nagus to explain to Rom what this big change is. And we see Mayher do pour a big glass of scintohal at the end to drink the whole pint. Mayhard do May Hardoo is not speaking as we have established before but I love

yet exactly I love that we hear he gets Oh my gosh I'm sure so did he I bet he did I wonder if he got paid

as an actor He did Good There's no question in my mind He was a principal He had to be Good Well he didn't have to be

We've got another character Who does the same thing And he was never a principal Yeah, Morn. Warren was never a principal. That's right. Which is what I used to say to Mark. Tiny Ron, he gets paid as a principal.

You're doing the same thing he is, and you're doing it more often. There's something wrong here, Mark. Yep. You know, the Screen Actors Guild has certain rules that are based on dialogue mostly. And in Canada, the unions up here have different rules that are not based on dialogue, that have to do with the composition of the shot, if they're not. in a single, they can not say anything, but if they're in a, I think it's less than three or less that they get bumps, varying degrees of bumps. And if anything that, even if they are a waitress

or a waiter, a principal speaks to them and what they speak seems to change the direction of the scene or story in any way, that is a bump. Even if you're a, you know, a server or something. So there's different rules up here, which I wish SAG could adopt some of those rules, because they seem more, as you're talking about, you know, Morn and things like that, that seems more applicable because he should have been a principal. He should have. Yeah. He had an action figure, though. Yes. He should have gotten paid more than background actor work.

Armin, did you ever see Tiny Ron when he was in full makeup and wardrobe for Voyager as the hunter species alien? no no okay he was he was yeah he was the first horogen basically so yeah yeah did a good job there nice man and and on our rehearsals where he had nothing to say that we did on the weekend tony was there oh my what he came too yeah he wanted to come and i said sure tiny absolutely i love it good for him good for him exactly yeah well we go to uh the cargo bay next there's this is where we see the dartboard i think it's in the cargo bay right it is but why are they in the cargo bay there's no other place to play darts i i thought this was in corks that they would be playing darts you would think so but we just left corks i think maybe just for not having to use

background maybe oh yeah that because i read somewhere that eventually the dartboard is put into corks bar yes that's the final resting place of that dartboard uh but now you're you're right no background actors needed in the cargo bay. Very clever. Well, there's the dartboard with the flashing lights hanging on the wall so when you hit the dartboard a light will pop up.

It's a sci-fi dartboard. Looks like an old-fashioned dartboard, except it has lights. But Bashir and Miles are playing darts because they've played hundreds of games of racquetball at this point since Keiko's been gone and they've got to do something else. O'Brien brings up the prize,

And as soon as he brings up the prize, Bashir misses his shot. This to me is like trash talking in sports, right? So each one of them says something to kind of mess, get into the head of the other person. And that's whenever the dart goes awry and it's the wrong part. That's because someone just got into the head of the other person. It's wonderful. But again, the scene is kind of suggesting that there's more to this prize for Bashir than he's claiming. But we never really go there.

Never. The closest we go is later on with Oda. All right, we're back in the Ferengi story in Cork's quarters. Now there's a high-tech office set up in here. All the Ferengi waiters are scurrying about with pads and items. Quark comes in. That's a lot of Ferengi makeups, by the way. Yeah, yeah. One of them, David, who's my stand in, he's in makeup anyway, so that's easy. It seemed like there were a half dozen more maybe. There were quite a few more, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, that's a big deal.

Well, Rom is running this business. Quark asks what's going on. Rob says it's the sector headquarters for the Ferengi Benevolent Society. Clearly, Rom had a conversation with the Negus, and now he's all in on the Negus' benevolency plans. As he should be. It will advance his career. Yes, true.

It will put him in a better place, and he won't have to take Guff from his brother anymore. And he's been promoted by the number one person in Ferengi society. He went from being a non-entity and now is the co-chair, we find that later, co-chair of this enterprise. Yes, he should be very excited. And he is. And he is, yeah.

Well, we do learn a little about it in Rom's quarters next. Rom is all in, we learn. I like this again, played in wide shots like a play. It lets you guys act, Let's hear you guys, rather than the editors and the cameramen, deciding. Comedy can't really be done in close-ups and single shots. You need to see the chemistry between the actors, and that's where the humor comes from. Well, this scene's done beautifully like that.

Rom says he wants to be part of the change in Ferengi society. This is where he reveals the negus has made him, has made Quark co-chair. Quark says, well, he never told me anything about this. and rom continues with explaining this to quark that once it's up and running they're going to return with zek to the sacred marketplace announce the new rules to everyone and cork says oh yeah and then that's when they throw him off the tower of commerce out of the top of the and suddenly rob's like oh my gosh you're right quark he realizes cork's right cork feels like something is very very very wrong This is the scene that I talked about earlier that I said

I felt that Max really shined and a lot and the interaction between Max and Armin was really, really good. It was this scene. This is the one that was so full. It's a great turn. Yeah, it's a great because you see them start in conflict and they end like-minded and the turn that Rom has to make in the scene. Yeah, it's great. It's got comedy and

real stakes here. Max, despite the makeup, despite the fact that he's often he often in this show anyway plays the fool is a very smart actor is a very smart actor and is able to vibrate in comedy that in ways that i am envious of he's brilliant at farce yeah yeah he's great now he had another line prior to this which we skipped over or didn't mention i i want to go back to it i can't remember which scene it is I guess it's when they first discovered that the rules have been changed. And Quark says, do you know what this means? And Rom says, it means we have to memorize a whole new set of rules.

And for me, that got an extra laugh out of me. Because the only person I know who has all the rules memorized is Max. Really? In real life. If you ask Max what number such and such, he can rattle off what that rule is. So when he said, you have to memorize a home news, I felt badly for Max, not for Rom, but for Max. Because he would do it. Yes, because he would do it.

That's funny. I love it. Very good. Well, Quark is very convinced something is really wrong. And so it takes Zek to the infirmary where Bashir is checking Zek's ears. And Wally Shon is laughing here at the top of the scene. And if you look carefully at Sid, he's laughing too. Is he really?

he's not taking this scene seriously he's having a ball of a time he's really enjoying it a great deal oh my goodness well i bet he was he was doing the scene with wally exactly yeah exactly what a what an amazing opportunity yeah well i love the way the scene starts uh bashears checked him out says he seems healthy nothing's wrong with him cork just doesn't believe it yeah he thinks uh he thinks beshear's a quack who says he won't win this prize he's up for. Quark's very frustrated. And less is more, Sidd's minimal reaction to that dig is quite good.

Yes, yes, you're right. I say less is more, less is more. When does he have that dig? I think Bashir responds when you say, oh, maybe we can make an appointment for you to see Dr. Wade. That's great. You know, a dig at Quark. I mean, I dig at Bashir.

And Bashir says, he doesn't react. He just says, oh, good luck. If I remember correctly, Nairobi is beautiful this time. Yeah, that's his response. So he digs back very dryly. It's very funny. Yeah. I also love where Zek offers a giant bar of latinum, a brick, it looks like, of latinum.

It is a brick. It is a brick. That's a lot of latinum. A lot of latinum. Bashir's like, no, I can't accept that. But Zex says, well, give it to charity then. And so, Bashir takes it. And Zek tells Julian to come to the ceremony at the Bajoran shrine where he's going to give a gift to the Bajoran people.

So suddenly there's a new twist in our story. He's got a big gift for the Bajorans. Right. So many needy people, so little time, Zex says. We cut to the airlock where Cork and Romm are breaking into the Nagus' shuttle. They've got to figure out what has happened to the Nagas. And he needs to know what Zek is going to be giving the Bajorans. That's when Mayhardu arrives.

He's got this looks like a weapon. It does. Yeah, it does look like a weapon. You may think it's a weapon. Yeah. They think he's going to shoot them, but instead he pushes the button, it opens the door. He waves them in. I had a thought when in this scene, the first time I've thought of it.

Do you remember the Silent Bob character? Kevin Smith made this low-budget movie Clerks where there was a character who never spoke, Silent Bob. And then Silent Bob was in all their movies after that. Oh, yeah. I suddenly thought, oh, I wonder if, because that was around this time. mid-90s when clerks came out and it was all at the same time and I thought oh I wonder if they just thought the Naga should have a silent Bob character because it's kind of it was the same

time or was it the other way around was Kevin Smith watching DS9 he thought hey I should be silent Bob I don't know we'd have to go back to look at the timeline yes fans listeners you have homework someone already knows the answer to this I'm sure they do Kevin Smith knows yeah Kevin Smith. Mayher do brings them in. They go inside the shuttle, and Mayher do shows them this gift. It's one of the missing pejoran orbs of the prophets.

Bum, bum, bum. Yeah. Go to a commercial. We come back. Cork explains the orb explains everything. He tells Rom, his ex-behavior, the new rules, everything. And Rom's trying to break it open.

Cork says it's too dangerous. They kind of struggle. It pops open. This bright light comes out. and off goes quark into a vision. How is this filming this whole vision? These are confusing to me. Like, they make my head hurt sometimes.

They did something with the film itself that they shot it a certain way to make it look disorienting. Yeah. Yeah, and the jumping around in these visions, and I know that's the design, that's the structure they've set up from the park. It mimics the original episode

where Cisco meets. the wormhole aliens. Can I read a little something for you? For both of the things? Sure, sure. To recreate the same visual style for cork scenes in the wormhole as had been seen in the pilot episode Emissary, director René Obijonois,

and director of photography, Jonathan West, went back to the original shooting method as developed by emissary director David Carson and then director of photography, Marvin Rush. As had Rush in the pilot, West over-exposed the images and used diffusion filters to create the dazzling white which seems to bleed onto the actress

faces. However, while the white is the same as an emissary, there is a subtle difference to the rest of the wormhole footage. Visual effects coordinator David Takamora used two versions of every shot, a slightly out-of-focus version, and a clean version. He layered the

clean version on top of the out-of-focus version to create an effect that is not quite out-of-focus, but is not quite focused correctly either. Interesting. And of course, when you're acting it, none of that is there. You just, you guys are just doing your thing. But when you're acting it, there's a linear progression of dialogue, but yet it happens all over the place.

And in the pilot, that sort of idea was explained because the prophets don't exist in time or space the way. In a linear existence. In a linear existence. Whereas now, and I know they have to keep the same rules, but it's. It was sometimes tricky for me to understand the jumping around. Was it hard to film? Was it confusing? No, I don't remember being hard to film.

There is a section where I'm going around a table between people's shoulders. I remember, you know, I had to hit the mark exactly right so that I would be in the right place. But, no, it's just bits and pieces. You just do it. What I find, this is the most interesting part of the show for me, and where it takes a quantum leap in my in my appreciation i love what the juxtaposition of who the aliens are are portraying and what they're saying uh that to me was quite quite brilliant quite brilliant i thought you mean the characters who got the prophets lines which which actor or character yeah for instance i remember

specifically the the the alien pretending to be rom says about the farangi we need to i can't remember exactly but we need to never associate with this race again uh right and i thought oh yeah that's clever uh and and a lot of those i remember also some of the things that uh the kira alien said were oh yeah that's that's indicative of actually how kira feels so i found the lines that they put into their mouths and who they chose to say the lines was brilliant was really quite brilliant i do want to say this first vision is just quark and zek oh that's right that's right that's right then you come back i do remember that being disorienting okay yeah the first one is just zek jumping around you're on the spinning wheel and he's upstairs and he's downstairs yeah he pops up

everywhere right rob he's not in okay yeah yeah but he basically says says in this, Zek tells you that, you know, you have to take a leap of faith. So he brings up this idea of faith, which is going to give you the prophets thing. And this is where he opens up the new book of rules of acquisition. And there's a crowd that appears in the bar and they're all applauding. So it does seem in this first vision like, like Zek is saying, oh, this is what the prophets told me. But that's what court puts together when he first comes back. I've got to go talk to the prophets. Right. And just technically, one of the things Renee did

as a director is put SEC on the top level of Quarks Bar. There are three levels to Quarks Bar. There's the ground floor that we're familiar with. There's the second level where all the Hall of Suites are. And then there's the third level that no one ever uses. It's up there, but no one ever uses it. Renée used it. That's

where he put Way up there. Yeah, and then he jumps over the railing in this scene. There was a stunt in this scene. I would assume my stuntman Georgie did it so got here's to Georgie for having done it yeah yeah well even uh Zeck had uh wali had a stunt double in this did he really i would assume that george was to double for both of us no i said dennis couldn't dennis couldn't tall to be wallie i know that that's what i read though

that's why i was confused i don't it's possible uh you know it's sci-fi anything is possible madeline's not that tall either though Robbie right is that was that Dennis madeline was not that tall He was probably 5-8, 5-9, probably. And Wally is shorter than I am, so. Yeah, okay. Yeah, who knows. Dennis doubled everybody, even if he didn't look anything like it. But Dennis had a brother-in-law, George.

George. Oh, that's right. And George doubled me. That's why I'm thinking George he did both. Okay. Could have been. Could have been. All right.

Well, yeah, Cork comes out of the vision. Cork realizes this gift was from the prophets to Zek that they put this idea. The prophets put this idea of no rules in his head. They asked Mayhar do, but he can't speak because he only talks to his master. He's following the rules. So Quirk goes to try and break into Zek's personal logs. And we see a bit later in the airlock that Cork has read the logs. And Zach got the orb from someone in Cardassia 3, got this, the prophet's orb, and decided to head to the wormhole.

But his log show he was only there for a few minutes. and left and cork says the negus recorded uh that the future looks bright in his personal logs so he must have seen the future uh he went there to see the future so that he could predict you know economic markets and things like that that was his intention but then something happened while he was there that changed everything and quark has an idea to make it right rom asks if it involves him cork says not really rom says i like it made me laugh very funny very funny is that's very funny that's that was my favorite joke yes i like it i like it this is the benefit of having hindsight yeah uh i'm sure the writers were

thinking about this i certainly wasn't you couldn't have need none of us could have thought this but actually this prophecy does come true what which in what way which prophecy are you talking I'm not going to tell you. Oh, this is a spoiler. I'm sure it wasn't intended, but when I look back on these seven years ago. Perengis are going to change. Something's going to happen. Oh, Garrett, we got stuff to look forward to here.

We do. All right, we go to the Replomat next. Odo joins Bashir. Odo comes down the spiral staircase. Renee gave himself a nice, fancy entrance. Yes, he did. Not just did he come down to staircase. He has to circle around the staircase.

Really? He is too much. He gave himself. It was like a movie star entrance. René's directing. Why not? Too much spice. Yeah, a little too much spice.

Loretta Young. I don't know. You guys are too young. It felt like old. Who's Loretta Young? Loretta Young was a movie actor since she had a TV show back in the 50s, the 60s. I can't remember. And she always used to come in down this long staircase.

She'd make a Loretta Young entrance. Yep, Renee gave himself a Loretta Young entrance. But he comes down, joins Bashir. Oda says he's heard from a lot of random people that Wade is not going to win this prize. I love this whole bit, by the way. It's a, you know, I have a friend who has a cousin, who has a friend who knows an assistant

and one of the members. And according to my friend, her friend heard something. It's a classic Abbot and Costello bit kind of thing. It's very funny. Yeah. But it works. It always works. What happens when the director is the actor?

who's who's back in video village who's who's watching the first ad on the star trek shows nobody like what i mean yeah the first ad is watching or marvin the d p yeah yes or marvin or jonathan jonathan jonathan jonathan jonathan jonathan on this show yeah but star trek our generation of star trek was very different than shows are now um nowadays most shows have a writer on set a writer producer who's there to assist the director with interpretations or give notes on, you know, producer notes on things and clarify things. And if they had had a writer on set when Renee was directing or Avery was directing or any of your actors that directed or when I was directing, if there had been a writer on set, it would have been so helpful. Because then I could have turned to the writer

and said, did we get what we intended? What you were looking for was my performance, delivering the tone and the story beats that we are we want but there was no writers it was left up to the d and the ad who should not be interpreting those kind of story nuances that should be you know an upper level producer helping that actor so robbie you're saying that nowadays there that that writer is there for the entire time you are filming i mostly do shows not in los angeles anymore so usually the shows that i do on location uh a writer will fly in usually a day or two before we start filming, the writer of that episode will fly

into town. Oh, the actual writer. Yeah. Yeah, they'll be there for your final production meeting so they can make sure that all the choices we've made in terms of props or blah, blah, blah, that aligns with the vision of the script. Yeah. And then they'll be there on set every day

from crew call to rap. And they will sit in Video Village. And if I'm directing, I'll turn to that writer after the end of a scene and say, you good with this you know and and during the process during the takes I might turn to that writer or the writer may turn to me and say hey I think they should tone down the anger it shouldn't be so angry yet in the story or you know so we we have a collaboration to go back to our earlier

conversation it's very helpful well at the end of the scene with Odo and Bashir there is that little bit where Odo kind of figures out that Bashir is writing his acceptance speech which is now referencing what happened with the TNG cast and crew feeling like they were going to win it. So again, these inside little tidbits of information are quite interesting.

Yeah, I like the reference to TNG, the Easter egg, if you will, of that idea. But in terms of Bashir's character arc in this, there's no development whatsoever. Zero. They're suggested that he cared about this

more than he's revealed. Correct. It's suggested. it but he never we never hear about that right other people don't talk about it no one we don't hear other people saying wow yeah you know it's strange he he he you think you care about that right nothing no attention given to it yeah we get a little bit in the scene and then we go back to corks quarters zek is talking to someone on the monitor um i did like this shot it opens the shot it opens with the door opening and the camera pushes past that open door and

goes in, and in slowly during Zek's monologue. And then at the end, Zach ends the phone call and looks up and says, how can I help you, boys? And that's when we see whose point of view we were in. That shot coming through the doors was May Hardew and Quark and Rom, putting a sack over his head at the end of the scene. And I must say that opening shot, one of the things I thought, oh, Renee just fell in love with that window.

because behind Zach is i mean he could have put the desk anywhere yeah yeah but he made sure that the desk was in front of the window that that window and and just became a huge christmas gift to ren he just loved focusing on that window and in fact that shot in an earlier scene of of rom in the window reading the book is one of the most iconographic photos ever taken or shots ever taken on our show. It appears everywhere. Really? It is one of my favorite shots from the show.

But it does appear. It's not just me. Everybody knows that shot. Wow. Wow. Interesting. With the Starfield behind it. Yeah. Yeah.

Renee had good instincts in terms of composition and framing in this episode. Much not to take a shot at any other directors, but much better than a lot of other first time directors. Because he was living there already for three years. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I do like the whole dialogue with Zach how generous he is. He's like, I never knew solar flares could be so devastating to a planet's agriculture. He's so empathetic. Yeah, I know. Let me see. A current market rate, 2,000 tons of barley would cost me 189 bars of gold press latinum, but it's worth it. So it's like it's something he would never do in a billion years. But here he is spending 189 bars of his own latinum to help out some alien race who lost their crop for this season, right? like wow so anyway

it's kind of fun he's a brilliant actor he's a brilliant actor he's very funny I have a question Aram and so the next scene we're in the corridor Mayhard do is carrying Tiny Ron is carrying Wally Sean supposedly in a bag there's somebody in the bag

no I don't think so what's moving it's moving though I still don't think it I don't think so either but I'm like how did they or maybe Tiny Ron had something that he was we didn't even notice I'm I have no memory of that but I just can't imagine that I can't either I can't either

not only because it's bad for the person in the bag it's bad for tiny run he's got to carry a person on his shoulder it's not like he's on his shoulder it's a bag and and with someone below the shoulder yeah that's that would be very hard to do and it was very convincing it was very convincing but but I just I and I certainly know Wally wasn't in the back that's for sure if it wasn't wally i would have been david if it if it was someone it it would have been david uh maybe it's not man maybe but no but george is too big uh okay it has to be someone small and diminutive basically yeah that's why david my stand in uh break uh one of the one of the characters on the show um it could have been david but but i don't think it was i can i give you my

theory here's my theory it wasn't you was it gart very No, it wasn't me. But I feel like if Aaron was there, Eisenberg was there. He's such a team player that he would be like, I'll do it. Oh, he would have. Yeah, Aaron would have done that. Absolutely. But I guarantee you they weren't going to pay him to be in a bag.

I'm quite sure. I think that I would offer a different, because it did move. I would offer a different solution that Tiny Ron had this bag, but he had something that could puppet it so that when he turned around and, you know, and we saw movement in the bag, that Tiny Ron was literally doing something. Pushing a button or pulling a thing. That pushed something, that made a string that made something move. Okay.

Because it was very convincing, but he didn't look like he was, there was much effort to holding a heavy bag. Right. Which if there had been a human in there, there should have been effort, a lot of effort. Yeah, but Tiny Ron is a massive human being. So, you know, but it's, again, it's one thing to carry someone on your shoulder. It's another one, where it's halfway down your back. That's a different...

Pulling backwards. Yeah. Yeah. I agree. Puppeting. I go with puppeting. My money's on puppet. And not Aaron Eisenberg?

Okay. No point. All right. I do like the Quark checks on Zek in the bag, though. Zek says he forgives him. And then Quark's response, though, is, see, he is in trouble that Zek would forgive you for this. It's just impossible. It's great because he's so calm, too.

Don't worry, Quark. I forgive you. It's just so opposite of who he really is. And that's how amazing Wally Sean is because you bought everything that he's doing in this episode. He's also humming inside the bag. Yeah, he's loving a song, yeah. Is he just making up a song probably? So that song, was he humming during the actual take itself?

I don't think so. Okay, so it was all opposed. Because when I was watching it this time around, I went, who's doing that? Where's that noise coming from? Who's doing the humming? And that must have been post, I'm quite. It must have been. But it's still, it's still while he's volle's voice.

voice in ADR. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. That's very funny. It is very funny. Yeah, so they get inside the Nega shuttle. Rom says, brother, this is a very brave thing you're doing, taking the Nagus back to the wormhole. I wish I could come with you, but I can't. Goodbye.

Takes off. Very funny. Now, that line prompted something in me. It has nothing to do with the episode, but it did prompt something in me. Okay. Quark's going off to meet the wormhole aliens. That's his intent in this. see yeah uh rom and pretty much all the waiters are all in the benevolent association they're

all manning the phones and making deals who's looking after the bar who is looking after the bar mourn is just helping himself yeah yeah and i thought really who's who's who's running the bar i mean quark is always concerned about the running of the bar who's running the bar i don't know maybe you're stand in maybe brook but he's in the benevolent association oh he's there david brook is in the benevolent association he's one of the people in and that would have been a scene in the bashear storyline they could have been in there and where's cork why don't we get to that that is exactly my answer okay rom leaves and mayher do leaves and zek is still in the bag and cork says to zek don't worry everything's going to be all right sure everything's going to be fine i know how to operate the ship i've never been on it before i'm

and learn how to run this thing, but we'll be fine. Well, yeah. Well, let me ask you, because the next shot's in space, we see this Ferengi shuttle. We see the, the Nagas's shuttle. It's very cool. Have we seen this before? Yes. It's hard for me to tell.

I've seen that shuttle many times, but it's 30 years, so I don't remember where I've This feels like I don't remember seeing the Ferengi shuttle before. Yes, we have, because you recall in a prior episode. Did I mention it then? No, the actual, I'm just saying the Grand Nagis said, and use my shuttle quark in one of the things where he goes to have do business in the Gamma Quadrant.

So we see the shuttle actually. Oh, we did see it. You're right. This is the alien race that they're so aggressive that they fight each other. Remember that he tried to deal with that? Do side or something like that. They have the white and red paint on their face. That was that episode.

That's right. We did see the shuttle before. Well, it's cool here. It's super cool. And in fact, I don't know if we talked about it, but inside the cockpit, I love that globe that looks like R2. D2 to me.

Do you know what I'm talking about that white, the white globe? That is the top of R2D2. It's R2. Absolutely. It is. Now I know who's running the ship. Okay, that makes sense. Thank God R2D2 is running it.

But the space shot's very cool. It goes inside the wormhole. Back inside the cockpit corklets neck out of the bag, the sack there. And the shuttle is shaking. Quark's very nervous because. Because it's dangerous. It isn't Quark that's shaking. It's Armand that shaking.

Because he does not like turbulence. Well, Zek comes out of the bag, tells Warc that he has to open the box if he wants to talk to the prophets. Right. I like his line here where he says, you better hurry, though. I got the dampening field on this ship

for a substantial discount. Not the best dampening field, not the best shields. You better hurry up. Goes into the white limbo. This is where he meets all the profits. So this is where everybody, Dax, and Emmy, our guest star is even there. Kira is there, Cisco's there. There's only one person who isn't there, which to me was obvious.

And, of course, he couldn't be there. Or he could have, but he wasn't. Who was it? Odo's not there. Oh. Oh, yeah. Yeah, I didn't even think about that, but you're right. Yeah, he should have been there.

Story-wise. Yeah. Yes, this is also the first instance where they refer to the alien Cisco as the Sisko. They don't ever say the Sussex. And they also call the Zek. The Zek, yes. The Cork, the, yeah.

Basically in this scene, the prophets, you know, describe how they de-evolved Zek back to a time when the Ferengi weren't so driven by prophets. And that's the first time we learned about that. Yeah, by profit. Not prophets as in gods, but profit as in money. Yeah, that Ferengi at one point were not. Acquisitive. Yes. I love that.

Acquisitive. They do say that they were less aggressive. They were less adversarial. And they say in the scene they threatened to devolve Quark back to the same way they did with Zek. But Quark brilliantly argues in this scene, I think, that basically his argument is wanting to better yourself, wanting to make profit, wanting to improve your life is a good thing. And that that helps evolve people. that helps people to grow. I love the idea, the argument,

the Ferengi argument that Quark makes in this scene is great. It's really awesome. And as I watched and realized that they had changed the Zek, that they were aggressively going to change Quark as well, the people that are really adversarial and aggressive are the wormhole aliens. Yes. Yes, exactly.

Oh. From my character's point of view, they're the aggressive ones. Yeah. They're the adversarial ones. They want to fundamentally change who you are. That's right. You know, it is, forgive me for crossing lines here, but it is directly against the prime directive. Yeah.

Yeah. They are meddling in somebody else's culture. Mm-hmm. Absolutely. Yeah, but they have no, I mean, the wormhole aliens have no reference points in prime directive. No, no, absolutely. That's what I mean by crossing. So, I mean, I'm in mixing the Starfleet morals with profit morals, but yes, totally makes sense.

They, they have, in my, again, I'm very prejudiced. So they've crossed the line. And, you know, not that I want this scene, but I, you know, I think Quarck should go back and tell Kira that her gods are not, her gods are not perfect. Yes, exactly. Okay. I hear you. Well, the only thing that convinced them to send him back is when he says, if you change him, change me, then this curiosity to better ourselves, this curiosity is going to bring more

frangy back. So if you want to, if you don't want to deal with us, you should leave me alone. And why is it that Cisco in the pilot episode, his philosophy, which is different than theirs, they accept that. And in fact, he is. They're Cisco tossing the baseball up and down right out of the first episode. And yet the Ferengi, and you said it's a good argument, that I can't be sure of, but I think it's too close to it, but you think it's a great album. so why can't they see it as a good argument yeah yeah why is it the argument is okay we can accept that but the but the guy with the big ears that we can't accept me yeah we can't accept the trolls uh uh argument his argument well i mean but then the flip

side is they accept cisco because he has been designated as the emissary whereas the phrenge they're not familiar with a frangy at all i don't know but they weren't familiar with humans either or leith's earthlings um when they first meets just go in the pilot okay i mean he isn't the emissary until after he meets the alias right right right okay well they do send him back he wins this chess match cork wins this chess match i think they're just bored with him they don't see him anymore they do say your linguistics you know what do they say something linguistic communication is tiresome and cork says my point exactly which is why i think you should send me back And before he even finishes his sentence, he's back.

It was like, well, you're right. He just wears no more. Get him out of here. It's a good strategy. It works. You annoyed them to the point where they're like, yeah, we're going to switch it back. For sure. But the valid point was this.

You said to them, if you do switch me to the same as Grand Nagas Zeck, there will be other phrengey will come here and ask the same question, why is cork like this? So it's just to stop. It'll be a never-ending loop. So just please stop this from happening, put me. put me do not change me and definitely put grand negus deck back to the way he was and being able to see the future wouldn't they know that yes the moment he said it they should know that yeah yeah here's my takeaway from this episode never get in a debate with quark because he is tenacious

he is clever and he will just wear you out with good argument after good argument and you'll you'll just yeah yeah there there's one moment but not one but there's a moment very slight in the going around the table and the where that happens and i go good for you arm that that's a good choice yeah um where where the argument is is trying to think what am i going and he comes up with something yeah i can see the moment where i'm going i'm not giving up i'm not giving you this is what i'm going he's passing around someone and uses that little pause to be inspired for his next argument yeah yeah it does make me think Sometimes I'll be directing, and I will give an actor an adjustment, and they'll say,

well, no, I don't think my character should do that, because blah, blah, blah, and I have to think of another way to do it. I have to pull a quark there. I'm like, what's my next way to put this? How can I say this differently? Because we've got to get this note. I got to get this change. How am I going to say it?

Because you've got the writer-producers there. I mean, you're the movie, but we have to have this. How can I quirk this actor? How can I quark this actor? That's going to be my new thing. Yeah. In my book of directing that I write, I will, I will, yes, I will term that the quark the actor. I love it. Back in the shuttle, though, Zach is back to normal. So is quark.

It's a mystery as Zach come back to normal. There's a moment where we don't know. Yes, there is a moment at the top. Quark, quark, are you all right? Seems concerned. Seems like that empathetic, Zach that we thought we had been seeing this whole episode. And then quark says, I think so. What about you? And that's when Zach turns and says, Oh, stop toying up to me. Now we know he's back to normal. Well, yeah, you kind of, but you especially know, because at the end of that sentence, he says, I have an orb to sell to the pejorans, not to give to them as a present. So, you know, he's back.

And you hug, Zach in this scene. Yeah. Nice hug. Yeah. Easy to do. Yeah. And he's your hero, too. Your hero is back.

You're wrinkling my suit. I'm back in the ward room. They're all watching this award ceremony. for Bashir. He does not win. Everybody scatters. Picket fences one. Picket fences one.

Dax tells Julian that he seems to be handling this very well. And Julian admits, actually, I'm not. Believe me, I'm not, he says. But to Robbie's point, we don't know why he's not. We don't know why he, why didn't you care at the beginning and why do you care now? We don't even know. We're clueless. That's kind of a surprise.

because we don't know much about his feelings. He's been kind of numb to this whole journey, this whole story. So we go to the airlock next. Zach is preparing to leave. He wants to make sure all the records of this whole thing have been destroyed. Doesn't want anybody to know about it. Or he might get thrown off the Tower of Prophet or whatever it was called. Tower of Commerce.

Tower of Commerce, yes. He sneezes on you guys, which I thought was an extra bit. I don't know if that was in the script or not, but it was. It was funny. Sneezes and leaves. Sneezes right on you and then leaves. Quark wishes he'd made some profit for all this trouble. And that's when Rom says, well, actually, you did.

Oh, wait, wait, before you get to that, though, Robbie, when Zek says, are you sure you've destroyed every last copy of the revised rules of acquisition? Rom goes, well, the only place the new rules exist is inside my head. And at that point, Zek sort of like gets serious. May I do. who puts his big hand on Ram's show. That's right. That's right. Like he's about to take him out. You know what I'm saying? And then that's when Cork sticks up for his brother. Don't worry. Within a week, you'll have forgotten them all.

And so he releases his spot grasp. He saved. You just saved your bro. There's a love-hate relationship between the brothers. For sure. There's a love-hate. But in this scene, Rom reveals that maybe they did make some profit off of this, that Rom was the administrator of the Benevolent Association. And he admits he embezzled some money in court.

is very impressed with that says father would be so proud and they walk off arm in arm so it's more love than hate that's what i take away from this episode and did either of you feel that there was a nod to um oh god what is it um humphrey bogart and uh oh um as they walked to with casablanca yeah yes i just got a sense of that it had a classic heroes walking off into the sunset kind of vibe yeah it was great whatever it was, it was satisfying to watch that. So the bonding between the two of you is wonderful. And to know that, yeah, Rom actually does have the lobes. He actually, he embezzled from Grand Negus's X's personal fortune, which is huge. And that we, and that's the, again, this is the beginning of Rom turning into a mensch, or at least an entity unto himself. And I'm really happy to see that,

really happy to see that. You're great. Lesson theme slash moral of this episode, what do you say, Robert Duncan McNeil? What I wrote down is the drive to improve and be rewarded for that improvement is in all of us. It's how we all evolve. It's universal in a way, whether it's animals or plants or, you know, it's Darwinian in a way. You want to improve. You want to better yourself. It's the argument that Quark makes to the profits.

It's even the essence of the Bashir story, in a way, that could have been, this is where I'm, this is where I'll put my frustration with that story altogether, if that's the theme, that this, that we all have this innate drive to be, to improve and be rewarded for that, to be, you know, that the reason we try to improve is to survive or to better our living conditions. if that's the reason, then Bashir's blowing off the, oh, I don't need an award, is bullshit because he does have that same innate drive to be rewarded, to improve himself. So why wasn't that fleshed out in a way that could have echoed Quark's argument to the prophets? It would have made that argument so much richer if we had seen that theme played out in Bashir's story a little better. Okay. I like that. I like that.

It's very deep. There you go. Armand, what would your lesson be from this episode? Well, mine actually is pretty close to what Robbie just said. This is what I wrote. Ambition and greed are first cousins and spring from the same prejudice that more is preferable to less. Which is a quote from the show. Interesting.

Interesting way you worded that, the same prejudice. There's a bias that one is better. Yeah. But he The ambition, yes, if we If we are to assume that that Bashir is disappointed that he didn't win, it's because he had ambitions. And greed is essential to the Ferengi culture.

But they come from the same place. They're both prejudices. It's probably both a prejudice and a virtue. I agree. I think that's what Cork argued is it's a virtue. Yeah. That this is, you know, the greed or the, you know profit motive that we have as a virtue because it helps us better ourselves helps our

people better ourselves yeah what do you got there you got a comedy one garret i feel like a comedy i don't know i don't have a comedy one i know i don't have a comedy one i it's interesting because i was kind of struggling with this one like you know i was trying to come with a serious one but then in the actual recap and discussion when armin brought up the fact that inside the wormhole that the wormhole aliens or the prophets, they talk about how, you know, well, we couldn't stand how aggressive Grand Sack was, so we changed him. But Armand mentioned they're pretty aggressive on their own in changing him to begin with. So I guess my lesson or caveat is that those who live in glass houses shouldn't be throwing stones or whatever. That's it. Is that it? Is that

did I say that incorrect? Yeah. No, you said it right. People in glass houses shouldn't throw stones. Shouldn't throw stones, yeah. What's our Patreon poll theme moral lesson of this episode? Yes, that is submitted by Sherry Kay, and that is, if never, keep, profit, a good smile, honesty. They left it at that. They got a comedy. They got the comedic. Comedy lesson.

Thank you for a great episode, Armin. I really enjoyed this. I don't care what you rate it. I don't care all their bits and quibbles and bits about it. I enjoyed it. That's what counts. That's really what counts. That's what kind of our favorite so far.

Robbie and I were both thoroughly entertained. So that's what we want to say to you. And we want to thank you for joining us for this recap and discussion. Thank you for your honest opinion about this episode. And for all of our Patreon patrons, please stay tuned for your bonus material. Be it. I'm going to Beard

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