The Diary Of A CEO with Steven Bartlett - Charlie Sloth: From Homeless, To Fire In The Booth, To An £800 Million Business!

Episode Date: November 28, 2022

Charlie Sloth is a radio presenter on Apple Music One, and previously on Radio One. The creator of “Fire in the Booth”, he is known as a adept and visionary patron of new artists worldwide. Appearing on Sloth's show is the moment many rappers and musical artists ‘make it’. Charlie wouldn’t have it any other way. As he reveals in this episode, he has never deviated from his dream of bringing new talent to the fore. Even when he was living in a shed as a single father with a young son, he knew where he wanted to end up. That perseverance got him through the difficult moments, when nothing else would. In this conversation Charlie opens up about the need to hold yourself to high standards, because the only feedback that’s actually going to take you to the next level is the feedback you give yourself. In a raw, honest and Frank exchange, Charlie shares his lessons that he’s picked up from a lifetime of hustling, from being a street artist to founding one of the worlds most successful vodka brands - Charlie is never someone to do things by halves. Charlie: Instagram - http://bit.ly/3u2YD8n Twitter - http://bit.ly/3gDhLqn Follow me: https://beacons.ai/diaryofaceo

Quick one. Just wanted to say a big thank you to three people very quickly. First people I want to say thank you to is all of you that listen to the show. Never in my wildest dreams is all I can say. Never in my wildest dreams did I think I'd start a podcast in my kitchen and that it would expand all over the world as it has done. And we've now opened our first studio in America, thanks to my very helpful team led by Jack on the production side of things. So thank you to Jack and the team for building out the new American studio. And thirdly to to Amazon Music, who when they heard that we were expanding to the United States, and I'd be recording a lot more over in the States, they put a massive billboard in Times Square for the show. So thank you so much, Amazon Music. Thank you to our team. And

thank you to all of you that listened to this show. Let's continue. Stormzy. The minute he left that studio, I rang everyone and said, this guy is a superstar. But then three years ago, I've never told anyone this story. Three years ago... It's your boy Charlie Snow, BBC Radio and X-Shock. We're the biggest rapper on the planet. Just when you thought AU vodka was done for the year.

My favourite part of the show. I was raised in an environment where not many people ever amounted to anything. It's not our fault, it's society's fault. Fuck society. So it was tough. We was living in a shed. My son had just been born. I couldn't afford nappies. And we had no toilet. That was the sacrifice that I had to make in order for me to become the person I needed to become. Branding has always been

so integral for me. The Fire in the Booth brand became a monster within the culture. There's not many people like me that understand culture and understand business in the same way I do.

AU Vodka is a great reflection of that. We outsold Trey Goose twice over. Three times as many bottles of syrup. Turnover, £80 million this year. Are you joking?

No. How much do you think this is valued at now? £800 million. Jesus Christ. We actually have a Bible to do's and don'ts. Everyone wants to know what's in that Bible. What kind of things are in there? I mean, it goes from... Charlie, I'm a big believer on this podcast that our earliest years end up defining who we become

and shaping who we are from a character standpoint, our perspective on the world, what we think matters, our values and all of those things and really decides which way we go off into the world and how we go off into the world. When was reading about your early years that felt more evident in this case than in the case of most guests I sit here with so can you tell me in those earliest years when you look back as an adult now what were the things what was the context that ended up shaping you and who you went on to become in your life I think for me um coming from the humble beginnings that I did, I feel like I was raised in an environment where not many people ever amounted to anything. So there was no one for me growing up who I looked up to as a role model per se. It was more, you know, family members for me that gave me the confidence and

inspiration to do better in life but I feel at the same time me coming from that environment coloured me and toughened me to become almost I felt like growing up invincible because you know growing up seeing friends get killed, go to prison. When you survive that, it almost makes you feel like, wow, I'm indestructible, especially at a young age. And I've always been very confident and had loads of self-belief, but I feel like it set me up to want to a prove people wrong because i felt like i was never given any opportunities or chances to you know better myself or be the person i am today you know when i was

17 i didn't even know what university was i had no idea what university was when you think about that now and put that in perspective that's crazy i had no idea what university was when i was younger i wanted to be a director i wanted to make movies and i never had no insight into how that made that how to make that happen my teachers were like you'll be a plumber electrician or a chippy at best if you do well so for me I was kind of like huh there's gotta be more to life than that and I was always very inquisitive I always wanted to know how things worked why things didn't work or how how you do this and how you do that I was always very up on self-education so I feel like those early years of my life really shaped who I am today. You know, how I treat other people.

Because obviously my mum was the cleaner. So, you know, when I'm in a corporate building or, you know, wherever I am in the world, I'll always treat that person with the same respect that I'll treat the CEO that I meet in that day or that I'm doing business with that day because that cleaner was my mum so I have a different view and perspective on life and on people and I think that's put me you know in a great position in life especially with my people skills and how to treat people which I feel is a massive part of why I am where I am. What about your father? My father was an electrician very strict very very strict, very strict man, very disciplined. And as a young kid, you know, we didn't always see eye to eye.

And I always felt like he failed my sisters and he would always make comments to me, you'll never be as successful as I am. And as a kid, I'm like, whoa, like, what are you we're talking about that and it's mad this is this is a funny story my dad used to always say that to me you'll never be as successful as I am and as a child I always thought that he meant in terms of monetary success. That's what I viewed as success. But then three years ago, I've never told anyone this story. Three years ago, I took my family away, my whole family for Christmas. And me and my dad had a drink. And I'm like, dad, like, just look around you, dad. Look at everything that I've got and everything that I've achieved.

You said I'll never be as successful as you. And he said to me, son, I was never talking about money. Money's never been a thing for me. I've never chased money in the same way you chase money. I was talking about you and your sisters and your mother. And I had to stop and I'm like, why are you talking about you and your sisters and your mother. And I had to stop and I'm like, why are you talking about that?

And he said, look at the man you've become. Look at the women your sisters have become. I am successful as a father. You're all winners. And it's true. Me and my sisters, we're all winners. Like my sister's got an incredible job. My youngest has got an incredible job,

incredible business. I can't help but think you beat him. So move the goalposts. Maybe, maybe, maybe my dad's pretty good at that to be fair. But it made me think, it made me stop.

Cause I've always, to be fair, i've always used that as motivation without even knowing it and to that point i never really assessed the situation in the way that i should have because i always used that to drive me on to be like come on dad but i'm light years ahead without having that conversation having that conversation with myself in my head. Until I had that conversation, I didn't really sit down and read deep why I was thinking like that. And I think it almost, there was a weight that lifted from my shoulders once I'd had that conversation.

I think likewise for my dad you know um I think it's like it changed the dynamics of our relationship somewhat but when I do look back at the things that he would say and the things that he would do he was like a coach like the ultimate coach you know like he he would inspire and motivate me without pampering me, without making me soft. He would say things that he knew was harsh or he would discipline me in ways that he knew were harsh. And he probably felt bad about it at the time. But he had a plan for how he wanted me to turn out. And, you know, look at me now.

And he played a big part of that what about money when people come from backgrounds i mean you grew up in a council estate right when people come from those backgrounds and money is a center point of like the relationships in the household it's the the cause of the arguments it's everything right it's always there in a conversation when we become adults we can sometimes have like an unhealthy pursuit or relationship with money it can control our decision making a little bit too much so as it relates to your relationship with money at that point growing up and how that kind of orientated you as you became a young man what was your relationship with money i think for me money was a necessity if we didn't have money or if i didn't make money additional money from my family home

we never had gas we never had electric we never had food and growing up for me I was like this can't happen I need to change this I need to make effort myself not rely on my parents or my sisters to get out of my way and change this. And from a young age, I was, I was always about, you know, from when I was 12 to up until I was 17, I was always about making money. And that for me was the drive. How do I make money? I need to make more money. You know, it started with me selling sandwiches because I couldn't afford lunch dinners. I weren't getting free dinners at the time. So my mum used to make me a packed lunch.

And I remember going to school, selling the sandwiches, selling the crisps, selling the drink, making a fiver. And I was like, wait a minute, I can just replicate this. So then I started going and buying a loaf of bread salami some salad cream some lettuce and I started making 10 sandwiches selling all the sandwiches and then throughout a two-year period it extended to me buying cigarettes buying 20 cigarettes and selling the cigarettes for a pound each sometimes five pounds depending on how desperate the person who was who's trying to buy the cigarette for me and I would always save the money that I'd make and reinvest it to make more money and then by the time I was I'd say 21 my idea of chasing money had changed somewhat. It became very apparent for me that I weren't happy chasing money. I weren't about chasing the money. I still understood the value of money and knew how

important it was for me to make money. But I made a decision around 2021 that I was going to focus on something that I loved and that I was very passionate about and allow the financial rewards to follow that rather than doing it the other way around chasing the money by doing things that I'm not so passionate about I don't really care about and I can't see it ever making me happy before that point I was reading about your your running with the law. Yeah. And it's pretty severe. Yeah. I mean, where I grew up, you know, like I said, it was tough.

And I made a lot of bad decisions as a kid. I was watching Tablox Jews. Yeah. A lot of that was bravado. And that show, a lot of that was bravado. At a time where I felt like I had to portray a certain image to be accepted in a community that I felt like that was the cool thing to do and the cool way to act. A lot of that was bravado.

Was there any truth to any of that? I mean, there was some elements of truth to some of the things that I got caught up in as a kid that, you know, I regret. And I live with that regret every day of my life. But again, you know, I was a product of my environment and I'm lucky enough that I was able to escape that environment to become the man I am today. And going back to what I was saying before, all of these incidents have shaped me to become the person I am today.

So, of course, I regret a lot of the things that I got caught up in as a child. And I was a child. I wasn't a man at any point. When you look back at that kid in that documentary, Tower Block Dreams. I'm embarrassed. Really?

Yeah, I cringe. I can't watch it. I cringe. But at the same time, there's a certain amount of warmth that I feel just watching how much I've progressed and grown as a man. And to look back at that now, for me, it's just like, wow, wow. But at the same time, I feel like, you know, the amount of messages that I get every day about how inspiring that is to people that are living in certain circumstances very familiar to those that I was living in back then and I feel like it shows a generation for me

that right now seems very lost very scared very confused that it's possible that if you believe in yourself and you apply yourself and you put everything that's expected of you to the side and just do what feels right for you anything's possible and I'm living proof of that like I'm here today you know one of the most successful hip-hop DJs in Europe I own multiple brands and i'm still doing what i love when i was told that that wasn't possible when i watched those videos outside of the bravado um which you described there what i did see was a young man that was incredibly hungry yeah it was as you say it's someone that was trying to change their life in fact i i went to a prison the other day and

spent like five or six hours in the prison talking to the inmates and I saw the same kind of like ambitious kind of desperation to get out of that situation and to turn things around and that's what I saw in that young man was outside of all that stuff there was a man there that really really wanted to be successful and really wanted to get on and it's so funny because you say like it was you didn't have the ideas. Nobody had given you the ideas. Your environment hadn't given you the ideas. You didn't even know what university was.

I had no idea. At that point, I had no idea. And when you think about that, that's bizarre. How does a 17 year old young man not know what university is? And that's because nobody had told me. And none of my friends were going to university. I didn't know one person that had gone to university at that age goes to show how much

information is a privilege oh of course information is everything and of course at that at that time there was no internet so for me to self-educate in the way I do now it wasn't possible back then but yeah you're right my hunger and passion was. And I feel like that's what set me apart. You know, there's times when I've sat there and I'm always my own worst critic. I'll always review myself and I'll sit there and I wouldn't say I meditate, but I like to reflect. I like to look within to find out what I'm doing right, what I'm not doing so well. And just where I'm at in life in terms of perspective. And there was a time maybe three years ago when I was sat there

and I'm questioning myself almost. I'm like, you know, what is it that's made me become the person I am? Like, why have I been so successful? Is it luck? Have I just been lucky? I'm asking myself these questions. And then, you know, I'm thinking about my old friendship groups and where a lot of those are in terms of life

and some of my new friendship groups. And after reflecting for several hours and sitting there and questioning myself, the one thing that was very clear that separated me from everyone that I'd met throughout life and had been part of my journey was my self-belief.

Like, I've always believed that impossible is nothing I can do it as long as I've had that mindset about things I've been able to accomplish it and part of that same you know analysis on myself was going back to the imagery that I'd put up around in my studio and how I went about achieving those certain goals and targets that I'd set myself. And it was almost like I had achieved those things subconsciously for me. Like I had set myself a target and they were they was all around my room but I wouldn't

sit there every day thinking I want an orange Porsche Porsche I want a massive detached house with land

I didn't sit there and think every day about those things but they were around me and they were part of my environment and in the same way when i was

younger my environment had a huge influence on who i was and how i behaved once i stepped out of that and created my own environment my own universe if you like which was surrounded by all of these things that i wanted to achieve i I started achieving them subconsciously, unknowingly, without having a real formula to how I'd achieve them. So I'm sitting there thinking, wait a minute, so how did I actually do that? And then it always comes back to the self-belief. Because the moment I believe in something something if i can visualize what i'm

trying to achieve i know it's possible the analogy that i've come to like really believe in based on having these conversations with people who have all to some degree subconsciously because you're saying that i didn't consciously sit there every day and think about it and make a plan it was just in my subconscious so so i drove towards it. It's this analogy of the car, right? The sat-nav and the pedal. You've got to set the sat-nav and you've got to push the pedal. If you do one of them, if you just push the pedal, you're going to get lost. That's a great analogy. If you set the sat-nav but don't push the pedal, you're going to be in your garage all day.

I love that. You know what I mean? And you did both, clearly. You had the drive drive to push the pedal but you also knew the direction of travel you wanted to go in in those early years though i was watching a talk you did uh i think it was on the bbc's channel to a group of what looked like students about living in a shed yeah and then your manager giving you some advice yeah take me back to that period of your life was that the the toughest moment of your journey i'd say so it was a period of my life where i just um become a father and my partner was from a very different world to me a A family where, you know, you could say middle class. And I was at a transitioning period in my life

where I'd got to that point where I was like, I'm going to do something that I love and something that I'm passionate about. And if I'm as good as I believe I am, the success will follow. And for me, it was the success that I was chasing rather than the money at that time. I just wanted to be the best. I just wanted to win.

I knew that if I won, the money would come. And I'm not going to sit here and say it was never about the money. Because of course, it's always about the money. Anyone who says that, you should never trust them. But for me, it wasn't primary it wasn't it wasn't what was driving me forward it was the win that was driving me forward and i knew the money would follow and i couldn't wait for the money to follow but i knew it would as long as i focused on being the best but at that time um we was living in a shed that had no sanitation.

My son had just been born. And there were times when I couldn't afford nappies and milk. And I was kind of doing what I could to get by. And at that time, because I had self-educated on all aspects of new media, like I really went in, Like, I really went in. Like, really, really went in. I was editing. I was editing content for Jump Off TV.

And that was kind of tying me over and, you know, giving me enough money to get by. You know, like, we still had to go elsewhere to shower and use the toilet which is crazy when I think about it now it's crazy but you know like I look back at those moments now and that was sacrifice for me that was the sacrifice that I had to make and I had to put my family through in order for me to become the person I needed to become. How are you feeling every day when you look over at your family in that shed? What's going on in your head? I'm embarrassed. I'm like scared. Anxiety was a big thing for me.

A lot of self-doubt. I'm questioning myself. Can I really do this? Am I really the person that I think I am? Am I being selfish? Should I just go and get a job? Should I just give in and go and get a nine to five and just submit to being part of the 98%? And for me, I just couldn't there was something inside me that wouldn't let me that it was almost like a voice in my head when I look back you can do this man you've got this and I've been I can't I can't I almost felt a pressure and the moment my son was born that pressure intensified like something i've never felt before like something

i didn't even know was possible the the drive and the ambition i was like i it's not about letting me down all my parents down i can't let my son down and there's no way in a million years that I'm gonna let this young man down no way and at that point I was working 18 sometimes 20 hours a day every day seven days a week I wasn't even spending time with my family because I was just so engrossed so obsessed with becoming the best and creating something that moved the needle and in my, I always knew I'd never move the needle unless I was willing to move the needle. And that's what it was for me. So I'd wake up every day, 5 a.m.

And in my head, I've got a four-hour head start before anyone's even started work. I'm four hours up on you where I've got no distractions, no emails, no phone calls, no texts, four four hours just focusing doing what i needed to do and then i had the rest of the day for everyone to play catch up and that's what i was doing in my head and there were times over a two-year period this was there were times when you know people are sitting down and saying this ain't never gonna to happen, Charlie. It's just not going to happen.

Like, you need to be a realist. And their doubt almost made me doubt myself even more. But I knew that if I kept putting in the effort and the work that I was putting in at that period of my life, something was going to give. And it did. Now, this is, you know, when YouTube first started, very fresh, people were doing the vlogs. And my manager at the time was saying, you've got to do a vlog. Let everyone see your personality.

People will fall in love with you. And I'm like, no way. That is so corny. Everyone's doing it. Everyone's your personality. People fall in love with you. And I'm like, no way. That is so corny. Everyone's doing it. Everyone's doing it. And from a young age, my thing was always be, be disruptive. Be as noisy and as loud and as different as you can possibly be. And I still, to this very day, apply that to everything that I'm doing.

So I was like, no, no no i can't do a vlog everyone's doing it i'm just going to be like everyone else i need to do something different so we came up with um being charlie slough where at the time i played like seven eight different characters in a show all wore different outfits different different uniforms, all had their own personality. So you had the cameraman, the editor, the manager, the street team, the artist, the web designer. And they each played on stereotypes of what I felt those people were. And I made the first episode and I spent ages on it.

So long Because I wrote it Myself I filmed it myself I edited it myself And we put it out on YouTube And it done a few thousand views And I was

I remember the feeling I can still I can almost feel The feeling of disappointment That I felt 24 hours after that going live on YouTube, thinking like, wow, I've just spent all that time making this. The first episode was like 40 minutes long.

And it's genius. I'm thinking no one's ever done anything like this. And nobody's watching it. And I thought, you know what? This may be the sign that I needed to actually call it a day. I was so disheartened. And the next thing you know,

we get a message from worldstarhiphop.com saying that they wanted to take it on exclusively. And that was a huge, huge defining moment in my life and in my career. Because not only did it give me the break that I needed within the industry, but it also gave me this new lease of life in terms of self-belief and made me understand that the work and self-belief that I'd had in myself wasn't a waste of time. And that there are people paying attention around the world even when you think people ain't looking they are and for me i feel like that really changed my outlook on life

and on myself and from there there was no looking back like beast mode was fully activated and there was nothing and no one that was going to stop me you know what's really interesting is when we think about self-belief the self-belief you had we almost assume that it can't exist in the same place as doubt but it completely rang true for me that i i was such a self-believing person i think the most self-believing person i'd met when i was you know the early stages of my career but at the same time when my diary, because, you know, we all recount these stories in hindsight to say I had so much self-belief. I was there.

I knew exactly where I was going. Bum, bum, bum. And it happened. Whereas when I look at my diary, I could see the self-doubt. And it was, it come from other people. They're like, maybe they're right. That voice of like, maybe they're right.

Do you know, a lot of people that are successful, that I speak to, I think it's hard for a lot of people to admit that they doubted themselves at some point on their journey I still doubt myself today there's still times when even though I've achieved some incredible things throughout my career I still doubt myself but that's the pessimist in me that gives me balance. I feel like if I never had that, I feel like that self-belief could almost turn into arrogance. And that's something that I've never wanted to happen.

So I feel like when I chat to people, especially people that are grounded, it feels like that's a safety mechanism that we install in ourselves and program in our minds to keep ourselves grounded and humble. Because anytime I spoke to people that don't really have that or don't really want to admit self-doubt, they're the ones that are bordering on the line of arrogance.

Those people typically tend to come from a slightly different background to yours as well i think it could because you know if you'd grown up in a family where everyone was a billionaire yeah you saying that you want to do this or this people would be like easy charlie i'll connect you to the guy now but growing up in that background you're constantly can where nobody's doing what you want to do you're confronted with with um that negative pessimism because that's what people feel about themselves around you why could you do that how can you become that person you know i've never they don't live around here when i came up jamal for me was the the only it was the black guy that had made become successful in business i stalked that kid on skype i told

him years later when we became friends like you were the bridge and when kids come from your background they don't have that bridge i think it's it's a shame it's a massive shame and you still see it today i mean you know but that's again that's that's being from that environment you know no one wants the working class to be inspired no one wants the working class to believe that they don't have to be working class this is a choice you know like it's it's from a young age it's programmed in us from our parents you know that this is what you have to do to have a good life you have to go to school then you go to college if you're lucky you can go to university then you get're lucky, you can go to university. Then you get a job. Then you find a partner.

Then you get a mortgage. Then you're trapped. And then that's it. The moment you enter that agreement with the bank is the moment you're trapped, in my opinion. There's no, you can't really escape at that point because you have commitments. You now have to go to work to pay that mortgage every month and it's at that point where you become

a part of the system and the sad thing is most of the working class youth of today don't know any better and that's why you find a lot of the kids from that environment looking up to the drug dealers the fraud guys because they're the only guys that have ever seen financial success in those communities so they're not going to look up to a doctor or a lawyer or a dentist because there are none the moment that shifts is the moment the mentality of our kids of this generation will change and i think it's changed slightly now because obviously the internet has given everyone a much broader vision in terms of what's possible but there's still a lot of the youth that don't really use the internet in that way. And when you think about that, that's insane.

There's still a lot of families that haven't got a computer or a tablet at home. And this is a real thing. You know, I spend a lot of time doing things with the youth and trying to give back and trying to inspire and encourage the next generation. And some of the conversations that i have i'm just like whoa go and buy this kid an ipad i'm saying go and get him an ipad right now it's it's mind-blowing

it's mind-blowing on that point of you know seeds planted seeds i think your story is the most perfect examples of how seeds you plant can end up changing your life not just for you but all the seeds that were planted on your platform that changed lives yeah and we like i sit here so often with people who tell you know gold medal olympians or they've got a hundred billion dollar company whatever it is and you see at some point they planted some seed without really knowing what the consequence would be and maybe three years later maybe five minutes later that seed unexpectedly changes their life that day when you started making being charlie sloth and it went on world star hip-hop for anybody that

doesn't know world star hip-hop because maybe you're so young or you just you're not been watching world star was the cultural hip-hop website of my whole childhood yeah the biggest in the world yeah it was like youtube it was like YouTube. It was like YouTube for the rap market. And they picked the videos that went on there. So you couldn't just upload it yourself. Um, it was the biggest millions and millions of views. Um,

you were getting a week on that, on that platform when you, when you eventually, when they found you, but that idea of planting seeds, you must've seen that over and over again. Oh, for sure.

In the booth. For sure. For sure. I mean, like, you know, initially, you know, that was a massive

crossroad in my career do i go back into what my passion was you know music producing djing or do i stay on this road of being charlie schloff which is ultimately acting stroke comedy if you like um and it was because i could see the potential in the platform at bbc one extra that i made that decision and it wasn't so much about me and when i look back at that now i was very selfless because i could have taken a big check at the time but this goes back to again what i was saying it weren't about the money i could have taken that check and i don't know where i'd be now but being the man that i was with money i've always been very good with money i would have i would have made that money into more money but i was like it's not about that this is about the next 10 years and what can i do not only for me, but for the community?

Did the BBC see the Worldstar videos? How did that come? They saw the Worldstar. So it was actually DJ Semtex. Ah, okay. Great friend of mine. Great, one of my peers, someone who I've always looked up to and respected.

He was going on tour with Dizzy Rascal on World Tour and needed someone to cover his show. So he got me and Retch Free 2 to come and cover the show so me and Retch covered I believe it was five or six shows and then you know the response was insane that they offered me and Retch Free 2 our own show so they offered a show to me and Retch Free 2 and me and Retch spoke about it and we was like it's a no-brainer let's do it so we agreed terms with the bbc and the night before they was gonna anno it wretch called me at early hours in the morning he's like charlie i've been thinking about this

non-stop i'm like what's that he's like i'm not gonna do the radio show bro i'm like what he's like bro i hope this don't mess things up for you but i really believe that i can crack this music thing so i was like bro i wish you were the best look man i'm just gonna go and do the la thing the bean chai sloth thing bro kill the music so he's like oh thanks bro it means a lot so the next day bbc ran me there's like ah you know rex don't want to do it. Probably won't work with just you on your own.

So I was like, cool. For me, there's no skin off my back. I'm like, I'm doing this being shy stuff stuff. I'm getting millions of views. All the American rappers

know me. They all want to do stuff. I'm kind of like, cool, the BBC is cool. Even at the time, in my head, I was like, I can do so much here.

I can really move the needle. Like, no one has. You'd already started dreaming. I had started putting things in place in my head i was like i can do so much here i can i can really move the needle like no one has you'd already started dreaming i had started putting things in place in my head and planning so i was like it's cool don't worry and then a few days later uh rebecca frank ran me back she's like listen um i've had a chat with a with a management and i've convinced them that you can do it do you still want to do it? And in my mind, I'm like, yeah, I do. So bad. But obviously my team at the time, we're all set on going stateside.

It's just got my O-1 visa. I'm ready to go. And I said, yeah, you know what? Let's do it. But I didn't tell my team. And it went into the, and I went out that they were like, how are you going to know what? Let's do it. But I didn't tell my team and it went into the, and I went out, that they were like,

how are you going to do this? It's impossible. And I was like, well, I'm actually going to do the radio thing and I'm not going to do the being Charlie Slough thing. And obviously they're like, you are insane. Have you lost your marbles? At the time,

when I first joined the BBC, I was getting £140, I believe, a show. So I was only earning £140 a week working for the BBC. So when you think about that, even when I think about that now, you know, there's this huge perception and illusion that djs earn ridiculous amounts of money now they do i mean let's be fair you know i've done all right and there's other djs that trump me um but at a time you know going accepting a contract a year contract at a time for £140 a week, you know,

to go and be on the BBC rather than a six-figure deal in LA. I think most people, especially, you know, managers in general are very straight thinking. Yeah. Right? Yeah. And it's all about the money it's very straight thinking it's it's better you do that because there's more money involved but for me i'm looking about i'm looking at the big picture and i knew what i was capable of bringing to the

table and in my mind i'm sat there and i'm thinking before i even started i'm looking i'm like right what components of a radio show live within a radio show and make people come to the radio show to listen, but also have a life outside of the radio show and continue living and continue bringing new listeners to the show while growing outside? And I was like, freestyles. So I was like, well, I'm just going to brand

ultimately what has been happening within the culture for years, but make it a brand. But it has to be a brand that stands and lives within the community, which solves a problem, which gives artists from the UK, from a street level, a platform to showcase their talent but also means something to the culture something to look up to something to

inspire them something to work towards if you're an artist and that's where Friday Booth came from and you know I feel like you know understanding the power of branding is what put that in a position that it still is today of course it's not the brand that has carried Friar in the Booth it's the talent the Friar in the Booth brand is just a conduit but a conduit that's trusted a conduit that you know is not going to peddle you artists because the brand's being paid to. A product that is positioned within the community to serve the community. I think the integrity of Fire in the Booth

can never be questioned. You know, I see people now, Fire in the Booth's done. It's finished. And I read those comments and I laugh to myself because I've been through that finer booth is done, finer booth is finished, three or four times.

Understanding the cycles and understanding what's happening and repositioning the brand so it never dies. And the finer booth brand will be around as long as i'm here or there's someone else who cares as much as me about the culture so you know there was times when a new freestyle platform will come up and be doing more traffic more views friday booth done a year later a moment that we've been planning for 18 months will happen friday booth is the best that no one else can get these guys on friday

booth like drake like drake and there's been you know multiple juice world yeah little baby yeah you know there's been so many moments where we've had moments with artists that were special moments pop smoke that you don't really get anywhere else that are just very unique and raw unpolished so yeah i feel like that the fire in the booth brand became like a monster within the culture and you know we i've never ever ever taken a penny of any artist to perform on there. I've never taken a check from a label to make sure their artist is positioned right or never. And because for me, that's what makes Find a Booth so special.

When it comes to building a brand that has integrity, what matters? You know, this is a brand. Yeah. And I think, you know, a lot of people... It has integrity. But I think because you have integrity. I think What matters? You know, this is a brand. Yeah. And I think... It has integrity. But I think because you have integrity, I think because you have integrity, you install your morals into the brand.

And this brand is a reflection of you. I think like pretty much everything you do speaks about you as a person because I feel like I'm the same. I feel like if it challenged my morals, I wouldn't want to do it because I'd be like, well, that's not a real reflection of me.

Why am I going to invest my time or my money, my energy into something that doesn't represent me? And I feel like my team, you know, I have an amazing team, do an incredible job of managing the expectations of all of the brands that i'm involved with and i don't even have to say it no more if i if i feel like something's wrong or it's not going to work doesn't look right for the brand they know before it's even come to me because they know what

my morals are they know what i stand for what i don't stand for what i feel is right so it's got to the point where i don't even have to have those conversations because I have such a great team who have those conversations for me and they protect the brand. I feel like if something goes wrong with one of the brands, it's a reflection on me. And something that I've always believed is one of my biggest assets is my reputation.

I feel like you may not like me. You may hate me. You might find me annoying. But one thing you can't challenge is my reputation. I've never done anyone dirty, ever. I've never backstabbed anyone. I've never said I'm going to do something. I've not done it. And my brands have to hold up that same ethos in order for your team to know what decisions you'd make before you know it even comes to you as it relates to the branding the positioning of it and all those things that must first start with you being really really clear and what i've got from all of that is because you're so clear in your head and non-negotiable about what this brand is you've been able to kind of like install that in all of the people around

you so now they are like all of the people around you. So now they are like disciples of the values. For sure. We actually have a Bible. Oh, really? We actually have a Fire in the Booth Bible, a handbook to do's and don'ts. And especially now,

because, you know, the vision of Fire in the Booth has gone from being a feature on a radio show to being a global brand. You know, obviously now we're with Apple, you know, one of the biggest companies in the world who I believe share the same ethos as we do in terms of vision, in terms of content consumption.

And I feel like now the brand really is going global. Everyone wants to know what's in that Bible. What kind of things are in there? I mean, it's, you know, it goes from camera setup to edits, colours to use, right through to how artists are treated once they arrive, communication with teams. One of the things I found really interesting

is I read that you deleted potentially hundreds of episodes of Fire in the Booth that just didn't cut it. Yeah. Which I think a lot of people would be surprised by because, you know, a rapper, an artist comes down, they perform, they might think it's gone off, they might think that, you know, they killed it. And then you're sat there thinking,

this doesn't meet the standard. Yeah, I feel like, you know, I feel there's times when I've not released a Friday Booth and an artist later on has gone on to thank me. Because, you know, it's a big moment in an artist's career. And I feel like if it doesn't do you justice, it's not about me. It's not about why I think this is going to do well

for the Friday Booth brand. Like, anytime I have a conversation with an artist and they say to me, do you think it's not about why I think this is going to do well for the final booth brand. Like, any time I have a conversation with an artist and they say to me, do you think it's good? I can't sit there and lie to the artist's face and say, yes, it's okay. I'm going to be like, you could do better. If you want to come back and go again, we can. If not, let's just park it off for now and come back to it at a later date. And there's been so many that have not gone out

but that's because i felt it's not a good reflection on them not on the brand because no one's gonna you know attack the brand as much as they would the artist there's one of the biggest artists in the world right now steven one of the biggest globally right who come in to do a final booth and I can't tell you how excited I was for this moment even though it was a few years ago they were still a big artist then but they weren't as big as they are now and they came in and done their final booth and you know we everyone was excited and we were prepared for it And they came in and it was possibly one of the worst fine abuse I've ever recorded. And I could see that the artist was quite excited by their performance. And, you know, they was like, oh, when are we going to release it?

And in my mind, I'm'm thinking is this just me is it because i expected here and they delivered here that i'm judging this and they're talking to me and their mouth's just moving and i'm processing all this information in my head because i'm like i don't want to lie to the artist i don't want to be disrespectful to the artist all All this information is swelling in my head and I was like, I'm going to go back and listen to The Final Booth. Give me 10 minutes. So I went back into the studio, replayed it.

All right, this is garbage. This is garbage. So I chatted to the producer at the time and I was like, how's best to handle this situation? I don't want to go out and say that this is not

going to go out. But at the same time, I want to give them the opportunity to redo it while they're here, while they're in the country. And regretfully, I didn't do that. I didn't go out and give the artist the opportunity to do it again. I was like, you know what? I'm just going to say that it's not going out and for me that was a bad decision i look back at that now it's a bad decision

um but it just weren't good enough it weren't good enough and there's so many artists that have come through and not performed but again like i said some that have called me a later day and said you know what i appreciate you not putting that final brief out. Let's go again. Why do you regret that decision? Because in hindsight, I could have given them the opportunity to record it again there and then. But because I had no faith in the situation,

I was like, I'm not going to waste their time and I'm not going to waste my team's time. I just think it's best that we kind of keep it moving but now on reflection i should have given them the opportunity to do it again you know and his comments all the time i've spoke about this before where people like release it release the fire in the booth this person is huge right now we've got sign off on it we can release it but i just wouldn't you know like i'm i don't i don't do things for that reason i'm not gonna shit on the artist now we put something out that i thought was shit back then and put it out now

for views it's counterproductive goes against everything that i say and stand for so it will never come out i probably wouldn't even say the person's name. I'll tell you off camera. I have a slightly similar story that I record an episode of the Diary of a Seer with the person who's currently, if there's three biggest YouTubers in the world, he's definitely one of them.

Oh, wow. And I just never put it out because it just, the conversation is so dead. Are you serious? It's so dead. It just doesn't go anywhere. And it like, I blame myself in part for like not being able to get anything from them um and in the same situation they were they weren't as big then as they are now now they're one of the biggest

and i just but i look reflect on the conversation i now i say like how do i stop that happening in the future because this you know i play a role in the content whereas in firing the booth you play a role but it's you create a platform for them to show them their talent whereas i feel like you gotta lead it yeah i feel like i could have done better a better job i was so inspired watching your conversation with adam where you say about the that board meeting with with the bbc at the start where you lay out to them that you what you're going to do yeah as a dj did anybody believe you what did you say no definitely not they didn't believe i think, I feel like I got laughed out of the room

at the time. So it was two, the two bosses at the time and I'd gone in to do my paperwork and, you know,

they was like, so, you know, what are your aspirations? What are you trying to achieve here? Why are you at the BBC? I said,

well, within a month I'll create the biggest online freestyle platform that'll do millions of views like great yeah it's not radio that's not radio charles i'm just letting you know that's that's not radio that's youtube i'm like all right mate and then i said secondly i'll replace westwood i'll take all the westwood shows within five years and one of the guys actually laughed in my face

i said excuse me why are you laughing? He said, do you know how many times I've heard that? And I said, well, you've never heard it from me. And he's like, good luck with that, chap. Good luck. So I was like, okay. So it actually took me three years of being at the BBC to replace Westwood on all of his shows.

So that was six radio shows a week. And I said it would take me five. So I remember, this is a great story. I actually saw the guy a few weeks back and we laughed over it. You know, I got the call to say, there's going to be an anno going out today announcing all staff that you're replacing Westwood on all shows as of set date here we go now at midday today

so i was like perfect so i left my house nice and early went into uh the bbc building and went around to this guy's desk at maybe must have been55, sat on the edge of his desk and just waited for that inbox to light up with an all-staff from the boss. 12 o'clock it drops in. He opens it, looks at me, says, fair play, you did it. Fair play, what can I say?

And I was like, thank you. I said, I'll do it in five, I did it fair play what can i say and i was like thank you i said i'll do it in five i did it in three it reminds me of your what your dad was saying to you as well for sure and those things you know into into you unwrap it and unravel it you don't really understand what impact it's had on your life i feel like those small moments that drive you on and and give you that fuel to keep pushing through there sat at the back of your mind and then once you've achieved that goal or you know something's happened around that conversation when you can really dissect it and really get into the the nitty-gritty of the words that were presented to you that have inspired and motivated you to become better you're like wow okay it's bizarre but yeah it was a big moment

for me that the interpretation going on there is the key thing right because your dad's words that guy's words any words of self-doubt can be interpreted in many ways depending on the mind that's interpreting them so with your dad's comments that could have made someone go fuck i'm not good enough i'll just i'll just yeah i'm gonna crash and chill i'm gonna crash and chill whereas you you almost interpret it as like you still probably interpret it as like i'm not good enough but i'm gonna prove to you that i am yeah and i think that's such an interesting thing because from this podcast i used to think people that were driven or successful were just these people that were like super motivated and whatever else. What I've come to learn, the more episodes we've done,

is that nearly all of them start with this complex they're fighting against, which is you're not good enough. Dude, you know what? For a long time, I lived with that. And especially when I started stepping into board meetings and meeting corporate folk, I felt like I was dismissed because of how I spoke, how I dressed. But for me, I always thought, you know what? You're no better than me because of your background or

where you are in life. So why would you judge me for being who I am, even though I've worked hard enough to sit at the same table as you? And that would eat me up for a long time. And I'd never speak about it. It was, you know, it was, I guess, a class complex, if anything. I felt like a lot of people judged me on the way I spoke and the way I dressed without actually getting to know me or or picking my brain and to be totally honest i think it wasn't until maybe five years ago where i got past that i was like you know what i deserve to be at this table

and you should be humbled and grateful that I'm sat at this table willing to give you some of the information that I have. Because if you had the information that I have, I wouldn't be sat at this table. You wouldn't need me to be sat at this table. And you probably wouldn't want me to be sat at this table. And that's how I think.

I think I understand the value that I bring to every situation that I'm in now. And that self-doubt has been totally removed. Still self-doubt in my life. But in terms of who I am and what I bring to the table and what I'm capable of achieving, I feel like I'm in a very unique lane in life. There's not many people like me that understand culture

and understand business in the same way i do it's so funny because being charlie sloth in more ways than one not just the documentary you started but throughout your career and being your authentic self in in situations where you might not have fit the status quo is so clearly to me one of the key reasons why you're successful like being yourself yeah so it's interesting to hear that someone who from the outside everyone go well charlie sloth is charlie sloth because he's charlie sloth yeah right would also go no i had those moments walking into rooms where i thought fuck i don't belong or are they judging me or you know yeah for sure i felt inferior i felt like should i really be at this table should i be

speaking different yeah and there, and there was times in my life when I'd go into a meeting and my phone voice would pop out. And I'd leave the meeting and I'd be so mad at myself. I'm like, what are you doing? What are you doing?

Why did you do that? Because you felt like you had to speak a certain way around a certain type of person. No way. And I feel like, yeah, I feel like a lot of people appreciate and respect

me for being unapologetically me you've had all these artists come on your your platforms over the years and with fire in the booth you've really like without a shadow of a doubt made people's careers and i've always wondered what is it that makes one of them actually go go the full distance and become a star? Because there's not many seats at that top table, especially in the UK. So from your perspective, which is a unique perspective, what is it that's separating them?

I think it's a concoction of things. I think the first thing, of course, is always talent. You've got to have talent or some degree of talent, even though I'm a strong believer in hard work always beats talent but talent especially within music is always one of the key ingredients vision is the second thing and I say the third thing is work ethic how much you're willing to work how hard you're willing to go and then the fourth and i think someone who encapsulates this is stormzy is personality morals and a sense of vulnerability i think i think when

you look at all of the most successful artists for me they allow themselves to become vulnerable they allow themselves to be judged they allow themselves to talk about things that a rapper wouldn't necessarily feel comfortable talking about i feel like stormzy he's got the talent he's got the talent. He's got incredible talent, you know, in terms of vision and his work rate, unmatched. I remember doing sessions with Stormzy maybe eight, nine years ago, recording sessions in the studio. And I called him and said, and this was before he was massive.

I called him and said, dude, I said, dude, I want to get you on a project that I'm working on. Can you come to the studio? He's like, what time do you need me there? I said,

if you get there for 4pm, it'd be amazing. Now, I didn't need him there to 6pm, but with me spending as much time as I have with rappers, I'd always

say two hours earlier. So, it was five before he turned up I'm like you're early he's like only five minutes I'm like in my head

I'm like it's two hours and five minutes but so he comes in the studio he's like what do you want me to do I was like do a verse on this song do a verse on this song

do a chorus on this song normally an artist would be in there maybe four or five hours he was in there for like 40 minutes done the two verses done the hook i was like is there anything else you want me to do i'm like whoa uh nah man with that attitude with that attitude and the minute he left that studio

i rang everyone and said this guy is a He is going to be a juggernaut because his mindset was just, he was so focused. He weren't in there gossiping, drinking, smoking. He was like, I'm here to do a job. I'm going to do the job to the best of my ability and then I'm going to move on to do my next job. And to see that in such a young man i was like wow this guy's gone and i remember after that there was a few moments that happened and he was just out of here i just

knew it there's a few artists like that that have been on the show or i've met personally and i've said straight away even to labels friends within the labels I'm like if you want to place a bet that's the guy to place a bet on you can just feel it like it's like you've either got it or you haven't some of the things that these artists have that make them superstars are unteachable and they're hard to see yeah very because no one would have said that but from my external perspective when i think about why stormzy made it i'm thinking i did that thing in the park with the freestyle and then you know he worked with you and then

i think and he's a great rapper yeah but even then there's a reason why he became a great rapper and it's it's dedication dedication so focused no no distractions wretch was the same and you know what like when you look at these artists they're the most incredible human beings set aside everything else they're the most incredible human beings geeks you know one of the biggest rappers in this country one of the most incredible human beings that i know and you know if you're looking at it from an interest entertainment perspective you're like these guys are gangsters and they're not they're human beings and you know their personality their morals their integrity is a big part of why they've

been so successful because everybody wants to work with them. Everybody likes them. Nobody ever wants to say no because they're such good people. And that's, for me, a huge... Stormzy is super talented. Incredible artist. But a huge part of people wanting to do stuff with him is because he's such a great person. But you represent all of those things that you've just described.

The hard work, the vision, the vulnerability, the openness, even the body language point you said. Like, I hard work, the vision, the vulnerability, the openness, even the body language point you said, like I could turn off the volume on a fire in the booth and just watch you. I get carried away. That's because I genuinely care. Yeah. And a lot of that goes back to how many finer booths have not come out.

Yeah. If you saw my reaction to those finer booths, really? You'd be like, well, he's definitely not feeling that. Maybe that's why they flopped. Yeah, maybe.

Maybe. I don't know. You can't lie. I can't. You can't. I can't just. I'm a showman. I DJ all over the world.

I put a show on. But in that environment, that is how I feel. The energy is what makes me become the person I become in the studio at that moment in time. They say 80% of communication is non-verbal, don't they? A hundred percent. And I believe that. I mean, yeah, you can see. Even K-Coke, if you just,

if I didn't speak English, I'd still be like... Yeah, it's like, oh, the passion. The pain in his voice. Yeah, it was a real moment. He'd just come out of jail. He'd just come out of jail. Yeah, yeah.

Just being shot at. So he's like, this is my opportunity. I am not letting this slip and he didn't you know i mean what a huge moment that was for him as an artist first time i'd ever heard of him huge could when i was be signed by jay-z off the front of booth mad insane at some point you get a call from apple yeah tell me tell me about that i mean apple for me you know it was a massive moment in my life and my career so prior to me leaving the bbc i had had offers for a few years before people just trying to start conversation about what it would look like with me leaving the BBC. And, you know, I've got so many great memories and made so many great friends at the BBC

and it was such a huge part of my career and my growth as Charlie Slough and, of course, the Fire in the Booth brand. But I'd got to the point in the building where I'd achieved every single last thing that I'd set out to achieve. And every time I'd achieve a goal in there that I'd set out to achieve and every time I'd achieve a goal in there I set myself a new target but I'd run out of targets in terms of where I could go and what more I could do and you know at this time I was doing five radio shows a week i felt a little bit trapped and for me

what i quickly identified as my next mission was i felt not as easy to achieve while being fixed at the BBC. So I was like, all right, what's next? You know, and, you know, of course, I took into consideration at the time how people were consuming content, the age group of the listeners that were listening to radio, the demographic of people that was listening to radio. I felt like it changed and the way we consume content, it changed forever. And I felt like listening to radio was felt like it changed and the way we consume content it changed forever and i

felt like listening to radio was no longer an appointment i used to wait every night to listen to zane lowe i used to wait every weekend to listen to westwood it was an appointment i wouldn't miss it i felt like those days had moved on and people were listening at their leisure. You know, there was no fixed time for you to have to listen. You could listen back anytime you want on the iPlayer.

So for me, I'd reached this point in my life where I was a bit like, what's next? I'd always knew what was next. I'd always find something

that was next throughout my journey at the BBC. I'd say, all right, I've achieved this. This is next. Let's work towards that. I couldn't find something that was next throughout my journey at the BBC. I'll just say, all right, I've achieved this. This is next. Let's work towards that.

I couldn't find one. I really couldn't find one. And this was just after the Drake fire in the booth, because that was something that I'd worked towards for years. And I'd finally achieved it. And I'm kind of like, what's next, man? And I couldn't find something that was next. I'd never want to do breakfast

it's not really for me um i couldn't see anywhere else that i fitted within the schedule so so i thought you know what let me call zane low because he's the first person from the broadcast world traditional broadcast world that's made that jump. And he's done an incredible job of doing so. So I've called him and I've run through my thoughts with him and how I'm feeling and doubts that I'd had. He was like, dude, I'd love you to be over here. I'd love it.

If you've got any doubts or any concerns, go and speak to Oliver. Oliver's the big boss at Apple Music. He's like, just have a sit down with Oliver. I know you. I know what you stand for. I know what you believe in. Just spend an hour talking to him.

So I was like, okay. He's like, I'll set the meeting up. So he set the meeting up with Oliver. I sat down with Oliver. He's like, you like you know okay so what are you trying to achieve I said I want to be part of the story for the first British rap artist to become a global brand so in the same way you know drake did for canada which people 20 years ago would have laughed at you for would have laughed at you the biggest rapper in the world is canadian no way and i feel like that's how people have thought about a british rapper becoming a global brand and for me being a part of that story um helping that British artist to whatever capacity that I could but having a platform

and a network that would enable me to do that was so important just to be a part of the story um he was like whatever you need I can help you you know he spoke about his passion and his belief and what motivated him and inspired him and like we had a very similar outlook and for me i was like you just get it like i left that room and i was like i know apple is where i want to be i don't care who's offering what there was there was better offers on the table i'm like nah he's the guy i will follow this guy on his journey and make his journey a part of mine and vice versa i know that he gets this he understands what's happening in the world of content and i'm willing to jump on this train and that was it and then from there you know but we've achieved some incredible things

i feel i feel like that we've been doing things that nobody's ever done find a booth being uh an asset that lives on a dsb on apple music that people can stream the the the legals that we had to get around to create this template of how that looks now everyone's trying to create this template of how that looks. Now everyone's trying to do it. Everyone's trying to do it. And everyone's trying to work out exactly how we got around all of the hurdles that we had to get over. A lot of people will ask, because it seems quite amazing

that you managed to take Fire in the Booth from the BBC to Apple. You'd think that that would be like their intellectual property or something. Yeah, so I owned Fire in the Booth before I even went into the BBC. And luckily for me, because the BBC didn't have the same faith in the brand as I did,

they didn't invest any money into the brand whatsoever which would have made things a little bit more messy i feel like on my exit if they'd invested into the brand you're right that if they didn't put money into it then it becomes uh well yeah yeah it would have become a lot messier but there wasn't a contract but it was just you they had invested so you could yeah so basically there was no side deal per se for finding a booth it was something that i just did within the show okay they didn't pay me extra for firing a booth they didn't provide me any staff you're in the copyright i did oh okay so i've always been up on stuff like that okay good before i went in there yeah i owned the full

copyright and then all the trademarks and so i like, I was up on it and there was nothing they could do. So when I did decide to leave, it was like, cheers. Thanks. I mean, I know that probably burnt them. Yeah.

You know, I still have good relations with a lot of the people in there and they're like fair play. You know, you're one of, one of a few that I've got out of the building

with their IP. And then you took that to Apple. I took it to Apple. So now I license the brand. You license it, okay. Yeah, to Apple. Makes sense. Smart.

It's important conversations because, again, we talked about information and people not having information. You know, ownership. People talk about ownership. And I feel like the conversation around ownership sometimes gets a little bit cloudy. And a lot of people take the wrong information out of the importance of ownership. I feel like, you know, it's like any business. You can own 100% of a business and it'd be worth zilpwa.

Or you can own 2% of a business that's worth a billion pounds. I know what I'd rather own. So the understanding of ownership, a lot of people think when you say, make sure you own everything, they think you're talking about you owning a hundred percent of everything rather than actually owning the brand you know like find a booth i own a hundred percent of find a booth but i feel like the conversation generally just gets a bit cloudy because people don't understand what the importance of ownership is. On the point of ownership, there's a bottle sat behind me on the shelf.

I'm going to go grab it. I mean, first of all, you've engraved this with the diary of a CEO. Of course, just for you. It's never getting open. I'm hoping I'll get one of those diaries. Yes. Trade-off.

One of these ones here we have one here a lot of people you know that get involved in the music industry don't end up starting companies like this especially companies that are truly legitimately successful yeah what is the story of au vodka and why did you start this business and also let's start this by just giving me an idea of how successful this has been so far? Wow. So we, last year, we outsold Grey Goose twice over. You're joking. No.

We outsold Grey Goose in the UK twice over. Three times as many bottles as Ciroc. We're on schedule to turn over £80 million this year. Jesus Christ. Yeah. So, I mean, yeah, you know, we're the top selling premium vodka in the uk and we've recently started to really focus on export we sold out in the states we just launched in the

states last week and we decided to go state by state we sold out in two days in the states sold a significant amount of bottles in the states um so yeah i mean the story with AU Vodka interesting story actually so I had just come off the back of having this massive vape business that I set up years ago vapes so I remember being in a club and everyone was smoking vapes

and I was like what is everyone smoking long story short invested in a company made a significant amount of money selling these vapes what is everyone smoking? Long story short, invested in a company, made a significant amount of money selling these vapes, sold the business. Very quick, very quick transaction.

And I was like, what's next? So I was like, no one's got their own vodka business. And I'm looking at Ciroc. I'm looking at what Diddy's doing over there. I'm like, these guys are so ahead of the game,

the Americans, in terms of branding, in terms of creating businesses, in the culture and lifestyle and understanding how to navigate that brand and target a certain demographic. The hard to reach demographic. The demographic that marketeers all over the world spend significant amounts of money trying to penetrate every year. I have access to that market.

And I understand how to position things in the marketplace. So I need to find a vodka. So I ended up spending, I spent way over £100,000 developing this brand. And I just weren't happy with it. I was like, the bar's not right the name's not right the liquor's okay i was like it's not right so um i was like all right cool i'll kind of put that on the on the back burner for for a couple of months i need to focus on some other stuff two days after me having that thought i'll put that

in the back burner i'll get a dm on instagram and it's from au vodka and you know they're a few months old just not really found their foot they're like charlie can we send you some bottles of au vodka and i never respond to messages like that i just don't i'm not in it for i don't want gifting i'm not into that stuff so i was looking at the page i was like let me just check these guys page out vodka i've been trying to do my own thing i go on the page and i see the bottle i'm like whoa these guys have hit the nail on their head so at the end back i was like hey you guys got a number um there's like yeah cool sent me a number of i called him i was like hey what's up man but was incredible i was like what's the story and

they start speaking to me i you know two friends from swan zoo you've just kind of set it up it's pretty new i was like do you guys need investment and i was like nah we don't and i'm like you don't need any money and i was like nah we're good so i was like all right cool i was like well if that changes this is my number i'm more than open to a conversation i'd love to take you guys for dinner so all right cool thanks charlie yeah hopefully we'll speak again soon so two weeks later i met the bbc i get a call oh we just finished a meeting in town would you be up for grabbing a coffee I was like of course

so I meet the two lads Charlie and Jackson we go for a coffee at Nero's Coffee just under the BBC and of course because I've been working on this project

of my own in the background I've already got my five year plan I've got it written out step byby-step to a T. So I sit with these guys and I'm like, what's the story? So they start talking to me and telling me about their backgrounds

and how they got into it and why they got into it. And I was like, look, I've got a five-year plan that I know we will destroy with this product. We'll make this the biggest thing since sliced bread. And I feel like they believed in me in the same way I believed in them. Now, when I invested into the business, of course, the product was incredible.

And I believe that we could do so much with this product, especially within the urban community, which I feel is the community that drives pretty much everything in terms of lifestyle these days. And when you understand that, I feel like it gives you a different view on why things work and why things don't. So spending time with them, getting to know them,

I was like, these guys Are so hungry And so switched on I would be honoured to be their partner So we done a deal We had the five year plan You know The plan was very simple Yet very well thought out

Like step by step We went through that plan And we achieved every single last thing that was on the plan now when we set out on this journey we had all agreed that within five years we'd sell the business for a hundred million pounds i mean like great bit of business you know three years in four years in but like set it for a hundred million like what you know, three years in, four years in, but like set it for a hundred million. Like what?

You know, like our vision changed somewhat and the success that we achieved from this plan that we put in place, we all believed together that we would achieve this and all of us brought something different to the table. How much do you think this is valued at now, this company? I think by the end of this year, realistically, if we was doing a 10 times multiply, you'd be looking at 800, 800 million.

I think with some of the activations that we have going on at the moment i'd like to think by this time next year will be a unicorn for anyone that doesn't know what unicorn is yeah a business that's valued over a billion um and i feel like we're on we're on the right track to achieve that by this time next year everyone listening to you know this this idea of a plan yeah is gonna say charlie listen i want to i want to pop off too i want to build a business what's the what are some of the key things that i need to know about that particular plan when you look back in hindsight and go that's why this worked out i think like for me the most important thing for selling anything is understanding your

audience even firing the booth yeah even find a booth and this goes back to branding and my understanding of branding and my interest and fascination in branding i've always understood the power of branding and i've always understood that in order for you to sell something you have to understand who you're trying to sell it to seems much easier for you because you've always been the audience yeah yeah well i think i think that's why i'm in a privy position in life especially with the brands that i involve myself in i understand the culture i understand what's acceptable what's not acceptable what's cool what's not cool i understand how to speak to that audience. And I also understand that that audience speaks to everybody else.

And, you know, people try and pivot away from it. No, it doesn't work like that. It does work like that. The hard to reach young black audiences around the world set trends. It's as simple as that. Whether it be fashion, lifestyle, they're the trendsetters they're the people that are cool they're like if you wear you know you might wear a jacket a rapper might wear a jacket in a video that's no one's ever seen could be a brand i mean everything that i'm wearing

now maybe the exception being for the top which has real heritage and people have worked with different things but people in my world know this because a rapper's wore it and the same for my trainers or the jeans like even the the indie kids or the dance kids will be inspired by fashion from the urban space so i think understanding your audience for me is one of the most important things and I feel like we understood who we were trying to sell it to so it made it a lot easier selling it to the audience now for me a big thing was making it feel like it was organic natural and not forced like the worst thing for me was for it to feel corporate or to feel like it was part of the old guard so for me it had to be as disruptive as possible like one of the things that I did

which at the time you know a lot of people would have been like what's the point of that but I understood the implications that it would have two, three years down the line. I shouldn't really give this as a gem away, but I'm going to give it away because it's done now. We've done it. So I wanted to align the brand with success. It's a gold bottle. It's a trophy.

I wanted people to feel like that. I wanted people to hold the bottle and feel like they was holding a trophy so we we sat down me and my partners and it was like how how do we do this how can we achieve that we don't have much money to spend we have to make this feel natural and organic so what we did is we partnered up with GRM and I said, every time you give away a plaque to one of these artists who's achieved something incredible on your channel,

can you give them a bottle of AU? Yeah, cool. So every time these artists were getting a plaque, they would hold their plaque and hold a bottle of AU. Now for everyone else who's watching this content straight away the information that they're getting every time they

watch these videos or see these photos is that their favorite artist who's just won or had the massive achievement is holding a bottle of au every time it's happening so straight away you're aligning that bottle with success i think cost us hardly anything it cost us a bowl each and every time it happened but the implications that that had on people subconsciously aligning the bottle with success i mean mean, priceless, absolutely priceless. And I feel like a lot of the things that we did, the most significant things that we did were all shadow marketing,

doing things that people are not really even paying attention to. So if you go back five years ago and you look at some of our marketing strategies and how we went about implementing these strategies, it's like, wow, okay. Like you can see it. I could tell you the whole story and then you can go back and actually see how we applied these strategies to make us generate the interest and desire in the bottle that we have today you know like we've had huge people do it now like in your face oh hey you i love this but i don't

feel like those things are half as impactful as the things that we'd done earlier on in the brand's lifespan planting those seeds planting those seeds yeah that's what it is is planting those seeds you know when i started this podcast it was to hear stories like this about businesses and successful people and how they'd risen and stuff and i think the reason why i called it the diary of a ceo as well was because i don't feel like we spend enough time talking about the other side of the coin which is like some of it we've talked about already today which is the self-doubt piece the struggle piece like if I was to look in Charlie's diary and I could read some of those days where he had written in there things and you know he was being completely honest because he

didn't think anyone would see it you talked about self-doubt you talked about anxiety playing a role in your career from this from the jump what are the things that I would see in that diary that it's not typical for a boss a CEO a successful person to be talking about there would be a lot of conversation with myself about balance I think that's one thing that I've always struggled with in life Balance between my personal life Which I keep very personal for a reason I don't ever want people interfering in my personal life Or passing judgement on my personal life

Because it's my personal life and I keep it personal for that reason. But obviously I've spent a lot of my adult life working and travelling the world, which means I haven't got to spend time with my loved ones in the way that I'd like to. And I've got a lot better at it. You know, over recent years, I've got a lot better at it. But I feel like that's always something throughout my career that I've questioned myself over balance have I spent enough time being a

father have I been the best father that I could possibly be am I being a good example to my children, you know? And I feel like I said, I've got a lot better at recent years, recent years of being a father and spending more time and finding that balance. I've always been a good father. I've always been there for my children. I've always, you know, I've never missed one of my kids' birthdays or, you know, big moments at school or what have you, but I just feel like I could have spent more time being a father.

And I balanced that out with myself, knowing that everything I do ultimately is for them. Like, you know, when I'm not here, I think there's a misconception of me that I'm always spending money um I'm quite um loud with what I do but I don't really spend money at all very little and everything that I do earn it goes into a trust for my family so when it all is said and done you know they won't ever have to experience some of the things that I've experienced in life and they've got a head start and

knowing my children and how grounded they are and you, such beautiful children. Never asked for anything. I think that's one of my proudest achievements. But yeah, I question myself a lot about balance. It rings very true to me because it's the number one thing I go back and forth on. I've said it a couple of times on here that just, I almost worry that I'll regret in hindsight getting that wrong. And sometimes I don't want hindsight to tell me.

Yeah. Because it'll be the hard way, won't it? Same thing for me. And I fight myself over it a lot. Like, am I going to, you know, get to 60, be a billionaire, but live in regret that I didn't spend as much time with my loved ones as I potentially could have have all cards on the table here as well i know i don't have kids yet but i've i'm you know i'm in a relationship i'm committed

so it's the you know the next natural thing that we both want in our lives i know that when i have kids if i don't change something i will say well all of this stuff is helping them yeah that's an excuse i make to myself. I think most people do. Yeah. You know, like, I genuinely believe that. And a big part of my motivation from the moment my son was born

was that he will never have to experience the things that I've experienced. And of course, when he was living in the shed, he was way too young. He don't remember that. When I say it to him now, he's like, what are you talking about dad you know

I drive him past sometimes like you used to live in there well this goes to a point that someone said on this podcast to me one day they said kids don't care about that stuff they just care about quality time of course they do

they do and that is the biggest fight of my career balance finding balance finding time to spend quality time with my loved ones those that ultimately i tell myself i do this for do you think your career is like validating you making you feel accepted in a way that you might not have when you were younger. I used to constantly seek validation. Constantly. Like, I feel like, especially growing up where I did, you know, even going back to the comments that I made on that show,

being bravado and talking about stuff that I didn't actually do, but I'm trying to be, trying to fit in. I'm trying to be cool. I think I shed that, you know, at the same time I did when i felt inferior at times in those board meetings when i was worried about people looking down at me i feel like i don't feel like that anymore i'm not i'm not trying to fit in a test here then this is what i said to my assistant literally this weekend when we were chatting we're chatting in the kitchen because

i was saying you know i think i'm a workah. And then I sat here with this trauma expert and I think he helped me figure out why I'm a workaholic. If I said to you now, all your goals are complete. You've done your to-do list. Your goals are complete. You've done it. I'd say, Charlie, it's pina colada time. The aircraft's waiting.

You go into the beach to relax. No work. How would you feel? Do you know what? This is funny. Because during the first lockdown, when it was like stay at home, can't leave, no work, was the first time in over 10 years that I'd stopped,

that I had literally stopped. And for me, I can't explain the anxiety, the fear, the confusion. I was like, so what, I just stay here and do nothing? Yep, you just sit in your house and do nothing. I mean, I don't understand that. And for the first two weeks, I enjoyed it so much. I was just with my family. We was doing cool things.

I was like, this is amazing. This is what life's about. Week three, I'm sat there tapping my fingers. I'm like, right, this ain't life. I'm not ready for this life yet. So we ended up traveling me and my family around the world going to different places that hadn't fully locked down yet finding things to do creating an adventure to keep me occupied and making the fun part of what we was doing, finding a place where we're not restricted.

We did that for several months and ended up in Dubai where I could work, where I could DJ and where I could operate and do business deals freely. We're not spending seven months there. So answering your question if i was presented with that opportunity now and you said to me everything's done we're going to sell au for a billion we're going to sell find a booth for 50 million uh you know your portfolio of other things we'll just keep it there ticking over uh we're going to manage that throw it all into the trust no how would you feel i couldn't do it but how would you feel give me a word of how you'd feel just a word lost

and i guess that what's the opposite of lost i guess found yeah so that's kind of what what i was talking to my assistant about is like my work addiction which I think I clearly have is making me feel found it's making me in some it's validating me it's making me feel important it's accepted and whatever else and I tend to see that often when people have not always but often when people have like an early experience where maybe they're insecure maybe they had shame because of where they came from maybe they had a chip on their shoulder what they have this unhealthy relationship where their self-esteem and their work are so closely linked that they're not really driven they're being dragged and i'm being dragged i can say it because i i've you know i've sat here

with so many smart people to understand myself like i'm i feel like at times i'm being dragged too much and i need to start driving the car not being pulled by it dude that just hit me that hit me that's a dude yeah fair this is quite a deep conversation well fair

what do you think we do here wow making me reflect on everything that I thought I knew well this is the privilege of sitting with smart people they shine a

polar mirror up to me yeah every day and I sit here fucking like with goosebumps sometimes thinking this guy needs to at me because he's like how do you reflect on all of that i mean yeah i feel like it's been a great conversation and you've definitely made me leave in here thinking more like even some of the comments you just made there that ring so true within my personal life the insecure steve the insecure insecure charles is still there

you know and sometimes you know i'm probably guilty of doing that still to this day i am yeah we have a closing tradition on this podcast where the last guest asks a question for the next guest and I don't know what the question is until I open this book who was the person who first believed in you and what do you want to say to them now I'd say my grandad was the first person

who really believed in me and I guess I'd just say thank you thank who really believed in me. And I guess I just say thank you. Thank you for believing in me. He had like 32 grandchildren. And I was the one I feel like he felt he saw something in, like an energy or just a hunger and a desire to be better. I feel like, you know, yeah, he's belief in me made me who I am today.

And then I'll say away from my family group, it'd probably be a guy who's still part of my team to this day, Ara, calling the coach. You know, at a time in my life when no one believed in me really everyone just saw me as a street kid who didn't really have any prospects or and I feel like he was someone that saw past that and I could see that for the first time and I felt that in my life he was the first person who saw past the way I dressed and the way I spoke and saw me for me and helped me develop to become a better person and focus the energy hunger and desire that I had in the right direction. And to him, you know, he's still a very dear friend of mine today,

still a part of my team, has been for 16 years. And again, just thank you. And, you know, I always have these thoughts in my head of what it looks like when this ends and how I reward everyone because I do have an incredible team some you met earlier and I wouldn't be able to operate the way I do without my team I wouldn't they make sure that I'm enabled to deliver the best version of myself and I sit there and I think when this is all said and done like how do I reward my team and that's something that I think of more and more lately

you know as I'm getting older in life and I feel like there's a few chapters in my life which will shift in the next five years. And I think how do I reward them and show them that I am grateful for the time they've dedicated to me, which they have, you know, dedicated to me and believing in my vision and helping me make my visions a reality. And that's one of the hardest things. How do you reward these people that have enabled you to achieve the things you have? Because I'm under no illusion that without my team,

I wouldn't be who I am today. And I wouldn't have achieved half of the things that I've achieved. Delegation was one of my weakest points because I just wanted to do everything and I believed I could do everything

and that's where the whole being shy stuff comes from because I did everything. But then as you grow you need to understand that you can't do everything. You need to stick

at what you're good at and allow other people who are better at you at those other things to come in and take some of the pressure away and that's what my team have done and have allowed me to become who i am so wow i felt deep like a speech no it's honestly it's beautiful to hear and i and again it shows where you're at in your life that that's the those are the reflections you're having about paying it forward. Your career has been that though. Your career has been enabling people.

It has been pushing forward the UK hip hop rap scene in a way like very few that I could ever name have done. Getting rappers who didn't have a platform, didn't have a voice from areas where they were probably counted out, giving them a chance for their talent to matter above everything else. And that is something that I don't think you'll ever fully get the credit for like even though you've got

loads and loads of credit you'll never fully get the credit for the impact that you've had in that way i mean that when i was in plymouth a kid i was watching all of those videos when i went up to manchester i watched all of those videos that's why you can name one you know whether it's all of the retrofire and i've seen them all yeah i could see your reaction yeah yeah because i know them i know that i know i know all of them and i was there and i had my friends go on fire in the booth and it was the and it still is the platform now it's a global platform but in the uk it was the uk platform at the time to get to get your uh to get your brand out there and it's truly amazing you'll never see that you'll never see i'm sure karma will pay you back in

pleasant ways but i just wanted to say that to your face while i have you here. Thank you. And thank you for your honesty and your vulnerability and your openness. Thank you, Stephen. I appreciate it, man. It's incredible and it will help more people than I think you realize. All of it. All of it. Thank you. Thank you.