The Downbeat - ALIEN WEAPONRY: Māori Tattoos, Culture, and Meeting Your Idols

Episode Date: February 6, 2026

My guests on The Downbeat podcast this week are Tūranga Morgan-Edmonds and Lewis de Jong of ALIEN WEAPONRY.Alien Weaponry are a groove metal band from New Zealand, and their music and lyrics heavily reflect all three members’ Māori ancestry. This episode digs into said ancestry with conversations about Tā moko (traditional Māori tattoos) as well as the Haka, a ceremonial Māori dance that the band performs on stage. We also discuss their new album Te Ra, meeting your idols, working with Randy Blythe, and touring with Gojira. A truly educational episode 2.5 hour episode… and I could have done 2.5 more.

Hey guys, welcome back to the Downbeat Podcast. My guests on the podcast this week are Taranga and Lewis of Alien Weaponry. Alien Weaponry is a band hailing from New Zealand, and every member of the band is of Maori descent. Now, I knew nothing about the indigenous people of New Zealand, and they schooled me for two and a half hours. We also talk about their music, their influences, touring. There's a bunch of stuff, but mostly it is a history lesson and a super, super interesting one. Before we get started, though, I want to let you know If you want to support this podcast, you've got two options.

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by going to neuraldsp.com and using the code downbeat. Check it out. It's alien weaponry on the Downbeat podcast. Alien weaponry. We're here. What's going on? We made it. Nine hour drive to Lewis.

Thanks for coming on the podcast. Thanks for having us. Yes. Nine hour drives from, where we? Chicago last night. Yeah. And the snowy, Fuck me.

Chicago this time of year is like top three cities I don't want to be. Packing up our gear outside in the snow in our stage outfits, which is one layer basically. Hell. What's your stage outfit? Talk me through that. Well, my stage outfit actually is just a pair of pants and no shirt. So I have a shirt side of stage ready to go, especially for these tours because it's like brutal. Yeah.

Same pretty much. I mean, I used to do the shirtless thing too until I gave up on the cold weather thing. there's at least a t-shirt on top. It probably works a bit better. It does work a little bit better. Yeah, it does work a lot better in New Zealand. It's great for summer tours. I know.

And even though we're Pacific Island, like, we're North boys as well. So we're from the winterless north. Wait, not the South Island. Okay. Which is much warmer. Inverse of everything. Auckland's at the top. Wellington's at the bottom.

Wellington's at the bottom of the north. Of the north. Oh, and then there's the South Island. That's where the cold calls. So you're the South Island completely not on. No, we're top of the north. Yeah, so we're like three hours north than Auckland. Ah.

So we're kind of the tropical beach. See, in my head, Auckland was the top of that island, but it's not then. It's like a quarter, maybe a third. I think it's about four hours up to the tippy top from Auckland? Oh, which is we're longer than that? Six to seven, actually. Does it get cold?

Not like this. Yeah, like I see. Where we were raised the Celsius, the very coldest. that will ever get in where I'm from. Say that again, sorry? It's probably like, doesn't get much colder than 10 Celsius, maybe one Celsius on a really bad day. Like, if you see a frost, you're like, oh, boy.

Doesn't hit freezing? Not very, really. I mean, yeah, we're known as the winterless north, you know, so it's like... Sounds black metal, but like the opposite. Right, right, right. And it's, so when we come over here, it's like, goodness gracious. South Island gets a lot colder, though, of course. You know, Southern Hemisphere flipped, of course.

for the South Dakota. When you get the tour offer through and it's a winter in America, do you look at it and you're like, yeah, but... Yes, and it's the second one we've done this year. We did January, February with Kerry King at the start of this year.

Oh my God, yeah, just winter again. And then we had nothing in all of the summer. And we're coming back now for the beginning of winter. It's like, nice. Whoever writes that schedule, you're the man. It's almost the same whenever strayed.

like that side of the world. We didn't, unfortunately, we just came back from Australia a couple of months ago. We didn't get to do New Zealand that time. But like, it's always, they're like, yeah, you want to go in August? I'm like, really. No, no.

I'd rather go when it's fucking freezing here. Right. No one wants to hit a Pacific Island in the winter. I loved New Zealand so much, but I have to admit, I didn't get to see a lot of it because we did, we flew to Auckland

and then it was the drive Auckland to Wellington and we were ready to do it and we were going to stop off a lot of beautiful places on the way all the Lord of the Rings, Lord of the Rings. Yeah, Lord of the Rings. All of the Lord of the Rings places got into the van. Fuck, you probably know the guy. There's a guy that owns a bar in Auckland and he also owns a bar that does venues in Wellington. Oh yeah, it would have been the Valhalla guy. I can't remember his name. That's the fucking guy. He was our promoter for our New Zealand tour at the start of the year. And he drove us though.

But yeah. Okay. So lovely guy, no disrespect to him. We've just done like a world tour. And we're getting in the van at the end of the night in Auckland to drive all night. And he just bought that bar in Wellington that he owned. So he was transporting a load of glasses from both bars. We get into the van and then someone feels something scurrying along their legs.

And I was like, what the fuck was that? And everyone was like, shut up. you're just you're freaking out turn the light on in the van and there's like 150 200 cockroaches in the fucking glasses and i was like i'm really sorry boys it's like one thing in the world that i'm scared of and it's cockroaches i was like i'm getting a fucking flight yeah i just went i stayed at the airport i got a flight i missed out on all the beautiful countryside yeah yeah and it is a good drive walking to wellington is a good drive you get a good range of the country doing that but i i i don't blame you. I don't blame you. I'm not a big fan of creepy crawlies either. Bro, there's so many.

My arsehull was just sucked up this seat, just remembering it. Yeah, we had a, in Riverside on this tour, we had the Roach Hotel, which was a nice fun experience. What do you mean the Roach Hotel? Yeah, well, we, like, we were playing in San Diego, and it was only like, it's only like an hour and a half drive to Riverside, and so we were like, oh, yes, it's going to be like one of the tours, like, we're in a van on this tour, so it's like, you're just doing van hotel. And we were like, oh, it's so looking forward to like a short drive. And, and after the show, get us sleeping at the hotel, whatever. And we start the drive and then like, we're 20 minutes away and there's a crash on the

highway. So we were sat there for like two and a half, three hours. And we're like, oh, come on, man. Great start. Yeah, yeah. Supposed night off, you know, short drive night. And then we get to this hotel and we pull up into the rooms and then, yeah. You and Juergen just like put your stuff on the bed, got in your undies and got in the

bed. And like, I think your room was slightly less dingy than hours, but we got into the room and we were. were like, yo. Like, we're not fuss pots, but like, we got in there, the deadbolt on the door had been ripped

off violently. There were like bullet holes in the door. All the smoke detectors had been like violently ripped out of the ceiling. There were live cockroaches living underneath the mattress. I'm pretty sure I saw

like a piece of blood-soaked tissue left in the bath, room. I was like, dude, I don't even like want, I feel like I'm going to catch some shit just standing in this room. And so basically we were like, yeah, now, let's find a different place. So it obviously was slightly more expensive to find a different place on short notice. And then we spent the whole rest of the tour like arguing with this hotel chain trying to get our money back and they finally have refunded us. But we were like, what the heck. So it turned what was supposed to be an hour and a half drive into,

we found the next hotel at like 5.30 in the morning. Oh, you might as well have been fucking driving. We might as well have just driven in or stayed. It was like, it was a whole thing. And so that was like right at the beginning of the tour too. So then every hotel after that, regardless of the quality, felt like the Hilton.

I mean, I'm not at fuss spot either. I think I'd probably draw the line at cockroaches in the bed that I'm sleeping. Or the van. It's my one regret, though. I was like, why couldn't I have just lived with that cockroach infested van and I could have seen one of the most beautiful countries in the world. Understandable though, I wouldn't have done that.

Is it a culture shock for you when you come to the States? Definitely like this is, I mean this is your second or third time in the States but this is my on tour at least. Yeah, on tour. My ex-girlfriend lives in L.A., so I spent a lot of the past few years back and forth over here, but L.A. on its own is a culture shock versus the country. It's a different. It's a different. mentality for sure but it's kind of cool you know like you grow up watching western

movies or like movies that are primarily set in america yeah and kind of have that as the main culture and it's kind of like you come over here and you're like oh dude people like that's how people are in like like like you hear voices that you only see on TV and you're like what or like food or like you're like I'm the same when I moved here and I was like oh my god Twinkie the real. Right, right, right. The obscene amount of processed things, packaging, you know.

I do find it hard sometimes because I've gut issues. So sometimes I like, you know, I do, no disrespect to the States, but I find the food in New Zealand to be fresher and less, like, gone through process, you know. I think it's one of the worst foods in the world

in terms of, like, the laws. Right, around, like, freshness. and pesticides and stuff right delicious some of it yeah yeah yeah yeah but then some of it you're like what do you eat when you're on tour then because if you just did a nine hour drive from Chicago it can't be that many places to stop that's good

there's a lot of like either I don't eat for six hours or I get like a gas station thing which is never like my what I want necessarily but it's like I'm hungry and I need to eat but I do find that Asian foods usually pretty good for like a palate cleanser, you know, like just a good thing of fried rice and I'm like, oh, I can, you know, digest. It's not so greasy. But like I do end up,

you know, just hitting up like burger spots and stuff, you know, because they're there and there openly. Is there like a universal place that you know that you all want to eat if you see it, that you'll stop to get it? And now it's pretty good. It's pretty standard, you know. Like it's just one of the most flawless burgers in the world. Yeah. Like the epitome, I think, of a burger. It's number one. And still relatively affordable on the scale.

It's so cheap for what it is. They haven't blown up like everybody else has. I'm definitely on tour. I'm like a Mexican food. That's the staple for me. Oh, yeah. Real Mexican food or Chipotle? Either all.

I had literally a life-changing burrito in San Diego. San Diego. Yeah, I keep thinking it's Phoenix for some reason. But I went in there, like, 11 bucks for like, reido like three different solstas in a drink and I was like oh yeah got the thing like walk back to the green room and I like bought it out of the packaging

and I was like oh my god I was like literally felt sick and depressed before eating it ate it and I was like felt happy healthy and like a million bucks I was like no way like for me it's like the ex-bodybuilder in me thinks it's the perfect package I knew there is I knew you mentioned Trayn earlier

I was like, this guy knows what's going on. Rice, protein, it's like wrapped. It's like the most perfect thing ever. They're still relatively affordable. Like, we did a tour with the Kiri King at the start of the year and they're a Phil Demmel's guitar tick, Max Karen. He like would eat a burrito three meals a day every single day. And I was like watching him and I was like, man, I think he might be on to something.

Because like Mexican food, New Zealand is it's a nearly non-existent thing. Couldn't be further. Right. So it's like coming into fashion now, you know. like because everyone raves about it over here, it's like the general popularity, but like it's not nearly as accessible as it is while we're on the road. Do you know what though?

Funnily enough, I did have an amazing burrito in Wellington. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Actually, Wellington does have good burritos. There's like one place and it was like, because I, my like autistic food, I've been told it's an autistic food, is like I eat burritos.

Right. Like that would be at home, I will eat burritos three times a day because of the same, exactly the same reason. Easy meal. I bet that place was Ikem. Ekem.

Yeah. Probably. Is it like a popular spot? Relatively close to where I can't remember. We played some little bar, I can't remember. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Probably the same bar. There's a spot in Rotorua and I, like that sounded amazing.

Say that again. Rotorua. It's actually where me and the drummer, that's where we ancestor from. But it was like I couldn't believe that I found it in New Zealand because it was, it was, it It tasted so authentic. Honestly, it bet like 80 to 90% of Mexican. I've even had it America. And I was like, get out of it.

Damn. Yeah. Well, it was like, they were owned by Mexicans, run by Mexicans. So it's like, it's from fresh. But with New Zealand ingredients. That's what I always think about that place. Because we all went to that place and we were filming, most of the alien weaponry music videos are filmed in Rotorua

because that's where like the Maori tourist experiences are. So it's where you can find the replica villages and the sort of environmental look. And yeah, we were down there filming our videos for one of the latest album. And Lewis was like, oh my God, I found a great Mexican spot. When you say down there, geographically, where is that? Yeah, it's... Mid-country, probably. East Coast, in between.

So it's like Lake Topo, which is smack bang in the middle of the North Island. Yep. And then there's the actual, like, East Coast. Rotorua is like kind of in the middle of those two. It's so interesting because like I know nothing and you're going to educate me and the viewers and the listeners. I know nothing pretty much about New Zealand,

nothing about Maori culture. So it's fascinating to hear it. Classes in session. Classes in session? You want to dive straight in? You want to dive straight in? We can go straight in, man. Straight into class.

All three of you are of Maori heritage, correct? Yeah. Is that something that is, you know, since birth, or is it something that you've looked into, like, deep in your lineage? Or is it, like, your immediate family still are involved in Maori heritage? Do you know, like, I know literally nothing. I don't know if that's like, oh, I found out my ancestors. Or it's like, you're born and your parents are like, you know, this is who you are.

Yeah. It depends on your upbringing, you know, for me, it was from birth, you know. But obviously anyone that is familiar with how colonization works and those sorts of things, there are plenty of people out there who are in today still finding that information out. So I was for, I think the boys are in the same boat. We were fortunate to have been aware from the beginning, you know, raised in the culture, raised with the understanding that we are and always will be with both of my parents are Māori. My grandmother is Scottish.

No fucking word. Shout out the Orkney Islands. I'm like both my parents are Scottish, so I'm technically Scottish. Right. English accent lived in England. Right, right. That'll explain Glasgow. Yeah, there we go.

Yeah. Never been to the Orkney Islands, though. I would like to. I'm sure my grandmother would love me too. But so when you're in those fortunate circumstances where you get that knowledge from the get-go, it's much easier to feel integrated and connected into the culture. And Māori work on like a, it's called the fucker-papa. system, which is one of those words that makes a lot of unfamiliar laugh, chuckle a little bit.

I just love every word that you've said so far. And that's the concept of lineage genealogy for Māori that stems even into the environment, the lands, mountains, rivers, oceans. Our ancestral canoes in which the early proto-Polynesian settlers arrived to New Zealand on, a thousand years ago is all included in our concept of lineage. And so any living person on earth that can make a connection to those things today can identify as Māori, especially too as a lot of people around the world are familiar with the concept of blood quantum, which is like I'm a half this, quarter of this eighth,

divided up as many times as you want. but Māori are one of the fewer groups around the world that have kind of ignored that premise especially in countries like the United States or Canada they actually have like legal systems that divide their indigenous blood up into fractions in order to actually like legally identify based off of some arbitrary mathematics however that works

I didn't know that yeah but New Zealand doesn't and Māori don't function on any of those systems. So, um, and you'll see people who look very Māori. Yeah. Like Moana type, you know,

like stereotypical look. And then you'll have the more fair skin, blonde, blue eyes and everything else in between. Kind of like me. Right. Yeah. And you can get the whole range now in, in the modern day, uh,

but to Maori. But to Maori, if you have a little bit in you, you're Maori. It's all it is. You know, if you can make a connection to, that lineage that I talk about that's all it takes because their premise is like

the concept around that is like a lot of people go oh my great great grandfather was Māori and then like the argument on our side of it is always and so is your great grandfather and then your great grandfather and then your grandfather and your father

like it all still marrots it doesn't just disappear one day I like that yeah and so that's that's one of the sort of things I think that helps our culture thrive in a way it does, you know, because a lot of people get shunned by that idea of splitting it up or you have only so much that you can't identify with that anymore. Of course, you can also then identify with everything else, like I said, Scottish ancestry, English ancestry in there,

blah, blah, blah. But a lot of people like to think that you really can only pick one. Yeah, a lot of people like to funnel you. Forgive me for the interruption, guys, but festival season is officially kicking off. And I want to let you know about a little festival. The downbeat's going to be at. and I would love to see you there. This May, welcome to Rockville, is at the world famous Daytona International Speedway in Daytona, Florida, from May the 7th to the 10th.

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festivals of the year. A good example of that is like me and the drum of my brother's ancestry is like our grandmother's Māori so that makes our dad Māori but his father is Dutch and both my mother's parents are Dutch. So people always were like, oh, you guys are white boys, you know. But me and Henry people. No, it's always what we call Pakea, which are non-Malry. Right.

Or, yeah, kind of, we were always sort of looked at in a weird way by those people. They kind of use that as a reason to kind of invalidate what we were doing, even though me and my brother were raised in a kind of Māori Kauapa, and we went to Kura Kauapa Māori, which is basically Māori preschool and Māori, you know, secondary school. so that that was kind of we never got any of that from Māori because they understood that concept of Faka Papa

but people that are outside of that kind of go half a quarter where your blood is diluted and that's not really how Māori think Maori is if it's in you in any capacity you're Maori that's so awesome and the interesting thing about what Lewis says too is it's always interesting

like more often than not too if you are, like, even let's say you are split, just to entertain them, split half and half. Then the half that they want you to pick is definitely the white. Yeah. You know, like that's always how it's to clarify. It sounded like white people behave.

You know, no one ever goes, oh, well, then you're half Māori. Yeah, yeah. Like, no, you're us. Yeah. Like, it's, which is part of that mindset that the colonialism just brings subconsciously to, you know, half the time people just, they just don't even know. otherwise.

Yeah. You know, like half the time I can't even blame them. It's just a lack of education otherwise, you know, in the way that the systems are built. Is there discrimination against Māori? Again, I know, I know nothing. Thousand percent, yeah. It's like most indigenous groups around the world, you know, in their respective countries, Māori are always in the sort of misrepresented statistically in all the illegal or criminal situations

or whatever. they're the impoverished and things like that, which is the same patterns. You see alcoholism and all those sorts of things that you just see amongst other minority groups all around the world. It's no different for Māori to, you know, currently government-wise. We're in our most right-wing government

that we've had in a long time, if not ever. Same back home and same here. The whole world seems to be running on that trend a little bit. On that side of the pendulum swing. So it's no different for us back home. You know, this is where the interesting part about this experience, though, as Māori. Like, yes, Māori are discriminated against. Am I discriminated against with pale skin and blue eyes?

The same as my cousins who are dark-skinned, dark eyes? No. You know, it is very different. And then that's where the sometimes, you know, Lewis said he's obviously most of his experience in this, when you are of mixed ancestry, the negativity coming from non-men Māori. Not always the case. You know, sometimes it does come from Māori and I would assume like more often than not it's due to the fact that they know that they are treated very differently for the way they look then the way that we are treated for the way that we look.

I suppose it's like when me and Henry we went to Kutakoopa Pāā maori and we actually left Kutaka Pāāāāāāāāāāāāā because we weren't accepted because we were by far the white as kids at Kukā Kukāāāāāāāāāāāāā. And a lot of kids were kind of like oh well then you're not Māori because you're not brown like me and you know I it's that's more of a social issue rather than a Māori issue I would argue right I was gonna say as biracial myself that's you're gonna find that in any culture whether both sides whether what side it is they're going to look at you differently because you are slightly different yes and like human it's the human thing you know like for some reason us as humans are just obsessed with

obsessed. You look different to me. I'm going to hate you and kill you over it. It's like, it's just saying Americans, this is obviously, this is obviously a joke. I mean,

but like Americans, Americans wish they had that kind of Maori, if it's in you, then you're Maori with being Irish. Oh, like, Americans are fucking obsessed with like, well, my great granddad's granddad, granddad's, granddad, granddad once went to Irish.

So, yeah. I'm Irish. March 17th. That's fucking go. Yeah. And that's a real interesting conversation there. And I might not even dive into it. But the,

I always think it's interesting. It's when I, because yeah, that's a whole thing. And I always find it's the ordering of the nationality or the ethnicity, right? It's like Irish American.

I'm like, if anything, you're American, Irish. The American, foreign American, born and raised generations in the American is first.

You know, like to the rest. of the world you are from a nationality perspective in American. But the tricky thing with that conversation is like, and this is one thing that we have with Māori because Māori becomes the word that encompasses all of it. A lot of Māori don't even

want to identify as New Zealanders in today's day and age. They want their nationality to be Māori. But Māori is also an ethnic group. It also happens to be the name for like the culture, right? Yeah. Which causes a lot of confusion. Because American is a nationality.

like you're from like the united states of america or you're from the america's north or whatever you know if south american people become south america but you know if you're brazil you're a brazilian you're like yes you get the nationality thing mixed up with the ethnic thing ethnicity so like yes you will be nationality american united states but sure ethnically polish irish italian you know like america is such a melting pot of culture but because it's one of those places where most of the people here aren't like indigenously from here. There's no claim to the ethnic belonging of the land itself like Native Americans can. Yeah.

So that's what causes that like. They cling on to like, I'm partly Irish. That is what they are, you know, but they're not culturally Irish or from a nationality perspective. They're not Irish, but ethnically they're Irish. And like, so that's a whole mixed match Rubik's Cube thing. You didn't want to get into. Yeah.

Well, that's dusting the way into it. That's a big conversation. But it is, we get that a lot with Māori, you know, causes a lot of confusion. Like, what are you? Is it a nationality? Is it a religion? I mean, I'm going to be like that through this whole episode

because I know fucking nothing. Yeah. Which is why I was so stoked when Natalie sent the email. I was like, fuck yeah, I love those guys on. I don't know fucking anything. So apologies if I pronounce anything wrong or I say anything that's, you know, considered offensive because I don't know. And if I do,

then like be nice but like call me out on it right so other people can learn from it hey well you know that's always the first step though most people don't even want to even yeah learn or correct their ignorance and whatever you want to call it you know and yeah you've got the right guys though anyway the fucking tattoos yeah yeah yeah yeah question number one we're not yet there yet don't worry oh wait we might actually be that i've made a whole living over the past four years talking about my face. I was going to get into that. I mean, we can get into that.

Let's just get into that now. Yeah, your TikTok's massive. Band-Aid off. Your TikTok's massive. Yeah, yeah. It blew up very quickly in a very small span of time. When did that happen? Two weeks after I got it done.

Like literally it was like we'd finish that first of the Gojira tours, which was 2021 in the United States. With Knock Loose, was that? With Knock Loose, which was such an awesome tour. And actually, we've been dusting a lot of those same venues on this. run with Avatar, which has been nice to like to see how it, how those venues are with different crowds. But I had been talking with my mom what throughout that tour like about getting it done when I got home, asked if she wanted to get hers, her face done on the same day, like, make

a, you know, because there's a lot of ritualism around it and significance and whatnot. And she was like, yeah, let's do it. So I literally, I was in the back of the bandwagon, like messaging the artist like, can you do it like do, do, do. But then we're going back on tour with GoZero like so if you can slot me in right before Christmas he's like I'll do the last slot before Christmas which was like December 18th and then in the new year I was like scrolling through TikTok I had never posted a TikTok in my life I think I'd barely had it downloaded it was like this the new thing for me I'd kind of been like one of the those goes of no I'm not gonna get oh in the pan down there's a video I got TikTok for a week and tried to post it and I was like no I don't

want to be a TikTok guy. And there's a video of me being like, too, are you ever going to get a TikTok? And you're like, absolutely not. And then like, you blew up on TikTok and I was like,

all the irony. Yeah, yeah, because management were like, you probably should have some personal TikToks like, because it's the thing right now. I was like,

okay, and now I'm scrolling. And then I've seen this, um, video come up about mokoh, you know, about our face tattoos. And I was like,

oh, I'll stitch it, whatever. Yeah. See what that's all about. And it was like 10 million views or something ridiculous. This is post having it done.

Yeah. Just after you got it done. First video I ever posted on TikTok and it went like stupid viral. Great business. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. And then before I know it, like, yeah, the virality comes. But then the questions. Yeah. What the hell is that? What is that? We'll never get a job. We might as well dive in because we're already in tattoo world.

Right. I actually did that as a joke. but we're going to be in it now. So am I, how do you pronounce it? Moco? Yeah. If I say it like that, is that okay from a white way? Yeah, yeah, totally, totally.

You know, we're actually, this little, overall the years of doing the social media and explaining things Māori to people on the internet, a lot of people, you know, they get really like caught up on the pronunciation thing, you know. In all fairness to all those people out there too, Māori sometimes can be real sticklers for like brutal almost. I'm like come on man how are you going to expect someone like French people oh right right right right in French and no you you are dirt yeah

yeah and um so I coined this like little catchphrase that people seem to like which was effort is respect it's not about the perfection of it it's about the intent behind the you know and because like people don't we've heard people speak English from all sorts of places around the world and they all have accents everybody's got an accent you know you can't always have that perfect so the the the as long as you're trying you know it's it's all you can ask for you can't ask for perfection yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah i'm right that there's different types? There is. So muco is the all-encompassing term refers to these days. There's been a lot of change in the art form over the years. But these days it's like the all-encompassing

term that refers to the specific art style, Māori. So the word muco is unique to Māori compared to the other Pacific Polynesian cultures that all practice some form of ritualistic tattooing. So muqo is unique to Māori. is unique to Māori and it refers to it anywhere on the body. So I have decided to only be covered in Muko so my arms are covered in Muko, my stomach and my face. A lot of people think

it just means the face. It's actually just the broad term. Then each place has like the specific name. So actually what I have is what on my face is what's called Matta orra, which is the men's facial markings.

One of the styles. There's another style called Matakure, which is only the bottom half. Mine's incomplete, so one day it should be my entire face. Fuck yeah. Right. When you go through the motions. And then the women, of course, are known for the Kowai, which is just below their lips and chin area. And then they will sometimes, you'll see women will have a, like a diamond shape on their forehead as well. And those are kind of like the well-known face ones, you know, because it's the face ones that draw everyone's attention. But Mojo does refer to all of it, so it is not an incorrect term.

I'm an amena. And, like my music, my hair changes with me and has to be able to continue my rhythm. For so, Pochon Nine, of Sebastian Professional, has all what my hair needs. Nutrition Profunda. Protection against the encrespaid. 99% less of rotura and punas abirtas under control.

New Motion Nine of Sebastian Professional, the secret professional, of who not sighing tendencies, but of who they're not the different placement and pattern mean something depending on where it is

yeah for sure I mean these days because the actual facial mokor had nearly been made extinct from colonization and religion

was a big part of that Christians was it yeah yeah I think we had a lot Anglican in New Zealand I think Anglo Christians again we do have Catholic

Mormonism is very popular amongst Polynesian groups particularly too so like my dad's family my dad is no longer practicing but his family he was the oldest of 13 and most of his family were all Mormon so you know while being Māori and continuing to practice some elements of of Māori them lost others like a fucking what a combo yeah yeah yeah yeah and Mormon yeah and it's an interesting thing actually like Māori relationship with introduced religion as well because we were one of those cultures that attempted to maintain balance

between the two which inevitably though leads like because pre-colonial Māori religious practice was a lot more open there was a polytheistic religious system so the idea of introducing another god was not like super out of it yeah there's yeah but then you find out very quickly, though, that with a monotheistic religion.

You bring one of those in, and then that's the rest of them are gone. It's a heathen god. Right. So then with that, they tried to keep the balance. A lot of them, you know, have maintained a semblance of balance, but it's always slightly skewed in favor of some form of Christianity. And so one of the things that was lost heavily throughout that time period was Mo'Koh in general, particularly on the face until the gangs brought it back in about the 70s.

as an act of defiance as gangs do and then the stigma came and then the stigma came that's how that's how new zealand developed it's like oh those things mean gangs yeah i feel like watching movies in the 90s right ever there was a new zealand gang right i mean it looked fucking cool i tell you that fucking much but it was i mean until maybe a couple years ago and maybe maybe maybe until your first music video where you had it that I was like, oh, he's in a gang and then I googled it and was like, oh, he's probably not in a gang. Right, right, right.

That's how far the steamer is with that. That's true. It's pretty deep. Especially too, because probably the movie you're talking about, which is the movie that everybody talks about, is once were warriors. What's Warriors. You know, which is an incredible movie.

Unreal movies. Everyone needs to watch that movie at least once in their life. But, you know, it heavily focuses around a month. Māori family in this urban diaspora, which was a part of the period and where Māori were starting to be like stripped of their culture through modernization, you know, and yeah, all the gang members, that movie depicts them as having muco, which yeah, definitely didn't help. Because a lot of people saw it more for the gang side than they did the cultural side,

you know, fantastic movie. Heavy movie. That's a big trigger warning movie. for those out there. It's not a light watch. Fucking insane acting in it as well. Oh, yeah. Incredible. Some of the best in the world, I'd say.

Is that scene in the car? I don't want to ruin it for anyone. I'm not even going to go there. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Just watch it. Just go find that movie and watch it. So where you have it placed, does that specifically mean anything other than just, you know, relating to your heritage or...

This really depends on who you ask. So don't come at me, anybody back home. But for the most part, the, like, two, like, really traditional placements are the face and then there's like a very complex art that goes from your like knees up to your lower back

it covers both legs, bumps, waist yeah I know the one you know um puhorro yeah the puhoro or the pehah god I love the way you say words just keep your answer for the mattoora

it like on the face this was one of the first biggest like misconceptions which is part and parcel with the gang thing was that people associated the face with the violence thing you know everyone goes

oh yeah the warriors yeah it's like a warrior markings wrong the leg ones were and one of the reasons I've heard that is the the

around the midriff it was like the battle belt it was like your armour it protected you also Māori were had a tendency to chop heads off

right take heads off eat brains, fun stuff like that. Hell yeah. Right. So if you needed to identify somebody, you weren't doing it with their face. We were going to do it with their legs and bum, you know, because the thing with mochoo is every single one is unique. There is no two mochoo that are the same for the most part. By design?

Because no two people are the same. So some might argue that like twins, maybe, might get the same one. I do know that some people do get like, for example, they'll be the first in a generations to have Muko and they would like it to be the same as whatever the last ancestor was. I have seen that happen. It is rare though. Most artists will encourage you to make it slightly different because you are your own person. So when it comes to my face, it covers, I always think like the short way to describe it is it's like your ID and your family tree. Cool.

Right. So for me, on my face, it covers my family, my placement in my family, my connection to or lack thereof, because that's why I don't have all my face done to spirituality, things like this. And then my job. So as a, I was a musician by the time I got it done. So on it is depicted my relationship with my job. In the design or in, oh, okay. Yeah. Because that's what I'd read in some research for this that some of it. was to do with, I think the word I read was manor. Yes, yes. So mana is the, which is a word actually that has been taken from Polynesian cultures, you know. Like we're all familiar with it in video games and things like that. It all comes from the same origin of sense, which like, for Māori mana basically means like prestige, respect, honor, yeah. honor things like this.

And the general practice carries with it a huge amount of mana. So an artist will not give moqo to someone they consider to be of low mana. However they measure that, you know, that can be measured and it's not entirely a one size fits all measurement. And so for the facial markings, they always follow that similar kind of set of rules. Now other places on the body, like my arms, for example, the arms is probably the one place in the modern world today in New Zealand,

you're going to find the most mochal. Sleeves, shoulder to wrist, elbow to wrist. Is that Maori or appropriated? It is moqo. And it was brought about predominantly because of the attempt to remove the facial markings from the practice. So it was a way that the artists were able to kind of keep the adobeys. tradition alive while trying to keep up with the, you know, colonial attempts at removing it.

So they're like, oh, well, you know, face is unprofessional or its gangs. All right, we'll keep it on the under the, you know, like most tattoos around the world have had to deal with, you know, below the, under the cuff kind of thing. Yeah. But when you ask people around New Zealand, like that you meet with Mojo, what that means on their arms, that is a lot broader. That can mean a whole range of things. the time it is as simple as it's my family. Most of the time, Mo'o, people get it to honor their

heritage, their family, mum and dad. Like my arms is, uh, right arm as mom, left arm as dad, you know, so. And the design depicts that. It does. It does. If I didn't have this on, I'd be able to like, shake you. I mean, you can tell me and I can get a photo of you later and it can be magically superimposed. Yeah. Yeah. I'm just interesting because you said, the face one depicts, you know, your career, it's a lovely design, but I'd love you to tell me which part of it depicts that. Yeah, so for the music part, it's actually along here under my jaw. So there's like these swirls that are representative of the way that music travels. It's poetic.

That's so cool. A lot of it requires a lot of poetic, creative. And is that from the artist? That's from the artist. So when I showed up, like, on the day, you know, this is not sort of thing you get stenciled or whatever. It's like free-handed. So I sat down with him and he just, you just talk. The first

like two hours of the session is just talking about your life. What do you do? What have you done? What do you want to do? You know, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And then he goes, okay. And then with him the artist in question was called Lance Ngata. He

comes from a long lineage of Mokor revivalists. So he's very well practiced in the outform. He's probably considered one of the more prolific artists that we have now, especially for facial moko. Not all mucco artists are quite tuned in yet to like doing facial moko. He is definitely one because his family have been doing it since the revival of the 60s and 70s. So with the knowledge that he has learnt through all his years takes what I have told him

applies it to his style and his understanding of his learnings and tells a story on your face tells my story through his eyes because another artist will probably do it differently approach it differently so fucking cool yeah and you know

one of the cool things that apparently this was back in the golden era you know say pre-colonialism supposedly like you know the knowledge was so much more widely understood that, you know, you could actually recognize people and where they're from just by looking. Like someone could look at that and go,

that guy's a musician. Right. Right. That's the sickest thing anyone's ever said on this. Right. And, you know, we don't have that so much anymore, you know? We just told fucking a few thousand people. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Now people can look at me and go, oh yeah, cool. There is one thing that's like nice and easy to teach though. It's these, they look like sixes or nines right here. And I always forget now, which way are mine flipped? Downwards. Downwards, eh? Yeah. Which means I'm the oldest child.

Okay. They flip the other way, you're not the oldest of any kind. Oh, I can't wait to just drop that. Next time I bump into a Maori person. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You're like, oh, you must be the oldest. The first time to my knowledge. Yeah.

Can't wait. How can I remember that? Okay, wait, so down is the oldest. Yeah. So down will make it look like sixes. Yeah. Yeah. So in my head, I'm going to think you're looking down on your siblings.

There you go. God, I can't wait to fuck it. One day, it might be 20 years when I'm going to drop that. and be like, oh, you're the oldest. Yeah. So that one's a nice easy one. Because once upon a time, like if a unfamiliar party was arriving into your village, they would have to talk to the oldest.

And so if they don't know who the oldest is, it was considered disrespectful to talk to anyone but. So then they could just go on like, oh, yeah. All right, six. Number six. Get the fuck over here. He's the guy I need to talk to. So that's a nice easy one that I think across the board now.

is kind of like, you know, because like this one along here for the music, that's a little more obscure. It might not be the same case for everybody kind of thing. So it gets a little bit more poetic in that sense. But as the, hopefully as the tradition revives even further, becomes even more known and styles become solidified. Because right now there's a lot of spread amongst the styles. We hopefully might get back into a place where like you can actually truly use it like the ID thing that I was talking about. I mean, I'm going to go home and research this. I'm like fucking stoked on this. Lewis,

I don't want to leave you not talking because your face is not tattooed. Got any plans to do it or any already on your body? I don't have any moccoy yet, but I've been kind of planning to for years. But I guess the thing with me is I do have this kind of disconnect almost a lot because of my skin color.

I guess I haven't really felt ready to delve into that just yet. It's quite sad that you feel right. But I mean, I do a lot of, I do a lot of mocko artwork in my own time, like my guitar strap on this tour. I carved that myself with a dremel. But I just feel like I want to. I guess, except my place and my complexion more,

um, if that makes any sense. That makes so much sense. Yeah. It's kind of sad to hear though, like, yeah, but you know, it's,

uh, sort of the real, the kind of reality of my situation and, uh, you know, I do, yeah, also getting more cool is expensive.

And, um, you know, of, you know, you know, not always been. men in a place to be able to just go and get mo'o.

You know, I don't want to shortchange anyone, especially not, you know, tattoo artists or moko artists. Yeah, like that with a lineage. I am, you know, I suppose I've got a few, a few things to sort out in my own life and in my own journey before I get there. But even if you don't, like it's, it's fine. That Maori is in you, you're a fucking end. I've learned that on this podcast. Yeah, definitely. And it's definitely,

that's not an uncommon thing, you know. I mean, even I did a podcast for a while, a couple years back where I interviewed mo'clock artists. I saw that. Because the, uh, I was getting like, I was like, man, I can't answer everything. And even if I did, I feel like it would be disingenuine of me to like pitch it as if I was the one that has secondhand information. Secondhand information. I haven't spent my entire life studying the traditions of Mukul. I'm just a guy that got one to further it.

So yeah, I did that interview series and like people who had seen that, one of the questions was because most of the Muco artists themselves don't have facial Mukul at least, you know, which shocks a lot of people. Is that because of the gang affiliation?

Well, it's because of all sorts of things like Lewis is saying, you know, disconnect. Some of them are from a generation where they had just been told their entire lives, like, don't get it, don't get it. It's da-da-da-da. And even though they'd come out of it enough to impart it onto people,

they were still stuck in that, you know, it's hard to break out of those things. And what's been really cool watching since I've done a lot of those interviews, like a lot of those mocha artists now have facial mokko. Not to say that I was any part of that decision, but it's cool to see that growth because I had the answer of why they didn't when they didn't.

you know and so then now to see that they had healed that whatever in them and felt now that they woke up one day and went oh now's my time and they've gone and got it done you go like hell yeah dude that's what we love to see and love to hear it but you know it's like one of the most common questions i've got over the years on my ticto is i have white skin am i allowed to get mokoh my parents are maudi but you know and i's yeah and i suppose yeah even though you know i've I've been doing this and I've grown up, you know, kind of in the Māori realm, I have always felt some level of disconnect or some level of like I can never truly understand what it's like to be a dark skin Māori, if that makes any sense.

And, you know, I'm a thousand percent always wanted to get Mukul my whole life. And I, you know, I do a lot of artwork. I do all sorts of artwork, but one of my main forms of artwork is actually drawing mokko. But I also feel like I want to build my knowledge and my understanding of all of it. And I am a bit of a stickler for things and I am a bit, you know, I'm very scared to jump into things unless I feel I can, you know, irrefutably just, shut someone down if they come at me about anything, you know what I mean? It's also, it's a huge decision. It's a face tattoo.

Even if it wasn't, definitely. Even if it wasn't culturally, like, such a thing, it's a fucking face tattoo. That's right. That's right. How much shit do you get at the border? Yeah. Like, my entire life, as I knew would, but changes, you know. Yeah.

For positive and negative, of course, you know, like. It reminds me of when we were crossing the border and he asked you about your face, muck or. And then you explained to him kind of a very skimmed over like, oh, it's, it's a, it's a, it's a, it's a, it's a, it's a, they're traditional markings, blah, blah, blah. And then I was next up and he's like, are you part of the same group? Why don't you have a marking? I was like, essentially what I just did. But then I think this guy was like, oh, was the first guy lying and he's actually an MI 13 or something.

Yeah, yeah, it was like a very, I was like, dude, a border officer is asking me some hard questions and now I'm like put on the spot. Yeah. I normally have an all right time at the border, like for the most part. Like there's always just, it's a very interesting thing, you know, obviously we're from New Zealand. I'm the one who singled out most of the time. You are? Really? I just, I just, I just have a, I just, I just have a weed smokers. That's what it is.

That's what it is. Yeah. But because we have this funny thing, right? The New Zealand passport is one of those relatively powerful passports. So like we'd be rolling into immigration. The guy is looking at me. I can tell like just on looking, he's tuned in all of a sudden. He's ready to like thing. and then I'll slide across the New Zealand passport

and like nine out of ten times they instantly change. Why is you so powerful? The Lord of the Rings. Wait, wait, wait, wait. O-1 or P-1 visa? O2 for me. O-2? Yeah, he's like O-1.

You're the O-1 and you're the one that gets roasted. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I get pulled aside for bomb swabs, all sorts. Every time, too, like every time I was like, me and Henry like straight through and then it's Paul Lewis. I like usually the O-1, they're just like, oh, famous, go on in. The thing that's,

visually the most Māori about me is the crazy eyes. So people are like guys? I can have them. After a 13 hour flight. Oh yeah dude. And a bit of weed. Wait, do you smoke weed? Actually, I'm not really at the moment.

I have. I have been down that journey in my life. But I guess I've kind of got to a point where I'm like, eh, I want to have a, I guess, a healthy relationship with it. So I've really chilled off on that. You know what I mean? I stopped because it made me fucking mental. Yeah, yeah.

Madison's hiding herself because she smokes more weed than anyone I've ever met my eye. I'll tell you what, that is good water. It is. Hey, thanks, Monster, energy. Do you want another whiskey? You sort of hinted to a whiskey. If you want to offer me, well, I would love one.

Delicious bottle of whiskey that comes in like a mythical sack. A lot of mana in this whiskey. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Looks like Hobbit whiskey, so it's probably fitting. Lanterns. Apparently is the best of it. one. It was a gift from Aaron from Under oath.

Plus 10 money. Plus her and charisma. Plus 10 fucking drunk. I'm not going to have another one because I do have to drive later but you're going to have another one. I have to get in a number. There you go, lad.

46%. That would be why. I do love me a 46. We're still on the border thing. I can't believe you don't get stopped and you get stopped. He's just too smooth. I think half the time is the delivery. I'm a very comfortable airport person.

I've never been nervous in an airport a day on my life. I'm an uncomfortable person in general. Read it on the face from a mile. I have major anxiety issues in my life constantly. And that's like key number one. It doesn't matter really what you look like

if you just, hey man. I have worse mental health than this guy and people can fucking see it and it pisses me off. and I feel defeated by the world. That's so sad. I don't mean to be all depressing. You want to get that scene too, man.

I'm planning to. Because I don't ever get stopped to the border now. I've got an 01. I used to get stopped all the time. But I'll get stopped for the random security check every single time. The minute they can't find a black guy on the flight, it's me. They go, everyone's white.

That's probably him. Tattoo guy. And I don't even have that. However, check me fucking going home and looking at my 23 and me to get point zero, zero, zero one. That means I'm fucking in. Hucker at the start of every episode. Let's go. Wait, great segue.

Were you a fucking pro? Did you used to have a podcast? Oh, no, not me, surely. Let me just check on that. I have anything left on the mokko. I mean, I technically do. So pronunciation, mao mokko. Right.

The song? Yeah. That song I'm assuming is to do with the moco, but it's 100% in Maori. Teirao Maori. Oh, yeah, Thereo Māori. Terrio Māori. Perfect. Thank you.

Is that the, that's the official name for the language? That just means teereo means the language. Oh, okay. So you can say teereo Pakeha, which is English or Tereo wee wee wee. Is it wee wee? It's wee wee. WIWI And even then

You'll pronounce it slightly wrong And it'll be like What are you not saying yes I'm only saying this Because we just come off to And I love him to death He's French though

And then I'll say something Like am I saying this right Jumapel And he's like I don't know what you're trying To say I don't know what you're trying And I'll say

I don't know what you're trying And then I'm like How do you say my name is And he goes Jumapel And I'm like Motherfucker I just said

That's what I said You didn't go A hoot In a ghou Yeah I didn't go So I assume that song is about the moco But it's kind of more specifically about the head trade

Well it depends on what you're talking about When I wrote the lyrics I wrote the lyrics for Mo Mo'Ko In general about my experience with Muco And what needed to further be addressed In the general understandings around the world towards Muko But there's one line in there Which talks about displaying our heads like art

And the video has that inspired the video. Yeah, okay. So then we were like, lock in, because that's a lot more heavy metal than the general conversation surrounding the lyrics. Like the lyrics are very much, I've been calling it like a pride anthem. Like the whole chorus is like,

we're the people who wear mo'u. Mo Mo'u means to have mo'o. Okay. So, like, where the people who have mo'o, you know, you've tried to get rid of it, but it's back and it's going to be better and stronger than it's ever been. I'm low-key, so jealous.

I got nothing like that. But the concept of the head trade, which was a very real part of the history of Muko, and another one of the many reasons that the art form nearly went extinct, makes for a pretty heavy metal video. So we kind of focused in on that one line and turned that into the whole premise of the music video.

What is the head trade? The head trade was, When the British arrived, like, you know, as they went around. As we do. You know, they like to, they would see things that they thought were interesting and want to take it back to England. They were already interested in the concept of the shrunken heads from African cultures or other cultures around the world that do that kind of thing.

Then Māori would preserve heads. They weren't shrunken, but they were preserved. And one of the quirks about a preserved Māori head was that the Muko was still visible on the decomposed. Wow, okay So they were like, oh my God Not only is it a Preserved head

It's got some decorations on it We want those So my brain Kind of did the same thing Yeah But carry on And so they would Ask

Maldi tribes to like Trade it for something Whatever guns Guns was a muskets Was like When Māori were introduced muskets We had a field day Like you know

Like we always did Right most people did Grom Napaohi. Yeah, we were already a warring, you know, people. Yeah. And so the idea of the musket was just like took the warring up to another level. So guns was very popular, wool, blankets, clothing was very popular. But, Māori didn't really want to give up, because the heads were kept for sacred purposes,

either very esteemed chiefs or people, family members that they wanted to preserve the mana of by maintaining the head because in Māori culture their head is considered the most sacred part of the body they didn't want to give away their family so then they would go out there

and just kill a whole bunch of other Māori to trade their heads classic British like we're going to do something fucked up but like can you do it for us? Can you do it? Yeah yeah yeah and we did it you know we were happy to do it we were already warring over whatever we wanted to

might as well make a quick buck right and then it caused this like big chain reaction thing where we were even like just killing people who didn't have Muko and then after the fact like on the already decapitated head putting the Muko on very quickly

like very half-assedly and then tossing it over to the Brits to take over wherever Kind of sex scam. Right, right. And what then happened because of that though was in a pre-to-all-of-that Mo'u was supposedly much more prevalent

across the people you know like in the early what's the word scrimmage scribbage it's like the sailor artwork they would like carve it into their bottles or into whale teeth it's like an art form that the sailors would do

I think it's scrimbage I think you're right something like that they a lot of those early like depictions of Māori like they had all the people they would depict all had facial muco but there's been like one of the like when you've on one hand

you've got the misconception that it's a gang thing On the other hand, a really, really big misconception is that it's for chiefs only. That's become a big thing. Oh, it's the chief tattoo. So when modern people get it, you go, oh, you're not a chief, do-da-da-da-da. But one of the reasons that that myth

started to surface was because of the head trade. Chiefs were the only people who could continue to protect themselves from getting their head locked off to be sold. So they ended up being the ones left? The ones left. So other people would not, they were like, I'm not going to get it done. I don't want to have my head chopped off.

So people just stopped doing it, except the chiefs who had war parties behind them to keep them alive. So then, and then there was two artists, Goldie and Lindauer, like this two famous European painters because of their depictions of Māori chiefs. And a lot of them depicted, like a lot of the exhibitions were called like the last of the Māori kind of thing. And they were all these beautiful paintings. They were incredible paintings of chiefs and chiefesses, all with their facial mokul. They also perpetuated this idea.

Because then it was like these very, very popular paintings, all of chiefs only who all had the facial mokul. So everyone was like, oh, it's just a chiefs only. And then a hundred years later, everyone's like, yeah, only chiefs can get it. So it's like all these like little things that people don't really realize play a huge role in the near eradication of a whole tradition.

You had that, what year are we talking for this? For the head trade, late 1800s? So then you had the 1800s, no one getting it done because they didn't want a head cut off. And then you got the 80s and 90s, no one getting it done because they don't want to be associated in a gang. Bloody hell, guys. And then the third banger in this was a government bill

that was called the Tohunga Suppression Act, which was the, on surface level, Well, it was pitched as an idea that the New Zealand government didn't like the idea of Māori medicine. Okay. Like they said they made it illegal, basically. What's Maori Madison? Well, you know, like more holistic by their standards, natural approach to things. But because the tohunga represents like, it's always a tricky one to expert, but like priest or shaman.

Yeah, okay. Like it's a tricky translated word because it never quite fits any of the English translations quite accurately. But the Tohunga was a word that applied to many experts in many fields. So when you have a very vague title like Tohunga suppression act, like yes, then maybe they were trying to target medicine. But what it did was it prohibited Tohunga from imparting the knowledge on.

So like a professor or something like someone. Of anything. Of anything. And so one of the words. words for the mokul artist, which is what we just used the word mokor artist today, but it's actually Tohunga ta-mokul. Okay, so they would have been suppressed as well. So they stopped teaching people how to do mokoh.

So that was another factor as well. It's like all these many things is like played a part in the... The world sucks. It sucks so much. And the worst thing is there's so many layers to it. It's very difficult to like, you know, that's a lot of information you've got to like absorb to understand the big picture, which is why you can see so many people just go, no, it's it's just for chiefs only or no, you can't get it because of this and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

But anyway, so the song, Mo Moko was the whole point of that was just a pride anthem about the art form. And then the head trade being a significant part in the near extinction of the art form. So it makes it, it makes for a good video. Video is fucking awesome. Yeah, yeah, it was a cool one with the, and the fake head, which was like a. That, yeah, no, that was freaky because it, it, even in person, it looked real. So real. Who made it?

It was, I believe it was a prop for a Māi TV show, like that plays on our Māori network back home. It was, it looked like it's decapitated, decomposed head. It certainly does look like it in the video. Yes. It was freaky. Like, there was this, I don't even think we used it in the music video, but there was this one scene where, like, the head's sitting on this, like, display pillow. And then they took the head off and I had to put my head through the pillow and like sing

the lyrics and I felt fucking weird about it like I felt where it been. Even though it was a rubber prop, I was like, ugh, like it felt it was very interesting on that shoot watching the Māi part of the crew, including us and the non-Maldi part of the crew reacting to that head. It was very different. My mom couldn't even look at the same room. She couldn't even look half the time. Even though we knew it was fake,

like I said, the head is a very sacred part of the culture. The idea of the traded heads thing, and some people call them stolen heads. It's stolen by somebody. Arguably, it was stolen from the Māori that killed the Māori prison to get it in the first place. A lot of people lay a lot of the blame on the British. Yeah, it's an interesting one.

You can blame us. I always find it interesting though because I'm like, well, they wouldn't have got them though because they weren't killing them, the British weren't killing them for them themselves. So I'm like, it took two parties, but they were still stolen because just because a Māori took it. British people coming in were like, oh, you want this. They want it. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

You want this, I want this, I want that. You want this more than I want that. So go do it for me. Right. So that, like, concept of it, even though we knew it was fake, a lot of the Māori and that shoot were like, oh, man, this is a. Yeah, like, your fucking ancestors watching over, like, especially too because we know, like another one of the messages about the video was to bring attention to the fact that places like the British Museum, they still have them.

Like somebody's real ancestor is sitting down in a box in the basement of the British Museum. And Māori have tried for years and years to get their heads back. They have gotten quite a lot back, you know, different tribes and that have managed to claim back. A lot of them just, oh, let's put them in the basement, yeah. Yeah, yeah, but there's still a lot out there. Good accent. So that was another one of the reasons for that video, too, just to put a little bit of eyes on

the fact that there are still people's ancestors sitting somewhere out there and people do want them returned. Did you get any, like, did that give any push to the movement to get the heads back? I don't know, you know, I don't know. It's a lot of people just were even introduced to the idea in the first place. They're like, holy heck. What do you mean? A lot of people didn't think it was real.

Like that, there was a thing. They were like, oh, this is just a video thing, right? It's pretty fucking terrible. Because it sounds nile. They're like, what you mean you're trading heads around, you know? I was like, no, it was a thing. Someone's an ancestor's head is just in a box. In a box downstairs.

No, I paid for that, so I'll keep it. Right. While we just, last thing on the tattoos and the family stuff, you mentioned, you said to your mum that does she want to get it done at the same time as you? So she got it done. So before her, who was the last person in your lineage that had it? On her family, her sister, her oldest sister, had it. But then before her, my auntie was one of the first in a while.

because like I So it's my mom's mom That is the Scottish one So her father's the Māori But he didn't have it And great-grandfather didn't have it It's a long way back You know

So great Assuming maybe great great Yeah the photo I have of the person I was named after I do have a photo of the man I was named after And I'm not even sure if he has it So maybe his father May have been the last one

And there's no photo of him. No, there is a painting of his first cousin. And so... With the... And he has it. So he was painted by one of those artists I mentioned earlier. And so I have his paint, not an original, but I have his painting, a print of it in my room in my house. Because he is one of the last, like, actual known ancestors.

And he had no offspring. So then our line is the closest line to him. Yeah. So he is actually one of the only ones we have of proof that had it. But we can only assume that his father had it. And maybe the cutoff was there. Right there. Damn.

Damn. I feel like I'm at school, but I want to learn. I don't think, I don't even know if anyone within the five generations of my Maldi family have had it. If I'm thinking, if I'm looking back on, you know, my dad's got Pujoro, which is the markings that go, you know, from your... Is that the armour one? Yeah, the abdent... So he's got the Tatua Tawa

and he's got the Mangwapari in the middle for protection. And Henry's actually got his... His Pujoro started, so he's got the... Henry's the drummer, your brother. Yeah, Henry's my brother. And he's got his... Basically, the spirals on his butt started. Oh, cool.

But my dad's got the whole shebang down to past his knees all the way up here. If the number I just texted is yours, then Otherwise, you've just texted a random person A lovely painting. No, no, I've got it. It was you. Damn!

That's fucking AI. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It's so good it looks AI. Yeah, yeah, it's, I've never actually seen the real picture either. One day, I've been hunting it like, because it moves around, I believe, the original. Yeah, you want to try and buy that one day? I haven't even seen it coming home. I've got it right here.

Yeah. See he doesn't He hasn't even showed me that Oh yeah Fucking AI That's chat GPG Bro they love the must Bro heaps of my ancestors

Have that mustache too Yeah They love the mustache back then Grow one out boy I can't grow one You can't grow one No That's why I got this done

I'm a good big girl You said you're an ex-bodybuilding Yeah Yeah Got rid of all my hair No I still got a full bloody head of curleys up top

What was the bodybuilder Ark Gave it up Oh yeah when I joined The band I haven't quite figured out The balance to maintain it.

First tour I lost 18 kilos. Damn, I lost seven pound. I'm a pounds guy now because I live here. So I don't even know three and a bit kilos on that tour we just did.

Yeah. Because just fucking not eating enough doing all that shit. And I was like, man, I haven't figured that balance out yet. I was like, maybe one day I'll bring it back. You don't miss it? You go to the gym?

No, that's what I like, basically cold turkey did because I was like, I started doing other stuff. just to stay physical. But I was like, I dedicated so much time to it that when I couldn't dedicate a hundred percent,

I was like, it's not even worth my time. I didn't even want to give it 50. My ex-girlfriend was like, you should just go to the gym anyway. I was like, not interested. That is like,

similar thing. It was like almost pro bodybuilder. I mean, I think you, whatever the one before pro is, I can't remember. But like competing and stuff, same thing.

Simi pro. Yeah, I think there was a name for like where the NFBB, whatever the thing. Right, right, right. But like, same thing. He started going on tour and he just dropped it fully.

Never asked this question on the podcast ever. But I feel like given your Maori heritage, predominantly your lyrics being in Terrell Maori. Yes, sir. Let's go. Where the name come from? Oh, that's a you go. Alien weaponry.

So originally the name came from, who's in District 9. Love it. I'm fucking real movie. It's great. It's unique, right? I could talk about it all day. I've told Madison to watch it.

You're the fucking prunes, you're the fucking prawns, bro. So basically, me and Henry, 8 and 10, somehow we watched District 9 at 8 and 10. Yeah,

because you started the band at 8 and 10. Yeah. And, you know, it's as simple as that movie has aliens. Aliens have sick fucking weaponry. Alien weaponry. And like, I suppose the band's been going since 2010,

but we wrote our first Māori song in, I don't remember what, yeah, it must have been like 2013 or 15. And, you know, that band name, you know, we always liked the band name. But I suppose another way of thinking about it. think about it when we named the band but like when the british first introduced muskets to new zealand um to the malty they were alien weaponry you know that was a whole different realm of weaponry you know you used to be able to take a great chief to kill another great chief and now some fucking idiot on a hilltop shoots him in the head yeah i mean just scrap just just just make it that

Well, don't admit it's not that. But District 9 is a fucking sick film. Yeah, but also District 9 does have that sociopolitical fucking commentary all through it, you know. The displacement of people and the aliens. They look different. Let's put them in this fucking corner. I don't want them living near me. It's got such a great, like, apartheid story in a story about aliens.

It's fucking incredible. Africa too what a what a setting you know yeah I always one thing I always think that was like sweet just about the actual origin of that because I remember actually when that like it was like a fan theory that started like someone had just commented like oh yeah because the muskets and gunpowder was alien weaponry and they're kind of like you should have just taken it yes you shouldn't be admitting but I always thought there was this like nice sort of year innocence to it like because it also perfectly explains like the history of the band you know like that the band has been around since the brothers were boys, you know.

Little boys naming a band. Our band is, we talk about this often, you know, like when we're touring with a band right now, like Avatar, who have this theatrical element to them and they're like having fun, like, in a humorous way on stage and presenting themselves, you know, our music is always so serious. The band's image is like so serious.

It's this cultural thing, political thing, you know. Our stage persona is always very serious. I always like this kind of contrast of like, so what's the reason behind the name? It's like, oh, I was an eight-year-old kid, and I like this movie. Honestly, I hate that question because the one thing I do about this podcast

is like obviously being in a band, like I despise press. Like I hate it. I hate festival press. Are you okay? Are you having fun? Oh, dude, I forget, this is chill though because you're chill

and this, you know, it's not like, so like what's your top 10? What's that bad? I'm like, I have to think of a top 10 and explain to you why I just like music. Shut the fuck up, you know? Like I get mad when people are. I mean, I just,

the usual stuff. I, and sometimes I do, you know, I'm guilty of doing it because it's stuff people want to know about, but like, that, I just call it festival press, because it's like when someone doesn't know who the fuck you are,

right, or what you're about? And it's, so what's the band name? The new album. Yeah. And then they just, they drop the line.

What's the funniest thing he's done on tour? Yeah. I mean, that was sometimes, as if we'd tell you. Only if it comes out, like, naturally.

Right. But like, the name one I would never, ever do other than, like every single bit of your lyrics are videos i can see the heritage and then their name is wacky yeah yeah yeah whoever that reddit user is that made that fucking thing up they left off and i still see it like i still see it every now and then like people go yeah i read somewhere that like it was this this i was like people also people also claim that oh i know them they're

are Pohi and they're my cousins. People say all sorts of social. All over the place. Yeah, I get that a lot. It happens. It happens. I learned that plenty of times in my social media journey with the TikTok blowing up.

It's like it's broken glass out there, man. Yeah, you just have to just read it and ignore it or just don't read it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's why like I feel like one of the reasons I was able to succeed in that space was I couldn't care less what you say about me. Half the time good or bad. Like I don't need my validation. from you. I also don't need the criticism from you

with in reason. Sometimes criticism is warranted. I could say that I was probably warranted a little bit of criticism. Right. You know, I've had the odd thing where I've said something slightly out of past and, you know, when it comes to cultural stuff, there's only so fine a line, you know, and I'm like, oh yeah, my bad. You know, that was on me. Yeah, but that, that...

It's different. You must be making decent money on that TikTok now. Well, I've been actually withdrawing because I was finding, like, one, people wanted more and more and more as they do, but I was not willing to give more and more because it was not my place to do so, which is why I did the podcasting, right? But of course that wasn't as popular,

which is fine with me at the time. I was like, it doesn't matter, it's not about popularity, it's about what's right. Especially in this context, you know, it's not like I'm running around just showing you what I do in a day. I'm actively educating all that very broad and in-depth culture.

There's only so much you can teach on the internet. And I was just to say, I'm basically like a sign post, like a road sign saying like, oh, you can go this way for this. I can put as much information on a sign, but the actual thing is going to be in the library down the road, right? It's not your fault if someone turns left when it says turn right. And so then I was like, all right, I'll just stop doing it. And I literally just like stopped.

Like I haven't posted like dedicated Māori content. And I've been putting out the last of the clips from the podcast, just kind of weaning them off. And then I, you know, I'm like, do something else. And that's because you got sick of it? Well, because I wanted to, one, stay genuine in the cause, right? So I could have kept going on with the Māori stuff and spitting out a whole bunch of whatever

just because it was popular and paying the bills. But I didn't want to, you know, ethically. Not the same at all, but with parallel. every episode or clip that I put up which inspires conflict in the comments I make the most money from and I it fucking kills me

like even if I haven't even done it on purpose like I'll put something like I put one up the other day of Will Ramos from Lorna Shaw and we're talking about his vocal techniques and I just say one line right which was you know in the world of death metal vocals, you're arguably one of the goats, right? Yeah.

Because he is, he can fucking... Right. The band's selling out the pinnacles, fucking 7,000 people in Nashville when they sound like that. Right. Like, arguably, being the big word there, one of the goats.

Fucking, I put up a clip of it yesterday. Not even TikTok. YouTube shorts, 200,000 views, or yesterday. And it's just hatred. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And it kills me.

because it's like, I need that for the podcast. I need more eyes on the podcast, but I'm the result of all this conflict. Right, right. Just fucking me. No, totally. And it makes me want to stop, but I fucking can't. I'll pay my fucking bills.

I know. Like, you want to harbor a certain environment, but, like, yeah, hatred or negativity is the driving force on the internet, you know, like the videos of mine that consistently, without fail, would do absolute numbers. always revolved around telling people that they couldn't get Mukul because they're not Māori. Yeah.

Particularly Americans, sorry Americans absolutely lose their minds when they're told that they can't do something. Those videos without fail, boom, light up every time. It's a horrible foundation for the years to come. It's just so bad.

Every video that is put in front of you is conflict. And for you, it must be even more, you have an actual, cultural responsibility. Right, right. But for me, it's just like, you know, I hate it. But at the end of day, it's just people fucking arguing.

Like, I don't, I care and it sucks. And I try not to do it. But when it happens, it's not like a cultural, cultural. Why can't I fucking say that word? It's not a culturally relevant thing to me. So it doesn't have, it doesn't carry that way. But for you, that must fucking suck. Yeah, it was an.

interesting thing. Like every time something like that would happen and I was like, well, New Zealand's a little different though, you know, we don't have creative funds, things like that. So I'm not actually making money directly off my videos. Oh, damn, that sucks. But more eyes on the videos just meant more eyes from sponsors and people that would pay you to do stuff or whatever. Yeah. And like particularly TikTok themselves, like I did this big campaign with TikTok and they pay you to do videos. Like that wasn't a creator fun thing, you know. Yeah. Because yeah, New Zealand doesn't have it. So I, I was never so influenced per se on the views

because it didn't amount to anything. Oh, okay, yeah. But still in your head, in your head views are a type of currency. It's a thing, because then when the business goes, oh, what are your views on a month? And you go, right now, I'll only be like, oh, it's only 100,000 or something. And then once upon a time,

it would have been 10 million or something. Because you're causing all these fucking arguments. Because you're causing all these rows with people. And I always used to think like it was nice that my, I always felt that my audience, general, like, it was pretty good. Like, most of my videos, you can go into the comments and it was all, like, you know, but those particularly viral ones, like the crazy, crazy number ones were always outrage, you know, like, without fail. It sucks. There's no answer for it either. No, human nature.

I feel like, I mean, I know you stopped doing it, but like, the podcast was the right move. I think so. In terms of, like, you know, I don't know everything. Let's bring on someone that knows more than me. You get to learn. Everyone else gets to learn. Right. But you weren't causing that outrage. Well, it was interesting because even like even as I wane off like still.

Like I had one just the other day, get numbers, you know, more than usual. And for the same reason, it's like people got really mad at it, you know. And it's always an interesting thing too because I'm like, I'm, you can argue with me all you want, right? I'm just a guy. Yeah. I'm a guy that has it. I don't claim to know everything. I've made something wrong, whatever.

But these are videos now with the people who do it. You're just a random guy and you've decided to argue with the literal art master of the tradition in this context. And they still go crazy over that. So I'm like, man, sometimes you just can't, there's no winning, you know. The internet's a place where people say whatever the fuck they want because they know they're not going to get that real world consequence back to them. apart from some dude being like, you're an idiot, you know,

they're not going to get punched in the head, they're not going to get screamed at, they're not going, you know, it's kind of like, some people just like to fucking poke other people too. And it can be good for like, you know, blowing up comments and blowing up views, but at the end of the day, it's like,

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coms bar records. Man, the internet's a fucking wicked beast. I personally have always, I've had this weird

relationship with the internet and technology I tell Tudong all the time I'm like, I have a technology curse and it's like I sometimes do but also I think I sometimes

just have always hated the way the world's going because of that way. Wrote a whole song about it. Yep. Brod plenty of songs about it but then like these days it's like that's why I was so resistant

to upgrading to digital and now neural have sent me two quad cortexes and then I'm like oh fuck these are sick bro These are sick like, you know. I mean, they sponsor the podcast, so that's fucking

You're a BSP. You make some good shit and I hate computers, but your one's good. You've already heard me gas them up about an hour and a half ago. We did it again. They're the fucking best, though. They are the fucking best. I've never had a better guitar tone in my whole life. It is the only one that I know, all of my analog friends that are like,

I'm never fucking doing it. And then they get that little fucking box and they're like, I don't. You mean I can just take this on a plane? Yeah. I was like in the green room like just like I was intonating my guitar and I was using it as a chuna which is like using a fucking supercomputer to play Minecraft. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, I know you sold Matt from Spirit World on it too.

I was literally like that's a fucking good band. I had to convince me that. I was like, oh, do you want to plug your rig? I was like, oh yeah, yeah, maybe. I was like, yeah, it's here if you want to plug in. and then I was like chugging on it and then I think Stu had a jam when I only put my headphones on

he was like oh Do you still have cabs or are you No straight Nothing Neural I'm still using a couple pedals But then next to her I'm like fuck that

I'm just gonna like Get it all on the thing Oh dude because the effects on it better than you Do you guys want to click Yeah time code Time code Whole set

Yeah so it's gonna be It's gonna be I still foot switch whichever thing because I'm like I'm one of those young guys that's like convinced I'm an old guy if that makes sense like you said you're 23 yeah you are a young boy how are you uh 26 yeah I'm so old yeah good for you go guys making fucking moves at that age on the other side of the fucking world I mean I've been in the band for five years and I was my fifth year and they would already you know been doing the international tours when I knew them in high school you know

that's crazy I'm a young guy but I've been doing it for a while now. I mean, eight. Were you eight or you were ten? I was eight when we started the band. And then we started touring internationally, I think, 2017 or 18? How old were you in 2018?

16. Touring internationally at 16? Yeah, in Europe, playing Wakan. The Hucker. Right. The fuck is it. That is a big question as well. From my, okay, from my understanding,

so I saw it all the time. My dad would watch rugby. I saw the all blacks do it. And I remember just thinking that looks fucking sick. Right. From my understanding, it's a dance either for war or what's the other one?

There's like a different version of it. I don't know if I'm wrong. Respect to someone. Oh, yeah, like in a celebration or something like that. Yeah. It's taken on a very broad, uh, encompassing use now. I mean, like, we do it at the start of our set every night, you know, and it's simplest form once upon a time. It was the pre-war ritual, hype up threat, you know,

like so the, everyone always thinks, when they think of the haka, they think of the tongue, poking out, you know, like that had a function. It was a threat to the enemy that you were going to eat them. We're going to eat you, motherfucker. Yeah. That's so sick. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But again, because this, and it's a deep answer, you know, about, uh, Māori cultural values is the thing about when I said before about the sacred and mana and things like this. There's two concepts in Māori culture that really form the like strong basis to most of the rules and it's tapu and noa. Tapu meaning sacred. Tapu is actually or the variance of tapu was actually the origin of the English word taboo. Okay. Was a mispronunciation of it which is now we see

is prohibited, you know. Yeah. So tapu, which is a word that you can see all across Polynesia in many different forms, kapu and Hawaii and blah, blah, blah, blah, basically means sacred. And then Noah is the opposite of that. And those two realms should never cross. So the human body is hugely tapu, mostly so our heads. And food is noa.

Okay. So it's like very unsecret. So when you do a lot of Māori ritual, food is always. happening at the end because it's sort of like the cleanse. It resets you back into a non-sacred space. So the threat of eating somebody wasn't just a threat to eat someone. It was actually considered like the highest insult because you were eating, making something so sacred like a human and turning it into food.

You're turning their most sacred thing, right, your least sacred thing. Exactly. So sick. Yeah, so actually like, and everyone always asks, like, I'll answer it before you even ask about swear words, right? In a foreign language, a lot of people are looking at. for variants of shit, fuck, whatever.

You know, like those are Western ideas of a swear word. But because, like, that's too deep of a conversation, but like the origin of swear words have like a lot of depth behind them. Māori culture didn't consider things like sex or pooing like that offensive. So it wasn't a thing that was considered offensive, but the eating thing was. So like the swear word that is normally attributed to Māori is pookokokokohua, which means to boil and eat your head.

And that was essentially like the highest form of insult. It was like calling someone or whatever. In a sentence, how would it be said? No, just dropped. So you've done something insulting. Like, I don't know, you've stolen my wife. I will boil and eat your head. Kaya te kuri is another one, which means dog food.

So that's even going lesser than a human won't even eat you. We'll feed you to the dog. I mean, we actually say that in stray all the time when catering is dog. shit. We'd just be like, well, even then, I just said dog shit. Yeah, yeah. What's catering saying? It's like dog food. Yeah. There you go. Kayate kuri.

Yeah, I'll say that. I'm saying. I'm saying that. Yeah, but so that's what the tongue, the whole tongue thing is with the haka. So it was like threat, morale boosting, you know, challenge. You don't like you want to add something. Yeah. I suppose I always at the end of understanding that if your haka was fierce enough, the enemy tribal war party would be so scared that. they'd be like, all right, we're going to fight you. I'm not even going to do it.

You know, we believe you, you're going to fuck us up and eat us, you know. So we're not even going to bother fighting you. So sometimes the Haka would actually resolve the battle without having to slaughter, you know, heaps of hundreds of hundreds of warriors, you know. And they'd just be like, all right, sweet. Yeah, fuck that. And there's the very famous story during the World Wars, actually, of the Māori battalion, feeling like,

They were ambushed by Germans. You can say German. I can't remember who though. They started the whole fucking thing. Someone on the opposite side. Yeah. And they were like, it's a suicide mission. Let's just one last hurrah.

They got up and did a hucka and the Germans ran away. Like that's a very famous story from the walls back home in New Zealand. There's like an example of the hucker in modern use. Actually. Imagine having a gun. And then seeing that and being like, fuck me, nope. Yeah. Not doing that.

Yeah. Supposedly that was like, that was exactly what happens. That's quite a, I remember that was circulated a lot, that story growing up through schools and that. But in the modern context now, because we're obviously not warring with each other, it has become partially because of the all blacks, like rugby's use of it as a challenge to the team, you know, like that. Is it kind of warring, you know?

It works. You know, sports is a good example. You were trying to best somebody in an environment where you were. putting them up to the challenge. But because of what the haka is rugby did for the culture, like it has become the thing. I mean, they smashed it as well. Right.

You know, when we say we're from New Zealand or we're Māori, everyone goes, Haka, all blacks. Yeah. It's normally like the first two words that follow. So the rugby has made the Haka such a cultural identifier for Māori and for New Zealand that its use in modern time has evolved to fit that as well.

So like Lewis was saying, now you've got celebrations. So quite often you'll see Haka at weddings. funerals, graduations, you know. Do you plan? Is it planned? Sort of sort of not, you know. It's a very common thing when you, you know, even non-Maldi, just normal high school in New Zealand, you know, someone of Māori descent gets a prestigious award at high school.

You'll just hear so, ha, oh, God. Then 10, fucking 20, 50 people will get up and just do this hucka and everyone will be like, fucking, check. Because a lot of it seems quite synchronized. Yes, it's a tricky thing because like haka is the term, but there are many haka. Yeah, like the haka we do at the start of our set, Ahah Tiarawa is very specific to mine and my brother's genealogy atao.

It's the Tiaraara haka and that's kind of where we fuck a pappa too. And the haka that the all blacks to is actually Kamate. It's a very interesting story. That is. But I think they even have their own one now, They've had one like made for them as well. They used to do kamatea a lot and they've added bits to it. But like the one that we do at the start of the set, for example,

I learned because I joined the band. So if I was in an environment where that was being used organically before the band, I wouldn't be able to join in, I don't know it. I grew up in a different family, different tribes. So I learned different haka. But maybe one where we would all know is like we went to the same school. So then schools often have a haka made for them or we use the Nāpuhi one, which is the local tribe.

So at school, if someone wanted to do the hucker for someone graduating, chances are the entire school knows it. So then anybody can join them because they want to. But so there are ones that are taught with choreography and you do learn it. So that's why a lot of them are synchronized because they are. But the organicness is that they're not always like, no one goes, we're going to do the hucker. Yeah, but someone will start and if you know it.

If you know it, yeah. Someone will stand up and then everyone will stand up. and then everyone will be like, oh. And they would recognize which one they were doing. Yes. If they knew it. Yeah. If they knew it.

So now, like, if I hear Ahatiyara air, which is the one at the start of the set, I'm like, oh, I know that one now. You just come in with Kotevaka. Yeah, I can jump in now. And, you know, it happens every now and then. And it happens, I've been at places where I don't know the Hakka, you know, like, when I was at university before the band, our university split, you can opt in or up, but they split the graduations between everyone else.

and Māori because they know that like when Māori walk across the stage, the likelihood of people standing up and then doing a three minute haka is very likely. So it's fucking always. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But so in those environments, for example, like 90% of those haka I have never heard in my life. Yeah. So I'm just sitting there and watching and enjoying it, you know. And then every now and then one will come across and I go, oh, I know this one.

All right. I'll jump up. I don't even know the person, but you just, you know, jumping into support. And it's kind of funny how the, how the, how the, modernization has come about too because you know back in the day I would have never known Arangapuhi because Chara

and Napaohi historically hated each other and they were very much opposed and I know Ahat Charawa and I know Arangapuhi here because I went to school in Northland which is predominantly Napa'i and they're the ones

that first got the muskets like Hongi Hika traded his suit of armour he got gifted from King George for like 800 genuine good muskets and then he came back to New Zealand and fucked up everyone that wronged him basically

800 are a lot yeah yeah and Nāpuhia are considered like the biggest collective tribe of Māori in the country they take up the majority of the upper north island region and yeah in Hongi Hika who the the boy's viral song Kaitangata

was like about it's about him fucking up our our family basically damn that's fucking awesome I feel this is great perfectly heavy metal but you know what it's like it's so honest because it's your heritage right but it's like so fucking unique

like so unique yeah I'm like amazed it's like a lot of people like one of the comments we always get is like one thing I love about alien weapon ring is you get the head bang and history like yeah it's both right now. I am having a headbanging history right now. Some people have described this as kind of folk metal,

which I guess is kind of true, but also at the same time, like we don't have the fiddles. Yeah, you don't sound like Lord of the Rings music. But in the word folk, I guess it makes sense. It's like I see people call bloody wood folk music all the time.

Because a lot of people, like, they're one of those ones we get brought up alongside a lot of the time, you know, for the same kind of things, like singing in different language, cultural elements, you know, they've got their cultural instruments and things like that.

So the who, you know. Everyone compared us to Sepulchura. Well, they still do all the time. And it's like, everyone's like, you're a massive Sepulchre fans, right? And it's like, we never actually like really heard Sepulchera's music until people started. I think I heard Sepulchura's music way back in the day, one of my friends' moms in, I think she called it Sepultra. I think I called it that back in the day when I was a kid.

And it's like the reason people draw the comparison is because of that kind of indigenous element. You do use some, I'm assuming, native percussion. Yeah. Which roots, Sepultura is big on Brazilian. And then we use kind of what we call Taonga Puoro, which is like traditional Māori instruments like Kuo-wo and... I guess it's because there has to...

hasn't been much legitimately tribal. Tribal, that sounds wrong. That's it. It's a funny word that word. We always have a, I know Henry gets particularly irked by that word. I irked myself saying it. It's a weird one because it's not that it's wrong,

but like that's always the comparison with Sipltura, right? It's like the word that normally follows, or you guys must be inspired by Sipatera because it's so tribal. It's always the like thing. And I think like there is, you know, the jungle rhythm thing. there must be a better word. It's kind of like saying I have mojo and I've got a tribal bro.

You know, it's that same sort of... It's a tricky one because I also find like it also what it is the word. Do you know what I mean? That's why I have... They're word tribes, you know. I guess you can, but it's a very just way of describing it. I think that sometimes it feels a little bit not infantilizing. Dismissive.

It makes you seem like less. Like when you hear the word tribal, it makes you think like Stone Age backwards. Very vague as well. It is vague. There's no like pride in your like being, oh, tribal, you know. The what tribe from where? And also tribalism in general now is a term for the fucking internet or people just being, you know, of one thought pattern or the other. Yes.

Of lesser thought. Let me even try. I mean, I guess what I'm trying to say, there's not that much world music influenced metal. Like, there really isn't. Particularly nothing as big as roots, Sepulchura. So I get the comparison and I do, I would say you guys are more like, I mean,

kind of, it's like groove metal. If I had to, like, put a name on it. I would have always, because everyone calls us thrash. and I'm like the least genre Nazi person ever But I'm like When I really objectively listen to the music that Alien Wepenry makes There's only a handful of songs that are like You know got that thrash

A lot of it's slower tempo More in tune with bands like Lamb of God And like you know It's definitely I'd say more groove influence And we definitely found that out when we did the Kerry King tour. Like, Kiri King, municipal waste. Well, not that they hate it, but then, like, everyone, like, everyone's always like,

oh, yeah, thrash, thrash, heavy metal, thrash groove, you know. Yeah. But when you're actually playing with two thrash bands, you feel like you are banging bongos, you know what I mean? It's like we felt like we were slow as on that tour. Did it go well, though? Oh, yeah, it was cool, man. You know, it was cool.

It's not a bad thing always that. For me, as a viewer, like, I can't do three thrash bands in a row. Right. Something in the middle. Well, I think a lot of the time, too. A little bit tribal. Yeah. You know, one of the words actually that I do think better encompasses the response.

Because normally it's about the response that people get, right? Like when people listen, they feel tribal. Yeah. Primal. I always think primal is a better one because it's a little more instinctual. You know, everybody can have a primal instinct, a primal response to something. And that when they hear that type of rhythm and things like the Haka, It was like a very collective sound that the Huck gives

where people feel like, oh, I feel like I should join in with this. They don't even know why. They're just going, oh, ha, ha, you know, in the crowd, that it's a primal, like, response. Primal's the term. We're going to primal grieve metal. And it's cool, man, because like I was saying,

you got Bloody Wood, you got the Who. You know, you got a bunch of, like, Scandinavian bands that aren't singing in English. I never remember their name. I think you guys went and saw the more Henry went and watched them at Power Station. The lady's got, like, the big antlers and stuff. High lung

I went and saw them live actually Yeah I went and saw them with my mates There's a great band from New Zealand Actually we tour with them a lot Shepherds Rain Shepherds Rane

If anyone likes alien weaponry For Māori Shepherds Rane is Samoan Same premise They're one of the people That actually put me onto Quad Because they've been on Quad For a while now

Their style of metal is a little different It's a little more like power metallie In Sarmorn I mean what are they called Shepherds Shepherds? That's a power. metal name if ever. But rain is in rain,

like the reign of the king is... Of a king. Yeah, more than... Yeah. Yeah. A great band. But, you know,

there's so much more of it now out there. Metal that is... You know, everyone always uses Ramstein as the like non-English band, you know, but you're still speaking of very popular language, you know. So it's one thing to garner's popularity in a language that...

800,000 Māori, how many of... 100,000 people speak Māori? Is that the language? the demographic Are you fluent in it? Nope. That was one of the things

I wouldn't consider myself fluent. No. What does writing lyrics look like? Yeah, well, that's a very collaborative process and also takes, you know,

you can write lyrics or write the concept of a song and then send it to someone who, you know, I guess Māori is a very family-based cop-papa, meaning, what is,

making cop-papa? translate to Coal? Yeah, yeah. So like, you know, between the three of us, we're, I guess, fluent, but then even then we'll send it off to...

We use my uncle on this recent album. And it'll be like, oh, I'd swap that word out for this word. That makes more sense. I wouldn't say it like that. I'd say it like this, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. You know? Just so that you're absolutely. sure. Kind of a proof,

a proof chicker, so to speak, you know what I mean? I mean, like, not, again, not drawing a comparison, but a parallel, like obviously stray, we write a hell of a lot about essentially other people's problems. Right. So we would always, we write lyrics

and then we would send that to someone we know with their lived experience. Right. Does that make sense? And sometimes they come back and be like, this is some white people shit. And then we're like, okay, so like, you know, help us out on this. Because it's so much better to get it from, right, from someone who, you know, lived that experience.

Yes. And luckily for us, too, like, like, contextually, the lyrics and their intent we never have any issues with because, you know, like, we live and breathe it. Yeah. But then it's just like, it's just grammar policing, you know. But when you're singing that to a crowd, even though you know, 99. 99.9% of those people have no idea what you can sing whatever bloody words you want. You just like to know, you know, like sometimes. Your auntie who's a stickler will see it and go, oh, you can't be doing that.

You want to respect. Exactly. You respect the lineage as well. Not to everybody, but in our, for our people, language is also sacred. You know, language is tapu. I'll give you a great example. So we have like, obviously our biggest music video is Kaitangata. It's got millions of views.

on the internet and there's a kind of a screen grab from that video that we have as one of our merch designs which is like the chief like pulling a pukana with a tajaha and of course Ali Express loves to rip stuff and what they did was they ripped that image and they put it on a coffee mug so they took something that was very tapu which is this dude's head in face kapu being sacred sacred and they put it on something very nor as in, you know, your consuming food, basically. Oh, yeah, you made an insult.

And so Ali Express when in, you know, there's some wicked, there's like our album cover stretched across like a steering wheel cover. There's a wicked ones out there. But basically, they put this image on a coffee cup and we got a very, very, I wouldn't even say angry, but a very stressed email from one of our elderly relatives saying,

you can't be doing that. And we're going to trying to explain to it. This is not us. This is someone stealing our design and selling it on Ali Express. But what they did was they took something sacred and put it on something that's, you know, consuming food. What was the word for, no. Noa.

No. Yeah. And it was kind of that weird thing where we were like, oh, fuck. Like, you can't. You can't. You can't, there's nothing, there's not much you can do about Ali Express. That's always going to be there. But it's that thing where we're like, oh shit, like, yeah, we would have never put it on a coffee

cup because we have that knowledge of, you know, I wouldn't have had that knowledge. Right. Yeah, but then of course, you know, they're like, oh, people buy that shirt. Let's put it on everything. Let's put it on this. Let's put it on that. And then you put it on a food item that's hugely disrespectful in multicultural. And we kind of, I wouldn't say got in trouble, but we.

We had to kind of carefully explain the situation to our elderly relatives, I suppose. That's that one of the unique things, you know, when you're dealing with an image and a brand that isn't just a image in a brand that you can do whatever you want with it, you know. It's really interesting. I would never have known that. Yeah, and I always remember that one. I'm like, yeah.

It's also really cool. Like, I don't know, like everyone being insulted and offended by the same shit these days. it's like kind of cool to be like right that thing was the the most insulting thing you could do and to like you know western person right i'm like if you did not told me the context behind it i'd have been like there's a face on a coffee right but now understanding it i'm like it doesn't seem like a ralry express it doesn't seem like a big deal to someone who isn't i guess bought up that way is there hasn't been taught that way this is here's a question are there any Maori black metal bands that flip everything

so they'll do like against Maori now that would cause a lot of that's an idea yeah yeah that would cause something that's for sure there's not already not even that many Māori bands you know that's already a market that is dwindling a black metal was only because I thought of the way that they invert everything that religion knows

so I guess it would have to be I guess it would just have to be white people British people just a white supremacist band band coming out and just doing anti-Mauri stuff. Well, actually the funniest thing right now, of course, those are the biggest anti-Maldi are actually New Zealanders. Really? Right?

Like, they're not the British anymore. The British are so far detached from that history that's just like, because we get that question a lot, like, I'm British, people are going to be mad at me? I'm like, no. I mean, if you're mad at me, the whole fucking world is mad at me. We are at it all boys. Like, the modern Māori now, like, doesn't see Britain as the enemy.

Yeah. It's like, it's the people that are like, I don't know why the Marys keep complaining about everything. They're lazy. So is it similar to the dynamic in Australia with Aboriginal people? Yeah, not as bad, I would say. The Aboriginal's got shafted pretty damn hard. And they still are.

Like, I'm in a bar recently in Australia, and a guy came up to me and was like, I'm like sat there. He was a bit drunk and he was sat down around. having a chat or whatever like what are you up to i played in a band did a show or whatever and he's like i'm aboriginal and i was like cool and then he was like are you okay with that and i was like bro what's the fucking am like i know enough of the history or country like you know and a good example actually about the situation over there with like the first nations in australia is

like maudi there's a lot of maudi that live in australia maudi wanted to have a marai built which is like our temple grounds, sacred grounds. Yeah. And it caused a huge uproar because like First Nations Australia can't even have their land. And we are like asking for permission to use the land to build our stuff. And a lot of Māori back home in New Zealand thought it was just the most outrageously disrespectful thing ever. But it's like that's how more fortunate we are that we can even pitch that idea to them in their own country because the,

Australian system is just so... And I assume it had to be pitched to the white man. Probably. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Fuck me. That's a kettle of fish.

Let's not. Yeah. That's a whole kettle of fish. Let's get political. No. We're going to get the opposite of political because we are fucking run out of time because I'm having too much fun. Promo speed run festival interview.

Yeah. We'll do the festival bit now. Before we do that, I have you had fun. Oh, yeah, dude. Definitely. This is a nice way to break up the nine hours of traveling. I'm fucking so thankful that you did it after. that like that sucks. I'm sorry.

Um, okay, Teira. Yes, Teira. Does that mean God? In this context, it means the sun. The sun. It's the short, short name for Tamunui Terra, which is that the actual personification of the, that is the sun in our stories. And that was just too long for the front cover.

It's kind of, there's a very, there's a few very kind of famous, almost folk. or stories that as milder, you kind of know growing up. And the story of Maui and the sun, like, I mean, it's literally in the Disney, it is. Moana, you know, the line where he's like, I'm the guy who slowed down the sun. Like, that's, do you know this line? I haven't seen it. Yes, he also talks about how he killed Neil and sprouted coconut trees in that.

You can fish the islands up out of the ocean. Yeah, so that's the story of him fishing up the North Island of New Zealand out of the ocean. Well, Maui fished up all the Pacific Islands. He's a Pacific Polynesian demigod, not unique to us. And one of the, he was kind of like a Polynesian Hercules, you know, completely a bunch of feats that explained the world around us. And one of them was slowing down the sun to give us the day. I guess the very just glossed over version is the sun was racing across the sky super fast,

Everyone was like, oh shit, I can't, I don't even have time. I've done all this shit in the day. And then it's already night time. And then Mo was like, enough. And so he went to the pit that the sun rose out of with his brothers. And basically they chucked this big net or ropes. You know, there's a few variations of the story. But basically held the sun down and he was like, you need to slow down.

And he just beat the shit out of the sun. He just beat the shit out of the sun. So down the sun was like, oh, okay, I'll slow down. Give you a proper day. I'll give you a proper day. You have some more hours. How'd the Randy Blythe thing come about? Oh, yeah.

Yeah, that's a funny one. So I'm a super, I'm like, I can hear it, bro. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I never approach Randy about anything because I'm too fucking scared to. Yeah, Randy had come across my videos. The TikTok ones. The TikTok ones. But like on Instagram because they had cross-post,

but like it was those, those videos, not music ones. And it was of a book that I had recommended as an introduction to Māori practice. Recommend the book. T-Kanga, T-I-K-A-N-G-A by Keri Orpai, who's actually one of my relatives. And it's a really, really awesome book. It takes all this really complex stuff, kind of like what we've been talking about tonight, and compresses it into like a really perfect introductory for anybody in the world could get a grasp of a much deeper understanding than most people already have. Randy bought it.

I wake up one day, I see this message in my Instagram going, hey man, one, I like your guys band. The two, I bought this book and I really like it. I was like, cool, nice to meet you. Nice to meet you, Randy, Blive from, right. Now, me, admittedly, I was never a huge metalhead. So I didn't really, I knew these guys loved them. Yeah, especially Lewis.

So for me, it was just kind of, oh, cool, Randy, you know. But that was about it. And then fast forward months later. And we had been getting a film, like a documentary filmed about the band. Well, they'd been adding it for years. But like, and it was continued until since I had joined. And the director managed to get Randy on the interview to talk about the band. So then that was like another thing where I was like, oh, he really,

knows the band. Like, if you ever get to see that documentary out there, like... Is it out yet or is it still being made? It's done and it's been out for a few years now, but only Australia and New Zealand, like, geolocked, so... Really? That sucks. It is.

I'm pretty sure. So, like, unless you're going to hit the old VPN trick, it's basically unwatchable for anyone outside of our country. Because I bought it for 25 bucks on Google movies. So that's its current issue is there's no international license. It's called alien weaponry. Kuatupu Teara. Yeah.

There's the, I guess, yeah, alien repruguato, but it's a cool docco, but yeah, Randy's in it quite a lot. And so when I'd seen that, I was like, oh, man, not only does he just seen my video one day, but he knows enough about the band to talk about us on a documentary. So then fast forward again, we're writing the demos for the new album. And there was a song, originally it was a song called Hanging by a Thread, which is on the album. I had been sitting in my car just listening to the demos and I went, man, this song would sound really good. with something on it, or maybe it's another vocal, you know, like, I was like, I don't know who to ask, and we'd done tours with Employed to Serve, with the Gozier run, and I thought

Justine maybe, and I even thought, Brian from Knocked Loose, but both of them were quite high screams, and I was like, ah, it's not quite the right thing. And then all of a sudden I was like, oh my God, Randy, Randall. I was like, I have the contact. He broke the ice. He'd already messaged me, you know, and then I know that he knows the band enough that he might even consider it. So I just sent him a message on Instagram, and I was like, hey, man, we got the song what would you think he's like yeah sure send it through and blah blah blah and then you know band schedules happen and like months months go by and then we find out we're working with josh wilbur who for anyone who doesn't know has produced like every lamb of god record so he's very familiar

with randy and he produced this record produced our record yeah was our first time working with him which was awesome so we hit the studio we tell him oh hey man we got randy on a song and josh at first thought we were asking he's like oh i can't ask for you i was like no we already got it He was like, oh, really? Yeah, we just need you to do it, you know, like figure out how to record it. And then through the process, though, we told him the song hanging by a thread. And he goes, ooh, ooh. I think it was one of the members was like, they've got a song called Hanging by a Threat.

Like the main hook is hanging by a threat. Oh, yeah. Which is the first song off of their last album. Yep. I think. And so it was like either change the lyric or changed the song. And I was like, I was too stubborn on the lyric. I was like, I don't know how.

Good for you. I don't know. You got that vibe about you. He's got that quiet, but like, don't fuck with my fucking vision. Pretty much. Yeah. So we changed the song. And it became Tanifa, which Randy loved.

Arguably kind of worked out better as well. Yeah. Like it was one at the time because Tanifa originally was all Māori. So like in our heads, we weren't, you know, like, it was like don't even consider it. But then when the idea of Randy came up, we were like, well, we could do an English verse ourselves. We do have bilingual songs.

So it was like first verse English, second verse Māori, third verse Randy. In his own language. Right. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And Randy then was very keen because he loved the whole Māori side of things. And he was like, he's always a big proponent for Native American stuff. And so he was always like, oh, I'm so in. So Josh flew to Randy's house.

after we all wrapped up and did the thing and the rest is history, you know. It fucking rips. Dude. It fucking rips. Like Lewis said, it ended up better. I mean, we had an idea that it would sound nice on hanging by a thread. Like Lewis did his best Randy impression for the demo, you know. But then when we got what Josh had got out of Randy for Tanifa, we were like, oh, man,

even better. Because the Tanifah also could get Randy's famous cleans, like the speaking. So we got him both speaking. You got his little gravelly fucking. And then the full-blown. Randy growling, you know, so it ended up super sweet. And then we got to get him on for the video, which he filmed in his hotel room while he was on his book tour,

like a G. Dude, he went out and got a suit, got some makeup and did his whole. He had like all these ideas for his bit. And then he just filmed it and then sent it to us. He filmed it on his phone. Yeah. Well, he actually had like a little camera thing that he must carry around with him. Man,

he's a main photographer. Oh, yeah, because I'm thinking in my head, I'm like, it didn't look like a fucking phone, but he's a photographer. Yes, but also we dress it up a little bit with the effects of the, Yeah, yeah. For the video's sake. We were supposed to have him on stage for the Charlotte show that we just played.

But then he went out with, not Lamb of God. I actually don't even know. But he went out with somebody. I think I saw that. Yeah. So he was like, oh, no, I can't make it anymore. And I was like, ah, we'll get there one day. We'll have the one live performance.

Because we play that song live, but he just comes out of the PA, like a sample. He's on the side quests. Yeah, he's on the side quest. He seems real fucking cool. Super nice. Have you met him in person or is it all just been? Yeah, I've met him a few times in person. Yeah, no, I've met all the boys from my...

That's a funny story how I met those boys, actually. We were on tour in Europe maybe. I'm trying to remember what year. I think it was... Might have been 2019? Yeah, we were touring Europe. We're doing, like, headliners, festivals, and we had, like, a intense drive,

and then we're driving into Resurrection Fest. That is a fucking intense drive. Fucking... I do, like, love that festival. Oh, that's great. But it was funny. We, like, pulled up.

We were doing it real budget style. We had, like, a caravan and, like, surrounded by these towering two-story, fucking blacked-out tour buses. And I was tired. I was a bit hungover. I, like, came, opened the door to my caravan. And then it was like, okay, I guess I'll find my way into catering, try and get a snack, coffee, you know, stepped off the... steps. Checked my reflection in one of the, you know, one way mirrors of one of the tour buses.

I've done that many times. Sweet, you know, walked into the catering area, when he got my coffee, was sitting like on the chair, like right in the entrance corridor to the catering, basically, like sunglasses on drinking coffee. And then I see my favorite band of all time walking. And I see Willie Adler, their guitarist, coming in and he locks eyes with me and he's like, dude, and he points at me and he starts beelining it towards me and I'm like, dude, what the fuck?

Like freaking out. And he's like, dude, dude, I was brushing my teeth, bro. I was fucking brushing my teeth and you're checking yourself out. You're staring at me and you had no fucking idea, bro. And I was like, oh! Like just dying internally,

but also like this grand. excuse to like connect on like a human to human level with like my favorite band of all time without being like hey bro i'm like a really big fan you know like he came up to you and randy came up to you you guys got it fucking made dude and it was like see you know i i i have met so many people that i completely look up to and like idolize but i haven't got a single fucking photo with any of them. I'm just not that guy. I don't bother people for photos. I don't approach people that, you know, I look up to.

I'm just like, I'm just like, nah. Like, I don't, I just, I just have a mental block about it. And it was like this weird fucking thing in the universe where I was like, how the fuck did I step off and stare at my, you know, like someone that I've idolized my whole. life and that he found it funny enough that he came and started that conversation with me. And then we ended up hanging out with them. And we were like, I was in their green room later that night, like doing shots with their new drummer.

And like, Randy came and it was like, man, y'all, y'all are getting crazy near me. I was like, dude. It was just a surreal fucking moment for me. It's really cute the way that you talk about it because you do have to remember you are contemporaries now. I mean it is like obviously it's your favorite man of all time but like you're at the festival playing shows too you're a cool guy but you know it's it's that kind of realization of like holy fuck I'm like I'm in this environment where I can you know I'm not just at a meeting greet I'm not like fighting for their attention like you know it's it's it's like we're looking at

at each other at the same fucking level and it was just it was one of those experience I was like how the fuck that I get here and I get that all the time but it was probably like one of the most intense moments in my life I was like how the fuck did I get here like I used to say oh what if so-and-so came through the door and my parents would be like yeah you know and now it's like so-and-so came through the door and fucking talk to me talk to me it's something A that they don't really like like tell you about like if you get in fortunate enough to get into this position like when you're playing things like festivals you know you're like oh my god it's so and so

blah blah blah and then you play your show and then you're sitting in your groomman before you know it yeah Kerry King is knocking on your door going oh hey boys you know we really like your show we want to get you on the tour which is how that how that happens how we go yeah you like yeah you like yeah you like yeah he like heard us on serious xm and he was like yeah I want those boys on the road with me. You know, we had a bill from Mastodon. Oh yeah. Portuguese festivals. Like he just rolls into the groomroom and we're like, oh, and success. And you're like, thanks, you know.

It's like an interesting thing that like, yeah, when, like you say, oh yeah, for us like they're there, but you are, you are. You are. Yeah, you're contemporaries. Something they don't really think, like, prepare you for that. And you will do that to another band. Right. You will do that to another band and they'll be like, oh my God. You never, like I'm 38, you never fucking get used to it though. I'm always at a festival and someone, like, fuck, it happened to me at Grass Pop, Mike Portnoy, from Dream Theater, like, DM me and was like, hey, I saw her on the same festival.

You want to hang out? And I'm just like, what? Where am I? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. This is great. And then he was like, I'll give you one of my kidneys, bro. Came to the green room and hang out and I was like, this is fucking crazy. And then he's like, you want to get photo?

And he posts it on his story. I was like, what universe is this? It's fucking flipped. Yeah, it's really out of it. That's a pretty good fucking place to leave it. Yeah. Next year you got a tour with anthrax. Yes.

Yep. And the other half of the Avatar tour. Avahe. Nice. You've got two. Two, is that your two tours that you got booked? Do you got anything else? Yeah, currently.

They also announced us on. Alcatraz. But, well, it's not entirely sure what? Alcatraz. What? Belgian festival. I was going to say, what? On the fucking prison?

Yeah, yeah, yeah. We're going to Alchras. That would be cool. It's about the tattoos. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But that's August, September. Like, it's way in the back end. So, like, our most immediate is Avatar Round 2 throughout Europe.

And then Anthrax in Australia. Antwerx in Australia. It's Australia, which is directly after the Avatar run. Shortish flight as well for you. Yes. It breaks up that hectic New Zealand to Europe, 36-hour ordeal, which is no good way to do it. No good way to do it.

If you go through it, America, you're going to get fucking have to leave the airport to then do that. If you go through Dubai, in my case, get fucking anal cavity service. It's not a great time. Anyway, check out Teira. Check out alien weaponry. You've got any last thing. You've got any like, you mentioned Shepard Rain.

Is there any other Maori bands you want to take this opportunity to put over? Are they like, is there so few? There's a great band as well back home called Pull Down the Sun, which is actually, speaking of the Maui story, Teira, that's their inspiration as well, was pulling down the sun, slowing it down. So Pull Down the Sun, a really awesome band back home as well.

Fuck yeah. They're not a Māori band, but they're a really cool, up-and-coming young band called Powder Shoots back home. They're awesome. Definitely checked them. Powder shoot. And they drop one of the best albums of the year.

A bunch of kids in New Zealand. It's fresh out of high school. Classic. I like you guys. work. But thank you so much, guys. Yeah, now you'll be fucking telling about the next generation.

Bumping into them at a festival and they'll be like, oh my God, I can't believe me said hello and I'll be in a fucking wheelchair by that point. Boys, thank you so much after this drive. Hey, thank you so much, man. Good luck with everything.

This has been eye-opening and I've had a lot of fun. Thank you. History and hit banging. Thanks, guys.