The Downbeat - Kyle Brownlee - Counterparts

Episode Date: November 30, 2018

I'M BACK FROM TOUR. My guest this week is Kyle Brownlee from Counterparts. Kyle is an incredible, VERY precise drummer, and also obviously a great guy. We talk SO much about drums and touring (for once), including the insane story of how he got so good at drums. Our top 5 starts off as bands but then ends up Top 5 songs by The Black Dahlia Murder. Peace!

What up, my little Gruselows. It's me. I'm back. I'm back off tour. I've been on tour. US tour. Straight from the path. Silent Planet.

Kubla Khan. Greyhaven. Thanks to anyone who came to a show. It was very good. Now I'm at home. Then you get a delightful podcast, which today is with Kyle Brownlee from counterparts. Who, maybe after Dansell, is the most...

Recommended. That's the wrong word. Why do I always fuck this bit up? What's the word? Someone telling the word. Requested. Jesus fucking Christ. Should probably stop swearing. Sorry, Mum.

Kyle Brownlee is... This one is the worst of the lot. Just turn off. Kyle Brownie, yeah, most requested other than Dan Searle, I think. Everyone that everyone's been requesting will be on the podcast because I've spoke to them all when they all. want to do it so don't worry about that um we talk about how he started to learn the drums which is a mental story involving a well-known video game actually crazy um what else do we talk about we talk

about our top five was supposed to be top five bands and then we realized we both like the black dahlia murder a lot so we did top five black dahlia murder songs we sort of moan about what it's like to be drummer on tour and not have a drum tech which is annoying but you know it's necessity in this world not really moan just sort of talk about it there's a lot of drum talk in this podcast so you know if you don't like drums sorry but you shouldn't be here in the first place so leave don't leave got 20,000 listeners now which is insane um this is the point where I do an advert but no one's paying me money but really some of you are paying me money so I've got to say a quick thank you to anyone that bought a t-shirt on this new run of the lovely orange blast beats one

and the new blast beat more blast beats shirt which has a sort of burning people who've been saying it's a burning church on the front it's not if you look very closely the writing in very small prints as guitar shop so you're not going to get me on that one uh yeah Kyle Brownie the downbeat podcast oh we're like exactly an eighth note out oh man that's the delay that's why we do that for anyone who's listening, because this is now the live podcast, what I do before the podcast starts, is we do like a count to four and then four claps, and then I sync that up. So it sounds like we're in the same room and the same studio, but we're not.

We're actually just on the phone with different microphones. Hi, Kyle. Hi, Craig. How are you? I'm all right. You sound like you don't want to be here. I absolutely want to be here. What are you talking about?

I love you, Craig. Have you been up till 7 a.m. playing Fortnite? Is that what this is? Not seven, more like 5 a.m. last night. It took a little earlier departure to bed, but I'm still absolutely shot right now. What time is it? Here it's 117 p.m. right now.

What time is it there? Jealous. 6.17 p.m. 1817 in the military time that I'm accustomed to. So you play Fortnite until 5am? Yeah. Just Fortnite? Yeah, we've been playing Fortnite a lot.

Who's your gang? Anyone I know? What? Who's your gang? Anyone I know? We're, like, mostly I'm playing with my buddy Kenny. He's been doing merch for us lately because Trey's been gone. I've met Kenny.

Yeah, I've met them. And that's pretty much it. Do you do duos? We do doos, yeah. I was talking to Tom. And he said we were going to join up and, you know, do squads. But I haven't seen him online since you guys got home. So I don't know.

What do you play it on? Xbox. See, he has Xbox, PS4 and Switch, because he's a fucking massive nerd. Oh, my God. And I think he plays, like, majority on PS4, I think. But he has the other one so he can play with other people. Okay, that makes sense. Fucking loser.

Yeah, it's nice to speak to you. Are you back from tour? You're about to leave? Yeah, we leave on the third, I believe. We fly out and we have a Europe tour. Let's stick to your guns and employed to serve. That's such a fucking bill. I was talking to Brendan about trying to just fucking come along and like sleep in the lounge on the bus.

Yeah, that would be sick. Oh my God, do it. Because I think I looked at the date and it was like, you're going to drive. I live eight minutes off. the motorway or highway, as you would say. I live eight minutes off it and in the middle of the country, so you could just pick me up and drop me off.

Yeah, let's do it. Right, that's confirmed by two of you now, and that's all I need. Okay, perfect. So that starts, you were just on tour, though. You've been on tour loads. Yeah, this year was insanely busy. We got off tour like a month ago or so. but yeah we just finished our

headliner and it's the first headliner that we did since I've been in the band so it's I really didn't know what to expect but it was it was fucking sick how much does headlining suck okay well like it sucks because you have to show up at the venue so early and you're just waiting all day

and you've got that like stress and anxiety just building like oh am I gonna play like shit tonight and you've got seven hours to think about it before you go on stage. So that's a good seven hours of, you know, panic. But I mean... I think me and you are the only two people that really have that day-long anxiety. It sucks, man. It's not like, I don't think I'm not like, oh, nervous about stage.

I'm just like, I wonder if I'm going to be annoyed at myself at 11 p.m. Or if I'm going to be happy. Yeah, exactly. It really depends. It could depend on so many things. Like, am I going to blow it? Am I going to actually play okay? But think in my head, I blow it.

Like, I don't know, man. It's, I don't know if it's in my head or if I, like, certain nights I just play terrible. But that time when I'm just sitting there thinking, like, okay, I don't feel like I'm going to play well tonight. And sometimes I'll play really well when I think like that. But then I could be like, in my head be like, all right, I'm in the zone right now. I think I'm going to remember every really difficult part and then I'll just absolutely blow it and then I'll... There's no logic.

I've tried to figure out the logic. I've been trying to figure out for fucking ages. The closest thing I can come to figuring it out is how much sleep I've had and how much food I've had close to stage time. Yeah, that does make sense. I... Yeah, I can't like...

I can't eat... I think, I don't know, if I eat within the hour before we go on stage, I feel like gross and big and slow, and I just can't do it. Adrian and I have the same thing where we just go. Is that your cut off? One hour. Mine's two and Drew's is three.

Really? Oh, that's a lot longer. Drew's is like fucking, it's so hard to deal with because we get to the venue at like two o'clock and he's like, guys, I've got to have dinner. Oh my God. Yeah, three hours. thing I hate. So yours is one hour? One hour, yeah. So you're on stage at 9.30. You're eating

dinner at 8.30 or you're finished dinner by 8.30. Yeah, probably around that. Either it's, I wouldn't even call it dinner really. I'd either eat just like something small or I'd, I'd go get food and like save half of it and I'll eat half. And then I usually am absolutely starving after we're finished playing and I'll just have to like finish whatever I've eaten or we'll try and find like I guess gas station food as we're leaving but yeah it's it's usually just like a half and half kind of dinner I don't really eat like a big full meal before we play because I know it's just gonna it's gonna absolutely fuck me up yeah so this is another thing I've been investigating because sometimes if I eat two hours before I can still play like shit and

feel sluggish and sometimes I can't. So what I actually, I'm starting to think, is to do with lunch. It's like how much carbohydrates and calories and stuff you had for lunch is actually what you're using at the showtime. Yeah. You're not like... If I have Jimmy Johns, I'll play like shit because it's fucking crap. But if I have like crack a barrel, big old.

breakfast, oatmeal, you know, whatever, going nuts, chicken fried chicken. Yeah. Then I'll play good. I think I'm trying to fucking, I don't know. The other thing that sucks about headline is how late you play. Yeah, well, that's the thing. Like, going on, I think our set time was usually like 9.55 every night. Nope.

Bedtime. Yeah, and that's like, I'm not used to that at all. I'm used to, like, we've only done. support tours or like opening tours since I've been in the band. So playing that late, it feels like makes it all that much worse because you're like more tired and then I feel like there's just way more room for stress and then way more room for things to go wrong because you're tired and stressed. So it's, yeah, it's a recipe for disaster sometimes. I mean, it's not that bad, but it can be bad. I mean, I'm getting stressed out just thinking about it.

The other thing, it's like how late you actually get finished packing up and everything, because we don't have drum texts because we're fucking real. Yeah. We can't afford them. But they're like, if you play at 950, how long is you set? That's the other thing. You've got to play at least three more songs than a direct support set, if not fucking four more. Yeah.

That's another knackering thing. I mean, for us it kind of works out. Our songs are like, at least all the newer songs are only like, I think they're all under three minutes long. So we can play like 14 songs and it still be like 45 minutes, 50 minutes. So it's not like we're, I think we didn't even hit an hour most nights. So it's still longer, but it's not, it's not like unbearable, which was nice. Because I feel like if I played any longer than the set we played, I would just collapse every night and have to like take a breath. before even thinking about tearing down drums and like loading out right away that's the

worst part for sure about headlining just like oh we just had that Gabe kid do photos for us on that last run oh yeah I saw those are sick and uh have you met him uh no I don't think I've met Gabe no he's like I don't want to fucking put him out there like this but he is like a mini drum tech as well so he would help me pack down and set up and load just out of nine That's not even asking him or anything and it made my life so much easier. That's so sick. Yeah, we had Kenny do merch, like, assistant on our headliner. And he was just basically doing merch assist and whatever we needed, you know, just as an extra hand.

And yeah, whenever he would help me with loading out or just like, he learned how to like pack up my symbols in the right order and like tear down hardware and stuff. And I'd just be like, dude, you have no idea how much that, like, like, minute of you taking symbols off actually makes a difference and it helps so much. Like, I was appreciative of that. It's insane how much it helps. Yeah. Like, I can see why people have drum tech.

Oh, absolutely. Give me a little bit more money and I will pay for a drum tech. Yeah, I used to think like, you know what? I don't understand it. But after headlining and it being that late and you're that exhausted and having

a little taste of it, totally get it. Like, imagine this right now. I'm imagining it. And not only can I feel serotonin. flooding my brain, but I'm like close to tears. Imagine turning up at the venue, then going to do whatever the fuck you want, go and get

coffee, you get somebody to eat, then at exactly 4pm, going to the stage, your drums and everything are there, popping your in-eers-in, playing two songs, then leaving the stage and doing what you want until 9.50pm. And then when you've played that set for an hour, then you just leave the stage again. that is a dream. That is delicious. Yeah, that's insane. Like, I would, that sounds way too good to be true.

Like, I feel like that's, I've been doing it not like that for so long. That, that is just like a, a myth. Like, that, that's impossible. Like, I can't even think about not having to move all of my drum, like, setting up my drums for sound check and being like, cool, this is, I'm all set up. And then playing a song and then being like, now I have to move the, all across the venue. Like, just, oh, fuck.

Now all the serotonin's gone. Yeah. I can honestly feel it going in and out of my brain, and you just sucked it all out. I think drum techs are more important than guitar techs. I have this argument with people a lot of the time. I would agree. There's just more shit. Yeah.

So much more shit to do. And then, like, a guitar tech, yeah, maybe if you've got like a billion strings and you break strings and you've got different tunings, but. you can have those little boats and just leave the stage. When I was drum teching for architects, for a while, there was no guitar tech, because Tom could do it himself. Yeah.

It was like, it was easy for them. Yeah, that's, like, I feel like, not to knock on guitar players, but I feel like you can just, you can just kind of, like, all it is is, like, you set up your guitar once and it's set up. Maybe it falls out of, like, it's set up like very rarely and you can just tweak it but like it's just changing strings and then

kind of getting it in tune and having it kind of ready but like it's always the same kind of set up for your guitar whereas like drums it's like are all my like symbol stands at the right height that I like it's like I don't know for me it's a whole process setting up my kit and like making sure I'm like comfortable because if I set up my kit and like I'm guilty of doing this where I'll just like I'll be either exhausted or not really into the day or whatever because I'm just shot and I'll set up my kit really quickly not really think about like where all like my stuff is positioned and then I'll go to play and just be like oh my kid is not set up the way I usually play and now I feel like I'm going to play worse and I evidently do play worse when I just do

that. Not playing good, though, is not getting a perfect score on rock band. Yeah, well, yeah, ideally. Is perfect when you get it right, is it perfect, or is that guitar hero? I can't remember which one's which. Yeah, no, rock band is, like, that is, that was my goal for rock band. And when I'm playing drums, too, like, if I, I could mess up, like, the, how hard I hit one hit and I'll be like, yeah, I played like shit.

And in reality, I know I didn't play like shit, but as soon as that hit happens or something happens in my head, the rest of the set is just a write-off for me, even though I know I'm still playing okay, but I just go, no, I just fucked it. That's it, you know? See, that used to be me. And then with my hip shit,

it actually just became, if I felt nice when I was playing, I would have a good show. And if I made mistakes, I'd be like, at least I felt okay. Yeah, I get that too.

It's now become that. But even with that, like, I thought I'd fix that. I think it might just be, like, the last three shows of this last tour

that we just did, I was shot the last three days. And I played like shit for the last three days. And I think it was just because I was shot. Yeah, the last, the last couple days

and the last week, I'm definitely burnt out if it's like a four week tour and I'll just I'll play like shit and even if the shows are like incredible shows and people are going mental like I'll still have fun and I'll still be in that mindset of like okay well I enjoyed that set but I I know I didn't play the way I was playing two weeks ago kind of deal but yeah I think it's just a cumulative like I need a day off and it never fucking happens yeah it's like I need more than a day off actually I need a week off. Give me three weeks on, one week off for the rest of my life, and I'll go on tour for that long.

Yeah, the days off are so crucial, and I feel like, like, whenever booking agents kind of, kind of route a tour, they don't, I mean, they do a count until like, oh, they probably need rest, but like, oh, here's an off day, and it's like a fucking 14-hour drive, so it's, like, not a real off day, and then you've got, like, eight shows in a row, and it's like, okay, I've, I've been just annihilating my body for like two weeks straight and like that's obviously going to make you play worse and that's just that's just what happens every tour it happens every tour so what we do when there's an off day and it's a 14 hour drive is we do that 14 hour drive overnight so the rest day ends up making you more tired than not having a rest day yeah because you've

slept in a van overnight and then you've sort of slept the night after but you never really catch that sleep up. Yeah. I mean, it's not like Southeast Asia, though, is it, mate? Oh, my God. We've experienced that together. Yeah, we did. I think about that really, really often.

And not even, like, it just pops in my head because that was such a insane week that I could just be doing anything and I'll just go, yeah, remember that time that we didn't sleep for a week straight? Yeah, I do. Like, it's insane.

That was a mess. The crazy thing about that was, I don't think I've talked about it on the podcast, so I might better explain. Counterparts Australia from the path did a South, Japan. Did we do Australia together? Yeah, we did. Japan, Australia, South East Asia. No, it was in this order.

Japan, South East Asia, Australia. Yeah. New Zealand tour together. And we did Japan and we got there like a few days. early, didn't we? And we had a fucking nice little vacation. And then by the time we played those shows everyone's accustomed to

the jet lag so that was great and Japan is the best fucking place on Earth. So that was just amazing. And then immediately after the last Japan show, we fly overnight to was it the Philippines day one?

I don't remember. It was. We flew overnight to the Philippines to vanilla. And then, so no sleep after that Japan show, straight to the Philippines, straight to the hotel, sleep for two hours, then play a show, straight to the airport again where the promoter hasn't bought you enough luggage. You think you're going to get five hours sleep at the airport and then you end up spending four of those five hours trying to make sure it's not going to cost you 20 grand for two

band's worth of equipment to get on the plane, which the promoter hasn't paid for. And then you fly to the next show, sleep for two hours, if that. In fact, the next show was when we were in Indonesia and we got to the hotel. I don't know if you had it, but outside our room, there was that guy. Like, we were like, oh, yeah, we're going to get two hours sleep. And then we get there and immediately there is a guy protesting the government outside. and he is screaming, and this isn't supposed to sound ignorant, but because it's in a different language and he had quite a high-pitched voice,

it was like the crazy frog, was like just outside our hotel room. And he had a megaphone. It wasn't even like he was just screaming. He had a megaphone, so his voice was amplified so loud. We were delusional and just, like, delirious. I wonder if anyone recorded it. If anyone recorded it in the band,

I'll actually message them and I'll try and put a little bit, a little clip of it at the end of this podcast. I've got a feeling that Tom recorded it. I hope. It's the kind of thing he would record. Yeah. But yeah, so you would do that and then you'd play the show and then you'd fly to the next place.

The same thing would happen at the airport. It's just what they do over there. And then, and the shows were incredible, so it sort of kept you going. But fuck me, that was difficult. Yeah, that was a very difficult, difficult string of shows they were yeah they were all really sick though

like I still got videos and I just like every time I like go through my camera roll on my phone I'll just see like a little picture or like a clip from it I'm like man those shows were actually fucking mental yeah it was like fucking 800 kids in Indonesia and Jakarta

yeah wild however many in Manila where else did we go there was one more uh Singapore oh Singapore that show was fucking sick as well. Very sick. Singapore might have been actually be my favourite.

And by that point as well, like I listened to a podcast on sleep, on the plane back actually, from on my trip back from New Zealand to the United Kingdom via San Francisco, which took 39 hours. I listened to a podcast on sleep. And it said that after about two days of no sleep,

the reason it gets easier is because your frontal cortex just turns off. That's the bit that starts dying first, like brain damage. And that's the bit that deals with like reason and like logic. And then that is why you don't really get that annoyed by sort of day two. By day two, it's like, wow, I'm just a zombie now. This is it. This is life.

I don't think I was even playing that bad because part of my brain had literally turned. the part that was worrying had literally turned off. Yeah, at that point, I wasn't worried about playing at all. It was like, am I going to survive? Am I going to be able to actually like function and like do regular human things on this little sleep? But it worked. I've just remembered something as well that I actually did, which is fucking dark. And I'll, for the, for the interest of being straight with the listeners of the podcast,

when we were landing to, I can't fucking say this, can I? I'm going to say, anyway, I've sort of started now. When we were landing, I can't remember, maybe into Singapore. The flight, like, hit the ground pretty fast when it landed. And do you remember that? In my head, my first thought was, yes, I'm going to die. Yeah, I remember that flight because it was a smaller plane. And when we hit the ground, I was like, are the wheels going to explode?

And then is the like nose of the plane going to hit the ground? And are we going to explode? Because that was like my first thing. I was like stoked for it though. Yeah. For the sweet relief of, and that sounds really bad. That wasn't stoked for it because we were in an amazing time. But I was just, I just wanted some sleep in the form of death.

I would take that, you know. Yeah, at that point we were all broken human beings for sure. We were all broken. I didn't even drink, I don't think, on that, because I just couldn't imagine doing that with a hangover. I remember fucking some of your lot. We're still drinking stuff. It was like, fuck me. Yeah.

See, I rarely drink, but, like, my band drinks quite a bit. And, yeah, I don't know. I would not be able to drink. Your bad drinks so much. Yeah. Other than you do. But they're all good with it. Yeah.

No, everyone's like still like, well, like, like each other and we're all like, we can handle our shit. It's just we like to drink. I'm not like a big drinker at all. So I just kind of, I get to watch the shenanigans go down. But it's, it's fun. It's a blast. I used to be a big drinker and I kind of went off it because of the way it makes you feel the next day. And I think if I had just powered through, you get to that point where you don't have hangovers anymore because you're so,

used to them. Yeah. But when I'm at home, I don't drink. I'll, like, drink a beer sometimes. So then when I'm on tour, if I get drunk, the hangover is ten times worse because I'm not used to it. Yeah. So I'm just a boring bastard.

But I did, when we're on this last tour that we were just on, in any state where it was legal, I definitely smoked weed. Yeah, I mean, it's legal in Canada now everywhere. It's fucking sick. Yeah, but you can't, you can't buy the fucking, I'm very specific. with my weed. I need the one to one

THC to CBD. Yeah, okay, that makes sense. I'm a neurotic freak and I can't handle the, like, what's the word?

Like the paranoia from THC and the CBD counteracts that. Yeah. And it's the full spectrum of medicinal herb and it doesn't get you

that fucked. Yeah. So I need specifically that. So when I was in California, I could go into a place and just buy a pen in a fucking shop a one-to-one pen

you've got any one-to-one they'll be like yeah bro take this and you have this fucking pen and it's amazing I was like I didn't drink at all the whole tour yeah see that's sick obviously I only used a pen when I was in a legal state yeah so the non-legal states

was very annoying yeah but then Canada was right at the end and I wanted to get a pen for the whole Canada run but you guys have a law now that you have to buy it on Don't you? Yeah.

So, like, I guess the only way you can buy it right now is through some website called, like, Ontario cannabis supply. And, like, you, I guess, like, everyone ordered weed because, obviously. So it's so backed up with orders. And then our, like, post office is on strike. So, like, people are just ordering weed and no one's really getting their weed on time. And it's not in stores. I honestly don't know.

I really haven't kept up with it. I just know that my Amazon packages haven't been arriving on time. And I looked it up and I just saw their own strike. And I go, oh, yeah, fucking rare. Like, something's going on. Doesn't Amazon have its own delivery service? I'm honestly not sure. I don't know if it does.

I think it does. I love a strike. I back strikes. Anytime a strike happens, I'm the opposite of, you know, when people are like, wow, fucking strike. My train's not on time. It's like, well, yeah, they're striking because they fucking need more pay, motherfucker.

Yeah, they're pissed off about their work. Yeah, they're pissed off about their work situation. So it's, yeah, I back it. I definitely back it. I'm back a strike. I might strike next time we have to do Southeast Asia. No, that's not true. I want to go back and I love it very much.

Yeah, I would love to go back. I want to do that exact same tour in the same order, but days off and with you guys and have more time to just explore and do fun shit. Give me one day off in between every show that's in a different country. Yeah, 100%. And I'll pay for that myself. I don't care. If we're going to lose this much money, I don't care.

I'll pay for that. It'll be so good. Yeah. Yeah, at that point it's vacation. Isn't this good? We're just on the phone. And I was like, earlier on, I was like, I can't really bother to do a podcast. And I thought about it.

I was like, yeah, I can. It's just ringing a mate who I haven't spoke to for a while. Yeah, it's sick. Having a chat about drums. Pretty good. Pretty fucking good I have to send you a t-shirt, mate You'll have to give me your address

Oh yeah I saw the next order of Shirts that you made And they look fucking sick The church in quotes burning When it's not a church, right? It's a guitar shop I don't want to offend anyone

It's actually just Fantoft stave guitar center Love that In Norway Sadly burnt to the ground Oh yeah Animal from the Muppet I've actually

I've got backup of all of the colors for people who are on the podcast even the ones that are sold out so if you want any of them just let me know Absolutely Let's start talking about Kyle Brownlee

The man, the drummer, the legend Oh my God Let's talk about how you learned to play the drums because this is fucking mental Okay Well what happened is I know rock band's going to come up In this little story

So I'm going to just skip that for a second But I got lessons from my cousin, Graham. I went over to his house once he had a drum kit and I was like, okay, that is sick. And then I watched him play and I was like, I want to do that. So I got lessons from him for a couple years and then I kind of just messed around and taught myself for a bunch of years. and that was just me teaching myself was really just me listening to bands that I liked that I had

CDs of having my like, you know, disc men with the bass boosted on it and my crazy headphones that wrapped around the back of your head just like smashing drums like in my basement. Thank you. Shout out to my parents because they put up with me sucking

for so long. But yeah, that's kind of where I started drumming. And I was always kind of just shot and eventually I got okay at it. But yeah, that's where I like started to learn drums and then, uh, I don't care about the starting. I'm sorry. Give me the fucking juice. Give me the juice. Okay. You give me the boring bit. Yeah. So you were crap of drums by this point. Yeah. So I, were you crap or were you okay? I was okay. I wasn't like,

I wasn't as tight as I am now nearly. My timing wasn't great and I was just kind of, messing around, didn't really take it all that seriously. Is this before or after the Viatrophy cover that you did? Which I watched maybe eight years ago and we didn't know each other. Yep. So that would have been, I had not done rock band before the Viatrify cover. So you were pretty good. Yeah.

So the Viatrophy cover was, that was, I would say right before the rock band stuff kind of took off. and then yeah so if you don't know Craig was in a band called Viatrophy which is fucking sick the band is sick I love that band

and I did a cover of it with my friend Billy and I think it's still on YouTube and it's mixed terribly and my playing is mediocre but that was like my first kind of like drum cover

kind of thing that I ever uploaded on YouTube. And then the game called Rock Band had come out. And I... You probably know by now, but I got really good at it. How good did you get, Kyle? Enough to rank first in the world. So that's the best person in the world at Rock Band drums. Yeah.

Kyle Brownie. What was your username? It was Blindsor, and it still is Blindzor, actually. Hang, do you still play it? Well, not rock band, but, like, I still use, like, the Blindzor tag on, like, whenever I play, like, games and stuff. So that's still, that's still me. So you were the, you were the best rock band drummer in the world ranked. Yeah, it was, and, well, technically I still am.

It's, it's, it's an insane thing to say, but it's, it's true. Nobody's knocked you off. No, it's physically impossible. Well, not physically. I guess it's mathematically impossible for me to be knocked off. Why? Because there's a, there's a, like, a ranking system in rock band called True Skill. A lot of other games have it, too.

But basically, I knew all of the songs so well, and I could just cite read the songs on rock band from playing so much that I, uh, I would play online against other people and, like, ranked battles. and I just never lost. So there's a true skill ranking for the first place person that's like a cap of 40. And then, you know, second place to 10th place

has 39 and then, you know, as it goes down, the numbers increase for the amount of people. And I'm at number 40, which is rank number one. So it'll just never be moved unless I lost, you know, hundreds of times. Oh, shit, yeah.

So. A bunch of 39s or 38s or whatever. And then it will, kind of bummed me down, but... And people still playing it? I don't know, to be honest. I honestly have no idea what's going on with rock band, because I haven't really kept up with it.

Imagine if number two is out there. Like, have you seen the, the Tetris documentary? About that guy... No, the Donkey Kong documentary. About the King of Kong on Netflix, about the guy who is trying to be the best in the world at Donkey Kong and the guy that is the best. What if number two is like searching the internet for you

to try to try to be the best? Brian beat you. He would probably kick my ass now. If he's still playing, he would destroy me, I think. But he's going to waste his whole life looking for you because you're out ripping gigs now. You progressed. You made it out of the machine.

He's still in the machine, poor bastard. Yeah. My, yeah, I lucked out really hard with the trajectory of what happened for me. So I, I mean, shout out to the second player guy or second ranked guy. I hope you, I hope you aren't mad at me. So is that why you've got billions of YouTube subscribers? What's your YouTube? Get everyone involved in your YouTube.

The YouTube is actually before Blind Zor, I had a little tag called SS Blind 73. And obviously that was because I'm a dumb young kid and I was like, okay, well, this is sick. And yeah, so that's, it's YouTube.com slash SSblind 73. And yeah, there's a bunch of YouTube subscribers on there. And it's... SS, that's a bit fucking racy. It's for Super Saian because I was... Oh, yeah.

When I was a kid, I was like, yo, you know, Dragon Ball Z is fucking sick. Yeah, and the Nazis aren't sick. No, fuck that. If you're a Nazi, get the fuck out of you. SS Blindsor, that's fucking disgusting. It's something I never knew about you, mate. That's it.

Interview over. It's fucking done. You know, you know I've got zero tolerance. No, I know. Any kind of stuff. Absolutely. joking. Super Zion.

That's the Dragon Ball Z thing, isn't it? Yeah. But yeah. Never got into it. I think I'm too old. How old are you? I'm 26 now.

Yeah, I'm five years older than you. Yeah. So it was, yeah, I only got into it for a brief second and obviously when I got into it was when I made my YouTube channel. So it just, and I can't change the URL anymore for some reason. So it's just stuck like that forever. And you still upload like counterpart shit, don't you?

Yeah, yeah. So, we like I had like a bunch of random drum covers up there that I've taken down now because like I obviously was terrible when I uploaded them but I have like a bunch of rock band videos up there that I did take down for a while and then I put them back up but yeah I still put all my like counterpart stuff up there and like playthroughs and you know live cams and stuff just because I mean I could make a new one but there's I mean there's already like 35,000 people that can you know,

watch it if it's up there. So I just throw it up. Do you do live shit then? Do you do that Twitch bullshit? No. I feel like, well, the funny thing is,

is like when I played rock band, um, there was, like streaming was like kind of getting popular. It wasn't like a phenomenon, like Twitch yet, but there was a streaming platform called Ustream. And,

uh, we used to like me and like the people that I used to play. with used to stream when we'd play like full band on rock band live and uh we would have like you know anywhere from 500 to a thousand people watching us like at all times and uh we did like live charity events and like donated money and stuff and we never really thought of it as like making money for us and then but then i guess like rock band kind of fell off i quit playing rock band and now twitch is like this massive thing. And there's people that I like know that used to play rock band that are now they like

branched into other games on Twitch and they make a shit ton of money playing video games online. This is a thing, right? I'm bad at video games, but I will play, I'll probably play two hours at least a night. And if you're playing till 5 a.m., like, and everyone has told me, I'll get into it, get into it. But it's like, it's like being a cam girl, isn't it? But yeah. for boys with no wanking. Well, the thing is, like, I feel like it could be sick, but then, like, if you get in,

like, the rabbit hole of, like, oh, my God, like, my main source of income is playing video games, I literally have to stay inside all day, play video games, and that's my way of making money. And if I don't do that, I just don't make money that day. Like, that's scary a shit. Yeah, but could you do it off? tour is it? I don't know how it works. Could you could you not do it off tour and then go on

tour, make money on tour, come off tour, and then stream video games? Or would you not get the fan base required to make money? How did you make money on it? Is it tipping? Is it literally like being a cam girl? I imagine I've never seen a cam show in my life.

I think it's tipping. I think or like they call it, I guess donations or something and they've got like these new things called bits or whatever on Twitch. Yeah, I think, I don't know the fuck that works i'm not like super into it but i've seen enough to know that but uh yeah people like watch people play and then there's like a donation link and people go oh if i give someone five or 10 bucks microsoft sam will read out the stupid sentence that i said to you know all these thousands

of people that are you know watching the video or the live stream that's that's that sucks yeah it's It's pretty cringe sometimes. Is there any way to make it not cringe? I honestly don't know. I have no idea. I'm sure there's like streamers out there that like do well without making it cringe. But I think a lot of it is like, you know, people are personalities. So they put on this like fake kind of persona for like the live stream and then it gets cringe.

Well, yeah. I mean, respect. This is the thing. I would do it just not to make money, but to. like have something to do and have like a connection to my followers. That sounds fucking terrible. Even the word follower. But you know what I mean?

Yeah, no, I guess that's why I do the podcast. Yeah. And also to make myself, not to cut you off, but to make myself feel like I'm working when I'm off tour. Because I don't teach as many drum lessons as I used to because obviously I've moved.

So I need to do this to make it feel like I'm working. otherwise I get fucking depressed because I'm just fucking sat around doing nothing well yeah that's where I'm at like I don't really do much when I'm home from tour

like I do like web design and like web like maintenance for like a bunch of people but like I just bring my laptop on tour and I could be doing work on tour and then not have work when I get home or whatever so then it's like

I feel like you need to you need to be the the first proper band Twitch guy. I'm sure. I think Josh Manuel does it actually. Yeah, yeah, Josh does for sure. I think Kevin from Knock Luce does as well.

I'm sure there's like, I know like the, or Matt from Trivium does a bunch as well. There's a lot of, he does good from it, isn't he? I think so. I haven't like watched any of it, but I know there's. He don't fucking sing songs and shit. It's not just. Yeah, he does like, he does like guitar stuff on it too, which is fucking sick. I just quite want to, quite want people to see how bad I am at Battlefield.

and yeah, I continue to try and play it. Yeah. And how much I scream if someone, like, comes out of nowhere and shoots me. Oh, dude, like, I, yeah, video games are, like, really fun for me. And then there's also times where I can feel my brain expanding in my head. And then I feel physical pain from playing video games because I get so heated at just, like, some dumb shit. And I go, fuck.

Why am I doing this? Yeah, you're the number one person in the world at a specific computer game. So I can tell that you take them. seriously. That's, yeah. I mean, I didn't play video games until I bought PS4 maybe four years ago. And before that, I would literally be

just doing nothing when I was off tour. Yeah, that's... I would just be like, to have nothing to do. And then I bought a PS4 and I was like, oh, I've got a couple of hours spare. And at first, I would feel guilty. I'd be like, I've done... nothing for the last two hours

except play this game and then the more I sort of get older and the more my brain is fucking broken that I realize sometimes you need to just do something that's fun. Yeah, you got to have something to keep you occupied other than video games for sure.

Or work. Yeah, exactly. Or like looking for work or hustling gristling for work. Yeah, getting off tour and then not doing anything is like, you're so you're doing that you're busy for 30 days straight and then you just sit on a couch

for like the time off and you're like, what the fuck am I doing? I need to be doing something. You get like, I don't know, it freaks me out just not doing anything for that long. I'm glad I got into the podcast thing before I don't know if other drummers

just saw me do it and then did it like copying or it was just like all of us at the same time decided to do it. But I'm glad I got in there before now because I don't know what I'd do. Like, number one, it makes me, like I said, makes me feel like I'm working. And it is kind of work. I don't get any money from it.

But, you know, I looked yesterday, there's 20,000 listeners now, which is absolutely fucking mental. Yeah, that's insane. And then, like, I, we have a period of time off tour until the end of January. So I was like, you know, I've got. paid from tour but it's it's enough for me to live like incredibly frugly

before we go away again. And then I just paid a designer to do these new t-shirts and then they all sold out and now I don't have to really work until tour so I can just do more podcasts. Yeah that's sick. Which is sick because it's not like I'm not going

oh please donate so I can make more it's like yo you're getting a t-shirt and it's a sick t-shirt and it's a sick t-shirt and also it's helping me make more podcasts because I don't have anything else to do. Yeah, it is very... Whereas if we didn't have that, if I didn't do that, then I would have to fucking...

I don't know what I'd do. I would probably hustle more on drum lessons, but it's annoying. I mean, yeah, like... This is better. Yeah, I could teach drums when I, like, have... When we're, like, home from tour and we have off time, but I don't...

Like, you know drums and you know, like, rudiments and you know like a lot of things about drums and I just kind of I never really learned any of that and I never got good at runaments and I never like practice them a lot so like I don't think I'm going to be able to teach someone effectively so like I don't even try or like thinking about teaching someone freaks me out people say this to me all the time and also a lot of students don't want what I can teach a lot of students not saying like I the be all and end all, but for anyone who's listening, you know, I have a degree in music.

Ha ha. But, so, like, I can teach sight reading and whatever, but some students are freaked out by that. They're like, I don't want to do sight reading. I just want to learn how you learn. And admittedly for you, that involves getting the fucking PS1 out. Yeah, I don't think you should put yourself down.

And the other thing is, the amount of downtime we have from tours, what we're just talking about sat around doing nothing. You can teach yourself anything. I taught myself how to be a fucking coffee barista. I saw that. If you wanted to do rudiments, thank you.

Thank you for the progression notes. I got really fucking good. Yeah, you did. You're literally an artist at it now. It's insane. But that took like three months. We had three months off tour and I was like, what am I going to do?

I know. I'm going to learn how to be really good at coffee. Yeah, and it's sick. So if you wanted to learn how to site read, it would take you fucking three months, if that. Yeah. But the problem, The problem we have here,

and this is actually quite a good thing for the listeners, is America, North America, differs from England, Britain, I should say, in that you don't really have like a registered school of drumming where there's like books. And once you do book one, you're allowed to do book two, you know? Whereas in the UK, I mean, correct me, if I'm wrong.

But whereas in the UK, there's something called grades, and they take you from pre-grade one, which is being a beginner, to grade one, which is, you know, being slightly better than a beginner, all the way up to eight, which is when you're supposed to be professional drummer.

So there's eight books plus another one. And they're facilitated by actual universities so that past grade six, they become, like, they give you points that you could use to get into, to a school for like anything. So they're like, you know, like,

I don't know if you have it in America, but we have UCAS points here where you get a certain amount of points and that means you can apply to certain schools. I'm sure you have something similar. But drum exams, six, seven and eight in the UK, actually add to those points.

So to get you into a school or whatever. So the minute you get a kid that likes drumming, like you give him a couple of introductory lessons and they love it. Say it's like a fucking eight year old kid and they love it. You've got at least nine years out of that one student

presuming you keep his interest and he loves it because there's nine grades. And then, and you know, you tell the parent, like once he gets to grade six it's going to help him get into a better university and they're like, okay, I'm fucking in. That's smart.

That's an insane system. I honestly don't even know if America It doesn't exist because I've told this to so many of my professional drummer friends who struggle to get a teaching career because you don't get the return students because there's no system in America which is linear. There's no like it's like you want to get good at jazz? Here's 10 jazz books. It's not like you want to get good at jazz. Here's jazz book one. Once you finish that, you do two.

Then you do an exam. You know, there's no school. One of my things is I would love to actually bring that to America. in my lifetime. That would be a really good thing to bring here because I literally have never heard of that ever. Like me hearing this goes,

that's a really good idea of why isn't that here. I wonder who I would talk to to I actually get that somewhere. I mean, that's the ultimate side hustle because it helps all of my friends and the whole of America

get good at drums. Yeah. But like for me, so before I was in Stray and after I was in brutality would prevail, solely did that and you know I had some students

maybe five or six students that didn't do the grades because they wanted to do they just wanted to work on weaknesses or whatever but I had 21 students who did these grades every single week

holy shit and not only the way they're getting better at drums but there's no like pressure of the student's parent being like, well, how do I know he's getting better? Because it's like they're sitting actual exams every year. Yeah.

And then it's like being a real teacher. But it sucks that that doesn't exist in America. Because it was not only good for this. I think it's great for the students or whatever, but it's lucrative as a drum teacher because you get eight years out of one kid. Yeah. That's an insane, like, concept to me.

Like, hearing that goes, like, that's incredible. I don't know why it, like, if that was a thing here, like, I feel like teaching drums would be an actual, like, career path that I could take after touring. Whereas, like, yeah, like, here it's like, oh, well, I could teach drums and then I could get maybe four kids. And then they go, I never actually gave a shit about drums or not. 100% they just wanted to hang out. Escorting again. Which is the problem all of my friends have is that

because there's no graded system or schooling or whatever, it's like it's either a kid that wants to hang out with you or it's a kid that wants to know how to play fast. And both of those things have like a three lesson life expectancy, if that. Yep. Yeah. I will say this though.

When I started touring more, that's my dog now freaking out. Luna, you're going to be on the podcast again. All right. Shut up, my lovely, lovely woman. So now I've lost my train of thought, Luna. You're going to come and speak to the people? I've absolutely lost my fucking train of thought.

Oh, yeah. So when I started going on tour more, the students that didn't practice, which, because they're always going to get students that didn't practice, they actually struggled more. with me being away because they weren't their practice every week was being at the drum lesson. So those ones actually kind of started getting worse.

Not getting worse, but like stagnant and then they dropped off or I sacked them off. Yeah. And then, but the students who I could give, like, I'm away for four weeks, here is what you should do on week one, week two, week three, week four. The kids that actually did that, they were fine. But I think as soon as I joined Stray, it dropped to like 12 students. students a week from 21. But then I was making money on stray, so overall it was the same amount of money.

But it definitely needs to be introduced in America. I'm going to do it. You should. Anyone who's listening and does this before me, fuck you, but also respect for stealing my idea because that's a grustle baby. But all of my friends could teach if this was the thing. Yeah, I...

I've thought about it and I've definitely I've had like my parents say oh you know what you should you should definitely teach when you're like when you're home because like you can do something and then you're you know you're still drumming and all this stuff and it's like if I

what the biggest thing for me is like when I'm home from tour like I it's hard for me to drum now I've just been drumming for a month and I want a little break from it and then about like a week after I want to start drumming again. But, you know, I've, like, I lived in Toronto for the last, like, year pretty much.

And then I'm moving to Hamilton in, like, three days, right? Like the day, a couple days before tour. And there's nowhere I can really play drums. So if I was trying to teach, I'd have to be like, okay, guess what, mom and dad? I'm going to teach kids that don't know how to play drums. in your basement again, and you have to relive the torture of me being not able to play the drums when I'm 26 years old again.

So I'd have to, like, read the spot. The sound of someone learning. Yeah, they would, I think that would drive them insane. And like I... It's an outgoing, yeah. And without that constant income of like doing a grade or whatever, it's like a big, it's a big amount to let out. out.

Yeah, renting a place. I moved and now I rent a place. And like last month I wasn't in the place at all, but I obviously still had to pay for it. Exactly. And like the rental space is around here. Like, I think, I can't remember. I think it's like 400 bucks or 500 bucks a month to like have a room.

And it's like, that's, that's like insane for an empty room with like no amenities. And like you just kind of are there for like, maybe half the year, if not less, when you're in like a full-time touring band. So it's like, it's a crazy expense that I don't even know if I'd be able to recoup based on the amount of students I would be able to get. So I just kind of, it's been a thought in my head, but then also thinking like, I don't even know if I can teach. I don't know if I can afford to get a spot to do it.

I'm just going to not do it or stress about it right now. But the other thing, sorry, carry on. No, if there's like the grading system, like over there, like it would be so, it'd be like an actual opportunity that you could, you know, pursue and make income from because that's, that's sick. I wish we had something like that here. It's, well, you know what? I'm going to do it. So don't worry. The other option is lessons on tour and then I've got a lot of friends.

I know Jay Postones and. Troy Wright when he's touring. They do lessons every day on tour and then keep that money and then that money they use when they're at home. But I can't fucking do that because both our bands don't tour in buses. So you don't know what time you get to the venue

and then you're tired and then you're hungry and there's no time. Yeah. Like I tried to do it a couple of times and I bounced on like three lessons in a row because I was just shot and I had to eat dinner. Yep. And I just felt bad. I was like, no, well, no. Yeah, I was thinking of that too because, like, that's, it, like, it sounds like, for anyone

that's not in a touring band, it probably sounds like that's the perfect time to do drum lessons. Like, oh, like, you could just do it on tour and you're already around your drums and you're already in a place where you can do it. But it's like, you get, you're already busy for the majority of the day and then you're exhausted and then you may have just drove nine hours overnight. And then it's like, it's just not, unless you're, you're, you're just not. you're if you've got like a tech and you're in a bus and you've like you've got enough sleep and you're like living super comfortably on the road and you've got like a schedule that's like adhered to every single day and there's never like it's never late and you can actually like

you know get there on time and all that stuff it's like that's when it makes sense to do drum lessons on the road but i personally like i i sympathize with that there's no way i could do it Not a chance. And like, I mean, you could do it, but the kid's not getting a good lesson out of it because nobody wants to be there. Yeah, exactly. And it's going to be cut short. But then thinking about it, you just saying that again, like, imagine if you had a drum tech. If you had a drum tech, realistically, you only have an hour's work to do a day.

Yeah. So you could just do fucking anything. Yeah, you could. Including getting your drum tech to set up a drum kit, like a mini kit in the trailer. and then you could literally wake up, teach two lessons, then go to the gym and eat food, then fucking challenge check. Oh, it's, it's, I'm going to cry. It sounds so good.

Yeah, it's the dream. Like, just getting to the venue and then, oh, I'm going to do whatever I want for seven hours straight. That sounds insane. Yeah, someone else is going to worry about my gear is, wherever my gear is. Yeah, that's the dream. And how it gets on stage and the striking and everything. Oh. I'm

Sometimes I think I'm close to that And then I'm like Stick to your guns Doesn't have a drum tape yet Yeah no If I see George with one Then I'll be like Okay

That's the level That's when it happens Oh I know I know I know I've seen I've seen the shows That they're playing in Europe now

And I go Oh okay George All right stick to your guns Oh well All right let me look at your tour dates Right A we'll shout them out Because this is probably

going to go up tomorrow so this will be good. Love it. I'm going to go on your Instagram, which is at Kyle Brownlee. Yeah, I don't even know if I've posted it. I think go to the, you might have to go to Counterparts page. Jesus Christ, Kyle. I'm not good at Instagram.

I just post the same song clips over and over. I nearly posted a song clip today, and then I was like, this is the only song I ever fucking post. I need to write new songs that we then play live. Um, it counterparts doesn't even have this tour up. Oh, it does,

but a million, million years ago. Fuck me, guys, come on, read a book. I don't have a password. Otherwise,

I got it. Right. Antwerp. Nuremberg. Cologne. Looks like Herreford, but it says, Krampus Fest.

Nice. Oh, you're going to be in Europe. You're going to be in Europe at Christmas. I love Europe at Christmas. I've never been to Europe at Christmas. Oh, my fucking.

God, it's the best. All the Christmas markets, like Germany is fucking lit, gingerbread. It's gonna be sick, mate. That's sick. In fact,

you've only got fucking, are this tour's fucking perfect? Yeah, it's gonna be mental. Two weeks in Europe. Oh, two weeks.

Only two weeks. You might as well have a drum tape. That's like fucking only eating dessert. Yeah, we're splitting a bus with stick to your guns too, so it's like,

this is, you must have spoiled. For me then, surely. It's going to be, it's going to be great. Look, here's a thing,

look, you got Belgium, Belgium, Germany, Germany, Germany, and then six UK shows and then one Germany show and then you're out. That is the world's most perfect

tour. Yeah. It's best case scenario for sure. That Carl Drew date, Knockdown Festival, is the worst I've ever played at a gig ever in my entire life. Was that that show? Like you playing or is the worst show? I was shot. No, the playing.

I was shot. I think it was a similar thing at the end of a tour but the tour was four weeks long. I was shot, the drum kit kept falling apart. There was six and a half thousand people there so I played everything way too fucking fast.

Yep. And then the drum kit falling apart as well which just made it just the worst. And then like what made it worse, I don't want to throw them under the bus, so I won't say which band it is. But obviously whoever can fucking go and Google this. I can't even remember their name.

But there was a band on before us. and they like they did crowd interaction painting by numbers like they did they did everyone get down on the floor and then when I say stand up you know they did the singer stage diving they did but they did it all and they had it like rehearsed choreographed and they had screams and all that shit and it was like and the crowd lapped it up because it's fucking Germany and everyone's suicide suicide Islands merch. They were like. And then by the time we went on, everyone's fucking knackered.

Plus, we're playing shit. Well, I was playing shit. It was like the biggest deflation ever. Anyway, right, I'm looking at these days. Bristol, Birmingham, Leeds, Glasgow, Manchester, London. Here's the thing. I'm an hour from Leeds. Okay.

Right. And then to get from Manchester to London, you need to drive past my house. so you could just pick me up come into Leeds or I could get a train to Leeds but you know I'm the host of a successful podcast I'm carted around but I could potentially come from Leeds

and then get dropped off after Manchester so just have a little three day Leeds Glasgow Manchester yeah do it for sure that's sick we'll get you an Uber X we'll get Uber XL and then I just get a bus to come pick me up We gotta convince the bus driver

Who's, I don't even, like I've never done a bus tour So I don't even know how the fuck it works But I'm assuming it's just we drive over night I've done a bus tour with you, I'm sure No, I've never done a bus ever This is baby's first bus tour Oh my God And it's only two weeks long

And there's only two bands on it Yeah You are, you've just kicked a fucking goal my friend That is so sick Yeah, I'm stoked You'll never be able to go back though. No.

I know. Well, that's what I'm worried about. It's going to be paradise and then it's going to be back to driving a green van and everywhere. We've got this while she sleeps tour coming up at the end of January

and we're splitting a bus with landmarks, the other van on the tour, and I just fucking can't wait. It's just... So sick. You do all the driving overnight, so you wake up whenever you want to wake up and you are already in the city.

It's just the best. and you get so used to it that the only time it really sucks is like you have to get up for the border coming out of the UK to go into mainland Europe but when you compare that to every day of tour in a van it's like getting out

checking into the hotel getting into the hotel sleeping checking out of the hotel getting into the van instead it's just oh I've played the show I'm going to bed immediately I've woken up in a new city I'm going to go and experience explore.

Ah, jealous. Yeah, that's the one thing. Like, we've done, I've been to Europe now, like, I think four, three or four times. And I've barely got to explore. Like, I, I want to go, like, see cool shit and, like, see, like, landmarks and stuff. And I just basically have never got to see any of, like, the massively cool shit in, like, all of these major cities. So now that we're, like, able to wake up and go do whatever we want, like, I can actually

go like, oh, I've seen this even though I've been here four times. This is my fifth time and now I can finally do all the cool shit I want to do during the day. Like I'm so like that. Hang on, I'm going to sneeze. If anyone wants to know what my sneezes are like, there we go. So you've got Nuremberg's day too.

Obviously you can go to the Nuremberg, where the Nuremberg rally was, where the nasty man did his nasty talking. So that's a bit of history. Then you got Cologne the next day, which has, I think, the biggest cathedral in Europe is fucking crazy. That's sick. Then you've got some place, I don't know.

Then you've got Bristol, which is kind of sick. Birmingham is kind of sick. Leeds is kind of sick. Glasgow is low-key, one of the sickest places in the UK. Really? Okay. Yeah, I just love it. You've got Manchester, so much good food.

You've got Nando's. The dome show's going to be fucking crazy. Oh, you've got two dome shows. Yeah, dude. Two of them in a row. Crazy. Imagine that. No load out.

either. That's, I was thinking about that too. The dream. It's so sick. That's honestly, how sad are we that we're getting excited of the aspect of not having to pack up a drum kit once? Yeah, just leaving it in the venue, like, leaving it in the venue being like, I'm done, and this just stays here. That is insane. We actually did that with Sticture Guns on their last Euro headline or the one before it, and they did two nights at the underworld.

That's. And leaving the kit there was. wonderful. Yeah, I love that. Yeah, George and I think are sharing a kit, so it's just going to be like a, oh, we set up, oh, well, all right, let's go, I guess either, you know,

play board games or play video games instead of, you know, tearing down drums. Sounds great. That is fucking delightful. Yeah. Maybe I'll share my drum kit with bandmarks, and then I don't have to do, I can do half as much.

I do like sharing drum kits, but I also hate sharing drum kits. It's like a lot. It's so bittersweet for me. I love sharing shells when the other drummer has their own symbol stands. Yeah. That's the dream because you have another person to get the shells out of the fucking case and help with that. But your symbol stands are your symbol stands.

Yep. And you can pack symbols a way easier than you can pack like two fucking kick drums. Oh yeah. Yeah, the worst is when it's like, oh, we have four drum kits and it's maybe a 250 cap venue. So the drum kits are just kind of in the crowd along the wall. Like, oh, good. Hey, I just did that exact thing. Yep.

Last week. It was good, though. I'm going to look at my notes, see what else I've got to ask you. You know, because I'm a professional. In fact, I haven't got that many notes. I think I just fucking spoke at you. How's your symbol endorsement going? I haven't got one yet.

No. No symbol endorsement. Mine all symbols. One of you's got to be listening to this. In fact, I know many of you are listening to this. Endorse my man here because one of those fuckers is going to do it. And I don't want him to play fucking Sabian. Yeah.

Well, I mean, I, to like, to be real for, Any of like the, you know, minor, Sabian or Zildjan, any of those, like three, even like, I guess pasty is also up there.

But like the, those are like the big, big names, I guess. And like, they're all, all of them have their good shit. Like,

they're all good. It's just, give me your ideal pasty set up then. I mean, I just said pasty to be nice. I don't. I knew it. I knew it.

I knew it. But you're right. The other three, the other three. sorry to call you out there, but the other three make perfectly good symbols, you're right, and they have a model for everything. Yeah, I, yeah, I, I've applied for sure. I'm not going to like name whatever, or whatever companies,

but like I've tried and it just hasn't happened. And I've been, you know, I've been trying. And I just kind of, I accepted my fate and just went like, you know what? It's not going to happen. I'm just going to keep doing what I'm doing. Because, like, getting excited about it and, like, trying to make it happen is, like, it's stressful because it's, like, how much is this going to, you know, save me in the long term? And it's, like, a lot.

It's, like, like, symbol endorsements are really fucking hard to get. Are you paying for your own symbols? Yeah. Well, not, like, well, okay, here's my thing. in obviously in the u.s there's guitar center um in guitar center you can like buy a symbol and if it's within like 30 days you can return it and you can buy the protection for whatever amount and how many years is the protection for i think two years uh here's one for you that i'm gonna fucking i'm going to throw them under the bus on live fucking podcast i've actually heard of some

US Sabian artists who I'm not going to mention who they are but that they have been doing the Guitar Center deal because it works out better than their current Sabian deal. Jesus, man. So they're breaking them and then they're they're going back to Guitar Center

and they're getting them fixed because Sabian's given them like a two two limit, two replacement limit on each. or something. Which is pretty shitty. Yeah, that's rough. I mean, like, yeah, the guitar center thing definitely works.

But you're still losing money every time you have to buy the warranty. Or if you get, if you go to a guitar center and they see like, oh, you've returned the symbol three, four times now. They're just going to go, yeah, we know what you're doing. We can't. We literally can't do this because, you know, you're abusing the system or whatever, which is, happened to me because I have been doing that for a really long time. But in Canada, they've got the equivalent to guitar center is called Long and McQuaid. And, uh, of course he's not called something fucking simple.

No, I guess there's two guys Long and McQuaid and they were just like, let's just call it us. Yeah, it's insane. But they've got, um, like a used symbol section. And I guess what it is is like, people returning their symbols after they buy them. And I guess they can't sell them for new again. So they put them in like this use section and you can rent like symbols from the

use section. So I've just been like renting symbols from there. And if they like if I destroy those symbols, they just don't give a shit. Like I can give them back with like a huge crack in it and they'll go, oh, okay. Well, that one broke and they'll just they'll just take it back like it wasn't cracked. I've just been... How much does that cost? For right now, it's like...

I think I have a whole set of symbols and that I've got backups of everything except my high hats. And I think I'm paying like 160 Canadian a month to keep those out. So it's not terrible. And I mean, it's better than spending 400 bucks on a symbol to have it crack

fucking two weeks into a tour and then have to go to guitar center and stress about it and then them go actually you have to you have to call and mail in this thing and then we give you a gift card to get your money back

and it's just like it's so fucking stressful that it's just not worth it so I've just been dealing with you know Longa McQaid and just saying fuck guitar center you just need a fucking endorsement I know

I know it would help me up a lot you probably crack more symbol because you're using symbols that fucking a billion other people have used. Well, yeah. I mean, like that's the thing.

Like, it's not like I'm, whenever I get new symbols, they last a normal amount of time, but I just don't get new symbols. I get used symbols and I don't know how long those have been played. Even if they look like, you know,

they, they haven't been played all that much. Micro cracks you can't see you. Exactly. I've, I've rented a symbol and it's cracked on the first hit. We went to, uh,

to jam before a tour and I used a, a used symbol it was going to be like the main accent crash that I use and it just like first hit it exploded

and it wasn't even like a small crack I took a picture of it it's like at least seven inches down towards the like the bell of the symbol and I was like this was one hit like this symbol was already broken and that's probably why they returned it with the micro crack and like

shit like that just happens when you, you know, you get, you know, use symbols and you rent them. So, but that's why I break so many. It's just like, I'm not using new symbols ever. Because they're expensive. That's so expensive. I can't believe how expensive symbols are, actually. Just fucking...

Drums and general, man. Drums are the most expensive. And it's fucking insane. And you've got the most shit and you get the least credit and no one takes photos of you. Respect to... photographers that do take pictures of drummers. I figured this out, right? The problem is, there's two problems.

It's very hard to, because we move around so much. It's very hard to get a pleasing photo. So photographers either do one of two things, which is they either take a few photos and they go, well, I'm not getting that guy. Yeah. Or they take a load of photos,

but then they don't go through them and go, well, this one, he looks like he's on fucking, Molly. This one he looks like he's on Molly. This one he looks like he's on cocaine. Oh, this one he actually looks okay. What they do is they go, yeah, that one will do. And they just stick one on.

Oh, I've done the drummer. Whereas Gabe, actually, is the first person that I've noticed. He will go through them. And if I look like shit, he just doesn't put them in the drop box. Yeah, I love it. We had Eric. Eric Easter Daily. Let me show it.

I've seen his photos. Yeah. He's, yeah, he, he would always, like, make an insane effort

to come and, like, make sure I had a bunch of pictures that were fucking sick and, like, respect, because that doesn't happen. And Gables were also really fucking sick.

Like, I saw the pictures that he got at you, and I was like, yeah, respect. Like, you actually, you went and you, you made,

like, sure that you cared about getting drum picks, and that doesn't happen. So it's fucking awesome. But yeah, like, Drum faces, it's not curable. Like, it's insane.

We look, we look insane when we play drums. Like, we look, like, if you're critically watching a drummer, like, it's just sweaty, weird faces while you look like a crazy person hitting things really fast. Like, it's a recipe for looking like an actual crazy person. Yeah, it's, yeah, so shout out to photographers who actually make us look okay. Yeah. Gabe fucking killed. it on those last thing. And anyone that actually comes to a show will

know that I actually do look like I'm on Molly constantly when I'm playing the drums. So for anyone in England that doesn't know what Molly is, that's MDMA. Our name is Mandy. It's what we used to call it. Mandy? Mandy. Yeah. Mandy. I didn't know that.

Sort of like the UK version of the name Molly, I guess. There's not many mollies over here, but there's a couple of mandis. Anyway, I imagine that's what people would look like on that drug because I've never seen anyone on that drug because it's I don't know what you're laughing about because it's an illegal substance

yeah so this is going quite well mate you got anything you want to plug or talk about other than getting a symbol endorsement not real I don't know if you I mean if you're listening to this and you don't know I should probably say I play in a band called counterparts and we

I will have done all this shit oh yeah you do the true Okay, yeah. Professional, mate. Professional boy. All we do is we listen to malice or of malice by misery signals. And then we go try and do that and rip off that. And that's our band pretty much.

And your band's fucking sick. I like your band. Yeah. Well, I mean, for me, it's crazy because like I liked counterparts before I was in the band. like I was a fan so it's it's cool to be playing in one of my like top bands that I respect as like musicians and like as people it's it really it worked out it's fucking it's sick I really lucked out shout out to rock band for you know making that happen yeah that's fucking I saw yeah you saw you did covers of counterpart songs before you're even in them yeah

though that's how it happened like I uh you like you know they had some other guy they had some new drummer when when matey boy got kicked out they had some other guy and Tom told me I can't remember who it was so Tom was like oh he's the best drummer I've ever seen and then the next thing I know he'd been kicked out and you're in yeah I mean it's it's really like he's

the other guy that was filling in at the time like I filled in in 2016 on the Parkway Drive tour and then I didn't really think anything of it I just figured oh they just need a fill and whatever I'm just gonna do what I'm still doing at home. And then, yeah, they had the other guy and he went and did, I think, I think it was actually Japan and Australia and I think Europe as well, like all within like a month and a half or two months.

And, yeah, he's an insane drummer. Like, he's fucking so good. But I guess, like, they just, for some reason, wanted how I guess play the songs. and then... Like a fucking robot. Yeah, straight up. I guess that's what it is. And then...

I mean, they're so hard that you've got to be pretty fucking accurate. I mean, Will Putney, you heard Will Putney's sucking you off. That's insane. That's insane. No, that's bullshit. I was thinking about that when I heard it. I don't know, man. Like, I understand how, like, I do play pretty tight.

I'll say that. Like, I get it. But there's no way that they're, like, I'm up there. Yeah, but this is the thing. From a producer's point of view, he needs a drummer to be really tight, really consistent, and on the click. And you are all of those things because you were taught by a fucking machine. Quite literally. So for here, I think his story checks out.

Yeah. You might think you're not as good as other drummers because you prefer their style or whatever. But from a point of view of recording, you are. The best drummer Will Putney has ever recorded. And probably a lot of sound guys have worked with because of how consistent you are. You are insanely consistent. It's worrying. Yeah.

It hurts when I play drums quite a bit. Because I just, I push my body way too much. How was your back? You said your back was a bit fucked. Yeah. I mean, it's not like really, really bad. But I can tell that if I don't start working. to fix it now, it can get bad, or it will get bad in the future. It's just, it's my lower back

just, it doesn't hurt. Like, I mean, that's not true. It does hurt. It's not like shooting pain. It's just kind of like a dull pain that sits there. And when we're done playing a set, that's when I feel it the most. And I know it's because my posture is like terrible and I like over-exert myself when we're playing because these songs are, fucking mental, like having to listen to what, you know, like Jesse and Alex and Blake and Adrian all right and go, oh, I have to do that. Okay. Like that is insane. And then I obviously wrote parts that were even harder than I thought. And then it just, it in turn is like, I guess just slowly kind of fucked my backup. And even when I'm like sitting down and I mean, it's probably

to do with like being in a van for fucking seven months of a year. I think that's a big part of it. Yeah. Just those two things combined have eventually or have, you know, resulted in my back just being kind of shot. And now it's not, it's kind of, I'd say I'm like 15% worried about it because I think if I work to fix it, it'll be fine. But I'm lazy and I will probably procrastinate on doing that and could get bad.

but, you know, I probably should figure it out. But your hip now is fine, right? Yeah, but these last three, I mean, technically, I haven't been back to the Cairo since this last tour. The last tour we just did was the longest I've ever gone without it being a problem. And then the last three shows it was a problem. Oh. Which makes me think maybe it is just being fucking shot.

Yeah, maybe. I don't know. I don't know. But it's much better. Some kid, not some kid, the guitarist of the band, Glema, came to a show. And he, very good band. He works at like a sports therapy company and they have like a prototype of a hip thing, which is exactly for my problem.

And he listens to the podcast. The guitarist of Glema listens to the podcast. And he brought it and was like, here you go. There's one of these. And that helped a lot, actually. So shout out to you. Nice. so right we're going to do

partly because I'm hungry and partly because we're like an hour 20 something in which is usually the point of people getting bored um top five bands uh I thought about this I figured that you had asked this I'm I don't know I thought about this but I have been changing my list

since probably like a week ago just thinking about it. Anyone that knows me knows that I ask everyone I've ever met this question. Yeah. I remember like first tour that we ever did, I remember talking about Viatrophy and you asking this. And I was like, fuck, I don't know. And then it made me think about it.

You must have some. Yeah. Everyone's got at least three. And then the next two are like rotations usually. Yeah. So top, top three, I'm going to have to say, number one, Seosen, because that's, that's what got me in to not like heavy music, but that's what got me fully in on drumming and got me fully in on like songwriting and like being a musician. Though, yeah, that translating the name EP and like bug record are just, they're timeless. They're fucking so good.

have to put them at number one. Loves a high hat, doesn't he? Yeah. Oh, I mean, dude's an insane drummer, Alex or whatever. He's fucking incredible. Number two. I'm surprised.

Number two. I have to say, band-wise, better off. Luke is an insane songwriter. Probably one of the records I've listened to the most. Like, I think they're still doing stuff right now in the studio, but God, they're so good. And I can listen to that record on repeat and not get tired of it. And same with, or I think I'm leaving in Milk is the second record.

Yeah. Three has to be misery signals. I mean, fucking rare. Look at the band that I play in and what we do. And then like the other two, I don't know, man. Hang on, let's talk about two of those other ones. I don't know anything about better off whatsoever. Listen to them.

They're sick. So I can't really talk about them. But I can tell you this, misery signals completely fucking pass me by. Really? Even being my age and playing fucking shows where they were on the same bill and stuff in like the mid-2000s when they were like massive. I just couldn't get past the vocalist. Yeah, it grew on me.

For, there was, I, like, I'm really, as much as they're one of, like, they're in my top three. I, it's really only of malice that keeps me putting them up there because that record is, in my opinion. You can't have a top three band of all time that you're only like one album. Okay, well, I don't like the other albums. Like, I don't like, or like, I do like the other albums. It's just that record is the one that solidifies their spot. The other records are obviously still fucking sick. But of malice is still, it's got to be one of the best metalcore records.

Or, like, melodic metalcore records of all time. The drama's incredible. I get it. The breakdown's good, but I just fucking hate the singer. I can't handle it. I don't hate it. I just... Maybe I just didn't like it at the time.

I just remember it being really monotone, so I just never bothered listening to it. Yeah. No, I can understand it. Maybe the production was sterile. Well, does that happen for you where the production can severely, like, impact how much you like a band, even if the songs are sick?

Yeah, but usually it's when it's too good that I don't like it. Like, I like a lot of blackmail, which sounds like it was recorded in a fucking shoe. Yeah. And I like... like poison the well and stuff like that. Oh, yeah. In that sort of mid-2000s, early 2000s, metalcore where it's like, how are we mixing this?

It's like, trigger the kick. Don't edit anything and don't mix anything else. Yeah. And it's honestly safe. And then it has a vibe. But yeah, when stuff is like, like, gent in particular, I don't like any gent bands. No, not at those. Unless you put Tesser acting with Gent, which I think by this point, they've surpassed it.

They're their own thing. Yeah. That sort of, that production that everyone has because they all buy the same plug-ins and the presets. And I know that the musicians, musicians are incredible and that everything's incredible, but I just can't hear past, like, the plug-in presets. No, I know. It's true. Like, that's the one thing that I was thinking of, too.

Like, everyone just, now everyone's, like, on AxeFX or, like, I mean, I guess Kemper isn't really, they may have presets. I don't know how fuck it works, but like, or they've got the, you know, the new, like, Joey Sturgis amps,

or they've got, like, the presets for all of these, like, amp sims or whatever, and it's just everything sounds the same. They use, like,

slate, kick 10, fucking snare 12, 22, and all the shit. It's just like, oh, well,

nothing sounds unique anymore. And it's, yeah, no, I back, I understand that. Like, it's,

and I think when music music is fast, and it has that production, that's when it suffers the most. Because it's like, I don't need to hear the Power or More snare from misery fucking business

as a blast beat because it's overkill. I would like to hear the real snare maybe and then maybe blend in some Power More snare in the breakdown. But it's like overly triggered, fucking, just even like, I tell you a band that kept it real

and I'm going to say this and you're going to say, actually, they're in my top five because I know this about you. But every one of their albums doesn't have that production because their drummer has always been incredible. And it's close to being too clean, the production, but you can hear it's real.

And that is the Black Dalia murder. Yeah, they're in my top five, 100%. There we go. Yeah, that band is insane. They've never put out any bad record ever. All right, let's do this. Top five Black Dalai Murder albums. Top five albums?

Top five songs. Songs. This is what I usually, I forgot that we both like Black Dalai Murder, because usually I'll do top five songs from a band, but then I couldn't think of one that we both like enough, but I feel like Black Dalia is there. I don't know.

I'm going to have to say a lot of them are going to be off nocturnal, Just because that record for me is the one. Yeah. Okay, top five. And I'm going to do no specific order just because all these songs are insane. What a horrible night, obviously, is up there. Insane song. So sick.

That is so difficult to play. I remember trying to learn that. I actually played a bunch of shows with them. That's sick. There's no way. There's a Viatrophy song that like kind of has an intro like that. Yeah, we ripped it off. Yeah.

I remember hearing that on Viatrophy just being like, oh shit, that's sick. Scenes of extended peril. Yeah, we ripped off that song. And in fact, we gave the producers. The producers were Dan and Justin from Sixth, who produced that album, the Viterf album. We gave them Nocturnal as our reference. different. Nocturnal and I think a cult of lunar album for the like ambient bits.

Nice. Yeah, that's tight as fuck. Actually, watching Shannon Lucas at the furnace in Swindon, uh, when Viatchfi played with them and the ocean. That was the lineup.

The Black Darling murder of the ocean and Vyathevichy. Um, watching him was actually game changing for me in terms of like wanting to get good at blasts and playing fast because the man is a freak. That's, that's the reason why. I started playing like death metal and like blast beats like just hearing

I remember like it's nocturnal I think before I heard my asthma and just hearing like the intro of everything went black as the first track me just going oh like this is this is what I've been wanting to hear this is the thing this is what I've needed

and then like watching videos of Shannon Lucas just rip drums is, I remember doing that for hours. I do that on, I have like the DVD of him in the studio or whatever, and I would just like watch that nonstop just being like, look at this fucking guy drum. That DVD fucking rules. And then there was like the video of him playing.

Yeah. I think playing What a Horrible Night to Have a Curse was like the first thing that came out. Because that was the first album he was on, wasn't it? Yeah, I don't think he played on Myasma. No, the guy on Myasma was a guy called Zach. Yeah. The first drummer in Abigail Williams as well. at the top.

That band's also fucking sick. Yeah, go on then. We've only got one song in. Let me look at the list. Hold on. What are they got on this record? Yeah, what a horrible night. Death Mask, Divine.

That's like a pop song. It's not really a pop song, but you know what I mean? The thing that gets me in that is like going from triplet feel kicks in the chorus to just 30 seconds or whatever. Just, God damn it. And the vocal. That's what I mean about it being the pop song. It has like that like the chorus feel

and the yeah it's so good I'd say nocturnal that chorus is insane to a breathless oblivion that's like one that I like I think it's an underrated song

like that is one of the best songs they've ever made in my opinion I think Warborn the song after it is Like really just like chuggy. I don't think it has any vocals, but you can really, yeah. Yeah.

You can hear the Tom's really well in it. It's like, it's great for production. You give me four off that album. You're going to give me one off another album or not? Yeah, my husband has to be flies. Ooh. In fact, this is the second time I mentioned flies on the podcast. Yeah, that.

Because Dan Wilding from Carcass auditioned for Black Dahlia. And that was, I remember listening to that podcast, man, I'm like, oh, really, holy shit. very sick that song is mental I feel like okay I'll give you mine I think I can do mine really fucking easily unhallowed

the first track whatever the first real track on funeral thirst yeah yeah particularly we played a festival with them when they did the 10 year anniversary and they played it with

obviously Alan playing drums who was a freak as well Oh, yeah. And it was just amazing to see that song live. And I think they even played it faster than what it is. Oh, my God. And I kind of liked it when they had that sort of like breakdown stuff. Yeah.

Then on my asthma, I think I would go, built for sin and I'm Charming. Yeah, I respect that. In like 2005, there was not a band in metal, in like metal core, that didn't try and rip that off. I'm charming. There's a Bring Me the Horizon song with and I'm Charming riff in it. There's a Viashvian song with

and I'm Charming riff in it. The Bring Me the Horizon, the first full length album looks like the front cover of My Asthma. Like they were insanely into that band. I've got quite a lot. I would say maybe. No, I'll go those two off that album.

And then I'll go everything went black. Mm-hmm. I've just picked the first song on all of them Everything went black And then to be honest I kind of switched off after Nocturnal Yeah

I think Necropolis is pretty good Yeah deflorade or I don't even know how you say that word Dflore Yeah that's what you say Yeah that record was Still really incredible for me And then I wasn't too into like ritual Or anything after that

Like all the, obviously it's still, like, all the records. And like, whenever I just put on a random song from any record past that, I'm like, okay, yeah, this is definitely sick. But I just never got into those records as much as I did, you know, my asthma nocturnal and deflurate. Those were the top three for me. In fact, if I haven't done five, you know, I'm going to put as number five. I'm going to put their fucking DVD as number five. Yeah. Oh, yeah.

100%. What's the name of the normal DVD? There's Fall of All and then there's the one before it. It came out the same time as Deflerate, I think. I know the majesty thing is the... Is that the live? Is that the one? Half of it is live and half of it's a documentary.

Okay, yeah, yeah. That's up there with the Every Time I Die documentary for me in terms of, like, things that I watched when I was becoming a young musician that had aspirations of touring, and then, like, just made me want to be on tour. Shit happens every time I die, and... Majesty, Black Darling Murder. If anyone is like, you know, 16, 17 thinks they want to go on tour, watch those two DVDs and you will want to go on tour.

And then go on tour for long enough that you complain about not having a drum tech and you have to fucking check yourself at the end of a podcast when you think, actually, I am doing everything I wanted to do. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, as much as like I can complain, I am very grateful for every single fucking day. I'm able to tour. Yeah. Let's fucking, I think I'm going to watch both those DVDs in a minute with my dinner.

And then I'll be thankful. And I think that's a good place to leave it, mate. Yeah, that was a good one. That was a pleasure. Yes, thank you for having me. I appreciate it. That's awesome. Thanks for coming on it.

You actually got requested quite a lot. Someone requested you while I was trying to take my shit off stage the other day. I can't remember where I was. That's when people. decides to request people. They're like, Craig, Craig, and I'm like, yeah, it's like thinking they want to stick or, they're like, you're going to get Kyle Brownie on the podcast?

I'm like, can I take my fucking drums off stage? But yes, it's so weird. And honestly, to be honest, don't stop doing that guys. And also don't stop shouting Grussell because Tom fucking hates it. And it's becoming a real problem. Oh, that's sick. That's so funny. He doesn't hate it, but it is happening a lot now.

And he'll like just look at me and be like, for fuck sake and I'm like yeah because people scream it that's so funny oh my so fucking sick right we're going to pretend to say bye now and then we're going to stay on the phone sounds good all right see you later Craig bye