The Downbeat - Will Putney - Producer, Fit For An Autopsy, END

Episode Date: February 7, 2022

My guest this week is GRAMMY AWARD-WINNING producer and guitarist of FIT FOR AN AUTOPSY and END: Will Putney.

Hello everyone. Welcome to another podcast. Might be a video podcast. Might be an audio podcast. Depends what you're doing. Got a pretty cool guest. He's been on the podcast before. Not in video and in the worst audio of all time with the podcast. So it'd be nice to hear him in high definition. You might be watching this video early advert. Not really an ad, so stick with me. You might be watching this video early because you've got exclusive access on patreon.com forward slash the downbeat, which costs just one pound or whatever that is in your currency. And then you get early access to stuff and you might be able to be able to watch this glorious video. Or you might be watching this later on YouTube, like ages later after the normal people, they're like the good people have seen it on Patreon.

You might just be listening to this on all the normal platforms. Or maybe you've even, maybe you're just wearing a cool t-shirt from www. the downb-e.a-t. Maybe you're just doing that. You're just hanging out doing that. I don't know. Who cares? That's my plugs.

They're all to do with me. No one's given me any money to give you a proper advert. Usually I'll tell you what I've been up to, but I haven't really been up to anything. Just doing this. Just generally doing podcast-y things. My guest this week on the Downbeat podcast, is a Grammy winning?

I was going to say nominated because he's been nominated a few times, but Grammy winner, granddad winner, Will Putney. He's a producer. He's the brains behind fit for an autopsy.

He's awesome band. He's more brains in the band end. He's very fucking. good at everything to do with music and he's funny. No pressure to be funny, Will, but you are pretty funny. I've just finished up the new Strait and the Path album at his abode. We'll talk about that. We'll talk about his bands. We might bring back got goth menu, which if anyone remembers the podcast off menu, I've sort of stolen it and made it about music. So I'll check that they can't really get me for an idea. It can't be called.

copyrighted, so we will be stealing that. Anyway, without further ado, if I can press all the buttons in the right order, it is Grammy Award-winning producer and guitarist, Will Putney on The Downbeat Podcast. If everything works, everyone should be able to hear you right now. What's up, everyone? What's up, Craig? It fucking worked.

Oh, my fucking God. It's so much stress. To set this shit up? Isn't technical shit the worst? It's always one little thing. It ruins your day. It happens all the time. When I was setting this up, it's so boring,

but you must have to deal with this stuff every day. When I was setting this up, Pro Tools was saying it couldn't see my sound card, and it was saying some other bit of software was using my sound card. There was no other software open, and I had to just press buttons until it suddenly worked and then go live to 4,772 people.

Hello. Well, here we are. Hello. It's nice to see you. It's nice to see you. So you today, saw you earlier. Saw you last week to prepare this. Saw you, what, Christmas?

Gave each other COVID? Got COVID together. That was cool. Lots of fun. Thanks for bringing that over from the UK. I actually think, I think it was a little bancled end going to play Tid the season, which gave the tour COVID. We wouldn't have got it.

We wouldn't have given it to you the next day. So I think it was just in New York. It was just a coincidence. We all just got it. Yeah. I feel like... I'm just going to tell everyone you gave it to end. Because no one knows the sequence of events.

Well, now I guess 4,800, however many people do. But whatever. You gave it to end. It's fine. We're cool. With it, just, you know. You know what the weird thing was, is like, I did all the tests to get home, got home, tested when I got home was like, yeah, negative, and then big, big positive.

And then every single friend that I have in the world pretty much got it on the same tour. Yeah, we picked a bad week to roll through New York. Imagine that this tour was a month long. Yeah, that would have been rough. At least we were all in and out and got to get home before it got. bad so yeah super super lucky you got you're in that nice new studio will putney's i heard a rumor if anyone doesn't know will used to track at a little place in belleville new jersey formerly the machine shop then graphic nature then he since changed the operation to his house and a new drum

room which i didn't get to track in i heard a rumor it was too loud and boomy It's very loud. We got construction in there now fixing, not fixing, but quieting up to place. But yeah, we bought a log cabin, which is not an extremely well insulated building because it's just literally log. So from room to room, once we hit a drum, we were like, oh, right, there's nothing in the walls. So now we're currently putting it together. The drum room sounds great. So it's going to be great. It's just going to take a little work. Oh, so what, have you got, I thought it was just going to be for drums. Is there going to be rooms in there?

It's basically Belleville relocated. So all the guys that work at Graphic Nature are going to work out of there, and then we're going to share a drum room like we've been doing. Oh, that's awesome. So the drum room sounds right. The drum room's great. As soon as we walked, I almost cried when we hit a snare drum. I was so excited.

And then I walked anywhere else in the house, and it sounded like I was in the drum room. So I was like, okay, we probably should fix this. Fuck. But, like, as long as the room sounds good, that's how we always start, where it's like everything else is fixable, but you can't make a bad room good. You know, so treatment, isolation, it'll be awesome suit. I thought that with my drum room, I, like, got a kit in there, and I started just hitting it.

And I was like, fuck, this sounds amazing. I was fully going to treat it. And then I put some mics up and was like, this actually just sounds sick. I'm just going to fucking do it. Yeah, I mean, that's the number one thing. I mean, you've seen Belleville. You're aware that it isn't, I wouldn't say, the most luxurious building in the world.

But they hit a drum in there and it sounds good. So it was like, all right, we'll figure the rest of it out. You know what's funny, though? It kind of was, though. The drum room by the end could have been a coffee shop. Do you know what I mean? It was around for so long that initially it looked like a janky old room of like just bits and scaffolding or whatever.

and you can see the beams in the ceiling and fucking dodgy light bulbs. And then the world became, that was what good coffee shops looked like. So actually the drum room in Belleville, if you just stuck a little bar in there, wouldn't look so bad. Yeah, we were pioneering, you know, coffee culture there for years. We have been, so it only makes sense. Exactly. It could have actually, that's where it came from. How are you?

How's your day going? What time is it? it is 11 a.m. I've been up since 5 a.m. because my dog was very sweet, had a nightmare and took all of his legs and then just kicked me and then proceeded to get up and step on my stomach while I was sleeping. That's a big dog. Yeah, so I'm up, you know, so I've had a nice morning, got some worked on. Let's set the scene with this dog. How big is this dog for the people that don't know? Stampy is like a almost a 70 pound pipple. He's very sweet. He's a cuddler.

Is he sweet, though? He's sweet at night and in the morning that there's like a block of 12 hours where he's out of his mind. He's special. When you rescue a dog, you get like a garbage dog and, you know, they come with baggage. He's definitely a special. Isn't it? Do you use that as like an excuse if something happens when you're walking in?

because I use it all the time, even with camera. So yeah, that's the thing. If you rescue a dog and they're bad or you're bad at training them, which is probably a combination of both with my dog, I always just get the pass where I was like, oh, yeah, you know, we saved him, and he's just a little emotionally weird, and that's why he's, you know,

barking at a light bulb and screaming at children. And, yeah, you know, it's a little cover. Barking at a light bulb. I feel like that's not. just a random thing that you said he does that doesn't he he doesn't like hanging lights and any of the glass or ceramic ones where they make like a like a ring like a bell sound to him if you flick them um it's like a trigger for him so it's like the nom flashback happens and i don't know what happened this dog in his past life but he's just there's just a few things that are just normal as hell

that are just the end of the world for him but um you know I got... We're working through it. We're working through it. I got our little chihuahua, obviously, slightly less, you know, psychotic internal. I mean, not even slightly less psychotic. Slightly less, like, dangerous, could be dangerously psychotic. But she wouldn't eat food for the longest time.

Like, we were just like, what is going on? We tried all the different types of food or whatever. She just wouldn't eat it. She would eat treats or whatever, so we just had to just give her treats. Then one day, we put her food. food in a bowl on a carpet instead of on just the normal kitchen floor and she took the food out of the bowl onto the carpet and ate it there and that's the only way she'll eat so it ruins the fucking carpet but what goes on in a rescue dog's life for them to have to eat food off a

carpeted floor i don't know i mean wow it could be worse you know that's what i always say it's like oh little state on the carpet could be baby killer yeah could be mawling children running the streets so i i'd like to think we we lucked out with them depends what kids uh none of it does depend what kids none of this is about music let's talk about music well sure famously talk about music famously you are we've got loads to talk about famously will putney is Grammy Award winning producer. Now, every time I say that, Will sort of freezes up a little bit

because I say it every time, even in just like a high will, how's the Grammy? Yeah, now it's just a goof. But it's like winning a Grammy is obviously cool, but we didn't, I don't care that much. I guess I'm not,

I'm probably supposed to pretend. Yeah, I'm supposed to, I think it's cool to say that, but I didn't even know I won until people texted me. Like I'd kind of, kind of forgotten about it. Because when you lose three times, which I have, I'm like,

eh, that's never happening. So I was just over it and off it. And then we actually won, which is cool. And I didn't even think we, you know, I thought Power Trip was going to win the Grammy, like in 2020, which is when it happened because they were nominated. Riley had just passed. And all signs had just pointed to like they should have won, you know. So it was, I was kind of shocked when we got it with body count.

especially knowing like body count would have wanted power trip to win that year you know like everybody was friends we did a song together on that on that record and um yeah it was just surprising so it was like bittersweet that's why whenever i think about it i'm like yeah it's cool but could have waited a year you know but i'm uh obviously the recognition's cool it's cool because now my mom knows like that it counts like it's better for people you know when you'd say, oh, I play in a band, it's like heavy music.

And they're like, oh, it's like, it's that thing. Now, now my family can take me more seriously. So my one of those was Reading Festival, because obviously I'm from Reading. So you're just anyone that you would speak to in Reading or family members or anything. Like, oh, you're in a band, are you? Yeah. Playing the festival. And then the time that I first played the festival, I went, yes, I am, actually.

And then it was like, whoa. Wait. So you're a proper band, so you're rich. Yes, that's how it works. It goes from not playing the festival to being first on, and that's when they give you a million pounds to be first on. That's not how it works? That didn't work like that for Shrey?

It's working like that now. We've got a million pounds to record with you. No, we didn't. Thanks. If anyone doesn't know what the Grammys are, it's the Oscars for your ears. Is that the slogan? I mean, it should be.

I just come on with that. Then. Oscar's, Grammys, the Oscars for your ears. I wonder if your career will take you to the point where you can host like a proper award show one day. Like you'll be 50, have the most successful music podcasts. And they're just like out of ideas. And they're like, what about the weird guy from the UK? And you wind up on, you know, NBC. And my mom sees you as like a old man.

Listen, there was so many slight offensive things you said in the, there, but the main sentence was that you think I could do that, so it was nice. But then there was a lot of stuff in there, like, weird guy from the UK. I'll tell you this. You've got one of these as well, right? I do. Right. So I can't remember they messaged me about something.

I can't remember what it was. Oh, like, because it was the best podcast award. It was the first time I've done it last year. And then they posted something like, can he do it again? It's like, I don't want to do it again. I want you to give me some money. and I'll talk throughout the whole thing. I'll do the hosting.

Host me up, baby. Yeah. Are you going to become a host? Is that the goal here? This is a Craig interview now. Like, where's the podcast? Where do you see yourself in five years, Craig? Well, I'll tell you this, Will.

There is 7,025 people watching this on Twitch. I don't know what, hello, everyone. Love you. I think, I think I don't. deserve it really don't I I I've sorted this out just put it on another platform I just like doing it I hate

setting up drums I love playing the drums I've employed Gabe to drum tech from now on oh nice because I just can't be bothered to do setting up and it fucks my backup as you know so if I could get paid to talk and then get

paid to play the drums but not get paid to do or just not do any of the stuff that precedes those things, then that would be great for me. Well, I would love it. Yeah. Yeah, it's just like you don't want to do anything, but you just want all the money.

I want to do the main thing, but I don't want to do the bits before it. So right now, what I've got going on, I told you about this before, I've got Pro Tools running the multitrack from what's happening. I've got you on this screen, Zoom. I've got the other screen with the stream happening. everything's being recorded

so that when this finishes I just have to go on to a website and upload it and I don't have to edit anything or do anything because that bit I'd rather just live in a hut than do any kind of I don't know what it is I just don't have the bit of my brain

that's like oh let me just fucking edit this and da da da essentially just give me the glory so what we do exactly that I understand so okay fair enough

we have different maybe Okay, so if I become the biggest producer in the world, undeniably, where it's like, oh, he's the king, you come do the edit stuff for me and Steve. And then if you become the biggest podcast hosts in the world, we come and do all the edit stuff for you. How about we just get Steve to do all of this? All right, fine. Shout out to Steve. He's probably listening. Shout out to Steve's side because he's basically I need a Steve.

and I kind of have a Steve. I have a guy called Simon, who's in the chat right now, who does my YouTube minion work. And what I just want, she just want someone to do all that. Gabe's going to do the drum tech in. Simon will handle the internet. Just let me do what I do best,

which is fucking host and not play the drums. But while you just say, if I've become the best producer in the world, that leads me on to one of my two questions that I have prepared. Okay, let's go. Give them to me. So you are, in my opinion, and in a lot of people in the heavy music industry's opinion, the best producer in the world.

That's very flattering. Thank you. I personally love, and we'll get on to this when we talk about fit, but I think me and you have such a similar musical taste that you just do the things that I would want the band to do. So when, you know, when you listen, I'm listening to a bit of me. music and in my head I like preempt oh imagine if they did this next like like example and you actually do love doing this like imagine if they they flip up a little like a quarter note poly rhythm

for one bar and then come back down or something and then if you've produced the band I'll think it'd be sick of this happened and then it happens and I know I know it's you even if it's whatever band I'm like will did that bit prime We do like a lot of the same stuff. So, and I try to be impartial with just what I like when I'm working with a band, but, you know, you fall back on your habits and tricks. And I'm always going to go towards the things that I think are cool. And they just happen to align with yours. So that's why we work together.

She's fucking awesome. But one of the ones that was like, I like the band already. And then they started working with you. And it just, the album was perfect to me was harm's way. Because I like, I already loved them. And then you did that harm's way record. Post-human? Yeah, post-human.

Was that the first one you did with them? Yep, first one. And it was just, it was what they needed, or what I wanted from them. And it was like, I just know it was you. Yeah, you could tell where our streams crossed, especially with the industrial stuff in that one. It was probably like, oh, okay.

Yeah, that's my guy right there. Yeah, yeah. You've done, you've done, you know, a lot of bands. Is there any, here's my one question out of the two that I have prepared, because I'm a professional host. Okay. Is there any, what's your like, I don't even know the word. What is the word?

But like, I want to say dream, like, put dream band to produce. But there's a, there's a word to say that, isn't there? it doesn't matter professional can a coal band no there's a way better way of saying like the one that you aspire to do

it doesn't matter I'm fucking brain dead I mean I get what you're saying sure no there must be a word Twitch chat hit me up anyway you know what I'm saying have you got who's the number one number one that's tough

give me three then it doesn't have to be an order see it's weird because my favorite bands aren't necessarily the bands I'd want to produce. That's not what I want, though. Yeah, yeah. Wait, hang on, explain why. Explain why, and then don't tell me them.

Well, I think I like a band like, like 9-inch Nails, for example, is one of my favorite bands. But I don't want to produce it because I wouldn't, I like somebody else's brain. It's like, I want to just, I want to be a fan, and I don't want to be on the inside of certain bands, you know. The number one band, this is actually very. easy because it's something that I understand very well and something that I think I could be of service to is Metallica. Has to be Metallica. I will, I will do unspeakable things for that to happen. Because it would be just like unlimited resources, we'd be able to spend as much time as we have. I mean, you saw the documentary, they spent years making records. Like, I've never been in

a position where I have more than six or seven weeks to do an album, you know. And it's like, imagine what I, what we could do if I had this kind of time. Yeah, with just all of the, like, everything at your disposal. It would be the final level, like, fulfilling thing to be like, okay, what am I actually capable of? And it's a band that I grew up loving that obviously, like, over the years has sort of had a mild identity crisis. And, like, now is sort of older and set in their ways. And it's like, oh, I'm a little younger. You could be my dad.

so I have a different perspective on metal and heavy music and I think I could be useful and it would be awesome. So that's the one. That has to be the one. I don't know why that just hasn't happened. I mean, our world is very compartmentalized, like metal and hardcore and the scenes we live in. Then there's like a breakout section of it

where bands grow from this and turn into that. but we we don't exist in the same circles really you know on a business side to like it doesn't like they're probably i'm just not on their radar you know and how could i be like why would i be no i just mean i don't i mean not even you i mean just the just the concept of just in every walk of life but let's take it for this example you're fucking old you're still doing the shit that you're doing you were sick you're not as sick just get someone younger to give you a hand

because they know what they're fucking doing. I think it's like there's certain bands that are open to it and then some that are, there's like an ego thing or they're so set in their ways that it's scary to do something different. Like I've had meetings with bands

that are where I was like, oh, this would be awesome. I could bring so much to the table. And then leaving the meeting going, that's not going to work. Like they don't care about my, what I think could be cool for a heavy record in 2022 or this kind of band, you know.

And it's been pretty eye-oping to see, like, some bands just want to do exactly what they do, then actually don't care, like, what a producer thinks or what their label thinks. That's like, they've been a band for life, they do this thing, that's their release. So you don't get involved. You can't get involved, you know. So the doors just close sometimes before you even have an opportunity, which is, like, understandable because it does produce a lot of great bands. but then you know you have stuff that's like slug it along where you can see the potential and it's

frustrating but you know you got to find the ones that are open to it is there an example you can think of because i can't think of an example in music but then again i don't really know about production that much is there an example of a band that were falling off and that you can think of that were falling off and then they got a producer i mean it's the one that i know because i worked with them and i wouldn't say they were falling off it was just the band had was just they just kind of put it down they had a hiatus forever is body count you know like body count was a band from before i was like even into heavy music this is like one of the pioneering rat metal bands maybe one of the first ones ever to do it you know and uh then they

just hadn't played for like a decade you know at some point they lost some members and um they wanted to pick it up again but they admittedly needed like they were self-aware enough to know like we probably, if we're re-entering this world, we've been sort of out of touch with it, we should probably work with someone who's kind of living in a little more. So that was, I mean, that's the real experience that I ever, that's the one, like,

shining experience I've had with, like, a more veteran band. And, like, it's working good. Yeah, how did that end up? They win a Grammy? Did they get an ear Oscar? Oh, I hate it when you do this. Hate it when you do this.

They got an ear Oscar. They got an it. Well, guess what? Now I'm not going to say, Grammy ever again, Will, but now you're going to hear hear Oscar often. Okay, Metallica, anyone else? Metallica is the number one.

Oh man, imagine how fucking good it would be. It would be cool. There's other bands that, like, just bands that I'm a big fan of, Macedon, Deftone, stuff like that, where they've had, I feel, like, peaks and valleys and records over their careers where it's like, just stuff I really understand as a fan, like where I feel like I am the fan for you.

Like I'm your fan base. I know all your records. I love your stuff. Even the stuff that people don't really listen to, I still understand. So it's like bands like bands like that would be really, really fun and rewarding because I'm up and they're great bands. Like there's not at the core of it,

it's not like anything sucks. It's just taking something that's great and making it even better. You know, so it's like those kind of opportunities are super fun and fulfilling. because you don't feel pressure in the sense where it's like, God, this record's bad, and now I have to make it good, or everyone's going to think I'm bad.

Like, you walk into a room with a bunch of brilliant musicians right off the bat. That style of workflow is really, really fun. Do you think, have you ever had it when, like, you work with a band who you've wanted to work with, or whatever, or you think, oh, they could do with a, you don't have to name the band, that they could do with a bit of production or whatever, and then you just butt heads with, whoever was calling the shots beforehand?

Generally, I've never had a really bad experience in the studio where it's like, oh, this band is awesome, this is going to be great, and then by the end, you know, aside for maybe like one or two records in my whole life, we never really butt heads past the point of just like mild creative differences, you know? But I have had conversations with plenty of bands where before I even got involved, I was like, I'm just not your guy. because what I, like either my vision or the way I work or what I want to do doesn't just align with how they see their band or what they're willing to let go or who they're willing to let in to work on songs. I've talked to one of my favorite bands last year or maybe two years ago and then discovered that like three guys in the band want to co-produce the record and they want to be there for the whole mix and touch everything and like they'll listen to me but they're still going to have three other opinions that then they'll discuss.

It was just this complicated thing where I was like, yeah, I'm just going to hate it by the end. Even though I love the band, I'd rather just hear the record when it's done and be like a fan of the band. Got it. Got it. So, look at this amazing segue here. So in fit, look at that. Look how it's done that. My new thing is drawing attention to what seems like a seamless interlude and making it actually not seemless.

It's not seamless if you describe it. I know. That's my new thing. though. I don't know why I started doing it. I started doing it on the live podcast. I was like hey, everyone, I'm going to tell you exactly what I'm doing it. I don't know why and now it's stuck. But do you do everything

in your band Fit for an Autopsy whose new album Oh What the Future Holds is out now? No, I don't do everything. I write a lot of the material, but I keep my guys involved through that process and then, you know,

I jam with my drummer and work on stuff with my singer. Like the whole, Obviously, I'm heavy-handed on guitar stuff because I'm writing a lot of it and I'm playing it while I'm writing and recording bits. Like, it's sort of the workflow works good like that, but it's still a band. You know, like, we still, everybody has opinions and everybody has good taste and music in my band where I feel like, you know, I don't feel a need to really strong on everything. We like hear any idea. It's always the best idea wins, you know. For my own bands or records I'm producing, like, I just want the coolest idea.

whoever has it, we pursue that, you know. So if it's got like, so there's a debt, let's talk about just the, I'm trying to get into the mind here. So demos, you start, you start a demo, front of back, give it to everyone, and they go, what if we did this? Or are you all writing it together? Yeah, it's more like, I put something together, show to everybody, see if anybody wants to to mess her part, he's concerned about a part, you know, I just like the feedback from my guys because I think generally, if they're all feeling a certain way about something, it's probably an indicator like, all right, maybe we shouldn't use this, or maybe I should rewrite this,

you know, we've had, you know, there's definitely been songs too where I've written some lyrics and then, or I've written a certain melody and showed to them and everyone's like, I don't know about this, and then I've wound up rewriting it, and it's been better. So anytime I get that kind of feedback and I could see another perspective, I could usually improve what I have, you know. Part of the reason why I kind of wish somebody would just produce me. I was just going to say, it's like they're producing you. Yeah, I would, I've flirted with the idea before. And there are like a couple guys that I reached out to that I couldn't get together for this one.

But it would be just like fun for once to be like, someone else tell me if it's good. Like, you get stuck in your own head when you're writing, and I want, I'm, like, constantly searching for somebody where I feel like, oh, I'm on a page of them. I could trust them to actually help make this stuff better. I feel like I would just punish somebody because the way I work. I don't know. That's the thing. It's hard for me to, like, there's pros and cons for all these other guys, you know.

I never really landed on, like, the one where it's like, okay, this is the guy. He'd take all my music and do it. And then the guys that I really look up to from production standpoints or creative standpoints aren't on are just out of this world where they just probably wouldn't even want to do it. So it's tricky. Who watches the watchman? Who produces the produceman? I know.

Maybe next time. I'm going to try something next time. We're going to do something. I want to do something different. Well, like a little co-producer in there. Yeah. I just want to find somebody to fucking help a little. I would love, I would love, I just, I would love to click with somebody where I,

could be produced i've never done it's never happened no one's ever produced me you're all spoiled you get all the you get all the trinkets all the little tricks yeah but you chose that you chose that i know i really i'm not complaining it's it's going it's going good but it seems like it would be fun that's all i see i put you you and josh you've your if you think you're you think something is right there's there's like you can push against you you can push that I don't think this is right well and you will be pretty resilient to one point and like no this is right right shut the fuck up this is what we should do this is what you should do and then it reaches like it's almost like you've got a power bar the will putney power bar where I'm like I don't

think we should be doing this and you're like no we definitely should I don't think we should be then then you go ah fuck it okay whatever you want to do and it's your resistance level is Perfect because now I've done three albums with you and an EP, which will never get fucking released. I know if I get to like half of the Will Putney Power Bar, I'm like, oh, he's actually right. And in my brain, I can go, I could push him and get this where I want to go. But I know he's probably right, so I leave it. Josh Middleton, whenever I've worked with him, the power bar never moves,

which is like, I guess maybe why, I don't know, I mean, Josh is too busy to produce or whatever, but the power bar rarely moves with Josh. Yeah, with me, you have to, I pick my battles. Like, if you want the rack two instead of splash three on the fill, and I think it sounds stupid, I'll say it sounds stupid. But then 20 minutes into the conversation, I probably don't care anymore because I'm like, I'll let them have this one.

So when I actually care about something, the power bar doesn't move. Oh, clever. It's all psychological. Because then I could throw that back at you. Like, dude, I've been doing everything you wanted all day. I'm just trying to get this thing. It's all, I definitely have learned to pick my battles, especially with people who have strong opinions on music. It just helps you, like, kind of muscle up for the things you really want.

That's clever. I was unfair to Josh then. That was, I was thinking about the time what I recorded his solo album. And obviously, that's his solo album, so it's what he had in his head. So, apologies there to Josh. Okay. The new album. Look at that.

Again, break character. Tell everyone where you're going with it. You need, like, when you get into the dual camera, so you can do the character break, Pan. That's clever. I'm producing your show, dude. Come on. Please, do.

Please. We'll get a Steve in here. The, right, so I might be wrong here. Who's doing the clean singing? Joe's doing the clean singing. How long have you been doing that for? I don't know. Five years?

Six years? We started that a bit on the last record. Yeah, but this one's got like a song and everything. Yeah, we did. more, I think, on a song or two this time. We just like it. He's good at it now. He's fucking great at it.

I was like, is this another person, but I didn't have like any notes, so I didn't really know. So we did on the last record, there was an outro song where there was a bunch of clean singing and it was written for somebody else. We're going to have a guest vocalist. Then we decided now, let's do a record with no guess. Like Joe's like, I think I could do it. And I was like, okay, sure, guy who just screams all the time. Yeah, I'm sure I could do it.

Yeah, I'll see you there. And then he did it. And I was like, oh, this is actually cool. And now I'd just rather be our singer than random guest vocal guy, you know? So it's sort of us kind of working on us like trying to write a part for like out of the box for us for somebody else that we really liked turned into like us discovering we could do some of that stuff on the last one. So now on, oh, with the future holds, I was like going into it. I was like, let's just do a song or two like that because I think we. have confidence that we can pull it off a little better now.

But yeah, he definitely did his homework and practiced, and it was cool to put those together. My personal favorite, have you got to put it in this, do you first, what's your personal favorite from the record? Personal favorite. I like two towers. That's mine. I think because it's like the journey of the song. and it was, I like it because it was definitely, um, out of the box for me as far as, like, writing, trying to tell a story in a song. I never really write like that. Everything's, like,

pretty literal with fit or it's got its own little poetic meaning, but this was like actually a story time kind of thing to make a point. Um, I never wrote a song like that for fit. So it was like harder and it's long and there's like hard stuff in it, you know, like it was just difficult to make the whole time it felt like this mountain but then when it was done i was like wow we did something cool this is awesome so that one's probably my uh that one's probably my favorite what's the story i don't listen to fucking lyrics well i listen to the drum no it does matter to everyone isn't me all right there's 10,619 people watching this right now right and i bet you almost all of them aren't drummers so a lot of the concept on the record is like this inevitable conclusion that

the world's head into and I wanted to write a song about maybe just coming to accepting the things that you can't change and it's like hard to write a song like that so I was like what if I built a story around it where it's like what if your past self and your future self could meet each other and what would you say to you in the future would you like warn them of something would you try to correct something that he did or maybe other people did and it's like this little journey of these two people locked in two towers that get out they try to meet and they're prevented from I'm doing it by whatever in the weirdos story. And it all just kind of comes to ahead.

And the conclusion is that you just have to accept things that you can't change. What a fucking smart guy. How the fuck do you get the time to do all this? Wait, at what point in the day? A pandemic. A pandemic is how I had time to do this. If I had three weeks, I don't know. Maybe story time when it happened.

But it was, we had a lot of time this time. It was nice. Everybody's tour. You know how this went for everyone, you know. So I had a bunch of I had a bunch of UK bands actually that were supposed to come here and make records and They couldn't just as you couldn't Who? Who? Who?

I don't know what I could say You being one and then a band that we both know and like very much is another one And I went just mixing that So I had like some downtime I was like I'm not going to book anything I'm just going to mix stuff and I'm going to write my own stuff So I spent more time writing than I ever had. It was awesome. Now I feel like we were spoiled on this where I'm going to have to carve that kind of time out in the future, but it was worth it, I think.

How have you done it previously? Because whenever I'm around you, you are constantly working. Like the person that works the most out of anyone I know. Yeah, I was like only in pockets. Like I would write when I was waiting for recalls for some other projects. Like there was never there's never like dead dead downtime here even when I'm like oh I was off We were still mixing records every day, you know, but it was like I I Decided this time I would just literally make it this month. I'm going to work on fit, you know and that was something that I had never really done ever

It was always like I would I would be squeezing songs in in between projects and writing and then when it was ready we would book time to record but my writing process was always just chaos you know I had a like a lot of laptop in a hotel room for the previous record because I was traveling and do a record and I would just go home at night and write after recording all the day. So I'd ever like had the clear head time. It was always like squeeze it in, you know. And like if you've got like, so do you block everything out? So let's say so we did however long we did with you. How long do we do? Two weeks? Something like that. Straight love to fucking. A couple weeks. Will, we'll do this album in fucking 10 days. You're the band that I spend the least amount of time recording.

And that is not my choice, just so everyone knows. Just because we're so good. No, it's Tom Williams having no concept of how time and space are connected. And as the hours go by, you can't complete certain tasks. Yeah, he's like, oh, we're going to wake up at 8. By 8.10, we'll get the guitar sound. We'll get bagels. track from 820 to 10, 40, and I think guitars will be done for the whole record.

Then we'll go sushi and we'll come back and we'll probably get, we'll probably get through like four songs on vocals. So we'll just need like five days and we probably do the whole record. And it's like, okay. And then he sleeps till 11. And it's like, okay. So we've had, we've had, we've been down to the wire before. But we had two sessions this time.

One, one without you also. So it was better this time. We got, we got. Because I wasn't that. On a straight record. No, we were remote. We were trying to. Yeah, we did good.

I think we did good. But so, do you have that blocked out? And then, because I swear that you started something the same day we left. Yeah, it was pretty much on top. Sometimes it's like that. Is that constant? I try to leave sometime. I was squeezing stuff in because everything, the past two years have been crazy with shifting schedules and stuff.

everyone's like rescheduled record plans fall on me to solve sometimes so it's like that was a rescheduled session that i got in and then literally the day you were leaving another band was showing up yeah i mean sometimes it happens like that what uh how many what's your ideal amount of time none of this is written down by the way it's just stuff i want to know uh what's your ideal amount of time to make an album plan out an album for me I like like four or five weeks, six if I can get it for the right band. Depends what we're doing. You know, depends like if I've worked with the band before, what state the songs are in.

It always varies, but no less than four weeks usually has been the motto, and that's worked pretty good. You ever just come straight and there's no demos and you have to write everything? Yeah, it's happened. I wouldn't, you know, not everything, but I've definitely walked in. into a room and then realized that a band wasn't prepared enough and had to deal with that. You know, it's been better. Like, earlier on, you take what you can get. I'm trying to make a name for myself and I just need to stay working.

So I was, you know, pulling some pretty wild hours with some pretty bad bands at the time. But I feel like now I'm a little spoiled where everyone kind of has their shit together. I will raise you that, though. when me and Tom are writing and we can't figure out how to get two sections to go together, it will go like this. Okay. Should we try this? Nah, it didn't work.

Should we try this? Nah, that didn't work. We'll do it. And it's fucking, we do, not that we rely on you, but it's just so good to have you as, like, an extra member of Straving the Path when our brains are just maxed out and we're like, I got no fucking idea what to do. I remember the prime example being the song only death is real.

We had the beginning of it. And we didn't know what the fuck. I think we had the beginning and maybe the chorus and we didn't have it and we were like, what the fuck are we going to do? We didn't have anything and then we brought it to you. And then you were like, what about this? Yeah, I mean, it's definitely my favorite part of the job.

you know, like having a good idea and being like, all right, make it work now, you know, or solve the little puzzle in it. It's the fun part about making music to me. It sounds like it's not as fun for other people, but it's the part I like. You know, I like that challenge because that activates whatever part of my brain that keeps music interesting to me, where like the recording side of it is the redundant side. You know, like tracking is punishing now. but like writing and creating music and like that side of it is the exciting part.

Do you ever get like burnt out with music and have to be on your game? It's happened, sure. When we get overloaded with work, there's this like thing that keeps happening where people will say, hey, you want to mix my record? Yeah, cool. Okay, it's due January 1st, cool. Yeah, yeah, when do I get the files? November 1st. Okay, cool. The files. up December 15th. Oh, it's still due January 1st, though. Sorry about that. So I've been like, that stuff, when that happens with multiple projects and then my schedule is all over the place and I have five things to do at once, like that burns you out because you try to stay organized and now you're like there's pressure involved with making music that never feels right.

Like it's never the best place to do anything music related to me. I don't like working under pressure when it comes to any form of this job you know some people do well under pressure like brandon from counterparts doesn't write a single lyric until it's the last possible minute and then that pressure like motivates him to write to get cool stuff done you know and uh it's it's so frustrating to me and stressful but it like the end product is good and that's the process now but i don't work like that like i try to keep it organized and get things done so when it's all at once it's really um that's when I'm like, I'm pretty over this now. I can't even imagine.

Like, I've got one band that I do, and my burnout level is insane. Like, the amount that I hit burnout, and I don't even fucking do anything. And you're out there like, got a band producing fucking, I've got two bands, producing, you should have three bands,

but you haven't mixed the thing that we did. We'll have three soon. I've actually got a speech of, about that i got spoke to someone today about something it's this is not for this is not this is for later um what is the track after i keep wanting to say the twin towers right now that's a different thing yeah i wouldn't say no we didn't write that song the twin towers extreme music song has been taken by sworn enemy it's a fantastic song if you don't know sworn enemy is go look up to nine 11 sworn on me so I will never touch a 9-11 related musical piece after that so you just did

lord of the rings instead do tell us yeah you know it's funny I forgot that that was a thing until it was done and then it was too late I was like ah damn it that's gonna someone's gonna say that and yep everyone's this about lord of the rings like yeah I wrote a song about lord of the rings yeah there's an elf and he walks around and there's a spooky guy and then I got this animated video done And then I looked at it. I'm like, this is fucking Lord of the Rings. Goddammit. Do you know what my best catch of all time was?

And I'm not going to say what any of it is, because I wasn't even there, but there was a lyric from on the New Strait album. We can't talk about the name or anything or the song or anything. The lyric was from an, like, accidentally, because none of you guys even knew the song was accidentally from WAP. There was a lyric from

fucking Wap in the song and I was like listening back and I was like, guys, we can't do that because of this song and what do you mean because of this song? And then it played the lyric and it was like, oh, good catch. Like, that's the beauty of being able to send stuff back and forth even though you're not here. Yeah, it happens from time to time, but I try not to copy anybody.

Oh, I'm not saying you copied it on purpose. It's just, it was a normal sentence, but because that song was the biggest song in the world right then, like the two towers, doesn't have to be about fucking whatever, Lord of the Rings. Yeah, of all the songs, too, because that song, to me, there's like one line in that song. So it's like any other, the fact that you knew another lyric from that song besides that hook, I was like, that's impressive. Because that thing was, I bought that song quite a bit. I'm glad you caught it because that would have been a weird thing to do it. That would have been,

it would have been absolutely terrible. And we're known for putting stuff from movies, popular culture, you know, there's stuff, there's a fucking from a meme on this next record. Sure.

We had a good Adam Sandler run for a while. Everyone would have just thought we'd done it on purpose and that would have been cringe. That would have been. So when, in the two towers, when Joe goes,

One ring to rule them all. That's not about that. Anyway, where I was going with this? The song after it, something about hate, professional. Higher level of hate.

That's the best bit for an autopsy song. Oh, I figured you would like that. Because there's poly rhythms and drum stuff and it starts to switch on. Yeah, that's a Craig song. Do you know what it is, though? I'm glad you like it, though. I love it.

Do you know what it is? is it's actually the riff. I don't know what's happening. What's happening with the riff? There's a couple, it's a weird bendy trick where you hit the note. The note that it starts on is not the fret that's being hit.

It's bent like way out. And it's hard to nail. But it's like it moves in a weird way because I'm not actually moving, I'm not playing frets. I'm just bending notes up and down to other notes. I've never heard it. That's like a very basic way to describe it, but...

I've never heard anyone do that, except I guess bleed. But it's not the same pattern or whatever. Bleed has a bit where it goes... It goes up, but he doesn't do anything. Do you know what I mean? Yeah. That's the only other, like... Not trying to say it sounds like bleed, but I've only heard that happen twice in metal.

Maybe I don't listen to enough metal. But the riff, I know it's a poly-rhythm-me song that I like. The riff, I was like, this is fucking insane. Yeah, I did it by accident. I was like, oh, that was cool. How do I make that apart and then figure it out? What, were you just jamming? And then you did it.

Yeah, it was literally just accidentally hit a note too hard and bent it too hard because I'm not very good at guitar. And then, like, it came down a certain way where I was like, oh, that was cool. And then I just found a way to play it where I'd, like, cover eight frets with two bends. Yeah. A higher level of hate. Anyone who's listening, that's what it's called, right?

Check that song out in particular. would the two towers is probably the best the best song but i don't care about songs i care about cool things i think shiny things a higher level of hate is more squatable so it's on the gym it's on the gym playlist it was it was deadlifted to yesterday you are absolutely correct my friend there you go got um have you ever because if people don't know this have you ever do you play do you play your shows with fit ever i haven't in a while i mean i used to we did the early all the earlier touring stuff i did but i like fit started when i started producing records basically the same time like the first demo was like one of the first things i ever recorded you know so like as fit

grew so did my producer career and then it hit this fork in a road where it was like i actually can't do both things like couldn't tour full time and make records full time and it's like i you can so I was like what do we do like do I quit you want to go replace me do you like at that point I was like I found the calling where it was like making records is what I'm going to do till I'm like till I can't hear anymore you know or or I'm over it you know one of the two which ever comes first but the we realize like I realized like early enough to be like all right a lot of tour opportunities are coming up I don't want to hold the band back I know it's going to be an issue like I know it's going to affect my life after the band.

And it was like, at the time, we didn't think the band was going to be a full-time career band. So I was like, we started this thing for fun. We're doing some tours. Now we're doing cooler ones. And now there's like international stuff. And I was like, I never thought we would do that.

And I'm not really a like live on the road kind of guy. So I was like, you know, I talked to them. They were like, well, just stay involved. Because we started the band together. And then we'll just get another, we'll get a fill in, you know. So I was playing. some shows then there was like filling guys we were going through i was doing what i could and then subbing myself out and then got this point it was like what if we just added a guitar player who's

really good who can just be a third guy the band could always tour as a five piece we don't have to look for fill-ins anything like that and um and we found him and it's from like one show with him it was like oh good i never i'm never going to play show okay like he's great you know and it it made my uh It took all that stress off of like, how do I balance these two things? Because Tim's a road dog dude, like loves being on tour and I'm the guy that likes the studio. So we just solved the problem with another person. And yeah, since then, really since Tim's been in the band, I haven't really played any

shows with them. So when does that mean when you're writing, you can be like, oh, that was hard? It's staying. Do I mean? Dude, me and Tim always joke because he'll be like, dude, this part like, come on, man, this sucks. Like, you play it.

And then I'll play it. I'm like, I can barely play it. And he's like, yeah, see? I'm like, yeah, but it's not my job to be sick at it. That's what you're like with me. That's what you're like with me when there's stray demos.

And I'm like, come on. And it's the fucking Dillinger blast all over shit. And I'm like, come on. You're like, oh, if you can do it once, then it stays. And then I do it once. No, well, we try to,

I try to write stuff. Tim is much better than me. So, like, if it's hard for me, it's, like, medium for him. You know, how people have, like, Thai spice levels? Like, I tap out first. So if, uh, if, if I don't write stuff that's impossible, it's just, like, not the style of our band. It's never, I'm not just, everything we do on the record, aside from, like, the little bells and whistles ambient layer thing, you know, like, the core of the band is designed to be able to be executable good live. So, like, we never really cross that.

line where it's like, oh, now it's impossible music. There's just like little challenging bits and that's what you got to practice, you know. Okay, okay, okay, I like this. What about, so the band that you do play, hang on, well, well, before I absolutely forget, so where can people not see you play for fit for an autopsy? Because people can not see me on tour now until February 12th in the US. and then apparently it looks like Europe's looking good for May. So we'll be in Europe and the UK in May. And then waiting to announce all the other territories once things start opening up,

but we have plans for Mexico, South America, Asia, Canada, Australia. So for all the international downbeat podcast listeners out there, will be near you soon. There's a lot, man. Don't fucking make fun of me. There's a lot. Okay, so the other man, where you are not, known to stand away from your computer and play the guitar.

Yeah, I play stand-up guitar in end. Sick down guitar and fit. You play a stand-up guitar like a cello. Yeah, it's upright, took the frets off. We're having fun. We're being creative. What, um, where, like, how did that even start? Because is that just some darkness that lives in you?

So Will plays in another band called End, um, with Brendan. Murphy from counterparts. What's Greg from misery signals, the wrist taking, bunch of stuff, Shilude. Everyone was in Shilu, but Greg was in Shilu. Shilu doesn't count. What's Stampey from? Shirelude. No offense to Shirelude, but everyone's been in you. And then you got Billy Rimer, Dillinger. So it's kind of a super group. How did it start? Why did it start? Go. Uh, it started because 10% darkness inside me, uh, friendship, because these are all my darkness and friendship don't go.

Friendship's important. Yes, it does. No, it started with, be honest, it started with darkness. If you were super happy all the time, do you think I'd be like, dude, I love talking to Craig? No, it would be so punishing and terrible. You're right, actually. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, so, um, everyone in and is someone I had like known or worked with.

previously where I knew they liked this style of music but weren't doing it in a band you know like me and Brendan had always talked about these kind of bands and all the stuff from Canada that he grew up listened to and all that kind of power violence and grind stuff that like we weren't really doing you know but everybody just liked it so I was like I wanted to do a band like that because I saw fit going into more of like a proper metal band and all that kind of all that more extreme crazy stuff that lives in that world that I was forcing into fit, I was starting to realize, like, these aren't making the songs better. I'm just trying to, like, satisfy myself, but I'm writing crappier songs. So it's like, what if I just focused it and had another project where I could

just get all this out of my system? And, yeah, I just hit up all these guys and was like, I want to do this thing. If, uh, I know you don't know all the dudes I'm talking about, like, maybe joining or playing, but like, you know, of them and their projects, but like, if I could put this together, would you do it? And everybody. said yes so like the first day that everybody met was at the studio to start writing and recording a record so it was this weird like form a band from people i just knew it was like oh this is going to work like this guy's got this thing going on he's got this skill set like everybody like and everyone's just like cool and i knew it would get along you know and um we wound up yeah that's how it started

and it was just for fun same same scenario like i didn't think I didn't even know if anyone would like I didn't know how it would go you know how these go with like bands forming these little mini groups and I didn't I had no expectations of it other than I just wanted to write that stuff and me and Greg begged out a bunch of songs and it was pretty well received and we decided to take it like a little more seriously I guess so we've we're actually going to like tour now we have planned to do stuff around everyone's schedules so it's been uh it's good it got it got it got all the that out of my system. And now

where N sits and where it sits, they live in two different spaces and I feel like both bands are better because I can do both projects. Nice. What album is End on? We have one EP and a full eighth, yeah. Is that it? Just an

EP in a full end? That's it. Pretty new. Pretty new. Wait, there's another No, that's it. That's all it is. interesting very interesting um

and ends you got some shows i do we're on tour in march in the u.s and uk and are you going yeah so i play the end shows because it's way less it's way more part-time it's so when we schedule and stuff

it's all the guys that are in and are doing it so it's uh it's limited but i can do it and it's fun does anyone in fit for an autopsy get jealous? No, I think they're just stoked. I honestly, I think all of it, it helps all of us, like, because it bridges these, like, little roads between all of our bands. Counterparts fans find fit, and end fans find counterparts, and then they find fit. Like, so it's been this thing where,

like, I think just being involved in multiple projects has just helped everybody. Okay. just the final thing on your two bands before we move on that's a little thing that I like to do which is imagine imagine you know the lovely Marissa is not not a thing and you've got a new squeeze right and you're at their their family house it doesn't even you know it could just be that maybe you haven't met

Marissa's parents you're at their house and there's a oh it's christmas dinner and there's an older brother right and they go what does your band sound like right so yeah see i love watching people squirm oh that's the worst i just always go to metallica because they know okay so this this this is where we go from here though because my concept with this is right how we got how many people we got watching about 13,776 people watching now that is like a christmas dinner where there's 13,776 people there. So what we've got is the mum of the Christmas dinner, one of those 13K, saying, what does your

band sound like, right? And you've said Metallica. Then the older brother at the Christmas dinner goes, oh, what? Like sort of injustice for all Metallica. So then your ears prick up. You're like, okay, this guy might know what he's talking about. So where do you go from there? Because he doesn't sound like injustice for all mataka.

Yeah, then I'll go, do you mess around any death metal stuff? And he goes like cannibal corpse? Yeah. Yeah, so if I get, if I get something back like that, like, oh, yeah, cannibal or like, if he says suffol, like, and doesn't say suffocation,

like then I'm like, oh, we're in and now I'll say it. Yeah, this band is kind of like, you ever, you know, it's like in tune, but it's like power violence that's mixed with this. And that this one's like, we borrow from like early morbid angel. We do this and that. That I'll just pun.

him with it but if he's like oh yeah no that stuff's like too crazy for me then I'm like oh no that's cool you probably wouldn't like our stuff and I'm out yeah is it like this so is it like the screaming stuff and then you would just say okay you're not gonna like it it's scary yeah I got a similar a similar vibe there the I think death metal is the Bridger that's like the I'm getting past like the superficial I know the big four guy because if he could respond with anything death metal related then you could maybe talk to him about extreme music.

Yeah. But if it stops at, if it stops at Metallica, it's good to just like, you could feel that out with that question. Would you class, would you class fit as death metal, if you were? It's a little everything. It's the kitchen sink. What are you putting, remember one MySpace had three genres? Yeah, I guess we do death metal, metal, and then probably whatever, the least offensive one is.

we like to say progressive I'll just say you're progressive we call it post death core how's that sound sounds fucking terrible if I'm on it's with you yeah that's fine that's fine

I'm not I don't like it but that's what we call it now but I mean I love the concept I love the concept of that yeah that's why I like fit I'm a death court kid I like a breakdown

I like a fast bit yeah us in die art we're trying to coin that like a few years ago and then we realized that was a terrible idea and stop

what post death court I remember when despised icon had a t-shirt that said Death Metal Core Nice I had that t-shirt I'm sure you did

Yeah fuck I had the t-shirt Yeah I think We came from that world But I feel like now when I hear our band It sounds so distant to what Like that current scene is That when people ask me I'm like I don't know what's like an aggressive metal band

Not knocking any There's actually a lot of new death core that's pretty cool right now i love it's all great in the gym we just don't i just don't think we sound like that genre no that's why i asked like it's fuck you couldn't even say like extreme metal because that makes me think of like carcass it's just metal it's just all the stuff like you can just listen to it to it and figure it out for yourself man it's whatever you want it to be bro i don't believe in like stereo like being in a box you know i'm an artist Don't try and pigeonhole me.

Bucket list. That's what I wanted to say earlier. Bucketlist, bad. That's just popping your head. That's how my brain works. That's crazy. Okay, what we're going to do. We're going to do some questions from the Patreon.

Patreon.com forward slash down because some of them are good for once. Sometimes they're really, really bad. No offense, because these people give me money. So, some of these are, you're going to have some, this is great. sort of insight here. Look at his arms are up for the insight. Ready. Fireway, patron people.

So, this is from Pete Barber. Not a barber, I imagine. Just a pretty name. You don't know that. Don't assume his barber identity. I can see his hair. All right. There's going to not a barber.

I can't actually see his hair, but that was funny, wasn't it? So, my band records and releases all our music independently. What's the best way for us to start taking our mix quality and overall production to the next level? Well, if you do everything yourself, you get to control it all, but you're only as good as you are. So you have to be honest with yourself. Am I good enough where I'm going to put the hours in, learn, go through the trial and error, like really invest the time commitment that comes with producing and

mixing and getting good at it because you only get better by doing it like most professions in this sort of creative world. So is that you or if it's not, find the person that you like because if you're not going to do it and you really want your music production value to go up and not suffer, you have to admit to yourself like maybe somebody else is better suited for this. So you do it or you don't? Let's assume, I'm going to do a little bit of assumption here. Let's assume, what's the best way of start taking our mix quality overall production? Let's assume they think it's the fucking shit, right? Not saying it isn't.

Let's assume they think it's the shit. But how do we take it to the next level? Is there a... How would you get someone... I actually want to know this now. Well done, Pete Barber, who isn't a Baba, who might be a barber. Is there a place where you could get someone like yourself or anyone? Does anything exist where you can...

you know, be, ask for advice from a pro. Yeah, I think like there's a good wealth of recording and mixing classes. And generally people are pretty accessible aside from a handful of guys. Like, I talk to kids all the time online and they ask me, how do you do this? What do you do for that? And I don't mind answering the questions because 18-year-old me would have punished me today anyway with the same kind of question. So I do understand that stuff. you know um but i think yeah you i mean aside if you're the if you think you got it and you're

putting the work in and you feel like you hit a wall the best thing you can do is learn from people who's work you admire and then so seek them out see if they need help with any projects punish them ask them questions buy their stuff like punish me we were saying just yeah i mean there's no other i mean that aside from doing it yourself that's the fascist lay to target what you're actually trying to do. That guy does a thing. I want to figure out how to do that. Talk to that guy, you know. Advanced evolution. Yeah, maybe he doesn't sit down and teach me, but maybe he can point you to the thing he learned from. And like, you follow that, you follow those breadcrumbs

by commerce communicating with the people whose work you want to, you're interested in. I would also say, not really your world will, but my world, as we're on it right now, a fucking great place to get advice from people provided they're on the platform from people that you like actually believe in or people that you want their opinion is Twitch because you can have your you've got your Twitch Prime sub right you don't even pay for that your mum and dad have paid for that whatever Jeff Bezos is paying for that

then what you do is you come into someone's chat this happens to me all the time you come into someone's chat and you subscribe which didn't actually cost you any money then I got paid for that and then you hit me with a hey can you check my band out there's no way I'm saying no right and then and people do it's a Tom all the time because Tom does like a new music Friday

and provided the person you do it to is pretty honest you're gonna get some good feedback that way when people just going like you might think your mix is incredible and then you drop into say let's say Tom from Stray's new music Friday hey man can you check my band out and he puts it on and he's like, whoa, the guitar sounds terrible.

So then you know, like, you're going to, you can get, he might not say that, but you're going to get that, like, in industry, like, uh, opinion without being super, super former. That was a great question, Pete. Pete Barber. Pete Barber. Pete Barber. Who might not be a barber.

Um, right. Some of these I've already asked because I'm an absolute professional. there was one more really good one which I should have already had so I could do it quicker but I haven't um in order

great Oscar Baker is he a baker we don't know he couldn't be a baker there's no profile picture so all your all your subs are just trade professions asking questions I love it

Oscar Baker isn't a baker might be a baker might be a barber uh in order If Pete Barber's a baker and Oscar Baker's a barber, I'm going to lose my fucking money. Find out, absolutely. I will find out. In order, what band member tends to be the least annoying to most annoying to work with out of drummers, singers, bassist, guitarists?

Basists are least annoying. Then it goes, drummer... Look how quick this is. Guitarist singers. Singers are the most annoying all the time. Not all the time, but when someone's really annoying, it's usually the singer. And then drummer and guitar interchangeable level of annoyance. Depends who's the main songwriter. It depends who's the crazy one. It's always different. No basis has ever punished me.

But you haven't recorded Dream Theater. For a reason. Yeah, that's true. Because they won't return my calls. No, but I'm sure it's different. It's different all the time. Singers are the worst, though. That's not different.

I mean, that's universal. that is a universal um like i would say this and the problem is right it's just something no offense to anything out there but yeah this isn't please don't take offense you're all terrible in your own special way but it's what makes you good exactly there is something in your mad little brains that makes you want to stand in front of everyone else in front of loads of people and make noises at them. Whatever the switch is flicked in your head for that, unfortunately, makes you terrible to be around.

Without any exceptions, I would say every single I know, and there are loads of them are my best mates. They've got that one thing. I know some, there are some that are fine, that are normal. Some of them are normal. A hundred percent normal? No. No, see, there's none.

No. I'm checking them. off as I go. Yeah, they all have their own little thing. There's none. And whatever that thing is, the switch, even though I'm a drummer, I've also got it, hence the podcast, right? A little showboating little pony man. I've got it and that's why I'm also mad. Also the chaotic mental thing, issues that happen there too. Exactly. And, you know, it's to answer your question, Oscar Baker, he kind of answered your question there, didn't he? There was the order. And it was, I would agree wholeheartedly.

Although, depending on the type of band, I would perhaps, perhaps put, if there was a guitarist that does the solos. Sometimes they... No, because if I had to pick one, I would put drummers at number two. Because it's harder to record drums than it is to record a guitar. The guitar is like one track, you can get away a little more. It's easier to take shots at it. drums is like it's when it's when it's a struggle it's really a struggle to me like I feel like

working with a drummer who's like got his own issue is is harder than a guitarist generally because it's harder thing to get done right so the start to finish that's a more punishing process you're all the worst I need a new profession I was pretty fucking bad on that last you were okay so you do the thing where you are you are you are good enough to know that you are not good enough. Like there's, there's, so there's the top teeny 0.001% drummer guy that,

like the guys we look up to are like, fuck, he's the best, he's awesome. And they've spent a lifetime of dedication and work, or their God-given, like, ability to just be this world-class,

undisputed, this guy is just incredible at drums. You know what it is, what it takes, who those people are. And you write stuff that can be comparable to people on that level, but it's way more challenging because you're not in the tiniest of the best drummers in the world. So when you go to like perform, you're holding yourself to a standard that's like them. So everything sucks because it's like, I can't, this guy's so good and I'm not doing this.

Like I've seen you're aware of what it takes even though you're like, you're not the guy, you know because I'm not. Now I hate myself and this sucks. But it's also what makes you a good drummer. It's like you understand the instrument enough to know what it should be. You know? The imposter syndrome keeps me going. I actually had that issue with my fucking back when we were recording where the strangest little thing. I had to change my completely changed my bass drum technique.

The two kicks. The two kicks. where I would go toe and then heel to do those. I would do a sliding motion, right? I now cannot do that. There's something that's happened. It's the only thing that's happened. I just can't do it.

I physically can't do it. So now I'm actually, I'm trying to learn heel, toe, which is the one where you do the... The opposite of how I've played the drums for the last 20 years, and that's what this recording session has done to me because I'm terrified of that happening at a show. So it's a bit boring drum geekery for the 1% of drums watching. The drums are great on the record.

Now that we've got to hear it in all its glory, you did great. Even with a broken back. I am very stoked on it. The drum mix will is absolutely crazy. Thank you. I'm glad you liked it. I put a lot of work in for you. Only you.

Well, putting a lot of work in sounds like maybe I didn't do such a good job. even if you did a good job it would still be a lot of work no it was uh like i said even if you did you did you did great and if you played poorly the drums wouldn't sound the way they do there's just no way the tom's sound incredible what kit did we use what kit do we use will we used a walnut one we did we used a tamer walnut birch with a maple kick drum shout out to sam gamble from tamer who provided us with a Maple Tama Star Classic kick drum, which is now ours. I know, it's great.

Well, I bought the Toms because I heard them, and I was like, this is what I want. Paid full price like a mug. Yeah, it's fine. That's how much I liked them, that I paid retail guitar store drum price to have them for this session, because I wanted them. We've got Kyle Brownie in the chat,

saying he can't wait for our drum mix. you're just the king mixing drums mixing drums mixing drums mixing theirs right now as soon as we hang up as soon as we hang up as soon as you hang up you're going to do it what you're going to start with

drums just are you still doing the drum mix how do you mix what's you mixing how do you how do you mix so what is all this I don't want to get onto a fucking hour of talking about that but in order how do you do it I do a lot of it at once

the balance People start, they start solo and stuff, and then what I've learned the way I like to work is I like to put it all together first and get a good balance of where my tracks are before I start touching anything or adding plug-ins or doing anything. I try to get just sounding good with what I have. Yeah, but you've got to have a go, so you press play, what's the first thing you adjust? Well, I just listen, I go, that's loud, that's quiet, that's loud, that's quiet, and I balance the thing where I'm like, this sounds as good as it's going to sound without touching anything but volume.

That's where I start now. And then I'll go, what do I want? I want to hear what? The guitars need to sound like this. Kick drum. Kick drum. Up. More.

More. More. Yeah. So I think there's like, it's like, and that's where it starts. And then I'll like break into drums and bass and see if there's any problems or anything like that. But the little micro details. But a lot of that makes much less of a difference once you get the foundation of

just sitting good. You're pretty, pretty fucking specific about raw sounds sounding great. Like the drum sound that we got on that last record, raw was fucking, like, we- Your drums are very close to being 100% real on this record. Oh! Wild. If anyone, I-

A little bit of sample here and there for, like, the occasional part where it just, like, is an effect, but it's like, they're very, very real on this record. I thought that when I was listening to it, I was like, That snare. If anyone's watching that, what do you mean? Every fucking album that you listen to that's good.

That's samples. All of them. All of them have samples. All of them have edits with the most part. Yeah, I did think that one. And I can't remember what I was talking to you the other day. I was like, part of the problem with being able to hit a drum hard with Will Putney is that he will not want to use any samples.

So you will be busting your fucking balls. Yeah. once I hear what 10 out of 10 is, then it's like, oh, you can't do eight ever again. Yeah, that's the thing. Yeah, yeah. And there was actually some, because we streamed a bunch of it on Twitch, and there was actually a lot of people in the chat who are fucking idiots, by the way, being like, I can't believe this is how you record.

I can't believe this is how you record. And it's like, if realistically, look at the black album, the fucking best drum sound of all time. section by section so you can keep that fucking velocity at as high as humanly possible. We would all love to be able to play. I'm sure someone like Eloy can come and sit and play a stray song from start to finish. You could sit down and play a stray song. I have to live.

That intensity. Right. But it would kill you. So it's like, yeah, sure, we could do, you know, 20 takes of a song or 10 takes or however many it takes. like that where you're literally killing yourself and you're laying on the ground after 20 minutes of drumming at that intensity or we could do like a diverse and then get a sip of water and then not die yeah and then yeah so it's only it's not like it's impossible it's just like well that's just comfortable and if we're going to like spend all the all these hours trying things and changing fills and stuff it's like it's kind of stupid to be like yeah no do it all at once and

play as hard as you can and kill yourself over this. And also, as we've already established, we try and record with you in 10 days. So if we were doing full takes. Look how annoyed he is. Look how annoyed he is. It's the worst. Okay. Okay.

Right. So I got a new concept. I'd got a text from Sam Gample right then. He's not watching, but my drum kid doesn't come in until mid-March, which is annoying because I'm on tour. Anyway. Send it to me. I'll use it. It's literally going to get sent to you anyway

because that's where my gear is. You can use it. Thanks for the drums, Sam. Thanks, Sam. Appreciate the drum kit. There's actually a 14-inch rack tom in there, walnut, which you don't have. And they sound incredible.

There you go. There we go. Anyway, so I've got a new little thing that I stole off a different podcast called Off Menu where they do a guest's dream restaurant, right? what I've sort of stolen the idea I call it Goth menu and it is

basically a dream festival but not just the bands and I don't want a whole line up of bands what we're going to do is a very specific sections of a festival that I'd like to talk about and then we're done for the podcast this is a new thing I'm going to end the podcast with

because I did used to do top five of shit and I ran into issues where people had already been on the podcast they couldn't do another top five and also everyone in the world has a podcast called top fives we've all seen fucking high fidelity anyway so got the got the got the goth menu the got the goth menu uh festival of will putney so what we're going to start with is oh at a festival what is your accommodation of choice i mean my my accommodation of choice let me give you like some

Just like some examples, because, you know, let's assume, it's up to you. Are you playing your dream festival, or are you simply spectating? I'm spectating. Excellent. So your choices are the usual. Camping, RV, hotel, are you got anything, like, fancy there? Now I'm thinking I want to play. Yeah, I'm going to open, N's going to open the festival.

Fantastic. Because I play with End. now and we have fun and we've opened we've opened a festival recently it was a lot of fun so I'll do that and our I want my accommodation to be the scammed green room that we were able to comedeer for the entire furnace fest festival that just happened in September how did you get that what was it there is we played a stage and there was like I forgot the furnace stage and then there was a trailer that was supposed to be a green room and it It said like the something green room, but it wasn't the stage.

It was labeled wrong. And the bands like kind of knew about it. But we had, I don't know how we figured this out. But we wound up with a trailer for us, the like 12 p.m. band that plays on the side stage for the entire festival for the weekend. It was fantastic. Leave our bags there. Brinks of friends there. There were snacks.

They would just restock it for us all weekend. And then like there was the occasional band that would come in that fast. that found the trailer that was playing throughout the weekend but we just had the center of the room the whole time it was awesome like what it was just labeled end no it wasn't labeled at all oh you just walked yeah yeah they didn't like put a band list up or dressing room we're like oh i think this is the green room and it turned into a green room and then the next day we're like what if we just go back there there's like nobody there no one's so we just had it again it was awesome was there like refreshments and stuff yeah they kept restocked

in it it was awesome like I said there was a banner too that used it but there was a center area no one knew it wasn't I mean I don't know maybe just could maybe they just didn't care I mean furnace festival was a blast and they were very cool but anyway I want the trailer that's accommodation too and and the location which we have just the trailer goes on the freight and it goes to Australia and we're playing this festival takes place in Australia love it love it okay in Australia my trailer I'm in Australia and get warmed up and it's going on first. Love it.

I love it. Okay, so the next thing in the dream festival, what is your dream refreshment to have throughout the festival? You don't drink. Yeah, I don't drink, so. I mean, I'm a Spindrith guy. Hello, Spindrith. My name's Will Putney, Grammy Award winning record producer, engineer, graphic nature audio,

and I love Spin Drift. I've never seen him reference the Grammy himself, which means a serious spin drift. There's also 15,000. 183 people watching this. And if any of you work for the lovely people at Spindrift, I have an Ear Oscar and I will

market your beverage. Send me a palate. Yeah, but I won't I'm a big Spindrift guy, so I'll probably just have like a little case of these that somebody will just walk around with and when I'm thirsty they'll hand me one. A little case is a dream festival. You can have a massive case. You can have a custom

fridge. It's not going to have someone is going to be there that's going to, if this is the dream festival, I'm not walking around anything. So the guy next to me who's going to carry the spin jervs, and if he runs out, he's going to go get more. The spin drift guy. Okay. What flavor spin drift?

Or you've got a multiple selection? Multiple selection. Currently enjoying pineapple. Oh, who wouldn't enjoy pineapple? It's very good. Yeah, we're in Australia. It's going to be hot. Let's just call it pineapple spin drift.

Okay. So to be still in festival mode, I'm still This is the second time we've ever done this. It'll be smoother by the time I've done this a few times. It's going good. You're doing all right. Thank you, mate. Thank you.

Yeah, yeah. This podcast thing might work. So, okay, so your ideal, like, so your ideal little gem find that you would find at a festival. So by this, I mean, sort of a band that you've found recently that are quite small, that you'd like to, you'd like to have discovered at a festival, maybe. Like a little, a little gem. A little tiny one?

A gem. Yeah. I'm going to go with... Okay, I think this band is little. I'm not sure because they're new to me. I did recently discover them, but they're called LLNN. Have you heard this?

Yeah. Copenhagen band? They kind of remind me of like end if it was like in space. Spacey end? I love it. Band's absolutely great. What does the name mean? Because I've...

I don't know. I should ask them too. I think, yeah, I've started chatting with those guys, so I'm going to start bothering them a little more. Yeah, that's a great choice for that. Yeah, that's that little nugget where you leave and you go home here. I'm glad I found that. And then five years later, you're like, oh, this is one of my favorite bands now. Do you know what my nugget of that was?

You will love this. What do you got? First on the Small Stage, download 2005, a band I'd never even heard of before on the I can't remember what tour it was. It might have even been for the Link, Gojira. Oh, wow. And I walked into the tent, and they played, I was like, this band's pretty cool.

Oh, no, it must have been Master Serious. And they played Backbone, and then they played Remembrance, and the breakdown from Remembrance. I'd never heard it before, and it was, I just literally just walked in. I was like, this is the best band I've ever heard in my life. We had a very similar experience, because I did that at a Lamagachio.

the opening band and I didn't even know I had never heard them and I walked in while they were playing and it would have been Mars era stuff that they were playing too and I was like what am I listen maybe it was heaviest matter or something was what is this somebody's like oh's that band goger and I'm like why is it the best band and they were the best band all day too I think I just left the show halfway through too because I was like I'm good that was whatever that was that's now what I like. Yeah. I got to share that experience with Randy, who had not heard Gojira before.

Oh, nice. When he came on a stray tour for a couple of days and we played Sam Fran, and next door was Gojira and Tesseract. And I was like, man, you've got to come see this band. And then he was just, you know, Randy, like, he was just really stone, just like. And I think we walked in to remembrance as well. That's the bit when you hear that, you're like, wait. Everybody walks into remembrance.

Yeah. I think Paxon, Nacus might have had a similar one too because I know he saw them for the first time and walked in on like an old song. I remember him to tell me. I feel like that's the move. You walk in on remembrance and then you just sold. Maybe they just play it in like, I haven't seen them in a few years. Maybe they just play it like in six, every 60 seconds.

They just do four bars of it in case somebody walks in. They just play the end of it now. I know. They just give you the breakdown with the strobes. Just just a bit that we want. Just give me what I want. Yeah. It's a bit that we want.

Okay, so then I want your like, I want your headliners. I want your big band, but I also want the band on before the big band. So, you know, I want your headlines on one day. Okay. Hit me. I'm thinking. Oh, you've got to decide actually the size of the festival. Is this a download-sized festival?

It's a big fest. Yeah, it's a big fest. I'm in a trailer. The trailer moves. I'm just driving through crowds with my own. green room. Spendriff's park.

I got spin drift guy. Yeah. All right. I would like, okay, there's two bands that I would want to see in certain errors

headlining and I would like the openers to be more of like a slow roll into the day because I don't want to get punished all day at a festival. That's the thing. I don't want to hear 10 extreme bands in a row.

I want like nice music. Okay. And I want instrumental music. I just want to hang out, talk with my friends or in my green room with my spin drift guy. Maybe I'm friends

with the spin drift guy. shout to spin drift. Maybe you actually got like, maybe you got a budget to hire your spin drift guy. So they provided the drinks. Yeah, he's like a buddy that I pay. And he's totally cool. He's getting way overpaid.

It's Steve. Let's be honest. I'm paying Steve like 10 grand a day to be the spin drift guy. He's stoke. I'm like, dude, you can have one too. It's totally cool. I know they told you you couldn't. But like, dude, just crack.

I'm not going to tell him. Yeah. Fuck, yeah. Yeah. So, all right, I'll take a couple of instrumental bands that I like. Warm me up. Let's go. This will destroy you. Yeah, maybe. Let's go Russian circles.

And then let me get, not instrument. Now, let's get some vocals going. We'll get neurosis in there. Playing 90s era stuff. Okay, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, 90s era stuff. But then do they have the projectionist man back? Projectionists? I don't care. You don't care?

I don't care. I don't care. I don't care. I know it's cool. I don't smoke weed. Yeah, I'll take the projectors. We got a big show. give me all the production do yeah do neurosis that that favor give me give me Ices do an oceanic front to back

just for fun snares off in a festival setting I want to hear that yep um wait slow the fuck down for a minute I saw neurosis I think I saw the last the last show neurosis did if anyone didn't know they used to have a projectionist

like film fucking projectionist guy that was a member of the band and he would project shit and I saw them at hell fest um the french hellfest not the fucking early 2000s hellfest and uh i saw him in the rain and it was neurosis and then emperor closed the stage it was fucking awesome spooky okay you're at neurosis but who's your now you've got two big ones i want and you are me and you are going to differ here but that's okay because it's my show so i don't care so headlining this Australian Paradise Festival. It will be Metallica

doing injustice for all front to back. Why are we going to differ? Why is that different? Because you're a black, you're so black album. No, no, no, no, no, no. I'm, at the moment, I'm black album. I'm actually, I used to hate, but the reason I'm so black album is because I hated

the black album until I was about 30. All right, so we're doing injustice for all front to back with the same anger snare tone. Blastin through the PA. Just give it to me. I want it all. I want experience it live in that setting base up

St. Anger's snare tone and Justice Rock Why would you bother turning the base up with I just get it just to just it's just it all happens it's like Mattalka went all right we get it we're giving you the base

but fuck you we're keeping the St. Anger snare and it's just a high entertainment value here this is what I'm going so this is a guy that lives in music and works in music he wants his dream festival to be a comedy experience. Entertainment experience.

Okay. It's an entertainment. And then, and then I just take a nine-inch nail set because they're my favorite live band. What a fucking fest, Will. Yeah, that's it. And there's like, what was that,

seven bands? My band, four openers, Metallica and Nine In Shails. And they rotate. They play a song each. It's like a big dick, like contest between the two of them. They rotate.

Yeah, they play one song each. Imagine going from a, Trent would, be so annoyed. Both bands would be so annoyed, but I don't care, you play one song each, and then you have to be quiet while the other band plays. That's what I want.

I mean, it's your dream festival, you get whatever you want. Then, curtain drops, stage lights, everyone thinks it's over. I love how into this you're. Lights go off, fire,

the curtain, fire, drops, and it's Romstein. And they play Duhast, and then we all go home. This is all, one day. Well, they play, they have their full production for one song. Yes. You're going to take Deutschland as well. Yep. That's, uh, yeah, we'll do Deutschland too. Come on. We'll do Deutsche. It's got a nice intro. That's the song that converted Tom. So I remember I was there. That was

internal. Tom will be there. Like all the friends are there. So we could enjoy, we can enjoy that song with Tom. I can't wait for your festival will. That's it. And we're, that's like a, I don't know, like a seven, eight hour day. And what do you do after? There's what I've got. I'm written down in my very professional goth menu notes. This is definitely, definitely going to stay. I'm stealing this content. I might even change the fucking name so people don't realize that it's not my idea.

What are you doing after the show? You got to eat. You eat after the show. That's the ritual, you know? What are you eating then? Dream festival. Dream food. Fuck, we're in Australia too, so I don't know.

There's that dream food. We're close to Japan. So, a nice. This is the shit. You could fly to Japan for the food if you want post show. We text the order about eight hours before, and they put the ingredients on a plane, and then a bunch of ramen chefs come over from Japan, and they set up, and we drive our little RV green room out of the festival. Spian drift, drinking.

Come on, and they cook us ramen. And that's it. We have ramen. That's it. So I want to do after a shot. It's want to eat, and then I'm done. I want to go to bed. the whole show experience should just be, that's the release.

And now put pasta in my body and then let me go to sleep. Wait, just ramen counter's pot, like, pasta? Noodles, I'm sorry. Yeah. Do you know what's crazy? And we'll end on this little tip. You guys call what we would just call spaghetti. Spaghetti noodles.

I don't call it that. I call it spaghetti. Some people in America call it spaghetti noodles. Italians call pasta noodles sauce gravy gravy and noodles spaghetti valenase which I'm going to make tonight actually Beyond beyond

Will I make a beyond Spaghetti Balinese I'd love to make it for you one day I know you're a vegan It's the best It's the best thing I can make Let's do that that's what we're doing after the show You get a little chef outfit on You don't know it's good you're just taking my word for it

I appreciate it No but it'll be the joy of like You're cooking for me I appreciate that more than random Japanese guy flew in to make me ramen. This is Craig from the Downby, the heavy music award-winning podcast. No here, Oscar yet. He's making me Bolognese. Okay, to sum up, let's go through your festival, and then we're done.

We are in Australia. We are, the accommodation is an RV right next to the stage where it's filled with spin drift, which are being provided by Steve's side, who is being paid $10,000 for the experience, and he is allowed to drink the spin drifts. End is opening. Then we have, this will destroy you. Russians, oh, we have LLNN. This will destroy you Russian circles.

Neurosis with projectionist, although Will didn't bother, wasn't bothered, but I'm well up for it. We got him in. Then, what did we have after that? We should probably have something writing this down. We got Isis doing Oceanic. Ice is doing Oceanic in full with the snares off. Unsatisfied with the snares being off just for that. We then have Metallica playing and Justice for All with the St. Anger snare drum sound.

Base turned up. Then a curtain comes down. No, then 9 inch nails play a full set. Sorry, 9 inch nails and Metallica are flip-flopping. Two stages on the same stage. Two stages. Right next to each other. You have to watch them wait for the other band of fish.

Love it. Watching, watching James wait for Trent and vice versa. Love it. Then, Curtin comes down. Ramstein play Deutschland, DuHast, with their full production, which costs half a million dollars, but they play two songs.

They leave. And then I make a spaghetti bolognese. That's it. That's great. That's a fucking great. The crowd is dogs. The entire crowd is dogs. My list, like my guest list, and then it's just dogs.

No one else. It's Metallica and Ramstein, like you said, in a crazy accent, nine-inch snails and all these bands, and they're just playing the dogs. And then it's just us. And if you, like, the dogs are all friendly, and that's it. That's what I want. This sounds like a fever dream I had when I had COVID. That's the Dream Festival.

Will Putney. And that, you know, that's going to bring us to the end of the podcast, Will. Yeah. Just think about dogs. I mean, I often do. In the silence of like, thank you. And then it's just dog sound. It's all I want. I want a festival with dogs. And like sincerity of the bat, like James Hetville, going, thank you, baby. And it's just dogs. Just dogs. All right. That's going to live with me for a while. That was fun. Thanks, Craig. I'm so glad that you had an excellent time. I need to figure out,

what order to turn everything off. I'm going to stay on stream for the next 16 minutes because I'm still on the front page. I'm going to milk this little cash cow. We'll get some subs in maybe. Anyone want to give me some money? I'll put this on all the normal platforms. Go and check out Fit for an Autopsy on tour.

Go check out End. Go check out the new Fit for Autopsy album of What the Future holds, particularly check out the tracks, two towers and the track after it. Something about hate. A higher level of hate. You got it.

I know the song. I just don't know the name. And that's it. I'm going to end in this order. The stream's staying around. I'm going to say goodbye. You will. I'm going to stop Pro Tools

and I'm going to be back to the stream. Okay. All right. I love you, buddy. Have a lovely day. Take care, man. Bye. Boom.

I'm still here.