The Downside with Gianmarco Soresi - #148 Poop In the Urinal with Jimmy Cash

Episode Date: July 11, 2023

Comedian Jimmy Cash shares the downsides of both your parents being drug addicts, getting a 98% on the janitor exam, cleaning poop out of urinals, women’s restroom graffiti, your dad getting arreste...d for stealing cafeteria food, and your mom sleeping with your sponsor.  You can watch full video of this episode HERE! Join the Patreon for ad-free episodes, exclusive content, and MORE. Follow Jimmy on Instagram, YouTube, & TikTok See Jimmy in a city near you: https://www.jimmycashcomedy.com/#schedule Follow Gianmarco Soresi on Twitter, Instagram, TikTok, Facebook, & YouTube Subscribe to Gianmarco Soresi's email & texting lists Check out Gianmarco Soresi's bi-monthly show in NYC Get tickets to see Gianmarco Soresi in a city near you Watch Gianmarco Soresi's special "Shelf Life" on Amazon Follow Russell Daniels on Twitter & Instagram See Russell in Titanique in NYC! E-mail the show at TheDownsideWGS@gmail.com Produced by Paige Asachika & Gianmarco Soresi Video edited by Dave Columbo Special Thanks Tovah Silbermann Original music by Douglas Goodhart Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Starting point is 00:00:00 Hello, Debbie Downsiders. This is Gianmarco Cerezi. We, look, here's what happened, okay? We recorded a bunch of episodes, and some people canceled, some people moved, blah, blah, blah. Suddenly I looked at the thing, and I was like, oh my fucking God, it's like eight straight white cis men in a row. And I try to be good. I want to be good, and I said, well, all right, we got to mix it up. We got to, all right, we'll record this now. We'll move this to later so we have some space. We'll mix it up so you don't have to hear just eight guys talking about cancel culture in a row, and it did not work out in the sense of this episode, we make several references to how excited we are for the upcoming taxidermy episode, which I know you've heard enough about already, but it's only for a little.
Starting point is 00:00:55 And I promise it's some new stuff. And then it's such a great episode. We're not going to do this again, okay? If I fuck up the booking, we'll just deal with it maybe it'll be 50,000 women in a row who knows but thank you for listening you know ignore the mouth stuff
Starting point is 00:01:14 pass forward five minutes but it's fun and that episode got fucked anyway so I want you to get everything you can from that experience we have so many great episodes coming up Russell and I are about to be at Just for Laughs. It's a huge comedy festival. It frankly feels like a mistake that they let us do a show.
Starting point is 00:01:32 But if you are in Montreal, please, please go see that show. It is on July 26th at 2.30 p.m. in Montreal. We have so many things coming up. Thank you for being a Debbie Downsider. If you haven't joined the Patreon, just join the Patreon, even if you just want to support. You know, I had a comedy friend. They said what a lot of podcasts do is they put the first hour of their episode
Starting point is 00:01:58 on the main feed, and then, like, at the end, they go, if you want to hear the rest, join the Patreon. And they told me, they said, oh, this is so effective. It boosted my Patreon subscribers. And I said, fuck that shit. I don't want to be splitting up my art to force people to doing it. But who knows? I could someday if the Patreon doesn't get moving.
Starting point is 00:02:23 So please check it out, patreon.com slash downside. Thank you for listening. Thank you for sharing your complaints. Email me any this has got to stops if you want us to talk about them on the show. The downside, wgs at gmail.com. And I'm about to fly to motherfucking Fort Wayne where there are zero Debbie Downsiders,
Starting point is 00:02:44 except for me. Enjoy the downside. Welcome to the downside. My name is Joe Marcos-Horazi, and I'm here with my co-host, Russell Daniels. Hi, Joe Marcos. Wow. It's hot in here. It's hot?
Starting point is 00:02:59 I just noticed a little bit. Yeah, the AC is behind the fridge. It's a lot to turn it on. We don't have to turn it on today but i'm saying i'm saying it now because summer's coming and we will have to figure this out at some point you just gotta start wearing tank tops like me no okay uh i just hired a task rabbit to install an ac in my place really and why what do you mean? What do you... Do you always have... Do you think, like, just get Tova to do it, you mean?
Starting point is 00:03:28 No, but, like, it's... You just... I remember your AC. I don't remember it being overly elaborate. We just got a better AC for the bedroom. Oh, okay, okay. And it was one of those task drivers you pay them for an hour. You're worried about it falling out. Oh, horrifying. Yeah, okay. I'll kill someone. I'll be the first to do it.
Starting point is 00:03:43 You know, I was in an apartment once when it happened, but it fell into an alley, so it didn't hurt anyone. I didn't do it. It was one of my roommates. How far up? Two floors. Jesus Christ. That's enough.
Starting point is 00:03:57 Jimmy, do you install air conditioners? I just close the window on them. I don't get technical. Usually just no screw. I installed it in my old apartment and I kept having nightmares truly of where I woke up. I remember having this nightmare once
Starting point is 00:04:13 and I wake up, there's red and blue on my walls. Lights flashing and I look at the wall and it's empty. It fell on one of those, you know where there are a bunch of kindergartners on a little chain. It fell on all of them. And it fell on one of those, you know, where there's like a bunch of kindergartners on a little like chain. Oh my God. It fell on all the way to the hole.
Starting point is 00:04:28 And the police were already there. They already knew you had done it. The police were already there. They knew it was me. Would you get in trouble for that? Probably. Like second degree or like some manslaughter type thing.
Starting point is 00:04:36 Second degree air conditioner fault. No, but you know, involuntary manslaughter. Involuntary manslaughter. Something like that. I think so. I think about that a lot it must happen all the time in new york but i don't hear about that much no i think it's only having i looked
Starting point is 00:04:49 it up it only happened once that it actually fell on someone which is shocking from how high was that i i don't know oh i don't know all the details that that is because you don't think about it and then every so often i'll have a day where that's all I think about when I walk around New York is things falling. Because things do fall on people. I remember reading about this businesswoman one time in Midtown. What fell on her? I forget, but something fell on her and she died. And I was like, she was like close to retirement.
Starting point is 00:05:18 And I was like, that sucks to like work all your life in New York. And then be like, a thing falls in your head you know yeah but you don't know it's a good way to go it's like that other woman that died she got killed by a shark
Starting point is 00:05:29 in Maine and they never had a shark fatality in Maine or something like that it was like a year or two yeah yeah yeah
Starting point is 00:05:34 close to retirement business woman in New York I'm telling you business woman in New York that's crazy because every family member who tells that story they're like
Starting point is 00:05:43 oh she got eaten by a shark they're like was she in Hawaii no in Maine a shark. They're like, was she in Hawaii? No, in Maine. In Maine. She probably had been swimming in those waters for like every summer for decades, you know? Yeah. And then an elephant, a great white shark, eats her.
Starting point is 00:05:57 I feel like, Jimmy, people must ask you to do a lot of physical tasks. Oh, yeah. Because you're a janitor. I am a task rabbit, yeah. You are a task rabbit. No, but like by, you know. You're like an unpaid task rabbit.
Starting point is 00:06:10 I'm paid, but yeah, I'm a task, yeah. Oh, sure, it's like one of those things, like friends, they're like, hey, could you do this? And you're like, listen, 10 people asked me today. Oh, outside of work, like? Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Starting point is 00:06:20 People don't know I have no skills. Like I can clean, but I don't have like the maintenance skills, you know what I mean? Oh, really? Yeah, I'll put in People don't know I have no skills. Like, I can clean, but I don't have, like, the maintenance skills. You know what I mean? Oh, really? Yeah, I'll put in a work order for a son. You know? I'll put in a task rabbit order, pretty much.
Starting point is 00:06:31 Yeah. You know? Because, like, that wasn't part of the job. It was just cleaning, pretty much. Maybe small. Like, I could put in a screw into something, but... Hey, that's a skill. That's about it, you know? I it. I'm not repairing too many things.
Starting point is 00:06:48 That's why it's very janitorial, cleaning, that type of thing. Well, for those who don't know, this is the downside, where we talk about things falling on people randomly who are just about to retire. This is a place where if you're feeling sad, listen to this, and you'll feel better because you're not us. And you're alive, and nothing fell on you today.
Starting point is 00:07:12 But maybe tonight, we're here with stand-up comedian, still a janitor? Still a janitor. Still a janitor as well, Jimmy Cash. Yes. Before we kick off this theme music, I gotta ask, you do a lot of videos about people shitting in the urinal. And has that ever happened?
Starting point is 00:07:31 Oh, yeah. For real? Oh, yeah. Have you ever shit in a urinal? No, no. Is it kids? I think. Adults?
Starting point is 00:07:38 I've never caught anybody in the act. Are they doing it to be a prank or they just couldn't make it in time? Or there's not one available. Maybe this doll is full. in the act. Are they doing it to be a prank or they just couldn't make it in time? That is... Or there's not one available. Maybe this doll is full. Occasionally you see stuff in a bathroom and you go like how did this happen? And then as you get older, you start to find out.
Starting point is 00:07:56 I gotta be honest. Shitting in a urinal, I can't logistically make it make sense. I've seen somebody peeing backwards into a urinal but not at school at like a what does that mean?
Starting point is 00:08:07 at like a bar. What do you mean? I thought they were shitting but they were just peeing backwards. They were touching They touched their penis? It was under.
Starting point is 00:08:15 They were just really drunk. They were going over. Yeah, no. They were just really drunk. And were they doing it as a bit or I think they were just drunk and confused.
Starting point is 00:08:23 They were having fun. Okay. Wait, I don't... But were they bent over all the way or they just had a long dick like a hose underneath the legs? They were sitting and they had it tucked. They weren't really hitting.
Starting point is 00:08:35 It was messy. I didn't watch for too long. I would have watched the whole thing. You should put it on TikTok. I know. Can you imagine shitting in a URL? Can you imagine logistically in a urinal? Can you imagine logistically?
Starting point is 00:08:49 Yeah, I can't imagine at all. I feel like I'd miss. I pee a little when I poop. Yeah. Jesus Christ. God forbid this is someone's first episode. Where does that happen? Go start with our episode with art critic Jerry Saltz and then move you away
Starting point is 00:09:02 into Russell saying he pees a little when he poops. This is The Downside. You're listening to The Downside. With Gianmarco Cerezi. Well, Jimmy, before we get to all your downsides, I do want to introduce the newest member of the Downside team. Can you hold this real quick, Russell? Just hold it from the base.
Starting point is 00:09:33 Really gentle. Hold it up like you're presenting it. This is Jerry Squeakfeld. This is my taxidermied mouse. Is that a real mouse? That's a real mouse that I made yesterday. I took a taxidermy class. And he loves you, Russ.
Starting point is 00:09:48 Get away. I hate that. I took a class, a taxidermy class. What was that mouse like before you touched it? Alive. No, no, no. I mean, it was dead. But did you have organs?
Starting point is 00:10:00 No, he was already in the stand-up pose and everything. I just put the mic in his hand. We are going to have a taxidermist on the show soon. And so our amazing producer, Paige Acechika, and I went to find her online. Gotham underscore taxidermy, I believe. And we made a taxidermy mouse. That's impressive. Russell, I don't know if you could have handled it.
Starting point is 00:10:25 No. I could barely. So here's how the class started. I didn't have to skin the mouse. Because you know this is empty. There's no mouse inside of this mouse. No, I know. But the first part she showed us,
Starting point is 00:10:40 she's basically, it's like an arts and crafts type thing. It's like someone who does miniatures, but it's with dead animals. Does everyone have a mouse? So it's me and three other people. And we went to her art studio, and there was like all these different, she specializes in birds. And it's crazy, like a zoo will give her a flamingo that died from an illness, but they want the bones back. So she's got to skin it and then send back the bones.
Starting point is 00:11:08 And we signed up for the mouse workshop. There's all sorts of workshops. I didn't get any discount for this, so I do recommend it. And first she showed us how to – you okay? She showed us how to skin the mouse. And this is the part I don't think I could have done. Though I would pay because I always, whenever I watch Survivor I'm like, could I?
Starting point is 00:11:29 Could I eat a mouse or a rat or a fish even? Or would I die? You could eat fish You could do it too? You could eat a fish Could you take the fish and get over your squeamishness And skin the fish? Not right now, but probably if I was starving.
Starting point is 00:11:46 What about this? I mean, I guess anything eventually. I think I'd die. I think I'd die. I really do. I don't think I have it in me. But she showed the skinning. This is very upsetting for some people, I'm sure.
Starting point is 00:11:59 But that's the horrifying part. That's where she showed you a mouse and showed you how to, like, take out. She was doing this live or it was a video? Live in front of us. How many mice does she have around? A lot of mice. Dead? Yeah, they were all dead.
Starting point is 00:12:15 Yeah, we didn't watch them. It's funny that you could create this. Like, you couldn't eat one, but you would play with a dead mouse, you know, and decorate it. Yeah, exactly. That's impressive. And you basically, you see what's on the inside and that's the
Starting point is 00:12:32 hardest part and she like to scoop out oh god, it's horrifying, like to scoop out the head you have to push the face like fully inwards and then take little tweezers and pull it out. And again, it's very much like arts and crafts. It's like building a doll's house or a little train set,
Starting point is 00:12:48 but it's with dead mice. And again, the mouse was going to get eaten by a snake, if not this. I have a question. Yes, go ahead. What is her main business? I know I've got to ask this to her in person, but I figure is it 90% deer heads? Is it 90% deer heads? it 90 deer heads she specializes
Starting point is 00:13:07 well she's specializing killing animals and then no no she doesn't kill them running these workshops so when your cat dies yeah if if your cat's these are all mice 15 pounds or less no no these were just mice that they were going to sell for stakes okay. Okay. I'm saying that they – You get them wholesale. And if your cat is under 15 pounds or less, that's her limit, you can, for like a lot of money, send it to her and she will take the skin off your cat. No. And make a taxidermy Louie so you always have your cat with you. No, I hate that. But that's what her main business is, is like cats and like small dogs. I don't know where the amount of money comes from or the most money comes from. We can talk to No, I hate that. But that's what her main business is, is like cats and small dogs. I don't know where the amount
Starting point is 00:13:45 of money comes from. Or the most money comes from. But it's like high art pieces and it's flamingos. Again, she's not killing any of these animals. Sometimes it's like roadkill, I think. Or it's like in New York, it's very illegal to
Starting point is 00:14:01 even get dead birds. If you pick up a feather off the ground, apparently that's illegal you know don't don't trust me on this don't go to the police officer with this but it's like complicated it's like imagine doing with arts and crafts but where all of your items like have very heavy legality and rules around the master like if I wanted to, for example, when I die, I would want you to put me in your home. Okay. My whole body. And she said, it's very complicated.
Starting point is 00:14:33 It is. I imagine. Should they get humans? I don't think there's humans. I don't. Have you ever heard of a human being taxidermied? I feel like we would know about it. Maybe in a different country. I don't think so. I mean, we would know about it. Maybe in a different country.
Starting point is 00:14:47 I don't think so. I mean, we have mummies. Sure. But I don't think we have humans. How would they maintain the skin? Well, that's what you go to the class for. She said it's harder with human skin because... You'd be kept in alcohol or something.
Starting point is 00:15:01 You'd be kept in a jar. It looks dry. We couldn't keep your rosy glow. Yeah. But if you died, I would love to change it to a podcast where my co-host is a taxidermied friend just sitting here. That would be fun. No. So we're going to have her soon.
Starting point is 00:15:22 But look her up. Gotham taxidermy. And yeah, I really love this mouse Put it away I think I'm going to put it on the camera or something Do you deal with a lot of dead mice as a janitor? A lot of live mice How do you kill them?
Starting point is 00:15:39 I don't like it They ask me to But again another thing That I kind of try to pass the buck on, like not, I'll clean a toilet. I'm not, I'll call the most, the pest control people, you know, and then the guy shows up and he hands me sticky traps. Yeah. And I'm like, okay, I don't like the sticky traps. I found them on there.
Starting point is 00:16:00 I found one once last summer and I tried to free him and it was a disaster okay how did you try to free him first of all why that's the point of the stinky trap i didn't like cool i didn't hear what do you do you find one that just got caught and he was like moving the trap and i'm like i took him outside and i sprayed him with a hose but the only thing that happened was he got really what it was like I was waterboarding him pretty much. And I was like, looked up at the sky, I was like, why God? Like, you know, what do I do? Should I put him out of his misery now?
Starting point is 00:16:35 Do I let him, do I know he's just going to, they could be there for like three days on the city trap. Yeah. So what do you do? What did you do? I hit him with a shovel oh my god did you put him in a bag first or did you just witness it well the the trap can fold into like a hot pocket it looks like a hot pocket you know it really literally like a hot pocket and that sorry this is no we're gonna need trigger warning from people on this episode um. I don't understand the sticky ones.
Starting point is 00:17:05 It just seems like an awful invention. It is. So I stop doing it. I go, I don't want to deal with it. But then all the pest control guy comes, hands me the things, and I call, and he goes, have you caught any?
Starting point is 00:17:17 And I want to be like, how about you go catch them? Yeah. They do get pretty... They come to my apartment once a month, and they just give me sticky traps and then they spray a little spray that I'm sure took years off my life, decades off my life.
Starting point is 00:17:31 Absolutely. Do you have a exterminator person? No. I mean, maybe the building does, but it hasn't been a thing. I mean, we're on the sixth floor. What kind of traps are you using? We don't have traps. We don't have herds.
Starting point is 00:17:42 Do you have any mice? We don't in our building, no. It's a newer building. It's like, you know. Oh like you know oh get ready wait for when at some point it's inevitable they're coming they always come they might already be there let me tell you not this building you don't know not okay i did the humane mouse traps for a long time and they're a real pain in the fucking ass yeah i would go bring them by the bridge and just let them out. And they come right back in. They come right back in. I caught one live and like in a classroom during class, caught it.
Starting point is 00:18:11 And I freed him into the dumpster. Oh. Because I figured he'd have like an abundance of things to rummage through. And, you know, and then who knows from there, he might live a lot. He might get sent out to like an island of trash and just like live it up. You know what I mean? Yeah. Where do you, where are you a janitor?
Starting point is 00:18:29 In, it's Worcester, Massachusetts. It's like central mass. Yeah. In a school? Elementary. Yeah. Wow. What grades is this?
Starting point is 00:18:38 It's pre-K through six. So also it's ages. That's a messy, that's a messy group. It's a lot. Yeah. It's a lot. So tell us how Tell us how did you get into the field of janitorial. You're going to barf. A lot of barf I said.
Starting point is 00:18:52 Kids are always throwing up. Just so you know, I have an internal goal for you to throw up on this podcast. Just one time. That would be the cliff. He already looks like he's getting nauseous it's rarely from talking about something
Starting point is 00:19:07 it's usually a texture or a smell thing that really gets me going gagging like you ever eat in the sink when you've like when you like are done with cat food dish and you like it's that little
Starting point is 00:19:22 oh no so close cat food dish and you're like, it's that little. Oh, oh no. So close, so close. Wow. Yeah. Amazon's holiday deals are here so you can celebrate the season early. With low prices on decor, electronics, and beauty. Perfect for stocking stuffers.
Starting point is 00:19:39 And my stockings looking good. Shop holiday deals early on Amazon now. Where were you born? Worcester. Worcester. Oh, yeah. Is that a fun place to live? No, not at all.
Starting point is 00:19:50 What's bad about it? Well, I mean, it's come a long way. It's one of those, like, you know, second-class cities. Kind of like it was an old industrial, like, you know, back in the, you should have been here back in the 30s. This place was rocking. You know what I mean? Was it known for a particular industry? Like barbed wire or something you know just barbed wire that is bleak yeah barbed wire and like sticky traps just a real seriously yeah and uh yeah so it was like
Starting point is 00:20:17 it's it's had one of those like uh you know it's it's it's been revitalized a little bit yeah you know had a little renaissance but not much you know it's close revitalized a little bit. Yeah. You know, had a little renaissance, but not much. You know, it's close enough to Boston. Oh, yeah. It is? It's the second biggest city in New England. Oh. Yeah, it really is.
Starting point is 00:20:32 Yeah. It's, I know, but it's definitely kind of, it's depressing. It's just not near the ocean. So it's an hour outside of Boston, just about under an hour. Uh-huh. So, you know, you're close enough to that. It's diverse as can be, yeah. It's got, you know, everything, but
Starting point is 00:20:49 it's just kind of, you know. Good family? Yeah. There's likely yes and no. Parents together? No, no. They never were. They never were? Never were, yeah.
Starting point is 00:21:02 They dated and messed around. Yeah, clearly they messed around. But when you were a kid, were you raised in a house with both of them or no? No, no. Were you going back and forth or just one parent? A little back and forth, a little back and forth action. My dad lived with his parents. How old were they when they had you?
Starting point is 00:21:25 My mom was in her early 20s. She was in a halfway house. It would get real dark. She was pregnant with me in a halfway house, a woman's halfway house. Now, what does a halfway house mean exactly? Like getting sober, like long-term, like you live there for like six months. Is it a government-funded thing? I think some people can go, like, I think, like, you can have health insurance. i don't know what they did back then but like health insurance might help but you can also get in if
Starting point is 00:21:51 you have like mass health you know it's like out of detox they find you somewhere to go long term to like really settle into the yeah yeah sober lifestyle you know so she's getting sober she she gets pregnant yeah she's at the halfway house pregnant. Yeah. And then were you living at the halfway house when you were born? Or did she, where'd you go from there? She went, my grandparents like renovated the attic apartment. No pun intended.
Starting point is 00:22:19 She was an addict. But she, the attic apartment above that, he lived in like, my grandfather owned a two family. Third floor was an attic and they renovated it and put us up there. Yeah. So I lived there with her and she was like sober the first several years of my life. Like really good, like running. All the years that you didn't have a memory of. Yeah.
Starting point is 00:22:40 She was like, I used to be so sober, sweetheart, you have no idea. Exactly. That's exactly what she does. Yeah. Loves to bring up those years. When did she start drinking again? I think there was a couple dabbles here and there, and then she started chasing my dad.
Starting point is 00:22:52 My dad was doing heroin. We know heroin, these two guys. We know all about the black dragon. Is that what it's called? Black tar? Black tar, chasing the dragon. Is that a term for heroin? Black tar? Black tar, chasing the dragon. Is that a term for heroin? I think that's like smoking heroin, which nobody does.
Starting point is 00:23:10 That's what I heard. There was a time people smoked it like a crack pipe? I think people try to do anything. Yeah, they just put it in every port. Let's try to smoke it this time. What about the ear? Let's give it a shot. So your dad's doing heroin. Your mom's like, I'm going to get into some of that?
Starting point is 00:23:24 Or you must have tried it before that. I mom's like, I'm going to get into some of that. Or you must have tried it before that. I don't know. I don't know. But she started. But they're not together at this point? At this point, no. He used to come over once in a while, you know, spend the night here and there.
Starting point is 00:23:38 You know what I mean? Do you remember him from those ages coming over, being like, hey, son? Yeah. Yeah. Did you, back then, did you love him? Did you see him as your dad oh i thought he was the coolest i didn't know much i just thought because i was raised with him not there so like he was just a cool guy i got to see sometimes yeah yeah yeah and they were like sometimes they'd be like oh he's away you know and then he'd come around it would be like oh it's mr cool guy my mom would resent that though you know because i like him
Starting point is 00:24:04 but she you know would he take you it'd be like here's a toy or let's go out get ice cream he was a janitor too he was a janitor yes so i'd go hang out with him at the school at night sometimes uh-huh you know or we go up on the roof and like watch the fireworks on the fourth of july on the fourth of july sure i thought like in wooster there's fireworks every night every other night yeah i feel like that'd be cool as a kid to be in like an empty school oh yeah yeah it was cool you know just wander around and then he got fired because he uh robbed the cafeteria uh a food or yeah food a food yeah like that should be a freebie Like a lot A truckload Wait a truckload?
Starting point is 00:24:47 A heist? That's not like I'm hungry at work You thought it was like an applesauce I thought it was like He was like working I'll just take whatever they got in the freezer Do you mean he really He took a truck He took a city truck that they had at the school
Starting point is 00:25:03 He stole the truck, too? Loaded it up, brought it down to the project, sold it. There was a market there. I don't know if he thought this through. And that's where he used to buy his heroin, so he sold it to the market. What kind of school food? Yeah, a bunch of heroin addicts eating goldfish on the side of the street. But did he steal the...
Starting point is 00:25:22 It was turkeys. Did he sell the truck, too? No, he left it on the side of the road. But did he steal the... It was turkeys. Did he sell the truck too? No, he left it. He left it on the side of the road. Oh, my God. I don't know if he... Wait, it was a truck of the school that he worked at?
Starting point is 00:25:31 Yes. I don't know if he thought this through. No, he didn't. How old were you when this happened? I must have been like, I don't know,
Starting point is 00:25:38 seven or something. I didn't know about it really when it happened. What's the profit margin on selling loose OJ cartons? A couple bags of heroin, dude. You know? I mean, it's just like, who cares?
Starting point is 00:25:49 They think in terms of like the next high. Did he get arrested or just lose his job? I think he just lost his job. He got arrested for all this stuff. No, he probably got arrested. He had a father that like squashed a lot of shit. Had some city connections. So he was always getting out of
Starting point is 00:26:05 trouble you know yeah did his father was he like doing heroin or was he like put together he had his shot put together yeah how did he have city connections politician politician well he was a irs guy so he had ties with all the he was like in what as far as worcester goes he was like uh he was like a you know it feels like a hunter biden joe biden situation yeah i mean like just how did your dad get on the other side of the tracks if you will like on the like what happened that he was kind of like i don't know it's funny it's funny you ask because he grew up like i feel like everyone that my mom and dad went to high school with like really like in the 70s,
Starting point is 00:26:46 a big group of them got into that shit. My mom always says she thinks, because he was in a fire when he was little in the woods, he tried to put it out up the street from him. It was like kids started a big fire, then he tried to put it out, but he got burnt so bad he was in the hospital for three months, and they had him on morphine.
Starting point is 00:27:06 Her theory is that was the trigger. He was on morphine for like three months. And he didn't start the fire. He just saw a bunch of kids making a fire? He probably started it. I don't know. But he had like a Freddy Krueger, like his whole leg was like from top to bottom. He had like skin grafts.
Starting point is 00:27:21 He was in there like for a while on morphine. And, you know, maybe that's where he got the taste for the you know i don't know yeah wow because his brother his he had two brothers and a sister and they kind of did all right sure but he was just like the the bad seed you know yeah and uh so he he he loses job. How old were you when that happened? I had to be like six or seven, maybe. Was it something you were cognizant of? Like my dad did a bad thing? No, I didn't know much about it, but I knew he was in and out of like rehabs. And so I'd go visit him at halfway houses, you know, what is it? Is a halfway house like a nice apartment building or is it scary? Is a halfway house like a nice apartment building or is it scary?
Starting point is 00:28:12 It's kind of like in New England, a lot of them are like really big old Victorian houses that they turn into like rooming houses. And they have like, you know, programs and, you know, they just live there and they have them all over. They're like everywhere. Yeah. So it was like every weekend was like, oh, we're going to see dad at the you know halfway all over new england you know yeah that's how i got to see new england was halfway houses pretty much and was your mom like were they at this point were they dating on and off like was your did your mom go out on other dates or was she she went out on other dates yeah there was some guys that came around you know definitely some guys tried to court my mother how did you
Starting point is 00:28:43 feel about it when you were a kid? I was pretty laid back about it. I was always like, cool, like attention. I guess when I was real little, it's vague. You know, that part's kind of vague. Like, oh, this is cool. And then, dude, it just, it did get crazy. Like, shit got crazy. Tell me.
Starting point is 00:29:00 Like my, so she started doing heroin with him at some point. With your dad? When I was in second grade So the halfway houses aren't doing They're not doing the trick No, it's kind of just like you get in trouble Alright, I'll go there I'll go there
Starting point is 00:29:13 Get everyone off my back Yeah, yeah, yeah And come back and try to Yeah Get it going again But try to control it Sure I got it this time
Starting point is 00:29:21 So They They start Once my mom started doing it, like shit just went. So that's when things went haywire. How old were you about? You said second grade. Second grade, going into third around then.
Starting point is 00:29:33 And how did you find out about this? I started to notice. I have these memories. Is this too depressing? No. This is exactly. This is the downside. This is the downside.
Starting point is 00:29:43 By the way, if you're enjoying the show, join the Patreon. Patreon.com slash downside. Heroin, dead mice, morgue. We got it all. Yeah, yeah. No, we'd love to hear it. I have a very distinct memory of noticing when my mom, because I didn't understand drugs totally.
Starting point is 00:30:00 Well, you were in second grade. My grandparents lived downstairs. They were in AA though. So I was exposed to like AA at a young lived downstairs. They were in AA, though. Yeah. So I was exposed to, like, AA at a young age, too. They would drag me to meetings. I'd sit in the back, you know, play with the ashtrays. I used to smoke in meetings and, you know.
Starting point is 00:30:14 And you understood, like... They kind of tried to explain it to me when I was young. Like, you know, we had... Were AA meetings... Like, are they very emotional? Are people... Or is it, like, kind of boring? Is it people just, like, I had a tough day today? Or is it, like, people, like, are they very emotional? Are people, or is it, like, kind of boring? Is it people just, like, I had a tough day today? Or is it, like, people, like?
Starting point is 00:30:29 They would tell, back then it would be, like, a speaker would go up, tell his story, and I'd hear some crazy shit, you know? Yeah. And for me, my grandparents treated it, it was almost like Teen Wolf, like, where they're, like, you might have this, too, you know? Oh, yeah. I was warned very early, like, you might have this too. You know? I was warned very early. Like, you... Did they say to you, like, don't... Did they try to be like, don't ever drink?
Starting point is 00:30:51 They tried that? Yeah. Yeah. I didn't like that. Yeah. They were right, but I didn't... Yeah, yeah, yeah. No one wants to have a preordained thing
Starting point is 00:31:01 that you're like, you know, you were like, let me figure it out. Right. I was very, like, indoctrinated into AA as a young kid. I didn't, I resented that big time. But my mom started using and I started to notice like, I remember she put me to bed at night when she was high. And I would look at her and go, are you my real mom? My real mom?
Starting point is 00:31:20 I just had an aneurysm there. I imagine. No, I would go, mom, are you my real mom? Because I knew she was different. You could tell. She remembers that too. And she said it would crush her. What do you think you saw? Like just the way that she was talking to you weirdly? I think her complexion changed. I mean, you've seen people on the street, like when they're high, right?
Starting point is 00:31:43 I mean, like on heroin heroin like you can see that but she used it so like it wasn't like this uh-huh they were doing like they were doing speed balls it was cocaine heroin they shoot it all together so when i so she was never like she was kind of she just was different i don't even know what the effect of a right ball is you're getting a downer and an upper at the same time. It's insane. A speedball is, now is this, do you burn this, cook this in a spoon?
Starting point is 00:32:09 Yeah, coke and heroin together, put it in the needle, shoot it up. Yeah, I know. How do you make sure it's not too hot? Every time I see that, I'm always like,
Starting point is 00:32:18 what if it's really hot and you're like, ow, ow, ow, ow, as it's going through your whole body? Are you telling me that's not a thought you had? No. Blow on it a little bit. Yeah, to blow on it, as it's going through your whole body. Are you telling me that's not a thought you had? No.
Starting point is 00:32:25 Blow on it a little bit. Yeah, do you blow on it? Like it's soup. Yeah. So she's, oh, God, it's tough. And did it scare you as a kid? Yeah. Oh, yeah.
Starting point is 00:32:41 I would have dreams. I remember the dreams. I would have dreams of two moms all the time god and i'd be like like one's bad one's good i didn't know you know that's how my brain was processing this i think you know you didn't have any siblings to talk with no like no you know no kind of being this with no it was very weird because my grandparents who lived downstairs at this point had retired into florida yeah and they rented out the apartment to someone else so it was just her and i upstairs and things just went started to spiral and at that age did you were you able to connect
Starting point is 00:33:15 that to oh she's putting something inside her body like did you make the full connection of of did you ever see her do it no No, when I made the connection, she said all of a sudden all these people were around that I'd never seen before. The first time I saw someone doing it was another, there was a lot of custodians, janitors around. It's a weird thing. I feel like
Starting point is 00:33:38 that class that my dad graduated with, a lot of them became janitors for the public schools. And they all went to high school together. And they all ended up on heroin. It was really weird. But the first time I saw someone doing it was this other janitor named Bees
Starting point is 00:33:52 who was hanging out at the house. Very janitorial, Bees, heroin. So I opened the bathroom door and he had the needle in his arm. He was like, get the fuck out of here. And I was like, whoa. You know? And then I just like went back to like, get the fuck out of here. And I was like, whoa. You know? And then I just, like, went back to, like, you know, watching whatever was, you know, playing with my toys.
Starting point is 00:34:12 G.I. Joe. You know? G.I. Joe. I don't know. Man, that is dark. Imagining. It's hard to imagine going over. You're going to go over to a friend's house and shoot up some heroin.
Starting point is 00:34:22 And then you're like, damn it. Their kid walked in on me doing it. Like, that is, it's a lot of, you know, I'm just imagining, like, going over to our friend Jessica's house. And you're the one doing heroin? And then Margo opens the door and I'm like, oh, you know, like, oh. Get the fuck out of here. Get the fuck out of here, Margo.
Starting point is 00:34:44 Yeah. I'm like, oh, you know, like, get the fuck out of here. Get the fuck out of here, Margo. Yeah. Now, why, I guess, like, did your mom become friends with them because, like, they needed to get heroin together? I think maybe, yeah. Or they needed something to talk about? Like, they could be like, hey, did you try today's batch? Or not talk about, you know?
Starting point is 00:34:57 That's heroin. I imagine you just need people who won't judge you for your addiction who are your friends. Yeah, you all end up in the same circle. And then things started getting, like, hairy, you know? Like, she started sleeping with a dude that, like, my dad introduced her to that was in the, you know, in the cipher of people. And was she, like, sleeping with him for heroin or, like, she liked him? No, he was doing it, too.
Starting point is 00:35:20 Yeah. You know? And she started, like, when I started noticing her, like, when I knew she was on drugs would be, like, she'd get me up in the middle of the night. We'd go down to that Projects where my dad sold all the turkeys and food. And, like, she'd go buy drugs in the middle of the night. Did she bring you? Yeah. Rather than leave him home alone.
Starting point is 00:35:38 Well, which is worse at this point? I don't know which one's. I know. No, that's funny because it was both. She did both. One time she left me in the car while she went in, locked the doors, and I was like half asleep. She put me in the car.
Starting point is 00:35:50 I was sleeping. I woke up to all these Spanish guys knocking on the door. They couldn't even speak English. They're all like, you know, speaking Spanish. They were probably trying to see if I was all right. Yeah. Well, that's nice. You know what I mean?
Starting point is 00:36:01 Yeah. I didn't know. You didn't know. Come on. You're a little kid. I was just like, what the fuck? Yeah. Yeah.
Starting point is 00:36:05 You know what I mean? Yeah. I didn't know. I was just like, I was just like, what the fuck? Yeah. Yeah. You know? And then, uh, then she would leave me alone. My uncle who was like, like, uh, Captain America,
Starting point is 00:36:12 he'd come over and try to like, take me when I was, uh, he'd try to catch me alone. He knew she was doing this. He caught on. This is her brother, her brother.
Starting point is 00:36:22 Uh huh. And she used to, you know, when we'd hear him coming up to see us, she'd call me into her bedroom and say, just be quiet. Like, he'd come in, he'd go through the lock with the credit card, and he'd walk in, and he'd, you know. And then one time he caught me alone there, and he took me.
Starting point is 00:36:38 He said, get in the car? Yeah, he took me. And were you of the mind, you were like? I was just like, all right. I don't know what I was did your mom ever say to you like when my brother's around don't talk about don't talk about the Spanish guys
Starting point is 00:36:52 knocking on the window like did she ever talk to you about it or did she just bring you along and you just were alone with your thoughts of like this is this feels wrong the only thing she specifically told me not to do was and you just were alone with your thoughts of like, this feels wrong. Alone with my thoughts, pretty much. The only thing she specifically told me not to do was,
Starting point is 00:37:08 the only instruction she gave me was like, when people called the house ever, was to say she was in the shower. And like my uncle would call and it was always, she's in the shower. And then to the point where I'd answer the phone, they'd be like, she in the shower? You know what I mean?
Starting point is 00:37:22 Yeah. And then he had to get me back because he took me and they couldn't prove anything, like with social services. So he was trying to get the government involved to get custody of you. Yeah. Yeah. And they were like, you can't prove it. She showed up in the middle of the night at their house. They lived in like a town outside of Worcester.
Starting point is 00:37:44 And she showed up in the middle of the night, and then the cops, the next day, we had a meet at the police station so that they could give me back to her. And I remember being like, this isn't right. Like, that's when I knew, like, I felt safer with him. I was like, this feels bad. Did he have kids?
Starting point is 00:38:01 Yeah, he had two kids, yeah. Younger, like. Yeah, yeah, yeah. They were like toddlers, you know. Man. Were you, how old were you at this point? Like third grade. How long did this go on for before there was some sort of.
Starting point is 00:38:13 There was a year, oh, about a year of just like escalation. And then he finally caught me one night where she left a note and that was proof enough. She left a note on the TV, like, I'll be back. And then he used that as, like, proof to, like, get custody of me. Okay, so she left a note saying to you, I'll be right back. Yeah, yeah. And then he came in before she got back. Yeah.
Starting point is 00:38:37 And that note was enough? Yeah, that held up, I guess so. Yeah, I'll be back, love, mom. And it was, like, in the middle of the night, and they used that. Because I woke up a few times, like, no one was there, and I was like terrified. What did you do at that age? Did you just watch TV until someone came and got you? No, I was too scared.
Starting point is 00:38:54 It was dark. I was scared of the dark. I ran downstairs and knocked on the tenant's door on the first floor, and he didn't answer, and I just ran back upstairs like what the fuck you know how was like the longest she like was on a bender i don't know i don't even know but he got me he got custody of me he got full custody you were temporary yeah third grade third grade and you went with with him till when not long because my grandparents moved back from Florida because they heard about all this. Because even before that, they came back because even before that, is this too crazy?
Starting point is 00:39:30 No, I don't know. No, so my mom. I mean, it is too crazy. It's a horrific childhood that you had. One time I slept over at a friend's house and I came home and my apartment was empty and my mom sold every piece of furniture was gone. And her and the guy she was getting high with were like, we're moving to California. And we drove to Logan Airport. She had a Datsun.
Starting point is 00:39:50 I sat on her lap and we went to Logan. We actually first we stopped at a friend's house. One of my friends from elementary school who like had some dough, whose parents had dough. And they scammed them for like plane ticket money right how did they scam them i don't know they did it they i remember i went in the basement they had like a finished basement and they were up in the living room present presenting their you know their their plight or their their story yeah yeah next thing you know we had tickets to california because we had family like
Starting point is 00:40:26 i had distant relatives all this so then we go to logan right from there right from there right from there and then we pull up the guy gets out to like he's like i'm gonna whatever he said he was gonna do and we're sitting in the car and the breakdown light like the like the fire lane and it was like taken forever then we went my mom took me in to look for him and he was gone he just he took the money or whatever he did oh my and then we came out and the car was fucking gone what yeah did he steal the car too or no oh my god and then you go back home you don't even have a couch to sit on. Dude, pay phones, too.
Starting point is 00:41:09 She had to start using the pay phone. We were sitting in Logan all night on the pay phone, dude. Like, a guy handed me a $20 bill. I was like, wow, this is like. It's kind of amazing that she, no offense, didn't abandon you. She's doing this, having to bring a kid around for all this is wild. I mean, I would think that she'd want her brother to take you or the grandparents to take you.
Starting point is 00:41:34 Yeah, yeah, yeah. But, you know, I also understand she loves you. Yeah. So your grandparents hear all this, they come back. They come back. Then it was right after this somehow that, like, I don't know if she got some of the furniture back. We went back in the apartment.
Starting point is 00:41:48 Grandparents came back right after my uncle took me. Yeah. Which was after the Logan ordeal. And then my grandparents showed up at my aunt and uncle's house, and they didn't like that I wasn't unpacked yet. I had been there for several months, but all my stuff was still like, and my grandmother was like, I'm taking him back to like the house I grew up in. And were they saying they're going to be there now? It'll be better.
Starting point is 00:42:14 They were going to take custody. Oh, I see. And my aunt and uncle were pissed because they had this like other life outside of Worcester that was very like, they already were like, they took me to a school to like look at. And like they were already planning my future. Probably would have worked out. I probably wouldn't have been a janitor if I stayed with them. I probably would have been like a scholar. I'm amazed.
Starting point is 00:42:34 How did you feel? I guess in terms of hierarchy, why did they have the power over your uncle? I don't know. They got in a big fight over it. But my grandmother asked if I want, you know what she did? They used me. She goes, do you want to be back?
Starting point is 00:42:47 I was very tight-knit with my friends in the neighborhood, with your friends, your school. Do you want to leave your elementary school? Wauwekus, that was my school. And I was like, oh, that sounds, I love Wauwekus. So we went back. And then. You went back. They went back to where then... You went back? They went back to where your mom was,
Starting point is 00:43:08 so you were all living together again? Actually, right before that, my dad OD'd. Right before that happened, he died. Right before that. Because I was living with my uncle, and he was driving me to school in Worcester, and we pulled into my grandparents' street. And I was like, what are we doing here?
Starting point is 00:43:24 And we pulled in, and my mom was there I was like, I hadn't seen her in months She's sitting on the couch My grandparents are sitting there And they're like, sit down And they told me he She, my mom goes, daddy's Daddy's gone to heaven
Starting point is 00:43:37 And my uncle goes, don't say it like that He died of a fucking drug overdose And I was like It was like tripping It was like I was A bad trip They could have told you A lie at that age
Starting point is 00:43:49 They lied about Fucking everything else In your life They didn't need to be harsh In this one moment Right Yeah Do you remember
Starting point is 00:43:58 Like How did it affect you Because you saw your dad So intermittently Yeah Were you devastated Was it just weird Was it What was the? Because you saw your dad so intermittently. Yeah. Were you devastated? Was it just weird? Was it, had you, what was the last time you saw him?
Starting point is 00:44:09 That's what it was. It went into, like, I wanted to, like, grasp to every memory I had. Because I was like, oh, my God. Yeah. I didn't even know when the last time I saw him was. But, like, I think one of the last times I saw him was at his parents' house. You know, I remember, actually. It was like, I remember one of the last times I saw him was at his parents' house. You know, I remember, actually. It was like, I remember one of the last times.
Starting point is 00:44:28 It was when Aerosmith dropped Living on the Edge on the Get a Grip album. And I was out in the street, and he was like an old Aerosmith head from like in the 70s. Yeah. And he called me inside to see the video premiere. Because Steven Tyler was naked, and it was a big deal. That's the last time I remember seeing him, actually. That's a nice one.
Starting point is 00:44:50 Yeah, it was a good memory. That's a nice core memory. Yeah, yeah. So that was it. So I'm just, I mean, your life is wild. It was wild, it was. But so, okay,
Starting point is 00:45:01 so your dad's dead, your grandparents now have custody. Yeah. And you're living with them and your mom again? You're all... No, she's running around. She's running around. She's still chasing the dragon.
Starting point is 00:45:16 Your dad's overdose didn't really... It wasn't like a thing for her where it shook her enough to be like... That pissed me off. That's when I started to get real resentful at her. Because I was like, when I needed her the most she stopped by to like tell me he died and then she was just like off and running in and out of you know all the halfway houses and detoxes and would she like it would she say like i'm so sorry that i'm this way yeah yeah oh yeah promises letters i have like all these letters she'd write
Starting point is 00:45:46 From rehabs and stuff Like handwritten This is it, this is the last time And it just went on for years Yeah, it went on for years And then My uncle resented that That they would let her, she'd come home
Starting point is 00:46:01 She'd stay with me and my grandparents For a month And then she'd go home, she'd stay with me and my grandparents for a month, and then she'd go off on a run. They didn't like that they were letting me just continually get exposed and ripped away, you know? Okay, so then where does this go next? You're with your grandparents for a number of years? Yeah, till, like, she got sober
Starting point is 00:46:23 when I was about going into high school like really got sober what do you think was the made her change um i don't know she finally just like gave it up yeah for a while sure she gave it i don't i don't remember because that's when i was starting to like fuck around you know i was starting i didn't was starting to like fuck around, you know. I was starting. I didn't do like heroin, but I was like, you know, becoming rebellious. Yeah. You know.
Starting point is 00:46:53 And what was your form of rebellion? Were you like not paying attention in school, skipping pot? Yeah, pot. A lot of pot. A lot of pot because I was scared of drinking because of their warnings. Yeah. Really? Their planting worked. It did work.
Starting point is 00:47:05 And I started smoking weed, and I thought that was like, I was like, this is good, you know? Yeah. But then when I started drinking, it was like, oh. Do you remember when you first started drinking being like, oh, I'm doing the thing? Yeah. Yeah.
Starting point is 00:47:20 Yeah. The first time I got high, though, was hilarious. Like, I got so high. I had smoked a couple times but didn't get high. Yeah, I remember the first joint I had was pretty weak. You didn't really know what was. One time I got so high because my grandmother was, like, devout Catholic, like, scary Catholic.
Starting point is 00:47:38 Yeah. And I got so high, me and my friend snuck out of their house. We got so high that I was, like, I and my friend snuck out of their house. We got so high that I was like, I blessed my friend with holy water when we got back. And like, I was like, we're going to rehab tomorrow. So you unironically blessed him with holy water? Oh yeah, I wasn't kidding. I was like, this is bad.
Starting point is 00:48:00 We're like possessed right now. That'd be a good way to make someone Catholic. I feel like if they introduced more drugs into the beginning of religion, it would be easier to be like, oh yeah, I feel God. What was your first time getting high? You know, I don't have a great memory of it. I remember early on getting high. I don't think I even smoked weed until college.
Starting point is 00:48:27 I didn't do any in high school. So I have a couple of memories of getting really high in college for those first couple times. But I don't remember the very specific first time, really. I think probably I had a few times where I didn't feel that much of a thing. I have a memory of one time being incredibly high early on in college where i wrote a paper so i wrote a paper i wrote half of a paper and it was on my birthday and my birthday is 4 20 so i had a couple friends be like come over
Starting point is 00:48:57 come over we'll celebrate blah blah so i had like i was like three quarters of the way through this paper and i went over to their house and got really really high and then i finished the paper after that turned it in and then i turned it in and it was for a history class and when we got the back the history teacher said see me and i like i i wish i had saved this paper because then i reread it in the cold light of day. And John Mark, he's like, he told me, when he saw me, he's like, he goes, yeah, the first half of this is great. It all makes sense. I don't really know what happened
Starting point is 00:49:33 in the second half of this paper. And I reread it. It was so many questions. It was me asking so many questions for a history paper. It was me being like, but what does that? Like, it would be, I remember there was periods in the middle of words sometimes. But then like, but like artistically, like it was like, I was trying to do something. Like it became beat poetry, like E.E. Cummings all of a sudden.
Starting point is 00:49:54 I really wish I had saved it because it was so funny to read back. And he let me redo it. I was like, that's very nice. This is clearly the work of a crazy high person. It would be amazing if he could tell. If he's like, hey, is there any chance like halfway through this paper? Yeah. So then you start doing pot.
Starting point is 00:50:15 Yeah. And are you thinking about like, did you ever have anyone to talk to that was like outside of the family? Did you ever have a school counselor who could be like hey you've had a tough life did you know you had a tough fucking life yeah i did no i went to therapy as a kid yeah and your grandparents got you there yeah that's good yeah i yeah all i remember is playing um chinese checkers remember that, yeah. With the therapist. But I did talk to him. I had an idea. You know, there was some connection.
Starting point is 00:50:50 Was there anger there? Yeah. I imagine it would be hard to exactly place on who. There's a lot of different adults doing different kind of things, letting you down in different ways. And then also, like, also, you know, we were going to school with kids who have i imagine not as difficult of a thing and being like fuck these people who have these nice don't have to worry about you know who's going to take care i don't know so i know it wasn't and it wasn't
Starting point is 00:51:17 as this is early 90s not every the heroin thing wasn't big like oxycontin hadn't come out yet the whole world wasn't addicted to opiates it was weird yeah like i people were like what you live with your fucking grandpa heroin yeah like it was like yeah would you tell your friends like i think were you like yeah my mom's they knew they just knew like probably their parents told them you know could you feel when you went to your friend's house for like sleepover? Were they like, hey, how's everything? How's grandma? Yeah, I had friends say, I remember one time my parents got arrested. And a friend was like, I saw your parents in the newspaper.
Starting point is 00:51:56 And I was like, my parents made the paper? Wow. I thought it was good. They got an award. You know? It was like, they got arrested. I don't know what award you get. That was like they were going to arrest it. I don't know what award you're giving kids. That's why they don't have time to see me.
Starting point is 00:52:08 They're out doing good things. Yeah. Oh, man. So, yeah, the neighborhood was just like, it was weird. I had a family I was real close to, good friends. They kind of like took me in, in a sense. Like, I was real close with this family and uh but yeah it felt weird the kids would make fun of you like i had a kid you know tell me i saw your mom
Starting point is 00:52:31 shooting up at friendlies in the bathroom it's like what the fuck were you doing in the yeah you know what i mean but like i was like so hurt or like they call me a crack baby you know man would you would you just like go away and cry would you fight him would you um i would i would fight oh this you know depending on the kid i would i would if you could if you were bigger yeah yeah yeah what would you do like would you would you sock him um no i'd probably talk back nobody really like i guess nobody there was only one kid i punched for calling me a crack baby because Because I wasn't a crack baby. I did heroin. My mom didn't smoke crack
Starting point is 00:53:08 until I was in my 20s. Sure. Oh my god. So your mom relapsed. Oh yeah. Yeah, sorry. I was hopeful. I was like, it sounds like it's gonna stick this time around. She had like a set of years though. My high school years. Just to make me miserable in my
Starting point is 00:53:23 high school years. Came back just to fucking me miserable in high school oh yeah i came back just to fucking torture me because i was trying to have fun and all of a sudden she's like now we can finally do this together yeah we have something to talk about we have something to connect on mom yeah exactly but she was a shark she knew everything yeah of course was she being like she was like don't do it yeah. Did she ever find like a little bit of pot? Oh yeah. And she would, would you get in a fight
Starting point is 00:53:49 where you'd be like, fuck you mom. Oh yeah, I ran away. I ran away to Friendly's and I got arrested there. You got arrested at Friendly's? Yes.
Starting point is 00:53:58 Why were you arrested there? I broke a bunch of shit in my house. Threw shit at her. Oh God. Because she was in my house Threw shit at her Oh god Cause she was in my face You know And I was like
Starting point is 00:54:07 Oh you're gonna You left me for this many years All of a sudden you're my mom now I was like Get the fuck out of here You know And I flipped out Like broke a bunch of shit
Starting point is 00:54:17 Left And we went down to Friendly's Like you know We got high Yeah And the cop came in Like looking for me This was, like, later that night or something
Starting point is 00:54:27 Sure And he asked me if anyone had, you know, seen James That's my first, you know, not James, James And I said, yeah I was like, yeah, we saw him He's went to, you know, Johnny Mac's house or whatever And then he pulled out a picture of me And I was like, ugh
Starting point is 00:54:44 And then he arrested me right there Like paddy wagon But then all my friends were in the window At Friendly's watching So part of me was scared but part of me was like Yeah that's right I'm a badass I felt like I had arrived
Starting point is 00:55:00 You know Was that your first time really in trouble with the law? Yeah And you weren't scared at all? I was was that your first time like really in trouble with the law yeah yeah oh yeah and you weren't scared at all you were like i was scared but i was also like yeah yeah yeah just me getting thrown in the paddy wagon you know i felt like it was like the stage it was like a perform it was like look at this i'm a fucking rock star now you know that's how i felt yeah because i always wanted to be a performer. That's the moment the theater bug bit me.
Starting point is 00:55:32 As the policeman threw me into the back of the paddy wagon. Yeah. Actually, the theater bug bit me earlier because I was in a third grade play before my dad died. It just reminded me. It was a big deal. I was living with my uncle at the time. I was doing one of the main roles And my parents weren't living with me
Starting point is 00:55:47 And they showed up at the play And I walked them I walked my parents No they just walked out I saw them leave in the middle of my performance And I was like fuck dude Oh my god What show was it?
Starting point is 00:56:00 You were bombing? No no I guess it was called The Tiniest Heart I don't know if the teacher wrote it. Oh, my God. Oh, my God. Oh, my God. I was the king of hearts, though.
Starting point is 00:56:13 It was cool. It was cool. I had all these kids. I had like 20 kids. And my brother was the king of diamonds. And he was rich. And I was going in to borrow money because I had all these kids. You watched them walk?
Starting point is 00:56:24 Yeah, I watched them walk out it's it's man it's tough parents watching you perform it is like my my dad it's still something in me when i perform and he sees it okay once a year right and he doesn't say anything after there's there is something in me that is triggered. Absolutely. Oh, yeah. And it's just like I'm in a bad place. At least you stayed for the whole performance. I mean, it's crazy. I can't imagine it was that long of a performance for a third grade play. It's not a two-act piece. It's a mid-first song.
Starting point is 00:56:57 20 minutes, you know? Oh, man. Okay, so you're now in trouble with the law. You went to jail for the night? Yeah. Yeah, they let me stay. They sent me to, so like if you're a juvenile in Worcester, they wouldn't keep you in the holding cell.
Starting point is 00:57:15 They'd send you to this little place called the Key Program, and it was just like a holding. It was like an apartment. It would be like college people that like work there. Was it fun in a weird way? In a weird way, yeah, because it was like co-ed, and the boys sat on one coach and the girls sat on the other, and you kind of just make eyes.
Starting point is 00:57:34 You weren't supposed to interact with them, really. They would just put on like, I remember watching Rush Hour. They put on Rush Hour and feed you SpaghettiOs, and you just hang out out and you kind of make eyes at the girls on the other couch. And that's all I remember about it. I mean, I feel like it would be a good way to meet other people with
Starting point is 00:57:53 fucked up family lives. Yeah, that's where... They'd hear your story and be like, oh, they even came to the play? You lucky son of a bitch. I felt like the fucking kid that had, you know, I felt like they all had it way worse than me. They had all been there before. I was the new Jack.
Starting point is 00:58:11 So then take us to, I guess, leading up to when you became a janitor. Like, how bad did stuff get for you? Did you graduate high school? Yeah, by the skin of my teeth. You know, barely. For you. After, did you graduate high school? Yeah, by the skin of my teeth. Uh-huh. You know, barely. And do you do anything more than heroin? I mean, not heroin, sorry, more than weed?
Starting point is 00:58:32 Did you get to heroin? No, I didn't do heroin. I would do, like, all the party drugs, and, like, ecstasy was big then, and... Yeah. Coke. Once I started doing coke, that was, like, that was, like, the... What year is this that ecstasy was big?
Starting point is 00:58:45 When I was in like mid high school. I don't know. I graduated. I started high school in 98 and graduated in 2002. So somewhere in between then. Yeah. You know. Was ecstasy, it was like a big.
Starting point is 00:58:57 It was big, dude. Yeah. Everyone was doing it. You know, I stayed, I was scared of it at first. And then I just realized, I was like, everyone's doing it. I would do. And when I was drinking, it at first. When I was drinking, I would take anything. Sure. Some of this, some of that.
Starting point is 00:59:16 I was always the last one standing. The sun was up. I've never done ecstasy. Me either. All I know from a kid is, again, they'd be like, don't have sex on ecstasy. Because it's so good. Regular sex suck. And I hadn't had sex with anyone.
Starting point is 00:59:33 And I was like, good to know. Good to know. And that kid had never had regular sex. He has no idea. Don't get a handjob on ecstasy. Oh, my God. Yeah, I a handjob in ecstasy. Oh, my God. Yeah, I never did it just ecstasy alone. I never got that experience of, like, this is just the effects of ecstasy.
Starting point is 00:59:52 You know, I'm very intoxicated. And so where did all this lead? It led to I graduated, and then I kept getting, like, in trouble. I kept getting arrested, you know, for, like, disorderly stuff. I was always the guy, like, the last, you know. What was the biggest thing you got in trouble for, like the most nights you spent in jail? Well, I would try to resist arrest,
Starting point is 01:00:20 so then that would turn into, you know. Would you run? Oh, I'd fight. I'd fight. That'll do it. That'll do it. That'll get you more... Do you ever punch a cop?
Starting point is 01:00:32 I try to. Yeah. Yeah, that was one of the ones that shook me. I didn't remember it. They told me I did. I woke up in the jail cell with the shakes, and I got taken to the ER in shackles and i didn't even know why i was there i hadn't got to go to the hospital in shackles in shackles yeah into the emergency room
Starting point is 01:00:52 would they did they hook you to the bed like did they cuff you to the bed cuff you to the bed probably i don't remember i remember sitting in there with the police officer though and i was like why am i here it was like the next day and he's like huh you want to know and read off the list of charges you know every little trumped up chat you know yeah yeah uh you know resistant arrest disorderly conduct assault you know assault murder no no not murder He murdered three cops last night Murder Murder one And Did you have Get any time
Starting point is 01:01:30 Or was it all like You know Service Probation I was on probation For like two years Of high school And then
Starting point is 01:01:38 And what does that mean Do you have to check in Yeah With a probation officer Yes Drug tests Yep Were you failing them
Starting point is 01:01:44 I failed one I was pretty good I was pretty shifty check in with a probation officer? Yes. Drug tests? Yep. Were you failing them? I failed one. I was pretty good. I was pretty shifty. You would bring in fake pee? I got caught for that. Tell me about, was it someone else's pee? Yeah. One time because I was lazy because I used to flush. And this was before the drug testing technology
Starting point is 01:02:01 I feel like really took off in a few years even after this. You know, early 2000s, it was like you could still drink a ton of water, maybe some vinegar, whatever. And you'd be peeing. You'd just be flushing. Flushing, you mean that you flushed your system of the drug? So much. And then now they'll be like, oh, you flushed.
Starting point is 01:02:22 But back then, they wouldn't say anything. They'll be like, your pee you flushed. But back then they wouldn't say anything. It'll be like your pee is a brown vinegar. Yeah. Your pee would be good on a salad. This is clearly flushed pee. Did you ever try to sneak in someone else's pee? I did one time and I got caught. How did you do that?
Starting point is 01:02:38 I'm trying to remember what I did, dude. Because this was a week, maybe biweekly. No, every other, yeah. I would go down to this drug testing place downtown Worcester, take the elevator, and I brought it somehow in my pants in a bottle maybe. Yeah. Just snuck it in with me. Whose pee was it?
Starting point is 01:02:55 My friend Dan McNamara. What's up, Dan? If I needed to pee, would you give it to me? Yeah, but I don't really want to give it to you, but I would. He pees a little when he poops. Yeah, yeah. I'd be like, is this poop pee? It sounds a lot like some pure pee.
Starting point is 01:03:14 Would you make me go up and get it from you, or would you be willing to bring it down here for a podcast recording? Absolutely not. No, you're coming to my door. You're coming up there to get it from me. Am I holding the cup? No, no, no. You're going to have to come You're coming up there to get it from me. I'm not bringing it. Am I holding the cup? No. You're going to have to come get it at home delivery for the pee.
Starting point is 01:03:30 And do you remember how you got busted? Was he like, take a sip of that drink? They go, it's cold. It was cold. They were like, you gave a cold urine. I was like, oh, I forgot about that. It's going to be warm. He picks up your pee cup and it's
Starting point is 01:03:46 like a like frosted glass you gotta heat up in the sink you gotta like heat the little container oh my god yeah i love just forgetting that part yeah totally did you keep it in the fridge before they just know the body temp you know it's supposed to be hot yeah it's supposed to be piping hot like heroin and coke and a spoon yeah you know that temp but uh yeah so that i got caught but then i had to like they gave me a chance to retake it so i went really yeah that feels like uh yeah that feels like uh no you're in trouble right i guess they're like well let's just take the p then yeah yeah yeah that way the league's getting a sample from him. Sure.
Starting point is 01:04:26 I think I went right to my probate. They were like, you've got to go to your probation officer right now. And I was like, in the courthouse. I went there. She goes, go back and take it again. So in between there, I just drank a ton of water. And then it worked? Yeah, it worked.
Starting point is 01:04:40 God damn. I know. Wow. Isn't that crazy? My PO would come to school too, like check in with me and stuff, and I'd get called to the office. And so when did you finally? Yeah, well, yeah.
Starting point is 01:04:52 Yeah. All right. Let's just get to a nice moment. The performing and kind of getting out of that. Well, things take a little while there. When you became a janitor, were you sober at this point? Yeah. Yeah.
Starting point is 01:05:04 I got sober when I was just turned 19. Okay. And I, yeah, I got the job because I got, so I got sober and then I got someone pregnant. And then I was like. After the sobriety. Yeah. Well, cause it was nothing else to do. You know what I mean?
Starting point is 01:05:22 Yeah. Sure. So just, you know, switching seats on the Titanic. So I got my daughter's mother pregnant, and I was like scrambling. I was like, uh-oh, you know. Uh-oh. Yeah, yeah. I remember my grandmother hung up the phone on me and was like,
Starting point is 01:05:41 she goes, you have a real talent for trouble. She hung up on me, And I was like, oh. That's real ballsy of these people who know your whole life story. Yeah, yeah. So I got her pregnant, and then I had to scramble to get a job. And I was just like, someone was like, you should take the custodian's exam. There's an exam. What does the exam entail?
Starting point is 01:06:03 It's like, it's just pictures, circling pictures. Honestly, it really is. Like, here's a picture of vomit. What do you use to clean this up? Yeah, I have a whole thing about it. There's like a window. How would you clean this window? Which tool would you use?
Starting point is 01:06:21 Like a shovel, a mop, a lawnmower, you know, and a window. Wait, is it truly? That's like, that was the hardest question on the test. There might've been some, like,
Starting point is 01:06:33 I remember some lengthy, like, you know, situational things, you know, fire. That's like you, you see a urinal,
Starting point is 01:06:40 do you shit in it? Or do you flush it? I feel like you describing this test, I just feel like I'd be taking it and being like, this is so rude. Just give us the job. Just give us the job. It's so mean. Like, whoa.
Starting point is 01:06:53 Oh my God. Could both of us pass it now, do you think? Based on your knowledge of us. Easily, yeah. Yeah, you could get extra credit. You'd probably get above. I got a 98, but. What did you get wrong? I don't know. The window.
Starting point is 01:07:08 You're like, how do you clean up, throw up the screwdriver? I don't know which one. I rushed through it. I didn't check my answers. I want to talk about being a janitor without any kind of judgment, but is this a kind of job that if you've had trouble in life or you only have a high school education that it offers, is it a good job?
Starting point is 01:07:33 Oh, yeah. A city job, it's school department. There's like 50 schools in Worcester and we're all in the same umbrella. And yeah, it's a city city benefits, all that shit. Are there a lot of janitors who, more than other jobs, who became sober, who had a drug problem? Oh, yeah. It's a very, yeah.
Starting point is 01:07:54 Or still do have drug problems. Yeah. Yeah? Yeah. Oh, yeah. There's a lot of that. And I did go back to school. I went to community college for like, when my daughter was little, like the first 10 years of her school. I went to community college when my daughter was little.
Starting point is 01:08:05 The first 10 years of her life, I went there. Did your daughter go to the school that you were working at? Later on. I transferred to one of the schools she was at when she was in fourth grade. Was that fun? Was that cool? Yeah, that's where I am now still. I started at a high school at night.
Starting point is 01:08:23 That was tough because kids thought you were in high school and they try to like, you know, start shit with you or. You ever punch a kid? I almost did. It was my first month on the job. A kid smacked a broom out of my hand and I was like, I still had that like, you know. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Starting point is 01:08:40 Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Starting point is 01:08:41 Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Starting point is 01:08:41 Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Starting point is 01:08:42 Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Starting point is 01:08:43 Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Starting point is 01:08:43 Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Starting point is 01:08:43 Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Starting point is 01:08:44 Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.. Yeah. I'm a good. I'm a good. I'm a good. I'm a good. I'm a good. I'm a good. I'm a good. I'm a good. I'm a good. I'm a good job. And someone luckily had given me a talk when I started, like, it's your word. What was the talk? Don't punch a kid. Yeah. Good thing I had that. Yeah. You know, that's important. It's a tutorial.
Starting point is 01:08:56 It's in the seminar when you start. So being a janitor in high school was worse. Yeah. You got to start as a night guy. It's tough in the city to get the daytime. Like, I consider the janitor in elementary school like the pinnacle of janitorial work. Because it's the quintessential janitor that you remember from when you're a kid. You're part of the community.
Starting point is 01:09:21 The teachers all know you. The kids all know you. Kids like you. They're not judging. Yeah. High school, you're part of the woodwork or they're just like, you know, you're a weirdo that's just of the community. The teachers all know you. The kids all know you. Kids like you. They're not judging. Yeah, high school, you're part of the woodwork, or they're just like, you know, you're a weirdo that's just in the background, you know?
Starting point is 01:09:29 Yeah. So I love doing it. Like, I've been there. I've been doing it. This is my 19th year on the job. What's, like, do you feel, I saw that you are the guy who brings in, who rolls on the TV.
Starting point is 01:09:44 Oh, yeah. When they're going to watch a video. Yeah. I mean, what age group, so what do you say? You said it's pre-K through six. Six. Yeah. Wide range.
Starting point is 01:09:57 And since this is the downside. Yeah. What, tell me some of the harder aspects of being a janitor. Oh, it's dealing with, like, personality. Like, anywhere. Like, some teachers, you know. I get along with most of them. What's, like, an annoying teacher?
Starting point is 01:10:13 Like, what do they do? Just always ask you. Like, they can't walk by you and say hi one time. Oh, they see. Oh, I've been meaning to ask you can you you know move this over there oh yeah you know when you get a minute can you fucking you know whatever it is stupid shit you know or fill up their trash you know way above you know put a they'll put a fucking piece of furniture in the a chair on top of like a pile of like lunches you know what i mean oh man toppled over yeah that's that's stuff that you're dealing with
Starting point is 01:10:51 more more vomit or poop or what's what's the worst part of the day that you worst task the worst task is definitely like almost poop than puke. It actually depends on where it all lands. Sure. You can have some tricky situations, but with the puke, I have an absorbent that I'll just... It takes the visual out of it. That stuff you put on it.
Starting point is 01:11:19 You sprinkle the stuff on it. It's like a magic dust. Yeah. With poop, there's no, like... You don't want to do that. There's no point, really. But, like, pukey, just cover it, and it's gone. The visual's gone. So you're no longer...
Starting point is 01:11:33 Now you're just dealing with this absorbent, you know? But poop is usually, like, you know, you get the toilet seat. Yeah. Sometimes it's on that, and then it's under it, and then it's on the floor. It's on the wall. Oh, God. You know what I mean?
Starting point is 01:11:48 What's messier, boys' bathroom or girls' bathroom? Girls' is messier. Boys smell worse, but the girls' is always messier. Always. That's fascinating. They make them, the toilet paper, they just go nuts with it. It's like confetti you know um and the girls in middle school like very you know they they their graffiti is unreal like just stories like i used to get
Starting point is 01:12:15 stuck i used to like forget how long i was in there because i'm like catching up on all the drama yeah you know what i mean i'm like oh my god what did what would what what kind of things are they writing? Like gossip? Yeah. Like so-and-so? Yeah, suck this one's dick. Yeah, shit like that. Or this bitch is a slut.
Starting point is 01:12:31 Oh, my God. There's like arrows to like, no, you're the, you know, and you're following the arrows. And then you're like, oh, my God, Linda said that. You know? Is this in marker? Marker, pen, pencil. Do you ever have to paint over that? Yeah, yeah.
Starting point is 01:12:44 Oh, okay. But I kind of let it ride for a little while. Yeah, you can't do it every day. This is like the Library of Alexandria. You can't just paint over all of it. It needs to be documented. I didn't know that really happened because I don't remember it happening in my school.
Starting point is 01:13:01 Graffiti? Like graffiti. I remember maybe small things, but it feels very like a 90s TV show or something. happening in my school. Graffiti? Like graffiti. I remember like maybe like small things but not like, you know, it feels like very like a 90s TV show or something.
Starting point is 01:13:08 The boys don't get too involved. It's usually dicks. That's it. Just big dicks. That's it. Ever have to deal with someone
Starting point is 01:13:16 did a swastika? Oh. Yeah, maybe in the middle, when I worked at the middle school, I've seen one probably. Do you have to report,
Starting point is 01:13:24 say, just so you know, there was a swastika. I painted it. I have graffiti remover, actually. I would just hit it with the gel. It's gone. You just hide it. Did you tell the staff? He's like, I've covered up.
Starting point is 01:13:38 He's like, so I have dozens of swastikas. Yeah. There's a point where they're just like, you know. When you're that age, it's hard. Sometimes you just do a swastika just to be a punk. You do? Wow. I've seen them and they did.
Starting point is 01:13:53 Usually you could tell they're not... They were trying to do one, but it wasn't. You know what I mean? That's so cute. Like a swastika, but two of the lines are the wrong way. Maybe they weren't doing it. I don't know.
Starting point is 01:14:07 And do you think as your stand-up comedy takes off, like, is this a job? Are you looking to get out of this job? Yeah. I mean, eventually. The thing is, a lot of people are like, what are you going to do? Why don't you make the leap? You know? I mean, I didn't start stand-up until I was 32.
Starting point is 01:14:25 Sure. It was as my daughter got older. I was like, she was probably in fifth grade maybe. You know, and I was like, man, I always wanted to do it. Like I spoke at AA meetings and I get laughs. So truly, because there's been some TV shows where that's how it's portrayed. People figuring out their stand-up comedians. Really?
Starting point is 01:14:46 I'm dying up here on Showtime. There's a comedian who realizes that's going to be his new open mic. I'm dying up here. Which one? I feel like I watch all the stand-up shows. It was on Showtime for two seasons. Was that the old one? It was about the 70s.
Starting point is 01:15:00 Yeah, yeah. I started that. I never finished it. No one did. Yeah. Except for me. I think I was the only one. Really? But is that really how you figured it out?
Starting point is 01:15:11 It was a piece of it. It was like I always wanted to do something. Did you ever start getting too funny in the AA and they're like, okay, buddy, you're like working out new material? Yeah, you can tell when somebody's like yeah or like you start to realize where you get a laugh and then you start to realize where you oh I should have got a laugh here yeah yeah yeah I usually get a laugh when I say
Starting point is 01:15:34 my mom fucked my sponsor you know what I mean and then it dies it falls flat and you're in a jail speaking to like did your mom fuck your sponsor yeah yeah they had a kid what oh wait okay before we go to the last thing and you're in a jail speaking to like did your mom fuck your sponsor? yeah yeah they had a kid what? yeah oh wait okay
Starting point is 01:15:47 before we go to the last segment just say that last you had a how old were you when you had this sponsor? um so 16 before I got sober
Starting point is 01:15:57 sober one of the times I got court ordered to AA I was 16 and I got a sponsor I got sober for a few months and then they they started dating.
Starting point is 01:16:06 And that's not allowed. Eh, I guess not. But I was happy because it was a distraction. Got her off my back. Sure. That was cool. Then they had a kid. Yeah, not until I was 18.
Starting point is 01:16:21 So I have a sister that's 18 years younger than me. Question. Step half sister. Just before we go on to the last segment. What's your relationship with your mom like now? I mean, I took her out yesterday for Mother's Day. Okay. But like...
Starting point is 01:16:35 Friendlies? Yeah, I got her a speedball and all. Is she sober? I think so. It's gone so far to the point where I'm like, I don't even. She's pretty sober. She's on methadone. So it's like that maintenance where they like.
Starting point is 01:16:53 And methadone, is that something, how do you take methadone? Usually like a liquid. You have to go to the clinic in the morning every day. And does it get you high at all or it just takes care of the the craving of it it gets you a little i think you get a little buzz i think you get immune to it you know and then sometimes they up the dose it's a whole game that's a whole do you since you went through the whole process of of being an addict and getting sober do you feel more sympathy? Do you think you understand her more? Or do you feel frustrated?
Starting point is 01:17:27 Why didn't you get better when I did? I was frustrated for years because she did this. She relapsed when my sister was little, and it was like watching a playback of your life. And I was like, how dare you fucking do this again? Yeah. Fucking idiot. And I was sober, but I was
Starting point is 01:17:45 completely pissed for years. Yeah. And she kept doing it with her. And I was just like, I just wanted her to die pretty much.
Starting point is 01:17:53 In a sense. Sure. With my dad, at least I didn't have to fucking deal with this. Yeah. He just got it over with. She's just like dragging us
Starting point is 01:18:00 through the mud for years. But there's a point of the sympathy too, like, wow, you really must be fucked up if you can't. You know what I mean? There's something drastically wrong with you, and I kind of feel bad for you. You know what I mean?
Starting point is 01:18:14 Sure, sure. Yeah. Well, that. Sorry. No. No, it's just amazing that you're okay. Yeah, I guess. Are you in therapy now?
Starting point is 01:18:26 Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I guess. Are you in therapy now? Yeah. Yeah. Not, yeah. Do you still go to AA? Is that? Not like, you know, I guess I'm not even supposed to say I go to AA. Sure. Yeah, I stop.
Starting point is 01:18:37 You know, I. The rules around that are very confusing because. I know it is. It's weird, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. They kind of like, I think they like to be like, they don't want somebody to see someone talking about it and be like that guy.
Starting point is 01:18:51 I'm not going there. You know what I mean? I imagine too with that, there's a certain point where you're like, okay, well, I feel pretty good about things. I don't need to go as... It would be a lot to just go if you don't feel like it's.
Starting point is 01:19:07 Sure. Yeah. Some people hide. It gets like that becomes. That almost happened to me. That's why I didn't. Part of the reason I don't think I started stand up for the first 10 years of my sobriety or so, because I was wrapped up in that. That was like, well, this is my life.
Starting point is 01:19:22 Now I'm going to the conferences and like. Yeah. Yeah. And I was like, that was it is my life. Now I'm going to the conferences and like meet and be. And I was like, that was, it was almost. It's just strange. I mean, I think there's, there must be new organizations now, but you're just like, this is an organization that was started by one person and it's known as the
Starting point is 01:19:36 thing you go to if you have an addiction problem, you go to AA. Right. And it's one unit and there's like a weird, there's a religious element to it that not everyone's comfortable with and it's just like one thing I don't know it's basically just they got principles you know you kind of do what you want with it
Starting point is 01:19:54 they don't try to force anything it's very like laid back it was great it worked for me but like I'm just not consumed by it anymore you know what I mean I kind of still apply some of the things I learned. You know? And I got to open mic there for years
Starting point is 01:20:10 so I'm not mad at them. Are you really upfront with your daughter about your drug past? Oh yeah. Yeah, she knows. Do you do what your grandparents did with you to her?
Starting point is 01:20:25 Do you say don't ever do it? No, not at all. How do you try to like... Not at all. Do you worry that she has the genes? Yeah. Yeah. So I'm super laid back, Dad.
Starting point is 01:20:37 Yeah, yeah, yeah. I don't give a... Like, do what you got to do because I don't want to be overbearing. And I always told her like call me if you're gonna try something whatever and it was a birthday if you want some gonna make sure it's the right temperature so she called me one time on her birthday last year her friend got on the phone like listen we're gonna smoke weed and you know annie wanted me to call to see if it was like to let you know and i was
Starting point is 01:21:06 like what are you fucking crazy you're calling me like i told her to do that but i'm like you are actually calling me yeah you know what am i supposed to say what did you say do like so and i'm like uh you know i don't know doing it yeah you know i didn't know what to say but that's sweet I think that's really sweet that she called she did yeah I think that's that's the thing
Starting point is 01:21:28 all the parents fuck up it's like the main thing especially with drinking it's just like if you're drunk tell me and I'll pick you up like that's all a parent needs
Starting point is 01:21:35 I don't know exactly yeah so that's how I wanted to be with she's pretty open with me about stuff she's she's graduating high school this year
Starting point is 01:21:42 wow that's great yeah so I guess I did something right but I graduated high school too year. Wow. That's great. Yeah, so I guess I did something right. But I graduated high school too so I guess it's not that impressive. It could still go downhill. No guarantee. Let's go on to our next segment.
Starting point is 01:21:54 This has got to stop. This has got to stop. Do you have something that needs to stop? Well, my mom doing drugs, I guess. No, I don't know. That's a fair one. That's a fair one. I like to end with the guests. So do you have one you want to say, a specific thing?
Starting point is 01:22:09 Do you have one here? You're looking at my notebook? I don't know. I'll start. It can be anything specific, big, broad. So I don't want this one to come off as too bitchy. Okay. Oh, my God. People, people, young comics
Starting point is 01:22:25 will sometimes, basically every day, at least 46 white comedians write me asking to go to coffee to pick my brain. Okay.
Starting point is 01:22:35 And I want to be nice. I want to give time. I want to be a decent human being. Right. Uh-huh. Offer to buy a coffee.
Starting point is 01:22:44 Offer to buy a lunch. offer to buy a lunch, because there's so many people asking and not, not cause cause there's just a lot of comedians and they all want some like advice and ultimately the advice. And I try to be, you know, give, but part of me is like, it's, it's different now from even five years ago. But the bottom line is when you're asking someone for their time and you're not like friends, friends, friends, just offer to buy a coffee. If you offer to buy lunch, that's so fantastic. I think that's the thing where people just go, can I pick your brain?
Starting point is 01:23:20 And it's like that's why this has got to stop. If you want to ask someone for time and you're not friends with them, you're not super close with them, offer to do something. Offer to say, let me bring you a thing. Let me buy you a chai latte. That's what I want specifically. But if you really want someone's time, if you want an hour of their time, you've got to offer lunch. Because what happens to me is I don't want to say no, but I'm overwhelmed. And then I spend hours figuring out a way to say no.
Starting point is 01:23:47 And then I say yes anyway. And I do it anyway. So that's my caveat is I do it anyway. But give me lunch. That's why this has got to stop. I agree. And also in general, enough with the comedians. We're done.
Starting point is 01:24:00 We're done. No one knows what to advise I feel like in that regard a lot of it I like talk to them and then they go like yeah so I just have to keep working I guess I'm like yeah yeah yeah yeah and there's no secret thing
Starting point is 01:24:17 I know you know we both have won comics Mohegan Sun competition what's the advice? Win the competition? Yeah. Yeah. And if you don't, go back and try it again, I guess.
Starting point is 01:24:31 Yeah, yeah, yeah. If you go the third time, just give it up. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, God. We want that. Yeah, I know. That's a long...
Starting point is 01:24:42 It goes on and on and on. And you live close to the casino. I say like five rounds going up to Mohegan Sun for free. What I did, I bought for the finals, it was me and two other people. You do 25 minutes, which to be fair, if you want to do a real competition, 25 minutes is a good amount of time. Oh, yeah. It doesn't matter where you go.
Starting point is 01:25:02 If you don't got it, you're going to die after after 10 that's what separates a lot of people at that round and i bought a new suit before that competition it was expensive yeah and then i had to go from that competition to something in rhode island i had to take a uber for like it was it was going to be 175 so i went to that competition going i have to win this competition to get this money back. So I gave myself a little bit of extra fire, a little bit of like, I got it. I need this. Yeah, yeah. So that's my advice, guys.
Starting point is 01:25:34 Win. Yeah. If you can't. I'm with you. What's your This Has Got to Stop? Oh, this is nothing new, but. All right, dude. Here's my other This Has Got to Stop.
Starting point is 01:25:44 Me. One, This Has Got to Stop. Because you know what? Sometimes I want to make a clip out of this. dude, here's my other this has got to stop. Me... One, this has got to stop. Because you know what? Sometimes I want to make a clip out of this. Fucking this has got to stop. It's not a brilliant... The clip's going to start with you going like, this sucks.
Starting point is 01:25:52 Okay, it's not a brilliant idea, comedic idea, but I saw something the other day, and I was like, what has to stop is we've got to stop losing fat people to skinny people. Like, them changing... something is lost in translation always they're never as interesting chris pratt adele all any anyone that you name that was fat they're a little more they're a little boring now like and there's something that's like not quite there and they they seem like you're kind of worried about them you're like
Starting point is 01:26:26 what's going on you seem a little crazy you seem a little off you seem a little psycho like what's going on and i just it just and i and i'm not advocating that people stay fat but i am saying if you're known as fat it just is not john good. Think about how good John Goodman and how you see him in the Connors. And you're like, can he act anymore? Can he even talk anymore? Like, it seems so awkward.
Starting point is 01:26:52 Yeah. It seems so weird. It's something's lost and we can't ever get it back and we all miss it. And, and I'm sorry. I'm not, not to take anything away from you, but to take everything away from you.
Starting point is 01:27:05 You're, I don't know what to do anything away from you, but to take everything away from you. You're, I don't know what to do with these people. Do you think the inverse works? Do you think, do you think if I, if I put on a hundred pounds that I'd be funnier? Oh yeah. No,
Starting point is 01:27:17 no, no. I don't know. I'm not saying I have no opinions on people going fat. I only have it on like, and I'm, again, it has nothing to do with how they look it's
Starting point is 01:27:25 actually just like what am i what's happening here like i mean adele can still sing sure sure but she doesn't seem as fun maybe i don't know i don't want to get the adele fans in the comments but certainly with john goodman and chris pratt i'm like what happened guys what happened yeah you were you were you know and john goodman's old, so maybe that, I don't know. It's just like, there's something lost. Yeah, maybe John Goodman's doctor said you could either die a very interesting man now. I don't understand how that, I don't understand how that impacts his acting. Like, or his like, it just is awkward to watch him talk.
Starting point is 01:27:58 It's just like, I don't know what it is. I don't know what it is. And Chris Pratt, what happened? He was so funny. What happened? You know? Yeah. I imagine they just, they're not as happy.
Starting point is 01:28:12 They're going to the gym, so they don't have any interesting stories. What's their story? I went to them treadmill, and it sucked. I don't know. Cool. I don't know. You know what I'm saying? No, I totally know what you're saying.
Starting point is 01:28:21 There's something. Post Malone, kind of. He was never like that, but didn't he just get like wicked like super skinny post malone they all get that temptation i okay if you you okay you you get snl you become movie star you get a lot of money and there's some new pill no i'm dropping'm dropping it all. I'm just saying. Would you ever? Do you think that would ever be something you'd want to see? Yeah, maybe out of curiosity.
Starting point is 01:28:56 Do you worry you'd stop being funny? No. You'd start yelling on stage and people would be like, oh, God, this skit guy's yelling about the hunger use. That's why I am curious because I'm like, what happened? It's not just about the weight. It's some sort of personality thing that goes through that transition where it's less interesting to me. Or something happens. And I don't think it's just me. I think it's pretty quantifiable.
Starting point is 01:29:19 It feels like there's something that happens. I know a comic who was big and then got small and then got big again. We could talk to them and say what happened. What changed? Was he funny when he was skinny? I can't go into this. Dubinus got to stop. Yeah, it's kind of like, it's random, but I thought of it recently, like a week ago.
Starting point is 01:29:44 I don't like people asking me for a massage like like i'm is this happening why do people expect well like like my wife or my daughter i thought you meant random no no but like why is that like if you're a family member you just expect can you just do my shoulders? And I'm like, I don't like doing it. I don't feel like I'm good at it. And I don't like it. I fucking hate it.
Starting point is 01:30:14 My hands get tired really fast. I think that's the point, though, is that if your loved ones aren't going to do it, who are you going to ask? Go to someone with a license for it. I'm a license for it. I get that. I'm always asking for it on my feet. Really?
Starting point is 01:30:29 Nicole? Yeah. Nicole's giving you long foot massages? Not long, but at the end of the day, you want just a little bit, not every day. You know? But sometimes... How long are these? How long are we talking? We're talking two minutes on each foot. They, they're short.
Starting point is 01:30:45 That's pretty nice. That is nice. It is nice. That's what I'm saying. Two minutes, your hands get. But that's why I'm like, I, you know, I'm just putting them in her face. You know, just being like, you know, like, kind of like. That's what my daughter does, too.
Starting point is 01:30:58 I would have to really. Tova's giving me a foot massage on my birthday. Wow. Okay. Like, we'll do a lot. I'm doing her feet too A lot of back scratching you're doing her feet Do you feel like you're skilled like you have like moves
Starting point is 01:31:10 No no you're just like you know Just crushing them you know you're just like You know I don't feel like it's great I don't feel like no offense to either of us Neither of us are great at it you know It's like when you go to a professional Masseuse you're like Wow they are strong
Starting point is 01:31:26 I got one in Hawaii And it was like It was a 90 minute massage And with feet Everything Whole body Everything The whole body
Starting point is 01:31:34 It was amazing It really like 90 minutes is long That is long I just worry Sometimes you fall asleep And then you're like What did I
Starting point is 01:31:41 What did I pick What happened Yeah No I didn't I was I mainly be like I need to do it more i need to do it more here than i i do buy buy your wife and your daughter like professional massages and then they'll be like your massage is sucked down right yeah that's the solution yeah right that's a good point yeah yeah um you hear that tova no more
Starting point is 01:31:59 massages no we're all in agreement here yeah it would be funny if like a fifth grader's like give me a massage you're like are you to your fucking mind are you to your fucking mind our final segment you better count your blessing you better count your blessing
Starting point is 01:32:19 this was a downside episode I don't know if we'll ever top this one ever again it was so great but uh now is our time to say something we are we are thankful for i'm trying to pull up the the name of the thing uh russell what what are you thankful for i'm thankful for our friend chris cafero got to see him this weekend in from la he'll never hear this but um he it was so good to see him. And I saw him on Friday night and Saturday night. And it was just, oh, I miss him so much, you know, now that he's not here.
Starting point is 01:32:52 Yeah, it was nice to see him. I've seen him so much, honestly. I think I probably see him as much as I did when he lived here. You think? I mean. You saw him out in L.A., I guess. I guess in Uncle Function stuff. But yeah, yeah.
Starting point is 01:33:04 Yeah, I don't know. It was just really nice to see him and get some, some good time in with him. So, yeah, thank you for him. Yeah.
Starting point is 01:33:11 Did you like that restaurant that we went to? Okay. Yeah, you saw him a bunch. It was fine. Yeah, it wasn't the best food.
Starting point is 01:33:18 No. Who picked it? Okay, well, I made no fucking promises to you. At least I did something. We should throw in a blessing for Douglas's wedding party. Yes.
Starting point is 01:33:32 Fantastic. What a great night that was. It was great. He did it at a sauna on the lower. No, it was a beautiful venue. I know when he comes in, though, his disgust up is the AC breaking down. Oh, my God. god yeah that was it was just so funny to to be like to oh man you were you're just like because you kept thinking when i first walked in you're like well maybe just this room and then
Starting point is 01:33:56 that whole room but i felt bad because you were like it was such a you really got over quickly i did i felt like i had a great time like 10 felt like 10 minutes in, you're like, oh, it's this way. Douglas actually will listen to this. I had a great time. He also had a delivery of Shake Shack at 11 p.m. And I got to tell you, it was the perfect timing. I had Shake Shack the next day before the show. Took some home with me. Oh, wow.
Starting point is 01:34:19 In a little bag. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Took a little doggie bag. Yeah, it was a great night. Great. So much fun. Great wedding. Can't wait for the next one uh i had such a great time uh i saw we're gonna have him on the podcast um he brian ford i was on his podcast called the flaky biscuit coming out soon but he is a
Starting point is 01:34:39 world-class bread maker and we went to this was It was called DoorDash Studios. I think cooks can go there to rent out their kit. We got a box of croissants and fresh bread and it was astounding. Brian Ford, check him out. The Artisan Brian and they have a bakery
Starting point is 01:34:59 pop-up once every two weeks. It's very cool. Nice. You got a blessing for us just any blessing really yeah yeah i'm grateful that i don't have to like dress up for work i thought about that that's i could dress kind of like i'm homeless you know and i in like even stand up too i don't have to dress like some people wear a suit but i thought of that recently like because i had to get ready for a show. And I left work, had to drive like three hours, and I had clothes in the car.
Starting point is 01:35:34 And me getting ready for the show was taking my dickies off and putting jeans on. That's the extent of my dressing up. I'm like, man, this is kind of nice. I pushed myself recently. I landed somewhere and had to go straight to the show. And I fly like shit. I fly in sweatpants. And I was like, I'm going i'm gonna do it i'm gonna wear sweatpants for the show whoa i felt i felt i felt bad yeah that's that's that's impressive yeah that's the dream yeah my
Starting point is 01:35:59 dad dresses like shit yeah and the dream is to dress a little bit better than that but still i want to wear more shorts on stage when I can finally wear shorts at the cellar and not feel guilty that's when I will have made it amazing
Starting point is 01:36:12 will you do the tank top too? I want to yeah but I feel like you either got to be really fit yeah or look like shit
Starting point is 01:36:21 right and I'm right in the middle there oh don't you yeah where can people find you Jimmy Cash? or look like shit. Right. And I'm right in the middle there. Oh, don't you? Where can people find you, Jimmy Cash? JimmyCashComedy.com or TikTok, Instagram, all that, you know. Should I make an Instagram account for Jerry Squeak?
Starting point is 01:36:38 No, just get that fucking thing out of here. Russell, where can people find you? At Russell J. Daniels. And you know what? As always, come see Titanic the Musical at the Daryl Roth Theater. I've had a lot of Debbie Downsiders come through recently. It's been nice. It'll be come June 13th. I will be there. Wow.
Starting point is 01:36:54 With our producer Paige Asachika. It'll be really cool. It'll be very easy to kill you. If we sold out their first show in a long time. No, we've been selling out. Okay. We're full of Debbie Downsiders. It would be cool if after the show, more people in the audience came up to me then oh yeah the cast of titani great um uh and for me find me everywhere at marco cerezi lots of shows coming up headlining los angeles november 25th london november uh no fuck fuck. It doesn't matter. Find me online.
Starting point is 01:37:25 There's lots of dates. We're not running down the clock here. You can get it right. I just, I feel, I always feel there's like a certain time in the podcast where I feel you going, all right. Yeah, I am. I'm like, let's fucking go. Hello. Let me tell you, when we blow up, when we finally get ads, I'm going to say, Russell, we're becoming Joe Rogan.
Starting point is 01:37:44 We're going three hours. No, we're not. We're cutting back when we blow up, when we finally get ads, I'm going to say, Russell, we're becoming Joe Rogan. We're going three hours. No, we're not. We're going back when we get ads. We're going to an hour and boom, we're done. That's what I'm saying. That's why we need to have this dinner coming up soon. Have a real game plan strategy. See, we're on the same page.
Starting point is 01:37:59 Well, well, look, whether listen, God, I got to get better at this ending. Oh, yeah. What are you planning? Wait, hold up. Hold up got to get better at this ending. Oh, I forgot this. Wait, hold up, hold up. Remember this. For our Patreon subscribers, do you know any street jokes? You know what a street joke is?
Starting point is 01:38:11 Yeah, yeah, I remember this. So we're going to flash our patrons on the screen. We've been, we got a $25 patron today. That's amazing. That's amazing. If you like the show, you want to support it, you want extra bonus live episodes. Once we hit 150 patrons, Russell and I are doing the New York Times questions to fall in love to. A lot of bonus content, my clean comedy special, The Rats Are In Me, patreon.com slash downside.
Starting point is 01:38:34 Do you have a street joke that you know offhand? Oh, no, no. If one pops up, let me tell one. This is right out of the book. Russell, the judge says to a double homicide defendant, Mr. Ravioli, you're charged with beating your wife to death with a hammer. A voice at the back of the courtroom yells out, you bastard. The judge says, you're also charged with beating your mother-in-law to death with a hammer. The voice in the back of the courtroom yells out you motherfucker the judge stops the proceedings
Starting point is 01:39:10 and says to the guy in the back of the courtroom sir i can understand your anger and frustration at this crime but no more outbursts from you or i'll charge you with your with contempt understand the guy stands up and says, Your Honor, for 15 years I've lived next door to this piece of shit, and every time I asked to borrow a hammer, he said he didn't have one. That's the end of the joke?
Starting point is 01:39:38 This is the downside. You're listening to The Downside Downside You're listening to The Downside The Downside With Gianmarco Cerezi

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