The Downside with Gianmarco Soresi - #213 Getting Pummeled with Caleb Hearon

Episode Date: June 18, 2024

Comedian Caleb Hearon returns to the pod for the third time to discuss the downsides of the DNC’s fundraising texts, having his mom on his podcast, why str*ight guys don’t do enough butt stuff, getting accused of pretending to be himself on dating apps, why he’d rather die than go to a game night party, the importance of telling your friends when something’s important, and why restaurant seating rules are out of control. You can watch full video of this episode HERE! Join the Patreon free for 7 days for ad-free episodes, exclusive content, and MORE. Follow Caleb on Instagram, Twitter, and TikTok See Caleb in a city near you: https://linktr.ee/calebsaysthings Listen to Listen to Caleb's podcast, "So True with Caleb Hearon" at: https://linktr.ee/sooootruepod And follow Caleb's pod on Instagram & YouTube Follow The Downside with Gianmarco Soresi on Instagram Get tickets to our live podcast recording in NYC on July 1: https://www.showclix.com/event/the-downside-with-gianmarco-soresi-live Follow Gianmarco Soresi on Twitter, Instagram, TikTok, Facebook, & YouTube Subscribe to Gianmarco Soresi's email & texting lists Check out Gianmarco Soresi's bi-monthly show in NYC Get tickets to see Gianmarco Soresi in a city near you Watch Gianmarco Soresi's special "Shelf Life" on Amazon Follow Russell Daniels on Twitter & Instagram E-mail the show at [e-mail] Produced by Paige Asachika & Gianmarco Soresi Video edited by Dave Columbo Technical production by Chris Mueller Special Thanks Tovah Silbermann Original music by Douglas Goodhart Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Shop at Sephora today. Limitations apply. Must be a beauty insider. See terms at sephora.com for complete details. Welcome to the downside. Russ, did you shower? I showered right before, seconds before I left the apartment. But now it's wet with sweat. It's also kind of raining out, so. Yeah.

Yeah. For those tuning in for the first time, this is a I'm working on my intro is a place we give me negative complain, bitch, moan, kvetch. And we are here with the third time guest first, first, third time, first, third time formal guest. Oh my God. Do I get like a little jacket or something that's that's five we're doing the snl system here okay you're just gonna keep it directly their thing yeah god yeah but then every five after you you have to return for that episode for a brief cameo okay with the jack we need something like a jacket what would be the equivalent candace bergen will be there too who's that she always goes to the thing that's kind of all she does now yeah candace bergen i would love to tell you john marco candace bergen an iconic actress who you brown yeah murphy brown or hey here's

what here's what i'll do for you she was the pageant director on miss congeniality okay i saw miss congeniality recently wait but do you not know where murphy brown is no you guys well i was about to say you're older than me c Caleb's younger than both of us combined. I mean, I didn't watch it, but it felt like everyone knows what it is, though. Let me guess. It's a law show? No, no, I just mean like she is Murphy Brown. Soap opera?

I don't know. It's like saying like, I don't know who Tim the Toolman Taylor is. Never heard of it. Never watched it. Murphy Brown is like they parodied it on 30 Rock or it was like, it was of a different time. You watched the show.

It's in the 90s. You guys are falling apart. Yeah. I've been, like you said, this is my third time on the show and you guys are absolutely falling apart. I wanted to share,

I hope Russell will oblige me. So Russell, you get texts from Joe Biden. I get texts from Joe Biden a lot. Thank you for your service and Russell sent me a screenshot I was surprised at this Russell's the kind to write back to the robot

I'm not normally but they sent me the same quiz that they've been sending me they sent me a quiz and I said he's doing a bad job oh I got it right here we just quoted no I'm giving you context before this even happened so they sent me a quiz and I said, I said, he's doing a bad job. Oh, I got it right here. We just quoted.

No, I'm giving you context before this. Okay. So they sent me the quiz. I said, he's doing a bad job. And then all the rest of the questions that were like only phrased in a way that you could say he's, he's at least pretty. Do you think he's really young or spry for his age? Do you love the way he finishes his sentences? So I answered the quiz that one day i don't know why

and then the next day they sent me the same exact quiz and text so then i it's a real back i took the poll already and said he's doing a bad job i will only vote for this man if he stops funding a genocide so then they they texted russell i think it's so funny this is the language that they use to inspire donations i know here's what they they said. Joe Biden is getting pummeled in the polls. Your personal invite to confirm your vote for Biden expires in 60 minutes. Fast. So then I responded. And then they sent me.

They sent you again. Joe Biden is getting pummeled. Yikes. And then you said, yikes, is he in charge of this text campaign too? Do you know what my favorite one recently was? Because I do think about their fundraising emails a lot i worked in democratic fundraising briefly and always thought it was horribly annoying like the way you have to do it but the day that trump got indicted or convicted oh they uh joe biden's team sent an email that the

subject was apropos of nothing oh and the body was seems like a decent time to donate to us i'm like i'll kill you do you think that was algorithmically like designed for for you or do you think everyone got that feels very like hey cool kids hey i don't know but i'm like it just isn't hitting when you're like signing off on bombs you know what i mean it's just not really what tongue-in-cheek thing is a little played out at this moment what What's the language aside from, of course, the subject being like, hey, Joe Biden from the river to the sea. Other than that, like what language tone could he use that would make you go, OK, are you leaning towards patriotism? Are you leaning towards not sassy? Clearly.

Yeah. What? Because right now the thing is like, hey, guys, we're fucking losing bad. And that doesn't inspire me. I think he could continue to send the exact emails he's sending now and then just not support the genocide. Okay. Agreed. Agreed.

Hold on. Hey, actually, wait. I'm going to give you guys something. Will you replace when I said I'll kill you about the president and make it say I'll kiss you? Just so everyone knows I'm a good a good democrat yeah I don't know about the fundraising emails I mean I guess don't also don't send them at all I don't I'm not gonna send you I'm not sending money to politicians anymore I stopped doing that in like 2016 no that's over yeah don't you think yeah sure I'm not sending any politicians get my politics okay you what they always say get money out of politics. Okay. You what? They always say get money out of politics. I'm like, okay.

I'm going to do. Hey, I'm starting with the man in the mirror. I'm done. I'm not saying candidates, no more money. Yeah. This is the downside. One, two, three. Downside.

You're listening to The Downside. The Downside. With John Marcos Sereza we are here with a guest producer David right on time with that cue we didn't prep it and I was like I'm pointing at you and I thought you were going to go and just laptop flying but you nailed it you nailed it

this is the downside if you're a fan of the show join the patreon patreon.com slash downside bonus episodes live episodes we announced on our last episode our live tour a fan of the show, join the Patreon, patreon.com slash downside. Bonus episodes, live episodes. We announced on our last episode, our live tour. A lot of things going on. Yeah. Where are you guys going?

How many cities? Short little stint, Philly, Boston, DC, New York. New York. What are you guys making on Patreon? Tell the listeners. It's public. It's nothing. It's nothing huge.

It's, I think right now we're making $1,500 a month. Oh, you went for the actual... Okay. You told the truth. Is your guys' number public? No, the number of people is public. Is the money not public? No, man. That's just you throwing that out there.

You can do the math. Which way? What do you think? Yeah, you could. But some people do five. Some people do ten. We are getting pummeled in the Patreon numbers right now. We need your support.

Apropos of nothing. Hey, bitch. The downside could be some patrons. God. Well, you started a podcast and quickly soared to the top. Yeah. Podcast is doing okay. You just had your mom.

I was listening to your mom's episode. What'd you think of it? I, you know what? I'm going to say I was a little just had your mom I was listening to your mom's episode What did you think of it I'm going to say I was a little attracted to your mom Your mom in the clips She had something She has like a spark There's a quality to her

Just so you know Russell says this about every guest mom No I don't Your mom's intimidating to me sexually But like I But Kayla's mom, just, there's something there. She has an effervescence. Yes. Yes.

She, she's very charming. Yeah. My mom is very charming. I will get, I will give her that. Yeah. Um, no, that episode was really, really fun and interesting. My mom and I have had a, uh, a lot of conversations like that one. Um, we're very, very close, but it was fun to But it was fun to do one for the podcast.

I didn't know how it would go. I didn't know if people would really care. If it was like an inside baseball thing or if people would be like, oh, it's interesting. I thought it was funny, though, because in one of the clips you talked to your mom about does she ever wish at some point she would try eating pussy. And I thought, like, I'm also comfortable talking to my mom about those things in a way that sometimes people from the outside are like, what the fuck is going on? People didn't like that. People didn't, people were commenting. This is not a way to talk to your mother. I'm like, what do you guys not eating? I mean, you're not like doing something to her. Yeah. She and I aren't going to hook up. Like we're

just talking about a thing that, you know, I'm here because she had sex with some guy, you know, that's the genesis of our relationship. I don't know. People are so weird and conservative about parenthood. I think it's like my mom. Yeah. I don't know. People are so weird and conservative about parenthood. I think it's like, yeah, I don't know. My mom is just like my buddy. Yeah, I don't know. I think it's just they grow up and you don't talk about it at all. So it feels so foreign. But when your parents, especially when your parents are single at any point in your childhood,

like you deal with them. Do they go on a date? Like the idea of is sex happening? It exists in the space and you have to confront it. Yeah. And also maintaining. I think there's a very conservative thing about maintaining a parent child, like high status, low status dynamic into your adult life. It's like I don't I'm not to say when exactly it should happen.

I think it probably varies per person. But like at some point, you and your parents should move into a different type of relationship than like you being scared to tell them about your life choices or them being scared to talk to you about their. Like at some point, you need to move to a place where it's like more of a friendship. I do think that's appropriate. Yeah, I think some people still want that that caretaker or they want someone who if you know about someone's sex life, you know about their flaws, you know about their shortcomingscomings you know about things about them that might turn you off yeah and like some people i think just want that like godlike figure of like a parent who can comfort them and they can go is everything going to be okay and the parent goes yes and you believe it yeah yeah you want to you want to hold them in that same esteem because it helps you yeah but then i think it makes it more jarring to like if they do that

then when they have to caretake for them you you're like, oh fuck, we're fully reversing this rather than gradually getting on the same plane and then having to do the caretaking thing. Do you know, it's interesting that I was thinking about from the mom episode that we didn't obviously talk about in the episode, cause it was kind of a result is like any time there's something interesting. I had a bad, um, okay. My dad was bad at being a father, right? My mom is incredible at being a mother. When I talk about my dad being bad at parenthood, no one would ever to your face go, oh, my dad's incredible. So I have a great dad.

But when you talk about having a good relationship with a parent, people who have like mommy issues or like bad mothers, which exist, they are so comfortable being like, yeah, not all moms are like that. Like it's kind of like the long Mother's Day post of someone who has an estranged mom where they're like, just so not all moms are like that. Like, it's kind of like the long Mother's Day post of someone who has an estranged mom

where they're like, just so everyone knows like, today, like, if you do not love your mom, like, that is okay. You don't have, it's like, maybe just wait until tomorrow. I don't know. I don't think you, like, the way people will make their parent issues so presently your problem is so weird to me.

Yeah. I'm one of those people. Stone cold Simon. No, no, I get what you're saying. I'm just like, I'm trying to think about like,

what is the pain that they feel that they need? Or what? Yeah, it just sucks. I think it's, it's more not, it doesn't suck. I think it's just like,

sometimes you witness people with their parental relationships and you go like, wow, that must've been so nice. Yeah. And I know that feeling because i have that well yeah so i would never i just would never when someone like if someone put out a podcast episode where they're being very happy and comfortable with their mom yeah there was like a clip of my mom saying like mothers love their children so much because they're a part of each other they share

cells and she was talking in a blanket way about motherhood because it's the only way she's ever been a mom is good at it yeah and people are commenting being like fucking false i wish my mom and all moms are truly yeah and i was like oh god like okay drag my mom for being incredible at motherhood i don't like what are we accomplishing here um did she say anything that that caught you off guard or can can your mom still hurt your feelings? No, my mom can't hurt my feelings. Um, I mean, I guess she could, there, there are things she could say that would, but nothing she would ever do would hurt my feelings. She wouldn't behave that way. You know what I mean? Um, you started with a great story about if you wouldn't mind, uh, sharing, uh, this TV incident when you were, yeah, the Christmas, I was ungrateful, all caps.

Yeah, she only brought that up to me very recently. And Russell, I don't know if you saw that part or not, but there was this Christmas where we grew up very poor. There were times that we didn't have money for food. We were very, very poor. Did you go back and forth with your mom

and dad? No, I was full with my mom and then every couple weekends I would go spend the weekend with my dad. But my mom was a single mom raising two kids by herself putting herself through nursing school working three jobs crazy shit and um yeah i really wanted a tv for christmas in my bedroom because all my like not all my friends but my rich friends um missouri rich had tvs in their bedrooms so i asked for that for christmas and my mom like worked extra shifts and like went to fucking like Black Friday at Walmart and like fought people to get me a little TV for my room for Christmas.

It was a big thing for her to do. And I, when I opened it, I was disappointed because it was like pretty small. It was a small TV. Like I want to say it was like. How small are we talking? It was like small enough that it was definitely like you would have a hard time putting a smile on if you were 13 as well. It was small and you're 13 and you've seen what a real tv looks like i don't know cal

like was it like so small you could like pick it up with a little handle with one hand it was so small and so cheap that they wouldn't even dare like they wouldn't deign to give you a handle you know what i mean like it was just tiny and it was it was lovely it was perfectly good for a child's bedroom but i at the time i opened it and it's not like i was like oh my god you crazy bitch what were you thinking i just was like and she could tell and she um she only recently brought this up to me that she was she cries when she talks about it she was like that broke my heart i worked so hard oh and she's like you went to your bedroom and cried and i the reason i cried was actually i explained to her like i wasn't crying about the tv i was crying because i was closeted and depressed and nothing was making me happy

at that point in my life things that had made me so happy before like songs that I liked or like playing soccer like anything that I enjoyed was not making me happy anymore which now I know was like full grade depression but I didn't have words for that and no one in my family talked about that stuff either and they were all mentally ill as well My dad's one of the most mentally ill people I've ever met. So I was crying because I knew that I should be happy and I wasn't. I had that, my dad wants, my dad would go to New York and he'd like go on some big money trip,

I'm sure to sleep with whoever he was cheating on with. But he'd come back and always bring a gift. And he brought a video game, Star Fox, I think it was called. It was just like a game that I hated or whatever. And it was one of those moments where I was supposed to be like excited and grateful and i felt such shame that i didn't yeah and i went in my room and i cried yeah and then he came by and i told him and looking back i also think there was a degree of like oh he doesn't know anything i think it was a moment of seeing a gift where he didn't know anything about me he was just buying a weird

yeah thing that he thought you know know, was on the shelves. Yeah. But I remember it's getting a gift that you don't want is awful or that's not right. And you also don't have that emotional regulation where you're like, I have been happy at something like this before. I know I should be happy.

I am not. What is going on? So I went to my room and cried and I asked her, like maybe the time before the podcast episode, when we had talked about this at lunch, that she randomly brought it up at lunch. I was like, what did you do the rest of the day? And she's like, I went to my room and cried. And I was like, oh, so we're just both in our rooms crying.

Fantastic. But yeah, it was that shit like that. I'm trying to think. You said, is there anything she said on the episode that surprised me? Yeah. Or that you really didn't realize. to me yeah or or that you really didn't realize like when i talk with my mom so much uh when we get into it so much is just a a re um contextualization of the my my father i learned so much about my father and kind of the lies or just the framing it's like it feels like

learning uh history in america and then going going to Japan and learning their perspective of things. Yeah. It's just so different. And you go, oh, that changes it. And oh, he was kind of the bad guy in this thing. Yeah. I think the one thing that she talked about in that episode that surprised me was how much – I don't even know if shame is the right word. that surprised me was how much um i don't i don't even know if shame is the right word but uh she was feeling raising us a lot of um probably shame and guilt around us not having a two-parent

household and money like those things like those those my friends who had two parents in the house and had money we had neither and i definitely felt shame about that but i thought that i was wrong for feeling that and uh i i think in a way it is a wrong feeling, but it is something that you feel. And she was processing a lot of that too. And we never talked about it, even though we were both feeling it. It was worse.

I wasn't going to go to her and be like, Hey, I hate that we're poor. Could you step it up? You know? Sure. When the men she dated, I did not want to stick around.

So I definitely was like, don't try to fix that part. You know? How many, did she bring a lot of guys in your life over the years? Did she have like a rule of like when she introduced you other than the no eating pussy rule so she has that one uh i don't know if she had a rule about when she brought them to me my mom is a really like my mom is a

really giving person and she i think she sees the best in people and so uh even at a young age she would bring a guy around and i could just immediately put it all together i was like you're gonna try to fix this guy he's a piece of shit like she just she would take on somebody who was like you know uh he would always have one fatal flaw like an achilles he would he would have like he'd be super charming and he'd have great taste in music he'd be a really cool guy to hang out with and then he'd be like a horrible drunk you know or yeah just one thing that she was convinced that she could like love him out of and i just from the start would be like this ain't gonna work girl what for what age did your parents split up again they were never together they were never together

yeah what were you at any point when you were younger and a new guy brought in you attached to him or were you like standoffish from the get oh i would say when i was younger there was probably a guy or two that i was like oh this might work out that he there was a definitely a guy when i when i was in like eighth grade my mom got together with a guy for two that I was like, oh, this might work out. There was definitely a guy when I was in eighth grade, my mom got together with a guy for several years that we moved in with and he had two daughters. Wow. They were engaged to be married and his daughters

are still to this day. I just was at a wedding celebration for one of them. They're my sisters. We still consider each other family. Really? Oh, yeah. That's incredible. We're very close. I have it called my dad's ex's kids that we have a relationship. Yeah. You know, they see the show when I'm in town.

Yeah, yeah. They come through. They get some comp tickets. Listen, shows do that to your life. They give you a little bit of a focal point to like, it's not an authentic thing. You know, they're coming to see you talk and you go, hi. Yeah. But you go to Connecticut and you go, oh, these people I had a relationship with are,

I'm catching up with them yeah these Abby and Taylor shout out Abby and Taylor love you guys they're already listeners they're big downsiders they're big Debbie Downers what do you guys call your fans Debbie Downsiders yeah they're

tremendous they like at a very pivotal time in my life when I like was very self hating and like trying to pivotal time in my life when i like uh was very self-hating and like trying to still be in the closet and was like you know trying to be christian and like pray the gay away they were two people who like showed me cool music and were like that shit you're doing is lame like you need to fucking stop did you tell them you were trying to pray the gay away no i i was closeted to them and they very much from jump street were like okay honey whatever like they knew i was gay really and that yeah and they very much from Jump Street were like, okay, honey, whatever. Like they knew I was gay.

Really? Yeah. And they were such cool girls. They still are. They're such cool girls. They have the best taste in music, the best taste in TV shows. Like they just were so much cooler than me in every conceivable way. And they kind of like ushered me into like who I eventually became.

Like they made me like a cool person with good taste. I had a friend in high school who was like a good friend for a little me and and a woman and he was just so so clearly gay and i just remember it never came to fruition in high or like he never came out in high school but it was one of these things where it was like i certainly would have never said a single thing but me and the woman of course would be like well clearly yeah he's gay this has to occur at some point for him to be because he was also miserable yeah you know i didn't know i don't know what you'd say i don't know what i would have said back then even now with perspective i remember one specific moment where they had this gay friend who was like an out gay guy in like his twenties or something, they were probably, we were probably like, maybe I was 16. They were like 17 and 19.

And they, he, I came over to the house for a hangout and it was just the four of us. And I, I can put together now at the time I was just really uncomfortable, but I can put together now that they were like, Hey, you need to like,

sure. Talk really positively about being a gay guy on purpose and see if we can get him to come out to us. Cause they were, he was very much like, yeah, the first time I hooked up with a guy like, what about you,

Caleb? And I was like, Oh, I don't, I don't do that. You know, like it was very like they, now I'm looking back and going,

they were dead. It was an intervention, you know, but it didn't, it did not take. That's a fun intervention. Just constantly. Why are you always bringing gay guys around?

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Truly. Sounds fun. I wish I was gay. Yeah. Derek's coming over. Derek's coming over and we're gonna watch some films you know they put on the normal heart yeah i think i think that um yeah i think that i would be a much

different person had i not lived with those girls for that time so that i didn't like that guy that much um but i loved his daughters and that was a fun, that was a fun time to live with them. And when they, when you moved out of that house, yeah. Was that, was that upsetting? Were you, did you like, how did they tell, how did your mom explain that it wasn't working out? Uh, it was, it was pretty easy to explain. He went to jail. So the, that guy went to jail. The cops told you.

Yeah. He got like 17 DUIs or something. Oh. And they finally were like, Hey man, it's jail time. And so that's the cop. So many 17,

man. I'm sorry. That's kind of how it, that's in Missouri. It is a little bit like that. It's like, it's just the cops being like, damn brother,

we get it. But I think we have to send you to jail for a little bit. Like everyone's got at least one DUI out there. 17 strikes and you're out of something i mean you know it was it was he got a couple and uh so he went to jail and then um went for like a year and my mom waited on him and like oh i took care of his house visit him at jail ever no she did but i didn't like him and also i was my mom wouldn't have had me do that. Like wouldn't have probably let me, even if I wanted to, she took care of his house.

She like the girls stayed there and stayed in school. She like basically ran everything for him while he was in jail. And then the, the idea was he was going to be sober when he got out and he got out and started drinking, uh, immediately again and got caught. And my mom was like, we're out of here.

And I was pretty happy about it. Cause he was, he was, um, that guy sucked. I didn't like him. His vibes were bad. Great taste of music though, which is important to me.

He showed me some really good music. He really turned me on to Otis Redding and Ray LaMontagne and Johnny Lang, blues and soul. So I appreciate him for that. Guys who drink, they're going to have good taste in blues. Dad's really responsible for music taste. I like some oldies, some Led Zeppelin. My dad was really into disco some Led Zeppelin. My dad was really into disco and Led Zeppelin stuff.

We listened to Elvis exclusively and then the worst country pop. Whatever's just playing on the country pop. You know what I mean? Elvis and that's it. Nothing. Like a shitload of Elvis all the time? Elvis. Loved Elvis. Do you like it?

Yeah, it's fine you know like it's not my big thing I think it's sometimes when you're introduced to something that's like so a part of growing up you're not able to hear it in a way that's like like if I could hear the Beatles without having it be in every single fucking thing yeah it would be cool to hear that but you you know you just already know it so um yeah but i like some of it but um he's had the last elvis one of the last things before he died those last shows every time you see old elvis it looks like he's going to die in the middle of the show he's just sweating just like barely looks like he can he can stand he there's one he puts the mic in his mouth almost chokes on it he who's fucked up yeah i want to do some shows like that right before i go yeah i want

to do some like yeah i want to do some some like that right before I go. Yeah. I want to do some, like, yeah, I want to do some, some or music who knows what I might do by then. But I, I really want to do some shows where people like imminently he's going. Yeah.

If I knew I was about to die on stage, I think I'd throw myself in for a crowd surf and, and I die midair. Really? And then they crowd surf and they realize as they're surfing me around that I'm dead. And I mean, I would, I want to die like on stage and make sure

everyone can see it and it burns brightly into their eyes. You think that's so traumatic to watch someone die? Well, so, okay, are you doing one of these? Because this happened where they go to sit on the stool and then they or do you want to scream? Loud, as loud as possible. do you want to scream loud, loud, as loud

as possible? I just, I want to die in an interesting way. That's what I've been saying lately. Yeah. That's all I want. Something interesting. I don't care when I'm like traumatic, not necessarily. I'm not like, I'm having a great time being alive truly, but I'm not addicted to staying

around. I wouldn't be like, I don't want to go anywhere. I like being here. I'd like to live a long life. But my only goal for my death is I want it to to go anywhere. I like being here. I'd like to live a long life. But my only goal for my death is I want it to be something interesting. Like I want to like jump on a grenade and save a bus full of school children.

Or I want to like parachute. I want to parachute in some random foreign country and get caught in a tree. I like the idea that you jumping on the grenade, your body would prevent the grenade from... It would. Yeah? Yeah.

In the middle of the bus. It would save some people. I would say, first of all, it would do that with anyone's body. But I think we have to take a look at the evidence and go, this is a body that would do some shielding. I mean, just mass-wise, this is a body that would do some shielding. Yeah, our bodies would shield more than yours, but I think, like... Yeah, me and those kids are fucking...

No, some of those kids would be saved even with you. Sure, sure. Like, you know, yeah. I don't think... I think grenades... It absorbs the black... John Marco? We're not talking about... I'm not doing this with you sure sure like you know yeah i don't think i think grenades it absorbs the black john marco we're not talking about i'm not talking about yeah you're wrong we're talking about a standard grenade we're not talking about whatever the u.s so you didn't mean an interesting death you meant like you meant like a hero's death no hero's death is one version it's

an umbrella situation it's a squares and rectangles. Hero's death falls under interesting death. Okay. But my interesting death does not have to fall under hero's death. I tell you what, I do not want to be eaten. Okay. I don't. I mean, I think anytime you hear a story about someone getting eaten by bear, tiger, alligator, it seems awful.

Yeah. I mean, it's interesting. As long as it's quick. As long as they get me in the jugular or something, I would take it. quick i don't want to die in a funny way like how like i don't care from a piano fall like her like yeah i don't want to fall is a that's an interesting getting lost that's a good death that's the kind of loss that's like that's the kind of interesting i don't want like i don't want to be on instagram live being like i hope there's not an active shooter in this grocery store and then i get active shot no like that would piss me off that i'm like a meme i don't want to be a meme dude that would really fucking

piss me off that feeling when you're worried there's an active shooter and there is where i'm carrying like 17 pizzas and i slip on a banana peel and someone captures it on video like a ring camera and i get my head in a way that kills me. And all those Twitter accounts, it's just a picture of you. Like the last picture taken of Caleb before he slipped on the banana peel. Yeah. Yeah. That would kill, that would kill me. Oh yeah. I don't want to be a joke. Yeah. Like all those people from that, uh, spike TV show. Like you've, you know, Oh, a thousand ways to die. Yeah. I've never seen it. It just sounds off. It's not that's the kind of thing that triggers. Yeah, it's like somebody masturbates

with a raw carrot and they die from a bacterial infection and then everyone's like, you know, you can die from masturbating with a carrot. It's like that person actually really died. That's horrible contributed to the science of knowing. Yeah, I hadn't thought of that. I love don't jerk off with a carrot. I probably closest to that. Are you guys doing butt

stuff? Not really. In what sense? Like, sexually. Not together. Well, because the other day, we talked about this on the Patreon episode. We can bring it up now. We were walking to a venue.

Oh, yeah. And someone on the street said, which one of you takes it up the ass? To us. Well, I'm sorry to say, definitely the one in the rainbow berries tank top. I'm so glad. If you guys were a gay couple.

That's what I said. I said i said well he had you were wearing a cola scola oh mary shirt at the time i had a headband on uh so we but i think i was perplexed he could not he could not calculate which he was mad about it too though i have i have all i had i used to have a joke about that that when people ask which one's the girl and which one's the boy i I'm like, the one wearing the Britney Spears t-shirt does what you think he does. You can almost always tell by looking. It's like there's a clear bottom. You guys would be a beautiful gay couple.

Well, answer his question, Russell. I've tried and I haven't found success in a way that is meaningful. How have you tried? Couple fingers, a strap arm no no nothing nothing serious i want to tell you that you're missing a straight i want to tell any any guys listening who are not doing butt stuff stuff a sign mail at birth people there is a thing going on in your butt that it will make you come so hard can i can i tell you my why the idea of a strap on Can I tell you why the idea of a strap-on doesn't appeal to me?

Yes, you can. He's like, no. No. No. Interview is over. Shut up. Turn it off. Okay.

So my theory has always been like if I were to try, other than fingers, fingers, whatever. Yeah. You'd become gay. No. Okay. Is that I would sooner, quite the opposite. I'd say I'd sooner with a guy doing it than a woman because, listen, listen, listen.

I know, I know, I know. We're all so tired. I know, I know, Caleb. But here's why. Why? Because if I'm going to be experiencing that, which I understand, I'm familiar with the sensations. There's a vulnerability of like, oh, Leo, making noises and whatnot. And I want the other person to be in a state, in a similar state, if they're going to witness me in that vulnerable state.

So it's kind of like feeling like you're high with someone who's sober and you feel self-conscious because of that. So that there's something about pegging where I understand. Can she not though? You could get a double, you can get a rub, but it's not the same thing. I mean, Dr. Marco. Sorry, I'm just explaining. I'm explaining myself.

Like a double strap on or like a strap on that has like a vibrating base. It would be effectively the same thing. I think you've created a reality where you don't have to fully experiment. And I think, Russell, your hands are not clean here either. You boys... He's busy fingering himself. Before I come for episode number four, I want you guys to come from butt stuff.

Listen, we've done more than most. How do we know? No, we've done more than most. How do we know? No, I think most people, I think most, not most, but I think. I don't think so. I think there's a lot of guys who don't even wash. They don't even put soap. They're so scary.

That's true. But I do remember seeing Chris Rock had a movie called Top Five. I do remember seeing Chris Rock. I saw Chris Rock. I saw Chris Rock. From Anal Simulation. I saw Chris Rock from anal simulation and it was this movie where it was like some woman that he was in love with

but she had a boyfriend and there was a montage towards the end where she put a finger up his ass once and then suddenly that's all he wanted and then it was time for sex she got all sexy came out of the bathroom and he was like on all fours on the bed like hi and the implication was very much once you do this you'll be gay yeah and there i i can tell that that's certainly that's something ingrained there's something deep in the dna of it

he said chris rock is right on this yeah no but there's something deep like societal that even if i'm uh progressive in my mind something deep about the idea of getting pegged that feels very there's something about me that pushes it away I'm not saying it's good you have to commit to getting the materials and spending some money on it

it's not like something you can rent or be like maybe you gotta really commit before you try it and you don't want to go cheap this is why it's so much easier to just uh have a guy involved let's bring a guy in this is back back to my earlier point that you rolled your eyes at yeah well i just like to be confrontational with you it doesn't murder my actual you've never with a strap on no i'm not even bottoming that much i just like to bring straight guys into the conversation you any gay guys do it they ever go sometimes i can't get it up i'll have a strap on no i'm not even bottoming that much i just like to bring straight guys into the conversation you any gay guys do it they ever go sometimes i can't get it up i'll have a strap on

just back up i don't know i've uh that's not happening to me at this current juncture but if i ever have a problem getting it up i guess maybe i would get a strap on that'd be nice kind of uh outsource that work i want a strap on but there's a there's an indent where if I can't get up, I can put it in the indent and feel like it's mine. One more time? Say that. Describe that. Do that again for me. Because guys, we can't have a... It would be tough for us to wear a strap on because we got

the penis in the way. You mean like a hollow? A hollow. So I could like armor. So you can lay your softie in there. Yeah, and feel like this is me. I'm virile.

It must exist. I'm sure. All of these things must exist. All of these things all exist. People are so progressive now. Yeah. Which is beautiful. There's something about spending money on a thing. Like I bought a flashlight in high school. But I haven't bought anything since, really.

Yeah. In terms of like, I always see the ads and it's some like machine that you put it on to all the work and I'm like 130 bucks. I couldn't possibly.

Did you go in person to buy the fleshlight? No, I got those online when I was younger, shipped them to my dad's. They send it to you with no labeling. So you feel like. I ran into a high school director at a porn shop once.

Not my high school director. It was from someone like from a community theater setting. Just want to clear it up. My high school choir director was like a nice conservative Christian lovely person. Just the way you never had sex once. No, no, no. But I'm just saying like this was someone else, a community theater person. But it was awkward enough where I was in high school with friends and we were like doing that thing where you go and you're just like giggling and stuff.

And then, but he was there. He was really there. He wasn't giggling with anybody. He was not giggling. Stone cold. He was doing business there. You know, he had many business things to attend to there. He's holding the strap onto the light.

And you're just like, hi. And you're just, oh, yeah. He said hi to attend to there. He's holding the strap onto the light. And you're just like, hi. He said hi to you? Yeah. I mean, it was like there was no way around it. We came across each other face to face. I mean, hey, no one did anything wrong there. No one did anything wrong. But it was quite shocking at the time when you were in high school.

Of course. Of course. I'm sorry to say that when, John Marco, when you said that you got a flashlight in high school my i my brain went i didn't know that i didn't know that they had them when you were in high school like i didn't i really genuinely was trying to do the math and i was like did they have them when i was in high school i didn't know that you thought back in my day we were doing the american pie way i genuinely did not know the flashlights have been around that long and this happens to me pretty often like i'm actually i'm a little bit stupid and like i'm not stupid overall i think i'm a smart person but like i'll

be watching like i was watching the crown you know and it's um it maybe it's like the 50s or 60s in one part of it and a dog ran up and i a genuine part of my brain went i you thought they were still wolves back then i just was kind of like I you thought they were still wolves back then I just was kind of like oh I guess they did have dogs back then like it really oh yeah there's a part of me that was like oh shit yeah they would have had dogs then yeah which is like so obvious and stupid of me but there are I can't have any concept sometimes of like I just the other day was watching sex in the city there was an episode from like 2000 big jar of Nutella I thought that came out and like, you know

what? You know what? That does that kind of blow this out of me. What I was watching an old episode of I love Lucy and what's what's her husband's name? Ricky Ricky. So he comes home with a big flashlight and Lucy. You're so stupid. I hate you. That would be a great episode of I Love Lucy. Instead of the chocolate factory, she's working at the Fleshlight Factory. She's got to figure each one as it's going by.

She can't be fast enough. That is a part of the job at the Fleshlight Factory. You have to figure each one. I'm sure you've got to make sure it opens. You've got to make sure it goes away. Or someone can get hurt. On Twitter, they show some? It's like on Twitter, they show someone who's really good at their job

and they flick a hundred tomatoes into each box. But it's just someone who knows how to finger them. You got to make sure there's nothing at the bottom. It's sharp. Yeah. Yeah. What a disaster. Recalled flashlight.

There was a set of dentures at the bottom of it. Oh my God. Cut all this, okay? Cut this whole moment. You know how they make... They'll make like dildos that are molded after... They make fleshlights molded after people's pussies or penises.

Yeah. That's the downside merch. You could get... You could get, you could get, Oh, I'm trying to figure out new merch ideas that I just feel like that would be, that would be so fresh. Keep thinking.

I think keep thinking. Keep spitballing. Yeah. Hey, let's do, let's get a whiteboard in here. Let's do a little bit more brainstorming. You know, what's funny in that,

in that vein of things, I get kind of accused uh lately of or i interrogated on dating apps of being a catfish oh people you're faking people will be like are you actually caleb heron and i'm like it would be so crazy to choose to act like me like i'm i do fine but i'm not getting nearly enough ass for anyone to pretend to be me you know what i mean imagine being like oh i want i think i want a catfish um i think i'm going to pick caleb heron who a fat gay guy with like a little bit of attention that's a crazy crazy choice yeah every time it cracks me up they go is it really you prove it i'm like what prove it

prove it yeah what do you do i think if they were they the proof is that the picture is not of benny skinner that's the proof why would you pick me get a crib um how's dating going you guys um i think i'm gonna have a good good career. I think I like my relationship with my family. I've got good friendships. I might have. I think if things keep going well, I'll probably have a good like real estate portfolio. These are things I can look forward to in my life.

My love life is such a fucking joke. What joke in what way? Yeah. The way where I'm not having a good one. Like it just like I don't know, dude. I can't, there's something, of course, there's something wrong with me. But in an even bigger way, there's something wrong with everyone else. You know?

And so that creates this sort of tornado of consequences where I go on three dates with a guy. The sex is fine or good even. And something's off. You know, he turns out to be a weirdo or annoying or he lives in another city and I can't keep up the texting. There's just something, there's always something. Would you rather have, cause you're kind of, uh, not by coastal, what would you say? By, by live you're by, I'm by, I'm, I'm, I'm a little, I'm in kin city a lot. I'm in LA a lot. I'm in New York a lot, but I'm never anywhere enough to like build a thing. Where, where would you, where do you think that that guy would be in Kansas city? Are they in the business in some

capacity or on the coast? Like ideally I would find a guy in Kansas city. That would be amazing. I give people way more chances there. I look much harder there. I would like to raise kids there. That's like a thing that I would like in my life. But I date, I'm honestly considering a move to New York because I date so much more here really i can't walk down the street without getting laid in new york and if i hit on someone in la they like they can euthanize me it's they're legally allowed to euthanize me like la versus new york dating for me i don't know if it's going this way for everyone but i date so much more in new york it's insane it's like really a huge difference so i'm i'm literally like maybe

i need to move to new york 30 i'm turning 30 in january i have never been in a serious relationship i'm like maybe i just need to is it refreshing uh when you date people do they do they are they are they a fan even in a light way of your work is it more is it more it doesn't feel more pure if they don't even know who the fuck you are i love that you do love that i pure if they don't even know who the fuck you are i love that you do love that i love if they don't know who i am i think that's awesome and i try to keep it i try to keep it to myself for as long as i can it's pretty hard because like you have to talk about why you're only in town for a week or like whatever yeah i try to say that i work in communication a lot if i if i have a real sense that they don't know who i am and then i'll see

well if it continues i'll like kind of reveal stuff that they can google if they want i don't know who I am. And then I'll see, well, if it continues, I'll like kind of reveal stuff that they can Google if they want. I don't want, I don't necessarily want a fan, but it's also hard because I have a very, most gay people know who I am. Like my audience is very gay. I don't think there's a ton of gay people who don't know who I am, especially now that I'm doing a podcast again,

like the clips are out there and I have on guests who, you know, it's just like, if there's somebody who's going to know who I am, it's a gay guy. Yeah. You know? So it's, it's, it's a little tough that way. Not like I'm mega famous or something, but I have like a very specific kind of audience. Um, I don't know. So I'm not upset. You know, if someone tells me that they know me, I'll still go on the date. What do you think you struggle with? I mean, I understand the there's, there's, uh, what do you bring to a relationship that you challenge yourself on? Or you go like,

maybe i'm doing this what how am i part of the problem of my current situation yeah problem is a very uh well it is a problem let's get to the bottom of it no uh what am i bringing i'm i travel a lot and that really is a logistical problem um i also am i'm like picky, you know, I'm like, you need to, like, I have all these, I definitely on a first date am sizing up in a way that I think is, I'm like with my friends, like you, with my family, like you, you, I'm very big on friends liking you. And I have a lot of different types of friends. And so I'm always kind of doing that math.

I've never understood when your friends bring someone around, like a friend brings a new boyfriend, girlfriend around partner and the friends don't like them. I can't believe they come around again. I go, why is that person not around partner and the friends don't like them i can't believe they come around again i go why is that person not out of here we don't like them get them out of here yeah what is going on say it to friends every every time you do every time if something's off i will say on the first and i've i have i don't i'm trying to think of a time when i've been wrong but do they do they would they how do they respond i mean have you had friends be like, fuck you. I'm still going to take this person. Yeah.

Well, it's never, it's never fuck you, but I definitely have had friends be like, I, I love you and you love me and I like this person and I need you to give them a chance. And I'm like, I'm giving them a chance. I'm not going to like, uh, not come to dinner cause they're there, but I'm telling you the vibe is off and I'm going to be mean to them if they're weird. Yeah. I'm going to, I'm going to treat them the way they deserve to be treated. Cause sometimes people bring someone around that it's like, yeah, they're hot, but I'm telling you the vibe is off and I'm going to be mean to them if they're weird. Yeah. I'm going to, I'm going to treat them the way they deserve to be treated because sometimes people bring someone around that it's like, yeah, they're hot, but they're fucking rude

or whatever the thing is. And I'm like, I'm not putting up with that just because you want to fuck a hot person. If I find meet a hot person who's rude, I fuck them in private. I don't bring them to group dinner. You could do me that kindness as well. That's always whole with my dad with some of the women he dated over the years. I was like, did you have to come to Thanksgiving?

Fuck her. Fuck her. Fuck her over there. Don't bring, I'm like, really don't bring them to group dinner. Yeah. That was it.

That was an old joke. That was too harsh. I'd be like, thanks for bringing your fleshlight to dinner. Oh my God. Jesus. I was young and I was angry. Thanks for your me cut bitches.

I truly... God, these fucking useless women you bring around. Every once in a while, it was comical. It was like just a... I remember one woman. I just met her at dinner and she came an hour late and she was just coughing the whole time. And it was just like, listen, maybe she's ill.

But it was just like... She definitely was ill like this stupid bitch has the common cold the fuck are you thinking bringing that whore over here she has seasonal allergies do you want kids yeah he said he won oh you did yeah um yeah how many ideally you know it's funny because i really do i've always wanted kids i i love kids and i i i think i would like like three kids i think that'd be great could you ever be such a mogul you've talked about owning a lot of real estate um that you could just have kids in a community and your mom's there and you'd be a single dad oh i've thought about it it's getting

to that point. I mean, I don't know. I feel like I, the thing is that when I think about having kids more these days, I'm like, I think it's gotta be not soon, but I'm definitely already getting too comfortable to imagine uprooting my life in that way. Like the selflessness you have to have to have kids to at least to some extent. Sure. I'm like, wow, am I actually going to be capable of that? I really like doing whatever I want all the time. I don't even like doing my job i mean i hate doing things yeah coming here was a nightmare yeah you know i i hate every time if i have to go to a show sold out show where i'm i know i'm gonna have fun i go i guess you know because i'm

in the moment anything that's on my calendar i don't want to do it yeah what free money and blowjob convention i'd be like god that yeah you know i don't want to do it yeah what free money and blow job convention i'd be like god that yeah you know i don't want to i just like i like doing it feels oppressive to have things you have to do yeah i'm so bad with authority that i rebel against myself when i'm in charge like why did you fucking tell you you have to do you know what i'm saying yeah so i don't know the kids think it's a little tricky it will be tricky. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But I like to believe I can overcome it.

Are you going to have kids? No way. No, I wish you would. No way. You'd be such a good dad. I like kids, but I sometimes the thing, we're going to spend more time in LA next year. I want to be around people with kids more.

I feel like that's a little bit more in LA. Some people, more people are settling down there than new york i just feel like i don't i want to be around kids when it's not just all fun and i'm visiting hi oh my god like i want to be around kids when it's annoying just to feel yeah what it's like to have i just haven't had it for the last ask me if i want to have kids like saying like do you want a kangaroo i'm, I don't know what that entails really. I've just seen it once a year. I think I've got the intimate look. I have too.

And I think you have. And I love kids. I just know I love them like in that like, oh, it's so cute and sweet at a wedding holding a baby. But just really dealing with it. And it's hard in New York, at least with my current friend group. I just know that I, I just know that I have two dogs now. And there are times where I'm so thankful. I can just put that dog in another room and be like, shut up. Like, just like, and you can't, you can't, you can't ignore a human. You know what I mean? Like you can't just be like, and I just, I know, I think I'm good at it. I mean, I did, so I was like, I did,

one of my first jobs in New York, I was helping this kid, and I was good at it. I'm good at it, but my patient, my like how I want to live my life doesn't feel good. With which you described that job. No, I was good at it. I mean, I'm like a patient, kind person. And like, I'm very also aware of like,

I hate when I see parents not wanting to answer a question because it's hard with a kid. And they're just like, they just like say something that's not true to like shut them up or blah, blah, blah. And then it's like, no, like you're teaching them fucking everything. So teach them. You have to, if you're going to be a parent, you have to take the time to like do it. And so I see that stuff. And so when I'm in with kids, I'm very conscious of that. But I just know how I feel. And I'm like, this is not how I want to live my life. Like it feels very oppressive to me.

Are you, are you, okay, here's a question for you too. Are you guys happy? Sometimes. I think I am more so, but I get, I am anxious and I get, if I, I get in phases where I'm, what I'm struggling with now is I can, I don't know when I'm happy versus when I'm like, oh, I have something and I know that it's okay right now. And it's like, I'm, I have a gig and a thing and blah, blah, blah. And then when I don't have it i'm like frank like anxious for the next thing so it's like dichotomy happy versus busy or yeah i'm like am i am i just associating busy with like happiness does that make sense it totally does because

right now i'm in a phase of like oh i don't have anything right now and i have time which is what i was desperately wanting and that's why i was like, I want to get out of the show. So I have some time and I am feeling anxious because I'm like, but I'm like, am I, do I need, like, is that going to help? You know, because I have been having nice nights and time off. And so it's like, I'm having to retrain my body to be like, busy doesn't mean happy. Does that make sense? Yeah.

Yeah. Totally. I get that. I think busy can mean happy. Does that make sense? Yeah. Yeah, totally. I get that. I think busy can mean happy sometimes. It can. It can. I, I don't,

I'm just very skeptical of the concept of like big overall happy. I think people, people churn through life and I have, I'm a mix. I feel fulfilled sometimes. And sometimes I have deep dips and I think sometimes it's connected to my circumstances. And sometimes it's just chemistry in my brain being miserable.

But when I'm busy, whenever I do stand up, I think the reason is like whenever I do stand up, it's like a drug that resets my mood when it goes well. And is it good to be a drug addict? Is it good to be a drug addict? Yeah. I don't know. That's the question. This is what we're asking. And what about, because you,

just based off social media, it seems like you live, at least from my perspective, I look at your life and I go, oh, that's a life. What do you mean? Friends. You have friends?

You can go, hey, house party at my place tonight. And it's full. It's filled. If I went to Instagram right now and said a house party, I'd say, Russell, please come. I don't think anyone else is coming. You foster community.

You foster community. Thank you. House party. Three people maximum fire code. But you do, you have House party. Three people maximum, fire code. But you, you do, you have a community and you spend a lot of time to like build it. And I'm very envious of it, but also knowing that like,

I get so anxious about my own shit. I don't make the time to even build that thing. Yeah. And in a way, and I think, I think guys do this a lot, straight guys with their partner, is like Tova is better at community building. I think, you know,

there's plenty of married people, our parents' generation, where the guy has no fucking friends and the wife is the one bringing the people for the dinner party and whatnot. And in a way, I think Tova has lent me or I'm involved. I mean, I know you, you know, via Tova. I know Tova's friends via Tova.

I know. So I get jealous of that. But what about you? Are you happy? Yeah, I think so. But I have the same issue that you bring up of like, what even is that worth? Or what does that mean? Like, what is happy?

Like, I don't think it's this thing you can be. I don't always feel happy. There are days when I'm very like sad or upset or you know what like this happy is a feeling I guess not really a state of being but I think yeah I'm very lucky with people I've always had very good people in my life and I do I do now as well and I think I I think I attract good people who are like kind-hearted and warm um so i do feel that i have community in uh all the places i really spend time like new york la and kin city i think i have good community um these days i'm really uh i don't want to say busy because my my every minute of my day is not booked but i'm definitely doing worse these days about like maintaining individual relationships it's brutal

yeah it's hard it's really hard and i, I can feel people being not necessarily annoyed with me. I mean, maybe that is the case. I would be open to that, but I can feel people like reaching out and being like, where the fuck are you, dude? And I'm like, I don't know. I'm like everywhere and nowhere. Yeah. Individual relationships. That's why I was just telling someone, I don't know if this was on a podcast or what, but I was just talking to friends about how that's why I throw so many parties these days. It's because I'm like, sure. I'm in town town for two weeks i am not going to see the 500 people i would like to see i here's a time where we can all you can come and see me and i can see you and if you can't make it maybe next time i because i used to schedule every minute of my day seeing

people and catching up and doing early coffee late coffee breakfast early lunch late lunch coffee coffee dinner you know and i would see everyone and i felt much more um individually connected like i'd be like man me and russell are really on a good page right now because i made time for that lunch i cannot do it anymore and so i don't know it's interesting i feel i feel when you do the party thing it's you're like okay i did the check the box that i saw them but it is that thing of like you're when you have your wedding or you have like something that you're the host of and you're like, Oh, I never got a meaningful thing with anyone. But sometimes it's that feeling, but, and you spend the whole time hosting too. I'm running around, I'm getting people drinks. I'm introducing, I'm like these two people,

you're singing a lot. I'm singing a lot. These people don't karaoke. There was, there was a tattoo artist at my last house party I like to host and I try to bring people together for me the best part about hosting is going these two people who came don't know anybody I'm going to introduce them to everybody and then I let them run off and then I have to go do more so yeah it's not really

I don't really catch up with people do you guys know what I mean though the individual thing is getting so much harder I do I feel like I prided myself for a long time on being like a good friend and i felt like i've not been there for certain things or certain people in a way and i'm like i truly don't know how to like i like i don't know how to fix it and i don't it's not even like anyone's asking me to fix it but it is a thing of like oh i feel like i'm letting people down just cause I'm like,

I don't know. I'm busy. I'm doing stuff. And it's, it's, you know, I mean, I tell people all the time,

I mean, part of, part of the reason I wanted Russell to do the podcast. It's, I mean, this is like, this is the way that I'm trying to like figure out like my life in a way. It was like,

well, here's a friend I want to, I mean, other than wanting to do a podcast for creative and artistic reasons but there was a there was certainly a degree for me of like i want to be able to spend time with this person and then you know the fear of are you just spending time in a work-related space uh but that was part of it for me certainly to just be like here's a way i can i mean it's a real it's it's my fucked up way of trying to somehow not let go of all the work ethic I want to do, but still mix in the social. I mean, Tova and I, we have a very creative, worky aspect of our relationship, too.

So especially friends outside of it completely very hard to find that time. I always fantasize about throwing a game night. I'm always like I want to be in my fancy. I'm like always fantasize about throwing a game night i'm always like i want to be in my fancy i'm like once a month i have a game night i don't want to go to a game and i know he doesn't i don't like games either i don't like you too i don't like games either can i actually tell you something okay my friend got so mad at me because i told a joke about this uh like last year i was at a friend's it was a it was a friend's party it was just supposed to be a house party okay oh and it's in l.a so you know it's me and i want to say 47 lesbians and we're all chit-chatting and talking

about their subarus and whatever else and it starts to turn into a game night right and i was already planning on leaving i was i've been there for about an hour and a half to again as someone drops a die and goes like what does that say i've been there for an hour and a half and people are going hey gather up in the living room we're gonna play and they I don't they were doing like Jenga or fucking mafia or something as I'm like putting on my shoes and I said on stage I felt like somebody who forgot their keys on the day I couldn't find their keys on the day of 9-11 like I felt like when me leaving right before game night the relief I felt going down the stairs and hearing everybody be like gather up gather up for the rules they're gonna explain the rules. Walking down the stairs, I was like, freedom.

I felt so, I was like, oh my God, I just watched the tower fall. You know, like. And it was just a Jenga tower. Truly. But there's still the smoke and everyone's getting sick. Yeah, I really, I felt so, and my friend was very much like, that was a party that I threw. And I was excited to have you there.

And I was, and she wasn't being serious. She totally gets, but I hate games. I hate games. Why? Can you explain it to me and she wasn't being serious. She totally gets, but I'm, I hate games. I hate games. Why? Can you explain it to me? I hate them. Yeah. I love having annoying. I love having a little bit of structure.

No, a little bit of a common goal. I want to like a little bit of competition, a little bit of a, Ooh, let me find a conversation. I want to be in, let me find a conversation.

I don't want to be in. That's the game. What if he can't find it? Let me, let me find some food. I want, let me like, let, let, I don't want, I don't want to want to we're not in school we're not in fucking school we're

not in college like wait so there's there's no joy to a game get him russell no games no i don't want to win i'm gonna win i'm gonna win no we're not taking this serious for fun you win i don't i don't you feel a little bit of stakes i. You feel life and death without the death. Most I can do is like a Pictionary kind of like act out thing. Charades? I don't really like any of it. What game are you comparing to a lesser tragedy than 9-11? What game are you comparing to just bad traffic?

Maybe like Jackbox games on the TV can be kind of fun. That's my least favorite kind of game. You can get high and sit there and you can write on, you can write your little guesses and you get to see what your friends, here's the deal here. You know what? You asked me what's not fun about games. I'll fucking tell you, brother. Okay. At every gathering there is, I'm a, there is at least, I don't know what 30%, 20, 20 to 30% of the people there I don't want to talk to. Yes. And so then the game forces me to be in unison with them. Well, now you know why I like games, Caleb. Because that's when people have to talk to me.

But you do fine talking to people. I don't, you know, you don't need it. I've gotten better over the years. You don't need this crutch. You know, I don't. It's not a crutch. It's fun. It's fun.

My, the way you're acting right now about this, like my, uh, last night, my agent took me to a concert of one of her other clients and she was so stressed to take me because of this is how I behave. This is how I am. I'm very critical and I like just what I like.

And she was like, if you don't think you're going to like it, you like, I'm so stressed to bring you. And I was like, I'm going to go and I'll see if I like it. I went to a concert last night. It was like October 7th.

She's like, she was stressed out of her mind to take me. And I had a great time. You're going to start booing. Well, no, just that I was, just that I was going to,

that I was going to be like, yeah, yeah, yeah. You know? Yeah. And I will be like that if I don't like something, it's not nice.

I'm working on, but it was never something she should have worried about. I liked this person a lot that we were going to see and I knew it. I would have a good time. So if Tova and I threw a big game night, would you decline? I don't know that I would do probably, but only because if Tova and I threw a big game night, would you decline? I don't know that I would do. Probably, but only because if you threw it in New York,

I'm only in New York usually for like eight days at a time, and I'm certainly not spending one of my nights doing that. It would be so fun. Tova and I are on the same page with games. Why wouldn't you just have a party? It is a party. You should do. Okay, this is what you should do.

You should do either before or after. You should have two parties. You should section it off where we're going to be doing games. Party's over. We're doing games now. Yeah. And you shuffle out. Or make like an enrichment area for people like me and Russell where we can be like, they're going to play games. We're going to sit and chat. That is the thing too is because

you get harassed by people when you're like, I don't want to play. And they treat you like you're an asshole or you're like, and you're like, no, I just don't want, I don't like it. I didn't like it when i was a kid and to be nearly 40 and still being forced to play games okay like i didn't like this when i was five why like i'm gonna spend my life watching sporting events because we are on the same page we are not with sports i think you guys would i think you guys would be very into watching chiefs games at my watch parties i i can i get like a like a party is fine like

but i'm not gonna follow all the things you know i'm not gonna know the players and things like that you're gonna be you're gonna be wanting to talk i'll be like it's fourth down no you would you would like my watch parties you would you would get to know the players you would be surprised the number of girls and gays that i have brought in that now they were they were just the way you guys are talking they were just like you guys being like i'm never just like the gays truly you guys are like i'm never gonna know the wide in the wide ends name the tight receiver i played football i know the rules yeah like i don't know the play like i didn't you're gonna you're gonna like the chiefs if you come to watch party it's a lot about the food

and it's a lot about commenting on who's the hottest we just got a couple new hot guys for this season i'm really excited about. Yeah, you would like it, I think. I do love food. Like football food. I make chicken wings every week. My chicken wings are incredible. We make like Rotel, like spicy sausage queso dip.

It's a good time. I got carrots for this one. Drink Dr. Peppers. One of the vegetarians always brings something stupid like a veggie tray. I'll bring a veggie tray. Yeah, and I think that's beautiful. Let's say the thing in a veggie tray that's got to go is the broccoli. You say the radish, like the little

radishes. I do too. But like a fully uncooked broccoli with no sauce? Well, you can dip it in sauce or hummus or something. If the hummus is there, but that stock is thick. I like it more than celery. I'm not a big celery. Really? Well, you can dip it in sauce or hummus or something. If the hummus is there, but that stock is thick. I like it more than celery. I'm not a big celery. Really? I prefer celery.

I don't like the stringies. Yeah, they get stuck in your teeth. That's no worries. What's your guys' favorite veggie to dip? Mine's cucumber. Too wet, too watery. Not if you do it right. Next. Red peppers. Really, really hard. I like green peppers.

Green peppers. But I also like carrots. Green is at the bottom. Red, orange, yellow. I don't like any of those. I don't like raw peppers. I don't super love cooked peppers. I like spicy. I like a pepper like a spice. But like eating a raw

red pepper, when I see someone do that, I'm like, okay. Let's go on to our next segment. Oh, cutting me off on veggie trays okay no let's go deeper what else let's go deeper let's go deeper how deep can we get on veggie trays um i also feel bad because john marco was like yeah i guess i don't feel like i have community and it's my girlfriend brings a lot of community i'd love to throw a game night and then i was like i know me i'd rather fucking die than come to your game i would come to your game night but you have to tell me how important actually can i say something this is something i want to tell a lot of people grown adults listen to me people not telling you that something's

important to them and then expecting you to know i can't know like if you have a show i'm never going to care if someone comes to my show i have never once had a show that i cared if my friends came or if you have a party like if you're like oh it'd never going to care if someone comes to my show I have never once had a show that I cared if my friends came or if you have a party like if you're like oh it'd be really important to me that you came to this I'm never going to guess

you have to tell me if you told me game night was important to you I would be there I did that I did that recently for a show with Uncle Function

I think I was like I was like my friends haven't seen me do stand up in a very very long time and I told them I said this was important that's nice

and they all came that's really nice and necessary. Cause I don't like, I think people will get their feelings hurt. I'm like, you got it. If you tell me, I'll be there. Yeah. But you can't not tell me

and then expect me to know cause I don't care about things in that way. That was Tova's advice. Cause I was just like, I was just like. That's good advice. I was like, they never, they've never seen my thing. That's really good advice.

Tova's good at talking people off a ledge or talking people into the right. She has to talk me into the right headspace a lot. Yeah. She might ultimately my manager, but I could see dating her being nice. She's good at that. She is.

I'm happy that she got you there. And did it work out? Did they come? We all came. They all came good. It really like shot like some one friend in particular. It'd been a long time. Yeah.

Long time. Well, it can't be a technique, right? It can't be to dry. It has to be a genuine. You can only cash that in every once in a while. Sure. You can't be a technique, right? It can't be to dry. It has to be a genuine, you can only cash that in every once in a while. Sure.

You can't have a, this is so important to me every week. I think that's the thing where you date. I say the thing with being friends with artists, dating artists, there's a thousand ways to let them down. Oh yeah. Like,

like, especially if you have a pair, if you're a parent and your kid's a theater kid, it's like, well, how many of these shows do I have to go to? Yeah. Yeah.

Do you know if you do a run of, of head of Gabler in high school, like, do I have to go to all eight shows? No. Hedda Gabler. Newsflash, she kills herself at the end. I saw that one time on stage and I was like, some of those plays... Hedda Gabler's a good

one of those old ones. You know what? I'm going to say something here on this podcast. I have never done a musical or a play, never once in my life. Crazy. I would like to. I want someone to put right one for me or put me in one or something. Do you have an idea? Any musical come to mind of what role you'd play? I don't know musicals and that's, I think musical people can sense that on me and they're not going to like that about me, but I'll work really hard and I'll learn and I want to be in something. I don't think I want to, I think maybe a play more than

a musical, although I do like to sing real quick quick I think someone just put me in something or I'd love for someone to write something for me like write me a nice little show yeah my experience with this podcast is there's not a lot of casting directors watching or making offers no one's ever booked anything off this podcast yet but if you're the first that would be great you don't know

that Broadway play right away and you could clip this up you could clip you could you guys are in charge of the we could play brothers we could play i would love to play something with you we could do it on broadway true west true west true west is a two brother it's a two brother like brutal philip seymour hoffman and um john c reilly did it and they switched roles every other night one's like kind of like one's kind of like wild and out of control and the other is like kind of like intellectual intellectual and trying to and the other is kind of like intellectual. Which one do you want to play more?

I think we should do the thing where we switch off. You'd be the heady one. I'd be the crazy one. Just because I have long hair right now. Your long hair is really part of it. Sorry, I got so excited about that. I just got so excited about that. I would love to do something with you.

Actually, I was thinking of you the other day in a roundabout way because I went to Largo in LA to see a show and I was on the list and I love Largo. I go there all the time. I know the staff there, but there was a guy working the door who I didn't know, which I didn't think would be any worries. I thought maybe he would know me.

I walk up and I had a date with me and it was like a third date. I had made it. So last date. Well, ended up being, but his terms, not mine. I really liked that guy. Um, but I, uh, I kind of made a big deal about being like, Hey, this show is sold out, but I'm going to get us on the list. You know, I was like, kind of, I kind of made a thing about being like, I'm kind of a guy here, you know? Yeah. Not a big thing, but just enough, just enough for this to be more embarrassing. And I get to the door and he goes, he goes hey man i'm i'm so sorry i see you walking over here and i know you

but i don't have your name on the list so let me just text really quick it's gad right he thought i was josh gad and i said i said my god i said hey i would love to have josh gad money but i don't have Josh Gad money and it's just Caleb in fact and then yeah I just went and saw the show and he said it so confidently that I was like oh me and Gad must be giving

much more I think I'm taller than him way taller maybe if he gets a Broadway show you could understudy him too I get a Broadway show and Russell understudies me that's like the one time they thought I was when I was going to see you they thought I was Tim Dillon

and I was like how funny would it have been if they bumped you for me if he had gone up and just fucking did it can you tell that one thing that someone told you the other day about the musical you should be in I think it's been long enough oh god say it thing that someone told you the other day about the musical you should be in? I think it's been long enough. Oh, God.

Oh, my God. Okay, so this was back in the Titanic days. You come out of the show and sometimes there's people to sign or blah, blah, blah. And there's this group of people and they're very excited to take a photo and get a

signature. And they're saying nice things. And then right before I and, and they're saying nice things. And then right before I go, it could have all been great. And then right before I go, this woman goes, she goes, and if there's ever a family guy,

the musical on Broadway, you're going to be Peter. I was like, then you're just like walking to the subway. Like you're like, oh man, like everything. I'm going to go. Well,

great show killer show. Come out. There's a crowd of people. And then this thing, and you're just walking alone to the subway. There's every Star Wars Jabba! We love you, Jabba! No prosthetics, just you

without your shirt on. Yes, White Medea! Yes, White Medea works! God damn, that sucks. I do love, there's all these, they make Peter gay in so many episodes. I love Family Guy, first of all. But they make Peter gay and they, all the screenshots of gay Peter I keep on my

phone because it literally is just how it's me. Maybe it was more that. Yeah, you're gay. You seem gay. Is that better? Yeah, I mean, she saw me in Titanic. Yeah, of course. Just the gay aspect of Peter. Just gay Peter.

She's like, if they ever do Family Guy the musical, you play gay Peter. She's like, if they ever do Family Guy the musical, you play gay Peter. You play gay Peter. Someone else for straight Peter. They have Tim Dillon for straight Peter. Have you played gay Peter? Here's our next segment. This has got to stop.

We only have six minutes, then you've got to run. Oh, God. Yeah, something like that. Do you want me to say mine? It's super tight. Run, run, run. You tell me. Enough. I mean You want me to say mine? Super tight? Run run run? You tell me. Enough. I mean I have to go to lunch. But my friend can wait a little bit.

What's your this has gotta stop? Well I wonder if this is too common because your guys' producer in the email does say avoid common topics. So I'll try not to offend Paige. It is Paige right? I didn't make that up. That would be so humiliating if I made that up. Love you Paige. By the way recently I said

my mom's birthday on an episode and i realized we that i messed up the date and so we did uh we added uh avio adr after the fact yeah of me saying correct the correct birthday you're like talking like this and it's like june 12th and one commenter noticed it and I was like that was very, you got it. Dude, they'll notice shit that you can't even they'll notice shit you can't even believe. Like there are

little tiny things about our set is changing on my show a lot because we're still figuring it out and we'll change the tiniest thing and they'll be like bring back the doily cloth that was under the right cup. I'm like good God. Thank you for your dedication. if they notice here the uncle function frame broke we're gonna fix it um so what's your this has got to stop well yes i don't know if the traffic well i will say okay this is not mine but i will say on the on the traffic travel of it all

need to put some hard limits on two things at the airport number one tsa pre-check more stringent requirements. Make it more expensive if you have to. I don't care. Price people out. The lines are getting too long. It's the same now. It's the same now. Now they have clear and now they have, this is the most TSA plus clear. So if you have both, that's the faster

line sometimes. I need to, I have clear and I have global entry. I'm approved to go and finalize it. I just need to make time to get to the airport and do it. For the first time in my life, global entry came into use and it was still fucking an hour long. And I was like, okay.

It's just a constant. And the Delta Lounge. The Delta Lounge. Tell me. Let's talk about that. Everyone was mad when Delta recently tightened up requirements a little bit. I was like, make it tighter. I am so, I'm like, I've never been a pro border person.

I'm about to get on a four-wheeler and start checking people's papers at the Delta Lounge. I'm so fucking tired of these animals and the way they behave in there. These people that should not, they've, what are you, you travel twice a year? How are you in here? They don't know how to move. Their suitcase is too big. They've got, they're like wearing clothes that aren't, they're like truly, they've got like six sweaters

that they're taking off at the buffet. Have a system, bitch. I cannot believe, there was a woman in the Delta Lines the other day wearing a shirt

that said Buck Fiden. If you, if you own merch like that and you wear it to the airport. Well, I did, I did, I did make a joke

to my friend. I was like, I wonder if it's also the Israel stuff, which is like, of course it's not not no one who ever wears something like that hates those guys for the reason i do uh-huh it's always something insane where they're like he wants transgenders to be nurses or some you know crazy shit but i we've got to tighten up but my real this has got to stop is this restaurants that won't seat you until the full party is there

okay now why do they do that i imagine i've always wondered why and i imagine it's because sometimes people they sit and then the person never comes and then they lost a seat i don't think it's that i think it's that they they they're worried that sometimes when you're waiting on a friend you say it's gonna be five minutes and actually it's 20 and so you're you're taking up a table for longer without whatever whatever that's not gonna happen with me if i'm sitting and my friend's waiting 20 minutes, I'm ordering our drinks. I'm ordering an appetizer.

I will behave. Like you can maybe put a rule on it. Like comedy clubs have a two drink minimum. Maybe you say, hey, if you're going to sit without your full party, you do have to order apps or something. I get the table turnover and the servers needing to turn tables to make tips and the restaurant needing to whatever. Do not make me stand in a fucking foyer because my friend is five minutes late.

Put me at that goddamn table and bring me a dr pepper i think it's hard with two people because i know with like if it's like you're multiple people and there's like you know one like two people are missing out of a group six or something i just say yes yeah and then they they what are they they they don't really look and you sit down and then there's two and then they're like oh and then you're like oh they're coming you know and so you sit down and then there's two, and then they're like, Oh, and then you're like, Oh, they're coming, you know? And so you just kind of like,

it's especially egregious when it's a restaurant where it's not crowded. I went to one recently where Tova was a little bit late and it was empty. Yeah. And I'm like, well, so the reason this rule was created doesn't apply here at all. You can sit me down. You can put me over there.

You can put me over there. A hundred people aren't going to show up on this Monday night. Suddenly one time in Chicago, I, this is the genesis of me hating this rule. I went to a cafe that I went to all the time. It was this late night diner that I would sit and ride out at like two in the morning. I was there. I would go on Sunday mornings, Wednesday nights. I was always at this place and I kind of knew the staff. And there was this one server who was, uh, I love servers and I love, uh, retail workers and I I'm, I'm normally not like this. She was a huge bitch and she had a constant attitude problem that was persistent and horrible. And, and she was immune to my charms as

well, which of course upset me. And, uh, I go in one time and there's three of us and a fourth friend is coming. And so we need a table for four and she goes, as your whole party here. And I go, oh yeah. And she sits us. And then our fourth person comes in late and comes's three of us and a fourth friend is coming and so we need a table for four and she goes is your whole party here and i go oh yeah and she sits us and then our fourth person comes in late and comes and sits with us we've already ordered we ordered their drink we ordered their food because we know what they wanted this server sent me a dm on instagram no way uh-huh we do not follow each other i was not i did not have a bunch of followers i was not like famous there's i'm i there was no I was just a regular dude who, I don't even know if she knew I was a comedian, like found me personally, probably from my name on the receipt,

found me on Instagram and DM'd me and was like, how fucking dare you? The way you lied to me today, the adults don't lie to each other. Like to come in, that restaurant is my community. That's my home and my family. And like the fact that you came into my home and lied to my face, like really, I mean, it was insane. And I don't think that's obviously normal, but now would you write back something devastating? No, I think I wrote back and I was like, Hey,

I'm really sorry that that made you feel that way. I was apologetic. I'm getting pummeled. I'm kidding. We're getting pummeled at the cafe, y'all. Let's go to our final segment. You better count your blessings. You better count your blessings. You got a blessing? Yeah, shout out to my landlord, Tigran.

He has been redoing our roof so we're not gonna have all the leaks that we've been having uh when it when we get these tsunamis that we get now every like couple weeks um and uh and he refloored the whole thing it looks nice and uh yeah hear that put the guillotine guys. We got a good landlord. We found him. We found the good one. Yeah. Well, no, he's a little different. He owns the apartment that I live in. So he's the condo owner. So he's not like a landlord of like, you know,

he owns my one. A lab. Yeah. A lab for me. All landlords are bastards. Don't care if he owns the condo or the whole building. Sorry, Tigran. Come around me and you're getting your shit rocked. My blessing. I'll shoot out to my opener, Liam Nelson.

Very last minute, I decided I wanted to film a set, but like an upgraded, like for a special release, a micro special of sorts. And he did it incredibly at a comedy club in Rhode Island. And, uh, very impressive, very incredible,

uh, that he's able to put this together, fly people out, film it, edit it. So Liam Nelson, follow him. Yeah.

Do you have a blessing? I do. Many. I'm blessed beyond words, but here's what, this is what I'll do. Uh, I'm in town this trip to i'm

doing a show but i'm also do i'm going to a premiere of a movie i was in that's an indie movie and so they didn't have a budget to like put me up nice or anything and so i i my friend isa medina very funny comedian uh she has a beautiful apartment in williamsburg that she she's out of town right now letting me stay in her apartment all week for free wow very nice. And that is a New York moment where if you can't be at a hotel, which is my preference, that you get a friend who lets you stay at their place for free and they're not even there. There's a good gift card coming Issa's way.

I'll tell you that. Well, this used to be Tova and I shared this and there was a guest room over here. And recently Tova came over and that room was filled with merch and wires and mics. And we decided this is now financially completely my place. She said, hey, love you. No.

Yeah. Not paying for your merch house anymore. Your merch house. And I was like, it's not up to bed. It's fine. I should, let me add the blessing Tova too. Tova was very supportive for this filming I had to do made myself do

but I can't be you every time sweetheart but it always is it was always you Caleb where can people find you hey y'all it's Caleb Heron your boy you can find me at Caleb says things on everything follow me if you want I actively hate the internet but do listen to my podcast

especially on YouTube so So true podcast. John Marco's episode is coming out two days, probably two days from now. Yeah. Please listen to the podcast and share it. I really, really need you to. Yeah. I hope you move to New York. It'll be. Yeah, we shall see. We got to do it. Game night with your

name on it. If you tell me it matters, I'll come to game night. Russell and I both will play Parcheesi or whatever the fuck. I think if there's a limit, an hour limit to the game. Putting a limit on the friendship. I just want to play charades. That's my main one.

That's the worst. I mean, that's tough. You just want to act. I just want to act. I just want to act. John Marco, you want to self-tape. All the things I write down are like acting roles. Salieri and Amadeus.

That's my sure rates. Where can people find you? At Russell J. Daniels. I'm getting pummeled on Instagram. I need those followers, baby. And then come to our tour. Plug it. You plug it. Okay. I don't come to our tour. Plug it. You plug it.

Okay. I don't know the dates exactly. Jesus Christ. July 22nd, 23rd, 24th, 25th. We are doing, again, D.C., Philly, Boston. New York City. City winery. And it's going to be big. And again, I know a lot of you don't live there.

I know some of you live in Dublin or Rhode Island. If you live in Rhode Island, you can make it to Boston. A lot in India. Listen, figure out a way to help us sell this. Over here. And then one day we'll get to India. Yeah. It's deep in the list.

Yeah. That's far away. But enjoy the Patreon. Patreon.com slash downside. I know a lot of you are on the verge of it. It helps us so we can start touring more and more. Patreon.com slash downside. I know a lot of you are on the verge of it. It helps us so we can start touring more and more. Patreon.com slash downside. And this weekend, I will be

in Portland, Oregon. And then the weekend after that, Panama City Beach, maybe, unless we cancel it. I hope we don't. But who knows? And, you know, vote for

RFK Jr. That's our official position. And support the Jimmy Kimmel Show. This is The Downside. One, two, three. Downside. You're listening to The Downside.

The Downside. With Gianmarco Ceresi.