The Dr. Hyman Show - Do Our Computers Know Us Better Than We Know Ourselves?

Episode Date: September 25, 2020

Do Our Computers Know Us Better Than We Know Ourselves? | This episode is brought to you by Perfect Keto Studies have shown humans only actually remember 0.05% of our memories, whereas databases can remember it all! It’s a scary realization, but computers can know us in a way we don’t even know ourselves. We like to think we aren’t easily persuaded, but when companies know our likes, wants, needs, and purchase history it all adds up to an easier sale.  Earlier this year, Dr. Hyman sat down to discuss this topic with Andy Russell. Andy explains how big companies like Google and Facebook access and use our data. He also shares what we can do to maintain control over the content we see. Andy Russell is a digital media, ad-tech, marketing-tech, and data science innovator and pioneer as well as a self-taught Behavioral Economist. He has invested in, incubated, or run over 50 technology companies, including Daily Candy, Thrillist, Tasting Table, Idealbite, PureWow, Zynga, Betaworks, Business Insider, Sailthru, RapLeaf and LiveRamp, SpongeCell, AdRoll, and Bounce Exchange. He is the Founder and Chairman of Trigger Media, InsideHook, and Fevo. This episode is brought to you by Perfect Keto. Right now, Perfect Keto is offering Doctor’s Farmacy listeners 20% off plus free shipping with the code DRMARK. Just go to perfectketo.com/drmark, and make sure you try their Nut Butters and Keto Cookies. Find Dr. Hyman’s full-length conversation with Andy Russell, “How Your Free Will And Data Are Being Hacked By Micro-Targeting Of Your Personality,” here: https://DrMarkHyman.lnk.to/AndyRussell

Coming up on this episode of The Doctor's Pharmacy. The same technologies that could be used for very good purposes, satisfying needs of people, lowering their anxieties, making them overall happier, less angry, less frustrated, less hate. The same technologies can tear us apart. Hey everyone, it's Dr. Mark. You know, I'm all about the benefits of healthy fats. And so many of my patients have found that toning down the processed carbs in their diet is the best way to support better cognition,

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and make sure you try their nut butters and keto cookies. Now let's get back to this week's episode of The Doctor's Pharmacy. Hi, I'm Kea Perowit, one of the producers of The Doctor's Pharmacy podcast. As humans, we like to think that we aren't easily persuaded and that we make decisions based on our own free will. Yet most of us have had the experience of seeing an ad for a product we just thought about, leading us to wonder if our devices actually know us better than we know ourselves. Earlier this year, Dr. Hyman sat down with digital media and data science innovator Andy Russell to discuss this phenomenon and how we can maintain our own opinions and free will

in the current technological environment. So nobody wants to think that they are influenceable or persuadable. Like we like to think that our brains are so magnificent and we have free will and we make our own decisions and we're rational human beings. Yeah. Well, so a really famous psychologist, Daniel Kahneman, who actually won the Nobel Prize in economics based on something called

cognitive biases, insecurities, and how we make decisions. He said something at a speech once that really freaked me out. He said, the human being remembers about 0.05% of their memories. 0.05% of their memories. Yeah. And a memory's period of time, moments moments of time are defined as three seconds intervals right because that's how long it takes for the uh the neurons to actually fire and create a a memory right yeah three seconds um if we're only remembering 0.05 of all of our memories and all the actions we've done a computer database

that remembers all of it. All of it. Including, yes, where you take your cell phone, right? As you go on an easy pass, as you use Google Maps, plus all your offline purchase data everywhere you've ever lived, everyone, everywhere you've ever had a meal. You go buy coffee, Starbucks. What vitamins you take, everything like that.

Plus it's studying what content you read, what videos you watch, what magazines you subscribe to. So now it's like, wait a second, what do you mean Google or Facebook or YouTube knows me better than I know myself? Well, excuse me, Mr. or Mrs.. human being you only remember point zero five percent and you know the computers the databases remember all of it yeah and therefore as they're studying that stuff it becomes very easy scarily wickedly easy to tap into your insecurities and your fears by playing you information that they

already know will rattle you and trigger you the same technologies that could be used for very good purposes I mean satisfying needs of people lowering their anxieties making them overall happier, less angry, less frustrated, less hate. The same technologies can tear us apart. Yeah. I'm hearing things and I don't know if they're accurate or not, but I mean, I heard one woman give a talk and she said, you know, there's up to 3 billion data points on every person

that these companies collect all of our activities, where we shop, where we go. They have location tracking on our phone. They know where we are. There's geo-targeting. They can literally ping people's phones if they're at a rally and be able to then target them later. There's, you know, you're on your phone

and all of a sudden you're talking to a friend about something and then some ad for that thing you're talking about pops up on your phone. Are they listening? Is the iPhone listening? You know, are Google and Facebook selling your data to third parties that are using against us are third parties selling it back to Google and Facebook like what's happening okay so let me just break it down all right so you know how every morning or so you get a piece

of maybe two or three or four pieces of direct mail, snail mail, the old fashioned stuff. Oh, yeah. In your mailbox. Right. The ones I don't open and throw in recycling. Yeah. So, there are 10,000 direct mail campaigns. Different campaigns. That happen every day in this country.

I'm assuming you don't get 10,000 pieces of direct mail. Huh. You ever wonder why? Since the birth of the credit card and even before then, okay, they're big data companies. Companies such as Experian, Epsilon, Oracle, Alliant, lots of them. Okay. And what they've done for decades is against you as a persona. Create a profile.

Right. Create a profile on you. How the hell does some company, which is just like a company with a name like Epsilon. They buy. They buy what? Your data. From who? From all the credit card companies.

Yeah. So every credit card company sells companies like Axiom, Experian, Epsilon. Information on every purchase you've ever made with those credit cards. And this has been going on for decades. Decades. Who else sells this information to the big data companies? The banks? with those credit cards. And this has been going on for decades. Decades.

Who else sells this information to the big data companies? The banks. Like you have your money in a bank, right? So all that information. Your tax records. So how much money you make. How much taxes. The IRS sells your tax data?

No. All of it is sold to the big data companies. All of it. How do the government sell your your tax data? No, all of it is sold to the big data companies. All of it. How do the government sell your tax return data? It most of it's put on public record. Yeah. And then what they do, because they've got, you know, hundreds of thousands of individuals that they have that level of millions of data on.

It's so here. So that's the kind of data we're talking about for offline stuff. Yeah. Right. Then you can append to it like, oh, what television shows are watching your home? That's good. What kind of car you drive? Yeah. How long you've driven the car? Might you now be in the market for a new car? Yeah. Because we know that you have whatever kind of car and you've been driving for leases on and you've you've only bought tires like six years ago and you had your oil change I mean you know everything yeah so then the the data

companies take all these personas people individuals human beings and all this in let's stop calling it data information about these people yes okay yeah and run what's called predictive models against these people and say that there's like you know 50 000 people who have like 60 of the same purchases that you've made for the past two years and then you know of those people the next purchase they made they went on to get a mx platinum card yeah but you haven't yet gotten your mx platinum card yeah so if you model all this purchase behavior off of all the people who have similar purchase upbringing educational income levels as you huh now it's worth sending you a piece of direct mail

offering you the opportunity to get a platinum card. And this is all analog. You're not even talking digital yet. I'm just talking analog because this is the birth of the whole thing. Yeah. So what happened in 2014, so think about it.

You log on to Facebook with one email address. Right. But you probably have like four or five or six different email addresses over your lifetime. Yeah. Right. And you log on to Google with an email address. But you probably had six or seven different email addresses.

Yeah. And same thing for YouTube and same thing for Instagram. Sure. Okay. Yeah. And same thing for YouTube and same thing for Instagram. Sure. OK, so in the years kind of 2013, 14 and 15, all these big data companies, the one I just told you about that were buying all your credit card information, all your financial information, your travel information, they started it's called appending to your file, adding to your file.

Yeah. All of your email addresses. Yeah. All of your email addresses. Yeah. All of them. Right? So in 2014, all of the big data companies then went- Or analog. They then got digital. Or analog, went to Facebook and went to Google. And because Facebook owns Instagram, same thing with Instagram.

And because Google owns YouTube, same thing with Instagram, and because Google owns YouTube, same thing with YouTube. If the email address that you logged on to Facebook with, they had as one of their, the data companies had as one of their seven email addresses, they were able to find you and they sold all the data, your offline data, behind the scenes to Facebook and to Google. So it was like a swap. It's a big data swap. No, it was a cash sale. The data companies sold to Facebook all of the offline data on you, plus up to six additional email addresses on you.

Okay. So, this is just fine if that information was being used to better curate what we think we might like, right? And what's concerning me is, and they use this for more nefarious purposes. It wasn't selling you a new jacket a new shoe or something you might like it was selling you political ideas yes and it was using the personality typing to target and it's not just political messaging it is seeding a fear inside of your head yeah and then it is uh watering that seed of idea, fertilizing that seed of an idea, surround sounding you in an echo chamber, revertibrating that fear back into your head until you take an action.

Exactly. Yeah, that's what was striking to me was that they know us better than we know ourselves. They know our weaknesses and fears and insecurities better than we know ourselves they know our weaknesses and fears and insecurities better than we know them and they use that data to create customized messaging to manipulate our behavior so that free will becomes a fiction it's that news article that seems like it's an authentic news article 100 percent because anybody can put up a website right and can put up a facebook page right or it can put up a twitter handle or uh you know a linkedin linkedin uh page or an instagram page and all of a sudden can put a name to it that

sounds somewhat official and can start making up their own news yeah so the most important thing like right now like here and now is uh people what they read, what they see, what they view as video, don't take it as fact. Yeah. Full stop. Research the hell out of it. All right. We don't live in a world where just because you read something or see a video or it's on your internet feed, don't think it came from a scholar or from somebody who's an expert. Buyer beware, reader beware.

But it's reader question. Question all of it and realize that most of it out there is fiction. Yeah. Or most of it, if it's not fiction, it's opinion. And then before you trust someone's opinion, make sure that they're qualified. Yeah. To have that type of, is that somebody who you should be listening to?

How do you do that? I mean, the average person, like, how do you vet whether this is true or not? I read articles all the time. Like, I look where the the authorship is i look at who they are i look at where they work for i mean i i try to do that but it's it's tough like even in science we think science is this pristine field but you know much of science is funded by industry much of the data is manipulated to shape it into outcomes that the funder wants. How about this? Take your time.

We're all going from article to article to article. We all have to open up all of our email addresses. We have to get back to everybody's text and we have so much we have to do. So we just read the headline or no, no, no, no. Take your time. Be curious. My hope, like my big hope,

and this is what should happen because we're an educated society. We really are an educated society. If people literally listen to both sides of an argument, then they can choose who they're gonna trust as our curator or teacher of information. And therefore, less people will be reading false information and remember these are just businesses that all make money off of advertising

so if less people are reading stuff that's untruthful right they'll go out of business don't be that easily fooled or that easily riled up. No, if you wanna say that you have free choice and the ability to make up your own mind, then prove it, done correctly, as one species communicating collectively. We can end climate change. Yes. We can change the food system.

Yes. We can end climate change. Yes. We can change the food system. Yes. We can educate everybody. We can finally have equality across the board. We can further science. And we can come together as a less competitive society and working together to collaborate for everybody's good. Sounds good. And therefore have better mental health and enjoyable lives. We know that different areas of our brain are activated

when we are experiencing stress and fear versus when we are in a relaxed state. And that this leads to variation in our decision making. Through greater understanding and awareness of how various content is put in front of us, we can be mindful of how we interact with it and what we take as fact. If you enjoyed this episode of The Doctor's Pharmacy, please consider leaving us a

comment below and sharing it with a friend. Until next time! Hi everyone, I hope you enjoyed this week's episode. Just a reminder that this podcast is for educational purposes only. This podcast is not a substitute for professional care by a doctor or other qualified medical professional. This podcast is provided on the understanding that it does not constitute medical or other professional advice or services. If you're looking for help in your journey, seek out a qualified medical practitioner.

If you're looking for a functional medicine practitioner, you can visit ifm.org and search their find a practitioner database. It's important that you have someone in your corner who's trained, who's a licensed healthcare practitioner, and can help you make changes, especially when it comes to your health.