The Dr. John Delony Show - Guilt & Boundaries When Living w/ a Special Needs Relative

Episode Date: March 7, 2022

Today’s show is a prime example of why I say it’s worth choosing guilt over resentment. We start by talking with a man whose younger brother is struggling to grieve their father’s death, then we hear from a woman needing to set boundaries with her special needs sister, and finally we talk to a wife who’s feeling guilty for leaving her abusive husband. My brother needs help grieving our father’s death. How can I help? I’m struggling with guilt & boundaries trying to support my sister’s Asperger syndrome I’m preparing to leave an abusive marriage & dealing with guilt Lyrics of the Day: "Another Is Waiting" - Avett Brothers Let us know what’s going on by leaving a voicemail at 844.693.3291 or visiting johndelony.com/show.  Support Our Sponsors: BetterHelp DreamCloud Churchill Mortgage Greensbury Resources: Own Your Past, Change Your Future Questions for Humans Conversation Cards Redefining Anxiety Quick Read John’s Free Guided Meditation Listen to all The Ramsey Network podcasts anytime, anywhere in our app. Download at: https://apple.co/3eN8jNq These platforms contain content, including information provided by guests, that is intended for informational and entertainment purposes only. The content is not intended to replace or substitute for any professional medical, counseling, therapeutic, financial, legal, or other advice. The Lampo Group, LLC d/b/a Ramsey Solutions as well as its affiliates and subsidiaries (including their respective employees, agents and representatives) make no representations or warranties concerning the content and expressly disclaim any and all liability concerning the content including any treatment or action taken by any person following the information offered or provided within or through this show. If you have specific concerns or a situation in which you require professional advice, you should consult with an appropriately trained and qualified professional expert and specialist. If you are having a health or mental health emergency, please call 9-1-1 immediately.

On today's show, we talk to a man whose father just passed away and he's worried about his little brother. We also talk to a brand new wife and she's struggling with her sister who's got special needs. We talk to a woman who's about to leave an abusive marriage and she's struggling with guilt. Stay tuned. What up? What's up? This is John with the Dr. John Deloney show.

So glad you're here. So glad you're here. We're talking about mental health, relationships, dealing with the mayhem, all of it. I'm so glad you're here. If you want to be on our show, give me a shout. 1-844-693-3291. That's 1-844-693-3291 or go to johndeloney.com slash ask. A couple of housekeeping things. Don't forget, please go to johndeloney.com and pick up the new book. If you pre-order now, tons of stuff that comes with your pre-order for like 20 bucks. You get tons of, you get free counseling, you get audio books, all kinds of stuff. The reader cop reviews are coming back and man, this is humbling to say the least. Never could have imagined the book is resonating like it is. And so go check it out. And if this show, if you like it, let somebody know.

Be cool if everybody who listens to it just forwarded one episode that they like to somebody that they care about or that they think might like the show too. So let's get passing it around

and do all the subscribes and all that kind of stuff. I want to read one thing and then have a moment. James, I'll start with a moment. So James, I got to read one thing and then have a moment. James, I'll start with a moment. So, James, I got to give you a – this is going to be a first for our show. It's a positive shout-out. So, when I was recording the audio book, it – James would talk into my ear because James was recording the engineering audio book too.

And we're producing the audio book. I don't know. What's the least offensive way I can say that? Is there a better way? Just keep going. All right. So, but you said, man, you talk to yourself so poorly, like so negatively. Because I would do these takes and I'd be like, you idiot.

Or gosh, you freaking moron. Do this. And then another one of the engineers there pulls me aside and they're like, hey, the way you talk to yourself, like you got to stop that. And then a third person was like, hey, I don't know if anyone said anything to you. And so I was like, man, kind of feeling like we're having,

like getting hassled here a little bit. And then I talked to my wife. I was like, man, these guys said I just trash myself all the time. And she got kind of choked up, man. She said, it breaks my heart that somebody who I love so much talks so poorly about themselves. So then I was like, man, now everybody's ganging up on me. Because I'm always going to try to make myself a victim. We're ganging up for you, not on you.

Thank you. So anyway, I just started watching it myself. Oh my gosh. I would fight me if I wasn't me. I think I do fight me. I think that's the problem. I'm working this out live on the air right now. So anyway, now I'm going to talk bad about myself

about how bad I talk about myself. So this weekend, I just had a moment and I heard my son say something. He said something to himself like, gosh, what a dummy or something like that. And he was laughing when he said it. But I immediately was like, I got to stop because he's watching and learning from me. And so, man, that's my new thing. I'm going to spend the rest of 2022 really shifting the way I talk to myself and just negative self-talk. And this isn't some kind of woo-woo like, I just want to project and whatever.

I want to manifest. No, no, no, that nonsense. But I'm going to start treating myself a little more kindness. So here's what that looks like for me this morning. I have an obnoxious morning routine. I go through all the paces and do all this stuff to get this stuff all done. And I have somehow shifted that you're supposed to do that. And I am.

Like, that's the way I stay well. But when I get through it all, and it's a pretty extensive routine, I think, yep, on to the next. And that's fine. But this morning, I shifted a little bit. And I said, outstanding, way to go. And just that shift of, ooh, you finally did everything you're supposed to, to, that was hard this morning, you did a good job. What a shift.

I don't know. My wife's like, man, you're in a good mood this morning. And I think it's simply because I didn't wake up going, get up, you loser. I woke up and thinking, I'm going to go get some good stuff done today. Just that tiny little shift. So I'm going to start talking to myself more positive. And so here's the other honest truth. The number of people who've reached out to me on the internets and have commented on like, hey, you're really helpful and we like your show, but you got to lay off yourself. You're always telling me how dumb and idiotic you are. I'm kidding.

Kind of not. So thank you all for caring about me too, like James does. One person who's never mentioned one thing about it, and that's Kelly. Kelly's just pretty much self-focused, just caring about Kelly, caring about Kelly. Hey, now that we've handled your self-talk, we need to talk about how you talk about Kelly. Hey, now that we've handled your self-talk, we need to talk about how you talk about Kelly. No, absolutely not. That's for...

Oh, let's go down that road, shall we? That's for HR to discuss. We don't need to do that publicly. But we'll talk about this email I got from Stephanie. Here's what Stephanie writes. Deloney, been listening to you for a long time. Moved out and left my husband on January 1st, 2022.

Whoa. We have two boys, age three and eight. We trade them every Monday. Needless to say, it's a huge adjustment for them and for you. Two weeks ago when I got them, I decided to start giving them both 30 second hugs three times a day. My oldest is very empathetic and is seeing a counselor to help with the transition. Oh my gosh, great use of the word mercurial. The oldest loves the hugs. He says, my hugs with the youngest. After the first couple of days, they started to change. They both seemed more settled emotionally. It also helps that we, that helps me become more settled too.

After they start to get a big stress, it reminds me that I forgot a hug. When I went to my oldest after school care yesterday, it was my first day with him again. He was very frustrated about something. I walked over and gave him a hug and he just melted. When the time was up, his emotions were more balanced and he was able to finish what he was doing. All this to say, thank you. Something so small. I'm glad that I took the advice you gave someone else and incorporated it into my life. If I could tell people two things that will change your life, one, sleep, and two, it's physical touch. And if you got little kids, make it a priority to, in concert with them,

don't force yourself on them. Then you traumatize them like a crazy person. But hug your kids. Touch your kids on the face. Hold their hands. Touch kids. All right, let's go to Zach in Huntsville, Texas, north of where I grew up.

What's up, Zach? Not much. Hauling freight. Hauling freight. What's up, Zach? Not much. Hauling freight. Hauling freight. That's what I'm talking about. Way to go, Zach. Hey, while you're at it, fix the supply chain, dude. What are you doing?

I'm just hauling stuff. I just haul whatever they tell me to. Right now, I'm hauling a load of lumber. I see you passing the buck. Hey, I'm grateful for the call, brother. What's up? How can I help you passing the buck. Hey, I'm grateful for the call, brother. What's up? How can I help? Alrighty, so

my father passed away back in September. I'm sorry. From what, man? I'm sorry. I'm not exactly sure. There was a couple of diagnoses.

I think it boiled down to mainly some type of blood infection. He fought it for well over a year and a half and around September he finally just said, I'm sorry, I can't. He even asked the pastor if it was against his face

to just admit he doesn't have to fight anymore, and he passed away. I'm sorry, man. How old are you? I'm 28. Dang, man. I'm sorry, brother. That's hard, man.

Oof. I'm 28. Dang, man. I'm sorry, brother. That's hard, man. Oof. I appreciate it. The main reason for the call, though, is I'm the oldest of four boys. I got three younger siblings. Okay. My youngest brother is 15, and he seemed to be having the toughest time with it. Mm-hmm. I don't remember.

I cannot for the life of me remember how he phrased it, but he was helping with taking care of my dad when he was having, like, when some of this was going on. Like, he said something that hinted to the idea that he thinks he's the reason dad didn't get better.

That's exactly right. Yep. I'm trying to navigate how me and my brothers can help him out. Okay. And also how I can talk to my mom about certain things that happen because there's a couple issues. If I ask if we can send him to counseling and she has also, she also gets defensive. If I ask for like help with what do you want me to do when he's having, cause like one of the reasons that prompted the call is he's having major

attitude outbursts and I don't know how to handle it. And my mom gets to me at any time. I try to do something about it and I cannot, I've asked her every which way and I cannot get her to like talk to me. It's like, what boundaries do you want me to set to get him to not have attitudes with me and how to help him? I'm not trying to be a jerk or anything.

I'm trying to be his brother and love him, but I can't handle it if you're going to yell at me for everything I do. And I, you got to give me something. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Absolutely, man. Well, again, I'm so sorry for the loss of your dad. That's hard, man.

Whether you're 28, 58, 68 or 15, it's man. Well, again, I'm so sorry for the loss of your dad. That's hard, man. Whether you're 28, 58, 68, or 15, it's brutal. All right. So I'll walk you through a few things here. And I just want to start by saying your brother's lucky to have you in his life. I want you to listen carefully. We're going to reorient a few things. And hopefully I can provide some wisdom for you. Okay. The first thing is I want you to keep this in your head, this line.

Our childhood biography becomes our adult biology. Our childhood biography becomes our adult biology. So right when you said my brother was helpful, helping take care of my dad, I wrote down the words, if he had only dot, dot, dot. And you immediately followed that up with right what I wrote down with now he's starting to blame himself, which is exactly what happens when kids are brought in.

And let's, I don't wanna, I know your kid's, your brother's 15. He's probably a big guy, whatever. He's a kid. He's a child. Okay. And when kids are given the responsibility of making sure their parents are okay, physically, emotionally, psychologically, spiritually, whatever, kids aren't strong enough to carry that. And when it inevitably goes sideways, which it always does anytime a kid is having to prop up a parent, then the kid immediately goes,

what did I do? Or I should have done this thing. If I had only done this thing, then this would have happened. This would have been okay. And if we don't get on that right now, he will try to solve for that failure, that perceived failure that's not even real

for the rest of his life. And his body will pay the toll. His relationships will pay the toll. And though these outbursts, it's his body trying to work that out right now while we're in it. He's in the middle of hard grief. And it doesn't sound like he's getting a good picture of what grieving should look like from your mom.

Is that fair? Yeah, that's very fair. I don't know exactly what caused this my mom's the person she don't really like she cried at the funeral and my brothers each took a turn giving her a hug and stuff like that but 90 of her grieving has been done alone in her room that's right so as a bit of an issue for this that i think might help her if you got any advice on this as to how to approach her about it but my my Aunt Wendy passed away five years ago, I want to say,

and she was the closest person to my mother. She was the only person, aside from my dad, that she would ever break down emotionally in front of, and she's not found another best friend since then. Okay.

And even then, she was a family member, not a best friend, right? Technically, we call her Aunt Wendy because she's been in our life for 10 years. They were our next-door neighbors. We were very close to them. Not related, but

you know what I mean. Excellent. Yeah, I've got several folks who call me Uncle John and same thing. I'm not related to them, but just in their lives of their kids. So yeah, I totally get that. I actually just forgot about this. My Aunt Wendy's husband, okay. Oh crap. I actually just forgot about this. Um, my aunt Wendy's husband, Randy, uh, adopted uncle, probably the most positive male influence in all of my brother's

lives. I forgot to mention this. He passed away a month before my dad died. Oh, geez. Okay. Yeah. That's big too. So it's just a lot of trauma, a lot of loss. All right. So, man, a couple of things here. One, you and I could probably talk for a few hours about mom. And there's not a lot you can do about mom. You just can't. And I would also, I'd cut her as much grace and slack as you possibly can. She also has that same, if I had only been able to, going through her body and head too.

If I had just cared this way or if, or maybe she's pissed off that he quote unquote quit on her. Right? He quit fighting for me. Right? And grief makes us do really gnarly things. Like make the whole situation about ourselves because we're scared. We're alone. Suddenly we're exposed. So when it gets to your brother, understand that

your brother is taking his cues on what should come next, how he should feel, what's okay, what's not okay from the grownups in his life. And he's not getting a good one from his mom right now. And what he really, really needs from his big brother is not another father. He needs a brother, okay? And it's tempting for you to come in and be the, I'm the man of the house now. And you don't talk like that.

That kind of dad stuff. Brothers do things a little bit differently, right? And brothers can say things a little bit differently that dads can't say. Brothers are able to bypass things that dads, you know, dad's got to keep some decorum and nonsense like that, which is just part of being a dad.

I got it too. But brothers can come around some of that. So I want you to keep in your mind, I'm going to be his brother, not his dad, okay? And that's going to be different lectures. That's going to be different the way, just a posture. And you've probably felt like his dad for a's going to be different. Just a posture. And you've probably felt like his dad for a long time because you all have such a big age gap, right?

To an extent, yeah. I never thought of it as like dad. But I mentioned to my brothers to let them know I was calling to see if they had any questions. One of the things my brother mentioned, he thinks I still view as a child. And jokingly, he's not totally wrong, but even still jokingly, I was like, well, of course I do. He's my baby brother. I'm 12 years older than him. So I want you to elevate him because he grew up real fast.

Okay. He's a child who's had adult experiences now. And his body's going to rattle for a while trying to toggle back and forth between that, okay? So here's what he needs ASAP. Are you all in the same community in the same neighborhood? No, I live in Texas. They live in Colorado. Okay. He needs somebody. Does he have any brothers and sisters around him in Colorado?

The brother under me lives about three hours away in Denver, and he regularly communicates and tries to help out with some of these things. And then my brother, his wife, and his children live with my mom. They're kind of like sharing a household. Are they stable? Yeah, they're stable. So he needs a brother who can take him out once a week, just them two. And he needs adults in his life talking to him about how much they're hurting. And this sounds counterintuitive and backwards. Like we need to go to the back room and hide our grief. We cry when no one's watching because we don't want to hurt little brother and you're stealing from little brother. You're making little brother

feel crazy. So he needs to know that you're weeping, that you're devastated, that you're heartbroken, that you think in your head, I should have done more, even though that's nuts. He's desperate for that from y'all, all of y'all, but he needs somebody to take him out every week and just be a human with him. And what you can do from nine hours away away like you are 10 hours away like you are is you can This is gonna sound so lame dude I'm, just telling you you can become pen pals with them Y'all can you can write him a letter once a week and you just commit to doing this which by the way You're hurting too. You've gone into fix-it mode, which is what 30 year old guys do, but you're hurting too

and Whether it's on email whether it's I'd prefer it to be handwritten, but email will do in a pinch. A weekly phone call with him just to say, hey, this week sucks. How are you? And he needs to know, oh my gosh, my big brother is struggling.

And I'm not crazy. You hear what I'm saying? His body has had two important male role models just pulled right out from under him, and now he's going to fill the gap with outbursts and chaos and whatever is going to make this pain stop hurting. And like I said, he's going to be on a sideways track if somebody doesn't step in there real quick. If the adults in his life aren't buying this, are grieving badly, this ends not well for him,

is what I'll tell you. So when it comes to, you need to have a hard conversation with your brother that lives there, with your sister-in-law that lives there, and cut mom some slack. I would tell you at the end of the day, if he starts showing signs of he's getting into drugs, he's disappearing, he's staying alone all the time, then I would reach out and call a school counselor. I'd go around mom and say, I'm worried about my brother. My mom's dealing with her own grief in a heavy, heavy way. In fact, you know what?

I'm gonna alter what I just said. I think y'all should call the school counselor anyway and let them know this has happened. And my mom's struggling with grief. We just want to let you know, there's no abuse or anything. Nobody's getting hurt, but I wanted this on y'all's radar. He needs some extra attention and some extra care right now. He needs some extra adults in his life telling him he loves him. And I'm all the way here in Texas. Just wanted to reach out with all the resources we got. I would do that today. Probably make that phone call today.

And the counselor will reach out and he'll probably be like, no, I'm cool, man. I'm fun. I'm cool. And I want you to let the counselor know he's not, he's not okay. And he's holding a lot of this in on himself. And if you'll check on him, that'd be great. And the counselor will know in short order if he needs to be referred to psychological services and things like that. But I think that'd be a gift. But man, if your brother who's living with him right now could just say, hey, once a week, we're going to get something to eat, just the two of us, I'm checking in with you.

If your brother who lives with him would, or your sister-in-law with him would get one of those, you've heard me talk about this on the show, would get a journal that just sits on his bed that he will write in every day and then drop it back off on their bed. And they can just have some sort of dialogue. Even if it just says the entry for February 29th, today sucked. That's it. That's it. Or not doing okay. Today was okay. Missed dad. Those little bitty things, it's a, it's a, it's a, it's oxygen. It's just a little breath of air,

a little breath of air, a little breath of air. And my big concern moving forward is mom is going to start to vampire everybody and that she's going to need people to take care of her. And he's going to end up in that role too. Is that, am I onto that or no? I'm, that's the tough, that's a tough one to figure out because my mom, despite the fact that she's kind of hiding most of her grief, she is still a really strong woman. She's put up with a lot throughout the years and she does her best to take care of the family. That's the mercy I give her is I know that when she gets mad at me for questioning, like, how do I deal with him when he's doing this and stuff like that? She's trying to love him, but.

Well, but when you ask her that question, it's an indictment on her parenting. Yeah, she does take that. If she's carrying around that somehow I failed my husband and that's why he's dead, which is irrational, but that happens a lot.

That's, we just naturally go into what could I have done? And then her oldest son calls and he's like, yeah, and what about this 15-year-old too? I mean, then you see what I'm saying? Like that ends up being a heavy load. I'd rather you call him and say not, hey, you need to shut your mouth.

Not that, that's dad. Hey man, I heard you're really struggling, brother. How's it going? And if he's like, I'm not struggling, be like, dude, I hear how you're talking. You're not doing okay, right? So we're going're really struggling, brother. How's it going? And if he's like, I'm not struggling, be like, dude, I hear how you're talking. You're not doing okay, right? So we're going at it like a brother. We're going at it with, hey man, this hurts.

And you as big brother need to go first and let him know I'm not okay. You need to go first and let him know, hey, by the way, your job is to love you as much as you love dad right now. You need to turn the screens off, get out in nature, make sure you're moving around, make sure you're going to lunches and breakfasts and things like that. to love you as much as you love dad right now. You need to turn the screens off, get out in nature, make sure you're moving around, make sure you're going to lunches and breakfasts and things like that. You need to make sure you're writing this stuff down, mail it to me, I'll mail you it back.

What I'm writing back to you, he needs to have some permission to begin taking care of himself in the way that he's been taking care of his dad for so long and again all that permission has to be said explicitly by an adult that he cares about and who loves him and that he knows loves him and that's you so no him hawing it has to be hey your job is not to take care of mom that's not your job she's an adult your job is to love and take care of you. I'm going to send you a letter every single week. Your job is to write me back. Older brother who lives with him, you have to come eat with me. That's just two brother rules.

That's just the rule. It's going to make it happen. And on and on and on. He's so blessed to have you in his life. But hear me say, y'all got to get on him now. He doesn't need a bunch of answers. He needs a bunch of connection. Not a lot of answers. A lot, a lot of connection. We'll be right back.

We are back. Grace in Seattle, Washington. I was just in Seattle this weekend. What's up, Grace? Hi, John. How are you doing? Good. I tell you what, Seattle is one of the most beautiful places I've ever, we flew in last weekend. It is stunning how beautiful it is. Wow. Yeah, it's beautiful here. So what's up? How can I help? So first off, I'm going to say I have a cold. My voice is going to be a little funny. That's awesome. Cool. But my question was, I was wondering if you had any resources or tips on how to navigate my relationship with my sister. She has autism.

Okay. I was also wondering if you could help me process my childhood growing up with her. That's a lot. Yeah. So tell me about your sister. Is she mobile, able to talk? Yeah, she's a lot. So tell me about your sister. Is she mobile, able to talk? Yeah, she's very mobile. She's able to talk.

She graduated high school just a few years later than she would normally graduate. Cool. But she's very smart, but she still has a lot of emotional issues, I guess. Sure. Yeah. And so what was it like growing up? When we were little kids, it was really good because we were very close. We shared a room.

But then as I got into like middle school and high school, it was kind of hard because I felt like I had to include her in everything I did. Just because she needed that like extra support. Yep. So, yeah. So what's happened recently that made you want to call? Well, about five months ago, I got married. And I have trouble feeling guilty, like I'm not spending as much time with her.

And also that it's kind of hard on my mom to take care of her. Are you feeling guilty or are you feeling grief? And here's the difference. Guilt is a violation of your personal value system. I did something that's against the way I think it should have been done. Or I cheated and I don't believe in cheating. I hit somebody and I am a pacifist, right? That's guilt.

Grief is the gap between what we wanted or we hoped for, we thought would happen and what actually happened. And often folks who love someone with special needs, who then transition to basically like you're starting your own life and your life has been on pause for the last however many years, because whether you were told explicitly or you felt it, you've been living somebody else's life. And, or you've been living two lives at the same time or a life and a half or whatever and now you're starting your own and there's this grief this i can't believe i missed my whole childhood and not married i can't believe that like there's nobody like no one's gonna be able to take care of does that make sense so is it guilt or is it grief um and there's definitely

some grief there. Okay. Because sometimes I grieve that like, I don't know, it sounds bad, but like I didn't have a normal childhood. Yeah. So let me free you of that. It can be both and. You can have really,

you can be grateful for having been able to serve your sibling with special needs and serve your parents in a really challenging situation growing up. And you can weep bitterly for having not had a childhood. Both of those are okay. And in fact, you have to do both and, or one of the other ones will set your body off. Yeah. Okay? You'll have trauma issues on either side of that deal. You have to own what happened and own the fact that kids around you just got to like, their big concern was, you know, what TikTok dance did they know

and what pair of jeans they were going to wear. And you were busy dealing with somebody with some very, very unique needs, right? And you're allowed to grieve that and say that sucks and I wish it hadn't been that way and boo-hoo. And I love my sister. I love her to death. Both of those are okay. Okay.

Okay? And there's an entire industry designed to make you feel, multiple industries, to make you feel bad about either way you think on those issues, right? And it's both and. So what do boundaries look like moving forward for you? I was actually going to ask you the best way to set boundaries. Because it's, yeah, it's hard. Well, do you all live in the same neighborhood?

Yeah, we actually live in a renovated trailer right now on my parents' property, so that's been a little tricky. Yeah, I bet so. What's your, who are you married to? Who am I married to? Tell me about the person you married. Okay, so we met at a discipleship school, actually, about three years ago. Um, who am I married? Tell me about the person you married. Okay. So we met at, um, a discipleship school actually about three years ago. Okay.

Um, and he's really great. He, um, he's like good at taking out my sister and I together. Like he says, he includes her in things. Okay. So have you sat down with him and to discuss what boundaries moving forward is going to look like? Do you have a plan to get out of the trailer and to get your own place and to build your own life? Kind of. Right now, it's very at the beginning stages.

We're saving up to hopefully move out so we're not in the same area as my parents. And when you say your mom can't take care of your sister, what does that mean? Well, she can take care of her, but it's just really hard. My parents' marriage, they're still married, but they're not, they're kind of like roommates, so it's been hard on her because she doesn't get a lot of support. So Grace, what I'll tell you is going to be hard to hear, okay? Okay. Those, your mom's marriage, your mom's parenting, your mom's, this is hard and I'm balancing things.

Those are her challenges to solve, not yours. Yeah. carry your mom's challenges of her marriage, of her parenting, of her whatever, into your new marriage, you're bringing excess weight into that thing that your new marriage cannot carry. You'll crash the whole thing. So kind of like I told you earlier, it can be both and. You can really be sad for your mom

and that's her challenge to solve, not yours. Think of it like, you've heard me talk about bricks in your backpack. Have you ever heard me talk about that? Yeah, I have. Okay. So imagine you're holding a brick that you're talking to your mom and she's telling you about her marriage and about this and oh my gosh, I can't believe it. And she just handed you that brick. You can hold it and you can look at it. That's what love is. I'm going to hold it with you. I'm going to hold it for you for a minute. And then I'm going to hand it back to you because I can't carry this. And sometimes for me,

handing it back when I'm doing something hard is I'm writing stuff down, sometimes handing it back. There's all different ways to set those down, but I'm not going to carry that because I can't do anything about it other than drown myself trying to save you. Can't do anything about it, okay?

So repeat after me. I can't fix my mom's marriage. I can't fix my mom's marriage. And starting today, say it. And starting today. I'm going to stop trying. I'm going to stop trying. I can love my sister. Say it. I can love my sister. But I'm not her mom. But I'm not her mom. There you go. So here's what I want you to do.

I want you and your husband to go out. And I want you all to dream real big. Not in a cheesy way. Not in like, but in a, in three years, what would our life look like? And then this is gonna be hard. I want y'all to reverse engineer that. What do we have to start doing today, this week, this weekend, next week, next month,

so that this happens? And this dream may have a dollar amount attached to it. This dream may have, we're gonna have our own place. This dream may have, we're going to have our own place. This dream may be, we're going to move to Texas. I don't really know what it's going to be, but we're going to reverse engineer it. And when it comes to your sister, it's going to be some reverse engineering that will look like, hey, mom, we're going to work really hard to save up this much money, which means I got to start working three jobs over the next 12 to 18 months. So I'm not going to be able to come pick up sis. I'm just not going to, I'm not going to have the bandwidth to do it. And so I'm letting you know ahead of time, I used to,

I usually do these things. Great. Hey sister, we are going to come up with an every two, every two weeks, you and I are going to go out together. It's going to be our thing. But what we're doing is we're gently setting up boundaries so that your sister can have a day to plan. You can have a day to plan, but you also have 13 days off in between to have to live your life because you've never had to live your life, right?

Yeah. And that's both a blessing and a curse. It's a blessing because you've been able to pour into somebody else for so long, but I don't know that you know how, right? So you're going to have to practice how to have your own life. You're going to find yourself bored to death. And when you get bored, you're going to either do, you're going to pick up your phone and start scrolling,

or you're going to try to reinsert yourself back into mom's drama. Yeah. You're going to have to find new, am I right? Yeah. So you're going to have to find new, am I, am I right? Yeah. So you got to find new coping mechanisms. You have to find new things to get involved with. And my hope is those are going to be taking care of you, taking care of this knucklehead new husband of yours, taking care of your new baby marriage, right? Um, whatever that's going to look like working towards those things that you guys decided y'all wanted to work towards and expect some pushback, expect to feel guilty, expect lots of grief.

All this. What do I do when I feel guilty and grief? Like, how do I handle it? Write it down. Write it down. Okay. I would have a guilty and grief journal. That's just yours. And the magic of grief is you

have to have a witness. You've got to have somebody that you're talking to. So if that means you got to find a counselor and you'll build that into your budget, then do that now. I would recommend, since you don't have a good picture of what a healthy marriage looks like, you're kind of making this up as you go. And your parents didn't become roommates overnight. It happened over time. They probably were in love when they got together. That's my guess. Maybe not, but that's my guess. And so roommate-ness, that's not really a diagnostic. I should make that up though. Roommateness happens to the best of us. It's happened to me. It happens to everybody. And you've got to intentionally lean out of it

or lean way, way, way into it. I would love to see you and your husband go to counseling now while y'all are healthy and while y'all are young and while your marriage is new and y'all begin practicing language that's gonna be boundary language, love language, desire language.

Y'all gonna learn some skills right now that will pay off 20, 30, 40 years from now. Okay. Okay. And here's the word I want you to keep in your head. Keep this in your head. Keep this in your head. Practice. Practice, practice, practice.

You're going to practice boundaries. You're going to practice telling your sister not today. You're going to practice not getting involved. There's going to be times you call your mom just out of habit and be like, hey, how's dad? And then you're gonna go, nope, nope, nope, nope, nope.

I'm stopping, I'm stopping, I'm stopping. I don't wanna know. That's your husband. Right? You're practicing this. You're gonna start to pick up your cell phone when you're bored. No, put it down, put it down.

You're gonna practice it, right? And then you're gonna think, what's one thing I could going to practice it, right? And then you're going to think, what's one thing I could do to love my husband right this second? We're going to do that. I'm going to lean that way, right? So we're going to practice, practice. Everything moving forward is practicing. And like everyone in practice who wants to get good at something, you get a coach. I was with a professional coach this morning. You're going to find a coach that's going to help you. And that's going to be your marriage counselor or some pastor that you trust that's not a goofball

making stuff up or whoever, right? So, man, your sister's lucky to have you, lucky to have had you, and you're not going anywhere for a while. Your husband's lucky to have you. Let's start changing the family tree today. We'll be right back. It seems like everybody's talking about how crazy the housing market is right now and how powerless homebuyers feel. Mix that with the

stress of moving and life change and job change, and you've got a tornado of anxiety fueling one of the biggest purchases you'll ever make. This is not a good idea. So if you're a new home buyer right now, my advice to you is to focus on what you can control, like the people you choose to help you in the home buying process. You need folks like my friends at Churchill Mortgage. Churchill is a Ramsey trusted provider that's been helping people with their home mortgages

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All right, let's take one more. Let's go back to Washington to Spokane and talk to my new best friend, Mary. What's up, Mary? Oh. Oh, what of those? Yeah, and Donna. I don't even know. Hey, I don't even know what's going on, but I'm so grateful that you called.

What's up? So, thank you. It's great to talk to you. It's great to talk to you. It's better to talk to you. I've been together with my current, well, only spouse, for the past nine years. We've been married for eight. And eight of those years, there's been abuse going on. Um, gosh, what kind of abuse?

All of them. Okay. And, uh, we have two kids and things really, um, really got bad a few years ago when, um, when our daughter went through a challenging time and she needed weekly counseling that I took her to. And it was just, um, it was hard on everybody, but I was trying to get her healthy. So, um, drinking started happening more frequently. With you or your husband? With him. Okay.

And I've been with the same personal counselor this entire time. Our kids have the same counselor, and so they know all of it. Some reporting has happened. Are your kids safe? Yes. Are they watching things? Are they seeing things happen to their mother they shouldn't be seeing? Yeah.

Okay. The physical stuff has not happened since about seven months ago, six months ago when he, um, last did it, but it was never, you know, on the brink of death or anything, but he did. He did get arrested. Yeah. Okay. Good for you. He got arrested. He did get arrested? Yeah. Okay, good for you. I called 911. Good for you. He got arrested.

He was charged. And there was no contact order in place. And then he got another charge. And now he's on probation. Okay. But for some circumstances, he's now... I'm sorry, this is hard.

No, of course it's hard. Take your time. I've been making plans for quite a while to leave him, but I haven't really found the strength to do so because my parents had the world's nastiest with a capital N divorce. And it was terrible. And I don't really remember much from my childhood because of my own assault that was happening at that time.

But as I'm kind of peeling back those layers, more memories are coming back. And I can't, I just, I don't really remember them married. But what I do remember the most is how alone I felt when my parents did separate. And, um, although I've, I've made the steps, I've never really made that big leap to finally then be done and move forward with my two kids, our two kids. Um, but I did have the conversation with him early last week. Um, and I told him I was done. And in the first time for the first time in the last eight years, he wasn't defensive or denying that anything has happened. But I don't trust that this is going to last because he usually does. He's usually good for a week, maybe.

Mary. A month, you know. So I guess I'm just really trying to figure out, because a lot of words were thrown around last week that have kind of thrown me off, which is I'm the one wrecking the family. Mary, Mary, Mary, Mary. Mary.

Yeah. You know. Yeah. You know. Yeah. You know. You're worth more than all of this. And there's a moment now where you get to, for the first time in a decade, finally love yourself enough to scratch and claw yourself back to two feet and say, I'm worth more than this. And especially these two little babies are worth more than this.

There's no words. There's no, I promise you, there's no, you have a baby this time, it's 10 years. 10 years. Your parents' divorce is not your separation. Your body remembers that trauma. My guess is a lot of your childhood trauma

got pinned on that divorce. What do I mean by that? My guess is it probably is not as bad as you remember it, the actual divorce. My guess is it got wound up in a whole bunch of other stuff. I may be way wrong on that, but my guess is there was a lot of abuse going on a lot of trauma going along a lot of screaming and yelling and stuff that terrified a child that got pinned on and i say pinned on our bodies just do this man um in trauma trauma screws up our memories big time they got pinned on the divorce process and my guess is it wasn't that And hear me real clear when I say what I'm about to say, okay? Okay. You can do the right thing, and it still hurts like hell.

Leaving an abuser, someone who, I mean, just listening to your language, he hasn't done it in six months and he's out of jail now and he's saying and I was never really close to death all of those things are ways we just try to make what we have happened to us

okay so that we can just keep stumbling forward and you deserve more than a stumble forward life and so this is the end of an era this is the end of a decade this is the end of a fantasy. And so this is the end of an era. It's the end of a decade. This is the end of a fantasy you've had. This is the end of a picture. This is not what you signed up for, and it slowly became the hell on earth that you were living.

All of that's going to hurt when you finally say, no more, I'm worth more than this. It's going to hurt bad, and that doesn't mean it's the wrong thing. If you have a heart blockage, they have to break your ribs and open your chest up to fix your heart. It hurts and it's right.

Just like this. Okay. I think I'm doing it more so that the kids could see. I know, I know. But because, and if you have to do it for the kids, fine. But I'm telling you, you're worth doing it for you. Nobody deserves to live in the horror and the fear and I can't sleep. And my body's not my own body.

Yes. Nobody should live like that. Yes. Nobody. But I also know after a decade of living like that, it's hard for you to even look in the mirror and say, believe that. Your body feels it right now as I'm saying it. I know it does.

But it's hard to even believe it cognitively. So fine do it for your kids But you and me my friend mary Do this for you Because you're worth this And when I say you're worth this here's what you're worth can you imagine just falling asleep at night and sleeping all night Can you imagine getting to decide if you're going to have sex or not? Can you imagine not getting hit over something stupid like you bought the wrong beer or whatever? Or you forgot to pay a bill? That's what I mean when you're worth it. You're worth going to sleep. You're worth laughing.

You're worth wrestling around with your kids and not having to worry the house out of place or whatever's going on in your home for the last eight years. Yeah. So hear me say this. There is no more conversations. Conversations have been had and you know as well as I do the my guess is he is a master at lobbing emotional and verbal grenades at you that will cut to your core and will cut back to that little girl who's still trying to fix her parents marriage from way back in the day still wondering what she did to deserve the abuse that you endured as a child. Am I right?

Yeah. Yeah. That crap wasn't your fault. You were a baby girl, man. Should not have happened. And your body's trying to solve it now. And this is how these things happen generationally. Some guy finds somebody who's still trying to solve it and he tries to

be that solution and makes you crazy. Okay? Okay. Here's what I want you to do today. I want you to write that little girl a letter. I want you to write you when you were nine a letter. Will you do that?

Yeah. And I want you to let her know that she's a sweet little girl and it's time for her to go play. Because the adults in her life suck. And they've hurt her for too long and no more. Now grown up Mary's back. And we're going to start turning

stuff around. And now little girl Mary can go play. Okay. Will you do that? Yeah. Do you have somebody to walk alongside you during this? It's going to be hard. This guy sucks.

Maybe, yeah. So hear me say, you can't do this by yourself, okay, Mary? You got to have somebody to walk with you. Okay. All right. Have you called a lawyer already? Yeah. Okay.

I've had one retained. Good. He doesn't know that. Make sure you go to the next appointment. You promise me you won't skip the next appointment? Promise. I don't have one scheduled, so I feel like that's a little bit. One will come up, one will come up, and then you're going to be talked out of going, or you're going to talk yourself out of going. And that's where having somebody with you that's going to be your

accountability partner, that's going to go with you, that's going to show up with you, that's going to call you and be like, nope, because everything in your body is going to want to skip this part. And you got to go. You just told me and all 11 of our listeners. We don't have a lot. Actually, we've got millions. You just told millions of people that you're in and we're walking alongside you and we're walking with you. I'll say it one more time. You, my friend Mary, are worth being loved. You're worth going to sleep. You're worth laughter. You're worth joy. You're worth people being patient with you. You're worth screwing stuff up, figuring out and having somebody laugh with you and walk alongside

you. Your kids are worth all that too. We'll be right back. Hey, what's up? Deloney here. Listen, you and me and everybody else on the planet has felt anxious or burned out or chronically stressed at some point. In my new book, Building a Non-Anxious Life, you'll learn the six daily choices that you can make to get rid of your anxious feelings and be able to better respond to whatever life throws at you

so you can build a more peaceful, non-anxious life. Get your copy today at johndeloney.com. All right, as we wrap up today's show, I'm gonna end it with two things. One, some positivity. Good job, James, Benjamin, Kelly. Just kidding, you did great, Kelly. You did great.

You did great. Song of the day is from my favorite band, the Avett Brothers. Off the Magpie and the Dandelion record, 2013 it came out, and the song is Another is Waiting, and it goes like this. It's a fake. It's a hoax. It's a nowhere road where no one goes anywhere, anyhow.

Well, you're following your heart rate down. She's a rose. She's a queen, but she's staring at a magazine in the dark on the path where they doctor every photograph. Another is waiting. She isn't saying anything. But if you care, if you like, well, I'm standing in the lantern light with our weapons and our love,

and I use them both to cover up. Come on, guys. These guys are so good. We'll see you soon.