The Dr. John Delony Show - I’m in Love With a Married Woman

Episode Date: August 28, 2023

On today’s show, we hear from: - A man in love with a married woman - A mom who wants to stop being a control freak - A woman who wants to set a boundary with her mom To pre-order John's new book Building a Non-Anxious Life click here. Lyrics of the Day: "I Don't Love You" - My Chemical Romance Enter The Ramsey Cash Giveaway for a chance to win $3,000!  https://bit.ly/TDJDSgvwy Let us know what’s going on by leaving a voicemail at 844.693.3291 or visiting johndelony.com/show.  Support Our Sponsors: BetterHelp DreamCloud Hallow Thorne Add products to your cart create an account at checkout Receive 25% off ALL orders Resources: Anxiety Test Own Your Past, Change Your Future Questions for Humans Conversation Cards Redefining Anxiety Quick Read John’s Free Guided Meditation Listen to all The Ramsey Network podcasts anytime, anywhere in our app. Download at: https://apple.co/3eN8jNq These platforms contain content, including information provided by guests, that is intended for informational and entertainment purposes only. The content is not intended to replace or substitute for any professional medical, counseling, therapeutic, financial, legal, or other advice. The Lampo Group, LLC d/b/a Ramsey Solutions as well as its affiliates and subsidiaries (including their respective employees, agents and representatives) make no representations or warranties concerning the content and expressly disclaim any and all liability concerning the content including any treatment or action taken by any person following the information offered or provided within or through this show. If you have specific concerns or a situation in which you require professional advice, you should consult with an appropriately trained and qualified professional expert and specialist. If you are having a health or mental health emergency, please call 9-1-1 immediately. Learn more about your ad choices. https://www.megaphone.fm/adchoices Ramsey Solutions Privacy Policy

Coming up on the Dr. John Deloney Show. You've fallen for a married woman. Yeah, doesn't really work as well. The story would be so much different if she wasn't already married. The fact that she's going home and sleeping in a bed with another dude. Yeah, definitely don't like that emotionally. It's ate me up inside. It's the reality.

The person that you have feelings for right now woke up in the bed of another man this morning. What in the world is going on? This is John with the Dr. John Deloney Show. So grateful that you've joined us. We have a packed house out there. Just kidding, there's two. There's two. Two people got up early to come watch the show.

Hey, and for those of you listening, I'm so grateful that you are joining us on this show. As you know, we talk about mental health. We talk about emotional health. We talk about your marriage, whatever's going on in your dating life, your kids. Kids are going back to school. Or by the time you hear this, kids will be back in school.

Whatever you got going on in your life. Kelly's raising the roof in there. Get my kids out of my house. Whatever you got going on in your life. My promise is I'll sit with you and we will work it out and figure out what's the next, what's the next right step. What's the next right step. If you want to be on the show, give me a buzz 1-844-693-3291 1-844-693-3291, or go to johndeloney.com slash ask. And, um, two, two big asks that I've got for you. Um. I don't like to ask for a lot, but please go like and subscribe to the show.

That does make a huge difference in how the show gets kicked up into the algorithms. We had our biggest month all time ever, ever. We ended up the top five last month. It's amazing to see the support you guys are continuing to give to the show. And continue, I'm gonna continue to just beat this to give to the show and, um, continue. I'm gonna continue to just beat this drum. My brand new book, building a non-anxious life.

This is the actual book. I'm excited about it. Um, it is in presale right now. If you go to johndeloney.com, you can pre-order it for 20 bucks and we'll send you all kinds of stuff. You can instantly download a talk I did for a couple thousand folks, um, on one of the chapters in the book. And, um, you'll get the ebook and the audio book. Some folks have asked like, hey, can I just get the audio book? You can when it comes out, but it's going to be like 12 or 15 bucks or whatever. So you can get a hardback copy here. I'm autographing some of these books, whatever. So building a non-interest life. This is it. If you're watching on YouTube, check it out. Go to johndeloney.com and pick it up for 20 bucks. It really, really helps the final count of the book.

And I just can't tell you, we've been so blown away by the numbers on the front end. What's up? You just say something. Well, just wanted to make sure people know the actual date the book comes out. Yes, the book will be in your hand October 3rd. Right.

If you pre-order it, it comes out on October 3rd and it should be in your mailbox that morning. That morning. That's exactly right. Yeah. And they're shipping up some pallets up to the building i'm gonna spend a couple of days signing books and signing books which is the it's the funnest thing for me man so

um thank you all so much check that check that out let's run out to cleveland ohio and talk to the great and powerful bradley what's up brad how's it going dr john i'm doing great man how are you uh living the dream sir anytime somebody says you? Living the dream, sir. Anytime somebody says they're living the dream, they're for sure not living the dream. I mean, that's the midwest way. I mean, it's what we do. We lie. What's up, dude? Going through life. Had a question about relationships.

Met this new girl that's absolutely incredible. And she is in the process of going through a separation and then a divorce and just feeling some feelings of I don't want to say shame, but uncertainty. I want to know how to best support her, me.

We talked about wanting to be together. I know I truly care about her. I know she feels the same. Just looking for some guidance on how to move forward with that. How honest can I be with you? I'm ready. You've fallen for a married woman. Yeah, that's the truth.

The best advice I can give you, just guide a guy sitting across the table, is run as fast as you can. And I know you don't want to hear that because she's incredible and she's had some moments where you can reach out and actually help her because she's been struggling

and for the rest of your time together, you will wonder when this other shoe drops and you're the other guy. That definitely crossed my mind. I would tell you right now, man, you will wonder when this other shoe drops and you're the other guy. No, it's definitely crossed my mind. I would tell you right now,

man, she's cheating on herself. She's cheating on her, even if she's in the middle of a breakup. And by the way, that's the number one thing I hear from folks who are like, no, no,

no, no. Like we're already breaking up and there's their husband or wife has no idea that they're already breaking up. Right. I would tell you to, as hard as this is going to be, I would tell you to run. And maybe, and even after she gets, y'all get divorced, or she gets divorced, and there's six months where y'all are friends or whatever, then maybe.

But I'm telling you right now, dude, you're never going to be able to sleep. Have you already had those feelings? Or I, I bet, let me ask you this. Are you feeling weird that she goes home to her house with her husband? Uh, it comes every so often, but I mean, generally I just kind of do my best to, you know, not think about that. The fact that she's going home and sleeping in a bed with another dude? Yeah. Yeah. I mean, definitely don't like, yeah. That she's sleeping with another guy?

Yeah, definitely. Again, no, don't like that. Definitely something that's crossing my mind, and I just, again, just don't think about it. Well, I do. I can't not think about it, but. I bet you're being coy. I bet you think about it a lot. do I can't not think about it but I bet you're being coy I bet you think about a lot depends on the day I mean to be honest they're like some days more than others other days not um yeah I mean I want to say it's on my mind every waking moment I can't say

with absolute you know honestly that's never there yeah uh just i mean again just depends on the day how this happened man um i we uh met through some uh some through martial arts um when i first met her, she, there's like instantaneous chemistry and at no point would I have ever thought she was married then. She didn't have a ring on, just the way it was looking, there was nothing that would have seemed

a married woman. And at that point, I knew if I met her again, it would have been an issue for me because I felt the chemistry right away. At that point, I was in a, if I met her again, it would have been an issue for me because, like, I felt the chemistry right away. And at that point, I was in a relationship, so I didn't do anything. And then a couple months later, we met up again. At that point, I wasn't. And I was like, oh, you know, it definitely just kind of spurred from there.

But I think it's just so much of the compatibility, like, that instantaneous chemistry, but it doesn't really work as well if, you know, the story would be so much different if she wasn't already married. Yeah. I mean, the story would always be different if dot, dot, dot, fill in the blank. If they were taller, faster, funnier, made more money. No, absolutely. Weren't married, right? I mean, I can't lie. I figured what you said there about running uh i figured the um what you said

there about running be the you know i figured that's what you're gonna say why haven't you yet not what i wanted to hear i know why haven't you what okay because i think about this you met her she was married yeah and yeah even your own words like i wouldn't even have known which told me she was flirty she was fun she was hilarious She was a good martial arts competitor, like a corner, not a, the cornerstone of her life. Yeah. You didn't even know about, um, so put yourself on the other side of that, man. What happens when, when, when that happens to you? No, I,

you bring up a lot of stuff that I've thought about and I promise I have, and naively or ignorantly, I push it away. Um, I ever, it's a lot easier to say, Oh, that wouldn't be me.

Um, I think at this point, not, not running. I've been, again, so easy to call up in the feelings and the emotion. And right, wrong, or indifferent, we have been through nothing romantic, but we've been through different things.

She's had various medical stuff that I've been the only person that's been there with her because she didn't trust her husband or family to be there. I'm going to tell you right now, dude. She's playing you. Here's what's happening. She found herself in really, really deep water, and you happened to swim by, so she clung to you. And she'll cling to you until the smoke clears on this thing. Good old school trauma bonding, man. It's not even trauma bonding, dude.

There's not a bond here. This is someone holding on to you for dear life, and you like the warmth of that hug. And I don't blame you. I don't blame you at all. But you have to see that what you're feeling and experiencing is not real. It feels so intense and so good and so right. And there's none of it is real. If you were to call me and say, hey, six months, like I just met this woman.

She's amazing. She just got divorced six months ago. And I'm thinking about asking her out or whatever. I would tell you to be careful then. Right. But you don't even feel comfortable being Brad right now. You don't feel comfortable being in a relationship with a married woman, right? No, I don't. So what is it about this whole thing that is making you take what you feel and just throw it away or just put it in a paper shredder and just keep plowing forward again i guess it could just be naivety could be

ignorance could just be getting so caught up in the emotion that's there with it um genuinely trusting and believing that you know what she's saying and how she's acting is that she wants that new relationship, that new life, and she wants it with me, but ignoring the potential downfalls and the hole that I'm digging with it. I would even go as far to say as I don't know that she's, I wouldn't call her a liar right out of the gate. I don't think she's lying to you.

No, I mean, I don't think she is. I think she doesn't know either i i let me just give you the stats on it yeah i a hundred percent of the time i've never seen this work now i'm gonna get all kind of there's gonna be a bajillion people in the youtube comments they're like no one time fine i don't know those people yeah i don't know them i i don't know them sometimes people will meet some i do know people who are like have full-on affairs and go on to get divorced and be with the person they're having an affair with and that goes on fine um but i can hear in you you really have feelings for this person and you understand

that you have feelings for somebody in a house that's on fire. No, that's, that's, that's right. So what's your question? Like, how can I help you? I know I've kind of just taken all the air out of everything. No, I mean, I mean, the genuine question was, you know, how could I best support her and myself? And, you know, at that point it was like a future us, but the future us has been deflated, you know, probably rightfully so.

I mean, you know, a lot of you should just blaze a trail ahead without looking around to see what's going on. If this is going to be a hard thing to hear, but it has not been your job to take care of her. That's been her husband's job and her family's job. If she's in an abusive situation, she's getting beat up, whatever, that's a whole other situation and that doesn't sound like what's going on here. And that separation is not a lengthy drawn out process.

So I would ask you, if she was so committed to this, why is she still going back to that same house? I mean, for her words, it was, um, finding housing, which she just did. And then, um, with the medical stuff, the insurance was with him. So she was holding onto it for that. Explanations, maybe excuses. No, but from a like a logical standpoint it made sense to me emotionally it's you know just kind of ate me up inside but yeah and it's still eating you up inside

no it is and if you think about it from her side she got a free pass she didn't have to deal with the relationship challenges that she she may or may not have um she just got this guy that swooped in and gave her rides, took care of money, took care of meals, took care of emotional needs. She didn't have to do the hard work of asking for help, dealing with her marriage from the inside out,

dealing with her family situation. I didn't have to deal with any of that stuff. She just had this white night that showed up and ta-da. And the moment that there's not a say, a need to be saved, there will be a reckoning of some sort. No, I mean, that is definitely something I've thought about. I mean...

How old are you? Briefly, 26. Okay. Briefly, what were you going to say? I said that's definitely something I thought about, you know, however briefly. I wouldn't say I just ignored it entirely, but after thinking about thought about, you know, however briefly, I wouldn't say just ignored it entirely, but after thinking about being, you know,

that just a temporary thing that it's just, you know, clean to the person that happens to be there. Um, you know, it's a tough time. So of course she's looking for a life raft. And then after that,

it's just going to be, you know, said and done over with, um, definitely something I thought about and for sure, something I've pushed away even more because i'm like no i can't get the reality but it's the reality the person that you have feelings for right now woke up in the bed of another man this morning that's the reality

that's the reality and at 26 this will probably be the hardest thing you've ever done maybe not maybe you've been through a bunch of crap in your life and whatever. But I think that the right call here is I'm going to call her on the phone and say, hey, I can't talk to you anymore. When the smoke clears from everything and a divorce is finalized and all that, then possibly. Maybe. But you can't. You, Brad, let me talk just to you. You cannot enter into a romantic relationship and just start pretending reality isn't real. Facts aren't actually facts, right? You can't just pretend like, I'm just not going to pretend

that she goes home to this other guy every night. I'm not going to pretend that we've been having deep conversations. We may have hooked up a few times, but she's been saying it just takes a while. It just takes a process. It just takes time. I'm slowly working on it. I'm going to do this and we're going to be together forever. You can't enter into a relationship just shoving all that stuff down. It's real. It's real. And let's be super honest, brother. It's killing you, and it should be killing you. There are people who can just be like, I don't care. That's between her and her husband,

but what we have is between us. And knock your lights out. But that's not you, man. That's not you. But you're going to, probably what would happen is if you did this, it would be like, I thought, and you said, and so you're just Probably what would happen if you did this that would be like I thought and you said and so you're just gonna leave me here To do all this by myself. Yep. I am

And if she turns the tables on you and starts accusing you of stuff and starts but you said that Now you really have all your answers Because I would say somebody who's dealing with a relationship falling apart with integrity would say hey Um, I like you. I like spending time with you It's not fair to you to drag you through what i'm going through right now And I love having you around but it's not smart. It's not safe. It's not it's not it's not reality When I all the smoke clears from this, then I'll reach out. But until then, man,

please follow your gut on this one. And your gut is so true and your gut is saying, run, brother, run. So I'll just tell you, I'll speak up on behalf of your guts, run, walk away and do it with dignity. But you got to back out of this one, man you gotta you gotta back out of this one man you gotta back out of this one and man you know that you know sorry man i wish i could have given

you some some happier news to start this show but um she's cheating on herself she's cheating on her husband she's cheating on her family she's cheating on you and that's cheating on her husband. She's cheating on her family. She's cheating on you. And that's not a great way for you. That's not a good ecosystem for you to start some new relationship right now. Sorry, my brother. We'll be right back. All right, we're back. Let's go out to Phoenix, Arizona,

where it's one billion degrees and talk to Rebecca. What's up, Rebecca? Hi, it is not quite a billion degrees, but it definitely feels hot. It feels hot because it's a billion degrees. I heard the other day

there was 25 straight days of over 110. Yeah, it was horrible, especially we just moved here from Montana. So I am not used to this heat. Why did you? Everyone in the planet is like eyeballing Montana as the sacred holy place to escape to. And you guys are like, nah, we'll move to hell. That sounds fun.

I know. Yep, that's my husband's doing. I mean, you got to reevaluate this relationship. I'm just playing. I'm playing. Golly. And again, I'm from Texas. I'm a lifelong Texan.

And even Texans are like, it's real hot. But they're looking over to their left and they're like, but it ain't Phoenix, man. Jeez. Our cactuses are falling over. Yeah, it's been a huge adjustment. Our pets' heads are falling off. All right, all right, all right. So I'll quit talking about the weather.

What's up? Yeah, so I guess I'm just going to kind of jump right into it. I wrote out my question. I hope that's okay. Yeah, that's great because I talk too much. That's perfect. Yeah, all right. Here we go.

So I'm a mother of four young kids, five and under, and I feel like my patience is spread just too thick to cover my whole family. Hold on. Let's just stop right there. I go out of my way to try and be as patient and kind with my kids as possible because I know at the end of the day, they don't mean to frustrate me as much as they do. Hold on. Hold on. Rebecca. Rebecca. Rebecca.

Oh, yes. Sorry. You have four kids under five. Yes. You are entitled to all the feelings you would like to have All of them There is no feeling You are experiencing right now

That makes you crazy Oh I don't know about that Rebecca If you said I think about murdering Three out of the four I would be like yeah that's fair You have four kids under five. That makes your house like a bomb went off inside of it.

Yeah. Most days. Yes. And you're left changing the diapers of all the survivors. That's chaos. Okay. So you are frustrated and you feel like you're snapping at people. Basically, it's just my husband at the end of the day. I know it's so bad. I've never

had problems with other people too. I'm kind of a control freak. I've been that way for, I think, all of my life. I'm sure my mom would attest to that as I'm dressing up my younger brother in dresses and carting him around the house, telling him what to do. As you should. Yeah, but I've never had issues. You know, it's not a problem when I was in school. It's never been a problem at jobs. And even with my kids, you know, I really do. I try my best. I understand at the end of the day that teaching them how I want them to behave

is going to be a process that takes years. But my husband, it's just, I have no patience, no grace for him. It is zero to a hundred, even if it's just the most minor thing. I just, I snap. Because you have four kids under five. Is he helping at all? Yes. Oh yeah. He's amazing. He's a, he's a teacher. So he has gone for most of the day, but when he gets back and I mean, he does everything that I ask him to do, but it's, it's gotta be specific. It's gotta be, you know, it cannot be, Hey, will you make up some baby food? i have to tell him exactly what needs

to be made how it needs to be made all that kind of stuff and even sometimes when i do that he still will do it different ways and that's almost where i really lose it is just that it's not done the way i want it to be done yeah yeah so what happened when you were a kid and this can happen, you can have great parents, this still happens, but somewhere along the way you learned that you had to be in control of every variable. What does that stem from? Um, probably I'm, the more I've talked to my mom, the more I think that it comes from the fact that, um, I'm the oldest of three and my sister is born with one of the rarest conditions of arthritis. She would know everything about it. I just basically know that basically

from the time she was an infant, she suffered a lot of pain in her joints. And of course, as an infant, they didn't know what the problem was. And so my mom just did not have time for me and my brother. And she tells me now that without me there, she doesn't think she would have been able to do it because I'm the one who got us up and ready for school. I'm the one who made breakfast. I'm the one who, when we got home from school, was entertaining my brother. Where was dad? And letting my mom sleep. My dad's a graveyard, um, worker.

He's a sheriff. So, you know, he's sleeping during the day and then at work for 12 hours a night. Did you say he's a sheriff? Yes. Oh, fantastic. All right. So here's what you have like, and, and I want to give you some peace on this. Okay. Um, there are some pretty compelling anecdotal uh huberman calls it anecdata um with cops kids of which i am one oh i didn't know that that's so cool yes it is cool but also comes with a lot of drama because cops kids have dads that their entire lives are lived outside the bell curve, meaning nobody gets murdered in the park except 100% of your dad's day is dealing with that one time someone did. And over time, it becomes, you know, this could happen, Rebecca.

You know, Rebecca. Hey, Rebecca. And you put on top of being a cop's kid who's working the graveyard shift, you've been a mother since you were four. And if you didn't do everything, like your mom said, the house shut down.

So the stakes have been so high for so long that if you get one thing wrong, you're out. Right? Your sister goes on whatever. Your brother doesn't have food. He doesn't go to school. You've been a parent since you could, you should not have been a parent when you were a kid. You should have been sitting in a mud puddle playing with sticks. And then you fast forward and that same skill set kicks in when you have a chaotic house. And I'm making a joke, but I'm being super serious. Four kids under five is a lot for a human nervous system to handle.

It's a lot. And so your body has one switch. It's got those neural maps already mapped out. Here's how we handle this. And then you have an amazing, loving husband who's like, or I can just put raisins in it. And your brain goes, and it lights him on fire, right? Yeah. And so your brain is doing exactly

what it's been trained to do. So I want you, A, to give yourself some grace. Stop going to war with Rebecca because that's not going to solve this. Okay. Okay. Also, you're going to have to keep on a loop in your mind. My husband is not my dad. My husband is not my mom over and over and over and over again. Okay. You had no business running your household as a, as a little girl. And yet you did. Okay. And so now what you're going to have to practice is a couple of things. Number one, you are going to have to just flat get over sister. I don't like telling him all the details. You're going to just have to help tell him all

the details. What I would tell you is these conversations are way better had not in the heat of battle. This is like, hey, we've got four kids under five. Our whole life is different. Let's go out and you hear me say this. I just beat this drum over and over. Let's go out and talk about making breakfast. Let's go out and talk about how we do laundry. Let's go and talk about some of these things. Give him a list of three or four things of the way you like it done and um so be super super clean because here's what happens you you you are not looking for the results which are clean clothes or mixed baby food your body is searching for the action am i in control of everything see what i'm saying and here's the thing you are not and And your body knows that, but your brain's like, I want to be in control. And then it creates a self-fulfilling prophecy

where he didn't want to touch nothing because he always does it wrong. And he's just going to work a little bit more. And maybe he's just going to stay a little bit later and grade papers, which leaves you on your own more. You see how this thing just gets sideways real fast, right? Yeah. And so, and then you get more control-y because your husband's going away, your kids are a little bit crazier because they miss their dad, and you grab control a little bit tighter, and then the whole thing just, right? Like one of those cactus in the Arizona desert just falling over, right? So here's how I want you to practice this. Number one, I want you to take them out and

distill it down to a few things you can't live with. Here's what I mean by that. My daughter has a peanut allergy. I didn't believe those things were real. And because I was a loud mouth, 18 to 25 year old, the Cosmos gave me a kid with a peanut allergy. When she was born, I would take her places. I would go have fun. I was trying to get out of the house. And I love doing things with my one-year-old, two-year-old daughter. I would always forget the little bag with the EpiPen in it and all that. And one day my wife said, hey, if unsuspectingly the wrong thing ends up in a cookie and you forget and hand it to her, she will die.

You cannot forget this bag. And I'll she will die. You cannot forget this bag. And I'll tell you, I don't forget that bag. There was some things when it came to how laundry gets done that my wife's like, hey, this is how I like it done. And I would say after being on the road and working, you know, a hundred hours a week at the university, this is how I can get it done. And my wife said, okay, that's cool. And so it became, I don't want to be in control. I just want clean clothes. I'm going to let these things get done in this way. And then there's a couple of clothes like, hey, please don't throw my nice whatever into the underwear and put it on hot. Like, cause it doesn't work that,

you know what I mean? So there's some basic things like that. So I want you to be very clear about the few things you can't live without. And then here's number two, you have to practice letting the rest go. And here's how you do that. I want you to ask yourself, when you start to feel yourself snapping, ask yourself, what's the worst that can happen here? And if the worst that can happen is not death or somebody getting hurt, you've got to practice letting it go. Because you've got a husband that's shown up, that loves you guys, and is trying his best. Is that fair? Yeah, that's going to be the hard part, though.

It is. I have such a hard time with that. It is. But, I mean, just think about this. Think about every time when you were a little girl, with the front door open, someone just hit you in the face with a cream pie, just splat,

right? As an adult, you would make sure you would deadbolt that front door because it's your house now. And anytime somebody started opening it, you would just duck it because you've been hit in the face with a pie a thousand times, 10,000 times.

This is the same exact thing. You have to remember what didn't, what, what, what kept me alive then is then is going to destroy my marriage now. It's not worth it. And it's not real either, by the way. And you know that. Yeah.

Is that fair? So like, go to the other side of this. Do this thought experiment with me. Just imagine how cool it would feel to not be angry with your husband. A lot less stressful. Okay. So can I say something crazy? For some reason, you're choosing stress. If you think about- But why? Why would I do that? I don't know. I'm asking you. Because that's what your body knows. Your body knows when there's a bunch of kids of kids we're supposed to feel this way and what you have to teach your body is no No, no, no, that's how it was one time

It's not going to be that way in my house because I get to decide what my house is going to feel like And i'm going for warmth and i'm going to go for joy. I'm going to go for more laughter than chaos There's always going to be chaos, especially with the way you guys did it, which is like hey Let's just throw all the ingredients in the blender at the same time. That's going to be fine, but the blender is going to get really messy. That's cool, but you get to decide. And so that means that when your husband's taking the laundry down and you see him put the t-shirts in with the underwear, you ask yourself real quick, what's the worst that can happen? Nothing. There is no worst here. The clothes are going to get clean. Okay, cool. Yeah. Can I ask a question that kind of goes along with that? Ask anything, yeah. So, because I think I've been kind of trying to do something like that where I tell him more specifically, but I guess if I ask him to do something specifically,

and then I still see later on that he's not doing it that specific way, do you think it would be better to still just practice that? Like, okay, she didn't listen this time, but nothing bad is going to happen or yes. Okay. I'll do that. But two things. One, you can't, if you've got a baby on in one arm and a baby on the other and one Raptor on your leg and he's holding the fourth and you're saying, you got to do it like this. And if you do, you got to make sure this and that he is in survival mode.

He is not in learning and listening mode. Yeah. Okay. And you are not in teaching mode. You are in control mode. I am barking orders because this is what my body knows. Oh, I like that a lot. Teaching compared to control mode.

Yes. I like that. So if you want to teach somebody, you get down, like when I want to teach my daughter something, I get down on eye level with her because I am humongous compared to her little body. And when I hover over and say, hey, her body instantly goes to fight or flight. There is no more learning happening there. She'll do what I say because I'm humongous. She will not learn why we're doing what we're doing. So I'll get down and I'll look her in the eye and say, hey, and I'll hold both of her hands. If she'll do that, sometimes she will,

sometimes she won't. And I will say, listen, if you put this in that light socket, you will die. Don't do that. And she'll get real wide eyed. And I'll say, I love you. And my job is to keep you safe. Right? See, I'm teaching her in that moment. Okay. So teaching has to be done offline. It cannot be done with kids screaming and blah, blah, blah. That's why I love like a weekly check-in husbands and wives. And by the way, it's real, real important at your kid's age, my wife and I would, I would walk in the door and it sounds cruel and I'm going to get a bunch of mean emails. I don't care. I'd walk past my kids. I'd say, hi guys, hi guys. And I'd go straight to mom. And mom got my first hug.

Mom got my first attention. And then we would always say, I would say hi to the kids. And then I would say, we have to have, we're having adult time. Y'all got to go. And they had to leave the room. And they have learned that even we say, we're having adult time, y'all got to go. And they had to leave the room. And they have learned that even we say, we're having adult talk,

they'll just get up and leave because it's just so wired into them that they just know that's a part of our home that they come second to my marriage. The kids have to come second to your marriage. And in a strange way, they will go in the rooms and they'll play and they'll do silly things.

And yes, they'll whine and complain. He hit me, blah, blah. Cool. As soon as we're done with adult time, then we'll come back. But that's the only way you can hang in there in the chaos you guys have.

Okay. Tell me what you don't like about that. I mean, just the days are hard, obviously, sometimes. But no, I think I like it overall. I think as you're saying it, I recognize that we don't really spend a lot of time just talking one-on-one. And we have twins that are eight months old. Oh, jeez. So those are the ones that really take up the most time.

But I'm thinking like even our quality time that we spend together is at the end of the day, we both feed a baby together. And then once the babies get in bed, he's got to go to bed because he wakes up early in the mornings to get ready. And he's such a nice guy. He lets me sleep in a little bit in the mornings too. So he wakes up early with the babies. But I mean, that's our quality time and it's not even truly alone. We're feeding babies together. But also, can I say this? You've been pregnant for six years. And a baby, an eight month old baby is, I love this.

It doesn't make mathematical sense, but it's the fourth trimester. If you look at evolutionary psychology, we traded humongous brains for nine to 12 more months of gestation, like of a baby having to be attached to his mom. So I want you to hear me say this. This does get better. There is a season, and you're in it where y'all ride this one out. Okay. But when you're feeding a baby, sometimes just watching a show, my wife and I watched Bones, that show with, I forget. I don't remember all the actors. We still laugh about it.

Like, man, what my poor son, what he just, what he learned by osmosis because we watched that show. But there was some of that was important. But then there was also seasons when my wife was feeding my son and the TV was just off and we just talked to each other. And that was all we could do.

That was it. That's all we could have in that season. Otherwise it was going to get chaotic. And so eight months will, in a snap of your fingers, turn into 12 months. And then when you're 12 months, you're going to have

a five-year-old, and a five-year-old can be in the shower by themselves. A four-year-old can't too, or in the bathtub. And a five-year-old, they're not going to

wipe properly, but they can go to the bathroom on their own. And there's going to slowly be a tiny little pinhole light at the end of this tunnel. And the one-year-olds will turn into 18 months old. And then you'll get a little bit of a gap. And the gap will get a little bit bigger and a little bit bigger. So right now, I don't want you to do anything drastic.

I want you all to hold on. And I want you all to come up with, all right, what do we need to hold on in this season? What do we need to hold on. And I want y'all to come up with, all right, what do we need to hold on in this season? What do we need to hold on right now? We got twins that are eight months old and we have a three-year-old and a four-year-old. God help you all. That's a lot of humans, a little dependent humans. It may be we need to get some help. And I know he's a teacher and y'all got a family of six. And so there's not a lot of extra income. Maybe a friend comes over in the afternoon. My son did some things when he was younger, when he was about 12 or 11.

He would go over and play with little kids. One mom, like a neighbor's mom did some stuff. And it was kind of like a stay at home babysitter-ish kind of thing. My son loved it. The kids loved it. And the mom loved, loved it. And because he was young, she got to pay him a lot less, just a couple of bucks.

But figure out ways, What do we need here? What do we need? What do we need and it's really hard to do that when you have babies all attached to you So I would recommend you guys get away for a half day if possible That may sound insane and have somebody come over or two people come over But y'all plan okay, everything in our life is different. We have to prioritize us first And we have to get these babies fed. What's that look like for us? What's that look like? And you, my friend, have to understand there's a light at the end of this tunnel. And how are we going to continue to

prioritize and prioritize? What are the three or four things? I got to be clear on, I'm going to die on this hill. And then yes, if you say, I need the laundry done, the bed made like this, and your husband does it 85% right, let it ride. Let it ride. Ask yourself, what's the worst that could happen here? You guys have got this. Hang on the line. I'm going to send you a copy of Building a Non-Anxious Life, my new book.

I want you guys to use this as a roadmap for your family. And y'all can create a world inside of this chaotic ecosystem y'all have. How do we create a non-anxious world? How do we create this? We'll be right back. Hey, good folks. Let's talk about hallow. All right. I say this all the time. It's important to get away for times of prayer and meditation by yourself with no one else around. But one thing you might not think about though is maintaining a sense of community when you pray or meditate. And this is especially if you don't consider yourself religious, if you question things, or if you've been burned by a

church experience in the past, it's hard to want to get together with other people. And that's another reason why I love Hallow. You can personalize your prayer experience with Hallow and they give you three free months to do it. You can prayize your prayer experience with hallow and they give you three free months to do it. You can pray or meditate by yourself, or you can connect with friends, with family, a prayer group, or some other community that you choose. And this way you can share prayers, share meditations. You can even share journal reflections to grow in your faith together with others. And with hallow, there are other ways you can personalize the app. They have downloadable offline sessions and links ranging from one minute up to an hour,

and you can listen where it works for your schedule. You can choose your guide, your background music. You can create your own personal prayer plan and more. I've made it a personal point to begin my day every single day with the hallow meditation on the scripture of the day. It's a discipline and it's a practice. And here's what I'm learning. As with anything of importance and meaning, prayer takes intentionality, practice, and showing up even when I don't feel like it, and even I don't want to. This is discipline. Sometimes you do this by yourself, and sometimes you do this with a group, and Halo helps you with both. Download the number one prayer app on planet Earth, Halo, right now. And listen, viewers and listeners of

this show get three free months when you go to halo.com slash Deloney. It's amazing. Three free months of the app when you go to halo.com slash Deloney. Go right now and change your life. All right, we're back. Hey, man, I didn't even notice that last call. We got a whole bunch of more new people out here. Look at this. Are those twins? Wow.

All right, let's go out to Kaylin in Columbus, Ohio. What's up, Kaylin? Hi. How we doing? I'm all right. How are you? Good, good, good, good. Okay, so to give some context here, you called in on another show.

I was on the Ramsey show. You called in, and you were talking about boundaries with your mom. Is that right? Yep. Okay, walk me through the original call here. Okay. And what the advice I gave, because it may have been terrible advice.

No, it was good. It was good. So I called, essentially since I graduated high school, my mom has been asking me for money. And I'm just feeling kind of over it. And, um, so, but my mom doesn't have a very good income. She has a very low income, so I can't just not give her anything. So your advice was to, um, pay a bill directly to the company and tell her like, I'm taking this over, but I'm not giving you any more money.

I'm not giving any money directly to her. Okay. And I don't know if we talked about this, but why does she choose to make an income that she can't live on? So she, yeah, I forgot to recap that part um she's on disability okay yeah she has a seizure disorder and her knees are horrible because my brother beat her that's right that's right that's right so there's some family violence in there and then um so she's on a fixed income but if i remember correctly does she spend a She just, she doesn't even have that much money, but she spends all of the money she doesn't have. Like, I'll give you an example here

in a minute when I tell you my new problem. Okay. Okay. So basically I told you, Hey, if it was my mom, I'd continue to help her out. But clearly just handing her cash is not helping the problem. So instead of handing somebody the cash, I will take care of one bill or two bills or whatever, but I'm going to, I'm going to pay directly to the company. I'm going to take this burden off of you. Yeah. Okay. And so bring me that now we're up to speed. So what's happened since then? Okay. So a few days after that, I, I don't live in the same city as my mom. So I drove down and like sat her down and we went through her expenses. We went through her income. We, I downloaded every dollar we talked about, like, mom, you have to budget, like, look, you just don't have enough money right now

because you're spending here and here and here. And, um, I told her I would take over some of the bills. And I think the phrase that I used was I'm paying this, but that is it. I cannot be your emergency fund anymore. Um, I just stopped real quick. Good for like. That was a hard conversation, wasn't it? Yeah, I was so stressed about it. I think I listened to her call on the Ramsey show like five times right before to like- Get all pumped up. ... reassure myself. Yeah. You were like Dwight in the Camaro listening to Motley Crue, just like getting ready.

Good job. Yes. All right, good job. Okay, so you had this conversation. How did she take it in person initially? It seemed to go well. I mean, she was upset and embarrassed, but she seemed receptive.

And my sister was there too. My sister lived with her and also just gives her money all the time. And so I talked to my sister too about like, I know you live together and you don't pay rent, but you need to come up with like a set number that you're paying her every month. Not just like swipe my card when you run out.

Just not be an ATM machine. Good for you. Gosh, good for you. Okay. So I'm assuming that sounded good in philosophy in theory but then in reality has been different yeah so we had that conversation seemed to be good i set up to pay a couple of her bills um and then literally the next week she was, hey, do you want to go to a concert together?

I just bought tickets. So that was very frustrating. Yes, so frustrating. So now she's got a little bit of room to breathe and she chose to buy concert tickets, right? Yeah, and I don't think they were insanely expensive, but I know they were more than the amount that we budgeted for stuff.

Yeah. And then last week, Like I know they were more than the amount that we budgeted for stuff. Yeah. Um, and then last week, so before I emailed you guys, um, she called me crying on Thursday. Um, and said like,

I'm so sorry to ask you this. I know you said you can't give me any more money, but, um, the property taxes are due and I am a failure and I didn't budget for them.

I need $1,000. Oh. And I kind of sat in silence for a little bit and she said, or, I mean, if you could at least do $500, that would help. Wow. Yeah. So you asked me what you should do now? Well, I told her no. Okay. Um, so,

okay. So there's another layer to this that I'm like kind of done with giving her all of this money is because my spouse and I are like aggressively saving to cashflow fertility stuff. Um, cause we want to be parents and my mom knows that we've had this conversation that we're trying to save up this money so that we can have a baby because it won't work for us naturally. And it feels like when she asked me, gosh, knowing what we're trying to do with our money, it feels like she's saying, my desire to not budget is more important

than you guys being parents. And that's making me feel really resentful. And like, I know you always say she's guilt over resentment, but I'm feeling both. Yeah, well, and let me reframe that a little bit, okay? Yeah.

Do you have kids yet? No. Okay, okay. Yeah, that's what y'all are working on. Okay. So, I've got two little ones. I've got a 13-year-old and a 7-year-old, okay? I'm trying to imagine what would happen if on the way home today,

I got in a car wreck and I hit my head just enough that I couldn't, I couldn't talk as quickly as I can on the show. And ultimately me and my boss, me and Dave had to sit down and say, Hey, um, uh, we can't, I mean, we can't have you on the radio show anymore. I had to go on disability. And then when I was on disability, my 13 year old, which is just, this is funny because he's the kindest guy in the world, but he got mad at me with a baseball bat and broke both of my knees. And I went through rehab again and had to get on government assistance and I was on disability and I'm never going to be what I was. And I'm pretty active. I'm out all the time and so i want to i do get the feelings that you have your feelings are very very real

but just for context i'm going to imagine your mom as somebody who's gone through severe trauma and her life as she had mapped it out is nowhere close to what she thought it was going to look like. And her body has, over time, focused everything on her own belly button. Right? And so I don't think she, and this may even hurt worse, I don't think she even thinks of you guys. I don't think it even enters her mind because everything is about the next second in her life.

And because she has lost the inability over time to look up and see out ahead of her and see other people and experience the people's lives, she just staring at her belly button, belly button, belly button. It's all about right now. I want to buy these tickets right now. I need a thousand dollars right now.

And I just expect the world to give it to me because in, in many ways she's given up on herself. And I'm going to even say for some of that, fair enough, but eventually people who give up on themselves do one of two things. Either they run out of options and they decide today's the day, like sick and tired of being sick and tired, right? You've heard that? Yeah.

I'm going to figure this out. Or they spiral out. you're putting up some pretty significant boundaries and you're choosing your family, your husband and the family that will be to come over just being an endless ATM machine. And the way you've done it, which is not just cutting her off and not just saying, forget you. No, we're still gonna honor you. I'm still gonna honor my mother and father.

Honoring doesn't mean I have to do whatever you say whenever you ask. That means I'm gonna love you the best we can right now. And so I'm going to pick up one or two bills. I think that's pretty noble. But I would tell you, I would get out of her head as to why she's calling, what she's not thinking about, what she's trying to do to you and your husband. I would get out of her head Because all that does is weigh you down Yeah, it's an exhausting thing to try to figure out what your mom is thinking, right? Yeah

And so I would just quit trying to figure that out and I would stick by our boundaries And if you and your husband want to say, okay, you send us your bill And i'll tell you this, um when people start budgeting it usually takes about 90 days about three budget cycles to get it all ironed out Because crap like this happens like oh, I forgot about life insurance. That bill just showed up or I forget that You know, we oil changes I forgot that Um, and so these things just pop up And so it usually takes about 90 days three three months to get to a solid budget. And so it may be that you sit down with your husband and say, hey, we cut off, we cut mom off, but there's

going to be an exit ramp here. It's going to be a little bit longer than we hoped. So mom, you send me your tax bill and me and my husband will decide. Because that tax bill may not even be real, right? Yeah, I don't know. Yeah, exactly. So you send me the bill, I'll consider it. Or you say, mom, we're just not going to do any more money right now. Yeah. And I'll tell you this. Here's probably what's going to happen.

There's going to be tears, and it sounds like she's already tried that, calling you, I'm such a loser, I'm the worst. Will you help your poor mom? You said good for you for holding boundaries and then it's going to turn to anger how dare you who do you think you are who do you think you are right yeah i just don't know like like i saw her yesterday and like I was just like my whole body was just like tense the whole time and I don't know if that's because you always say to like

weed with this my ACEs score is like a 9 so I don't know if that's why or like but like I feel like I get worked up easily but hold on your body's been trying to protect you for so long Kay Kaylin. I know. And your mom has never been a place that's safe.

And I want to tell you this. She should have been. I'm not blaming her because it sounds like the whole world caved in on her too. Yeah. But your mom's not safe. And so constantly putting your finger back in the light socket and getting frustrated, you keep getting electrocuted. At some point, that's on you.

And that means you have to deal with, you have to grieve the picture that I'm going to have this new husband who's amazing. We're going to have a couple of kids. It's going to be amazing. And we're going to have grandma time. You may not have grandma time. Or it may be very limited and very different than how you had hoped it would be. And you have to also grieve the fact that we were just going to start having babies. And that's been a challenge, right?

Yeah. And the one person you should be able to call is your mom. And you can't call mom. And so that means not that you do without calling people, but now your new mission is to find a woman who's got some experience down the road from you that you can trust that you could reach out to. Do you have that? Um, maybe. Everything in your body will say, don't take a risk with a maternal figure. And I'm going to tell you, you got to. You need that. You're worth that.

You see how much bigger this picture gets for you? Yeah. Have you been to counseling yet? Yeah. I've been in and out of counseling for a long time, but I started going again a couple months ago. How is that working? It's good.

I haven't been able to see my person for a couple weeks because she's been on vacation. Okay. I want you to get back in as soon as possible, and here's what I want you to ask in a direct way. I need to work on A, boundaries with mom, and B, I need to work on some skills that when I'm with mom, I stop outsourcing the way my body feels to her energy. That's what healing actually is, is when you can be around somebody who's not okay and you remain okay.

You can remember those things that happened to you and ACEs score of nine means you grew up in hell, right? Yeah. Yeah. That you can think back to some of those things and your body doesn't take off on you. I'm going to tell you, being on the other side of it,

it's amazing do you trust me that that healing is real? yeah I promise I promise what you've done with the skill set you've got is

nothing short of staggering it's amazing and you don't see it because you're in the middle of it you just feel every time mom calls or every time she's around your heart starts beating really fast Remember this line she does not get a vote. Do you have any close close friends besides your husband?

Um I have a couple okay, I want you to call them And I want you to um, if you can invite them out for coffee, great. If not, cool. Talk to them on the phone and just say, I'm going through a new season of healing, especially as I enter into IVF and all that stuff, which is just an up and down roller coaster. It's brutal. And I'm going to need somebody to reach out to just to say i'm not okay today

And i'm choosing you and i'll hope that you'll accept that role like like 007 this. I hope you'll accept the mission And I might text you at midnight I might text you at 10 a.m And here's our secret code if I need you to call me right away But can I count on you in that way and And they may say no, they may say no, but I bet they won't. I bet they'll say absolutely. Because you're doing the right things, the hard right things. I'm proud of you. But now we're going to move into step two, which is, we're putting up boundaries, which are great. Now that we've got these boundaries up, we got to take care of the heartbeat inside these walls,

inside these boundaries. And that's you. It's going to be some intentional connection with husband. It's going to be some intentional connection with some friends. It's going to be some intentional disconnection from mom.

And by the way, when the money gets cut off, she'll probably pull away and you're going to feel a tension that you got to go find her. You don't. Not in this season. Not while you're getting well.

Because mom's still not safe She's gonna get mad she can get angry all that Mom's not safe So i'm gonna hold my ground i'm gonna hold my boundary i'm gonna rely on my people who I love I'm proud of you hang on the line. I'm gonna send you building a non-anxious life, too Um, that's something you and your husband can use as a roadmap inside your home because you're going to have to build something you've never seen, which is a home full of laughter and warmth and joy, not a home full of chaos, chaos, chaos, and abuse.

You call anytime. We will, we'll, I'll have you on the show once a week. Just have you call in and check in and see what the latest thing I can help you with. But I promise you there's healing on the back end of this. Last thing, as I said earlier, be very direct with your counselor about what you want to work on. We're not just going to go and talk anymore. We're going to get very specific because I need to learn how to live in my own skin. And unfortunately, I got to learn to live in my own skin separate from mom. I promise you can do it. I promise. We'll be right back.

Hey, what's up? Deloney here. Listen, you and me and everybody else on the planet has felt anxious or burned out or chronically stressed at some point. In my new book, Building a Non-Anxious Life, you'll learn the six daily choices that you can make to get rid of your anxious feelings and be able to better respond to whatever life throws at you so you can build a more peaceful, non-anxious life. Get your copy today at johndeloney.com. All right, we're back as we wrap up today's show. This is Kelly's latest tattoo. I didn't strike her as an emo gal, but I did catch her the other day

with her fingernails were all painted black and she had like the swoop haircut. And I walked by and she was like, it's time to go right now. And then she was writing poetry about her dad. It was the whole thing. But she got this one tattooed on the back of her neck, right above her barcode symbol.

And it just says My Chemical Romance real small, which is kind of cool. Song's called I Don't Love You. And it goes like this. Well, when you go, don't ever think I'll make you try to stay. And maybe when you get back, I'll be off to find another way. And after all this time that you still owe, you're still good for nothing. I don't

know. So take your gloves and get out. Take your gloves and get out. I've never heard that. I've heard take your jacket, take your coat, but take your gloves and get out. Take your gloves and get out. I've never heard that. I've heard take your jacket, take your coat, but take your gloves and get out. Better get out while you can. When you go and would you ever turn to say, I don't love you like I did yesterday.

Whew, dark poetry. My Chemical Romance, Kelly's fave. I love you guys. Bye.