The Dr. John Delony Show - I’m Scared I’m Turning Into My Father

Episode Date: August 30, 2024

On today’s episode, we hear about: ·      A man looking for advice on how to control his anger ·      A wife unsure if she should open a separate account for her inheritance ·      A single dad seeking advice on co-parenting after a toxic relationship   Next Steps 📞 Ask John a question! Call 844-693-3291 or send us a message. 📚 Building a Non-Anxious Life 📝 Anxiety Test  📚 Own Your Past, Change Your Future  ❓ Questions for Humans Conversation Cards  💭 John's Free Guided Meditation  🤘🏼 The Dr. John Delony Show T-Shirts     Offers From Today's Sponsors ·      10% off your first month of therapy at BetterHelp ·      Three free months of Hallow  ·      25% off Thorne orders  ·      20% off Organifi with code DELONY ·      25% off plus two free pillows at Helix Sleep ·      $350 off Pod 4 Ultra at Eight Sleep  ·      40% off Cozy Earth products with code DELONY ·      20% off DeleteMe with code DELONY     Listen to More From Ramsey Network 🎙️ The Ramsey Show 💸 The Ramsey Show Highlights   🍸 Smart Money Happy Hour 💡 The Rachel Cruze Show 💰 George Kamel 💼 The Ken Coleman Show 📈 EntreLeadership   Ramsey Solutions Privacy Policy https://www.ramseysolutions.com/company/policies/privacy-policy

Coming up on the Dr. John Deloney Show. I've been dealing with a lot of like frustration and quick temper, low fuse. When I'm focusing on something and something else pulls me away from it, that can frustrate me really quickly. What makes your focus, your time more important than other people. What's up? This is John with the Dr. John Deloney Show. Man, I'm so glad that you're with us. Talking about your mental and emotional health, your relationships, whatever you got going on in your life. Hey, do me a huge favor.

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to the home allison chains and sound garden seattle washington talk to dylan what's up dylan hey how's it going dr john i'm good brother what's up man yeah well i um i have uh i guess not a problem but i've been dealing with a lot of like frustration and and and quick quick temper low fuse like short fuse um just kind of day-to-day and it's reminding me a lot of my father who i don't really want to end up like and i was hoping that you might have some advice to deal, help me deal with that. Yeah, dude. So what are you frustrated about? It's, it's so funny. It's, it's kind of in and out. Like some days I'm just happy go lucky me. And some days it's just like, I am, I am so quick to like get frustrated about something.

And then I got to, you know to take a break, come back. What are those things? I want to get pretty specific, because it's going to be a roadmap for us. Right. So when I'm focusing on something and something else pulls me away from it, that can frustrate me really quickly.

Like if I'm, uh, at work and I'm doing one thing and somebody's pulling me off of that thing, um, that that's me that like instantly frustrates me. Um, when I'm at home and doing something and my wife asked me a question and I'm like focused on something and she pulls me away from it, I'm like instantly frustrated and I can be a little short, which I hate doing cause my wife's an angel and she pulls me away from it, I'm like instantly frustrated and I can be a little short, which I hate doing because my wife's an angel and she does not need that short spat from my, from my big dumb mouth sometimes. So what makes, what makes your focus, your time more important than other people?

And it really doesn't. I know, but it does. It does, though. That's the thing. I mean, I get existentially it doesn't, or I guess philosophically it doesn't, but inside of you it does. And so this isn't a judgment question or a blame question. I'm really curious.

What is it about your focus and your time? And let me give you a primer. It's very hard for me to get focused. I struggle with focus, always have. Yeah, I think that's... When I finally land in it, if somebody pulls me out of it, I get frustrated. Not that they have a need, but man, it was so hard for me to get in here. I feel the same way.

Okay. That's literally down to the line for me. Like, it is hard for me to get focused. Okay. And sometimes it's not even focused. Sometimes it's like when I turn my brain off. Like, let's say I'm just like, what do you call it? You call it Xanaxing out on my phone.

Yeah, yeah. And I'm just like shutting down for the evening. And, and my wife will ask me a question and I'll like not even hear it. Like I won't even process it. And then like, I'm like, and then I'll hear it and then she'll ask me again. Then I'll get frustrated. Not because she's asking me a question because that's crazy. No, that's shame. But that's embarrassing. That's embarrassing. Because 100%, like I feel dumb half the time, man. Yeah, that's it. That's it.

You just said it. Yeah. Who used to call you dumb? Oh, man. Yeah. Say it. Say it. Say it.

Who used to call you dumb? Oh, a lot of people not just myself but for most of my life i've been dumb name i'm i'm a i'm a big guy name my aunts aunts uncles my father my my friends what'd they say? Um, that was stupid. That was dumb. Why would you do that? Failure is not an option. There is no try just doing. And if you're not going to do it right, then why do it at all? Hold on. Just sit there for a second, man. That sucks. Dude, my brain is pumping right now. I don't think I've ever said that out loud.

I know. I hate that for you. Instead of teaching you, instead of showing you, they just shouted from the rafters at you. Yeah. And here's what happens. I'm just picturing a little kid. You're a big kid? Yeah, I'm 62,

230, but I was a big kid growing up. Okay. You're already pretty self-conscious because you're a big kid. You're wearing the husky jeans like you're a big kid. Yeah. Right? And then you got everybody telling you you're wearing the husky jeans like you're a big kid. Yeah. Right? And then you got everybody telling you you're stupid.

What are you, an idiot? And I'm just picturing a little boy that is trapped inside of his own body who can't do a damn thing right, and everybody in this world is letting him know it. Yeah. I'm also thinking of a little boy who's just a big kid who wants so badly to do right, and no one will show him how. Yeah. Yeah.

That's a recipe for frustration. That's a recipe. Anger, right? Anger points us towards something we care about, right? Mm-hmm. It's the way things should be, and they're not. Rage is being trapped and i think i think you're too good of a man i think you're a great guy and so i think you're able to temper rage and it comes out in little leaks like either disassociation meaning meaning like Xanax out, it comes out in ADHD and I think it comes out in little snippies with your

wife. Yeah. Have you ever just, have you ever just damn near lost it? Oh yeah. A hundred percent. Tell me about a time you just came, like it came from within. Um, we were having an, an argument. Um, we had just gotten a new car and it required premium gas, but we were running low. I was, I just took it to run to the lake to go fishing. And, um, I had to stop at this little one horse, one town gas station and all they had was regular. I was going to put like nine bucks in it. Um, ended up not being able to read the gas thing, right. Put 90 bucks in that, filled the tank.

And you're not supposed to do that in this vehicle. Right. So I got back, I told her about it. Right. Um, and, uh, she treated me like I did it on purpose. Like I didn't care. Um, that I didn't care what she was saying. Is this your wife? Yeah. Hey, Dylan. Dylan, Dylan, Dylan. No, she didn't. She broke the cardinal rule. What'd she do? Yeah. What'd she do? What'd she call you? She called me an idiot, basically. She called you dumb. I mean, she didn't. Dylan, she called you dumb. She made you you dumb. I mean, she didn't. Dylan, she called you dumb. She made me. That's right. Yeah. She made you feel dumb. And there's that sense inside your guts like, no, no, no, no, no, no, not you two.

Not you two. Yeah. Yeah. And you lost it? Yeah. I mean, I didn't lose it there. We drove an hour home in silence. Yeah. And after we got home, you know, I asked her, I said, you know, I,

I, it was an honest mistake. I, yeah. And, and it was, it, I kind of came unglued after that. Like I was very defensive. Um, the last, I mean, the, before that, the last time I had, I had freaked out is, is after my, yeah, I, that yeah, that one's even tougher to get into than this one. But I guess the rage really started building after my grandmother was sexually assaulted in her nursing home a couple years ago. Yeah. And that's when I started feeling like this happens more often. I mean, to give you a little background, my dad and my mom got divorced when I was seven.

He cheated with the neighbor. And then after that, I kind of felt like lost and angry growing up. And I did stupid things. So I felt stupid and dumb. Hold on. You did kid things, so I felt stupid and dumb. Hold on. You did kid things, Dylan? Yeah.

You did kid things. But you're laying out a path. I mean, you're just going down memory lane here. Sorry. No, no, no. Don't apologize to me. We're on the same team, brother. Okay?

Yeah. I just want you to get a picture of what I'm seeing. Seeing a little kid who didn't get to choose to be the big kid. I'm seeing a little kid who was trying to make sense of a world whose parents blew your world to smithereens when you were a little 5, 6,

7-year-old. Watching your dad lose control of his marriage and lose control of his marriage and lose control of his family and lose control of his kids probably his job and taking it out on you and you being a little kid just wondering what what am i doing why why won't you just love me why yeah and then everybody calling you stupid everybody calling you stupid. Everybody calling you dumb. And by the way, you did some dumb things like all people do. But every time at just, you know, there's that old Brene Brown saying,

whatever you go looking for in the world, you're sure to find. What everyone tells you you're dumb, what you do is you highlight those. You double click on all the dumb things. The one time you filled up the truck with $90 worth of gas. The one time. You filled up that car 5,000 times. One time. Right? That's when you remember.

Yeah. Right? So, to back up all the way, you can't go looking for this externally. You're going to have to look in the mirror. And you've probably heard me say this but you're gonna have to do it man it's gonna suck yeah you're gonna have to put your fist in your chest and say I'm not stupid and I love this guy yeah because as long as you walk in around your walk you're walking through life on eggshells.

Stop reading me, oh man, you just read me like a book. You can't. You can't tiptoe around in your own house. You gotta be able to fart in your own house, dude. Oh yeah. I just, I'm so terrified of making mistakes. I know, but that guarantees you're gonna make mistakes. Yeah.

Have you ever held your wife's hands and asked, do you love me for real? All the time. Okay. What does she say? Yes. Okay. You got to believe her, man. You got to stop tiptoeing through your life.

Yeah. You deserve the space you inhabit, brother. Yeah. Now you're starting to fade out on me because you don't believe me. No, I, no, I, I, I'm, this is, this is a first for me. I'm just trying to, I'm trying to take it all in and I'm not trying to, I'm an over-talker. No, I know, I know, I know.

But when things get uncomfortable, you think I've taken up too much space here and you try to get really small in a conversation. I'm not going to let you do that. Okay. I want you to stay fully present. I am. Are you still a big guy?

I am. Cool. You're a big guy. You're here for a reason. Yeah. Are you a good man? God, I try to be Nope, that's not what I asked you

Are you a good man? Yes Yeah Do you honor and take care of your wife, treat her with dignity? Yes Are you a good employee? Yes Are you a dad?

Not yet, trying You have pets? Yes, sir Do you treat them with respect yes sir dude do you are you a person of faith no no i i'm not can't say i am okay what do you lean into that's bigger than you um boy that's a good question do the seahawawks count? God, no. You're way bigger than them. They're terrible. They got rid of Coach. They got rid of Coach, man.

You know, we could go on about that one for sure. They got rid of Coach. No, dude. They've lost my respect for a while. I don't know. I think I've also been hunting for some responsibility in my life and in my work and help myself feel a little bit more satisfied looking for that bigger picture. I've been trying to at least. What do you do for a living? I'm a welder. Okay.

What do you want to do that's different? Um, it kind of crazy, but I think I've kind of settled on law enforcement. Great. When's the academy start? They have runnings in September, I believe. You signed up? Not yet. Today? I think so.

Why not? That's a great question, honestly. Sign up this afternoon. And then tomorrow morning, I want you at a gym at 6 o'clock in the morning to get in shape for the academy. Yeah. Tomorrow morning. You probably got about 25 pounds to lose.

You're a big dude. Yeah, I lift a lot of weights. I know. But you're going to have to, you're going to have to do more than lift in an Academy. Oh, cardio. Cardio makes me sweaty.

Exactly. Welcome to it, brother. Yeah. Okay. Sign up tomorrow, but apply today. Yeah.

Cause I want you to at least have the, I want you at least have the meetings. And have you sat down and had coffee with a buddy? That's a cop. Um, actually my, my, my best friend in the whole world he's been doing private security and he's been in that realm for a long time and he's he's into it he's done it before he's gone through the process so we've been talking a lot about it okay is it the right have you have you talked to your wife about it? I have. She's all in favor. She wants it for me. Done.

Today. Yeah. And here's what's happened. Now you've walked on eggshells through every part of your life where you've lost trust in the most important person you've got to lean into, and that's you. Yeah. And you've got to regain trust in Dylan your wife trusts you your best friend trusts you

I just met you and I trust you the world is waiting on Dylan to trust Dylan yeah and you're not going to be able to just snap your fingers and make some vision board and make that happen you're going to have to practice that you're going to have to stand in front of the mirror

and put your fist in your chest and say, I love this guy. This guy works hard. This guy goes a thousand miles an hour trying to do the next best right thing. And this guy messes up like everybody else. And by the way, you get to be frustrated in your life. It's a human emotion.

It's normal. You get to get angry. That's normal. You don't get to blow up on your wife and you know that. But asking the specific question, if you struggle with Xanaxing out on your phone, then make a decision to put your phone away when you walk in the front door. Force yourself to be uncomfortably present with your wife. Practice that discomfort and y'all talk about it. Talk

about it. Don't run from it. Don't hide from it. Head right through the middle of it. When you find yourself getting short, just put up one hand and say, honey, I'm sorry. This is about me, not about you. I didn't sleep last night. I didn't eat right. I don't feel good. My knees hurt. Whatever the thing is going on, I feel small. I feel less than. And be very honest with your wife about, hey, I just have a switch inside of me when somebody calls me dumb. I'm gonna work on it. But I didn't fill the car up with gas on purpose.

It was an accident, I made a mistake. Not dumb, I made a mistake. Those are two different things. And brother, I'm sorry everybody called you dumb. Sorry that you were the biggest kid and everybody was looking at you like you're just a big oaf. What they missed was a guy with a pretty amazing heart and a guy that would probably do just about anything for anybody. They missed it because they were too busy trying to make jokes at your expense or trying to prop up their falling apart egos. Well, look at what you did, man. Sorry, dude. Now it's time for you to begin to trust yourself and to lean into things that you want to do. By the day's out, by the day's end, you're going to

have an application in to the Seattle Police Department and you're going to go make it happen. Let me know when you get accepted to the academy, and let me know when you graduate. It's going to be awesome. You can send me a patch. I'll put it with my collection. I'm proud of you, brother. I'm proud of you.

Stay on the line. I'm going to send you a copy of Building a Non-Anxious Life. I want you to read that book, and I want you and your wife to go through it together and to begin to craft this world in your home. Read it cover to cover. It's going to change everything. We'll be right back. This show is sponsored by BetterHelp. October is the season for wearing costumes, and if you haven't started planning your costume, seriously, get on it. I'm pretty sure I'm going to

go as Brad Pitt because we have the same upper body, but whatever. Look, it's costume season, and if we're being honest, a lot of us hide our true selves behind masks and costumes more often than we want to. We do this at work. We do this in social settings. We do this around our own families. We even do this with ourselves. I have been there multiple times in my life, and it's the worst. If you feel like you're stuck hiding your true self behind costumes and masks, I want you to consider talking with a therapist. Therapy is a place where you can learn to accept all the parts of yourself, where you can be honest with yourself,

and where you can take off the mask and the costumes and learn to live an honest, authentic life. Costumes and masks should be for Halloween parties, not for our emotions and our true selves. If you're considering therapy, I want you to call my friends at BetterHelp. BetterHelp is 100% online therapy. You can talk with your therapist anywhere, so it's convenient for just about any schedule. You just get online and you fill out a short survey and you'll be matched with a licensed therapist, and you can switch therapists at any time for no additional cost.

Take off the costumes and take off the masks with BetterHelp. Visit betterhelp.com slash Deloney to get 10% off your first month. That's BetterHelp, H-E-L-P dot com slash Deloney. All right, we're back. Let's go to Sacramento, California and talk to Valerie. Hey, Valerie. Hey, Valerie. Hi, John. How are you doing? I'm great. How about you?

I'm pretty good. Thanks. What's up? recently lost somebody and I'm coming into a substantial inheritance. I don't know yet, but, um, I'm just really nervous about putting my, any of that money in a joint account. Um, my husband had an affair three years ago and it, it still, you know, haunts me. Of course. Um, I don't know how to explain it, but it just, when he mentioned it opening a separate account, it just really made me question doing that. How long have you been married? And talking to him.

Now, 32 years. How many affairs did your husband have over this time? Only the one that I really, of course, am aware of. I don't really think he had another one. Okay. So over 32 years, over a quarter century with somebody, did you all raise kids together? Yes.

Okay. You raised kids together. You probably buried loved ones together. You went through illnesses together. You went to hospital check-ins. You went to surgeries and picked each other up. You've done life. Yes.

Yes. And an affair is an incredible betrayal. And y'all have done more than a quarter century of life together. Yes. And it tells me there's something else here besides that affair because you chose to stay with him. Did y'all go through counseling and all that and y'all made a choice to stay together?

Yes, we did. Okay. And my husband, he admitted the affair before I, I didn't discover it. He admitted it to me. I guess he couldn't handle the guilt.

Or he wanted to come clean or he wanted to do the right thing after messing up. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But you have a institutionalized lack of trust that transcends one indiscretion. Why don't you trust this man? I think it was when this happened, I felt like I had such complete trust in him. I would never question anything about finances.

I trusted his judgment. We did, we made decisions together and I never felt any hesitation on anything and especially our finances and it's just like I'm getting back that trust on finances but this thing just kind of kind of hit me like shouldn't, should I just not do this? Put it in a separate account and deal with it and then decide? You know, I don't know. I don't know why I don't. Valerie, it sounds like what I hear often, almost every time actually, especially in a situation like you've described, is infidelity after 25, 26, 27

years with the same person is devastating. You lose trust in that person. It rocks the foundation of your home. But in the aftermath, you discover an even more insidious, more terrifying problem. And that's you no longer trust Valerie. Because if you miss this thing, then God help you. What else did you miss? If I put everything into this man and this world we built

and I was so off, I could be off about everything. And I hear from cheated on person after cheated on person that their entire, the ground they walk on, it's like it fell out from underneath them. It's like that Indiana Jones scene in part three when he's walking on that invisible sidewalk and he's just got to take the next step because I don't trust anything anymore. Yeah, that's exactly how it was. So here's what I can guarantee. If you and your husband have been working to reestablish trust for three years now, four years now,

and you look at him and say, I don't trust you with something big that's happening in our life, that's a big statement on the status and state of your marriage. I'm not saying it's the wrong move. I'm saying it's a big moratorium on the state of your marriage. Yeah. I'm afraid that if I tell him I'm not wanting to put it together in a joint account, that he'll start doubting himself, too, that he's done enough, too. He should. He should doubt the state of your marriage.

I don't want to do that. Yeah. How much money are we talking? You should doubt the state of your marriage. I don't want to do that. Yeah. Yeah. How much money are we talking? I'm not 100% sure yet. Things have not been completely settled, but it's probably anywhere from $500,000 or more. How much? It's probably half a million to possibly even a million. Okay. And what, in your dream, what do you do with this money?

Um, I pay off my mortgage. How much is that? It's about $260,000. Okay, wonderful. So let's say on the low end we have $250,000 left. What are we going to do with that money? Probably help my daughter pay off her student loans. Also some of it will go towards my son who's still in college how much is your daughter student loans somewhere in the 20,000 range I don't have the exact number okay so we have

two hundred thousand dollars left and let's say your son's in school, so that's going to be down to $150,000 left when it's all said and done? Yeah. Okay. I will be. I've committed to support him. Okay. So let's say, let's pretend that's $50,000. You're going to go ahead and pay for his college.

Yes. And so that leaves you about $150,000 left. It should go into some sort of retirement account for you guys. Maybe I'll get a car or something. But, and so here's what I'm saying. I'm, I'm saying there's a third way.

Okay. There is taking 500 grand, 750 grand and putting it in your checking account, which would be the stupidest thing you could do. Uh-huh. Not just because it's a joint checking account and he cheated on you one time, but because that's a way to look up

and that money's just going to be like pouring water through a screen door. It's just going to be gone. Yeah. Or you could tell him, I don't trust you yet i'm putting eight hundred thousand dollars or five hundred thousand dollars or whatever the number is in my own checking account high yield savings account i'm just going to leave it alone and you can't touch it don't talk to me about it unless you're ready to sit down and have the conversation about should we stay married

because that's the declaration you're you're making after four years i'm never going to trust you again this is going to be a partially trust marriage for the rest of our time together yeah and if i'm him i'm going to say like you like you called out okay there's nothing i can do to regain her trust. I need to decide how I want to spend the rest of my life because I messed up. She said, we're back together. She didn't really mean that. The third option is you get $500,000 or $600,000 and you sit down and you say, so-and-so passed away. The way we can honor this person and the way I am going to feel the safest with this money is the following. I want to pay the house off. I don't want to have zero liabilities going into our 60s and 70s.

I want to pay off our daughter's college and I want to help our son like I committed through college. That leaves us with 150 grand, maybe 300 grand, whatever's left. You need a new car. I need a new car. That's cool. We can spend some money and have some fun. And then the rest of this, I want to go to retirement. Are you okay with that plan? And then the trust conversation becomes, how do we allocate this money? It doesn't become some, it's just sitting in an account somewhere saying, I dare you to touch it. Okay.

You see what I'm saying? Yeah, I do. What bothers me the most for myself is I thought a lot of this healing had been done. And then this comes up and I'm having these thoughts and I'm like, I don't know what to do with it. Hey, Valerie, your thoughts are right. You're not crazy. And you're not a bad wife.

I'll even say, I don't think you're an untrustworthy person. I think this is the next big obstacle after your husband blew your whole world apart. Like say you were a weightlifter and you were lifting really heavy weight and you tore your pectoral muscle. It just rolled up on you. And this is three years later and you're in your first competition and they put real heavy weight back on that bar. You would be bonkers not to be nervous. Yeah, that's a good analogy for sure. But you have a decision to make. You're going to quit the competition and walk out the door and go home? Or are you going to try to lift that weight? I think I like the third option the best. It seems like it makes more sense.

Well, I think trusting him with a plan instead of trusting him with $700,000 is a way to ease into this. So before this money, before there's a check that's sent to you guys I want you and your husband to go out and I want you to tell them about your fears, honey This is the first big thing After the affair And my body is reacting as though all this is coming back up it's not your fault

That's my body trying to take care of me And I want to do the next right thing. And so it would make me feel safe and comfortable. If we begin to talk through right now before holding a check, what are we going to do with this money? I've made a map and I want you to see what you think about the map I've made. And if he says something like, well, actually, I want to put it all in Bitcoin because I feel, then you know, then he's thinking with his ego, not with safety.

Or if he says something like, I really don't need another car. I think your cars, I think our cars are great. They're fine right now. Let's put this money in retirement. Or I don't think little Timmy needs to have all of his college paid for. I think two semesters is great. Like y'all can negotiate those things on the edges. That's how you reestablish trust.

You're practicing trust. Yeah. can negotiate those things on the edges that's how you re-establish trust you're practicing trust yeah but do you see how to do this in a lower stakes environment then do i look at him and say i don't trust you at all or i just go all in blindly and ignore my own body yeah yeah it makes a lot of sense okay i think i could deal with that. I just was so confused on how to talk to him about it because I didn't want to hurt him. I want you to use the word I, not you. Okay. I am feeling this way. My body's trying to protect me. This is the first big obstacle since the thing.

My guts are all knotted up. That's different than, well, you cheated, so now I'm still feeling, like now he's like, well, what do I got to do? You said we're back in this thing together four years ago, right? All you're doing is relaying to him, my body is trying to override everything and protect me. And by the way, Valerie, I want you to spend some time by yourself and ask yourself, is your body trying to get your attention? Cause it's right. Is he trustworthy with money? Is he going to take your plan and wad it up and throw it away and just try to steamroll you and take this money and buy five rent houses with 2% down and do something stupid and leverage you guys out and make y'all really like

You know more than any of us do you have to decide What if my body's telling me the truth? But if your body is just and that's that's the old cbt Like i'm gonna look at these thoughts and these feelings and i'm gonna ask myself. Is this true? Is it true? Maybe i'm gonna ask a close close girlfriend ask her and say, okay. I'm gonna run some stuff by you Tell me if i'm crazy right And she may look at you and go no, hon, that was four years ago. He's a changed man. I see it. I see it on you

Your body's just trying to protect you to run an old scripts and you can go. Okay. All right Or maybe she's like honey i've been wanting to tell you. Yeah, things look pretty dicey again But let's let's negotiate the plan. Let's don't negotiate the money sitting in the account. That's too. That's that's Pretty tough and then when that 800 or 500 or 600 however much money lands in the account We have a plan we're gonna do it that day boom mortgage paid off boom daughter gets a check boom kids College is paid for done Boom. Boom. The rest of this goes to our SmartVestor Pro as somebody who's going to help us with our money. And we're

going to invest the rest of this money in our retirement account and we're out. Ah. And then we're going to go on a really fancy dinner, maybe go buy a couple of new cars because we just got a whole bunch of money. Like, that's amazing. But you're not crazy and you're not broken. There's not something wrong with you. I want you to listen to your feelings. Feelings aren't designed to tell us the truth. I want you to listen to those feelings, challenge them, challenge the stories. Is this telling me the truth? And then go do the next right thing. Thank you so much for the call, Valerie. I'm really, really grateful. We'll next right thing. Thank you so much for the call, Valerie. I'm really, really grateful. We'll be right back. All right, let's go out to Milwaukee, Wisconsin

and talk to James. Hey, James, what's up? Hey, how are you? Good, brother. What's up? My question is how to co-parent after a toxic 10-year relationship. Oh, man. When was your divorce finalized? So this is where it gets sticky is we got divorced back in 2022 after about six months of separation. That way, we kind of got back together here a year ago and now just recently kind of split up again. So. Y'all going to get back together in six months no are y'all is your divorce finalized or you're all just legally

separated no it's it's finalized but we have three kids and that's kind of where the reuniting came into play oh man dude i'm sorry what a mess yeah um is your ex do can y'all act like adults around each other or is it pretty rough uh in the past on both sides you know i'll admit it's been a little petty um as of recent you know i've i've sobered up quite a bit and me not drinking has definitely helped my communication skills um but her feelings are obviously still where they're at, and some of it definitely justifiably so. Did you do some stupid things when you were drinking? What's that?

Did you do some stupid things when you were drinking? I'm pretty good about keeping it in check, but obviously the first thing you lose after the first drink is your judgment, and the more you drink, the worse it gets, and you start saying stupid stuff. Who left who? I left. How come?

Just not being happy. Obviously, more than that. Yeah, what's beneath that? Not being happy and getting to the point where it's... Like I told her at that point, at that time, I was going to end up with either one of us hurt or me going to jail because the cops ain't going to hear me getting, you know, me talk about me getting beat up or anything. Is she physically abusive?

There's been some incidences, yeah. Have you been abusive back? I mean, I'd like to say no, but taking full accountability, I definitely have had some pretty shitty reactions. So that's kind of where my part plays. Okay. So my guess is every time you're all around each other, things are pretty electric. And sometimes that electricity has felt like romance, right?

It's felt sexual. But sometimes that electricity, often that electricity is every alarm bell that each one of you have is going off because you're not safe. Is that fair? Yeah, it's pretty accurate. Okay. So really, brother, the only way forward is for both of you to... In all honesty, I'm just thinking about this in real time, man.

I would ask her if she'd be willing to go see a counselor with you guys that y'all can come up with a plan that y'all co-create together with a neutral third party. That was another issue of why we needed to officially separate again this time, because I had been proposing that. And I know she kind of doubts my commitment to that as well, but it's something that's been proposed and never really acted upon. And I take that as kind of where she feels about it so it is what it is so what are you asking me how can I help you well like I was explaining to the lady I talked to earlier kind of where this has left me John is I just feel like

again I've been with her since I was 18 I'm turning 30 tomorrow and due to this relationship and other past you know life stuff I just my problem now is I feel like I'm stuck in fight or flight mode all the time and that feeling is super draining you know and I feel like I'm either a really great guy when I'm on it and then when I'm not on it and I'm starting to slip it's like definitely a slippery slope um and I you know I've made a lot of good steps and I'm not on it and I'm starting to slip, it's like definitely a slippery slope. Um, and I, you know, I've made a lot of good steps and I'm feeling a lot better about my life now. I'm in a better spot than I've ever been. But now that I'm out of the bottom of the barrel, I'm just kind of

looking for some guidance as to how I can kind of move forward and try to try to do something to offer her resources as well, to figure out how we can just be our best jobs as parents for our kids. Even if you don't like me and if we can't get along as friends or whatever out how we can just be our best jobs as parents for our kids, even if you don't like me. And if we can't get along as friends or whatever, but at least just be civil enough to say, hey, I got the kids, I'm doing this. Is that okay? Instead of having an argument or talking about what's on the court paperwork and all that stuff. You got to go with what's on the court paperwork for now. Well, absolutely. And so that's where I try to stick to. And so, for instance, today is my day off of work.

From the way I understand her paperwork is 4, 5 o'clock, right around there is whatever our designated drop-off time is. So I designated with her mom today. Since I had my day off, I dropped off the kids by her at noon instead of 4 o'clock. Her mom said that was fine. I paid her to babysit. Everything was good. But now I've got harassing text messages from the ex-wife saying, you know, complaining about what's going on. You know what I mean?

It wasn't something I twisted anybody's arm. I simply asked her mom. She agreed. But that's an issue for the ex-wife. Well, it may be that she's having to hug two little boys in the middle of the night who are crying because they just want time with my dad. Which, true. And I, you know, on my end, they get that. But they didn't today.

I'm just saying they didn't today. And right now, for right this second, your ex-wife has a pair of glasses on. And those glasses are James Sucks. He's the worst man. He ruined my life. With his drinking, with his abuse, with all of it. And she's not in a place where she can take accountability for her actions.

So every moment, ounce of energy she has is looking for a story that backfills what she feels about you. And dropping off the kids four hours early on your quote-unquote day off when you're quote-unquote not doing anything except laying around like whatever story she's making up so what that does is it just puts gas on a fire so i tell you like what you need is a period of time when you follow that court order to the letter because what that's going to communicate to your ex

is something that she's never felt with you, which is stability. Okay. She's felt profound, deep, like romance novel level passion, right?

Yeah. She's been all in on you. And she has, and that's the accountability I take where I feel bad is, you know, she wanted me to be my best, and now I'm at the point where I've gotten better. But for me to be my best, I need you to keep growing with me. Nope, that's not fair. That's not fair to her. Y'all got divorced, man. You're on your own now. You have to be responsible for your growth and your well-being and your safety and your mental and emotional health.

If she's doing something that puts the kids in an unsafe situation, then you're going to deal with that. But her adventure is hers now, man. Y'all are separated. Y'all took this sucker to court and said, we can't solve this on our own. Y'all officially break us up. And they did. In a perfect world, yeah, dude. Y'all would grow together.

Y'all would recommit on behalf of these kids. Y'all would be able to be civil together. And that's just called marriage. Y'all ended that. And so now your work is is i need to be the best man i can be the best dad to these three kids i can possibly be and the most mature connected ego-free co-parent that i can be yeah right any energy spent trying to fix her get her to grow with you whatever is a complete is a waste of your time and it sounds like you're trying to fix her get her to grow with you whatever is a

is a waste of your time and it sounds like you're trying to go back and and um to use 12-step language like make amends to somebody that doesn't want you to make amends with them they don't want she doesn't want your insights or your information or or your programs yeah Yeah, fair. So what have you been doing lately that's helping you become this person that you've wanted to be for so long that you struggle to be,

and now you're on the way? What are you doing differently? So like one thing you mentioned, instead of laying around on days off and stuff, I volunteer and I coach sports. So that's one way I try to, you know, really get on my purpose and substitute bar time for coaching time.

And that's been, obviously, a really good building block. You enjoying it? I love it. Yeah? Connecting? What are you coaching?

I was, I've coached six seasons of soccer, but now I'm transferring to high school football in the same community. Thank goodness, man. Thank goodness.

Going from a, to a real sport. I'm just kidding. I was always clowning my soccer buddy. Okay, that's great, man. What else are you doing? Just working, and then between three kids, and then the coach, and that's pretty much a lot of my time there.

When's the last time you sat down and crossed from somebody kneecap to kneecap and said, I'm not doing so good a while you need to do that because this reality is becoming real and it's going to bury you you got a big hole in the center of your chest don't you

yup you can't run from that dude and you can't fill that up with external stuff man I'm telling you right now you will crash and burn and those boys those kids deserve better than that. She does too. You do too. And I wish there was another way.

I wish with all my guts there was another way, dude, but there's not. You got to sit down in front of another person and be seen and heard. Because my gut tells me you haven't dealt with the grief yet. You've been really busy acting and trying to do the next thing,

but you got to deal with the grief part. Yeah. That you wanted this thing to look a certain way and now it's not. You did not want these three kids growing up in a divorced household and here they are.

This girl that you've been in love with since you were 18 years old drove you crazier than anybody, but you also loved her more than anybody and you did not want this to end like this and here we are.

Yeah. And until you exhale and sit in that darkness for a season, man, your body's just going to keep going playing whack-a-mole with the next xanax and i'm just telling you man alcohol works until it kills you but you can you can remove alcohol you've met people who quit drinking and right they just smoke weed all day or people who don't do that and they work 170 hours a week

you can backfill that with volunteering volunteering looks good on a resume and on a dating app but you can become addicted to volunteering as a way to avoid i blew up my life in the my life of my three boys man well that's kind of exactly where i'm at right now i mean so you're right on the top with everything okay um i mean again i have these i genuinely, but yeah, it's definitely an escape from the reality I'm living. Escape's not bad, but it has to be purpose. It has to come from the inside out, not the outside in. Otherwise, you're going to use a bunch of high school kids to prop you up, and that's not fair to them.

Well, no, and that's why I be careful. I got the self-awareness the problem is just when you're kind of hitting some of those manic slopes and kind of there you go making sure you take measures and you you know you live with some rules and you don't break the rules and you have standards you know yeah man but if it was as easy as that the world be a pretty perfect place again i can say it but doing it different that's awesome. So have you been to a group yet? Have you been to a meeting yet? So my history with AA is back when I was a daily drinker.

I was going to AA, like you said, kind of the outside-in thing, kind of as a front, just to kind of make some other people in my life happy and make sure I could just at least get through. So I was going to AA at 10 a.m. in the morning. to kind of make some other people in my life happy and make sure I could just at least get through. So I was going to AA at 10 a.m. in the morning. I would leave work, go to AA for an hour, and I would be on the inside, banging my head on the wall, listening to these other people talk. And it honestly made me feel like a narcissist, even though I'm not. It was a lot of weird communication.

So I'd leave the group after an hour, go home and have a drink or two and then go back and do my job. And I was doing that for probably at least three months, you know, giving it the old college try as far as the AA goes. I just, I knew I had a problem, but at that point I didn't want to quit yet.

I just knew I needed to and so. So maybe you walk back in the front door knowing this time you're not better than them. You are them. Which I'm not. I'm not. I know. I know you know that intellectually.

But, dude, you lost your kids, man. You lost the love of your life. Yeah. And the thing that breaks my heart talking to you, man, is you lost James. This isn't how you drew up 32, right? No. I'm not saying the meetings are right for everybody, so that's okay if it's not for you.

I can't in good conscience tell you to do anything other than to go find somebody, whether it's a therapist or a counselor or a coaching mentor or somebody in a meeting to sit down across and say, I'm not okay right now. Every major religion for all of human history has had some sort of confession wired into it.

And over the last few centuries we've turned confession into come tell me all the bad things you've done that's not the origin of confession the origin of confession is i have a hole inside my chest and the person across from me says yeah me too yeah right on and i don't know how or why i don't know the alchemy of that interaction but that's the he that, but that's what heals us, is being seen and known, and we can go up and do the next right thing the next day, and then we go again,

and then we go again, and then we go again, and then all of a sudden you look up in seven months, nine months, two years, and your ex-wife says something that normally you would have punched a hole through the sheetrock, and this time you just smile,

and you're like, all right, I'll be there on time. And that's luckily kind of where I'm at right now. And, you know, I agree with what you said. Like, I can't really try to plant seeds as far as trying to inspire her to act right. But I'm just trying to, like, lead by example. There you go. Like they say, you know, timing heals all wounds. I don't know if that's going to be the case here.

That is an old stupid trope. It doesn't. Time does not. That's what I'm saying. Intentionality does. Like, I don't know if I just be consistent for six months,

maybe shrug it off my back. You know, I don't know. Longer than that. That's where I'm kind of, well, whatever it takes, I'm willing to do it.

Because it's for those boys. And right now, you're still in your head sounding like you're courting her. Your marriage is over, dude. Oh, yeah. There's no confusion as far as that part. Yes, there is. But hey, it's good. Just show up

for those boys. Right. And that's the plan. Like I said, we were reunited for about a year. They were trying to make things work. And then just recently, we kind of officially separated and moved away from each other again. And so I'm just trying to just each work and then just recently we kind of officially separated and moved away from each other again and so I'm just trying to just each be 50-50.

I don't need to be Captain America. I just need to be a good dad and show up and just do my thing. There you go. And maybe if you want to be really brave, you want to be real brave,

like super brave, ask your ex to go to coffee with you. Okay. And just say, hey, I can't sleep and I'm sick. I just need to say this out loud. I'm sorry for all this. And she might blow up at you and be like, oh, it's too late now.

I know, I'm not trying to, I just need to say, we got three little ones, man, and let's make the best possible avenue moving forward. And I've got a lot to prove to you when it comes to stability and day in and day out and over time and year after year after year after year. Just know I'm going to do my best, man. I just need you to say that. I'm going to write that down word for word. Does that sound, does that, I mean, will she respond to that?

Yeah. I mean, I've tried it less eloquently, but I like the way exactly how you added at the end you know I got I've got some time to prove and put under my belt to show you like I'm going to be

stable and be there for the kids but I just you know I guess I don't even need to ask her for grace just tell her my intention and let that be that and she dude

if she blows up on you that's her she gets to she gets to own her response well that's why you do it in public at a coffee place

I mean that's kind of my secret but I've also learned that sometimes people blow up anyway regardless but I'd say don't do that because you're looking for some don't do that because you're looking for I don't want to look for a reaction

that's why I'm here is I want to avoid those reactions I want us to just be adults there you go yeah and hopefully down the line, when you're going to do something that she's going to blow up on, and you can say,

hey, now it doesn't sound like it's a good time to talk. When you're ready, just give me a buzz. Or I don't talk by text because text, we get lost in translation.

Yeah, that's a big problem. Exactly. Because when you read it, you don't feel the vibe behind it. That's right. So maybe tell her, hey, I'm terrible at texting.

I'm just not good at it. And so the only time I'm going to text you is just to say the word call and then just give me a shout when you're available. And that way I can say, hey, I've got the day off. I'm going to do this.

Your mom's going to babysit. Is that something? Are we cool with that? Which is different than her getting a text from her mom saying, I have to pick up the kids. Well, no, again, you know, she, in her words, I needed to go through her mom to communicate. So, cause she didn't want to, you know, and I was like, whatever,

like for the time being, like her and my, her mom and I get along really well. So whatever, like, that's what you want to do. And so that's why it went that way. Otherwise, you know, I would just be direct and just be civil and say really well, so whatever. That's what you want to do. And so that's why I went that way. Otherwise, I would just be direct and just be civil and say, hey. But also tell her, hey, I don't feel comfortable going through other people. We're going to be adults.

I tried that, but I'm trying to accommodate without bending the knee. And I understand I deserve, I have to take accountability. This is the bed I made. I got to lay in it. I get that. So now, how do I get up out of this bed and just make this thing and move on with my day? Well, it's the old Dr. Phil thing.

Do you want to be right or do you want your relationships to be okay? And that's where I know I've evolved a little bit because I'm past the point of caring if I'm right. There you go. Take an E, brother. It's for those kids. Okay. Take an E. Thank you.

It's for those kids. And I'm going to get a bunch of red pill responses on the internet so don't read the things on this because you're gonna get a lot of like yeah you tell her just shut up it's about those three kids not not you shut up i'm talking about the the those with the negative comments for the three kids man if i gotta take a knee to love my kids make sure they're safe and that they're in respective um non-electric homes because i've already blown their world up by divorcing their mom and then trying to reunite and then divorcing again and i'll blow their world up again when i get remarried and she's gonna do it when she

gets remarried because kids hang on to a fantasy that one day my mom and dad are gonna get back together dude i've been taking me all day long on behalf of those kids. That's the least I can do. That's the least I can do. Because it's not about me anymore. It's about these kids. James, man, I appreciate your humility and I appreciate your honesty and integrity. And for those of you listening and wondering why I'm not beating James up for X and Y and Z, he knows. He knows he screwed up.

He knows he was abusive. He knows he was abusive. He knows those things. And I want to honor this man by honoring the changes he's making in his life and his attempts to go do the next right thing. That's what redemption looks like. I'm proud of you, James, for the steps you're making and for the restoration you're trying to provide in your wife, your ex-wife's life, and your kid's life, and in your life. You're worth that change, my man.

You're worth that change. We'll be right back. I'm so proud that Thorne Supplements, my favorite supplements on the planet, have continued to partner with me and our show listeners for health, longevity, and just feeling good. Thorne is one of our longest standing partners on this show, and it's because I trust them, I use them, I read their research papers, and I know their products are great and that my

fans will love them too. Here's the deal with supplements. There's so, so much garbage out in the marketplace. And other than my admitted gummy candy problem, I'm pretty freakish about what I put in my body. And that's why I trust my health and the health of internets with these shows. And my wife and kids have been taking them as well. And here's what I take every single day. I take the super EPA fish oil, the methylated B vitamins, creatine, phosphatidylserine, and more. I take Thorne for specific physiologic needs for me to keep my body and mind optimized and for overall longevity and health. And here's the cool thing.

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Probably. Yeah. That's the most common. Probably, John, probably. My sister just had her first baby and I miss the way things used to be. I'm absolutely in love with my nephew, but I feel left out. Am I the problem in just being selfish? Yes! Yes, you're the problem.

She, your sister, made a human. it came out of her body and you are in the corner going well what about me what about you it's not about you in marina del rey it's not about you it's about this little baby and about your sister so yes the way things used to be are over. They no longer exist. Past tense. They were. Now they are. You have a choice.

You can be an adult and be the best aunt and sister ever. Or you can cross your arms in the corner and be like what about me and one of those um paths is going to get you a ton of connection and give you some amazing memories and give you a deeper sense of love and and and purpose than you could ever imagine and the other one of those paths is going to leave you isolated and alone and bitter and angry. I choose path one. What do you think, Kelly? I think it's kind of a no-brainer. Yeah, and I mean, I understand,

you know, she might be young and you have no clue how much a child changes your life. You just have no idea. And I mean, I was, my sister's a little bit older than me, so I remember I was 16 when she had her first child. It's like, oh, we're not going to go like do any things anymore, you know, my sister's a little bit older than me. So I remember I was 16 when she had her first child.

It's like, oh, we're not going to go like do any things anymore. You know, and that kind of thing. Well, now I feel bad. Maybe Marina's 16. But even at 16, I knew because her life is different now. And I love my nephews, you know? And so even I was, you know, new because everything's different now. So I don't, you know, I didn't get my feelings all bent over it.

So she needs to, yeah, she's the problem here. Did you have feelings back then? Yeah, I wasn't quite jaded. Well, I didn't work with you, so. That's fair. Man, I could see that being a thing. Yeah, when someone you love has a baby, everything's different. And if it's not, it should be.

It should be. Kelly, we're going to have jobs forever. We're going to have jobs forever. Awesome, America. Love you guys. Stay in school. Don't do drugs. Bye.