The Dr. John Delony Show - My Husband is a Hypochondriac...How Can I Help Him?

Episode Date: October 18, 2021

The Dr. John Delony Show is a caller-driven show that offers real people a chance to be heard as they struggle with relationship issues and mental health challenges. John will give you practical advice on how to connect with people, how to take the next right step when you feel frozen, and how to cut through the depression and anxiety that can feel so overwhelming. You are not alone in this battle. You are worth being well—and it starts by focusing on what you can control. Let us know what’s going on by leaving a voicemail at 844.693.3291 or visiting johndelony.com/show. We want to talk to YOU!   Show Notes for this Episode How do I reconcile with my dad after he cheated on my mom years ago? My husband is a hypochondriac and I'm not sure what to do Chatter: The Voice in Our Head, Why It Matters, and How to Harness It Hardcover – Ethan Kross In-laws are letting their teenage son harm himself; should we intervene? Lyrics of the Day: "Everybody Wants to Rule The World" - Tears For Fears   As heard on this episode:  BetterHelp dreamcloudsleep.com/delony Conversation Starters Redefining Anxiety John's Free Guided Meditation Ramsey+   tags: anger/resentment/bitterness, reconciliation/forgiveness, infidelity, family, anxiety, suicide/self-harm, kids, boundaries   These platforms contain content, including information provided by guests, that is intended for informational and entertainment purposes only. The content is not intended to replace or substitute for any professional medical, counseling, therapeutic, financial, legal, or other advice. The Lampo Group, LLC d/b/a Ramsey Solutions as well as its affiliates and subsidiaries (including their respective employees, agents and representatives) make no representations or warranties concerning the content and expressly disclaim any and all liability concerning the content including any treatment or action taken by any person following the information offered or provided within or through this show. If you have specific concerns or a situation in which you require professional advice, you should consult with an appropriately trained and qualified professional expert and specialist. If you are having a health or mental health emergency, please call 9-1-1 immediately.

On today's show, we talk all things relationships. We talk to a woman whose dad cheated on mom, and she's trying to make peace with that relationship. We talk to a woman who's in love with a hypochondriac, and it's so hard. And we talk to a woman whose brother-in-law is self-harming and doing drugs, and she doesn't know what to do.

Stay tuned. Hey, everybody. This is John with the Dr. John Deloney Show, and I hope you're doing well. Hope your family's healthy. Hope you're safe. Hope you're laughing more than you are not. Hope you got some joy in your life.

On this show, we talk about your relationships and your relational IQ, how you talk to yourself and other people. We talk about your mental health and parenting, everything, anything you can think of. Give us a shout. If you want to be on the show, give me a call at 1-844-693-3291. That's 1-844-693-3291. And leave a message at the beep. When did answering machines come out?

Was it a while ago? Yeah. I don't know. James is like, I was born in this century so I don't know. Very early 80s I remember we got our first answering machine. Oh yeah. You were in college then, right? That was a good old person joke.

I could make your life hell, FYI. You do. You absolutely do. Already do, probably. Exactly. Leave a message and Kelly may or may not

call you back, just like when I was dating in high school. And if you want to go to johndeloney.com slash ask, you can do that too. Hey, last night,

I went and spent some time after we got off the, last night I went and spent some time, after we got off the show, actually, went and spent some time at a local Celebrate Recovery group here in Nashville and just spent a couple hours with them. And I tell you what, man, what an amazing group of guys. I don't remember how many, 20, 30 men who are trying to turn their lives around, who are struggling with addictions of various kinds

and who are committed to being in community with one another man I left that group so uplifted and hard stuff and it was hard stuff and they wanted to know how their brains worked

and relationships and some stuff they could do and this and that so it was a cool time. It's one of those things where I showed up to be the guy to answer questions. And I walked away with more of my questions answered and more fulfilled. Man, it was such a gift. But if you're struggling with addiction, find a local group and just submit yourself to that group and to the honesty and to the connection there. It's pretty incredible.

It's awesome. All right. James reminded me. We have this newsletter. We have thousands of people signed up for it, but there's bajillions because I never talk about it. So, James, what can a person expect in this newsletter? It's mine that I write every week. Full disclosure, I haven't actually subscribed myself.

So you probably see that. But it's not like your typical newsletter. It's more personal, and it's very on-brand for you. There's a lot of that. Very on-brand. If you listen to the last show, there's actually going to be a new segment called Animal Geography where we teach you how animals run and escape from other animals.

Hey, Kelly, by the way, we just found out James doesn't even subscribe to the newsletter. I don't even subscribe to the newsletter, so let's just be honest. I'm going to commit to doing it today. Go to JohnDeloney.com. That's D-E-L-O-N-Y. Go to JohnDeloney.com, scroll down, and put your email address in, and subscribe to the newsletter. I'm doing it as we speak. You're literally not, but it's cool. I'll do it right now as well, because I don't either. You're not either? Sarah. I get enough of you. It and subscribe to the newsletter. I'm doing it as we speak. You're literally not, but it's cool.

I'll do it right now as well because I don't either. You're not either? Sarah. I get enough of you. It's good to see you. Would you like to be the new producer and associate producer of the John DeLonge Show? Jeez Louise. I bet Sarah's subscribed.

I'm not going to ask though because my self-esteem can't handle it this morning. She's not either. She said she didn't even know we had one. This is so cool. This is like the roadie of Metallica. The guy running the board with headphones in listening to Fleetwood Mac or something like that. Hope you guys are proud of yourselves.

But I'm not subscribed either. 100% chance my wife's not. Guarantee my family's not. But hey, today we're turning that around. There's literally thousands of people subscribed to this thing, and I write it. It's a hoot. Listen, I hate them.

I hate email lists. I just unsubscribe. There's like three people in the world that I get their email every week, and I look forward to it. And so I'm trying to make mine one of those. So please, JohnDelaney.com, scroll down, subscribe to the email list. And as James says, it's on brand. It's about as teetering on one of the train rails without falling over, but it's a blast, man.

It's cool stuff that I've read, stumbled upon, like gadgets that I like, things that are bringing me joy out in the world, all that stuff. So subscribe to it, and we will connect that way as well. Or if you don't want to, you can just be like James and Kelly. Just getting all this, I don't know.

Never mind. Y'all are both beautiful and kind and brilliant and all the things. All right. Let's go to Laurel in Fort Wayne, Indiana, before this thing gets further off the rails. What's up, Laurel? Hi. Thanks for taking my call, Dr. John. No, thank you.

Hey, you've been on the phone for a while, and so you got to hear all the behind-the-scenes stuff. Just for the average listener, we don't just turn this on for the camera, right? You guys are doing a great job. All I'm saying is Connor is back on the YouTube videos. Thank God, because Zach, what is that guy doing? Anyway, Connor, you kicked him out. Way to go, man. Good job.

All right, Laurel, what's going on? How can I help? Okay, so basically my question is, how can I move on from a past hurt? And it's about 15 years going now without getting the closure that I think that I need. So basically, my mom and dad divorced about 15 years going now without getting the closure that I think that I need. So basically my mom and dad divorced about 15 years ago. How old were you? My mom discovered, um, I was about 25 at the time. Um, I've three other siblings are all adults at the time.

Um, my mom discovered that my dad was having an affair and, um, it was just completely shocking and destroyed our family. We all kind of went our separate ways and we don't talk. We don't see each other anymore. You and your dad? My dad, however, I didn't talk to him for a couple of years, but I've tried to mend the relationship and honor my dad and be respectful and just try to show up. And it's still kind of rocky. It's never been the same. So basically my dad, he quickly moved on, married the woman he was having an affair with. And she had two daughters, one of which was still living at home. And she never found out about how our parents got together.

And I guess fast forward 15 years and I've been going to holidays and family gatherings. And I've just kind of suffered in silence without being able to move on and heal. Can I ask you a hard question? Yeah, sure. Why have you chosen that path? That seems like an exhausting path you've put yourself on. 15 years is a long time to carry that. How come you've chosen to carry that? I guess I I guess I expected, I expected, um, everybody to find out and, and then we can all move on together. Um, I also, I don't know. I just, I have a hard time bringing it up with my dad. Um, I don't know. He's the kind of guy who wants to move on and everyone should get over it. This is happening with or without you.

So he's kind of hard to talk to also. So why do you want to maintain a relationship with him? He sounds pretty dismissive of his family, of you guys, of your past, of your mom. I have a son and he loves his grandpa. And I don't know. I am to the point where I just want to stop seeing them all together. It's just hard. But I also want to honor my father and do the right thing.

And do the right thing. So one of the things. Do the right thing for my son. Yeah. That's a hard place. And I want to honor, A, your trust here. And B, it's one of those things that you hear about, but it's different when it happens in your house. And then it's easy just to freeze and then think I'll deal with it tomorrow. And then suddenly tomorrow is 15 years later.

And there's some imaginary, I'd say fantasy is kind of a dismissive word, but there's a fantasy that this stuff will just play itself out or the dad will one day call and be like, what did I do? And I'm so sorry. And then that turns into one year

and then two years and three years. And you kind of find yourself waiting for that call or that he takes you out for coffee and says, hey, screwed this up I'm so sorry I hurt you and those things never come and suddenly you look up like you say you've got your own kids now and my guess is you are probably waiting for somebody to cheat on you and your relationship like you can't ever breathe the other side of that is there is a difference between respecting the I wish I had another word for it

respecting the office respecting the position and being honest about the person who's in that seat and you can respect your dad and not speak to him on a regular basis you can respect your father meaning I'm not speak to him on a regular basis. You can respect your father, meaning I'm not going to talk bad about him.

I'm going to treat him with dignity. And I don't want him around my kids because he hasn't been a person of integrity. He's not safe. He's not a person willing to own up to mistakes that he threw a grenade in the middle of my family and then he just walked away and acted like it was no big deal. And some of that is you probably have had a thousand, if not 10,000 imaginary conversations where you just let him have it and you tell him and he cries and says, I'm so sorry.

Is that right? Yeah. Yeah. And my question for you would be, what is that conversation going to solve for you would be, like, what is that conversation going to solve for you? I've thought about that and I don't, I don't think anything.

Yeah. I think about, like, my stepsisters actually knowing and what that would do to them and it's like,

that does not help me. Yeah. I'll say, if they find that out about their mom, that doesn't help me. You finding another grenade. I don't want to hurt anyone. Yeah, and throwing it back at him.

Right. You know, it doesn't, it feels like it will feel good. I'm telling you it won't because then what you're going to do is be opting in to put two more young women in the same, put them through the same hurt you did

as an attempt to stab your dad. And that won't feel good for anybody. All that to say is, answer this for me. What are you looking for? Where do you find peace in this situation? I don't know. I guess I, I just, I don't know I guess I I don't

I just I don't know it seems like he's moved on and is happy and it's almost like he's chosen a new family and

okay so let's go there what if he has that sucks yeah that hurts and that's that's always been in the back of my head, and I just never wanted to accept that. Yeah.

My dad. Yeah. Dads aren't supposed to choose other families. And with all of my guts, I'm sorry that he did that to you I'm sorry he did that to your brothers and sisters and he did that to your mom thank you but you

and your little one are paying the price for living in a mythological land and not dealing with the reality is that your dad moved on and mythological land and not dealing with the reality is that your dad moved on. And the sooner you can make peace, not make it okay, but you can own, this is what happened to me and to my mom, the woman I love, and to my brothers and sisters, then you can make rational, real, true, honest,

integrous decisions about what comes next. And that may include your son going to play with him. That may include you telling your dad, I'm not really comfortable with you around my son. Like, man, I just don't want him picking up on how to be a grown man, how to love. I don't want him picking that up from you. So we're just going to move on.

Or it might be, yeah, son, you can go play. And that's cool. And when dad says, hey, everybody, I want to do this, you can say, no, you opted into a new family. So you have a good time, and we're going to do Thanksgiving this way. And that'll hurt, but that will be more honest. Your body will stop trying to fight different things. Yeah. Yeah, that's what I've been leaning to

is just saying, okay, I have my new family or I have my family and we're going to just do our own thing on the holidays and you can do your own thing. How does that sound when you say it out loud? I like that.

My guess was it's peaceful because right now you're playing house or you're playing I'm trying to make everyone happy my five year old always says hey can we play family and I always think we are one but I know what she's talking about she wants to be mom and wants me to be like a cat

or something but it feels like you're playing family and you're the person trying to hold together a fantasy. And instead of playing family, I'd love for you to create, co-create. Are you married? Yes. Yeah, I'd love for you to co-create one with your spouse

and man, y'all just go be about it. Okay. It's not gonna make it just instantly like ah good but what I'm telling you is if you will do the work of grieving it letting it go and then living in the reality of

hey my dad was a scumbag man he bailed on us he's not even being honest with his new step kids yeah and that's the guy he's chosen to be. I don't know if I want my son around that, or I don't care if my son's around that. He's getting good stuff from me and his dad.

And then just making peace with it. Yeah. Do you think that's possible? Yeah. I think I need to just step out of those, like, you know, family, quote, unquote, get-togethers, because that's where it just reminds me of it. And, yeah, I need to say no. Well, and do it affirmatively. Plan something instead.

Sometimes we take things away, and we just end up empty. We don't end up fulfilled. So plan an awesome Friendsgiving that's going to be a blowout this year that you're going to invite people over to your house. You're going to do a whole thing and it's going to be a table full of misfits and it's going to be the one that you and your spouse are going to plan together. And you get to pick it. It's going to be a blast. And design what you love. And then you set your boundaries around that.

And man. And one more quick thing. Sometimes we feel in these situations, it hasn't happened to me, so I won't say we. I won't co-opt it. But sometimes when parents cheat on each other and the kids are involved um the kids feel like if i don't hit back i'm betraying my

other parent especially as adults if i go actually go to his house he did he abandoned my mom that sucked 15 years ago but he's actually a fine guy he's all right and I like him and I would like to have a relationship with him I'm gonna do it on my terms with my boundaries but I'd like to have a relationship with him but I feel like if I do that I'm betraying my mom that can be equally abusive on the other end you're an adult and you get to decide who you're in relationship with you're an adult you get to decide who you want to open doors. You're an adult. You get to decide who you want to open doors to, who you don't want to open doors to. You're an adult and you get to decide

who's around your family, who's not, who's around you, what your holidays look like, et cetera. And so this goes on both sides of this deal. You do need to respect your mom. Do you need to respect your dad? I believe in that big time, but you have to have firm boundaries, especially when they are people who betray you and they're not safe. And so if you want to reach out to him

and have a relationship with him, however wonky it might be, feel free to do that. The key here is to make sure everybody's on the same page, that you are honest with everybody. You don't do stuff behind people's back. You don't hold secrets. If you are not going to be around Thanksgiving or Christmas with your dad this year, let him know. I'm not coming this year. You all have a great time. I'm doing Friendsgiving with my neighborhood. Hey, Mom, I'm reaching out to Dad, and I'm going to spend some time with him at Christmas this year.

It's time for me as an adult to forgive him for the past and try to reconcile some sort of relationship with him, even though he fill in the blank. Put everybody up in the forefront, be honest to everybody. And if they want to act immature, that's their job. That's not yours to solve. You've done a lot of solving for a lot of adults and it's time for you, Laurel, to co-create your adult world with your new family. You deserve it and you're worth being well. We'll be right back

on the Dr. John Deloney Show. This show is sponsored by BetterHelp. All right, October is the season for wearing costumes and masks. And if you haven't started planning your costume yet, get on it. I'm pretty sure I'm going as Brad Pitt in Fight Club era because, I mean, we pretty much have the same upper body, but whatever. All right, look, it's costume season. And let's be honest, a lot of us hide our true selves behind costumes and masks more often than we want to. We do this at work, we do this in social setting, we do this around our families,

we even do this with ourselves. I have been there multiple times in my life and it's the worst. If you feel like you're stuck hiding your true self, I want you to consider talking with a therapist. Therapy is a place where you can learn to accept all the parts of yourself, where you can learn to be honest with yourself,

and you can take off the mask and the costumes and learn to live an honest, authentic, direct life. Costumes and masks should be for Halloween parties, not for our emotions and our true selves. If you're considering therapy, I want you to call my friends at BetterHelp. BetterHelp is 100% online therapy. You can talk with your therapist anywhere

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That's BetterHelp, H-E-L-P dot com slash Deloney. All right, we are back. Let's go to Elaine in Pittsburgh. Hey, what's up, Elaine? Hey, Dr. John, how are you? Remarkable. How are you? Good.

I am now a subscriber to your newsletter. Yes! Guess who's not? James and Kelly. I am now. Oh, I beat them. Oh, you are now, James? I told you, I literally did it when we were talking about it.

Have you already hit unsubscribe? It's probably getting filtered through spam. It is. Dude, hey, you just made my day, Elaine. I'm not subscribed, but I'm going to be by the end of today. So you beat me to my own newsletter. I expect really big things. All right, so let's take your expectations and dial them back about 40%.

But we're going to get there. Okay. We're going to get there. Thank you so much. Hey, so what's up? How can I help? Well, I'm calling today because I have a husband who I feel is a bit of a hypochondriac. So I was just looking for some insight into how I can better meet his needs

because I feel that every reaction I have to him ends in a very negative way. So why do you think he's a hypochondriac? What does that mean to you? So he, well, I didn't notice anything while we were dating or engaged, probably infatuated with him still, you know? And then after- How long have y'all been married? Seven years. Oh, all right. So after some, you know, I noticed while we were married, I'm like, oh, he complains of headaches a lot.

You know, a couple days a week, he's complaining of headaches. And then I would say within the past six months to a year, it's really gotten to the point where he was convinced he had Lyme disease. He's going to his PCP requesting blood work. He's been to a cardiologist within the past year complaining of chest pain. He's like racking up medical bills at this point. And he went to a podiatrist for foot pain. He went to a, his ear hurt. So he was going to an ear, nose and throat doctor.

And then it just sort of got to the point where about a week or two ago, he were like laying in bed and he looks at me and he goes, I think I have a brain tumor. And I just was like, what? You know, what? So I said to him, look me in the eye and tell me that you honestly think that you have a brain tumor. So he did, and he was very serious. And then, of course, it escalated into. You don't believe me, and how can you not love me?

I'm dying, and you don't even care. yes you nailed it yes and i it's not true you know i love him so much and i just want to give him what he needs and i just cannot figure out what exactly he wants i feel like at this point he almost wants to be sick and he's looking for something and i just don't understand what he's looking for and i just i just don't understand what he's looking for. And I just really want to help him. And I'm not sure how. Oh, man. So this is beyond.

So when you first said he's a hypochondriac, I thought it was a, this is, you know, generalization. But my wife reminds me often that she had children. And so she knows I have a headache, but I need to get up and fill in the blank, right? That's exactly how I feel. On one hand, I feel I want to help him. I want to meet whatever needs he has. I can't figure out what that is.

But on the other hand, I'm like, chop, chop, buddy. We got you. You know? I got a brain tumor. Well, great. Into the dishwasher. We'll talk about it later. Excellent.

Right, exactly. So has there been any sort of finding at all from any of these doctor visits? No. And then I've noticed that after he goes, he kind of lays off of it. He's kind of good to go. But then they just keep building up on top of each other. It gets even more almost fantastical. Now we're at the point where he has a brain tumor. I'm like, oh gosh. Number one, nobody's ever used the word fantastical on this show ever. So Elaine,

you get a special star. I may call you out in the next newsletter for excellent word to use. Fantastical. I'm writing that down. All right. So this actually sounds, so hypochondriac is like one of those words like narcissist or I've got anxiety or I've got ADHD. It's a diagnostic that's thrown around a lot. This actually sounds like what you're dealing with. Not just somebody who's got a low pain tolerance or somebody who actually has some medical issues that they're trying to figure out. This sounds like somebody who has made medical fears a part of their identity. So having a medical diagnosis becomes part of a hypochondriac's identity, and you nailed it. It feels like he wants to be sick.

He doesn't want to be sick, but like, he doesn't want to hurt and be dying. But there, this has become part of his identity that I go to doctors, I Google things and I've got phantom pains and et cetera. So hypochondriac, another way to think of it is a, an illness, anxiety disorder is really what it is. And it does sound like he needs some psychological care right now. And not in an overdramatic way, but I do think he needs to go talk to a counselor about where this is coming from. Because here's the loop you get in. You go to a doctor, they do all the tests, and they say, I don't know, take some vitamin D. I mean, they'll make up something. They'll give you something. Or try this thing for 12 days and see if it feels better. And this is my opinion. I don't have any data to back this up.

But I do have data to back up. Anxiety is a connection issue. It is people who are disconnected. I have a strong hypothesis that those who struggle from hypochondria, they get that connection through doctors, through experts, somebody that will look at them, give them 30 minutes of undivided attention, give them their expertise, their opinions, and their bodies go, I'm connected. And then they get home and they spin up something else. And then now I've got to go find the next. So you went from headaches to foot pain to any sorts of anything. Has there been a lot of COVID related stuff? No, actually, no, no COVID stuff.

Okay. So, and then now we're at brain tumor. I mean, cancer is usually the big one, right? I've got cancer. This is happening. It's all coming down. And let's be honest. There is a minuscule statistical possibility that he's got brain cancer. Probably not. We all walk around with that every day, right? So most hypochondriacs, the word I've heard used that I love is they need a witness. And when we love somebody who is struggling with this type of challenge, it becomes more, as you say, fantastical. And it's hard to be a witness to like, hey, look, I'm riding a unicorn.

Check it out. It's like, okay, great. I need you to go outside and finish the yard or whatever. And we also have to realize that the mind is so powerful, so incredible. The research on placebo is staggering and it can create real pain and real challenges. It can manufacture them on its own, if you will. So what I'm telling you this is this is actually hard. This is harder than it sounds. And I do think he needs to go talk to somebody. And I do think it's probably rooted in anxiety. And again, I'm not talking to him. And I do think there's some peace he finds through the connection through medical providers. And it does get really

expensive and it does get really, really hard to be in relationship with somebody similar to somebody struggling with anxiety. What are things you all have tried in your home? Well, I've tried everything from sympathy to tough love. And it all seems to end the same way. Exactly like you said, you don't love me, you don't care. And then it ends up with me saying, no, I do love you. I'm also a nurse. No, you're not going to bring your knowledge to this situation, are you?

Right. So he'll ask for my opinion and then he does. And you're right. We have half bottles of pills laying around. And, you know, the foot doctor said take these pills for a month. And that was over the summer. And there's still a half bottle of pills. Of course.

Because we've moved on. Right. Right. So I just, if I tell him straight out, like if I take the tough love approach and say, it's just a total nightmare. But I also don't want to get if you give in to the the uh like oh well maybe you should go get it checked out that causes almost

like a spiral as well. Like he just keeps going with it and until we end up at a doctor and you know I do sense that it is much more anxiety related and um so if I bring that up to him I have bring that up to him,

I have brought that up to him. It's a, no, you don't believe me. Exactly. Yeah. And it's really hard to be in relationship there because then it's a spiral at that point. You can't win that engagement. You're in a place where you can't fix this.

What you can do is love him. You can, the next time y''ll go to some doctor to go with him and let them know, I believe at this point, here is the, here's our trajectory and you hand that doctor, here's the last set of, so let me back up. Here's, and I've talked about this, I think on this show, I know I've talked about it in some live events recently. Really cool. I read a book by Ethan Cross and I mean, I read several books a week and occasionally one or two things will stick with me or I'll add to a body knowledge. This is one that was extraordinary for me. I'd never heard it. I thought it was mumbo jumbo and I've tried it and it is unbelievable

how successful it's been. So I run pretty hot when it comes to anxiety and I have a pretty regimented life. It's a silly fun life, but I have a regimented life so that I don't get to those places. And over the last decade, I mean, I'm almost anxiety free, but if I get tired and I don't eat right and, and, and, then I start withdrawing and I can find myself spun up if I let it get that way. So Ethan Cross, the book's called Chatter, and it's about the inner voice. And there's evidently been a lot of research on the inner voice in our heads that just keep going all day, every day, all day, every day.

He's telling stories, stories, stories, stories, stories. And he dropped some information that I'd never heard before. And here's what he said. He said, when our bodies think and solve for I or we, there is a neural circuit that the I and we conversation inside our head operates on. And it's the fight or flight circuit. So I don't know what I need to do. I don't know if I should be buying this thing. Should I even be moving to this house? Should I marry this person?

Should we have another kid? That is an immediate threat that your body tries to solve. And it solves it. And you know this as a nurse. It solves it with adrenaline and cortisol and dopamine, all kinds of things. With all sorts of hormones and neurotransmitters, all this stuff. When we think of them, they, our bodies don't take off on us. It doesn't try to solve that.

It's a different circuit. And I hate using tech metaphors to describe the human brain, but it's easy on this one. So what this guy's recommendation was, when you have hard decisions to make, if you're struggling with addiction, if you are working through really tough challenges, talk to yourself in the third person. Write your journal in the morning in the third person. Because here's what happens. When I'm struggling, I teach relationships and marriage and parenting for a living. And there are times I don't know what to do with my kids. And I'm just scrolling, like in my mind. What am I supposed to do here?

Then my buddy calls and says, hey, my son is fill in the blank, is doing this, this, and this. And I can go, well, yeah, just do that, that, and that. Because my brain's not in fight or flight. My prefrontal cortex is still connected. And so if I talk to myself in the third person, often my brain doesn't react. My thinking brain, my rational brain stays intact. So what does this have to do with y'all's situation?

Number one, I want you to keep a front and present spreadsheet or a Word document that has all of the ailments and the dates and what y'all did. Okay. And I want this to be an ongoing list that can be seen because anxiety thrives off chaos. And so we're going to clear this up. And then what we're going to do is we're going to talk to, let's say your husband's name is Tom. We're going to talk to Tom in the third person. Because my guess is if your husband had a buddy show up and say, hey man, I thought I had foot pain. And then I thought I had chest pain. And then I thought I had headache pain. And then I thought I had neck issues.

Pretty sure it's a brain tumor. Your husband would probably say, I bet you don't, just as a first default response. But when it's your body, your body takes over for you, and then it's in fight or flight, and then we're not thinking straight. And so when he comes to you with a new ailment, I want you all to write it down, and maybe even put, I'm going to be obnoxious here, okay, but maybe put a Star Wars figure or a Lego figure or some sort of something on the coffee table. And I want you to talk to Tom and say, tell Tom what your symptoms are. What are you feeling? And what would we tell Tom that he should probably do? And your husband should be able to have that conversation without it becoming internalized.

And the hope there is you begin to have more, I don't want to say rational, but more fact-based, more direct, more rational conversations about, do I really have a brain tumor? What is the data that would tell me I have a brain tumor? And begin to go down that road. Does that make sense? And then when you go to the doctor next time, I want you to take this list and hand it to the doctor and let the doctor know, I am concerned as a medical professional that this may be an anxiety disorder more so than physiological challenge. And your husband may get upset with you. He may say, you don't trust me. You don't believe me. And call that out in front of the doctor.

I'm struggling with connecting here and it may be on me, but here's all the things we've been through. And that sort of clarity for a doctor would be a gift. And know this, you can't solve this anxiety disorder with your husband. You can't solve this anxiety disorder with your husband.

You can't solve it. And it's going to be frustrating. Frustrating. Not a word. That's fantastical. It's going to be frustrating. What you can do is love him, not give in to either side of this thing, not give in to the despair and hitting him upside the head.

And also, we're going to put some boundaries on how many times we go to the doctor, unless we have some real evidence that suggests you may have some maladies and some challenges. But I want us to talk to Tom, not to your husband, but I want us to talk to an external third Tom and begin to look at the data. It was feet. And then we had about a week of whatever this medication is and it all went away. We had headaches and we weren't able to solve them. We had backaches. We weren't able to solve them. Now our knees hurt and there's no solving there. And now we're under brain tumors. And hopefully if we're talking to Tom, we can keep our brain plugged in. It won't go limbic on us. We'll be able to look at the data. And then at that point we can say,

okay, maybe it's something a little bit different. And I hate that for you. The last step you can do is you go see somebody and you model counseling. You model living with somebody who's got lots of medical challenges. You can tell your husband this. I don't know how I can help you because you seem to be moving from medical challenge to medical challenge to medical challenge. And I want to love you. And I don't know how, because every time we go get the medical challenge taken care of, there's no findings. And I'm struggling with how to love you in this situation. The hope being that he joins you, the hope being that you continue to invite him. You continue to say, I want to love you. I want to connect better. And I don't know how to do that.

One final, final thing. Hold his hands every single day and look him in the eye and tell him that you love him. And I want you to begin practicing skin-to-skin contact. It can be sexual. It can be non-sexual. Begin to lean into, let's don't talk. I just want to hold you. I just want to touch your hands.

I just want to touch your face. I want to touch your feet I just want to hold you. I just want to touch your hands. I just want to touch your face. I want to touch your feet. I want to hold you. And the anxiety alarms begin to... This one's tough, Elaine. Tough, tough, tough. If you're struggling with anxiety, go see somebody. You're worth it.

We'll be right back on the Dr. John Deloney Show. Hey, what's up? Deloney here. Listen, you and me and everybody else on the planet has felt anxious or burned out or chronically stressed at some point. In my new book, Building a Non-Anxious Life, you'll learn the six daily choices that you can make

to get rid of your anxious feelings and be able to better respond to whatever life throws at you so you can build a more peaceful, non-anxious life. Get your copy today at johndeloney.com. All right, we are back. Don't forget johndeloney.com. Scroll to the bottom and sign up for the newsletter. Is that a good pitch?

I'm so terrible at this. Buy my new used car. I don't know how to do this. The newsletter. Is that a good pitch? I'm so terrible at this. Buy my new used car. I don't know how to do this. Listen, the newsletter is going to be rad. It is rad. And it's going to be rad-er with you and the gang. All right, let's go to Sarah in Minneapolis, Minnesota.

Did I say that right? Did I get it? No. How do you say it? Minneapolis. Did I say Minneapolis? You did. Dang, Gina. Okay. Minneapolis. There you go. I'm going to go with Minnesota. Is that cool? That works too. That works. Minneapolis. Minneapolis. What's up, Sarah? How can I help? Hi, John. I'm calling today. My brother-in-law turned 15 and over the last few months, we've noticed some disturbing behaviors, smoking weed, cutting. And now the latest has been drinking and getting drunk around family members. We just feel like, you know, my in-laws aren't necessarily doing enough and we're afraid of what comes next. And so we're looking

to see how do me and my husband speak to my in-laws about this. Have you all spoke to them yet? We've tried, but it never goes well. It it always gets shut down and we're told you know we're not the parents you don't know um and stuff like that um man this one's hard um and it's hard for a couple of reasons one is they're right you're not their parent this kid's parent and right the And the sentiment of mind your business with the parents, fair enough. Where it gets hard in my book is as a child, it's a kid. And I believe that neighborhoods raise kids. And I believe if I see a kid in an abusive situation or if a kid is not safe as a community member, I'm going to step in and get involved in that.

Kelly sent me an awesome thing yesterday about a dad who was taking his kid out to TJ Maxx, Kohl's, something like that. Yeah, kid was having a tantrum. Yeah, kid was having a tantrum. A dad was carrying his daughter over his shoulder, and kid was screaming and hollering. Turns out she wanted to buy a toy or something. And dad said, no, we're leaving. And a guy was walking into the store in the parking lot. And so imagine a guy's walking out of a store holding a kid over his shoulder, and the kid's screaming and yelling, saying, ah!

And this man in the parking lot stopped that dad and said, hey, what's the problem, kid? Are you okay? And the kid said, no, I'm not okay. Daddy won't, whatever. Let me buy a pony. Actually, it was a loofah sponge. A loofah sponge, right? But the dad of the child ended up taking out a picture

saying, I'm the dad here. My kid's throwing a temper tantrum. And then he went on to say, and thank you for stopping me. Because if someone had been taking my daughter out of the store, I'm so glad that people like you exist and are willing to get in the middle of something that doesn't look right, even if it's just a check-in. So I tell you that to say, I believe in that. And if I see a kid screaming in a store and it looks like there's a not safe situation, I'd rather ask than not. You're in a messy situation right now because this is your in-laws and this is going to

wreak havoc. And what I would tell you is havoc's already been wreaked. Is that fair? That's fair. Yeah. So I would have one final conversation that goes along the lines of, we've got a kid who's self-harming, who has taken drugs, who is now intoxicated. He's 15. He's underage on all counts. He's not getting the mental health care that he needs. He's clearly not getting the boundaries

and parental connection that he's desperate for. All of those behaviors are him screaming, will somebody see me? And they're not. And so I would let them know directly, we're going to call the school, we're gonna call the local child protective services and get somebody involved in this young man's life

before we are all at a funeral or we are all pooling money to bail him out of jail. And that will be a disaster of a conversation. That's your husband's to have, not you. I just made an assumption. You're married, right? Yes, we are. Yep, we are.

It's his to step up and say, that's my brother, and I'm not going to allow my brother to live in this situation. And it's going to be that level of directness. And I wish there was another thing I could tell you, but that's the next step. And that's the step I would take in my world. That little boy, that 15-year-old little boy, which I know it's 15-year-olds can be gigantic and they have hairy legs and they smell and they make out with girls and they, whatever. He's a kid. He's a child. And he needs some adult in his life to step in and they, whatever. He's a kid, he's a child and he needs some adult in his life to

step in and say, I love you too much to not keep you safe. Right. And we know he has a therapist that he sees, but it's not, it's things are getting worse and, and it's just, it's hard to watch. Does he have a relationship with your husband? Yes, he does. My husband is about 11 years older, so it's not as brotherly as it is with other siblings. So what is it? It's more of a... Do they connect, though? Does he tell them the truth? Does he tell them what's going on?

He does. He does, but it's probably not as often as it should be. Do you all live in the same community? Yes, we do. We live very close. Okay. It may also be worth a conversation with, and I'm using these words intentionally, your husband bringing his little brother over to the house to meet with you all too.

You say, hey, what's going on? This isn't okay, and I'm worried about you, and love you. Right. And we all know, we all know, I know, but I've never spoken directly with him about it. My husband has a little bit, but it's all this secret we know, but haven't necessarily acknowledged. Yeah. So, so you've heard me, you say this before. I think somebody needs to turn the lights on, turn the music off of the dance, and just call this what it is right now. And that may be y'all bringing them in over to your house and inviting them over for dinner and just saying, hey, things aren't okay. And we're about to get super involved the best we can. We're not your parents.

You've got a free ride. Smoking weed's awesome. Drinking's awesome. Hooking up with girls. I mean, all that's awesome, but you're not okay. And we're going to do the best we can to put a stop to it. I love you too much. And it's going to be a relational fracture.

Anytime you throw up boundaries on a 15-year-old who's out of control, they're going to say, I hate you. You're not my parents. You don't get to do that, whatever. But it will be the first seed planted that we love you and care about you enough to try to keep you safe. And it may end up with him saying, can I come live with you? Who knows where it's down? So I'd have this conversation with the husband. What are y'all's boundaries? How much money were y'all

willing to put in on this? Are you willing to let him come stay with you for a season? I mean, all those things. If there is abuse going on, if there's chaos or neglect going on, and he's going to get removed, who knows where this thing goes. But he is desperate for someone who loves him, who's an adult to step in and say, I'm going to do it. I'm at least going to go to bed knowing I made the right phone calls. And I invited you over to my house and said, I love you and you're not safe and you're

not okay. Right. Yeah. It all seems to be self-inflicted harm. Yeah. No other signs of external. But yeah, it all seemed to be self-inflicted harm. Yeah. No other signs of external. But yeah, it's very clear there's a cry for help and attention here. And it may shock you how little is going on, or it may shock you how much is going on that y'all don't know about.

Yep. A lot. Maybe a lot. But this 15-year year old is saying, somebody please help me. And he's lucky to have you. I just don't want there to be any illusions. This is going to be one of those, like the music's going to swell and it's going to be an afterschool special kind of moment. It's going to be really hard on your marriage. It's going to be hard on your family dynamics. It's going to screw up Thanksgiving and Christmas and all that stuff. And what I would tell you is this little boy's worth it. Yeah. There's definitely already been some strains and arguments had and, and it's, yeah, it's just painful, painful to watch. And you, you know, watching from the outside is

obviously different than being the parent. And that's right. You know, we think we might have all the answers, but, but we probably don't. I mean, I don't know. For sure. That's right. We think we might have all the answers, but we probably don't. I mean, I don't know. For sure you don't. And 100% chance, go into it knowing you don't have all the answers. That's why the approach you take is, here's all we can see and we're about to act in an over the top way. We're going to call everybody we can. And you may cut us off. You may shut us out. You may close the doors on us and not let us talk to him. That's fine.

We're going to go to bed at night knowing we did everything we could to keep this young boy safe because y'all are not. And I'm not going to go to my little brother's funeral knowing that I didn't do anything, that I stayed silent when I shouldn't have. Right. I'm not going to be trying to help my brother get a job in 15 years with a felony on his record, and I should have said something. Can you all prevent everything? No. This is not by your hand, but it's in your lap. Somebody you love is hurting, and I'm going to stand up and say something.

Yeah. That makes sense. Easier, definitely easier said than done. Oh, man. Yes. So here's the big thing. Yep. That makes sense. Eas most 15-year-olds are. Most 15-year-olds are extraordinary and they are desperate for people to connect with them. And so get all that stuff planned out.

Otherwise, you're going to end up in a mess and you're going to end up saying yes to something that y'all are not ready for or can't afford or don't have space for, et cetera. And you're going to get way over your skis on it. And then you're going to end up resenting everybody. It's going to be even more chaotic. Have your game plan

and then have the conversations that you need to have. And I would make sure he feels like y'all, not feels like, he knows. He looks you in the eye over a meal in your house and he knows that you love him. But he knows that love comes with accountability and safety. And know that your parents, your in-laws, we are willing to, y'all have already blown this thing up. We are willing to just

call to pay the piper on this one. And y'all don't want to hang out with this great, but I can't continue to come over here and see the blood and the scars on my little brother's arms without saying something. And I can't keep hearing about him getting drunk around us at our house. Can't do it. Can't do it anymore. He can't come over here high anymore. We have too much respect for you guys, for him and for our own house.

And I'll say it again, Sarah, he's lucky to have someone in his life that loves him like you do. And love gets really messy and really hard sometimes. So thank you so much for continuing to restore my faith in humanity. I'm really grateful for you guys. Call me back any step of the way after these emails. I mean, after the conversations,

they're going to be hard. They're going to be messy. They're going to go sideways. Call me after those and I'll continue to walk alongside you guys as y'all work through this. Thank you so, so much for reaching out. All right. So as we wrap up today's show, let's see here. James brought some songs in. I'm kind of a huge fan of this one. This is one of my lo-fi secret favorites. I love Tears for Fears, man. Do you?

Yeah. Duh. I love Tears for Fears. When this song comes on, I turn the radio up as loud as it will go. It might be overplayed, but it's jammed. Way overplayed. Love it. But since it was overplayed three to four decades ago, I think we're good now. Love, love, love this song.

It's not one of the greatest of all time, but it's pretty awesome. It's called Everybody Wants to Rule the World, and it goes like this. Listen to this song today. It just feels good. Welcome to your life. There's no turning back. Even while we sleep, we'll find you. Acting on your best behavior, turning your back on Mother Nature.

Everybody wants to rule the world. It's my own design, my own remorse. Help me decide. Help me make most. A freedom of pleasure. Nothing ever lasts. And everybody wants to rule the world. This song's good, man. I'm going to listen to it right after the show. Not really. James has probably got some tasks for me to do or whatever, but stay tuned on The Dr. John Deloney Show.