The Dr. John Delony Show - My Husband Loses His Patience With Our Son

Episode Date: June 28, 2023

On today’s show, we hear about: - A mother frustrated by how her husband treats their son with ADHD - A woman terrified to die alone - A single father who’s sacrificed his dreams for his daughter Lyrics of the Day: "Growing Up" - Macklemore & Ryan Lewis Let us know what’s going on by leaving a voicemail at 844.693.3291 or visiting johndelony.com/show.  Support Our Sponsors: BetterHelp DreamCloud Hallow Thorne Add products to your cart create an account at checkout Receive 25% off ALL orders Resources: Own Your Past, Change Your Future Questions for Humans Conversation Cards Redefining Anxiety Quick Read John’s Free Guided Meditation Listen to all The Ramsey Network podcasts anytime, anywhere in our app. Download at: https://apple.co/3eN8jNq These platforms contain content, including information provided by guests, that is intended for informational and entertainment purposes only. The content is not intended to replace or substitute for any professional medical, counseling, therapeutic, financial, legal, or other advice. The Lampo Group, LLC d/b/a Ramsey Solutions as well as its affiliates and subsidiaries (including their respective employees, agents and representatives) make no representations or warranties concerning the content and expressly disclaim any and all liability concerning the content including any treatment or action taken by any person following the information offered or provided within or through this show. If you have specific concerns or a situation in which you require professional advice, you should consult with an appropriately trained and qualified professional expert and specialist. If you are having a health or mental health emergency, please call 9-1-1 immediately. Learn more about your ad choices. https://www.megaphone.fm/adchoices Ramsey Solutions Privacy Policy

Coming up on the Dr. John Deloney Show. I need some help getting my husband to understand how detrimental some of the things he says to my son are about his ADHD behavior. He's one of those be tougher, you know, we just think this would end. You cannot beat ADHD out of a human being. What in the world is going on? This is John with the Dr. John Deloney Show. A show about your mental and emotional health and your marriage and your kids and your job. Whatever you got going on in your life, we're here.

1-844-693-3291. 1-844-693-3291. It's 1-844-693-3291. And show's not just about opinions, right? I try to do my homework. And if I, when it comes to the actual research on some of these questions that we get, and if I don't have the right answer, I like to reach out to a friend um who's a professional who lives in some of these spaces to get some wisdom and so just know man if you call in the show my promises i'm gonna tell you the truth and i'm also gonna say if i don't know and i'm gonna do my best to find data supported like wisdom and not just cool instagram scrolly things that are like, yeah, bro. Yeah, bro. So if you want to join the show, give us a buzz again, 1-844-693-3291 or go to johndeloney.com slash ask. That's A-S-K and Jenna Kelly's out of town. Actually, she's at home moving back into

her house. She's finally moving back home into her house. It's been a wild six months for her. It has been a wild six months living in a hotel and all that. Yeah. She had a tattoo go horribly awry, and so it's been a whole thing. And now she's moving back home. It's pretty cool. Pretty cool.

So, we do anything special for her being gone? Like mom's out of town? You know, we got one day left. We can think of something. All right. Let's go out to Arkansas and talk to Holly. What's up, Holly? Holly. Yes. How are you? Sometimes when people are like, John, I like to yell my first name too. John. It's so good. What's up? Not much. Thank you so much for taking my call. Of course. Thanks for calling. Sorry for hanging up on you earlier.

What's up? Well, I was just going to get your advice on something and see how it goes. Let's just see how it goes. You know what? That's probably the wisest response of any caller ever. So what's up? What's up? Well, I need some help getting my husband

to understand how detrimental some of the things he says to my son are about his ADHD behaviors when he's frustrated with him. Now you're getting all into my business now, Holly.

Well, it's my world too. That's in my soul. Is this kid his son also? Yes. Okay, so it's y'all's kid. Yes, our child. I want you to know that just as the call is starting,

your language is very instructive. And I'll tell you why in a minute. That's really important. But go ahead. Okay, I won't interrupt you anymore. Go ahead. Okay, well, it's just when we try to talk about it, I'm sure that I'm oversensitive and overcompensate because I also have ADHD.

Okay, maybe not. Go ahead. He's one of those be tougher. You know, if you didn't spank him, this would end. We've got to get on the same page, but I kind of feel like we're not even in the same library. And I'm kind of stuck on this one. So when you say, oh, man. Okay, I've got to say this first because it's just burning a hole in my chest, and then I'm going to circle back, okay?

For your husband, for everybody listening, you cannot beat ADHD out of a human being. You can't hit them. You can't spank them or whatever word you want to use for beating your child, but you cannot beat ADHD out of a kid. Period. End of discussion. All right. So I needed to say that out loud. All right. Let's circle back. When you say your husband's struggling with his ADHD behaviors, walk me through it. What are some things that frustrate, what, I mean, what are some things that are hard to live with, with an ADHD kid? Well, he, my husband's super not ADHD. So he's structured routine, um, always prepared. And my son is forgetful, distracted, impulsive, um, you know, forgets to wear his shoes are, um, doesn't hear the first, you know, a couple of times you ask him to do something, he may nod, but it didn't go in. Just those typical things.

He's not out of control or, you know, getting in trouble at school or anything like that. It's just at home, it's very hard for my husband to understand the world of an ADHD person because he is so regimented and opposite. So this isn't what you're asking, but I'm going to put this out there as a point of reference. ADHD is a complicated thing, but ultimately the best way I've heard it distilled down by the great Gabor Mate is ADHD is a body's long-term response to chaos, to disconnection, okay? And there is even some evidence, according to Dr. Mate, that begins in utero in some cases, okay? an over obsession with routine and this is the way this should be

and this is the way this has to be can also be a body's way of trying to create control out of chaos. So I want to frame what's going on in your home. It may be two sides of the same coin Okay And you know this better than anybody because as you said you've lived with this your whole life The thing that your son needs more than anything in the world as a starting point

Is to know beyond a shadow of a doubt that his dad loves him. Not how he performs, not how he gets everything right and in the perfect order, but that his dad loves him. And that, my friend, is the place from which the other behaviors can be constructed. Because I'm also not one of these guys that lets ADHD kids just run amok. That's nonsense too. They don't like that life either. I didn't like that life. I still don't like that life.

I still need high accountability. But it has to start from a place of, there will be no bigger fan in your life than your dad, period. And mom is going to have to hold son accountable too, right? So here's what I see sometimes, not sometimes, often. I see one of a couple of things. One, dad is got too much going on in his own life. And so the thoughtful, patient practice that is parenting is frustrating because in his mind and body, he doesn't have time for it.

That's number one. Or there are parents who see any sort of forgetfulness as disrespect, as lazy, because they also see ADHD kids laser in on Legos or laser in on a video game or laser in on writing a novel, right? And so they say, if you can do it there, you can do it here, right? Or the third, is that your house? Yes. Okay. All right. Well, you know, all those dinosaur names. Why can you remember that? There you go. There you go, man. And that usually leads to the third thing, which is moms and dads, we all do it.

We use our kids' behavior as some sort of scorecard for how we're doing as adults. Yes. And if my kid can't put his shoes away, that means I'm failing, and I'll be damned if I'm going to fail. Yes. Does that sound right? Yes. Okay.

I see there's this head shake and this look of defeat on my husband's face sometimes when he's looking at him, just kind of like he's throwing his hands up. Like, I just, I don't, I don't know what to do. Yeah. And you, you know this because this was you as a kid, but you know that there is no worse feeling being an ADHD kid and feeling like you just failed your adults to the point the adults quit on you. Yes. It's, it's collapsing, which then sends the body off careening, trying to solve for the chaos and the whole system loops back up, except it loops a

little bit faster and a little bit faster and a little bit faster because that body's telling that kid, hey, because of you, you ran dad off. Yeah. And that's when my son goes in for the physical touch because he wants the hugs and the holding and the, you know, that's his, I guess, way to. No, no, that's, that's going back to, yeah, what I said a few minutes ago, the number one thing a kid with ADHD has to know is the adults in his life will go to hell for him. They will fight for that kid no matter what. And they love that kid no matter what. And that does include a ton of touch,

especially from dad. And from there, we can have conversations about choices and conversations about upstream and conversations about getting enough sleep and getting off screens and some of those things that I've seen anecdotally. And I think the literature is, it's kind of mixed, but I don't trust some of that literature these days. It exacerbates ADHD. I know sleep for sure. And I know diet for sure. But some of those things upstream, right? And you know, when you get a full

night's sleep or when your son gets a full night's sleep, the morning's different. We all know those things. Yes. But man, it's tough to get a kid to go to sleep when he feels like he's trying to fend off or make his dad feel better. Yes. Which isn't his job. So here's the hard part about this call. This call is best had between me and your husband, not between me and you. I know. I've gone to therapy to work on mine, and they suggested coming,

but he's not really receptive to that. Why? He's not a feelings guy. I don't give a crap about that. He is a feelings guy. He just has a very sophisticated mechanism for shutting that system down. Oh, yeah. And he knows.

I mean, I've talked about how he probably has PTSD, and he's like, well, doesn't everybody have something? Is he a veteran? No, he grew up in southwest Little Rock when it was major gang violence and that. So he's got a lot of hardened stuff there. So here's— Ugh. there. So here's, and I've, I've read scattered and I've told him, you know, if you would listen to it or read it or something, it would help him understand. He just, he kind of looks at me like

I'm an alien. Okay. So here's, here's, here's where we have to go from here. Okay. Um, and I, you know what I'm about to say but me saying it out loud is going to be very hard to hear and I know I just kind of talked out of both sides of my mouth but both things can be true at the same time this is a very generalized Neanderthal way of looking at things but in the grand scheme

or in the anthropological sense if if you will, it's mom's job to circle up and protect young kids. And it's dad's job to protect the system. The unit. Now, we're in the 21st century and most of us work on computers. I realize life is different and there's not people chasing us with clubs. But I just paint that picture for this reason. There comes a moment when if your husband or your wife, depending on who's listening to this, is hurting your child, the other parent has to step in.

And stepping in looks different for everybody. And I'm very reluctant to give somebody their or what statement. That's something that is very personal. But at the end of the day, your husband is choosing. You handed him the roadmap, which is the book by Dr. Matei. You handed him that roadmap.

I don't know of a better book. And if I was sitting there with my son and I've had these moments in these seasons when I don't feel like I don't, he's talking Spanish and I'm talking like, I don't know, Swahili and we are on different planets. We're not even talking the same. We're so disconnected. And somebody handed me a map back to my son. You better believe that'd be everything else in my life would stop. And so in a strange way, your husband is choosing misery and he's choosing to have a broken relationship with his son,

not to head to healing. He's also choosing to have a broken relationship with his wife because you've asked him to go to counseling with you. You've asked him to be a part of healing the family unit and building something new. And he's looked at you and said, no. And that puts you on an island to either watch this continue with your son

and let this thing continue on in another family system and yet another family system, or you step in and say, this ends with me and my son. What does that look like in real life? That looks like you when there's no fighting. And you've heard me say this a thousand times on the show, not in the middle of a fight, because lines are drawn at that point. This is you saying, hey, I want to go out. And you telling your husband, I want you and our son to have a great relationship and my son needs his dad. And right now my son has a drill sergeant or my son has somebody who's really frustrated with him and he has the distinct impression that his dad doesn't like him, much less love him.

Would you be willing to try something else? Because what we're doing is not working. He's not finding his shoes. He's not suddenly making his bed. And more volume, more hitting, more film, those aren't working. Will you be willing to try something else? And I'm trying to intentionally make this about an offer of,

I want your life to be better too. Because here's the deal. Your husband doesn't want to have a bad relationship with his son. He's out of tools, right? He loves that boy. He loves that boy. He just keeps reaching into his toolkit, and he only has a screwdriver.

That's it. Correct. And quite honestly, I bet his dad had no tools in his tool kit, right? No, probably not. So he's trying, right? And I'd love that. His dad says all the time, I see him in me because his dad's like super soft guy now, but he'll say, I see him or me in him, all the time. Does he like that, or is he trying to avoid that?

My husband? Mm-hmm. Well, I mean, my father-in-law says that about my husband. He'll say, you know, I used to be like that, and now he's different. He's retired. He's looking back on everything. And so I don't, that surprises me because he is so, such a soft guy. I know many, many, many men who look back and say,

man, I would have done that differently. And sometimes it's, I would have kicked my kid out of my basement. Right. I let my kid play way too many video games and I would have had his butt in a gym. I would have had his butt out of the house.

I would have signed him up for stuff. And also, there's a lot of dads that look back and say, my God, what did I do? I tried to beat love

into my child. I tried to beat mental illness out of them. I tried to yell and kick and scream peace into their heart. And I tried to get a kid to make sure that I wasn't mad. And that was never the kid's job.

Man, that's a common regret. A really common regret. So I want to honor the fact that your husband loves your son. I know that. I also benefited greatly from having a wife that said no more because I need to get some new skills And I would put my relationship up with my son over anybody's It's pretty powerful. Here's here's healing in 101 for adhd

Something as simple as how old's your kid? 10 10. Yeah Perfect. I can't tell you the magic in my home um again, I don't Not talking about my son's diagnostics or anything like that. He didn't have any diagnostics. That they start a weekly breakfast together and they just go talk and they hang out. That they play and wrestle together. That we're practicing. So when your kid forgets his shoes cool Let's go find the shoes And if you choose to not know where your shoes are then you're choosing to not go fishing man Because we only have this much time to go fishing

And there's one or two times we cancel the fishing trip and it's a bummer for everybody But we can't go fishing without shoes. And kids learn upstream about choices and learn upstream. And it's not this panic and this yelling and this, oh my gosh, dad's going to be so mad. My kids know they really, really can't make me mad because I don't give them that power. All of this is creating a peaceful home so that the kid whose body is over fired up all the time can actually function just turns the music down on everything and you've experienced that right yes i'm sorry that you have to watch this because i know it's hard to watch it is it's especially when i know because a lot of it is i know what to do, but I kind of like the structure to follow through with some of it because I get distracted.

It may really be important for you to work, well, if you've got a chaotic home. Because I guarantee you, you and I could have another two or three phone calls because this isn't the only thing going on in your house, I know. Exactly. Well, this is, we've worked on, I mean, because like I said, I've gone to therapy and worked through a lot of things. And thank goodness Dave Ramsey found his way into my husband's ear several years ago on the deer stand. And so we don't have money fights anymore. So this really is kind of the last, but you're right. There are several other layers that kind of come back to this. Well, if he would have the courage, I would love to talk to him.

And with a spirit of love and a spirit of, hey, man, there's a different way to do this. Okay. I love you. And this isn't me wanting to fight anybody. I have no interest in fighting anybody. But I do want dads to learn new tools for how to love their sons. And I want parents, both moms and dads, to have new tools to create households

so that their kids can be successful. And we've just had a generation of kids that we thought we'd just get louder and get more angry and more raged out. And that would work. And look around, guys. It's not working. It's not.

And for the bro-downs listening to the show, no, I'm not talking about not holding kids accountable. Accountability is a cornerstone. No, I'm not talking about getting rid of consequences. Are you kidding me? Consequences are critical. cornerstone. No, I'm not talking about getting rid of consequences. Are you kidding me? Consequences are critical. But I'm also talking about 10 year olds, 10, 6, 4, 12. Moms and dads, we can do better. Thank you for the call, Holly. I'll be up, man.

I'll be here for you guys. Holler at me anytime I can help. We'll be right back. Hey, good folks. Let's talk about hallow. All right. I say this all the time. It's important to get away for times of prayer and meditation by yourself with no one else around.

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Go right now and change your life. All right, let's go to Emily in Austin, Texas. What's up, Emily? Hey. Wow. What's happening? This is like real life. Oh, it's real life.

It's about to get real. What's up? Hey, okay. Let's do this, I guess. What are you nervous about? Everything. I don't know. I didn't think I was,

and then all of a sudden, here it is. I've had this effect on people. Even when I was dating, like I didn't date in middle school, but when I had like a girlfriend, I always made everybody nervous. I think I love that for you. I don't love it for me. I think it was weird. Okay. Go ahead. Go ahead. Okay. Um, so I'm going to read my question cause I squirrel off. So you might have to like reel me back in a little bit. Um, but my is, how do I let go of my extreme fear of dying alone? So I guess my biggest fear is like the unknown that comes with age. Like, what if I get Alzheimer's?

Am I just going to sit in a nursing home forever alone? I've been divorced twice and I'm scared to leave my current relationship. That's very toxic because deep down I'm almost 40 and I don't have kids and I can't have kids and I feel like this is my last chance for a family. Too much? No, no, no. This is one of those rare calls that probably more than anything I could say if you and I were just sitting down talking somewhere, I would just sit in silence for about 30 seconds. And then I would ask your permission if I could give you a hug.

And I would hug you to the point that it got a little bit awkward. And then the point where your shoulders could drop. And you could feel that I love you. And that there's not something wrong with you. Because there's not something wrong with you because there's not. Yeah. What happened in your first marriage? Um, well, I was really young.

Nobody, I mean, so growing up, I always just wanted to have a family. I, I did have siblings, but, um, they were older. And so I kind of grew up as an only child. And so I was 18 and a situation presented itself to get married to someone with two tiny little kids. And so I did. And I raised them for five years. I was their mom. And then he cheated on me and left and moved to a different state. And so that just kind of ended abruptly. But I was still a baby. Sit right there. I don't want to blow by how huge that is. Yeah.

Like you were 18 years old. You were still a baby. And then you had an Insta family. Mm-hmm. And this was your life. This was your family for five years. Did you give up college and your dreams for other things for this one path? Oh, yeah, absolutely.

I was a crazy, crazy person who had my whole life mapped out, you know, we don't know any better. And yep, just threw it all to, to these babies cause they were mine. And you didn't just get left romantically, which is brutal. You didn't just get cheated on, which is brutal. This cat stole your family. Yep. He stole my babies. And he took your heart with him, right? Absolutely. I was very empty for a long time. Yeah. All right. So then what happened in the next one? So then I waited a long time.

And when I was 30, I, um, got married again. We eloped and, um, why not? Um, and he was a soldier has had a lot of PTSD, got into some really heavy alcohol addiction to where he was going to rehab, went to rehab a couple of times, did an inpatient where I had to take him to the hospital to detox a few times and then sent to a three-month rehab. And during that, say, he just decided he wanted a life of solitude. So three years into our marriage,

we just didn't have a marriage anymore. And I don't have to tell you how damaging and hard it is to be married to someone who's an alcoholic. Yeah, it was crazy. Because they're staring you in the face, but they're not there. Absolutely. And you're making love to them, but they're not there. And you're trying to talk about the future and they're not there and it makes you it makes you feel insane yeah and then they leave you right the person is there to do anything and everything and i'm one of those ride or die people like i would i would have stayed with my first husband after cheating i would have stayed with my first husband after cheating. I would have stayed with him through, you know, my second husband. I know, I know, but you won't ride or die with Emily. Why?

I don't know. Why don't you like her? I don't know how to. I don't know. That's fair. That's fair. I'll give you that. And then what about this person you're with now?

It's kind of starting to remind me a little bit of my last relationship with like a lot of the PTSD stuff starting to trickle in. He's a police officer with, you know, been a soldier and war stuff coming up, but also just it's smothering. Like it's too much constant, like phone calls and texting and this and that. And it's like, it's overwhelming. It's just too much. And so we don't know how to communicate well with each other. Have you sat down and said, Hey, this is a lot. Absolutely. And he just says, I don't really care what you think. This is how I'm going to roll.

Yeah. It's kind of been like, Hey, I need a boundary of, I drive to work for 10 minutes. Like I just need to not talk to you for those 10 minutes, or I can text you that I'm on my way home, but I need to be able to just drive home for those 10 minutes and just decompress. And then it's a thing. It's always a thing. Like, can you please not call me 15 times when I'm at work? Because I think there's an emergency when, well, I just needed to know if you need to think from the grocery store. It's a lot. It's a lot. And I'm used to being alone and by myself. And this is, you know, the first relationship I've been in for four or five years.

And it's too much. Like, I just. Okay. You know your body better than anybody. Yeah. But over 40 years, you've been conditioned strongly to not trust that body. Yeah. years you've been conditioned strongly to not trust that body yeah and you're either wide open or you are shut them down

yep and my dream for you would be to be wide open for Emily so the it's like I was a licensed therapist and we were sitting down talking, um,

which I'm not, I would go, you know what? Let's do it anyway. We can do it. We got a few minutes. Go to the end. Go all the way to the end.

Give me a scale on one to a hundred, how healthy you are. A hundred being like, you've got to be kidding me. Super healthy. And then one being like, ah, I'm mainline.

20. All right. So 20. So let's say you're 75 and you're at the end of your life. Okay. Absolutely. Maybe 70. Maybe 70. Yeah. I've got some miles. Yeah. I, uh, I, I snorted brown sugar off the counter. So I, I've got a lot of miles on my body So Back when I was a kid So I have so many questions about that Trust me I had a problem I used to eat it out of a spoon

Anyway So you're 75 And you're in a nursing home And you're all alone you're in a nursing home and you're all alone. Describe that for me. I just think that you're just lost. Describe it for me. You're thinking about it.

I want you to describe it. Put yourself there. Just sitting alone in a chair, just sitting there. Where does that picture come from? Around you. I think with my grandpa, when he had Alzheimer's, we had him even in our home, but he would just sit there just alone. And nobody really, like, I see other families and, you know, grandparents or whatever. And you're always taking care of each other.

And there's that love there. But there's, like, I don't have any of that. And so I just picture at the end of the day, just being alone, like in a chair, just all by yourself, getting changed by someone that you don't know. You know what I mean?

Just sad. It looks sad. I don't think that's end of life. I think that's right now. I think you're a good anxious person like me and the rest of us that can project our brains will spin up narratives and stories

that aren't true into the future that we can worry about in the present because I just that allows us to not to avoid what we're experiencing right now

yeah but you have a guy that texts you 400 times a day and you are completely and totally alone yeah and you've gone all in twice on two different people and they've left you

one for a bottle and one for who knows what and that feeling of I'm just sitting here in a chair is right now fair? yeah so here's my question a chair is right now. Fair? Yeah. So here's my question. You can continue what I, what you just described to me in a few minutes.

I'm sure you and I could hang out for a couple hours and you could tell me the full story, but in just a few minutes, it looks like it has been a slow collapsing of Emily over the period of 20 or so years. And probably, if we're honest, and got into your childhood, there's probably some of that there too. Oh yeah. I could be a weekly

segment if you'd like. It's time for time with Emily. So we could go through all that and I think it'd be worthy to go through all that, but we're here. Right. And so let me just, let me cast a vision for you as though you're my sister. Okay. You're my friend. You can't go back and change that stuff that happened, even though

it shaped you in a profound way. The question I want to ask you is, are you going to continue to think I'm only worth this much until you just can't take it or they can't take it and they they leave or you leave but I think you're too stubborn I think you're too ride or die to ever leave I think you'd marry somebody who's abusive and controlling because ride or die and you can do that or you can live wide open, not for some person who's going to come in and rescue you, but for you. So my question would be,

what will you have done when you're sitting in this rocking chair and you're 75 years old? Will you have gone skydiving or got another graduate degree or play checkers with old folks in old folks home every saturday or serve your local church or try to would you will you have done that will that be the story of your life or will it be these hyper intense relationships where you get set on fire followed by half a decade of isolation. Yeah.

That's where we are. In one of the, you get to pick both avenues. Do you have a gang of like women there in Austin that you hang with? No, I don't want to tell you where I came from because you'll judge me, but I just moved to Austin recently. From where? California. I'm not judging you.

Dude, I was just in Hollywood a few months ago. It's amazing. It's one of the most beautiful places. I walked outside like at 5.30 in the morning, which is noon for me back here. Not really, but to go get some coffee. And I just remember stopping and laughing. I was like, oh, this is why everyone on the planet wants to live here.

It was incredible. I don't judge you. Good for you. I mean, it's good weather, but you're a Texan, so I'm sure you're aware. I mean, we're superior, but I mean, I'm not going to judge you, right? Right. Okay. So here's a beautiful moment.

And I usually don't like this kind of language, but I'm going to do it anyway. This is an either or moment for you. You're almost 40, right? Yeah. Okay. I made the same journey. 39 and a half. I moved to Nashville. Marriage barely, barely hanging on. No friends, maybe one or two like that. I had colleagues, right? Some people that I'd known that we weren't super close yet, or we had been close and not anymore, but I had a right some people that i'd known that we weren't super close yet or we had been close and not anymore but but

I had a choice to make I'm, either gonna go all in and be weird and just go make friends and invite people over from work and take people to lunch And put in my budget like this is just I go to lunch a lot Or I have lots of coffee with people or I say yes to every invitation to whatever Um, you can do that. Or you can just circle the wagons and go home every night and watch, wait for the next Ted Lasso season to start. And my challenge to you is looking back over the last 20 years of your life,

the Ted Lasso route hasn't worked. Would you be willing to try something crazy and different for Emily now? I guess it's time. I don't know another path. Or be that weird person at the gym that asks people to hang out after meeting them at the gym. I don't know. What are you into?

I don't know what you do, but man. I mean, I'm only at a 20, so I guess I need to get to the gym. But you know what I mean? Yeah. Yeah. And here's, it feels to me like you have a very anxious life. Can I run through a couple of things with you and you just say yay or nay or give me like some quick data points? Yeah. Do you owe money? Yes. A lot? Yep. Okay. Not a lot of friends. What's your calendar look like? Empty or chaos?

I fill it up with work. Okay. So you don't do heroin, but you do work? Correct, yes. What's your job? I am a director at a preschool. Oh, sweet. So you are... A crazy person. Yes.

No, you're a saint is what you are. You're an absolute saint. But you also have to deal with overzealous parents're an absolute saint. But you also have to deal with overzealous parents 24-7, 365. And you have to deal with preschoolers and you have to deal with teachers, which all of that is a lot. Yes. Right. But at least you didn't have to do that during COVID in California and you did. Right. So I want you to understand your body is doing the best it can to protect you. It's just doing its job. And you've created an anxious universe for your body to live in.

And it's really hard. Every alarm you've got is going off and they should be. And so if you reverse engineer this thing and say, where are places I can begin to get freedom back in my life? So I give my body a fighting chance to have peace. So my body has a fighting chance to not be so anxious. So I have a fighting chance to go do things that I actually want to do. I'm tired of waiting for people.

Yeah. And that will be where you find so-and-so. And you will be the best version of yourself when y'all do meet. I know that's the worst. I know it's the worst. Go pack my bags. No, don't pack your bags. You know what I mean?

Yeah. All right. So what if I did this? What if I did this? So, you know, I work with Dave Ramsey here. What if I gave you a year of Financial Peace University And the EveryDollar app to help you pay off what you owe Would you do it?

That would be amazing Okay, done If I gave you my book, Own Your Past About dealing with your childhood stuff So that you can be a functioning adult Would you read it? Absolutely Done

If I gave you three or four sets of questions for humans So that when you're going out and being weird you could be like hey I got these cards and they'll be they'll they'll either go you're an idiot let's do this which is awesome or they'll be like okay and it'll give you a pass if I give them to you we actually use them I will level my weirdness for you absolutely excellent excellent and then it's just going to be, I can give you some tools, but you just have to go out and be weird and take a risk and go make friends and

get a community and start looking in your life for ways you can not be surrounded by a bunch of clutter and not be surrounded by nobody. Yeah. And let's be honest, that fear you have at the end of it all, that's real. That's real. Yeah. And let's be honest, that fear you have at the end of it all, that's real.

That's real. Yeah. But it's more a symbol. It's a representation of the death of this fantasy you've had since you were a very little girl, which is I'm going to have a family. And I'm going to be at the epicenter. Mike, you probably already have a picture in your head of the Thanksgiving where one of your kids brings home somebody the first time. I mean, I did, but now I'm almost 40.

Oh, so what? Now I'm just a crazy aunt. But that's okay. I know. If you got pregnant right now, they would treat you like you're 1,000 years old or whatever. But here's the deal. Yeah.

I don't think you're done. Can I tell you my mom's story? Have you heard me say that on the show? Bits and pieces. I mean, yes, about her going back to school at... 42. Yep. I mean yes about her going back to school at 42 and I'm trying to figure out a way to surprise her in Oxford this summer and I'm only saying that because this show

will be out by the time I'm gone because she's doing her last year at Oxford this summer at 73 amazing I know but it's not weird she just made some choices one little step after another little step after another little step after another little step. You get one shot at this tiny little reckless crazy life we got.

And you are worth so, so much. Are you in? I'm in. Promise? Let's do it. Yes. All right, if you will take a picture of the people at your first weird little dinner party

that you're gonna throw. Okay. Send it into the show, and we will post it in the show notes. We will all celebrate you. Everyone across America will celebrate you for going to be weird. And look, here's why this is important,

because you're gonna provide people a picture of what it looks like to go out and take a risk let's go and take a risk because you know that being alone is killing you you know that putting up with abuse and toxicity or whatever is going on in your life and i'm not talking to you i'm talking to everybody listen let's kill it let's something different. You're worth so much more. Be right back. This show is sponsored by BetterHelp. October is the season for wearing costumes. And if you haven't started planning your costume, seriously, get on it. I'm pretty sure I'm going to go as Brad Pitt because we have the same upper body, but whatever. Look, it's costume season. And if we're being honest, a lot of us hide our true selves behind masks and costumes more often than we want to. We do this at work. We do this in social settings. We do this around

our own families. We even do this with ourselves. I have been there multiple times in my life, and it's the worst. If you feel like you're stuck hiding your true self behind costumes and masks, I want you to consider talking with a therapist. Therapy is a place where you can learn to accept all the parts of yourself, where you can be honest with yourself and where you can take off the mask and the costumes and learn to live an honest, authentic life. Costumes and masks should be for Halloween parties, not for our emotions and our true selves. If you're considering therapy, I want you to call my friends at BetterHelp. BetterHelp is 100% online therapy. You can talk with your therapist anywhere, so it's convenient

for just about any schedule. You just get online and you fill out a short survey and you'll be matched with a licensed therapist, and you can switch therapist at any time for no additional cost. Take off the costumes and take off the masks with BetterHelp. Visit betterhelp.com slash Deloney to get 10% off your first month. That's BetterHelp, H-E-L-P.com slash Deloney. All right, we're back. Let's go to Manhattan and talk to Omar. What's up, Omar? Dr. Jaloni, how are you? Partying, man. What are you up to? That's not true. I'm at work. What's up, man? I'm off from work today. I took a couple days off. I'm about to take my daughter to a water park for a little celebration of her finishing school this last Friday. Dude, dad of the year, man.

Way to go. That's awesome. Well, give it a couple minutes. Let's see how you feel in about 12 minutes. All right, let's do it. Go for it. All right, man. My wife, deceased wife, we couldn't conceive.

Whoa, you just blew by that. Your wife passed away? Yeah, a long time ago, seven years ago. Yeah, we were married for nine years. She could never conceive. So we did uterine surgery, three cycles of IVF, postpartum depression, modulation of progesterone and estrogen all over the place.

She had a friend who adopted a little girl from China. Guess where this is going? We start the process and 18 months later, we bring home beautiful little 26 month old, our daughter. And then three weeks later, she gets a nosebleed, doesn't stop, computerized tomography. Nine days later, it's already stage two. Within nine months, she goes to be with the Lord. So this was back in 2016. So- Whoa, whoa, whoa, hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on. I need a minute.

You may not need a minute. I need a minute. I've had years. I've had years, Dr. Delaney. I know, but you talk so fast through it. I know you've, you're also running on string and duct tape too. Bro. Bro. Yeah.

What was her name? Her name was Bonnie. Bonnie? And she amazing? And she was gorgeous, beautiful. She loved Christ. I met her in church. I mean, she was.

Was she funny? Tall, green eyes, hilarious. You know, she was wonderful. Is she put up with your nonsense? Yeah, yeah. So she's sainthood, I believe. And I think the purpose of the call is predicated on the image and ideology I have, sir, of living in a way to honor her life through my parenting. You with me?

I'm with you. So I am an accountant. I had just passed the CPA exam. I was working in the city and then stopped everything to take care of her. And then after she passed, never thinking I would have to cash a life insurance check, but I didn't have to go to work. So a mentor of mine told me about a fantastic job as an auditor for the state and the Department of Education with 35 hours, very good, close, edging on six figures. But the point is like 40 days off a year, no nights, no weekends.

So I guess the point of my question is, how do I not resent myself and the career trajectory I have in this 18-year slog, 16-year slog of just sacrificing everything to make these good choices for my daughter? Do you know what I mean? I could go on. There's lots of details. I superfunded her 529. If, you know, God willing, it'll pay for medical school or dental school or business school or wherever she wants to go.

Hey, hey, Omar. Hey. Yes, sir. You've done real well. Thank you. No, no, no. I'm not blowing smoke at you your shoulders are up around your jawbone right now I can feel them drop them real low

you've done a real good job thank you sir that little girl won the cosmic lottery getting you as her dad you haven't heard the jokes. I mean, I think I'm funny, but I appreciate that. You know, I, I, your whole, I mean the whole, the whole thing. Right. And I'm like you, I laugh at inappropriate times. And if you're not laughing at this point, I don't know.

I don't know how you stay sane, right? I do, you know. What's your ethnicity, Omar? Jordanian. My mom was from Germany, and my father was Jordanian. Okay, hold on. So you've got a Germanic Jordanian walking hand-in-hand with a young Chinese girl down Manhattan. Yes. Totally normal, dude.

Totally normal. Right? I mean, the whole thing. Listen, listen. You have done so good. So good. Thank you. Now.

Yeah. Now, listen. Two things that are super common when we lose somebody we love, especially over the long haul. Number one, many of us don't have the tools for that. I can't, I know all the textbooks, all the whatever. If my wife passed away tomorrow, I can honestly tell you I don't know where I would start. You'd get the grace you need.

I know you do. I know you do. But you know where I would end up? I can almost already tell you. I would work like a maniac. And I would try to make sure every variable in my kid's life was sealed up and buttoned up. Because my body would be saying, okay, you're the last one. You're the last one.

You're the last one. What about you? What about you? And I would dedicate my life to buttoning up every variable. You've done that. The second thing that's really hard is you're constantly looking at this beautiful little girl, but that was y'all's dream.

Yes. And so every day is a constant reminder of y'all's dream. And it's really hard to live in the present when every day is kind of got these glimpses of the past with us right yeah i tried i tried to fight moving like because we we bought this starter condo and I paid it off after she passed. So I'm debt free, baby step seven. And, and you know, I didn't want to transplant or buy a big house with a $3,000 a month mortgage payment, sir. Cause then I knew I'd have to work more and that precludes my time with her life skills, discipleship, all that. Okay. Hold on. If you work 90 hours a week and you made a million dollars, okay?

Let's do this thought experiment. You work 90 hours a week. You become one of the top over the last 15 years or seven years. You become one of the top accountants in Manhattan. Everybody goes to Omar. Everybody trusts that guy. He's a good guy. He knows where every last

Loophole is But he's a high person of integrity Everybody goes to Omar And you make about a million dollars a year That money would be for what? What is the profit of man? To gain the world and lose his soul What would that money give you?

It would give you the opportunity. Hold on. But it does give you an opportunity to take care of your daughter, to create safety for your daughter or the illusion of, to at least have her healthcare funded and her med school funded. If that's what she wants to do, it would provide you some cushion for when the world hits you in the mouth, which it will.

Right? So it will, right? So it has, yeah, it has. Well, I mean, I mean, it took an arm and a leg, actually. I mean, you got it more than just a nose punch, but when it comes for you. So I'm not one of these guys, it's like, man, why do you work hard and make money? No, it's a great buffer on the world, but you've been able to accomplish it also. Here's my question for you. Seven years in, how old is this little girl?

Nine months, I mean, nine years, nine years old? She's 10. She just finished fourth grade. Okay, 10 years old. Yeah. 10 years old. You funded her college education through med school, about. You've got no, you owe no money.

You've got a great stable job. If you want to call the state of New York's government stable. Okay. Are you being haunted by the question? Is this enough? Well, I was writing my thoughts down before and waiting for, you know, you were talking with the other lady, Emily i believe yeah that's exactly it like when do i realize a point of satiety in that college private school 529 you know um time with her you have you have to you have to do the hardest part that you've you've probably done it but it's going to be real hard i'm looking forward to her meeting you We're coming, God willing, to Smart Conference

In Chicago? Excellent, man We'll get you backstage Stay on the line and we'll get you backstage You can meet everybody, but I would love to have you there And I'm going to bring her I want to intentionally bring her So that she gets exposed To all the great personalities

As great as they could be other than you I was waiting for you to say it But good for you know, as great as they could be other than you. I was waiting for you to say it, but good for you. All right. Here's what she needs more than anything else right now. She needs her dad. Yeah. Yeah.

And there's not a good, um, I can count money in a bank account. I can count baby steps if I'm a part of the Ramsey pay off your debt plan. I can count dollars in a life insurance payout. It's hard to count this morning when I asked my daughter to stop doing something and she kept doing it and I asked her to stop, but she kept doing it and she dumped water all over the back of my leg and she dropped water all over the floor. And then 30 seconds later, I went over and I was making my breakfast and I said, Hey, will you come over here and crack these eggs for me? And letting her help

was a little glimpse of redemption for her. And it would have been way faster for me to crack my own eggs this morning. But I asked her to come help me. And I asked her to clean up the water that she had spilled. And I looked, I bent down and I looked her right in the eyes and I said, thank you for helping me with my breakfast. I'm really grateful. And then she rolled her eyes almost out the back of her head,

like a seven-year-old and she walked off There is no metric for that But you know what that little girl knows at the cellular level her dad loves her And so behind bias I'm, sorry. No, go ahead. Are you biased about what? Do you think i'm biased because I grew up without a father So i'm trying to not only catch up and honor my deceased wife, but also subconsciously be the dad I never had.

I'm sure that's a bunch of it, but I also think, imagine you got a job at an accounting firm and no one would show you what a prepared tax return looks like. DMS, I'd get fired. Well, they just yell at you Like, go prepare taxes And you're like, what does it look like? And they're like, go prepare taxes And then you go on Instagram, there's like all these beefcakes

And then there's idiots, and there's morons Like, you're Carving a path Through the jungle with a machete And there is no path for you Because you didn't have a dad And so Every step along the way You're having to look to the right or left to see if this is the right way we're supposed to be going. And my fear for you is you're going to have done all the right things.

And you're going to have missed an opportunity to really get to know this beautiful, precious little girl. I don't want to do that. I know. That's the purpose of the call. That's what I want to do that. I know. That's the purpose of the call. That's what I want to tell you. You've done it, man. You've done it. Thanks.

It's amazing. What you're giving your daughter is a real-time picture of what it looks like when all the plans in the world get set on fire overnight. And you're giving your child a real-time picture of what grinding it out over the long haul

making about one-third of your quote-unquote market value in service of this precious little girl and that's really hard when she's like oh my gosh, you don't let me do anything. Right. That's super annoying. Right. And I can imagine that it would be easier to be thinking about an accelerated tax season than talking about periods in the next couple of years or talking about like all that's, that's, that's on you, man. That's all going to be coming. Yeah. And the more you put in the relationship equity on this side of the hard conversations, of the dating, of the being a teenager and the taking the subway by yourself, all those things, which are tiny little rituals that are just y'alls.

You've probably heard me on this show say every Tuesday of my life, I go to breakfast um at waffles and my son i don't miss those days i just don't and if i at the rare moment i have to because i'm out of town at a speaking event or something i'll we make it up that same week but just in the last few weeks we've had some conversations that would not have been possible had we not tilled the soil for the last two years. And so I want you to look around and say, exhale really deeply. Omar, well done. Yeah, I think sometimes

I wait for Christ to say that so when people say it on my own in my own thoughts I think you don't know you don't know what I've been through I know but listen to me and I'm not implying that for you

people confuse me with Christ all the time nobody ever does but listen and this is important I remember I know, I know. People confuse me with Christ all the time. I'm just kidding. Nobody ever does. Nobody ever does. But listen, listen, and this is important. This is important. I remember a speaker, and I have this image that's burning in my mind. It's one of the few times that I walked away.

It was a before and after moment for me. And I believe it was in Haiti, but maybe Rwanda. It was one of the two. And anyway, there was just devastation and devastation and some missionaries showed up and they were trying to be do-gooders and like a weekend kind of thing. And they were going on a tour

where there was just a mass slaughter of people. And there was a monument to the slaughter. And there was a pastor there. And the people asked, one of the people asked the pastor, how do you still believe in God and see all this? And the pastor's response changed the way I live my life. He said, oh man, I stopped asking a long time ago, where's God?

And I started asking, where are God's people? And often when you ask for a sign, it shows up in a neighbor. When you ask for words, yeah, or word you ask for, will you speak to me? Some idiot on a podcast make, right? It's in the homeless person when you walk out off your stoop.

It's in the person, the bus driver, as they smile to you. It's in the homeless person when you walk off your stoop. It's in the person, the bus driver, as they smile to you. It's in the Uber driver there downtown. It's in your exhausted, exhausted boss. It's in that little girl. And so you can white knuckle. You can hold a fist so tight so that this never happens again because you've been through the worst of the worst of the worst. You held the love of your life's hand as she left.

Or you can open your hand and say, come what may, here we go. I've taken care of my daughter. We're good. She's good. And now we're going to spend days at the water park like today. We're going to spend days at the park. We're going to spend days laughing and going to see plays. And we're going to spend days at the water park like today. We're going to spend days at the park. We're going to spend days laughing and going to see plays, and we're going to spend days serving the poor.

We're going to spend days building core memories so that little girl never for a second doubts if her daddy loves her. We're going, God willing, in three weeks to Athens on a short-term missions trip. I'm so excited. Yeah, yeah. For discipleship, you know, to show her, Hey, not everybody goes to a private school. And also, and also, and also, yeah. Yeah.

Hey, your daddy loves you. Well, yeah. Um, yeah, yeah. I got her passport. Yeah. I mean, I know that. No, you keep talking about achievements. Listen, can you blame me? Yes, I can I can Gosh, teaching relationships to accountants is the worst Listen So You can't 10 key this one

But I'm going to give you a 10 key thing for it Okay Yeah, there is no equal sum algorithm on this one Alright, here we go I'm solving for peace, man I'm solving for peace Okay Every day of your life

Twice A day Morning and evening I'm solving for peace man I'm solving for peace Okay Every day of your life Twice A day Morning and evening Say Can I give you a special dad hug And she's gonna say What's that dad And it's when you put your hands

On the side of her face And hold it And she's probably brilliant Like her old man And you can tell her Some weird podcast guy Told me that this helps and look her dead in her eyes and say i am so grateful that god picked me to be your daddy you're wise because that's the gladdest tissue on the cheeks that's exactly right that's exactly right there's a lot of neuroscience behind it, but I leave that to the Hubermans

and the Tias of the world. But listen. Very good, yes. That's right. Put your hands on her face twice a day and look her in the eye and let her know every single day, you are so grateful that you get to be her dad

and she gets to be your daughter. You've done all the stuff, all the metrics. You've done all those stuff, all the metrics. You've done all those things. You got her passport. Good for you. I want you to cherish and love the relationship. Know her.

And I know your body's going to really fight you on it, man, because you did that once. And the world took her. Hard. And it's real, real scary, Omar. But you're in it. You're in it. Go all in.

She won the lottery getting you as her dad, Omar. Man, we'll be right back. Hey, what's up? Deloney here. Listen, you and me and everybody else on the planet has felt anxious or burned out or chronically stressed at some point. In my new book, Building a Non-Anxious Life, you'll learn the six daily choices that you can make

to get rid of your anxious feelings and be able to better respond to whatever life throws at you so you can build a more peaceful, non-anxious life. Get your copy today at johndeloney.com. All right, as we wrap up today's show, Jenna's driving. She loves her some Macklemore and Ryan Lewis. She doesn't get tattoos, though. Actually, you're the only one with real tattoos. That's funny.

Song's called Growing Up. Good grief. Macklemore and Ryan Lewis. Ed and Ed Sheeran. Let's invite everybody. They say boys don't cry, but your dad shed a lot of tears. All right, this is good. That's enough for me.

Is that a good song? Do you like it? Nate Dog picked it. They say boys don't cry, but your dad shed a lot of tears. They say I should be a strong man, but baby, I'm filled with fear. Sometimes I don't know who I am. Sometimes I question why I'm here. I just want to be a good dad.

Will I be? I have no idea. That actually is a good song. That's all me, Nate Dogg. That's a good tune right there. Good job, Macklemore and Ryan and Ed. I think it's a question we all ask. I just want to be a good dad. How do I do that? We'll see you soon.