The Dr. John Delony Show - My Parent’s Divorce Is Ruining My Wedding

Episode Date: August 4, 2023

On today’s show, we hear about: A man worried about planning his wedding around divorced parents A mother wondering how to be present as she grieves the death of her husband A woman wondering if it���s okay to divorce her disabled husband To pre-order John's new book Building a Non-Anxious Life click here. Enter The Ramsey Cash Giveaway for a chance to win $3,000!  https://bit.ly/TDJDSgvwy Let us know what’s going on by leaving a voicemail at 844.693.3291 or visiting johndelony.com/show.  Support Our Sponsors: BetterHelp DreamCloud Hallow Thorne Add products to your cart create an account at checkout Receive 25% off ALL orders Resources: Own Your Past, Change Your Future Questions for Humans Conversation Cards Redefining Anxiety Quick Read John’s Free Guided Meditation Listen to all The Ramsey Network podcasts anytime, anywhere in our app. Download at: https://apple.co/3eN8jNq These platforms contain content, including information provided by guests, that is intended for informational and entertainment purposes only. The content is not intended to replace or substitute for any professional medical, counseling, therapeutic, financial, legal, or other advice. The Lampo Group, LLC d/b/a Ramsey Solutions as well as its affiliates and subsidiaries (including their respective employees, agents and representatives) make no representations or warranties concerning the content and expressly disclaim any and all liability concerning the content including any treatment or action taken by any person following the information offered or provided within or through this show. If you have specific concerns or a situation in which you require professional advice, you should consult with an appropriately trained and qualified professional expert and specialist. If you are having a health or mental health emergency, please call 9-1-1 immediately. Learn more about your ad choices. https://www.megaphone.fm/adchoices Ramsey Solutions Privacy Policy

Coming up on the Dr. John Deloney Show. You know, I come from a split home. Parents split when I was two and then got divorced by the time I was three. And as long as I can remember, it's always been tumultuous. You know, if one person wasn't going to, is going to show up to one of my events growing up, the other person wouldn't show up there. Oh, gosh. So your parents are children. What in the world is going on? This is John with the Dr. John Deloney show.

Show where we talk about your mental health, your emotional health, your marriage, your parenting, who you're dating, whatever's going on with your in-laws. We talk about all of it on this show. So grateful that you're with us. I know you got a lot going on. I know you got a thousand, you got a million voices clamoring for your attention. I'm so grateful that you put your headphones in or you got in the car and you turned this show on and you're going to sit with it. Big news. This is big time. We talked about this on the last show, but I'm going to keep beating this drum for a while. Available to pre-order right now, my brand new book, Building a Non-Anxious Life. When you pre-order this book, it's 20 bucks. That's it.

I'm going to blow you up with bonus items. I'm super hyped as we start rolling them out. It's going to be very, very cool. But it also includes instant access to one of a keynote I gave to a couple thousand people. The book provides six daily choices to overcome an anxious life. It is really my flag on the moon. For those of you who believe the moon landing actually happened,

it's my flag on the moon. It's my stake in the ground to say the way we are dealing with mental health in this country is not working and we got to do something different. So I know it's going to be exciting, but it's a book that will change your life, change your life, wherever you happen to be. This is about real change for real people, not a bunch of theories, not a bunch of nonsense. This is for you and your family. Building a non-anxious life. So go pre-order it right now. Go to johndeloney.com, and they'll have the link there.

Check it out. All right, let's run out to Andrew in Spokane, Washington. What's up, Andrew? Doing pretty good, man. How about yourself? How's life treating you? I would be lying if I said it was anything other than pretty awesome. It's pretty good, man. How about yourself? How's life treating you? I would be lying if I said it was anything other than pretty awesome. It's pretty good right now.

Good. That's great to hear. What about you, man? You know, everything's going pretty good. You know, outside of just some issues going on with family drama, it's rounding, you know, getting married next month. You have family drama? That's weird. I know, I know. So what's up, man? Um, so quick little backstory. Uh, you know, I come from a split home, uh, parents split when I was two, um, and then got divorced by time I was

three. And as long as I can remember, it's always been tumultuous. You know, if one person, uh, wasn't going to, is going to show up to one of my events growing up. The other person wouldn't show up there. Oh gosh. So your parents are children. I don't want to word it that way, but yeah. They're not my mom and dad. So they're elementary school kids. Fine. I'm taking my ball and going home. Good job parents. Way to go. Essentially. Yeah. Essentially. And you know, it's gone through like probably only a handful of moments in my life that I can actually think of that they've been in essentially and you know it's gone through um like probably only a

handful of moments in my life that i can actually think of that they've been in person you know like my high school graduation basic training graduation those type of things um well leading to my uh marriage next month um you know my dad found out that my mom was going to be at the rehearsal dinner and pretty much said outright that he doesn't want to show up to it. And, uh, I mean, seriously, seriously, he is opting out. Gosh, that's so heartbreaking, man. Like I'm making a joke, but I'm heartbroken for you. I'm sorry. It's difficult, you know, cause me and him do have a good relationship overall. And, uh, but my fiance and I were just discussing like, what's going to happen in the future when we start having kids and trying to plan birthdays around them and those types of things. And, um, and so we tried to discuss it with them, you know,

we've, um, called them and immediately he got defensive, you know, saying that we never stand up for him. Um, and he has a lot of times in his life where he doesn't have the best relationship with friends or family, you know, and it's, uh, it's been pretty difficult and we didn't know if it was right for us to confront him and talk to him about it. Um, but yeah, we just don't really know how to go forward with it. You know, it's been pretty difficult. Yeah. So here's the language I would use. I would say, um, dad, this is my wedding and I'm inviting all of my parents. If you choose to not come, it will break my heart, but you're a grown man and you get to make that choice.

I hope to see you there. And that's the end of the conversation. Anytime he starts with the, nobody ever sticks up for me. You guys have always said, dad, I'm not going to continue down this road. And what you're going to start doing is practicing putting your own two feet underneath you because you're now building your own home and you're building your own legacy in your own trajectory ideally it would be part he would be a part of that and for reason, the whole world's out to get him and he can't see the forest from the trees and he can't make hard choices through his own discomfort for

a, in service of a larger picture. And I hate that for you. I hate that for your kids. When you have kids, it will be the birthday party will be here. Everyone's invited. If you choose to not come because mom came, or if you choose to not come because dad came, you're a grownup and I can't make you be here, but it will break my heart if you don't want to be around my child. And that's it. You have no other role to play. Your job isn't to make him feel okay about himself. He's a grown, I mean, he's your dad. That's his job.

Tell me why that sounds, why that's hard. Well, you know, I try to come from, from understanding cause he did have a lot of trauma growing up. You know, there's a lot of things that he's gone through too.

But hold on, hold on. That was then. And this is now. Yeah. And if he's going to continue to let what happened when he was a child drive the car through adulthood, through grandparenthood, then he is choosing to not be a part of his son's life and his grandkids' life. Yeah. It's a context, not an excuse.

Yes, his childhood was hell. I'll give him that. That doesn't give him license to kick and scream like a child all through his 50s and 60s and 70s to the point that it impacts his kids, his son's new marriage, his grandkids, and on and on into the future. That's how family dysfunction continues from generation to generation. And you, my friend, are being the strong one to say, this stops with me. Yeah. Because your childhood was hard too, right? Yeah, you know, I mean, I was blessed with at least having two parents that loved me, you know?

So I try not to dwell on it too much, but you know, it was definitely difficult. It was hard. It was hard. I'll dwell on it for you. You don't have to. And by the way, when you have a little one, it will come screaming back at you. So just be ready.

But I will, just you'll remember this moment. You'll be like, oh, that's what that idiot on the podcast was talking about. But I'll tell you, it'll come for you. And that's all good. That's why you're going to have a great marriage. You're going to work hard on having a strong marriage. You're going to have some men in your life that you hang out with and do life with. So when this stuff comes um when those childhood

memories come running back especially when you're holding your own kids um you will you'll be absorbed you'll be able to absorb it right it'll become part of your life won't be something you have to run from and right now your dad's still running and here's the scary sucky crappy part you can't fight that fight for him yeah Yeah. What you can do is set boundaries that will help you have a whole marriage, help you be the best dad you can be to help your kids be whole. And a lot of that's going to come with some grief, man, because you're going to have to sit with a broken heart, wondering why your dad's dislike for his ex-wife is greater than his love for his son. And that just hurts, man.

Yeah, yeah. It's something, you know, that's exactly how I've worded it, you know, and it's something I felt for a long time. And yeah, you know, like you said, I just have to try to continue to do better and make sure it stops here. I wouldn't say just try to do better. I want you to hear me say you're good enough as you are. You're a good man.

I think it's a matter of continuing to ask yourself, what's the best way I can love my wife? What's the best way I can honor her husband, which is Andrew? What's the best way I can love and honor my kids? What's the best way I can serve and honor and love my community, my workplace, my God, whatever things are in the foundation of your life? But I think you're doing a pretty good job. The fact you're even asking these questions and considering drawing some of these boundaries tells me you're way down the road, man. It's impressive.

Well, Austin, I really appreciate that. Thank you so much. Boundaries tells me you're way down the road, man. It's impressive. Awesome. I really appreciate that. Thank you so much. So here, again, just to reiterate, my conversation would be with my wife and, Mark, your fiance. You're about to be married in a month. And congratulations, by the way, I'm speaking super clearly today. I think I've had 700 milligrams of caffeine so far today, and my tongue is moving faster than my brain.

You sounded like Scooby-Doo. I think I usually do. Minus the edibles or whatever. He was always on, right? I don't know what Scooby was taking, but sorry. That was Shaggy. Oh, Shaggy, his owner. I think they were both a little complicit.

But back to Andrew. Back to Andrew. I'm a little bit distracted today. And I want you to sit down with your wife and say, hey, who do we want to become? And what kind of home do we want to have? And that hopefully that home includes warmth and that home includes peace

because your home should be a safe place where you and your spouse and your kids and your friends and your loved ones gather as a shelter for the storm that is the madness of the outside world. And if family members bring chaos into that peace and into that warmth, then they are opting out. And so sit down with your fiance, with your wife and say, what do we want this to look like? What do we want these boundaries to be? And then begin practicing saying, hey, dad, this is my wedding. And so I'm inviting everybody. And if you choose not to come, it's going to break my heart, but I respect your right to make that choice. If you choose to not be around our grandkids,

just because your ex-wife is there, you choose your hatred or your anger more than you choose your grandkid. I hate that, but you get to do that. And I'll sit in that grief, but I'm not going to budge on my boundaries because I'm expanding love here. I'm not trying to constrict. Andrew, hang on the line. I'm going to send you a copy of both Own Your Past, Change Your Future and my brand new book, Building a Non-Anxious Life as Wedding Gifts. Nothing says I love you like a couple of books about emotional and mental health, right? And I'm going to send you both couples decks so that you and your brand new wife will have something to do for the first month or two of your marriage.

Or maybe longer, maybe more. Congratulations, my brother. We'll be right back. All right, let's go out to San Fran, California and talk to Marjorie. What's up, Marjorie? Hey, Dr. John. What's up?

Oh, nothing much. Just putting my business out there for millions of viewers to hear. Hey, man, listen, listen. Nobody listens to this show, Marjorie. You know that. It's true. Nobody listens to this show. Hey, I do. There's going to be dozens of people. Dozens. Dozens. So what up? How can I help?

So thank you for taking my call. Of course. So my question is, how do I emotionally be there for my daughter while I'm going through grief? And the back story is my husband passed away back in April. And so— What was his name? His name was Adam. Adam?

Yeah. He was all right? He was all right. We had a rocky marriage. He was in— he was an addict. And so, um, we were separated for the four years that we were married. And so it was kind of, uh, I guess, uh, I was grieving through the whole ordeal. How did he pass away? I'm not sure yet.

I'm still waiting for the coroner to release the information. I'm so sorry. That's so recent. Yeah. Man. How old is your baby girl? She's three. Three?

Did she know dad? Or was there a lot of separation? Both. She knew him, but, um, you know, there was kind of, um, a lot of separation, but she knows, you know, she sees pictures and stuff. She knows that's her dad. Yeah. Man. So what does grief look like for you these days? A lot of not wanting to do much. Yeah.

And a lot of kind of circular thinking and not being motivated to do things. Are you working right now? Yeah. Where do you work? I am an urban farmer. No way. For real? You like sell like vegetables and stuff?

Yeah. Yeah. What else do you sell? That's just produce. Produce. Awesome. Yeah. And you do that year round? No, we don't do it year round. Just mostly during the summer the off seasons we kind of just are getting ready

for the harvest season pretty much okay so here's the hard part is as a single mom you got to pay your bills.

You got to work. You got to make sure your insurance is paid up. You got to make sure the lights stay on. You got to make sure that baby girl's got food. Yeah. And you have to honor your body in this season when it just wants to be quiet for a while. And so it's a both and. You have to honor your body in this season when it just wants to be quiet for a while.

And so it's a both and. What you're going to have to do, I would say the most important thing, and I'll give you a list of a couple of things that I think would be really good just to have checkoffs on a note card every day. I'll give you those things. But you're going to have to switch your anger and frustration and disgust that you have with Marjorie and change that to curiosity. Okay? Because you get really mad at Marjorie when she don't want to get up and go work out

or she don't want to get up and go do whatever. Fair? Yeah. Yeah. You got to let her off the hook for a minute, man. The love of her life died the love of her life died and when you're in love with somebody who really struggles with addiction

you know this day is coming and you constantly ask yourself what you should have done and what you could have done and so the shame cycle gets worse and worse, right? Right. You got to let Marjorie off the hook, man.

Marjorie did everything she could. Marjorie loved that man to the moon and back. Even when she couldn't even be in the same house with him because he wasn't safe. Right. So when Marjorie's body says, hey, we're laying right here today, if you got to go to work, you got to go to work. But I want you to honor yourself, okay? Okay.

Now, here's a path out, not for suddenly feeling a million times better. Anybody who's selling you that is selling you snake oil, okay? Don't do that. But here's the path out. The path out is having a note card that you fill out the night before the next day. And on that note card, it's going to say a couple of simple things. the next day. And on that note card,

it's going to say a couple of simple things. One of them is movement. You got to move. That can be taking your baby girl on a walk, in a stroller, that can be taking her to a park, but you got to move. And the second one is you got to get sunshine.

You live in San Francisco, that shouldn't be too difficult. And you're going to, but it's going to mean just for a few minutes, you got to get up and get outside. Okay. This is, this is those moments when I don't care what you feel. I want you to just practice the discipline of, I am going to move today. I am going to go outside and get some sunlight and have a cup of coffee outside. The third thing is you cannot do this season by yourself. Do you have some women in your life that you can reach out to, that you can talk to? Yeah, I have a few. I would love it, love it, love it if you had a once a week morning breakfast or a morning coffee.

One of your friends came over to your house. Or you went to theirs and brought knucklehead three-year-old with you. And what will slowly happen over days and weeks and months is the light comes back on a little bit. You're always going to love that guy. And you're always going to be heartbroken. How are you notified that he passed? Someone I was living with told me.

Can I tell you one more thing? Help me. Okay. Whew. Can I tell you one more thing? Yeah. Often when we lose somebody that we love, especially somebody who is hurting or somebody who got in a car wreck or somebody who was struggling with addiction, our brain locks in on the hurt and pain they were feeling as though at the time of the wreck, at the time of the assault, at the time of addiction, using.

And I want you to hear me say now that Adam's at peace. You're not hurting anymore. And for somebody who loved him for as long as you did, that was the dream, right? Is that he would stop hurting. You want him to stop hurting and be with you. Yes. Correct.

But it's easy to remember how much he was hurting and to get locked in there. Bro's at peace now. Adam's at peace. And hopefully over the next few weeks, next few months, you can... Have you written him a letter yet?

No. Alright, that's your last assignment. We're going to get a note card. It's going to say move. It's going to say outside. It's going to say contact a friend. It's going to say eat. You got to make sure you're eating. Are you skipping meals?

More meals than I should. Okay. We're going to be a good steward of Marjorie. Okay. And by the way, if you eat a few, if you gain a few pounds over the next few months, it's all good with me. Okay. I want you to write three letters. If you gain a few pounds over the next few months, it's all good with me. Okay? I want you to write three letters. Okay?

Here's letter number one. Letter number one is how much you miss Adam. Dear Adam, I miss you. Tell him what you miss and be specific. I miss your laugh. I miss when you were sober and clear-eyed, how much you loved me. I miss how funny you were, all that.

Letter number two is, Dear Adam, I'm so angry I can't breathe. And let him have it. Write down on paper how much you tried, how you went to the ends of the earth, how he cheated on you, how he did this, how he did this, how he did this. Write all that down. The third note, the third letter is,

Dear Adam, here's who I'm going to become. I want you to tell him what kind of mom you're going to be to his baby girl. I want you to tell him what kind of mom and woman you're going to be, what kind of business owner you're going to be. Start to write down the plans. Okay. Don't do these all on the same day. Maybe take a break between them. And if it gets really tough get a counselor okay good but I want to get some of this some of these spinning thoughts like you mentioned

the loops I want to get them out of my head and out of my body and onto some paper so I can look at them okay okay okay

if you're a real gangster a real San Fran gangster when one of your friends comes over for coffee I want you to say hey I wrote a letter to Adam can I read it for you and I want you to read it in front of somebody else if you're just a regular gangster

then you can read it in front of a counselor but saying these things out loud is really really important getting them out of your really, really important. Getting them out of your body is super important, but also reading them. So make a note card every night. There's a practice to this. There's a commitment to this, writing it down.

And don't just put it in your phone, on your notes app. Write it down on a note card the night before. Wake up that day and just commit to doing those four or five things. And then give your body peace give your body peace there will come a time in the next few months when maybe you don't want to be an urban farmer anymore maybe you want to move maybe you want to do some other things awesome let those things come and that's why you'll have a group of women you can bounce some of these ideas off of you can dream with you can think with, get some encouragement or some insights or some wisdom from. But man, you're still flat in the thick of it, man. I'm so sorry that you lost the love of your life.

We'll be grieving with you, Marjorie. Thank you so much for the call. Thanks for being brave. That little baby's lucky to have you. We'll be right back. This show is sponsored by BetterHelp. October is the season for wearing costumes. And if you haven't started planning your costume, seriously, get on it. I'm pretty sure I'm going to go as Brad Pitt because we have the same upper body, but whatever.

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Take off the costumes and take off the masks with BetterHelp. Visit BetterHelp.com slash Deloney to get 10% off your first month. That's BetterHelp, H-E-L-P dot com slash Deloney. All right, let's go out to Denver, Colorado and talk to the great Diane. What's up, Diane? Hey, John Deloney. How are you? I'm so good. How about you? Good. What's up? So I have got a kind of moral, ethical dilemma going on in my personal life. And I have a son-in-law and daughter who listen frequently. And he said, you know who you need to ask is Dr. John Deloney.

So here we are. Here we are. I'm not a very moral or ethical person. So just so you know. Well, I have listened to you enough to know that is not true. So I'm not a very moral or ethical person, so just so you know. Well, I have listened to you enough to know that is not true. So I'm going to kind of lay it all out there. It's a kind of a long story. I'm going to make it as brief as I can because it's been a long few years. So five years ago, first of all, I'm 49 years old. I'm married for 30 years

to just the most amazing man. We have eight incredible kids. And, um, five years ago, we took the kids up to the mountains about three hours away from home, went mountain biking, and he was in. He crashed his bike, very, very severely suffered a traumatic brain injury that almost killed him. We spent two months in local hospitals, five brain surgeries, had half of his skull removed, coma, you know, all the everything, just horrible couple of months. He regained consciousness enough that they accepted him to a rehab hospital eight hours away. They said for two months, we'll do rehab and do the best that we can. So I packed up, left my kids with family members and I went to this rehab hospital for two months and that two-month stay due to a very serious stroke and seizures turned into a seven-month stay and we finally got to go home.

He came home with a trach in, a feeding tube in his stomach. I had to learn how to put a catheter in. I learned how to take care of him so we could bring him home. I had so much faith, John, the whole time he would be healed. I just, I knew it. And I'm a religious person and we had so much faith and we worked so hard. I knew he would be, he would get better, at least better enough that we could carry on a conversation with him. He would be somewhat himself. And over the next two years of having him at home, it was a lot of work. And he just never really got better. He did learn to walk again.

We taught him to walk. But ultimately, his injuries are, he lost hearing. He's completely deaf. Um, and he has no short-term memory. So we can't even teach him sign language because he can't learn new things. He knows my kids. He knows anything that happened 10 years ago or more, but anything that's happened about two years before the accident and anything current, he has no idea. He doesn't remember he's had three kids get married. He has grandkids. I have an eight-year-old. He was kind of our surprise baby. He knows that he has an eight-year-old, but doesn't really know him. He forgets their names sometimes.

He has no concept of space or time or age or distance. All of that part of his brain was damaged. and two years ago, I decided for the sake of my kids' lives moving on and mine that I needed to put him into a facility. So he's in an assisted living facility just a few miles from home. We go see him all the time. A couple months after we put him in that facility, we made some medical decisions, decided it was time to let him go. And we put him on hospice and thought the time would come that he would pass. And it's been almost two years. And despite all medical odds, science, everything, he's still with us. Pretty much no quality of life. We've prepared ourselves to let him go so many times when it

looked like everything was heading that direction, and he's still with us, and it's just been so hard to know how to move on. Through this process, I got my master's degree. I went back to school. I was recently become an LCPC, so I'm able to work now and provide for my family. So my question is, sorry that took so long, but here's my question. Hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on before you ask your question. Okay. Can I just sit with you in that for a minute? Yeah. That's so so so much

it's a lot and that is just the tip of the iceberg this could be a whole Hollywood movie that would last 10 hours so my oldest best friend on planet earth is a traumatic brain survivor

and um when I'm with him now and we go out I still have to help him go to the bathroom still have to have people take care of him and help him and

I can't imagine going up 100x that with building a life with somebody because it changes everything right oh man changes the way you breathe yep 100x that with building a life with somebody. Because it changes everything, right? Oh, man. Changes the way you breathe. Yep. And my guess is, as a mom of eight,

you've been solving and fixing for five years. Yeah, I have been. And then you went and got a freaking master's degree. Like, at some point. I know. Have you exhaled? You know, after about year one, I did, and I still had so much hope and so much faith. And we would work with him every day, work on walking, work on brain stuff. Like don't let him just sit

in front of the TV. Like we got to work with him. It's going to get better. It's going to get better. And then after about year three, I just really had to shift my thinking that this isn't going to turn out how I thought it would. Um, so we, we've, we've come to peace with it. In fact, we've come, we came to so much peace with him passing. That is what we've been praying for for the last two years, that it would be better for him. I mean, you know, you talk about your friend and how that is with him. My husband is the same way. He would be humiliated to see what he has become. This is not what he would want. It's not, this is not the kind of life. I mean, he,

if he had his right sense, he would say, why didn't you just let me go three years ago? Why did you keep me alive? And I listened to your last caller and it breaks my heart, the loss that she feels. And do you know what I'm thinking is, why can't I be one of the people whose husbands get to pass? I'm in the position where I'm jealous of women whose husbands just get to go peacefully and don't have to live through this pain and agony that my family lives through every day. I'm so sorry. Yeah, sorry. Because you're right. You're right.

Hold on, you don't have to make me feel better. You do that too much to everybody around you. When you finally get a glimpse, they finally get a little peek behind the curtain and they realize how much you're hurting, you have become so accustomed to making sure everybody around you feels okay. And at least for these few minutes, that's not your job with me.

I get to be sad that in the effort to save somebody's life, yet again, we got so sophisticated with our medical care that we have put families in these positions. And I'm sorry. So what's your dilemma question? Okay. So I recently, um, one of my husband's old friends that I didn't know before we knew each other

reached out. I had a caring bridge account, you know, Facebook, I kind of would keep friends and family up to date and I haven't posted anything for a really long time. So he just reached out and said, how's he doing? How's the family doing? So I responded and we kind of struck up this friendship. Oh no, no, Diane. No, no, no, no. Listen, it does not go where you think it's going. That's my dilemma, but it was just nice.

It was nice to have somebody talk to me on that level. It was nice to have somebody check in at night saying, how are you doing? He's divorced. So he's single, but I'm married and I promised you it has not gone anywhere. You know what I mean? It just- Listen to me. Listen to me. You're not crazy. You're not a bad person. Okay. Okay. Here's my question. Okay. It's, this is, it's kind of a doozy. There's no doozies on the show. Go for it. I am considering getting a divorce so that I can move on with my life. Okay.

Nothing with my relationship with my husband would change. One thing I didn't say about his, um, you know, kind of his personality is he, he's very apathetic. He doesn't care about anything. I walk in, he smiles at me. I could tell him his kids took his truck and wrecked it or whatever. He wouldn't care. He doesn't really care. And just this little encounter I've had with this man made me start to really question, yeah, absolutely. Like, would it be so bad if I divorced him just for the sake of getting my feet out of the concrete. I feel like I'm stuck in and start to imagine a future because for so long, we thought he's going to pass any day, any day, any day, any day. And we've lived thinking he's going to pass. And now I'm thinking he could live another 10 or 20 years. Like his heart and lungs are pretty dang good. His brain's pretty shot, but he could live a long time like this.

And what does that mean for me and my kids? It sounds like in all of the, if I was to distill down, well, let me say this. I want to be careful how I do this because I don't want anyone listening to this to think this is the right path for somebody who's having this conversation. Okay. So I am collapsing what would be a long time of you and I getting to know each other and hanging out and me getting to hear all the stories and developing a relationship with you before I started asking you these questions, okay? You know more than anybody else listening how awful and thoughtless and dumb and just stitched into pillows the sayings you get lobbed at you all the time, right?

You've got that for five years, okay? Right. So I don't want to contribute to that, but at the same time, for the sake of this, I've got to, I've got to expedite a lot of this. Okay. So this is just you and me, same side of the same side of the booth, just figuring this out. Okay. Actually, I'm not really the same side of the booth kind of guy. So we're looking across from the booth at each other. It sounds like through all of your prayers, the chief prayer over all has been, I want this to be exactly as I want it. I want this to,

the outcome of this to be exactly what I want it to be. And wrestling with praying for, and I've done this, praying for someone that I love to go ahead and pass, and then they don't. And then I have the guilt that I prayed for them to die. And I can't breathe. And then I go through these like, well,

I guess they're here to teach me something, as though that's their job. It just never stops. It never stops. Right. Something I'm supposed to get out of this. There's still something, right? It just, it just, it never stops. It never stops. Right. Right. Something I'm supposed to get out of this. There's still something I'm supposed to learn.

That's right. I guess you said it best earlier. It's, there's a coming to terms with the fact that all the things you've prayed for the last five years, many of them have come true. They just haven't come true in the ways that you wanted them to. Yeah. And the great challenge of just being alive is dealing with that gap of what we wanted versus what we get, what I thought this would look like versus reality. And that's the worst. That's grief, right? That's the black hole. And so going back to what you said, this is for you. I would suggest you're not crazy.

I can't imagine how alive you must feel to have somebody check in on you, who also might be a little bit cute. I cannot imagine how lonely it is not being intimate with somebody when they're right there all of it all of it but just from the few minutes I've heard you on the phone I'm trying to project out a year from now would you be able to breathe this isn't a judgment question at all. This is a curious question. This is me just asking Diane. If I were to divorce him, would I be able to breathe? Is that what you're asking me?

I think I would. I don't foresee that me getting a divorce would change anything with him. It has nothing to do with him. It has nothing to do with him. I would still. Has nothing to do with him. Has nothing to do with him. It has to do with you saying for sickness and in health. Right. I know he won't know up from down.

Day one from day seven. He won't know. You will. And so as terms of your covenant, like this idea, and again, I use that word intentionally and I'm not even using it in a religious context. I'm just saying there's so few forevers anymore in our culture. If you say, no, no, no, I'm in forever and then I don't have to look Diane in the mirror. You do. So if it's like, yeah, no, I've done, I've done my duty. And if my husband was alive today, nobody knows him like me. It's been 30 years together. Um, he would be saying, what are you doing? Go hook up with

one of my greatest friends. Yes. At least you'd be taken care of. Um, Or if you say, I'm going to figure out how to feel alive and be alive inside of the parameters of life, inside of this deck of cards, this hand of cards that life has dealt me. Because I said forever. I guess at the end of the day, I can't let you off the hook either way. Yeah. I can tell you what I would do, but I don't think that's helpful here. And I can't let you off the hook either way. Yeah. I can tell you what I would do, but I don't think that's helpful here. And I can also tell you, telling you what I would do right now on this side of this thing actually happening probably isn't even true. Yeah, this is not something I, in fact, people started asking me early on, you know, would you have, you know, have you thought about divorcing him? What did you, and I just was like, absolutely not. Like that is a ridiculous idea. And it's just been long enough. I know if it were, if the roles were reversed, knowing what I know now,

I would tell him, go find somebody, go find somebody to be with and be happy with. And one thing, you know, I am a religious person. I've talked a lot about prayer and faith. And my religion, my husband and I were married in our temple. And we were married for what we call time and all eternity. And so one thing I know is if I were divorced from him, it would separate us for this life. But I know and fully intend on living with him in the next life forever. in my religion that some man would be very cautious to even date me knowing that I have been sealed to my husband because that would mean that whatever marriage we have here would not extend beyond this life, if that makes sense. Just, you know, kind of as a frame of reference

for where I am at. Sure. i i mean i don't have any reference point for your religious background but i would say based on what you just said if there is a if this is a cosmic linkage if this is a forever together what's the rush if you truly believe that and I do and I know everything is going to work out I know God's got a plan and in the end it's going to be great

I don't like it and I can't help but think with 30 more years in me in this life would it you know is this idea of finding somebody to have some companionship with for the next 20, 30 years? I know where I can tell what you're thinking. Can you tell that?

Yeah, you don't know what I'm thinking. You don't know what I'm thinking. I'm thinking how hard this is. And ultimately, my biggest, you know, I've got an eight-year-old, like I said. My next oldest is 16, and I've got older kids out of the house. And he is my biggest concern at this point is this eight-year-old that I have still at home and in no way would I ever do anything that would you know make life harder for him or jeopardize my relationship with him for sure well, not a judgment question, but just a question, question, curiosity question.

Mm-hmm. Would you be showing that eight-year-old that there is a boundary to forever? There comes a day when mom moves on. What do you think? I don't know. That's a tough one. I guess I'll – I'm not going to give you the satisfaction of telling you what I really think. Just give me permission, John.

No chance. Just tell me what I want to hear. Nobody ever does. No. I hear a woman who deeply loves her husband. I hear a woman who has not yet opened her hands up to the fact that you can't control any of this. And every step of the way, you're continuing to control, continue to try to control and continue to try to control even to the point that you got everybody together to plan for the end that you don't get to decide and so

there's no possible way i'm going to sit in judgment of you on any decision that you make i do believe that you get to choose to feel alive and to be alive in whatever context you find. I also believe that for sickness and in health and covenant, I don't know still means something and I'm trying to think of what my life

would be like dating Diane who's like no no no I still love this guy I'm linked cosmically forever to this guy I'm still gonna go take care of him every week I just needed some cover so you and I could hook up there are certainly men that will take you up on that take care of him every week. I just needed some cover so you and I could hook up.

There are certainly men that will take you up on that. I've talked to a couple of friends and that's what I said. Like, say I go ahead and do this. Like what guy in his right mind? There'll be a line of them, Diane. There's a bunch of shady people out there. No, they'll be there. They'll be there.

They'll be there, no question. But it all comes back to you. It comes back to you. And just talking to you, like you're exhausted. And every plan you've made along the way for the last five years has not worked out as you wanted it to. And so your next option to try to control what happens next is what it sounds like to me to violate one of your core tenets, one of your core beliefs religiously, one of your core beliefs in love, because you're real lonely and you're real lonely. And you're really exhausted.

But again, it looks like yet another attempt to control what happens next. Because you've been out of control for five years. And I would suggest before you go file for divorce, you spend some time with open hands. And fully leaning into, probably with your kids too. I don't control any of the outcomes now. And I'm going to stop racing and seeking to try to find another outcome that I can control. And God almighty, yes, it feels good when people reach out. That feels good when you've been married and you're happily married. it feels good when somebody reaches out and tells you they miss you or they

like you or checking in on you i would tell you to take a break take a break from visiting for a bit take a break from the divorce conversation for a bit take a break from talking to this visiting for a bit, take a break from the divorce conversation for a bit, take a break from talking to this guy for a bit. And maybe your prayer switches from, okay, what about this? Okay, what about this? Okay, what about this? And instead your prayer switches to,

I've got no control and I've got no power. Please lead me into what comes next. And again, I don't know your faith tradition. I don't know your religious tradition. I know you've been trying to control stuff for a long, long time. So sorry, I can't give you my truest, deepest thoughts on this one.

What I can tell you is, unhook all the brakes and just sit for a minute. Maybe talk to your kids. Maybe get some wisdom from your friends. But seek to be alive outside of some new romantic relationship for just a friends. But seek to be alive outside of some new romantic relationship for just a minute. Seek to be at peace.

Seek to open your hands and say, okay, I control nothing. Get me through tomorrow. And really dig in on the promises that you made for forever. Because you're the one that made them. And if you make this other choice, you're going to be the one that breaks them. And Diane's going to have to live with Diane. Thank you so much. I'm so grateful for your bravery. You're awesome. Call

anytime. We'll be right back. Hey, what's up? Deloney here. Listen, you and me and everybody else on the planet has felt anxious or burned out or chronically stressed at some point. In my new book, Building a Non-Anxious Life, you'll learn the six daily choices that you can make to get rid of your anxious feelings and be able to better respond to whatever life throws at you so you can build a more peaceful, non-anxious life.

Get your copy today at johndeloney.com. All right, we're back. As we wrap up this show, man, this last call cost a lot of back and forth with the studio back here. Yeah. And Kelly, you brought up some great points about I was locked in here. And let me tell everybody listening, I was locked into this caller and I was running through my head in real time

some conversations I've had over the last 20 years with folks in similar situations. And I just didn't feel it was appropriate to bring them into this without asking their permission. So I didn't. Just knowing I've sat with people and given like, I think you should do this next. I didn't feel that was right've sat with people and given like, I think you should do this next. I didn't feel that was right here just because they were on the phone. But you

brought up some important things like if you divorce somebody, do you lose the right to visitation? How do you split up assets? Is that even, you know, what are the legal ramifications? How does it go? I mean, that causes all kind of other mess that, I mean, you have to sit down with a lawyer, obviously, and figure all that mess out. Yeah. I mean, that causes all kind of other mess that, I mean, you have to sit down with a lawyer, obviously, and figure all that mess out. Yeah. I mean, we were just wondering as we were talking here because, like, I know there's certain states you can't divorce a pregnant woman. So is there any reason you couldn't divorce somebody that's impaired? Maybe not.

I don't know. But also then if you divorce, does the care then fall to his children? Does that put that on them? Because I know that she's got adult children as his heirs. Does it roll up to medicaid yeah how does that where does that does that would she lose her rights to make all those decisions for him because i'm assuming now you know she's got that right as his next of kin so there's in addition to the gosh the like man i just want a life part of it but there there's also the, like you said, the spiritual part. And then the legality.

The moral and ethical part and the legal part. I mean, there's so many. I know she probably feels like damned if she does and damned if she doesn't. You are. I think there's 100%. Yeah. And I just feel for her. That's just a horrible situation to be in on so many fronts.

Yeah. to be in on so many fronts. Yeah, I go back to, I was talking with a psychologist once and was really pushing me. It was a famous psychologist. I won't give his name out, but it was a famous psychologist that we were engaged in a pretty heady one-on-one and it got heavier and heavier

and he kept digging into my marriage and digging into my marriage and digging into my marriage. And I was giving him all of my surface answers as to why my wife and I have stayed together over, we'll celebrate 21 years next, next, next week. And, um, especially when there was times when it got real gnarly, right? Like we had grown up conversations about, are we going to keep doing this? And it, he kept pushing and pushing. And finally it popped out of my mouth. It's, he was like, but why, but why,

but why? And finally I said, cause I, cause I said I would. And I landed on this. I didn't say unless dot, dot, dot. I didn't say there's an end to this. I said I would, no matter how stupid and how dumb. I said I would. And that sentence, that covenant that I promise you till the end of time was what kept bringing me back to the table. As frustrated as I was, as lonely as all those things, I said I would. And I can't, I cannot stress how grateful I am that I had that, that I anchored myself to that sentence because the easy thing would have been just to be like, hey, what's the cool Hollywood saying?

This relationship has run its course, which I think is the most BS. Conscience uncoupling? Conscience uncoupling. Well, conscience uncoupling is just like, if we're going to get divorced, let's be grownups about it. But like the, just this relationship just ran its course.

No, that means one of y'all quit driving. One of y'all took your foot off the gas. And you can do that. I just don't buy that that happens inevitably. That's when somebody

makes that choice. And I'm just so grateful that I anchored myself to because I said I would. And I just think as a culture, we just have stopped buying into that. So that's tough.

That's tough. That's tough. That's tough. That's tough. That's tough. That's tough. That's tough. So I don't know. I'm gonna end today's show with, I don't know.

And I'm sure the YouTube commenters will have plenty to say. I love you guys. Stay in school. Don't do drugs. See you later. Bye.