The Dr. John Delony Show - My Wife and I Don’t Agree on Our Son’s Education

Episode Date: March 24, 2025

On today’s episode, we hear about: ·      A couple who disagrees about whether to homeschool their kid ·      A woman who’s unsure how to support her friend who just lost her spouse ·      A father who’s struggling to enjoy parenting small children Next Steps: 📞 Ask John a question! Call 844-693-3291 or send us a message. 📚 Building a Non-Anxious Life 📝 Anxiety Test  📚 Own Your Past, Change Your Future  ❓ Questions for Humans Conversation Cards  💭 John's Free Guided Meditation  🤘🏼 The Dr. John Delony Show Merch Connect With Our Sponsors: 🌱 Get 10% off your first month of BetterHelp. 🔴 Get 15% off with code DELONY at Bon Charge. 🌿 Get up to 40% off with code DELONY at Cozy Earth.  🔒 Get 20% off when you join DeleteMe. 😇 Go to Hallow for a 90-day free trial. 💤 Visit Helix Sleep for special offers! 🥤 Get 20% off with code DELONY at Organifi.  💪 Get 25% off your order at Thorne.  🏋️ Go to Trainwell to get started! Explore More From Ramsey Network: 🎙️ The Ramsey Show 💸 The Ramsey Show Highlights   🍸 Smart Money Happy Hour 💡 The Rachel Cruze Show 💰 George Kamel 🪑 Front Row Seat with Ken Coleman 📈 EntreLeadership   Ramsey Solutions Privacy Policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I'm trying to figure out how my wife and I can agree on whether or not to homeschool our son. He's two right now and the reason we're talking about this is because it will determine whether he goes to preschool or not. We can talk about the merits and all that of homeschooling versus public school and private school. We can talk about all that, but. What in the world's going on? This is John with the Dr. John Deloney Show.

Man, I hope you're doing well. Talking about your relationships, your mental and emotional health. I hope you're doing well. And on this show, here's the deal. I hope you're doing well, but I know for many of us, just a tough season, man. And things are hard and things are up and they're down. And that's what this show's about. Sitting with people, trying to figure out

what's the next right move. I would love to have you on this show. So if you want to join us, man, give me a buzz at 1-844-693-3291 or go to johndoloney.com slash ask. And I feel like I got to shout it out. There's this rad dude who came out in the lobby. It may be four degrees outside. It's February when we're recording this show.

And he is just straight up like a gangster wearing cargo pants, shorts, cargo shorts, the way Limp Bizkit designed them. Well done, my brother. Well done. There's another guy here dressed respectable like with a button up shirt, like he has a job and everything. But homies just straight up rocking cargos and a dude man after my own heart. I got some new origin pants that are like four sizes too big and I feel like I'm back in high school again

and it's everything in the world is right except for the way Kelly looks at me with disdain. All right let's go out to Manchester and talk to Ben. What's up Ben? Hey John, how are you? Dude I'm doing great brother. How are you man? Good I want you to know that you do have friends in New Hampshire and I am one of them. Dude I've got one in New Hampshire and I am one of them. Dude, I've got one in New Hampshire. That's fantastic. I used to teach high school geography and I don't know that I could point out New Hampshire on the map. That's embarrassing, Kelly. See, she goes with her judgy face. I know it's up there. I know it's up that way. Yes. Yep, it is. And I also wanted to say thank you. I know you get a lot of generalized thank yous, but I want to thank you specifically

for the Carlos Whitaker interview and for telling people that holding your newborn may be different than the way people say it should feel. And my wife and I now have a joke that I've loved my son since the moment I knew he existed, but I didn't like him until he was about six months old. Yes. And you will probably not like him from the ages of two to five. And then when he turns 14, like mine is, I'm already counting down the days.

I'm already pretty sad that he's going to leave me in three years. So it's awesome. It's amazing. It's awesome. Good for you, brother. Thank you so much, man. I'm glad that you're with us, dude. So what's up?

How can I help today? Yes. So basically, I'm trying to figure out how my wife and I can agree on whether or not to homeschool our son. He's two right now. And the reason we're talking about this is because it will determine whether he goes to preschool or not. Why is that? Um, because we figured do, if he's going to be homeschooled, then we'll just keep him at home right now. I work from home and take care of him throughout the day. So he's already at home. We don't do daycare or anything like that. So if he was going to public school, we'd put them in preschool next year.

Okay. We'll talk, we can talk about the Maris and all that of, of homeschooling versus public school and we'd put them in preschool next year. Okay. We'll talk, we can talk about the merits and all that of homeschooling versus public school and private school. We can talk about all that and I love that conversation. It's one of my favorite things. But for you and all new parents, like the way you and I grew up, which is you go to one school and then you just go to the feeder middle school and you go to the feeder high school, that world is over now.

Yeah. And so I want you to feel free to make a decision a year at a time. Okay. Sometimes even a semester at a time. It's just kind of a mess out there. It's the wild west right now. And so all I have to say is when you put pressure on yourself with a two year old, or let me put it this way, you and I both went to a schooling system that was, if you're not in

this class by third grade, you're not going to get into the other class by fifth grade. If you're not in that class, you're not going to get into honors math. If you're not honors math, you're not going to get into honors, whatever in high school. And then you're not, then you're just doomed to live under a bridge, right? That's the world we grew up in. That world doesn't exist. It's a wild west. So you do what's best for you and your family this year.

And then you do, you do its best extra. And obviously stability and friendship and community and all of that will play into account, right? And you want some consistency. You don't want moving every year kind of thing, but just take that pressure off yourself. You do not have to have this thing figured out when your kid's three years old, dude.

Yeah, well, and that's kind of what we've talked about is even just starting in terms of the root of public school, meaning he goes to preschool, he goes to elementary school, and we just see where it goes from there. But I don't like the idea of pulling him out once he's in, because he'll have friends by then, and that whole other aspect. Yeah, but he'll also have people who don't like him,

which how dare they, right? But it's a mixed bag, right? It just is. And by the way, you and I, I don't know about you specifically, I grew up in a world where almost nobody ever moved. I remember my high school, I graduated my high school class had just under right around a thousand people in the graduating class ish. It was huge. And when I sat down at graduation, I won't say her name, I'll say her first name. There was a girl named Laura that sat,

she's a woman now, she sat by me on one, I'd never seen the person on my right. I had no idea who that was. And I had not seen the woman on my left. Her name was Laura. I hadn't seen her since we sat by each other in kindergarten, like in like the little red bird row or the blue bird row, you know, the other status. And so nobody moved where I grew up. That's just not the case anymore. Everybody moves

every two years, five years, three years. And so this idea that you have this static group and this, this like gang that goes from grade to grade, it's just, it's just not the way it is much anymore. Yeah, that makes, that makes a lot of sense. that goes from grade to grade, it's just not the way it is much anymore. Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. So free yourselves from, we have to have this figured out at the age of three, all the way through 18, like bro. Think about this, 15 years is pretty much

three presidential elections from now. Right. Dude, who even knows? Who even knows, right? Who knows, man? So just free yourself from that. Yeah. All right. Let's talk about public school versus homeschooling. What kind of discussions are y'all having? So essentially, we're not worried about the education that he's going to get from public school. It's just more of firm. So I'm, my wife's coming from it on the side of it's easier it's cheaper

and everyone does it in terms of public school. Whereas I'm coming from more of the side of we can get the socialization and pretty much all the pros of public school we could do in a different way by homeschooling and I don't know. I just see, you know, when you have a vision of ten years down the road or five years down the road, the public school doesn't align with what vision we have for our family, I guess is the best way to put it. And is what vision we have for our family, I guess is the best way to put it.

And she has the same vision, but she also thinks that public school is just easier. So let's do that. Sure. I think there's merit to both of those. So tell me about your picture. Like when you think of your kid, are you all gonna have more than one?

Yes. Yeah, we're planning on having another one. Who knows? Yeah, everybody's got plans. Yeah, and the reason I ask is you're asking first parent questions, which I love. I just assumed that this was your first one, but you're asking very first parent questions. Kind of like should we should we disinfect the the pacifier when our kid dropped it? We're googling if pacifiers are gonna mess up their jawline and then by your third kid, you're like, whatever dude, like, right, who cares? But tell me about your picture.

You imagine your kid is 10, let's pretend you have an eight year old too and a six year old. What is your picture in your head of a random Tuesday morning? of a random Tuesday morning? I would say, you know, getting up, having breakfast together as a family, hopefully by then my wife won't be working. So she will be at home with us

so that I can just work from home and have from 8 a.m. till 1 p.m. of actual homeschool learning and doing things more in a structure. And then from one to dinner time, going out and doing real world, whether it's hiking or going to an aquarium or somewhere else, just going out into the world with them and letting them experience things firsthand, I would say is what we are thinking about. So I guess what I would tell you is, my wife and my daughter had breakfast together this morning. Me and my son had breakfast together this morning. My daughter was under the weather a little bit. And yesterday, me and one kid went and did one thing for a while

and then we all had dinner together. And then me and my daughter had WWE for a while. And so I guess what I'm telling you is the very beginning of that and the ending of that is capable. You can do that no matter what schooling situation you're a part of. Yes, yeah. Yeah, well, and I think this might be actually even more clear, like to help you understand, is like, I, you know how you can run to something

or from something? There you go. I see the lives of people that I know that have kids that are older, And it's like, all I know is I don't want that life. And, and I don't know how much the schooling plays into that. But it's like the schedules that they have the running around that they do. I'm like, Oh God, that's, that's us five, six, seven years from now, if that makes sense. It does. And I'm glad that you're thinking this through right now. What I don't want you to do, as Brene Brown says, I don't want you to dress, rehearse tragedy.

Yeah. So, yes, there is going to be more pressure, theoretically, in a private or public school that you drop your kids off, that all kids are going to violin and from violin they're going to soccer practice and then every weekend is filled with horse riding and dancing and what it like There there will be pressure to have that life There will also be a pressure to In fifth grade. I think my kid was the only one maybe one other one who didn't have a smartphone in fifth grade Which is insane to me,

but it was what it was, right? So those kinds of things are real. I think homeschooling comes with another set of pressures. And so I think trying to not have pressure is better solved by saying, what are our values? And solving, creating a world where those are present, meaning we will eat dinner as a family four or five nights a week, period.

End of story. And that means that we'll get one, every kid can do one thing, one instrument and one sport. And that's it. That's all we're doing. Y'all get to pick. Um, or I want every one of my kids to try jujitsu. One kid likes it. The other kids don't.

Or I want all my kids to try soccer just because kids need to run around and one will love it and one will hate it. Like it's setting down those values first and that's a cool thing to begin to work through right now because that's something y'all can practice now without being anxious or worrying about something that is gonna come 10 years down the road.

Because here's the other thing, 10 years ago, this is crazy to think, 10 years down the road. Cause here's the thing, 10 years ago, this is crazy to think 10 years ago, I was one, two, three jobs from where I am right now. Yeah. 10 years ago, I was on call 24 seven, 365. Five years ago, I was on call every second of every day, leading a team of, I don't know, 500 people. Like, and then now I'm a freaking YouTuber, right?

So who knows what your life looks like in 10 years. I'd much rather you anchor to values. Like this is just kind of who we are. We just don't do tons of busy stuff. We spend extra time with our kids. Every time you go hiking, even though it would be more efficient, you'd get a better workout, yada, yada, yada. I bring my kids with me when I go hiking.

That's just gonna be who I am. Or when I, like for me hunting for four or five years, I knew I'm gonna get, I'm not gonna be as successful because I'm bringing my little, my kid with me. And now I've got an amazing, fun hunting partner as a 14 year old. Right? And so it's, I'm gonna make those concessions early on because I'm gonna take my kids with me

everywhere I possibly can. Those are the values to anchor into. And here's the thing I want you guys just to think through. Every family has different values, okay? For me and my wife, I could care less what the social yada, yada, yada they're being taught in public school. And here's why, I do not believe in outsourcing

my kids' spiritual development to somebody else. That's my job, that's my wife's job. And for me and my wife, we want our kids to be exposed to all kinds of stuff so they, when they have questions, they ask us. I don't want them being 18 or for some of the students I worked with at private faith-based universities,

22 before they enter into a world where they're like, oh my gosh, and they have no psychology for it. And so what they do is they go to Google or they ask their friends or they ask Reddit. And so for me, in my house, the reason we've moved schools is all academics. I want my kids to be pushed really, really hard. And I have found in some public school settings

that it's, man, it's like two worksheets and a Khan Academy video. And it's not, my kids aren't getting pushed. And so I moved them schools purely for academics. The social stuff, I feel like it's my job. And if the school's teaching them crazy things, those kids, awesome. I want them to come ask me about that.

And then we can have that dialogue at my house. That's not for everybody. Other people are like, I don't even want those ideas in my kid's head. I'm fine with that, whatever. That's for you guys to think through, but I want you guys to be specific about what will homeschooling bring us. What will there's something to be said for what your wife said.

It is easier. You already pay for it. It's free. Um, there's some built in communities for you, your wife, for the local kids, you know, there's buses, there's all kinds of stuff for public schools. Great, man. And public schools have shifted and changed dramatically over the last 15 years.

I had one guy told me, and I loved the way he said it, he said wanting public schools to be like, I went to a giant public high school and it was essentially a college prep school. I'll put it up against any school in the country in terms of how hard it was academically how much they pushed us how hard the coaches pushed us in athletics And that school doesn't exist anymore in public schools. It just doesn't There's just been too much drama and too much watering down of everything

And so one guy said wanting public schools to be like they were 25 years and 30 years ago is like wanting gas to be a dollar again. It's just not. Right? And so it's just shifted and changed. But ask about the values you and your wife hold. And dude, I think there's just me. I think a local preschool trying it out, a half day preschool kind of thing is a good

way to feel how y'all feel, how your kids are feeling. Are they seen at school? Do you have teachers who are plugged in? There's amazing teachers everywhere. And there's some duds out there, just like every job, right? And asking yourself, how does this work for our family? I'll tell you, just you personally,

if you're trying to work a full-time job and be a full-time present parent, that's got a very short shelf life to it. Either you'll crash and burn. You will not be where you are. You won't be honoring your workplace by also trying to cram in a full-time parent slash teacher role too, right? Right.

Well, that's a, I work for myself and that's where it's like I work during his nap. So right now I want you to spend more time on your business than three hours a day. Yeah, right. And that's the problem is I would have a lot more time for taking on more clients and that would change everything at the same time. So. That's right.

So it's all a trade-off and it all comes back to you and your wife saying values, values, values, values. I'm a huge fan of at least one of the breadwinners in the house. One of the, I hate that word, but one of the main earners in the house, um, just going bananas in their twenties and early thirties because the research tells me that that's expertise and that hard work and those connections and that networking and those skills you learn, how hard you push yourself professionally,

getting trained, getting opportunities, saying yes to a lot of stuff, that's what guides your 30s and 40s and 50s. Okay, yeah. And so there's something to be said for, I'm gonna grind and grind and grind and grind and grind, and I'm still gonna get up early and have breakfast, and I'm still going to stay up and do silly things with my kids, and I'm still gonna get up early and have breakfast and I'm still going to stay up

and do silly things with my kids and I'm just gonna be tired in my 20s. That's just kind of part of it. There's no such thing as balance, right? There's no such thing as balance. And by the way, AI is gonna screw it all up. All these things we're talking about, who knows in five years what that's gonna look like.

So I love that you're thinking down the road, amazing. Don't overstress about stuff 10 years from now because God help us, who knows, dude. We might have a colony on Mars by then, who knows? And we might all be driving 79 Fords because that's the last time they made a truck with a computer in it. And maybe that's all we got left, right?

Who knows, dude. But I do want you and your wife to spend time thinking about the values. As for our house, what do we want it to feel like in the evenings? What kind of relationship do we want to have with our kids? And what's that gonna cost us? You don't want your wife to work in five or 10 years?

That's a math problem. How much money do you have to make for that to be true? What kind of house are you gonna live in so that you can afford that kind of shift? What kind of cars are you gonna not buy so that y'all can afford to do these things that you value? Values is a much harder conversation than just sitting around complaining about schools.

Values force you to say, okay, who are we gonna be? And I love that question for every couple. And I love every couple to do that every year too. Cause values, you know, get stress tested and pushed and beliefs changed. I love that. But dude, you're on the right path. And I'll just say this, man, you're little two year old boy. He won the lottery getting used to that. That dude, you're on the right path. And I'll just say this, man. You're a little two-year-old boy.

He won the lottery getting used to that. That's awesome, man. Awesome that you're so invested thinking five, 10 years down the road. Amazing. And yes, it's okay that you loved your kid, but you didn't really like him until he turned six months. That's fine. You're good to go, man.

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All right, let's go out to Lincoln, Nebraska and talk to Heidi. Hey, Heidi, what's up? Hi, Dr. John. How are you doing? I'm doing all right. How are you? I'm doing well. Thank you. Fantastic. What's going on? Well, I'm looking for some advice. Okay.

One of my, well, okay. My question is, how do I support my grieving best friend while celebrating my own accomplishments? Tell me more. So, a little bit of context. Me and my best friend and like her husband, my husband, we're more like brothers and sisters than best friends. And we had really similar short-term, long-term life goals. We were on track to reaching those goals soon,

like buying a house, having kids. And then she called me one day screaming that her husband had just been killed in a car accident. Oh man. And so we went through, you know, sat in the mud with her, got through those days, those weeks, those months. And now the hard thing is, her life came to a screeching halt. But me and my husband, we're still moving on. We're reaching those goals that we were gonna reach like at the same time.

And I feel stuck because I still sit in the mud with her and go through the hard times with her, talk on the phone whenever she needs me. And then I hang up with her and my husband's home. And then suddenly it's like, oh, hey, this is great. We just bought a house and we're reaching these goals and it's I feel like I'm emotionally flip-flopping a lot and I'm just not sure how to continue to support her long term. Yeah I guess that's kind of where I'm sitting.

One sorry about the loss of your friend man. Thank you. And actually sorry for the loss of both your friends because your best girlfriend is, she's a different woman now. Her life is different now. Very. And that's one of those, you all had plans, right? Lots of plans.

Yeah, we were like, oh, we were those friends that were going to build houses and have them like conjoin. Right, right. Because, you know, we just want to live our lives together in a sense. Yeah. And it's fun to like dream about being old fat rocking chair people who, yeah, I hate that for you, man. I'm sorry.

Been there. Been there. I hate it. Hate it. So this is, this is hard. I'm going to say it, but I'm going to be pretty direct. And if you and I were just sitting down talking and we had a couple of hours, I'd be a little more gentle.

Is that cool? Yeah, that's fine. How long ago was this wreck? This happened, I think three months ago. The wreck happened three months ago? Mm hmm. Okay. So, I'm going to go back to the first one.

I'm going to go back to the first one. I'm going to go back to the first one. I'm going to go back to the first one. I'm going to go back to the first one. I'm going to go back to the first one. I'm going to go back to the first one. I'm going to go back to the first one. I'm going to go back to the first one. I'm going to go back to the first one. I'm going to go back to the first one. I'm going to go back to the first one. I think three months ago. The wreck happened three months ago

Okay, so I would tell you until year one is up You don't there's not even the smoke hasn't even begun to clear after three months The paperwork has done is done the T's have been crossed and the I's have been dotted. But grief hasn't even begun to begin to ebb. Not for you and your husband, especially not for her. My rule of thumb is, in fact, I told somebody this morning, um, in a personal phone call, um, who's just experienced a pretty tragic loss, no decisions for six to nine months, no quitting jobs, no getting divorced, no selling houses, nothing for six to nine months, just because

you don't know what day it is, man. Um, and so I'll, I'll tell you that like three months is still she's still waking up and reaching over the other side of the bed, right? And she's still walking through the house on a relatively good day in a wave of grief. She'll find herself curled up in the field position on the floor. Then you know where it came from, right? And she calls you. There will be a transition time and maybe it's now everybody does this differently, so there's not a right way

I love Kessler says grief is like a fingerprint. It's unique to everybody At some point in three months actually pretty raw Maybe in another month, maybe another two or three months and you knowing your friend No, it now is a good time or not a good time, is you cannot become her therapist. You gotta stay a friend. And for friends, there's a clarifying conversation that goes along something like this.

It's similar to, you have a best friend who just went through pregnancy loss and you find out you're pregnant. Those conversations have to be had directly, head on. Me and my husband are buying a house. We are gonna start having a family or whatever the things are. And I wanna honor you by you set the gauge

on what you can hear and not hear, but the greatest gift, Heidi, you can give for your friend is to be fully you. And fully you is also grieving and also experiencing some pretty awesome personal moments. Yeah, that was kind of hard for the first little while, cause I felt like, I didn't know if I needed to almost, not hide it from her but

Not get going through the worst part of her life and I'm like, hey, we just bought our dream house That's that's exactly right doesn't really seem like that appropriate thing to say But then at the same time share it not sharing it with her also felt like I was betraying her Well feels like you're lying right limbo. Yeah. Well, I think I think there's a I think I'm just a huge fan of putting it all on the table. Like saying, I love you so much and this is so weird. I don't know what to say. So I'm looking to you for how I can best love you. Like, I don't even, I can't wrap my head around

being in your situation and I will always be your friend. And also we just bought this gigantic house and we'd love to have you over. And I don't know how to say it And giving her permission to say like if you can't come over I totally get it and Also, if she's like, oh my gosh, I need somebody in my life to be having something good happening

You get you get I'm saying so I think putting on the table and saying I want to love you and I don't know how to do that right now. I'm gonna look to you for guidance. Okay, that's helpful. And there's also, here's the thing, that's a real thin line because also the single most annoying thing that can happen to somebody who just got tragic news,

Kelly and I've talked about this a lot, is they find themselves getting bombarded with, how are you texts? And then they feel like they have to answer it in just the right way so to not make anyone else have a bad day. And suddenly you find yourself having to take care of everybody in your life and you're the one, you're the one hurting, right? And so there's that weird, I'm your best friend, so I'm going to keep showing up with meals

and I'm your best friend. So I'm just going to show up at your house. We're going to go for a walk and I'm going to, I'm going to point blank. Like tell me, tell me what you missed about, you know, tell me what you miss about Mark. Tell me I want to hear it. And her eyes might get real wide and be like, yeah, we're talking about it unless you don't want to like, so there's that. And then the other side of it is, I don't know how, I don't know your capacity for hearing great news. And I don't know, I don't want

to, I don't want to bomb you. I just don't know what to do. Can you, can you help me give me some guidance? Do you get how there's a tension there? Mm hmm. I do. And I guess just get it out of your head. You're going to say something stupid. You just are all of us do. I do this, I do this for a living and I still say stuff and I'm like, Oh, let me take that back. I didn't mean to say it like that. I still do that Well, I'm glad I wouldn't be the only one No, and I love that you're trying to get this one right I

If I'm being honest it sounds It sounds... Those of us who are around the blast but aren't immediately affected in as profound a way, if that makes sense, which sounds awful. This is one of your closest friends on the planet. But there's concentric circles, right? And she's at the very center of this thing. the planet. But there's concentric circles, right? And she's at the very center of this thing. It's easy to quote unquote, try to get back to the way things were. Yeah, I think that's definitely where I was at first, in those first like weeks and months even. But then it was, at first I was like, I don't want to lose another friend. And like you said earlier, I had already lost her. And so coming to almost relearn who she is now and who she still will become in the months and years.

And who you'll become, because it would be wild if your husband isn't five minutes late and your heart rate goes up 10 beats a second, like 10 beats a minute 100% every time every time right right or you see his phone is He's supposed to be home at 6 from work and he calls at 6 o 5 and you grab that phone really aggressively like you're different now That's true I hadn't thought about that. And it's just metabolizing it. Everything in your life is different because you now know how precious it is. And you look at that, at your big, handsome, tough, mustached husband.

I don't know. I just made up a whole caricature of the husband. Who knows? But you look at him and you now have a, like, in your nervous system, you know deeply inside your body, any second he could go away. And that changes how you grief that changes how you guys fight and how you how you repair it how you make up right? How you make sure you tell each other you love each other before you go.

And so there's something to be said for you and him getting on the same page too. Like hey this is three months after you lost your best friend on the planet tell me tell me how you're how we're doing How are you doing? What are you noticing about yourself the big things the little things You be honest every time you leave and get in the car I catch my breath And that's just how a couple grieves together y'all gonna grieve at different paces and And he might be like, I'm fine, I'm good. You're not fine. You lost your best friend 90 days ago, right?

But everybody just does it different. But yeah, for her three months, yeah, she's just getting started, unfortunately. Yeah, it's, you know, the grief, there's a lot of other factors like, you know, he didn't have life insurance and that and all those things that came tumbling down and yeah, it's just, it's a lot. Yeah, it's a lot. And being able to tell her, I love you, you can always call me.

I'll go with you to your first counseling appointment, but I can't be your therapist. I'll direct you to our money manager person, the smart best I use or whatever, I'll point you to that, but I can't make your money decisions for you. And that's really a hard conversation, but that's also a blessing.

And she might say, well then screw you. I don't want you to call me anymore. And she gets to do that for a season two because she's just a raw exposed nerve. Yeah, that would be more than fair. I could understand that. Yeah. And you can say like, all right, you don't have to talk to me right now, but I love you and I'm going to call you again.

Call me, I'll call you till you block me and then I'll probably kill you. Still keep calling you. You can still keep showing up at your house until you tell me do not come here. Right. Um, and it usually doesn't get there, but it's just expect the swings and expect the hard stuff. It's just, it's just awful, man. I'm sorry.

Thank you. But I'll tell you this, man, being a friend that's trying to get it right and being a friend who's, I just love your spirit, I guess. I mean, it's easy to be like, why can't she be happy for me? You acknowledge her whole world's over and she's just sitting in the ash of what once was trying to just like pick up half burned photograph to see if it still looks right. You know what I mean?

Like she's just trying to figure out all 10 fingers and 10 toes kind of thing for her. And it will be that way for some time. And so you setting the boundary and just putting on the table. I don't know. I don't know. But I want to love you. I don't want to be here. And you let me know what you can handle.

By the way, she might be like, I want to hear about all the good stuff. I can't wait to hear. And then you start telling her, okay, we just bought our dream house. It's this big. It's amazing. It's the one we looked at. And then you'll hear the other phone just go numb silent. That's okay.

Or she plans to come over to your new house and like look all around and like help you decorate a room. And then five minutes before she calls and says, I can't do it today. That's when you exhale and give her grace and say, I totally get it. Love you. Let's put another day on the calendar. It's just gonna be that sort of rhythm

and you having the courage to say, well, I'm gonna stop you right there. I can't be your therapist on this one, but I'll go with you on the first meeting. And you letting her know, I love you. And here's my boundaries. It's awesome. She's lucky to have you.

Thanks for the call, Heidi. We'll be right back. Let's talk about Hallow, the number one prayer and meditation app in the world. It's officially Lent, which are the 40 days leading up to Good Friday and Easter. And Lent is when Christians all over the world commit to a season of fasting from all sorts of things,

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covered all through Lent and beyond. Go check out Hallow at hallow.com slash Dulony for three free months. That's hallow, H-A-L-L-O-W dot com slash Dulony. All right, let's go out to Phoenix, Arizona and talk to Travis. Hey Travis, what's up, man? Hey, Dr. John, how's go out to Phoenix, Arizona and talk to Travis. Hey Travis, what's up man? Hey, Dr. John, how's it going? Doing great brother, how are you man? I am good on paper.

Ooh, tell me more about that. So, I have two kids and I seem to be able to experience all of the sort of negative emotions of parenting over exhaustion, frustration, fear, responsibility. But I have yet to experience the real highs of parenting that other people talk about, sort of the joy that fills them up. And so I'm three years in and I'm starting to get concerned. Yeah. So just as a guy who's been a parent for a long time, everyone's lying to you.

You're just now figuring out that lie. There's no joy. There's no joy in parenthood. I'm just playing again. So you have a three-year-old and a how old? Eight months. Eight months. Tell me about them.

Boy, girl, names. Tell me about, don't give me their names. That's fine. But boy, girl, tell me about them. Boy, girl names. Tell me about, don't give me their names. That's fine. But boy, girl, tell me about them. A couple of boys and they are both great. The first one was definitely a tougher baby, but you know, I don't know if that was part of just becoming a new parent, but I think he was just a bit more tricky. Second one has been pretty good, right? Like that's why I said good on paper, right? I don't really have a lot to complain about. How's your marriage, man? It's good. No, it's not. Tell me about it. It is. So, but the, I guess part of why it concerns me so much is that my wife

derives so much joy from the children. Yeah. And it's hard for her to see me not sharing in that. Okay. Um, all right, let's put a pin in that. Tell me about growing up, man. Where'd you, where'd you grow up? Tell me about your folks. I

Grew up right here in the valley. I grew up in a fairly religious household Is that a good thing or not a good thing It's a complicated thing there you go, all right, Let's put it this way. I'm not religious anymore. Okay. All right. My mother passed away when I was 11. Okay. I sort of have like a very much older sister.

There's like a big gap to my older sister and me. So she's been more kind of like an aunt in my life. And then I have one younger sister who's closer in age. You didn't mention your dad. Where's your old man? He's still around. He's still like very helpful. He, you know, he is the guy that I can call at any time and he will show up. No questions asked. If there's sort of a problem, like, but he, there's never been like strong, like emotional conversations, if that makes sense. Absolutely. Right?

Like he very stoic, very helpful, very wise. But it's almost like he's being the arbitrator, being the therapist, like he's listening, he's taking it in, he's offering some advice. But like, sometimes I feel like I don't know like what he actually thinks. Yeah. And to his, not to his credit, but to his defense, his generation was told. Yeah. If a man lets anybody behind that iron curtain, you're a coward, you're weak, you're a failure.

Yeah. And you are meant to be the pillar. You are meant to be the rock upon which everything is built on. That's right. And the lie was the rock is... It's not like in Japan the architecture is designed for these gigantic powerful strong buildings to be very very flexible to absorb earthquakes. Mm-hmm. That's not how these men were told strength was. They were told you will be on an anchored foundation,

which means when there's an earthquake, it falls over and it can never be put back, right? I heard one man say, I feel like if I start crying, I will never stop. And my guess is that's probably your old man. How'd your mom die? She passed away from breast cancer that spread. Take me back to 11 year old Travis.

What was that like? What was like 10 year old Travis? I was pretty all over the place. I was pretty wild. I, you know, I was probably a pretty annoying child to a lot of people, but like I was, I was a big bundle of joy. Like I had, I had fun all the time. That's all I was looking for was fun. Um,

And when'd you find out mom got sick? How long was, how long was she sick before she passed away? It was about two years from when she told us to when she passed away. Okay. And so you just had a ringside seat from nine to 10 to 11 of watching your mom slowly fade out. Yeah. Okay. I can't imagine any more powerless feeling than being nine years old,

being 10 years old and watching mom slip through your hand like sand at a beach. I mostly just didn't. That's right. I remember I just, like, I think I went to a friend's house that day. Like I just didn't want to acknowledge it. I just left. I just continued on my way.

Have you let your 11 year old self off the hook for that? I did. When I was in my 20s, I think I finally just like let go of the guilt. I felt like I hadn't, you know, I hadn't treated her right up until she died. But like I hadn't, you know, I hadn't treated her right up until she died, but like I was 10, you know? Yeah, there you go, yeah. It took, you know, over a decade, but I think I finally got,

I don't feel guilt when I think about it now. Good, awesome. And that's healing, right? You can think back and be like, man, I wish when I was 11, right? I A, hadn't peed in my neighbor's flower bed and B, I wish I had the right words to say for my mother who was terminally ill, right?

I mean like you can think about that but it doesn't overwhelm you. Is that right? Yeah, that's right. Okay. I'm shooting in the dark here, man. Cause this is one of those situations you and I could talk for a couple of hours, man.

I would, you sound like somebody I would love to just to sit and be quiet and listen. Because it sounds like you've got a pretty powerful story. Just your life has been pretty, pretty rich. My guess here is that at some point along the way, your body put some GPS pins in feeling. They did. Because if you feel anything, that level of pain can get you again. So your body's way of taking care of you was just to shut the entire system down.

And you may have got enough from your dad about, hey, you still got to go do the next right thing. So you got good grades, you got married, you're good at your job. You had two kids But your entire The what I would call the other 90% of your life Which is the perceiving and the feeling and the emotions the good stuff and the painful stuff that system is off and disconnected Because ten-year-olds aren't supposed to bury their mothers system is off and disconnected because 10 year olds aren't supposed to bury their mothers. Can I recontextualize a little bit of that?

Absolutely. I'm throwing spaghetti at a wall, dude. You come back. I almost feel like it's the opposite. The time when my body shut down had nothing to do with where I'm at now with my kids. I don't think I'm very good at my job. It took me seven years to get through college to get married. Right. I'm, I'm, I'm a, I'm a fiscally responsible person. So like we're set, right? There's not stressors there, but when my body, like

when I noticed that, like, I, I kind of changed fundamentally was in college. I was really, really miserable comparing myself to like my fellow high school mates and my wife who were all doing really amazing in college. And I was just kind of struggling and floundering. And then at the time I thought like, Oh, you know, I have, I've, I've conquered it. I don't feel bad anymore. But looking back, I feel like I have fundamentally changed since then where like, I don't, I just don't feel. That's it. That's fair

So I was half right Yeah, yeah, and so okay, you actually added a more complex layer to it, which is we're not gonna feel and Cognitively that 10% you think you're a failure Yeah That 10% you think you're a failure. Yeah. But I seem to only care when like people look like I have a therapist and the way it described it is like I kind of have this ramshackle house. There's stuff in the gutters. The lawn needs to be mowed. Right. Like I could probably use a pressure wash and like I don't mind it. It's like okay with me, but I don't like when people look look I don't want to have them over

That may be the greatest analogy for what's going on inside your chest I've ever heard somebody put on paper You just described what's going on inside your guts dude not on your yard And here's the scary thing about a three-year-old. They can see right damn through you. Man, I hope not. I promise you they can. And here's how it comes out. You'll have a three-year-old that either really wants to hug you because somehow, and I don't know how they know this, they know that that's their job, because you make dad okay.

Or they learn really fast that the greatest gift they can provide to dad is to just kind of be out of the way. And at the same time, they can't physically be out of the way because they're three and everything in their body is saying go towards, go towards, go towards. My guess is your wife is not frustrated about, I can't believe you're not enjoying this. She feels the electricity.

Yeah, it's kind of both. I feel like I am a good dad. I feel like I do the things that I... You go through the motions in an amazing way for someone who's been through what you've been through. Thank you. But I think it's what I think he was, is it Brené Brown also? She said the sucky thing about like psychotropic medication is that joy and pain are on the

same switch. That's a scary thought. It is. That's what I thought. It is. That's what I can turn your herd off, but I'm going to turn off the highs too. I'm going to turn off the good stuff. I'm going to turn off the, we're not having sex. We're just sitting by my wife watching TV and we watch an old episode of Matlock and

it's super lame. And my heart rate just goes down another 10 beats a minute because I'm at peace. Joy, right? Yeah. It's getting fired and being pissed off or being frustrated but not thinking I'm a pathetic loser. And see I told you so. I think that I think the path forward brother is a don't beat

yourself up for looking at a three and a one-year-old and being like uh right like you're not crazy that's a hard season that's a house that's messy yes and if it is a mess if connection has been purely through sex which is very common for guys in your situation of course that diminishes a lot with two kids under three running around the house. If you heard now opening up your eyes and it's kind of like in retrospect and you're feeling and seeing, I haven't really felt anything for a long time.

I'm great at going through the motions. The practice for you and your counselor is not just to sit there and talk about and talk about and talk about what happened, but I want to begin to practice feeling good stuff, anxious stuff, scary stuff, bad stuff. Here's some ways you do that. It's stuff I talk about on the show a lot, but I don't go into all the clinical detail

just because I don't want to bore people. But that's why I have people write a letter and read it to somebody else. Because I want you to feel that stuff that's still there. So I want people to have somebody they can call and say, hey, I just got promoted. And there's nowhere in our modern ecology that allows us to share good news because everyone goes, oh, it must be nice or oh, it's just because of and they insert some privileged position or whatever there's no place to celebrate yeah but for you you're gonna have to tiptoe your body into being able to feel again because it knows dude we did we we We buried our mom when we were 11.

Yep. And I don't ever want to feel that again. And I don't know, dude, kids have a very refining fire way of seeing right through you. But I would sit down with you. I think the place to start would be to sit down with the therapist. I'm so proud of you for going, man. But to sit down and begin to practice, I wanna begin walking towards how do I feel stuff? And there will be a mindful practice there.

I'm gonna send you my book, Building a Non-Anxious Life, just as a gift. This isn't about anxiety, but it is about presence. It's about how do I become okay in my own skin? And what are some practices I can do? And good for you, you've tried to solve it fiscally, you've tried to solve it fiscally, you've tried to solve it in these other ways,

and I get that. My guess is you've probably forgiven your 10 year old self, but now we've got to let that 10 year old actually absorb what happened. And we got to do some pretty intentional things to let that 10 year old cycle through your body and let him go play Because 10 year olds are supposed to be out playing man, not burying their moms

And yes, it is there's a story that people are told like when you have a three-year-old it's the greatest three's kind of the worst it's hard and then having a one-year-old that's And having a spouse that's like, this is the best! And you're just like, it's not the best. And then you get into that cycle of, I knew I was a loser. I knew I couldn't do this thing right.

And home becomes a failure factory. And it just goes in a long line of this is why we don't feel anything. And unfortunately, that means shutting off all the good stuff too. So I guess in a weird way, I hate to tell you this, but you're on the path. You're on the right path, dude. And I think now you're going to be like, dude, there's hard work ahead. There's the hardest work ahead. I guess what I would tell you is somebody who sat on the other side of that switch,

I'm saying I feel anything. Dude, there is peace on the other side, but you gotta go through it. So sit down with your therapist the next time you're in there and say, all right, it's game time now. We've been talking, we've been circling. I'm gonna learn how to feel. I'm gonna turn those switches back on and it's gonna be an avalanche of electricity. And with your therapist, they can help you hold on through it. It's going to be like Star Wars three, right?

The Empire Strikes Back when the guy's electrocuting, when the Emperor's electrocuting the guy. Darth Vader and he still does the right thing. It's going to be like that. And that's why you have a good therapist to sit with you. It's going to be tough. Blessings to your brother. Thank you for the call. Hang on the line. I'll get you hooked up with that book. We'll be right back. All right. Let's talk about bond charge. Here's the deal. The modern world exposes us to things

that were unheard of until just a few decades ago. And I don't mean all the TikTok dances and the cat videos or the AI influencers. I'm talking about the screens in our homes and in our offices and the fluorescent lights and the EMFs, these things that can affect our mood, our sleep, our anxiety and more. And that's why I'm so excited to partner with BondCharge, a world leader in red light therapy and EMF blocking gear. I use BondCharge products all the time,

literally every single day and I love them. I used them this morning when I was working out. And here's why you'll love them too. Studies show that red light therapy can boost your mood, reduce stress, and help with sleep. It can also help your recovery from aches and pains and transform your skin, and even help with cellulite and stretch marks. My red light therapy panels, the infrared, sauna blanket, the EMF mat, and more have become a cornerstone of my health and wellness routine. I use them all the time. You can also check out BondCharge's other

amazing products like Blue Light Glasses, EMF protection products, infrared sauna blankets and 100% blackout sleep masks. Go to BondCharge.com slash Deloney and use coupon code DELONI to say 15%. That's B-O-N-C-H-A-R-G-E, bondcharge.com slash deloni and use coupon code deloni to say 15%. All right, we are back. We have something cool that happened, but Keeler, who is the president of the Ramsey Chess Club was just foaming at the mouth here. What did I say? Did I say something wrong? Yeah. Uh, it was return to the Jedi Empire. Oh man. Nerds unite. Congratulations. You can always count on Keeler in your corner. What was it? Return of the Jedi? That's the Bubba Fett one. Look at that.

Bobo. I think three of our listeners just wreck their cars in rage and protest. Boba Fett. Boba? Yes. Isn't that like a T? Like the... Like with the little gushy things at the bottom? Yes, but Bubba Fett, that's a different person. Bubba Fett's from Alabama.

He's from Alabama. Yeah, totally different person. Bubba Fett is the cousin. Yeah, and he may be a bounty hunter as well. But he, but it's for people who took the cows. Yeah, it's very different. Bubba Fett. For meth dealers.

That's right. Bubba Fett gets the Sudafed. Boba Fett gets Skywalkers, I guess Han Solo. All right. Just stop. All right, something cool happened. What I love that, you know, too Kelly I do what was not this conversation is what was cool but she does listen across the back of her neck underneath her her Tattoo of the barcode that she has across the back of her neck underneath it says I love Jedi's Go ahead. I mean that I don't have one with that. I mean if I was gonna put you know Jedi's are pretty cool

So I'm good with that. All right, go ahead We need some more especially cool crap that happens a lot of am I the problems y'all y'all got problems No question about that. They got problems and they don't want it to be them. They want it to be other people. That's right. But we need some cool crap that happened. So I know I tell y'all to email them in. If you could go to askjohn.com or johndelote.com slash ask. She's just producing the crap out of the show. She's amazing. Oh really? Johndelote.com slash ask.

Yes. If you'll go to that and put it in at this. Oh, really? Really? JohnDoleo.com slash ask. Yes. If you'll go to that and put it in at the top of the question, put, you know, cool crap that happened or CCTH, that is the best way for those to get to us. And I would really appreciate it. All right, cool. So this is from Amanda. Now this one came in at the end of last year.

Okay. So keep that in mind. She said, my husband and I separated this past March. My daughter was 11 at the time and I had not yet found your podcast. Fast forward and now I found your podcast and I heard you talk about dates with your kids and decided to try it this past September. Every Thursday I pick up my daughter for school and we've been going on dates. I wasn't sure if she would enjoy it or value it at first, but it's turned into the highlight of our week. We've already gone through the questions for

humans for parents and kids, parents and teens, and are currently going through the Thanksgiving deck. We drew the question about what we want to be grateful for in the next year. This morphed into an hour long discussion with my now 13 year old. We have been continuing to discuss how we can implement these things today that will create gratitude in one year. We're planning a special day to map out our goals for the upcoming year. I love how these cards can be super fun and silly and can also be super deep. Thank you. Dang dude. Good on her. Dude, separations with teens are brutal. They're brutal for everybody, but with teens, it's very, very tough, man. So good on her, man. That's amazing. Taking that extra step. I think it

would be awesome if you showed that level of intentionality towards me, Kelly. Seriously? No. I think we're good. I think you're all intentional-ed up. How about like if you came to a meeting I scheduled? All right. Hey everybody, thanks for listening so much to the show. That'd be great. Super grateful for you. Because I'm trying to be intentional. Stay in school.

Don't do drugs. Be nice to your coworkers for God's sakes. And get more tattoos. Just don't get Star Wars ones because Kelly's got most of the weird designs. Peace out.