The Dr. John Delony Show - Navigating a Failing Marriage & the Fear of Intimacy

Episode Date: December 21, 2020

The Dr. John Delony Show is a caller-driven show that gives you real talk on life, relationships and mental health challenges. Through humor, grace and grit, John gives you the tools you need to cut through the chaos of anxiety, depression and disconnection. You can own your present and change your future—and it starts now. So send us your questions at johndelony.com/show or leave a voicemail at 844-693-3291. We want to talk to YOU! Show Notes for this Episode 4:44: My husband is in the process of transitioning. I am terrified that I am about to be a single parent and don't know what to do. Divorce Checklist: How to Prepare for Divorce 24:33: Should I push back my wedding date so my incarcerated mom can be there? 29:22: I'm in a relationship with a great man that I love and see a future with but I have a hard getting close to him. Teaching Segment: Fear of Intimacy 43:55: Lyrics of the Day: "Ring of Fire" - Johnny Cash tags: sexuality/intimacy, marriage, divorce, boundaries, family, trauma/PTSD, relationships These platforms contain content, including information provided by guests, that is intended for informational and entertainment purposes only. The content is not intended to replace or substitute for any professional medical, counseling, therapeutic, financial, legal, or other advice. The Lampo Group, LLC d/b/a Ramsey Solutions as well as its affiliates and subsidiaries (including their respective employees, agents and representatives) make no representations or warranties concerning the content and expressly disclaim any and all liability concerning the content including any treatment or action taken by any person following the information offered or provided within or through this show. If you have specific concerns or a situation in which you require professional advice, you should consult with an appropriately trained and qualified professional expert and specialist. If you are having a health or mental health emergency, please call 9-1-1 immediately.

On today's show, we talk about sex and intimacy a lot, so watch out for the little ears in the room. We talk to a woman whose husband is transitioning to become a woman, and she fears that her marriage is finally over. We're gonna talk to a young fiance who's about to get married, and she wants to know if she should postpone her wedding

until her mom gets out of jail. And we're gonna talk to a woman who has struggled with intimacy her entire life, and she finally met someone that she loves and can't get close. Stay tuned. Hey, what up? I'm John, and this is the Dr. John Deloney Show, a live show where we take your calls,

and we walk alongside you trying to figure out the next wobbly, crooked step, the next right thing to do. We talk about everything, trying to help people become human beings again. When we're talking about what we're eating, who we're dancing with, who we love, who loves us, dealing with hurts from the past, whatever it is, no matter what's going on in your heart, in your mind, in your family, there are millions of people just like you with the same challenges, the same struggles, the same things, keeping them up at night, helping them not wake up in the

morning, just wanting to hide under the covers, all of it. So give me a call at 844-693-3291. We're going to talk about love. We're going to talk about breakups. We're going to talk about divorce. We're going to talk about what to do with our pets. I don't even know. And we may talk about this to do with our pets. I don't even know. And we may talk about this.

This drives me crazy. I'm looking for things that we can do together that are little things, little steps, little wins that are going to help the whole world be better. And here's one of them. You go get some food in a line. And that's a whole other conversation. We eat out way too much. But it's the holidays. You're driving around fast. You go get in a line and that's a whole other conversation we eat out way too much but it's the holidays you're driving around fast you go get in line and you're 10th you're 11th and there's people

in front of you and they're all just standing around like looking around all over the place scrolling on their phones talking and you hear things in front of you like oh i'm a cat mom and it's so much harder than being a regular person mom right and we've talked about this and you just want to set your face on fire to make sure you can still feel pain and you're waiting in line and then they move up and they move up and it seems that they seem surprised when they get to the counter. It's like, oh, my turn. And then they look up at the giant 16-foot board in front of their face with all of the food and the prices, and they look stunned. Wow, burgers, french fries.

No way. We've landed on the moon. No way. And they wait in line, and they wait in line, and they get right up to the counter and they seem surprised that they're going to order food and they haven't even thought about it yet. So let's do this.

Let's live our lives with intentionality and be ready to order when we get to the line. Let's use all that time in line not to look at the latest doom news, not to text old boyfriends and be like, dude, what are you doing, bro? Hey, man. Hey, old girlfriend. You still doing vegan stuff? I don't know, whatever it is. Let's just look at the big giant board ahead of us and decide what we're going to eat and how much it's going to cost. And if you want to up it an ante, you can even get your payment method out, whether you're a phone waiver

and that makes me feel like we're in Harry Potter when I see people do that or if you're a check writer like me, like it's the 18th century, I trade tobacco and wheat for my food at the grocery store, I mean at the restaurants, whatever. Let's get our payments out,

let's be prepared and let's all make these little changes in our lives that's going to make the whole world move a little bit faster, a little bit more joyful, a little bit less friction. I feel better already. 1-844-693-3291 or go to johndeloney.com slash show. Fill out the form and we'll check it out and see if we can get you on the show. We are getting hundreds of inquiries, calls, maybe thousands, maybe millions. It's one of those numbers. And they're

coming in from all over the world. It's exciting. People are asking all kinds of great questions, great things, great ideas. And so let's look here. Let's go straight to the phones. We've got, let's go to Jane in Louisville, Kentucky. Jane, good morning. How are we doing? Hi, good morning, Dr. D. How are you? I'm doing so good. How are you? I'm doing okay. I'm very privileged and lucky to be able to call you. Got a little situation going and wanted to see if I could bounce something off you. So I'm just going to stop you. The way you said got a little situation makes me think this is going to be a big one. Am I right? Well, it's kind of one of those things where I, it's been going on for a few years, but

it's, you know, I've learned to kind of cope and it's just kind of getting to the point where it's all crumbling down to a, you to a dust and uh oh all right the house of cards isn't staying up anymore let's do this let's get there so my uh my husband who by the way i've known since we were 14 um but he's actually my second marriage that's just a little background but he's actually beginning a transition to being a woman and um i feel, you know, it's been rough. Like, had I talked to you three years ago, you know, I would have been sounding a lot different, but I've been trying to kind of stick with it and everything, like maybe hoping it would change or just trying to see if we would be married as kind of more friends. And I've received advice that that probably wouldn't be healthy. And I feel that maybe divorce would be more on the horizon. And

I'm just feeling scared and sad and actually paralyzed about making a move. So therefore, I just kind of stay, just stay. And, you know, I'm kind of losing myself i'm kind of not you know i'm kind of feeling hopeless and and down a lot and yeah and uh so can we do this for a second um i like transitioning and and um changing genders all that is big and it's third rail. I want to put that aside for a second and just exhale for a second and let you know this sucks. And I hate that your marriage is crumbling underneath you. And I hate that you're hurting and that you're looking at this, at the dust and the smoke and realizing that you've got some big decisions to make that you can't put off anymore. And that's just heavy and that's a lot. And so just as you're, you're, you're just to the North of us

there in Kentucky, just North of us from Nashville. And so I just want to look up and say, sorry, I hate this for you. And, um, we'll dig, we'll, we'll see if we can pick shovels up together and start digging out of this a little bit. So a couple of questions I want to ask, do you have any kids? Uh, yeah, I have anyear-old daughter and yeah, that's it. But it's not, it's from my first marriage. Okay, from your first marriage. Okay. And so what do you want to do? Do you want to stay married? Do you love this person um i i i love i love him but i feel that the passion is definitely gone you know i mean we we okay we're weird we've been weird our entire

lives like we're we kind of came together as like partners in life, which sounds kind of weird, but see, he's loved me since we were in ninth grade. Okay. And after I had that first marriage, which was abusive and I had swore it off all men. And then I was like, but what about Chris? Because then, you know, I thought he's the one person that would never hurt me. And plus he was missing me his entire life. He prayed. I mean, he would literally ask, you know, you know, just ask all the time to God for us to get married. And I was like, well, and I kind of realized, wait, maybe, maybe I didn't ever choose a

good man because I didn't think I deserved it because I was abused in my childhood. And I kind of put the two together and I was like, oh oh maybe I actually rejected him this whole time because he was good so then um we kind of came together as when I was I was a single mom and we were you know he's been you know very sweet to my daughter since she was born and all that because so you you've just painted me a picture I want to call this out you painted me a picture of loyalty you painted me a picture. I want to call this out. You painted me a picture of loyalty. You painted me a picture of a guy who just wouldn't give up on you. You painted a picture of he wouldn't give up on you so much that he was calling in God. He was calling in the cosmos to help with this deal.

He loved your daughter. He was good to her. You had history together but you have not once said once the light bulb came on i was he was it i was doubled over for this dude and i was in love and love and love and i couldn't wait to spend the rest of my life with him i couldn't wait to ravish him i couldn't wait you're not him. I couldn't wait. You're not sending me those signals. You're not using those words. And so was this a scared single mom who was comfortable and had a great friend that she could trust and decided to get married? Or did

you just fall head over heels with the dude that had been standing by you? Like every romantic comedy ever, right? Just by you the whole time. See see i know yeah you're you're so perspicacious and i really appreciate that i don't even know what that word means that was awesome okay continue we'll put it we'll put it in the show notes you're very perceptive and you hit the nail exactly on the head with the first scenario okay and and we kind of had this kind of plan that we would we would get married and become partners and then love would grow because we love each other and and that happened for like a week awesome all right so fast forward till now how long long have you all been married legally? Six and a half years. Six and a half years.

And how long have you not been intimate together? And I'm talking about intimate sexually. I'm talking about intimate spiritually, intimate. You tell each other secrets. You tell each other what's in your heart and minds how long has that been fading um we'll see the the emotional this is really crazy the emotional intimacy is upped like a thousand percent because i was actually the one that helped him figure out like you know that that this was going on because Cause he, he kind of, you know,

was in denial and all of this type of stuff. And I'm like, dude, you're not in denial. This is like, look at what you're doing. This is, and you know, and I, and I was, and I said, you have a wall up, you know, I can't get to know you. And so when the wall came down is when, you know, when he admitted and he kind of basically came out of the closet. So at the same time, when I got that kind of devastating news, that he also opened up emotionally. So we tell, I tell him everything. We're super close. I mean, he's like, you know, we know each other.

Sure. So what's stopping you from, so it sounds like you have an extraordinary friend, a world-class best friend and you love him you would you know you would to quote the song you'd stop the world and melt with him right and he would do the same for you and your daughter that that is not the entirety of a marriage right that's not the entirety of romantic love. That's not the entirety of holding somebody and feeling held and being held. So why don't you go through the divorce? What's holding you back from that? Because I'm scared.

I'm scared of, I've made so many bad decisions in my life, and I'm just scared that divorcing is another bad decision. Those are backwards. Those are backwards. So I'm just scared that divorcing is another bad decision. Those are backwards. Those are backwards. So I want you to set those aside. You've made some bad decisions in your life. We all have. Some of us have made bigger ones and other ones, partridge in a pear tree. What about this one? You're telling me that you don't love somebody sexually. You don't love them intimacy wise. You are great friends. Y'all are great co-pilots, but you are not attracted to him. You don't want to be married to him through this transition. So what's holding you back? What are you going to lose? I guess, well, I would say I'm kind of just scared about the future because...

So the future, Jane, is on you. In fact, the future is on you a couple of years ago when he started talking about this. And you knew about this. So the future is on you. So it's the present now. What are you going to do? Yeah, I guess I'm scared about losing the good things that we do have. Because, you know, we are a little family.

And, you know, there was that potential there. And I'm scared if, you know, I mean, at this point, I think he won't change. So, you know, I feel like it probably won't come back, you know, the potential for that physical intimacy and stuff. I don't know. I guess I'm just, I think I'm kind of mentally broken down to the point where I can't even make a decision to. Here's what I think. I think you have made the decision and you don't want to say it out loud. And I think you are trying desperately

to not let your world change. And that's a denial of reality because it has changed. It's changed in significant and major ways. And I'm not just talking about your husband's gender transition. I'm talking just talking about your husband's gender transition. I'm talking about you recognizing, oh gosh, I never loved him in this way. I never did. I hoped it would get there

and it didn't. And once again, I've made a bad decision. I didn't fully understand me. I got connected with somebody that's going to hurt me in a way. I've hurt myself and so on and so forth. And you've probably heard me talk about this a lot, but one of the hardest things about divorce is the actual separation, right? The mourning of a failed relationship or a relationship that didn't live up to what we all hoped and thought it would. We put a lot into this. We tried hard. We were open. We were intimate.

All that. Then there's the financial side, right? You have to sit down and do the nuts and bolts. You have to plan a funeral for somebody who's still alive, right? But the thing that we don't always talk about is you alluded to it, and we're just going to put it on the table. The thing we don't often talk about is that you no longer trust you. You lost trust in Jane. You thought this was the right thing. He called on God to make sure this was the right one. He was desperate to not acknowledge who he has come

to believe he is since he was a child. He's been praying to God, which is a common thing. I hear that. I've heard that for years and years and years. And not only is he praying to God to change the inside of him, he was praying to God

that you would be the catalyst for that change. Yes. And there's just a moment when you have to sit down and drop your shoulders, literally, physically drop them and grieve. It just is. And this moment sucks.

But the more you try to punt it and push it and move it and call it not what it is, the more you're going to continue to wither on the vine, the more your child is going to wither on the vine, and the more your friendship and close companionship and community that you have with this person, that's going to die too. Because while you're putting all your energy and making sure he's being fully him,

and you're making sure your daughter, and I can tell in your voice that you're a killer mom, that you would light the moon on fire for your baby girl. The person you're not caring for is Jane, right? Yeah, because I feel like I could stay in it because he's a good provider. We have a stable little family going on. And that Jane is a myth. It's a good provider. We have a stable little family going on. And that, Jane, that, Jane, is a myth. It's a fantasy.

It is. You do have a stable thing. And if you love this person and want to stay married and can be fully connected in a married world, that is incredible. I think, I mean, I don't think you would be calling me if that was the case. I think what you're realizing is that's not going to be the full answer. Yeah, because I'm scared. I'm scared about, you know, just, I really wanted to get married also to show her what a family was like, you know. That's right. Here's what you get to do. Here's what you get to do.

I absolutely 100% get that. You want to model to her what a strong, connected woman looks like, what a working mom, what a connected mom who loves her daughter looks like, what a devoted wife looks like. You want to do those things. And now what you get to do, which I think is an undervalued modeling exercise, a modeling moment. It's not an exercise. You're in it. You get to show your daughter what a good woman who is struggling and grieving looks like. You get to teach your

daughter how to love well, how to grieve well, how to be open and honest. And you get to show her what little wins looks like, taking care of yourself even when you're hurting, what going to a counselor looks like. You get to model all that for her. And over the course of her life, that will be one of the greatest gifts you can give her. Because here's what it's looked like when bad things happen, because all of our kids are going to get punched in the mouth at some point in life. And you get to model that for her. And that will be such a gift. So practically speaking, practically speaking, I'm going to have James put this in the show notes.

I actually just wrote an article for DaveRamsay.com about divorce. And divorce sucks. And it's just a divorce checklist. Here's some things to think through as you go through this. And if it's amicable, if you've got two people acting like adults, and there's one way to do it. And then if you've got one person throwing a temper tantrum, the other person trying to act like an adult, there's another way. But we're going to link that in the show notes, and we're going to make sure that you get a copy of that. The second thing is this. Here's just the practical, a copy of that. Okay. The second thing is this, here's the, just the practical, practical sense of this. Number one, and I'm, I'm, I'm repeating myself here, but I'll make

sure you get this. There is a practical money side, kid side to this. Okay. Your daughter will need your direct attention, your direct honesty, right? Straight talk. She will need love, love, love. And that will look like a lot of physical touch from you. That will look like a lot of physical touch from the person she knows as her dad. That will take a lot of honesty. And I love as my friend Rachel Cruz says, share, don't scare, be age appropriate, right? Be age appropriate and don't be overly gratuitous and don't be overly graphic. But be honest. Kids can feel that gap when they're being lied to. They can feel that gap of disconnection and they blame themselves and try to fix it.

Don't put your daughter through that. Be honest. Be straight up with the money. This may mean you have to go back to work. This may mean you have to get a different job. As you said, you've got this secure little unit and it's secure for the moment, but it's not. It's not. It's got a shelf life to it. And you know that. And you've got some time before this thing finishes itself out. you got some time to make some plans. The second thing is, is grieving. Your life is changing. Someone you love, I was going to say threw a grenade, but not really. Someone you love was honest with you. You were honest back to them. And then here we are, right? And so I wouldn't even call that a

grenade, but your life changed in drastic ways. And I'm going to even go back and say you knew going in, this was a hope and a prayer. You were hoping that you would fall physically attracted to this person. You were hoping that your hints and thoughts over the years would go away. You thought that if somebody loved you enough that you would eventually come around and love them. You've got to grieve that. This is a big loss. And you've got to grieve once again your loss of trust in Jane. And I think Jane's got some really extraordinary intuition. And Jane, you have got to go see a professional counselor. You talked about childhood abuse. You talked about an abusive relationship.

The person you need to invest in right now besides your daughter is you. Go talk to a professional and unwind some of that stuff from your childhood. My guess is you've got extraordinary intuition. You have one of the best gut feelings of anyone you know in your world. And you have an extraordinary ability to squash your gut feelings, put them in a closet, shut the door, lock that door, and then go do what other people in your life want you to do, which is classic behavior of someone who's been abused as a kid. And then the third thing is you've got to decide what you want. Not somebody who has been in love with you since they were 14.

Not somebody who's transitioning to a new gender. Not somebody who tells you, well, you know what you need to be doing for your kid. Not somebody who fill in the blank. You need to take some time. You probably need to do this with your counselor. This isn't forever. You don't need a counselor forever, but you do need one for a season. You've got to ask yourself, what do you want?

You hinted a little bit. You're going to stay in this marriage. You have to be all in, and they do too. Your transitioning husband has to be all in too. 99.9% of my gut feeling is you're out. You just can't say it out loud. What do you want to do professionally? What do you want to do emotionally and relationally? What do you want to do as a mom? You've got to articulate those things. Jane, this sucks. And again, everybody, I know it's big and it's all around the bend. This is a woman with a

broken heart who once again is looking in the mirror and saying, Jane, you dummy, you made a stupid decision again. And Jane, my heart's broken for you. You didn't make a stupid decision. You're a good human being. You're an extraordinary mother. You've been a great wife. And it's time to be honest with yourself and what tomorrow is going to bring. Stop living in the past and let's move to the future. Thank you so much for that call, Jane. All right, let's go to Kristen in Oklahoma City.

Kristen, what is up? Hi, John. How are you? So good. How are you? Good so far. Better than a lot of people. All right. All right. So how can I help? I need some help walking through a little issue I'm having. I am getting married April 11th next year, and my mom is in prison.

She's been in prison for a little over a year now. She's been in and out of prison my entire – not really prison. This is her second time being in prison, but she's been in and out of jail my entire life. We were super lucky. My grandma took my sister and I in and raised us from when we were like three. Mom's not really been a great mom, but she, I mean, she's my mom. I love her. I want her to be at my wedding. She has been doing really great this time around. I think she's finally kind of figuring out that this is either going to kill her or she will, you know, kind of grow up. But see, I'm getting married on the 11th. And if she, once she finishes this program, she will maybe be released on the 5th of April.

So we're not sure if I should push back the wedding so I know that she will be out. It kind of just depends on who's in a good mood and who's not. Or if we should leave the wedding as it is and if she's there, she's there. And if she's not, she's not. So Kristen, how many times have you planned things in your life and mom didn't show up?

Everything. Everything. Yeah. How many times have you opened your heart yet again to have your heart broken? Forever. Forever. Right. So nobody, I don't know anybody in my circle that believes in redemption more than I do.

I don't know anybody in my circle of friends and community that goes on the regular basis says, let's give that person one more shot. One more chance. I'm that guy. Okay. Yeah. But you've got to let the fantasy go. Yeah. And you are still hoping and dreaming and putting your heart back out there again,

that this is going to be the time. This is going to be the time. I think you should go ahead and have your wedding. You should plan your wedding. If your mom is out, that will be great. And a bonus. And if she is reformed and healthy and lovely and wonderful,

that is so good. So good. But she's probably not going to be. Yeah. I thought you'd say that. And I don't want you to set yourself up this really important benchmark moment, this moment when you are joining futures with somebody else. I don't want you to hinge that on a myth, on a fantasy.

Right. Okay? with somebody else, I don't want you to hinge that on a myth, on a fantasy. Right. Okay? This relationship with your mom can heal, and it can take years and years and years and years to heal, and it's going to start with little breakfasts, and it's going to start with getting together once a month. It's going to start rebuilding trust. That trust is hers to build, not yours. It doesn't mean you don't love her

It doesn't mean you're not connected with her But it does mean that This time your grandparents are there This time your awesome fiance Your husband's going to be there Move forward with the date If she makes it great If she doesn't, great

And I hate saying that out loud Not because I'm just sitting here saying it I hate saying that out loud, not because I'm just sitting here saying it. I hate it because I believe so strongly in honoring our father and mother. I believe so strongly in honoring wisdom of people who are older than us and have more experience than us. But I also know that parents just, they cash in their parent card. They're abusive. They are addicts.

They've got their own demons that they wrestle with, and they push their kids aside as they deal with those things. They break the law. They end up in jail over and over and over and over again. And at the end of the day, we can love them. We can honor them. We can be respectful for them, and we can also go and continue to live our lives. And there's a tension there and it's not one and it's not the other, but there's a tension there. So you got to hold them both. And right now, Kristen, I want you to plan your wedding.

I want you, you've got a date. Everyone's going to be there. If your mom's there, it'll be one of those fairytale things that'll make for a good video. And if she's not, you're not going to get your heart broken again. You're not going to move everything around just for her. So thank you so much for that call. Go get them. And hey, when your mom gets out, call me. When your mom gets out, call me. Both of y'all call me, Kristen.

I want to hear. I want to celebrate her. And hopefully she gets done and makes that wedding. That'll be awesome. All right, let's go to April at State, in State College, Pennsylvania. April, what's going on? Hi, John. Thanks so much for taking my call.

Thank you for calling. How can I help? Well, so I've been in a relationship since May with a really wonderful guy who treats me well and who has a lot of the qualities I desire in a partner. But I just don't feel like I'm starting to fall in love with him yet. And it's almost like when he tries to get closer, I feel the urge to start to pull away. And I guess that just scares me because looking back on past relationships,

like I realized that every time that I've been in love, it's always been with a really unhealthy partner. And when I find a man who would be suitable for me, it's almost like I have a tendency to either put him in the friend zone or I just can't develop feelings for him. And I just don't know how to fix this. Sure. So a couple of quick questions then. Do you have any relational abuse in the past or just guys that cheat on you? Do you have guys that are, have been awful or ugly?

You have childhood abuse. Like give me a quick primer. So for example, my last relationship, the person had a problem with alcohol and really only wanted to see me when he was drinking and he ended up cheating on me while we were dating. Okay. But as far as my, my childhood, my older brother has cerebral palsy. And so my past wasn't abusive. It was just my parents really didn't notice me because they were really focused on my brother and his needs for most of my life. And so I was always just very self-sufficient and was trying to meet my own needs during my childhood.

So understand this. Trauma works two ways. One is what I would call affirmative trauma. Someone's alcoholic. They're abusive to you. They hit you. They yell. You see a car wreck. You see somebody get shot. Those are affirmative traumas. There's also neglect traumas where people don't give you what you should have had, which is connection and value and high touch. And daddy's looking at their daughters on a regular basis in the eye and saying, how are you? Tell me about your dragons. Tell me about your princesses. Tell me about your baseball. Hugging their sons, right? Those are both traumas. And your brain registers both of those as there is a problem in a relationship that is my fault and I've got to fix it. It also logs in, and I hate using computer metaphors, I can come up with on top of my head right now.

It begins to log in relationships hurt. There is pain here. And it begins scanning your environment for the rest of your life for somebody that's going to hurt you. And so two things emerge from that sort of – from that childhood. Number one, other people are more important than you, and it's your job to make sure you plug into others. And number two, people hurt. And so when somebody who is good and somebody who is right and somebody who is noble tries to plug into you, your brain sounds the alarms. It goes off. Danger, danger. Will Robinson, look out, run,

right? Yes, exactly. And so you think you're only worth an alcoholic idiot, and that's a lie. And now you're looking at this other dude. Do you find him attractive? Would you love to just smooch him and smooch? So what happens? You lean in to give him a kiss. What happens? I just feel really uncomfortable, I think, with any sort of physical closeness. Or if he wants to spend a lot of time together, it's almost like I just want to pull away for some reason. So is he annoying or is this on you? Is he unattractive?

Does he not shave? Does he not brush his teeth? Or is this, do you? Go ahead. Yeah, he's very attractive. And honestly, he has like all the qualities that I would want in a future husband. Like I could see a future with him. It's just the feelings aren't there yet, I guess.

I don't understand what you mean when you say the feelings aren't there yet. What does that mean? Just the feeling of like, and loveness and that spark and like wanting to be with him all the time. Like when I hang out with him, it's almost like it's a chore that I have to do to let someone else into my life. And it's almost like I'm more comfortable just like being alone. There you go. And is that a learned behavior? Is that something you've experienced your whole life? I mean, you talked about when you were a kid, you had to be self-sufficient from a young age. Yeah. Yeah, I moved out when I was 17,

and I've pretty much been on my own since. Have you ever been in love, this spark that you're craving, or are you watching Hollywood videos and wanting that? No, I was in love with the previous guy who had the problem with alcohol. And I think it may have been because he needed me and it kind of gave me like a sense of worth. There you go. So what you're going to have to do is you're going to have to come to the realization that you are worth being loved. Not you only have value when you fix other people.

You only have value when you make sure everyone else is okay, but that you have value just because. And somebody else has the right to love you the way that you want to love other people. And the broad picture here is a fear of intimacy, right? It's this fear of getting close to somebody because they're going to hurt me, that I have no value, that I'm not worth it, right? So here's a couple of things I can tell you. You've got to ask yourself, do you want to love him? And so this big clouds and rainbows and marshmallows, all of that, the lightning bolts and all that, it doesn't happen for everybody. And it happens differently for other people. And I know Hollywood so bad wants us to believe that's the way it works. It doesn't always work that way.

Some people it does, and they are lucky, and they are blessed, and that's awesome. In my house, it happened that way for my wife and not for me. She'll tell you. I looked at you. I was playing a – I was singing a song at some show, and she said, that's the guy. That's it. And she was done, like literally done. And it took me years to recognize, oh, she's the one for me, right? She is the one

I want to dedicate my entire life to. It works different for people. And so I want you to look at moving forward this way. Not as love is a lightning bolt, love is a quote unquote feeling, but that love is going to become a skill. Love and intimacy are going to become skills that you need to learn. Okay. Things you're going to have to practice and things you're going to have to be vulnerable about with other people. Okay. There's a couple of great books out there. I'll recommend one of them here. Let's talk for a second, just globally. And this isn't just for April. This is to everybody. I want to talk for a second about this idea, this fear of intimacy. Okay. Fear of intimacy. It's a broad psychological term that describes people who are afraid of being in close relationships. And this can be a challenge,

even in long-term relationships, just because you've been married a long time, having regular sex, have a few kids, doesn't mean there's not major intimacy issues. And we often think intimacy is just about sex. It's just about holding hands and kissing. Not all intimacy is sexual. It can also be emotional, spiritual, intellectual, experiential, right? We have the same interests. We have the same experiences, right? It's this idea of intimacy

is being fully known. Can I be completely honest about the thoughts in my head? Can I be completely honest about my actions, what I've done? And here's where it gets even deeper. Can I be completely honest about what has happened to me? Can I talk about my hurts, right? So can I talk about what's in my head, my thoughts and my feelings? Can I just put them out there without being judged, without being given advice? Can I talk about the things I've done? Here's some stupid stuff I said when I was in high school.

Here's somebody I hooked up with when I was in college. Here's somebody fill in the blank. Can I talk about the things I did at work that I wish I hadn't done? Whatever it happens to be. Do I have a safe place where I can come home and put that down? And can I talk about people who've hurt me? And if you're listening to this and you know what I'm talking about, it feels like doors, just one door and then another layer and then another layer, right? Being afraid of intimacy doesn't mean you don't want to be intimate. Just like April, just like you're saying, it doesn't mean you don't want it. It just, it might look like indifference, coldness, or anger, but the person who fears intimacy usually desperately longs for it.

And you've heard me talk over and over and over about intimacy, loneliness, a lack of intimacy and loneliness are killing us as a country, killing us individually. It's destroying our bodies because our bodies crave connection, right? A couple of causes of fear of intimacy comes from being hurt by others. It's complex, but it stems from attachment issues. It could come from unstable, unpredictable childhoods. Think of this line and tattoo it on your heart. Childhood biology becomes our adult biography. A few situations, as we talked about with April, parent illness, brother and sister illness, right? It's this loss of innocence at a young age before you understand fully what's going on. Parent neglect, abuse, parent substance abuse, loss of a parent, cod age before you understand fully what's going on. Parent neglect,

abuse, parent substance abuse, loss of a parent, codependency, enmeshed families, unresolved grief. Here's the deal. And April, this is specific for you, but it's also for everybody. Relationships equal risk. Always. Relationships are a risk. I don't care if you've been married for 30 years. If you've got secrets you haven't told, you know it's because it's a risk. I don't care if you've been married for 30 years. If you've got secrets you haven't told, you know it's because it's a risk. And you're afraid that that person is going to hurt you. They're going to weaponize what your secrets are. You're afraid that they're going to tell you, oh, yeah, well, you should just fill in the blank as though you're an idiot.

Relationship is a risk. And when you've seen the other side of risk Your brain and your body Try to protect you from getting hurt again Right? So here's how to overcome the fear of intimacy Number one, April, here's what I want you to do Whenever that guy This beautiful guy Who treats you well, he's a good person

Whenever he leans over to hold your hand And you're like, ah Try this Thank your brain for trying to protect you whenever he leans over to hold your hand and you're like, ah, try this. Thank your brain for trying to protect you. It's just doing its job. I want you to exhale. I don't want you to say thank you, but I'm good now. This guy's safe. Thank your shortness of breath. Thank your heart rate. Thank your body for protecting you. If you have a fear of intimacy and you know you are safe and you want to get close to somebody, thank your physical response.

And then I want you to decide what you really want. You cannot have meaningful and deep relationships without intimacy, without being able to say, here's what I'm thinking. Here's what I've thought. Here's what I've done, here's who hurt me. And you can't be intimate if you can't receive that from other people. Accept that intimacy equals risk and understand the rewards of intimacy are so worth it. And you're going to get hurt in relationships. You just are.

I want you to embrace vulnerability and own the risk. Being close with people is scary because it involves vulnerability and vulnerability is when you expose yourself to the possibility of being hurt. And if you love somebody, you will be hurt. Period. At the end of that sentence, exclamation point at the end of that sentence, you'll be hurt. You can read Daring Greatly by Brene Brown. If you want to really get into sexuality and intimacy, you can read a book called Come As You Are by Emily Nagoski. It's probably the best book I've ever read on sex. It's not a faith-based book.

It is a science book written for dumb people like me. She does a great job of just distilling things down in a very simple way. But she talks a lot about this falseness of sex being a drive and intimacy being something other than something you learn and you practice. And then go for little wins. Exposure, they call it in the psychology world. Try holding hands. Try being honest.

Ask for patience. Try writing letters or gently leaning in. Let intimacy come through letter writing where there's a little bit of distance, not through text messages, but through letter writing where there's some distance, some space. But you're being vulnerable. You're beginning to expose your thoughts, right? And when your physical alarms know off, know that you're not going to die. You're going to be okay. And your feelings are okay.

They're just trying to protect you. And then also, if you really have problems connecting with other people, you know, you've got to go see a mental health professional. If you have a pattern of a fear of intimacy, if you've got deep rooted things, April, you're telling me this stuff's been around since my childhood. You may need to get with somebody who will hold you accountable, with a professional, a mental health professional, hold you accountable, give you some things to try and practice. This is not a forever relationship. You are going to learn some new skills. It's like getting a batting coach, except you're going to get an intimacy coach or a love coach or relationship coach, right? Make an appointment to talk with a therapist or counselor. Listen to me, April, and to everyone struggling with intimacy,

men, women, beautiful people, people who don't believe they're beautiful, everybody, you are worth a relationship. You're worth being connected. You're worth being loved. You're worth all of it. All of it. Okay? You're worth all of it. All of it. Okay?

You're worth all of it. And so, I want to... Sorry, I leaned over here. I want to... I was going to do one song, but I'm doing another one. And I love it. And it kind of applies, kind of doesn't, as I wrap up the show here. This literally is one of the greatest songs of all time.

And it's classic because a husband stole this song from his wife. But the song was so great. I say stole, maybe borrowed, maybe was lent. I don't know. But he got credit for it, even though she wrote it. From the 1963 classic. Nashville's very own Johnny Cash. The song is A Ring of Fire and it goes like this.

Love is a burning thing and it makes a fiery ring. Bound by wild desire, I fell into a ring of fire. Love hurts and it's risk. I fell into a burning ring of fire. I went down, down, down, and the flames went higher. The taste of love is sweet when hearts like ours meet. I fell for you like a child, but the fire went wild. I fell into a burning ring of fire. I went down, down, down, and the flames went higher,

and it burns, burns, burns. The ring of fire, that ring of fire. This is The Dr. John Deloney Show. burns burns the ring of fire that ring of fire this is the dr john deloney show