The Dr. John Delony Show - Rough Relationship w/ My In-Laws - How Do I Set Boundaries?

Episode Date: September 15, 2021

The Dr. John Delony Show is a caller-driven show that offers real people a chance to be heard as they struggle with relationship issues and mental health challenges. John will give you practical advice on how to connect with people, how to take the next right step when you feel frozen, and how to cut through the depression and anxiety that can feel so overwhelming. You are not alone in this battle. You are worth being well—and it starts by focusing on what you can control. Let us know what’s going on by leaving a voicemail at 844.693.3291 or visiting johndelony.com/show. We want to talk to YOU!   Show Notes for this Episode Getting a divorce after 11 years; how do I learn to live alone again? Husband recently found out he is on the autism spectrum. How do I move forward? I feel very alone. I have a very rough relationship with my in-laws, especially my mother in-law. How do I set boundaries? Lyrics of the Day: "Off the Grid" - Kanye West   As heard on this episode:  BetterHelp dreamcloudsleep.com/delony Conversation Starters Redefining Anxiety John's Free Guided Meditation Ramsey+   tags: divorce, marriage, family, boundaries, sexuality/intimacy   These platforms contain content, including information provided by guests, that is intended for informational and entertainment purposes only. The content is not intended to replace or substitute for any professional medical, counseling, therapeutic, financial, legal, or other advice. The Lampo Group, LLC d/b/a Ramsey Solutions as well as its affiliates and subsidiaries (including their respective employees, agents and representatives) make no representations or warranties concerning the content and expressly disclaim any and all liability concerning the content including any treatment or action taken by any person following the information offered or provided within or through this show. If you have specific concerns or a situation in which you require professional advice, you should consult with an appropriately trained and qualified professional expert and specialist. If you are having a health or mental health emergency, please call 9-1-1 immediately.

On today's show, we talk to a young man who has just been served papers for his divorce and he doesn't know what to do next. We talk to a woman who's married to someone with autism and she feels so alone. We talk to a married woman who's dealing with her in-laws. Whoa! Stay tuned. Hey, what's up? This is John with the Dr. John Deloney Show.

We're so glad you're with us. It's a show about mental health and relationships and life. Good stuff and tough stuff. We're so glad you're with us. If you want to be on the show, love to have you. We talk about relationships. we talk about mental health Talk about psychology, talk about everything Education, parenting, all of it

Give me a shout at 1-844-693-3291 That's 1-844-693-3291 Or go to johndeloney.com Slash ask And you'll be given a form You can fill out that form. And then it goes to Kelly. And honestly, I don't know what happens after that.

I don't think anybody does. I prefer it that way. See? I don't even know where that voice came from. Kelly's literally not in this room. And her voice just pipes in as though she is the Lord. Some say it might be. I'm always watching.

Exactly. WWKD. What would Kelly do right now? Actually, you can't ask that because she may kill somebody. Yeah, please don't ask that question. WWKD. Four more drinks. Okay.

I guess we're in it. So, hey, listen. Ben, it's good to see you, man. Good to be here. James is gone. Thank God. Right, everybody? I'm just kidding. Per usual to be here. James is gone. Thank God, right, everybody? I'm just kidding.

Per usual. Per usual. James is out with his family again. So we're glad to have you on the boards, man. Thank you. Running the show. All right, hey, I'm going to start off today's show a little bit differently. Normally, we make jokes, talk funny stuff here.

So we record this show. We're usually about two, 3, 4 weeks up ahead of what's going on in the world so if there's a current event I can't always speak on it the next day or the next day after that so sometimes it's a couple weeks out

in this situation I'm glad it is I'm glad it's a few weeks out because these are situations that it's easy to forget and I learned this over the years of working with folks who have lost somebody. It's sometimes the most important thing is just to pause and say somebody's name. And so as we're listening to this, there's at least, right? So by the time this comes out, there may be more. There's at least, right, so by the time this comes out, there may be more, there's at least 13 American families that have a big, giant hole in them right now.

And this isn't a political statement. This isn't a drama statement. So if you're going to get your heart all in a bunch, you can just hit the little fast-forward button. And I know there are hundreds and thousands of untold losses in Afghanistan, Afghanistan civilians. But this morning I got a list of 13 folks, and I thought it's appropriate to just pause and say their names. And not only say their names, but say their ages. Because as I looked at this, it was hard for me to catch my breath. It's a couple of days ago, we lost 13 folks in an Afghanistan event. And man, a lot of these guys, these men and women can't buy beer yet. They can't buy lottery tickets yet Kids It's too young

Man it's heartbreaking So we're just going to take a pause for a second And honor these 13 folks And honor their families Say a prayer for the mess that's going on All over the place We're not going to blame We're not going to yell

We're not going to do that We're just going to mention these 13 folks Marine Lance Corporal David Espinosa 20 We're not going to do that. I'm just going to mention these 13 folks. Marine Lance Corporal David Espinoza, 20, of Texas. Marine Sergeant Nicole Gee, 23, California. Marine Staff Sergeant Darren Taylor, Hoover, 31, Utah. Army Staff Sergeant Ryan Noss, 23, Tennessee. Marine Corporal Hunter Lopez, 22, California.

Marine Lance Corporal Riley McCollum, 20, Wyoming. Marine Lance Corporal Dylan Merola, 20, Wyoming. Marine Lance Corporal Dylan Marolla, 20, California. Marine Lance Corporal Kareem Nakui, 20, California. Marine Corporal Dagan William Tyler, 23, of Omaha. Marine Sergeant Johnny Rosario, 25, Massachusetts. Marine Corporal Humberto Sanchez,

22 of Indiana. Marine Lance Corporal Jared Schmitz, 20, Missouri. Navy Hospital Corpsman Max Soviet 22 Ohio The ultimate My heart's out to your families To your friends

To your community To fellow servicemen and women And if I said your name wrong I'm sorry No my heart's there. You gave the ultimate. Gave the ultimate. Whew.

All right, let's go to phones. Let's go right to the phones, man. Let's go to Eric in Salt Lake City. Hey, Eric, what's going on, brother? Hey, John, thanks for taking my call, man. I admit it's been probably the toughest week and a half of my life, so I'm grateful to be here. You bet, man. Tell me about it. What's going on, dude? I was recently surprised by my wife. She served me divorce papers.

Oh, man. Not this last Sunday, but the week prior and, uh, completely complete surprise. Well, it's surprising that I, I knew we were having some tough times, uh, especially this last year, year and a half. Yeah. But I, uh, but there was never a conversation had of that. She was reaching that point and we had just begun, you know, about two weeks prior going to working with a therapist on some of this stuff. And so I, I was really hopeful and excited about that process and looking forward to

that. And so the, I guess the timing was surprising for me, man. I'm sorry. That's heartbreaking. Y'all got little ones. Uh, we do not. It's just the two of us we've been married 11 years 11 years man so what's the last couple of weeks been like for you obviously it's been hell man what's it what's it been like i feel like you know my heart's ripped out of my chest man i i i do not want this divorce to happen. She is my everything, the center of my universe, even though I don't always act like it. Yeah. And it's, I'm just clinging, grasping for some way to try and make sense of everything.

And it's unfortunate that I have family who are close that are carrying me right now, holding me up. Have you talked to her? A little bit. It's been limited. I've had a couple conversations with her, mostly logistical stuff. But we did have a chance to meet together briefly with a church leader, for example. How was that? Is she done, done, done, done? Her words were, well, the time she served paper, she said she was done, done, done. Uh, during that, uh, meeting with my, our ecclesiastical leader, I asked her for the opportunity just to try working out through

that process with a therapist. And she didn't actually give me an answer at that point. And so, uh, the answer is I'm not sure I'm getting some mixed signals. Yeah. I, I know in these kinds of moments, especially as you're walking through just an onslaught of grief, um, you're going to read the signals that best fit the hole in your heart. And, um, I would let the divorce papers that she served you ring loud and clear. Obviously don't, you know,. Obviously, don't give up if you want to stay married and continue to be kind and treat her with dignity and respect and love. Of course, you will. But also, don't imagine a scenario that may not be real, right?

Yeah. Would she meet with you one-on-one at a coffee shop? You know, I don't know if she would today, but I think if—I do believe that she would. We can get to that point before all this officially completes. Yeah, I think she would. Is that mythological thinking or fantasy thinking? Or, like, if she would meet with you today, what would happen between now and a few weeks from now that would change that? During some of our logistical conversations we've had, I say logistical meaning, you know, budget things and process. Right.

She, she, she's showing signs, I think, of softening, uh, you know, not, not, not big grand conversations. And a couple of days ago, she even gave me a hug, uh, because of something going on and just little, I'd like to think that that would, that she would meet with me to have a conversation like that. Um, but I admit, I also accept that I am an emotional, I'm an emotional rollercoaster. That's right. Yeah. And so, and, and, and hear, hear me say, um, what I don't want to do is, you're going to look for every sign that this thing may still have a heartbeat, right? And sometimes we get our signals crossed there because she may be finally breathing for the first time. She may have been thinking about this for one year, two years,

three years, and she finally may be exhaling for the first time in years. And so a hug for her may be a sense of finality. And for you, it may feel like, oh, so you're telling me there's a chance, right? So you can cross each other in the night. That's why for your soul, and we haven't even got to the question. I still don't even know why you called,

but I just started talking. But for your soul, sitting down and saying, can we meet? And be not beating around the bush. I think there's still some, be very clear. You filed papers and have you had, we've had a couple of weeks now to be working on logistics. Is there a chance that we don't go through with this? And let her speak very clearly and with the period at the

end of that sentence otherwise you're it's going to be this hanging on weird thing right it's like being in love with somebody who's on life support and every day is an up day and a down day it's going to feel like this roller coaster and you've got an opportunity to cut through the middle of it and if she won't meet with you that's a great answer right yeah that's a great answer, right? Yep. That's a firm decision answer. But I think if your marriage is going to make it, having a conversation at the beginning, or not the beginning, but here at the beginning of the end, if you will, is a good way to get some clarity.

But I just cut you off, man. So how can I help today, man? I'm so sorry you're going through this. I appreciate it, John. And between us, I am praying my guts out and working hard to make sure that if there is a way of salvaging it, that's my first priority. But the question I was calling about was I've been with my best friend and closest intimate partner for 11 years. And the thing I fear the most is being alone again when all this is over. Yeah.

And being entirely on my own, you know, economically, spiritually, we're okay. You know, we've been debt-free, Dave Ramsey fans, for a long, long time. And we've set up a really amazing life. But just that thought of being alone without without her in my world just terrifies me so the question is how do i go about finding a sense of normalcy and learning to heal and and basically how do i continue my life after uh such a long time of being a partner with somebody and not having that anymore? That's a great question. I think the most important thing to do is to mourn this like a death. We hear about divorce all the time. And it's so common that we forget how brutal and painful

and gut-wrenching it is for a thousand different reasons. You're in a fortunate situation where your finances are fine. You know what I mean? There's not kids involved. And I say you're in a fortunate situation where your your finances are fine you know what i mean there's not kids involved it's and i say you're fortunate there's there's there's less layers here and you're just feeling the emotional oh my gosh i'm gonna wake up and i'm gonna come home to an empty house foreseeably you know for the next who right i'm gonna come to an empty house right and so it's owning the fact that this is common and everybody talks about it. We all have friends whose parents got divorced. You've got to mourn this like a death, right? And so this is not an event. This is a process.

And healing is going to look different for everybody. And it's going to look different in different seasons for different people. But for you, man, knowing I got to honor this thing. Cause it's going to come over me. Like I'm out in the middle of the ocean, right? Yeah. Grief will wave over you and it will feel like I can't breathe and I'm not going to be able to, I'm going to drown and you're not, you're not, I'm just going to feel like it. And then you're going to have all sorts of the shame and the guilt and the, you know what I mean? And the failure and all the stuff you're going to feel as you navigate through this. And then you're going to get really pissed off. You're going to have all sorts of the shame and the guilt and the, you know what I mean, and the failure and all the stuff you're going to feel as you navigate through this. And then you're going to get really pissed off. You're going to be angry and you're going to want to go rage. All those things are going to be normal part of this grieving process.

But it's knowing I'm in this for a season. This isn't something I'm going to do in a couple of weeks and I'm going to be up and at them. Does that make sense? Yes, sir. And at the same time, you're going to have to be up and at them. You're going to have to eat. You're going to have to sleep. You're going to have to be up and at them. You're going to have to eat. You're going to have to sleep. You're going to have to take care of your body. You're going to have to be around other people, right? Do you have some people that are going to walk through this with you? Do you have a group of guys that are ride or die that you've had for a while in your life

that are going to be able to come over at 2 a.m. and bring Taco Bell and who are also going to come over at 2 a.m. and make sure you're not having your fifth helping at Taco Bell, right? Do you have a group of guys that are going to walk through you with this? You know, I do, but it's complicated. She and I have been married so long. Her friends are my friends. My friends are hers. Yeah.

And it's, I'm trying so hard to respect, you know, the boundaries. And I guess what my fear is, is that by bringing people in, that I'll be betraying her trust. Because I certainly have no intention of throwing her under the bus for anybody. And those relationships. Why would you be betraying her trust? Tell me about that. Well, she's had a difficult time getting friends over the years. And my closest friends, because they're around,

are the only real friends she has in her world. And what I don't want to happen is for her to feel like And my closest friends, because they're around, are the only real friends she has in her world. Sure. And what I don't want to happen is for her to feel like the world is gathered against her. So, Eric, you love this woman. And I take it that she's a good human being. And she made a grown-up decision. Yes. Right?

And my hope is that she made a grown-up decision. She thought And my hope is that she made a grown-up decision. She thought it all the way through from start to finish. And my hope is that when she held those papers and saw you, she thought, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa.

Probably not. Probably not. But you can't not have people in your life, especially people who have been your friends for years and years and years, your go-to people. You can't choose to isolate yourself in this moment because of some things that maybe it might be this, might be, that's the wrong way to think about it. She's made up grownup decisions.

She's going to have to reach out to her community. You're going to have to reach out to yours. And if they happen to overlap, they happen to overlap, right? What I'm telling you is you cannot do this by yourself. Yep. Right? You can't. You got to be really intentional about your life. Can I ask you a hard question? I welcome it. Go for it. What part of this do you got to own? I have a lot to own, John. Tell me about it. Oh man. What? That's, that's a big question, my friend. It's a rattle them off. You got them. You've been thinking about them for the last two months. I've been, I've had, I've really dealt with some significant depression. Uh,

I've been battling, uh, battling honesty issues. Okay. Being honest with her. That includes a lot of empty promises. She's heard a hundred times, I'm going to get this taken care of this time. And I meant it in the moment. I didn't have the tools or the skills. And it didn't fall through.

Okay. Uh, and probably most significantly, I think is I'm, as I've been meditating lately, I think I've, I may have been emotionally bullying her, uh, unintentionally, but I feel, I think I've been smothering her emotionally, uh, for a long time. Yeah, I think so. Okay yeah I think so I think so and something that she's been trying to articulate and I just couldn't connect the dots until I had a family member hold my feet to the fire and walk me through it

and I had an aha moment and I realized how stupid I've been so assuming this is over there's two choices and I hate to bifurcate the world like this but I'm going to you got two choices you can choose to sit in

and stew in and try to rewrite sentences of the past with the period at the end of them which does no but any good or you can take this sentences of the past with the period at the end of them, which does nobody any good. Or you can take this as the greatest sign of your life that now I'm gonna deal with me, that I'm worth not living a life of depression

under those heavy, heavy blankets and I'm gonna go get healing, that I'm gonna learn how to connect with folks and not drag them around by their emotions and their hearts. And I'm also going to find out how to have peace with the guy in the mirror because that guy's worth being loved deeply, right? Yeah. And choosing to spend the next two years, five years, ten years,

not grieving this because you're going to grieve it. You're probably always going to love this woman, right? She sounds like she's pretty special. Is that fair? The best thing in my universe. Absolutely. Okay.

So you can spend the next five, 10, 15, 20 years mourning this, missing her, and you probably will. And you may find love again, and you're still going to have a thing for her in your heart. You always will. But you can spend 10 or 15 years just lashing yourself, beating yourself up, sentencing yourself to a life of further misery. Or you can say, I'm going to be intentional about my life. I'm going to own the parts. I'm going to change my identity. I'm going to do the hard work. I'm going to go see a counselor. I've been saying I'm going to for years. I'm finally going to do it. I'm going to start taking care of my body. I've been saying it for years. I'm finally going to do it. I'm going to be intentional about being

honest with people and telling the truth for the first time in my life, because I deserve that. The people who love me deserve that and some of that is gonna start as simple as something cheesy that I do every day which is a gratitude journal which is getting an index card saying here's what I can control today right it's getting teeny tiny little bits of myself back and it's a practice and you're gonna do really good for a month you're gonna fall off you're gonna get back up the next day you a practice. And you're going to do really good for a month. You're going to fall off. You're going to get back up the next day. And you're going to go again. You're going to go again. And you're going to go again.

But listen, Eric. You're worth being well. You're worth not living a life under that cloud of depression. And you're worth telling the truth. Right? Do you believe me? Absolutely. This one may be over.

I hope it's not, man. I hope you'll keep in touch with me. I hope you'll reach out to her and say, can we meet just you and me? And if she says no, obviously you're going to treat her with respect and you're going to honor her wishes, right? If she does, you can tell her where you're at. And you can also let her know, hey, I know I've said this a million times and I've never followed through. And this one's going to be different. And by the way, here's my meeting with, I mean, my appointment with a therapist. Here's my this and here's my that. But more importantly, not to try to win her back or to try to make sure she's like,

no, man, get healing for you. And then you can fully plug into somebody else, not through emotional manipulation, not through feeling manipulation, but connected to somebody of value, love somebody of value. Somebody wakes up every day trying to support somebody else. Somebody's going to be totally honest

because what you say, what you feel, and what you believe has value because you got to try to hem-haul around things. And there's no chance on planet Earth that she's blameless in this deal too, right? So she's going to have to own herself also. But this is a process, not an event. You got to have people and you're going to have to mourn this thing.

You have to take it seriously. Don't race to move on. And on those moments when the waves crash over you and you can't breathe, hang in there. Hang in there. You're not going to drown. You're going to catch a breath back. Your body's going to resurface and you're going to have to have some people with you and you're going to go again. You're going to go again. You're going to go again. So sorry. Going through this, Eric, man. Um, we'll be thinking about you. Let, let us know how that conversation goes and we're going to hold out hope for you. Um,

and then we're going to walk alongside you, ma'am. So if she says no, let us know that too. And holler back after the divorce is final. And we'll walk you through day one, day 10, day 180. And we'll keep going from there. All right. I want you to reach out to somebody today and make sure you've got somebody that's going to walk with you through this. Thanks for the call, man. Hey, uh, we'll be right back on the Dr. John Deloney show. This show is sponsored by BetterHelp. All right, October is the season for wearing costumes and masks. And if you haven't started planning your costume yet, get on it. I'm pretty sure I'm going as Brad Pitt in Fight Club era because, I mean, we pretty much have the same upper body, but whatever. All right, look, it's costume season. And let's be honest. A lot of us hide our true

selves behind costumes and masks more often than we want to. We do this at work. We do this in social setting. We do this around our families. We even do this with ourselves. I have been there multiple times in my life and it's the worst. If you feel like you're stuck hiding your true self, I want you to consider talking with a therapist. Therapy is a place where you can learn to accept all the parts of yourself, where you can learn to be honest with yourself, and you can take off the mask and the costumes and learn to live an honest, authentic, direct life.

Costumes and masks should be for Halloween parties, not for our emotions and our true selves. If you're considering therapy, I want you to call my friends at BetterHelp. BetterHelp is 100% online therapy and you can talk with your therapist anywhere so it's convenient for your schedule. You just fill out a short online survey

and you get matched with a licensed therapist. Plus you can switch therapists at any time for no additional cost. Take off the costumes and take off the masks with BetterHelp. Visit betterhelp.com slash Deloney to get 10% off your first month. That's betterhelp, H-E-L-P.com slash Deloney. All right, we're back. Let's go to Cassie in

Kansas City. Hey, Cassie, what's going on? Hi, Dr. Deloney. Thank you so much for taking my call. I watch all your videos and you have helped me in many, many areas. I appreciate that. Those can be some, uh, I'm not very good at this. So thanks for being one of the few people that watch those videos. How can I help you? What's going on? Okay. So, um, my longterm marriage is neurodiverse, um, which we just found out a few years ago. Um, our relationship has really passed the stage of resentment, which I know you say once you get there. It's hard to come back.

So we have basically just been really good roommates for a while. When you say neurodiverse, does he have personality disorders? Does he have autism or a traumatic brain injury? What's he got? So he is on the spectrum. Okay. Where? I mean, you'll have to forgive me because I'm not familiar with the terminology at times.

But I know Asperger's is the outdated thing, but that's what we were told at the time. Cool. Hey, everybody's doing the best they can with the tools they got, so you're not going to hear me hating on you. So he's high-functioning at this point. Absolutely. Okay. All right. So you found this out when?

A couple years ago? Yes, it's been about four or five years ago. And what steps have you all taken together? Has he taken? What's the last four or five years been like? I can't say they've been easy. They have been, it was rough before that. And if I had to be honest,

I would say that the diagnosis was almost more disheartening than it was encouraging. How come? Because, because beforehand, anything that hurt my feelings or I didn't understand, I could blame it on his childhood, on the ACEs score.

He's a six. He didn't have a great one. He was never hugged as a kid. I've never seen his parents hug him to this day. Sure. So I thought I could blame it on the fact that he just didn't know better. And I could eventually teach him what I needed. But the reality is a lot of those things are because of his Asperger's, because of the autism. And I didn't know that until I could read it.

I could read articles and then it would just smack me in the face. Oh my gosh, this is – somebody else knows exactly how I've been feeling. But, but, but, but, but. I know you're hurting. Can I be super honest with you, though? And I'm not trying to be mean. No, that's okay. I'm trying to be direct.

I need it. The way you just phrased that, or the way I heard it was I would rather him be ignorant or unwilling than to have some biological challenges. And the idea that you cannot teach somebody with, who's a high functioning autistic adult ways that they can love you better is inaccurate absolutely totally you can and so whether it's childhood trauma whether it is just knuckleheaded moron idiot dude who's just like i don't know what or somebody with um some neurological challenges that may not ever connect with your feelings, but knows that these feelings are real and that you are having them. And this is the way that I can best love her in these moments, man, there's, there's choice and chance all across that thing.

So what I hear you saying is after the last four or five years, have you given up on him? Or has he said, I'm not trying? No, absolutely not. I would say at the beginning, I guess I should have said, that's how I feel now looking back at it. At the time, I was like, okay, if I can just explain these things in a different way, something may click. And now I know if you say something hurtful, then it's really not, I need to not take it so personally and then explain to you why that hurts my feelings. Yes. And then maybe it won't happen again.

Or I can explain to you what I need. And to be 100% honest, I feel like that's hard to do. It is. That's hard to have to tell somebody how to love you. It is. It's hard. Yeah. It's real hard. And you want to be able to walk home from work and walk in the door, and they look across the room, and the music swells,s and he sees you and he knows what you need, right?

I'm being totally honest, right? Totally honest. And that's not in just non-typical neurological families. That's in every marriage I've ever heard in my life, right? So but it is painful and it's exhausting and it feels lonely and hollow right? I couldn't have put it in better words but that's for sure how I felt

for a very long time. Okay. So do you want to stay married? You sound like you're done. I feel like I wouldn't be calling you if I was done, maybe. Okay. I feel like I'm just desperate because I feel like I know we can do this. I know we can do this.

And I just don't have the tools to do it. And the people that I reach out to, we've gone to marriage therapy. We've gone to marriage counseling. He's seen a therapist on his own. We have just had bad luck after bad luck as far as that's concerned to where they're either, it's not really their forte. Like they come at our marriage with a neurotypical mindset and that's not helpful. Or one in particular that we went to see told me that I just needed to learn how to live in an autistic world.

And that didn't ring true to my heart either, because the truth is this isn't, you know, regular life isn't going to change for him. And I don't mind. That sounds horrible. No, it doesn't at all. And hey, here's the thing. I guess I would refute that. And there can be some autism specialists that can write in. I'd love to be shown I'm wrong here. My experience, which is admittedly limited, is it is equally lonely and hollow living inside an autistic mind. And while they may not be able to experience some of the same experiences that a neurotypical person might, I don't even know what that means anymore, but what you might feel, right? They do, they can experience the joy, the pleasure of knowing that they are caring for somebody in a way that that person has asked to be cared for. I've seen it and it's really remarkable. And I've also worked with folks who have to remember, oh, this is when I make that smile on my face because that brings joy to the people around me. And this is when

I raise my eyebrows and say, wow. But that in and of itself is an expression, that attempt, that try, that leaning into is such a powerful expression of love, even though it looks different. Does that make sense? Absolutely. And so I do get 100% that the Hollywood version of this is over, right? And it can be so lonely. And you say all the time, you? And it can be so lonely. And you say all the time, you know, have a funeral for it.

Yeah. Believe me, I was already there. I was there. I already have. I listened to you a year ago. Yeah. You know, that I'm never going to have the husband who writes me a love song. Except if you said once a month

I need you to write me a love poem and you are allowed to use somebody else's lyrics and then you would know how non-intuitive that is, how hard that is, what a challenge that will be and he'll do it anyway.

And what you're going to have to do is decide just because it's on his calendar, it doesn't mean less. And just because he doesn't have long hair like Fabio and he's holding, I can't believe it's not butter and he's not riding a dragon or whatever, that it's still romantic even though

it looks different. Does that make sense? It 100% makes sense. And so it's coming to, that it's still romantic, even though it looks different. Does that make sense? It 100% makes sense. And so it's coming to, and here's the thing, in completely neurotypical couples, the idea of putting sex on a calendar is always this, like, everyone feels like, well, if we have to put on the calendar, then we shouldn't even be married. And I just call bull crap on that. If we have to plan dates, they're not really dates. It's stupid. Yes, they are. Does that make sense? None of this looks like Hollywood, right? And so,

it has never, it has never looked like Hollywood. It never has. And I don't, and I don't have dreams of it looking like Hollywood. Oh, I know. I know. I'm speaking to everybody, right? You're way past that, I know, I know. You're way, way, way past that here. So have you sat down, and you may have done this, have you sat down and said every Sunday night, that will be our planning for the week, and we're going to plan our budget,

we're going to plan our calendar, and we're going to plan my needs? Because here's what I'm telling you. If every married couple on planet earth did this, the world would look very different in a positive direction. If everybody sat down and said, here's what I need right now. Here's what I need this week. Here's the hands motion I need when I am saying something that's hurting your feeling. My wife and I have had these conversations recently because she's going through some shifts that are setting some of my old alarms off

in a way we've been together for 25 years. And I didn't know we were there. And I had to say, when I start responding like this, I need you to just reach your arm out and then I'll know. And she's like, got it. And she's done it twice. It's been amazing, right? But it's that, and it feels so un-Jack and Rose, right?

Like I just, we saw each other in the Titanic. It's just supposed to be, this is not how it's working. So if you had that conversation, would he love you enough to lean into it? We have had many of those conversations. For an example, our intimacy, there just isn't any anymore. Okay, but have you said, I need sex three times a week and I need it like this? I need dress-up night this night.

I need music night this night. I need old, boring, married sex on this night. Have you done that? I have said, I need 10 minutes of your undivided attention every night after the kids go to bed. Okay. And what is that? Undivided attention is amorphous for me. So have you said,

I need 10 minutes of you holding my hand and I want you to take off your shirt and I just want to hug you skin to skin. Or I want you just to listen to me chit chat. Like, what have you been specific? And the reason I'm saying that is, is that I've had to do that in my own marriage. Every couple I work with has to end up there in their own marriages. And I'm trying to tell you, you're not crazy, but it is going to take a heightened level of, and I'm not trying to say that your marriage is typical. It's not, you've got some deep challenges in this thing, but you're going to have to get that specific. And that specificity can become really erotic and really fun and really directive.

Does that make sense? It does. Am I crazy? You're not crazy. For me, I thought, I mean, for months I asked for, I just need a deeper connection with you. I just want me and you to have a relationship again.

I just want to check in. How are you doing? How am I doing? How are you feeling? What's going on in your world I just want to like check in. How are you doing? How am I doing? How are you feeling? What's going on in your world? I want to, I want to, I wanted that.

And then that didn't work out very well. So then it got to just come and let's talk for 10 minutes. And apparently what I hear you saying is I need to be even more specific than give me 10 minutes of your time each night. When you say that to me as a husband, I don't know what that means. Like I, I, is that chit chat time? Do you want us to go French kiss for a while? Do you want me just to sit there and nod? Do you want me to fix?

I don't know what that means. I think there's a scenario here where you could have a blast coming up with a weekly marriage worksheet that your autistic husband is going to check off. How was your day today? Did you have mostly positive things happen at work? Did you have negative things happen at work? What made you sad? What made you experience joy? And y'all check this worksheet off together. Is that ridiculous? Yes. Is that intimate? Yes. And so what I'm telling you is there, and that's why I asked, are you done? Because what it feels like is that level of intentionality that can, how long have y'all been married? 16 years. There you go. Every 16 yearold marriage I know is in this boat. Not as deep as yours. Yours is unique. Hear me say that. But every 16-year-old marriage I know of starts speaking in, I just miss the old us. Or we just aren't having sex like we used to. Or the kids are, and it becomes this speaking in generalities in these big grandiose pictures and everybody starts, you've heard me say this over

and over. I'll say it again. We think in pictures, but we, but we speak in words. And so when you say, I just need 10 minutes of your undivided attention, he has a picture in his head of what that looks like. And you do too. And you're missing each other because your pictures are different. You're both using the same words and he thinks he's doing right. Or when you say, I need sex this week, he says, great. And his picture is six minutes and we're done. And your picture is, I just need some glass of wine and the music. I need the kids to disappear and I need it to be like we were dating. Right. Does that make sense? And so it's that level of it's not less romantic. And in fact, if you can get into the head part of this, the desire and the eroticism part of this and let your head go crazy about the guy that you love, it can be real fun.

And you can begin to practice desire with specificity. And you can practice desire with explicit here's what I need. Here's what connection looks like. And I haven't met, I haven't, again, admittedly, I haven't worked with a ton of folks with autism, but the high functioning adult autistic folks that I've had a chance to work with love that level of specificity. And the guys I've been around, the men and women I've been around are all in, right? Because they want so badly to connect. And I would really recommend you give that a shot.

High levels of specificity. Say beginning this week, we have a Sunday night meeting, you and me. No kids, they're off, whatever, whatever. And we're gonna plan the week. We're gonna plan love. We're gonna plan budget. We're going to plan budget. We're going to plan, I don't know, calendars.

And we're going to start from there. And then start being as specific as possible. And if you can co-create a worksheet together, co-create the calendar together and say, these two nights are sex nights. This night is hugging night. And I want 30 minutes of hugging and I want you to wear these clothes. Yeah, I know it's different.

It's never been in a Hollywood movie. Maybe it has, I don't know. And here's the other thing. He can learn forgiveness and grace and he can learn not record keeping of all your faults, which I know that's can be a challenge in these type of relationships. He can practice self-awareness.

He can practice being quiet, practice asking kind questions. So maybe on a worksheet, you say, ask me three questions about my day. And again, you're teaching. And is that your job? No, but is that gonna help bring you all together? Yes.

He can learn to be gentle with the truth, right? He can. And when I say that, he can say, is that what you're wearing? Versus a very direct, ugly comment about your, right? All those things starts with you being really intentional. And here's what I want to tell you. If you feel you started this call saying, man, we've been in resentment a long time. The way out of resentment is an all in. I'm doubling down with intentionality. That's the only way out. I'm going to be hyper, hyper, hyper intentional.

And I think you can do it. So here's what I want you to do. I want you to have this meeting with him and let him speak into it. I don't know a lot of people who once they say, hey, let's put this stuff on the calendar that would, that want to push back. Hopefully he wants to be all in too. I want you to have this meeting. And then once you write me back, let me know how that meeting went. And we'll be thinking about you along the way. Get two or three or four Sunday nights into this deal. And let me know if things have changed because my God tells me it can. My God tells me it can, but it does mean you're going to be super specific and you may need to go see

somebody to talk about your loneliness, your anger, your, ah, this looks so different, but you said you've already had the funerals for what was, and now it's time to plan for what could be. And I know I'm high optimistic on this one. I am, I am, I am, I am. Double down on intentionality and specificity and we'll see what happens. All right, stay tuned. We'll be right back on the Dr. John Deloney Show. Hey, what's up? Deloney here. Listen, you and me and everybody else on the planet has felt anxious or burned out or chronically stressed at some point. In my new book, Building a Non-Anxious Life, you'll learn the six daily choices that you can make to get rid of your anxious feelings and

be able to better respond to whatever life throws at you so you can build a more peaceful, non-anxious life. Get your copy today at johndeloney.com. All right, one more. Let's go to Sierra in Seattle, Washington. What's up, Sierra? Hey, Dr. John. How we doing? I'm doing great. How are you?

I am rocking on to the break of dawn. What's going on? How can I help? Oh, man. Life goals fulfilled. Okay. Listen, with all due respect, you've got to set higher goals for yourself. That's awesome. All right. So what's up?

No, no. Achieve your dreams before age 30 and then... Yes, but you want to shoot for the moon, not for like a medium-sized Volkswagen, right? Not for a small car. But anyway, okay. So what's up? How can I help? Hey man. All right. So, um, I, I have a difficult relationship with my in-laws in particular, my mother-in-law and I know I'm totally unique. I've never heard this call. Okay. So, oh my gosh, I know. What is unique? Um, what is difficult? I, well, so a bunch of things, uh, mostly we'd have very, um, it's very strange, especially since my husband, I moved to the other side of the state. So, um, there's a lot of mismatch expectations. Um, I see in my mother-in-law that she's not, she doesn't respect a lot of my

boundaries, a lot of my expectations for how I would like to be treated. And we've been working on it for like five years. And it's one of those things where every time it starts to feel like we're making some progress, we get set back right back to the very square beginning again. And she'll call my husband up and say things like, I don't know if we can all meet up as a family. You know, can just you and the kids come visit? Not, like, can you leave Sierra at home? What's your husband say to that nonsense? No way, Mom.

That's my wife. Good for him. You married well. I did. I did. She raised a good boy despite her nonsense. So what do you do that's so terrible? Fix it, Sierra. I'm just kidding. What happens?

Well, so, I mean, first of all, we moved away. We had an opportunity to, you know, for my husband to pursue a career. He wanted to be in and for us to move to a much lower cost of living area. And so we did. And that means we took the only grandkids in the family with us. And you recognize that she can't be mad at her darling little boy, and so she's got to take swings at the next adult in line, which is you, right? Yeah. There you go. Exactly. And you recognize you don't deserve that crap too, right?

Oh, yeah. No, I mean, we made the best decision we could. And frankly, looking at both sides of our families, they made that decision at one point too. And, um, so one of the things that really, you know, has broken my heart about this whole struggle and the fact that this relationship has been so difficult is I was so excited to have two intact sets of grandparents nearby for my kids. Because both my husband and I lived in places where it just wasn't possible for our grandparents to be around a ton. And so I was really, really excited about that. And then we had this opportunity to move and my family's close

but his is not. They're about four hours away. So they're not like, you know, it's not East Coast, West Coast, but it's a wave, right? And so makes visits puts a lot of burden on visits to be super fun and super action-packed and super busy. And one of the big sticking points has been things like because we moved away, my in-laws feel like it's our obligation to come to them. Hey, Sierra. Sierra. You're not crazy. Thank you. And your in-laws are immature. And they're not crazy. Thank you.

And your in-laws are immature. And they're jerks. And your kids deserve better than that. Your husband deserves better than that. And you deserve better than that. Thank you. And in your head and in your heart, it's never going to add up. Because you got two people that it makes no sense that

they don't act like adults. Now, adults would be heartbroken that their only grandkids moved away. Of course they would. And they would miss you like crazy. Of course they would. I'm from Texas. Four hours is your next door neighbor, right? That's not a long, that's a weekend. That's a, we're coming to hang out and we're just going to head home, right? It's not temper tantrum. And that if you don't see us, then I guess it, because here's what's going to happen. Your kids are going to make extraordinary,

wonderful, intimate relationships with your parents. And they are going to be ride or die with your parents. And it's going to be awesome. One, because your parents are close. Two, because your parents aren't acting like children. They already are. It's awesome. So special.

Here's who's missing out. How many kids do you have? We have a three-year-old, a one-year-old, and we're another on the way. Yeah, awesome. Here's who the big loser here is. Your husband's parents. They're the losers.

You know why? Because they're not going to get to meet and love and be intimately close to three wonderful little kids. They're going to take their grown-up temper tantrums and miss out on the life of three extraordinary little kids. They're going to miss out on their son who they raised, who's a great guy, who's going to be a great dad, who's a great husband. They're going to miss out on all of that because they're throwing grown-up temper tantrums.

And you can't do anything about it. And so the hardest thing you're going to have to do is mourn the fantasy of the four living grandparents that were going to be so great because you got two and anytime anytime a set of parents calls outside of some abuse issues some major addiction, some major addiction issues, some major violation stuff, and would ever say something like, hey, can you and the kids just come but don't bring her? Good for him for saying, absolutely not, that's my wife. And that is the clear signal to you guys. It's time for you all to move on.

And that means you're going to have to make your own Thanksgiving plans and your own Christmas plans. And that means that you can say things like, we're having Thanksgiving dinner with our friends here. And it's going to be Thursday at 4 p.m. You're welcome to join us. And that's it. And they get to make grown-up choices about whether they want to be in your life and in your kid's life or not. Because you guys are going to do Thanksgiving with or without them.

Does that make sense? Yeah. And it's hard for a second. And then once you draw that boundary and you hold it up for the first time, and it's going to come at a big moment, right? It's going to come at some big dramatic, oh, you mean you're not coming to our whatever Halloween event? Nope. We're doing trick-or-treating here. You're welcome to join us that night. We're going to have three kids under the age of four,

so we're not going to have, y'all are going to need to get a hotel, but we'd love to have you here. It'd be great. And here's the event that we're going to be at. And if they choose to join you, awesome, awesome. And if they don't, they made a grown-up choice. And it's okay to be sad, but you can't own it. And you got to, if it's so trite and so silly,

you just got to set it down. And that starts really with just mourning it. Is your husband's heart broken by all this? Is he surprised? Or sometimes this is a surprised or did he sometimes this is a big surprise when grandkids are involved often though like dude i grew up with these parents they've been acting like this for years yeah it was it's been an evolving thing like when we were first married it's not that my husband couldn't see what was wrong but you know he'd

been in the soup for so long and he couldn't see quite why it was affecting me so much. So it's taken him a little while, but it's one of those things that once you see it, you can't unsee it. And so he's ride or die with me, for sure. And he's like, you're my future and the mother of my babies and all of that. And so he's like, Mom, the idea of me coming for a visit with just the kids and not my wife is asinine. I'm not doing that.

So here's what we're done with. Here's what we're done with. We're done with long, dramatic phone calls. And we're done with long, dramatic text exchanges. We're going to move into a season of boundaries, which is going to be information transmission. Okay? Doesn't mean you don't love them. It means you are wasting everybody's time by having these long, finally, we're here. And you hang up and you're like, finally, this adult is going to act like an adult.

They're not. Five years, five years of this. Okay. So what would be really awesome Is to send out here in the next 30 days You and your husband sit down and plan it out Send out Holiday plans 2021 Here's what we're doing And send it in an email That's very concise

We will be spending Christmas with my family On these days We will both be at work So we're not going to be able to hang out. We will have this weekend off. If you'd like to come visit us, that would be wonderful. Due to, you don't even have to give a due to. We will not be traveling this year. We will be doing Thanksgiving at our house.

We do plan to have some friends over and some neighbors and some community members over. We'd love to have you too. You're invited. That is it. And any dramatic email response and he calls your husband and is like, can you believe it? That's their choice. That is the choice they are making, right? And this is going to be hard on your husband. This is like making me sad thinking about this because I always want to honor my parents i always want to honor the adults in my life that's the right thing to do and it's hard when ultimately i have to make boundaries and i don't fortunately i won the lottery with my in-laws i won the lottery

with my so but what i'm saying like even the even in our relationships though boundary i mean clarity and boundaries are super important. That way, it just doesn't turn into this weird, everybody's on the same page. Does that make sense? So everybody's going to win

by doing this anyway. And you can send this email to your parents too. We'd love to have you here at this time. It's going to be so great. And then you're going to find in your home

with you and your husband and three rambunctious bananas kids running around. One of them's not going to be running around. One of them's going to be, yeah, not running around. Oh, I can't believe you have three out of four. It's going to be awesome. Oh them's not going to be running around. One of them's going to be, yeah, not running around.

Oh, I can't believe you have three out of four. It's going to be awesome. Oh, it's going to be so exciting. Well, so that's actually something I wanted to ask you about. Okay, go quick. We're up against the clock. Go quick. What do you got?

Sure, sure. So we just had a visit, and I know they're going to be off my back for a bit, but the holidays are coming, and then right after the holidays, we're going to see. And so I'm trying to figure out and get my head around, what do I say about meeting the new baby? Whatever you want. It's your baby. It's your house. It could be, my mom's coming to stay with us for three weeks to take care of the two little ones,

while I either... You got to go back to work, your husband's work, whatever. And we will be accepting visitors at our house on the beginning, fill in the blank. That's it. It doesn't have to be dramatic. It doesn't, and obviously you're not going to be punitive and be ugly and rude and disrespectful, or it might be, they can swing by. They're not going to be able to stay at your house because your mom's going to be staying there, or nobody's going to be staying there. You're welcome to come. We're not going to have any visitors staying with us,

but you're welcome to come by and hold the baby and see the baby and do all that kind of stuff. You can take our little kids out to dinner while I'm recovering or whatever. You set the boundaries. It can be whatever you want. And this could be a really hard, heartbreaking time, or you could write this email with a smile on your face.

Like, oh my gosh, this is my baby and my house. We get to co-create. Imagine that. Yeah, we get to decide. We get to decide. It's up to us. It's our house, right? What a cool season. What that. Yeah. We get to decide. We get to decide. It's up to us. It's our house. Right. What a cool season. What a cool season. Whenever our second child was born, my wife gave me a list like for the hospital. Don't say this, these things don't ask these questions. And I was

like, Oh, okay. It made the, everything so great. It made everything so great. She sent an email out to my mom, to her mom. It was wonderful. Everybody was on the same page, right? And there wasn't any of this weird, like, do we come in? Do we not come in? Are we coming over? It was just clean as could be.

It was awesome, right? You, you, Sierra, get to choose. Now, don't fire this off without your husband. Obviously, sit down with him and say, here's what I'm thinking. We're going to draw the boundaries. Here's what it's going to look like. And so you get to dream and imagine October, November, December, January. You get to just make the rules here.

So great. So cool. Respectfully and with dignity, your life, your boundaries go from there. Hopefully, hopefully, your in-laws will stand up and say, wow, this is incredible. Good for them. Good for them. We're going to honor this family, this new young family. We're going to honor them.

We're going to love them. They've made some great grown-up decisions. We miss those grandkids so bad. We miss our son. We kind of miss Sierra, but not really. And we're going to honor what they're saying. Or they're going to throw temper tantrum. But for five years, you guys have tried the same thing. You've got to do something different.

This is about boundaries. This is about respect. This is about dignity. This is about y'all making grown-up choices and them making grown-up choices. They're big boys and girls, and they did what they did, and so did y'all. Proud of you for doing what's right for your family. Now you're going to go into a new season. You're going to mourn the end of this fantasy of these magical four grandparents, and you're going to deal with the reality of two pretty cool grandparents

and two who sometimes act like children. Heartbreaking, heartbreaking, heartbreaking. But that's where we're at. That's reality. Let's go, let's deal with that story and go from there. Thank you so much for your call, Sierra. Thank you so, so, so much. I was joking at the beginning.

You're not the only one. Everybody deals with this. Everybody deals with this. So thank you so much for being vulnerable and telling your story. All right, let's wrap up today's show. My boss's boss happened to come through here. Suzanne walked in, and I said, hey, Suzanne, pick the greatest song of all time.

Pick the song of the day. That's actually what I said. I said, pick the song of the day. I didn't say of all time. Pick the song of the day. That's actually what I said. I said, pick the song of the day. I didn't say of all time. And she said, she's been blowing up the new Kanye record. Ben,

that's got your number all over it. It really does. You digging it? Oh yeah. I haven't spent enough time with it. I'm just kidding.

I haven't actually listened to it. Is that bad? I mean, it means you're, you're like my resident hip hop guy. And so,

I feel like you failed me, but it's cool. Yeah. I've just heard all the drama around it. I haven't dug into it. I need to sit down and experience Kanye records when they come out. I just haven't had the time. And I don't have... I have a CD player in my car.

Evidently, they're not making CDs anymore. Except for John Mayer's new record came out on cassette, which was kind of dope. Don't have one of those players either, but it's cool. So this one's to you, Suzanne. Off the brand new Donda record, Kanye West's Off the Grid. And it goes like this. We off the grid, grid, grid.

This for my kid, kid, kid. For when my kid, kid, kids have kids. Everything we did for the crib. Everything we did, how we live. What? All this smoke got a scent. All this smoke heaven sent. Scent?

Everything. I spoke what I meant. I never disguised my intent. Lines outside the event. We off the grid, grid, grid right here on the Dr. John Deloney Show.