The Dr Louise Newson Podcast - 037 - Ageing Well, Menopause and Yoga - Claudia Brown & Dr Louise Newson

Episode Date: March 3, 2020

In this episode, Dr Louise Newson is joined by yoga teacher, Claudia Brown who runs workshops at Newson Health Menopause and Wellbeing Centre.  Claudia is an Om Yoga magazine columnist and runs classes, workshops and retreats in the West Midlands. She also works with professional footballers, teaching yoga at Doncaster Rovers Football Club! Together, Dr Newson and Claudia discuss ageing well and the menopause, demystifying meditation, how yoga is more than physical postures and why everyone should give it a try.  Claudia's Top Three Tips for beginning your yoga journey: Just do it! Don't be afraid to start, ask for recommendations and try different classes to find the right teacher. Don't get caught up in buying the right outfit or equipment. You can practice yoga in just about anything! Don't talk yourself out of it because of your body size - it isn't relevant to your strength or how your body moves. You will always be among friends in a yoga studio. www.yogabyclaudia.com  Twitter – yogabyclaudia  Instgram – yogabyclaudia  Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/yogabyclaudiauk/  To find out more about Claudia's yoga workshops at Newson Health, or to book your place, click here.

Welcome to the Newsome Health Menopause podcast. I'm Dr Louise Newsome, a GP and menopause specialist, and I run the Newsome Health Menopause and Wellbeing Centre here in Stratford-upon-Avon. So today I'm going to do another podcast about yoga. Some of you might have heard the one I've done a while ago with Lucy Holtam, and today I've lured Claudia Brown into my clinic today. So hi Claudia, thanks for coming. Hi, Louise.

Thank you for having me. No, it's great to see you. So we met probably just over a year ago in Manchester, didn't we? Did at the yoga show in Manchester. Yeah. And some of you might know, I trained in Manchester. And in fact, the app that we're developing is with a team in Manchester. So Manchester is very close to my heart.

So I came up to this yoga show, feeling a bit scared because I'm clearly a doctor and not a yoga teacher, although I do love yoga. And you, just brilliant. So you came and we were passing. I stalked you. You stalked me a bit. I do. And now you've actually come to, this isn't the first time you've come to my clinic, is it?

You've come a few times and been working in my studio that we've got in. We've got this lovely yoga studio and you've been helping some women. Not all the patients, but people that have come. So I think the work that you're doing is fantastic. You're full of enthusiasm. And I've, for many of you know, I've done yoga for nearly 17 years, actually. I've stopped obviously when I was pregnant. And it's really good for me personally, for my body.

my mental and physical fitness as well. And if I don't do it, I certainly my mind starts to become less focused. And it's really important. My yoga teacher, one of my yoga teachers, James Critchlow, is now and his, I won't say how old he is, but he's been doing yoga for decades, shall we say. And he is very inspirational and he's quite old style in that I do a shangar yoga and he's very experienced, very knowledgeable. But I have seen various yoga. teachers that are just come on because it's quite trendy now. Oh, yes, absolutely. So as you know that we have you, there's Lucy Holtham as Petra, who's doing some menopause and yoga workshops, and James obviously teaches me. And I'm very

particular about who comes in and uses my yoga studio. Yeah. But you're all different. So, which is great. We're all different. So, but talk me through how you've come to be even a yoga teacher. Yeah. Well, I'm a bit of a cliche, really. I worked in local government. for many years. I had a very traditional corporate management role, which I ended up finding quite stifling, quite stressful, didn't enjoy it. It was a very good job. I worked with some lovely people. I'd always done yoga. I naturally am quite a lazy person. And yoga was really the only exercise I didn't hate. And so I'd always had this idea in my head about being a yoga teacher and decided that I was going to do my training

but probably wouldn't teach. It was more just for my own knowledge, for my own practice, and just a bit of a challenge really. So I did my training, still was working at the council at that point at Staffordshire County Council and a lot of my colleagues were saying,

well, if you do a class, we'll come. We've always wanted to do yoga. And so I thought, well, I'll maybe do that just as a bit of a hobby. and that was really how it all began and I found that I really enjoyed it that it was something that it was that magical if it doesn't feel like work

you never work a day in your life and actually it was the first time you know in my sort of early 40s that I experienced that even though I'd quite enjoyed the jobs that I'd had so I did start to think more seriously about making this my career and went to do some more training

and that's something that's really important to me it's about that continuous development and it touches on what you said there about being very choosy about who you bring into the studio here at your centre in that the 200-hour training you do it is just the beginning. I remember Anne-Marie Newland, who I train with, some power yoga saying

this is just the start of your journey and I remember thinking that's ridiculous. I've learned so much. What on earth is she talking about? And I remember about three months in thinking, hmm, okay. Right, I've got these people standing in front of me and I'm saying the same things and I'm delivering the same content. I need to step this up. How do I do that?

Yes. So I actually decided that I would do some sport yoga training because I didn't really want to go into pregnancy yoga. I've never been pregnant by choice. I didn't want to do kids yoga. I love my nieces. Everybody else's kids, I can take or leave. So, you know, I just thought, yeah, I quite fancy that. I knew about this lady that had done all the yoga with Ryan Giggs at Man United,

found her, you know, on the internet. And she was putting together her first ever training. And that was how I then got into this amazing training course with Sarah, whose anatomy knowledge is just like she's done some sort of medical training. And that really was then the beginning of me having a... career as a yoga teacher. I got some work at West Bromwich Albion Football Club, so I was working with elite athletes at the time they were in the Premier League. So I was putting into practice all this amazing content that I'd learnt with Sarah. Then went in the opposite direction completely in terms of

relaxation, Yoga Nidra with Uma, who Lucy has also trained with. So you'll find that a lot of yoga teachers will have very similar backgrounds that tend to come together. So Lucy and I have a lot of similarities met for the first time this morning in your waiting room. I know it's great. Yeah. And so I always joke that I can teach from sweaty to snail pace. Yeah, which is really important. It is so important. When I first went to a yoga class and the only reason I went is because it fitted in with, I just had one child then and she was about six months old and I thought, I need to do a bit of exercise and I don't like running. I don't like going to the gym. But you know you have to do it. But you know you have to do it. It's like doing the laundry, isn't it?

Yeah, totally. And swimming I've always liked. But it's like. it's a bit of a faf having to dry your hair. Oh, you get wet. Florey. But I went. And the teacher was very good, but he was very fast. And it was, come on, come on, you know, race through it. And he was doing the same with everyone.

And I then thought, actually, this is, I like the feeling and I like the way that my heart was racing. I was sweaty. And I could see the merits of it. But I thought, actually, like you say, he was doing the same for everyone. And it just didn't feel right. And as I've had various injuries and I've had various injuries and I've had various. operations. James Critchlow has modified my yoga practice and you know when you see and that's where the skill is absolutely and I think knowledge of anatomy is really important like you say. Which you don't get

on your 200 hours. Some get non I was lucky we actually did quite a lot on mine. Still sort of GCSE biology kind of level it's not enough. No and I think I mean quote me if I'm wrong but you know Every day I do yoga, it feels different and it depends where I am, mentally, physically, hormonally. There's so much that changes. And what I want to do when I'm on my mat is to have a very special sacred time where all my thoughts of everything else have gone and I'm doing something for me. But I want to feel good at the end. I don't want to feel a failure at the end because life's hard enough. There's lots of times that I feel inadequate, but I don't want to on my yoga mat.

and James and I know you do and Lucy have this magical way of making any practice feel a really special practice because you'll never get that time again and so I think that's it's a skill though it's really important isn't it? My dad said to me when I first started teaching he says well I'm from West Cumberer if you're in the entertainment business you've got to give them a laugh and they'll keep coming back

and I thought yeah it's right because you know people are investing their time So if they're choosing to give up an hour plus travel to get to you. It's a bit commitment, isn't it? The least you can do is learn their name, engage with them. You know, I mean, I always joke about, well, this week we'll be talking about Game of Thrones. So if you haven't seen it, and it's just making it for me, it's just making it an experience. And people will often say, oh, I'm not very good at yoga.

Or, oh, I don't think I'm flexible enough. And it's like, listen, you've won when you come through the door. because sometimes for some people that's the really hard bit is to actually make the commitment or find the time to actually do anything. Absolutely. And so I think if they've actually managed to get to class, then everything else is a bonus.

Yeah, and I think certainly for me having a studio here is obviously a great privilege, but a lot of women, myself included, don't really want to go to gym where they're half your age, they've got the most beautiful figures, and then you feel inadequate as soon as you walk in the door. Whereas here you can either have small groups or one to one. And so those barriers are broken down from the start, aren't they?

I was really aware as a yoga teacher. So when I qualified, I was in my early 40s, I am very curvy and have become curvier as, you know, the perimenopause appeared in my life. You know, I have huge natural boobs, which you can't do anything about. And I was very conscious that I was not this typical, typical, you know. that's what makes it great for you because there's nothing was it looking at your instructor thinking I'm never going to be able to be like that. And that is exactly what the feedback is that I've had. So many of my friends and people who come to my classes have said, well, you know, but you look like me.

And, you know, they love it when I make a mistake in class or if I fluff a pose when I'm demoing because it almost makes it okay for them to do that. And, you know, I'm really open with people that my relaxation. time. You know, I schedule a nap. My go-to is Netflix on the sofa, the crown, is the current fave. You know, and actually the older I've got, the more important it is to rest and to actually make time to top up the batteries. I think it's really important. And I think the other thing is social media, obviously, as we spoke about before, we started recording, is very powerful. It's very good for connections. But actually, you're only seeing a tiny part of someone.

life, you know, and it's all, there's so much pressure that we have these perfect lives. None of us do. We always have chaos where we, you know, we're running late, we're shouting at children's or our partners. We're getting a new fridge today. You should see my kitchen. Yeah. So, but you're not going to put that on your Instagram story or whatever. So it's really important that we look after ourselves as well because, as you know, I've called this clinic a menoples and well-being centre. And I think as I've got older, I've realised that actually we have responsibility to look after ourselves. We think our friends and family care and of course they care but they're not with us every second of the day like we are and we have to make the right choices. And you still vanish what

they seek? Yes absolutely. So you can manage certain moods conditions. Of course absolutely and deep down you're not really going to tell people how you feel and it's only that sort of very small group for me, your husband and few friends that know. You know exactly. that actually there's maybe something else going on. You know, unless I do and quite regularly will be teaching a class and have a hot flush. And, you know, even for me the first time that happened, really, was actually when I was running a session for Staffordshire Police

who do a lot of amazing stuff around supporting the women that work for the service that are going through menopause. And they were having a session on relaxation, which I was going in to do, because I run classes there as well. And the next speaker on was one of the occupational health ladies to talk about menopause. Susanna, who I know as being content with you.

And, yeah, sat there and just, you know, glowed and sweated and said, this ladies, is what you're talking about next? And I can remember sitting there thinking, oh, my word, this is starting to happen. You know, and I was, what, 43, 44? Because, you know, that magic number, 51. It's not real, is it? No.

So, well, this is the thing, and as I'm sure many of you know, that 51 is the average age of the menopause in the UK. Average being the... None of us are average. And for many women, they experience perimenopausal symptoms, so a time when periods change in frequency or nature, and symptoms start because hormone levels start to reduce. And it can be, and often it is in the early 40s that it occurs, and we don't always expect or prepared for it. So you went from footballers, and now you're doing some with middle-aged... How does that go from me? Well, the facial hair's very similar.

It really came about through my own experiences, but also beginning to talk about that in my classes. Because I think having found you pretty much by mistake on the internet, but, you know, trying to find out more, but also one of the teachers that I trained with, Uma Dinsmore Chuli, who's written this amazing tome called Yoni Shakti, which is very much about the feminine journey from birth to death.

And that was the first sort of real information that I found that was really credible about perimenopause. It was something that I didn't even know was a thing. You know, and I like to think I've been well educated and reasonably healthy. But obviously, you know, I remember my mum's menopause quite vividly. So I did know quite a bit about it. She had twitchy legs and would have the sweats and the facial hair and lost hair.

And she was really lucky, had a really good female GP who put her on HRT. When it wasn't common, there was six types. That was it. Yeah. And so, you know, and I actually said to my mum this weekend, she came to stay. And I said, you know, you're really lucky, mum, that you had a GP that was switched on. And she said, oh, yeah, it was Dr. Sumner, Dr. Helen Sumner. and that was, you know, she was my doctor as well, a fabulous lady.

But yeah, so it's come from my own experience, really, of starting to talk about this in class. Predominantly females attend my classes, but actually men, you need to know about this if you've got a woman in your life. Absolutely. Be it your mother, your partner, your sister, your auntie, whatever. And actually, I think some of the men have found it really interesting to listen because they're, you know, living with this woman who all of a sudden is quite different. Absolutely. And they're like, oh, right, okay. Oh, it's not me then.

So that's another interesting dynamic. But yeah, the more I've learned about it, the more I've shared with people in class. And the more I have felt it's very important to talk about evidence-based treatments. So we've got the theories that don't die, HRT causes breast cancer. Well, to be honest, love, all that wine you're drinking and your three stone overweight, that's going to be causing the breast cancer not taking HRT. You know, I didn't know about that. I didn't know about all these lifestyle indications for.

breast cancer because it's the old clip bait. Well, it's totally. Yeah, I mean the newspapers have to sell and the way of selling is by talking time and time again about this risk of HRT with breast cancer and like you quite rightly say, lifestyle changes that you usually occur during the menopause such as weight gain, drinking more alcohol, doing less exercise, increase the woman's risk of breast cancer more than taking HRT. So, so carry on. Yeah.

So for me it was just about evidence-based information but also looking at. at just lifestyle in general, really, for me, that was the eye-opener. There isn't a quick fix here. There isn't a magic wand. H-R-T is amazing, but it's not the cure-all. It also is all that other stuff about your diet, your hydration. Yes. I mean, how many people don't drink enough water?

I think I've spent most of my adult life dehydrated. You know, just general nutrition. Do you sleep enough? Yeah. Do you move? This is what I say to people. If you don't want to do yoga, that's fine. Just get out for a walk.

You know, if you want to do circuit training, if you want to do CrossFit, if you, you know, we can get caught up in this. Oh, you have to do yoga. It's very important. Yeah, I think so. And I think it's doing something that's good for you. But there's lots of perceptions of yoga, aren't there?

So when I tell people that I do yoga, a lot of people say, yeah, but I want to do proper exercise. Yeah. Oh. And I would say, please, do you. just give me 10 minutes. Yeah. And quite often, you know, I'll always have somebody will come in and say, oh, my husband

was laughing at me because I'm doing yoga. And I said, oh, just bring him once. And, you know, like I say, working with elite athletes, I mean, these men are at their peak in terms of being able to perform their job. And, oh, they sweat. Yes. And it's quite interesting when I've seen people who are very athletic, especially men, but people who have maybe been running or doing.

other sport for a long time and then do yoga. Externally they're very strong, but their core strength is not so good, is it? And it's not just that, it's the tightness and it's the range of motion because they have ramped. So, example, running is an excellent example because the running, you're pounding along, but you're compressing into the lumbus spine, all those muscles are tightening in the hips and the legs and the lower back and it just gets tighter and tighter and then all of a sudden they've got back problems

and they've got knee problems and they've got hip problems and they can't put their shoes on and they've driven for half an hour and get out of the car and have to... Very stiff. Yeah. And again so it's this lifestyle stuff and it's don't underestimate the power of a gentle

stretch. Yes. For 10 minutes a few times a week it makes all the difference. Yeah. And there's different types of yoga but there's different ways you can practice and I was away with my daughter last weekend and I took my travel mat and well she was slowly getting up I just went through some salutations and did some standing postages and it doesn't take very long and we're all busy and everyone says oh I haven't got time to exercise and I sort of think well you have to make some time very fortunate

as you know I've done yoga this morning had a quick shower and I'm working now so I'm very privileged but I also do it at the weekend and I give myself time because I look at how much time I spend on my phone when it tells you all day. report and so I think actually it's finding exercise that physically and mentally works because there's lots of evidence isn't there that if you exercise it helps with our serotonin and our happy hormone and i always say yoga it's like exercise plus yes so any exercise gets the endorphins going gets the blood pumping you know there is that cheesy saying you know you never feel bad after a workout and it's true yeah absolutely but then with yoga you were also getting the breath work

you're getting the meditation, benefits as well, which again can get a really bad rap. Yes. And for me, just even the last few years, the breathing exercises and the meditation has become so important. I think people get very caught up on yoga being about the postures. Yes. And actually, there is so much more.

Totally part of it. And, you know, I was joke. Yoga's magic. But actually, it is because, you know, the number of people that have come to me, either to my classes or privately, for physical reasons but then we'll say after six, 12 months,

the mental benefits that they would never have dreamt of and, you know, so meditation, it's a very personal thing down to... So people are very scared, don't they? Yeah, and I think again, the media has its role here in that all of a sudden people go,

oh, meditation and sit cross-legged and go, ohm, and it's, well, that is a tiny part. actually oh I can't stop my mind well no it's about turning the volume down it's about quiet in what's going on it's not about stopping the mind which actually is impossible but you know I say try so much good stuff out there that's free so many good apps and things online so I would say it's a very personal thing even an accent will be the difference of it being effective or not yeah absolutely and I know one of the first sessions you were having looking at your your lovely feedback, which was phenomenal.

But a few people commented about the meditation side and said, gosh, you've taught it so well. It's just demystifying it for people. It is because I think it is scary. And sometimes actually even some of the apps, if you don't know what you're doing, it can be quite scary because you worry that you're not doing it right. And then you're forgetting the actual process of what you're doing. And so certainly it's a very personal thing, I think, meditation is. And sometimes I find it's easier than others, days, depending on what's going on in my life.

actually if you can and certainly at the end of a yoga practice often is the time isn't it where meditation's done you can pull on those feelings at other times when sometimes my life gets a bit out of control because I'm so busy and I just breathe and close my mind and stop yes still it doesn't take long and then I can cope with the next task because otherwise it's just too much my head explodes it's like anything the more you practice the better it gets yes and you know the brain is like You know, it's a muscle. You've got to work it. You've got to practice. And, you know, for me, I struggled with it terribly for years. I always felt that I was the yoga teacher that didn't meditate, that I was a bit of a fake because I didn't have my own practice in terms of meditation. And actually, I spent some time at Oxford University studying mindfulness because a few years ago, that was the big thing. And I didn't know enough about it. So I thought, well, you go to the right place. So I did summer school. The irony is not lost on me. that I went to Oxford University. And I had an amazing time and found out all sorts of amazing things,

which was that I didn't want to be a mindfulness teacher because it's set very much in a mental health medical model. And I think that's much better placed within some sort of counselling environment or with somebody who is a mental health professional, whereas I am very much around well-being. And there is that difference. You know, the traditional mindfulness model is based in CBC. cognitive behavioral therapy and I just thought yeah that that is not for me however what I did

take away from it was there was a lot of practical right we're just going to stop for three minutes at the start of this next session and we're going to so over that course of a week because of the repetition I really got the hang of it and it was these little short sharp bites and so now I can happily meditate for half an hour whereas maybe two years ago I would have struggled for two minutes and I would be twitching and I'd be thinking about my shopping list and I needed to put the laundry in and we'd run out of milk and when was this going to finish and and so now it's such a gift to me and any sort of app or anything that you listen to the key pointers are always the same and it's to stop it's to be still it's just to tune into the breath and then anything else

is what flows what follows and it's like anything else that's like anything else that the more you do it, the better it becomes. And so, you know, and it's the same kind of thing with the breathing exercises. A lot of people as adults develop this very shallow breathing pattern. Whereas if you look at babies, if you look at animals when they're asleep and breathing, deep abdominal breathing. Yes. Yeah, using all the correct breathing muscles, using the diaphragm, using the intercostal muscles.

Whereas most of us, we're breathing using these secondary top muscles, you know, around the top of the chest. and neck and henceforth we all have headaches and migraines and yeah and I'm guilty of it myself and it's oh it all makes sense and then you have this link into you know this stressful lives that we all lead stress is more dangerous than HRT oh absolutely yeah I mean stress is just this epidemic it is and it is something that obviously as a medical student I ever taught about stress, but stress can lead to so many conditions. It's horrendous. And I think you're very totally right when you say HRT isn't the only treatment for the menopause. And as a lot of you know who are listening, I prescribe a lot of HRT because for most women, the benefits outweigh the risks.

But there's no point having HRT, smoking 20 a day, going to McDonald's and doing their exercise. And then a couple of bottles of wine at night. Exactly. So some people, that is normal. Absolutely. So we need to, The word menopause I don't really like, I think it's better to think about a long-term hormone deficiency, but we should be thinking if it is midlife in our 40s, some women it's earlier, then how are we going to live the rest of our lives to prevent disease, to reduce stress, like you say, and it's finding something that's right. And I think for those people that maybe have been a bit scared of yoga, to demystify it in the way that you do and to make it very individualised and personalised is really important.

And fun. Yeah, absolutely. Because if you have to sweat, I at least want to have fun. Yeah. Well, absolutely. If you said to me that I had to go for a 5K run twice a week, I would just do anything to avoid it. Absolutely.

Doing anger is something that you can fit in. Those women that prefer to run, that's fine. I think any exercise is good for our mental health, our physical health, our bone health, like cardiovascular health. And during the menopause, we have this increased risk of heart disease, osteoporosis, diabetes, like you say, body shape can change.

So looking at anything that's going to improve and reduce risk is... I talk about this golden triangle. So we've got general well-being and whatever age you're at. We have got menopause. We've then got the aging process, which often the menopause and the aging process

are so... intrinsically link together. And then in the middle of that triangle, we've got yoga. Because it's actually, it's almost like a quick win. Yeah, I love it. And it touches all of those things. And so for me, again, naturally lazy, if I can do something that will help my well-being,

that will help my menopausal symptoms, and that will help me have a healthier, older age at the grand age of 47, then I will take that quick win. Yeah. And to me it's a no-brainer. Yeah. But I think there is also that element of you've got to do the work. Yes, absolutely. There isn't a back door here.

No, and there's no quick fix because it takes time. If there was, I'd have found it. Yeah. So I just say to people, you know, and if you don't want to do yoga, Tai Chi, Pilates, there are so many sort of gentle exercise classes. And I mean, you have talked at length about you have an Ashtanga practice. which, you know, I always joke that I've grown out with that now because it's too hard. And I know that a lot of my clients couldn't do a sun salute because they're managing certain, you know, conditions, illnesses.

But it is just one strand of so many. And Lucy and I just chatted about this in terms of that variety. And it's great to know with the yoga teachers because you can signpost. Well, actually, if I'm not your cup of tea, and I get that I'm not everybody's, you know, then actually I can recommend you to various other teachers locally that do different things, and that's fine. Which is brilliant. Yeah, absolutely.

No, gosh, that's brilliant. So, well, we could talk for hours because there's so much to talk and think about. So thank you so much for coming. But before we end, could you just give three take-home tips for women who maybe are experiencing some menopoles or symptoms? thinking about their longer term wellness and wanting to dabble with yoga, what three tips would you give them? I think that it would be just, just do it, to quote night. I mean, don't be afraid.

Ask around who can recommend me a good yoga teacher. So just have a go. Try different classes. So they might put, oh, I tried it once. It was terrible. Try it. Another one if the first one you don't. I mean, we've all been to a crap hairdresser, haven't we?

So you just go and try another. So just do it. I think secondly, don't get caught up on having to buy the right outfit. You've got to have your own equipment. Oh, no. You can literally wear whatever you please. Don't worry about it. And the third thing would be to not talk yourself out of it because of your size.

Yeah. So I have had a lot of women who have said, I'm just too big and I'm too embarrassed and I won't be able to do it. And it just is not relevant in terms of how your body moves and your flexibility and your strength. So just again, you know, you will be among friends. People are not looking at you. So, oh, well, what if I do it wrong? People are doing their own thing.

Just get on with it. Yeah. So basically no excuse to give it a go. Well, absolutely. Thinking about it then. Yeah, absolutely. So brilliant. Thank you ever so much.

And we will put links to Claudia's D.T. in the podcast notes. So thank you ever so much for coming and I'm looking forward to seeing what else you do here in my clinic. Thank you. I'm looking forward to it. For more information about the menopause, please visit our website www.manyporesdoctor.com.uker.com. UK.