The Dr Louise Newson Podcast - 090 - Talking About Menopause with Women From Ethnic Minorities - Rushna Mia & Dr Louise Newson

Episode Date: March 15, 2021

In this episode, Dr Louise Newson talks to Rushna Mia about her menopause experience and how she is aiming to increase awareness of the menopause and support for women and their families within her local Asian community.  Rushna works in a primary school, is a busy mother of 4, grandmother of a 3-year-old and helps run her family’s businesses. She is passionate about supporting women within her community and takes a lead in various women’s groups. Rushna describes the particular issue of the menopause as a taboo within Asian communities and says it is mostly swept under the carpet and not spoken about.  It took Rushna around 8 years to recognise that the symptoms she was experiencing were due to the menopause and the doctors she saw did not raise this possibility either. After seeing Dr Sarah Ball at the Newson Health Menopause and Wellbeing Centre and feeling so much better on the right treatment, Rushna now wants other women to know the right help is available.  Rushna's Three Take Home Tips: Use social media, there’s lots of free information out there that can be really helpful regarding your symptoms.  Speak to your GP or try the Nurse again, ask if there are any local women’s groups.  Women should work together to help other women and their families. It's important that everyone knows that help and support is available. 

Welcome to the Newsome Health Menopause podcast. I'm Dr Louise Newsome, a GP and menopause specialist, and I'm also the founder of the Menopause charity. In addition, I run the Newsome Health Menopause and Well-Being Clinic here in Stratford-upon-Avon. So today I'm delighted to introduce to you, Rushner, who is a lady who I was introduced to recently because she contacted me directly. wanting to talk about her own experience that would hopefully resonate and help other women. She's also told me that she is a mother of four, which I have ultimate respect for. I can only manage three children just about. And she's also a grandmother. She does a huge amount of work in her community too. So welcome, Rushner.

Thanks for joining me today. Hi, Louise. How are you? Good, thank you. So tell me a bit about you and what you do, if you don't mind. Well, I actually teach children in the primary school, and I've done that for a number of years. I really, really enjoy that. And then I've got my family that I look after as well.

We've also got family businesses that we run. Gosh, we all do that. And I'm also a grandmother of a three-year-old. And also, I like to help a lot of the community, the ladies in our community. I do run a women's group. And, you know, we try and cover as much as we can. we get together once a week we used to before the lockdown. And at the moment, obviously, everything's come to a good bit of a standstill.

But I'd like to reach out to some of the community with this that's happening to me at the moment that I've encountered, which is the medical. And, you know, I'd like to lend out a helping hand and see if I can get the message across to some of the women in the Asian community and help them as much as I can. Because it's very neglected. It's neglected for all women. It's a real taboo, even though all women will go through the menopause. But certainly in certain communities, it's even more of a taboo, isn't it? Yes, it is. In our community, well, I haven't heard anybody talking about this, even, you know, say, like our mothers or our aunties, we've never had them speaking to us about this. And I'm sure, you know, they've been through a lot. And some of them just don't realize that there's a lot of help out there. which they can get. You know, it's all kind of like swept under the carpet in the sense they just think it's part of aging.

Yes. And, you know. Have many women, in your experience, heard of the menopause? Do they know it's something or do they put their symptoms down to something completely different, do you think? They know it's part of the menopause in the sense that they are getting old, if you like. So this is what will happen. We all have to go through this.

But other than that, I mean, you know, reaching out trying to get help or, you know, even recognising some of the symptoms that start at an earlier age, I think that's what a lot of women fail to recognise. So how did you recognise your symptoms then? Well, I've had my symptoms for a long time. Now I think about it for a number of years. Things like palpitation and muscle thinning. I've had dry skin and dry eyes.

and various other symptoms as well. And just recently, I've just been doing some research myself. And I've been going on good old social media Instagram. And I actually discovered your page and I looked into it. I looked into all the information that you have on your website. And from that, I realized what I was going through. And I recognised my symptoms, you know, what they're. kind of were equaling to.

And it was the hormonal changes, obviously, i.e. their menopause. That's when it kind of like everything, it was like a jigsaw for me. And that's when I realized how this jigsaw was kind of like coming in place. So how long did it take you before you realized what was going on? You know what? It took me a number of years.

Must be six, seven or eight years. I did obviously make trips to the GP. I also did mention it. my GP several times that, you know, this could be the menopause and my GP clearly said, no, it was in the menopause and you're too young and all this. So I really didn't get any help from my GP whatsoever. And I discovered, obviously, use in health. And that's when I just picked the phone up and I made my appointment because I had to see someone. I had to see somebody who knew what I was going through and had to get that help. So that's what I was.

when I made the appointment and, you know, I saw Dr. Sarah Ball. And she's helped you? She helped me, you know, straight away. And when I filled out the questionnaire, I ticked all the symptoms that I had. It was amazing to see the questionnaire. It was kind of relating to a lot of the symptoms that I was going through and that I had. I ticked all the symptoms on the list. And, you know, from there, Dr. Sarah obviously spoke to me and I told her everything that was going on.

And from, you know, then on I started my treatment. And, you know, as soon as I started, I actually felt better. You know, it's quite amazing, but might not be believable, but I actually felt better straight away. Yeah, and a lot of people do, it really varies with response. I don't want people listening to think that they're all going to be transformed. And I know when I started taking HRLT, it took a little while to get the right dose and type. But a lot of people do because you're just simply replacing the hormones.

But, you know, it makes you feel very sad that you had tried to get help. So firstly, it's getting the knowledge, obviously, which is one struggle. But then once you have the knowledge, you still can get help, even thinking quite rightly that your symptoms were due to the menopause. And it shouldn't be that people have to come to a private clinic. I shouldn't be working in a private clinic. I should be working for the NHS. And menopause resources are really scarce. There's only 70 or 72 menopause clinics in the UK.

that's nothing when there are, you know, half the population affected. And the symptoms can range. They can vary so much. But also there's these health risks. And, you know, for those six, seven, eight years, I presume really affected the quality of your life. Yes, it did. You know, my sleep was affected.

I used to get palpitations. And, you know, I used to left me wondering why it was happening. I did go to see my GP for. all the palpitations I used to get. I used to get anxiety. But, you know, I had monitors fitted and I did get my push-bush, and all the things that they need to do, they did. But I didn't have any help, didn't receive any help, no treatment, no medication, or advice, rather. So, you know, it affected life, if you know what I mean. Absolutely. I totally do. And one of the things, as you might know, we've set up recently launched the Menopause Charity. And I really want to have information

available to all women at every point of contact. And, you know, you've had four children. I'm sure you had a lot of medical contact and information given to you. But now your menopausal, you've been neglected. And, you know, you're going to be longer menopausal, then you will be, even if you count up how long you're pregnant with all your pregnancies, it's still nothing compared to the hopefully decades that you'll have living without your hormones. So it's essential that women are given information. So have you fed back to your community, people that you talk to about your experience. Have they learnt from you? I have. I've spoken to some of my friends and some of the women from our community. And what I wanted to do was set up a different kind of a group and talk to them

a bit more about it and just listen in and see, you know, how they are and how their health, you know, what kind of conditions they are going through and see, you know, if I can be of help to them. And obviously now that I've been, you know, through all this with my own symptoms, I can kind of be up help to them in the sense that I can understand it a bit more. So, you know, hopefully we'll try and do as much as I can. And there's lots of information available, you know, various places, even on social media, which they can themselves see and they can go to the GP, if you like, fully equipped with the information. I know it's not very nice out there sometimes when we just don't get the right help from

our GPs, but they kind of need a bit more training maybe or, you know. Absolutely. They totally do. And, you know, GPs really want to help. As a GP, I always want to do the best I could for every single patient that I saw. But if you haven't got the knowledge and education, then it's really difficult. But actually, we learn from our patients. Every day I see a patient, I learn something. And that's really important. And if as a doctor, they have lots of people. coming in saying, I think I'm a menopausal, then they need to learn because it affects all women. So it's not an unusual condition. It has health risks associated with it, so it needs to be managed appropriately. And we have good guidelines, actually, that doctors really should

be adhering to, which are very clear on how to diagnose the menopause and how to manage it as well. So is language a problem? Do you think with some women in your community, they're finding it difficult to access information in the right language? Because so much of it is. in English. Yes, that is also a barrier. You know, they may find it hard to explain themselves to their GP. I don't know if interpreting services are available out there. Even so maybe at times, they may not be having access to an interpreter. They may be going to the GP more often. So, you know, I think language is a barrier. It would help if they had maybe more sort of Asian people to help them out there that could relate to, you know, some of the things that they

are going through. I think it is so important. We've had some videos translated into Punjabi and we're getting some translated into Hindi as well. And there are so many different languages. And we really need to try and address. But it's quite hard. I've worked with interpreters before and sometimes they've been family members

and sometimes they've been NHS interpreters. But when you're talking about quite sensitive issues such as libido or vaginal dryness, it can be very hard to talk through a relative, and it would be quite difficult for the woman to talk through a stranger as well. So that can really, I think, inhibit maybe learning how many symptoms they have as a healthcare professional. I don't know what you think, but I'm sure it stops some women describing quite how those symptoms are. Yes, I think that's something as well for the women, you know, they don't want to really speak about openly.

So maybe at times when they do get to see the GP or maybe specialists, they're not, you know, fully describing their symptoms. They might be thinking that, oh, you know, this is just part of everything else. And, you know, they don't realize that there's a lot of help out there for them. Yeah. And how have your family responded to you telling them, I presume you have, about you, being menopausal and taking treatment? Does it mean something that has surprised them or they've been interested in? They've been interested.

I've been trying to educate my daughters as well. Good. I've been going on about this since I've discovered there's treatment out there, since I've discovered there's lots of help out there, and there's lots of groups even on social media that you want to help women like yourselves and there's lots of other people out there. So I've been going on about it so much to my family and my friends. I've tried to just keep them informed about what's happening with myself and about the treatments and things and the help that's out there. So, you know, they shouldn't feel as if,

you know, it's something that they have to go through alone. And that is a problem because people do feel alone and don't know who to talk to and where to turn. And it is easier now with social media. But there is a lost generation of women, isn't there, who have not been able to access social media. Some people still don't now. But certainly women who started to experience menopause or symptoms 20 years ago, will now still be experiencing some symptoms. And certainly symptoms such as vaginaldryness and urinary symptoms are symptoms that don't improve with time.

They often get worse. So there's a lot of women in their 70s, 80s, 90s who are really experiencing symptoms, but they don't realize they're related. And it's how we get through to those people is difficult, isn't it? Yes, I think there's a lot of work to be done. but, you know, if we kind of try, everybody tries on their part, trying to take that information out to different groups and certain places,

you know, we might be successful. And I think trying to educate the younger generation would help as well. Like, you know, I've got my daughters. So I've been telling them and, you know, they've been talking to their friends. You know, if they know at least they can advise or help their mothers or aunties or even the grandparents. I think that's really important, isn't it? I certainly know my, I've got three daughters and my children are very open to my mother and my mother-in-law. They talk about all sorts of things that they even don't talk to me about.

And they're not embarrassed in the way that we probably were talking to our grandparents, which is great. But also, I know my daughters have recognised some of their friends' mothers as being menopausal. And they've actually tried to tell their friends, look, I think your mother needs to go onto this website or get this book or get some help. So that's another way, isn't it? to try and help. Yes, yes, definitely. That's another way. And that's the way we can bring our kind of the elder generation into the picture if the younger generation help them and, you know, try and reach out to them. Because as you say, you know, everybody will have access or, you know, how to go on to, you know, the social media. Absolutely. And as one is the symptoms, which obviously

have really affected you negatively, have you been aware of the health risks associated with the low hormone levels? is that something that was in your radar before you saw Dr. Ball? Yes, you know, when I was looking into this, I realised, obviously, taking HRT has the long-term benefits where, you know, my bone health will be protected, my heart will be protected. So that was one of my main concerns as well. And that's another reason why I myself wanted to take that route of, you know, using HRT. And that's very important because it's important for all women, of course, but women from some ethnic minorities have an increased risk just because genetically

of developing diabetes and heart disease. And so it's even more important, actually, that certain women with these risks receive HRT. And it's really quite sad that less women actually receive treatment. And it's trying to think about the menopause, not just as symptoms, but about health risks as well. Yes. And also, even the weight changes that occur, there are a lot of women that push on weight and they blame it just because they're getting about older. And often it's due to hormones. I don't know if that's something that you've experienced with anyone you've

spoken to. Yes, some of the women that I have been speaking to, sort of like a bit more elderly, most of them had weight issues. They had a lot of weight gain. And because of that, you know, they kind of like don't go out and they don't want to exercise, they just think they're unable to. Then lack of motivation dies down with that. So I think it's very important, like you say, different communities kind of like have different health risks and I'll kind of like come into, especially the elderly women, do suffer from, you know, diabetes and blood pressure and things like that.

and then I think with the hormonal changes in them, you know, it gets them down and then they're able to get that motivation back to their lives. It's like a vicious cycle really, isn't it? So some of it's knowing how much is cause and effect, but if you're feeling low and less motivated, putting on weight, which are all symptoms of the menopause, and then you develop diabetes,

and then you find it's harder to exercise, so therefore maybe put on weight more, therefore your diabetes becomes worse and risks increase. It's just this never-ending cycle. And the longer it's gone on, the harder it is to change, isn't it? So it's trying to prevent that with giving the right education early, isn't it? Yes, it is. So that's where I think, you know, we will be able to be of use trying to educate as many people as possible.

And how do you think the best way of educating as many women as possible, certainly in your community, would it be by having group work or by written information or by watching videos? What do you think would be the most effective? Yes, group work definitely is something that's very good. And it works well when the women see other women as well. And they know that, you know, they're all in the same boat. And also, you know, if they can visualize if they see videos, that's very helpful as well. And also maybe talks from professionals.

Yes. That would definitely help. They came in and, you know, spoke to them, like, kind of like women to women kind of a thing. So there's help out there for them and, you know, they're not alone and they actually recognize their symptoms to what they equal to, i.e., you know, a lot of it is related to the menopause. Absolutely. And what about, obviously, we're talking about women all the time, which is weight because

it affects women, but it indirectly affects men, doesn't it? So what about some of the men? you had any experience of their understanding of the menopause or what they feel about when their wives or their family member is changing as a result of the menopause? I haven't speaking to many men as yet. Apart from the male members in my household, I've got my two sons and then my husband. They're very supportive. They can see what's happening to me, you know, the symptoms I've kind of like gone through

and now that I feel much better. So, you know, they can see what's happening. But I'm sure, you know, the same way women have the lack of knowledge, you know, the men equally have lack of knowledge. So, you know, if we can train the women up to understand why this is happening to them, I'm sure, you know, the men will be on board as well and be equally supportive once they've got the knowledge, once they can see, you know, why this is happening. Yes, and I think I certainly, men that I speak to become very frustrated because they don't know how to help their partner. They've maybe been with someone for a long time and they see her physically and mentally changing in front of them. And some men feel very sad. Some feel very worried and some actually feel very frustrated because it's not the person that they met that time before.

But they don't know why. And actually sometimes they internalise it and think, is it me that's changed rather than that person? So actually for them to have information in a way that they can understand and if it needs to be in a different language or a different format, that's really important, isn't it? but not just men who are partners of women, but younger men, boys need to know so they can recognise it in their relatives or their work colleagues because the sooner women have the knowledge and hopefully receive the right help and treatment,

the better it is for everyone, isn't it? Yes, definitely, you know, alongside women, if the men have that knowledge, they'll be better equipped to be able to help their partners or, you know, if it's their mothers or even colleagues at work. it impacts different ways for the women, whether they're working or whether they're at home.

So it's just the power of knowledge, really. If everybody kind of gets to know, they'll be able to support them in different ways. To degree, I love that, the power of knowledge, and it is very powerful. And I think what I'm finding with a lot of the work that I'm doing is it's very powerful connecting with other women. And actually, women, helping women, can really make a difference.

And I think maybe we're just, I'd like to say we're the stronger side of society. But I think when women really want to get something done, they usually can. And it might be her difficult, but we don't give up easily. I'm not saying that men give up easily, of course, but I feel that women helping women and supporting other women can really make a difference. And I'm sure you're noticing that just in the work that you've done over the years with your community, with your school and everything else. Definitely, definitely.

same here. I think, you know, if women kind of work together, they can often make a slightly better impact on the situation or, you know, whatever they're trying to achieve. So, you know, hopefully you can get a lot of other people on board and, you know, try and help as many people as possible and try and get that information out to the different generations rather. Yeah, totally. So really important. And I'm just so grateful, Bresna, that you spent some time talking about this today because it is quite sensitive. And, you know, there aren't many women actually talking about the menopause and especially women from different ethnic groups and ethnic backgrounds as well. So I feel really privileged that you've shared your own journey, but also the work that you're doing

and the work that you're going to do, which is going to make such a huge difference. So before we finish, do you mind just giving me three tips, really, for women who are struggling to get information in a way that they can understand or just access any information, What would be your three most important ways of getting information, would you say? Well, firstly, I would say nowadays, certain media does have a lot of information on there. And there's lots of brilliant groups out there that do a wonderful job. And they have lots of free information. You know, you could look into that and type in the symptoms that you have.

You get lots and lots of information coming back. And there's lots of groups on Facebook as well. have lots to share, you know, women sharing their symptoms and their health journeys with different women. So, you know, you're able to get a lot of information from there. And for those people that obviously are not connected to social media or, you know, maybe to use social media, not comfortable with that, you know, I would suggest that they could start maybe trying to see their GPs again or even the nurses and, you know, try to do that. You know, trying to get help from them.

And maybe, you know, some places they have the different women's group and, you know, even joining with groups like that and just trying to see, you know, where it takes them. You know, really try and get that help and support because it's definitely out there. And we all need to work together, really, to try and help a lot of the women as possible and their families and try and...

educate ourselves and the rest of the women folks out there. Excellent. So really good advice. And I think the most important thing from all of that is don't give up. If you don't get the right help, keep going. And it's brilliant to hear how much better you were and how you did persevere. But it's important as women, we can all help each other. So thank you so much for your time today. I really appreciate it. Thank you so much. It was so lovely talking to you. And thanks for all the help that I've got from your clinic. Oh, thank you. Take care.

For more information about the perimenopause and menopause, you can go to my website, menopause.com, or you can download our free app called Balance, available through the App Store and Google Play.