The Duran Podcast - Collective west preparations for the West Germany plan

Episode Date: August 20, 2023

Collective west preparations for the West Germany plan The Duran: Episode 1674

All right, Alexander, let's do an update on what is going on in Ukraine. We had a statement from Stoltenberg's chief of staff talking about some sort of peace deal territory for NATO membership. He has since retracted that statement and apologized. We have people like Sarkozy hinting at some sort of off-ramp with the conflict in. Ukraine. We have an article from Newsweek talking about how Zelensky faces an impossible decision to either hold back his forces, regroup and face a Russian offensive, or to go all in, which is the preferable choice from Zaluzni, which I think is an interesting revelation. My hunch there is that if things go badly, they're going to pit it on Zilluzni. But anyway,

that's coming out of newsweek. And you also have an article from Forbes talking about how the Ukraine military, the Zelensky regime, is indeed going to go all in with the 82nd brigade, and they're the ones with the 14 Challenger tanks and striker vehicles. And they have all the NATO equipment. And this is the big reserve force, the best trained, the most lethal force that Ukraine has. and they are going to throw it into the front line towards the direction of, I believe, Zapparozegra, and Apatino, that whole area in order to break through and get to the mock and militia pole

and divide the Russian forces, split the Russian forces in two. So a lot of interesting articles and interesting statements coming out of Ukraine. What do you think? Right. Well, I think an awful lot is going on. And I think we're seeing preparations now for the big retreat.

No, I don't mean the retreat by Ukraine on the battlefronts. In fact, I mean, I think you're absolutely right. I think they're going to try on the battlefronts to double down and triple down on their offensive. And they're going to launch this brigade, the 82nd brigade, which, by the way, as I understand it, is their last important reserve brigade. But it's the one with the challenge. That's what Forbes says. That's what Forbes says. And I think, you know, it's David Axe, who's pretty well informed. a fervid supporter of Ukraine, by the way.

So, I mean, I think this is probably what they're going to do. But I don't think anybody any longer, at least in the West, or even within the government of Ukraine, seriously believes that this is going to work and is going to change the dynamics, the underlying dynamics, on the battlefield. I mean, apparently, and again, this is, you know, what the reports are telling us, this brigade, the 82nd brigade

numbers 2,000 men. Now, that is not a huge force to break through all the way to the sea of Azulf. I mean, it's not going to be enough if it is indeed the last reserve. It's the last thing that they have to throw in.

And yes, they have the strikers and yes, they have the challenges, but why are they going to succeed where the Leopard 2's and the Bradley's have failed. I mean, it doesn't seem logical to me. They might be able

to capture this village, Rabatina, which they've been trying to capture now for two and a half months. But if they capture Rabatina, what then? I mean, they still got the big fortified lines ahead of them. So, you know,

I think this is probably the last throw, but I think it is what they're going to do. And I think you're absolutely correct, by the way, all the indications are that Zelensky is maneuvering to pin the debacle on Zillusioni and there's again rumours that the defence minister

Erznikov is also for the for the acts as well apparently this talk of giving him a position as an ambassadorship in some place or other but anyway get rid of blame it all on Zolluzni blame it all on Reznikov bring other people in

try to give the show on the road in some way. And bear in mind, of course, that Newsweek, they're talking about going on the defensive, but the point is that they acknowledge that there is a massive Russian offensive in preparation, perhaps for the spring. So that's the real thing that I think they're worrying about.

But this is all events on the battlefronts, and we've spent a lot of time discussing the events on the battlefronts There was more attempts today, today being the 17th of August, by the way, to capture Rabatina. It's all failed. They've failed to break through on the Vremovka salient area. They've been pushed back in the Bachmert area. They've lost ground there. The 82nd brigade will be thrown in, but I don't think anybody any longer expects this offensive is going to succeed.

The big story is all this talk now about diplomatic moves to try to end the war. And I think let's talk first of all about Jensen. This is Stoltenberg's chief of staff who made those comments in a talk show. And he's apologized, as you correctly said. He says that this is all about, you know, swapping territory for peace and then joining NATO. He says, you know, Ukraine might need to think about doing that. He then, as apologised for that, he then says a mistake, he made a mistake. If you read his words very carefully, what he's saying is, it's not a mistake to suggest this as a potential way forward.

It was a mistake to talk about it in the way that he did on that discussion program. In other words, it's the way he presented it rather than the idea itself. That is the mistake. When people engage in this kind of convoluted language, which if you look at Jensen's so-called retraction, it's actually convoluted language, then that tells you that something is up. The White House, of course, have also issued a denial, but that, you know, that they support this thing, but then that's, again, no more than to be expected. But we now have sarcasmus waiting in. We've had reports appearing in other places.

We discussed one of them, you know, a couple of weeks ago that had appeared in Moscow Times. It was all very strange. Lots of things are going on there. But that, it seems to me, the plan. Freeze the war. Greer ceased fire with the Russians. Give the Russians.

Allow the Russians to keep what they've got. bring Ukraine after a short interval into NATO, build it up, pour more money in, pour more weapons in, rebuild the Ukrainian army, and then wait until Russia eventually collapses, because that's what they still think ultimately is going to happen. And we've seen a lot of talk now about the German, what happened with Germany, that, you know, Germany, lost a lot of its territory to the Soviets after the Second World War. The East German Democratic Republic was created. But West Germany was still nonetheless

able to join NATO and they supposedly allegedly weighted it out. It took about what, 40 years. But eventually East Germany collapsed. The Soviet Union collapsed. And East Germany joined West

Germany and they all remained in NATO. So that's the proposal that's been floated around today. And you can see, you can sense that those discussions are underway now. I don't know whether anybody seriously believes that any of this is going to work out. But the priority, it seems to me, is to try to get some kind of a ceasefire in place so as to do exactly what you've been discussing in previous programmes. prevent a collapse in Ukraine before the election next year. Keep this thing under some kind of wraps. You don't want a debacle.

You don't want a Ukrainian collapse in the spring. So that's what the whole agenda is all about. It's not going to work. The Ukrainians are opposing it. The Russians will completely oppose it. But that's the idea that Jake Sullivan and the group around him are now coming up with. Yeah, I was going to say this is the German idea. We've been down this path before.

This was floated out. This plan was floated out, I want to say maybe nine months ago or six months ago? Absolutely. Are the New York Times or someone? Is that correct? Exactly. That's entirely correct. That's entirely correct.

I think it was about six months ago. That's exactly right. It's now, you know, there was then the swing back. If you remember, there was going to be the offensive. And then there was, then the offensive happened. The offensive hasn't worked, it hasn't improved, Ukraine's military position. So now you go back to that plan. And you've got all of these ex-diplomats of the Council for Foreign Relations.

Apparently this is true, trying to talk to the Russians to get them to agree to this. And the Russians are saying no, as they're bound to do. But that's now the plan. The West Germany plan. The West Germany plan. The West Germany plan. Exactly. the West Germany plan.

Yeah. And why do they believe that Russia is going to collapse? Are we back to this this ruble at a hundred dollar thing? Or what's the reasoning behind Russia's collapse? Because even insider, which may not be the most reliable publication, but they cited a U.E. bank report, which claims that Russia is getting wealthier in the law. West is getting poor. That's pretty much what the report said. So what are they basing this collapse on Putin's popularity is at 80 something percent. The economy is humming along. You have this

ruble fall, but you've explained this a dozen times as to why this is happening. Russia doesn't seem to be worried about this. I was in Russia. And I didn't see people worried about the the ruble to dollar exchange because Russia doesn't use. They can't use dollars or euros. Exactly. Exactly. I mean, what do they care? I mean, what is this based on? I mean, that is that is an extremely good point actually, by the way, before we proceed. I mean, you know, this is a I mean, this is an anachronistic issue. I mean, the the ruble dollar, ruble euro exchange rate is irrelevant for most Russians now because Russia doesn't trade in ruble in dollars. I mean, this is no longer an issue anymore. But anyway, let's proceed. What do they base this on? They base it on nothing except

hope. The thing to understand is that you're never going to get anywhere in the EU, in Washington or whatever by coming along and saying that Putin is stronger than ever, Russia is getting stronger, getting richer. You can't, even if you know that prime, you. You can't say it. If you did, they'd eat you alive. So nobody says it. So everybody goes around pretending that sooner or later Russia will collapse. They come up with the endless things. You know, progosion. There was a pregosion affair. You remember when the pregosion affair happened. You actually said this. I remember this. The very first video we did about the prognosian affair, you said they will seize on this to say that if we just keep going long. enough, Russia is unstable, progogion affair proves it, Russia will collapse. And that is exactly what they're doing. So they're talking like this.

Now, what they all privately think at the back of their minds is another matter completely. Their concern is not what's going to happen. In five years time, in 10 years' time, in 20 years' time. remember, German unity reunification took 40 years before it took place. They're not interested in that. Their concern is next year, November 2024, they have that election to win. So they don't want a debacle.

They don't want a collapse in Ukraine before the election. So they come up with all of these plans. The excuses, well, you know, this is not forever. eventually Russia will collapse, Putin will go, Ukraine will get back its territories, but in the meantime, we're able to build it up and we're able to do it inside NATO. So we have actually won, eventually we're going to win even more. That's the spin. You've said it again.

Many times these people are all ultimately about spin. This is what it's all about at the end of the day. whether they don't really believe that any of this is going to happen. But that's not their concern. Winning the election is. So Sarkozy said something very interesting in his statement about trying to find an off-ramp for Ukraine, which is essentially what he was talking about. He showed, I'm not a fan of Sarkozy.

I'm not a fan of what he did to the world, specifically to Libya. you know, but he was talking about an off-ramp to this conflict and basically admitting that that the collective was lost. That was pretty much what he was saying in his statement. But he said that Europe's interests do not align, in this instance, do not align with the U.S.'s interests. Yes. And that's true.

You know, Biden has an election, November 24, 2024, but Europe doesn't have an election. in 2024. The EU doesn't have a 2024 election. Poland has one in October. I believe Slovakia has one this week or next week, if my memory serves to be correct. I mean, this is, this is not in Europe's interest to drag this out for a year and a half because Europe is becoming hollowed out. It's getting the industrialized Germany is the best case of this. So why do they go along with this? Why did it, why does it, why does it, you go along with this? What do they care about the US elections at 2024? What do they care about Biden? Well, you're completely right. And of course, Sarkozy is completely right. Now, just to talk

about Sarkasie, I'm pretty sure that when he's making these statements, he's now positioning himself in France for an ex-presidential run. He's going to pose as the, you know, the Democratic candidate against the terrible Marlene Le Pen. And he's going to be the person who's going to take over. and he's also posing as the realist. He says, look, I mean, you know, this Macron policy has been a complete disaster. We've hitched ourselves to the Germans. We've hitched ourselves to the Americans.

The point has now come where we should break away in the interests of France, but also in the interests of Europe. And I'm the man to do it. Don't, you know, let Le Pen come in and make things even more complicated than they already are. So that's, I think that's what Sarkozy is up to. Whether as President of France you would actually

deliver on any of these things, that's another matter and we don't need to get sidetracked on any of that, because to be frank, I don't think Sarkozy has any chance of getting re-elected as President of France. Again, for all kinds of reasons which we can put aside for another day.

But you're absolutely correct. And so is Sarkozy. Why are they doing this to themselves. Why are they letting Europe be obliterated economically the way it is? Why are they allowing, I mean, Germany is now in recession, the Netherlands is now in recession, Britain is teetering on the brink of recession. We have stagnation, at the very least in Britain,

and in practical realities, you live in Britain. You can see that we are in recession. Living standards are falling across Europe, de-industrialisation, is taking hold. Why do they continue to do this? The reason they are doing this is because there are still very, very powerful people in Europe, in the European Commission, in the EU bureaucracy, in some of the governments, for whom this project continues to serve their own interests. You're talking about the EU. They have used the Ukrainian crisis to extend

their power even more over the sovereign states. So the EU now effectively controls energy policy, it controls financial policy, it controls all kinds of things which he didn't control previously. So the EU bureaucracy has done very well out of this crisis. Some of the people in the various EU states who rely on the EU for support, they're doing very well as well. So, They have no interests in breaking with this policy because it has worked for them. It might not be working for Europe, but it has worked for them. And of course, vicariously, even if Europe is being smashed as a result of all of this, it's always agreeable to think that you're involved in some kind of joint enterprise

with the superpower, which is of course the United States, and never ever forget there's a financial motive as well, because of course there's going to be arms sales to Europe, there's going to be more jobs in the EU bureaucracy, in the NATO bureaucracy, they want to expand NATO, they want to do all of these things. And as you said so many times in these kind of situations, follow the money. So what is in the interest of the political class, may not be in the interests of Europe, where it is the political class which is in control.

Right. They're going to have more power and control. They're gaining more power and control out of this Ukraine project. But for how long? They're going to have complete power of control of a hollowed out, weak, bankrupt and broke union. I mean, what's the purpose of it? Well, that's entirely correct, because of course what you're having is a situation where the parasite is killing the host because that's what they are. I mean, this is a parasitical class is latched

onto Europe and it is killing the host. Now the trouble is and this is, I'm afraid, the iron rule of this kind of politics. There are historical variants about over this extending back

across history. The parasitical class who are killing the host, never see it that way. As far as they're concerned, they always prioritise their own personal interests over the larger

interests of Europe. So yes, ultimately Europe has been hollowed out. Ultimately, Europe is going to lose more of its positions. What they will always say in response to that is that the answer to these problems is

more Europe, not less, and they will demand even more integration and even more control as a solution to the very problems that they are creating. So that is the iron law. I'm sorry to say of this. Eventually, of course, there will be either a pushback or some kind of collapse, but that's going to be, or at least they think, sometime in the future, it's not going to affect them directly. that is their assumption. Yeah, I think that's the sad part to all of this, just to wrap up the video, is that you still have a significant portion of the European population,

the EU citizenry, if you can call it that. That is still in favor of more Europe. They believe that Europe is indeed the solution to all of these problems, which the European Union has created. They create the problems. they provide the apparent solution and people actually buy into that. And what you get is more problems though. So, I mean, that's a sad part is that maybe enough people aren't waking up to the reality of who's behind all of this misery and they're not waking up fast enough.

Well, exactly. This is indeed the problem. And of course, you have a, I mean, the other thing is, I mean, you know, the other, that they control still the media. they're very, very aggressive in their rhetoric, that anybody who speaks out about this is classified as some kind of populist extremist. You already see moves, which you've covered them on your programmes, on your channel about the banning of the IFDA in Germany. And all this is justified on the basis that, of course, the EU is protecting democracy,

when, of course, on any objective analysis, it is doing the opposite. Now, before we finish, I think one point... You talked about this with Terry Boudet as well. Absolutely, yeah, we're a long program about this. It's a very long program about this. But of course, he, in return, gets criticized. He's called all kinds of things in the Netherlands, and people believe it.

And there's a lot of people who go along with this because they hear all of these things. I mean, if you actually listen to him, he is a European libertarian. I mean, that's his political view. But that is not the way he is presented to most people in the Netherlands or across Europe. They represent him as being the diametric opposite of that as a sort of right-wing authoritarian populist, which of course he's not.

Anyway, that's all I wanted to say about this. But coming back to these plans, you know, for freezing the conflict, bringing Ukraine into NATO, doing all of these things. it's not going to work anyway, because of course the Russians will never agree to this. This is what makes this whole thing so completely unreal. And I discussed this in my own program yesterday. They have this utterly cynical view of the way the Russians approach things. They always assume that you can bribe the Russians to do things that are contrary to Russian policy

and contrary to Russian interest. So they tell each other what the Russians are really all about is some kind of land grab in eastern Ukraine. You give them the land and they'll just walk away. And of course, that's not what the Russians are about. For them, Ukraine's membership of NATO is the core issue. So the Russians are certain to reject this plan. And in fact, they've already said so. I mean, Medvedev, of course, is churning up.

comments about how this is going to be completely unacceptable to Moscow and it is going to be unacceptable to Moscow but again they don't see that they spent all their time talking about these clever plans with each other and then of course as happens repeatedly it happened as I discussed in my program about the Syrian conflict as well when they come up with these clever plans and they present them to the Russians and the Russians say no they come away baffled and angry and they have no idea what to do yeah I agree yeah like your program that like your program outline they're they're the smart ones they're the smart ones and everyone else is just easy to to con and to swindle and yeah they're not

going to realize what's happening because they're the geniuses absolutely that's what makes them so dangerous well like you know I think it was one of our programs we once said about Jake Sullivan, who is, of course, you know, I'm pretty sure he's the, at least one of the originators of this thing. He is the mediocrity who believes himself a genius. That's what they all do, not just him, I mean, all of them do. I mean, Ursula thinks that, Birbock and Habek think that in Germany, Johnson used to think that in London. They all think like this. And of course, they're not geniuses. I mean, that's a fundamental mistake. They might be clever in a kind of way, but the Russians are not stupid.

And that's the one thing they just can't see to get round their minds. The Russians aren't stupid. They can see what they're about. In fact, it's obvious what they're about. And beyond that, the Russians are not the cynics about their own security that people in the West continuously imagine them to be. Just a final point, it's so hard to believe that you can sit across a table with Lavrov, for example, and believe that you can outsmart that, man. It's just an example.

You know, it's, how can you think that? I mean, I've never, I've never made him in person or anything, but I just, I listen to his speeches. No, no. I listen to what he has to say. And I understand that the guy is very, very, very intelligent. Yes. I mean, why would you believe that you can. sit at a table across from him and get him to agree to this West Germany plan.

For example, I mean, it's so bizarre. It is utterly bizarre. But again, look at examples. Liz Truss, meeting with Lavrov, yours at Borrell, meeting with Lavrov. I mean, what they thought they would do is something like that. And, of course, they came away, you know, absolutely, you know, steamrolled over. In the case of Liz Trust,

I don't suppose she even really understood fully what had happened. In the case of Borrell, he got incredibly angry. They complained about it in a press conference. But, you know, it hasn't made him change his views. Okay, any other final comments to wrap this video up? I think the thing to always understand is, I mean, they're coming up with a plan which isn't remotely workable.

plan and they're running out of time. Now, I don't know when this Russian offensive is going to happen, but if it really is the case that Ukraine is now throwing into the conflict, these last reserves for this offensive, which is everybody can see has failed, then there isn't an unlimited amount of time. So I can very easily see. In fact, I would say the most likely outcome is that sometime next year, they're going to get exactly the debacle that they've been trying to avoid. It'll be Afghanistan all over again on steroids. All right, yeah. The durand.com.

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