The Duran Podcast - Manila Meeting: Lavrov, Rubio And Iran Strikes CIA Facilities

Episode Date: July 23, 2026

Manila Meeting: Lavrov, Rubio And Iran Strikes CIA Facilities

All right, Alexander, let's talk about Lavrov's meeting with Rubio in Manila on the sidelines of the Asian summit, 35-minute meeting. And we didn't get any statements before the meeting. We didn't have a press conference after the meeting. Rubio made some comments. Lavrov made some comments before the meeting, but nothing official was made by you. either of the two foreign ministers. I would do have some reports as to what was discussed. 35 minutes.

Doesn't really give too much time to go over much. I mean, five minutes saying hello to everybody, and then 30 minutes to talk about what really. I imagine they just went over some basic bullet point items or something like that. Well, that's exactly right. 35 minutes suggests a meeting that failed. I mean, if we're talking about a secretary of state and a foreign minister of Russia meeting, and this, the Russians have now confirmed, was a meeting that was initiated by the Americans.

The Americans wanted to discuss something with the Russians. The Russians came along because they always agreed to meetings, whenever they're asked to agree to meetings, but they clearly didn't give the Americans what they wanted. So the meeting failed. I mean, I think that's the way I would describe it. Now, we can speculate, I think quite intelligently about why the Americans wanted a meeting at this time and about why the Russians on their side were not at all forthcoming. But the key thing is that this meeting was a failure. Was it about Iran? The latest Reuters were. report. I think it was. I claim there's an investigation into Russia providing intel or drone

technology to Iran in order to strike the CIA targets, I believe two or three CIA targets back in March. Yes. Yeah, in March. I think that's exactly what it was all about. I think that the Americans came along. They're obviously furious about the fact that the Russians, as they believe, are providing help to the Iranians. They're absolutely furious that the Russians are targeting CIA at peak personnel. The Americans are becoming increasingly alarmed about the fact that the Iranians are showing extraordinary proficiency in attacking American bases across the Middle East. We've received lots of reports about this. This has been discussed in the Washington Post. The Americans are worried about all of this. And so they want to...

to get the Russians to speak to the Russians and tell the Russians to stop. And the Russians didn't say that they would continue and they didn't say that they would stop. They said that we're not doing this at all, which is their way of saying we will continue. Because I have no doubt that the Russians are providing significant help to Iran. And why wouldn't they? And We go back to what Lovrov said before this meeting. Lavrov said that there is an absolute obvious hypocrisy here. The Americans are providing intelligence assistance to Ukraine to attack targets inside Russia. And we are not providing help to the Iranians, but if we were, and that's the implication,

we would be doing nothing more to the Americans than what they're doing to us, except, of course, what they're doing to us is being done to us in our own country, whereas what the Iranians are doing to the Americans is being done very far from the United States in the Middle East. Yeah, it was in March to, at least two CIA sites were hit in March, according to, to, Reuters. Is Rubio still the NSA head? Yes, he is the NSA. Was he at this meeting more as the NSA guy rather than the foreign minister? Ask him. I really don't know. I think the situation is so chaotic now that it's very difficult

to make sense of this. But he spoke to Lavrov. Lov is not Putin's NSA. say, Shoygu is Putin's NSA. He was speaking to Lovov as Russia's foreign minister. So I suppose that he went to see Lovroff in the capacity as Secretary of State, but in reality as NSA. Yeah. I mean, he sees him as Secretary of State because they're at the same summit. They're in the same location.

So they have an opportunity to meet one another. But during the meeting, he's not wearing his Secretary of State hat. He's wearing his Intel hat. Yes. And this issue with the strikes on CIA targets is, it's a, okay, it is an issue for, for the Secretary of State, obviously. It is a foreign policy, geopolitical issue. But it is more than anything, an intel issue, right?

Because you do have an intelligence investigation, according to Reuters taking place at this moment. as to whether Russia did help Iran in hitting these CIA targets. I believe the New York Times three years ago, they put out an article talking about how before the SMO and even during the first months of the SMO, the CIA was operating around 12 sites along the Russian-Ukrainian border? Yes. That's correct, right? Absolutely correct.

Intel gathering locations along the board. That was the CIA that was running this. I believe they've now been, obviously, they've now been relocated, these sites taken apart and I guess relocated somewhere in Germany or somewhere in Europe. But the same article also talked about how the CIA located and single- out groomed Budanov. They also embedded themselves, merged. Maybe they merged their operations. You can say is probably a better word with Ukrainian intel, the military intel as well as the SPU. This was also in a New York Times, Washington Post article. These articles go back three years.

Of course, you have the strikes into Russia, the drone strikes, the whatever, missile strikes are using U.S. targeting, using U.S. data. You have Starlink, you have Palantir. You have the allegation that after Trump got off the phone with Putin, it was basically the CIA that decided to launch the drone strikes into Valdei. That's how the story goes. So what's the U.S. and what's the CIA's problem? I mean, I'll tell you what the problem. is, I'll tell you exactly what the problem is. They are losing the war with Iran. This is the problem. Up to this moment in time, right up to the 28th of February, they did all of these things, and they said to themselves, we can hit the Russians, we can go on hitting the Russians any way we want. He was discussed

this many times in many programs. And there's no consequences for us. Now they are finding that there are consequences. The Russians, and I remember, I've discussed this many times, when back in 2024, Joe Biden and David Cameron and all of those people started to talk about supplying missiles, attack them's missiles and storm shadow missiles to the Ukrainians. The Russians, Putin himself came out and said, this is a red line for us. If you do this, if you start launching missiles into what country, you are acting in as parties in a conflict against us. And the foreign ministry called in the ambassadors of Britain and France and told them very clearly if these sort of attacks happen, then Russia reserves the right to take retaliatory action against your bases,

your military people, your intelligence assets, anywhere in the world. That's what the Russian said the Americans, the British, the French, ignored those warnings. They went ahead. They supplied attack of missiles to Ukraine. They supplied Storm Shadow missiles to Ukraine. They started to be used against targets in Russia. Then, of course, Trump came along and said that he disagreed vehemently with his policy. We then discovered that he didn't actually disagree vehemently with his policy, that he was stringing the Russians along. And last year, in May, I think it was. He asked Zelensky, why don't you conduct strikes against Moscow? And the whole thing went on escalating and escalating and escalating and it's never stopped escalating.

And now shock horror, the Americans discover that the Russians are doing the same to them. And that's really what this is all about. Now, I would add something else. What the Americans are doing with the Ukrainians is painting. to the Russians and is causing them serious problems. I mean, we've had the attacks on the refineries. We've had the attacks on the ships in the Sea of Arzorff. We've had all of those things, but they do not compare with what we're seeing in the Persian Gulf now. Are the Americans being pushed back from their bases in the Persian Gulf, forced back to Georgian. Now they're talking of

moving back from Jordan to Israel. So they are being hit much more heavily, much more fiercely than the Ukrainians were able to hit the Russians. So this has all been very dismaying for the Americans. And because we're talking about the United States, because we're talking about this administration, I can tell you for as night follows day, that it's, If they were to give any assurances now to the Russians that if you stop helping the Iranians, we will stop helping the Ukrainians. The Russians wouldn't believe them. That's the first thing to say.

And secondly, this administration is not going to make that kind of proposal or offer. What it is going to do and what Rubio did when he met Lavrov is he's going to increase threats. The threats, the escalation is going to grow. Yeah, exactly. Absolutely. It's incredible that they didn't anticipate this, the United States. They didn't plan for this. No one in the Trump administration said, you know, as we go into a hot war with Iran, maybe we need to take some actions here and there, move some assets from this location to that location because, you know, we've been going after the Russians really hard. And maybe, just maybe, there. The Russians might see this as an opportunity to hit us back and to retaliate. So we should reconfigure things, tell these offices to move to these locations, tell the CIA to get out of the region.

It's incredible that they didn't think of these things. Maybe they have this sense of just feeling that they're untouchable, invincible. Well, that's exactly what problem. They do feel that they're untouchable and that they are invincible. Now, once upon the time, not so long ago, before a decision to attack Iran, a country like Iran was made, there would have been a series of massive meetings and studies in Washington, which would have gone through all of these things in great detail.

You remember we discussed this all with Jim Webb in a program we did on this channel, and Jim Webb said this is the way the United States prepares for wars. I mean, you may not agree with the wars, but they prepare for the start of the war, was meticulously. Nothing is left to chance. Well, this time, it didn't happen that way. Again, we know from, I think it was the Washington Post this time, that it was all decided in a single meeting with Netanyahu comes along with Barre, the head of Mossad, and they tell Trump, he's all going to be over in a few days. There's nothing to worry about. New York Times.

New York Times, wherever it was. Same thing. And there's a sort of headcount made, and General Kane says he's not too keen and Vance says he's opposed. Rubio pretends he's opposed and then pretends at the same time that he's supportive and nothing is ever discussed. Nobody goes to sits down, works it out, says what is our situation with inventories? What could happen in the straight of almost? What might the Russians do? What might the Chinese do? Nobody ever did any of that. And now we are, where we are, and the Americans are in a very awkward position. And they are, and they They made lots of threats against the Russians at various times, and no doubt they get to make more threats now. But by this point in the relationship between the Americans and the Russians, I don't think the Russians care.

We've had the other reports on Bloomberg about Putin telling the Americans that he's taking back all of the territorial concessions he made in Anchorage. Now, I think actually that that is an old story. I think Putin actually told Trump that in the telephone call that they had after the Valdai attack, directly after the Valdi attack. If you go to the summary of the conversation that Ushokov gave, it says straightforwardly there that Putin warned Trump that in light of what it just happened, the Russians would rethink. their concessions, the previous concessions they had made. But the point is that the Russians are in a completely uncompromising mood now, and they are retaliating. And they will continue to retaliate. They may not criticize Donald Trump openly. They may meet with Rubio in Manila, but they're not going to change their policies at this point. Peskov is saying that the Bloomberg report was inaccurate. He actually put out a statement saying that the terms that Putin outlined in 2024 at the foreign ministry in June, those are the terms that are still on the table.

Why Peskhov would go to the trouble to say that? I have no freaking clue. How could we just could have come out with a statement and say, you know, Bloomberg doesn't have any sources to the Kremlin, and just leave it there. Why does he have to then follow it up with a statement and say, well, actually, Putin is not hardening his position or he didn't say to Trump, which I believe he did. I remember what you're referencing with Uschikov.

And I do believe that Putin said to Trump something along the lines of there aren't going to be no more territorial concessions. Yeah. I remember what you're saying. Why would Peskov have to be. to have to take all of that back and then roll it all the way back to June 2024. That's two years ago, man. Exactly, exactly.

I don't understand. I don't understand, Peskov at all. I really don't. He could have just left it there. Bloomberg has no official sources in the Kremlin. We're moving on. But nope, nope, he had to walk everything back all the way to June 2024. Anyway, Whitkoff, he also said that.

Wittkov and Kushner are also going to be coming to Moscow and he's going to be announcing a date very soon. Zelensky also spoke to Wittkoff and Kushner the other day. Zelenskyy posted all of this on X. They talked about the resumption of diplomacy. I was actually encouraged by, even though it was a 30 minute meeting, I was encouraged by the fact that Lavrov is now engaging with Rubio. In other words, I'm more comfortable with all of the of this in the hands of Lavrov. But it looks like Peskopf is pushing

the Whitkoff-Kusner trajectory or that route, yeah. The businessman, the business deal which business guy's route. Which Lov absolutely hates. I mean, he gave a press conference in which he spoke about Whitgoth and Kushner as being

America's do-all negotiators who simply did what the president tells them. I mean, he didn't He clearly doesn't take them seriously. Well, obviously, we have always these constant dissonances from the Kremlin. They don't like to shut the door completely with the Americans, as we've discussed many times. And it is very frustrating for many people.

But nobody should expect any change in Russian policy now. I mean, when Peskov says that it's Istanbul plus, that means Zaporosian-Herson regions. So the narrative, the story, if it was ever true, that the Russians agreed to a ceasefire in Zaporosia and Herson regions, if the Ukrainians pulled out of Dombas, that seems to have fallen away. And the fact that the Russians are now insisting on retaining control of the territory they have in Kharkiv and Sumi region is interesting. And I suspect that for Zelensky, certainly, and for the Americans, definitely, that's a deal breaker. I don't think the Americans could agree to that one.

I don't think it's the Russians, though, closing the door when Lavrov is engaging with Ruby. I mean, they're leaving the door open to the United States. It's just, I think it's in better hands, the negotiation process under Lavrov and under the farm. I would say it's in the correct proper hands, then this offshoot. with Kof Kushner coming to the Kremlin at 5 in the morning thing? The fundamental problem with Peskov is that he has been Putin's spokesman for such a long time that he has gradually evolved into something that's more than just a spokesman. It's almost at times as if he imagines himself to have some actual diplomatic

role himself. And I've had many criticisms, by the way, of Peskof, and I believe you've had those as well. Lots of people in the Russian elite think that Peskov oversteps his position repeatedly. I would not be surprised of Lavrov thinks that. Lov never mentions Peskhov, I notice. Never, ever, ever mentions Peskof. So I suspect. that there is a sense that, you know, Peskov imagines himself to be a more important person than he actually is. Right. Final question. Okay, final question. 30 minutes, that's all they had. Yeah. But do you think that Rubio specified some of the threats or the escalation that could take place?

No. What do you think the U.S. could do in retaliation for, for, for the United States? for the Russians, what they believe to be Russia's help to Iran. We know that weapons are not going to be going, at least from the United States, they're not going to be going to Ukraine. Maybe the U.S. will do the sell weapons to NATO thing, and NATO gives them to Ukraine. But even there, I'm doubtful given that you have a very, very hot escalating war in the Middle East. And we know that the U.S. stockpiles are running low. So I don't see escalation in terms of weapons. We know that the money is also from the U.S. is not going to Ukraine. We know that 400 million, which was earmarked for Zelensky is now being postponed until

2009 until after Trump leaves once again, everything that the U.S. has, they're going to focus it on Iran on the Middle East. What is the escalation that could come for the United States? You have the sanctions, the bone crushing sanctions, which will end up hurting Russia, but they'll hurt the United States and the world, especially Europe, a lot more. You have the continuation of targeting satellite, intel data, Palantir Starlink. They can continue on that route. I mean, what do you think the U.S.?

What do you think Rubio could have told Lavrov or hinted at to Lavrov when they met saying, look, knock off, help knock off what you're doing with Iran, or else we are going to I don't think the Americans yet have decided what they're going to do. For all of the reasons that you've just said, all of the things that they've done already have been unsuccessful, one form or another. So further sanctions would be counterproductive. Escalation of the drone war, well, they can try that. But the Russians are becoming more adept to dealing with the drones.

I don't think the Americans yet have a plan. of how they're going to respond to what the Russians are doing. Nonetheless, I think they will work on something and they will do a few things. I think there will be more sanctions and they will try to target the Russian energy industry because that's the only thing they can do. So they might, for example, try to stop Russian tankers. I mean, all very counterproductive, very unwise at this time. They might also ramp up sanctions on Russian banks and financial institutions and threatened to impose

secondary sanctions on countries that deal with them. I think that's becoming also increasingly less effective. And the other thing they're going to do, and here I think they probably will have some effect, is I think because they're the Americans, they're going to ramp up the shadow war, the dirty war with the Ukrainians, more assassinations inside Russia, more attempts to kill people there, more targeted drone strikes of that kind. That's something the United States has a history old, by the way. And I'm afraid I think we're likely to see quite a lot more of it over the next few weeks, months, years.

Now something they're very effective at. And that would be a direct CIA response. Absolutely. To Russia. But of course, Russia would then retaliate to that as well. Absolutely. Absolutely. The Russians are not as good at it, by the ways the Americans are, just to say.

I mean, the Americans are the experts of this sort of thing. Yeah. All right. We will end the video there, the durand. Dot locals.com. We are on X-Rumble, Telegram, and Substack. All those links in the description box down below. And check us out on the Durant Shop for merch, 26% off.

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